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The opportunities for female financial planners - Marie Smith · Financial Planner Life Podcast

• 0:04
  SPEAKER_03: Hi, and welcome to the Financial Planner Life Podcast, where we talk to professionals at varying stages in their career about what it's like working in the wonderful world of financial planning and financial advice.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_03: This podcast is proudly sponsored by Recruit UK, a recruitment consultancy specifically focused on the financial services.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_03: They have a niche specialism, recruiting, within the financial planning industry.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_03: So check out their website for the latest job opportunities, hints and tips, and blog articles.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_03: And today's guest is Marie Smith from Cooper Parry Wealth.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_03: Marie joins me today and talks about her journey into financial planning, starting out as an administrator and working her way up into power planning and eventually becoming a power planning manager.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_03: She's actually recently been promoted to a director-level relationship position for Cooper Parry Wealth.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_03: And we talk about the distinct lack of females in the financial planning profession in leadership positions and the benefit of females getting into those positions to help the next generation feel confident to progress their careers within the profession.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_03: We also talk about mentorship, how she reached out to a mentor over in the USA.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_03: We also talk about the importance of learning and development throughout your career and how Cooper Parry Wealth have supported her and her journey.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_03: It's a fantastic episode.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_03: She shares very deeply about her career, very passionate about her profession, and I think she's an inspiration to lots of females and males who are thinking about progressing their career within financial planning.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_03: I hope you enjoy it.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_03: Marie, thanks so much for joining me today on the Financial Planner Life podcast.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_03: How are you?
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_00: I'm great, thank you.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_00: Nice to see you, Sam.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_03: Nice to see you.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_03: Nice and early as well, isn't it?
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, you know, you've got to get started early and get on with it, haven't you?
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_03: Absolutely.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I've been up since seven.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_03: I've been interviewing somebody for our place.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_03: So um, yeah, I was up nice and early this morning.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_03: I did thank her.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_03: I said, thanks very much for the early wake-up interview because she booked into my diary.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_03: And oh my god, I can't believe I did that.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_03: I said, I'm joking, it's fine.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_03: And my wife's up at quarter five anyway.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm up at a little five-year-old, also.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_03: So you know what it's like.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, bless him.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so Marie, um, you're on the podcast today because I've seen some exposure on LinkedIn around your actual career progression and moving up into a relationship director position at Cooper Parry.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_03: Um, Cooper Parry is a company that we work with, and some of the guys, as I said to you, absolutely love working with Cooper Parry.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_03: And it sounds like a really interesting company to work for.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and what for me was really, really stand out was the fact that there's very few females within the financial planning profession that actually move into more managerial positions, director level positions, uh, business leader positions.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_03: And, you know, when I I've got that exposure, if you like, to the market, I see it all.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_03: And I just find it really refreshing when it happens, not in a patronizing way, just in a way that I like to see women getting into leadership positions because the more women in leadership positions, the more women are going to see that and see that it's achievable and want to progress.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_03: So it's a very inspiring position.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_03: And that's why I wanted to bring on the podcast today to talk about your journey, how you got to that level, um, and what's some of the hints, tips, tricks, things you've learned along the way that you could be able to pass on to somebody else.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, thanks so much for coming on and um and sharing your journey.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, you're welcome.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_00: Looking forward to it.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_03: Brilliant.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_03: So, Marie, what I always like to do in the very beginning is just really find out a little bit about how you actually got into the profession.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_03: So, how did you end up getting into the profession of financial planning?
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, so that's a bit of an interesting one.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I have a bit of a joke with my friends about this quite a lot.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_00: I I sort of fell into the profession.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_00: I sort of studied law at uni.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_00: I wasn't really sure what I wanted to do.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I took a gap year, and then um I was living in Loughborough at the time, and and sort of my parents were like, come on, you know, you need to get a job, you need to get on with it.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um and I I I basically um got offered a position at a small firm in Loughborough and just really loved it.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_00: I could just see the um, you know, the changes that we're making to people's lives.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: I joined as an administrator at the time, so um, you know, wasn't sure what to expect, didn't know anything about the profession at all.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and sort of my love for it grew from there.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I stayed there, I got and started my exam journey.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_00: So at that point in time, it was all the certificate level exams.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then um I moved on to a slightly bigger firm and started my sort of trainee paraplanner journey and worked my way up really um through the ranks of that company before moving into Cooper Parry um to eventually manage the para planning team and then progressed from there.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_03: Fantastic.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, great.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_03: So interesting then.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_03: So it was a law degree that you did.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I studied law um for a period of time and then, yeah, and then just sort of moved on from there.
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um, like I say, I didn't know what direction I wanted to go in.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it was a really, I think it's hard when you're younger, um, unless you sort of got a goal in mind that you want to be a doctor or you want to be an engineer or um, and was just fortunate to find the profession when I did.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_03: So when you do a law degree and you're going through it, are you sort of presented um opportunities within university by law firms?
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_03: Do they come in?
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_03: Do they talk to you about the career of getting into law and becoming a solicitor?
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_03: Was there a sort of path that was presented to you that you actually decided not to go down?
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_00: Not really, to be honest.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_00: I think um for me, um, when I was going through university and and and school as well, I was always sort of reasonably good at sort of an all-rounder, I would say, um, but wasn't really kind of, I suppose, um excelling in any one area.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_00: I was always into sport, into music, and and it, and and I suppose at university, um there were certain career paths you could take.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and for me, I just wasn't sure the right one for me, I would say.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and there were people did come in and speak to you, absolutely.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and um, but I just wasn't sure at that point in time it was the right thing for me.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_03: So when you were in university, I assume you didn't get anybody from a financial planning firm coming in and talking to the wonderful order of financial planning.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_00: No, absolutely not.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you didn't.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: And and interestingly, um, you know, one of the areas I now really enjoy is working with solicitors um, you know, really closely, which we do, um, you know, whether it's um talking about wills, trusts, etc.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_00: So I find that part of the job quite quite interesting.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but no, you you absolutely didn't have people talking about financial services.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_03: Does your degree help you in that respect, though?
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_03: You know, when you look at your because you can imagine a lot of people probably listen to this podcast, so it might well be at university or maybe are grads and they're doing some research into financial planning as a career, and perhaps they've got a a law degree, but they don't want to go down that route.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_03: You know, they're not keen on becoming a solicitor or or working in in that profession.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_03: Do you feel that your knowledge and study around uh legals, uh, you know, legal system law, did you think that helps you in the position of financial planning and building those relationships with uh solicitors, for example?
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: It does.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you learn the language ultimately, um, because there's a lot of jargon in the financial services profession, I would say.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_00: So being able to relate to solicitors on their level, I think is really important.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, when you're just talking about the different types of trusts.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_00: Well, in financial services, there's there's loads of different types of trusts, whereas actually when you talk to a solicitor, it's a lot, it's it's a lot different.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_00: And so, you know, being able to relate to um different professions, um, absolutely really important.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_03: So your language that you would use in the, you know, the jargon that you might use within financial planning isn't always transferable across to the legal side.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_03: So you're almost having to interpret what it is that they're saying and bringing it into the financial planning side to build that connection to make sure you're both on the same page, I assume.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_00: And and that's one of the reasons I did um the step qualification was um because that's obviously recognized by solicitors, but actually you're talking on a language level that they understand.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so that's one of the reasons that I did that qualification.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_03: Fabulous.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, so you you stepped into the world of financial planning.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_03: You went in as an administrator, yeah?
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_03: So um, okay, again, I'll just how did that how did you, when you stepped into that role of administrator, did you actually have an idea of what financial planning really was?
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_03: Did you think, yeah, brilliant, that's what I want to do?
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_03: Or was it it's a job, it looks like a professional company, um, it's paying me a decent salary.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_03: How you know, what was your first impression, if you like?
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_00: I had no idea.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_00: And so I researched the company.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I actually knew someone that worked there at the time.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_00: And um, yeah, they seem like a really good company.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_00: They talked to me about a potential career path, they spoke to me about professional qualifications, and I thought, yeah, this is this is brilliant.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I can I can earn money, I can um use some transferable skills.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and yeah, work in a company that and with people that I really liked as well.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_00: So it was uh a no-brainer for me.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_03: Because that wasn't Cooper Parry, was it?
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_03: That was a different firm altogether.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_00: It wasn't.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_00: No, it was it was a much smaller firm um in Loughborough.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um and you know, I was lucky to get the opportunity for a foot in the door, really, um, and work my way up.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_03: Interesting.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_03: So lucky to get a foot in the door.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_03: And do you think, like, you know, based on your experience so far and how you've moved up the ladder now to relationship director, and you've been there for quite some time, you've managed people, this kind of foot in the door.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_03: Do you think back then you were lucky to get a foot in the door?
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_03: Do you still think people are lucky to get a foot in the door?
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_03: Do you think there's an abundance of opportunities, or is it a lot easier to get into the profession now?
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_03: What's your view on that?
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think um a lot of companies now are looking for the right person, not necessarily the right qualifications.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: I think it depends on the role that you're recruiting for.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, for example, at Cooper Parry, we recruit at lots of different levels, but we like to recruit at graduate level, but they don't have to be graduates.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, they can be the right person with no experience at all.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_00: But if they've got the right attitude, their values align with our values, um, and we can see that kind of energy within them, um, we will absolutely, you know, uh take on board people like that.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, so recognising that skill set, recognizing that passion, that ambition.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_03: Um funny, I don't know as I said to you before, you know, I got I got off the phone with a chap yesterday and he blew me away.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_03: You know, his background was scaffolding for eight years.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_03: He left school.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, he was truant, he left school.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_03: He was, you know, he didn't have the best education uh for whatever reasons, but deep down inside of him, he really wanted to, he had an ambition within him.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_03: He knew he was better.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_03: And he was really good at maths in school.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_03: He said, you know, he really enjoyed maths and um, you know, he's got no degree or anything along those lines.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_03: And um, he's now working towards becoming a chartered financial planner.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_03: And he's got a job in, you know, City of London on the building that he used to scaffold on.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_03: So I think attitude, skill set, the desire that to learn, and um, I think these are the types of things that often get overlooked if you look down the graduate route only.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_03: You know, if you just say, I only want to graduate, and don't get me wrong, going to university and doing degrees a great indication of being able to um study, to be able to stick to process, project management, managing your time, living on your own.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_03: All these are great, great skill sets, but sometimes you come across these kind of what we used to call diamonds in the rough.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_03: But you know, that's a bit derogatory, really.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_03: These are great people that just you know haven't got the education behind them.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_03: And so what?
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_03: If you can put them into a role where you can nurture them and bring it out of them, then happy days.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_03: So it's great to hear the Cooper do that, you know, and they look at that in that sort of way.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_03: So that's really, really refreshing to hear.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_03: Um, okay, great.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_03: So I administrator, how long are you doing the admin role for then?
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um I would say about a year and a half.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so not a huge amount of time.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_00: So really learning the ropes um about you know, calling up providers, requesting information, understanding the sort of information that you're requesting, um, processing paperwork, you know, making payments to clients, you know, things like that.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_00: Really, really learning from the kind of ground up.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I think that puts you in really good standing to understand all areas of a business, um, all different role titles.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_00: So I learned a lot.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_03: I think there is a um, you know, with within financial planning, there's this, there's these, there's never been a sort of set route, a bit like becoming a solicitor, there's a set route, like becoming an accountant, there's a set route.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_03: And with financial planning, it's never really um been that way.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_03: And it's starting to be created now, this this competency framework, this passage to becoming a financial planner.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_03: Um, now, what you've then got is a huge amount of financial advisors that are going to be exiting the industry and not enough people coming in as financial planners.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_03: And it's like, well, okay, well, what happens if we look at somebody maybe outside of the profession that has the skills that they've built up, perhaps in a relationship role, but within another profession?
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_03: Could they step across and become a financial planner?
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_03: Go straight into the role of financial planner.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_03: And there's always this kind of disparity and argument, I guess.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_03: And does somebody really need to do the administration to power planner route, then become an advisor?
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_03: Or can they quite simply two-piece across and go straight into financial planning?
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_03: Somebody that, you know, and we'll get into this, but somebody that's gone from admin to power planning to power planning manager into relationship.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_03: What do you think about that?
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_03: Do you think that the two, you know, taking somebody from the profession straight into financial planning good idea?
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_03: Or do you think there should be a framework that somebody has to go through to be competent in their knowledge as well as their ability to actually sit down with somebody and open them up and get them to invest their money?
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think that's a really great question because I don't think there's any one size fits all.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_00: I think you could, if you've got the right skill set, you can absolutely shift across to another role without going through the ranks.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_00: And actually, you know, at Cooper Parry, we we identify people at a very early stage in terms of the career path that they want to take.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_00: So we've had people that that would go straight from one, you know, say, for example, um client services administration to a trainee advisor role.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_00: You know, so all of our all of our um um administrators are diploma qualified, for example, so they're really technical administrators.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um and some of them decide to stay in a senior kind of administration role, others actually sort of say, no, I want to go down the advice route, others the paraplanning route, and we help them jump to those different um areas.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_00: And I think if you're working within a framework and a company that support that progression um and that identify where you want to get to at an early stage, you you can make those leaps and jumps.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, I know we we had a guy in our um BD team, so the wider Cooper Parry uh team.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_00: So we're part of an accountancy practice, and he moved from a BD role in the um accountancy practice over into a trainee advisor role, um, which was you know completely different.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um and you know, he's doing really well.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: So absolutely.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_03: So it's again it's identifying those um key skills and strengths and those transferable skills and moving outside of the kind of rigid framework sometimes that can be put into place, especially in some of these larger, more corporate firms, although they have the ability to look within to the staff that are within the business.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_03: And I, you know, a lot of these companies have got some fantastic questionnaires they put out and training and development that helps bring those types of people and those skill sets to the surface and say, look, you know, don't leave the business if you're unhappy, for instance, come and step across into this role and they've got the ability to do that.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_03: But I think, you know, when we're in this kind of evolutionary state within the financial planning profession, which I almost call a bit of a startup phase, I've used that before in the sense that lots of people exiting the industry, lots of people coming into it.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_03: But what you do find is the next generation that are coming in are a far more entrepreneurial bunch.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_03: So you're going to have these kind of more smaller type firms running, you know, with one, two to 10 to 20 type people.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, seeing them pop up, especially the guys that left bank assurance and are now built those businesses up and then they're now 10 to 20 to 30.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_03: So it feels like there is this kind of startup phase.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_03: And obviously, as the pool of advisors gets smaller, there's a lot more fighting going on for those people.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_03: So I think the flexibility around saying, look, you know, you don't have to be an administrator, you don't have to do your two years, three years, four years.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_03: You can step across.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_03: I think it's refreshing.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_03: And it's kind of, again, it's understanding the skill set required to do the job and then providing the training and support around that to get them up to the knowledge levels as quickly as we possibly can, um, instead of wasting time sometimes, I think.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, historically, some people have been sat in administrator roles, hoping, hoping, hoping, hoping, loyalty to the business, but never really getting anywhere.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and um, those are the ones that um now, if they just look put their head above the pulpit a little bit, they'll start to see that there are opportunities that will support them, but they've got to do it themselves as well.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_03: You can't just uh land it on their lap.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_03: Um Marie, so you did that, you were uh you fell into it, as a lot of people do, you know.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_03: Lots of people fall into their professions.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_03: That's pretty much what you hear most of the time, actually, is people fall into it.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_03: No one wakes up, you know, fight you know, in school 13, 14 years old.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_03: I want to be a financial planner.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_03: You know, there's very few people.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I know recruitment consultant.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_03: I'm 40 years old and I'm running my own recruitment business.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_03: Never said I would do that, you know.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_03: Professional football, I think it was at the time.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but um so you did that, you did your administration, you did your qualifications.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_03: At what stage did you think, right?
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, well, this is the this is the profession for me, therefore I'm going to start my qualifications.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_03: When at what stage in your career were you doing that?
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so I mean, I I moved firms to a slightly bigger firm where there was more opportunity um to move into a poinning role.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so that that was it for me.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: The first company I worked at was great, but there was only a few people, so there wasn't much opportunity.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, I was a young, I was pretty young back then and and really sort of passionate and wanted to kind of drive my career forward.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then the next firm I moved to was a trainee paraplanner role, and actually, you know, to be a paraplanner, a true paraplanner, it's a technical role.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, and and and at that point in time, I needed to do my exams and I wanted to do my exams and carve out a career for myself.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_00: So as I said before, you know, at that point in time to become an advisor, which, you know, at that I didn't, I wasn't sure I wanted to be at that point in time.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but it was the certificate in financial planning, um, and that was the route that I took.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I started my journey um through those uh qualifications, um, and I was at that firm for quite a few years before Cooper Parry approached me about joining joining them.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um but my exam journey really took off at Cooper Parry, I would say, when I joined as a as a power planner, because there's a lot of high achievers at Cooper Parry, I would say.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so for my part, you know, I didn't want to be the person with the least qualifications or the least experience.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_00: So I I really sort of they really motivated me and pushed me, not not just from an exam point of view, but from a skills point of view as well.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so they helped me identify my key strengths and put me through a lot of training, whether it's um organization training, whether it's presenting.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I was really lucky to have that opportunity as well.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um to have all that.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_03: I like what you said there.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_03: You know, when you've moved from one environment where perhaps they weren't so invested in personal development of their staff, perhaps they didn't have as many people that were going through the qualifications, and there wasn't such a kind of, I guess, promotion of that um idea of um uh success being through learning and development.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_03: And then you move into that environment and that sparked you, that made you think, oh, you know, I'm surrounded by high achievers.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_03: I need to either I need to up my game, I need to, I need to step up.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_03: So that's a really valid point because imagine how many people are sat there in their roles right now, just like, you know, I don't feel like I'm going anywhere.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_03: I know I've got the ability, but is this it?
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_03: Is this what financial planning is?
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_03: Have I got to just do it myself and do my qualifications in my back bedroom and have no one to banks off of?
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_03: And and it's funny because some of the guys, some of the guys and girls I've had on the podcast that have been in companies that just invest in learning and development, it's a different, they're a different breed because they're positive about learning, you know, they're positive about connecting and with people within the business and networking with people within the business and and then mentorship as well becomes quite a big thing.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so that's really, really interesting.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_03: So that really helped spark your your journey, I guess.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_03: And you said they're about power planning and you said they're about advice.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_03: You weren't sure that you wanted to be an advisor.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_03: So what when was it that your first power planning journey, your first power planning job actually happened?
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_03: What what year was it?
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_03: Because the role of a power planner, for instance, it's only kind of just evolved as being like so um common now.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_03: Before it was like not many power planners around sort of 10 years ago, for example.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_03: So when did you start your journey into power planning?
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so um, I'm trying to think.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_00: I think I've been in the profession about 16, 17 years, and and I was an administrator for about one and a half, two years, I would say.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, it was um Quite a long time ago, you know, it's about 14 years ago.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I I started to become a trainee paraplanner and worked my way up um to sort of a fully fledged power planner.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um and you know, basically experience um worked my way at Cooper Parry to a senior paraplanner and then to manage the team.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: Um and interestingly, back then at Cooper Parry, we weren't a big team in the wealth team, but it's grown massively over the over the last sort of 10 years that I've been there, um, to the point where I grew the power planning team to a team of 10.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_00: So there were 10 of us from three.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then comes the challenges of managing a bigger team and um the different sort of levels of experience and and training that that that brings to the to the fore as well.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um so yeah, it was um a big journey, I think, for Cooper Parry in terms of the growth and the experience and the training.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but one of one of our values is keep learning.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, throughout all of the stages of the journey, um, you know, keep learning.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_00: And I think in in financial services, it's it's really important because things change, legislation changes, you know, the way that we work with clients, etc.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_00: So there's always something to learn.
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_03: So for thinking company, really, and and offering true, you know, 14 years ago, you said you got into poinning, for instance.
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_03: And I mean that's pre-RDR.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, a firm that's actually delivering proper financial planning back then was considered like um an odyssey, I guess.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, and especially in the in the world of like bank assurance, where most people kind of went through the route of, say, being a personal banker and um, you know, selling credit cards and things like that, and then moving into financial planning positions, there was no kind of uh you know, administrative type role, it was a sales role, wasn't it?
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_03: And I suppose for you, that was a blessing, really, because it gave you that exposure to what true financial planning was, but also what goes on in the research side of it, in the background side of it.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_03: What do you think is the most interesting thing you've learned through your career when it comes to say the power planning side and how that's only you know how that's enhanced your role as a financial planner in in later on in your career?
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's the fact that it can be so varied from different companies and um and so different from a technical basis.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_00: So there are so many different levels of power planners, I would say, across the board.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_00: So um, and I think I've been very fortunate actually to work in a really technical role, really alongside um advisors as well, um, as that second point of contact to clients.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_00: So I think there are lots of opportunities for power planners out there, um, and depending on your individual skill set, whether that's accompanying advisors to meetings and being that second point of relationship contact, whether it's uh, you know, you're at home or you're in the office and being a really super technical power, or whether it's um, you know, more of an administrative power planner, that there are different opportunities.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, if you're looking to change careers or you're looking, um, be really clear about what you want from that role um and find the company that that suits you.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, that's what I would say.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_03: So what we're saying here is, yeah, okay, great.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_03: I really that's really, really, really good advice.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_03: There's a kind of there's a sometimes a bit of a hat that goes on and says, well, if you're a power planner, you're a power planner because that's what your personality says that you are, that you're quite techie and you're into research.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, there's this idea of this guy in the back guy or girl in the background just typing away and all the work comes in and doesn't you know, they wheeler, wheeler, wheeler out every now and then, you know.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_03: So but it's not really like that, is it?
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_03: And um, it's uh it's a route into becoming a financial planner, but it's also that idea that you can understand.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_03: So some people like to know the ins and outs of everything, don't they, before they end up doing a role.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_03: And I think that's what power planning to me and my understanding of not doing it, but talking to them, is that it really does give you that grounding and gives you that understanding of what it is that you are talking to, talking about when you sit down eventually with some clients.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_03: Now, when you go through that journey, you might sit there and think, well, actually, power planning for me is what I love.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_03: I enjoy that side of it.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_03: And you experience, by the sayings of it, also having that extra responsibility to grow a team as a power planning manager.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_03: So if you are a power planner and you want to manage, there is that route as well, isn't there?
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_03: There is that opportunity to make a whole career out of power planning.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, absolutely.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know, one of my best friends is an outsourced power planner now, and she used to manage a technical team in a company.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and she's made a career out of it in that respect.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but there absolutely is, and I think again, it's about aligning your skill set because managing is a very particular skill set and it's not right for everybody.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but one of the things that I did, you know, through um power planning, but also when I moved into an advisory role, was I identified my key strengths, um, and I did that in a couple of ways.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_00: So um I basically completed the Gallup survey, which identified my top 35 strengths.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and a lot of those were aligned to actual relationships, um, so empathy, um, you know, winning others over, working with people, um, communication, positivity, those type of things.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so that's one thing that people can think about doing is actually looking at identifying your own key strengths.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I also got a book called The Strengths Finder as well, which basically again looked at some of my key strengths and basically helped me understand myself and where I wanted to go with my career.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_03: Excellent.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_03: So, some personal self-development there, looking inwards to see what your strengths are, what really your skill set was, and how transferable that is to a role where you're gonna eventually be sitting down with people where you have to kind of build empathy, build relationship, have a deeper understanding, put the earnings to one side, the bonus to one side, and actually do what's good for that person who's sat in front of you.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and there is that skill set that's required to do that because if you're letting the old ego take over, aren't you?
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_03: You're gonna kind of get yourself into all sorts of trouble when you work in a role, especially where you're regulated.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_03: Um perhaps there's a huge amount of ambition.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_03: And there's, you know, let's not beat around the bush.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_03: Financial planning, there's lots of money to be earned within it as well as a career.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_03: You know, people get into these careers to make money, and there is money to be made in financial planning.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_03: And I think if you don't understand that you've got the right skill set, attributes, um, values, yes, you're going to um trip yourself up a little bit further down the line.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_03: I've spoken to many a financial planner that's been that way inclined, and um, you know, sometimes eventually get struck off or, you know, have have issues around it.
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_03: So being clear about who you are, what you want, and aligning that to the company that you're working for is paramount to you being a success and also reducing your risk of um sort of stepping off the line, really.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_03: So thank you for those recommendations.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_03: Have you got a copy of that book?
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_03: We can just have a quick look now.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_03: Have you got it in front of you?
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, I have.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_00: So um, this was one of books um that I would highly recommend um having a look at.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_03: I'm gonna take a look at that.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_03: I'm gonna take a look at that.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_03: It's gonna go on the old bookshelf behind me.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_03: The one I've been really interested in at the moment and I've um taken a lot from is Key Person of Influence.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_03: So, Key Person of Influence is a book about how to establish yourself as a key person of influence within your specific sector.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_03: So, for example, me, I'm recruitment, you know.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_03: So, I want to be considered to be the key person of influence within the financial planning profession when it comes to recruitment.
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_03: So, my goal here is to align myself and surround myself with other key people of influence within the profession, and that helps me elevate myself above the riff-raff.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_03: And I get considered I get considered to be um, you know, an influential person.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_03: And then you start to cross-market with people and and work with specific people that are going to add value to both me and to and and to them.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_03: Um I thought that was a very, very good book.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_03: I also really enjoy um atomic habit.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_03: Atomic Habit is a is a fantastic book and it's completely changed uh my mindset around personal life and um professional life.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_03: And um I really, really love atomic habits.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_03: So if it's something you ever sort of thought about reading, it's um the psychology around habit building and breaking is um it's brilliant.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_03: It's a great read and uh it's always done me quite well.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_03: Always do like a book like a bookshare.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_03: We could I should do that really on the financial plan of life, do a bookshare, I think, because it's good.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_00: It I think it is, and um and one of the again key takeaways I would say to people looking to progress through the through the profession is read as much as you can.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't matter what job you're doing.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, certainly when I when I moved into an advisory role, um, I just read, I went to every possible seminar um course that I could go to.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I read as many books as I possibly could.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so whether it's the psychology of money by Morgan Houser, great book, uh, Beyond the 4% rule by Abraham.
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I read as many books as I could, um, just to pick up as many skills as I could from a from a relationship point of view, because ultimately, when you get to an advisory position, you should have all the technical knowledge that you need.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and yes, there's continual professional development, of course, that you have to stay up to date, but just keep reading.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I I read, you know, a book a month at least, um, you know, to stay up to stay up to date, but to basically be as be the best advisor I can be to my clients, um, you know, and whether that's relationship building or or technical, yeah.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's really important.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_03: Absolutely.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_03: It's great, it keeps you grounded.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_03: It also any, you know, I think psychology books and um looking around things like emotional intelligence and those are the key things that can um help you build deeper relationships without coming across, as we said earlier, egotistical or driven by money or um targets and all those kind of stuff.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_03: And that's the area that um obviously financial planning needs to avoid because it creates bad advice, doesn't it?
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_03: Um on the subject of sales, though, you know, it's difficult to be a financial planner sometimes and win clients.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_03: And I often speak to advisors in in different stages within their career, some going self-employed, you know, and they're on their own and all of that kind of stuff.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_03: And they haven't got an accountancy firm or a solicited firm to perhaps build relationships with, um, and they have to go and do all themselves.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_03: So I think sales can often become a dirty word.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but actually, I think when you look at sales and the fundamentals of sales and the training around sales, there's a lot to be taken from good quality sales training that helps you um build better relationships, but also to win that.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_03: Because when you sit in front of somebody, you can have all the technical knowledge in the world.
• 33:01
  SPEAKER_03: But if you are unable to get them to understand what the benefits are to them, um, and essentially build a picture of a better life, you know, a happier, more content and relaxed life, which I think most people want around money, money causes a lot of fear and anxiety, then um, then I think you're missing the mark.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_03: And I think you're absolutely right.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_03: Self-knowledge is absolutely paramount.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_03: You know, you have to teach yourself, you have to learn.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_03: And um, if any training or development or networking events come up that's going to add to your skill set, then get stuck into it.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_03: So fantastic advice.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_03: And that's obviously helped you because you've progressed your career very, very nicely by the looks of it.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_03: You've moved on all the way up now to out of the power planning world, and then you moved into a more of a senior relationship manager world, and then into a relationship director, you know.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_03: Congratulations on that, because that was in July, wasn't it?
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it was.
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_00: It was a recent promotion, so yeah, it's um it was a good tick for me and um really great to be recognized, particularly um at a company like Cooper Parry that expects so much of you, um, but support you to get there, of course.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but no, it was great, great opportunity for me.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_03: Before we sort of delve into that a little bit, are you what's your sort of viewpoint on you said expectations there?
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_03: Did you feel at any point within your career that you had a deeper expectation upon yourself as being a female within the profession to step on up?
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_03: Was it did you feel like there was an internal um drive to prove a point because it's a lack of females in the profession?
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_03: Did you even think about that?
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um interesting question.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um I suppose when you look around, there's there's a lack of female advisors, I would say, in the profession.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I've tried to find put a number on it, um, and I and I know it's um pretty much less than 15% of the UK advisors that are out there are female, um, which is really interesting because I think naturally their skill set is massively favoured towards being an advisor because ultimately clients want to be understood, they want to be listened to.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and yes, men and women can do that.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_00: It's not a men and a women thing, but it but I I am so surprised that the the number of female advisors is so small.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and for me, um, I had an opportunity to move into an advisory role, but actually at the time there was no female advisors in in my company.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so it was I I I did have a bit of a crisis of confidence.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not gonna lie to you, sort of thinking, well, can I do this?
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's a different role.
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, will I be okay?
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_00: I was quite comfortable in the role that I was doing and I knew I could do it.
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so for me, it was a bit of a confidence thing.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and actually, you know, as soon as I stepped into the role, I just thought, why didn't I do this sooner?
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I I absolutely love it.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_00: I love looking after my clients, and um it's it's a strange one.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_00: I do, I suppose part of this is understanding why that is, whether it's confidence, whether it's you know, people taking time off to have children, um, and thinking that perhaps they can't come into an advisory role in a part-time position.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I don't know.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I mean, for me, I got over the confidence hurdle by again just learning as much as I could.
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I've got a mentor as well.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_00: So a mentor outside of my company.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so that that I think is if it's something you are looking at doing and moving into an advisory role, see if you can get a mentor from another company, or maybe even from, say, for example, uh a firm that you know in America.
• 36:52
  SPEAKER_00: So I I got um I spoke to a lady who um in America who basically um specialized in advising female solicitors and um she gave me some great book recommendations, she gave me some um pointers on how to kind of overcome some of the confidence um issues that I had, um, which really, really helped me along the way.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_03: That's really um that's a really great thing that you just raised there, because you were a one thing there about the mentors, you know, looking for a mentor outside of your business.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_03: And you even went as far as the USA there to find a mentor.
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_03: Um I think there is a lack of females within director positions, um, running businesses, leadership roles, and also a lack of them that are out there that are then promoting themselves as being, hey, I'm here, I've done it, this is what I'm doing, and this is how I'm doing it.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm talking to that next generation of females that might sit there and feel that they have those limiting beliefs that they can't step up into that role, that you know, because of the historics of it being very masculine and male and you know, like middle-aged white guy with his suit on and his bright, I'm just loving the next generation that are coming through that are far more relaxed and calmer and and are using their female attributes to build deeper relationships.
• 38:15
  SPEAKER_03: And what's really, really obvious is that female financial planners to me are, you know, and there's some great guys out there.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not sort of some champ just championing females because it's trendy, but I I'm drawn to female financial planners.
• 38:27
  SPEAKER_03: And I think it's because of that that they have a an e a better way of articulating the um, I don't know, the well-being aspect of financial planning and the benefit it has to you because I think naturally being quite an empathetic um uh type of people, you know, they are very, very, very empathetic women.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_03: I and I I'm drawn into it.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm where I've been building my profile on Instagram, um, I see more females that are using it as a tool to be able to get that across.
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_03: And um I think that's brilliant.
• 38:57
  SPEAKER_03: And the more women that get into leadership positions, I think should stand up and talk about it because it's only going to inspire um uh the next generation to step up into the role and have that confidence.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_03: So um for me it's a it's a brilliant thing.
• 39:08
  SPEAKER_03: I think the opportunity, also, as you're aware, more than likely, of female millionaires that are going to be coming into you know the world, I think it's like let's have a look.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_03: Many still I got an article about it, let's have a look.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_03: Half of married women with a business-related degree out earn their husbands.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, 80% of women will be solely responsible for their household finances at some point.
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_03: There you go.
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_03: Look, whereas it predominantly maybe men used to be that way.
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know.
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_03: Um, women will also inherit 70% of the wealth passed down over the next two generations.
• 39:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 39:41
  SPEAKER_03: Control two-thirds of household wealth by 2030, and 53% of UK millionaires will be female by 2025.
• 39:51
  SPEAKER_03: So when it comes to female advice careers, up to 70% of women who work within with financial advisors prefer female advisors.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_03: 34% of financial advisors believe their firms should employ more female advisors.
• 40:04
  SPEAKER_03: However, female advisors account for just 15% of the current profession.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_03: So that to me, any any any female that's listening to this podcast, anybody that's in the profession right now, there is a huge opportunity.
• 40:19
  SPEAKER_03: Huge opportunity.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_03: It couldn't be bigger, could it?
• 40:22
  SPEAKER_00: No, I I completely agree.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_00: And and and it's interesting because I mean I've actually had some people come to me directly because they want to work with a female advisor.
• 40:32
  SPEAKER_00: And that's been really interesting because, as you said, you know, they've they've spoken to a couple of other firms, and it's you know, men of a certain age wearing a pinstripe suit.
• 40:41
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, gone are those days, I think, thankfully.
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I think I think a lot of people, it doesn't matter whether you're a male or female advisor, um, ultimately the the clients um they just want to be listened to, they want to be understood, um, and they want, you know, each partner wants to be talked to and listened to.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_00: Because I think in the past we've been guilty of perhaps focusing on the man because the assumption is that they earn the money and and they're the breadwinner.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_00: And and actually, what I find is regardless of who earns the money and who who holds the assets, a lot of the time um the female, um, the wife um manages the household finances.
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I've heard you know stories of you know wives being ignored um in meetings and and not being directly asked questions, which is you know pretty horrendous actually.
• 41:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so it's interesting when you reel off those statistics because um, you know, I was I was reading a um a study the other day by I think it was strategic marketing that basically said that something like 70 or 80 percent of um people in the UK, sorry, in the US, um females leave their advisor when their husband passes away, right?
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um when they're bereaved um because they've previously just felt ignored and want a new relationship, which again is a horrendous statistic if it's true.
• 42:07
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I it it sounds like it, it sounds like you know, if you think about it, it sounds like it could be true, you know?
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_03: It makes sense, doesn't it?
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_03: Fantastic.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_03: So let's just talk a little bit about your opportunity.
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_03: You know, you move from power planning, you steps over into relationship management, yeah.
• 42:20
  SPEAKER_03: So into the role of a relationship, but you guys call it a relationship um manager, like like uh, but that's a financial planner for you guys, isn't it?
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's an IFA.
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I hate using that term, but it's we like to call it relationship manager, relationship director, relationship partner, you know, because it is about relationships, it's about working with that client, really understanding them, what their dreams, aspirations, goals are, and supporting them through life's journeys, basically, some of the toughest times and some of the best times.
• 42:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then we've got really clearly defined roles at Cooper Paris.
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_00: So, yes, my role is managing that relationship.
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_00: I'm responsible for the advice.
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but very much um, you know, para planner is the number two for the client.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_00: So they will know everything that's going on, they'll come to the client meetings, they'll present the cash flow to the client and um really be that second point of contact, but the technical support for me.
• 43:20
  SPEAKER_00: But ultimately, yes, I'm I'm there to sign off the advice, but really it is about the relationship.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_03: Fantastic.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_03: And you've been doing that now for how long?
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um four or five years.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_03: Four or five years.
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 43:34
  SPEAKER_03: So moving into that position and being that more client-facing facing role, and then looking back on what you did as a power planner.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_03: So you made the right choice.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_00: 100%.
• 43:45
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not gonna lie to you.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_00: I when I moved from managing the power planning team, I was very comfortable in the role.
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_00: I've been doing it for a long time.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_00: I was really technical.
• 43:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I was not that I found it easy, but I was I was comfortable, you know.
• 43:57
  SPEAKER_00: I I knew my stuff and I've I've been At the firm for a long time.
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_00: So kind of go from there where you feel very comfortable to moving into a different role.
• 44:06
  SPEAKER_00: I knew I knew my stuff, I'm, you know, as technical, but then it's okay, well, you know, you're you're now responsible for looking after clients and explaining concepts to clients and um, you know, making sure that they're happy and and and taking them on the right journey.
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_00: So that was a very different, it's a very different skill set, I would say.
• 44:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so yeah, it took me a while to to kind of feel comfortable with that.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_00: But actually, I've never looked.
• 44:33
  SPEAKER_00: It's the best, best move I ever made, and and I love it.
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_00: I love looking after my clients and yeah.
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_03: Fantastic.
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_03: So when you were in the role of power planning, towards the end, you were managing, yeah.
• 44:43
  SPEAKER_03: So you were definitely a people manager and having to deal with the uh not only the management of work, but also the management of the staff there, you know, that has its that has its challenges.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_03: I I know that myself.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and then stepping into a relationship role where that where you're then managing the relationships with a group of clients, did did you carry on, apart from having the power planner that supports you in the relationship with the client, did you carry on any management responsibilities or did you take management responsibilities off?
• 45:10
  SPEAKER_00: No, I I took the hat off.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because um very much, I mean, it gives an opportunity for other people coming through um to take on new roles.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_00: And actually, I think you have to be clear about what you want to focus on, because there's no way I could focus on managing clients and managing a team as well.
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it would be too much.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_00: And actually, for me, it was about having focus about my role and what that meant.
• 45:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's really important because focus, because otherwise you can get involved in too many things and you spread too thinly.
• 45:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so for me, it was like, no, my soul focus is looking after clients, making sure they're happy, um, and we're providing the best possible advice to them.
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_03: Um we see that very much in the owner, the owner advisor businesses, you know, when they've got multiple hats on, as you do when you set up your own business.
• 46:03
  SPEAKER_03: You know, it's no one's going to do it for you because you haven't got the money to do it.
• 46:06
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so you wear these multiple hats, but you've got sort of companies that want to grow and build, but at the same time they're managing and trying to build their own clients and do their own business development and put the marketing hat on, and it becomes a real real stress.
• 46:21
  SPEAKER_03: And it doesn't take that many employees to realize how much of your time is taken up with management if you're not naturally a manager and actually your gift is relationship building and build sitting in front of somebody and winning business, and it can sometimes suck that energy out of you and deplete you.
• 46:35
  SPEAKER_03: And it's one of those vital positions, I think.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_03: If you're if you want to build and your strength is building financial relationships and clients or whatever, that's your skill set, is to focus on that skill set and bring somebody in to actually do the management side.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_03: So a strong um technical manager would be a great hire for a small business that's starting to start out because that technical manager can come in, support the advisor, but also be able to build the administration team that then creates the beautiful foundation for you to then bring two, three, four financial planners on that are sufficiently uh experienced to um maybe take up 20% of your time as opposed to 80% of it.
• 47:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 47:13
  SPEAKER_03: So that's yeah.
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_03: Um, would you ever move back into a management rollout of interest?
• 47:18
  SPEAKER_03: You know, is that something that you you you would always keep that door open, or are you sort of like, no, do you know what?
• 47:23
  SPEAKER_03: I've I've done it and I it's not for me.
• 47:26
  SPEAKER_00: I I took a lot of um benefit from it and I love seeing people develop and um progress.
• 47:33
  SPEAKER_00: But for me, um, so I I will have a hand in training some of the advisors coming through at Cooper Parry.
• 47:40
  SPEAKER_00: So I am supporting some training advisors or uh what we call our RM Academy.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um so I am I'm helping in that role, but I'm not going to be directly managing.
• 47:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um for me, it's about having focus and um again not having too many hats, so focusing on the clients, but absolutely supporting the team, but not directly managing.
• 48:02
  SPEAKER_03: Just talk to me very, very briefly about then, just give us a little bit of an overview of the RM Academy.
• 48:06
  SPEAKER_03: That sounds um that sounds really interesting and forward-thinking.
• 48:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so one thing that that we've done again, it's it's part of what we touched on earlier about identifying people in the business, you know, what what direction, what path do they want to take?
• 48:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so what we've done is we've identified again, you know, using Strengths Finder and key skills and talking to people about what they want across all areas of the business.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and we've identified certain individuals that want to be a relationship manager in the future.
• 48:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so we've set up a relationship manager academy, which is basically um a monthly session um talking about key skills.
• 48:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it might be looking at a book and talking about that, it might be here's how we present this to clients, here are the reasons why.
• 48:57
  SPEAKER_00: So um technical skills, relationship skills, presenting skills.
• 49:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so then actually, when an opportunity presents itself or when someone's got the right level of experience, they can hop across into that role and have a really good head start rather than just starting the training from day one.
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_00: But it also keeps people engaged as well, because you know, if you if you're in a role and like you said before, it's like, well, how do I get to there?
• 49:26
  SPEAKER_00: It gives people a path to be able to get from A to B and not feeling stagnant in their role as well.
• 49:34
  SPEAKER_03: Beautiful.
• 49:35
  SPEAKER_03: Sounds really, really good.
• 49:35
  SPEAKER_03: Is that a Foo Fighters poster in the background?
• 49:38
  SPEAKER_00: It is.
• 49:38
  SPEAKER_00: I do like the Foo Fighters.
• 49:40
  SPEAKER_03: I love Foo Fighters.
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_03: I saw them at um I've seen them the very first time I ever saw the Foo Fighters was in Milton Keene's Bowl in 1998, and it was um they they got on the bill because um I can't remember who, I think it was corn, band called Corn.
• 49:54
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, yeah, had pulled out and um they were chucked on there, and it was like a heavy metal festival, and um they got booed and said, you know, booed off terried up, really, really booed.
• 50:05
  SPEAKER_03: But it was when he very, very, very first came out, and then I saw them again a couple of times actually, and one of them was Reading, and um, it's on the anniversary of Nirvana, I think it's like 25 years Nirvana played there, and oh my god, it was the best gig ever.
• 50:16
  SPEAKER_03: I just love Dave Grohl.
• 50:18
  SPEAKER_00: Well, the thing is, tickets become available at 10 o'clock this morning for their UK tour.
• 50:23
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm hoping I'm hoping we're gonna be finished by 10 sounds so I can log on and and and buy some tickets.
• 50:29
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I we will be because that sounds really good.
• 50:31
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, no, absolutely love a bit of the old Dave Grohl.
• 50:34
  SPEAKER_03: That guy who made did that poster is Bristolian, I think.
• 50:38
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, really?
• 50:38
  SPEAKER_03: Because I bought some Queens of the Stone Age ones.
• 50:40
  SPEAKER_03: He does, he does really cool prints.
• 50:42
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but yeah, that's why I noticed these the style of it.
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_03: I'll tell you what, Marie, listen, you've you've shared so much today um about your journey, and uh it's inspiring and it's definitely going to inspire the listeners.
• 50:55
  SPEAKER_03: And Cooper Parry, what a fantastic company it sounds like there.
• 50:58
  SPEAKER_03: Uh hats off to you, progress in your career, sticking to it.
• 51:01
  SPEAKER_03: One thing I've taken away from that is surround yourself with within a company where people are positive and want to progress, that there is an element of competitiveness there and a need to achieve, except and you know, a need to avoid failure.
• 51:15
  SPEAKER_03: Being around people that are achievers, you know, is what it's all about.
• 51:18
  SPEAKER_03: You surround yourself with those types of people, you're gonna you're only gonna feel that way, aren't you?
• 51:22
  SPEAKER_03: And it's gonna progress and help your career.
• 51:23
  SPEAKER_03: But what's things one thing that's very, very apparent within your career is that you have invested in your own um uh you've invested in your your your own learning development as well as taking on board those around you.
• 51:34
  SPEAKER_03: And the mentoring thing is I think it's a really great tip for anybody listening.
• 51:37
  SPEAKER_03: And just how did you reach out to that mentor?
• 51:39
  SPEAKER_03: What did you do?
• 51:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so again, I was really fortunate because um, again, we we're always looking at being the best company that we can be, and and what are the best firms out there doing?
• 51:50
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, the US are really far ahead when it comes to financial planning.
• 51:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so my CEO um provided an introduction for me to a to again a really successful uh female director in the US that was absolutely smashing it.
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and she was delighted to be a mentor to me.
• 52:11
  SPEAKER_00: So I think it's about um looking looking out there, who's doing what you want to do, who'd who inspires you, you know.
• 52:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and she was a great mentor for me.
• 52:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um so I was really lucky to have that introduction.
• 52:24
  SPEAKER_00: But um look look out just outside of not just um the UK but the US, who are those firms that are doing it, how you want to do it?
• 52:33
  SPEAKER_03: Fabulous, I love it, brilliant.
• 52:35
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you so much for your time today.
• 52:37
  SPEAKER_03: I really appreciate sharing on the Financial Planner Life podcast.
• 52:40
  SPEAKER_03: I think and all the listeners listening to this will will benefit massively from your experience.
• 52:44
  SPEAKER_03: And um, and also absolutely lovely to meet you and um thank you for your time.
• 52:50
  SPEAKER_00: Cheers, thank you very much.
• 52:51
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you.