Latest / A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast / Talks to Steven Alexander about his choice of The Green Death (2/6)

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Talks to Steven Alexander about his choice of The Green Death (2/6) · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

• 0:33
  I'm so drunk. Hello and welcome to a hamster
• 0:43
  with a blunt penknife, I'm Steven Alexander, and I can't do
• 0:47
  Welsh accent and I know someone else who can't do Welsh accent,
• 0:50
  and his name is. Don't look at me like, it's my
• 0:54
  fault. Hello.
• 0:56
  I'm Jerry Ford just massive apology to my Connor.
• 1:01
  The only Welshman so far to come onto this bottle.
• 1:06
  I mean, did you know what? Okay, so we did.
• 1:08
  I did Mark on the rod a little while back and we did a few
• 1:11
  terrible Jordi accidents on that and we know there's some Jordi,
• 1:14
  but there's like, Mark McManus is from that.
• 1:17
  Yeah. Part of the country, isn't he?
• 1:19
  I think dogs who, when it goes Regional, there's on the va's,
• 1:23
  on the offensive occasionally? Yeah, I did it.
• 1:26
  I don't know about accents anyway because I was cockneys.
• 1:29
  Probably cotton, Iggy's is probably the only one you can do
• 1:33
  this really sort of like you. No, no one gives a crap about
• 1:36
  because who gives a cock about companies.
• 1:38
  Anyway, I'm gonna get so hard to say for sure.
• 1:40
  You're telling me all right. Now, honestly, and that is sort
• 1:45
  of middle class. Why are we here today?
• 1:52
  What we just what we talked about well last week last week?
• 1:58
  No, yesterday we did part 1 of Doctor Who and the green death
• 2:04
  which is a Sighs. You don't hurt.
• 2:06
  We story from 1973. I'd like to say I'm probably,
• 2:11
  right. I think written by re let's and
• 2:14
  Roberts Lomond, and starring, Joe Cohen, Katie moaning you
• 2:18
  need to anything else. Well okay, so I got a question
• 2:21
  for you straight off the bat. Even before we go into the
• 2:24
  episode. What do you think of the output
• 2:28
  of director? Mike Lee Brian.
• 2:33
  Oh, now lay me a couple of Mighty bright story so I can get
• 2:36
  my head in the right frame. Our may know.
• 2:37
  And I think he's very strong over.
• 2:40
  So he dare, he started with colony in space.
• 2:43
  Then he did the sea Devils, then he did the green death, then he
• 2:48
  did death to the Daleks, then he did revenge of the Cybermen and
• 2:52
  then he did robots to death. Yeah.
• 2:55
  Yeah, that is damn fine, isn't it?
• 2:58
  He? Well, I mean, there's a couple
• 3:00
  things that I think he likes shooting because like, Just the
• 3:03
  last episode like shooting through things.
• 3:04
  So you like to shooting through. There's those funny ornaments in
• 3:08
  robots of definitely like shooting through.
• 3:10
  He was shooting through the lab equipment in Cliff's laboratory.
• 3:15
  So you get lots of three shots things like that, which always
• 3:18
  works very well. And very dynamically, he was
• 3:20
  shooting through the spinny wheel thing that my work in
• 3:24
  securing. The Cliffhanger, wasn't it?
• 3:26
  Which was a very expensive shop for and very atmospheric in very
• 3:30
  good, but you didn't have to do that.
• 3:32
  You can adjust Happened like in the studio.
• 3:34
  In Bessie saying oh look here we are alone.
• 3:38
  I think if you look at his output as a whole he's one of
• 3:42
  those sort of young directors this trying to make his mark on
• 3:45
  Doctor Who so he's not phoning it in like some of them you know
• 3:48
  like you're on Jonesy is or something like that and there's
• 3:52
  an energy and dynamism to his Direction and he does Action
• 3:57
  really well as well. I think of the see Devils,
• 4:00
  there's a lot of action in that. Yes, you can only tell its story
• 4:04
  whooshing, this story. Yeah, hopefully, Kerri Walsh,
• 4:08
  she'll call it, we call it won't watch.
• 4:12
  Well, I don't I I wanted Terry Walsh.
• 4:15
  Five Points that Gorman. 10 points Stewart fell 20 points,
• 4:20
  all right, bye. Yeah, we'll probably have about
• 4:23
  500 points, you know their own. Leave it there, leave it this
• 4:27
  time, very less says of Mikey Breyer because they do a couple
• 4:30
  of common trees together that That he was as interested in
• 4:36
  adopting, like the latest technology, whether it was at a
• 4:40
  level sophisticated enough for television at the time.
• 4:43
  But he wanted to have a go with CSO and, and anything basically
• 4:47
  that they could use to make the show look more interesting, and
• 4:51
  certainly like in this story, like, he may be over stretches.
• 4:56
  Some of the effects like especially the CSO.
• 4:59
  Yeah. But I still think I should have
• 5:02
  a go. You know, I still feel.
• 5:04
  They should be ambitious. I think at least half the effect
• 5:08
  shots work quite well, this time.
• 5:11
  Yeah. And certainly the film shots of
• 5:13
  the maggots which we'll get to but I think wouldn't it be
• 5:20
  interesting time in the 70s and 80s when you've got lots of new
• 5:24
  techniques and lots of techniques?
• 5:26
  Whereas now it tends to be a joy.
• 5:31
  And that is the the go to technique for everything I do.
• 5:35
  I think it makes it more interesting if you've got more
• 5:37
  toys to play with practical effects personally.
• 5:43
  So so like looking at the Star Wars movies.
• 5:46
  Yeah. I prefer the originals because
• 5:49
  it's mostly practical effects. Whereas you go then to the
• 5:52
  prequels and they just don't look like cartoons to me.
• 5:57
  Yeah. Well that might also be because
• 5:59
  of Ra Each and that is what we're used to.
• 6:02
  What we see is real. You calling me out.
• 6:07
  Well, you're not as old as you may yet become but your fake it.
• 6:13
  That's all right. Yeah, there we go.
• 6:15
  I think I was a half compliment in there somewhere.
• 6:18
  Oh yeah. Well okay.
• 6:20
  So should we skip into some Mike Lee bright Direction and see
• 6:27
  what we can see because I think that I think we might be able to
• 6:29
  talk about Bow bars is story, progresses, definitely, let's go
• 6:34
  for it. Okay, let's count as in five,
• 6:38
  four, three, two, one. Go.
• 6:45
  This is our second time fairness.
• 6:46
  I'm going to say once again that sounded like your vehicle fully
• 6:49
  impression and I'm going to say once again the big finish are
• 6:53
  lining up to have you in a range of pick up all the adventures.
• 6:58
  Yeah. It's lodged in my head now, and
• 7:01
  any Regional accent idea is just going to sound like me doing
• 7:04
  Pete just gonna be awful, Isn't it?
• 7:09
  Okay, so episode to see ya. Now I've talked to a lot of
• 7:13
  these halves the commentaries about episode 3 S because they
• 7:16
  are very often in a four part of the tricky one.
• 7:19
  Yeah and it's really easy to talk about episode 1 because
• 7:22
  that's the scene sale. And if so for which is generally
• 7:25
  the conclusion of this case episode 2.
• 7:29
  I feel like they're like The lame dogs.
• 7:31
  Are they like? The excitement is here of
• 7:34
  episode one and now it's just continuing the story.
• 7:39
  I think this kind of bleep bosses that because normally the
• 7:43
  end of episode one you get the monster reveal away.
• 7:46
  I was eatin, ya See, No Monsters.
• 7:50
  I've got a does that mean? This is episode 1 because it is
• 7:53
  the monster reveals at the end of this episode, it must be.
• 7:56
  I must be, you know, we only watch one episode.
• 8:00
  God, imagine watching an Omnibus of this, how can Used to be
• 8:03
  about where the chip on yourself.
• 8:04
  You know what, right? There's a YouTube video.
• 8:07
  They will color YouTube video of John Pertwee to the music of
• 8:10
  Bonnie. Tyler's I need a hero and he
• 8:13
  keeps coming back to this see where he's got that thing in
• 8:15
  there and the Sparks are flying. What is one of his big heroic
• 8:21
  moments? Is, it is actually doing
• 8:23
  anything. He's just standing there going
• 8:26
  is very good. Doctor is like superhuman,
• 8:30
  because I don't think a human being could stick a thing in
• 8:33
  that wheel and come out of it. Unscathed.
• 8:37
  I do not sure what the Brigadier was contributing either, but
• 8:39
  they have stuck out all, but you have to know, you have to
• 8:43
  understand how lift shaft work and I really do II know.
• 8:47
  I use very simple, Goes up and one goes down.
• 8:51
  You do the hand motion on going up on goes down but I like what?
• 8:56
  Yeah, there's please and leavers and wires and cables.
• 8:59
  And I view if you were stuck in, are you relying on me to get you
• 9:04
  out of it? You be doomed.
• 9:06
  I'm telling you all this that I hear what it guys name, but oh,
• 9:12
  he's really sweet. It is really sweet and and it's
• 9:17
  so sad. What happens to him, isn't it?
• 9:18
  Well, it's almost a Okay, go with me here.
• 9:21
  It's almost a bit benro. The heretic in that.
• 9:24
  It's basically like a one episode relationship between two
• 9:27
  characters. That's really very gentle and
• 9:31
  very sweet that results in one of them died and Yeah, it's
• 9:36
  nice. That he's he's an experienced
• 9:38
  Miner and he's in his element and he's helping Jose obviously
• 9:43
  doesn't know the fact that, you know, doesn't know that does
• 9:46
  know how lift shaft work. Whoo.
• 9:49
  But he's yeah, he's he comes across as a really sort of
• 9:52
  strong kind character. And what's interesting is after
• 9:57
  he dies his death has resonance, doesn't it?
• 10:00
  Because they're talking about that in the next episode, when
• 10:04
  he dies in the hospital. Squirtle he's remembered
• 10:07
  although she says they'll never be another minor, like your
• 10:10
  birds, not in the whole universe.
• 10:13
  Then of course next year, monster of colored bra.
• 10:16
  They bring about the same actor playing a binder.
• 10:18
  So is the one time that would have actually been wrong.
• 10:24
  It's it's true for the fact that patterns reoccur in the
• 10:28
  universe. You know.
• 10:29
  Yes there's a lot of birds arrive.
• 10:33
  Every Doctor Who mine? Okay, that's up to you.
• 10:38
  Of course, we don't have coal mines anymore in this country,
• 10:40
  do we? I don't know.
• 10:42
  I do know. I've no I is it.
• 10:45
  I think there might be one. I didn't do any research so I
• 10:49
  could be lying. Oh no.
• 10:50
  No me, neither me neither but we certainly don't have the coal
• 10:53
  industry that we used to have and if we do I think everything
• 10:57
  is automated so You know, sorry, well, I need is a huge issue
• 11:06
  that the government broke up, all these communities in broke
• 11:11
  up all these mining Society by sea mining communities, without
• 11:16
  giving them anything, just saying with your clothes, in the
• 11:18
  mines now and like, what's anyone going to do?
• 11:22
  And, you know, that that in a very simplistic, kind of way,
• 11:27
  was a huge story through the 70s and 80s.
• 11:30
  Then just kind of drifted away in the late 80s.
• 11:32
  I mean, we all remember the line strikes.
• 11:34
  Well, we remember all the details of the Union's.
• 11:36
  Everything is another matter, but with two words bloody
• 11:43
  Thatcher. But would any prime minister of
• 11:51
  done the same thing in someone else?
• 11:55
  Yes. And you know what?
• 11:56
  I was out getting to Urkel now because I am very anxious about.
• 12:02
  Yeah. But generally speaking, I'm very
• 12:04
  anti prime minister. So it's not like she did such a
• 12:08
  terrible job. I think, particularly happy with
• 12:13
  any of the prime minister's I've had in my lifetime, but like, I
• 12:16
  don't know. Imagine being in that role,
• 12:18
  like, you probably have to make those tough choices as well.
• 12:21
  Yeah, yeah. And it's a, when you're here,
• 12:25
  you're a complete bigger, it's very easy to make tough choices.
• 12:31
  Families are very important for people's happiness.
• 12:33
  Steve they are indeed Stables. That's John.
• 12:41
  Durr isn't it comes back in a minute?
• 12:43
  You said there were lots of legs to Pilot the spiders.
• 12:46
  There are ya. Now my theory with this is, of
• 12:49
  course that we see John dirts character lock button and planet
• 12:54
  of the spiders and he's down and he's like, he's been thrown out
• 12:56
  of his company's, it's gone to join this monastery.
• 12:59
  And my theory is, is they scanned his brain to form the
• 13:03
  boss, which is why it's got the same voice and talked about this
• 13:06
  company and then he's actually a copy of his brain.
• 13:11
  You're doing what I do, you're taking an actor who played
• 13:13
  several roles in Doctor Who and then finding a way of linking.
• 13:16
  All those parts I do that phenomenally well with Prentiss
• 13:20
  Hancock, you know, the Lord then is he bouncing around through
• 13:25
  time and space Prentiss. I created this very long-winded
• 13:28
  narrative as the How we was both a bar and Salim are and the the
• 13:35
  Shreve guard in re Vos. It was just a very eclectic
• 13:38
  career. Yeah, that was all I do for you
• 13:43
  to do it with my defy you to do with Michael sheared.
• 13:50
  No it's not possible and reverence of the Daleks Master
• 13:56
  valve or a Stories, that's never gonna happen.
• 14:03
  Is it look at this totally natural and stilted performance
• 14:06
  this guy's giving I certainly trust him.
• 14:09
  It's like so the original review was to somebody's head.
• 14:12
  The second someone has to play you know like hypnotized or
• 14:15
  zombie, they automatically lose the ability to act and I think
• 14:19
  that's a good case of it there. But in real life, I know a lot
• 14:24
  of people who talk like that who behaves like that, it's just odd
• 14:28
  because it's on telly. Reading are people that talk
• 14:30
  like that. Okay.
• 14:34
  People, who are not very good at projecting their personality in
• 14:38
  the way, in the way they behave. Oh, yeah, you ain't talked about
• 14:42
  me, mate. Yeah, you're completely flat.
• 14:45
  Joe. I just like, I don't get
• 14:46
  anything for you. I can never tell what you're
• 14:48
  feeling. No, I keep it.
• 14:54
  What's his name? The glasses, Elgin aerogan nice
• 14:58
  character and obviously he's the the dissenting voice isn't.
• 15:01
  He's the one that's a no, you know, we can't murder people.
• 15:04
  We guard hypnotize, people and take over the world and then he
• 15:08
  vanishes off. I threw the story, that's the
• 15:11
  big Doctor Who fact, isn't it? Because he got tonsillitis and
• 15:15
  appendicitis and at to have his tonsils and appendix out and so
• 15:18
  couldn't make it to part 5 of the story and this is it one of
• 15:21
  your Frito toes off. But as his replacement yes no
• 15:26
  it's not. One of my three do is but his
• 15:29
  story features a couple of Dalek people since John Scott Martin
• 15:33
  who is inside the Daleks Roy skeleton?
• 15:35
  Who voices the Daleks? Oh, but the minor here, he was
• 15:39
  in the Daleks master plan. He's one of the delegates is he,
• 15:43
  of course he is with that. With that really terrible
• 15:47
  Beatles haircut? Yeah, he's the one.
• 15:49
  Yeah. Who did I started operators
• 15:53
  playing this, just got Waltons in the opening scene.
• 15:57
  He's the one who dies very quickly.
• 16:00
  Well, and Roy skeleton is the replacement for elgyn Somebody's
• 16:08
  gotta pay pin that I shall find out who it is.
• 16:12
  You bet I'll be pointing the finger at me, I'm not old see.
• 16:17
  Now we're talking about pioneering special effects so
• 16:20
  the use of like the gel on the hands to sing a.
• 16:23
  So like the green death effect, that's quite effective.
• 16:26
  I think it's pretty. It's um I think it's the same
• 16:30
  thing they use in silver Nemesis, which is front axle
• 16:33
  projection and they use it next year.
• 16:36
  Mike Willie Brown. It uses a next year in death, to
• 16:38
  the Daleks doesn't need to make the, the exes at the Excellence
• 16:42
  choice to make, to make the things flash on the walls.
• 16:45
  Yeah. Yes.
• 16:46
  It's very clever. And yeah, that's that's a lovely
• 16:50
  bit of Television engineering because it just looks it looks
• 16:53
  so much better than if they'd see us odor or put some just
• 16:56
  green blobs all. This looks weird and alien,
• 16:58
  doesn't it? That's nice.
• 17:02
  I like the fact that there seems down in the mine and they kind
• 17:05
  of going ever deeper into the mine into the dark, aren't they?
• 17:08
  And to whatever horror is lying in wait for them down there and
• 17:13
  then there's there's like quite a lot of momentum built with
• 17:17
  these scenes with them trying to get down there to help them out.
• 17:20
  Again it's a nice mixture of like the Doctor Who Adventure
• 17:22
  which is like the bit down the mine and the sort of domestic e
• 17:25
  stuff that's happening here. Mixing with the doctor and his
• 17:31
  replacement for Joe's affection Cliff Jones.
• 17:34
  Yeah, I because all this stuff up here.
• 17:37
  I mean like this will actually very much action.
• 17:39
  I mean, apart from the cable and the sparks flying everywhere.
• 17:43
  Oh, really is just chat, but there's good sense of urgency to
• 17:46
  it and I was flying and the actors doesn't it could you say
• 17:49
  Sparks Fly? When you talking about Joe and
• 17:52
  Professor Jones? Well there she still in the big
• 17:55
  isn't she? You know, she said there's no
• 17:56
  chance for Sparks wife, not yet anyway.
• 18:00
  In the next episode. Did you hear that?
• 18:02
  Where it goes all promising, youngster eye and he says, no,
• 18:04
  I'm at the age that you live in. It's a really nice dialogue in
• 18:07
  this. It is and there's a lot of
• 18:10
  quotes will. Oh, here they come.
• 18:11
  Oh, becomes extinct Extinction Rebellion.
• 18:14
  This is great because obviously, like, you know, Mike, if I dad
• 18:16
  was watching this so prick don't get me wrong.
• 18:19
  But if you're going to do the bloody hippies, and, Yep,
• 18:23
  they're actually leading into that.
• 18:24
  Are they by causing a distraction?
• 18:26
  That's Vince loving hippies. I see your shows that they're
• 18:31
  small to than they appear, that they doing things for a reason
• 18:35
  they got plan. So what, what do you think of
• 18:39
  like the extinction rebellion, and the modern kind of version
• 18:42
  of hippies? And that kind of movement is
• 18:46
  that still going? Oh yeah, the really you don't
• 18:50
  know, this is resistant. Coconut bits of London.
• 18:52
  They're still protesting on the street.
• 18:55
  Well, I Greenpeace and the green party and that's that Element.
• 18:59
  Well, it's part of that. But I think I think it's
• 19:04
  probably Associated but it's slightly outside of that.
• 19:06
  It's a bit more of an extreme element because great tell.
• 19:10
  I think they they so they've been in London.
• 19:14
  They been, yeah, they have just been blocking streets and doing
• 19:17
  very peaceful kind of protest, you know, they don't want to get
• 19:19
  bullied or beaten up by the police like some protests have
• 19:23
  been in past couple years and they're kind of viewpoint is
• 19:29
  that basically the world is going to be absolutely screwed
• 19:36
  in the next 10 years that we have you know we should have
• 19:38
  done something about all the pollution.
• 19:40
  All the problems like years ago, we're too late.
• 19:43
  Chloe changes on the way. Hey they were warning us about
• 19:46
  it here in 1703. Yeah.
• 19:49
  Yeah yeah yeah. We've known about it for so long
• 19:51
  and not enough has been done and that the only way to get action
• 19:57
  now is that talking's been You know, people have talked and
• 20:00
  talked and talked and it's not done anything.
• 20:02
  So their view is that there needs to be action.
• 20:05
  There needs to be sort of like proper affirmative, kind of like
• 20:08
  protests. There needs to be a real people
• 20:13
  really kicking up a stink about it because it does matter.
• 20:15
  How is that action? Be executed, though, this is
• 20:18
  this is all Revelation to me. So what it's not, it's not like
• 20:21
  terrorist acts and things like that, is it?
• 20:23
  No, no no they. Well like any organization?
• 20:28
  In this nation, I'm sure there are people.
• 20:30
  You would think about doing things like that, but the way
• 20:34
  they move forward is all their fish, we're going forward is
• 20:37
  saying, we want to do this peacefully.
• 20:40
  We want to do protest will cause disruption but we don't want to
• 20:43
  hurt anyone, you know. You don't want to say.
• 20:46
  I absolutely think that's that's the best way to do it but again,
• 20:52
  a protest of that it's horrible, isn't it approaches that nature?
• 20:55
  You can door and just say I look, they're idiots.
• 20:58
  They do and I don't know, I don't think protest of any kind
• 21:03
  particularly do they work? Just protesting benefit anything
• 21:07
  I think. I think it's just a bit of an
• 21:08
  annoyance, isn't it more than anything?
• 21:12
  But it's interesting because Barry that says his inspiration
• 21:15
  for writing this was reading. I think it was a copy of the
• 21:19
  economist. Oh my God.
• 21:23
  You've got it. You've got it.
• 21:28
  How the fuck did you get that eBay?
• 21:34
  I love to fight. You turned out for The Darlings
• 21:36
  with Terry Nations book of facts about Daleks and now you've got
• 21:40
  baronesses. Blueprint for this purpose of
• 21:42
  all evil. Yes I'm ready yet.
• 21:43
  I'm going to face nightmare rushing nightmarishly convincing
• 21:47
  after reading it. Nothing seems quite the same
• 21:49
  anymore and that Is this was published in Ohio.
• 21:53
  Missing Kobe's fly. I'm talking about saving the
• 21:55
  planet, 1972 outside. It's amazing.
• 21:59
  How is is here? Changes color depending on the
• 22:01
  shot. If the doctor has a chameleon,
• 22:04
  it affects, you know, depending on what angle people are taking
• 22:07
  them from, if you know what I mean.
• 22:10
  Oh yes, yes, definitely. Yeah.
• 22:11
  That's the in story isolation for that when he's fighting when
• 22:15
  he gets aggressive and fighting Boos, his hair, just flattens
• 22:19
  immediately in the mosque. Emiliana.
• 22:22
  Capulet. He's managed.
• 22:24
  Just have another face at one point and goes no, it is no.
• 22:31
  So go back to what you were saying, though.
• 22:35
  I've got a question about environmental messages in Doctor
• 22:41
  Who and where the line is between educational and preachy.
• 22:51
  Well, this is where I think things have changed.
• 22:55
  I think in the green deaf the right turn to take was
• 23:00
  educational. It was sort of like saying,
• 23:02
  look, here are the issues, here are the people involved.
• 23:05
  Here's what's going on. Do you understand why this is
• 23:07
  causing friction why this is causing problems?
• 23:09
  So it does it in a Sci-Fi, kind of way, but then byproducts of
• 23:17
  petroleum refinement do. Lady, fuck up the environment
• 23:21
  and a very hard to get rid of that has.
• 23:23
  I create killer markers but yeah, but they do kill people
• 23:30
  and then maggots eat their corpses.
• 23:34
  Sorry that is a super fun way of getting the idea of foster kids
• 23:37
  though isn't it? I know it's like a crazy science
• 23:39
  fiction idea but it actually Birds the idea in their heads
• 23:43
  that bad things happen if you dilute the planet anyway.
• 23:46
  Sorry. Go ahead.
• 23:48
  Yeah. So there's some there's that A
• 23:50
  limit to it. However, in certain extent on,
• 23:54
  you know, I'm not with, I'm not literally with Extinction with
• 23:57
  alien by agree that now the time for subtly saying, oh well,
• 24:02
  maybe we should consider the environment is probably.
• 24:04
  Oh yeah, I agree. And that in the next within the
• 24:08
  next 10 years, I think by 2030 it would be all that matters.
• 24:12
  It would be literally, everybody will be suffering because of the
• 24:17
  changes that are going to happen.
• 24:18
  I'm really worried about it. Was frustrating.
• 24:21
  Yeah, is we are a race of people now that can literally go?
• 24:28
  Okay, that's going to be a problem in 10 years, we'll deal
• 24:30
  with it then like that's what we do.
• 24:33
  Now we deal with the problem when it hits rather than getting
• 24:37
  ahead of the get a 90 in some degrees move with pollution,
• 24:40
  there are movements and there are people in government and
• 24:44
  scientific institutes and blood were all doing good work.
• 24:47
  But as a whole it's not a priority as it Well, the problem
• 24:52
  is systemic and what I mean by that, is that our entire society
• 24:58
  and the systems we live in, are all rooted to improve efficiency
• 25:04
  and causing more pollution. And in many ways, there's that
• 25:09
  offers a lot of benefits to us. You know, it offers a lot of
• 25:12
  good things come out of that. So, you know, we have cheap
• 25:14
  food. We can all afford to eat.
• 25:16
  Or actually, we used to all be able to afford to eat.
• 25:19
  We got it. Looks remote food banks.
• 25:21
  But in mind with that, I can actually with one of my old
• 25:25
  jobs, I can sum up. Basically, what you're saying is
• 25:27
  it's kind of a small version of what you're saying but
• 25:30
  essentially yeah a piece of fruit.
• 25:32
  Yeah. Yep.
• 25:33
  Piece of fruit. You can buy it.
• 25:35
  Grows on a tree. You can buy it Loose.
• 25:37
  You can eat it. Yeah, yep.
• 25:39
  What I worked in a convenience store which had many plastic
• 25:42
  packets of cut-up fruit because people can't be fucking asked to
• 25:47
  buy a bit of fruit and cut it up.
• 25:51
  Yes. But people do buy it.
• 25:53
  People like to have the fruit cutter.
• 25:55
  Yeah, that's liked it. That's the problem.
• 25:57
  Isn't it? Is that we're so lazy.
• 25:59
  We're so you. We were.
• 26:00
  So in that kind of convenience mindset.
• 26:05
  Yeah. People don't necessarily want to
• 26:06
  buy a whole pineapple when they just want a couple of chunks.
• 26:09
  But then if they brought a whole pile up and through most of it
• 26:13
  away, every time with that, be worse for every kind of like
• 26:16
  efficiency saving, you can argue something else which is a real
• 26:19
  pain, it's really difficult. Well there are so many systems
• 26:24
  in our society that are burning up resources unnecessarily, I
• 26:30
  feel. But then from another's
• 26:32
  perspective, you know, I mean like if you if you work in the
• 26:35
  airline industry, then surely you think.
• 26:37
  Oh well, you know people love to travel travel is a great thing.
• 26:42
  It helps people understand other cultures, it brings people
• 26:44
  closer together it. If you work in the, so you work
• 26:49
  in the closet. Maritime industry and you deal
• 26:53
  with the transport of goods. You think all these containers
• 26:56
  they keep the world turning. They allow people in the UK to
• 26:59
  have like a rich and varied diet.
• 27:02
  Whereas otherwise they wouldn't have these things.
• 27:04
  Why do I feel? There's a big but coming, but
• 27:08
  the system Building Systems destroying the planet.
• 27:10
  Yeah, and we are burning up resources faster than you can
• 27:14
  use them, but you know, what's even more frustrating?
• 27:17
  Yeah, is disaster. Will strike at some Maybe not in
• 27:21
  our lifetimes, but it will strike at some point.
• 27:24
  Yeah. And then everyone will be
• 27:25
  looking each other. If someone to blame our all to
• 27:28
  fucking blade, this is another thing is that people, there is
• 27:35
  no claim that like, like what one person could change this.
• 27:41
  Yeah, there's no one. It's not like, you know, you've
• 27:43
  got to put that slightly out. One night.
• 27:45
  Big question though, because if every one person chose to change
• 27:49
  this, then obviously Lee, the tide would turn look at what
• 27:53
  happened. Look what happened in parts of
• 27:55
  the world in the pandemic. When people couldn't go out
• 27:59
  couldn't drive and suddenly these areas that were like, smog
• 28:03
  written were clear and nature was frightening.
• 28:06
  Again, my God, we've got gone off on a crazy environment or
• 28:09
  ran our love it. I knew this was going to happen
• 28:13
  because it's something that I'm very concerned about, and we're
• 28:17
  just about see the giant maggot. So we're for one.
• 28:19
  So we come back to the sweet sweet, but A little bit more.
• 28:21
  Can then come back to it? Like yeah, I would like to
• 28:23
  return. This really interesting coming
• 28:25
  on stage and what were having I think as well.
• 28:29
  Yes. I mean, is there anything more
• 28:31
  quintessentially Doctor Who, than going through a darkened
• 28:34
  location and confronting a hideous?
• 28:38
  Grotesque monster. Yes.
• 28:41
  But enough about John Purvis, Savage a room, I'm telling you
• 28:59
  just jump over. It was just marvelous person who
• 29:10
  like having what I've read about him.
• 29:12
  He his entire personality and everything you read about some
• 29:15
  of the way he behaves is all driven by those insecurities.
• 29:18
  Yeah. All driven by his is the lack of
• 29:21
  Students in himself. So he projects his huge image of
• 29:24
  his huge person when inside he's full of self-doubt and and
• 29:29
  stuff. And interestingly, you can see
• 29:31
  there's some behind-the-scenes footage of death to the Daleks
• 29:34
  and dimensions in time as well. And you can see him getting
• 29:38
  really angry on the set. And it's all because he's
• 29:41
  fucking up and he's getting angry with other people and
• 29:44
  you're, I think you're right, I think deep down he was an
• 29:48
  incredibly insecure man and yet for Objects that he's this
• 29:52
  hugely charismatic figure and it's great for the show because
• 29:56
  I think it I think he's a very distinct and very charismatic
• 30:00
  doctor, but yeah, maybe not great for working on the same
• 30:05
  case. Oh my God.
• 30:06
  Hello, we go, there we go. Two minutes.
• 30:09
  Okay, the start of next episode asked me, have you ever met Jon
• 30:12
  Pertwee make? No, I haven't.
• 30:15
  Okay, I'll tell you about when I met Jon Pertwee next episode.
• 30:18
  I don't think I'm going to now offer but then Don't worry like
• 30:21
  it is it now you're always saying earlier about practical
• 30:26
  effects. Yep.
• 30:28
  The maggots are a phenomenally good practical effect?
• 30:32
  I think. Yep.
• 30:34
  Yeah. It's it's such a good.
• 30:38
  It's the mouth. Yeah.
• 30:39
  It's using the the terrier skulls, which they did for the
• 30:43
  dress shoes earlier in the year and it works superbly well
• 30:46
  because it gives you some real teeth structure.
• 30:49
  But, you know, when you can see like the the Maca, God, I mean,
• 30:53
  that's green below where they've superimposed like real maggots,
• 30:58
  with Joe Grant, like in the foreground, that's horrible
• 31:01
  cooling through the green swarf eager.
• 31:04
  But like, it doesn't take much of a leap of imagination, to
• 31:07
  imagine that really happening. And how horrifying it would be
• 31:10
  to come across that. I mean, have you ever seen tiny
• 31:13
  magnets? They're horrible.
• 31:15
  Oh Lord. I had a thing where so we got a,
• 31:20
  when we The house we bought our old fridge freezer with us and
• 31:24
  we put it in the garage, we use it as a beer fridge.
• 31:26
  I'm not going to sleep tonight. After hearing this story, that's
• 31:29
  fine. And one time I thought well is
• 31:33
  he wasting electricity? Let's get rid of it.
• 31:35
  Oh, well, let's not use it from it.
• 31:36
  Let's turn it off because I don't believe are in there.
• 31:38
  We use electricity took everything out together.
• 31:41
  The out going to do output and about two months later, there
• 31:45
  was a smell coming from Africa, and we'd lift a kind of meat.
• 31:51
  I don't know like shepherd's pie or something in there, and one
• 31:54
  of the drawers of the freezer was just full of maggots.
• 31:58
  It was horrendous, take the draw, down the drain and then
• 32:07
  bleached the draw to just get rid of it because it just, oh my
• 32:09
  God. But even like I know you said
• 32:24
  that the skulls really effective but even like like the the kind
• 32:28
  of the wriggling movement of them as well.
• 32:30
  I think is very authentic. Whereas like compare it to
• 32:34
  something like the grubs in Arkansas space, which just look
• 32:40
  incredibly fake than they, they don't work nearly as well.
• 32:44
  No, this is they made all the right to start design decisions
• 32:47
  and they made the right thing. Shooting them on film, getting
• 32:50
  them looking slimy. Me and getting them looking
• 32:52
  vicious. And it really works tremendously
• 32:54
  well in the story and the doctor and I are back together again.
• 32:57
  And I like that too. Yes.
• 33:00
  Big hug. Well let's see what they're
• 33:02
  going to happen when confirmed confronted confronted with these
• 33:06
  hideous phallic monsters in episode 3.