Latest / The STA Clinician Podcast / Ep.253 'Countdown To STA South West Conference' with speakers Dr Claire Minshull & Serena Simmons

Transcript

Ep.253 'Countdown To STA South West Conference' with speakers Dr Claire Minshull & Serena Simmons · The STA Clinician Podcast

0:00
You're listening to the Sports Therapy Association podcast, putting evidence
0:05
back into soft tissue therapy.
0:07
Music.
0:18
Okay, well, I have no countdown for people. Apologies, I'm a little bit late.
0:22
Four minutes passed. I'm so sorry.
0:23
Two minutes, cool. Three minutes, not so much. Four minutes,
0:25
just rude. So apologies for that.
0:26
But welcome to episode 253 of the Sports Therapy Association podcast.
0:32
My name is Matt Phillips, creator of runchatlive.com. And as always,
0:35
this episode is being recorded live on the Sports Therapy Association YouTube
0:39
channel and Facebook page, normally on a Tuesday at eight o'clock.
0:44
But tonight we are going out live on a Wednesday, but next week back to the Tuesdays as normal.
0:49
So thank you for joining us. If you've joined us live, thank you if you listen to the podcast.
0:52
We are going to continue our countdown to the STA Southwest and Hands on Hub
0:57
conference, which is happening in Exmouth this September the 20th and 21st in
1:02
collaboration with the ST school.
1:05
So yes, less than three weeks away now. It's going to be amazing. I'm obviously biased.
1:10
I'm emceeing it and I'm presenting there, so I'm biased. But I don't know,
1:14
after 257 episodes, hopefully you can believe when I say it's going to be an
1:18
amazing weekend of presentations with workshops and networking.
1:22
And in this episode, I'm going to be talking very shortly with Dr.
1:26
Claire Mitchell, rehab and conditioning specialist and founder of Get Back to
1:30
Sport, and also Serena Simmons, charter psychologist and founder of the Psychology
1:35
School, to discuss what they will be delivering at the conference later in September.
1:40
Last week, in case you missed it, just a huge thank you to Michelle Lyons,
1:44
women's health physiotherapist and founder of Celebrate Mouli Ebrity,
1:47
whose conference presentation in September is The Menstrual Detective,
1:51
Why the Fifth Vital Sign Might Be the Missing Link in MSK Health for Female Athletes.
1:56
Michelle was joined by guest Siobhan O'Donovan, aka The Boobie Physio,
2:00
and founder of Posture Fitting.
2:02
And Siobhan is going to be presenting Bits and Boobs and Bumps and Babies.
2:05
Wonderful alliteration there. and as always that
2:08
episode is on all popular podcast apps and
2:11
YouTube if you want to watch the video and also at the STA website thesta.co.uk
2:16
just to keep you in touch of what's happening
2:19
in the lead up to the conference next week I'm going to have the
2:21
one and only Anna Maria Matsieri on the show
2:24
director of the ST school who's going to be chatting
2:27
about the conference but in particular something that
2:30
was brought up in the one of the debate panels we had
2:33
with experienced therapists and less experienced therapists was what
2:37
the hell is evidence-informed practice anyway what does it mean it's all
2:39
very well when more experienced therapists goes oh you have to be more evidence-informed but
2:43
a lot of younger therapists less experienced therapists is like what what
2:46
do you mean by that so we're going to have a little chat about that with Anna-Marie
2:49
Matsieri who has a fantastic course
2:52
on this or workshop on this on at the
2:55
ST school and also two other presentations are very much about that at
2:58
the conference which are going to be when pain echoes trauma and
3:01
when massage echoes embodiment and also massage and
3:04
manual therapy for scars so that is next
3:07
week hopefully you can join us live eight o'clock on the
3:10
tuesday and then the week after we have the wonderful
3:13
james earls i have born to move and who's also going to be speaking at the conference
3:18
with a presentation entitled the knee why do we have it all back to front again
3:23
i've gone forever about james just the approach to anatomy which you need and
3:28
put forward in a style that's not going to make you think, I'm going to give
3:31
this all up. This is all terrible.
3:33
I'm going to sue the people who gave me that last course.
3:35
Not at all. It's just tweaking it a little bit to help you and most importantly, your clients.
3:39
So again, a wonderful speaker in the lead up. And that'll take us to the actual
3:43
conference, which like I say, is on the 20th and the 21st.
3:46
If you can't make it, please don't sit there with FOMO, fear of missing out down with the kids.
3:51
We're going to make this regional. The whole idea of this conference is to try
3:54
and do something which people can travel to in the same day,
3:57
maybe don't have to stay the night. So we're going to be moving around the country.
3:59
We're going to be moving, hopefully, to Ireland at some point,
4:02
up to Scotland, and maybe even abroad. Who knows? The world is our oyster.
4:07
Right. I've left my guests down in the lobby for long enough.
4:10
If you do want tickets to the conference, I'll repeat this afterwards,
4:13
but just go to thestschool.co.uk.
4:16
And if you're an STA member, remember there is a discount code,
4:18
which you'll find in the latest STA newsletter or on the Facebook members group.
4:22
But for now, allow me to bring up my guests for tonight, Dr.
4:25
Claire Minchell of Get Back to Sport and Serena Simmons, charter psychologist
4:30
and founder of the Psychology School.
4:32
Music.
4:49
Um i'm still red because of what you said before we started
4:52
you really shouldn't kind of make my head swell like that with compliments just
4:55
before we go live please don't ever do that again it's what
4:57
i was thinking of anyway but i'm really thrilled to have you along thank you
5:00
so much for joining us thank you thanks for the snacks you're lovely as well so
5:05
as we chatted off air i'm really hoping i'll be surprised
5:08
but i'm really hoping that some of the couple of thousand downloads we
5:11
get don't know you guys um some will but
5:14
i'm hoping that we're obviously we're going to reach out to people who have never heard of you so to
5:18
do that we need a little bit of an introduction which is tricky because you
5:21
know you've been in the game for a long time and it must feel like just a nightmare
5:24
going through well once i got injured and no one sorted me out and so i did
5:29
this which is normally kind of the story but so i thought we'd do it slightly
5:32
different with it with a few images which i think might help us kind of present you if that's okay.
5:39
There's nothing no embarrassing pictures of you either of you,
5:43
she's embarrassing images of it so let's just bring this up
5:45
first of all i mean i hate to start on a sad
5:48
point but podcast listeners you won't be able
5:51
to see the images you might want to stop now and go over to youtube but essentially
5:54
what i've got here is a series of of well it's it's
5:58
you described what's going we've got a pretty bruised up nasty stitched up wrist
6:01
going on claire what happened a fat hand it was well intentioned so this is
6:07
the end point of my rehab journey this year this was me trying to break up a
6:12
cat fight of my own cat bullying the neighbor's cats,
6:17
just instantaneously just jumped in because he just jumped on her in full fight
6:22
mode he turned around and bit me right down to the bone that scares me carry on.
6:33
Yeah so yeah i've since learned that
6:36
cat bites can be really really dangerous and
6:40
not just painful but yeah so within i
6:43
went to a and a when the 24 hours i was within in surgery as in hospital for
6:48
three days so so let's just break that down a bit surgery for cat bite yeah
6:52
what happened let me let me provide some education about cat bites that i've
6:57
learned first and foremost if you're going to approach a cat fight use a super soaker or a buttock,
7:04
She really is getting into detail.
7:22
Not only can they penetrate deeper, they have particular bacteria on their teeth,
7:27
which then obviously is entered into the tissue that it penetrates.
7:33
Fortunately for me, it wasn't in the joint. Unfortunately for me,
7:35
it wasn't in the bone. It went into the tendon sheath. But within 24 hours,
7:39
it's extremely infected.
7:40
And there's some horrific reports of the consequences of cat bites if left,
7:48
or if left untreated, even to amputation points.
7:52
If you get bitten by a cat just straight away
7:56
go to your nearest A&E that type of thing so
7:59
yeah within 24 hours I was in surgery and phenomenal
8:02
phenomenal kind of service from the
8:05
A&E that was just amazing saved saved my hand so yeah I'm smiling I shouldn't
8:11
be but I just love the way I'm not I shouldn't be surprised but I love the way
8:14
you make it so interesting I mean even when you're talking about cat bites and
8:18
and a trip to A&E I'm sitting there thinking this is great I hope she does like
8:21
a kind of workshop on this because i really want to attend it's like,
8:25
so that's why i'm smiling because it just sounds so informative and interesting
8:28
and i want to yeah i didn't didn't really want to learn it about it in that way.
8:35
Especially especially as if we go back a little bit,
8:39
again if you listen to the podcast you can't see us unfortunately this is why
8:42
you need to join us live get back into what we used to do you know when you
8:44
actually turned up in person for something But yeah, we've got lovely Liz Bailey
8:48
there and James Noakes and your leg, I think. My leg.
8:52
And just a big shout to James Noakes who's going through the phenomenally difficult
8:57
time at the minute with his back disc infection. He's the most knowledgeable,
9:03
kindest sportswear doctor ever.
9:06
And yeah, he's struggling a bit at the moment and he's just been just...
9:11
Those guys phenomenal so and especially james is
9:14
going through a really really difficult patch so i think
9:17
i i had it hard and he's yeah he's he's laid
9:20
at multiple hospital admissions if you follow him on twitter
9:23
or x you can he's publicized his journey so
9:26
big love to james james
9:29
yeah so that is a
9:32
bone stress injury to my right talus
9:36
and probably more also a capsule anterior
9:39
capsule injury as well and yeah so it
9:43
was a month a month on crutches we tried to manage it
9:46
with reduced loading so I do a lot
9:49
of lifting compressive loading running
9:52
cycling that kind of stuff but backed off for.
9:55
A couple of weeks it didn't didn't settle so yeah I
9:58
was at four weeks in a boot on crutches which was
10:01
so joyous and uh yeah so
10:04
I'm playing rehab twister right now with
10:07
my right foot and left hand don't know
10:10
really know what i've done to spin this but yeah yeah
10:14
i mean it's sad but
10:17
it's great it's not entertainment's the wrong word very education for
10:20
us because you're documenting this all in your social media feed we're seeing
10:23
ski pulls we're showing different hand grips we're seeing
10:26
all sorts of stuff which and it's or as always
10:29
inspiring i mean yeah i wouldn't wish it penne obviously but as
10:32
always you're turning it around as something which is helping others you just can't help
10:35
it can you just a giver also you
10:39
know well you know it's anybody that exercising it's a
10:42
part of them you find a way otherwise it's even more traumatic so yeah trying
10:46
to find different ways of doing things that you can for mental health absolutely
10:51
important and also physical health too so i didn't really need any more experiences
10:57
on the patient side of that model.
10:59
I've had plenty, but I've had them.
11:02
And so there you go. I'm back to the side.
11:05
It's true. In fact, yeah. I'm thinking back to your previous,
11:08
anyone who wants to catch up with the first installments of Claire's Journey
11:12
Through Rehab, then check out the first couple of episodes and you'll hear it
11:15
way back at the beginning where it all started.
11:17
So in the meantime, whilst you were all suffering with this and going through
11:22
different areas of rehab, it's quite a nice segue into, let's go over to our
11:25
other guest, Serena Simmons here, to see if there's any parallels.
11:30
What picture have I got here? Let's just go through here.
11:33
Right. Again, if this is the podcast, you you won't
11:35
see what's on the youtube screen but essentially i'm just
11:39
going to describe what i see and then you can explain serena what's
11:42
going on this is pesky if anyone's
11:45
a dexter fan then yeah basically we've got a kill room we haven't got the cellophane
11:50
but it looks very clean and and all i can see is serena dragging up a wrapped
11:56
up body over to you serena simmons who are you and why are you doing this i
12:01
feel for a blind day who are you what's your name where do Yeah,
12:04
this is a great question.
12:06
I'm Theresa Mons. I've killed someone. No.
12:10
So, yeah, thank you. It's nice to be here. Yeah, this is a very pesky picture
12:15
here. So I had a lot of fun this weekend.
12:18
I'm just about to do some teaching on the topic of body disposal.
12:23
I can say no more at this point other than I'm trying to convey how we dispose of a body.
12:29
And the reason I'm doing that is because my area
12:32
my background is in forensic psychology and in
12:35
particular a speciality in serial murder and
12:39
I hope that we get to segue into why I'm
12:42
coming to the conference and how I'm going to deliver something
12:45
of value to the physios and the people are
12:48
not physios but people in the in the arena who who
12:51
want to learn more about how we can incorporate psychology and
12:55
behavior change into practice based on my background but yeah I'm basically
12:59
manhandling a fake dead body in a picture that people can't see brilliant i'm
13:06
just going to pause for people who will ask you through the podcast to get over
13:08
to youtube just give them a few seconds to catch up with this they're back.
13:13
Yeah let's let's stick with that and go into a bit more of the link so from from forensic,
13:19
specialist yeah to helping clinicians yeah healthcare yeah thank you thank you
13:26
for asking the question because I think the jump seems really big but I think
13:30
so essentially my background and training was all in forensic psychology and I followed.
13:37
A forensic pathway in my training for a long
13:40
time so I worked for a long time for the prison service
13:43
so my initial job was I was
13:46
the manager of all of the
13:49
cognitive behavioral programs being run in
13:52
the UK for prisons in the UK so I
13:55
managed everything that was cognitive behaviorally based and
13:58
I then went on to work in practice at Rampton Hospital so some
14:01
of the most dangerous offenders basically in the country with
14:04
my own caseload of patients and group therapy and I
14:08
think what people often don't realize is when you work with those
14:11
really dangerous people and you're working in that arena is that
14:14
your main job as a psychologist in the UK is to
14:17
rehabilitate and so actually your job is
14:20
to change the behavior of some of the most dangerous people
14:23
that we have in terms of what they've done so we're
14:27
talking I don't know what I can say in terms of like
14:30
certificate 18 or not oh yeah we've
14:33
had oh we're good okay good so basically the
14:37
three main groups of people you work with in a setting like that are
14:40
typically those who've committed rape so rape so
14:43
rapists paedophiles and murderers and my speciality being murder serial murder
14:47
is the area that i come from and so as i began to work more in the area it was
14:53
people that approached me to say how do you know if you've changed try to change
14:57
the behavior of those people how do we do it for these people And it was really healthcare,
15:01
although I've worked in healthcare since I was 17, actually.
15:04
Healthcare found me and I was able to translate what I've learned from that
15:08
arena and bring it into something really positive.
15:11
And so actually now I spend half of my time working still in that area and mostly profiling.
15:17
So I mostly profile offenders now and do kind of teaching in the area.
15:22
But then I bring that into this really beautiful area of positive behavior change in healthcare.
15:27
Fascinating journey and now you've explained i'm hoping people can see the
15:30
link there and it should it's a very typical thing at
15:33
the moment because we are realizing and
15:36
we've had people on the show before talking about the importance of
15:39
psychology and behavior change and how important that
15:42
is to do with therapeutic alliance and using
15:45
your eyes sorry your eyes and your ears and your hands sorry
15:48
your mouth just as much as your hands if not more yeah yeah but
15:51
i noticed you have said i've read it a few times
15:54
or maybe people talking about you an actual psychologist teaching the
15:57
psychology behavior change which I suppose is quite thrilling
16:00
for you because being a psychologist you've got that upper hand
16:03
you kind of yeah and I don't mean that
16:06
in a I would I would say the same thing I would
16:09
say for me when you're working with
16:11
a person first and foremost we have to honor the person and
16:15
I think anyone would anyone knows that but when
16:19
you have an understanding of someone's psychology you have
16:21
a better understanding of their their thought
16:24
processes how they think and therefore how
16:27
they behave and how they respond and so
16:30
I think what psychology does is it goes beyond
16:33
what could be quite a surface level approach to
16:37
helping someone change because what you're doing is you're
16:40
going way beyond that surface level technique and
16:43
you're looking at why someone is doing what
16:46
they're doing and when you know more about why humans do what they do you have
16:51
a much better ability to help them move the needle and it could have changed.
16:54
Something in their behavior in their rehab in anything really so for me obviously.
17:00
I'm biased but psychology forms the basis of all of that other good stuff.
17:06
And just to reinforce that, all the obviously amazing exercise prescriptions
17:12
that I do for joint approach,
17:14
which are phenomenally life-changing, would have absolutely no relevance whatsoever
17:20
if patients didn't do it.
17:22
And the reason why they do it is because of Serena's influence throughout the entire program.
17:28
I know we'll get to this, but a point to iterate here is we had,
17:32
in an NHS clinical trial, zero people drop out, and that's unheard of.
17:39
So it's profoundly impactful and can pave the way.
17:45
And it's like a symbiotic relationship, but you'll pave the way for anything that comes thereafter.
17:51
There i'm gonna say something else i think the
17:53
other thing you don't have to put your hand up sorry i'm excited
17:57
can i say something and the
18:00
other thing is is you don't and that's the whole point of me
18:03
teaching us to healthcare professionals is you don't have to be a psychologist
18:06
to be able to understand that and i think that's the
18:08
bit for me that i get on a bandwagon about so if anyone has
18:11
ever been on a podcast before usually what i'm saying is everyone
18:15
should know this like if you're working with a human you
18:18
honor the human you don't like it's it's a
18:21
tendency to jump to our expertise because we because it's beautiful
18:24
and we're excited about it so as I work a
18:27
lot with for example physios or kind of surgeons actually
18:30
and doctors they want to do the thing that they were trained to do and
18:33
that's beautiful and it's brilliant but we must first
18:36
honor the person in front of us and there's
18:40
a way of doing that and I think when you kind of
18:43
when you do that in a different way if you do that in a very unique individualized
18:47
way where you're honoring that person first and foremost there are things that
18:51
anyone can learn to make that better and to for example to make it stick so
18:57
would be adherence to make that kind of better kind of over the long term as well.
19:03
So exciting. It really is because it's so topical at the moment.
19:07
Like I say, I think I wrote somewhere, I mean, I love listening to you because
19:13
it explains something that I felt for a long time.
19:16
Every time I heard people complaining about, oh, so-and-so, my client or patient
19:21
hasn't done their exercises.
19:22
How do they hope to get better if they haven't done their exercises?
19:24
And inside, I always felt that burning thing of, hold on, if they haven't done
19:28
their exercises, aren't you a little bit culpable?
19:30
Isn't that something to do with you let your patient go and they haven't done
19:35
that? That's got to do something with the conversation you had or didn't have.
19:37
So I think that's such a common problem. We talk about lack of exercise adherence
19:41
being one of the kind of biggest delays to recovery.
19:44
But now we've got something to get our teeth into with regards to how to bring
19:48
this down and actually through coaching and through psychology.
19:51
Yeah I'm going to pick up on something that you said which is really interesting,
20:03
you said it's really interesting that maybe there's something
20:05
you did or didn't do and the thing is I think the
20:09
beauty of learning what I teach people is I think learning what I teach about
20:15
someone's psychology it actually frees you up because what I don't want practitioners
20:20
to do anyone in any discipline is to go in thinking that the onus is all on them.
20:27
I.e. you can learn the tools you can do the thing you can do the learning and actually,
20:33
here's the trojan horse that i always incorporate into my teaching
20:36
is actually if i'm honest a lot
20:38
of the psychology that i teach is about you it's not about them
20:41
and that's the tricky bit is that yeah
20:44
you know people everyone's comfortable going in and learning a
20:48
tool if i said i'm doing something on motivational interviewing i'd
20:51
get loads of people sign up if i say behavior change it's
20:54
a great label lots of people sign up because it feels like
20:57
the thing the thing that will solve the thing but actually
21:00
the the real like response
21:03
is down to you working on you really
21:07
and that's the that's the pesky bit is because it's how
21:10
you're showing up in the work and some
21:14
of that looks like letting go of the results because actually
21:18
someone might change but they might not and that's
21:21
okay so there's a lot.
21:23
Of psychology around oh it's just
21:26
beautiful i just i just feel so calm at
21:29
the moment yeah and that's the beauty of it is i think when
21:32
i teach a lot of the students i teach what's really beautiful about
21:35
the teaching i i'm not my teaching per se but
21:38
what people go away with is it's like now
21:41
suddenly the confidence goes up and it's like
21:43
it's like a what i try and instill is this beautiful curiosity
21:47
about a human meeting another human being and so
21:50
there is nothing to get to it's a bit like Yoda a
21:53
bit deep like where are we trying to get to here
21:56
it's like what are you really trying to do what is this for and so you start
22:01
to kind of look at it in a different way where you go with this kind of beautiful
22:05
curiosity into a conversation it takes so much pressure off them and you that
22:10
it kind of creates a space for change to happen and that's what I'm marked up.
22:15
Brilliant. I'm so happy you're coming along to the conference.
22:18
This is exactly what we're trying to achieve through the conference,
22:20
because people say, what CPD do I need? What can I do with my hands? What can I learn?
22:25
And it's like, no, turn that with some other guests around the show.
22:28
We're talking about turning that mirror, that lens round and shine it a bit more on you.
22:32
Stop just looking at what's on the couch, whatever, and start turning it around.
22:36
And that will help ultimately yourself and therefore the person on the other end.
22:39
And that's what the conference is all going to be about and the speakers
22:42
we've put together with like both of yourselves and other people coming along they've
22:45
all already on that same page of realizing
22:48
that they're not they are experts but it's not
22:51
all about them standing on a stage and just vomiting out this information it's
22:55
about turning that lens around so exciting beautiful amen brother and sisters
22:59
yes i was going to do your course but oh so annoying but i didn't get on it
23:03
and i was it was on our list of things to do in fact anime was like you've got
23:07
to do Serena's course it'd be amazing do it do it do it do it do it do it doors closed.
23:12
Because it was so popular um I mean I've got to sign up here talking
23:15
about it so we're talking about behavior change psychology for therapists launched back
23:18
in May wasn't it and and it's kind of full isn't it I think I saw on the website
23:22
that it's kind of no more applications yet until I don't know what 2029 well
23:27
I normally do one a year I may do another one I'll say but yeah we'll see how
23:30
we go oh don't just do one for me please you've got the other program I've got another,
23:36
Yeah, I've got a site club as well, which we can talk about later if you want
23:40
to, because I feel like we have to go. I can talk forever.
23:44
Oh, Dr. Clemens should say as well. Sorry, Dr. Clemens.
23:47
I enjoy this. I mean, it's impactful. It's changed my practice,
23:51
and it's lovely to listen to. But what you said,
23:56
it's probably the most important thing so far is that
23:59
and you admitted it yourself for all the amazing rehab
24:02
and strength and conditioning and protocols and dynamometers and different
24:05
types and all of this stuff it's all fantastic but if you are trying to get
24:09
the person on the end of whatever you're doing to do it and they're not at that
24:13
right state of change or behavior you're preaching to ears that just close and
24:16
not ready you know and it's oh you're not necessarily preaching so if you're
24:20
trying to elicit a response in terms of a strength test or an effort on a,
24:25
strength exercise you have to have the engagement and for that you have to have
24:29
the right communication so I thought pretty good at it before and then with some uh helpful input.
24:38
From Serena then I become you know
24:41
much much better at that and I think that comes also with
24:44
age and experience too but but that is the key
24:47
right so you've got a person usually is
24:49
a whole and complete being i'm kind of incomplete at
24:52
various points in my life
24:55
at the minute but you know you with i
24:59
don't know and neo8 we're not just treating treating the
25:02
knee the knee is attached to a whole person which is
25:05
all the other musculoskeletal part of the system
25:08
plus their thoughts and feelings and plus
25:11
their life and logistics so even if it
25:14
comes down to exercise prescription you go right this is the best exercise you
25:17
can do delivered in this way I need you to
25:20
do it and then you go three times
25:23
a week at this time every day or every every session and they go hang on a minute
25:28
I can't do that because of x y and z you have to acknowledge what's in what's
25:33
in front of you it becomes a logistic channel a logistical challenge I think
25:38
the the best I was forgive
25:40
forgive me the reason why we're at wednesday is i was in yesterday down at the
25:44
mod in winchester teaching so it's my bad forgive me the point that that i'm making every.
25:54
Interaction that i have the pleasure of of of
25:57
living with anybody that that wants to listen is that you can start out let's
26:04
start out with what the optimal prescription would be for that So if we need
26:08
to get somebody stronger and let's look at what's the best stimulus you could possibly deliver,
26:16
dose response to get somebody stronger, that muscle group stronger.
26:19
Then let's layer on then the real life logistics. What equipment have you got?
26:24
Have you got no equipment? What environment have you got? What commitment have you got?
26:27
And then we can work back from that. It's the whole person.
26:32
So cool and do you think i'm interested
26:36
to know that ideally should
26:39
this be taught from the beginning so like imagine the
26:42
traditional ymca level three fitness trainer or something
26:45
which i did in like 91 or something and there's obviously back
26:48
then there was no talk of psychology or anything like that it was just three
26:51
sets of 10 and it was cool because it taught you like how
26:53
to demonstrate an exercise in different angles and group exercise and
26:57
a bit of exercise to music so you had all of that going on but
26:59
do you think it would be too much to integrate something like this now about
27:03
the questions that need to come before prescribing the exercise or should we
27:07
be putting it in that early on in the person's kind of learning path do you
27:13
mean the psychology bit yeah is it too much too soon does it need to be black and white.
27:22
My point being is i think it very much depends on the environment because what
27:27
you don't you We need to acknowledge where, as you were saying,
27:30
Serena, where that person is at, where the learner is at.
27:32
So if they are in a gym-based setting, you already have some buy-in from that
27:38
person because they've come to the gym.
27:40
If you're in an NHS setting and they're being told to come there by the doctor,
27:45
you've got to have a representation that's much greater on that continuum of behavior change.
27:51
You might need more understanding and also the risk reward is is or the or that
27:57
balance is is much greater so what you could potentially lose by not doing this
28:03
or potentially gain so i think.
28:05
Absolutely yes the levelness I
28:09
think needs to be commensurate with the learner and the application what
28:13
were you going to say yeah I
28:16
guess probably say the same but I would describe it in
28:19
a different way which is 1000 million percent
28:22
big fat yes for me yes because
28:26
I cannot I've never been able to get my head around the.
28:29
Fact that if you're dealing with a human that you don't do psychology first
28:32
that personally I don't think it's just because of my bias.
28:35
I just don't understand how even
28:39
an injury starts in your head as in
28:42
yes you have the physical but it's the human that deals with
28:45
it so they think about the injury they relate to the
28:48
injury so you have to first deal with the psychology of it to
28:51
help them with the thing so how can you not
28:54
be taught psychology and it's no criticism of anyone
28:57
listening it's for me it's a criticism of
29:00
how things like degrees or training is structured
29:03
that this isn't incorporated however having
29:07
done this for a long time taught health care
29:10
professionals in general for a long long time what
29:13
I realized is not everyone is receptive to it so
29:17
I teach if so I go into say hospitals and
29:19
teach teams of people and if I'm being really
29:22
honest and that is my normal mo I'll get
29:26
say I get a group of 30 people there'll always be
29:28
those five people that are just rolling their eyes at me going I
29:32
don't need that don't want to hear that don't want to learn that don't
29:35
care about that my patients do what they need to or actually don't
29:37
care whether they do or they don't so I think that's replicated
29:41
early on I think you get people who and I
29:44
understand this when you go to uni for example say
29:47
if I'm teaching a physio the physio wants to learn physio
29:50
they don't want to go and learn psychology so their listening isn't open for
29:55
what someone might say about someone's psychology so what typically happens.
29:59
Is people come and self-select into things that I might teach or other people
30:04
like me when they think they need it or they've encountered an issue.
30:09
And for me I think it's only those that really
30:12
want to kind of genuinely help
30:15
the whole person and feel like there's a
30:18
benefit to learning this that will want to learn it or very
30:21
early on see the merit in doing so and so
30:24
that would kind of knit in very cleanly with what Claire
30:27
said I would just describe it slightly differently I think
30:30
it's like anything at uni we all do I had to do statistics and
30:33
research methods from year one I actually hated it but
30:36
I had to do it to pass my degree you know
30:41
so like I think it should be a part of
30:44
our training and it's like anything we learn you
30:47
just you just don't know when it will come in useful and I think those that
30:50
will like it will really like it I personally think it should be integrated
30:54
into everything I think if you're working with a human you need to know psychology
30:58
because you need to have you need to know how people think and feel and how
31:02
they respond on a very basic level at least.
31:06
I'm hearing Anna Maria's voice in my head, which you're going to an awful lot
31:10
on September the 20th and 21st, because she very much, I mean,
31:15
it's more to do with learning about pain.
31:18
But as soon as you start, pain is so complex, but if you really want to start
31:22
understanding what we can, psychology is going to come into it.
31:25
And also these days as well, I mean, potentially the pendulum swung a little
31:29
bit too far away for some people.
31:31
And now it's evolving more the inflammatory system and other things which are
31:34
being worked on. But you're going to have to have that biopsychosocial lens
31:38
or appreciate what it is.
31:39
And she would say, Anna Maria, that if you are going to make a living out of
31:45
working with people in pain, then there's no excuses. You can't just say,
31:49
this doesn't interest me now. I just want to do this.
31:50
It's like ethically, you need to find out these things, be evidence informed
31:56
and start adopting a change in what the syllabi are kind of preaching at the
32:00
moment, which is very outdated.
32:01
Otherwise, don't work with people in pain. It's not a game. you
32:04
know if you're mending cards also from a business and
32:07
reputational perspective it'll become quite apparent
32:10
that you're not making a difference to people and you can't
32:14
buy word of mouth so you have a positive word of
32:16
mouth or a negative word of mouth i don't know if it does though i think there's still
32:19
plenty of business models out there with the old kind of structured
32:22
approach to click come back so you want there's
32:25
people who are still going to certain nationals okay it's a
32:28
massive buy-in isn't there from things you can't do to yourself i think
32:32
a good model a good frame of reference is
32:35
if anyone feels like that about say
32:38
for example pain and again it translates well
32:41
to like a training i might do if i go i did quite some quite controversial trainings
32:46
for example like with groups of surgeons who i find are one of the most challenging
32:52
groups to work with because their training is about doing surgery so they are
32:58
trained and they put so many gears into learning a craft.
33:02
It's art and science kind of coming together and they put
33:05
you know so much into that and I really respect and admire that
33:08
however conveying to those
33:12
groups of surgeons that I want you to think about
33:14
just talking to people in a different way honoring the
33:18
whole human giving the power back
33:21
to the patient for them to maybe do
33:25
maybe for example even so radical to do some exercise
33:28
and physio before they resort to surgery heaven
33:31
forbid I take kind of surgery out of their remit and
33:35
give the power back to them surgeons who
33:38
are on board with that and forward thinking think that's great
33:41
but when someone feels that their power is being taken
33:44
away they don't want to kind of
33:47
give that power back and I think ethically as
33:51
you mentioned the word ethics and that's really important to me is ethically
33:55
and morally you know how do we feel for example when we sit with a surgeon kind
34:00
of go back to what you were describing with a doctor it's not just a model it's
34:03
not just just the thing it's not just getting for example the treatment it's
34:08
the human to human contact that matters.
34:11
So yes we might be fixed by going to the doctor or getting
34:14
some pills or a paracetamol but first and foremost
34:16
we want that person to respond like a human to us in terms
34:19
of what we've experienced and we're looking
34:22
for that connect we're looking for that connection with that notion and understanding
34:26
first so and i you know when it's looking when you're looking at pain or rehab
34:31
or surgery we go and seek these experts because we're actually we're looking
34:36
for more than the expertise really when we kind of look beneath it it's not
34:40
just the thing otherwise,
34:41
we will have ai doctors and actually we are i was going to say i think there was a study.
34:48
I think there was an NHS study which showed that the survey showed they preferred the AI,
34:54
treatment they were getting the triage they were getting because there was just
34:56
more empathy than the doctors which was worrying,
34:59
well let's do AI then no no no it's really scary but it shows the power of someone
35:06
who's listening and looking after the language which they reply with and the
35:09
questions they're asking so if the empathy is being picked up on that is yeah oh man we could talk
35:16
what we have talked about this no it's fascinating
35:19
and what i really love and the reason why i wanted to i'm
35:22
so happy that both of you on the show together is because it's just not
35:25
the two sides of the coin because it all works together it's the yin and the
35:28
yang it's the continuous flowing of the circle because that's what
35:31
it is i know i can't believe it's 2025 and i mentioned yin and yang but we all
35:36
had them little earrings with a black and a white little thing going on the
35:39
first stud i had i think but yeah it is it's it's yeah it's it's it's really
35:44
cool and it's something which I think so many therapists, so many listeners have.
35:49
Need i get i get messages now from therapists
35:52
who are just saying basically you know what matt it was so
35:55
much easier to make a living before this whole biocycle social
35:59
thing came in starting to care about people it's so much easier where people
36:02
just came and needs to be fixed bam bam thank you very much see you in a week
36:05
bam bam thank you much now i've got a conscience you know and that's a shame
36:08
because it just means they haven't grasped that model change enough that there
36:12
is a fantastic future in health care if you've got the skills and the empathy
36:16
and the coaching abilities to look
36:18
to people but it is a different model and and you just need
36:20
help from people like dr clare minshaw and serena simmons
36:24
and you can start getting that help by coming along to
36:27
great segue to the exmouth devon
36:30
conference on the 21st and the 20th on
36:33
a weekend which is nice i thought instead of midweek talking of
36:37
which right talking of which let's tie this all in i mean
36:39
this has been great because the idea of tonight was introduce you to
36:42
everybody and and give them a reason to
36:45
potentially come to the conference or anything else you do with courses
36:48
and things so let's let's dive in if we can to
36:50
what you are delivering at the conference in
36:54
September there are still tickets available people if it's the podcast you can
36:57
still get in it's not unreasonably priced it's more now than if you you know
37:02
listen to me when I first mentioned it but that's that's just organization on
37:05
your part you don't have to look at your time management a little bit but you
37:08
can still get a ticket okay it's still possible let's have a little look at
37:11
what we're going to be doing,
37:13
what you guys are going to be doing. Remind me.
37:15
Remind you. Yeah, this is why I use the screen as well.
37:19
Again, if you listen to the podcast and you want to see the images,
37:21
we'll talk through the images, but I've just got them up here for people who've joined us live.
37:24
And if you are listening live, then don't forget, feel free to ask questions.
37:27
This is your chance now because you are going to have to make some choices.
37:30
We've got a main theatre and we've got a breakout room. We've got things happening at the same time.
37:34
So you're going to have to make some decisions based on what's going to be most
37:37
useful for you, whether that's reinforcing something you know or something that's
37:41
going to challenge you by yourself. No silly questions, unless you ask them twice.
37:44
Ask them questions. I've got one comment then, and that's just probably that
37:47
Nikki Mansfield. No, it's not.
37:48
It's Deborah Thurler-Rowley. Hi, Deborah. How are you? It's not a question.
37:51
I think it's just admiration.
37:53
Rightfully so. Deborah Thurler-Rowley has said, always great to hear what Claire
37:56
has to say. There we go. Thanks, Deborah. Thanks for checking the post.
38:03
Right, let's go back to Claire first, if we can. So, Claire,
38:06
you are going to be gracing the stage, first of all, on this Saturday.
38:10
That's going to be 10 30 a.m in the morning in
38:13
the main theater with the title of the presentation strength and conditioning
38:17
for preserving joint health yeah don't get too much away but the theme the theme
38:23
of our so my talk and obviously serene and i are doing a session in the in the
38:28
afternoon together so anna-marie asked if we could,
38:32
present on Joint Approach and the principles about Joint Approach,
38:36
which is an online multidisciplinary program for the management of neostroarthritis,
38:40
which I've already mentioned,
38:41
which has had a profound impact on individuals suffering from NE OA from early
38:47
stage, but also to very late stage and NE OA.
38:51
So it comes back to what I said about dealing with the whole person.
38:57
So I have an expertise in exercise science, rehabilitation.
39:03
Neuromuscular physiology, but to think that I was the only answer to somebody's
39:08
rehabilitation needs is quite short-sighted, should we say.
39:13
We have a whole and complete being, and we need a joint approach from psychology,
39:20
from education and clinical input, and also nutrition to give that individual
39:26
the best shot to, I don't want to say get better, but have a much better quality
39:31
of life, reduce pain, etc.
39:32
So from my perspective, we can really do this exercise interventions far,
39:40
far better than we are doing already with some really, really simple things.
39:44
So strength and conditioning is, and it still remains the kind of buzz phrase,
39:48
it's all about exercise prescription, which doesn't sound quite as sexy as S&C,
39:54
but it is basically that.
39:55
What is the type of exercise that we're giving? How intense do we need to deliver that?
40:00
And then also then in front of you, look at what that individual is struggling
40:05
with in terms of pain particularly.
40:08
And can we modulate and adapt exercise to take account of pain before we start,
40:16
for example, to reduce load?
40:18
So for example, again some of the really important
40:21
things include muscular strength so muscular strength
40:24
is so so important for a multitude of reasons
40:27
it is related to incidence of disease all-cause mortality quality of life and
40:34
then also we can look at the joint surface and joint health too so if we're
40:38
going specific into neo-way and joint joint surface an experience of pain from
40:42
joint surface changes, it has a profound impact.
40:45
So then how do we start to deliver and prescribe exercise that's got the best
40:51
shot of improving muscular strength around the joint?
40:55
Musculature is like your biological scaffolding. How can we best condition that
40:59
in an individual who is suffering from knee osteoarthritis to help the joint
41:06
that's suffering from knee osteoarthritis?
41:08
And also just to acknowledge that joint health can go back from or to a very young person and we're.
41:18
Through then to perhaps end stay and pick away as the condition prior to knee
41:24
joint replacement surgery to optimize that outcome.
41:27
And we have multiple touch points in there where we can use these principles
41:32
whenever we encounter that individual or those groups of individuals to optimize
41:37
our exercise interventions to improve these parameters,
41:41
which will then mean maybe that individual actually doesn't have to go for joint
41:44
replacement surgery because they're feeling so much better.
41:47
Coupled, might I say, with all the extra stuff about, you know,
41:50
with the psychology and understanding of pain and what it is and what it isn't
41:54
and finding their support network, et cetera.
41:58
Right back to, as I said, kind of thinking about injury prevention and conditioning at an earlier age.
42:03
But from my perspective, we're going to be talking in this conference about
42:06
knee osteoarthritis and some really
42:08
simple things that you can use in
42:12
your practice to help just tweak those
42:15
exercise prescriptions that you're giving for a best input output
42:18
equation so what you're doing with your
42:21
patient what your patient's doing with the exercise fantastic sounds
42:25
amazing and it sounds i mean one of the most common
42:28
questions i get from massage therapists particularly those
42:32
who qualified after kind of 2014 is they hadn't
42:34
done any strength and conditioning i mean they really are aware
42:38
that they've what they have developed and
42:41
i think this is where the power of massage comes from is they have normally developed
42:44
some fantastic empathy and communication skills even if they're not aware
42:47
of it because they're the sort of person who likes to earn not
42:50
much money rubbing their hands through the hairy back with oil on it
42:52
so they've naturally they are caring people you know so and
42:56
god bless them and they form such an important part of the of
42:59
the circle of health for clients but
43:02
for people who are massage therapists and
43:05
looking at learning some strength and conditioning
43:08
principles this will be useful for them to come in and know what what they can
43:11
maybe should be doing themselves or how to refer it out and just to just to
43:15
be able to refer out i think that's so important just be able to flag up certain
43:17
things and suggest that patients go to other people yeah absolutely and also
43:22
so as i don't know if listeners know i'm so fortunate to be able to.
43:28
Teach multiple kind of groups of people around the world on these topics,
43:33
which include sports medicine doctors,
43:36
physiotherapists, sports massage therapists, anybody who's got an interest in
43:41
rehabilitation to help the practice that they already deliver,
43:45
help optimize that. So one, there's that.
43:47
And then two, absolutely, and Serena, I've talked about this before,
43:50
where you acknowledge there's a need greater than what you're able to deliver,
43:55
but you're all working with the patient at the heart or the client
43:58
at the heart of your practice and actually forming those relationships
44:02
with people you know like and trust is not
44:05
giving business away it's strengthening your
44:08
practice and you fall from this like positive cross-referral
44:12
relationship so there might not be you know you
44:15
give out the or you refer on to
44:18
this this practitioner and likewise your area
44:21
of genius and expertise will be reciprocated with
44:24
that right in the relationship where they refer back to
44:27
you or the patients and clients so absolutely
44:31
absolutely what you're saying there fantastic so
44:34
yeah i mean so that's why the catchphrase of our conference is pause reflect
44:38
and connect when we're talking about connecting we're not talking about connecting
44:41
with just people who do your job about connecting with other professionals in
44:44
healthcare because it is a great joint approach isn't it matt it's a joint approach
44:48
you should trademark that that's a fantastic.
44:54
No it's beautiful really looking forward to that definitely,
44:58
Fantastic. Right. I'm conscious of time. We're going to kind of come back to
45:01
that when you mentioned already the joint afternoon session you're going to
45:05
do with Serena, but let's move to Serena's.
45:08
I'll read it out, the presentation. So Serena's is going to be later on at 12.15
45:12
and it's called Beyond the Treatment Couch, The Hidden Power of Words, Belief and Behaviour.
45:19
What would you like to say about this? How's it going to help people come along to see it?
45:23
Do you know what, Matt? I'm just very, very much thinking I've talked far too
45:28
much tonight so I'm going to keep this really brief,
45:31
you've said it all in the title I really what
45:34
I want for people to have is I want them
45:37
to go away thinking that they've learned more about how people think and respond
45:43
and behave and why they do what they do really I'd love to give people more
45:48
of an insight into maybe what they're seeing in their treatment rooms and why
45:52
people are doing the things that they're doing so actually I want
45:55
to go into that room and hear more about what other people have
45:58
experienced and help them to make sense of that really and
46:01
for me to try and unlock some of that for them from a psychological point
46:04
of view so that they can go and try some things when they
46:07
go back to their treatment rooms on Monday because there
46:11
are some really quick kind of wins that we can kind of have and give I can give
46:15
to people where they can try things really quickly and I think the beauty I
46:20
hope of what I teach with psychology and the thing that actually one of the
46:24
things I should say as a little side note that always makes me smile is the
46:28
thing about psychology and I'm doing it again I'm.
46:33
Is that actually this is the authority finger not the hand is that when you're
46:40
learning about human psychology you're also learning about yourself mm-hmm,
46:44
So one of the biggest compliments I get, really genuinely, like my heart just
46:52
kind of hums, is people say, do you know what?
46:55
I did your course, but I've been doing that thing you said with my children
47:01
and it's really working.
47:04
Or I use that thing you said about how to communicate with my husband.
47:08
And oh, my God. so that's the beauty of understanding
47:11
how someone thinks and feels and behaves is that it's
47:14
not just applicable in the treatment room and it and it
47:17
will do that it will change that i hope as well and it does kind of jokes aside
47:21
but it has a ripple effect in terms of other relationships because understanding
47:26
those things just has that kind of universal impact so that's what i hope to
47:31
have that sounds actually quite big but yeah hopefully you can take one thing away.
47:38
It summarizes exactly what we're trying to achieve in
47:41
the conference and i'm hoping listeners have read our kind of
47:44
go to the sd school decoder again have a look at what
47:47
we've written on the web page because the whole idea of the conference is it's
47:51
not just another conference where you're going to go along and listen to amazing
47:54
information because that might be amazing information but it's all about how
47:59
it's delivered and and the learning cycle and normally nine times out of ten
48:03
about you being involved during it,
48:05
being given a chance to reflect, because that's how we learn.
48:08
It's education as opposed to just, there is a place for kind of lecture halls
48:12
and people just sitting there and not talking and listening to person at the
48:15
front. But what we're trying to do with this.
48:19
People who come along really walk away with empowered and
48:22
with some information they can use something functional something useful and
48:25
it's thanks to deliverers like yourselves educators like yourselves
48:28
that i'm really i'm confident that they are gonna that's gonna
48:31
be achieved because you've you've both i know you both do
48:34
this i make it a thing actually matt and then anything that
48:37
i deliver whether it be a short free
48:40
seminar or webinar or of indeed of
48:43
course that there needs to be
48:46
at the end of that and especially the scrutiny I
48:49
suppose is especially on those short things that people
48:52
can go away and practically implement something from
48:55
that session otherwise it's a nice to
48:58
know but what do I do with that and and invariably all
49:01
the people majority of people that I teach and
49:05
interact with are involved in changing people's
49:08
physical status and mental psychological
49:12
status although I don't have the psychological expertise or
49:15
input like that if they can't go away and
49:18
use that what's the use it's been nice but everybody's such
49:22
a busy life how many people can can go away and read the latest research articles
49:28
critically evaluate them and then try and understand what that means for their
49:32
own practice so if I'm able to do that that's absolutely my pleasure and i every
49:38
single session i make sure that that that is the.
49:42
In there at least one thing they can go away and try didn't that as soon as
49:46
they get off the off the call otherwise if it were me sat in that seat i'd be
49:50
like ah but how how do i do that.
49:56
Yeah yeah brilliant yes so exciting can't wait right and then as you already
50:02
mentioned as well Well, there's going to be a joint presentation,
50:05
which is to be later on in the afternoon, and that's going to be 1.40.
50:09
Both of you are delivering a workshop in the breakout room entitled Why Rehab
50:13
Needs a Joint Approach. And I guess that's kind of what we talked about.
50:17
The two of you come together and be able to show that this is a person we're working with.
50:22
Yeah, I'm really excited about this one because we've got some case studies,
50:26
haven't we, Claire? So massively changed.
50:29
I think this is the beauty we
50:30
get to show what happens when you bring that knowledge together, I think.
50:34
I don't know what Claire knows. I haven't got a Scooby-Doo.
50:39
I've learned a bit over the years. Likewise. I think what this shows for me
50:44
is psychology, as I've illustrated probably in what I've said is the basis.
50:50
I think it's the start but you've got to back it up with someone if you're helping
50:54
someone change their physical strength you want to rehab them you won't they
51:00
won't think themselves better so that's the starting point and then they need to do the thing.
51:07
I think yeah violently agree in so much as let me just give you I know we're
51:12
short on time quickly exam exemplify this so in the trial that I mentioned.
51:17
So we did a load of objective data collection and also qualitative as well.
51:23
So through interviews and questionnaires and properly evaluated.
51:28
So individuals that were on this program were in this particular group were
51:34
two to four years on a waiting list for knee replacement surgery.
51:36
They were in such incredible pain.
51:38
They couldn't navigate the stairs, majority of them. Some had put beds in their living room.
51:43
Some had, you know, it was just it was just horrifically horrible for them now
51:48
this is a 12-week program within two weeks of this group being on the program
51:55
many of them if not the majority well definitely the majority if not all were reporting improved.
52:03
Pain so the pain levels were going down that's not a massive physiologic change
52:08
we know that strength will take a bit longer than that even neurally to change
52:12
so that for me is a psychological.
52:16
Relationship understanding of what pain is what
52:19
it isn't that it relates to through the education that we've got
52:22
on there doesn't mean you're doing damage and that
52:25
is profoundly impactful because then that means they can engage
52:28
in the strength-based exercise which requires you
52:31
know for them like a pretty extremely intense
52:36
effort to push and pull against these heavy
52:39
duty resistance bands etc but it gave them the confidence to do
52:42
that that's the bit that crass creates elastic
52:45
physiologic change which then again this
52:48
is all hypothesized the change in
52:51
pain thereafter which we also saw again
52:54
so a continued improvement in pain continued improvement in
52:57
quality of life continued improvement of
53:00
function and then just to
53:03
come back to the psychology the psychology bit is recognizing
53:07
what they're going to do after the end of that program so we don't want people
53:11
to just stop we want them to become independent confident exercises and if they
53:16
fall off the wagon which everybody does and that's fine how to get back onto that cycle of behavior,
53:25
can i just say one last thing which is my little favorite one of my favorite
53:29
phrases which tags onto the back of what claire said which is change is not
53:33
just for life christmas it's for life.
53:38
Because a lot of i think a lot of strategies that you
53:40
learn around behavior change are great because what they create
53:43
is compliance in clinic and that's it and i
53:46
think the difference between a compliant person
53:50
slash patient slash client whoever
53:53
you're seeing versus that person where you upskill them enough that they've
53:58
tapped into something deeper psychologically so it means something different
54:02
that the behavior change is sustained over time that's when you've really done
54:07
something great for another human being and you've not just done your job,
54:12
And I think that's the difference. That's what I'm after. So the work I do that
54:16
I'm kind of collaborating with Clermont with Joint Approach, an amazing company,
54:20
is to help that behavior change be sustained and not just basically to go beyond
54:25
the program itself. And I think that's the power of it.
54:29
Fantastic. Yeah. That sounds amazing. It's going to be such,
54:32
I mean, if anybody's planning on coming along to my presentation,
54:35
if you've got any of these guys at the same time, then this should like seal the deal.
54:39
Oh, stop it. Oh, no. Honestly.
54:43
I'm going to have to rearrange the time i'm organizing the time i
54:46
might have to play around with this now although if it's
54:49
the same time as you you can't come and see mine so that's good i'm
54:52
going to come and see yours i'm pretty much going to make sure shortly after
54:55
this you can't anyway anyway anyway so yeah there
54:58
we go brilliant so much said that is is
55:01
kind of exactly what this conference is about and you
55:04
are two of 19 speakers who
55:07
i like to think as we selected them are all
55:10
kind of on the same page and yeah it's gonna be a great
55:13
event so thank you so much for and
55:17
for coming along to it if listeners have heard you and they can't come along
55:21
to this but they want to follow you and maybe get and find out about courses
55:26
and things what's the best way for you it's the website getbacktosport.com you
55:31
can find everything on there so online courses,
55:34
on strength and conditioning dynamometry some in-person courses as well although
55:40
probably most of those are in-house but you might find the odd one and yeah on social media,
55:45
when you say in-house you're based where these days.
55:49
Nottingham, I'm in Nottingham, but yeah, the in-house courses, yeah, all over.
55:54
Oh, I see what you mean, in-house. It's a really good one. If you fancy a holiday,
55:58
there's one in Abu Dhabi in November. I saw that advertised.
56:01
Yeah, that's it. Come on, it's not advertised.
56:05
Yeah, maybe next year. Brilliant. And yourself, Serena, if people want to follow
56:10
you, you've got the psychology school .co.
56:12
That's an interesting one. I know. Just repeat that for listeners, it's .co.
56:16
Actually, I honestly think I've got both. so if you put .co.uk it
56:20
should also go through I think it does
56:23
yeah it's clever and then in terms of work I
56:26
have got a course the behavior change course which is a five-week online
56:29
course that I release once a year so there's a
56:32
page on my website just go to that sign up to the wait list and
56:35
then my main focus now is
56:38
psych lab which is my exclusive membership
56:41
which is really for female I say
56:44
it's for female practitioners but actually we have men in there
56:47
which is amazing it I love it so like sod that that's not
56:49
just for women I'm committed and it's not I mean
56:52
we don't look at anything inherently just female it's just most
56:56
of the women people in there are female and it's a closed community
57:00
for people who would like to learn psychology
57:03
and behavior change ongoingly so there's a community we
57:06
do we have a master class every month I bring in
57:09
amazing guest speakers I train in there we have
57:12
coaching calls every month we have a book club we have
57:15
kind of work together sessions amazing people like claudia hammond have come
57:20
in we've got amazing guest speakers coming in so that's opening again and well
57:24
this month twice a year only that's all available at psychology school.co yeah
57:30
it's been lovely to see more people in.
57:33
Amazing. Even if you're a man. Fantastic. Even if you're a man.
57:37
And actually, Anna. I'm going to name drop. Anna was in it. Oh,
57:41
Anna Maria Asier is there. Yeah. Of course she is.
57:46
Right. So we'll make sure these links go into the show notes as always.
57:50
It's been absolutely lovely spending time with you and can't wait to see you
57:54
guys in less than three weeks now. So very exciting.
57:58
People who joined us live, thank you very much as well. If you're listening
58:01
to the podcast, obviously thank you.
58:02
Would love to see you live i understand and for some of
58:05
you you're working and it's tricky to come along but if you can make
58:08
a lifestyle change if you're struggling with that then go
58:11
to um serena simmons she'll help you along with it if you
58:14
can make a lifestyle change and give more time to yourself and
58:17
living in the present then maybe come along to youtube
58:20
on a tuesday normally at eight o'clock and hang out with
58:23
the other people in the live lounge and you can ask questions to
58:26
our guests directly if you listen to the podcast and obviously thank you
58:28
very much as well we do appreciate that but we'd
58:31
appreciate it even more if you could subscribe to the youtube channel and
58:34
also just leave a rating and a review on whatever podcast that
58:37
you listen to because it just helps it appear high up in google particularly if
58:40
it's apple or youtube it just helps the good word of our guests.
58:43
Get out there more which is what it's all about it's all about just being a
58:46
conduit for great information so yeah do your bit by
58:49
subscribing and liking and all that sort of stuff it makes a difference as
58:53
i say we'll be back next tuesday where my guest is going to
58:55
be we've had enough Anna Maria's got a massive shout
58:58
out so far today hasn't she yeah once again we're going
59:01
to say Anna Maria Matsieri will be here next week and direct
59:04
to the ST school who I think is gonna be really interesting conversation about what
59:07
is evidence-informed practice something that you guys have asked to have
59:10
clarification on and Anna Maria will
59:12
be linking that with a couple of presentations she's giving in September and
59:16
to do with pain trauma and also manual therapy for
59:19
scars so if you can join us for
59:22
that and yeah next Tuesday o'clock but in
59:25
the meantime just once again thank you so much for dr claire minshaw absolutely
59:29
my pleasure and serena simmons thank you matt
59:32
you're a great interviewer and thank you to nikki who said something lovely thank
59:35
you oh if we've got a comment let's bring that up then thank you
59:38
for you both thank you see you september thank
59:41
you how nice of you thanks nikki
59:45
and thank you everyone who joined us live i mean it's not as many it used to be like 80
59:48
or so it's not as many but we still do it live because the feedback
59:51
we get even for people who download it is we love it's the fact it's live it's
59:54
just why we do it life but if you can join us then then even better that'd be
59:57
lovely as well and see glenn murphy can have the final word obviously because
1:00:01
he's a sir nice well thank you thank you so glenn thank you very much right
1:00:06
take care of each other and um and look at.
1:00:09
Music.