Latest / The Sports Card CEO Podcast / Episode 2, S3: Big Matt x Little Matt Q&A | Navigating The Sports Card Market, Grading, and AI

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Episode 2, S3: Big Matt x Little Matt Q&A | Navigating The Sports Card Market, Grading, and AI · The Sports Card CEO Podcast

0:00
[SPEAKER_04]: What is happening everybody welcome back to another week of the sports cards C.E.O.
0:05
[SPEAKER_04]: at Big Matt You got a little Matt we're going to do a little bit of a mailbox episode today going through some listener questions Did he get another one?
0:16
[SPEAKER_03]: Get him on the side of your way back Get him on the other side of your head On the other side of your head Link over again That is he did it
0:28
[SPEAKER_02]: a 4070 season and a season unlike any other and age-only baseball history from one of the Koenia Junior.
0:38
[SPEAKER_03]: There's a drive right on the panel.
0:40
[SPEAKER_03]: Evan Barnard, what a season he is having.
0:45
[SPEAKER_03]: He hits the show hard.
0:46
[SPEAKER_03]: He hits the line of the left.
0:48
[SPEAKER_03]: My truck has ripped him on the run.
0:51
[SPEAKER_00]: What's up, guys?
0:52
[SPEAKER_00]: My truck.
0:52
[SPEAKER_00]: Listen, the sports car CEO is current.
0:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Buff on hand.
0:57
[SPEAKER_01]: What about how we doing it back?
0:58
[SPEAKER_01]: Doing good.
0:59
[SPEAKER_01]: Doing good.
1:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Big week ahead for me, have varsity basketball trials this week.
1:04
[SPEAKER_01]: So let's go.
1:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, looking forward to that, but you know, school, school work had the SAT this week and taken the SAT for the first time.
1:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Dude, you've got a big week.
1:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I do have a big week up ahead.
1:14
[SPEAKER_04]: Dude, it's actually really wild.
1:15
[SPEAKER_04]: For those that don't know, little mat goes to my alma mater high school.
1:19
[SPEAKER_04]: and so he's a sophomore and my sophomore year's the first year I started playing basketball.
1:23
[SPEAKER_04]: So it's pretty wild to see him out there doing it in a wildcat uniform.
1:27
[SPEAKER_04]: We got the twins also as freshmen, so I'm looking forward to basketball this year.
1:30
[SPEAKER_04]: Man, it'll be a really fun season to see you guys out there.
1:33
[SPEAKER_04]: I think the team's gonna be really good, so I should have a good time.
1:36
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, our teams should be pretty good this year, but I'm not really looking for the basketball season.
1:40
[SPEAKER_04]: All right, do well, us as well.
1:42
[SPEAKER_04]: So in classic CEO fashion, jumping into, you've already kind of shared a little bit about your week, give me a little bit of an update on the card side of your week, what's going on there.
1:52
[SPEAKER_01]: He had me in the card front, I'll tell you what, I get stuff on top for every week, man.
1:56
[SPEAKER_01]: Every single week, it's like this summer and we've talked about this more and more, and we'll talk about it here on the show.
2:02
[SPEAKER_01]: It's, it was to a point where it was like, fairytale.
2:06
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, literally like, I would, I didn't have to try to sell cards.
2:09
[SPEAKER_01]: It was, I would make a sheet and I'd send it to someone they'd be gone or I'd send some on a picture.
2:14
[SPEAKER_01]: They'd be gone and there was a person on the app.
2:17
[SPEAKER_01]: There was a single person who wasn't buying cards.
2:20
[SPEAKER_01]: or we go to a show and they'd be gone like that and now it just becomes tougher and tougher like you're actually having to shop cards now you're having to list them on eBay you're having to list them on Facebook and you've been telling me like I mean tell me it's one of the times that I mentioned on the show like can you be good when it's bad and it's like are you only good when you're handed you know the money or you're gonna go out and grind and make it and
2:44
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you got to think like, I got, I mean, that's stuff to pay for.
2:47
[SPEAKER_01]: I got car, I got, you got stuff to pay for.
2:50
[SPEAKER_01]: So I got to put food on the table.
2:52
[SPEAKER_04]: So well, you know, cars just never about putting food on the table for us.
2:56
[SPEAKER_04]: And that's where, you know, part of the reason why I went back to early Oak and did that.
3:00
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, of course, I love the insurance industry and my clients and my my business and so forth.
3:04
[SPEAKER_04]: But I did not want cars to be the only source of full-time income.
3:08
[SPEAKER_04]: And so, you know, that that was a very important aspect of why we did it, the way we did it.
3:14
[SPEAKER_04]: that said they're it creates pressure, you know, and you know, one of the things I would tell you is kind of just interesting and any of our listeners as well is like mentality is everything.
3:25
[SPEAKER_04]: If you wake up and you think of some tough market, nobody's going to buy is then you're probably going to just flounder and get out of the hobby.
3:32
[SPEAKER_04]: But if you have this kind of mindset and strategy and continue to move forward,
3:37
[SPEAKER_04]: like that is what helps people overcome you know tough moments and that's that mean again the sports card market's not going anywhere the hobby's not going anywhere some of the you know like you said the the the the whipped cream if if you will the the the the fast-making money stuff that might be
3:57
[SPEAKER_04]: you know, a foregone conclusion or an old, an old thought, but that said, but I mean, I want to point on one thing.
4:03
[SPEAKER_01]: We were watching the Wolf of Wall Street other night in the scene with Matthew McConaughey.
4:07
[SPEAKER_04]: Okay, I showed you a scene.
4:08
[SPEAKER_04]: You didn't watch the home.
4:08
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't know if it's not appropriate.
4:10
[SPEAKER_01]: No, we were watching a scene from it.
4:12
[SPEAKER_01]: And the scene with Matthew McConaughey, all he just goes is like, the whole market's a food gasey.
4:16
[SPEAKER_01]: He's like, it's all fairy tales, it's all fairy.
4:18
[SPEAKER_01]: And then it's pissy dusted.
4:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
4:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
4:21
[SPEAKER_01]: It translates to the card market so much because of how much the market was inflated and how much of it is like how much of it is real And that's what you go ask yourself like oh my gosh, was this sale real and you go look at this sale and you like thinking your mind and it's all you have to do in your mind is like reflect internally and say all right, I need to make smart decisions and
4:42
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, see how I can perform in this tough market.
4:45
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, you know, I have a very vivid experience for my past that when I was 22 years old, I was I moved to Florida, South Florida, Palm Beach area, selling real estate, and I watched the real estate boom from 2004 to 2006 in South Florida, like
5:07
[SPEAKER_04]: first-hand experience, you know, and I watched people making money hand-over-fist when everybody was flooding to South Florida to buy land, and here we were selling it.
5:15
[SPEAKER_04]: It's a lot like showed you the day Glenn Gary Glenn Ross, you know, that movie, you know, of course you've got
5:21
[SPEAKER_04]: like boiler room and these movies that have been made about like this high pressure sales environment.
5:26
[SPEAKER_04]: That's where I cut my teeth when I was 22, 23 years old is on the phone getting people to come down to Florida to buy land and it was wild watching what happened but simultaneously watching it all unfold.
5:41
[SPEAKER_04]: And so I see so many parallels between the industry and again the nature of people and the fear of missing out and the emotional buying and selling see this and I've known this and so I've always been like hey man hey man and you've been like dead you're so negative and it's not that I'm negative and it's not that I'm even right I'm just saying right now we're seeing the market shift a little bit.
6:03
[SPEAKER_04]: And so again, I appreciate you sharing that and you know we're going to talk a little bit today about some strategies and some approaches from some listener questions as far as my week goes I'm actually getting ready to go to boon North Carolina for a few days get away with some of the guys that I do a Bible study with.
6:19
[SPEAKER_04]: really looking forward to hanging with these guys being away for a couple of days.
6:22
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, it's always this tension of not being with the family, but needing some time alone.
6:26
[SPEAKER_04]: And so I'm in much need of a nice reset.
6:30
[SPEAKER_04]: So I may sleep through the entire day tomorrow after I drop up today, but it's going to be a good moment.
6:35
[SPEAKER_04]: It kind of hit reprieve.
6:36
[SPEAKER_04]: And then, you know, this weekend we're not really big Halloween peeps, but, you know, Halloween and neighborhood, you know, our neighborhood, a lot of folks will be around.
6:43
[SPEAKER_04]: And then next weekend we're trying to plan a trip to Williamsburg.
6:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, love bush gardens.
6:48
[SPEAKER_01]: What's gardens if if anyone's here listening bush gardens theme park is top tier.
6:52
[SPEAKER_01]: We all we always love doing down the last two years.
6:55
[SPEAKER_01]: This is a big third year, but highly recommend.
6:58
[SPEAKER_01]: But let's kick it off first listener question.
7:00
[SPEAKER_01]: I got this one last night.
7:01
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
7:01
[SPEAKER_01]: I got this one last night.
7:02
[SPEAKER_01]: And the guy said, when the market's shifting, like, how do you know what to buy?
7:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, what are you buying right now?
7:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Top things I would look at is, if you really want to make money, if you see people shifting, you have to beat people to the shift.
7:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Because if you beat in the shift before the market rises, you're going to make more money than people that are late.
7:22
[SPEAKER_01]: So get in early.
7:23
[SPEAKER_01]: So if you see something and you have conviction on it, get in as early as possible, don't overthink it, don't think too much about it.
7:31
[SPEAKER_01]: right now, my personal favorite thing is NBA.
7:34
[SPEAKER_01]: NBA season just started.
7:36
[SPEAKER_01]: I think there's been more hype on the NBA than ever with guys in the league like Luca, Wendy, Janice, Yoke, it's so much international talent in the league and the rookie class, the rookie class last year was like flag and con and Dylan Harper and Ace Bailey and this year it's even better.
7:53
[SPEAKER_01]: Karen Booser, Caleb Wilson, AJ DeBonce, Darren Peterson.
7:57
[SPEAKER_01]: You really have
8:01
[SPEAKER_01]: with football having a very weak rookie class baseball and having a great rookie class, I think a lot of people are going to flood over the basketball, so I'm mind a lot of NBA right now.
8:10
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, talking about this, what's your buy right now?
8:13
[SPEAKER_04]: I wanted to bring this up as an example, and into your point, I think.
8:17
[SPEAKER_04]: you're definitely right that NBA is the season that is getting ready to pop off people's eyes around the NBA.
8:24
[SPEAKER_04]: And you're going to see I think the market's going to flood.
8:26
[SPEAKER_04]: The market's going to find somewhere to put capital.
8:29
[SPEAKER_04]: It was interesting.
8:30
[SPEAKER_04]: Over the summer it was moving into the goats, braidies, Jordan stuff like that.
8:33
[SPEAKER_04]: And then here recently it's been moving into vintage, man.
8:36
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it has been, it's been moving into vintage the whole time, but we haven't seen it until now.
8:41
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, but it's pumped.
8:42
[SPEAKER_04]: But because I mean, think about this, like a 1953 tops Mickey Manel, PSA 3.
8:47
[SPEAKER_04]: We bought that card for $3,800, right?
8:50
[SPEAKER_04]: It's 2023.
8:51
[SPEAKER_01]: We bought it for a dude, that was a good three, too.
8:54
[SPEAKER_01]: That card was $3,000.
8:55
[SPEAKER_04]: It was like a, so we bought, we paid strong on a good three.
8:59
[SPEAKER_04]: I think we ended up selling that card for five grand.
9:01
[SPEAKER_04]: $45, $45.
9:02
[SPEAKER_04]: I ended up seeing somebody offer that same card right now at 8k.
9:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's not.
9:06
[SPEAKER_04]: So it's doubled and that's a 53-manel and that's a higher population, 50-square.
9:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, and this is why people always say of inches.
9:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, third in your safety deposits.
9:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's just say you like, what if we went out, 53-tops-manel is one of our all-time favorite cars.
9:19
[SPEAKER_01]: What if we went out with every profit we made each month, just say?
9:22
[SPEAKER_01]: And buy one.
9:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Just buy one every month.
9:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, and we were done.
9:25
[SPEAKER_01]: What?
9:25
[SPEAKER_01]: three years straight.
9:26
[SPEAKER_01]: That's 36 of them.
9:27
[SPEAKER_01]: We're probably ended up with a couple of fours, couple of three is couple of two's.
9:30
[SPEAKER_01]: Dude, we literally would have and you would have doubled up on 150 grand.
9:35
[SPEAKER_01]: That's 300k.
9:36
[SPEAKER_01]: Just off-card sitting in your safety deposit box.
9:38
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, for me though, that's where I struggle because I don't like holding cards.
9:43
[SPEAKER_01]: No, and that's where we can get into the conversation about Jackson Cherio right now.
9:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
9:47
[SPEAKER_01]: But we...
9:49
[SPEAKER_01]: Time means everything in sports cards and if you if you know When to sell something then you've made it, but well, when to buy something too.
9:58
[SPEAKER_04]: It's both by and sell You just funny the other day you made the video when you closed that big Brady lot and you made a comment You said we were joking you're staying at that Starbucks.
10:07
[SPEAKER_04]: She said coffee is for closers and this guy that you used to work with comes on He's like actually Closing is when you sell something not when you buy and I said
10:15
[SPEAKER_04]: Contrary to my friend, when you close on a house, you could be buying it, or you could be selling it.
10:22
[SPEAKER_04]: I said, when you are in the type of market we're in.
10:27
[SPEAKER_04]: buying is as important as selling when it's assets going to buy right and you want to start.
10:32
[SPEAKER_04]: So to your point about Cheerio this is something I brought up last night.
10:36
[SPEAKER_04]: Cheerio went three for three last night.
10:37
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't know when I went to bed.
10:39
[SPEAKER_04]: There are three out in the world.
10:40
[SPEAKER_04]: There are three out in the world series.
10:42
[SPEAKER_04]: He's had what I think he's the only player in history to have three 20 20 seasons to start his career.
10:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Yep and walk off in the divisional series.
10:50
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
10:52
[SPEAKER_01]: runs like Jackson Cheerio.
10:55
[SPEAKER_01]: We were buying his 499.
10:58
[SPEAKER_01]: We were buying his base.
10:59
[SPEAKER_01]: I remember the first Bowman car of every ball was a base Jackson Cheerio auto roll on eBay 280 bucks.
11:06
[SPEAKER_04]: And we were here to go.
11:07
[SPEAKER_04]: We were buying his 499 at 12, 1300.
11:12
[SPEAKER_01]: last week, that was when they were at the hundred.
11:14
[SPEAKER_01]: I remember buying some of 750 bucks.
11:16
[SPEAKER_01]: Really?
11:16
[SPEAKER_01]: And a PSI 10.
11:17
[SPEAKER_01]: I remember, well, we got three in a trade.
11:19
[SPEAKER_01]: We traded a Jason Manga's true blue for a three trio, refractor 10s and a wood and a thousand bucks.
11:27
[SPEAKER_01]: And
11:28
[SPEAKER_01]: I remember they were like 1500 and we did that trade, but all of them came down.
11:32
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, I think they came down to like a thousand and like after his debut, they were at like seven hundred and eight hundred bucks.
11:38
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, so, so Cheerio as a test case, specifically on his refractor autos.
11:43
[SPEAKER_04]: hit when he came out of the product, I'm pretty sure a PSA 10 was like around 1200 or something like that.
11:49
[SPEAKER_04]: And then he might start a building.
11:51
[SPEAKER_04]: Yep, and he kind of went up to 15.
11:53
[SPEAKER_04]: And then after his debut, those cards went down to 800 to 1000 and then floated around 800 to 1000 for a while.
12:00
[SPEAKER_04]: And we looked, I looked today, I think the last one sold for like 13, 1400.
12:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I mean, the craziest thing about this to me is,
12:08
[SPEAKER_01]: That card did more when he was a 19-year-old prospect versus him literally leading a team to a world series.
12:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
12:16
[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely nutsman.
12:17
[SPEAKER_01]: And this shows that like why you should sell prospects early.
12:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Unless it's like a dark horse guy that you think can go up, but for big prospects, there's no reason to hold.
12:28
[SPEAKER_01]: Is there a single prospect that they debuted in the major league, said his cards are up since they've used this year?
12:33
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
12:33
[SPEAKER_01]: My other whole corner, McGonagul.
12:35
[SPEAKER_01]: McGonagul has literally going to the best rookie seasons of all time and his cards are down.
12:38
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, the to the point about the Cheerio is it looks like last night, one sold for $19.99, but before that it did $1,400, $1,500.
12:46
[SPEAKER_04]: So to your point that Cheerio's peak was as his 19-year-old self, then he fell off and then he came back.
12:55
[SPEAKER_04]: So if you had conviction on Cheerio and you bought him when they were down at $7,800 or whatever, even a thousand, now you're kind of reaping the reward.
13:03
[SPEAKER_04]: So on a card like that, the conversation was about holding a card.
13:07
[SPEAKER_04]: On a card like that, you could have bought sold, bought sold, sold, sold, and still get back into the entry point that you were originally in on when he was 19 years old.
13:16
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
13:16
[SPEAKER_04]: You know what I mean?
13:18
[SPEAKER_04]: And you could have done it when you let's say with the car was $800, $900, you could have made $700, $600, $500, you could have paid for the car that you bought now on vintage.
13:27
[SPEAKER_04]: It's different because it's not volatile like that.
13:29
[SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't generally fluctuate unless it's like a good copy versus a bad copy.
13:34
[SPEAKER_04]: But the point being on vintage for me is I hate buying a card for $3,000 and holding it for six months and selling it for $3,000.
13:43
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, you're very good at that, was it?
13:45
[SPEAKER_01]: Don't you just say it, I'm not true statement.
13:48
[SPEAKER_01]: That is not a true statement.
13:49
[SPEAKER_01]: Take it back, take it back, take it back.
13:51
[SPEAKER_01]: It was just a joke.
13:52
[SPEAKER_01]: I always get on him for a...
13:54
[SPEAKER_01]: for literally buying up like he'll buy a card, he'll let sit on the shelf for two months and end up breaking even.
13:58
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just the inside joke that we have.
14:00
[SPEAKER_01]: But no, it's true.
14:01
[SPEAKER_01]: And or we'll make a few hundred dollars on it.
14:04
[SPEAKER_01]: But what's the one we are?
14:05
[SPEAKER_01]: We've got 48 leaf tablets, we've paid three grand, the Comps 3300, we'll end up son of a 3100, we'll make a hundred dollars.
14:11
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, and again.
14:12
[SPEAKER_04]: It's fine for me because I can hold the asset.
14:14
[SPEAKER_04]: I can look at it for a little bit and then I can sell it and make some money.
14:17
[SPEAKER_04]: It's more fun than just having money sitting in a bank account.
14:21
[SPEAKER_04]: But if you're wanting to make money and cards, you have to keep your money active.
14:25
[SPEAKER_04]: I guess that's the point to the listener question about windabye, what to buy and how to buy.
14:30
[SPEAKER_04]: So that's just like a multi-faceted answer to that listener question.
14:34
[SPEAKER_04]: So let's move on to the next one here, man.
14:36
[SPEAKER_01]: So, well, while you're looking for that one, I just want to talk about
14:41
[SPEAKER_01]: How the Jordan market right now.
14:42
[SPEAKER_01]: I know a lot of our listeners do building, but I really think there's a good opportunity coming up in the Jordan market.
14:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Jordan market is very volatile because you have certain cards that will way too high at some point and they all started to come down.
14:56
[SPEAKER_01]: And since they're coming down, the whole market's coming down, but some of the cards that are coming down should not be going down like the high voltage Michael Jordan.
15:04
[SPEAKER_01]: great Jordan card should not be going down so i think there's really good value in cars like the big mountain court the flare hot shots the high voltage because they're low pop they're rare and iconic Jordan insert one of the things i do want to say to our listeners is what ultimately drives the sports card market at the end of the day after all the noise fades
15:26
[SPEAKER_04]: is collectors.
15:28
[SPEAKER_04]: This hobby only exists because there's somebody out there who wants to collect this asset.
15:33
[SPEAKER_04]: And the reality is is there was a lot of corporate money that got flooded in with the breakers and with the inventory and the opening of card shops and people needed this inventory.
15:44
[SPEAKER_04]: So there was an acquisition of all of these cards.
15:48
[SPEAKER_04]: but those people, not all of them, but most of them inherently are not collecting the cards, they're using the cards as inventory.
15:57
[SPEAKER_04]: So when you have a card that is ultimately a collector's piece, that's what's going to drive the value.
16:04
[SPEAKER_04]: Now, I would argue,
16:06
[SPEAKER_04]: that this kind of card here.
16:08
[SPEAKER_04]: So this we're just going to show this.
16:09
[SPEAKER_04]: This is a 1993 finest Michael Jordan.
16:12
[SPEAKER_04]: Okay, it's not the refractor.
16:14
[SPEAKER_04]: It's a high population card.
16:17
[SPEAKER_04]: It's cool to have in a binder.
16:19
[SPEAKER_04]: It's, in my opinion, not a card that is going to be a long-term collectible compared to these 90s inserts.
16:27
[SPEAKER_04]: And so that's what's ultimately going to separate this market.
16:31
[SPEAKER_04]: These cards that are true collectible pieces, art pieces, highly sought after, highly rare, versus ones that are kind of readily available.
16:40
[SPEAKER_04]: So that's the transition that's happening.
16:43
[SPEAKER_01]: And I mean, it goes to the conversation we had a few weeks ago about rare and iconic.
16:48
[SPEAKER_01]: And, or, by rare versus iconic, but some of these Jordan inserts, you get our iconic and rare.
16:53
[SPEAKER_01]: So you can find bugs that hit every single box.
16:56
[SPEAKER_04]: Yep.
16:57
[SPEAKER_04]: All right.
16:57
[SPEAKER_04]: So next listen to a question here.
16:59
[SPEAKER_04]: This is something we talked about before, but the question is, when will a raw card sell for the less than a PSA-9?
17:08
[SPEAKER_04]: And I can't believe it hasn't happened already.
17:11
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, because it shows you how ingrained the hobby is in PSA.
17:17
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, it really depends on the card, right?
17:19
[SPEAKER_01]: I will say so I don't know if they're talking about like a downtown because downtown's high gem rate.
17:25
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of they get graded a lot.
17:27
[SPEAKER_01]: So like maybe a PSA nine should do the same as raw.
17:30
[SPEAKER_01]: But on a card like a Jordan insert or even like
17:35
[SPEAKER_01]: a LeBron tops Chrome rookie, Rawls kidding, like close to PS9 in it should like not be that way.
17:41
[SPEAKER_04]: Well look at, you look at like Bowman stuff too.
17:43
[SPEAKER_04]: Like for years, it was always a Raw.
17:48
[SPEAKER_04]: was the same as like a PSA-8-ish, and then you had a small premium, maybe 20%, maybe, maybe, maybe 10, yeah, on a nine, and then you were like two X-ish on a 10, right?
18:01
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, right when we got on the hobby, like there was like a three X difference between him, we're all on a 10.
18:07
[SPEAKER_01]: and then it like slowly got down to the two and then two and a half and then like now like there's a two X difference and a nine to the ten.
18:16
[SPEAKER_04]: And again the question is is when will that change?
18:19
[SPEAKER_04]: It changes when the buyers change.
18:22
[SPEAKER_04]: When people start placing value on PSA Nines is when
18:36
[SPEAKER_04]: cards that were graded before are now being sold as raws on eBay cards that were in a BGS lab are are now being moved over to PSA PSA is being resimitted like the market itself
18:52
[SPEAKER_04]: unless it gets regulated in a way where it's controlled from top to bottom, that is what you're going to be dealing with.
18:59
[SPEAKER_04]: And so when people come into the hobby and don't understand that there are some cards that may have been graded three and four times because it's all subjective and because the market has allowed this to occur because at the end of the day people pay the bigger number for the higher grade, that's just the way it works, you know what I mean?
19:21
[SPEAKER_04]: When you start to understand these things, you understand that that's what's driving this, not necessarily logistical common sense.
19:30
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, the market is not being driven by common sense.
19:34
[SPEAKER_04]: And when you can find things that don't make sense, then you can kind of exploit them and start to make your money.
19:40
[SPEAKER_04]: And, you know, if that's the primary objective.
19:43
[SPEAKER_04]: Now, it was funny I was talking to a buddy David the other day.
19:46
[SPEAKER_04]: And it's funny.
19:46
[SPEAKER_04]: I always talk about David and David was never been on the podcast, but you know, I want to get him on one day and get him spiced up a little bit.
19:53
[SPEAKER_01]: David is the one that put us on to buy in PSA 9.
19:56
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
19:57
[SPEAKER_04]: David, David consumes a ton of these local guy for and he consumes a ton of content and sports card hobby.
20:03
[SPEAKER_04]: He's really smart with investing and stuff and he approaches it that way.
20:06
[SPEAKER_04]: And he'll always call me and he was like, big Matt, I got a question for you.
20:10
[SPEAKER_04]: And he called me another day and he asked me about a 93 top's finest refractor current congenior, which is still my ghost card, okay?
20:17
[SPEAKER_04]: I bought this card two times now.
20:19
[SPEAKER_04]: I bought it the first time I got lost, I got refunded.
20:22
[SPEAKER_04]: I bought it the second time and it did not clear authentication.
20:25
[SPEAKER_04]: The third time I went after it, I was the underbitter on a PSA 8 by 20 bucks.
20:30
[SPEAKER_04]: I cannot secure this card anyway.
20:33
[SPEAKER_04]: He asked me he said, why would you buy a raw card of that off of eBay right because it's 1993 every good copies been graded and I said because quite frankly at this point time it's not about the
20:45
[SPEAKER_04]: copy of the grade.
20:47
[SPEAKER_04]: It's about the card.
20:48
[SPEAKER_04]: If I just have the card to sit on my shelf, I can upgrade it later.
20:51
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, that's a great point you made.
20:53
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's about like, it's almost like, if you want to have a checklist, like, and you want to question yourself on, okay, is this a card I want for my PC?
20:59
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, does it have to be graded?
21:01
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
21:01
[SPEAKER_01]: It should be valuable.
21:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.
21:05
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll say, every card we have up on the shelf, which on the shelf, we have pretty strict rule like we try to keep a certain amount of cards.
21:11
[SPEAKER_01]: None of those cards have to be graded to be proven value.
21:13
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
21:14
[SPEAKER_01]: All of them are.
21:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Flared Jordan, Star Jordan, your Ripkins, all those are rare, good cards that don't need to be graded.
21:20
[SPEAKER_01]: But a card like a Steph Curry topstruck, that card needs to be like a PS-10 is four times more than a PS-10.
21:26
[SPEAKER_01]: That card needs to be graded to have good value.
21:28
[SPEAKER_01]: Because of population.
21:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
21:30
[SPEAKER_04]: So it's, it's interesting when you really start to think about this PSA situation and PSA NONs versus Raw.
21:36
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, we've said it for years.
21:37
[SPEAKER_04]: I think there's value in PSA NONs.
21:40
[SPEAKER_04]: I think when the market is snubbing PSA NONs, you can grab a PSA NON and, and long-term especially, think about this.
21:47
[SPEAKER_04]: If you owned, this is a way for example, but just stick with me.
21:51
[SPEAKER_04]: If you owned a PSA-9 versus a PSA-10 versus a PSA-7 versus a PSA-5 of a 52 top's mantle, yeah.
22:02
[SPEAKER_04]: It doesn't really matter.
22:03
[SPEAKER_04]: It matters.
22:04
[SPEAKER_04]: It's hundreds of thousands of dollars from a five to an eight.
22:07
[SPEAKER_04]: Lawrence.
22:07
[SPEAKER_04]: But my point though,
22:10
[SPEAKER_04]: at the end of the day, you own the card.
22:12
[SPEAKER_01]: But like, I feel like that example because you're not, I mean, the grade matters a lot of money.
22:17
[SPEAKER_01]: I think a difference would kind of be like a one versus two versus three versus a five versus a 10.
22:22
[SPEAKER_04]: Like that's kind of crazy because a 10's probably 50 million and a five's 250 K. Again, if you don't have conviction to own the card, my point is if you don't have conviction to own the card in a nine,
22:34
[SPEAKER_04]: or it or raw, why would you, like if you're buying it with a specific expectation, which is in this case, a raw card might gem.
22:43
[SPEAKER_04]: So people are paying more than a PSA 9.
22:46
[SPEAKER_04]: I would say if it's not a serial number card, you're better off to crack the 9 and resubmit the 9, then you are to buy the 10.
22:55
[SPEAKER_04]: you know what I mean.
22:56
[SPEAKER_04]: That's just the nature of it.
22:57
[SPEAKER_01]: No, it is.
22:58
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I'm not saying you're giving away our secret, but like, that's kind of what we figured out a while back.
23:03
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's not a secret that most of all is cooked unless it's fresh out the product.
23:07
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, unless you find somebody on eBay who hit it out of a pack or whatever.
23:11
[SPEAKER_04]: That's insane.
23:11
[SPEAKER_04]: Unless it's everybody's story.
23:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, I hit it.
23:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
23:14
[SPEAKER_04]: And I get it and it's all like crinkled up.
23:16
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I
23:17
[SPEAKER_01]: If you go to shows 90% of the raw cuts, it just proves how much grading how much grading actually happens.
23:22
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, it influences the heck I'm on.
23:24
[SPEAKER_01]: It's nuts.
23:25
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's why I'd rather go after a nine that literally tells me, okay, this card is almost a gem versus, and I don't have to look at the card.
23:34
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't have to spend my time asking for pictures.
23:37
[SPEAKER_01]: I already know this card's almost a gem.
23:40
[SPEAKER_01]: Versus, all right, hey, can you send back pictures?
23:42
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that corner's messed up.
23:44
[SPEAKER_01]: And perfect example, something I look for.
23:47
[SPEAKER_01]: 2025 Bowman is the most notorious, and they call it the Bowman corner.
23:51
[SPEAKER_01]: It has the back corner, which is colored for God knows why.
23:55
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know why tops did this.
23:56
[SPEAKER_01]: The back corner is colored.
23:58
[SPEAKER_01]: So let's just say you see a PSA9 Hazus mod A blue 1700 bucks.
24:03
[SPEAKER_01]: But the back corner looks perfect.
24:05
[SPEAKER_01]: That means, okay, this one probably is a better shot than 90% of other ones.
24:09
[SPEAKER_01]: So you go buy it at 1700.
24:11
[SPEAKER_01]: You crack it.
24:12
[SPEAKER_01]: You send it to PSA.
24:13
[SPEAKER_01]: They give it a $10, $60, $500 card.
24:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Infinite money glitch.
24:16
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, but here's the thing.
24:17
[SPEAKER_04]: And people might go, oh, why can't believe you do it?
24:20
[SPEAKER_04]: Until the market gets regulated to a point where you can't do that.
24:25
[SPEAKER_04]: That is nothing more than resubmitting a card to get a subjective grade.
24:30
[SPEAKER_04]: That's what the hobby has created.
24:32
[SPEAKER_04]: It's basically created tomato, tomato, potato, potato, two different graders look at it.
24:39
[SPEAKER_04]: One goes non-one goes tin.
24:40
[SPEAKER_04]: Now, what we found out was that at the national, they bring in their top tier graders who are a lot more stringent on this kind of stuff.
24:49
[SPEAKER_04]: So they're trying to figure out the supply and demand.
24:52
[SPEAKER_04]: So they're just hiring people, running them through a three-day training on how to grade a card, and then they're just trying to process to get that form of college kids grading it versus a person.
25:01
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, and then you've got like a, which is why people value what Mike Baker has to say, because he was a lead grader at PSA.
25:08
[SPEAKER_04]: So if there's a true subject of opinion on the value of a card,
25:13
[SPEAKER_04]: then you can take advantage of that by resimitting it, getting somebody else to look at it, versus they're being an objective.
25:21
[SPEAKER_04]: This is why people argue, should there be AI when it comes degrading?
25:26
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
25:27
[SPEAKER_04]: And again, who knows what that we're going to get into all that today?
25:29
[SPEAKER_04]: The other thing I want to say in a list or question, we got two more.
25:32
[SPEAKER_04]: One is that this one came in on the topic.
25:35
[SPEAKER_04]: How would you fix PSA?
25:38
[SPEAKER_04]: That was the question.
25:39
[SPEAKER_04]: Now, I'm going to let you answer this as a young hobby guy and I'm going to come at it from a business perspective.
25:45
[SPEAKER_01]: All right.
25:46
[SPEAKER_01]: So obviously, you're the most popular company.
25:51
[SPEAKER_01]: You what you did is I honestly, I think they bought back it.
25:54
[SPEAKER_01]: They bought SGCS no secret.
25:55
[SPEAKER_01]: They made them worse.
25:56
[SPEAKER_01]: Becky has gotten so much worse since PSA bought them.
25:59
[SPEAKER_01]: And what does that make people do?
26:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Why would I send a back it for $30?
26:03
[SPEAKER_01]: When I could just send a PSA for 150, so PSA, like I'm not saying they're purposely doing a bad job to get more people send a PSA, but I really think that Beckett, SGC was great, SGC was falling off.
26:16
[SPEAKER_01]: Beckett was great, now they're falling off.
26:17
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's kind of coming to the dark side, you have to submit with PSA at this point.
26:22
[SPEAKER_01]: So if a lot of people are submitting with you, I think you have to expand, expand, expand.
26:31
[SPEAKER_01]: Now what are regular orders now?
26:32
[SPEAKER_01]: Was it 80, 90 days?
26:34
[SPEAKER_01]: Like that's insane.
26:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Regular orders should be within a month.
26:37
[SPEAKER_01]: Express orders like if I send it like, I remember we sent the star Jordan off on a Monday on a super express and we got it back Friday.
26:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, I'm not saying she'd be like that, but if I send a super trip, if I've paid you $500,000 to grade a card,
26:52
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm expecting that card back in less than two weeks.
26:54
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
26:55
[SPEAKER_04]: So I don't know, so everything is controlled in one or two facilities.
27:02
[SPEAKER_04]: Yep.
27:02
[SPEAKER_04]: That's crazy to me.
27:04
[SPEAKER_04]: That means you can only send your cards to one or two facilities.
27:08
[SPEAKER_04]: And how in West Coast?
27:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Yep, us from North Carolina.
27:10
[SPEAKER_04]: Yep, we've got to ship it all the way across the country, which we haven't even gotten into this, but the whole theft thing.
27:15
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, but from Friday.
27:16
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
27:17
[SPEAKER_04]: This is where I think a business development strategy.
27:22
[SPEAKER_04]: I know you left the truck.
27:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, for an hour, I don't want to break.
27:25
[SPEAKER_04]: And it feels, everything about it feels like an inside job.
27:28
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
27:29
[SPEAKER_04]: But here's the thing.
27:31
[SPEAKER_04]: I come from the world of one-to-one coaching, consulting, speaking, whatever, working with executives and helping them.
27:40
[SPEAKER_04]: look at John Maxwell right so I'm not a certified life coach or whatever I do life coaching but I didn't pay for some certification from John Maxwell but John Maxwell has a program that you can go through and you can pay two three four brand for it and then you can be a John Maxwell certified coach and people pay you to coach them based on that certification.
27:57
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't know why PSA would not offer a certification program where they train people satellite
28:06
[SPEAKER_04]: to be graders within their program and have the ability to grade cards other than just in their facility.
28:15
[SPEAKER_04]: It would help with the shipping thing and in listen, set up 10 or 15 hubs or
28:21
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, 50 hubs across the country.
28:23
[SPEAKER_04]: Every state has a PSA hub where you have certified graders and people can take their cards or whatever.
28:30
[SPEAKER_04]: I feel like there would be a quicker turnaround.
28:33
[SPEAKER_04]: You would have people being able to deal with it themselves.
28:37
[SPEAKER_04]: And I don't know.
28:37
[SPEAKER_04]: I just feel like that they've missed the boat on not allowing third parties to get certified because they could charge for the certification process.
28:46
[SPEAKER_04]: And then that person could then turn charge as an official PSA
28:50
[SPEAKER_04]: And they do that basically with LCS is who want to submit on your behalf.
28:53
[SPEAKER_04]: But those people aren't grading the card.
28:55
[SPEAKER_04]: All they're doing is shipping them for you.
28:56
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
28:57
[SPEAKER_01]: And they get lower rates.
28:58
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's one of the things like the PSO basically go to the car shops and they'll say, OK, we'll give you a few submit.
29:03
[SPEAKER_01]: This may car service will give you these rates.
29:05
[SPEAKER_01]: But, Pete, what I've seen PSA, they've created drop-off stations.
29:09
[SPEAKER_01]: I know CarzageQ are partners, Gary, obviously, of some Georgia.
29:12
[SPEAKER_01]: So, they have PSA, CarzageQ drop-off station.
29:15
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the most pointless thing I've ever seen in my life.
29:17
[SPEAKER_01]: So, you go drive.
29:18
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to mail it, but you can mail it.
29:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's the most pointless thing ever.
29:22
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to take time out of my day instead of going to the post office five minutes for my house.
29:26
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to go drive an hour to CarzageQ to do the same as I think.
29:30
[SPEAKER_01]: that it makes zero sense to me.
29:32
[SPEAKER_01]: Number one, I think it takes longer because you got to think from cards it's cue.
29:36
[SPEAKER_01]: When you get the cards back in mail, you're like, you get them back.
29:39
[SPEAKER_01]: What cards is cue probably as to, okay, we have a new PS order and we're going to log them first, make sure everything got in.
29:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Hey, your PSA order is ready.
29:46
[SPEAKER_01]: How long do you think it takes?
29:47
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just to email you instead.
29:49
[SPEAKER_01]: You're probably waiting extra two weeks between
29:51
[SPEAKER_01]: cards each two shipping them because let's just say they ship all orders out on a Friday and you give it to them on a Tuesday like you're probably waiting extra two weeks.
29:58
[SPEAKER_01]: It's pointless.
29:59
[SPEAKER_01]: Drop offgrading is pointless.
30:01
[SPEAKER_01]: What I will say PSA needs to set up at more shows.
30:04
[SPEAKER_01]: We see the popularity if the Dallas cart downscarcher is back at Beckett is awful with the Dallas cartcher.
30:11
[SPEAKER_01]: They literally like the grades they give them the Dallas cartcher is awful.
30:15
[SPEAKER_01]: But if PSA could find a way to set up a national, if PSA could find a way to set up a fanatics fest and one other show, that other show would become so popular just because of PSA being there.
30:28
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm telling you PSA needs to certify third party graders on their behalf.
30:35
[SPEAKER_04]: and put a program in place where you can scale the grading process laterally, instead of having to grow it all vertically integrated within one building in California or whatever it is, or now New Jersey or something.
30:51
[SPEAKER_04]: So that's just my two cents.
30:52
[SPEAKER_04]: They've got so much money to be able to do this, and they need to put this on like a multi-level marketing scale or something.
31:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Think about the PSA vault, how much money they're making there.
31:03
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, it's like it's not free to say as your own repack.
31:06
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, so we could talk for days about how to fix PSA, but my immediate thing is A, it needs to be fixed and B, you've have to come up with a different business model to be able to scale the grading side instead of try to keep it all vertical under one building.
31:21
[SPEAKER_04]: You've got to go horizontal.
31:22
[SPEAKER_04]: It comes back to the Starbucks Starbucks model, create multiple locations,
31:27
[SPEAKER_04]: where proprietors can come in and take your coffee beans and take your stuff and sell it and they can make money.
31:34
[SPEAKER_04]: Now, I don't know that Starbucks, I think they're corporate locations, but my point is is whether it's franchise or corporate or whatnot, you have to have multiple locations.
31:43
[SPEAKER_04]: You have to scale by having, well, instead of having one Starbucks coffee shop in Seattle that everybody has to go to.
31:49
[SPEAKER_04]: All right, rant done.
31:50
[SPEAKER_04]: All right, here's the last question Matthew.
31:56
[SPEAKER_04]: from Lance and this was an email that came in.
31:58
[SPEAKER_04]: He said, here's a listener question.
32:00
[SPEAKER_04]: Thanks for opening the door here.
32:01
[SPEAKER_04]: My name's Lance and I'm an Auburn fan in a dad of three girls.
32:04
[SPEAKER_04]: I started buying and trading cards this year and my top dream is to work my way up to a 1986 top traded Tiffany Bow Jackson PSA 10.
32:17
[SPEAKER_04]: My man.
32:18
[SPEAKER_04]: When you're flipping to fun, a long-term grail, how do you decide what to sell and what to hold?
32:24
[SPEAKER_04]: Thank
32:26
[SPEAKER_01]: This is easy answer as it gets.
32:29
[SPEAKER_01]: You don't hold anything if you're going for your grill.
32:32
[SPEAKER_01]: If the card isn't, what number one I would say is, that Tiffany Bo Jackson is an expensive, what does it do?
32:39
[SPEAKER_01]: Probably four grand.
32:40
[SPEAKER_01]: It's an expensive card.
32:41
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a rare card.
32:43
[SPEAKER_01]: So the first thing I do is, I think I know that a PSA 9's 1500,
32:48
[SPEAKER_01]: I wouldn't, as soon as you go get 1500 go by nine, but I'd say you keep trading up until you get three grand and then you go by nine and restart with it and then restart with 1500.
32:59
[SPEAKER_01]: Just so you have it in your back pocket that you know that, okay, I have a nine, I'm gonna work towards the 10th.
33:07
[SPEAKER_01]: about the flipping point.
33:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Go to as many shows as possible.
33:10
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the only way that you can do many deals at one time because you got to think.
33:15
[SPEAKER_01]: If you do it on eBay, I'll be going to sell this card goes through authentication.
33:18
[SPEAKER_01]: They take 13 per do this.
33:20
[SPEAKER_01]: But if you buy a card, go through authentication have to get it in the mail.
33:26
[SPEAKER_01]: Also, I think it's important what you buy.
33:28
[SPEAKER_01]: I wouldn't take risks.
33:29
[SPEAKER_01]: I wouldn't my rookie quarterbacks.
33:31
[SPEAKER_01]: I kind of stay with the goats.
33:33
[SPEAKER_01]: I wouldn't grade cards.
33:34
[SPEAKER_01]: Grating is just time right now.
33:36
[SPEAKER_01]: And if you're grading cards, I mean, it's just time.
33:40
[SPEAKER_01]: And what I would do maybe is like, I feel like five grand, maybe build out of grading order with a couple thousand dollar cards and send them off at one time, but make sure you have money.
33:49
[SPEAKER_01]: While those cards are grading, make sure you have money that you can kind of play around with to keep flipping up.
33:55
[SPEAKER_01]: So I've got a apologize.
33:57
[SPEAKER_04]: I was grossly off the last sale of a PSA 10 Bo Jackson Tiffany did 25 grand.
34:07
[SPEAKER_04]: That blows my mind.
34:09
[SPEAKER_04]: blows my mind.
34:10
[SPEAKER_04]: It's a pop 37.
34:11
[SPEAKER_04]: Okay.
34:13
[SPEAKER_04]: So that kind of changes things a little bit.
34:15
[SPEAKER_04]: I thought you're going after, you know, a five, six thousand dollar card probably.
34:19
[SPEAKER_04]: And again, I look back in a year ago, it was 10 grand.
34:23
[SPEAKER_04]: Okay.
34:23
[SPEAKER_04]: So it's, it's, well, that's all from Florida.
34:26
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, yeah, so like five have sold in the last three years.
34:30
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, it's a pop 37 so that makes me change my mind a little bit So I do like what little Matt said and this is what I'm going to say go get a nine a nine does two grand The 9th of value and the nine feels like value because the nine is a pop 183 so you're you're you're basically pop 200 Yeah, it's a subjective
34:49
[SPEAKER_01]: 90% of the tens that are all labeled be nons today.
34:53
[SPEAKER_04]: Absolutely.
34:53
[SPEAKER_01]: And 90% of the PSA nons that are freshly labeled would be tensed.
34:57
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, go get a nons, you know, absolutely what he said, go get a nons and keep looking for the nons.
35:01
[SPEAKER_04]: Honestly, I don't need to 10.
35:03
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't need to 10.
35:04
[SPEAKER_04]: Not on that card.
35:05
[SPEAKER_04]: If I get a centered nons and that card has that black border, it's kind of tough.
35:09
[SPEAKER_04]: Again, it magnification.
35:10
[SPEAKER_04]: You can you tell that there's a little bit of an edge.
35:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Bring up the card again, the 2009 topstaff curry.
35:15
[SPEAKER_01]: I swear I had the best 2009 topstaff curry copy in the entire world.
35:19
[SPEAKER_01]: Out of the 5,000 dollar printed, I had the number one.
35:24
[SPEAKER_01]: I ain't literally makes me so mad that I sold it.
35:27
[SPEAKER_01]: But I had to sell it.
35:28
[SPEAKER_01]: Nines were $1500 and I sold it for 10 grand in a 10.
35:32
[SPEAKER_01]: Like the difference made no sense.
35:34
[SPEAKER_01]: But like on that card, I would never go pick up a 10 for 20K.
35:38
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a base PSA 10 for 20 grand.
35:40
[SPEAKER_01]: But I buy 9 in a heartbeat, five K for a 9.
35:42
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, so a first of all, I would not to not to for Lance not to, you know, Pupu on your goal of owning a PSA 10, you know, go go for what it is that you want to go for, but I would say what little Matt said is you sell everything that's not that card, if that's your ultimate goal, you move whatever you can move for profit.
36:02
[SPEAKER_04]: Yep.
36:02
[SPEAKER_04]: to get to that point.
36:03
[SPEAKER_04]: But I would buy a nine.
36:04
[SPEAKER_04]: So you have something on your shelf, not to miss out on it, because on a pop threat like that, it could be really, really challenging.
36:11
[SPEAKER_04]: This is part of what we've learned is, you know, you've got to get cards when you can get them.
36:16
[SPEAKER_04]: And sometimes they're just not going to come up again for a long time.
36:19
[SPEAKER_04]: And so pull the trigger.
36:21
[SPEAKER_04]: The the card that I've missed.
36:23
[SPEAKER_04]: is the PMG Carrotkin, a fanatics fest, a year and a half ago, we had the card in hand, had a chance to buy it and didn't buy it.
36:33
[SPEAKER_04]: I have not seen one come up for sale since in a year and a half.
36:35
[SPEAKER_01]: With a six came up, we did a twenty nine.
36:38
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
36:38
[SPEAKER_04]: So anyway, and then also I love the point that you made is I wouldn't grade.
36:43
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
36:44
[SPEAKER_04]: I wouldn't grade and then what I would do is I would niche down into a few specific areas that you could focus on.
36:51
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, even a few specific cards, and that's what we've done a very good job at is like, they're literally people that make money just sticking to five cards break contenders,
37:02
[SPEAKER_01]: 52 mannels, 33 gattie roofs and Brady Bumblecrumbs.
37:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Like there are people that literally do those five cards and make hundreds of thousands of dollars.
37:10
[SPEAKER_04]: And those are all big cards.
37:11
[SPEAKER_04]: So find five cards or 10 cards that you really have.
37:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Or just have types of cards like Jordan inserts, downtowns, cabooms, like, wow, downtowns of cabooms are like really good money back on the day.
37:22
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think this still could be today.
37:24
[SPEAKER_04]: And the other thing too is in a market like this, you've got to be have a little bit more grind in you.
37:29
[SPEAKER_04]: You've got to do some research, you've got to look on Facebook marketplace, you've got to look in Facebook groups, you've got to look on Instagram, you've got to look on eBay, you've got to look at the different auction houses, you have to scower the market to find value.
37:42
[SPEAKER_04]: And then like little Matt said, you've got to be at shows, you have to have connections to be able to turn those cards.
37:48
[SPEAKER_04]: And so again, try to create a monthly process where you say, hey, I'm going to buy two grand this month, and I'm going to try to turn two grand into three grand.
37:56
[SPEAKER_04]: And you do that every month, every month, every month, you've made 12k at the end of the year, your halfway to your Bo Jackson.
38:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Last thing I'll say is you just named you say, oh, you got a grind, you got to do this, you got to look on either, you got to find value,
38:12
[SPEAKER_01]: A. I can do almost all of that for you.
38:16
[SPEAKER_01]: And if you want to make one in sports cards, I'd highly recommend using AI to your advantage.
38:21
[SPEAKER_01]: A. I has done great things for me in the sports card industry.
38:24
[SPEAKER_01]: And it really could help your business.
38:27
[SPEAKER_04]: Yep.
38:27
[SPEAKER_04]: the last thing I'll leave it.
38:29
[SPEAKER_04]: It is a fantastic research to what will Matt.
38:31
[SPEAKER_04]: I feel like this has been really helpful.
38:33
[SPEAKER_04]: Really good episode.
38:34
[SPEAKER_04]: Answer some listener questions.
38:35
[SPEAKER_04]: To our listeners to our viewers, we appreciate you guys.
38:37
[SPEAKER_04]: Thanks so much for listening for watching.
38:39
[SPEAKER_04]: Feel free to send us any messages, sports cards, CEO, those sports cards, CEO on Instagram.
38:44
[SPEAKER_04]: The sports cards CEO at gmail.com, as far as that goes.
38:48
[SPEAKER_04]: 888 pod CEOs, if you want to call in a message.
38:51
[SPEAKER_04]: and yeah, hit us up and then a little Matt and I are hand house sports on Instagram so feel free to shout out to us there.
38:57
[SPEAKER_04]: But appreciate you guys watching and you'll have a great week.
38:59
[SPEAKER_04]: We'll be back next.
39:00
[SPEAKER_04]: Peace.