Latest / Pod Therapy / #455: Touch Trauma, Sister's Love Triangle, Listening Skills

Transcript

#455: Touch Trauma, Sister's Love Triangle, Listening Skills · Pod Therapy

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: With a car yeah then that stuff exploded everywhere and
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: then the road smelled and then you had like.
• 0:07
  Speaker 2: A cloud of we're getting stoned this whole time yeah
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: wow that's that's the point.
• 0:12
  Speaker 3: They're smoking the skunks my childhood.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: Is just different now kids these days i'm just glad
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: that quicksand wasn't as big a problem not.
• 0:21
  Speaker 4: Yet From fabulous Las Vegas, Nevada, this is Pod Therapy.
• 0:30
  Speaker 4: Real people, real problems, and real therapists.
• 0:32
  Speaker 5: You can submit your questions anonymously at podtherapy.net or email
• 0:36
  Speaker 5: us at podtherapyguys at gmail.com. And now broadcasting from Blank Studio.
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: That's Jim.
• 0:42
  Speaker 5: That's Whitney. I'm Nick. It's time for some Pod Therapy.
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: One of my favorite characters on Dick Tracy. The Blank.
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: The Blank.
• 0:48
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: Played by Madonna in the movie. Nick never likes to
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: remind you guys that you can go to patreon.com slash
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: therapy and you can name our studio. and then make
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: a joke out of it.
• 0:57
  Speaker 5: Yeah, why do you think that is? Yeah.
• 0:58
  Speaker 3: Kind of casually blows over.
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: Just say blank.
• 1:01
  Speaker 5: How many supple, young, 19-year-old studio submissions have we had already? Several.
• 1:06
  Speaker 5: I'm saving you.
• 1:07
  Speaker 2: Then let's just fucking be done with it.
• 1:08
  Speaker 6: Fine.
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: Let's stop saying blank. Fine. Okay, good. Yeah, let's just
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: agree to go back to SJ and the Ruckus Scenic
• 1:13
  Speaker 2: Koi Pond Studios.
• 1:14
  Speaker 5: That's a lot.
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: That is a lot. Or we could just go back
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: to the churn. Oh, Liam the Beaver Studios. We could
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: just call it the churn. I like Liam the Beaver Studios.
• 1:21
  Speaker 2: Churn two. I feel like Two Dog Studios is a
• 1:23
  Speaker 2: pretty cool name, and they're always in here. So that's
• 1:26
  Speaker 2: kind of cool, too. I like that.
• 1:28
  Speaker 5: Too bad.
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: Patreon.com slash therapy. You might still be able to name
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: our studio before we figure out how to take it down. Oh,
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: they're not going to know how to take it down.
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: You can definitely just go on Patreon.com slash therapy and
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: name the studio.
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: Whatever you want.
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: You can make Nick just talk about balls for five minutes.
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: You can write that much in there. We'll probably read that.
• 1:48
  Speaker 5: If it's in there, I will read it.
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: You didn't answer your own question. What is the most
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: exotic pet that you would be comfortable owning? A bird, maybe? Oh,
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: I could see him being a bird guy. I think
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: you'd do very well with a cockatiel.
• 2:01
  Speaker 3: Oh, my gosh.
• 2:02
  Speaker 5: Laura would love it. I couldn't do a bird.
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: You don't think so?
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  Speaker 5: That's a big commitment. Birds?
• 2:07
  Speaker 3: That's true.
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  Speaker 5: They are. No, they don't live for 50 or 60 years.
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: Some of the big ones longer.
• 2:13
  Speaker 3: You can't just leave them with someone.
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: Who do you leave them with?
• 2:17
  Speaker 5: Whitney is the answer.
• 2:18
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I would. I'm like, send him with me.
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: Whitney's definitely a bird lady. I think of her as
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: like the lady from Home Alone 2 in the park,
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: you know, feeding the pigeons.
• 2:26
  Speaker 3: I think we're the same age too. Like I think
• 2:28
  Speaker 3: she was 40.
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  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: That's about it.
• 2:30
  Speaker 5: Which by the way, like that always bothered me in
• 2:33
  Speaker 5: that movie. It's like, he's at the plaza and he
• 2:36
  Speaker 5: comes down to give her a, christmas tree ornament oh
• 2:41
  Speaker 5: yeah yeah and she's a homeless i'll go put this
• 2:43
  Speaker 5: on my tree yeah enjoy your yeah go back into
• 2:48
  Speaker 5: the feast yeah and these this family's getting all this
• 2:50
  Speaker 5: free shit from this millionaire you know what i could
• 2:53
  Speaker 5: really use 20 bucks.
• 2:54
  Speaker 3: 20 bucks when you're a shitty.
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: Ornament i'm also trying to buy more bird.
• 2:58
  Speaker 5: Feed that'd be nice like let me feed the fucking
• 3:00
  Speaker 5: birds but no i don't think I could do a
• 3:02
  Speaker 5: bird I could do maybe like a lizard a turtle
• 3:05
  Speaker 5: actually turtle oh that's right because I was walking through
• 3:08
  Speaker 5: a star nursery the other day and they have like
• 3:12
  Speaker 5: a koi pond in the middle set up and they've
• 3:14
  Speaker 5: got a whole bunch of turtles and stuff in there
• 3:16
  Speaker 5: yeah it's like oh That'd be nice.
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: Would you want the water turtles or the tortoise? No,
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: the water turtles.
• 3:22
  Speaker 3: A desert tortoise.
• 3:24
  Speaker 5: Would be cool.
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: My next door neighbor has a desert tortoise that lives
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: in his backyard. Is it a big one? Yeah, those
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: things get pretty big. Every now and then he gets out.
• 3:32
  Speaker 3: I was like, they don't come out very often.
• 3:34
  Speaker 2: Does your ring doorbell notify you that there's a beaver
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: in your backyard?
• 3:38
  Speaker 3: A firm beaver.
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: It's a beaver with a shell. It's a smooth beaver.
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: S.J., there's a female beaver singing in the backyard and
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: doing yard work.
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: Sponsor the show, Ring Doorbells. We would love to take
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: your money. Patreon.com slash therapy. Join the pre-show hangout. Get
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: the show a day earlier. Enjoy watching us on YouTube.
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: We usually post it. You can check that out. It's
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: always more fun that way if you like to watch.
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: And I know you do, you dirty girls. But today
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: we've got some great questions for the show. Leading off
• 4:14
  Speaker 2: the order with a question about touch trauma. Dear Jim, Nick, Jacob, Whitney,
• 4:22
  Speaker 2: and the Atlas of Mental Health holding up the whole world,
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: the intern in the broom closet.
• 4:29
  Speaker 6: Hello.
• 4:30
  Speaker 2: You get your ass back in that broom closet. Also,
• 4:32
  Speaker 2: who has broom closets? I don't know that we... Do
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: you guys keep your brooms in a closet?
• 4:37
  Speaker 3: Mine goes by the fridge.
• 4:38
  Speaker 5: Yeah. No, mine goes by– it goes in the little
• 4:42
  Speaker 5: opening for the washer and dryer.
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: So he does have a closet.
• 4:44
  Speaker 5: Yeah, it is actually kind of a closet.
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: Mine's in– we have like a storage room back there.
• 4:49
  Speaker 5: Okay.
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: We have a broom in there. Supply closet.
• 4:50
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: I keep mine in the garage. Yeah.
• 4:54
  Speaker 5: Which is just a car closet.
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: It really is. It's a big closet. A house is
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: just a person closet.
• 4:58
  Speaker 5: Yeah, really.
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: All right. This is pretty– All right. Well, I guess
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: we got a broom closet. Thanks for writing in. Thanks
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: for writing in. Take care. I have a question about
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: dating and relationship dynamics. You're listening to pod therapy. I'm
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: a 27 year old female and I have trauma related
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: to touch. I've been in therapy for five years on
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: antidepressants for the same amount of time and recently had
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: ketamine infusions. They greatly lessened my anxiety, depression, and PTSD.
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: They're not permanent. However, I get about two weeks with
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: no suicidal ideation or anxiety, which is more than I
• 5:32
  Speaker 2: ever dreamed possible. I'm wary of touch, platonic affection, and intimacy.
• 5:38
  Speaker 2: It takes me a long time to warm up physically,
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: though I usually attach emotionally pretty early on. I have
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: a vigilance, even with people that I trust. I dissociate
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: and get into my head and feel tension, meaning I
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: get tunnel vision regarding the physical sensation. And I think,
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: does this feel good? Am I safe? How long should
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: I hug? How do I initiate touch with a partner
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: or hug? It's easier to manage with friends as the
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: stakes feel lower, and there is no regular touch expected.
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: It's been a barrier to dating, as people see it
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: as awkward or cold behavior. Perceived pressure or actual pressure
• 6:17
  Speaker 2: to be intimate is another thing that weighs heavily on me.
• 6:21
  Speaker 2: Someone I dated briefly had commented when we sat together
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: on a couch side by side that I appeared to
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: tense up. I was aware of this, though trying to
• 6:31
  Speaker 2: calm myself. I was not in danger, though my body
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: was feeling anxious. I used to feel more confident with
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: touch until a few years ago. I had a regression
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: in my feelings of safety because of multiple unwanted and
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: inappropriate touches at work and the men sexualizing and harassing me.
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: Really kills the mood. I can enjoy touch. I get
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: massages semi-regularly to satisfy the platonic touch quota. I don't
• 6:56
  Speaker 2: have the same anxious reaction. My line of thinking is,
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: I'm paying this person, always a woman, and I'm usually
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: bigger than them, so in my mind I think they
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: can't hurt me. I'm a very direct person, and I
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: don't want to linger over many dates without broaching this
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: very important issue, among other things. It's not hip to
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: wear a sign that says, please go slow, I have
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: a wound. I'm not a super affectionate person, even feeling
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: my best. I'm more scared of being labeled crazy or unusual.
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: that it overrides my desire to be direct. Being direct
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: is also at odds with the feminine archetype of passive
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: and pleasing. Why do some guys get upset if you
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: want to split the bill? That's another story, however. Thanks,
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: love you guys, Molly, professionally supple 19-year-old.
• 7:46
  Speaker 3: There it is.
• 7:47
  Speaker 5: You're welcome. Great.
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: I'm glad you're not an amateur. Well, I'm just confused
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: now because earlier she identified as 27 and now it's 19.
• 7:57
  Speaker 2: You know, we get to identify as what we want
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: to identify as, Joe. Okay.
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: I don't know why you have to control what I
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: want to identify as. And I want to identify.
• 8:05
  Speaker 5: I'm going to be a bigot.
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: Because I like the feminine passivity and whatever she said.
• 8:10
  Speaker 5: And all the other stuff.
• 8:11
  Speaker 2: Pleasing. Yeah.
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: So.
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  Speaker 3: The touch. You know, my first thought was going to be.
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: No, just go ahead.
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  Speaker 5: Oh, my God.
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  Speaker 2: I'm not touching you. I'm not touching you. Why are
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: you making it weird? Just talk.
• 8:25
  Speaker 3: I get tense and I don't know why.
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: That's weird. Just talk. Just focus. You're doing great. I
• 8:30
  Speaker 2: just don't want to get punched.
• 8:33
  Speaker 3: You better watch out. You sit way too close to me.
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: That's right. I'll send a stapler to fucking hit my head.
• 8:38
  Speaker 6: But no, my go-to is going to be to try
• 8:41
  Speaker 6: some desensitization, but it sounds like you already do that.
• 8:43
  Speaker 3: That's actually a really.
• 8:45
  Speaker 6: Great idea to go get a massage in a place
• 8:48
  Speaker 6: that you can choose who your masseuse is, their age,
• 8:52
  Speaker 6: or not age, I guess, but unless you want to
• 8:54
  Speaker 6: be their age like Jim.
• 8:55
  Speaker 3: Um, but, uh, you know, like just kind of the style.
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: You want to keep your hands to yourself.
• 9:05
  Speaker 6: So, yeah, uh, you're trying that and it sounds like
• 9:08
  Speaker 6: it's helping some, but when you're in these relationships, you're
• 9:12
  Speaker 6: feeling emotionally connected to them, but also you want to
• 9:15
  Speaker 6: bring this up early is what I'm hearing.
• 9:17
  Speaker 3: But then that kind of makes it awkward.
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it does.
• 9:19
  Speaker 6: Like, hey, just so you know, we've been out on
• 9:21
  Speaker 6: a couple dates, but I have a hard time opening
• 9:25
  Speaker 6: up or feeling comfortable.
• 9:27
  Speaker 3: With touch early on. And I'm sure that does come
• 9:31
  Speaker 3: off a little bit odd. I don't hate it, though, because.
• 9:34
  Speaker 6: You're setting that boundary, and if it feels odd for
• 9:37
  Speaker 6: the other person, that's their problem, not yours. There wasn't
• 9:42
  Speaker 6: a real question other than the splitting the bill thing,
• 9:44
  Speaker 6: so I'm not sure if the writer's just trying to
• 9:46
  Speaker 6: ask for input or.
• 9:49
  Speaker 3: How to not feel as sensitive.
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: How touchy are you on a day-to-day basis? She's kind
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: of a bitch.
• 9:55
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 9:56
  Speaker 2: She's so fucking … Jim was.
• 9:58
  Speaker 3: Respecting my boundary but not actually touching it.
• 10:00
  Speaker 6: That's right great thing so you're welcome way to go
• 10:03
  Speaker 6: um yeah how touch are.
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: You pretty touchy on a day-to-day basis.
• 10:06
  Speaker 3: Um it's funny because i i'm a hugger as you guys.
• 10:09
  Speaker 6: Know i don't mind like greeting people hugs i love
• 10:12
  Speaker 6: all that Um, but I don't think I am like
• 10:15
  Speaker 6: naturally a like cuddler touch. Like I'm not, that doesn't
• 10:20
  Speaker 6: come very naturally to me. I think I'm a little
• 10:21
  Speaker 6: bit observant and then I'll, I'll engage.
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: I don't initiate touch.
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: I'm fine if you touch me, but I, I like,
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: I'm not particularly a hugger, but if somebody hugs me
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: or indicates that they want to hug me, I'm fine
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: with it.
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: I think that that's why it's so important because I
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: think that's the default setting. I think we all kind
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: of assume that there's an amount of like you give
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: somebody a hug or a handshake or whatever, especially if
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: it's romantic and you're dating them or whatever. So I
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: actually really like that this writer suggested the idea of like,
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: I guess I probably need to come out with that.
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: But then I'm not trying to look for confrontation. And
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: then I appreciate this juxtaposition of like, look, I want
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: to telegraph to a potential partner. This is a fact
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: about me. Like you need to know that, right? If
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: we're going to be intimate, you need to know that
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: that's probably not going to happen on your timeline. If
• 11:10
  Speaker 2: you try to just do normal affection at me, I'm
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: not upset at you. But my body will seem like
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: I'm upset at you. Like the writer says, I can't
• 11:18
  Speaker 2: sit and watch a movie next to somebody. They will notice.
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: And I'm not conscious of it all the time. So
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: I like giving that information away. I think that's actually
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: really important. People are going to misinterpret it.
• 11:29
  Speaker 5: Yeah. As the person who may be dating you, if
• 11:35
  Speaker 5: that was the case, I would internalize that and I'd
• 11:37
  Speaker 5: be like, Oh, she just, she doesn't seem into me
• 11:40
  Speaker 5: or I'm doing something wrong or I don't know. I
• 11:43
  Speaker 5: don't know where it helps. Like having the information is like, Oh, okay, cool.
• 11:47
  Speaker 5: So I don't, I, yeah.
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: So that's the expectation.
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: Information is always going to be a good thing, right?
• 11:52
  Speaker 5: It's data. Yeah.
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And I know a lot of people that do that,
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: even with just the sex talk, right? Like just when
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: the dates start getting in the right direction, they'll let
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: them know like, Hey, you know, I have a sexual
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: history of some kind, like for me, it's just not
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: going to happen until I feel completely safe with you.
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: I'm not a casual fling or whatever. And like, okay.
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: Like I think just telling people that information upfront, there's
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: nothing wrong with it. But where the writer says, I'm
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: worried that being that direct and honest violates the feminine stereotype.
• 12:22
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: That's, that's interesting. Right. Cause I don't feel like it inherently, I,
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: first off, like that's, we should talk about the stereotype thing,
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: but like, I don't know that that doesn't come off
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: as pleasant.
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: I was watching Whitney as you said that, Jim. I
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: don't think she quite understands the stereotype thing.
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what I should explain. So like,
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: you know, women are smaller. They have smaller brains. And so,
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: you know, they need to be protected. Tell me what
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: I should think. Yeah. please yeah i try to send
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: you notes just check your fucking inbox.
• 12:54
  Speaker 5: I don't know how to log in you can't expect
• 12:55
  Speaker 5: her to know how to do those things that's your
• 12:57
  Speaker 5: i'll build an app.
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: You don't get mad at a kid that shoots somebody
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: after the adult gives them the gun you're mad at
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: the adult.
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: You're just right is it is it not do women
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: feel like sometimes it comes off as like non-feminine to
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: just like signpost some things up front? Like, is that
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: something that we're just being assertive in general? I.
• 13:21
  Speaker 6: I guess I wouldn't have labeled it as feminine or, uh,
• 13:25
  Speaker 6: they didn't say this, but like masculine per se, but
• 13:27
  Speaker 6: I do think there is that underlying tone. And I
• 13:30
  Speaker 6: do think it is not perceived well when a woman
• 13:33
  Speaker 6: is more direct, ironically, because that also, uh, my understanding
• 13:37
  Speaker 6: is that, uh, I'm just going to say how men
• 13:39
  Speaker 6: feel in this situation and feel to men as though
• 13:42
  Speaker 6: it's like, you're getting rejected and men don't like that apparently.
• 13:46
  Speaker 6: So it's more like rejection of you, even though as
• 13:50
  Speaker 6: Nick said, it's just debt data, data, however you say it,
• 13:53
  Speaker 6: but like, it's not personal, but I think a lot
• 13:57
  Speaker 6: of people tend to take it personally.
• 13:59
  Speaker 7: Interesting.
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: I know. Okay. I was like, are you being crazy going?
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: I only would have never know.
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: Take, taking it personally just isn't, that's not what I
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: would have thought you were going to say there.
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: I thought that it was going to be, Honestly, more.
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: About just directness, making your feelings and your boundaries known,
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: just kind of that more general thing.
• 14:25
  Speaker 6: I do think there is kind of an understanding like
• 14:29
  Speaker 6: women should be coy or like– I don't know. I
• 14:35
  Speaker 6: don't want to say playing games like.
• 14:36
  Speaker 3: Oh, he, he, he.
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: Hard to get? No, that's not the right word.
• 14:40
  Speaker 3: No, but just– Not too eager.
• 14:42
  Speaker 6: Yeah, not super direct, kind of like the writer said.
• 14:45
  Speaker 6: I hadn't really sat in that thought process much, but
• 14:49
  Speaker 6: I think that they're kind of onto something with that.
• 14:53
  Speaker 6: That directness comes off very harsh, I think, in the
• 14:57
  Speaker 6: dating realm. And I don't know that that's fair. And so, writer,
• 15:01
  Speaker 6: I don't know that you should even really change that.
• 15:04
  Speaker 6: I mean, maybe you're asking, do I change that? What's
• 15:06
  Speaker 6: the deal with it?
• 15:08
  Speaker 3: But I don't know. I think if you find a secure.
• 15:11
  Speaker 6: partner that you're spending time with, that won't matter. They
• 15:14
  Speaker 6: will just be like, oh, okay. And adjust if they
• 15:17
  Speaker 6: really like you. I almost think maybe you're weeding out
• 15:19
  Speaker 6: the right people.
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I don't think you need to change this practice
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: at all.
• 15:25
  Speaker 3: No, I agree. I don't, I don't think it should
• 15:27
  Speaker 3: be changed.
• 15:28
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: I have actually seen this work in real life and
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: I've seen it go both ways kind of in, in
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: anecdotal therapy stories. I've seen it where a person, man
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: or woman, Has this kind of touch trauma and they're
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: just like that's– they're very sensitive about it. They're really
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: slow with sexuality and with affection. But because they are
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: afraid that that will be bad in the dating systems,
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: they tend to hide that aspect. And then the other
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: person just feels like, great, we're building up. We're getting closer.
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: They're assuming what you might call like the average of
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: like how long it will be before they can be intimate.
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: And then the person with the touch trauma doesn't know
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: how to– We're almost halfway through this first date. Yeah, yeah.
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: Dessert's on the way.
• 16:07
  Speaker 5: Time to get anal.
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: Any moment now. But like they'll say like, well, I
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: don't want to even let them know about my touch trauma.
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: And so they come up with all these elaborate labyrinthine
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: explanations of like, Oh, well, I really like somebody who
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: does this or like does that. And then the partner
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: starts jumping through all these hoops believing, okay, I'm taking
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: this at face value. I'm trying to get to know you.
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: This is what you require in order to like gain intimacy.
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: But then later on down the road, it comes out. No,
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: it turns out that person had touch trauma or whatever
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: and just didn't know how to express it or was
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: afraid to. And the other person feels like kind of misled.
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: And I've seen that go wrong.
• 16:47
  Speaker 5: It's so much easier to just say I have diarrhea.
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 16:50
  Speaker 5: Like when things are starting to get touchy, just be like, hey,
• 16:53
  Speaker 5: just so you know.
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 16:54
  Speaker 3: Just every time.
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: Just FYI.
• 16:55
  Speaker 5: Well, it's just going to slow me down.
• 16:57
  Speaker 3: I was going to say, it doesn't smell that bad.
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: Feature, not a bug.
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: I mean, I'm just saying, you could drive real fast
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: on that Hershey Highway.
• 17:05
  Speaker 5: Oh, goddamn.
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 17:06
  Speaker 5: You're talking about weeding out some people. It may actually
• 17:09
  Speaker 5: accelerate some of the creeps.
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: That's right. Jacob was taking all of his first dates
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: in the last month to salad buffets. Are you right,
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: Joe's intolerant? Here's some cream.
• 17:19
  Speaker 5: Follow-up, though, to Whitney. So this is kind of– I'm
• 17:22
  Speaker 5: going to get a little off topic, but it's still
• 17:24
  Speaker 5: related to touch. You have a personal trainer. And I
• 17:27
  Speaker 5: think about this all the time.
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: How infuriated you are that she has a trainer and
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: it isn't you.
• 17:33
  Speaker 5: No, I'm fine with that.
• 17:34
  Speaker 6: We're not trying to ruin the friendship. Yeah, exactly.
• 17:39
  Speaker 5: It almost destroyed my relationship.
• 17:41
  Speaker 6: I learned.
• 17:43
  Speaker 5: No, how often does your personal trainer, if at all,
• 17:46
  Speaker 5: how often and in what ways does he touch you? Slower, please. Sorry,
• 17:53
  Speaker 5: go ahead.
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: Show us on this doll.
• 17:56
  Speaker 6: Uh no he actually does not touch me that that
• 18:03
  Speaker 6: often at all and if he does maybe once or
• 18:07
  Speaker 6: like a couple times every other session every couple sessions
• 18:09
  Speaker 6: and that is only when we do a lot of
• 18:12
  Speaker 6: like functional pattern stuff so um it's not traditional weight
• 18:17
  Speaker 6: lifting it's like a you know, I'm doing like planking
• 18:21
  Speaker 6: or like some weight things. And so he is cuing
• 18:23
  Speaker 6: different parts of my body. Like while I'm in a plank,
• 18:25
  Speaker 6: there's a lot of adjustments. Yeah. So what you might
• 18:27
  Speaker 6: do is come up and like on my back, he'll
• 18:29
  Speaker 6: be like, all right here. And he's like, sometimes, especially
• 18:32
  Speaker 6: if it's in more of a, like my hips, he's
• 18:34
  Speaker 6: going to adjust him. He's like, I'm going to touch
• 18:36
  Speaker 6: your hips. Like he'll tell me verbally. Cause I'm like
• 18:39
  Speaker 6: in the plank, not thinking he's like just, and it'll
• 18:41
  Speaker 6: be like a very light, like a tilt, like there's not,
• 18:46
  Speaker 6: grabbing or anything like that. But there's definitely a verbal
• 18:48
  Speaker 6: warning typically. And then, yeah, it's very brief.
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: See, but like the open communication piece of it is huge.
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: And that was the second anecdote I was going to
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: tell about filtration. Because like I've seen it go the
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: one way where the person hides their touch trauma. They
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: don't talk about it.
• 19:03
  Speaker 6: Mr.
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: Tration. Mr.
• 19:04
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: The other side is I had a patient, a male actually,
• 19:10
  Speaker 2: who had very severe touch trauma and a lot of
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: intimacy stuff. But as a man, he felt the opposite
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: stereotype that if he wasn't aggressing and like making initiation
• 19:20
  Speaker 2: attempts at the female and he was, he was heterosexual, he,
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: but like he would feel that he would get the
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: feedback that they didn't feel desired by him. And so
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: they would be like, okay, are you not going to
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: make a move? Like, what are we doing here? And
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: so then they would start to like not lose interest,
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: but I don't know, just like the chemistry is not
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: there because he's not acting upon it. And so when
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: he would be given the opportunity, when they would kind
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: of be a little forward or whatever, like be like, Hey,
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: let's go back to your place. He would go through
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: such a difficult experience where he would feel the need
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: to perform and to make the relationship possible.
• 19:52
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: But then like afterward, he would be an absolute emotional
• 19:56
  Speaker 2: wreck because he, he had a lot of trauma around
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: this and they really struggled with it. So through therapy,
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: one of the things that we started working on was
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: doing what this writer's doing, which is like telegraphing upfront
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: and learning how to say that in ways that that
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: he felt comfortable with, that honored his masculinity, that communicated that, yes,
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: he still is a sexual being. Yes, he desires them.
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: But without getting into his haunted past, he needed to
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: go slow. And what that ended up doing, as Whitney
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: had said earlier, it really created this really healthy filter
• 20:26
  Speaker 2: system where, you know, I mean, I think women are
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: much more comfortable with that language than a lot of
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: men would be. They're like, okay, whatever, let's go slow.
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: Thanks for telling me. Now I won't get hung up
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: thinking you're not into me, like whatever. But there were
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: women that were like, okay, that doesn't work for me.
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: I'm into you. I want more, yeah. Yeah, just I
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: don't want to wait that long. Or whatever. Just I
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: don't think we're a good match. We're not compatible. I'm
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: very affectionate.
• 20:47
  Speaker 5: He communicated.
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: They communicated back.
• 20:49
  Speaker 5: Perfect. Great.
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: And it was a self-selecting thing where eventually the partners
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: that he would have really understood that about him. And
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: then whenever he finally was intimate with them, he would
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: still abreact. Like even though they waited, even though it
• 21:01
  Speaker 2: was on his terms, he would still like have a
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: hard time. But because they knew about that, they were
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: able to like attend to him. And it was actually
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: really good partnerships for him that went much better and
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: he felt much safer. So I think there's nothing wrong
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: with like what the writer is doing. If you do
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: feel writer, like there's something about that that feels unattractive,
• 21:19
  Speaker 2: like you're being too direct. Okay. I think that's still
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: going to self-select, right? I feel like there's going to
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: be people that are like, yeah, that's unattractive that you
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: were that direct with me. Great. Tell them to go
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: fuck off. Yeah. And be with people that do not
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: find that unattractive who listen to you and are like, no,
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: thank you for teaching me how to respect you.
• 21:33
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 21:33
  Speaker 2: Great. That's what you want to be with.
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: I think as long as you are, uh, you know, polite, civil, reasonable,
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: all these things, which nothing makes me think that you're
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: not doing that.
• 21:44
  Speaker 2: You know, nothing in your letter makes me think that,
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: that anything is off with any of that.
• 21:47
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 21:48
  Speaker 2: I mean, you, You're having pleasant, polite interaction with other adults.
• 21:52
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: You're telling them about yourself. You're educating them about yourself. Fine. Yeah.
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: If they don't like it, that's okay.
• 21:59
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 22:00
  Speaker 5: It's okay. It's fine.
• 22:01
  Speaker 6: It feeds into the stereotype. I had a client once
• 22:04
  Speaker 6: who shared that what she didn't like about dating, and
• 22:07
  Speaker 6: we talk about the love languages, which I know is
• 22:09
  Speaker 6: very controversial, but for this example, she was like, Oh,
• 22:12
  Speaker 6: every man's physical touch. Like, you know, it's physical touch
• 22:15
  Speaker 6: because she associates physical touch in men as sex.
• 22:19
  Speaker 3: And I'm like, it's not.
• 22:20
  Speaker 6: Always sex, but I get where the jadedness is coming from.
• 22:24
  Speaker 6: So I think that plays into this a lot where
• 22:27
  Speaker 6: some women and some men, as you said, Jim, like
• 22:30
  Speaker 6: they're not physical touch, but I think we're playing into
• 22:32
  Speaker 6: a lot of stereotypes where men are typically seen as
• 22:35
  Speaker 6: like more physical.
• 22:37
  Speaker 3: Physical touch oriented.
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: But that's why I think it's so important to telegraph this.
• 22:40
  Speaker 7: Correct.
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: Because just like in my patient's case, women would think like,
• 22:44
  Speaker 2: maybe he doesn't desire me. And like, so they would
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: kind of fade out. I think the same thing can
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: happen in reverse. Like I think too often, and I'm
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: really glad you brought this up because too often I
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: feel like Society often pathologizes male sexuality, not seeing it
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: as a human need or a natural evolved expression of companionship,
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: but only seeing it as this like twisting the mustache
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: evil villain. He only wants one thing, girls. And like
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: that sucks because then it always feels transactional. It always
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: feels transactional. And like in a lot of these relationships,
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: as you're trying to create companionship, That may be one
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: of the currencies that a male might look for, not
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: because he just wants to get laid, but because he's
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: looking for connection. And those are the signals that give
• 23:26
  Speaker 2: a man a sense of connection of like, oh, she
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: does like me. Lots of women are polite. Lots of
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: women are just nice to you. Some women like send
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: sexual interest towards you. That's a different signal and it
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: makes you feel like, okay, you actually get– this is
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: going really well. Like this is a different kind of vibe.
• 23:43
  Speaker 2: And if that's not coming through at all, a lot
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: of guys are going to go, okay, so I guess
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: we don't have that. And then they'll walk away and
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: then sometimes they get stereotyped as like being jerks. And
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: it's like, well, you could have been a dick on
• 23:52
  Speaker 2: the way out. But a lot of times they just
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: kind of ghost or go away. Women are like, oh, man,
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: there's all this pressure. to like initiate intimacy in order
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: to keep a guy, there is definitely a delicate dance, right?
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: But this is why it's so important to communicate yourself
• 24:05
  Speaker 2: to these potential partners. That way they don't misunderstand that.
• 24:09
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: It isn't that I'm not into you. It's, it's just
• 24:11
  Speaker 2: a me and a safety and a body thing. And
• 24:14
  Speaker 2: it has to do with other people in my life.
• 24:15
  Speaker 2: Not you.
• 24:16
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 24:17
  Speaker 2: That's pretty important stuff. Did your shirt say brisket? Yes.
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: We're going to take a quick break.
• 24:23
  Speaker 3: And, uh, That's the menu he came up with on Pod.
• 24:27
  Speaker 2: That's what ChatGPT gave him. It was just a t-shirt
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: that says brisket.
• 24:31
  Speaker 6: Brisket.
• 24:33
  Speaker 5: Yeah. Next.
• 24:34
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 24:34
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: It's like a verb.
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: I miss the wear black memo.
• 24:37
  Speaker 5: Gosh.
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: It does have a period on it as well. So
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: it's brisket.
• 24:41
  Speaker 5: Period.
• 24:42
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah. We're going to take a quick break. And when
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: we come back, we're talking about My Sister's Love Triangle.
• 24:48
  Speaker 6: Ooh.
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: After dark.
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: You're listening to Pod Therapy.
• 24:52
  Speaker 5: Today's episode is brought to you by Judy Schneider, Leon Kassab,
• 24:55
  Speaker 5: Carolyn Albert, Sammy Scoop, Sarah Smith, Mike Kalk, Darren Cunningham,
• 24:59
  Speaker 5: Brady Malaysia, Max the Gender Scoop, Ellie O'Dare, Amy Aardvark,
• 25:04
  Speaker 5: and Edgar Allen Ho. And if you would like to
• 25:06
  Speaker 5: sponsor the show, become a TheraProducer at patreon.com slash theraproducer.
• 25:12
  Speaker 5: All right, we got some Emma trivia. All right, nice. True.
• 25:16
  Speaker 5: This is, I wish, where legal and mental health.
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: Ah, shit. This kind of trivia. Give us back Disney lyrics, Emma.
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: Not this nerd shit.
• 25:29
  Speaker 5: I don't like this either. These are big words. All right.
• 25:32
  Speaker 3: She knows how to get Nick even though.
• 25:34
  Speaker 5: He's not playing.
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: No, I feel like she doesn't think of me at
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: all when she writes these.
• 25:39
  Speaker 5: All right. Under the, and I'll be damned if I
• 25:42
  Speaker 5: know how to spell it, Midnighten Standard? Are you familiar
• 25:46
  Speaker 5: with this?
• 25:47
  Speaker 2: Standard.
• 25:48
  Speaker 5: Yes.
• 25:48
  Speaker 6: Go on.
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: It's McDonald's, but please continue.
• 25:51
  Speaker 5: Mildred. Maybe McNaughton standard.
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, McNaughton after Donald.
• 25:56
  Speaker 5: It's M-N standard. Okay. The test for legal insanity used
• 26:01
  Speaker 5: in roughly half of U.S. states, a defendant is legally
• 26:05
  Speaker 5: insane only if, at the time of the crime, which
• 26:10
  Speaker 5: of the following is true?
• 26:14
  Speaker 3: Whitney, we're going to start for you.
• 26:15
  Speaker 5: Start with you.
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: Let's fucking go.
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: Off the hip.
• 26:18
  Speaker 3: I was going to say, they are not competent.
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: She's a woman.
• 26:23
  Speaker 3: They did not know what they did was right or wrong.
• 26:25
  Speaker 5: Always innocent. A. They could not control their behavior due
• 26:31
  Speaker 5: to a diagnosed mental disease. B. They had been formally
• 26:36
  Speaker 5: diagnosed with a psychiatric disorder before the offense. C. They
• 26:40
  Speaker 5: did not know the nature or quality of their act
• 26:43
  Speaker 5: or did not know Uh, that they, uh, that what
• 26:48
  Speaker 5: they were doing was wrong. Hmm. What I just said.
• 26:52
  Speaker 5: Or D, they were incapacitated, uh, they were incapable of
• 26:57
  Speaker 5: forming the specific intent required by the crime charged.
• 27:02
  Speaker 2: Hmm.
• 27:03
  Speaker 3: Read the last one again.
• 27:04
  Speaker 6: They were.
• 27:05
  Speaker 5: They were incapable of forming the specific intent required by
• 27:11
  Speaker 5: the crime charged.
• 27:12
  Speaker 2: Hmm.
• 27:13
  Speaker 6: I mean, just because my gut said C before you
• 27:16
  Speaker 6: said the answers, I'm going to say C, but.
• 27:18
  Speaker 5: Yes.
• 27:19
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 27:20
  Speaker 3: I watched my true crime.
• 27:21
  Speaker 2: There you go. I watched my true crime.
• 27:23
  Speaker 5: It's the longest of four.
• 27:24
  Speaker 6: That's true, too.
• 27:25
  Speaker 2: That helps.
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: But I said it before. I could have gotten my
• 27:28
  Speaker 3: two points if I wanted to.
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: TV and media taught me that it's the inability to
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: know right from wrong.
• 27:34
  Speaker 3: Right from wrong. Yeah. That's what I always.
• 27:36
  Speaker 6: If they knew what they were doing was wrong, that's
• 27:37
  Speaker 6: what the cops are trying to catch them saying.
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: I'm sure that's a very oversimplified thing. But yeah, that's
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: what TV and media has taught me.
• 27:44
  Speaker 5: Yeah, and this actually, she goes on to write, this
• 27:46
  Speaker 5: is a critical thing most people get wrong about legal insanity.
• 27:50
  Speaker 5: The legal standard is about knowledge, not behavior. You can
• 27:54
  Speaker 5: know something is horrific and still not meet the standard.
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: Gotcha.
• 27:58
  Speaker 6: Yep.
• 27:58
  Speaker 5: Okay.
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: There you go, kids.
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: Honestly, even with that, I still don't like it there.
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: I still don't like it. It's still a poor standard.
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: Because I would argue that you can– That's so odd.
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: How do you– I would argue that you can not
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: fully understand the rightness or wrongness of something if you
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: have never done it before, if you have never done
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: that action in your life.
• 28:20
  Speaker 6: And part of me is like you can know like
• 28:22
  Speaker 6: it's wrong to kill someone but feel like I need
• 28:25
  Speaker 6: to do– that this is right for me to do
• 28:27
  Speaker 6: this right now.
• 28:27
  Speaker 5: That's it.
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: As soon as you bring feeling into it, as soon
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: as you bring feeling.
• 28:30
  Speaker 3: Into law, it gets– It gets very mushy.
• 28:32
  Speaker 2: Real sticky.
• 28:33
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 28:34
  Speaker 5: All right, Jacob.
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: Hit me.
• 28:36
  Speaker 5: Before the monotone rules were formalized in 1843. I knew it.
• 28:43
  Speaker 2: Monotone rules.
• 28:44
  Speaker 5: The primary English legal standard for insanity came from a
• 28:51
  Speaker 5: 1724 case and required that a defendant be so deprived
• 28:54
  Speaker 5: of understanding that they were, quote, no more than, unquote, what?
• 29:01
  Speaker 5: No more than what?
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: Use a hard R.
• 29:03
  Speaker 5: A woman. Oh! Poor Nick. I don't understand this. A,
• 29:12
  Speaker 5: an infant, a brute, or a wild beast. Honestly, completely
• 29:17
  Speaker 5: absent of reason.
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: My real guess was going to be a child.
• 29:21
  Speaker 5: Okay. Okay. B, a sleepwalker acting with no conscious awareness
• 29:27
  Speaker 5: of their surroundings. Interesting. Interesting. C, a person acting entirely
• 29:31
  Speaker 5: on instinct with no deliberate deliberation whatsoever. Or D, an automation,
• 29:38
  Speaker 5: executing behavior with no capacity for self-direction.
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: This is what year?
• 29:43
  Speaker 5: Before what year? 1724.
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: It's A. Okay. Infant. No, brute. Brute. Oh, yeah. The
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: word brute in there.
• 29:51
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. That's my nail in the coffin on that.
• 29:54
  Speaker 2: It is A. Wow.
• 29:56
  Speaker 5: Rex V. Arnold, 1724, sometimes called the wild beast test.
• 30:00
  Speaker 2: Okay. Wild beast, brute, all that stuff. Yeah, yeah.
• 30:05
  Speaker 5: The guy had shot a lord who he believed had
• 30:08
  Speaker 5: sent imps into his body.
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah. There we go. Some people need shooting.
• 30:13
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 30:13
  Speaker 3: Prove him wrong.
• 30:15
  Speaker 2: Also, not shedding any tears over a fucking lord. Power
• 30:18
  Speaker 2: to the people. Or an imp controller. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
• 30:23
  Speaker 5: Yeah. Power to the imps. Okay. Oh, Jesus Christ.
• 30:29
  Speaker 6: All right. I hate these.
• 30:29
  Speaker 5: Mm-hmm. Competency to stand trial and the insanity defense are
• 30:36
  Speaker 5: completely separate legal concepts that are routinely confused. I was
• 30:40
  Speaker 5: actually just talking to a colleague about this the other day.
• 30:43
  Speaker 5: What is the fundamental distinction?
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: Between competency to stand trial and the insanity defense.
• 30:50
  Speaker 5: Yes.
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: I'll take options.
• 30:51
  Speaker 5: Okay. A, competency applies only in capital cases. The insanity
• 30:57
  Speaker 5: defense applies to all felonies. B, competency is raised by
• 31:02
  Speaker 5: the prosecution. The insanity defense is raised by the defense. C,
• 31:08
  Speaker 5: competency requires a psychosis diagnosis. The insanity defense accepts any
• 31:14
  Speaker 5: mental health disease or defect. Or D, competency refers to
• 31:19
  Speaker 5: the defendant's current mental state. Can they understand the proceedings
• 31:25
  Speaker 5: and assist with their attorney right now? while the insanity
• 31:29
  Speaker 5: defense refers to their mental state at the time the
• 31:32
  Speaker 5: crime was committed. Give me D.
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's got to be D.
• 31:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll give you the D. Yeah.
• 31:36
  Speaker 5: Correct.
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: Hooray!
• 31:37
  Speaker 5: Hey!
• 31:38
  Speaker 2: Look at us. We're really good at this. I'm also
• 31:41
  Speaker 2: very comfortable with you replacing the trivia. I'd be fine, too,
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: because I like Disney songs.
• 31:46
  Speaker 5: Yeah, well, that's not happening.
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: There was much less singing in this one.
• 31:48
  Speaker 5: That's not happening.
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: I'm uncomfortable with it. My sisters love Triangle. Hey, Pod
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: Therapy guys and gal. My sister's love triangle has the
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: sweetest smile. Smile, smile, smile. Hi, Pod Therapy guys and gal.
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: My wife and I are in a tricky situation. We're
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: temporarily in a weird living situation. We're living in my
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: childhood home and waiting to close on a house. So
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: my sister and kids have moved in. My sister is
• 32:19
  Speaker 2: currently involved with two different guys. My brother-in-law is the
• 32:23
  Speaker 2: father of one of her kids and is someone who
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: we've grown pretty close to as he's practically family.
• 32:29
  Speaker 5: They have a.
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: Toxic on and off again relationship for several years and
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: are currently living apart. The new guy is someone she
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: met at work a few years ago. And while my
• 32:39
  Speaker 2: wife does not like him, I think he seems okay,
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: but a bit immature and naive. From what we know,
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: they've been living together for a while. But during family functions,
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: she brings our brother-in-law. My brother-in-law thinks she broke it
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: off with the other guy a long time ago. When
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: I asked my sister about this, she swears she and
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: my brother-in-law are not together and that she tells him this,
• 33:04
  Speaker 2: but he will not accept it. However, my brother-in-law tells
• 33:07
  Speaker 2: my wife that they are working things out, but she
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: doesn't make time for him. And every time he tries
• 33:14
  Speaker 2: to end the relationship, she begs him to stay. We
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: usually do our best just to stay out of it,
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: but this has become significantly more difficult and uncomfortable now
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: that we're all under the same roof. Yesterday, my sister
• 33:27
  Speaker 2: went over to my brother-in-law's house. They both ended up
• 33:30
  Speaker 2: coming back here and staying the night. This morning, once
• 33:34
  Speaker 2: my sister thought he was gone, she started arguing with
• 33:38
  Speaker 2: the new guy over speakerphone in the restroom about her
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: whereabouts yesterday. And my wife could hear the whole thing. Then...
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: our brother-in-law got back and also could hear the whole thing.
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: We had to awkwardly walk past each other in the
• 33:54
  Speaker 2: hall while this was happening and pretty much acknowledge that
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: we are all aware of what's going on. We care
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: about our brother-in-law a lot, and I'm worried he's going
• 34:03
  Speaker 2: to feel hurt that we've had at least some knowledge
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: that she's been lying. I obviously want to protect my sister,
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: but our brother-in-law is especially close to my wife, and
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: will often confide in her about their relationship issues as
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: well as his suspicions of cheating. It's clear that they
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: are not healthy together. We want to stay out of it,
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: but we also don't want to lie to him if
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: he asks about it. While I feel terrible being around
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: both of these guys knowing she is lying to them,
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: she's my sister, and I really don't want to get involved.
• 34:35
  Speaker 2: I also don't know if I'd be able to lie
• 34:38
  Speaker 2: if asked directly. And my wife will definitely not lie
• 34:42
  Speaker 2: if asked because of her friendship with our brother-in-law. So
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: how can we keep ourselves separated from the drama while
• 34:49
  Speaker 2: under the same roof? What should we do if we're
• 34:53
  Speaker 2: confronted by either of these guys? Any thoughts or opinions
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: would be so helpful. From Anonymous, pronouns are she and her.
• 35:01
  Speaker 7: Oof.
• 35:05
  Speaker 5: Why move?
• 35:06
  Speaker 3: Why are they living together again? When does your house close?
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: Waiting for a new house.
• 35:10
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 35:10
  Speaker 2: So Ryder, pronouns she and her, and Ryder's wife are
• 35:14
  Speaker 2: living in childhood home. There's got to be somewhere else
• 35:17
  Speaker 2: you can crash. Yeah, right?
• 35:18
  Speaker 5: There's got to be.
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: Somebody's got a sofa. I think sister– it's this Ryder's sister.
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah. But they're close with the bride. Got a love
• 35:26
  Speaker 2: triangle going on. And so they are in the middle
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: of it all. Holy shit.
• 35:31
  Speaker 6: I mean, I guess I can speak a little– that
• 35:35
  Speaker 6: from personal experience about the feeling of being in the
• 35:39
  Speaker 6: middle and not wanting to, or feeling like, uh, we
• 35:43
  Speaker 6: kept a secret from someone we're close to and, um,
• 35:48
  Speaker 6: situations like that can be really complicated.
• 35:50
  Speaker 3: And, uh, there, there was something like that in our family.
• 35:53
  Speaker 6: I absolutely not getting into details, but I had to,
• 35:56
  Speaker 6: my brother told me something he wanted to keep from,
• 35:59
  Speaker 6: you know, our parents and, um, And it was like
• 36:02
  Speaker 6: a really big deal. And so I felt very conflicted
• 36:06
  Speaker 6: at the time.
• 36:06
  Speaker 3: I'm like, this is going to hurt my parents.
• 36:09
  Speaker 6: When they find out, they're going to know I knew,
• 36:12
  Speaker 6: but I'm going to hurt my sibling because I want
• 36:14
  Speaker 6: to respect their ability to have their privacy. And they
• 36:19
  Speaker 6: didn't intend on telling me originally.
• 36:20
  Speaker 3: It was just like a mess.
• 36:22
  Speaker 6: And I guess eventually I kept the secret. And eventually
• 36:26
  Speaker 6: when our parent found out, it was really hard.
• 36:29
  Speaker 3: They were very hurt.
• 36:30
  Speaker 6: Like You can't control other people's feelings. You kind of
• 36:34
  Speaker 6: have to choose your evil or whatever that's called.
• 36:38
  Speaker 3: Pick your battle. Pick your poison. That's it.
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 36:41
  Speaker 6: Pick your poison there because there's no winning in that scenario.
• 36:46
  Speaker 3: Sophie?
• 36:46
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: Oh.
• 36:47
  Speaker 5: Sophie's choice.
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: Sophie's choice.
• 36:48
  Speaker 5: Oh, okay.
• 36:49
  Speaker 3: She has to choose. So you just, yeah, you kind
• 36:53
  Speaker 3: of have to choose.
• 36:54
  Speaker 6: Are you going to, what you want to do, but
• 36:57
  Speaker 6: there's going to be consequences either way, whether you feel
• 36:59
  Speaker 6: like you're betraying your sister or, You're betraying your brother-in-law.
• 37:03
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: How do y'all feel about the writer's partner, which I
• 37:09
  Speaker 2: think is a female-female relationship? How do we feel about
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: the writer's partner consoling the brother-in-law? I feel like that
• 37:20
  Speaker 2: immediately enmeshes you. If your sister's former husband is coming
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: to you still, For like relationship advice and to confide
• 37:29
  Speaker 2: in you about what's going on if you're allowing that
• 37:32
  Speaker 2: like you're inherently creating a conflict like obviously now anything
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: your sister does or doesn't do you know way too
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: much about you're involved and you're like consoling her ex
• 37:42
  Speaker 2: because you get along with him and he's a nice
• 37:43
  Speaker 2: guy to you but like. Maybe you shouldn't have any
• 37:45
  Speaker 2: more contact with them anymore. Yeah.
• 37:47
  Speaker 5: We also don't know the backstory there either because like it's.
• 37:50
  Speaker 3: Possible they– You can be really close with in-laws.
• 37:52
  Speaker 5: Yeah. They could have known each other before the two
• 37:54
  Speaker 5: even got together.
• 37:55
  Speaker 2: But isn't there a rule that like once they're your ex,
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: it's like, all right. You know, like the family shouldn't
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: still have like a close relationship with.
• 38:02
  Speaker 5: The ex, right?
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: This has always been a curious thing to me.
• 38:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 38:06
  Speaker 3: Because when you– are, I'm using the term marry, but
• 38:09
  Speaker 3: you don't have to legally be married.
• 38:11
  Speaker 6: But like when you're married and in that like committed
• 38:13
  Speaker 6: relationship with someone, you have a child, you do become
• 38:16
  Speaker 6: family with their, their other family members.
• 38:18
  Speaker 3: That's a hard, uh, break off to have there. And
• 38:22
  Speaker 3: so some more than others, sometimes you're just like, Oh,
• 38:25
  Speaker 3: well that's their ex.
• 38:25
  Speaker 4: Fine.
• 38:26
  Speaker 6: But I think sometimes they really feel like family to you.
• 38:28
  Speaker 6: And that's, a hard, you know.
• 38:30
  Speaker 2: But the sister is family.
• 38:32
  Speaker 3: But if you have a shitty family.
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: Jim, if you and your wife got divorced tomorrow, you've
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: been married since she was 14. If you guys got divorced,
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: her parents, I assume, gifted her to you, I think
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: is the terminology. Her and a pig.
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: It was legal. In our state. In the tribe that
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: we lived in. In the state of inebriation that you
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: had her in. Yeah, sure. It was legal. Small town Utah.
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: But yeah, if you guys got divorced tomorrow, you have
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: kids and everything.
• 39:04
  Speaker 2: Right. Your families are intertwined.
• 39:07
  Speaker 4: You are in that.
• 39:08
  Speaker 1: You have relationships with her family. She has relationships with
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: your family.
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: I feel like there should– I get that. I'm with
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: you on that. I think we all have spouses who
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: have siblings and stuff. As soon as you go past
• 39:18
  Speaker 2: a certain timeline, honestly, you're just going to be– But
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: there should be a boundary. Like I agree with that.
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: If like my sister has a husband and like I
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: like him just fine. And like if they divorced, I
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: think I would be inclined to be like, well, I
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: still want to be cool with this guy because we
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: have a nephew and like I want to be friendly
• 39:34
  Speaker 2: with him. That's great. But if he were coming to
• 39:36
  Speaker 2: me and being like, hey, man, you're a therapist. Like
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: can I just talk to you about what I'm going
• 39:40
  Speaker 2: through with your sister? and dealing with her, because you
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: know her. You get some of what I'm saying. That's
• 39:45
  Speaker 2: a little weird. That's what's happening, though. That's where I'd
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: be like, hey, man, I'm here to babysit your kid.
• 39:51
  Speaker 3: I don't feel like that's what's happening in this.
• 39:53
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I didn't get that sense of it.
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: That is explicitly what the writer said. Brother-in-law goes to
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: my spouse to seek comfort.
• 40:01
  Speaker 3: There's a caveat there you're leaving out.
• 40:02
  Speaker 6: What am I leaving out? The brother-in-law is saying, hey,
• 40:06
  Speaker 6: we're still together. We're not broken up. We're trying.
• 40:08
  Speaker 2: And the.
• 40:10
  Speaker 2: But if your sister says we're not together And like
• 40:14
  Speaker 2: he's misinformed.
• 40:15
  Speaker 6: Then she needs to clear it up because he's like
• 40:17
  Speaker 6: Yeah we're.
• 40:17
  Speaker 2: Together Hey sis you got some shit in your.
• 40:20
  Speaker 6: House You need to clean up Now if they really
• 40:22
  Speaker 6: were broken up and the brother-in-law is trying to come like.
• 40:24
  Speaker 7: We're broken up but I want your help That's not
• 40:27
  Speaker 7: on you That's on sis Like we've had people write
• 40:31
  Speaker 7: in before and say like Oh my ex is showing
• 40:34
  Speaker 7: up At my family reunions and things like that.
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: And like That's a line. That's a weird line to cross.
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: But like in those scenarios, like, oh, I'm friends with
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: my ex's parents. They invite me to things. We continue
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: having some kind of relationship. Like sometimes that line gets crossed.
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: See, this is, yeah, I don't know.
• 40:56
  Speaker 5: I have, I've been in this situation, not this situation,
• 41:00
  Speaker 5: but like I have. Nick also did it.
• 41:02
  Speaker 6: I was going to say that's a brother and father.
• 41:05
  Speaker 2: Nick was the person on the phone.
• 41:07
  Speaker 5: I've had axes and I, it is a weird situation
• 41:13
  Speaker 5: where it's like, I don't want anything to do with
• 41:16
  Speaker 5: this person. Right. But my family still communicates with this person. Yes.
• 41:21
  Speaker 5: And like, but my perspective on that is, although I
• 41:25
  Speaker 5: may feel hurt about that situation, I will never tell
• 41:29
  Speaker 5: somebody else that they can't have contact with another person.
• 41:33
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 41:33
  Speaker 5: That's none of my fucking business. Thank you.
• 41:35
  Speaker 3: That's their own relationship.
• 41:36
  Speaker 5: Yeah. If, if you guys want to talk and you
• 41:38
  Speaker 5: want to hang out, Go for it. Absolutely. I may
• 41:42
  Speaker 5: have feelings about it, but that's my own shit. I
• 41:44
  Speaker 5: got to work through that.
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: If you bring my ex to Christmas, then I'll deal
• 41:49
  Speaker 1: with it.
• 41:50
  Speaker 5: But now that collides with my world.
• 41:52
  Speaker 6: Exactly.
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: That's what I'm saying.
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: Then I will deal with it because now I'm being
• 41:57
  Speaker 1: forced to deal with it.
• 41:58
  Speaker 2: So I have a story from college that I think
• 42:00
  Speaker 2: aligns a little bit with this. My roommate had a
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: long-term girlfriend. And she would come over to our dorm
• 42:05
  Speaker 2: room and stuff. We were all friends with her. We
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: knew her really good. They didn't work out. They broke up.
• 42:08
  Speaker 5: Okay, cool.
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: So then he starts kind of dating around or whatever.
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: And we're just his friends. So, you know, we're meeting
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: new girls as he meets them. No big deal. Well,
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: then he like hooks up again with his ex and
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: like she's in the house and we all like the
• 42:21
  Speaker 2: other roommates are like, oh, hey, you know, how are you?
• 42:23
  Speaker 2: And she's like, oh, I'm really good. You know, we're
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: back together again. You're like. okay like you know but
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: you're not sure like if that's the real truth you're
• 42:29
  Speaker 2: just like whatever you're at our house but she's like
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: no we worked it all out like we're together now
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: and you're like okay but like there's other girls in
• 42:35
  Speaker 2: the ecosystem that we are aware of and so we're
• 42:38
  Speaker 2: trying to like be very careful and what we do
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: and say because we don't know what the current status
• 42:43
  Speaker 2: is we're waiting for orders you don't know yeah.
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: We're waiting for the guy to tell us because he's
• 42:48
  Speaker 1: our friend like hey what are we doing here I
• 42:50
  Speaker 1: think this is honestly less bro code and more keeping
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: peace in the house.
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 42:55
  Speaker 5: That's fair.
• 42:55
  Speaker 2: For roommate, I don't know what the landmines are here.
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: I'm not trying to start any trouble.
• 43:00
  Speaker 5: I don't give a shit about this guy. I just
• 43:02
  Speaker 5: want peace in the house.
• 43:04
  Speaker 3: I have to live here.
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: I will go with bro code when it's bro code.
• 43:07
  Speaker 1: This don't sound like bro code. This is peace of mind.
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: I just want the dishes to not be broken.
• 43:13
  Speaker 2: Okay, so how do we apply that strategy here for
• 43:16
  Speaker 2: the writer where they're saying like, look, we have to
• 43:18
  Speaker 2: share this space. Brother-in-law doesn't have to live here. Sister
• 43:21
  Speaker 2: brought brother-in-law here. So like that's on sister. She got
• 43:25
  Speaker 2: caught talking on the phone. Also on sister. Now there's
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: tension because brother-in-law confides in us and now has realized
• 43:33
  Speaker 2: we know a lot. And we weren't at liberty to say.
• 43:36
  Speaker 2: I would have moved last night. Jacob, oh boy. Midnight.
• 43:42
  Speaker 5: Just leave.
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: The dead of night. Wait until a moonless night.
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: Pack your shit.
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: Burn everything. Get out.
• 43:52
  Speaker 3: I want no evidence.
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: Go get you some of those night vision goggles.
• 43:55
  Speaker 3: I was going to say the ring camera is going
• 43:57
  Speaker 3: to pick you up.
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: Until you're able to cut the power to the house,
• 44:01
  Speaker 1: cut the phone line.
• 44:02
  Speaker 2: Okay. There's no good way.
• 44:05
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 44:05
  Speaker 6: But now it's all blown up because the brother-in-law has heard.
• 44:09
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 44:09
  Speaker 6: Like, so everything kind of is out in the open now.
• 44:12
  Speaker 6: So it's like, What's done is done. There's no more
• 44:15
  Speaker 6: secret keeping. I feel like it's more, they got to
• 44:17
  Speaker 6: figure that out.
• 44:18
  Speaker 2: So now what's going to be super easy and comfortable.
• 44:21
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 44:22
  Speaker 6: But how do we keep ourselves separated from the drama
• 44:25
  Speaker 6: while we're under the same roof? Well, if you want
• 44:27
  Speaker 6: to separate from the drama, then you do have to
• 44:29
  Speaker 6: kind of do what Jim said and back off.
• 44:30
  Speaker 5: Yeah. My take on this is I'm not lying for anybody.
• 44:34
  Speaker 3: Correct.
• 44:35
  Speaker 5: I get there is family loyalty.
• 44:38
  Speaker 3: I'm not going to stress myself out.
• 44:41
  Speaker 5: I'm not in the mob. I'm not... You don't pay
• 44:44
  Speaker 5: me enough to keep your secret.
• 44:46
  Speaker 2: And if I am, I wouldn't fucking tell you about it.
• 44:48
  Speaker 2: That's right. First rule of the mob.
• 44:51
  Speaker 5: Even with just family loyalty. I know some families are
• 44:55
  Speaker 5: like that. Family above everybody else. Yes, obviously, I care
• 45:01
  Speaker 5: more about my sister than most... other people in the world.
• 45:05
  Speaker 5: I don't know, dude, I like her a lot. I,
• 45:07
  Speaker 5: but also it's not like, I'm not going to lie.
• 45:10
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 45:11
  Speaker 5: I'm, I'll stay silent. Correct.
• 45:13
  Speaker 2: You might choose not to participate. Yeah. So if brother-in-law
• 45:19
  Speaker 2: were to come to you and was like, okay, man,
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: like what's really going on? Like now she's lying to
• 45:23
  Speaker 2: me about who she's on the phone with. Oh, I'm
• 45:25
  Speaker 2: not at that point. We're like, Hey man, I'm not
• 45:27
  Speaker 2: at all. Well, you know more than you're telling me.
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: You're right. What do I know? Right? Like I might,
• 45:33
  Speaker 2: I might not. Who knows?
• 45:35
  Speaker 4: I don't know.
• 45:36
  Speaker 2: I'll tell you what I don't know. That's anything. I
• 45:38
  Speaker 2: don't know anything about what's going on. I think earlier
• 45:41
  Speaker 2: I was saying there should be some boundary setting with
• 45:44
  Speaker 2: brother-in-law to say, I don't know that it's my place
• 45:46
  Speaker 2: to console you about what the terms of your relationship
• 45:49
  Speaker 2: to my sibling are. I see what you mean. Okay.
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: So weird position. So you were, you were, you, your example.
• 45:55
  Speaker 1: Earlier was definitely like you as a therapist coming to
• 45:58
  Speaker 1: you and wanting kind of like more professional opinion.
• 46:01
  Speaker 2: I would select not to get involved with my brother-in-law
• 46:05
  Speaker 2: because I don't want to put myself in that weird position.
• 46:08
  Speaker 2: I would too. I think I would as well.
• 46:11
  Speaker 1: I think that he's, I, I, I'm saying, I see
• 46:14
  Speaker 1: what you were, what you meant by your example earlier.
• 46:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 46:18
  Speaker 6: I don't know.
• 46:18
  Speaker 1: It's, just unwise just comforting someone yeah saying like you.
• 46:24
  Speaker 2: Know hey this is this is tough i'm sorry you're
• 46:26
  Speaker 2: going through yeah this is a.
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: Really tough scenario this tough situation that you guys are
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: in man that sucks yeah like that kind of thing
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: is one thing yeah but like talking through details talking
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: through like here's like your relationship with my family and
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: like all of that that's I'd.
• 46:43
  Speaker 2: Stay out of that. Does anybody confront sister and say... Oh,
• 46:47
  Speaker 2: I think... We do. Okay, so we say maybe there's
• 46:50
  Speaker 2: some house rules. Clean your shit up. I'm getting stuck
• 46:54
  Speaker 2: in this now. This is your problem, sis. Fix your shit.
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: Handle your business. Because if I have to handle it,
• 47:03
  Speaker 2: I'm going to be pissed about it. And you're going
• 47:05
  Speaker 2: to be pissed about it. And everybody's going to be
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: pissed about it. So please don't make me do it.
• 47:09
  Speaker 2: Make sure you handle this. To the degree that I
• 47:12
  Speaker 2: don't have to. Okay. So there is a direct conversation,
• 47:15
  Speaker 2: at least with sister. I think so. Say, look, obviously
• 47:18
  Speaker 2: all of your cats have gotten out of the bag here.
• 47:20
  Speaker 2: The solution to this now reality, like before I was
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: staying out of it, it is what it is. The
• 47:25
  Speaker 2: solution is not get me involved in this.
• 47:27
  Speaker 5: No.
• 47:28
  Speaker 2: My spouse and I are going to sit over here.
• 47:31
  Speaker 2: You need to sort your shit out. And then if
• 47:32
  Speaker 2: brother-in-law comes to us and goes, hey, she's not telling
• 47:34
  Speaker 2: me the truth now. Can you– no, I'm not involved. Yeah, yeah.
• 47:37
  Speaker 2: And I think you can tell sis that too. Yeah.
• 47:39
  Speaker 2: Like I'm going to stay out of it. I'm out.
• 47:41
  Speaker 2: This is between you three now.
• 47:43
  Speaker 1: If you have– I'm staying out of it. You're my
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: sister and I love you. If there is something that
• 47:48
  Speaker 1: you need from me, then that's one thing. But if
• 47:52
  Speaker 1: you just want me to make this transition with your ex,
• 47:55
  Speaker 1: your current whoever they are, if you're just looking for
• 47:58
  Speaker 1: me to take care of that for you, that's not
• 48:02
  Speaker 1: what this relationship is going to be.
• 48:03
  Speaker 2: Did I miss this in the letter? Sister is not
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: asking writer or writer's spouse to lie. That hasn't been
• 48:11
  Speaker 2: part of it.
• 48:11
  Speaker 3: That seems ambiguous, yeah.
• 48:13
  Speaker 2: But sister is being super unclear about what the hell
• 48:16
  Speaker 2: is going on with brother-in-law. Because whenever writer is like, oh,
• 48:20
  Speaker 2: you're bringing brother-in-law around family stuff. Sister is like, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 48:23
  Speaker 2: We're not like a thing at all. And it's like–
• 48:25
  Speaker 2: then brother-in-law is like, no, we're totally a thing. We're
• 48:27
  Speaker 2: trying to get– she begs me not to leave. Right.
• 48:29
  Speaker 2: And then you go back to sister and you're like, hey,
• 48:30
  Speaker 2: it sounds like you guys are together. No, no, no.
• 48:31
  Speaker 2: We're not together at all. He stayed the night last night.
• 48:34
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 48:34
  Speaker 5: No, no, no.
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: We're not together at all. And it's like– Yeah.
• 48:36
  Speaker 5: Okay.
• 48:36
  Speaker 2: So then what the fuck is going on?
• 48:38
  Speaker 5: Oh, yeah.
• 48:38
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 48:39
  Speaker 2: No, that's why I say like somebody got to talk
• 48:41
  Speaker 2: to sis too. Yeah. Yeah.
• 48:42
  Speaker 3: In some ways.
• 48:43
  Speaker 6: I almost like hearing you played out like that. I
• 48:45
  Speaker 6: could see her being like, no, we're not together, but
• 48:47
  Speaker 6: I did beg him to stay. And I do like,
• 48:49
  Speaker 6: you know, fucking him every once in a while, but like, no,
• 48:51
  Speaker 6: that doesn't mean we're together, but he's like, those sound
• 48:53
  Speaker 6: like we're together. Like, it sounds very much like, even
• 48:56
  Speaker 6: if she's not saying we're together.
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: Are you leading him on? Like what's going on? And like, again,
• 49:01
  Speaker 2: it doesn't have to be my business.
• 49:02
  Speaker 5: Like I'm not even asking those questions.
• 49:04
  Speaker 2: Nope.
• 49:05
  Speaker 5: Okay. Cause I don't want to get any further.
• 49:07
  Speaker 2: Good point. I don't need more information.
• 49:10
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 49:10
  Speaker 5: Do that, Ryder. I'd be all.
• 49:12
  Speaker 2: Up in that shit. I'm sorry. I take all my
• 49:14
  Speaker 2: points back.
• 49:15
  Speaker 3: My toxic trait is I would say all those things.
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: When he pops the popcorn.
• 49:19
  Speaker 2: We're going to talk this shit out.
• 49:20
  Speaker 6: We're all going to sit down together and we're going
• 49:22
  Speaker 6: to have a little intervention. We're all going to figure
• 49:24
  Speaker 6: it out out in the open.
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: No, my talk with this is like, here's the shit
• 49:28
  Speaker 1: that I'm having to deal with out of your world
• 49:30
  Speaker 1: right now.
• 49:31
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: Fix this so I don't have to deal with your
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: spillover shit anymore or we're going to have an issue.
• 49:37
  Speaker 2: I don't care who you end up with.
• 49:38
  Speaker 6: I also have that feeling, but I want to have
• 49:40
  Speaker 6: the come to Jesus altogether and then have that.
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: Well, I want to watch that on TV, but I
• 49:46
  Speaker 2: don't want to live it.
• 49:47
  Speaker 1: I think 10, 15.
• 49:47
  Speaker 2: Years ago I might have thought that I wanted to
• 49:49
  Speaker 2: have the come to Jesus.
• 49:50
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 49:50
  Speaker 2: But now I just don't want to. You just don't
• 49:52
  Speaker 2: want the drama? I think I might just be getting
• 49:54
  Speaker 2: older and not want the drama.
• 49:55
  Speaker 3: Old, crotchety brisket man.
• 49:56
  Speaker 5: Mm-hmm. Yeah. I just want to make my brisket.
• 49:58
  Speaker 3: Do you know the brisket man?
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: Do you know the brisket man?
• 50:01
  Speaker 3: The brisket man?
• 50:04
  Speaker 2: The brisket man. The brisket man?
• 50:06
  Speaker 3: Yes, I know the brisket man.
• 50:09
  Speaker 2: No, that's the muffin man. She's married to the brisket man.
• 50:11
  Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.
• 50:12
  Speaker 2: Ryder, this is a fascinating story.
• 50:14
  Speaker 3: I love it.
• 50:15
  Speaker 6: Put cameras up inside your house so he can watch.
• 50:18
  Speaker 2: We love the tea. I really hope that your new
• 50:20
  Speaker 2: house thing works out.
• 50:22
  Speaker 1: This sounds like it's going to be the new installment
• 50:24
  Speaker 1: of that terrible neighbor show on Netflix.
• 50:26
  Speaker 2: Oh, my gosh.
• 50:28
  Speaker 3: That show is insane.
• 50:30
  Speaker 2: It's painful.
• 50:31
  Speaker 3: You have to watch that.
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: Only if you want to be sad about life and humanity.
• 50:38
  Speaker 3: No, it hit way too close to home for a story.
• 50:40
  Speaker 5: I know.
• 50:41
  Speaker 3: When I was watching one of those, I was like.
• 50:42
  Speaker 1: Oh, my God.
• 50:42
  Speaker 2: I can't watch scary things.
• 50:44
  Speaker 3: It's not scary.
• 50:45
  Speaker 2: It's true. That's the problem.
• 50:46
  Speaker 3: It's not scary.
• 50:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Like, one of the ones– spoiler, I think, for
• 50:51
  Speaker 2: the first one.
• 50:53
  Speaker 1: It's literally about a woman who just harasses a couple
• 50:55
  Speaker 1: for years and years and years, lives across the street
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: from them, and harasses them in, like– I don't know
• 51:01
  Speaker 1: how else to say this on a pod therapy show,
• 51:03
  Speaker 1: but in an insane way.
• 51:05
  Speaker 2: Okay. Okay.
• 51:06
  Speaker 1: Like she batshit crazy ass, like bug nutty, all of
• 51:10
  Speaker 1: the weird things that like all of it.
• 51:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 51:13
  Speaker 1: She's like, as their small children are playing outside, she
• 51:17
  Speaker 1: is on the riding mower across the street in her yard.
• 51:22
  Speaker 1: And she's 180, 200 pounds. If she's a, if she's
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: a pound. And 45, 50 years old. She is out
• 51:29
  Speaker 1: on her lawnmower fully topless.
• 51:32
  Speaker 5: Oh. Yeah.
• 51:33
  Speaker 2: Because.
• 51:34
  Speaker 5: On a riding lawnmower.
• 51:35
  Speaker 2: On a riding lawnmower. Can I guess what state she
• 51:38
  Speaker 2: lives in?
• 51:39
  Speaker 3: Yes. I know what state it is.
• 51:40
  Speaker 5: I'm pretty sure.
• 51:41
  Speaker 2: I'm going to nominate Florida.
• 51:43
  Speaker 3: Not Florida.
• 51:43
  Speaker 5: Oh.
• 51:44
  Speaker 3: I think it's Ohio.
• 51:45
  Speaker 6: Hmm.
• 51:45
  Speaker 1: Hmm.
• 51:46
  Speaker 3: I could be wrong.
• 51:46
  Speaker 1: Whatever it was, it was like the nipples being exposed
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: weren't arrestable or something like that.
• 51:53
  Speaker 5: And she's on her property.
• 51:54
  Speaker 1: And she was on her property just because your kids
• 51:56
  Speaker 1: can see her and she's in the open, all of this.
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: And she would do all of these types of things.
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: And one day she just walked across the street and
• 52:04
  Speaker 2: shot both of them.
• 52:06
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm sorry. The neighbor one was not what I
• 52:08
  Speaker 3: was referring to.
• 52:08
  Speaker 2: I didn't see that shit coming. The nipples thing really
• 52:10
  Speaker 2: threw me off, man. I really thought this was going
• 52:13
  Speaker 2: a different direction. No, it's horrendous.
• 52:16
  Speaker 6: The one you actually should watch that's not as intense,
• 52:18
  Speaker 6: the neighbor one is intense. And I had a client
• 52:20
  Speaker 6: who had been through some shit and started watching that.
• 52:22
  Speaker 3: She's like, I had to stop. I was like, so
• 52:24
  Speaker 3: don't watch that.
• 52:24
  Speaker 5: If you have.
• 52:25
  Speaker 6: You said it wasn't scary. But no, the one that's
• 52:28
  Speaker 6: not scary that is just like so uncomfortable, makes your
• 52:31
  Speaker 6: skin crawl is the worst roommate ever. The roommate one.
• 52:35
  Speaker 6: Because most of the time, not all of them, but
• 52:37
  Speaker 6: like people aren't dying. They're just torturing you.
• 52:40
  Speaker 2: Gotcha.
• 52:40
  Speaker 3: It is crazy. And people can't move because they can't
• 52:42
  Speaker 3: afford to.
• 52:43
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 52:43
  Speaker 3: It's so sad.
• 52:44
  Speaker 2: The economy is always the real bad guy.
• 52:45
  Speaker 3: The roommate one reminded me of this one.
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: I have a friend who is just economic reasons living
• 52:51
  Speaker 1: with their ex currently until the lease is up.
• 52:54
  Speaker 2: Yep. Like, they're just forced roommates. Like, ugh.
• 53:00
  Speaker 5: No fun.
• 53:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 53:01
  Speaker 3: No fun at all.
• 53:02
  Speaker 6: No. Yeah.
• 53:03
  Speaker 5: Anyway.
• 53:03
  Speaker 2: And, you know, it's same as a lot of our things.
• 53:06
  Speaker 2: You know, there's not a good answer. No. Yeah.
• 53:08
  Speaker 6: Nope.
• 53:08
  Speaker 2: Well, and I think that the big answer that we
• 53:10
  Speaker 2: are all coalescing around is the need for, like, immediate
• 53:15
  Speaker 2: boundary setting because this is all exploded. And that might
• 53:18
  Speaker 2: mean brother-in-law doesn't get to have a confidant in you
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: guys anymore because this is all exploded.
• 53:24
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 53:24
  Speaker 2: He's not necessarily to blame, but you are living in
• 53:27
  Speaker 2: an ecosystem that unfortunately involves him and your sister and
• 53:31
  Speaker 2: the other guy. And at some point, you have to
• 53:33
  Speaker 2: protect your own sanity. And that's all fair to explain
• 53:35
  Speaker 2: to him, by the way, too. Yeah, exactly.
• 53:37
  Speaker 1: Like, hey, I'd love to be there for you. And
• 53:38
  Speaker 1: if you were just my buddy at the bar, I
• 53:40
  Speaker 1: would be there for you. But this is involving my sister,
• 53:43
  Speaker 1: my family. I'm in a bad spot here.
• 53:46
  Speaker 2: I don't have the answers you're looking for. You can't
• 53:47
  Speaker 2: put me in. I can't be in the middle of this.
• 53:49
  Speaker 5: Part of this, he has to understand to some degree
• 53:52
  Speaker 5: that when you are talking to the sibling of the
• 53:56
  Speaker 5: person that you are in a love triangle with.
• 53:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah, right.
• 54:00
  Speaker 5: You're not getting a fair, unbalanced opinion.
• 54:03
  Speaker 2: Correct. Yeah, yeah. One way or the other.
• 54:05
  Speaker 6: Yeah, either way.
• 54:05
  Speaker 2: Even if they're like, I hate my sibling.
• 54:07
  Speaker 5: Either way.
• 54:08
  Speaker 2: You know, I just want you to hate her too
• 54:09
  Speaker 2: or let's vent together.
• 54:10
  Speaker 1: Even if they are estranged and haven't seen each other
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: in 30 years, you're still going to have fucking opinions
• 54:16
  Speaker 1: about it. Yeah.
• 54:17
  Speaker 6: My brother tried to say that once when he was
• 54:19
  Speaker 6: going through a breakup and I was like, I think
• 54:20
  Speaker 6: both of y'all are probably lying to me at different
• 54:22
  Speaker 6: points and he was so offended by that.
• 54:24
  Speaker 3: I was like, Shut up.
• 54:25
  Speaker 6: Stop. You're definitely making up your own version.
• 54:29
  Speaker 2: In our entire lives. He's like, you don't believe me?
• 54:31
  Speaker 2: I'm like, no, I don't.
• 54:33
  Speaker 1: If I told my brother something, I have one sibling.
• 54:35
  Speaker 1: If I told my brother something like that, he would
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: just be like, in our entire lives, you've never told
• 54:41
  Speaker 1: me a story where every detail was true.
• 54:43
  Speaker 3: Exactly.
• 54:44
  Speaker 2: It's just never happened.
• 54:45
  Speaker 6: Exactly.
• 54:46
  Speaker 2: And also might not be humanly possible.
• 54:47
  Speaker 5: Yeah, you're not even capable of it.
• 54:48
  Speaker 3: You're not capable of it. Yeah, it just pissed me off.
• 54:51
  Speaker 2: And also, I'm not here to adjudicate. I am just
• 54:53
  Speaker 2: a human who lives in this building.
• 54:55
  Speaker 6: Yes.
• 54:55
  Speaker 2: That is it. And I know all of you, and
• 54:58
  Speaker 2: I like you. I like my brother-in-law. I like you.
• 55:00
  Speaker 2: You're my sibling. And boy, do I wish I wasn't
• 55:02
  Speaker 2: in this building right now.
• 55:03
  Speaker 6: That's it.
• 55:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's all. You get to figure out.
• 55:05
  Speaker 3: I don't want to be here.
• 55:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you get to figure it out.
• 55:07
  Speaker 1: I would either really set boundaries with everybody and just
• 55:10
  Speaker 1: tell them, you can't have me in the middle of this,
• 55:14
  Speaker 1: or honestly move.
• 55:15
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 55:16
  Speaker 2: Like, honestly, I would just start couch surfing with us.
• 55:18
  Speaker 2: That's it.
• 55:19
  Speaker 5: Yeah. Yeah.
• 55:20
  Speaker 2: But at a minimum, I do think that the boundary
• 55:22
  Speaker 2: with your spouse to pull your spouse aside and say, Hey, look,
• 55:25
  Speaker 2: I'm going to ask us to have a united policy here,
• 55:27
  Speaker 2: which is we're not going to get involved in this.
• 55:29
  Speaker 2: We out. Yeah, we're not going to console my sister
• 55:31
  Speaker 2: or get involved in her business. We're not going to
• 55:33
  Speaker 2: interview her to figure out which one of these relationships
• 55:35
  Speaker 2: is the most legitimate. We're not going to be the
• 55:37
  Speaker 2: lifeline for brother-in-law anymore. My name is Paul, and that's
• 55:40
  Speaker 2: between y'all. Yeah, that's it. I'm not involved. You guys
• 55:44
  Speaker 2: sort it out, and we're going to have an official
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: party line. If you do not establish that boundary, you're
• 55:49
  Speaker 2: just going to keep doing this.
• 55:50
  Speaker 1: I'm making burgers tomorrow night. I'm going to make burgers
• 55:53
  Speaker 1: for everyone who is here. If anyone would like a burger,
• 55:57
  Speaker 1: they will be available tomorrow night.
• 55:59
  Speaker 2: That's right. You may help yourself.
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: Outside of that, I will not be accepting any questions
• 56:04
  Speaker 1: or comments at this time.
• 56:06
  Speaker 2: We're not accepting comments.
• 56:08
  Speaker 1: Non-burger related questions or comments will be ignored. Just do
• 56:11
  Speaker 1: the Marshawn Lynch defense, man. I'm just here so I
• 56:14
  Speaker 1: don't get fined. It's over and over again.
• 56:17
  Speaker 2: Good luck, Ryder. Definitely please write us follow-ups. I would
• 56:20
  Speaker 2: love to hear it. We need to know more. But yeah,
• 56:22
  Speaker 2: I think you're handling it really well. I'm sorry what
• 56:24
  Speaker 2: you're going through. That is the worst. Like just being
• 56:26
  Speaker 2: in like this location tied up with all this chaos.
• 56:30
  Speaker 2: You're trying to just be a kind human and just
• 56:31
  Speaker 2: be involved in all this. But I think that like
• 56:34
  Speaker 2: your sister's living in kind of a weird transitionary time
• 56:37
  Speaker 2: of her life. That does not have to be your
• 56:39
  Speaker 2: problem or your pain. But you can't avoid all that
• 56:42
  Speaker 2: if you choose to continue to like get involved in
• 56:45
  Speaker 2: any way. And that means you have to release the
• 56:46
  Speaker 2: whole thing and say, hey, look, clearly there's been an explosion.
• 56:49
  Speaker 2: Clearly there's chaos.
• 56:49
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 56:50
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry. We're no longer a part of this. Good luck.
• 56:53
  Speaker 2: And that's not cruel. That's just self-preservation.
• 56:55
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 56:56
  Speaker 2: And smart. And just smart. And just good practice. We're
• 57:00
  Speaker 2: going to take a quick break. And when we come back,
• 57:01
  Speaker 2: we're talking about how to listen without losing your mind.
• 57:05
  Speaker 2: You're listening to Pod Therapy.
• 57:07
  Speaker 5: Today's episode is brought to you by Judy Schneier, Leon Kassab,
• 57:10
  Speaker 5: Carolyn Albert, Sammy Scoop, Sarah Smith, Mike Helm, Darren Cunningham,
• 57:14
  Speaker 5: Brady Malachian, Max the Ginger Scoop, Elio Deer, Amy Aardvark,
• 57:18
  Speaker 5: and Edgar Allen Hope. If you would like to sponsor
• 57:21
  Speaker 5: the show, become a TheraProducer at patreon.com.
• 57:24
  Speaker 2: I believe we're tied. I believe we all got ours right.
• 57:27
  Speaker 2: Despite this being pretty hard.
• 57:28
  Speaker 5: Whitney.
• 57:29
  Speaker 2: Whitney.
• 57:31
  Speaker 5: Plead or successfully, like, get it. actually plead.
• 57:49
  Speaker 1: I think there are tripping blocks to just submitting that plea.
• 57:53
  Speaker 2: Well, I think that lawyers can't do it in bad faith.
• 57:56
  Speaker 2: I think that that goes against their bar stuff. So, like,
• 57:58
  Speaker 2: they're going to only do it when they can legitimately
• 58:00
  Speaker 2: go for the defense.
• 58:03
  Speaker 5: Options. A, about 10% of felony defendants. B.
• 58:09
  Speaker 2: About 5%. C, less than 1%. D, about 15%.
• 58:11
  Speaker 5: Percent?
• 58:16
  Speaker 6: Yes.
• 58:17
  Speaker 5: Okay.
• 58:18
  Speaker 2: 15, 10, 5, less than 1.
• 58:20
  Speaker 6: My instinct was going to be like the 1%, so
• 58:23
  Speaker 6: I guess I'll just go with that.
• 58:25
  Speaker 5: Less than 1%? Yeah. Correct.
• 58:29
  Speaker 2: Wow. Okay, we're learning.
• 58:33
  Speaker 5: A 1981 study found that Wyoming residents believed insanity was
• 58:36
  Speaker 5: pleaded in 43% of cases. The actual figure for that
• 58:41
  Speaker 5: period was also less than 1%. Wow.
• 58:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 58:43
  Speaker 5: That I think.
• 58:45
  Speaker 2: TV definitely embellishes this concept.
• 58:48
  Speaker 5: Television is largely responsible.
• 58:50
  Speaker 3: Jim can see your screen.
• 58:52
  Speaker 5: No, I remember that as a kid. I remember that
• 58:55
  Speaker 5: was a thing. Everybody was like, oh, everyone's getting off
• 58:59
  Speaker 5: by pleading insanity.
• 59:00
  Speaker 2: And everybody's in comas and gets amnesia. Yeah, a lot
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: of that was happening. Wild and quicksand. Yes.
• 59:07
  Speaker 6: Help.
• 59:07
  Speaker 5: Same as the hot coffee.
• 59:09
  Speaker 2: Oh. the hot coffee thing.
• 59:11
  Speaker 5: McDonald's. Like that was completely– Totally misconstrued. Misconstrued in the media. Oh,
• 59:16
  Speaker 5: my gosh.
• 59:17
  Speaker 2: Everybody's so stupid. Why don't they get it?
• 59:20
  Speaker 3: She was like in the burn unit.
• 59:21
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 59:21
  Speaker 2: Jesus.
• 59:23
  Speaker 1: So apparently in Nevada, according to ChatGPT, the judge, when
• 59:29
  Speaker 1: hearing the plea, can just reject the insanity, the not
• 59:35
  Speaker 1: guilty by reason of insanity.
• 59:36
  Speaker 2: The judge at the plea can just say, nope. Okay.
• 59:40
  Speaker 2: You're pleading not guilty. So you can't take it all
• 59:42
  Speaker 2: the way. That's it. We're not even going to allow
• 59:45
  Speaker 2: you to try to go down that road.
• 59:46
  Speaker 3: Interesting.
• 59:47
  Speaker 2: All right.
• 59:48
  Speaker 5: I don't know. Okay, Jacob.
• 59:50
  Speaker 6: Yep.
• 59:50
  Speaker 5: Of the small percentage.
• 59:52
  Speaker 2: Of defendants– Hold on. Slow down. I can't type into
• 59:53
  Speaker 2: chat GPT that fast. Of the small– Listen to me.
• 59:59
  Speaker 5: Of the small percentage of defendants who do plead guilty–
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 5: or I'm sorry, not guilty by reason of insanity– Less
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 5: than 1%. Approximately what fraction are actually found in GRI
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 5: by a jury?
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 2: Not guilty by reason of insanity.
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 5: That would be a good guess, yes. Yeah.
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 2: I feel like I should get the points.
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 3: I heard that as in like the word in and
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 3: then GRI. I'm like, what's GRI? And they're like guilty. Oh,
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 3: in GRI.
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 2: I knew what he was trying to spell, but he's
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 2: bad at spelling.
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 2: I didn't spell it.
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 1: So what percentage of the people that plead not guilty
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 1: by reason of insanity are successful?
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 5: Are actually found not guilty by reason of insanity. Okay.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 2: Successful is probably the wrong word there, but you know
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 2: what I mean.
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 5: Yeah. A, only about 15% to 25%, meaning three out
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 5: of four NGRI pleas fail in court. Right. B, about 50%,
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 5: about 70% juries are sympathetic once mental illness evidence is presented.
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 5: Or D, about 85% prosecutors rarely bring insanity cases to
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 5: trial if the defense is well supported.
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 2: Hey, that's what I was worried about. What was the
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 2: first one?
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 5: Only 15% to 25%.
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah, with like three-fourths of them failing. Then it's 50-50,
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 2: then it's 75% success, and then it's very high success.
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 5: Yep, then 70%, then 85%.
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 2: 85%. Sure, 85. I feel like that's a good move.
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 2: Let's go with the big one.
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 5: No.
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 2: No. Oh, I liked the logic on that one, though.
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 5: Ugh.
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 2: I mean, once they get the chance to bring it
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 2: to trial, you feel like that's a big filter all
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 2: by itself.
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 2: I'll bet you people aren't that sympathetic. I'll bet you
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 2: it's low. Let me go with the lower one. Choice A.
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 5: Yes.
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 2: Wow.
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 5: The insanity defense is raised rarely. When it is raised,
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 5: it fails most of the time.
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 6: Hmm.
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 5: Both of those facts contradict what most people believe. The
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 5: defense is not a loophole. It is a very narrow,
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 5: very difficult legal standard that psychiatrists and juries both apply
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 5: extremely conservatively.
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 1: I mean the– The problem that a lot of people
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 1: always have with it is they feel like the person.
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 2: Is not being punished. Right. Right. It's not fair. Yeah, yeah.
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 2: Because you seem to be admitting that you did the thing.
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 1: You're just saying the reason I did it wasn't what
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 1: you think it is.
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 1: But I would argue that locked in a padded room
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 1: versus locked in a cell, maybe not all that different.
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 5: Sure. Yeah.
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 5: All right, Jim.
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 2: It's my chance.
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 5: John Hinckley Jr. attempted to assassinate... This isn't the question,
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 5: but let's see if you know.
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 2: Ooh.
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 5: Excellent.
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 1: Who did John Hinckley Jr. try to assassinate? You wanted
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 1: a different line.
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 2: Of questioning, Jim. Can I have multiple guesses? I'll give
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 2: you a hint. American political figure.
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 3: All right.
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 2: I'll give you a bigger hint. President. Yeah, I was
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 2: going to say Reagan. I was going to say he
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 2: shot Reagan. Is that not it? Yes. That's it?
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 5: Okay. John Hinckley Jr. attempted to assassinate President Ronald Reagan
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 5: on March 30th, 1981. shooting him and three others outside
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 5: the Washington Hilton. At trial, what was his stated motivation?
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 2: Oh, I'm going to know this as soon as I
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 2: hear it. Yeah. Is this the, if I shoot from
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 2: the hip, do I get a bonus?
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 5: Sure.
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 2: Well, he did.
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 6: Nice.
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 5: Or did he?
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 2: You know what? I'm going to shoot from the hip.
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 2: I don't know if we're talking about him. All right.
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 2: I think this is the guy who like read Catcher
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 2: in the Rye. and he thought or it's like jody
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 2: foster like he saw jody foster and something and he
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 2: thought she wanted him to do this and i'm sure
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 2: i can't have both of those so i'm gonna go
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 2: with catcher in the rye something about catcher in the
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 2: rye made.
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 1: Him do it uh no fuck oh i would have
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 1: given you credit if catcher in the rye was anywhere
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 1: in the.
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 5: End no catcher in the rye that was uh The
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 5: guy who killed... John Lennon? John Lennon.
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 1: Oh.
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I believe that was his motivation.
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 2: All right, goes to Whitney.
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 3: So options?
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 5: Yes, good call. Wow. A, he was experiencing paranoid delusions
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 5: that Reagan was directing government surveillance against him personally. B,
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 5: he had been radicalized by a French political group that
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 5: believed presidential assassination was legally justified under certain conditions. C.
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 5: He believed his religious faith commanded him to act as
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 5: a historical instrument of divine justice. I was thinking that
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 5: Key and Peele sketch. Derek is the student, God is
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 5: the teacher, and I am God's instrument.
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 6: Oh, that.
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 5: The boxer.
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 2: The boxers.
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 5: Or D. He had grown obsessed with the film Taxi
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 5: Driver and was attempting to impress... actress Jodie Foster by
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 5: imitating the movie's plot.
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 3: Oh my God.
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 5: You've been sending her letters and calling her at Yale.
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 2: Damn it. Whitney.
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 6: If it's Jodie Foster, I'm going to feel bad that
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 6: I didn't guess it after Jim basically said it.
• 1:05:25
  Speaker 2: I would say that Jim basically said it. I would
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 2: say that Jim directly said it.
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 1: Fine.
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 6: I'm going with Jodie Foster because if it's right, then
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 6: I get to rub it in Jim's face.
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 5: It is right.
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 2: God damn it. Fuck you, catcher in the rye. I'm
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 2: not touching you.
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 5: I'm not touching you.
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 2: I'm not touching you.
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 5: He literally sent her a note the day of the
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 5: shooting explaining what he was about to do. The trial
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 5: featured extensive psychiatric testimony. Thank you. Competing expert witness and
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 5: a jury that deliberated for four days.
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 3: Wow.
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 2: Damn.
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 5: When they returned their verdict, 83% of the American public
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 5: did not accept it. That reaction changed the law.
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 1: Geez.
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 2: Now, if you're Jodie Foster, okay. And like some dude
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 2: popped the president just trying to hit that.
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 5: It's kind of hot.
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's, you know, like not, not endorsing.
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 6: Okay.
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 2: No, just really quick. Pod therapy will not fuck you.
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 2: If you try to assassinate world leaders. But we will
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 2: recognize that it's a compliment. I mean, it's very flattering.
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 2: You know, it's very flattering. We will recognize it as
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 2: a compliment. Don't do it. Don't do it. Don't do it.
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 2: But if you did... But Whitney might be into it.
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 5: I don't know.
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 2: I'd be tickled. I mean, if you're Jodie Foster... But
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 2: don't do it. Yeah, yeah. But don't do it. You're
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 2: not doing it. I'm not going to do it. You
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 2: know that she at least told one person, like, I mean...
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 2: other you know nobody's trying to kill anybody.
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 5: For that is a flex against other actresses yeah callista
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 5: flockhart don't have fucking this kind of yeah like i
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 5: clearly win like that just won the red carpet like
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 5: there's nobody gets around this i mean meryl gets to
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 5: say that she's the goat but uh are you though.
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 2: I mean i tried to kill reagan over your ugly
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 2: ass it was me bitch It's Britney, bitch. Yeah, but
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 2: did he succeed? No. Okay. But actually, is that almost
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 2: even better? You know, because it's like, oh, it was
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 2: like this romantic effort without the tragedy. No, no. If
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 2: you're going to do it.
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 1: If you're going to do it, I want you to commit.
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 2: I want you to go all the way.
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 2: And again, my therapy doesn't want you to do that.
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 2: Don't do it. No, don't do it. Would Jodie Foster
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 2: want you to? I would be so flattered. But don't
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 2: want it to happen. And that was the last show.
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 2: I think this is easily where we get off.
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 1: Nobody should kill Ronald Reagan on my account.
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 5: Okay.
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 2: For sure.
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 2: And to be clear, we were only talking.
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 3: About Ronald Reagan.
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 5: Only Ron. Ron.
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 2: What else would we have been talking about? I wouldn't know.
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 2: That'd be ridiculous to talk about anything but Ron Reagan.
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 2: Or Jodie Foster. How to listen without losing your mind.
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 1: And I was mainly talking about it when he was
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 1: an actor.
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 1: That wasn't clear, but I was mainly picturing.
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 2: Him as an actor. He was an actor.
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 2: I didn't even know that. Ronald Reagan, the actor? What
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 2: a great line. Was that Back to the Future?
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 2: The actor? The actor in Chris Lloyd.
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 5: The actor?
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 2: How to listen without losing your mind. Hi, Pod Therapy crowd.
• 1:08:33
  Speaker 2: I've somehow become an official therapist to several... Oh, thank you.
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 2: I've somehow become an unofficial therapist. I bill their insurance.
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 2: That is a very important clarification. I've somehow become an
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 2: unofficial therapist. They found me on their telehealth.
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 3: I took Jacob's training.
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 2: That's right. Jacob's become an unofficial therapist training.
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 6: Why not?
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 2: I don't know what's unofficial about it. Step one, steal people's...
• 1:09:01
  Speaker 2: I've somehow become an unofficial therapist to several people. This
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 2: isn't something I wanted, but when people ask me, I
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 2: can usually see what they're looking for and reflect their
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 2: questions back to them so they find the right direction. However,
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 2: I have real trouble with some friends. I'm one of
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 2: those people who listens to podcasts at two times speed
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 2: because everyone sounds a little dull-witted at one time speed.
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 2: When I talk to some people I know.
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 1: With- And I don't know what you.
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 5: Mean.
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 2: Have you ever seen Zootopia? Bye.
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 5: Have you ever seen this?
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 6: That.
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 4: There it is.
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 2: When I talk to some people I know with ADHD
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 2: or childhood trauma, internally I'm screaming, get to the point,
• 1:09:54
  Speaker 2: as they take forever to tell me something, sidetrack themselves
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 2: on stories they've told me repeatedly, or go off on
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 2: tangents apologizing for being who they are. I know it's
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 2: not about the nail and everyone wants to feel heard,
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 2: but I find myself picking up my phone and browsing
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 2: while I'm waiting for them to get back to the subject.
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 2: That doesn't help either of us. There's no way. Although
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 2: that's the kind of thing you get to do when
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 2: you're an unofficial therapist.
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 2: When you're an official therapist, that shit is frowned upon.
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 2: They're getting what they paid for. Boy, do they hate that. Yeah,
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 2: I'm still listening. I got you. No, I got you.
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 2: I got you. I'm with you. Keep going. I'm totally
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 2: on this. You know, I made this app with flawed. Ah,
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 2: my scores. I'm doing so well. There's no way I'd
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 2: ever want to be a professional therapist, but I do
• 1:10:38
  Speaker 2: want to be a better friend. What techniques did you
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 2: learn that keep you from daydreaming, thinking about other things,
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 2: or playing solitaire while you're waiting for patients to get
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 2: back from conversational excursions? Is it different because they're paying you?
• 1:10:52
  Speaker 2: Do you just ignore them until keywords pop back up?
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 2: Or are you always listening keenly as they recount the
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 2: same thing for the sixth time just in case there's
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 2: a signal they didn't reveal before? How do you do it?
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 2: Internally screaming pronouns are he and him.
• 1:11:06
  Speaker 5: Hmm.
• 1:11:09
  Speaker 3: How do you do it?
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 2: We zone out until we hear the word suicide. That's
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 2: the one strategy.
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 6: That's what my mentors and professors told me to do
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 6: in direct practice 101.
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 3: I actually thought about this today.
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 6: I was at brunch with a couple girly pops and
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 6: one of them was going on a tangent for quite
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 6: a while, which fine. I was wanting to hear some
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 6: of this information, but it was the tea, right?
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 3: But then it kept going and going.
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 6: And I happened to notice that the other two, one
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 6: for sure has ADHD and she had gotten her phone
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 6: out at one point. Another one I noticed got her
• 1:11:47
  Speaker 6: phone out at a certain point too. And I was
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 6: sitting here thinking as I glanced over, but I'm also
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 6: listening to our other friend share this tale of woe.
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 3: I thought a bunch of things.
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 6: One, I was like, wow, that's super rude. They're on
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 6: their phones while this person's talking.
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 3: Like, this is one hour out of your whole week.
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 6: Like we just are supposed to be unfocused. But also, um,
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 6: I was thinking while she's talking.
• 1:12:14
  Speaker 3: Like what gets them?
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 6: Cause I had urges, like I had urges to like
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 6: check something on my phone because they're going on a while.
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 3: And I'm like, I could still.
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 6: Listen to this story and like check a, a alert
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 6: or something like that.
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 3: But I didn't want to.
• 1:12:27
  Speaker 6: So what I do whenever I feel that urge to
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 6: pull away is, um, usually I focus on something on
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 6: the person.
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 3: So, um, Again, basically. It could be their eyes. It
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 3: could be whatever. But I'm like.
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 2: Their titties hanging out on the John Deere?
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 2: That helps.
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 3: That's an easy one.
• 1:12:41
  Speaker 5: So as they're going into this huge long story, you're
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 5: no longer listening because you're thinking... She really get that
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 5: mold check.
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 2: God, that zit is going to burst.
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 6: You know what? That distraction to last less, much less
• 1:12:53
  Speaker 6: time than a distraction. So even if you're thinking they
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 6: should get that mold checked out, I missed like maybe
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 6: three filler words.
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 3: And then I'm back onto what they're saying.
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 6: So I'm like, Oh yeah, that is. Cause I'm still
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 6: focused on, I'm like, that's what I'm paying attention to.
• 1:13:05
  Speaker 2: I'm looking at.
• 1:13:06
  Speaker 6: Um, so for me, I did think about, I was like, I,
• 1:13:09
  Speaker 6: if I'm literally visually focused on that person, um, Maybe, sure,
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 6: my mind might drift a little.
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 3: We're humans. That happens.
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 6: But that helps me stay on task, basically. I'm a
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 6: visual person, though, so maybe that's helpful to me.
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 5: My patience level is different between different people.
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah, sure.
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 5: If I was working with a client, I can be
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 5: very focused and I can dial in the patience. I
• 1:13:36
  Speaker 5: can be professional. I can do all that.
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 3: You put up with a lot more.
• 1:13:39
  Speaker 5: If I am working with... like any of my staff
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 5: or employees of an organization, people that already fucking know. Yeah.
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 3: Then I, what I really want to do is just say,
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 3: hold on.
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 5: Go back to your office. Send this to me in
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 5: an email. Or get to the fucking point.
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 3: I ain't got time for that.
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 5: Tell me A, B, and how that affects C. I
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 5: don't need the side tangents. Give me the information I
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 5: need right now so I can make a decision. I'm
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 5: too busy for this shit.
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 1: But that's because those people are at work and you're
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 1: at work. And you're reacting to them as though they
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 1: are coworkers at work who are wasting your time.
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 6: And maybe this is like people-pleasing Whitney, but I'm just like,
• 1:14:27
  Speaker 6: this is important to them and I care about this person.
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 6: So I want them to feel that I care about
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 6: this too. So maybe even if I am zoned in
• 1:14:35
  Speaker 6: on their mole part of the time and like thinking
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 6: they should get that checked out or whatever, they feel
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 6: like I've listened to them the whole time. And I
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 6: think that's also just important as however weird that may sound.
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 2: I've, I've actually been kind of, and this is like
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 2: completely unironic. I've been struggling with this, like in the
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 2: same thing. Like if it's a work thing, if I'm
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 2: talking to a client, I'm very dialed in. I think
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 2: part of it, honestly, for me is being able to
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 2: take notes.
• 1:15:01
  Speaker 6: Yes. Handwritten notes for me help me a lot.
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Contemporaneous note taking really keeps me locked in. And like,
• 1:15:08
  Speaker 2: I probably do have ADHD, but like having something kinetic
• 1:15:11
  Speaker 2: that I can do.
• 1:15:12
  Speaker 6: I agree.
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 2: It really keeps me like with them. And then like,
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 2: even if there was something I just misheard or like,
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 2: you know, sometimes like you're listening and something gets trailed
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 2: off or they cut themselves off.
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 3: And then they reflect on it and you're like, wait.
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 2: And yeah, sometimes I, I mean, we all can get
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 2: lost in the conversation, but having the notepad helps a
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 2: fuck ton because I'll just like, what? And then I'm like,
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah.
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 5: Okay.
• 1:15:34
  Speaker 2: Now I know where you're going with that.
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 2: And like, that really helps me stay on track. But
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 2: a thing I've really been catching myself with, and I've
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 2: really been trying to do better is in my friendships.
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 2: I am just easily distracted, not dialed in, even whenever
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 2: it's something kind of important. And like, this happened a
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 2: few months ago where, where a really close friend of mine,
• 1:15:53
  Speaker 2: we met up at a bar after work or whatever,
• 1:15:56
  Speaker 2: had some drinks, had some food, hung out and talked.
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 2: And he was telling me all about this new important
• 1:16:01
  Speaker 2: thing that was happening in his work life and an
• 1:16:04
  Speaker 2: interview he was having and this new job and all
• 1:16:07
  Speaker 2: this exciting stuff. And he'd been waiting to tell me
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 2: it for a while. We'd been saying, let's get together,
• 1:16:12
  Speaker 2: let's get together, one of those things. And I had
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 2: life updates. And so we're both sharing a lot. And
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 2: the next day, I had forgotten- Like key details that
• 1:16:23
  Speaker 2: he had told me. And so I sent him a
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 2: text thinking this will be a good friend move. And
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 2: the text was, hey, man, like, let me know when
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 2: that interview happens for that new job, because I want
• 1:16:35
  Speaker 2: to follow up with you and find out how it went.
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 2: And he wrote back and said. I had the interview
• 1:16:41
  Speaker 2: the day we got dinner. I was telling you about
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 2: the interview. And like somehow my brain thought that wasn't
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 2: the interview. That was like a preliminary... And I can
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 2: miss that very important detail. That happens to me all
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 2: the time. Okay. If I miss a.
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 1: Like... It's so easy to miss a detail and then
• 1:17:01
  Speaker 1: keep on going, not realizing that you have missed that detail.
• 1:17:04
  Speaker 3: That is an important one.
• 1:17:06
  Speaker 2: If you know that you've missed something, then it's easy.
• 1:17:09
  Speaker 2: It's when you don't know.
• 1:17:11
  Speaker 1: I'm not aware that I missed anything, so I'm operating
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 1: as though I have all the information.
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 3: It's like, that's a one word difference.
• 1:17:17
  Speaker 6: I had the interview or I have it coming up.
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 3: And that's all you missed.
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 2: And then he's telling me about this interaction with the
• 1:17:23
  Speaker 2: person of interest, but then my brain is thinking it's upcoming.
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 2: You thought there was just something else coming up.
• 1:17:28
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 2: For whatever reason, you thought something was coming up. Yeah.
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 2: And so, but like, I felt really bad because he
• 1:17:33
  Speaker 2: was very earnestly telling me all about this, been waiting
• 1:17:36
  Speaker 2: to tell me all about this. And part of the
• 1:17:38
  Speaker 2: reason he had scheduled when we met Was to let
• 1:17:40
  Speaker 2: me know that he had just had this thing.
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 2: Like to tell me all about it. So like, again,
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 2: it happened. It can happen to anybody, but like as
• 1:17:49
  Speaker 2: a therapist, I think that happens a lot less often a,
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 2: because the consequences are much higher, like to mess up
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 2: something like that. B because we have the notepad and
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 2: C because like, I am functionally dialed in differently. Whereas like,
• 1:18:01
  Speaker 2: I'm kind of like your friends where, when I'm talking
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 2: to somebody, if they're telling me a story that, And
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 2: I can pick up that this is not banter. Like
• 1:18:09
  Speaker 2: we're not going to back and forth. They are monologuing
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 2: for a minute. Yeah. I'll pull out my phone almost
• 1:18:16
  Speaker 2: just automatically and I'll just– but not to stay on it.
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 2: Don't go through everything. I just like look for notifications.
• 1:18:21
  Speaker 2: Like is there a– but like I'm getting synced up
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 2: really quick, passively listening and then I'll put it away.
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 2: But like obviously you would never do that in session.
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:18:30
  Speaker 2: But I will like compulsively do it. And it does
• 1:18:33
  Speaker 2: affect my ability to listen. But this leads to what
• 1:18:37
  Speaker 2: about being the friend psychologist?
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 3: Yeah, there's like a different standard.
• 1:18:42
  Speaker 2: What about being the friend group psychologist?
• 1:18:45
  Speaker 5: Well, one way to quickly get out of that role
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 5: is to show that you're not listening. Yeah. Ah.
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 2: Pull out your phone. If you're interested in moving on
• 1:18:54
  Speaker 2: from that role.
• 1:18:55
  Speaker 4: If you don't like washing the dishes.
• 1:18:58
  Speaker 5: Yeah. There's an easy way to go out of business.
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 5: If that's what you want to do, there's an easy
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 5: way to do that. Just do a shit job. That's fair. Yeah.
• 1:19:08
  Speaker 2: So the writer's kind of saying, look, I like helping
• 1:19:10
  Speaker 2: my friends, but I am not able to track. So
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 2: how do you get through the long winding monologues? Professionally.
• 1:19:18
  Speaker 2: Like I think that each of us has a different
• 1:19:19
  Speaker 2: reaction to do you ever get lost? But when you
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 2: have the long winding stuff, how do you professionally lock
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 2: in even whenever it is kind of the story with
• 1:19:28
  Speaker 2: a thousand commas?
• 1:19:29
  Speaker 5: I think one thing– so if– are we certain this
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 5: is a– They do have an ADHD diagnosis? No, they're
• 1:19:35
  Speaker 5: just saying, I know.
• 1:19:36
  Speaker 3: You weren't listening.
• 1:19:36
  Speaker 2: I think they were saying some of their friends. I
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 2: was on my phone.
• 1:19:39
  Speaker 5: Oh, Whitney, when did you get here?
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah. The writer's saying some of their friends
• 1:19:43
  Speaker 2: who they listen to have these long winding stories a
• 1:19:46
  Speaker 2: la ADHD style.
• 1:19:47
  Speaker 5: I gotcha. I gotcha. I was thinking because the writer
• 1:19:50
  Speaker 5: has ADHD.
• 1:19:51
  Speaker 6: Well, that's what I thought of because I think it's
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 6: this weird paradox with people who tend to have ADHD.
• 1:19:57
  Speaker 6: It's like they want other people to get to the point,
• 1:19:59
  Speaker 6: but also they're bunny trailing all over too.
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 5: And actually, because that kind of reminded me a long
• 1:20:06
  Speaker 5: time ago, we were talking on this show about what
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 5: superpower you would want if you could have it. And
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 5: I said, I want something like what Quicksilver had. Where
• 1:20:17
  Speaker 5: Quicksilver and the Marvel comics.
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 2: Make it so women can't scream audibly.
• 1:20:20
  Speaker 3: X-ray vision.
• 1:20:22
  Speaker 2: I thought it was a weird answer at the time.
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 2: I remember being really uncomfortable. I still stand with it. Actually,
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 2: we deleted that. I think we deleted that entire episode.
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 2: The fact that he said the word audibly. Yeah, I
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 2: thought that was.
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 1: He said specifically they can't scream audibly.
• 1:20:34
  Speaker 2: I thought that was... And the police can't catch me.
• 1:20:36
  Speaker 2: The police don't know who I am. The catch was weird.
• 1:20:40
  Speaker 5: So Quicksilver is incredibly fast. Like in almost like time freezes,
• 1:20:45
  Speaker 5: but he can just navigate around at normal speed.
• 1:20:48
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:20:49
  Speaker 5: I thought that'd be so cool. And then it was
• 1:20:50
  Speaker 5: somebody in discord who sent me the link to like
• 1:20:55
  Speaker 5: a comic book that described that from that character's perspective,
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 5: it was hell on earth.
• 1:21:00
  Speaker 2: Oh, wow.
• 1:21:01
  Speaker 5: Because life is just so slow to him.
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 2: Oh, wow.
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 5: And then I, that got me thinking that like in
• 1:21:09
  Speaker 5: our society, like, Like another amazing superpower would be like, wow,
• 1:21:13
  Speaker 5: wouldn't it be great to be the smartest person on earth? No,
• 1:21:17
  Speaker 5: that would be terrible because then everybody else is.
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 2: A fucking moron. Let me tell you, it's tough just
• 1:21:22
  Speaker 2: being the smartest person in the room. It is your
• 1:21:26
  Speaker 2: cross to bear.
• 1:21:27
  Speaker 5: You know what? I feel great. I feel perfectly fine
• 1:21:30
  Speaker 5: in here.
• 1:21:30
  Speaker 3: Ignorance really is bliss, it turns out.
• 1:21:32
  Speaker 2: This is why we don't have to be afraid of AI.
• 1:21:33
  Speaker 2: It's going to kill itself. Fuck this.
• 1:21:36
  Speaker 5: Fucking idiots.
• 1:21:37
  Speaker 2: It's true. I don't live like this anymore.
• 1:21:39
  Speaker 5: Being stupid is not an inconvenience to someone who's stupid.
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 5: It's an inconvenience to the people around them. And so
• 1:21:45
  Speaker 5: I was like, if in the writer's case, if the
• 1:21:48
  Speaker 5: writer or I think like you have ADHD and you're
• 1:21:53
  Speaker 5: listening to somebody tell a long story, then like for you,
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 5: it's absolute torture to have to listen to.
• 1:22:00
  Speaker 6: But I think that's, I mean, maybe this is a
• 1:22:02
  Speaker 6: CBT outlook, but I mean, what helps, it doesn't make
• 1:22:07
  Speaker 6: it easy to do this, but what helps is shifting
• 1:22:09
  Speaker 6: that narrative to My friend may just need to monologue
• 1:22:12
  Speaker 6: right now, and I'm being there for my friend by
• 1:22:15
  Speaker 6: mostly listening. And I don't have to contribute.
• 1:22:20
  Speaker 3: This isn't about me in that moment.
• 1:22:22
  Speaker 6: And if your friend tends to talk a lot every
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 6: time you meet, maybe you just meet less often, and
• 1:22:27
  Speaker 6: that's okay too.
• 1:22:29
  Speaker 3: But I think taking.
• 1:22:31
  Speaker 6: That perspective away from, wow, this is boring for me
• 1:22:34
  Speaker 6: right now, that's more selfish, and friendships really.
• 1:22:38
  Speaker 5: Aren't about so much.
• 1:22:40
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:22:41
  Speaker 5: Yes, and I definitely agree with that. To give the
• 1:22:44
  Speaker 5: writer a serious answer to this, like if I'm– because
• 1:22:47
  Speaker 5: I've had to do this in sessions before. If I'm
• 1:22:50
  Speaker 5: having trouble focusing, I try to pick up on like
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 5: one or two words and like super focus on something.
• 1:22:57
  Speaker 5: So like if they're saying something, I'll take one or
• 1:23:00
  Speaker 5: even really one sentence and try to really super focus
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 5: on that and kind of ask myself some like follow-up
• 1:23:07
  Speaker 5: questions like, oh, I wonder what that felt like or
• 1:23:10
  Speaker 5: something like that. Just to kind of keep me into
• 1:23:12
  Speaker 5: the story a little bit.
• 1:23:13
  Speaker 3: In their shoes a little bit.
• 1:23:15
  Speaker 2: I like that idea of the internal monologue or dialogue
• 1:23:19
  Speaker 2: to check in with the situation when you can't say
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 2: anything back to them to re-engage yourself. It's almost recapping
• 1:23:25
  Speaker 2: your own mind. Like, what do I know so far? Like,
• 1:23:27
  Speaker 2: what is, okay, that person's name. They just said John.
• 1:23:31
  Speaker 2: Remind myself, who is John? How do they know them?
• 1:23:33
  Speaker 2: What else do I know about John? Like almost reviewing
• 1:23:35
  Speaker 2: your notes while you're listening. If you can mentally multitask
• 1:23:39
  Speaker 2: like that, that way you don't look at a device.
• 1:23:40
  Speaker 2: You don't like physically stray. But like you're with them.
• 1:23:44
  Speaker 2: Like you're more involved in the story. I think that
• 1:23:46
  Speaker 2: those are tricks that we've all probably used to like
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 2: double down when you're hearing a really long monologue.
• 1:23:51
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:23:52
  Speaker 2: It goes a long way.
• 1:23:52
  Speaker 3: Let's all look on our phone while Jim talks.
• 1:23:55
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:23:55
  Speaker 2: I do this with my interns too. When my interns
• 1:23:58
  Speaker 2: are going over cases– I will find myself pulling up
• 1:24:03
  Speaker 2: like things that they're mentioning.
• 1:24:05
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:24:06
  Speaker 2: Or I'll check multiple things. And then like when they finish,
• 1:24:08
  Speaker 2: I stop and then I turn and I address them,
• 1:24:11
  Speaker 2: which I think is an ADHD thing.
• 1:24:12
  Speaker 5: Yeah. You do that all the time with me.
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 2: Jesus. I'm sorry, buddy.
• 1:24:17
  Speaker 5: I'm only realizing this. You're just now realizing this?
• 1:24:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I told you I'm feeling convicted about it.
• 1:24:22
  Speaker 5: Because I always thought you were getting a text message from,
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 5: And you were checking to see what that message was.
• 1:24:30
  Speaker 3: Like, is this important?
• 1:24:31
  Speaker 5: Yeah. But I learned like years ago.
• 1:24:33
  Speaker 3: You're just checking shit on your phone.
• 1:24:35
  Speaker 5: Yeah. You're not getting messages. Yeah. You're just like lost.
• 1:24:38
  Speaker 5: And you're just like, I got to look at something.
• 1:24:40
  Speaker 2: I've been trying to be way more disciplined. Like for
• 1:24:42
  Speaker 2: the show, I have to hold the phone, guys, because
• 1:24:44
  Speaker 2: I have a script. But like in the real world,
• 1:24:46
  Speaker 2: I've been trying to be way more disciplined about putting
• 1:24:49
  Speaker 2: my phone like face down on tables and putting it
• 1:24:52
  Speaker 2: out of reach. Like when our family gets together to
• 1:24:54
  Speaker 2: have dinner now. The new rule I've been making with
• 1:24:57
  Speaker 2: the kids is like everybody's phones go in another room
• 1:25:01
  Speaker 2: and like we're just going to be bored and like–
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 2: You and Bruno Mars. And talk. Same rule. Bruno Mars
• 1:25:08
  Speaker 2: does this too.
• 1:25:09
  Speaker 3: Is that for his gambling addiction?
• 1:25:10
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 1:25:10
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:25:11
  Speaker 2: That's a different reason.
• 1:25:12
  Speaker 6: Okay.
• 1:25:13
  Speaker 2: But no, like– No, he didn't let phones at the concerts.
• 1:25:15
  Speaker 2: That's all. Oh, okay. But this goes back to your
• 1:25:17
  Speaker 2: thing about Quicksilver and frame rate. I don't know if
• 1:25:19
  Speaker 2: you all feel this way. Maybe it's another ADHD thing.
• 1:25:21
  Speaker 2: But like– Going through TikToks and like the vertical scrolling
• 1:25:26
  Speaker 2: that I can do and I'll spend like an hour
• 1:25:28
  Speaker 2: just like syncing and just it goes do, do, do, do,
• 1:25:31
  Speaker 2: do really fast. You keep saying syncing. Do I?
• 1:25:33
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 1:25:33
  Speaker 2: What do you mean by syncing? I guess, yeah, probably not.
• 1:25:37
  Speaker 1: Are you just saying syncing by saying, like, I'm looking
• 1:25:39
  Speaker 1: at my phone?
• 1:25:40
  Speaker 2: Scrolling. And that makes me feel a little more synced
• 1:25:42
  Speaker 2: up with life? Syncing into this thing. So, like, knowing
• 1:25:45
  Speaker 2: all my messages, knowing what my fantasy scores are, knowing
• 1:25:48
  Speaker 2: what I've missed. That's too much. That is too much.
• 1:25:50
  Speaker 2: That's way too much. Yeah. So, like, I feel like
• 1:25:52
  Speaker 2: I have to, like, refresh this thing. You gotta get
• 1:25:55
  Speaker 2: rid of this fucking thing. But, like, just doing the thing,
• 1:25:58
  Speaker 2: I feel like brains start to get this faster frame
• 1:26:00
  Speaker 2: rate And, like, I think there's some research on this, too,
• 1:26:03
  Speaker 2: that we're seeing with young people that do the vertical videoing.
• 1:26:06
  Speaker 2: They move so fast that their attention spans are notably
• 1:26:10
  Speaker 2: much shorter.
• 1:26:11
  Speaker 6: Yes.
• 1:26:11
  Speaker 2: And they can't tolerate, like, school lectures or conversations. I
• 1:26:15
  Speaker 2: think that's part of it, too. Like, disciplining yourself to go, like,
• 1:26:18
  Speaker 2: long-form content. Listen to podcasts and audiobooks at 1x speed.
• 1:26:24
  Speaker 5: We went out to dinner last night, Laura and I.
• 1:26:26
  Speaker 5: We had, like, a little date night thing.
• 1:26:28
  Speaker 6: Cute.
• 1:26:29
  Speaker 5: And my phone died. And I had no phone.
• 1:26:33
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 1:26:33
  Speaker 1: No.
• 1:26:34
  Speaker 5: So I had to raw dog that.
• 1:26:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah. That whole conversation?
• 1:26:38
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:26:38
  Speaker 2: Just sitting there.
• 1:26:39
  Speaker 5: We had a conversation. We talked. And I was like, oh.
• 1:26:43
  Speaker 2: You're pretty cool. I should talk to you more often.
• 1:26:46
  Speaker 3: When's the last time y'all have left?
• 1:26:49
  Speaker 2: This is going really great. You know what? I think
• 1:26:51
  Speaker 2: I'm falling in love with you. I'm going to pay
• 1:26:54
  Speaker 2: for dinner this time. He doesn't have his Apple Pay.
• 1:26:57
  Speaker 5: Sorry, I forgot my Apple Pay.
• 1:27:01
  Speaker 2: You can pick this one up, though. I appreciate it.
• 1:27:04
  Speaker 6: When's the last time any of you all left your
• 1:27:07
  Speaker 6: house and accidentally or on purpose left your phone? Like
• 1:27:11
  Speaker 6: you went with SJ somewhere on your own, whatever.
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 2: I got a worse one for you. When's the last
• 1:27:14
  Speaker 2: time you pooped and you forgot your phone?
• 1:27:17
  Speaker 3: Oh, often.
• 1:27:18
  Speaker 2: I don't usually poop with my phone. Yeah.
• 1:27:21
  Speaker 5: I don't know any other way.
• 1:27:24
  Speaker 2: I thought phones used to read shampoo bottles.
• 1:27:27
  Speaker 1: I did not think of myself as a germaphobe guy.
• 1:27:32
  Speaker 2: I don't need my phone covered in shit. Okay.
• 1:27:34
  Speaker 3: That's fair.
• 1:27:35
  Speaker 5: Well, I don't shit on my phone.
• 1:27:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't shit on my hands either.
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 5: Cool.
• 1:27:39
  Speaker 3: I can't not shit on my phone.
• 1:27:40
  Speaker 5: I don't know what your bathroom is.
• 1:27:43
  Speaker 2: I think you just misunderstand. Let's explain it again. It's
• 1:27:45
  Speaker 2: the bidet. It's the spray. I think he just doesn't
• 1:27:49
  Speaker 2: get it. He makes his servant hold the phone.
• 1:27:52
  Speaker 3: No, but for real. When's the last time you left
• 1:27:55
  Speaker 3: your house? The phone stayed at the house and you left.
• 1:28:00
  Speaker 5: I think the closest example I have is it dying.
• 1:28:03
  Speaker 2: No.
• 1:28:04
  Speaker 5: And that's it. Yeah.
• 1:28:06
  Speaker 3: I accidentally left it not long ago.
• 1:28:08
  Speaker 6: My neighbor and I went to like dinner or something
• 1:28:11
  Speaker 6: and I was like, sure, let's go. And I just
• 1:28:13
  Speaker 6: left my phone in the kitchen or whatever. And I
• 1:28:15
  Speaker 6: was like, huh? Like, well, I don't have my phone.
• 1:28:18
  Speaker 6: So we just went to dinner.
• 1:28:19
  Speaker 5: It is kind of nice. The only thing that really
• 1:28:22
  Speaker 5: kind of worries me about it is getting into a
• 1:28:25
  Speaker 5: car accident, not being able to call somebody.
• 1:28:28
  Speaker 6: Oh.
• 1:28:29
  Speaker 5: Or my insurance is on my mobile app. I don't
• 1:28:33
  Speaker 5: have an actual card.
• 1:28:35
  Speaker 3: Ours just sent us cards. I was like, I guess
• 1:28:37
  Speaker 3: I'll put this in my car.
• 1:28:38
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:28:38
  Speaker 2: But I mean, yeah.
• 1:28:40
  Speaker 1: Even though even those two examples i know i know
• 1:28:42
  Speaker 1: yeah just if you don't have your medical insurance card
• 1:28:45
  Speaker 1: you know you know you have insurance or car insurance
• 1:28:48
  Speaker 1: or whatever yeah.
• 1:28:49
  Speaker 3: Like if you get pulled over.
• 1:28:50
  Speaker 2: My sister can just go and like she's a toddler
• 1:28:53
  Speaker 2: and so she'll forget her phone and just like come
• 1:28:55
  Speaker 2: over to our house or meet us for dinner or
• 1:28:56
  Speaker 2: something like that. She just doesn't have her phone.
• 1:28:58
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 1:28:58
  Speaker 3: People with young kids.
• 1:29:00
  Speaker 1: How do you do the car insurance on the phone thing?
• 1:29:03
  Speaker 1: Because if you get pulled, I understand technically.
• 1:29:06
  Speaker 3: There's an app for that.
• 1:29:07
  Speaker 2: He doesn't know what apps are.
• 1:29:09
  Speaker 1: How old are you?
• 1:29:09
  Speaker 5: Explain it again.
• 1:29:12
  Speaker 1: I know you can look over here, Whitney, and see
• 1:29:15
  Speaker 1: that I don't adopt a lot of technology.
• 1:29:17
  Speaker 2: But I do get the technical part.
• 1:29:19
  Speaker 3: I'm just trying to help you out.
• 1:29:20
  Speaker 2: You're going to get pooped with phones.
• 1:29:22
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:29:22
  Speaker 1: How do you show, how do you present your insurance
• 1:29:26
  Speaker 1: card to the cop without handing the cop your entire
• 1:29:29
  Speaker 1: unlocked phone?
• 1:29:30
  Speaker 2: That's a bad idea, yeah.
• 1:29:31
  Speaker 3: Oh, you show them. They don't touch you.
• 1:29:33
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 1:29:33
  Speaker 5: I don't think I, I think I just held it
• 1:29:35
  Speaker 5: up last time I was pulled over.
• 1:29:37
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 1:29:37
  Speaker 3: They glance at it.
• 1:29:38
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 1:29:39
  Speaker 3: Like holding it.
• 1:29:39
  Speaker 2: Oh, they don't, they don't, they don't care about it.
• 1:29:42
  Speaker 1: Like they care about your driver's license and how they
• 1:29:44
  Speaker 1: take that with them.
• 1:29:44
  Speaker 2: I've been with him though. I do like to have
• 1:29:46
  Speaker 2: a printed one of the car insurance. So to keep
• 1:29:49
  Speaker 2: in the car. I just keep one in the car.
• 1:29:50
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 1:29:50
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:29:50
  Speaker 2: I have a little booklet. With like the registration and
• 1:29:52
  Speaker 2: the thing just ready to go. Just hand it over.
• 1:29:55
  Speaker 2: I get pulled over a lot. I keep meaning to
• 1:29:56
  Speaker 2: do some little booklet.
• 1:29:57
  Speaker 3: For cutting through gas.
• 1:29:58
  Speaker 5: Yeah, as you should. I think that's right.
• 1:30:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I keep meaning to do a little booklet. But yeah,
• 1:30:02
  Speaker 2: I've got it in the car.
• 1:30:03
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:30:03
  Speaker 2: Also, the worst thing that I think can happen to anybody,
• 1:30:06
  Speaker 2: and I pray it never happens to any of the
• 1:30:08
  Speaker 2: three of you, is you learn– a teenager in your
• 1:30:10
  Speaker 2: life learns how to drive.
• 1:30:11
  Speaker 3: Mm-hmm. Oh, it looks horrible. It looks terrifying.
• 1:30:14
  Speaker 2: Oh, no, no. That part's great. He's safe. It's awesome.
• 1:30:17
  Speaker 2: It's the condescending lectures. I'm just sick of this shit.
• 1:30:21
  Speaker 2: Because now all the things I do, he's like, you
• 1:30:22
  Speaker 2: know what? You can't do that, Dad. And I'm like, oh,
• 1:30:24
  Speaker 2: I'm doing it for a long fucking time. Do whatever
• 1:30:26
  Speaker 2: I fucking want. And he's like, no, you can't do that. Guys,
• 1:30:28
  Speaker 2: what's the main thing? That Jim's kid lectures Jim on
• 1:30:35
  Speaker 2: about Jim's driving.
• 1:30:36
  Speaker 3: Is it being on your phone while you're driving?
• 1:30:38
  Speaker 5: Yeah, that was going to be my first question.
• 1:30:39
  Speaker 2: Okay, what's the second thing? Because that was the number
• 1:30:43
  Speaker 2: one thing. That's got to be it.
• 1:30:44
  Speaker 3: Because I know you're lecturing him about that.
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 2: Let's see. I bet Jim doesn't stop at stop signs.
• 1:30:52
  Speaker 3: Oh, the full three seconds?
• 1:30:53
  Speaker 2: I bet he rolls. And I bet Eagle Scout points
• 1:30:56
  Speaker 2: that out.
• 1:30:56
  Speaker 3: I was going to say just speeding.
• 1:30:58
  Speaker 5: Just speeding, yeah. No, I'll bet it is running through
• 1:31:03
  Speaker 5: yellow to orange lights. Because I don't think Jim goes
• 1:31:10
  Speaker 5: through any areas where there are physical stop signs.
• 1:31:13
  Speaker 2: Interesting.
• 1:31:14
  Speaker 6: Interesting.
• 1:31:15
  Speaker 5: Jim?
• 1:31:15
  Speaker 2: All those. I mean, you're all just right. Every one
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 2: of those happens, except I do go past stop signs
• 1:31:21
  Speaker 2: and do not choose to stop.
• 1:31:23
  Speaker 3: There's no cars.
• 1:31:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I just do whatever I want. The speeding is
• 1:31:27
  Speaker 2: the most consistent.
• 1:31:28
  Speaker 3: Oh, I got both.
• 1:31:29
  Speaker 2: There's not a road that I do the speed limit on.
• 1:31:31
  Speaker 2: How much do you speed? This one's 35 miles per hour.
• 1:31:33
  Speaker 2: And I'm like, that's a suggestion. So I'm like, I'm
• 1:31:35
  Speaker 2: blue diamond. You drive blue diamond a lot.
• 1:31:37
  Speaker 5: I do. That's a 55.
• 1:31:37
  Speaker 2: How fast do you go on blue diamond? I believe
• 1:31:40
  Speaker 2: it is. I did not know it was 55. Okay.
• 1:31:42
  Speaker 2: Let's start there. Great. Definitely thought it was freeway speeds.
• 1:31:46
  Speaker 1: When we first moved into Mountain's Edge, before Mountain's Edge
• 1:31:49
  Speaker 1: was finished being built, the speed on Blue Diamond was 45.
• 1:31:53
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 1:31:55
  Speaker 1: And so I remember when they changed it to 55 and.
• 1:31:59
  Speaker 2: It was big dudes. Okay.
• 1:32:01
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:32:01
  Speaker 2: When that extra lane. It was like, this is fantastic.
• 1:32:04
  Speaker 1: No, because they had the extra lane open for like
• 1:32:06
  Speaker 1: six months before they changed. So it was an eight
• 1:32:09
  Speaker 1: lane road with a 45 mile an hour speed limit.
• 1:32:12
  Speaker 2: Just cruising. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'd say anywhere I go,
• 1:32:16
  Speaker 2: I'm always 10 above for the most part. But like,
• 1:32:19
  Speaker 2: I don't consider myself a speeder. It's just in the eyes.
• 1:32:22
  Speaker 2: I don't mind 10 above. But when there's a brand
• 1:32:24
  Speaker 2: new 16 year old reading the booklet, they're like, nah,
• 1:32:29
  Speaker 2: this one's 40 dad, not 45. And you're like, let
• 1:32:30
  Speaker 2: me tell you a little something, son. Yeah. No cops
• 1:32:33
  Speaker 2: gonna pull me over. And if he is, he's a dweeb.
• 1:32:36
  Speaker 2: Like that guy, I'm going to pants that guy. Like
• 1:32:38
  Speaker 2: he's an absolute nerd. And let me tell you something.
• 1:32:40
  Speaker 1: If you say something about it, when that cop pulls
• 1:32:43
  Speaker 1: me over.
• 1:32:43
  Speaker 2: Shut your mouth. Guess he wouldn't get in the car.
• 1:32:46
  Speaker 2: So he did the thing today. He actually had a
• 1:32:48
  Speaker 2: driving lesson. One of the latter ones in the series.
• 1:32:51
  Speaker 2: With you or a pro driver? A pro, yeah.
• 1:32:53
  Speaker 5: Okay.
• 1:32:53
  Speaker 2: We'll drive with him too, but we got him like
• 1:32:55
  Speaker 2: the official driver said. You got a real teacher?
• 1:32:56
  Speaker 6: Great.
• 1:32:56
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:32:57
  Speaker 2: And so today they spent a lot of time on
• 1:32:58
  Speaker 2: the freeways. They went all over the city on the freeways.
• 1:33:01
  Speaker 2: And that was his first real big time on the freeways. Okay.
• 1:33:04
  Speaker 2: He had been on them and then jump off really
• 1:33:06
  Speaker 2: quick in the slow lane. Never anything big.
• 1:33:08
  Speaker 5: I'm trying to think.
• 1:33:09
  Speaker 1: Because today is a Sunday as we're recording.
• 1:33:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Not too traffic. But he went all over the city.
• 1:33:16
  Speaker 2: So he jumped on, went the 215 all the way around.
• 1:33:19
  Speaker 2: Was the Raider game at home today? It was. Oh,
• 1:33:22
  Speaker 2: so you had that? He didn't go downtown or midtown,
• 1:33:24
  Speaker 2: but he just on the perimeter. So 215 mostly staying away. Oh, okay.
• 1:33:27
  Speaker 2: Not through the middle. And then cutting up a little bit.
• 1:33:29
  Speaker 2: But yeah, just all over the place. And then his instructor,
• 1:33:33
  Speaker 2: when I talked to the instructor today, I'm like, so
• 1:33:34
  Speaker 2: how'd that go? And he goes, yeah, it did pretty good.
• 1:33:36
  Speaker 2: He did the thing we all do. That when you
• 1:33:39
  Speaker 2: learn to drive on freeways and your brain at first,
• 1:33:41
  Speaker 2: you're really scared, but then you start getting used to
• 1:33:43
  Speaker 2: that speed. Oh. And then you do that thing when
• 1:33:45
  Speaker 2: you get off on the exit.
• 1:33:46
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:33:47
  Speaker 2: And you do not slow down. Yeah. And so he's like,
• 1:33:49
  Speaker 2: it's called velocitation. It's a thing. And he's like, he
• 1:33:52
  Speaker 2: totally did it. And I thought back and I was like, dude,
• 1:33:54
  Speaker 2: I totally remember doing that too. And I was learning
• 1:33:56
  Speaker 2: to drive as my instructor being like, slow down. And
• 1:33:58
  Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, shit. But before you've ever been on
• 1:34:01
  Speaker 2: a freeway, like 45 feels really fast.
• 1:34:03
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 1:34:04
  Speaker 2: And then you get up to speed and then you
• 1:34:05
  Speaker 2: try to get off and you're like, this is a
• 1:34:06
  Speaker 2: crawling pace. Also, and this is definitely.
• 1:34:10
  Speaker 7: Get ready for some middle-aged white guy talk.
• 1:34:15
  Speaker 2: When I was a boy. Yes.
• 1:34:16
  Speaker 5: Learning to drive.
• 1:34:17
  Speaker 3: Learning when I was learning to drive.
• 1:34:19
  Speaker 2: No, I mean like.
• 1:34:20
  Speaker 1: The cars felt like you were going faster because they
• 1:34:22
  Speaker 1: were shittier.
• 1:34:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:34:24
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 1:34:24
  Speaker 2: No driving.
• 1:34:25
  Speaker 6: Peter's Mustang. Now it is like, I mean, I should
• 1:34:28
  Speaker 6: bring that some weekend. Y'all go on the main road.
• 1:34:31
  Speaker 6: If he hits 70 or like I'm.
• 1:34:32
  Speaker 3: Driving, that's just like, Oh my God.
• 1:34:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:34:38
  Speaker 5: If you run over a dime, you'll feel it.
• 1:34:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it is.
• 1:34:42
  Speaker 6: And you have to focus like, you know, in our
• 1:34:44
  Speaker 6: new cars, they, Like, help you stay in between lanes.
• 1:34:47
  Speaker 3: And, like, it's gentle and soft. His car, I'm like,
• 1:34:50
  Speaker 3: 10 and 2. Don't look at shit.
• 1:34:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, this thing will not save you.
• 1:34:54
  Speaker 3: Absolutely.
• 1:34:55
  Speaker 2: Like, my first car was, like, a Datsun pickup truck. Oh, yeah. Like,
• 1:34:59
  Speaker 2: just all metal, but just shaky as fuck. It was
• 1:35:04
  Speaker 2: built with an erector set. Yeah.
• 1:35:05
  Speaker 1: Like, if you were going 65.
• 1:35:09
  Speaker 2: On the freeway, it felt like you were going 100. Yeah,
• 1:35:11
  Speaker 2: you're like.
• 1:35:12
  Speaker 3: This thing's going to break down on me.
• 1:35:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:35:15
  Speaker 5: Now.
• 1:35:16
  Speaker 1: If I'm in SJ's car, if I'm in the electric
• 1:35:18
  Speaker 1: sports car, I'll be going 100 miles an hour and
• 1:35:21
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 1:35:21
  Speaker 3: You barely notice.
• 1:35:22
  Speaker 2: See, I'm actually– I'm conflicted when I drive with him.
• 1:35:26
  Speaker 2: I want to disable all the safety stuff. but obviously
• 1:35:29
  Speaker 2: that's a choice that maybe you shouldn't make but then
• 1:35:33
  Speaker 2: i'm like but i don't want you to feel the
• 1:35:34
  Speaker 2: wheel fix your shit yeah yeah or i think you
• 1:35:37
  Speaker 2: can disable that well that's what i'm saying is like
• 1:35:39
  Speaker 2: the different things that's a fair to say i don't
• 1:35:41
  Speaker 2: want it to chirp whenever the car in front of
• 1:35:43
  Speaker 2: you moves and you didn't pay attention i don't and
• 1:35:45
  Speaker 2: i don't i mean i do want it to lock
• 1:35:47
  Speaker 2: the brakes and save our lives it has to but
• 1:35:50
  Speaker 2: you're also learning to drive we're gonna have some close
• 1:35:52
  Speaker 2: fucking calls and like i don't know that i want
• 1:35:54
  Speaker 2: the machine getting involved for right now that's fair i
• 1:35:56
  Speaker 2: mean i think that's fair but then i'm like oh
• 1:35:58
  Speaker 2: if i turn it all off and something bad happens
• 1:36:00
  Speaker 2: then i'm a fucking monster.
• 1:36:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah oh no that's true too that is also but
• 1:36:03
  Speaker 1: i believe that's the that's the choice you made when
• 1:36:05
  Speaker 1: you decided to have children you knew be a.
• 1:36:08
  Speaker 3: Monster yeah you're a monster either way.
• 1:36:11
  Speaker 5: So my uh co-worker i can't remember if i told
• 1:36:13
  Speaker 5: this story on air or not but my co-worker also
• 1:36:16
  Speaker 5: has a son who's learning to drive right now is
• 1:36:19
  Speaker 5: it me am i the co-worker it is not uh
• 1:36:22
  Speaker 5: and she's telling me all these different stories girl And
• 1:36:26
  Speaker 5: one of the questions she got asked as she's in
• 1:36:29
  Speaker 5: the passenger seat, kids driving, speed limit is 45 miles
• 1:36:33
  Speaker 5: an hour. And she's like, okay, come up here and
• 1:36:36
  Speaker 5: take a right. And his question was this. Do I
• 1:36:39
  Speaker 5: have to take the turn at 45 miles an hour?
• 1:36:42
  Speaker 5: She's like, no, no.
• 1:36:45
  Speaker 3: You know what he's asking, right?
• 1:36:47
  Speaker 2: I mean, roll. Great question. Thank you for asking.
• 1:36:51
  Speaker 5: Great question. And no.
• 1:36:53
  Speaker 2: You didn't say what kind of vehicle?
• 1:36:54
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:36:55
  Speaker 2: New policy. Keep asking questions. Whatever's going on in your head.
• 1:36:59
  Speaker 2: You say that out loud first.
• 1:37:00
  Speaker 3: This is a thought flow.
• 1:37:03
  Speaker 2: Like some cars.
• 1:37:04
  Speaker 5: Sure.
• 1:37:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. It's funny because for my son, he was
• 1:37:08
  Speaker 2: doing the exact opposite. We'd get into turns and he
• 1:37:11
  Speaker 2: would almost come to a stop. Oh, yeah, yeah. No, no, no, no. Momentum.
• 1:37:15
  Speaker 2: This is a fluid motion. This is not a stoplight turn.
• 1:37:19
  Speaker 5: Keep us going.
• 1:37:19
  Speaker 2: We're just flowing into the turn.
• 1:37:22
  Speaker 1: Did you teach braking and acceleration for turning specifically? Or
• 1:37:28
  Speaker 1: did somebody teach that to the pro driver?
• 1:37:30
  Speaker 2: I think the instructor did because I noticed after a
• 1:37:32
  Speaker 2: lesson he could do it. Oh, interesting. I started started
• 1:37:35
  Speaker 2: because I was his very level zero. And we did
• 1:37:38
  Speaker 2: the thing where you're literally just going around the block
• 1:37:41
  Speaker 2: of the neighborhood. And so like not even really touching
• 1:37:44
  Speaker 2: the gas. Like we're just coasting and learning how to
• 1:37:46
  Speaker 2: move the wheel and take the weight of the vehicle,
• 1:37:49
  Speaker 2: hit the brakes, that kind of thing. But like when
• 1:37:51
  Speaker 2: we started going on the first roads, that's whenever he
• 1:37:54
  Speaker 2: was doing the stop before the turn or in the turn.
• 1:37:57
  Speaker 2: Or like slowing down too much into the turn. And
• 1:38:00
  Speaker 2: like obviously then the traffic behind you doesn't sense that you're.
• 1:38:03
  Speaker 5: Going to do that.
• 1:38:03
  Speaker 2: Because I guess it's not intuitive.
• 1:38:04
  Speaker 1: Like slowing down before the turn and then gassing through
• 1:38:08
  Speaker 1: the turn.
• 1:38:09
  Speaker 2: Right. There's a delicate– That's not intuitive. That's not what
• 1:38:12
  Speaker 2: you would imagine. So the other day– So writer. Yeah, anyway.
• 1:38:17
  Speaker 2: Learn to drive. The other day he had another lesson
• 1:38:20
  Speaker 2: and it was the day it rained in Vegas.
• 1:38:21
  Speaker 5: Oh, no. Great.
• 1:38:22
  Speaker 2: And I was like, I am so glad that it
• 1:38:25
  Speaker 2: is a rainy day in Vegas, which hasn't happened in
• 1:38:27
  Speaker 2: like 400 days. Yeah. And like– Doesn't happen often. a
• 1:38:30
  Speaker 2: professional driver who's going to teach you how to do this.
• 1:38:33
  Speaker 2: I was like, today is the day. And the instructor
• 1:38:35
  Speaker 2: comes up and I'm like, hey, are you guys going
• 1:38:36
  Speaker 2: to like go teach him how to fishtail and stuff?
• 1:38:38
  Speaker 2: And he's like, no. Of course not. That is dangerous.
• 1:38:42
  Speaker 2: I was like, okay.
• 1:38:43
  Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:38:43
  Speaker 2: Cool, cool. Leave it up to you. Yeah, got it.
• 1:38:45
  Speaker 2: Got it. There's actually a course where they teach kids
• 1:38:47
  Speaker 2: to do that though.
• 1:38:48
  Speaker 5: They did that for us.
• 1:38:49
  Speaker 6: Oh, yes.
• 1:38:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:38:50
  Speaker 5: But we did it in the winter. So like we
• 1:38:53
  Speaker 5: had to learn how to drive on ice, how to
• 1:38:54
  Speaker 5: drive on snow and all that shit. Yeah. No, my
• 1:38:57
  Speaker 5: last– just one request I have. When teaching him how
• 1:39:03
  Speaker 5: to drive, do all of us a favor and teach him.
• 1:39:07
  Speaker 5: That if you're in the left-hand turning lane and you
• 1:39:10
  Speaker 5: get the green arrow, you fucking go. Because there's a
• 1:39:13
  Speaker 5: line of cars. We all want to get this.
• 1:39:15
  Speaker 2: You fucking go.
• 1:39:16
  Speaker 6: Let's go, bud.
• 1:39:18
  Speaker 2: Come on, bud.
• 1:39:19
  Speaker 1: We've got to get downtown.
• 1:39:27
  Speaker 5: Let's go. The pedal on the left.
• 1:39:31
  Speaker 2: That was awesome.
• 1:39:33
  Speaker 3: I knew he was serious when I heard that accent.
• 1:39:35
  Speaker 2: That's great. Well, I will tell him that. Anyway, Ryder,
• 1:39:39
  Speaker 2: good luck with your shit. I hope it gets better.
• 1:39:41
  Speaker 3: Jim was listening. He doesn't remember what you were saying.
• 1:39:44
  Speaker 2: Remember, when you see the green arrow, fucking go. We're
• 1:39:47
  Speaker 2: taking a quick break, and when we come back, we're
• 1:39:49
  Speaker 2: wrapping up the show. You're listening to Pod Therapy.
• 1:39:51
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  Speaker 2: All right. As we wrap up the show, I want
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• 1:40:34
  Speaker 2: We recorded this Is this also in the past? Yeah,
• 1:40:38
  Speaker 2: we're a week behind We're a week ahead So if
• 1:40:42
  Speaker 2: you've signed up with us since Which.
• 1:40:44
  Speaker 1: By the way, production meeting I think we ought to
• 1:40:46
  Speaker 1: go back to trying to stay a week ahead It's
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  Speaker 1: pretty good.
• 1:40:48
  Speaker 2: We used to do that. Yeah. Give us that cushion.
• 1:40:51
  Speaker 5: But then we fell behind on current events.
• 1:40:55
  Speaker 2: That's true. That's right.
• 1:40:57
  Speaker 5: People come to us a lot for current events. See,
• 1:41:00
  Speaker 5: now it's stupid to talk about Lake America.
• 1:41:03
  Speaker 3: I almost did earlier. I downloaded MapQuest. I downloaded MapQuest.
• 1:41:08
  Speaker 3: It's glorious.
• 1:41:09
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:41:09
  Speaker 2: And when they hear this, the AIs probably kill everybody.
• 1:41:11
  Speaker 2: So they're like, go chill with this cute Claude Code.
• 1:41:13
  Speaker 5: Who cares?
• 1:41:13
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 1:41:14
  Speaker 2: Anyway, we'd like to thank the benevolent, revered, generous, and
• 1:41:17
  Speaker 2: flagrantly pro-therapy diehard who loves you all so much. The
• 1:41:20
  Speaker 2: gift till it hurts, our Thera partner, Pickett. Pickett. And
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  Speaker 2: Illuminati members of the fan club, the Thera producers. Thank you,
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• 1:42:08
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• 1:42:09
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• 1:42:12
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• 1:42:16
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• 1:42:18
  Speaker 2: Well, that's all the time we got for this week's session.
• 1:42:20
  Speaker 2: I want to thank our landlords, uh, the churn.
• 1:42:22
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 1:42:23
  Speaker 2: Ice cream, social podcast, SJ and the ruckus, two beaver
• 1:42:26
  Speaker 2: dog studios, whatever. And thanks to those of you who
• 1:42:28
  Speaker 2: contributed to our show today. We really appreciate it. We
• 1:42:31
  Speaker 2: should thank the dogs. That's what we should start doing.
• 1:42:34
  Speaker 3: That would be great.
• 1:42:36
  Speaker 2: Anyway, show the episode, tag us on the socials when
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• 1:42:48
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• 1:42:52
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• 1:42:57
  Speaker 3: I'm Whitney.
• 1:42:57
  Speaker 2: I'm Jim.
• 1:42:58
  Speaker 5: Thanks, and we'll see you for your appointment next week.
• 1:43:00
  Speaker 2: Is it Liam and Lily? Is that the dogs? That
• 1:43:02
  Speaker 2: is the dogs, yeah. Lily Studios. They can't hear. They
• 1:43:05
  Speaker 2: don't care.
• 1:43:06
  Speaker 3: They care a lot.
• 1:43:08
  Speaker 2: They don't.
• 1:43:09
  Speaker 3: Bye.
• 1:43:10
  Speaker 5: Bye.
• 1:43:11
  Speaker 2: Not unless you've got chicken.