Latest / Have you met you? / Ep. 18: Love is an Ethic, Christian Mysticism and Ancient Technology with Dr. Lauren Borden

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Ep. 18: Love is an Ethic, Christian Mysticism and Ancient Technology with Dr. Lauren Borden · Have you met you?

• Sasha Pearl: What if everything that you've ever learned about spirituality, leadership, Today on the podcast, we have Dr. Lauren Borden. She's a holistic leadership coach, ⁓ she runs her private practice coaching business as well as the garden. ⁓ is also a 4/6 Manifestor with emotional authority, which we'll dive into that a little bit later. But Lauren, welcome. We'd love to hear more about you. ⁓ and success was missing the most important part. my guest today went back to the original texts, the ones the church literally tried to destroy, and what she found changed everything. Hey, I'm Sasha Pearl, the Energy Architect, and Lauren: Hey lady, thank you so much for having me. I'm like so excited. I'm so excited to be here. ⁓ Yeah, and I mean, I feel like it's kind of cool being in this space with you because I feel like you know me so much at this point personally, ⁓ professionally, yeah, I'm a holistic leadership coach, which basically means that ⁓ folks often come to me with the experience of burnout or just really wanting to make a deeper impact in their lives and in the world and. The way I work, my background is quite strategic. I was in the corporate world for a long time. while I have an abundance of leadership strategies, the work that I really thrive in is around somatics and the soul level foundational work that actually allows you to not just have an impact that's aligned with who you're meant to be in the world, but actually fundamentally change the fabric of who you are. Sasha Pearl: Today I'm sitting down with Dr. Lauren Borden, a holistic leadership coach and ⁓ She's the woman behind The Garden and The Beauty and also runs her private practice coaching business. Lauren works at the intersection of somatics, soul level leadership, Christian mysticism, and ancient technology. and this conversation goes deep. ⁓ Let's get Lauren: So that you become more authentic which I think is also one of the reasons why you and I vibe so much because it's like I sort of do work very similar to you, but often ⁓ Spaces with just in a little bit of a different way ⁓ But we have the same clientele. I think in many ways. Yeah Sasha Pearl: Yes, I would love more of your clientele. ⁓ So Lauren's incarnation cross too, which is about like the divine themes in your life is the vessel of love. So she is literally the embodiment of love in every aspect of your life. So I love that you are obviously bringing in authenticity and the part of authenticity is getting people back to the core of who they are to love themselves, to have more compassion for themselves in the world. Lauren: Thank you for reminding me of that, actually, because there are two really big threads in my work right now. One is around, ⁓ like, love is an ethic. ⁓ And I find that a lot of the folks I work with, that's a driver for them. It's like, how do I love the world better? How do I show up for people? How do we bring compassion? And love, like, it really is not love like we've been taught, because many of us have been taught that love is just sort of letting anybody walk all over you. And it's like, no, sometimes love is fierce, and sometimes love is ferocious. And then the second one is around in my own practice and spiritual practice. I've really been exploring more around Christian mysticism and spoiler alert, Christian mysticism in many ways can be boiled down to God is love. Love is God. Love is the divine. Like everything that we've been taught, you know, that that ⁓ spirituality is actually about is just removing everything in between you and love. So it's I'm glad to know that that's in my my ⁓ human design in a really tangible way. Thank you for reminding me of that. Sasha Pearl: I love that. I'd actually love to hear a little bit more about Christian mysticism, because from what I know about you, Lauren and I have been friends for two years now. We divinely got connected and it's just been a little love affair ever since. And I feel like Christian mysticism is something that's been newly online for you. I mean, maybe it's always been there, but yeah, tell me a little bit more about A, what it is and how you are integrating it into the work that you were doing in the world. Lauren: Yeah. Totally, yeah. And I think ⁓ this might vibe with you too, because I know, can I say that you like, well, like the Mary Magdalene stuff was coming online for you like a year ago, wasn't that? Kind of in a weird way, yeah. So the thing I'll say is, so I grew up, I grew up Christian, like I grew up in an evangelical household and I left the church when I was 15 in ⁓ a very dramatic fashion. I'm happy to tell the story. I don't want to eat up too much time, but. ⁓ I left in a very dramatic fashion and then in the years that followed, particularly once I got into my 20s, a lot of my work and inquiry was around ⁓ sort of like really finding my way back to a spirituality that felt true and that took the pieces that I sort of knew to be true in my childhood and that really resonated with me and really allowing myself to release the rest. that work ended up actually translating in really interesting way in coaching, because I often found people would end up in front of me who I, and I would not talk about this. This is not something I was talking about in the world. you know, right, energetics, just, people just land in front of you, right, who need what you're working and whether you're talking about it or not. And so I would often end up with these women and leaders and people in front of me who would share, they're like, you know, I grew up Christian and they had stories similar to mine. ⁓ And so often when we were looking at like, what is your life ethic? What are your values? What are your drivers? Like, what do you want your life to be about and your legacy to be about? We would end up coming back to these themes that resonated with people in their childhood, but they were almost sort of taught, weren't real or weren't important. So these things like slowness, stillness, love, like, know, loving one another, ⁓ community. like these really foundational pieces of what it means to be human being sacred. And a lot of the work ended up being just giving a ton of permission for that. And simultaneously was doing that work in my own life and through that process ended up, I'm a big nerd, like I've got a PhD so I like reading things and understanding things despite being in the kind of somatic and spiritual space. And I started reading on different, actually translations of biblical texts. I was going back to like the Greek and then trying to triangulate the Aramaic and looking at some of the actual like, big nerd, like you're giggling. Yeah. Like I went in and was, because I just, was like starving for an explanation of why so many of us had been exposed to the church and been like, there is so much beauty here. But why is it kind of getting corrupted out in the world or kind of. twisted in this way where it's like being used as an agent of hate and ⁓ started looking into translations, started reading more of what we call the apocryphal texts. So those were the texts that were biblical but not actually included in the main like canonical texts. So the church went like these books, not those basically. So the ones that were there were like, not those. I was like, I want in on those. Sasha Pearl: Like give me the other side, I need a full perspective here. Lauren: And when you read them, when I read them, it gave me language for what I had been, like the path I had been walking the entire time. And these texts talk about the spiritual practice of dropping into the heart of your heart and your body being a literal doorway to God and the divine. Yes, it talks about the heart, what they call it, the direct translation is a Greek word called nous or new. ⁓ Sasha Pearl: It says that in the books. Lauren: spelled N-O-U-S and the it's translated in the books as mind. But like in the in the Bible and where the word news shows up the way they usually translated his mind. the contextually, if you look at the way it was used in Greek, the more literal translation is the spiritual spiritual eye of the heart. Sasha Pearl: Whoa. I'm like, wait, what? Lauren: Right? And like, and I had been walking this path where I'm learning like intuitive development and somatics and I'm learning like, ⁓ you know, I'm learning meditation and these different meditative practices where you drop into the heart and I'm having these experiences where I drop into my heart and I'm like, I can see everything. Why can I see everything? And why are old patterns that I used to have that used to make me miserable are falling away when I'm doing this. And then I read, you know, like the most impactful one was probably the Gospel of Mary Magdalene, strongly recommend if you haven't read it. It's very short, but if you can read also some of the theological analyses of it, so works of people like Cynthia Bourgeau or Karen King, ⁓ they're able to kind of look at it through the lens of all of the theological texts. So they start pulling, all of the times the word new is used, all of the time these words are used to be able to make sense of it. in these sort of Christian mystic traditions, a very clear picture emerges where it's like, actually what was occurring was that Jesus and Mary Magdalene were showing us what it looked like to, they called it kenosis, self emptying, to actually like internally purify, not because we're bad, but because it's actually about coming back to love and then walk the path such that you become one with God and remember that you're God in human form. Sasha Pearl: ⁓ my God, the vessel of love is here. It's in the house. That's crazy. Lauren: You're It was, and it was like reading these things, I'm like, wait, what? it's, what, that's what's cool about it is that there are these, also when you look at these texts, a lot of these ancient texts have been like deleted and destroyed. Like they were forcibly destroyed because the church was like, yo, we can't have people thinking that they have access to God. That's not going to work for our business model, man. And, Sasha Pearl: See you. Lauren: that's not gonna work. And so, ⁓ and you like, you go to them, and it's actually, I lost my train of thought a little bit, but it's they're very, very clear about, ⁓ yeah, like you having you having the access point and, and that and that, like, all of these other lineages, right? So things like, like Tibetan Buddhism and meditation and like yoga and these things care, like Jesus and Mary Magdalene, in many ways, we're living a lot of these practices in a way that's been pretty violently deleted. being able to go back and get them and be like, actually, all of these things that you're doing, that I'm doing, we're remembering. We're actually remembering what those teachings were supposed to be despite those texts having been big chunks of them being deleted and distorted and all these pieces. Sasha Pearl: So have you, I mean, it sounds like you obviously have so much knowledge on so many different aspects of like spiritual beliefs, which is because I think that makes a really well-rounded perspective. Have you always been on this pursuit of knowledge in this specific way? Lauren: ⁓ Awesome question. ⁓ I've always been really curious. Like when I left the church when I was 15, I ⁓ was just starving for like spiritual. I thought spirituality and self-development was so interesting. When I was little, one of the first things I said, you know, people say, what do want to be when you grow up? And I was, I would run around. I said I wanted to be a pastor. And then when that fell off, I said I wanted to be a public speaker. So like, loved like learning and people and growth and all this stuff. ⁓ And yeah, so, but that probably started officially like in a spiritual vein, maybe around the time I was 18. ⁓ And then, but it was all very intellectual, I, hence the PhD, right? I kind of, I lived in a world where if you can't measure it, doesn't exist, like Brené Brown says, right? ⁓ was like trying to mentally make sense, you know, make sense of all these things that were kind of inexplicable because I could feel things really deeply. And so I learned a lot and I got really comfortable learning a lot. And then in recent years, it's turned way more into like intuition in the body where it's like, ⁓ actually, I have a really powerful mind, but there are these other ways of experiencing and learning and knowing that don't involve like being able to rattle off, you know, which Bible verses and theological texts and apocryphal texts like mention the word new, which I can give you, it's like that's kind of supplementary at this point. So that shifted actually a lot with my work with like the garden and the beauty way, which you've seen firsthand, yeah. Sasha Pearl: Yeah. ⁓ Actually, let's have you talk about like what is... The beauty way was what it started as and you have built it into the garden. So let's go there. Let's talk a little bit more about like what that is and why it's important for you and your fullest expression now and also for the world and the impact it will have for future generations. Lauren: Yeah. Yes, so both the Beauty Way and the Garden, ⁓ well, I mean, they completely changed create, birthing them, because it's interesting, because I wouldn't say creating them. It felt more like birthing them, like they were already. Entities that like wanted to be on the planet that were on the planet in various forms like the beauty way is a term That's actually been used across lineages like the Navajo use the word the beauty way It shows up in Christian mysticism. It showed up in all these places. We didn't know actually when we came up with that name Sasha Pearl: there a description? You didn't know when... Interesting. didn't... I don't think I... Lauren: Yeah, Chelsea and I were on like a zoom call like you and I are right now. And she just goes, I just heard the name the beauty way. And I was like, and I kind of went like beauty like what like I didn't. And then I sat with it and I was like, Whoa, that's really profound. And then we started like, getting hit with these different randomly, we didn't go looking like these different people came across our pads that would use the phrase suddenly, it was everywhere. And Yeah, Navajo tradition, Christian mysticism, Sufism, and ⁓ in Greece, they talked about it too. Sasha Pearl: So how would you, how is the beauty way described before we move into what it is in your form? Lauren: Yes, these other. So the beauty way is the way it's described out in the world is a way of walking through life in a way that you are connected with the beauty that is in all things. In reverence for the sacred and in right relationship with life. And the different kind of like lineages have a little bit of a different take like Sufism and Christian mysticism. It's like remove everything in the way of you and love. In the Navajo tradition, it's much more of like an indigenous feel where there's this deep, reverence for the earth and mother nature. Like everyone sort of has a different access point, but they're all speaking sort of to the same thing. And so all of these are in the way that we built the beauty way and the garden. And so really the central idea is that most of us are really starving for this experience of life, but we can't quite articulate what it is. And it's because In many ways, we've been disconnected from our humanity and from our sacredness and the understanding that these two things are one. And it was a huge breakthrough for me even to work with Chelsea and create a space like this because it was the first time I didn't have like a 10 point PowerPoint on like teachings of like, here's what the beauty wire is and I'm gonna ask you these questions. And instead, it's really a space where ⁓ we drop you into ceremony and ritual and the use of these ancient technologies that allow you to remember the magic that is in who you are and in life itself. And as a consequence, people leave the space with this deep sense of sacredness of life such that their whole lives reorient around what needs to be central, which is usually community, connection, spirit, a totally different pace of living, sustainability, authenticity and not needing to prove anything. Like it's really a giant pattern interrupt for like the kind of hustle grind culture that we're force fed in many ways. And the other piece is that the beauty way is really what the energy we're working with there is really around the divine feminine. So we're working more with like ⁓ with these energies of what it means to be woman and remembering in our bodies what it means to be woman ⁓ and the true power that can emerge when we live like that. And there's not the power that we're taught. The power that we're taught is like, I'm stronger than you. is where you just know your power in yourselves because you remember who you are. Sasha Pearl: Yeah, this is, yeah. So the beauty way, they used to call it a retreat. Let me tell you, it's just not that. It isn't an initiation. So I went to this beauty way retreat that Lauren was just talking about last year. And this is the retreat that Sasha Pearl came online. This is a retreat I literally cried every single day at. This is the retreat I met such a beautiful group of women and was like led so deeply and intuitively. back into my own remembering. it literally, like the container itself, everyone there is literally a fucking portal and mirror back into who you are. And so the work, the work is so intense and so powerful. to your, like, I feel like you said the consequences, the shifting of. like your entire world turns upside down. like, it's not like, for me, I mean, I don't know if you know anyone who it just slightly pivoted something for. Like, I think it's like massive upheavals of your life happened after this retreat, which I highly recommend people go and do. Lauren: It's like little baby tweaks. Well, In-Liv, I also want to acknowledge you and how you showed up for that because you went in knowing like we hadn't done any of the... were like, I still have a hard time explaining what the heck this is because it feels like it transcends language. And despite that, you were like, you had this sense and you came. Actually, I'm curious. Can I ask you question on your own, Patrash? What had you like, what had you say yes? Like what had you feel the resonance and move towards it? Sasha Pearl: It does. Lauren: Because you easily could have said no. Sasha Pearl: Well, I had no idea what you and Chelsea were doing. But all I knew is that I didn't want to be in bed that weekend. It felt really important to go do something differently, something that I thought would be... It was uncomfortable to go in the sense like I didn't know anyone who was going either. And I've never done a weekend retreat with a bunch of people before. But I was just like, whatever I'm doing right now is not working. And I was so deeply in my masculine. deeply like in like it's only one way or the highway and like really like leaving that retreat and having this whole new well first of all I got to be in my feminine because I got to cry and like I think even at the retreat I was like Something about, ⁓ me not crying means that I'm in power, in control, like, ⁓ yeah, like more in control. Where in actuality, that's completely disconnecting from my soul, from my humanness. And so to be able to be held in a container, connect with nature, the ancient technologies, which I wanna talk about that in moment, was just so like, ⁓ my God, I missed the fucking point. I literally missed the fucking point. And so leaving that retreat, I was like, I can't do my life this way. Also, I'm changing my goddamn name, apparently. And that was a whole other story. But that is the type of work where it's like, the remembering is so fucking true. Like it can be so far in the background, but by the end of the retreat, it's something where you like move forward enough to even bring it into an awareness and consciousness. Because Chelsea kept activating me. I was like, so annoyed. was like, I'm so annoyed. Lauren: Ha Sasha Pearl: I would ask a question because I'm trying to control the narrative, control how I'm going to say something. And she's like, well, what do you think? Well, what do you think it means? means whatever you want it to mean. And I'm like, I will, I will murder someone. Lauren: I remember that. You were also so chill in that moment. You wouldn't have guessed that you're like, I'm going to fucking cut you. Can I swear on here? just, I just swear. But like, cause you're just, you're like so cute and funny and you're just like, okay. And meanwhile, but I also love, want to like bottom line what you just said. Cause I think a lot of folks like, okay. So this is the case with the beauty way. also, my sense is that this is also the case with any kind of change that you experience, right? Our minds do not like change. don't. Sasha Pearl: Yeah Lauren: And also the whole, world, like everything in our world is like, be smart, be logical, have it figured out. What's the 10 point plan? Do you have the Excel spreadsheet? And by the way, have you figured out these other 50 things yet? So within that model, of course you're like, you're even like, when you're inside of it, it feels like that is the solution, that you just have to run harder and figure it out harder. And then when you go to drop that model, like you want out of it, but when you go to drop that model, and I've seen this a million times and I've also experienced this a million times, where then your brain, your mind gets really loud and will try to like all of your control strategies get louder. Like, and being able to actually, and what I was so proud of you for is the way that you held yourself through that. You witnessed it. You were like, huh. And like, you didn't let it take you out. You kept walking and that's really what it takes. to change, to shift this because that the roots of the old, of the thing that we've been taught where it's like we have to control, dominate and work harder to be joyful and successful. First off, it's not true. And also those roots are deep and usually go all the way back into our lineages. And what I think you found that was really cool. And what also I am perpetually humbled by is that the roots of this other way of being are even deeper and they're right freaking there. if you can just allow yourself to be in this kind of space and like go, which is what you did. And I was just like so freaking proud of you. Cause it's, I mean, I, I'll say when I went through this kind of thing, I did not go willingly. Like I, I, Sasha Pearl: but I don't think I was. Lauren: I just, I like fought like a motherfucker. I think a lot of people do. And so do you, you don't feel like you did go willingly? Yeah. Sasha Pearl: No, I did go willingly, but I didn't know what I was signing up for, because if I knew what I was signing up for, I probably wouldn't have gone willingly. No. ⁓ But something that I want to also underline there, it's like you mentioned essentially having the resilience to keep moving forward at this retreat. this is the power of actually being in a container with other women walking the same path as you, because I don't know. Lauren: I know, I don't think you would have actually... It can be a blessing to not know. Yeah, yeah. Sasha Pearl: if I would have chosen that if I was by myself. I don't know if I would have chosen that alone. And so to have other people who are getting activated, crying, getting like screen, like I don't want to sound like it's crazy, but somatic work here people. Lauren: Yes. Somatic work can be, somatic work can have some intensity. Uh-huh. Sasha Pearl: And I like it's just such a powerful way to not only connect with yourself but connect with yourself in community without losing your autonomy is very, very powerful. Lauren: Well, and I think that's a really important piece too, because it's, I don't know about you, love. I'm like really, I I just said this on a podcast with Chelsea the other day, actually, I had her on mine and I was like, I would have done this work alone for the rest of my life if I had had my own way. I, I'm so, I love people. My whole job is around people and I love people. And also I'm like, leave me alone. Leave me alone. I'm gonna go do this alone. I can like the individualism, like it runs as shit runs deep and yeah. I'm like, please, Exactly. Well, cause usually then you're in a community and there's all this stuff and now you gotta like, you know, there's like, now we have to tend to all of these things that wouldn't be here if I were by myself and. Sasha Pearl: We're so similar in that. I'm like, will do it faster my way. Thank you. I don't want your approval. Thank you. I'm just gonna go do it. Just approve. Get on board to get off. just don't. And I'm like, time is a-ticking, people. Lauren: Time is ticking. I'm like, actually don't at least for me, I'm same. would not there. I wouldn't. I would not be here without that community component. And I also would we would not be having the level of impact we were having without that community component. So I'm a huge like, follow your intuition, listen to your body person, almost like with the exception of the community piece where I'm like, if you're standing on the edge of I don't know if I want to do this in a group or like in community and there's resistance there. I'm like, yes, all of us have resistance to that. And like, that's where the magic is. Obviously, you know, trust yourself. I don't want to completely gaslight your audience, but it's, there's, it really is. I love that you spoke to that because it really is like the missing ingredient, I think in a lot of spaces, unfortunately. Sasha Pearl: And here's the thing too, when we are about to engage in community events, we're literally meant to be there. Like the universe is literally always working this little puzzle magic because you had to experience something bad, good in between neutral or not, right? Like you were meant to be in any, like any situation that you're here for, right? Like there is a lesson that your soul wants to learn from it, wants to... be in abundance of or overflow around, right? Like I just really feel like everything happens for a reason and we get to be mirrors and reflections of that beauty. Lauren: Yeah, and I'm sure you've gotten to see that too with Wild Well and Wealthy and what you've built there. Because sometimes even as a facilitator, I'm floored, right? Where the women end up in the space and suddenly you're exchanging. It's like you've no idea why that woman is sitting next to you and then she starts talking about something and you're like, that's so weird. That's what I'm handling. Or they just walked through something where they have wisdom for you. Or someone looks at you and goes, hey, love, by the way, your name's not Lindsay, it's Sasha. These sorts of tidbits can only happen in community. And so, I don't know, that's like a real place where I'm like, pushing past resistance is a good thing. And it can bring up so many things for us. Like, community in many ways is where so many of our pains and wounds and traumas were born. So that's not to like minimize. It can be really uncomfortable, but it can be really beautiful. Sasha Pearl: Yeah, 100%. I'm the, yeah, the beauty way is, yeah, I always say I'm like the beauty way changed my life, like for the better. And it's just, it's just something that you guys have to, I know. can't even, I'm like, there aren't even words to describe the transformation that happens in these, in these like weekend retreats. But definitely go check out their website. They just launched one, which is great. Lauren: Thank you, love. Okay, you all if you are listening to this, you need to understand something we I think also a lot of people who are in spiritual spaces can identify with this where it's like you are tapping into this thing and you're like how the hell do I put this into human language? Because the felt sense of the things feels so much larger than words and then it can almost feel like hard to hand off to somebody and like you're like no, cuz I don't want you to like ruin the magic and we Love, handed this to Y'all, we handed this to Sasha and she somehow took it and made it, gave it form in a way that I never would have possibly imagined. Chelsea and I just keep going back. Like we've, I think all of our traffic is us actually, just looking at our website, going like, this is so good. We love this so much. So this is, I just have to shoot. I have to talk you up there for a minute. Yeah. Sasha Pearl: And I mean, as you guys can hear, I'm a self-projected, so you can hear my passion for this retreat through my voice. But this is because I got to experience it in such depth and with such opportunity, I was able to really lean into the visual aspects and the branding of it. I was like, I know. I was like, I got you. Chelsea did not want a website. Lauren: Yeah, we had to fight we had some of these structures we had to like we were like, okay, I know, like ⁓ an LLC and a business banking account and a Cal and Lee like all of these it's like, ⁓ god, the business structures but and now we're here actually now we're here and we're like having a ton of fun. Who knew who knew that shit could be fun. Sasha Pearl: Yeah. Well, if you think about the feminine, needs to exist in the structure so you can be more feminine. So it's just nice to have like the team, the council to like really support that. And just for anyone who's listening, Chelsea is the co-founder of The Garden, the co-facilitator of The Beauty Way and Lauren's soul bestie. Anything else you want to describe us? Lauren: Yes. Yeah, she was like a co-parent of this thing. And yeah, Chelsea's brilliant. So one of the things to know about Chelsea and the medicine she brings is that she was initiated into shamanism when she was 13. So she studied with indigenous wisdom keepers for years, who then looked at her and said, we want you to bring this out into the world because we think it's going to help it heal, basically. Sasha Pearl: So cool. Lauren: And so she's been given permission for certain ceremonial practices that we weave in throughout the couple of days. And I'm really fortunate to be able to partner with her on it because she's like a literal force of nature. And she's a literal force of nature. Like when you think about the five elements, like there should really just be a sixth and one of them is Chelsea. Sasha Pearl: It was just her birthday. I'm like you should have said that to her on her birthday. Lauren: I know, I just realized, I like, that was good. That just came right out of me. It came right out of me. Sasha Pearl: Okay, so like you did both individually are forces of nature and like your own unique ways. So like it's literally a powerhouse dynamic for, ⁓ for what they're bringing into the world. And if you're in local to bend, you're going to get a little piece of them because they're offering a workshop called trusting the unseen. So I don't know if you want to talk a little bit about that now. Lauren: Thank you love. Yes, totally. And I'm cognizant, too, of the folks who are listening to this who are like, I'm not going to be in Bender. I have no interest in attending an initiation. And I think the thing I want to say broadly about this is like, well, so trusting the unseen is an event. But the energy we're working with isn't something that's accessible, right? Which is, ⁓ in many ways in the world, we're taught to prioritize a certain way of knowing. ⁓ I mean, I even just spent probably 20 minutes earlier rattling off all of the research that I've done, because I can have a ton of fun there. Sometimes that's a beautiful thing. And many of us have these more subtle ways of knowing in our bodies, and actually even being able to kind of communicate with the Earth and with our surroundings in a way that we are always getting signs. And a lot of times that might feel really true for some people listening. That might feel really like, wacky and not accessible for some people listening, but often that experience of like, there's something subtle at play here, but I can't quite give language to it. That's part of our magic as humans. Like that's part of what it means to be human and the intelligence that we actually have access to. That is also a technology and we've just forgotten it. And so, you know, in the beauty way and trusting the unseen and our work in the garden is really around learning to trust that. And tangibly, like that matters, right? Because I think also as women and men, mean, regardless of gender identity, right? Like how often have we had the experience where we have a sense that something isn't a good idea or is or. that we really want to do something or that we're being called to something, but then we like shit on it or like, that's not real. I can't do that. That's not logical. And like, it costs us in our lives. And so really being able to cultivate that relationship of trust of like, no, when I get a knowing when something drops in, I listen to it. And the difference that can make in your life and also in the world, because honestly, that's how a lot of really big ideas come through that like we need is a collective right now. that's the energy that we're really learning that we're working with at Trusting the Unseen, where it's like really having a felt experience of what it's like to move through life with this and interfacing with this way of knowing and technology such that you leave and it's like, ⁓ I can locate it now in my body. Like, I don't have to work so hard. can kind of, as I move through the world, go, ⁓ right, this is actually what I know and trust it and move with it. Sasha Pearl: Yeah. And with all the work that Lauren and Chelsea like put into the world, it's going to be deep and it will be activating. I will be there. So come say hi. Lauren: Yeah, we work like we work in the activation space, which is very different from like what I used to do in many actually maybe not, but I it was a newer way of working where it's it's there's a there's a way that ⁓ energy can kind of move through the space where it turns things on versus like going in through the mind or And I'm sure, you you've had that experience probably even just in life where you're like, ⁓ I'm changed now that that thing occurred. And it's, like that. Yeah. ⁓ Sasha Pearl: Yeah, the beauty way. I do want to talk about, I found it really interesting when we first started the podcast, you were talking about love and you said, you said this as if people actually understood it, which is why I want to bring it back. You're like love, but not in the way that people assume love to be, right? And so I want to kind of talk, I want to talk about love, this word for you and like, is the true meaning of, or what is the meaning of it? And then, Lauren: Okay. Yeah. Sasha Pearl: You keep saying ancient technology. And I also wanna go into, wait, we're not talking about a computer, this microphone, us, the internet. We're talking about our internal technology. And so what's that about? So let's start with love. So what is the current belief of what love is in the societal norm? Obviously people have their own definitions. And then what is your belief around the word love? Lauren: ⁓ my God. Hell yeah, awesome question. So love in my experience when I bring it to my clients as an ethic or a posture or way of being, like this is just the broad experience I have in the world, is that we have an assumption that it means being soft, ⁓ weak, like having a, what's it called, like weak spine. What's the phrase? Weak spine? Spineless, right? Sasha Pearl: Spineless? Lauren: Yeah, so we assume love means being weak, spineless, people please eat, or that love means you can just have everything. You know, my time, my attention, and you know, one of the most loving creatures on the planet is a mama bear around her cubs. And have you ever gotten in between a mother bear and her cubs? If you have, you probably aren't listening to this podcast because you're probably dead. like, so love takes many forms, right? Love can be nurturing like a mother. Love can be, Sasha Pearl: Mm. Lauren: you know, just give, give, give, and how do I just give as much compassion as possible? Sometimes compassion and love take the form of fire, of I love you so much, I'm going to tell you this directly, because I believe in you enough to tell you the truth. And sometimes those are actually the hardest moments, right? Or even in relationships, right? Like love just means harmony. Like love just means like we have to get along. it's like, no, sometimes the most loving moments are like you are in breakdown, you're on the, you're about to tap out and say, I can't do this anymore. You want to punch someone in the face and you show up anyway, bypassing any part of your experience, but in truth and in partnership and like holding the container and going like, I don't know what to do with all of this, but I'm going to still show up for you. And I want to see what happens. Sasha Pearl: Ugh, wow, that's powerful. Lauren: Yeah. like that as a, to me, that's actually the spiritual practice that gets to transcend any kind of relationship to a deity, a spiritual framework, any of that, regardless of whether you call yourself a Christian mystic, a Tibetan or an atheist, that's the kind of power that like changes the world, in my opinion. Sasha Pearl: 100%. This is such, I would say, a powerful belief system on love and a complete reframe on love. So how did you find that? Like, how did this come to be from your perspective? Is it through everything that you've learned from, you know, in the head? Is it through lived experiences? Where did it just drop in and it was given to you? Like, how did you, like, this is, it's such a beautiful, like, literal vessel. Lauren: I'm sitting with like, how the hell do I answer that? So, should put schnikes on the internet. that's a really good question. Thank you. Sasha Pearl: Yeah. Lauren: I think I've been a devotee of this energy for a really long time when I was really little. I don't know if I ever told you this. My mom was really sick. Did I ever tell you that? I grew up with a mom who, giant heart, so loving, but had a lot of chronic pain. so love for me when I was little, I got really good at showing up for people when they were in pain, because that was my... Sasha Pearl: I Lauren: sort of ethos. So I got good at that young and then later the lesson had to be love outside of caretaking or like love still while I have a self. Right? Like there were these codes that I just, like those codes were important but there were ones that were missing that needed to get upgraded. And I think more recently some of the lessons around like love can be ferocious. Sasha Pearl: Okay. Lauren: love sometimes looks at systems of power and is like, I will burn you down. it's sometimes like, you know, Kali is also loving from the Hindu tradition. And like, and for those who are listening, Kali is the Hindu goddess of death, rebirth and rage. Right? And like, so for me, even recently, some of these energies of like, around like activism and kind of looking more at social change and how are we actually reimagining the structures of our world and our communities has required a level of like, this doesn't mean that we look at systems of oppression or injustices or violence out in the world and just go like, ⁓ we'll just love you and that'll be okay. Sometimes love is fiery. Sometimes it takes action. And that's been recent. That's been more like in the last... for four five years with some social justice work I was doing and really holding that with love as an ethic and seeing love in its many forms there. So I don't know, that's a really long answer. There's probably more, but that's the high level. That's the clear. Sasha Pearl: I just feel that society has been conditioned. Like, obviously there's a type of love, there's like being in love. And I just feel like the movies are doing us a disservice of what love is. It's like the Cinderella love or like the Disney love or like, you know what I mean? And so to your point earlier, it's like, ⁓ yeah, that is, yeah, society does think of it as this like soft, as this like, you know, I will give all of myself to this other person and that's love. Where actually it's the autonomy. Lauren: Yeah. Yeah. And it's been defanged. That's part of it, right? Like, we skip over the part in the Bible, and I can't believe I'm about to make a Bible reference. Like, my old self would have been like, what? ⁓ But like, the part that we skip over in the Bible is that right before Jesus was arrested and crucified, he went into the temple and was flipping tables. Like, He literally made such a scene that he had to be escorted out because he was looking at systems of power and saying, absolutely not. And this was a man whose whole life was about the embodiment of love. Now you could look at that and you could say, well, he faltered. You could look at that and say, maybe he was just human. Or you could look at that and say, no, that's one of the many faces that love can take. And so can we revere that too? Sasha Pearl: Yeah, wow, that's really interesting. I'm also like, sitting here, hearing you speak about love and I'm like, your incarnation cross is literally the vessel of love. Her core gift is the gate 15, the love for humanity and like the gate of extremes. So like to really understand all perspectives of literally everything is part of like you. I'm like, oh my God, the alignment here. Lauren: Yeah. It can also, y'all can be a little tumultuous sometimes. It's consequence of that. Cause I'm like, oh, there's like a corner of my psyche that I like, oh, it's shadow. That's like, how do I love this little like demon gargoyle like part of myself or this person, you know, and there it's part of the lesson, you know, I'm not, I'm figuring it out as we go, but thank you for that. It's like cool hearing it grounded in my human design. Cause I haven't actually revisited a lot of this in Sasha Pearl: Yes! Yeah. Yeah. And I'm going to ask you just two more questions and we'll wrap it up. So I would love to hear a little bit more on the ancient technology aspect because you hear ancient, I'm like way past not relevant. And then I hear technology and I'm like future forward here now. tell me I need more information. I've never heard of ancient technology. Lauren: Yeah. Yeah, so okay, this was like mind bendy for me too. And also, by the way, my North node, my North node, yeah, is no, it's my mid heavens and Taurus, North node, which is about life's purpose is Aquarius. And I used to look at this and I was like, the fuck does that mean? I don't know what any of that means. Aquarius is all about tech, new, like it's about technologies and like evolution of the collective broadly. There's a lot you'd say on Aquarius, Aquarius is in my 11th house. Sasha Pearl: A Quirt. What house are you in? Do you know? ⁓ and that one's spirituality? Lauren: That one is ⁓ collective health. 12th is spirituality, 11th is, yeah, the collective. Sasha Pearl: Okay, so both Lauren and I have Aquarius in our north node and mine's in my fifth house of creativity though and children. No, I know. Lauren: Yeah. ⁓ that's interesting. ⁓ that's cool. Wait, that makes so much sense. Well, because an Aquarius has this technology energy, right? And so we think of technology like computer. I'm looking at a wireless keyboard and my microphone and my iPhone and Claude is running in the background. And it's like we've forgotten actually that there is a technology of what it means to be human. That ancient cultures knew and revered and centered. There's a technology of how our nervous systems actually sync up with each other around our somatics, around how our bodies process information and our ability to access intuition and spirit. There's also technology of ceremony and ritual and our interface with the earth that ancient cultures and indigenous cultures, it's not old, indigenous cultures still hold this wisdom. We still. They still, like, those are technologies too. We've just been taught that they're not or to look down upon them, but they are actually just as powerful, if not more. Especially when we fully unlock what's possible there, i.e., right, through our connection to God, Spirit, something larger than ourselves. Like you've even experienced like the technology of our dreams, of being able to receive downloads of. Creative forces move that moving through communities of community organization of ritual like some of these things can't be explained ⁓ science is starting to catch up with them, but When we're able to actually Plug into those ancient technologies and center them and like allow them to lead literal freaking magic happens And that's I'm that's coming from my like PhD brain that likes to understand like it's inexplicable What's possible? So that's how I describe it Sasha Pearl: Wow. I actually want to do like a whole other podcast on this and like how to like integrate ancient technology into everything. So we're gonna, we're gonna pause on that because we're, setting up another podcast with you. ⁓ and then my final question, if someone were to really know you, what would they need to know about you? Lauren: Hell yeah! Mm. Mmm. Mmm. I... Let's see. I think the thing I want to say is that at the core of who I am, know, there are a lot of these things that I do that I know about that I like leading people through. And fundamentally, I am deeply freaking sensitive, like really feel things so deeply that we know one of the reasons I found myself on this path was because my inner world felt so big and unruly and beyond language. that I actually in many ways couldn't hold it by myself and given like using the tools that I was given. But now that I have the tools, now that I, and I certainly have moments where I still like have, where I'm like, woof, where I still get overwhelmed by the depth of feeling. But baby, now that I have the tools, I'm like, ⁓ my God, the ability to feel everything is... I would not trade it for anything in the world. Sasha Pearl: Yeah, that's massive. Because a lot of people are so afraid of feeling. Lauren: Yeah. Yeah, and I still get scared. I still have moments where I'm like, ooh, that feels really big. But I think that's actually one of the reasons why I love what I do, because that doesn't scare me and other people anymore. I know what it's like to be scared of that. ⁓ And I also think that that's literally where our magic is. If we can. breathe through it, like learn that we can actually breathe through that and in the dark. Sasha Pearl: I love that so much. Okay, the last, where can people reach you? How can they find you? We'll also have this in the show notes too. Lauren: Yeah. ⁓ So I am somewhat active on my Instagram at Dr. Borden. ⁓ You should absolutely check out our website at RememberingTheGarden.com. ⁓ You can reach out to us there. ⁓ We have all kinds of amazing goodies and ways of getting involved that are of different levels, right? So if you just want to play for free and get a taste, if you are ready for the full shebang, ⁓ and also Sasha has created it, so it's actually like. kind of fun to just be on. ⁓ And of course, I'm actually always hungry to connect with people. So don't be shy if that's something that you want to drop in and connect. Sasha Pearl: Awesome, amazing. We'll also have all the links in the show notes for you. And Lauren, thank you so much for being on. This was incredible and I can't wait for the next one. Lauren: We're gonna talk about ancient technology. It's gonna be great. I love you so much. Thank you so much for having me love. This was freaking great. Sasha Pearl: Stay tuned! ⁓