Latest / The Skol Hop / TSH Ep. 9 - Pessimism vs. Optimism

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TSH Ep. 9 - Pessimism vs. Optimism · The Skol Hop

0:24
All right, Hey, Vikings fans, welcome in to the school. Hop
0:28
Evan here, God Austin. Hello. Hello. We're just a couple of
0:32
dudes from Iowa who like drinking beer and talking about the Vikings. Yeah school,
0:36
my friend's school. And so far the beer has been more fun than
0:40
the Vikings. Well, yeah, that's true. It's definitely not like last
0:45
season. No, last season that was a that was an anomaly, that
0:50
was a once in a lifetime season. And it's crazy to say that after
0:55
a you know, one playoff appearance with a loss. But well, we're
1:02
going to enjoy these beers here. Yeah, and we're going to talk about
1:07
the abysmal start to the season. But let's make sure we mention what we're
1:11
drinking here first. Yeah. So a few weeks ago I talked about how
1:15
I attended Octoberfest in the Amana Colonies. Right, Well, one of the
1:21
beers that I had there was from Millstream. It was their Octoberfest. And
1:27
so that is what we are drinking tonight. What do you think about it?
1:30
Of I like it. I've had this one before. And as you
1:34
know, if you're a listener of the podcast, all three of them,
1:38
all five of you last Okay, I think we have a few more than
1:42
three, hopefully maybe not this week. But if you've been listening at all,
1:47
you know that I love Octoberfest's one of my favorites, and this is
1:52
a good one for sure. Yeah. I like this one a lot too,
1:56
so much so that I went back to it within, you know,
1:59
a couple of weeks of having it the first time. So this is mill
2:02
Streams Octoberfest made brood canned everything in I guess, I don't know if it
2:08
says canned in there Brooden packaged in a Mana, Iowa. So that's right.
2:14
Check it out if you haven't already. It's it's hitting the spot and
2:16
it's kind of easing our pain a little bit right now. And I'm not
2:20
superstitious. I am a little stitious, But the last time we had Octoberfest
2:25
on the podcast, the Vikings won the next week, so they did,
2:31
so maybe we it's our fault, yeah, because we have an Octoberfest last
2:37
week leading up to the Chiefs game, so well, that kind of lends
2:42
credence to the idea of kirktober. I mean, October has been an on
2:47
a month for Kirk Cousins in his career it has. I didn't plan on
2:53
saying that, otherwise I'd probably like have his career stats in front of me
2:55
in October. But it's pretty good. I'm pretty sure he once won,
3:00
you know, NFC Player of the Month in October either last year the year
3:04
before. So maybe it just took him a minute to wake up, and
3:07
now that we're really in October, he can get back to those Kirktober days.
3:13
Well. He hasn't been playing bad though. I mean he's been statistically
3:16
top three in almost every major category in terms of quarterbacks in the league.
3:23
Not just in the NFC, but I mean league wide. Kirk has been
3:29
one of the best quarterbacks playing football so far. Yeah, he's been really
3:32
good. And it's really good that great quarterback play always equals wins in this
3:38
league. I wish that this is almost another argument for Kirk in the idea
3:46
that wins are not a quarterback stat because his poorest game this season is the
3:53
only Vikings win so far. Yeah, and I don't know, should we
4:00
be rooting for a more mediocre Kirk so that the wins start coming. Well,
4:04
there is a correlation. It maybe isn't a perfect correlation between quarterback play
4:11
and winning. But I mean, you got to look at the bigger picture
4:16
here. We've struggled to run the ball almost all year, and you know,
4:27
now we're down our best player, arguably one of the league's best,
4:31
absolutely, and I don't expect Kirk to drop in production. I mean,
4:41
I can see where that thought process is coming from, because, like,
4:45
yeah, JJ, one of the league's top five players. I don't think
4:48
you can really argue with that. You can definitely say he's the best player
4:51
in the league. He's out for at least four games. Sounds like it
4:57
could be a little bit more than four. We're not too sure yet.
5:00
The team has kind of said that they're not going to rush him back on
5:03
the field. I don't know why you would with a one and four record,
5:08
especially, but they've also been talking up Addison ever since the draft.
5:15
I mean, the only negative thing we've heard about him so far, which
5:19
I'm you know, reiterating the coaches words from this week. The only negative
5:25
we've really heard is that that speeding ticket, which thank god that turned out
5:29
the way it did rather than like scarier ending. But I mean, I
5:34
think the kind of mindset is that, well, it's not like We're we
5:39
It's not like the Vikings are, you know, coming in with a huge
5:42
record anyways, and you're going up against another really bad record team in the
5:47
league, and you have a really hyped up rookie wide receiver who theoretically could
5:53
step into those shoes and hopefully keep that pass game up to the way it
5:59
was before JJ went down. Yeah, and I'm just looking at the box
6:03
score from the Chiefs game this last week. I mean, he's still had
6:08
Jordan Addison had six catches for sixty four yards, which is a ten yard
6:13
average basically, and a touchdown on nine targets. So, I mean,
6:19
if JJ's not there, it seems like, at least in the very small
6:23
sample size that we have of like the last part of the third quarter and
6:27
all of the fourth quarter of the Chiefs game this last week, Jordan might
6:30
be the guy that Kirk looks for first, and then you know, some
6:35
of those other guys TJ and kJ will have to step up. Yeah,
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I man, TJ. He's been had some drops. He's been frustrating so
6:46
far. Yeah, I mean, he's been okay, but he's had some
6:51
very i opening plays that are negative for the team. I mean, the
6:58
dropped pass again. I don't even remember who all we played so far.
7:01
Against the Chargers, I'm pretty sure at the end of the game that if
7:04
he would have caught, that would have been a win. I think it
7:08
was also against the Chargers one of his first catches, he got the ball
7:12
for a decent gain and then the defender just came up and snagged the ball
7:15
out of his hand. He's had some drops. I don't think Kirk has
7:19
been perfect on all of those those missed catches by TJ. But when you
7:26
when you're, in some senses, the highest paid tight end in the league,
7:31
you gotta show up. I mean, the joke on Twitter has been
7:34
like, what happened to TJ's hands, Well, they're full of money.
7:38
Now, I don't think. I don't think it's quite that bad. I
7:43
think he's gonna be okay. Like we haven't seen, you know, the
7:46
beginning of a downfall of his entire career. But it's been frustrating, and
7:51
I'm sure he's just he's got to be just as frustrated as anybody else.
7:55
But he's not faultless and he needs to get better just like the rest of
8:00
the team. Nobody's faultless until you're you know, a completely undefeated season with
8:03
a Super Bowl, Like, nobody goes through the whole season being perfect,
8:09
even if you are the seventy two Dolphins or whatever they were. I mean,
8:13
they weren't perfect either. They probably had some close games and that,
8:18
you know, the more recent example would be the Patriots that were perfect through
8:22
the season and then lost to the Giants in the Super Bowl. So yeah,
8:26
you're right, nobody. Nobody's perfect, and the Vikings have been far
8:31
from perfect, leading the league in turnovers, which that's so frustrating. It
8:37
is a frustrating thing. And I was ready to throw a remote at the
8:41
TV or something when Josh Oliver fumbled the football on the first play of the
8:48
game, first play after a decent game, like that was a good catch.
8:52
It was a good catch, and then like everybody's fumbling like nobody.
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You can't sit easy on any play watching the Vikings on offense because you're always
9:01
gonna think they're gonna fumble or ope, there did they fumble right there,
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even though you know there's no question if they did or not. There's some
9:09
PTSD of like every snap where and I think you were describing this to me,
9:13
and I actually felt it this week, like hang onto the ball yea.
9:18
And I think I have repeated that phrase almost every time we made any
9:22
sort of long gain, like hang onto the ball, Hang onto the ball.
9:24
It's just so frustrating to watch every play and whether it's a two yard
9:30
loss or a forty yard game, like just at the end to have to
9:33
hyper examine the end of the tackle just to make sure the guy didn't freaking
9:37
let go of the ball. It was also interesting I watched the defenders,
9:43
the Viking defenders on the drive after the Josh Oliver fumble, and they were
9:50
going after Chiefs players trying to rip the ball out of their hands, And
9:54
so you gotta wonder, like maybe we just don't pay attention that much until
10:01
it happens to us, and then we watch our guys go out and try
10:05
to make up for it. Mm hmm. But hanging on to the football
10:09
in the NFL, it's a tough job. Everybody's coming after it, especially
10:13
when you're known for turning the ball over every two seconds, Like if you
10:18
if they think you're gonna fumble, they're just gonna believe it when they try
10:20
to punch the ball out of your hands and it's gonna work a lot of
10:22
times because they believe it. They're, you know, picturing the ball coming
10:26
out of your hands, and when it happens every time, it's it's really
10:31
frustrating. And another thing about the defenders. They need to learn how to
10:35
tackle. So many open field tackles are missed. And I know that happens
10:39
a lot in the league for every team, but it just seems like they
10:43
can't. The Vikings can never get the guy down with one defender, like
10:48
regardless of where they are on the field, which is extremely frustrating. That's
10:52
almost as frustrating as a fumble. Like you think you got a guy,
10:56
you know, a quick screen, and there's a corner back right on him
11:01
the second he touches the ball and it doesn't even matter because cornerback just slides
11:03
off like the offensive guy is covered in butter. Then he gains ten yards
11:07
and like when you could have had a two yard loss. I saw that
11:11
you tweeted at was it Dustin Baker? Yeah, yeah, I did.
11:16
Did you ever get a response? No? I didn't. I'm a little
11:18
surprised because I've actually I've interacted with him a couple of times, and that
11:22
seems like the kind of stat that he tweets out, you know, the
11:26
Vikings lead the league in miss tackles Like that just seems like something he would
11:30
know and be able to tweet out. But maybe I'll ask him again.
11:33
Maybe we'll see if you can get some interaction. It would be an interesting,
11:37
albeit obscure stat. Yeah, and maybe it's not one that you can
11:41
track unless like you watch every single game and you're super anal about it and
11:46
just watching everybody miss tackles. I don't know if missed tackles are or whift
11:54
tackles category. I mean, I know, like you can track it for
11:58
like you can you know this running has broken four tackles this game. Like
12:03
it's something I've seen heard before, but not necessarily on the defensive side of
12:07
the ball, like, oh, this season the Vikings missed x amount of
12:11
tackles, Like I don't know, I haven't really seen it, but it
12:16
seems like if they could fix that, it'd be a lot less frustrating,
12:20
have a lot less first downs and a lot less ten minute drives. I
12:24
think another issue And we've already touched on JJ right, but it's not just
12:33
JJ A Caleb Evans went down twice, and I think he's out for a
12:37
little bit. Is that right? While I pulled up the injury report that
12:41
came out today, Yeah, inform us, Oh went away, all right,
12:48
I'm gonna have to find it. Oh, here we go. So
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as of Thursday, which is when we're recording a Caleb Evans, he was
12:58
limited. So I don't necessarily know that means, I mean, he wasn't
13:01
I did not participate at least practicing. Yeah, him and Jordan Addison or
13:09
limited. That's the practice today. Marcus Davenport, he was limited yesterday on
13:15
Wednesday, but he was a full participant today from his elbow, not even
13:18
his ankle. And Knay wang Wu he uh coming back from my r uh.
13:24
Yeah, And I don't know if that means he's gonna play this week.
13:28
He was designated to return. So he's currently this is wang Wu.
13:31
He's currently in that twenty one day practice window where within that window, if
13:37
you you have to decide if you're gonna bring him back to the full roster
13:41
or if you're gonna keep him on IR. And I forget the rules on
13:43
if he keep him eye on IR. If that's like a season ending thing
13:46
or if it's another four games or whatever. But at least for wong Wu,
13:52
he's been a full participant two days in a row after missing those first
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four games, So maybe he's coming back. But again, it's like he's
14:00
a starter. It's not like we're getting JJ back, you know, so,
14:03
but they've thrown him into return kicks and punts and things like that.
14:05
Oh, he's an electric He's an electric kick returner. I mean, at
14:11
times you could have said he's the best in the league, you know,
14:13
in whatever week. In previous years, I think he has three touchdowns two
14:18
or three touchdowns in his three year career. Yeah, so he can.
14:24
Definitely he has the ability to come in and really be a difference maker on
14:26
the kick return, which would be nice. But I don't know that that
14:31
outside of the big return that Brandon Powell fumbled away, I don't know that
14:35
kick returning has been like a huge issue. I mean, obviously you can
14:41
always do better, but it's not like we're saying, oh, we're losing
14:43
games because we're not good enough on the kick and punt return. It's definitely
14:46
like a secondary or tertiary issue. Yeah, But I mean, if you
14:50
if you get a touchdown here and there, that can I mean, if
14:54
you get one kick return touchdown, that can be a huge game changing difference
14:56
maker. Special teams can swing moment to absolutely absolutely, So that'll be nice
15:03
to get him back. But I forgot Jordan Addison was on the injury report,
15:07
so did I until you mentioned it. Yeah, but I think it
15:09
said he was a full participant today. So hopefully we're not down our top
15:13
two receivers against the Bears, who they're a frustrating team to watch too,
15:20
because I can't really peg. Like the last two weeks, they've gotten up
15:24
to big leads and then in the second half they've kind of blown it.
15:28
Last week, you know, their previous game, they they were starting to
15:31
blow the lead and then they really took the top off and Dj Moore turned
15:35
into the second coming of Justin Jefferson. But but yeah, I don't know
15:41
what we've got looking ahead at if we can even beat this terrible Bears team,
15:48
which is kind of a frustrating thing to say. Well, we play
15:52
in Chicago, but remember when we did the schedule pick them, we mentioned
16:02
first of all that this is an outdoor game played in mid October, which
16:08
benefits the Vikings. The last time the Vikings went to Chicago, we were
16:14
there in attendance and it was January, and it was actually a pretty mild
16:17
day for January. It wasn't super cold. Yeah, we were bundled up
16:19
and we didn't even really It was in the low thirties and high twenties.
16:26
It wasn't terrible. But this will be October fifteenth, and I think it'll
16:33
be a fairly manageable day for the Vikings weather wise. Anyways. Yeah,
16:40
so that's encouraging. I've got us winning this game, so does my wife.
16:51
But my kids have us losing. My kids have us going on a
16:55
three game losing streak. Oh, that would be way different than what we've
16:57
seen so far this season. Already had a three game losing streak. Yeah,
17:02
my kids have us sitting at three and two right now. That is
17:07
far from reality. Yep. Yeah, just not a lot of exciting things
17:12
to say about the Vikings right now. I think they'll beat the Bears,
17:15
but who knows. They could come out and crap the bed like they have
17:21
the whole rest of the season, which is so frustrating because you could talk
17:26
about a couple plays in all of these games where I mean literally like two
17:32
plays each game where if it goes differently, you're winning the game. Well,
17:34
yeah, the Chargers game, we were in it until the end.
17:38
Yeah. Even the Eagles game, we were in it until the end.
17:42
Even this Chiefs game, there was a point towards the end the Vikings were
17:47
driving, they were in the red zone. They had I don't know if
17:51
it was a screen or not, but a quick pass out to the flank
17:55
to Madison and he dropped the ball or I don't know if it was a
18:00
good pass or whatever, but he was pretty wide open and if he would
18:03
have caught that ball, it would have been a tough touchdown, but it
18:08
could have been easily a touchdown and that would have tied the game up.
18:12
I'm pretty sure. I don't remember exactly when and where it was, but
18:17
I'm pretty sure it would have tied the game up within the final four minutes
18:19
of the game. If you catch that ball, I mean, score that
18:25
touchdown. That's one of the couple of plays, and that's not even a
18:30
play that people were complaining about the refsin for the Chiefs game, Like,
18:34
you just gotta do the right things when you're supposed to because you're paid a
18:37
lot of money to do those things, and when you don't, you end
18:41
up one and four. How much of the Vikings one and four record a
18:48
tribute to Kevin O'Connell and especially those late game clock management because it seemed like
18:57
last year we could almost do no wrong, and it seemed like in those
19:02
moments he was clutch. Yeah, he was a clutch play caller. He
19:06
was clutched when it came to managing the clock. Well, and there were
19:11
several games I can't pinpoint. They might have to really go back and look,
19:15
but there were several games where I think you and I had both identified
19:19
moments where he differed so much from Mike Zimmer. Oh yeah, yeah.
19:25
It was a very new age, like oh yeah, I can't believe they're
19:27
actually going forward there Actually was kind of incredible, like maybe this is how
19:33
the Vikings finally get to a super Bowl and he's kind of been scapegoaded,
19:41
I think a little bit, at least from what I've seen on Twitter and
19:45
Sports Center and things like that, of like he's struggling to manage the clock,
19:52
especially in those late game clutch situations, which I think is interesting based
19:56
on our success in those it's only a season ago. Last season. Yeah,
20:03
I mean, I would think that Koc himself would put put the blame
20:08
on him, just because that's what a head coach does. But I don't
20:14
know, it's hard to put a lot of blame on somebody when you're turning
20:18
over the ball every two seconds. It's hard to point it at one guy
20:22
when it's not just the same guy turning over the ball. I mean,
20:26
the defense hasn't been great, but they've been on the field for more than
20:30
half the game every game. The rushing game hasn't been consistently good, but
20:34
they cough up the ball every two seconds. Kirk has been okay, but
20:38
in his worst statistical game, that's the only win the Vikings have this year.
20:42
So that's kind of weird. Anyways, and I think he was a
20:45
little off against the Chiefs, like a lot of high balls. I don't
20:51
know, just he seemed not Kirk, like, not good, you know,
20:56
he seemed like what people think he is, do you. I forget
21:00
who it was, but somebody was kind of trying to drag Kirk through the
21:07
mud for going to the Twins game. Oh yeah, uh Fourio from Maybe.
21:14
Yeah, there was Mike Floria, He's saying, yeah, Pat Mahomes,
21:18
he's spent that time, you know, preparing for the game. Which
21:22
there's no way you can know that. Do you know what Pat Mahomes is
21:25
doing all the time? Like no, If Pat Mahomes eats chicken nuggets all
21:30
day and doesn't do anything but still wins games, nobody's gonna know or care
21:34
because he's winning games. If Pat Mahomes lives in the film room and the
21:38
training room, not like in the weight room and you know, watching film
21:42
and preparing every game and they lose every game, nobody cares because they're losing
21:48
every game. You know, it just Kirk, How dare he take his
21:52
family to a baseball game? Like, oh my gosh, that's frustrating.
21:56
It is agreed, I the Kirk can go to a baseball now they're one
22:00
and four, So criticize everybody for everything, But like that's ridiculous, Like
22:07
he doesn't live at the facility. Nobody lives there. Maybe the coaches do,
22:11
but they're supposed to, you know, Like, I don't know.
22:15
It's frustrating. This whole season's frustrating. That's why we drink beer on this
22:19
show. Well, let's look ahead to the Bears a little bit, and
22:26
let's talk about potential storylines, anything that we're kind of looking forward to.
22:33
Obviously, it's gonna be kind of a bummer of a game because both teams
22:38
aren't that strong. But I think I still believe that the Vikings are a
22:45
much better one and four team than their record shows. I would tend to
22:51
agree, but again, it doesn't matter because their records one and four.
22:55
You know, like, yeah, sure, you can have moral victories all
22:57
day, but like, and I agree, yes, if I had to
23:00
put money, which I won't, if I had to put money on one
23:04
of these teams winning this game, my gut says the Vikings. But I'm
23:10
obviously super biased, and we've seen the Vikings just shoot themselves in the foot
23:17
every chance they can. They're gonna turn the ball over at least twice,
23:22
and they're gonna miss four or five tackles, and Justin Fields is gonna look
23:27
like the next coming of every a mix of every Hall of Fame quarterback that's
23:33
ever taken a step on a football field. It's gonna have five hundred yards
23:37
rushing and five hundred yards pass it, just because that's how this season's going
23:41
the Vikings are just gonna You really think the running back that plays quarterback for
23:47
the Bears is gonna come out and look like maybe this will be good because
23:51
a game like this, because he's I just I feel it, and it's
23:55
so annoying, but I feel that Justin Field's is gonna come out and luck
23:59
in to one hundred and fifty yards rushing and he's gonna have a receiver make
24:06
him look amazing by turning a two yard dump off pass into a fifty yard
24:10
touchdown. But this is the kind of game that is going to dupe Bears
24:15
fans and the front office into thinking Fields is actually good because he's gonna luck
24:19
into so many good things against this team that the Vikings have a tendency of
24:25
making quarterbacks look the opposing quarterback look like a Hall of Famer and it's it's
24:32
just gonna happen, or or we could look at this more positively. We
24:37
could and maybe the Vikings get it figured out. Yeah sure, maybe we
24:41
don't. Maybe we don't turn the ball over at all, Maybe there's not
24:45
a single turnover. Maybe maybe the Bears are the ones that turn the ball
24:49
over and we take advantage of those I will I'll say this for this coming
24:55
Bears game and the rest of the season. If the Vikings go an entire
25:00
game without turning the ball over in any given game this whole rest of the
25:03
season, they will win. Not even just winning the turnover battle. If
25:08
they go a whole game without turning the ball over, they will win.
25:12
And that's my bold take on the rest of the season. So if you
25:18
can go anywhere against the Bears, and Soldier Field has been a tough place
25:22
for the Vikings to play, you know, since my fan hoods started for
25:26
whatever reason. And if you can go there and not turn the ball over
25:32
and maybe not with twelve tackles on defense, you're gonna win. Because I
25:37
think this could be a breakout game for Jordan Addison. I think kJ Osborne
25:42
has a little bit of chip on his shoulder because he's not producing like the
25:47
quote unquote number two wide receiver he thought he would be this year. I
25:52
feel like he thought he would step in and be the Adam Thielen this year,
25:56
which I think we all kind of did. Yeah, I felt really
26:00
confident in his ability to do so. Yeah, he's he's shown really good
26:04
flashes Throughout his career, he's been good. I have been liking the fact
26:07
that he's a Viking, and even this year. I don't really have any
26:11
huge reason why. I mean, I think he had the one game maybe
26:15
against the Eagles if I remember right, that he had some rough plays that
26:18
he could have caught the ball where he didn't. But I mean, I
26:22
don't know. He hasn't been fumbling the ball, so he hasn't. It's
26:26
not like we're saying kJ is the reason the Vikings are one and four right
26:30
now. I don't have anything other than like observational data to back this up,
26:36
but I kind of think he's oh late season bloomer could be so again,
26:45
I'd have to really go back and dig through the previous seasons to see
26:48
where he's really kind of hit his stride. But I don't know. I
26:52
remain optimistic about him. Yeah, I don't have any immediate reason to think
26:56
he's gonna just be terrible. And now without JJ, I mean, everybody's
27:00
mindset changes a little bit, so maybe I don't know, maybe something clicks.
27:06
I think I mentioned before, like back in the day when Megatron was
27:10
playing for the Lions, he was almost a hindrance because he was so good
27:15
that it's like, oh, we gotta make sure Megatron gets the ball as
27:18
much as possible, and he was the only guy defend defenders had to worry
27:22
about. And granted he still got his numbers, but like, I feel
27:26
like he was kind of a hindrance against the Lions because you can't just do
27:30
the same thing over and over again. And I don't think JJ has been
27:36
that for the Vikings. I don't think it's been like, you know,
27:37
the Randy number? What what did ah? What did Denny Green call it
27:41
for Randy Moss? Like the Randy ratio? That's what it was. He
27:45
had to make sure Randy got the ball X amount of times. I don't
27:49
think that's at least been a noticeable thing for fans with JJ. It's not
27:55
like we're saying, oh, you had this guy wide open, why do
27:57
you try to force it to JJ haven't really seen that, but maybe you
28:03
feel a little bit more free or feel like you have to step up a
28:06
little bit more because the best player is out. I mean, of course
28:10
that didn't happen against the Chiefs after JJ went down, But I don't know,
28:17
well, and you got to look at you know, the Vikings struggles
28:22
to run the ball, force the Vikings to pass the ball, and then
28:26
when you're forcing the pass, I mean stuff like Kirk throwing really untimely picks
28:36
a ninety nine yard pick six as one of them, and your best receiver
28:42
going out going on ir for at least four weeks with an injury, Kirk
28:48
floating someone's some passes over TJ, and I think a few others he's been
28:55
kind of inaccurate on, Like when you rely on the pass game so much
29:00
and you don't have that that consistent, steady force like we had in Dalvin
29:04
Cook. You know, I think you're going to see those flaws in the
29:10
passing game and you don't have the run game to just fall back on.
29:14
Yeah, you know, so, I wonder if there's a little bit of
29:18
that, Like we're over emphasizing one aspect of the game and it's kind of
29:23
becoming an issue. It's not a Megatron issue, because it's not one person.
29:30
But I know what you're saying. Yeah, Like, I don't know
29:33
you you you've emphasized this aspect of your game planning so much that other teams
29:40
just know, they just know this is how we're gonna have to defend that,
29:44
and we're gonna have to take We're gonna have to take away the middle
29:48
of the field. We're gonna have to take away you know, JJ for
29:52
sure. And now they're not gonna have to worry about that. Yeah,
29:56
I mean, yeah, how well? And that could how do teams defend
30:00
this Vikings team? Now that you don't have JJ, Maybe you're gonna see
30:06
somebody that you don't normally see. I mean, maybe the and Keel Harry's
30:11
of the world come in and do something that defenses didn't prepare for because I
30:17
hadn't seen it yet. I don't know. I just it's frustrating that after
30:22
five games we're still saying, oh, we need to fix the turnovers,
30:27
we need to fix the defense. Like this is deep enough into the season
30:33
now that you should be good at the things you're supposed to be good at.
30:37
To that point, I think the offensive line has started to look a
30:40
little bit better. Are Pro Football Focus had this as the best offensive line
30:45
the Vikings have had all season against the Chiefs, even down to ed Ingram
30:52
looking better and good enough that, for whatever reason, Dalton Reisner hasn't seen
30:56
the field yet that's true. He has not, like, outside of a
31:00
couple of special teams plays like he hasn't seen the field, which maybe that's
31:06
because he still doesn't know the playbook well enough to get in the game.
31:08
Or maybe that's because nobody has played themselves out of the game to give Riisner
31:15
an opening during the game. I don't know, But we're not saying the
31:21
Vikings didn't win because of how bad the offensive line was. It's true.
31:26
Yeah, no inadvertent like stepping on Kirk's foot or causing the fumble when you're
31:30
an offensive lineman. So yeah, nothing like that, And I would agree,
31:36
Yeah, it seems like the offensive line has really started to hit a
31:40
stride and hopefully, I mean, if they can maintain hopefully we can get
31:47
these other things figured out and really kind of make some headway. It's it's
31:53
a pretty deep hole though, that we've dug ourselves in here. Oh yeah,
31:56
I mean, I don't I don't think you're doing anything this year.
32:01
Well, and looking at the schedule here in front of us, we still
32:05
have some tough games. We've got a Monday night game two weeks from now
32:08
against the Niners, arguably the best team in the league. Yeah, I
32:13
don't. I don't see anyway the Vikings win that game outside of luck,
32:16
you know, Like that's still a loss for me. Yeah, and I
32:22
pegged that as a loss to The Saints aren't looking bad this year, right,
32:31
Yeah, I mean they just blew out the Patriots last week. Right,
32:37
So we've got them coming up in about a month, and we've got
32:43
some other like I would call them winnable games, but it'll come down to
32:46
what we've been talking about, turnovers. It'll come down to who's healthy and
32:51
who's not and things like that. But I would say at Green Bay at
32:55
Atlanta winnable if things are flowing the right direction for us and if we're not
33:05
turning the ball over. At Denver, playing at altitude is always a struggle
33:10
for players that don't. But hopefully in the week leading up to that game
33:15
they can prepare for that and be ready for that. And then we get
33:21
Monday night after Thanksgiving, we get the Bears at home, which you have
33:24
them as a lock to lose, yep, and I had as a lock
33:30
to win. Yeah, that'll be interesting. But anyways, I think there
33:37
are some winnable games in the Foreseeable feature leading up to our bye week in
33:40
week thirteen. Yeah, so I mean we could be coming into the bye
33:45
week with a five hundred record. Yeah, possibly, but man, it's
33:52
a less than ideal place to be going into week thirteen. But I would
33:58
say at that point that would be things going really really well. Oh yeah,
34:01
like every problem fixed and all the luck going your way and JJ coming
34:08
back bigger and better than ever. Like a lot of things have gone right.
34:13
If we're in that scenario you just said, though, I will say
34:20
playoffs are not mathematically out of the question. They are. Nobody's out of
34:23
it and weak what five or six? But if the Vikings get to the
34:30
point where they have played their way into the playoffs, they'd be a dangerous
34:35
team because that means they've gone from one to four to you know, one
34:39
of the wild card spots, and nobody wants to play that team because they've
34:44
been fixing their issues. I don't think that's going to happen. I mean
34:49
I have my doubts as well, but I mean, you're kind of the
34:53
optimist. No, I'm the optimist. Yeah, when you're the pessimist,
34:58
I got my words mixed out. They're you are the pessimist for sure.
35:01
And I'm the optimist, and we could go back to a lot of different
35:07
text threads that you and I have had during many Vikings games, and I'm
35:10
typically, well, you know, things can improve from here. We'll be
35:15
all right, we'll figure it out. And you're like, burn the place
35:17
down, get rid of everybody. My text to you after, you know,
35:23
immediately after I finished watching the Chiefs game was trade everyone, fire everyone,
35:30
sell out for the first overall pick. I was emotional. Please forgive
35:36
me all of our great listeners, but I mean there was a right to
35:42
be emotional about that game, though. I mean, we were in it
35:45
until the bitter end against arguably one of the better teams in the league,
35:51
and we had a few things that didn't go our way. The picked up
35:54
past interference call that probably should have been pass interference, yeah, followed by
35:59
or dovetailed with the Chiefs player taking off his helmet in front of the refs
36:05
that had zero consequence whatsoever, which should have been a penalty. I'll never
36:09
I don't get that why that wasn't a penalty. I mean it's a well
36:14
known thing. Players do not take their helmets off, right, so much
36:19
so that during the Minneapolis miracle when you know, the nail and the coffin
36:25
digs caught the ball, ran in the end zone, immediately chucked his helmet.
36:30
I put my hands on my head like, oh no, he's gonna
36:32
get a penalty. Yeah, and they didn't throw the penalty, which I
36:36
mean the game was over at that point. Yeah, and even in that
36:38
scenario would have been. But he forced on the even even Justin Jefferson got
36:44
fined like I don't know, some five figure him out for his little small
36:49
man cele tendrand something like that. Yeah, Like, I mean, the
36:52
NFL is really picky about the about taunting and about those safety things, and
37:01
you're right, they don't typically mess around when it comes to helmets off on
37:06
the field. Well, and even Tyreek Hill got fined for not wearing socks
37:09
the other day. Like they're they're gonna find you for the dumbest things.
37:15
And I mean this wasn't a like finding moment. But when the ref looks
37:22
at you and says put your helmet on, that's a bad look. And
37:24
I hope somebody got yelled at for that because you don't tell him put your
37:30
helmet on. You throw the flag, tell him that's why you threw the
37:32
flag Like I don't know, and I don't I don't think it's necessarily he
37:39
got you know, Lee way because he's a Chief and the Chiefs are the
37:44
favorite team. I don't. I don't buy into that. But like it's
37:46
still frustrating, and like you said earlier, it's not like it would have
37:52
given the Vikings the ball back because it was after the play, but it
37:57
still would have well, shoot, if they would have kept the past interference
38:00
call that should have been called in the first place. I still don't understand
38:06
that. I mean, if we think about what could have been in that
38:08
moment that wasn't if the past interference call happens, it's a spot foul.
38:15
We were in side of the five, I think I think that would have
38:19
been at the one yard line. Yeah, I agree, well, because
38:22
I think it was kind of at the goal line is where the past interference
38:24
occurred. And then I think the additional personal foul that would have been called
38:30
for taking the helmet off would have added. It would have added fifteen yards
38:36
in a normal situation, but we would have been at the one anyways,
38:38
so it would have been half the distance to the goal. And then you
38:42
just do a brotherly shove. Somebody pushes Kirk's butt into the end zone and
38:46
we score a touchdown there and we tie the game. Oh to that note,
38:50
they the Vikings were successful on that type of a you know, they
38:53
were one d QB sneak on a fourth down right, yeah, well either
38:59
third down or fourth down, yeah, third or fourth in inches. They
39:01
ran it at two or three times and were successful. And I noticed one
39:05
thing when they did that. It's almost like Kirk took the snap and like
39:09
almost leaned back for a second and then went forward. It's like he waited
39:15
for the the defensive and offensive lines to collapse a little bit in front of
39:20
him and then leaped forward. Like interesting shit, if you can go back
39:24
and watch those couple of plays, and it does seem like he kind of
39:28
stuttersteps a little bit. And I don't know if that was on purpose or
39:30
by design. It worked, but because when you usually work anyway, when
39:36
you watch like Jalen Hurtz do that, oh yeah, they do it,
39:37
and there's like four guys pushing him and he's well, he like disappears into
39:43
like Jason Kelsey's butt almost yeah, just like he just gets swallowed up into
39:49
the offensive line in front of him, and they score touchdowns and they get
39:54
first downs on that play all the time. Yeah, and a lot of
39:58
people are frustrated by that. I guess I don't really know your opinions on
40:02
the tush push or the brotherly love play. I don't see any issue with
40:07
it because I don't think I don't think they're breaking any rule. No.
40:10
I think people argue that, like, you shouldn't be able to like push
40:15
and assist the ball carrier. But we see it on stuff like that.
40:17
If a running back like his, let's say he runs ten yards and he
40:22
gets stopped, you know, off a yard shore of the end zone,
40:23
but he's still on his feet, you always see a teammate of his come
40:27
up and like push the pile forward, and the announcers are always like,
40:30
oh, look at that second effort, and oh look his teammates are helping.
40:34
I like that. I don't think there's anything wrong. I think push.
40:37
I think it happened in a college game. I can't remember, but
40:39
I saw it, like on Twitter or something. It was on a punt
40:44
return and members of the opposing team tried to force the receiving the receiver to
40:54
touch the ball. Yeah, you see that every once in a while.
40:57
Yeah. I thought it was funny because there was just this game of defenders
41:01
that grabbed, like literally grabbed the punt returner in tried to force him to
41:07
touch the ball so that they could recover the fumble. Now that isn't legal,
41:10
like you can't block somebody or push somebody into the ball like that.
41:15
That will get called as a penalty. But and I don't know if it
41:19
did. I just saw it, and I was like, Oh, that's
41:21
creative, I guess. I remember back in the day, Adrian Peterson,
41:28
he he was I don't remember exactly the play, but he was getting stopped
41:32
somewhat short of the goal line, within the two or three yard line.
41:37
And I forget the tight end's name. His last name was Ford. I'm
41:40
pretty sure like literally picked up Adrian and like lunged him into the end zone.
41:46
And I was surprised when I saw that. This might have been twenty
41:50
twelve, this might have been the MVP year, so way back in the
41:52
day. But I remember at the time thinking like, oh, is he
41:55
going to get penalized for that? And I think the announcers even said something
42:00
that I'm not sure about that. You can't, you know, assist the
42:04
ball carrier. But there wasn't a penalty on that play and Adrian scored the
42:07
touchdown. I wish I knew when that was against who. Yeah, I'm
42:12
pretty sure the tight end was Ford. You don't have to dig through the
42:15
archives. You can find that and post it on the social should Yeah,
42:19
because it was a memorable play. I feel like once, if you were
42:22
to see it, you'd be like, oh, yeah, I've seen that
42:24
highlight before. But yeah, I don't I don't see any issue with it.
42:29
It's not like you're picking up the ball carrier and running them in like
42:32
holding them like a baby and running them around, which again I don't really
42:37
think there'd be an issue with that either, Like what's what's the problem?
42:39
Pick them up and shove them in the end zone, like go for it.
42:44
It's a team sport. It should be a team effort. It's a
42:45
team sport and a physical play. And I mean that's a huge thing in
42:49
rugby too, you know the scrum yep, you just scrum it out.
42:52
I mean, if you're not breaking any written rule, like I don't think
42:57
the toush push does. I don't I don't see any issue with it.
43:00
If it works, it works, people can be mad, but this league
43:04
figures out how stop things so and if they can't, then the league figures
43:10
out how to, you know, rule wise stop things, which I think
43:14
may happen, but as of right now, it's not breaking any rules.
43:19
I think it'd be kind of a difficult rule to enforce because there are so
43:23
many nuances to a play like that. Yeah, I think the way they
43:27
would do it is just saying you can't either you can't assist the ball carrier
43:31
moving forward, or you can't assist the quarterback if he's the ball carrier moving
43:37
forward. They figure something out. I mean, but in a scrum as
43:42
you've described, like, how are you going to identify who the guilty player
43:45
is? I think it would just be a if he call, like you
43:52
know, the example would be literally the running back coming up and butt cheek
43:57
to hand pushing somebody for like that would be the blatant okay, that breaks
44:01
the rule. If that's how they were to change it, which I don't
44:05
think they should. It's a physical game, like, let it be physical,
44:08
especially in that scenario where it's not like a kick return where guys are
44:13
running one hundred miles an hour at somebody and bashing heads open. This is
44:16
just strength versus strength, So nobody's really getting hurt unless you're getting fallen on,
44:24
you know, like it's not a bang bang play. It's just a
44:28
strong man play. Well, and they've i mean, in recent years,
44:32
the league has really protected the quarterback. Yeah, unless he's a ball carrier.
44:37
True, but we've seen, I mean, we've seen all of these
44:40
rules, namely the the roughing the quarterback penalty kind of evolve and shift with
44:51
the demands of the game. And you know, certain players that will remain
44:54
nameless have influenced that. And you can say Tom Brady's name, that's okay.
45:00
You can say Aaron Rodgers' name and that's okay. I didn't want to
45:04
bring them up, but I think if they were to change that to try
45:09
to protect the quarterback, the easy thing is to like make sure you have
45:15
a defensive lineman that can take a snap as the quote unquote quarterback and that
45:21
kind of a play, which I'm kind of surprised that hasn't happened, like
45:23
the tush push, but you're really putting your fullback in as the quarterback.
45:30
Maybe it does happen. I don't know, something we didn't talk about from
45:32
the Chiefs game. I'm just now reminded of this. That fake punt was
45:38
pretty good. That was a double reverse. I'm kind of surprised they did
45:43
that because it I mean, it was a quick play, but that kind
45:45
of play can take a second to kind of form a little bit m hm,
45:52
and so it's kind of a ballsy thing to call, especially on top
45:54
of it being, you know, a fake punt. And it worked and
46:00
ty Chandler, how many yards did you get? He got definitely enough for
46:04
the first ten or so yards, like and it it's all for not I
46:09
saw something on Twitter. I think that this lady that she was like,
46:15
I'm a like fifty year old mom that doesn't really care about football, and
46:21
even I knew that was a fake punt or something like that. I was
46:23
like, because I was sitting in front of my TV just kind of thinking
46:28
like, this would be a great chance to fake it right now, And
46:30
then they did, and I just lost my mind. I was like,
46:32
yes, fans were booing the coach for throwing the punt team out like in
46:37
red play. Yeah, because it was only like two or three yards like
46:40
fourth and two ish, I think, and it ended up working, so
46:46
Koc looked like a genius. And more so, what's his name, Matt
46:52
Daniels, the special teams coach. I don't know how often you can get
46:57
away with that exact kind of a fake punt again, hm, because now
47:00
it's out there, but it worked and it ultimately led to a loss.
47:07
So way to keep us grounded there, my friend, Way to keep us
47:13
going. Yeah, I just it won't be too long. We'll be starting
47:15
to talk about Caleb Williams plays and highlights from his games and how cool it
47:21
would be to draft him with the first overall pick. A. Well,
47:28
how did that october Fest sit with you? It's good, it's good.
47:30
It's it's like medicine for for the broken Vikings fan's heart. So if you're
47:37
a Vikings fan and you need a little something, this one mill streams Octoberfest.
47:43
It's a six point two percenter, So I mean that's up there for
47:45
an Octoberfest's it's up there so enough that you'll feel it, but not too
47:50
much that you're gonna, you know, pass out on the floor mid game.
47:55
Yeah, it's it's been treating me, Well, what have you thought.
48:00
I've had it before, and of course you know I love Octoberfest,
48:02
so I can't complain at all. It's been an enjoyable one for sure,
48:07
and the podcast has been enjoyable too. Yeah, sitting and drinking some beer
48:13
talking about the Vikings. Yeah, the Vikings have struggled this year, and
48:19
yeah, we can be honest, it's not but a lost season yet,
48:22
but man, it's as close as it can be at this point. I
48:25
will choose to remain optimistic. Yeah, I will say I'm as much as
48:30
I joke and actually feel the feels. I'm never gonna really gonna really be
48:36
one that roots for a loss unless it's like the last game of the year,
48:40
and if you lose, you're guaranteed to have the first overall pick.
48:45
But outside of that scenario, which we witnessed when we went to the Vikings
48:50
Bears, yeah Soldier Field game last year. I mean, people thought the
48:55
Bears were gonna have the second pick and the Texans were gonna have the first
48:59
because obviously that's were gonna lose. But then Lovey Smith he coached the Texans
49:04
to a win for whatever reason, and the Bears lost, and those were
49:07
the loudest cheers of the game from Bears, from Bears fans when the Texans
49:13
actually lost, because it was when when our game, the game that we
49:16
were there to watch, was over and ton And decided and yeah, they
49:22
the Bears fans had learned that they got the first overall pick. Yep,
49:25
and I was happy for them. And now I we're in the same boat.
49:30
Well now it's kind of a battle between us and then or it could
49:35
end up being a battle. I guess I'm still rooting for wins because you
49:39
can always go get your guy if you don't have the first overall pick.
49:44
I mean, Pat Mahomes was not the first overall pick. Bryce Young so
49:47
far was and he's not looking amazing. You can always go get your guy.
49:52
I mean for Pat Mahomes. The Chiefs they had like the twentieth overall
49:57
pick, and they traded all the way up to ten to get so and
50:00
nobody remembers what they traded because it doesn't matter. They got Pat Mahomes.
50:05
So if they can identify the right guy, we're gonna be looking at probably
50:09
a new quarterback next year, maybe unless they can figure out one more season
50:14
with Kirk. I don't know. They're gonna figure it out. Next year
50:17
will hopefully be better, and we don't need to root for losses. Don't
50:22
root for losses. Let's hope for a better end to the season or a
50:28
better middle part to the season. For sure. It's a little freeing though,
50:32
because at some point, yeah, we're not gonna root for losses,
50:35
but we're not gonna care so much. So it'll be they'll be beer games,
50:39
you know, we'll just be watching care kind of. I mean,
50:43
we're nearing the point of apathy. It was just like, nah, whatever
50:46
happens happens, you know, mm hmm. So next week we will have
50:52
a Bears Vikings game to talk about that will have already happened, and talking
50:58
with us, I believe will be our show's first guest. That's right.
51:02
So if you've been counting, this is our ninth episode right here, this
51:08
one that you're listening to. The next episode will be episode ten, and
51:15
in celebration of ten episodes, we will be bringing on our first guest.
51:22
Are we going to keep this a surprise or are we going to reveal the
51:23
guest? I was gonna reveal it, but you should we keep it a
51:29
surprise, No, you can. We can reveal all right, well,
51:32
we're probably gonna lose a listener next week because one of our very few listeners
51:37
will be on the show. He's a Bears fan. He's our friend that
51:40
brews his own beer, even though we can't have that beer because he's an
51:45
Illinois brewer. Forrest, Forrest the Bears fan, is going to be on
51:50
the show with us. So that'll be exciting. It will be a good
51:53
conversation, all love, all the way around, no matter what happens in
51:58
the game. Maybe a little jabbing here and there, but it's not gonna
52:02
be an argument. We're gonna talk good and bad about both teams no matter
52:07
what. And hopefully we can jab him a little bit because hopefully the Vikings
52:12
will have destroyed the Bears. That's the hope. Forrest. He did throw
52:16
me a bone this week though. Yeah, I don't know if you saw,
52:20
but I needed a running back in our fantasy league. Did he trade
52:24
with you? He traded? What did you send him? I'm sure I
52:27
could look at it was just the one for one trade. I got what's
52:32
his name from the Patriots werena Sean, I don't know, oh Man,
52:38
I don't know. Are Remandre Stevens. Yeah, I got him, and
52:45
I traded Garrett Wilson okay from the Jets. Geez Oka. Garrett Wilson was
52:51
on my bench. I was like, well, I need a running back
52:55
desperately, and Aaron Jones and uh Devin or Devon a Chain who is now
53:05
on the injured reserve too. Yeah he's I R. Jones has been out
53:08
for a couple of weeks, but he's on a bye. Maybe we'll get
53:10
him back. I don't know. Yeah, but I was in desperate need.
53:15
I'm surprised because I know Forrest he's been needing a quarterback. I thought
53:17
he's gonna well, yeah, I didn't he have Anthony Richard say yeah,
53:21
yeah, that's a tough talk about a tough no kidding, tough ir spot
53:25
right there. Jeez. Anyways, I still felt like he kind of threw
53:30
me a bone a little bit. Yes, he didn't have to give up
53:32
a running back, so I appreciate it for us. Did you initiate the
53:36
trade? I did ye, out of desperation. And did he accept it
53:39
out right? He did? Nice? Okay, Well, Forrest a good
53:44
guy, this good guy. It should be a good episode. Next week,
53:46
hopefully a happier one for us. Anyway, for us, it'll be
53:52
a more it'll be a fun one regardless, because, like we said,
53:55
Forrest is a beer guy, so maybe we'll talk more about beer than football.
54:00
Next week. We are going to require that he brings the beer,
54:04
correct, I believe so, all right, I believe so. I told
54:08
him. I told him he had to recommend a beer. But well maybe
54:14
maybe if the Vikings win, then I'll make sure he has to bring it.
54:20
If the Bears win, maybe I'll bring it. I don't know.
54:22
I'll sort that out with him, all right, You work that out with
54:25
him, and we will have our first ever guest, yeah on the show
54:30
next week. Yeah, as we recap the Bears game. The Bears lost
54:36
the Vikings. That's right. See, you do have a little optimism in
54:39
you. I mean, I want them to win every game, all right.
54:44
Ev If you want the Vikings to win every game or lose, maybe
54:47
you're in the fan group that wants the first overall pick. And right about
54:52
now is when you start rooting against the Vikings. Let us know? How
54:55
can they let us know it? At the school high? Yeah, and
55:00
that's everywhere. That's that's Twitter, slash x, that's Instagram on Facebook.
55:07
It's just the skull hop. Oh, we did get an email. We
55:12
got an email last week. Do we need to give out a sticker?
55:16
I told him i'd give him a sticker, Matt, or you've met Matt?
55:21
I think maybe. I don't know if you have now I'm questioning if
55:24
you've met him, well, at least my friend Matt. Matt, if
55:29
you're listening, Hello, he sent us an email and it was a short
55:31
email. It was a supportive email. I'm pretty sure most of what he
55:37
said was skull, but yeah, we got one. So thanks Matt.
55:42
Thanks Matt, you get a sticker. You get a sticker. I'm trying
55:46
to find it. I should have pulled it up already. But yeah,
55:49
most of it was supportive. Most of it was just school. So well,
55:53
thanks Matt. We appreciate it. Yeah, and we still have more
55:57
stickers. Yeah, so Matt's getting a sticker. If you send us an
56:00
email and you want a sticker, let us know. We will gladly send
56:04
you one and we'll tell you why it's funny, because we still haven't revealed
56:07
why they're funny yet. I kind of forgot about that that was a good
56:13
reminder all right. Well, next week a lot to look forward to,
56:16
hopefully of Vikings win, a guest on the show, hopefully some good beer
56:21
and some good conversation. Yet, until that time, school school,