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Love Story Creator Connor Hines on Turning Rejection Into Success · Clyde Confidential

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Hi, everyone, Welcome back to another episode of Quite Confidential.
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: I have a very exciting guest today. I have Connor Hines,
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: who is an actor, writer, producer, and creator of Love
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: Story on my couch with his assistant Sam.
• 0:14
  Speaker 2: Thank you for having us. So excited to be here.
• 0:17
  Speaker 3: I'm so happy to have you guys. Connor.
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: I'm very flattered that you said yes this with everything
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: going on, because you are so on demand right now,
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: I feel like it's easier for me to get Obama on.
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: Well, we've also been friends for a couple of years now,
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: and so I was more than happy to do this
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: and to come and see you and to hang and
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: best and to chat. So I'm excited to be here.
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: I think maybe Sam's a little nervous being on camera
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: done a podcast. No, this is the first time. Okay,
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: this is it.
• 0:46
  Speaker 3: Well it's it's not scary, So don't don't worry.
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: I'm I'm here and ready to get Now.
• 0:52
  Speaker 3: How long have you guys been working together?
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: Well, it's actually funny because when I was when we
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: were in the writer's room Love Story, and I was
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: looking for an assistant to come with me to New York.
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: Sam was working downstairs for He was the receptionist. Is
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: that what you were? Yeah, it was working reception for
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: Ryan Murphy Ryan Murphy TV. And so I used to
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: walk by him every morning and I'd be like morning Sam,
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: and then I'd leave and I'd be like night Sam.
• 1:22
  Speaker 2: For like five months and we never said anything other
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: than good morning and good night. And then when we
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: were interviewing, I interviewed a bunch of people and then
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: who recommend? Was it Juliana or Stephanie?
• 1:34
  Speaker 4: No, it was it was Juliana. She was getting over.
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: Our writer's assistant was like, you should talk to Sam downstairs,
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: and I was like the one that I say good
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: morning to and you came upstairs. We sat down and
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: I was like, do you want to move to New York?
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: And like was it like it was five days to
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: pack up your life? And he was like, he was
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: like I want to do it. He was like I
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: just I don't have any place to say, but don't
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: worry about it, like I'm gonna figure it out. And
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: you you ended up sort of you couchsurfed. Yeah.
• 2:04
  Speaker 4: I lived it like an NYU student's apartment that wasn't
• 2:09
  Speaker 4: there for three weeks and slept on like a mattress
• 2:13
  Speaker 4: on the ground and like nothing in the fridge.
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: And I was like, I we'll figure this out. Why not?
• 2:18
  Speaker 4: And then found a place in Brooklyn, a terrifying experience
• 2:24
  Speaker 4: in itself.
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: I had like eight roommates in Brooklyn Way. It flooded
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: like the first weekend. It's like a subterranean apartment and
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: so there was a rainstorm and it was just like
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: feet of water in your place, and I was like,
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: welcome to New York. This is gonna be great.
• 2:41
  Speaker 3: Oh my god.
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: You know what.
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: I think this is so important for all the younger
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: listeners right now, because if you want a.
• 2:48
  Speaker 3: Job, you do it. If he wanted to.
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: He was yes, exactly, and you didn't hesitate. And even
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: I was like, are you concerned that you don't have
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: a place to live? And he was like no, I'm
• 2:59
  Speaker 2: going to think it out. And I mean, that is
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: something that's very great about Sam is that you can
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: really throw him into any situation and he'll be like,
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: I don't know what I'm doing, but I'll figure it out.
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: And it's a great asset as an assistant because we
• 3:13
  Speaker 2: were thrown into lots of situations and he was like, we're.
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: Going to figure it out, You're fantastic. How did you
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: get the reception job.
• 3:22
  Speaker 3: For Ryan Murphy?
• 3:23
  Speaker 4: So I had I was mutual friends with Sarah Carr,
• 3:29
  Speaker 4: who's one of the managers over at Ryan Murphy Productions,
• 3:33
  Speaker 4: and it actually reached out to my little sister for
• 3:36
  Speaker 4: a job. And my sister was working for another showrunner
• 3:39
  Speaker 4: at the time and was like, Sam is actually freelancing
• 3:43
  Speaker 4: right now, so if you want to interview him, And
• 3:46
  Speaker 4: I got this interview, and I was It was right
• 3:48
  Speaker 4: after the strike, so I was so really hoping for
• 3:51
  Speaker 4: something consistent, and I had this first interview, it was great,
• 3:55
  Speaker 4: and then the fires happened, and then two months of
• 3:58
  Speaker 4: radio star strikes fires, and I was like, oh, man,
• 4:01
  Speaker 4: is this ever gonna happen? And then I made it
• 4:05
  Speaker 4: on to a second interview a couple months later, and
• 4:09
  Speaker 4: then they brought me on as kind of like a
• 4:12
  Speaker 4: in house PA slash receptionist, and I worked with them
• 4:16
  Speaker 4: for like six months, maybe maybe a little bit shorter
• 4:21
  Speaker 4: than that. Once they had all their shows going to
• 4:24
  Speaker 4: post production, they were like, we are going to have
• 4:26
  Speaker 4: to cut down on some staff and that.
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: Is when I got the interview with Connor. So it
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: was it was it was cosmic timing, and I was like,
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: I didn't even I had never had this job before,
• 4:38
  Speaker 2: I'd never created a show. I didn't even really know
• 4:41
  Speaker 2: what I needed. So in my mind, I probably interviewed
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: five people, and I was like, I mean that it
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: feels like the priority is just like somebody that I
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: can be around a lot of time. Like I'm like,
• 4:56
  Speaker 2: everybody can like sort of be organized and kind of
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: figure it out. But I was like, but I need
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: like this person's going to be around me constantly. And
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: I was like, I feel like this is somebody that
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: I'll be able to spend a lot of time with.
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: But like we met and then five days later, you
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: were like on a plane to New York. Yeah.
• 5:14
  Speaker 4: Absolutely, you know, I was in New York a little
• 5:17
  Speaker 4: bit before you were, so yes, which was nice for
• 5:19
  Speaker 4: me because his first time show running, my first time
• 5:22
  Speaker 4: being a showrunners assistant.
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: We kind of got to learn together.
• 5:25
  Speaker 4: Yes, and so having a little bit of a head start,
• 5:28
  Speaker 4: I could kind of like figure out the names. I
• 5:31
  Speaker 4: was so lucky to have other assistants on this show
• 5:34
  Speaker 4: who totally showed me the way to do things, and
• 5:38
  Speaker 4: oh my god, there, thank you Sam Parker for teaching
• 5:43
  Speaker 4: me how to do this.
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: It's it was such a team effort.
• 5:46
  Speaker 3: You'd never been on set before.
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: No.
• 5:48
  Speaker 4: I had been on set plenty, had I had. I
• 5:51
  Speaker 4: was a set PA for five years, so I had
• 5:54
  Speaker 4: all of that experience, but I had never really been
• 5:57
  Speaker 4: on the other side of the rope and kind of
• 6:00
  Speaker 4: spent more time in video village before.
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: And I had less, oddly enough, less set experience. I mean,
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: I'd had set experience as an actor, adult best friends,
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: adult best friends, and I but you know, when you're
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: a writer and you're staffed in a writer's room, your
• 6:16
  Speaker 2: contract ends when the room ends, which is usually before production.
• 6:21
  Speaker 2: And studios used to be more keen to facilitate writers
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: into production in order to get experience, but because as
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: budgets have contracted, they're like, we're not sending writers to
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: set once their contracts are done. So a lot of
• 6:35
  Speaker 2: writers aren't really getting any on set experience. It's like
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: you write the show, you develop it, but then they
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: go off and make it and you move on, hopefully
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: to another writer's room. And so I didn't have a
• 6:46
  Speaker 2: lot of experience, and I didn't really understand like we
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: would walk through set and I'd be like, who's that going?
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: What's their job? And he would explain to me, like
• 6:55
  Speaker 2: what everybody's role was. He's also like, I'm terrible with names,
• 6:58
  Speaker 2: so he was very helpful for remembering. But he had
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: such a better understanding of the inner workings of a
• 7:05
  Speaker 2: set than I did. And here I was the creator
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: of the show asking my assistant to be like, can
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: you tell me what everybody's job here is? Yes, like
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: so much I was. I mean, I really did ask
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: him a lot of questions, and then he in turn
• 7:17
  Speaker 2: suddenly was like at the epicenter of a show now,
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: you know, creatively and with me all the time. So
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: we were obviously either in the office writing or in
• 7:26
  Speaker 2: video village. But it worked out so well that he
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: had had as much experience on set, because yeah, I
• 7:33
  Speaker 2: did not, So he was really helpful in that sense too.
• 7:36
  Speaker 3: That's very crucial.
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: Yes, I can't believe that I can't like, I can't
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: imagine you getting this show off the ground, stepping onto set,
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: being like I actually like kind.
• 7:45
  Speaker 3: Of don't know this very well. Yeah, no, pretty daunting.
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: It's really daunting, And like the last thing you want
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: is for anybody to think that you don't know what
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: you're doing, and so yeah, fake it till you make it.
• 7:57
  Speaker 2: And like you know Tina Fey, which it's similar, but
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: she has like this thing that she said in a
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: commencement address which I always think about, which is like,
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: say yes and then figure out the rest later. And
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  Speaker 2: I think that's like so much of this industry is
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  Speaker 2: like you just have to be like I'm in I'll
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  Speaker 2: do it, and then put yourself in a position to
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: have to figure it out. You know, you almost have
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: to like back yourself into a corner so you're like, great,
• 8:20
  Speaker 2: now I have to make this work. And that's like
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: what this whole process was for me. It was just
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: sort of like building the plane while we were flying
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: it and but it ended up working out great. Yeah,
• 8:32
  Speaker 2: it's fantastic.
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  Speaker 3: And that's exactly what you did.
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: You were like, I see this opportunity. I know it's
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: going to take me somewhere amazing my career. I want
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: to support Connor. I'm going to say yes and figure
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: it out, even if it means something with seven roommates.
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: Oh my god.
• 8:44
  Speaker 4: No.
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  Speaker 2: And it was the best thing I ever could have
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: done for my career.
• 8:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
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  Speaker 4: I think being the business of saying yes it really
• 8:52
  Speaker 4: does kind of propel you forward. And you know, there's
• 8:55
  Speaker 4: a lot of you know, gatekeeping with a lot of
• 8:57
  Speaker 4: these jobs, and there's so much daunting kind of like, well,
• 9:00
  Speaker 4: I don't know how to do this. I've never taken
• 9:02
  Speaker 4: notes in a meeting or I've like I've never been
• 9:04
  Speaker 4: on set before. It's it's not rocket science.
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: You will sort it out.
• 9:08
  Speaker 4: It's just time. And you know, i'd say, like within
• 9:12
  Speaker 4: a month or two months, you know, it was routine
• 9:16
  Speaker 4: and yeah, kind of like we we were figured kind
• 9:19
  Speaker 4: of figure.
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: It out and.
• 9:21
  Speaker 4: Have have kind of a somewhat calmness coming to say.
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: But I think, like also so much of this industry
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: is like you have to be open to things unfolding
• 9:32
  Speaker 2: in the way that you did not plan for, and
• 9:34
  Speaker 2: you have to be open to like success is linear
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: for like absolutely nobody. You know. It's sort of like
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: you do a job you have no it might not
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: be what you had in mind, but I think you'll
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: be continued to be shocked by the doors that can open,
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: by the opportunities you weren't expecting and weren't necessarily that
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: excited for I don't think when he thought working as
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: a receptionist that, Oh my god, what are the chances
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: that somebody's making a show and the floor above us
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: and he happens to bring me in for an interview,
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: and then in five days I'm on set and in
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: New York. But I'm sure when you took that job
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: with URMTV, you weren't thinking in X amount of months,
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: I'm going to be living in New York and right
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: you know, be the creator's assistant. Yeah.
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: I think that's why.
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: More people need to be open to these jobs that
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: aren't necessarily your dream job at the moment, but can
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: open doors just by saying hi. Because Connor obviously remembered
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: you from your interactions morning and night, and.
• 10:32
  Speaker 3: You felt familiar in a way.
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: I'm sure so it made it maybe easier during the
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: interview process.
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely. And he always had like such a nice
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: energy too, Like he greeted everybody when they walked in
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: the door like it was like it wasn't your job,
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: but it was like, oh, he had such like a
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: lovely disposition to everybody that we worked with, And like
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: the other writers in our room took notice of it.
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: They're like, oh, that guy, don't sair Sam, Like he's
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: such a nice guy. And also he would very much
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: take an ishe with the assistance in our office when
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: they needed help. It was like, we have to set
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: up this desk, we have to build this chair, somebody's
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: got to grab the delivery, like the lunch order. And
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: they took notice of the fact that like he would
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: always extend to helping hand to them when it was
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: not a part of his job. And so they were
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: the ones that were like, you should look at this
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: guy because he's been so helpful for us when he
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: did not have to be. So I think in terms
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: of just taking initiative, you know, you never know what's
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: going to open up for you, right, Hell.
• 11:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Sam, that's awesome. So how long were you guys
• 11:32
  Speaker 3: on set together?
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: It felt like a decade, but it was only six months.
• 11:38
  Speaker 4: Yeah, six months. I feel like set ages you and
• 11:41
  Speaker 4: dog years.
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: Yes, it is. It is quite the marathon, but yeah,
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: especially because we were we worked together on set for
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: six months. But you work like sixteen eighteen hour days
• 11:56
  Speaker 2: and we work it and we work weekends. Yeah, it
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: was really it's a twenty four to seven job, and
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: so by extension, it's a twenty four to seven job
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: for Sam and so even when I interviewed him and
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: I was like, oh, we're probably going to be spending
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: a lot of time together. I was not even prepared
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: for the amount of time that we were going to
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: be together, which is that you were just like an
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: appendage of me for six months, But which is why
• 12:21
  Speaker 2: it was so critical. I mean that I lucked out
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: with somebody that I trusted and then I could confide in.
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: Because it's also like, having done it for the first time,
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: I didn't realize how sort of lonely the job can be.
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: You can become very solitary with that responsibility and pressure,
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: and you just kind of want to like burrow and
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: feel like figure it out and and not let anybody
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: kind of see you sweat because you don't want people
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: to feel like you're not in control. And so like Sam,
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: really like it's like and my you know, fiance is
• 12:55
  Speaker 2: living in La So like your assistant kind of becomes
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: your confidant, your therapist, your soundboard creatively. I mean, I
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: even think you were probably surprised how much I consulted
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: you about the work of the show. And it wasn't
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: just like getting me coffee. I would bring him in
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: and I'd be like the scene isn't working, Like what
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: do you think I'm missing? And so I utilized him
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: all the time for everything related to the show, and
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: that was new for me.
• 13:23
  Speaker 4: I had, like, you know, so much so much of
• 13:26
  Speaker 4: being a PA as being professionally invisible, where you're kind
• 13:31
  Speaker 4: of meant to be good at your job and it's
• 13:32
  Speaker 4: like you were never there, and being an assistant at least,
• 13:38
  Speaker 4: the way Connor utilized me was way more kind of
• 13:40
  Speaker 4: using my brain and way more.
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: I'd even say like taste, yeah, and we you.
• 13:46
  Speaker 4: Know, talked about like what shows are you watching, what
• 13:48
  Speaker 4: movies are you interested in? Like there's a little bit
• 13:51
  Speaker 4: of a courtship of like are we on the same
• 13:54
  Speaker 4: page about kind of like what's what's good's, what's working,
• 13:58
  Speaker 4: what's not working?
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: And it was so nice.
• 14:01
  Speaker 4: You know, those are muscles I you know, you dream
• 14:04
  Speaker 4: to be able to flex in the industry, and it
• 14:06
  Speaker 4: was so nice to kind of get tapped to work
• 14:09
  Speaker 4: on that stuff.
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: Right, you're the only member of his team that's there
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: for Connor. Yes, and once you've earned his trust, of course,
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: he'll lean on you for those things. And I think
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: that's what a lot of assistants also don't realize when
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: you do the personal task for your boss to allow
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: them to be creative and go on and do their work,
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: you're opening up space for them to lean on you
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: in other ways, and you're the first person that's you're
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: their go to for everything. Really, yeah, you know, more
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: than an agent, more than a manager. You're spending the
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: most time with this person.
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: And they see how much they I mean, they're managing
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: how much is on your plate, so they, more than anybody,
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: understand the magnitude of the responsibility and that you're constantly troubleshooting.
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: There's always emails that have gone unanswered, or audition tapes
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: that I had yet to watch, or there was always
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: something to be done, and it's so nice to have
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: somebody there that's just like, I'm just here to help you.
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: You know, most people are there because they're like I
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: need something from you, which is a part of the job.
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: But it's great to just have somebody outside of your
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: office that is like, I am here in any capacity
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: to make your life easier. And you know, that's just
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: like a breath of fresh air when you're in that situation.
• 15:28
  Speaker 3: Totally.
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: Was he your first assistant, Yes, I hired his sister
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: to be my research assistant Cottage Industry.
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: Yes, yes, that's adorable story too.
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: How did that we were in it?
• 15:42
  Speaker 4: I feel like Connor and I got more business done
• 15:44
  Speaker 4: in the back of an uber than we ever did
• 15:46
  Speaker 4: at the office.
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, and you had pitched me on something and.
• 15:52
  Speaker 4: I had talked to my sister about it at like
• 15:54
  Speaker 4: a lunch and she was like, oh, well you should.
• 15:58
  Speaker 4: You should haven't read this, and she like she's like
• 16:01
  Speaker 4: Queen rabbit Hole of like she goes down all the
• 16:04
  Speaker 4: craziest corners of the internet and she found this like
• 16:07
  Speaker 4: crazy bit of research for something he was working on.
• 16:09
  Speaker 4: And I gave it to him and he was like,
• 16:12
  Speaker 4: this is really good. Is your sister like interested in Well?
• 16:17
  Speaker 2: Also before this, she was working for a as an
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: assistant to a showrunner and he was coming to New
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: York and he wanted restaurant recommendations. Oh yeah, and you
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: showed me a spreadsheet that your sister made for her
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: boss that was the most detailed thorough It was like
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: it was categorized by like burrow, by neighborhood, by price point,
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: and I was like, this is legitimately the most thorough thing.
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: And I'm sure. He was like, just like, send me
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: some like racks from the Infatuation. Yeah, And I was like,
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: whoever prepared this as somebody that I would like to
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: ask to do something? Yeah? It was an incredible list.
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: And so when I when I asked her to be
• 17:01
  Speaker 2: a research assistant for a show that I wanted to
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: write next, she was like, yeah, I'll like, let's make
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: a Google doc. And I was reading and she was reading,
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: and she was like, I just need to warn you that,
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: like I'm very thorough. And I was like that's great.
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: That's like what you'd hope out of a research assistant. So,
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: I mean, she sent me so much information, but things
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: were bolded and organized and and I'm so like technologically illiterate.
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: It's like shocking. Same where I'm like, where is the
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: Google doc? And she's like, go into your Gmail and
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: then I'm like and then what And she's like, how
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: are you like alive?
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: Yes?
• 17:37
  Speaker 2: Like y where I'm like okay, So I hit the
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: tab and she's like, wow, you really do need help.
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: I find a lot of high functioning people like you,
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: and I I think, yes, very similar. You don't don't
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: worry like my team is just as blown away, They're like, Christina.
• 17:55
  Speaker 3: How many times am I like can you resend this?
• 17:57
  Speaker 3: And I like scroll off? I'm like, okay, yes.
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: And but like, but we did, you know, become such
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: good friends that obviously then I started working with his sister,
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: my fiance, and I went to dinner with your parents.
• 18:11
  Speaker 2: It's really become any family affair. And you know he's
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: gonna come back and work for me again, which is
• 18:17
  Speaker 2: great and so but I knew. I was like, if
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: you want to like continue on this ride with me,
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: and I'm lucky enough for the ride to continue if
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: the show does well, Like, if you want to come
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: with me, I'll always want you along for the ride,
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: and I want to foster your career. I know that
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: you obviously don't want to be an assistant forever. I
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: know he's a great writer, has writing ambitions, And I
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: was like, if you want to keep, you know, coming
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: on this journey with me, you know, I will do
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: everything in my power to like hopefully help facilitate the
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: career that you want. And so you know, it's worked
• 18:54
  Speaker 2: out well for the both of us. That is so rare.
• 18:58
  Speaker 4: Sure, like Connor is is like a one in a
• 19:01
  Speaker 4: million boss, Like I don't.
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: I've worked for.
• 19:04
  Speaker 4: So many people that it's like it's not even like
• 19:07
  Speaker 4: bad relationships, but it is just people who are they
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: don't see you. And so it's so rare to have
• 19:14
  Speaker 4: somebody who takes an interest as you as a person,
• 19:17
  Speaker 4: and you know, want sees you as somebody who's going
• 19:21
  Speaker 4: to climb in the industry and send something to foster.
• 19:24
  Speaker 4: And that is so hard to come by. I have
• 19:26
  Speaker 4: so many friends who have bosses who don't know their names.
• 19:30
  Speaker 3: That's sad, that's that's awful, and.
• 19:33
  Speaker 4: It is just unfortunately a little bit of the nature
• 19:36
  Speaker 4: of the game, and we all go through it. But
• 19:39
  Speaker 4: I'm so grateful that I get to do this, and
• 19:42
  Speaker 4: especially do it with you.
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: I also think it's rare to have a boss who
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: there's not a lot of growth in assistant jobs. I
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: think a lot of clients who we work with, say,
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: find me someone who will just do my assistant stuff.
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: And I don't want someone who wants growth in the
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: industry because it's a little bit of a conflict of interest.
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: So to have someone who fosters your growth and who
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: takes all these teaching moments for you and really brings
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: you into his life that is.
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: Really rare, Yeah, because I think in my mind it's
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: like obviously there's there's personal things that they have to
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: do for you right where, you know, and it's really
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: just from a time efficiency standpoint where like if I'm
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: going to set at six in the morning, I'm like,
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: I just need a coffee and breakfast when I get there,
• 20:24
  Speaker 2: because like, we have so much fucking shit to do,
• 20:26
  Speaker 2: and it's great to you know, have somebody that's willing
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: to do that, or like there's errands that have to
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: be run, but I think you have to. In my mind,
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: I think it makes it makes my job easier if
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: I feel like they're incentivized to want to work too,
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: beyond just the payment, you know, where I'm like, oh,
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: if they feel like there's more to get out of this,
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: then we both win. And so I also recognized like
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: he was very bright, took initiative, like very thoughtful, and
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: so I read like a script that he sent me,
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: and the script was great. But I also think, you know,
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: I found success in my career, the success that I
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: have now at like thirty four thirty five. You know.
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: So when I was Sam's age, I was a nanny
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: and a caterer and a waiter. I had a brief,
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: regrettable stint in construction that I had no business doing,
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: so like like, I so deeply empathize with somebody who's
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: just trying to break in and just desperately wants to
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: do something, and I so empathize with how hard it is.
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: And I think because I was at it for as
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: long as I was, and you know, worked every side
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: job and was broke for my entire twenties and never
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: had health insurance, like I definitely have a gratitude but
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: a perspective of what it means to be somebody that
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: really wants to work in this industry.
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: I also think that's where nowadays. I mean, we deal
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: with so many not to lecture gen Z, but I
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: think that this is really important for them to hear
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: because you know what grit and hard work is, and
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: you were not so it sounds like you weren't so
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: focused on the now and you were just like, I'm
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: going to do these jobs and eventually it'll pay off,
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: like this is what I'm doing now, and you learned
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: how to. I think babysitting is the best training camp.
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: I grew up babysitting. I always look for that in
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: a resume. Yeah, you know how to be integrated into
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: someone's family, you know social cues, you can make amazing connections.
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: Babysitting is fantastic, but also service jobs, personalities, not having
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: an ego.
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: If anyone wants to work in.
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: Entertainment, go be a nanny or a nanny, or work
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: in a restaurant.
• 22:42
  Speaker 3: Unbelievable.
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: You learn so much. It's also just great as like
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: a human experience because you never will dine the same way.
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: If you've worked in a restaurant, you know how hard
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: it is. But yeah, you learn so much in that experience.
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: But I do think like whenever people ask me for
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: advice about breaking into this industry, I always say, like,
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: my advice is only useful if this is what you
• 23:09
  Speaker 2: feel like destined to do. Like I can only give
• 23:12
  Speaker 2: you advice to somebody who's like dogged about doing this,
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: because like if you just want to or you just
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: think it would be good or like feels like something
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: that could make sense, I'm like, I don't know how
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: to help you, because it's it's it was I've endured
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: rejection for a decade ye and so I can only
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: operate or help people that feel that it's like an obsession,
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: like a calling to them, because otherwise I'm like, if
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: it's not what you feel like is your purpose? Like
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: you can't imagine doing anything else in my mind, it's
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: too difficult to to to sustain. And so I always say, like,
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: first and foremost, can you imagine yourself doing anything else?
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: And if you can, you should just go and do
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: it now, because that's just gonna it's just gonna that
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: other thing, whether it's law school or whatever it is,
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: is going to become more and more appealing with every
• 24:05
  Speaker 2: year that you try to do this. But if you
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: feel like possessed by by this, then we can go
• 24:11
  Speaker 2: from there and then I can give you advice. Do
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: you feel possessed a hundred? I think I describe myself
• 24:18
  Speaker 2: as like for how many no's, Like it's the definition
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: of insanity technically to do something over and over and
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: expecting a different result. But I was like, I'm not
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: meant to do anything else but this, And so if
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: it's not gonna happen now, I believe it's a matter
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: of time. And like this sacrifice and the hard work,
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: like it will be a badge of honor. But like
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: I will make this my reality at any cost. And
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: I've been that way since I was like twelve, when
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: I like stepped on to stage in the fifth grade play,
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: I was like, this is it and there's no turning back,
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: and like I haven't looked back since.
• 24:56
  Speaker 3: What kept you motivated? After all? The nose? I feel
• 24:59
  Speaker 3: like that's hard.
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: The nose motivated me. Okay, yeah, where I was like,
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: you just wait and see how wrong you are. Like
• 25:06
  Speaker 2: I took it all and I was like, this way,
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: were they wrong? I was like yeah, I was like
• 25:11
  Speaker 2: this will be everything. I was like, this will be
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: a great story for my memoir the way you just
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: said no. But I was like I know that I
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: have this, so if you don't recognize it in me,
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: then I'll just have to find somebody who will. But
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: I didn't. I didn't doubt myself somehow for a second,
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: and I never entertained doing anything else.
• 25:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah that's I respect that so much.
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: And you and I are similar because when I was
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: looking for my first I always knew I wanted to
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: be a celebrity assistant when I was younger in my
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: twenties because I used to do celebrity styling and I
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: was always around actors and actors who would come into
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: the office and we would put them in these amazing
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: gowns and they would bring their assistance. And I thought
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: to myself, Oh, my gosh, that's the coolest job ever.
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: I didn't grow up traveling the world. I have four
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: younger siblings. I like my first time I had the
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: country was in college, and I thought, Wow, that's the
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: coolest job ever. You get to see things through such
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: a different lens. So I tried to get all these
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: assistant jobs and I remember emailing everyone saying the subject
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: line was literally Megan grim, I want to be.
• 26:10
  Speaker 3: A celebrity assistant or hire me.
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: And I got rejected so many times, saying you didn't
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: have experience. And went to do this other agency at
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: the time, saying do you have any clients and they
• 26:21
  Speaker 1: told me that they basically rejected me yes so hard.
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: And now I'm my company is their competitor, and we
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: still like have yes.
• 26:30
  Speaker 3: More than half their business.
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: And I went from there to work for three amazing
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: women in the industry, and all the rejections I got
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: only motivated me to keep going.
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think, I don't know, I think it's
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: the piece of advice that I give to everybody is like,
• 26:49
  Speaker 2: no matter how small it is, you have to do
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: something every day for yourself. That's like telegraphing to the
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: world how badly you want to make this reality. And
• 27:00
  Speaker 2: like that might sound very it's practical and also like
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: a little woo woo, because it's partially like it's like
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: just sending an email or going to meet somebody for coffee,
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: another writer, another actor. It's like whatever you can do
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: that's within your control. It's like those tiny little things
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: that might not feel like they're knocking down any doors
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: for you, I think make all the difference in terms
• 27:25
  Speaker 2: of like creating momentum and like telegraphing to the industry,
• 27:29
  Speaker 2: to yourself, Yeah, that you're like, I like, how am
• 27:33
  Speaker 2: I going to show the world today how badly I
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: want to do this?
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah?
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: And as a writer, that just meant like writing all
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: the time, and I would write things that my agents
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: were like, I don't know if this is like that
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: super viable commercially, And scripts that I wrote that I
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: never sold opened up doors that I wasn't anticipating. And
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: so I think it's so easy to come out into
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: this industry and be sort of paralyzed by the rejection,
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: But like, if you can just avoid standing still, I
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: think it makes all the difference because so then it's
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: just like quicksand and it's so easy to all of
• 28:09
  Speaker 2: a sudden be adrift. But if you can just find
• 28:12
  Speaker 2: the tiniest ways not to stand still, I think it
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: makes all the difference.
• 28:16
  Speaker 3: Like a mental game one.
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: Hundred percent, where it's like I did something that was
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: a little thing that I did for myself, and like
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: I just moved half an inch and like maybe they
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: don't respond to the email, but like I'm glad I
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: sent it, and like that felt like something I did.
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: So I feel like people are not this positive or
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: have this perspective on the industry. I feel like because
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: it's so oversaturated with everyone wanting to be a writer, director, producer.
• 28:41
  Speaker 3: It's you were a very rare case you actually.
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: Yes, it's it's like it's it's not And it's not
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: to romanticize the process either, because it's incredibly difficult and
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: it's heartbreaking, and it's not to say that like I
• 28:55
  Speaker 2: didn't feel that rejection. It's just the fact that the
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: rejection never changed my mind, and I don't know that
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: everybody is necessarily built like that. But like, I had
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: felt that this is what I was meant to do
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: for like a really long time, and my parents were like,
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: we're not surprised that I wanted to pursue this. They
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: were like, we'll support you emotionally, financially, like wish all
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: the best. Yeah, but honestly, like once they could see
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: me make inroads here and there, they it gave them
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: enough kind of confidence to be like, Okay, we can
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: be here and watch this and not be in excre pain.
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: They're very proud. I'm honestly surprised my dad isn't on
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: this podcast. He's like so excited about every You should
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: have seen him at the premiere of Love Story. You
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: thought you would have thought he was the executive producer
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: of the show. Like Bee lines it over to Ryan Murphy.
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: He's like talking to all the cast. He's like, what's
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: everybody doing next? He's like, can you believe how great
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: my son is? Which I knew once unleashed he would
• 29:54
  Speaker 2: be incredibly embarrassing, But he's very proud. He's the best
• 29:56
  Speaker 2: part of the party. Yeah. You you and my dad
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: really hit it off.
• 29:59
  Speaker 4: Yeah, Yeah, that's my drinking buddy for the evening.
• 30:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah he was, and all your siblings came, and yeah,
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: everybody came. It was like so surreal to sit in
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: a theater with my three sisters, my brother in law,
• 30:14
  Speaker 2: my fiance, my parents, and just to be like seeing
• 30:19
  Speaker 2: your name on the big screen of like created by
• 30:22
  Speaker 2: and written.
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: By I mean, when I would be walking in New
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: York or LA and look up and be like, that's
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: my friend.
• 30:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's really especially and you know, they've they've obviously
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: been so privy to this journey with me for for
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: so long, and so to see it finally materialize, you know,
• 30:40
  Speaker 2: because I graduated like sixteen years ago, you know, so
• 30:45
  Speaker 2: to see it finally come to fruition and they loved
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: the show so much too. You know, it's one thing
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: to break through, but the fact that I was able
• 30:52
  Speaker 2: to break through was something that they also loved and
• 30:55
  Speaker 2: felt so proud of America loved. Yes, they were just
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: they were just so I mean, they're still just so overjoyed.
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: So it's really nice.
• 31:04
  Speaker 3: What inspired love story.
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: I had been watching The Crown, which I loved, and
• 31:12
  Speaker 2: I think like Peter Morgan's ability to weave the personal
• 31:17
  Speaker 2: stories of the royal family in with some of like
• 31:19
  Speaker 2: the seminal moments in UK history. I thought was so
• 31:22
  Speaker 2: genius and the way he was able to humanize these
• 31:26
  Speaker 2: people that seemingly feel kind of unreachable, unattainable, And when
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: I was thinking about an equivalent, I was like, really,
• 31:35
  Speaker 2: we have the Kennedys, and that's it in terms of
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: the closest thing to royalty. And I just started reading
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: everything about the family and I was like, maybe I'll
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: do a version of the Crown, which, by the way,
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: where I was in my career, nobody was letting me
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: do my version of the Crown. They would have been like,
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: you should check into a mental hospital. I was like,
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: I'm a nanny and a caterer, but I'd like to
• 31:57
  Speaker 2: do the Crown. But I was reading everything imaginable and
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: then I remember when I started reading about John and Carolyn,
• 32:03
  Speaker 2: I felt like I had like stumbled upon something only
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: because I was shocked that because of their story that
• 32:11
  Speaker 2: nobody had made it for TV yet, right and it
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: it It's like I can only describe it as the
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: more I read about them, the more I felt like
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: I had like uncovered a book in a library that
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: like nobody had read where I was like, obviously, so
• 32:22
  Speaker 2: many people know them and are familiar with their story,
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: but it was so worthy of a limited series that
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: I was I was just sort of like what am
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: I missing as to why this hasn't been done? And
• 32:33
  Speaker 2: I texted my manager at the time and I was like,
• 32:35
  Speaker 2: I want to do a limited series about John and
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: Carolyn and she was like, that's great. Like I remember,
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: I put it in my notes app on my bucket list.
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: And you need to frame that, I know.
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: And then I think it was maybe three or four
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: months later it was announced in Deadline that Ryan was doing,
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: uh this show, and I was like, okay, well there
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: goes that, like obviously he'll make that show and it
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: will be great. And I thought, well, I don't know,
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: maybe there's a world in which I could be a
• 33:06
  Speaker 2: part of this. And you know, my relationship with my
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: agents is like I never call to ask about being
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: staffed on another show, like as somebody who also acts.
• 33:19
  Speaker 2: I was never really that eager about joining a writer's room,
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: so all I would do is like sit at home,
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: write scripts, send them to them and be like can
• 33:26
  Speaker 2: we do anything with this? And for this show, I
• 33:28
  Speaker 2: called them and I was like, can we can I
• 33:30
  Speaker 2: meet somebody? And they were like, it's going to be
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: really hard, Like he Ryan uses a lot of writers
• 33:36
  Speaker 2: and actors and producers that he like forms a relationship with,
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: So I think it's harder if you if you're not
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: on his radar. And I was like, I was like,
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: I know, I'm not trying to be confrontational, but I
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: actually can't take no for an answer. And I'm like,
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: and I've never called you about setting a meeting, so
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: like I'm going to have to insist that we find
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: a way. And I was like that's not my nature either,
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: like especially with my agents, Like I love to like
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: get the gold star and just be like the one
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: that never bothers them. Marissa. Yeah, and one of the
• 34:13
  Speaker 2: executives at color Force that produced the show had seen
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: my web series from like nine years prior that was
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: about dating. It was a tender dating series, one of yours.
• 34:27
  Speaker 3: That is your best work.
• 34:28
  Speaker 2: I mean it changed, it changed my life in so
• 34:30
  Speaker 2: many ways. And so she was like, oh, I remember
• 34:33
  Speaker 2: watching Local Attraction, like I would love to meet Connor.
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: They write a script that I wrote that I was
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: told wasn't particularly commercially viable that they loved again, just
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: the ways that doors will open for you from projects
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: that you think like have run their course. And I
• 34:50
  Speaker 2: went in there and they were like, what interests you
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: about John and Carolyn? And then I literally talked to
• 34:54
  Speaker 2: them for like an hour and they were like, okay,
• 34:56
  Speaker 2: loud and clear, you feel really strongly about them. They
• 34:59
  Speaker 2: passed me along to their bosses, Brad Simpson and Nina Jacobson,
• 35:02
  Speaker 2: who run color for US, who have worked with Ryan.
• 35:05
  Speaker 2: They did OJA together, and then I met with Brad
• 35:10
  Speaker 2: and Nina. I gave them the same spiel and I
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: was like, there's nothing I care more about than this show.
• 35:16
  Speaker 2: And they were like, great, then we should probably set
• 35:18
  Speaker 2: you up with Ryan. And I was like, this has
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: gone on too far. I don't want to do this anymore.
• 35:22
  Speaker 2: I was like two. I was like, I've overshot the landing.
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: And then I probably spent three months preparing a pitch
• 35:28
  Speaker 2: to him, and I still honestly didn't understand what I
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: was interviewing for. It was like never really made clear
• 35:33
  Speaker 2: to me. I was again looking to join the room.
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: I said I would like work as a PA. I
• 35:37
  Speaker 2: said I'd work security. I'm like all work crafty, I
• 35:41
  Speaker 2: don't care. And then I pitched Ryan and then that
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: was on a Friday, and then they called me on
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: Monday to be like he wants you to write the show.
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: And then I had a mental breakdown. So it's not
• 35:51
  Speaker 2: all rainbows and butterflies, like I had to build actually
• 35:56
  Speaker 2: physically debilitating imposter syndrome where I was like this has
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: gone awry, Like what what's going on? Why is everybody?
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: Why is everybody entrusting me with this? It felt like
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: somebody was like throwing me the keys to like a
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: stick shift Ferrari and was like, don't crash, and I
• 36:10
  Speaker 2: was like I will crash, so like take the keys back,
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: and I remember being like I can't do this. I
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: called some of my closest friends, I called my therapist,
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: and then I called them back and I was like,
• 36:22
  Speaker 2: I'd love to thank you so much.
• 36:26
  Speaker 3: That's amazing.
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: That's the Tina Fey of like say yes and figure
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: it out, Like have you ever created a show? No?
• 36:35
  Speaker 2: Do you know what you're doing? No? But once I
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: said yes, I just remember sitting at my desk and
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: be like, well now you have no choice. Yeah, let's go,
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: let's figure it out. You've jumped off the cliff. Yes,
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: and now it's kind of the best feeling to be like,
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: I've agreed to do this, so like now i have
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: no choice but to figure it out, and like now
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: I'm sort of like just chasing that high of being like,
• 36:57
  Speaker 2: let's take on something of a big scope and magnitude
• 37:01
  Speaker 2: that it's going to be really hard to figure it out,
• 37:03
  Speaker 2: but you'll have no choice but to do it.
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: That is the coolest origin story ever. I'm so unfamiliar
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: with how writer's rooms work. Yeah, that world is very
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: foreign to me. We don't have a lot of writer
• 37:14
  Speaker 1: clients yet. But is it typical for something like that
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: to happen that trajectory.
• 37:19
  Speaker 2: No, Because my last writing job was on this Apple
• 37:25
  Speaker 2: series that has yet to premiere, and I was a
• 37:27
  Speaker 2: staff writer in the writer's room, which is the lowest
• 37:30
  Speaker 2: level writer and writer's room sort of works similar to
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: companies in that, you know, if you're a staff writer
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: in a writer's room and you do five months on
• 37:41
  Speaker 2: a show and then you move on to another show,
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: you get a credit bump, and then you'll be, you know,
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: a story editor or a junior story editor, and then
• 37:50
  Speaker 2: it comes with a pay bump. And your credits billed
• 37:53
  Speaker 2: as you move from room to room and gain experience.
• 37:56
  Speaker 2: So I was the lowest level in my last job,
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: and then my next job was the creator of the show.
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: So like that's what that jump. I jumped like maybe
• 38:07
  Speaker 2: nine job titles casually.
• 38:10
  Speaker 3: Yes, so not at all.
• 38:13
  Speaker 2: It's crazy, Like it's it's really still so surreal the
• 38:17
  Speaker 2: way it happened, especially like you know, when you're toiling
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: away for twelve years writing scripts and I'd sell things
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: and I'd book things here and there, but like nothing
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: that was like breaking through in a way that was
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: like really changing my life. And so for me to
• 38:31
  Speaker 2: be just sitting at home writing and my last job
• 38:34
  Speaker 2: as a staff writer and then being like you're going
• 38:36
  Speaker 2: to create American love story, it was like something's got
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: to be yes, yeah.
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: My god, when did you I'm so curious, when when
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: did you understand the magnitude of what you had you.
• 38:49
  Speaker 2: Mean, in terms of like what we were making, what you.
• 38:51
  Speaker 3: Were making was going to be received.
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: And like, oh my god, I've just created like the
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: best thing on the planet.
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean I think when first of all, Paul
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: and Sarah watching them together, I was like, oh, this
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: is something because it's one thing to write it, but
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: like you don't know how it's going to go in
• 39:15
  Speaker 2: terms of creating chemistry for the actors. And I watched
• 39:18
  Speaker 2: the two of them and I was like, oh, people
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: are going to want to watch these two fall in love.
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: Like so that's a relief. But honestly, walking into we
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: like meticulously recreated Jackie Oh's apartment, it was like uncanny
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: the level of detail that our production design team puts
• 39:43
  Speaker 2: in two. But when you show up to set and
• 39:46
  Speaker 2: you're in Jackie Kennedy's recreated apartment on a sound stage
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: in Brooklyn, and then you have Naomi Watts playing Jackie
• 39:53
  Speaker 2: Kennedy saying your words, You're like, pardon my language, but
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: how the fuck did I get here? Like that was
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: really watching her on set because she's so incredible in
• 40:05
  Speaker 2: the show. Those were there were like little moments where
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: I was like, this is so walking into the Calvin
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: Klein offices for the first time, and the way it
• 40:15
  Speaker 2: like just the fact that something sits on your laptop
• 40:19
  Speaker 2: for years and then suddenly I'm like, hundreds of people
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: built Calvin Klein because of like what I wrote in
• 40:25
  Speaker 2: my studio apartment feels crazy.
• 40:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, now Calvin Kline is having a comeback.
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: He's having a comeback. Yeah, the brand is you know,
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: I don't know that he would attribute it to the show.
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: But but and then I think I really had very
• 40:42
  Speaker 2: managed expectations for the reception of the show. I didn't
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: necessarily know if it was going to resonate with everybody,
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: because you know, I don't know if younger if younger
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: generations weren't familiar with them, if they were going to watch.
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: And then, I mean, the way it exploded continues to
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: I don't really know that I've processed it yet. I
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: think I reached a certain level where I was like,
• 41:05
  Speaker 2: I think this is as much as I can sort
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: of take in in terms of just in shock. Shock, yes, shock,
• 41:13
  Speaker 2: seeing it everywhere on social media. I mean, it definitely
• 41:16
  Speaker 2: got to a point where I was like, I think
• 41:18
  Speaker 2: I need to disengage with the Internet a little bit.
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: My explore page cooking, like a couple of things, was straight.
• 41:24
  Speaker 2: Up just caring my fiance. I don't have TikTok, but
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: my fiance has it, and he'd be scrolling on his phone,
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: and like every other video, I could hear a character
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: from our show. And then I could just I just
• 41:38
  Speaker 2: watch him like lower the volume me to be like,
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: I'm like, what are they saying? Which clip is that?
• 41:44
  Speaker 2: And he's like, it's not from your show. I'm like,
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: then why are you lowering the volume? That's really fun,
• 41:49
  Speaker 2: But yeah, it was really It's also so it's such
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: a surreal experience, which I also wasn't expecting for. It's
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: so personal to write something like I really pour so
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: much of myself into what I write into the characters,
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: Like I like to find the commonalities that I have
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: with all of them and like really lean into that.
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: Like that's what the personal is, what makes it feel exciting,
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: it's what makes me feel invested. And so to be
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: sort of like actually hunched over your computer for three
• 42:20
  Speaker 2: years and then have something become sort of a global program,
• 42:27
  Speaker 2: it's such a strange thing to go from like, oh,
• 42:29
  Speaker 2: it was just here and final draft on my computer,
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: and now it's being watched all over the world and
• 42:34
  Speaker 2: you have sort of in a weird way, have to
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: kind of grieve the fact that it's no longer yours
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: and now it enters a new stage where it's everybody's
• 42:43
  Speaker 2: and it's however they want to experience it. And metabolize it.
• 42:48
  Speaker 2: And it's not everybody's gonna love what you make, and
• 42:51
  Speaker 2: that's a new experience that you have to be open
• 42:53
  Speaker 2: to criticism, and that can hurt your feelings when you
• 42:57
  Speaker 2: love something so much. But I mean, I couldn't be
• 43:01
  Speaker 2: more grateful for the way at all transpired.
• 43:05
  Speaker 3: Well, very proud of you, it is.
• 43:07
  Speaker 1: It was so cool to watch the whole thing happen
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: like from afar, and I hope that you feel celebrated
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: constantly because it is so impressive.
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: Thank you very much.
• 43:16
  Speaker 1: Do you ever have the thought of what if I
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: didn't decide to be so pushy and get those meetings
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: set up and really pursue this.
• 43:25
  Speaker 3: You made it happen for yourself.
• 43:27
  Speaker 2: I did. I was insistent that I'd be a part
• 43:29
  Speaker 2: of it, obviously, you know, and becoming the creator is
• 43:33
  Speaker 2: not something that I was necessarily imagining, even though in
• 43:38
  Speaker 2: a way I had imagined it for myself, I just
• 43:40
  Speaker 2: didn't imagine it to be months later in these circumstances
• 43:45
  Speaker 2: like creating a show for Ryan Murphy, like all of that.
• 43:49
  Speaker 2: But I do think it only solidified this idea that
• 43:54
  Speaker 2: like you're if when I moved to La If you
• 43:57
  Speaker 2: had told me that this is how my career was
• 43:59
  Speaker 2: going to go, just never would have believed you. And
• 44:02
  Speaker 2: I think it's the fact that, like, if you work
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: really hard and you're patient with how much rejection you have,
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: you have to like hold on to the fact that,
• 44:15
  Speaker 2: like your life can change at any moment if you
• 44:18
  Speaker 2: hang in there. And that's hard to hold on to
• 44:21
  Speaker 2: when you get knows every day, all day for years,
• 44:25
  Speaker 2: but it happens to people all the time, and like
• 44:27
  Speaker 2: your life can change if you believe it can, and
• 44:31
  Speaker 2: if you're working towards making that change plausible. And so
• 44:35
  Speaker 2: it's it's funny because it's like it was such a
• 44:38
  Speaker 2: life changing show, but at the same time, like I'd
• 44:40
  Speaker 2: been working at it for almost a decade, you know,
• 44:44
  Speaker 2: And so it's both shocking and also like kind of
• 44:47
  Speaker 2: amazing the fact that I was, like, you're toiling away
• 44:50
  Speaker 2: and then suddenly something sort of like shoots out of
• 44:53
  Speaker 2: a cannon, and yeah, it changes your life.
• 44:55
  Speaker 3: So cool.
• 44:57
  Speaker 1: I mean, again, so proud of you and so excited
• 45:00
  Speaker 1: to see all the other things that you do, know
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: that you know now you know you can keep going.
• 45:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know, Sam and I are excited to
• 45:09
  Speaker 2: take on what's next. Here we go and it's it's really,
• 45:16
  Speaker 2: if anything, like the takeaway of being like, oh, you
• 45:19
  Speaker 2: can do so much more than you realize. You just
• 45:23
  Speaker 2: have to be put in a position to have to
• 45:25
  Speaker 2: figure it out totally. And so I think it just
• 45:28
  Speaker 2: changed the way that I approach what I want to write,
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: how I write, because it felt like, oh, I'm so
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: much more capable than I realized because I was able
• 45:39
  Speaker 2: to figure out the show. And prior to that, before
• 45:41
  Speaker 2: saying yes, I was like, I don't know that I
• 45:44
  Speaker 2: can create a show. I've never done that. But you know,
• 45:47
  Speaker 2: if you box yourself into it, it's sort of like, oh,
• 45:49
  Speaker 2: then like if I can figure this out, the exciting
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: part is sort of asking yourself, like, well, what else
• 45:54
  Speaker 2: can I figure out? If I if I'm sort of
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: presented with the challenge.
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: So cool and Sam as Connor's assistant watching everything sort
• 46:04
  Speaker 1: of transpire with love Story, How was that experience for you?
• 46:08
  Speaker 2: It was?
• 46:09
  Speaker 4: It was so magical for me. I mean, first of all,
• 46:11
  Speaker 4: like living in New York City for the first time
• 46:14
  Speaker 4: and kind of getting to be.
• 46:15
  Speaker 2: A part of I agree, we didn't all the way
• 46:19
  Speaker 2: know the magnitude of what we were doing.
• 46:23
  Speaker 4: The funniest thing that would happen to us on set
• 46:25
  Speaker 4: is everybody always thought we were the devilwaar it's proud
• 46:28
  Speaker 4: of sequel.
• 46:29
  Speaker 2: Because we were shooting at the at the same time.
• 46:31
  Speaker 2: So yeah, they would come up to us all the
• 46:33
  Speaker 2: time when we're filming and they'd be like, are you
• 46:34
  Speaker 2: the devil wrest proud oft too, and we'd be like now,
• 46:36
  Speaker 2: and then they just take out their phones and stop
• 46:38
  Speaker 2: filming us anyway, So I'm like, all right, you want.
• 46:41
  Speaker 4: Yeah, So there was a lot of that, but it
• 46:44
  Speaker 4: was I think as we got deeper into the process.
• 46:50
  Speaker 4: I vividly remember watching the pilot for the first time
• 46:52
  Speaker 4: with Connor in the back of an uber on the
• 46:55
  Speaker 4: way to.
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: Long Island to shoot the wedding.
• 46:57
  Speaker 4: Yes, while I was trying not to be carsick, watching
• 47:01
  Speaker 4: the violet of this thing that would you know, then
• 47:05
  Speaker 4: erupt and I think Connor and I both had a
• 47:07
  Speaker 4: moment of like, oh my God, like this is something
• 47:12
  Speaker 4: you know, it's not just kind of like in your
• 47:15
  Speaker 4: brain anymore. Yeah, and it felt like a spectacle in
• 47:19
  Speaker 4: that way that I don't know, I felt like my own.
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: It's so tough when you're working.
• 47:25
  Speaker 4: On something because you're it's like looking at something one
• 47:28
  Speaker 4: atom at a time, and so you really rarely get
• 47:32
  Speaker 4: that moment to zoom out, And watching the pilot was
• 47:35
  Speaker 4: the first instance of being like, I know what we're
• 47:41
  Speaker 4: making in a grander sense, and I'm now just waiting
• 47:47
  Speaker 4: for the fireworks to go off.
• 47:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And also like it was it's really extraordinary to
• 47:53
  Speaker 2: write something. But also watching the pilot, it was the
• 47:58
  Speaker 2: first time what we what I saw, which was like
• 48:01
  Speaker 2: you put words to paper, you cast it, and you
• 48:03
  Speaker 2: hope for the best with the cast. You hope to
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: find great producers, you hope to find a great wardrobe
• 48:11
  Speaker 2: and costume department and all these people that have to
• 48:14
  Speaker 2: rise to the occasion. But like Sam said, watching it
• 48:18
  Speaker 2: all come together, like you know, Max Winkler directed the pilot,
• 48:22
  Speaker 2: and it's like what he did was so incredible, not
• 48:25
  Speaker 2: to mention like our music supervisor Jen Malone, and like
• 48:29
  Speaker 2: Ryan's instincts for like editing and cutting together compelling TV.
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: It was like I couldn't believe that I got to watch.
• 48:36
  Speaker 2: I thought when I'd watched the pilot that I was
• 48:38
  Speaker 2: going to like pick it apart about all the things
• 48:40
  Speaker 2: I'd wish I had done differently, and the fact that
• 48:43
  Speaker 2: everybody else did their job so well, our actors, directors,
• 48:48
  Speaker 2: all of our department heads, that I got to watch
• 48:53
  Speaker 2: something that I must have rewritten a thousand times and
• 48:55
  Speaker 2: enjoy it like as if I was in an audience member.
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: I thought was so exhilarating that I was like, I
• 49:01
  Speaker 2: can't believe I'm being swept up into this and I'm
• 49:05
  Speaker 2: not just sort of micromanaging it and picking apart. And
• 49:08
  Speaker 2: I so vividly remember watching it in the back of
• 49:12
  Speaker 2: that uber and being like, oh, I think this could
• 49:16
  Speaker 2: be something. I also think like that was an adrenaline.
• 49:19
  Speaker 4: Shot, yes, that we desperately needed, because I mean, like
• 49:22
  Speaker 4: we were we were shooting probably the sixth or seventh
• 49:26
  Speaker 4: episode at that point, and it's exhausting. I mean, I
• 49:29
  Speaker 4: think I remember that week very vividly, where I think
• 49:33
  Speaker 4: we were on our fourth straight day of working until
• 49:37
  Speaker 4: three or four in the morning mm hm. And you know,
• 49:40
  Speaker 4: your sleep schedule's messed up. You've got meetings at odd hours,
• 49:44
  Speaker 4: You're you're going to meetings before you're even on set.
• 49:48
  Speaker 4: Set is nowhere near where you're sleeping.
• 49:54
  Speaker 2: But also I think what I didn't account for, which
• 49:57
  Speaker 2: might sort of sound naive. Was that everyone's like this.
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: It tells you the job is so hard and there's
• 50:02
  Speaker 2: so much work to be done. But what you don't
• 50:05
  Speaker 2: anticipate is how hard it is to do your job
• 50:08
  Speaker 2: when you aren't sleeping. Oh yeah, So I was anticipating
• 50:13
  Speaker 2: the work and I was anticipating the responsibility. But like
• 50:16
  Speaker 2: writing pages when you are sleeping like three to four
• 50:20
  Speaker 2: hours a night, You're like, oh, this is why it
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: becomes so challenging, because you have to keep the same
• 50:27
  Speaker 2: performance level where the work cannot sort of wane, right,
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: you have to stay on top of it. But now
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: you're stay on top of it utterly exhausted. And I
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: was like, oh, got it, Like this is what makes
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: it so difficult is that the environment is so chaotic
• 50:42
  Speaker 2: and stressful. But then you have to do your job
• 50:45
  Speaker 2: seemingly unaffected. Yeah, and take care of yourself. However, I
• 50:48
  Speaker 2: don't even know that I did that.
• 50:50
  Speaker 4: But I would also even say, like on top of
• 50:54
  Speaker 4: the sleep, like I was always enamored with, like Connor
• 50:58
  Speaker 4: being on set having to he rarely had a desk,
• 51:02
  Speaker 4: so he was in video village like propped up writing
• 51:05
  Speaker 4: on his knees. You know, writing pages at all hours
• 51:09
  Speaker 4: of the.
• 51:09
  Speaker 2: Night, and.
• 51:12
  Speaker 4: It's it's such a testament that you were able to
• 51:14
  Speaker 4: kind of maintain equality while being constantly both mentally and
• 51:20
  Speaker 4: physically in the most uncomfortable positions, yes, and continuing to
• 51:25
  Speaker 4: kind of deliver well.
• 51:27
  Speaker 2: I mean, I really love being on set. Like not
• 51:30
  Speaker 2: all writers are like that. Some prefer to be like
• 51:32
  Speaker 2: sort of hold away and typing, but like, I love
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: working with actors. I love being available to them for
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: questions about scenes and their character and dialogue and so writing,
• 51:46
  Speaker 2: you know, hunched over in Video Village, I was like,
• 51:48
  Speaker 2: this is I guess the only way we have to
• 51:50
  Speaker 2: do this, because I didn't want to be unavailable to
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: them when they needed me. And I felt like because
• 51:55
  Speaker 2: we were doing a dramatization of real life events, like
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: a lot of our actors had a tremendous amount of
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: responsible ability and they felt that, you know that, they
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: were like this needs to be executed really well. And
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: because I had rendered all of these characters for TV,
• 52:08
  Speaker 2: I think they also just felt more secure when I
• 52:12
  Speaker 2: was around, because it made them feel like if for
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: some reason they felt like they were going astray in
• 52:17
  Speaker 2: their performance or something felt inauthentic. They knew that if
• 52:22
  Speaker 2: I was there that they felt like, Okay, Connor knows
• 52:25
  Speaker 2: this better than anybody. He has a deep understanding that
• 52:29
  Speaker 2: they could come up to me and be like, did
• 52:31
  Speaker 2: that feel honest? Did that feel truthful? And I could
• 52:35
  Speaker 2: always sort of give them the assurance that they needed
• 52:37
  Speaker 2: because I knew that they had a tremendous amount of responsibility.
• 52:41
  Speaker 3: That makes sense. That's so cool.
• 52:42
  Speaker 1: I mean, I I'm not a writer, but if I
• 52:45
  Speaker 1: were in your shoes, I'd also want to be on
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: set because I feel like you just you're like.
• 52:48
  Speaker 3: In it with them.
• 52:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And plus it's like it's just slowely to be
• 52:53
  Speaker 2: in your office. YEA trailer, yes, exactly, My god, the
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: trailer so much writing in a trailer where I remember
• 53:02
  Speaker 2: like we had some some low moments while riding in
• 53:06
  Speaker 2: a trailer where I all of a sudden, I'd be like,
• 53:08
  Speaker 2: if we don't get out of the trailer in the
• 53:10
  Speaker 2: next five seconds, I'm actually going to blow it up.
• 53:13
  Speaker 4: This Yeah, we're on the side of like Broadway, Yeah,
• 53:17
  Speaker 4: being like I don't know if.
• 53:18
  Speaker 2: We'll ever go home. Yeah, we're going to be smelling
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: this sale. We're going to die in this trailer. Have
• 53:23
  Speaker 2: I eaten today? What day is it? Have I called
• 53:27
  Speaker 2: my mom in like a month? Yeah? You it's really is.
• 53:32
  Speaker 3: A different life.
• 53:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's crazy. It's it's both so exhilarating because you
• 53:38
  Speaker 2: can't believe how lucky you are to get to make something,
• 53:40
  Speaker 2: especially something that you love. But it's also like you're
• 53:42
  Speaker 2: in it with this crew, literal crew of people, but
• 53:46
  Speaker 2: these actors where you're like, Okay, we've all committed to
• 53:49
  Speaker 2: just being exhausted and pushed to the to the brink
• 53:54
  Speaker 2: for the next six six months. But if everybody just
• 53:58
  Speaker 2: digs in also a mental game, yes, if everybody digs in.
• 54:03
  Speaker 2: I do believe that every day we were there, everybody
• 54:06
  Speaker 2: had a sense that they were making something that had
• 54:09
  Speaker 2: the potential to be great. And I know that's not
• 54:13
  Speaker 2: always the case, where people are like what is this,
• 54:16
  Speaker 2: especially actors feeling like I don't really know what I'm doing.
• 54:18
  Speaker 2: I don't really know what the tone is or what
• 54:20
  Speaker 2: I'm making. Same for the crew. But I really did
• 54:23
  Speaker 2: get the sense between the actors, the directors, our crew
• 54:27
  Speaker 2: that it was like, oh, if we if we do
• 54:29
  Speaker 2: this right and everybody gives one hundred and ten percent,
• 54:32
  Speaker 2: we have a chance to make something that I think
• 54:34
  Speaker 2: we can all be proud of, let alone have it
• 54:37
  Speaker 2: sort of be embraced the way that it was.
• 54:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, well it was certainly embraced.
• 54:41
  Speaker 1: Yes, Yes, I was laughing because I have always had
• 54:46
  Speaker 1: the idea to be Carolyn Bessett with a boyfriend for Halloween,
• 54:50
  Speaker 1: like the JFK crowin Yes, And I was like, your
• 54:53
  Speaker 1: show ruined that for me because everyone like, just wait
• 54:56
  Speaker 1: for Halloween this year.
• 54:57
  Speaker 2: Everyone's going to be a lot of headbands. Yeah, of
• 55:00
  Speaker 2: monochromatic Calvin Klein the backwards, but what are they?
• 55:05
  Speaker 3: What are the the brats y?
• 55:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, which I'm like, you guys, there's a reason that
• 55:09
  Speaker 2: jf K Junior could pull that off. It's because he
• 55:11
  Speaker 2: was JFK Jr.
• 55:14
  Speaker 3: Was that in Washington Square Park?
• 55:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah? The look like contest.
• 55:19
  Speaker 4: Walk.
• 55:20
  Speaker 2: I should have gone, oh, Grace your sister. I think
• 55:22
  Speaker 2: you meant Grace Gummer. I'm like, oh, that's so weird.
• 55:24
  Speaker 2: I was. I asked Paul. I was like, did you
• 55:26
  Speaker 2: even contemplate attending and surprising people because you know Timothy
• 55:29
  Speaker 2: Shall And it was like, not in a million years
• 55:33
  Speaker 2: did I want to go to a park full of
• 55:35
  Speaker 2: John lookalikes.
• 55:36
  Speaker 3: But that's so funny.
• 55:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, were you involved in the casting.
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: At all, Yes, involved in the casting. Watched all the tapes,
• 55:45
  Speaker 2: you know, helped narrow it all down, and then you know,
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: ultimately Ryan is the one who and he's he's so
• 55:51
  Speaker 2: amazing at sort of figuring out like this is our person.
• 55:55
  Speaker 2: Sarah was sort of like locked in as the front
• 55:57
  Speaker 2: runner from the beginning. Finding John was a process that
• 56:00
  Speaker 2: I'll never want to relive in terms of like I
• 56:04
  Speaker 2: was like, Sam, you sort of looked like John, Like
• 56:05
  Speaker 2: literally Uber drivers and people are Trader Joe's at the gym,
• 56:09
  Speaker 2: and like, there's gotta be somebody walking amongst us that
• 56:12
  Speaker 2: can play this really unique singular cultural figure. But no,
• 56:20
  Speaker 2: but yeah, Ryan brought flu Paul in and then I
• 56:23
  Speaker 2: think as soon as he walked in the door, I
• 56:25
  Speaker 2: think Sarah knew right away, which is also just a
• 56:29
  Speaker 2: testament to being able to do it in person as
• 56:31
  Speaker 2: opposed to like, you know, Paul sending a self tape
• 56:34
  Speaker 2: from his living room in Oregon.
• 56:37
  Speaker 4: This is when I was working reception for Yeah Murphy.
• 56:40
  Speaker 4: So I actually met Paul and Sarah before I had
• 56:42
  Speaker 4: really met you.
• 56:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah funny.
• 56:44
  Speaker 4: So and not only met them, but like met them
• 56:47
  Speaker 4: with like three other people auditioning for that part.
• 56:50
  Speaker 2: So there's like stress in the room and.
• 56:52
  Speaker 4: You can feel it, and it was like Paul and
• 56:54
  Speaker 4: Sarah just kind of jumped off you know, the page,
• 56:59
  Speaker 4: so to speak, even when they walked in the room. Yeah,
• 57:03
  Speaker 4: so it was it was pretty instant, at least for me.
• 57:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: I read an article that he almost quit acting before he.
• 57:08
  Speaker 3: Got this hole. Is that true?
• 57:10
  Speaker 2: Yes, he was definitely at his wits end, and I
• 57:14
  Speaker 2: think he'd been at it for maybe twelve years.
• 57:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and talking to your earlier point, yes, that it's
• 57:20
  Speaker 1: like going it's like he was literally.
• 57:23
  Speaker 2: One in an actual thousand you know that we saw
• 57:26
  Speaker 2: for the part. And and not only it's not only
• 57:32
  Speaker 2: the fact that he had been trying and you know,
• 57:36
  Speaker 2: at this for twelve years. It's the fact that, like
• 57:39
  Speaker 2: he booked this role, which was playing an incredibly famous
• 57:42
  Speaker 2: person in a large Ryan Murphy production that already had
• 57:46
  Speaker 2: a lot of eyeballs on it, and then did like
• 57:49
  Speaker 2: such a beautiful job too. It's like, it's not enough
• 57:52
  Speaker 2: that he happened to look like him, it's the fact
• 57:55
  Speaker 2: that he was able to just like knock it out
• 57:57
  Speaker 2: of the park knocked out of the park, and and
• 58:00
  Speaker 2: that he is just like so gracious and grateful, and
• 58:07
  Speaker 2: but it just goes to show you. I'm like, he's
• 58:09
  Speaker 2: you know, now obviously everybody knows his name, but it's
• 58:13
  Speaker 2: the fact that like, this is somebody that's obviously incredibly
• 58:16
  Speaker 2: talented that wasn't working and so but it does just
• 58:19
  Speaker 2: go to show you, like, you know, if you can
• 58:21
  Speaker 2: hang in there, you never know when when your luck
• 58:23
  Speaker 2: will change totally.
• 58:25
  Speaker 3: And you gave them that opportunity.
• 58:26
  Speaker 2: So and I like to remind them of that everything,
• 58:29
  Speaker 2: like don't you forget.
• 58:34
  Speaker 1: So to close out, what advice would you give someone
• 58:38
  Speaker 1: who's looking to be a SAM?
• 58:41
  Speaker 4: Oh, God, do you want to be a SAM?
• 58:44
  Speaker 1: I would tell lots of people would kill.
• 58:50
  Speaker 2: Every everything that comes with being a SAM.
• 58:53
  Speaker 4: I think to be an effective assistant in this you
• 58:55
  Speaker 4: need to have a lot of pride, even about the
• 58:58
  Speaker 4: small things. And people kind of talk about like, yeah,
• 59:02
  Speaker 4: you need to get over the coffee stuff or the
• 59:05
  Speaker 4: you know, getting food. I actually think you need to
• 59:08
  Speaker 4: take pride in those things. And I think you need
• 59:10
  Speaker 4: to do that well. And the way you do, you know,
• 59:14
  Speaker 4: one thing is how you do everything and do you
• 59:17
  Speaker 4: love that line, Yes, and it's so true. It really
• 59:21
  Speaker 4: is kind of stuff like that. And I also think
• 59:28
  Speaker 4: you need to have a good balance of I am
• 59:32
  Speaker 4: being a good assistant and I'm also taking in as
• 59:36
  Speaker 4: much information as I can. I think being an assistants
• 59:39
  Speaker 4: being a professional listener. And I find that obviously you
• 59:46
  Speaker 4: don't want to be doing most of the talking in
• 59:48
  Speaker 4: a room as an assistant. But I have gotten so
• 59:51
  Speaker 4: much better at being this job once I realized like
• 59:55
  Speaker 4: I'm a shield. That is what I do for Connor.
• 59:58
  Speaker 4: And the more you listen, the more you realize where
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 4: the bullets are coming from. And it's so much easier
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 4: to do your job when you have a better idea
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 4: of the landscape. So be a listener, keep going forward.
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 4: It is a trial of attrition. I have so many
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 4: people who are so talented who have left the industry
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 4: because you know they can't do it anymore. And I think,
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 4: like you just got to keep pushing forward and find
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 4: a way, you know, even if there's doing other jobs
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 4: in the introim. I honestly think if you stick it out,
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 4: the people, the people who make it in this industry.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 4: Nobody got it on their first try or very few
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 4: people got it on their first try.
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 2: I mean even just hearing Connor's story is just.
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 3: The same story. By the way, I didn't know the
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 3: full story.
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, see that's crazy.
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you have to keep just kind of taking the
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 4: nose and getting back in the game.
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 4: It is that kind of Rocky balbo a thing of
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 4: like it's not how hard you can and hit, is
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 4: how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward.
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 2: And you know, one thing, I mean, there were a
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 2: lot of great qualities for Sam as my assistant, but
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 2: it's the fact that, like we worked so many hours
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 2: and we were always together, but like not once did
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 2: he ever seem like I don't want to be here
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 2: cause it's a hard job. Like sometimes he's just like
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 2: literally standing next to me in video village four hours
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 2: and it's three in the morning and it's raining and
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 2: we're outside and we have a two hour uber back
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 2: to New York and we're not going to go to
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 2: bed till five in the morning, and like, I'm in
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 2: this job where he knows how much I have on
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 2: my plate, and I felt like he was so keen
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 2: to be like I need to be I need to
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 2: show up for him. Also, just like energetically in a
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 2: way that he needs because like I can't be one
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 2: more thing that he has to worry about. And so
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 2: I always felt like he was like we are in
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 2: this together. I'm here till the bitter end. And I
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 2: never felt like, oh God, like he's like so miserable
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 2: or I don't know. His attitude was just sort of
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 2: like I'm here for this job. I'm if i'm here
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 2: with you, then I'm I'm here, I'm present with you,
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 2: as opposed to being like when's this guy gonna let
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 2: me go? And by the way, like I would just
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 2: obviously cut him loose all the time to be like
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 2: you don't need to stay here any longer. But it
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 2: was never because I felt like, oh, he seems like
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 2: he needs to go home. He was always like I
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 2: am alert and I'm ready and available for whatever you need,
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 2: no matter the hour, and like, not a lot of
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 2: people necessarily have that constitution, but it's really assuring when
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 2: you have so much going on to have somebody who's like,
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 2: I know this is a lot, but like I'm here
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 2: no matter the hour to help you figure it out.
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 2: And I think that just goes a long way in
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 2: terms of like how you show up energetically for the
• 1:02:59
  Speaker 2: people that you work for.
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 1: Totally, that's what makes a fantastic assistant.
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right, and he and he was, he was
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 2: the best, and fortunately we get to, you know, keep
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 2: working together.
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 4: So it's also really nice when you have a boss
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 4: who advocates for you as an assistant. That is a
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 4: rare quality in this industry, and a lot of people
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 4: talk about how amazing their assistants are and how much
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 4: they help them. But Connor's been so generous with his
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 4: knowledge to me. He's not only you know, I've become
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 4: a better assistant, but he's helped me become a better
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 4: writer and really just kind of see the world in
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 4: a different way. So I'm so lucky to kind of
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 4: get to keep working with them.
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 3: You got a good boss.
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 2: I do. I do.
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 1: What would your advice be, Connor to someone who wants
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 1: to grow up and be a Connor Hines?
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 2: You got to be gifted. You have to be born
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 2: with it. My advice for somebody that wants to do
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 2: what I'm doing is is, like I said, it has
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 2: to feel like what you're meant to do, because it's
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 2: it's for me. It's too hard to do it any
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 2: other way. It's you have to be open to. I
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 2: think you people move here or they get into entertainment
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 2: with an idea of what they think their career is
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 2: going to look like. You have to have to be
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 2: open to stepping through doors that don't necessarily look like
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 2: they're leading to you to where you thought you'd want
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 2: to go, and be open to sort of life surprising you.
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 2: I think I think a lot of people wait for
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 2: what they feel like is the right opportunity in terms
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 2: of the direction that they want to go, and as
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 2: a result remain sort of idle or sometimes you just
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 2: it doesn't always have to make sense. But it's so
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 2: much better to jump in the wrong direction than standstill.
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 2: And I think you'd be surprised how often jumping, even
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 2: in the wrong direction can course correct pretty quickly into
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 2: the right one. You cannot wait around for somebody to
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 2: change your life. I think some people think once I
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 2: get an agent or a manager, then like they'll do
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 2: the work, they'll do the work for you. They don't.
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 2: They're basically like a partner for you, for your company
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 2: and what it is that you're trying to do. But
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 2: like no one is ever going to care about your
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 2: career as much as you do. So I have a
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 2: wonderful team of people. I love my agents, I love
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 2: my manager, but like, why would they care about my
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 2: career as much as I do? Like that they're you know,
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 2: like nobody's going to do that. And it is, like
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 2: I said, to find you have to find the smallest
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 2: ways to move the needle for yourself. You have to
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 2: celebrate all the little wins. It's like we're all holding
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 2: out for this like huge moment that will change our life.
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 2: But if you don't celebrate the little moments where you've
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 2: sold something or you've even gotten a great meeting, you
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 2: have to also use that as the fuel to keep
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 2: going to remind yourself that you're moving in the right direction.
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 2: You can't just be like only holding out for like
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 2: that make or break moment that changes your life. Otherwise,
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 2: like you're letting so many opportunities to be like you
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 2: know what, I fucking did that and that's further than
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 2: I was when I got here. And that's momentum. And
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 2: it's like it's just it's creating that ability to propel
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 2: yourself forward and creating that momentum. However, you can then
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 2: I think really makes all the difference.
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 3: It's great advice both of you.
• 1:06:27
  Speaker 1: Thank you, and did you I guess my last last question,
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 1: did you get any amazing advice from peers or from
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 1: people that you were working with on the show that really.
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 3: Stuck with you.
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 2: That's a good question. It's funny. I remember when I
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 2: was when I was starting out, though, somebody gave me
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 2: a piece of advice, which is that like nothing is
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 2: beneath you when you're starting out, like you have to
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 2: be like that might not be what you want to do,
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 2: but like, when you're starting out, you got to be
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 2: game for any thing. I was talking to this other
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 2: writer who wasn't working on our show, but she was like,
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 2: once in a while, pick your head up out of
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 2: your laptop and like look around at what you're doing,
• 1:07:18
  Speaker 2: and how lucky you are to get to do this,
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 2: Like this is what you wanted to do your whole life.
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 2: It is so easy to be buried in the responsibility
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 2: and to lose sight of the fact that like this
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 2: is what you've wanted to do your whole life, and
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 2: like it's such a privilege to get to make something
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 2: that you love and to get to make anything as
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 2: a privilege, but to get to make something that you
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 2: love is a tremendous privilege. And she was like, just
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 2: don't lose sight of how amazing that is, and you know,
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 2: don't just fully surrender to the stresses and all of that,
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 2: like once in a while be like, oh my god,
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 2: this is amazing that I get to be here and
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 2: I feel so lucky. And that was just really important
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 2: to remember because I think it's really easy to get
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 2: lost in all of the minute shave troubleshooting and problems
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 2: to be like, oh wait, like they built these sets
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 2: and we have hundreds of actors that are so talented
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 2: that we get to watch every day, and yeah, just
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 2: like the gratitude of it all, I think, yes totally.
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 2: Because also, like this is a ride that does not
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 2: last forever. You know. I think of like entertainment sort
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 2: of opportunities come in waves, and there's you're spending most
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 2: of your career like waiting out in the ocean for
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 2: another wave to come. So when you get one, like
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 2: you have to be so grateful because that ride isn't
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 2: going to last, and not every show is going to
• 1:08:45
  Speaker 2: be like Love Story, and to remember, like how long
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 2: you were waiting for this wave, and you know how
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 2: lucky you are that you got to write it, not
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 2: to just belabor the shit out of that metaphor, you
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 2: know what I mean.
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, that's very good advice. Well, thank you guys
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 3: so much.
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 2: This was awesome, Thank you, Thank You's pleasureable and.
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 3: So blown away by you. Seriously, and you too. Great.
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 3: Every assistant should be.
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 2: Like Sam, isn't the amazing Yes he's my best. Oh
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 2: my god, yes, you can see why I hired him.
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 3: Well, thank you guys so much. By Connor, by Sam,
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 3: thank you, thanks guys.
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 2: M