Latest / Karl and Crew / Grace-Based Parenting with Cody Kimmel & Resolving Conflict with Adult Children with Dr. Kathy Koch

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Grace-Based Parenting with Cody Kimmel & Resolving Conflict with Adult Children with Dr. Kathy Koch · Karl and Crew

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  S1: Broadcasting from Chicago, across North America and beyond. It's Carl
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  S1: and crew. Come as you are an experienced guide, overcome
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  S1: what seems impossible and live as you never imagined. Start
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  S1: your morning with a laugh.
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  S2: Practical from the Bible. Tips and tricks to kill. Not tricks,
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  S2: but tips and tricks.
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  S3: Tips and tricks to kill. Tips and tricks.
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  S1: Delivering the truth daily.
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  S4: All of my attempts to you know. Prop myself up
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  S4: with achievement and good works. Well, God wasn't impressed by that.
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  S4: Even if other people were.
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  S2: The gospel changes everything.
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  S5: Freedom in Christ. Man, it's like that backpack of cement
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  S5: just falling to the ground.
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  S1: Now from the call of Hope Studios. This is Carl
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  S1: and Crew.
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  S4: Hey. Good morning. Glad to have you with us on
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  S4: this Monday morning. I want you to think about the
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  S4: relationships in your life. If friendships, family, co-workers, co-workers, what
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  S4: are the things that you think are most likely to
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  S4: cause conflict in relationships? And for this, we're not talking
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  S4: about marriage. We're talking, although there's some overlap. Um, think
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  S4: more like friendships. Extended family. Mhm. And without giving specifics,
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  S4: draw from your own experience. What are the things that
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  S4: tend to cause conflict?
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  S2: Sure. Uh, pride my way or the highway type of.
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  S4: Yeah.
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  S2: Type of, uh, people.
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  S5: I'm my mind went to like topics like there's a
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  S5: lot of disagreement on politics. Who's in office? Um, just
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  S5: things in culture in general. Those kind of topics tend
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  S5: to cause a great division. Yeah. Like don't bring this
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  S5: up at the Thanksgiving table, please. Yeah. You know.
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  S2: 100%.
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  S4: Yep. Unresolved issues from the past.
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  S5: Big time, big time.
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  S2: In the church. It's, you know, sometimes it's preferences of
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  S2: disagreements on how things should be about the church.
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  S4: Okay. So I want you to track these, take a
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  S4: little keep keep a little mental inventory. So pride, unresolved issues,
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  S4: my way or the highway? What else? What are some
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  S4: other big buckets? Let's get 4 or 5 here. What
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  S4: about jealousy?
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  S2: 100%. Oh, absolutely.
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  S4: That's a big one, right?
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  S2: A really big one.
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  S4: Think about how many families are destroyed because of, um, favoritism.
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  S4: You ever had a.
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  S5: Think of Joseph?
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  S4: Yes, yes, yes. I mean, a lot of times this
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  S4: can happen over generations.
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  S2: Oh, yeah.
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  S4: You know, I, I won't speak to specifics, but, you know,
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  S4: there have been dynamics in my own extended families where
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  S4: there are people or groups of people who feel like
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  S4: their preferred or not preferred over the other.
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  S5: That's a big deal through sometimes through. Sometimes I'm saying
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  S5: in blended families.
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  S4: Blended.
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  S5: Can happen. Yeah, very much so.
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  S4: Where you go and and so this theme, this whole week,
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  S4: we're going to be talking about sticking with it. And
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  S4: so sticking with it through conflict, through relational challenges is
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  S4: kind of our big theme. And it can be tempting.
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  S4: We talked a little bit about this earlier in our
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  S4: kind of cut off culture to just be done.
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  S2: Give up, I'm out.
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  S4: Right? 100% to just be like, I don't really want
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  S4: to deal with this. I'm going to draw a boundary
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  S4: here and I don't really want to have you in
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  S4: my life anymore, because we don't see things the same way,
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  S4: because they're unresolved issues, because there's pride, because there's jealousy,
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  S4: because there's my way or the highway coming up. I
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  S4: want to take you to acts one, and I want
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  S4: you to see some dynamics that were present that in
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  S4: my mind could have absolutely 100% derailed some of the
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  S4: relationships in the early church with interesting. With those things
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  S4: in mind, pride, jealousy, my way or the highway. Acts one.
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  S4: I saw this yesterday for the first time. First time
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  S4: I saw it. It's been there.
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  S2: Didn't just get written.
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  S4: What was it and what can we learn from it?
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  S4: Coming up.
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  S1: Take your next step with Jesus today. You're listening to
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  S1: Carl and Crew.
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  S4: Well, I want you to think back to, you know,
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  S4: we just came off of Easters a little bit behind us.
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  S2: Yeah, but not far.
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  S4: Not far. I want to go to acts one, and
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  S4: I want you to think about what Jesus's closest followers
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  S4: were dealing with, right? As kind of the church is born. Sure.
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  S4: So just a quick timeline. They've just dealt with in
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  S4: very quick succession. The Jesus going to the cross.
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  S2: Yes.
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  S4: Them kind of being Scattered Jesus's burial, his resurrection. Then
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  S4: he's back. He's back with them. For he appeared to
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  S4: them over 40 days. Then he leaves again.
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  S2: Yeah, that would have been a hard one.
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  S4: Yeah. And then they all kind of come back together
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  S4: as he's leaving. There's major uncertainty here over what's next.
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  S4: He's told he's told them a couple of things. Don't
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  S4: leave Jerusalem until you receive the the Holy Spirit. So
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  S4: they don't necessarily know when that's going to be, what
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  S4: that's really going to look like. They have a lot
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  S4: of questions. Jesus, are you going to is this are
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  S4: you going to restore the kingdom to Israel? He tells them,
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  S4: it's not for you to know. So there's uncertainty. There's
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  S4: a group of people. There's 120 people that ultimately are
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  S4: sort of gathered, and they return to Jerusalem and they're
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  S4: in this upper room. But think about the group dynamics
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  S4: for a minute. So you had had 12 disciples, but
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  S4: they experienced the betrayal of one of them.
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  S5: Right?
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  S4: So now they're down to 11. And so although Judas.
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  S4: Judas is ultimate betrayal was to Jesus. Think about what
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  S4: that could have done in the group he betrayed them to. Right?
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  S2: 100%. It's a betrayal on everybody. Jesus. Obviously the most.
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  S2: But but yes, I mean, he was their friend.
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  S5: Yeah. And they just watched all this go down. Exactly. Shocking.
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  S4: So if one of them if one of them jumped ship,
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  S4: so to speak. How, how much could they trust each other?
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  S2: Right. Is anyone else gonna leave?
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  S4: Anyone else gonna leave? And then. So you've got the
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  S4: the 11 who walked closest with Jesus. What about kind
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  S4: of the the circles out because there was 120 people.
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  S4: You also have Jesus's brothers and mother's mother mentioned here
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  S4: who felt a different closeness to Jesus. But it was
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  S4: certain based on how he spoke, that what he valued
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  S4: most was those who followed him more than just like
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  S4: the biological sort of relationships. So they had their own unique,
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  S4: dynamic relation to Jesus, different from the disciples. So think
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  S4: about how that works out in, in, in families, right?
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  S5: Yeah. Yes, yes.
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  S4: You experience the loss of anyone ever gone through the,
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  S4: the loss of somebody. And it brought out the absolute
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  S4: worst in your family.
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  S2: Mhm. That's.
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  S5: Yes, absolutely.
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  S4: You see all those dynamics of what we're talking about,
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  S4: Jesus here. But I want you to just think about
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  S4: the very human elements of his his followers.
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  S2: And I think it's important to look that way because
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  S2: they were just as human as we are.
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  S4: They're tasked with making a major decision. They got to
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  S4: find somebody to replace Judas. They got to figure out
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  S4: what that's going to look like. Ever had to make
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  S4: a big decision that involved a lot of people speaking
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  S4: into it?
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  S2: And maybe not everybody agreed.
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  S4: Not everybody agrees. And then all of a sudden, Peter emerges.
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  S4: Peter starts addressing the group. Whoa, whoa whoa whoa whoa.
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  S5: Peter.
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  S4: Peter. Why? Why, Peter?
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  S2: Why do you get to talk?
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  S4: Why not Jesus's brother? Why not his mother? Why not
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  S4: someone else? Why does Peter get to be the one
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  S4: to lead? And it's not like they haven't had this
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  S4: sort of dynamic within them before.
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  S2: Yeah, they argued a lot about who was the greatest.
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  S4: Who's the greatest, the ones that had their mom go,
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  S4: so how about you let my sons.
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  S2: Sit next to.
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  S4: You, sit next to you?
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  S2: And, uh, Jesus isn't physically present in this moment to
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  S2: stop them from doing that.
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  S5: No. It's escalating.
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  S4: Let me read to you, James 316, for where jealousy
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  S4: and selfish ambition ambition exists, there will be disorder and
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  S4: every vile practice. Do you think there was the potential
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  S4: for any jealousy and selfish ambition in this room of
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  S4: 120 people sitting there waiting for the promised Holy Spirit.
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  S4: They don't really know what that means. Peter takes the lead. Huh?
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  S4: But somehow, even with all of those dynamics in play,
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  S4: there were a couple of things that united them and
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  S4: ultimately led to the birth of the church. Let's talk
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  S4: about that coming up.
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  S1: He was running from God, but God's love brought him home.
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  S1: Carl is in the crew. It's Carl and crew on
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  S1: Moody Radio.
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  S6: I see it my way. Do I have to keep
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  S6: on talking till I can't go on? While you see
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  S6: it your way. Run the risk of knowing that our
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  S6: love may soon be gone. Who sings this? We can
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  S6: work it out.
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  S3: The Beatles, the Beatles.
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  S6: We can work it out. Um.
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  S5: I like.
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  S3: It.
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  S4: We can work it out, man. Relationships can be challenging.
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  S4: And we're looking at acts one, and we're looking at
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  S4: Jesus's followers immediately following his death, his burial, his resurrection,
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  S4: and then his ascension, and so many things that could
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  S4: have happened from a very human standpoint, potential for jealousy,
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  S4: for competing interests, having to make a big decision, the
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  S4: uncertainty around what was going to happen and what they
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  S4: should do as they waited. I mean, they're waiting for
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  S4: the promised Holy Spirit, but they don't know yet. I mean,
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  S4: we have the benefit of reading on in acts to
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  S4: know how this all plays out.
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  S2: But they're waiting.
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  S4: They're waiting in an upper room in Jerusalem, 120 people.
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  S4: You have Jesus's mother and brothers who would have felt
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  S4: a certain Tied to him, that would be different.
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  S2: Certainly you could imagine them saying, yeah, but like, we
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  S2: grew up with him, so shouldn't we know what's best?
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  S4: I'm his mom. Yeah, I raised him. Remember that? Yeah.
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  S4: And you've got the disciples. But we're the ones that
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  S4: he picked to walk with us. Us 11. Well, there
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  S4: were 12 of us, but one of us.
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  S5: Yeah, right. But.
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  S2: And the three of us, James, John and Peter, he
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  S2: took everywhere.
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  S4: Exactly. Who was with him in the garden? Was that the.
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  S2: Peter, James and John?
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  S4: Yeah. So all of those things, when you really think
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  S4: about it, like so many things could have happened that
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  S4: could have caused early fractures that could have reverberated in
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  S4: the early church. But yet I want to read to
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  S4: you acts one, verse 14, all these with one accord,
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  S4: all these as in all these people, all these with
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  S4: one accord were devoting themselves to prayer together with the women,
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  S4: and Mary, the mother of Jesus and his brothers. So
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  S4: I want you to look at a couple of things
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  S4: that were present that I believe that kept this group together.
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  S4: Their common devotion was to prayer. You see that in
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  S4: this verse, but you also see it when they have
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  S4: that big decision to make, where they got to figure
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  S4: out who's supposed to replace Judas. They devote themselves to prayer.
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  S4: They have a common mission. Jesus has told them before
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  S4: he ascended that they are going to be his witnesses.
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  S4: They're going to be his witnesses. They've been given a mission,
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  S4: a mission, an assignment. And then they have this common
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  S4: expectation to wait on the Holy Spirit. Do not leave Jerusalem,
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  S4: but wait. Wait for the promise of the father, which
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  S4: he said, you heard from me, for John was John
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  S4: baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the
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  S4: Holy Spirit not many days from now. It's coming. He's coming. Rather.
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  S4: The Holy Spirit is coming. So there was unity even
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  S4: in the midst of all of these interesting dynamics. How
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  S4: does this hit you, Jonathan?
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  S2: You know, I really I like it because at the
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  S2: end of the day, they could have just said, well, I,
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  S2: I prefer this in one of the disciples. While I
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  S2: prefer this, I really appreciate that instead of focusing on
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  S2: the preferences that may have been in the room or
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  S2: the people who wish they got to speak in the
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  S2: middle of the room, they decided to commit the process
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  S2: to God because it is a big decision. Yeah, the
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  S2: church is. I mean, it is as early as it
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  S2: can get.
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  S4: Yeah. Because this is before acts two is when we
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  S4: see the day of Pentecost and the, the coming of
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  S4: the Holy Spirit. Yeah. This acts one is just setting
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  S4: the groundwork for that.
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  S2: 100%. And so you know, how many things fail before
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  S2: they even start because people, you know can't get it together?
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  S2: They decided that they weren't the ones that needed to
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  S2: be relied upon. Because, you know, I like this. They,
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  S2: they had two people to choose from. So they, they
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  S2: came up with criteria that they all agreed were important
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  S2: criteria to choose from.
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  S4: For the replacement.
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  S2: For the replacement of Judas. Um, and as they come
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  S2: to these two people, they pray, they commit it to
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  S2: the Lord, and then they let the Lord decide. They
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  S2: casted lots, which was a, a, a process that God
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  S2: had designed for them to allow him to be the
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  S2: one to make the decision. There weren't a bunch of
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  S2: people getting up and debating and arguing with each other.
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  S2: I think it should be this guy. Well, I think
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  S2: it should be this guy. And I was like, hey,
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  S2: we got the two who fit the criteria. Now let's
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  S2: commit it to God and let him decide.
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  S4: And the other one, justice who didn't get picked. Yeah.
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  S4: Like he didn't go. No contact?
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  S5: Yeah. No, he was okay.
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  S2: He wasn't sitting there bitter.
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  S4: It's. It's very interesting. What do you say?
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  S5: I say it's a major turning point in really watching
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  S5: them come to this decision. You know, like Jonathan said,
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  S5: they finally came to an agreement. They did it the
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  S5: right way. They handed it over to God as the,
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  S5: you know, as the ultimate decision. They showed their true
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  S5: character of why they actually were picked by Christ.
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  S4: Mhm. And, you know, the fact that Jesus had been
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  S4: with them and they had heard from him.
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  S5: Yes.
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  S4: I mean, had to have superseded all of the potential
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  S4: for these this other conflict, which clearly was there.
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  S2: Right? Absolutely. They they had spent so much time with
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  S2: him that his way, the right way of doing things
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  S2: had had seeped into them enough. It doesn't mean they
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  S2: were perfect. They certainly weren't. In the New Testament, we
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  S2: see Peter not being perfect. Uh, very much.
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  S3: So. Yeah. Oh yeah. There's there's more.
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  S4: Coming.
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  S3: Here. There's more coming.
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  S5: But they watched Christ's example.
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  S3: They did.
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  S2: And they were close to.
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  S3: Him.
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  S4: Acts eight but you will receive power when the Holy
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  S4: Spirit has come upon you, and you will be my
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  S4: witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and
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  S4: to the end of the earth. You know, I heard
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  S4: a commentator yesterday who said that even just the way
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  S4: Jesus described this in Jerusalem, in all Judea and Samaria
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  S4: to the end of the earth, is almost as if
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  S4: somebody was saying, you will be my witnesses, witnesses in Chicago,
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  S4: in Illinois, in the United States, and to the world.
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  S4: So this their circles of their circle of influence was
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  S4: going to get bigger as they were to grow. And
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  S4: so the fact that they stayed together is 120 people
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  S4: with so many reasons to have disorder and jealousy and
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  S4: pride and disagreement and uncertainty, but yet they stayed together.
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  S4: What can you take away from that today? I don't
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  S4: want to give you a hard fast, like how to
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  S4: apply this because I know relationships can be complicated, but
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  S4: where there is a common devotion to prayer, a common mission,
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  S4: a common expectation of the power of the Holy Spirit,
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  S4: I believe we can have unity.
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  S1: Your spiritual pit stop to keep you going in the race.
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  S1: You're listening to Carl and Crew.
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  S4: It's one of the most painful topics facing so many
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  S4: families right now. Uh, estrangement, no contact. There's a lot
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  S4: of different names or terms given to it, but primarily
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  S4: it is adult children and their parents who are at odds.
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  S4: Sometimes there is little to no contact at all with
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  S4: the children, with grandchildren. There are many people hurting around this.
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  S4: And so I'm really excited that we're going to be
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  S4: able to bring a conversation to you that's going to
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  S4: speak into this in a very godly, biblical way. Doctor
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  S4: Kathy Cook joining us. You have taken on a hot topic,
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  S4: and I don't know that it's been it's certainly talked
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  S4: about a lot, but without a lot of answers for parents,
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  S4: first give us just kind of the why behind why
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  S4: you decided to take this on.
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  S7: Right. I wrote this book for parents of adult children
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  S7: because the multigenerational biblical worldview family is falling apart. It's terrible. Right?
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  S7: God ordained the family. He loves us well in our
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  S7: family units obviously wants us to stay connected. And I've
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  S7: heard just far too many sad stories, as I know
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  S7: you have as well, where parents are wondering what have
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  S7: they done wrong? Adult children are often missing connection with
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  S7: their adult parents don't know what to do about it,
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  S7: just major conflicts. And God said, Cathy, do this next.
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  S7: And so here we are.
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  S4: Yeah. What have you found from your research, specifically around
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  S4: what adult children need from their parents?
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  S7: Oh, that's a great way to word that question. Adult
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  S7: children do need a chance to grow up and mature.
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  S7: And one of the things that happens is if we
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  S7: parent them longer than they feel they need to be parented,
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  S7: they will consider that to be disrespectful. They will feel
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  S7: like we don't trust them, that we think that they're,
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  S7: you know, immature. And granted, somebody might be listening to
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  S7: us who does have immature adult children and they're really
• 18:46
  S7: conflicted about this. But what I say at the very
• 18:48
  S7: beginning of the book is that we can't parent adult children.
• 18:51
  S7: We can guide them, we can counsel, we can influence,
• 18:54
  S7: we can support, we can mentor, we can coach, we
• 18:57
  S7: can help them, but we can't parent them in the
• 18:59
  S7: same way as when they're 18 and under and living
• 19:02
  S7: under our roof. So that's one of the conflicts. We've
• 19:05
  S7: got to be able to back off, especially moms. And
• 19:08
  S7: I don't say this lightly, but especially moms need to
• 19:10
  S7: make sure that they're not needed as a mom. They
• 19:14
  S7: need to parent out of, you know, love and support.
• 19:17
  S7: They can't idolize their kids. They can't get their needs
• 19:20
  S7: met through, you know, the choices their kids make. They
• 19:23
  S7: have to be able to say, hey, I have a
• 19:24
  S7: life beyond the parent of adult child. Otherwise, the kids
• 19:28
  S7: feel like everything's hanging on them. You know, their mom's
• 19:31
  S7: only happy when they're doing well. And that's a lot
• 19:33
  S7: of stress that our adult children don't need. I hope
• 19:36
  S7: that comes across well.
• 19:37
  S4: Yeah. Now, you mentioned the kind of those now that
• 19:40
  S4: your children are over 18, how about the blurring of
• 19:44
  S4: the lines? Because I would say just from my own experience,
• 19:47
  S4: gone are the days where as cut and dry as, okay,
• 19:51
  S4: now you're 18 years old, you're independent. There are so
• 19:54
  S4: many more households where adult children are staying around longer.
• 19:57
  S4: I know all for me and my siblings, all at
• 20:01
  S4: some point moved back in with our parents for long
• 20:04
  S4: or short periods of time as adults for a variety
• 20:06
  S4: of reasons. So sometimes you have children who are adult
• 20:10
  S4: by age, but they're still dependent on their parents, whether
• 20:14
  S4: it's some financial support or the living situation. So parents
• 20:19
  S4: sometimes are left confused. You need me in some areas,
• 20:22
  S4: but you want me to back off in others.
• 20:25
  S7: Yes. Oh my goodness. Well stated. No, this is happening
• 20:28
  S7: all over the place, and it doesn't mean that the
• 20:30
  S7: kids have been bad. They're not boomeranging back home necessarily
• 20:34
  S7: because of dysfunction. Sometimes they are. And I have a
• 20:36
  S7: whole chapter about that where there might have been, you know,
• 20:38
  S7: addiction or maybe they were college dropout and now they're
• 20:41
  S7: trying to reestablish it could be the economy and the debt.
• 20:43
  S7: It could be a broken relationship. It could be a
• 20:45
  S7: health issue. So we don't need to assume that there's
• 20:48
  S7: something wrong which caused them to move back home. But
• 20:50
  S7: when they move back home, for whatever the reason, for
• 20:52
  S7: however long that's going to be, I do write about
• 20:55
  S7: the need for communication, right? Like having conversations like, what
• 20:59
  S7: does this mean? Are you going to participate in the
• 21:01
  S7: cost of the home? Are we still expecting you to
• 21:04
  S7: have dinner with us at night? And do we want
• 21:06
  S7: you to let us know if you won't be here
• 21:07
  S7: for dinner at night? Like, how does that work? You know,
• 21:10
  S7: so it's your bedroom. Does that mean that the only
• 21:12
  S7: space that you care about in the house is the bedroom?
• 21:14
  S7: Like we're not a bed and breakfast. We're not a hotel,
• 21:16
  S7: you know? So this is where, you know, moms and
• 21:19
  S7: dads need to, you know, hopefully if they're married, they're
• 21:21
  S7: on the same page. If you're, you know, single parent
• 21:24
  S7: doing this, it's even harder. But if you're married, be
• 21:26
  S7: on the same page. Talk with the kids, support them.
• 21:29
  S7: You know the family does never end. And so ideally,
• 21:32
  S7: we do support ideally, we do offer guidance. Now, hopefully
• 21:36
  S7: the adult children are teachable and open to our guidance
• 21:38
  S7: and hopefully we're open to theirs. The generations are different, Ali.
• 21:42
  S7: You know that. And it's it is challenging.
• 21:44
  S4: So what are some of the ways that let's just
• 21:46
  S4: speak first to the parents. What are some of the
• 21:49
  S4: ways that we may be thinking we are helping but
• 21:53
  S4: are actually hurting our relationship with our adult children?
• 21:57
  S7: Smothering them is the first thing I think of it.
• 21:59
  S7: The research we did was really interesting. If you helicoptered
• 22:02
  S7: your children when they were younger, they might have appreciated that.
• 22:05
  S7: They might have appreciated that you were in their business,
• 22:08
  S7: if you will, and that you said, hey, grab your lunch. Hey,
• 22:10
  S7: remember the soccer team? You know, tryouts are tomorrow. Do
• 22:12
  S7: you want to go to the backyard and practice? Like
• 22:14
  S7: they appreciated that support when they were younger, their heads
• 22:17
  S7: were cluttered and they, you know, they weren't maybe on point.
• 22:19
  S7: Now that they're adults, they resent that they feel that that, again,
• 22:22
  S7: is indicating a disrespect. They want us to know about
• 22:25
  S7: their business but not be in the business. So parents
• 22:29
  S7: need to again be able to back off and ask
• 22:31
  S7: permission to share. I say in the book that you
• 22:34
  S7: don't parent unless you ask permission to do so. And
• 22:37
  S7: you say to your kids, you know, hey, I've noticed
• 22:39
  S7: a couple of things that I've had experience with. Would
• 22:41
  S7: you be interested in my perspective? And if they say no,
• 22:44
  S7: then you can be disappointed. Like moms and dads, you
• 22:46
  S7: have a right to disappointment.
• 22:48
  S4: So let's talk about one of the biggest things that
• 22:51
  S4: I see that creeps in is there is a worldview
• 22:56
  S4: sometimes difference between parents and children. And so I see
• 23:01
  S4: a lot of conflict resulting between we simply don't see
• 23:05
  S4: life the same way. We are different, maybe politically. My
• 23:10
  S4: parents believe things that I no longer believe. So there
• 23:14
  S4: is often a lot of conflict around simply what you
• 23:18
  S4: believe to be true about life. How do you navigate
• 23:21
  S4: that where there's respect on both sides. Obviously, every parent
• 23:25
  S4: who loves the Lord wants their kids to love the Lord.
• 23:28
  S4: And some adult children have go through a wilderness season
• 23:32
  S4: of searching. How do you parent through those seasons?
• 23:35
  S7: Carefully, right? Often choosing silence, often choosing to pray and
• 23:41
  S7: to pray with optimism. To often personalize Scripture and ask
• 23:45
  S7: the Lord to make you know, the kids walk, if
• 23:49
  S7: you will, on solid ground. I think we pray for
• 23:52
  S7: our children to be surrounded by other people who are
• 23:54
  S7: also Christ followers, who may be the ones who will
• 23:57
  S7: win them, ultimately to a saving faith and then to
• 24:01
  S7: a dynamic relationship with Christ. It might not be us
• 24:03
  S7: that do that. I think we need to grieve. I
• 24:06
  S7: think one of the really difficult seasons, difficult things here
• 24:10
  S7: in this season is we don't grieve appearance. You have.
• 24:12
  S7: You have to grieve that. You need to be sad
• 24:15
  S7: and you need to even maybe have a season of anger.
• 24:18
  S7: Grief has a season of anger and not toward the kids,
• 24:21
  S7: not toward towards yourself, but just a deep disappointment. I
• 24:24
  S7: think we need to be careful of the what ifs
• 24:26
  S7: and the if only's right. Like what if we would
• 24:29
  S7: have gone to a different church? Oh, if only I
• 24:31
  S7: wouldn't have sent them to that school. Oh, if only
• 24:33
  S7: I would have told my daughter that that guy wasn't
• 24:36
  S7: healthy for her. We look back and you know what, Alli?
• 24:39
  S7: We look back with today's wisdom and we're really harsh
• 24:41
  S7: on ourselves. But most parents, when you parented, you did
• 24:45
  S7: the very best you knew how to do. You know,
• 24:47
  S7: they were your guinea pig, kid. You did the best
• 24:49
  S7: you knew how to do. And now we look back. Now,
• 24:51
  S7: how many more Bible studies have you been to? Radio broadcasts?
• 24:53
  S7: Have you listened to songs? Have you sung? You know, prayers?
• 24:55
  S7: Have you prayed? And now you look back and you go, oh,
• 24:57
  S7: I was so stupid. No you weren't. You were the
• 24:59
  S7: best you knew how to do. And you need to
• 25:01
  S7: give yourself a lot of grace in this space so
• 25:04
  S7: that you don't become harsh and, and bitter, you know,
• 25:07
  S7: toward the Lord, towards yourself. Those things are really important.
• 25:10
  S7: And Alli, we also need to look for small growth
• 25:13
  S7: and we need to believe for it. We, you know,
• 25:15
  S7: we need to put our hope in God. The whole
• 25:16
  S7: last chapter of the book, as you know, is on
• 25:18
  S7: hope because you can't hope in open yourself for your kids.
• 25:21
  S7: We've got to hope in God. He loves them more
• 25:22
  S7: than you ever will. So we release them to him,
• 25:25
  S7: and we hope for for his goodness to be made
• 25:29
  S7: clear to them. And we look for small growth and
• 25:31
  S7: we celebrate it. And we and we pray for more.
• 25:34
  S7: I think those things are super important.
• 25:36
  S4: Doctor Kathy Cook. Our guest right now, we're featuring a
• 25:39
  S4: new book. She's got out Resolve Conflict and Find Peace
• 25:42
  S4: and Hope with adult children. Coming up, want to tackle
• 25:45
  S4: this one? You mentioned Kathy. Looking back, what do you
• 25:48
  S4: do when you got parents and adult children who look
• 25:51
  S4: back and remember things very differently, like the child or
• 25:56
  S4: the adult child says, you did this and this and this.
• 26:01
  S4: And the parent says, I was doing the best that
• 26:03
  S4: I could. There's conflict there. More coming up with Kathy Cook.
• 26:08
  S1: Celebrating the unstoppable gospel.
• 26:11
  S2: It's not that I've got to fill in these check boxes.
• 26:13
  S2: So he's okay with me, but it's that I get
• 26:15
  S2: to stand close to him so that I can experience
• 26:18
  S2: the life that he has for me.
• 26:20
  S1: You're listening to Carl and crew.
• 26:23
  S4: So when you reflect on how you raised your children,
• 26:26
  S4: you know that there are some things maybe you got
• 26:28
  S4: right by God's grace. There are some things maybe you'd
• 26:31
  S4: do differently when it comes to parenting adult children. Some
• 26:34
  S4: of the conflict arises from differences in how we process
• 26:38
  S4: some of the things that happened in those earlier years.
• 26:41
  S4: Kathy Cook joining us right now. This important conversation around
• 26:45
  S4: relationships between parents and adult children. Sometimes adult children look
• 26:49
  S4: back and they see maybe some trauma, maybe areas where
• 26:53
  S4: they feel like they were harmed in some ways by
• 26:56
  S4: their parents. Maybe they didn't see it at times, processing
• 26:59
  S4: it now through counseling or other means. And then you've
• 27:02
  S4: got parents who feel sort of attacked or judged as
• 27:06
  S4: if somehow they were supposed to get everything right. This
• 27:09
  S4: is a big source of conflict. What do you say
• 27:12
  S4: to this?
• 27:13
  S7: Yes, it is a big source of conflict, and it
• 27:15
  S7: makes me sad. So many of our adult children are
• 27:19
  S7: reframing what happened. They are sadly accusing parents of even
• 27:24
  S7: being abusive for quote unquote, making them go to church
• 27:27
  S7: and no parent. Well, I pray no parent was abusive
• 27:31
  S7: in that way. So this is where the parent needs
• 27:34
  S7: to stand on the authority of God. And you know,
• 27:36
  S7: what do they remember? And they can stand up and
• 27:39
  S7: say to their kids, you know, we will have to
• 27:41
  S7: agree to disagree about the way that we interpret this.
• 27:44
  S7: And I think we stand up for ourselves and we say,
• 27:46
  S7: I'm so sad and disappointed that this is your interpretation
• 27:49
  S7: at the moment that we were parenting you when you
• 27:51
  S7: were ten, 11. I don't remember that. And you stand
• 27:54
  S7: up for yourself, respectfully asking them to consider that they
• 27:57
  S7: could be wrong. I would ask them, who are you
• 27:59
  S7: listening to? Who has convinced you that there was abuse
• 28:02
  S7: in our home? Because I can almost guarantee you somebody
• 28:05
  S7: is telling them that story. And it's the story that
• 28:08
  S7: we tell ourselves about what happened. Like if, for instance,
• 28:11
  S7: now if a parent asks a child to come over
• 28:13
  S7: to help and for three times in a row they say, no,
• 28:15
  S7: you know. Can you help me with the garage door opener?
• 28:17
  S7: Could you help me understand? You know something? And they
• 28:20
  S7: say no three times in a row. The story the
• 28:22
  S7: parent tells herself might be, my kid doesn't care about me.
• 28:25
  S7: But what if the real story is your child is
• 28:28
  S7: legitimately busy and can't come at those three particular times
• 28:32
  S7: because of a of a tutoring session for the oldest son,
• 28:35
  S7: or a soccer game for the youngest, or a choir
• 28:37
  S7: practice that you know your daughter has or whatever. So
• 28:39
  S7: we tell ourselves story and the story often is a lie.
• 28:42
  S7: And I think we stand, we stand up for that. Um,
• 28:45
  S7: we have to understand that they do have a life
• 28:48
  S7: and we have a life. And I pray that every
• 28:49
  S7: adult parent listening to me or every parent listening to
• 28:52
  S7: me has a life beyond the fact that they're a
• 28:55
  S7: parent of an adult child, because if they only have
• 28:57
  S7: that as their life, this is going to be a very,
• 29:00
  S7: very difficult time. This is why we also surround ourselves
• 29:03
  S7: with wisdom. We are in small groups. We're in a
• 29:05
  S7: good Bible teaching church. We have accountability. We have a mentor,
• 29:09
  S7: we have friends and maybe family members who we can
• 29:11
  S7: be honest with to say, my children are remembering things
• 29:14
  S7: so differently and it hurts. And I want to say
• 29:16
  S7: one other thing, Ali. We romanticize the past. So many
• 29:20
  S7: of us believe, oh, we never had conflict when they
• 29:22
  S7: were younger. Thank you for laughing. Right.
• 29:26
  S3: I'm the parent.
• 29:27
  S4: Of two teenagers, so.
• 29:29
  S3: Yeah. Yeah.
• 29:30
  S7: You know, that's that's just not true. There were conflicts
• 29:32
  S7: in the past, and you worked them out because you
• 29:34
  S7: lived together and you had to, for the most part.
• 29:37
  S4: Now, certainly there are times when maybe some ownership and
• 29:40
  S4: apology is is needed if things are brought to you
• 29:44
  S4: as the parent, that there are things that you can own.
• 29:48
  S4: Maybe you hadn't realized the impact of your words or
• 29:51
  S4: your tone or your approach. I mean, certainly that has
• 29:55
  S4: to be part of the conversation is a willingness to say,
• 29:58
  S4: here's where I was wrong and I apologize. Right.
• 30:01
  S7: Oh thank you. You know what? That's chapter two. I
• 30:04
  S7: bring that up right in the beginning of the book,
• 30:07
  S7: that we better be humble enough to take responsibility. And again,
• 30:10
  S7: I would say that most parents didn't do anything intentionally wrong.
• 30:14
  S7: And yet we can look and go, oh, I can
• 30:16
  S7: see how you interpreted that. I know of many parents
• 30:19
  S7: as an example, who raise children before they knew Christ.
• 30:22
  S7: Now they know Christ. Now they think, oh, I wish
• 30:24
  S7: I would have had more grace. I wish I would
• 30:26
  S7: have been home more like this is what happens because
• 30:29
  S7: we're we're experimenting as we live life, right? Every day
• 30:32
  S7: is a new day. So yeah, we do have to
• 30:33
  S7: look honestly at ourselves. We must not blame shift. We
• 30:36
  S7: must take responsibility. We must listen with humility. We must
• 30:39
  S7: look them in the eye and say, you know what, Benjamin?
• 30:42
  S7: I can see how that makes sense to you. I
• 30:44
  S7: am so sorry that I chose to parent that way.
• 30:48
  S7: Now that I know what I know, I would have
• 30:50
  S7: been different, I wasn't can you please forgive me? Can
• 30:53
  S7: we put this behind and not bring it up again?
• 30:56
  S7: And can we move on into something that would be
• 30:58
  S7: a better season for us.
• 31:00
  S4: So much that we could get into here, and we're
• 31:02
  S4: going to run out of time quickly. But I do
• 31:04
  S4: want to touch on some of the some of the
• 31:07
  S4: big pain comes when grandchildren are in the picture. And
• 31:09
  S4: so then now not only is there estrangement between parents
• 31:13
  S4: and their adult children, the adult children now are not
• 31:17
  S4: allowing grandchildren to be a part of their of their
• 31:19
  S4: grandparents lives. When you're in that situation, do you continue
• 31:24
  S4: to push for more? Do you back off when they
• 31:27
  S4: say back off? I mean, for many parents, it feels
• 31:30
  S4: like this is this is so unfair. I don't even
• 31:32
  S4: have a chance to now know my grandkids.
• 31:34
  S7: It is unfair and it's sad. And many of our
• 31:37
  S7: parents who are listening were hopeful for that season. You
• 31:40
  S7: must back off if they ask you to. If you
• 31:42
  S7: keep pushing, they will resent more. It'll feel again like disrespect.
• 31:45
  S7: In fact, it is disrespectful and you need to back
• 31:49
  S7: off for a season and you pray for God to
• 31:51
  S7: open the doors. I know of many people could. Believe me, I've.
• 31:54
  S7: I've talked to so many people. When I wrote this book, many,
• 31:56
  S7: many people waited with sadness, waited with expectation, putting their
• 32:00
  S7: hope in God, not in their children. And they are
• 32:03
  S7: now in a season where they have at least some
• 32:05
  S7: contact and some possibility. So we pray for that. We've
• 32:08
  S7: got to remember we're not the parents. We need to
• 32:10
  S7: understand culture is different. They do have a right to
• 32:13
  S7: do things differently, whether that's, you know, diet or sleep
• 32:16
  S7: habits or the school choices they make. We're not in charge,
• 32:19
  S7: and we need to let them know that. I do
• 32:21
  S7: think we can ask questions. You know, why have you
• 32:22
  S7: chosen this for your kids? I think we also must, Ali.
• 32:26
  S7: We must comment on what's going well. I read a
• 32:29
  S7: little story in the book about a friend of mine who,
• 32:31
  S7: every time she goes to one of her adult children's homes,
• 32:33
  S7: she looks for something she can fan. She wants to
• 32:35
  S7: be their fan, and she wants to be their cheerleader.
• 32:37
  S7: So every time she walks in their home, she is
• 32:39
  S7: determined to find something that she can say. She notices
• 32:42
  S7: that as well. And recently it was simply that the
• 32:45
  S7: daughter in law had chosen flowers from the garden and
• 32:47
  S7: arranged them beautifully. And it was a welcoming bouquet. And
• 32:50
  S7: she watched the daughter in law perk up at that,
• 32:53
  S7: that she was noticed for having done something that added
• 32:55
  S7: hospitality and a warm atmosphere to her home. So let's
• 32:59
  S7: look for what's going well and not always walk in
• 33:01
  S7: with that red pen mentality. And I understand it's easy
• 33:04
  S7: to get out the red pen in your mind. Uh.
• 33:07
  S7: And yet, what if we. What if we didn't always
• 33:10
  S7: do that?
• 33:11
  S4: Kathy Cook always a joy. The book. I know it's
• 33:13
  S4: going to be of interest to so many of you.
• 33:15
  S4: It's called resolve, conflict and Find Peace and Hope. With
• 33:18
  S4: adult children. You can text kids to 800 555 7898.
• 33:24
  S4: We'll get you more info. Just text kids to 805 557898.
• 33:30
  S1: You're listening to Curl and Crew on Moody Radio.
• 33:34
  S3: I had a.
• 33:35
  S4: Never been known for high levels of coordination moment.
• 33:38
  S3: Yesterday. Oh, good. Oh oh. So I was sitting.
• 33:42
  S4: At the table dinner table across from my 16 year
• 33:47
  S4: old daughter. Wasn't dinner time. She just was working on
• 33:49
  S4: some stuff. And I was sitting there doing my thing.
• 33:52
  S4: So I get up. My plan was to go and
• 33:55
  S4: do something on the other side of the kitchen, but
• 33:57
  S4: I did not notice that there was a box of
• 34:00
  S4: things that I had loaded to drop off at, like
• 34:03
  S4: the donation bin. So you had put the box there?
• 34:06
  S4: I had put the box there, sitting down on the
• 34:08
  S4: floor next to the table. So as I got up,
• 34:11
  S4: I took that first step and my foot hit the box.
• 34:14
  S4: And so I felt it didn't hit the ground. I
• 34:16
  S4: actually hit the hit the the door to the broom closet.
• 34:20
  S4: So I like tripped over the box and it propelled
• 34:23
  S4: my body. And then I caught my fall as I
• 34:25
  S4: fell into the car.
• 34:27
  S5: No.
• 34:28
  S4: The look on my 16 year old daughter's face, it
• 34:32
  S4: was like it wasn't laughter. It was like, mom, really? Oh, man.
• 34:38
  S2: The level in which teenagers can be embarrassed by their
• 34:41
  S2: parents when nobody's around is astonishing.
• 34:45
  S4: Like, what in the world just happened? I was like,
• 34:48
  S4: I'm good. I'm all good.
• 34:50
  S5: She didn't even ask, are you okay?
• 34:52
  S4: Could have been way worse.
• 34:53
  S5: Thank you.
• 34:54
  S4: All right. Mother's day recap. Any any highlights? Anyone have
• 34:58
  S4: a highlight from their Mother's Day?
• 35:00
  S5: Well, especially with your wife, Jonathan.
• 35:01
  S2: Yeah. You know, actually.
• 35:02
  S5: It's.
• 35:03
  S2: Unique. This weekend. This weekend was certainly unique in that
• 35:06
  S2: all three of us were sick.
• 35:09
  S4: And so you, your wife and your little girl.
• 35:10
  S2: Yeah, yeah, we, uh, we made the mistake of taking
• 35:14
  S2: our two year old somewhere where other two year olds are.
• 35:17
  S2: And that's always a mistake. Every single time. It's a mistake. You.
• 35:21
  S2: It's when you're when your child is around two and
• 35:24
  S2: they're toddler times you have to make a decision. Do
• 35:28
  S2: you want to go live life and your child will
• 35:30
  S2: get sick and like guaranteed 100% is gonna come down
• 35:34
  S2: with something? Or do you want to stay inside your
• 35:36
  S2: house all the time? And so we, we decided.
• 35:39
  S4: That we were.
• 35:39
  S2: Going to live.
• 35:40
  S4: Life. Yeah.
• 35:41
  S2: And she got sick. And then my wife got sick
• 35:42
  S2: and then I got sick. And so, uh, Thursday or
• 35:46
  S2: not Thursday, Saturday was actually really good though, because, uh,
• 35:49
  S2: it was a planned rest day. My wife is pregnant
• 35:52
  S2: and does a lot and it had been a busy week.
• 35:56
  S2: So I was like, well, part of the Mother's Day
• 35:57
  S2: stuff is not going to be running around doing a
• 35:59
  S2: bunch of things, but just a good amount of rest.
• 36:02
  S2: So I got her a really nice foot massager. Oh, nice.
• 36:08
  S2: And and I said, you're gonna go in that room
• 36:10
  S2: over there and you're gonna watch a movie and you're
• 36:13
  S2: gonna sit and get your feet massaged and you're gonna
• 36:16
  S2: take a nap. And then she went out later and
• 36:19
  S2: got to go shopping by herself. And it was like,
• 36:22
  S2: just go get some rest and not have to worry
• 36:24
  S2: about anybody else for a little bit.
• 36:26
  S4: Yeah, it's a great gift.
• 36:27
  S2: Yeah. And Sunday was just kind of, uh, hey, let's
• 36:30
  S2: try to recover the.
• 36:31
  S4: Best we can recover. Yeah. Super day highlight for you.
• 36:34
  S4: Mother's day highlight.
• 36:35
  S5: Got away to the water again. The my favorite spot.
• 36:37
  S2: The river.
• 36:38
  S5: Good. And my son came with me. So that's always
• 36:40
  S5: an added blessing.
• 36:41
  S2: He better of it's Mother's.
• 36:42
  S5: Day and he loves it there too. So it's kind
• 36:45
  S5: of that we can kind of just talk. You know,
• 36:47
  S5: I just let him talk. So that was, you know,
• 36:50
  S5: as a mom of a teen, especially the older teen,
• 36:52
  S5: to have him talk, I'm like that. That was it.
• 36:54
  S5: That's what I needed.
• 36:55
  S4: That's all like, that's all the gift I need.
• 36:57
  S5: All I wanted.
• 36:57
  S4: Sit down and talk to me.
• 37:00
  S5: So yeah, that's awesome.
• 37:02
  S4: A couple Mother's Day observations in addition to my near fall,
• 37:05
  S4: which I'm glad that that broom closet door broke. My
• 37:08
  S4: fall didn't break my wrist.
• 37:11
  S5: My heart. I'm like.
• 37:12
  S4: Oh, but it was, uh, I kept kind of laughing
• 37:15
  S4: internally at the number of times that I almost wish
• 37:18
  S4: somebody a happy Mother's Day back who was like, like
• 37:21
  S4: a man.
• 37:22
  S2: Like a man. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 37:23
  S4: You too. The instinct of someone's like, Happy Mother's Day. Like, oh,
• 37:27
  S4: you too. Thank you.
• 37:28
  S2: It's the worst. It's the worst. I mean, it's it's
• 37:31
  S2: getting popcorn at the movie theater and they say, enjoy
• 37:34
  S2: your movie. And you say, you two thank you.
• 37:36
  S4: Yeah. You're like, oh, wait, that was really awkward. Yeah,
• 37:39
  S4: but I heard of something really, really cool that I
• 37:41
  S4: hadn't seen before that a church did. This is a
• 37:43
  S4: church out in Arizona, I believe, and maybe other churches
• 37:48
  S4: have done this, but I got a picture sent to
• 37:50
  S4: me of a church that set up a table out in,
• 37:54
  S4: I'm assuming, in the church lobby. And it had a
• 37:56
  S4: little sign with some folks volunteered to staff at the
• 37:59
  S4: table and it said you may be carrying. And then
• 38:02
  S4: it listed some other things or a list of things
• 38:05
  S4: that might apply to people in the congregation grief from loss,
• 38:08
  S4: estrangement or distance, infertility or unmet longing, regret or complicated memories,
• 38:14
  S4: emotional exhaustion. Support is available. And then they had some
• 38:18
  S4: meeting times for some celebrate recovery groups, some prayer and
• 38:22
  S4: care groups. And then they had counselors at the table
• 38:25
  S4: available to pray with people.
• 38:27
  S2: That's awesome.
• 38:28
  S5: I absolutely love that idea. And so I thought, that.
• 38:32
  S4: Is such a cool thing to have available on Mother's Day.
• 38:36
  S4: I often hear people, um, maybe from the pulpit acknowledge
• 38:40
  S4: that reality for a lot of people, but to take
• 38:43
  S4: that extra step of to actually have resources available.
• 38:46
  S5: I hope they maybe take that into Father's Day as well. Yeah,
• 38:50
  S5: I really do. Yeah.
• 38:51
  S4: No, this is so that's so kudos to this church,
• 38:54
  S4: which I've never attended, but I think it sounds like
• 38:57
  S4: an awesome resource to be available coming up though, as
• 39:00
  S4: we continue to talk about family, family conflict, family dynamics,
• 39:05
  S4: sticking with it. What do you do when parenting gets hard?
• 39:08
  S4: And as you will find out if you haven't already,
• 39:12
  S4: it gets hard early, right? Jonathan, parent of a two
• 39:15
  S4: year old.
• 39:16
  S2: It gets hard the second you step out of the
• 39:19
  S2: delivery room.
• 39:20
  S4: What about the delivery itself? Come on.
• 39:23
  S5: Thank you.
• 39:25
  S1: Want to hear that again? Just download the Curl and
• 39:28
  S1: Crew podcast wherever you like to stream.
• 39:30
  S4: When you think back on your journey as a parent
• 39:32
  S4: or a grandparent, maybe an aunt or uncle, there comes
• 39:36
  S4: a point in time where you realize this is this
• 39:39
  S4: is really hard. It usually comes pretty quickly if you
• 39:44
  S4: gave birth to those children or you got them a
• 39:46
  S4: young age, you know, you get them home from the
• 39:49
  S4: hospital and you go, what do I do now? Or
• 39:52
  S4: maybe you even get in the car. I remember that
• 39:54
  S4: car ride home.
• 39:55
  S2: Night one.
• 39:55
  S4: With that £50 car seat?
• 39:58
  S5: Yeah, exactly.
• 39:59
  S4: It was £47 of, you know, £45 of car seat
• 40:03
  S4: and £5 of child.
• 40:05
  S2: I was kind of hoping when we were at the hospital,
• 40:07
  S2: they would forget that my wife and I were in there,
• 40:11
  S2: and they would just let us stay at the hospital forever.
• 40:16
  S4: And then as soon as you figure out how to,
• 40:18
  S4: you know, change a newborn diaper, you got a toddler.
• 40:21
  S4: And then as soon as you figure that out, you've
• 40:23
  S4: got a tween and then you've got a teen, and
• 40:25
  S4: then all of a sudden you've got a young adult
• 40:28
  S4: and you go, I thought at some point in time
• 40:30
  S4: it would get easier. But each stage of parenting has
• 40:33
  S4: its own challenges. How do we stick with it when
• 40:36
  S4: parenting gets hard? Cody Kimmel with us this morning. Cody
• 40:39
  S4: is the executive director of Grace based, a ministry committed
• 40:42
  S4: to encouraging, educating, and equipping families for every age and
• 40:46
  S4: stage of life. Cody, you are a dad of four.
• 40:49
  S4: How quickly did you realize that this parenting thing was
• 40:52
  S4: maybe a little harder than advertised?
• 40:55
  S8: It's so funny, you guys talking about the hospital today.
• 40:57
  S8: I would say right there. Uh, you know, we, uh,
• 40:59
  S8: had our first and, you know, my wife was exhausted. Uh,
• 41:03
  S8: I was tired, not as tired as her and heard
• 41:06
  S8: this baby crying down the hallway. And I was like, oh,
• 41:08
  S8: somebody really needs to do something about that baby. And
• 41:12
  S8: only to find out that that was our baby, and
• 41:14
  S8: we were the ones who had to do something about it.
• 41:15
  S8: And so our little hotel stay, our little getaway, um,
• 41:19
  S8: was interrupted by a little baby. And it's been interrupted
• 41:22
  S8: ever since then. And obviously so much joy, so much delight,
• 41:26
  S8: but very, very hard. Yeah, very much so. Relate to that.
• 41:29
  S4: And people often joke that, uh, this parenting journey, it
• 41:33
  S4: doesn't come with a manual. There's a lot of figuring
• 41:36
  S4: it out as you go with God's help that happens
• 41:39
  S4: in the, in every stage. But one thing that Grace
• 41:42
  S4: Based ministries is offering is this blueprint. Explain why blueprint.
• 41:47
  S4: I mean, is this the closest thing to a manual?
• 41:50
  S8: Yeah. I mean, we we'd like to think so, yes.
• 41:53
  S8: And and on the one hand, you're very right in
• 41:55
  S8: the sense that so much of parenting is responsive. You
• 41:58
  S8: are figuring it out as you go. Every child is different.
• 42:01
  S8: Every situation is different stage, all that stuff. But we
• 42:04
  S8: really believe that if you look at the Bible, there's
• 42:07
  S8: actually a way that we can look at God through
• 42:10
  S8: the lens of him being a father, how he treats us,
• 42:13
  S8: how he brings us from infancy when we first become,
• 42:17
  S8: you know, believers all the way to maturity. And that
• 42:21
  S8: as we look at that, we can actually see a
• 42:25
  S8: real blueprint, a real model for what it can be
• 42:28
  S8: like to be a parent. And that is kind of
• 42:31
  S8: the basis of what we talk about, what we teach,
• 42:34
  S8: and how do we bring parents into at least a framework,
• 42:38
  S8: maybe not instruction manual or anything like that, but, but
• 42:41
  S8: at least a framework to understand how we can do
• 42:44
  S8: this in the way that God is doing that towards us.
• 42:47
  S4: Let's start with what's the foundational understanding that we need
• 42:51
  S4: to have to kind of build the house, so to speak,
• 42:54
  S4: using your blueprint.
• 42:55
  S8: Yeah. So the foundational really, it's rooted in the nature
• 42:59
  S8: of what grace is, which is grace is something that
• 43:02
  S8: is ultimately meeting our inner needs. And that's where we
• 43:05
  S8: always start is that at the core of what we're doing,
• 43:08
  S8: we're wanting our home and the way we treat our
• 43:11
  S8: kids to be trying to meet the deep inner needs
• 43:13
  S8: that our kids have, and that is they have an
• 43:15
  S8: inner need for security, which we can give them in
• 43:19
  S8: this secure love, which essentially says, hey, there's nothing that
• 43:23
  S8: you can do to stop being loved. There's nothing you
• 43:25
  S8: can do to stop being a part of our family.
• 43:27
  S8: We are wanting to give them a meet, the need
• 43:30
  S8: for significance and purpose. And so we remind them of
• 43:35
  S8: who they are in God. And then we want to
• 43:38
  S8: help meet the inner need that they have for strength.
• 43:40
  S8: This question that they ask every single morning when they
• 43:42
  S8: wake up, do I have what it takes for today?
• 43:45
  S8: And we want to be constantly working towards that. And
• 43:49
  S8: I think if you build that foundation. So much other
• 43:51
  S8: good growth can come from that because that's the foundation
• 43:54
  S8: God gives us in his grace.
• 43:56
  S4: I mean, your whole ministry is called grace based. Some
• 44:00
  S4: people can hear that word and they think, oh, you know,
• 44:03
  S4: that's these soft millennial parents don't believe in discipline. That's
• 44:10
  S4: what's wrong with kids today. When you say a grace
• 44:14
  S4: based foundation, a grace based blueprint, define what you really
• 44:17
  S4: mean by that.
• 44:19
  S8: Oh, totally. And it's a great question. And it's something
• 44:21
  S8: that I think a lot of a lot of us
• 44:24
  S8: are working through. And to me, grace is not juxtaposed
• 44:27
  S8: to discipline. Discipline is something that has to happen as
• 44:30
  S8: a part of grace. The difference is, I think the
• 44:35
  S8: the way discipline interacts with our kids in grace environment
• 44:38
  S8: is different than if it was in a very legalistic
• 44:42
  S8: or very performance based environment, Grace states. We are gods
• 44:50
  S8: regardless of our behavior. And so there is a foundational
• 44:53
  S8: identity that we have, a foundational relationship that we have
• 44:56
  S8: that is something God gives to us. However, in that gift,
• 45:01
  S8: God wants us to grow into maturity, and the way
• 45:05
  S8: he does that is through discipline. And so for us,
• 45:10
  S8: grace and discipline are not opposed to each other. In fact,
• 45:13
  S8: to be gracious to our kids is to discipline our kids.
• 45:16
  S8: It is to bring them into something better. But it's
• 45:19
  S8: always geared towards their good. And I think that's the
• 45:22
  S8: big distinction with discipline and maybe other ways of looking
• 45:26
  S8: at it. The goal is not perfection. The goal is not,
• 45:29
  S8: you know, performance. The goal is really that we would
• 45:32
  S8: be present with them and that as they're learning and growing,
• 45:34
  S8: we're able to be present and walk through with them
• 45:36
  S8: until the end.
• 45:37
  S4: Cody Kimball from Grace based with us this morning. Coming up,
• 45:40
  S4: we've talked about the blueprint and the foundation. What about
• 45:44
  S4: the floor plan and ultimately what are we aiming for?
• 45:47
  S4: What do we consider success when it comes to parenting?
• 45:51
  S4: More coming up here on Carl and crew.
• 45:53
  S1: Walking closer to Jesus every day. You're listening to Carl
• 45:57
  S1: and Crew.
• 45:58
  S4: We have a special guest with us this morning, Cody
• 46:00
  S4: Kimmel from Grace based Ministry committed to encouraging, educating, and
• 46:04
  S4: equipping families for every age and stage of life. Sticking
• 46:08
  S4: with parenting often means being able to adapt and to
• 46:12
  S4: change and to admit when we are wrong. How important
• 46:16
  S4: is that, Cody? Just from for every single parent.
• 46:20
  S8: It's so important. And I think the mistake we make
• 46:24
  S8: is thinking that when we admit that we're wrong, we're
• 46:26
  S8: somehow communicating weakness. But what we're really communicating is trust.
• 46:31
  S8: Our kids are not surprised that we mess up in
• 46:33
  S8: the same way that we're not surprised that our kids
• 46:35
  S8: mess up. What grace does is it creates an environment
• 46:39
  S8: where mistakes are not the end of relationships, that mistakes
• 46:42
  S8: are not the end of trust. In fact, the repair
• 46:45
  S8: that happens when we apologize to our kids, or when
• 46:49
  S8: we leave room and space for those things to happen
• 46:52
  S8: is we actually build and cultivate deeper trust, and we
• 46:55
  S8: provide opportunities to actually learn and grow from those mistakes.
• 46:59
  S8: So they're not opposed to each other.
• 47:02
  S4: Talk a little bit about the four freedoms that we
• 47:05
  S4: want to emphasize when it comes to our kids.
• 47:08
  S8: What I love about Grace, one of the things that
• 47:10
  S8: we see modeled in God is he's inviting us into
• 47:13
  S8: something that is freer, that is not a burden that
• 47:16
  S8: is not bearing us down. So he invites us into freedom.
• 47:19
  S8: And those are the freedoms we want to give to
• 47:20
  S8: our kids. And we outlined four different ones. The first
• 47:24
  S8: is the freedom to be different, which sounds nice until
• 47:27
  S8: you realize what different can mean is, you know, weird
• 47:29
  S8: and sometimes annoying and sometimes just, I have no idea
• 47:33
  S8: what you're doing or why you're doing it. Yeah, but
• 47:35
  S8: God gives us those freedoms. And as parents, if we
• 47:38
  S8: can really, really work hard to allow those freedoms to
• 47:41
  S8: flourish and not make them moral things, we give our
• 47:44
  S8: kids the gift that God gives us. So that's the first.
• 47:46
  S8: Freedom is the freedom to be different. The next is
• 47:49
  S8: the freedom to be vulnerable. Our kids are facing the
• 47:51
  S8: same worlds that we face, and there's a lot of
• 47:54
  S8: moments in there that are hard and embarrassing. Our kids
• 47:57
  S8: are constantly trying to figure out who they are, and
• 47:59
  S8: if we can allow that space at home for them
• 48:02
  S8: to be vulnerable, for them to come to us with
• 48:04
  S8: their hurts, with their fears, with their embarrassments, and treat
• 48:08
  S8: them with kindness in those that gives them the freedom
• 48:10
  S8: to allow that to happen. The third freedom is the
• 48:13
  S8: freedom to be candid, which this is the hardest one,
• 48:15
  S8: I think, for a lot of parents, and it's the
• 48:16
  S8: hardest one for me, because it means that we need
• 48:18
  S8: to give them the freedom to say hard things to
• 48:22
  S8: us when we are frustrating them, or when we are
• 48:24
  S8: causing them pain or anger. It's the hardest one, but
• 48:27
  S8: it's one of the most powerful ones when they know
• 48:30
  S8: that we're not perfect and that when they're feeling that
• 48:34
  S8: they can come to us without fear of being punished,
• 48:37
  S8: without fear of ending things between us. And the last
• 48:40
  S8: one is the freedom to make mistakes that mistakes are.
• 48:44
  S8: Don't ever need to be bigger than what they are,
• 48:47
  S8: which is oftentimes just a mistake in the moment, whether
• 48:50
  S8: that's spilled milk mistake or they're very intentionally choosing to
• 48:54
  S8: lie or choosing to do something with consequences. And it
• 48:58
  S8: doesn't mean that the freedom to make mistakes means that
• 49:00
  S8: there's zero consequences or there's never discipline, but that we
• 49:04
  S8: make sure that those mistakes that are made within the
• 49:07
  S8: context of our home are never bigger than and more
• 49:10
  S8: powerful than they need to be. And that love, forgiveness, grace,
• 49:14
  S8: and the repair that comes after mistakes is so much
• 49:17
  S8: bigger and so much more powerful than the mistakes in themselves,
• 49:19
  S8: in and of themselves.
• 49:20
  S4: You know, my oldest is 16, and so I'm 16
• 49:24
  S4: years into a parenting journey, and I already kind of
• 49:27
  S4: have this feeling of, you kind of wish you could
• 49:29
  S4: do this thing backwards where you could have the any
• 49:34
  S4: sort of knowledge that you've gained as many years as
• 49:37
  S4: you are into your parenting journey and apply that to,
• 49:40
  S4: you know, like the very early years. Oh, yeah. Because
• 49:44
  S4: I think every parent looks back and there are things
• 49:46
  S4: that they would like to have done differently, adjustments that
• 49:50
  S4: they would have liked to have made, sometimes small, but
• 49:53
  S4: sometimes big. How do you take the principles that you
• 49:57
  S4: are outlining here and apply them to wherever you are
• 50:00
  S4: in your parenting journey, even if your kids are are older,
• 50:04
  S4: even young adults, and you feel like there's so much
• 50:08
  S4: that I would do differently. How do you start where
• 50:10
  S4: you are?
• 50:11
  S8: The first thing I would say is, for one, never
• 50:14
  S8: too late to implement grace in your home and to
• 50:17
  S8: start doing some of the things that you wish you
• 50:20
  S8: would have maybe done earlier. The second, and I will
• 50:23
  S8: say this to myself as well, is we need to
• 50:26
  S8: give ourselves a little bit of grace. There's a good
• 50:29
  S8: chance that we're doing better than we think and some
• 50:31
  S8: of these things. And I would say, you know, if
• 50:34
  S8: there's repair that needs to happen, then let it happen.
• 50:37
  S8: You know, recognize that with your kids and say, hey,
• 50:41
  S8: I really wish I had done this earlier and we
• 50:43
  S8: can't go back in time, but I would really love
• 50:46
  S8: to start doing this with you now. And I think
• 50:48
  S8: we will be shocked by just how much something like
• 50:51
  S8: that can do to launch kind of a better path forward,
• 50:55
  S8: especially when you're coming into it with, you know, teenagers
• 50:58
  S8: where you're worried like, oh, I've blown it, you've not
• 51:01
  S8: blown it, you've not, you've not set yourself back in
• 51:04
  S8: a way that you can't repair or can't move on.
• 51:07
  S5: Yeah.
• 51:08
  S4: We praise God for his grace that he has with us.
• 51:10
  S4: Cody Kimmel from Grace based. We've got a resource that
• 51:13
  S4: we want to point you to. We've been drawing principles
• 51:16
  S4: from this blueprints pathway. It equips parents with a framework
• 51:20
  S4: for treating their kids the way God treats them. It
• 51:23
  S4: is a ten videos. They're a little under five minutes
• 51:26
  S4: each video. You can march through it. It's available on
• 51:29
  S4: their website. Just text Grace to 805 557898. Take a
• 51:34
  S4: look at it. Just text grace to 805 557898.