Latest / Next Act with Jeff Ornstein / Lauren Sowa - Actor, Filmmaker & Co-Founder, Form & Pressure Films

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Lauren Sowa - Actor, Filmmaker & Co-Founder, Form & Pressure Films · Next Act with Jeff Ornstein

• 0:01
  Jeff Ornstein: Hi everyone, and welcome to Next Act with Jeff Orenstein.
• 0:05
  Jeff Ornstein: I am Jeff, and on this show we celebrate people on the cusp of greatness.
• 0:10
  Jeff Ornstein: Those building on past successes in some of the curious and inventive and sometimes unexpected ways they have achieved those, and stepping into moments that could define their legacy.
• 0:21
  Jeff Ornstein: We'll talk about current projects, lessons learned, and the extraordinary opportunities ahead.
• 0:27
  Jeff Ornstein: So the best is yet to come.
• 0:29
  Jeff Ornstein: Today's guest is Lauren Soa, New York-based actor, filmmaker, and co-founder of Form in Pressure Films, a production company dedicated to diversity and equality on set and on screen.
• 0:41
  Jeff Ornstein: A Tish trained performer with credits on HBO, CBS, and Amazon Prime, Lauren has evolved from working in front of the camera to producing and directing award-winning independent films, including Marisol, which won the Huff Post Impact Award and was licensed by HBO.
• 0:57
  Jeff Ornstein: Welcome to the show.
• 0:59
  Lauren Sowa: Thank you so much for having me.
• 1:00
  Jeff Ornstein: You're quite welcome.
• 1:01
  Jeff Ornstein: So congratulations on getting your BFA at the Tisch School of the Arts.
• 1:06
  Jeff Ornstein: It's an impressive academic distinction.
• 1:08
  Jeff Ornstein: And you started your acting career in Philadelphia.
• 1:12
  Jeff Ornstein: Can you tell us what kinds of productions you were in?
• 1:14
  Jeff Ornstein: They were film or theater.
• 1:17
  Lauren Sowa: Yeah, I actually started acting professionally when I was a kid, so around age seven.
• 1:22
  Lauren Sowa: And I grew up just outside of Philly, well, a little bit south of Philly in a in a place called Lancaster, Pennsylvania.
• 1:28
  Lauren Sowa: Best known for cornfields and the Amish.
• 1:31
  Lauren Sowa: Beautiful place to grow up.
• 1:33
  Lauren Sowa: And um I was fortunate to start dancing at a very young age and then singing and acting, all you know, from a place of having fun as a kid.
• 1:43
  Lauren Sowa: And I I guess it was something that I took to naturally.
• 1:46
  Lauren Sowa: So I started working as a kid mostly in theater at that time.
• 1:50
  Lauren Sowa: Then when I went to school, I came to New York to attend NYU.
• 1:55
  Lauren Sowa: And that's sort of where things really took off.
• 1:57
  Jeff Ornstein: So I'm going to jump right into this because some of our other guests have made this similar sort of transition.
• 2:03
  Jeff Ornstein: When you're an actor, you, you know, I know when I started studying, you get the mantra stay in your lane.
• 2:11
  Jeff Ornstein: Stay in your lane.
• 2:12
  Jeff Ornstein: Don't try and write, don't try and direct, just stay in your lane.
• 2:15
  Jeff Ornstein: You're there to act.
• 2:16
  Jeff Ornstein: And some of our other guests have shared that while they loved acting, they sort of missed what they felt might be creative opportunities for them to express their theatrical visions by not being a writer or a director.
• 2:32
  Jeff Ornstein: So what was it that sparked you to say, hey, you know, maybe I want to be on the other side of the camera?
• 2:39
  Lauren Sowa: You know, for me it was a little bit different.
• 2:41
  Lauren Sowa: I think it was around 2016 when Trump was first elected.
• 2:49
  Lauren Sowa: And I, up until that point, had been doing, you know, theater, film, and television as an actor and having a great time, honestly, playing some amazing roles, uh, traveling the country, really having a wonderful time.
• 3:03
  Lauren Sowa: But for me, it was more so that I felt this need to say something more with my art.
• 3:09
  Lauren Sowa: I felt that for me, artistic expression was a wonderful way to connect with people, to build community, to create empathy, things that I really wanted to see grow in our country specifically.
• 3:24
  Lauren Sowa: And so around that time, I felt very spurred to start making my own work.
• 3:29
  Lauren Sowa: And it was also kind of combined with for myself as an actor, I had played incredible roles in theater.
• 3:37
  Lauren Sowa: And when I started transitioning to doing a lot of film and television, at that time, I just felt the roles I was auditioning for were not as complex and interesting as the roles I had played on stage.
• 3:49
  Lauren Sowa: And so I really wanted to start seeking out people who were creating the kind of work on screen that I had been doing on stage.
• 3:57
  Lauren Sowa: So that was sort of those two things combined for me, sort of the political climate and my desire to use art as a form of activism and my sort of disillusionment with the parts I was being considered for wanting to create opportunities for myself as an actor.
• 4:14
  Lauren Sowa: And so that's how it started is really from a place of facilitating more creative opportunities on screen.
• 4:20
  Jeff Ornstein: That's pretty powerful because it's sort of, you know, you're combining your love of the arts and your determination to have a voice in the where society's going and what's the direction.
• 4:33
  Jeff Ornstein: And is it important to express an alternative view of what's important, what should be important to us in society?
• 4:40
  Jeff Ornstein: And certainly, women and minorities took some serious hits in the first administration of the Trump fiasco.
• 4:49
  Jeff Ornstein: So I think that's really powerful.
• 4:51
  Jeff Ornstein: This group that you've started, PANO, co-president of Pano supporting women and gender expansion in filmmakers, with all of the things that women in our industry have endured, and in politics in the Me Too movement and the Weinstein disaster, and now you know all the Epstein victims coming to light.
• 5:11
  Jeff Ornstein: How are you kind of trying to reinforce opportunities that can't be belittled, like you felt when you you were editioning for films, or or taken away in your women and gender expansive attempts?
• 5:26
  Lauren Sowa: Yeah, I mean, Pano was a nonprofit that was in operation from around 2016 up through just the end of last year.
• 5:36
  Lauren Sowa: So we shut down at the end of 2025.
• 5:38
  Lauren Sowa: And Sidney Hugh is the founder of that organization, and and she and I co-led it for a majority of its run.
• 5:47
  Lauren Sowa: And it was an incredible community to be a part of.
• 5:50
  Lauren Sowa: It started in a very grassroots, organic way of a bunch of women, some had gone to film school, some had not, really wanting to learn and grow together.
• 6:00
  Lauren Sowa: And I think in that time, in that decade of operating, we did create a lot of impact.
• 6:04
  Lauren Sowa: We focused a lot on education, on building community, on small grants for the community, and then showcasing our members' work, always trying to create more opportunities and increase inclusion in the industry as a whole.
• 6:19
  Lauren Sowa: That's always been our goal.
• 6:20
  Lauren Sowa: I think there's there are a lot of women in film and other marginalized folks who are working really hard every day through various nonprofits and communities to try to create better representation in media.
• 6:34
  Lauren Sowa: You know, I think media is still our greatest influencer.
• 6:38
  Lauren Sowa: I mean, you know, we learned this during lockdown as well that when when folks come home, they want to watch something.
• 6:44
  Lauren Sowa: You know, if they're stuck inside, they want to watch something.
• 6:47
  Lauren Sowa: Our work is other people's entertainment, our work is other people's comfort.
• 6:52
  Lauren Sowa: And yet it is still not funded well in this country.
• 6:56
  Lauren Sowa: It is not a real representation of the people who live in this country.
• 7:00
  Lauren Sowa: So it is, you know, unfortunately, Panno is no longer in operation, but the mission continues.
• 7:06
  Lauren Sowa: And I think the impact, the impact that we created continues as well.
• 7:09
  Lauren Sowa: So now we have thousands of members who were a part of Pan O who are out there in the world making their films, hiring other women and marginalized folks.
• 7:19
  Lauren Sowa: And um, you know, we hope, I hope, that that legacy continues for a long time.
• 7:24
  Lauren Sowa: I think in a lot of ways we have made progress over the years, but in other ways some of that progress has gone backwards.
• 7:33
  Lauren Sowa: So it's it's an endless struggle.
• 7:36
  Lauren Sowa: I think I've been trying to de-stress my life in a way, which is kind of hilarious because anyone who's a producer knows that it's impossible and producing is inherently stressful.
• 7:46
  Lauren Sowa: But I think I got so bogged down in the statistics and the how difficult it is in this industry.
• 7:54
  Lauren Sowa: And I have to sort of in a way stop thinking about that so much and really focus on just the love of it.
• 8:02
  Lauren Sowa: You know, I I'm an artist because I feel called to do that and also because I just love it.
• 8:07
  Lauren Sowa: It's one of the best jobs in the world.
• 8:09
  Lauren Sowa: You know, no matter what position you're in, obviously acting is is a very full-body experience, very inside-outside experience.
• 8:18
  Lauren Sowa: And, you know, producing can be a bit more logistical.
• 8:22
  Lauren Sowa: But being a part of a community that continues to create art and tell stories that matter, that can change the world for the better, that's something that I take really seriously and that I just love and have committed my life to.
• 8:35
  Jeff Ornstein: Right.
• 8:36
  Jeff Ornstein: Well, you're absolutely right.
• 8:38
  Jeff Ornstein: I mean, it's not an industry for the faint of heart, and people do it for the passion.
• 8:43
  Jeff Ornstein: And women have been very successful.
• 8:46
  Jeff Ornstein: I would I would salute you that there's been strides in women getting recognized for in front and behind the camera in our industry, perhaps because it's a receptive audience for equality.
• 8:58
  Jeff Ornstein: But I think that the Pano, um I'm I'm appreciate the fact that Pano made a dent, and I think that it's going in the right direction, though not cross all the societal lines.
• 9:09
  Jeff Ornstein: I did have a chance to view a little bit of Marisol, and that seems like a very powerful film.
• 9:15
  Jeff Ornstein: Can you tell us a little bit about that?
• 9:17
  Jeff Ornstein: In particular, I was intrigued by the main character.
• 9:20
  Lauren Sowa: Absolutely.
• 9:21
  Lauren Sowa: Yes.
• 9:21
  Lauren Sowa: So Marisol was actually the very first film I ever produced, and that was inspired by Trump's rhetoric around immigration back in his first term when he was running.
• 9:33
  Lauren Sowa: And my husband, Tim, and I decided we wanted to make a film.
• 9:36
  Lauren Sowa: He wrote the film and I produced it.
• 9:39
  Lauren Sowa: We hired a wonderful director named Zoe Sali Kropunko to direct.
• 9:43
  Lauren Sowa: And our whole goal in creating that film was to tell a very human story that would hopefully create empathy in the viewer because what we were witnessing, and unfortunately, I think it's only gotten worse, is this sort of dehumanization of people.
• 10:00
  Lauren Sowa: Specifically at that time, it was around, you know, undocumented immigrants.
• 10:04
  Lauren Sowa: But it's only gotten worse now in the second administration.
• 10:07
  Lauren Sowa: And so we felt this desire to create a piece of work that would show basically a hardworking mother who, by all measures, is a model citizen, but she's not a citizen.
• 10:20
  Lauren Sowa: So you see, you know, throughout the course of the film, her going about her day, working with her daughter.
• 10:26
  Lauren Sowa: And then there's a situation where she has a run-in with the police, and it becomes very dangerous very quickly for her, knowing her status in the country.
• 10:34
  Lauren Sowa: And our hope was to bring it around the country to different film festivals and to screen it and to start conversations about, you know, this issue, which at the time was a very political issue and still is in a lot of ways.
• 10:49
  Lauren Sowa: I mean, I don't want this whole podcast to be about politics, but it's very hard to detach art and politics.
• 10:55
  Lauren Sowa: All art is political in a way, um, for better or worse.
• 10:59
  Lauren Sowa: And, you know, I I do think that we we did create a lot of good conversations at the time.
• 11:05
  Lauren Sowa: And we were very fortunate to have it licensed by HBO.
• 11:08
  Lauren Sowa: So it ran on HBO and HBO Latino for two years.
• 11:12
  Lauren Sowa: And that was such a gift because film festivals are wonderful and and have, you know, a good local reach, but to have more eyes on it around the country and around the world was incredible.
• 11:24
  Lauren Sowa: And yeah, that's always the hope is that your work will be seen and enjoyed and make an impact.
• 11:30
  Lauren Sowa: You can't control what that impact will be, but that's what I strive for with each film.
• 11:35
  Lauren Sowa: And I'm I'm very drawn to making work that has some form of social impact.
• 11:40
  Lauren Sowa: Um, so different themes or, you know, storytelling devices.
• 11:44
  Lauren Sowa: I I try to choose what I'm working on um pretty carefully.
• 11:48
  Lauren Sowa: And yeah, sometimes you you just want to put something joyful into the world.
• 11:52
  Lauren Sowa: Film I made recently is quite joyful, but sometimes you have to speak truth to power, and that's that's an artist's responsibility, you know.
• 11:58
  Jeff Ornstein: Right.
• 11:58
  Jeff Ornstein: Get the conversation going.
• 12:00
  Jeff Ornstein: So did you know this is it, this is an award-winning film, this is a this is really gonna get traction and have recognition.
• 12:10
  Lauren Sowa: I don't think you can ever really know.
• 12:12
  Lauren Sowa: I mean, you you you make a film and you always hope for the best, but you do kind of make it a little bit in in a vacuum and and it's not really until it's out in the world and people are seeing it.
• 12:23
  Lauren Sowa: That's sort of when the film is fully complete, because the audience, that's that's why we do it, you know?
• 12:29
  Lauren Sowa: So I I think I've stopped trying to predict things like that and really more so think about what kind of impact I want it to have on the audience.
• 12:38
  Lauren Sowa: Because sometimes you think, oh yeah, this one's amazing, and then it doesn't quite hit in the way you expected.
• 12:42
  Lauren Sowa: And sometimes you think, I don't know about this one, and then it really, really resonates with people.
• 12:47
  Lauren Sowa: So I think that's kind of cool because ultimately the viewer will decide.
• 12:51
  Lauren Sowa: And, you know, awards, they they come and go and they're nice to have, but what's longer lasting, I think, is what are you saying with your art and you know, will it have staying power?
• 13:03
  Lauren Sowa: Will it mean something in five, ten years or not?
• 13:06
  Jeff Ornstein: So one of the frequently discussed topics with my guests for young filmmakers is funding.
• 13:14
  Jeff Ornstein: So I'm just gonna go back to the HBO film and Marisol and say by having that kind of exposure and having that access to greater audiences, did that help you get investors for some of you and and I guess your husband's projects?
• 13:29
  Lauren Sowa: I wish I could say yes.
• 13:30
  Lauren Sowa: I think it's hard to measure in some ways, because I think it lends credibility, for sure.
• 13:38
  Lauren Sowa: An easy way to measure that would be someone sees the film, reaches out, says, I saw the film, and here's some money for your next project.
• 13:45
  Lauren Sowa: That certainly didn't happen.
• 13:47
  Lauren Sowa: That didn't happen.
• 13:49
  Lauren Sowa: But I do think that for myself, through producing and then eventually directing and running Pano, I think all of those things combined with yes, festivals, awards, HBO, et cetera, and my acting, I think it all kind of comes together to create a credibility that people can trust you, that you have, you know, a certain level of taste or ability or follow-through.
• 14:13
  Lauren Sowa: Um, and those things certainly matter, you know, as you increase your budget levels.
• 14:17
  Lauren Sowa: Right.
• 14:18
  Lauren Sowa: But, you know, I do think funding is is the major issue still.
• 14:22
  Lauren Sowa: It's unfortunately true, even high up in the, you know, in the ranks of things, like it's I I hear stories of quite famous filmmakers who can't get their films funded.
• 14:31
  Lauren Sowa: So it is, it's a part of the struggle of living in America where arts are not are not supported at the government level necessarily.
• 14:40
  Lauren Sowa: And it's also, I think, a a part of, you know, I went to drama school.
• 14:44
  Lauren Sowa: I I studied as an actor.
• 14:46
  Lauren Sowa: I didn't go to business school, I didn't go to film school.
• 14:49
  Lauren Sowa: And there's a lot of people like me out there making things and coming at it with a love of the craft and the art form and the storytelling aspect and having to learn the business stuff and the industry stuff on the go.
• 15:01
  Lauren Sowa: And I think for some people it's easier than others to talk about money or to ask for money.
• 15:07
  Lauren Sowa: I do think fundraising is a is a skill and it's something that can be learned, but it's it's hard won, you know.
• 15:14
  Jeff Ornstein: You learn by the school of hard knocks.
• 15:16
  Jeff Ornstein: I'm a designer and I was a designer for years before I started my firm, and then all of a sudden I'm a business owner.
• 15:22
  Jeff Ornstein: And I never took a business class, and you have to learn how to run a business once you have a shingle hanging out there for business.
• 15:28
  Jeff Ornstein: So I completely concur with you.
• 15:30
  Jeff Ornstein: I mean, like, yeah, if you have a national natural knack for sales or you speak beautifully, I'm sure you could go into a conference room and hold your own with the best of them, but still it's the planets all aligning so that you get the right person's ear and you pitch it the right way.
• 15:47
  Jeff Ornstein: And there's so many wonderful stories that want to be told, and there's only so many dollars to go around.
• 15:52
  Jeff Ornstein: You speak about making a safe and equitable and inclusive set for women, and that would be like, you know, a a life's goal to like seeing that through so that it wasn't even a topic of conversation.
• 16:05
  Jeff Ornstein: Are there particular instances or situations now that you see that you'd like to focus on or work on with that r in that regard?
• 16:14
  Lauren Sowa: Yeah, I think for me, you know, it's about creating a safe, supportive, constructive environment for everyone on set.
• 16:23
  Lauren Sowa: I think a big way that that can be achieved is simply by having more inclusion, getting as close to parity as possible on set.
• 16:34
  Lauren Sowa: The whole energy shifts, the whole dynamic shifts in, I think, a positive way.
• 16:39
  Lauren Sowa: I was at Sundance this year and I went to this amazing workshop that Chloe Zhao led where she talked about being on the set of Hamnet and some of the work that she was doing to create a safe, supportive environment on set.
• 16:53
  Lauren Sowa: She was leading her whole team through these dream work sessions, these meditation sessions.
• 16:58
  Lauren Sowa: They were doing dance takes after really heavy scenes.
• 17:02
  Lauren Sowa: It sounded like she was creating what I aimed to create, which is a very holistic experience.
• 17:09
  Lauren Sowa: You know, sometimes film sets can be a very rigid, kind of harsh environment.
• 17:16
  Lauren Sowa: It's a strange thing that we do.
• 17:18
  Lauren Sowa: You know, we're working very long hours, very long days.
• 17:21
  Lauren Sowa: It's not really set up for the actors process.
• 17:24
  Lauren Sowa: Those of us who are actors certainly understand that.
• 17:26
  Lauren Sowa: You know, it's very logistic-based, it's very budget-based.
• 17:30
  Lauren Sowa: And all of that is necessary for many reasons, right?
• 17:32
  Lauren Sowa: But how can we create an environment where it's not just the actors who need that space for their art to breathe and grow, but it's actually a better working environment for everyone, from the DP to the grip to the PA to the hair and makeup to, you know, the stand-ins.
• 17:51
  Lauren Sowa: Like everyone feels valued and taken care of.
• 17:55
  Lauren Sowa: For me, that's very important.
• 17:57
  Lauren Sowa: And I'm working at a smaller scale of set than certainly a lot of, you know, bigger sets in the industry.
• 18:03
  Lauren Sowa: So it's a bit easier for me to do that.
• 18:05
  Lauren Sowa: But, you know, for me, that sort of care and attention starts long before you ever even get to set.
• 18:11
  Lauren Sowa: Like I really like to sort of make sure that I'm interviewing and speaking to each person I'm gonna hire to get a vibe check in addition to their skill set, to make sure I know their allergies, their dietary restrictions, you know, what their favorite little snack is, like little things like that.
• 18:28
  Lauren Sowa: What do they need?
• 18:29
  Lauren Sowa: Do they need any accommodations?
• 18:31
  Lauren Sowa: Or, you know, is there a way that I can make this experience positive for them?
• 18:36
  Lauren Sowa: And a lot of the things we're making are we don't ever have as much money as we wish we had, right?
• 18:41
  Lauren Sowa: But are there little things that I can provide that will make that person's job that much easier or more pleasurable throughout the shoot?
• 18:51
  Lauren Sowa: You know, I think there's a lot of things that as a producer, I would recommend that other producers, you know, go that little extra step because it pays back so well when your crew is in a good mood, when everyone gets along, when they're multitasking, but they're also talking to each other and figuring things out together.
• 19:11
  Lauren Sowa: Like it takes one bad apple to ruin the vibe for everyone.
• 19:14
  Lauren Sowa: And I'm very sensitive to that.
• 19:16
  Lauren Sowa: So I really do try to create and do my part in sort of helping to set up the set for success.
• 19:22
  Lauren Sowa: And of course, all producers do that, right?
• 19:24
  Lauren Sowa: That's our job.
• 19:25
  Lauren Sowa: But I try to go the extra mile to really try to think about the chemistry of the team.
• 19:30
  Lauren Sowa: I try to think even before that, when I read a script about what are the themes of this, is there anyone I know in my sort of database of crew who has a personal connection to this?
• 19:41
  Lauren Sowa: Maybe I could pitch a DP that, you know, this is something that they really relate to.
• 19:45
  Lauren Sowa: We had a a set recently where it was about pregnancy loss.
• 19:50
  Lauren Sowa: And basically I wanted as many parents as possible on the set just to have, I think that even if you're a boom op, like your your point of view matters, you know.
• 20:00
  Lauren Sowa: And it might not be obvious to the audience how that impacts this the story and the film, but to me, I just find it to be a better experience.
• 20:09
  Lauren Sowa: So I I think about all those kinds of things and then, you know, see how it shakes out.
• 20:13
  Jeff Ornstein: That was fantastic.
• 20:14
  Jeff Ornstein: You kind of answered my next question with what how will you design an ideal film set culture?
• 20:18
  Jeff Ornstein: To me, I hear connectivity.
• 20:20
  Jeff Ornstein: How are all the components connecting?
• 20:23
  Jeff Ornstein: And is there other than your skill as a DP or a producer or director, what are the other connections that you might hold in common that you can share as a group that will help make the final product better and experiences?
• 20:36
  Jeff Ornstein: And like uh in Hamlet, and I also understand that that was very true on Ozark, that there was a lot of community outside of the actual filming of the scenes, that was uh part of its success, and I think it was wildly successful.
• 20:52
  Jeff Ornstein: As I promised you, we've gone grossly over time.
• 20:55
  Jeff Ornstein: Apple is happy about it.
• 20:56
  Jeff Ornstein: That means everybody's enjoying themselves.
• 20:58
  Jeff Ornstein: We talked about funding being a challenge for filmmaking, and that's across the boards, young and independent filmmakers, and even the big names.
• 21:08
  Jeff Ornstein: And it seems that we're in a little bit of a downturn here in our industry.
• 21:12
  Jeff Ornstein: But what do you think would need to change outside of just the general economy, you know, being strong and healthy, for it to survive and thrive over the next decade?
• 21:22
  Jeff Ornstein: Or do you see any buttons that we should be focused on?
• 21:26
  Lauren Sowa: You know, I I think we are in the middle of trying to figure that out right now because I do think the indie film model specifically is a bit broken.
• 21:36
  Lauren Sowa: And I mean, I could talk forever about reasons why, but a big reason why is that fewer people are taking risks in funding.
• 21:45
  Lauren Sowa: Right.
• 21:46
  Lauren Sowa: And let's be frank, the wealth disparity in this country is such that a lot of people just don't even have the money to put into the arts if they wanted.
• 21:54
  Lauren Sowa: Back in the day, we used to have patrons of the arts, and I think we need a resurgence of patrons.
• 21:59
  Lauren Sowa: Patrons of the arts.
• 22:01
  Lauren Sowa: And beyond that, I do think that the industry is trying to figure out a way to operate in a more affordable way.
• 22:08
  Lauren Sowa: I am very pro-union.
• 22:10
  Lauren Sowa: I'm a union member myself.
• 22:11
  Lauren Sowa: I belong to SAGAFTRA and Actors Equity, the stage union.
• 22:15
  Lauren Sowa: So I often hear a lot of people complain about wages being a problem.
• 22:19
  Lauren Sowa: To me, that's not an acceptable cut.
• 22:22
  Lauren Sowa: I'm very pro-union.
• 22:25
  Lauren Sowa: I do think we need to find ways to be economical in the sense of what kind of content are we funding?
• 22:31
  Lauren Sowa: How much are we spending on these projects?
• 22:33
  Lauren Sowa: And could we find a happy medium?
• 22:35
  Lauren Sowa: Maybe it starts at the script stage where we're writing things to be less expensive.
• 22:39
  Lauren Sowa: And maybe it's, you know, can we take a chance on some unknown actors?
• 22:45
  Lauren Sowa: You know, we're so celebrity obsessed.
• 22:47
  Lauren Sowa: And it's all linked, right?
• 22:49
  Lauren Sowa: Because those are the things that get people to leave their home to go see the movies.
• 22:53
  Lauren Sowa: But we have to get creative or it will die.
• 22:57
  Lauren Sowa: I also think a big issue, and I know that the producers union is talking about this and um trying to make some change here, but poor independent producers have really been screwed by the new model.
• 23:08
  Lauren Sowa: There's there's no development money anymore.
• 23:11
  Lauren Sowa: There's no back end if their film does get to theaters.
• 23:14
  Lauren Sowa: You know, it's very, very hard to make money as an independent producer.
• 23:18
  Lauren Sowa: And people are spending years and years developing work for free.
• 23:23
  Lauren Sowa: And it it's almost become that you can't be in this industry unless you are somewhat independently wealthy, or you have another job, or you do it for the love of it, and you often suffer because of that.
• 23:37
  Lauren Sowa: So I think, you know, there are a lot of things that need to shift.
• 23:41
  Lauren Sowa: And I think until our country recognizes that this sort of late-stage capitalism that we're in right now is really an issue, you know, I think a a lot of things could be solved with everyone having, you know, government subsidized healthcare.
• 23:56
  Lauren Sowa: Like if we had health care for all, that would create less expensive unions.
• 24:01
  Lauren Sowa: It would create less expensive production.
• 24:03
  Lauren Sowa: You know, there there are a lot of things that I think, again, it's like one string, and then all these things unravel the knot.
• 24:10
  Lauren Sowa: But the knot right now is very solid.
• 24:13
  Jeff Ornstein: It strikes me that we we have been in this slump for a couple of years, and there's no indication that we're gonna get out of it for a couple of years.
• 24:22
  Jeff Ornstein: And I wonder what that's going to mean to the quality and the quantity of theatrical productions in 20 years.
• 24:31
  Jeff Ornstein: Are we gonna have a 20-year gap of talent that's been seasoned and experienced along the way?
• 24:36
  Jeff Ornstein: And how will that reshape what our art craft is is looking like, what it's gonna be?
• 24:41
  Lauren Sowa: To end on a hopeful note, I do think that, you know, with with challenge comes creativity and inspiration.
• 24:47
  Lauren Sowa: And so while we are in a tough time at the moment, and certainly we didn't even touch on other scary things like AI and the future, but I do think that encourages humans to do what we do best, which is create.
• 25:01
  Lauren Sowa: You know, we we were not put on this earth to toil forever.
• 25:04
  Lauren Sowa: We're we're here to tell stories and and be in community and take care of one another.
• 25:10
  Lauren Sowa: And I really think that we're gonna see a resurgence of of independent film.
• 25:14
  Lauren Sowa: We're gonna see incredible innovation that is human-made.
• 25:18
  Lauren Sowa: And I can't wait to be a part of that and witness all of the cool things that people make.
• 25:25
  Jeff Ornstein: Right.
• 25:25
  Jeff Ornstein: Well, you know what?
• 25:26
  Jeff Ornstein: We'll have you back and we'll talk about AI and those other things the next time.
• 25:30
  Lauren Sowa: Oh, yeah.
• 25:31
  Jeff Ornstein: I'm sure a lot of the comments that we'll get will be about insightful commentary about where we are, how you got there, all of your accomplishments, but you still face similar challenges as other people, but you have a very positive outlook, but you're very realistic at the same time, which I love.
• 25:48
  Lauren Sowa: Yeah.
• 25:49
  Jeff Ornstein: Thanks for tuning in to Next Act with Jeff Orenstein.
• 25:52
  Jeff Ornstein: Follow, subscribe, and stay connected to your favorite socials at www.nexttackpodcast.com.
• 26:00
  Jeff Ornstein: Keep chasing your next act.
• 26:02
  Jeff Ornstein: The best is yet to come.