Latest / Red Couch Theology / Alex Nerds Out about John 21

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Alex Nerds Out about John 21 · Red Couch Theology

0:04
And we're live. Even though we're not ready,
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we're live. We both have food in our mouths.
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I mean a peanut butter and Jelly sandwich that my daughter made
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for me. Thanks for the warning.
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Wait, which daughter? Clara, the three-year old one.
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But this is a the the the crust of the loaf of bread.
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With the other crust of the loaf of bread.
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With the other crust of the loaf of bread, peanut butter and
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Jelly sandwich. And I would say it's so
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delicious because it was made by a three-year old, adorably so.
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Interesting. I feel like you're biased.
0:43
How are you, Alex? Splendid, good, wonderful.
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Looking forward to, you know, doing all the things you do.
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Yes, all right. One note that they don't need to
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know about, but since we don't ever do cuts, I need to be out a
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little early. Sure, I have parent teacher
1:01
conferences at 12:15 so. Good luck.
1:06
Is this for Clara as well? Yes.
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How do parent So this is what this is one thing I've never
1:13
understood about the American education system, like, well,
1:18
it's really two things, but it's the same principle graduation
1:22
ceremonies for preschoolers and parent teacher conferences for
1:26
preschoolers. That's because these teachers
1:28
figured out that in America, parents anxiety around the
1:32
educational performance of their kids is very, very high.
1:36
Yeah, OK, yeah, yeah, My first graduation in the UK was my
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bachelor's degree. Like until then, nothing.
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So you're like go through your whole.
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Life. Mine was high school.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know, Maybe they did
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they do anything for. No, I was in Africa.
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No. So.
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That might be the. Thing We didn't have schools.
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My mom was my teacher. Yeah, she gave me a Gold Star.
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Yeah, so anyway, it's a curiosity to me because I'm like
2:12
wow, they really like broke you into some stuff here, you know,
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buying graduation gifts for my 3 year old, you know,
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congratulations. Gifts.
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Is that part of it? Wow, am I supposed to show up to
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this parent teacher conference with like?
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Almost certainly. Wow.
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So anyway, all right, yeah, that's fine.
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This is the reason you signed used to showed up for a Red
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Couch theology podcast. So you start a new series
2:41
Sunday. I do.
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I would love to just get a brief overview of why in the world are
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we doing this series at a 30,000 foot level.
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What's in your heart is our pastor?
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What was like on your mind when you were like, we really should
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do this neighboring? So I think there's a couple of
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fun things really, like on one hand, so Jesus gives these two
3:02
like greatest commandments from his perspective.
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You know, in one version he gives them the other version in
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one, in one of the biographies, he gives the commandments in the
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other one, someone asks him a question and he says, how do you
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see it? And the person gives the right
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answer. Jesus says, well done.
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And the two are love God with all your heart and love your
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neighbor as yourself. So while there's like this
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beautiful, like synergy between the book of John is very much a
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book about loving God with all your heart.
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Like that's a lot of the language.
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It's inviting you to see God, to know him, to love him,
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especially in the person of Jesus.
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Actually the Holy Spirit's very Trinitarian book.
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And then this series is actually very much the second one, like
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love your neighbor as yourself. But but on a church level, I
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always also had this curiosity that, you know, we've just gone
4:00
to the second service. We have space for the first time
4:03
in a long time. And I was like, this really
4:06
feels like an important season of invite.
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Like how can we rethink and re like take hold of recapture our
4:16
our call to go to our neighbors, to love them, to care for them.
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And actually, in this series, it's only at the very end that
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we talk about sharing a story, sharing a faith.
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We actually start by talking by we begin by beginning where
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Jesus began, which is very relational.
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And so like we, we read stories like Jesus sat with sinners and
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try to remember who has this beautiful quote where they say,
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you know, Jesus didn't sit with sinners to celebrate their sin.
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He sat with them to celebrate the grace he brought in the
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midst of that. And so somewhere we're called to
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love our neighbors and, and according to Jesus, especially
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those that might be our enemies might have difficult
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relationships, you know, might, might be opposed to us in some
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way. And so the first step is
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actually just to take seriously. I call to pray for our
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neighbors. And I have a friend back in
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England who has this like lovely, pithy say saying that he
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says over and over again, which is when I pray coincidences
5:20
happen and when I don't, they don't.
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And you know, it's, it's like catchy and memorable.
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And and that's the invite to pray that God will give you an
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opportunity to become close to neighbors, that he would bless
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them, that he would change the neighborhood, even perhaps.
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Yeah. And, you know, some people are
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lucky enough to say, well, my neighborhood's already amazing.
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And others would say, oh, well, it used to be or, you know, we
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had seasons or, yeah. But like Take, believing that it
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begins with press seems like a really important thing.
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Yeah. So yeah, if you're curious,
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that's coming up this Sunday to a church near you and.
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We're beginning with the story of the Good Samaritan.
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And it's not anywhere near you. Or England.
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Or. All the other places that are
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being listened to. So that's that's coming this
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Sunday and I'm sure we'll find out more than so.
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This week was the last week of John, which has been man.
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John. I I felt like my energy for John
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went like super high like I was like loving it.
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Early chapters really hit some like, Oh my goodness, was still
6:32
in John moments. And then in this like Easter
6:36
season, like you preaching on chapter 1819 on Good Friday, 20
6:41
on Easter Sunday and then 21 this week suddenly just went
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like higher than it ever was. So I kind of finished John with
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his sense of, Oh my goodness, I love John.
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So good. But there were definitely
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moments where I'm like, oh, this is a lot of work.
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Yeah, it was it. It did feel like a unique study
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challenge for some reason when you're preaching.
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It and I don't know if it was the density of the passages, the
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length of the passages like specially I found because.
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Repetition of the passages week to week to week to week.
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Part of it is like, how do I illustrate being believe in
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Jesus 12 more times? Yeah, that piece.
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And then in, in the like in the, you know, the last part for me,
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the last leg or the second to last penultimate leg was the
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upper room thing. And there's only one passage in
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the upper room that's got any kind of like real metaphor to
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it. And I gave that passage to
7:41
someone else. So like through 141617, there's
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just this like, Oh my goodness, this is so this is Jesus last
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words to his disciples before his crucifixion.
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And it's so full of meaning and power and it's So what you feel
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it's importance to Jesus. Yeah.
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But you're like, I don't know how to keep keep trying to pull
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from this, like, one idea. Yeah.
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When Jesus doesn't seem very interested in one idea at all.
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Yeah. He's like trying to quick
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download is my last 30 things I. Wanted to teach you before I.
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Leave, you know, and then you're like.
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So I just, I just felt every week I'm like, Oh my goodness,
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this is felt like a big endeavor.
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Yeah. So this was an interesting week
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because in some ways you're unpacking this one-on-one
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relationship that Jesus has with Peter.
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I'm still chewing my sandwich, by the way, sorry.
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Which actually takes place throughout the whole book, but
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two primary moments, one in chapter 18 and 1 here.
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So. Give us a quick 30,000 foot
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overview of this. SO there was the denial of Peter
9:00
in 18 and then this week was about his restoration.
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And, and just by nature maybe of John and Peter's relationship, I
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would argue that John is less interested in Peter than any of
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the other gospel writers are. OK.
9:15
You know, like he, he, he has his.
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Saying that they didn't like each other.
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I don't know. I don't know.
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I feel like they did it in the end, but I feel like there's
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some competition there. Like Peter is very much the
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leader of the disciples in Matthew, Mark and Luke, and John
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is very much the beloved disciple in John.
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Yeah. So, so there's a highlight to
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like like none of Peter's big moments are in John by The
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Walking on the water, not in John like the the declaration,
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you are the Christ, the son of the living God, not in John.
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So, so like the things that like, stand out about Peter in
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John are his failures. Interesting.
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So, so like, I mean, that's just a curiosity to me.
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I don't know that I can say that I know the motive, but but it's
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not. Like St.
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John's, this old bitter man Peter's.
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I'm not saying no, that's that's still ruminating.
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That's. Precisely what I'm not saying,
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but I am saying that for whatever reason, they're not in
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there. Yeah.
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Like, like, yeah, Peter is very clearly the leader of that group
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when Jesus isn't there. And in Acts continue, like the
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loop narrative continues into Acts.
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It's one solid book. And Peter's the one that stands
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up on the day of Pentecost. And Peter's the leader of the
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early church. Peter's the one that he is, you
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know, that the Gentiles are now included and, you know, so.
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So for whatever reason, Peter doesn't shine at all as a
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disciple in John. In fact, most of the things he
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does, he gets wrong. There's the and and you got
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actually most of them right. You got the in 13, he's at the
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low end of the table when John is sat next to Jesus and he's
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the one that like fumbles his way through a bunch of
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statements about don't wash me, OK, then wash all of me.
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And then in 18, it's very like all the others, say one of us
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cut the air off the, the disciples and, and Peter's like
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it was Simon Pete. John's like Simon Pete.
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Like no way you're going to get him wrong.
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And so, yeah, he, he seems to bumble his way through John.
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Now, he makes errors in the others as well, but the errors
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are usually like counteracted with the incredible things he
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does. Yeah, yeah.
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Like he's confession, like, you know, stay away from me, Lord.
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I'm a sinful man. He's the first one to really see
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Jesus as more than a man. You are the Christ, the Son of
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the living God. First one to see the mission
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and, and, and proclaim it so boldly.
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And those are counteracted a little bit with the denial,
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which is in most of them with the, with the transfiguration
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moment of, you know, let's build some, some huts and stay here
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with the oh, this will never happen to you Lord moments like
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so, so they're all there, but it's a balance in the others,
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whereas in in Johnny mostly blows it.
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So so anyway, he's he's he's made these mistakes.
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He's been the one that declared in John 13, if everyone else
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betrays you, I never will. I'll even die for you.
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And you sang that incredible song where like it really is
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articulation has been like, you're wrong about me, Jesus.
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Like in those moments where you say that I'm weak and I'm not
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able to stick with you, you're wrong.
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I know myself better than you know me.
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And so somewhere the redemption Archaea for him is where you did
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know me all along. You, you very clearly saw me
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and, and there's almost this beautiful like moment when he
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says, you know, all things. You almost just picture it like
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the reason I talked about it is confession.
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It's like to me, confession has this beautiful like rest posture
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to it. You know, I remember as a kid,
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like, and I say kid like 14/15/60, it was really hard for
13:32
me to to, to, to like if a friend said, oh, have you seen
13:35
this new movie to say, yeah, I haven't seen that yet.
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I was like, I wanted to like have seen it.
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I wanted to meet the standard. And.
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Then you get older and you're like someone says, oh, have you
13:47
read this book? If you see that, you're like,
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no, haven't read it yet. Like you know, you, you and you
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see a desire. I remember someone telling a
13:55
story once that just stuck with me.
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It was a story about going to a an artist, like, it was a
14:05
session that he did where he was training them on how he does,
14:08
like, drawing work, whether it was a Simpsons guy or whatever.
14:11
Yeah, Yeah. And everyone's like, you know,
14:14
drawing away, trying to, you know, do what he's telling them
14:17
to do. And one person puts their hand
14:19
up and says, sorry, I'm lost. Could you say that?
14:23
Could you say that again? And this guy said the whole room
14:26
went, oh, thank goodness someone said it because they're all
14:30
struggling. They're all behind.
14:31
And finally one person put their hand up and said, I'm just, I
14:34
can't keep up. But no one wanted to say it.
14:37
No one wanted to be the one that said, I'm slow, sorry, I'm not
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able to do the things you're asking me to do.
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And so we as humans seem like we want to say we kept up with the
14:48
Joneses. We wanted to have all the
14:49
things, all have everything in order.
14:52
And so confession is that moment saying, no, sorry, I can't keep
14:55
up. I don't understand the question.
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Like I'm, I don't have it all together.
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I haven't paid off my mortgage. I haven't done like whatever we
15:04
think is the thing. Being able to go like, oh, yeah,
15:09
yeah, that's who I am. And that's what Peter does in
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that moment. He's like, yeah, you know, all
15:13
things, you know that I love you.
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Like for all the all the eras, almost mistakes, I do actually
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love you. Jesus.
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That's his story. So good.
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Well, we did get a few questions that came in and so yeah, let's
15:28
just let's address those. And then I had some questions
15:31
that you actually hinted at in your message as well.
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So Jesus had appeared to his disciples 2 times before he
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arrived at the beach. Were they out?
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Where? Where were they were?
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They were about go to go fishing.
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Where they were about to go fishing, Yeah.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah. OK.
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I don't know why I couldn't read that question.
16:00
All right, So he arrived at the beach where they were about to
16:02
go fishing. Why did they not recognize him?
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Oh man, isn't that, isn't that the mystery really?
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Like I, I think that's the difference between Lazarus
16:11
resurrection and Jesus resurrection.
16:14
And I think you could actually call Lazarus resurrection,
16:17
Lazarus resuscitation, to be honest.
16:20
And we talked about this like, the week before, like, comes out
16:23
with the sound, he said. Comes back with the same, like,
16:26
bad attitudes and same, like, scars and same, whatever.
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Yeah. You can imagine him sitting down
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for a meal and, and, you know, being salty about something.
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And people have been like, oh, wow, that really didn't change.
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You did it. Yeah, you resurrected from the
16:46
dead, but you're still. You're still the same person and
16:49
Jesus is very, very obviously has a different physicality.
16:54
Yeah, so like since we're a theology podcast, we can
16:57
actually get into some of the theological anthropology of some
16:59
of this. There's like some interesting
17:00
conversations in the theological, deeper theological
17:03
space around what does it mean to be human?
17:06
What is the imago day or to be made in the image of God.
17:10
And because we see Jesus as still in body, in fact, for
17:16
Christianity, the embodiment of Jesus through the incarnation is
17:20
so critical to the gospel message and so unique amongst
17:25
world religions where God becomes human.
17:29
Yeah, and he's still embodied after the resurrection, but
17:33
there's some differences, like he's walking through walls.
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Yeah, it's a very, he can change his appearance.
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Like it's only then that they recognize it's a very different
17:41
physicality. But there's still an embodiment.
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And it's not like it's just a 100% clean slate either.
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He's still got scars. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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But only some it's like, you know, because there's all the
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stories about the crown of thorns and the beating and the
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but none of those scars are present.
18:00
Yep, it's it's like a a freshness but with still the
18:05
signs of and not bleeding wounds like scars but but but healed.
18:12
You. Know so.
18:14
So they're present as a, as a memorial, but not present as a,
18:20
as a defect or a pain or a any of the things that they would
18:24
be. So, so there's there's something
18:27
going on there. Not now.
18:29
Paul interestingly says, you know, we will all be changed and
18:36
and he says we'll have a resurrection body like Jesus own
18:42
new resurrection body. Yes.
18:44
So to me, the fascinating thing is there.
18:50
So Jesus is, you know, and, and this, this is, this is where we
18:54
like, you know, we know, trying to enunciate a mystery.
19:00
Jesus is very clearly human, limited to 3 miles an hour,
19:06
living on reliance of his Father, living in the power of
19:10
the Holy Spirit, having laid aside his divinity.
19:14
And yet there seems to be things Jesus can do if he chooses to,
19:19
that becomes something like signs.
19:22
So you get this kind of story that seems to pass through the
19:25
well. In the same way, Jesus was able
19:27
to pray for people and they will be healed.
19:29
That's actually a story for his followers as well.
19:33
But then Jesus was able to walk on water and there's no
19:38
particular encouragement to us. Oh, give give walking on water a
19:42
try. That seems to be something
19:44
particular that he can do. So Jesus is very human.
19:48
And then there's some differences, some things that
19:50
he's enabled to do specifically because of who he is.
19:55
And then there's this idea that the the new body he has that's
19:59
actually very similar to what will happen to us one day.
20:04
And so like in terms of what that means for our assumption
20:10
that, you know, you're going to walk into an eternity and see a
20:13
person that you. Like have done life with them
20:16
and know them, yes, but also for them to be distinctly different.
20:22
You know this so and and even like the revelation story that
20:27
eternity is very grounded in an earthly Kingdom, a a new heavens
20:34
and a new earth, a renewed heavens and a renewed earth, a
20:37
new Jerusalem. And yet still the physicality
20:41
piece is different. And so I actually feel like the
20:46
most important passage to me understanding this stuff has
20:50
been when Paul says I've been there to a degree.
20:55
By the way, let me let me tell you no, I can no, I have seen no
21:00
error is understood what God has in store for you.
21:04
Like to a degree we we talk about uncertainties and our
21:09
certainty about it comes from our trust that God is preparing
21:12
something good and valuable and wonderful, not in knowing
21:16
exactly what it looks like. Yeah.
21:19
Interesting. Yeah.
21:19
So yeah, I I think the physicality piece for Jesus is
21:22
very clear. There's eating, there's
21:24
breakfast, there's all those types of things.
21:29
And yet at the same time, a transcendent physicality that
21:36
isn't limited. Yeah, there's this.
21:39
So there's this section of, I don't know if it's an article or
21:43
a full book because we only read a section of it either way by
21:47
Gregor of Nessa, who's an early church father called on the Soul
21:51
and the resurrection. And he does just this deep
21:54
meditation on it's, it's in his section around theological
22:00
anthropology, which is what anthropology is the study of
22:03
what it means to be human. And theological anthropology is
22:06
to say, what is the scriptures and what does God say in human
22:10
is? And so it's these questions
22:12
around, you know, what does it mean to be made in the image of
22:17
God? Are we only spiritual creatures
22:19
or physical creatures? All these sorts of things.
22:21
And so all the stuff you said there is fascinating.
22:25
The, the interesting thing. He asked the question at a level
22:28
that was like mind boggling to me 'cause I'd, he'd ask
22:31
questions that I'd never even considered to ask.
22:33
Like, like if someone, we've, we've probably all heard folks
22:40
who are older and they're like, you know, older Saints who love
22:43
Jesus and they, as they age and their bodies age, they're like,
22:46
I'm just looking forward to the day that I'm restored and stuff.
22:49
And so there's this longing for our new, our new bodies and the
22:52
restoration. We just had someone who was
22:59
deeply part of our community for quite a few years, who was
23:02
wheelchair bound for so many years.
23:04
They just passed away and and there's this this idea that like
23:09
he's finally going to be able to be out of a wheelchair.
23:12
But Greg, Greg of NYSSA asks a few questions.
23:16
But there's some ailments that are so integral to who a person
23:21
is that do we want them to be going?
23:24
Yeah. And we, I think we've talked a
23:25
little bit about this of like someone with like Down syndrome,
23:29
for example, are some of the happiest, most joy giving and
23:33
joyful people you could imagine. And it's hard for us as humans
23:38
to imagine them not that way. In fact, it's almost a grief to
23:42
imagine them not that way. And so do we want every single
23:48
thing to be wiped clean and we see the Christ has scars.
23:52
Do we want every pain to just disappear from our memory when
23:57
those pains shaped some of the goodness and beauty that we are?
24:00
These are the kinds of questions he asked.
24:02
His conclusion is really hard to even nail down because it's
24:05
ancient writing and so it's hard to read in the 1st place.
24:08
But I get the sense that his conclusion maybe not as based in
24:13
scriptures you'd like as he's like all the good stuff, none of
24:17
the bad stuff, the end. So he he plums the depths at A
24:22
at a, a brilliant level that I can't even fathom.
24:26
Yeah. And then finally he comes like
24:28
just all the good, none of the bad, whatever that means.
24:30
Yeah, yeah, yeah. End of story.
24:32
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's kind of what we.
24:34
Get I feel like with some of the church fathers and this might be
24:37
taking their approach too far because the scriptures aren't
24:41
this like like bound locked edition, like they write with a
24:47
bit of a swagger of like, you know, like what I'm writing
24:51
might well be as good as the other stuff.
24:53
Like it's almost just like I'm just like.
24:57
They think they might be writing scriptures.
24:59
I, I don't know, like especially early on now Gregor of this is a
25:03
little bit later, but especially like that, the early 1st
25:07
century, 2nd century guys, they're like there's a little
25:10
bit of a swagger there that's like, yeah, I mean, we're pretty
25:13
close to the thing. Interesting.
25:16
So I I I know. I actually feel that way about
25:19
some of the New Testament. Yeah.
25:20
Like I just finished Second Corinthians now.
25:23
Now we're really chasing rabbit trails all over the place.
25:27
But I just finished a Second Corinthians United.
25:29
We're kind of reading that at a similar time.
25:31
And the, the whole second-half is so like, it's almost, I feel
25:36
like I'm reading a personal, a very personal journal entry.
25:42
Yeah. Or a, a, a, a love note that no
25:45
one else was supposed to read between Paul and this church.
25:49
And you're like, I'm like a little bit ashamed that I'm
25:51
reading this. Yeah, yeah.
25:52
This private letter. It's yeah, it's almost like
25:54
reading love letters that like some friends have written to
25:57
each other and you. Yeah, and you're like, you're
25:59
the caught in between and I'm like reading this.
26:01
I was like, what does this have to do with me?
26:03
It's so specific to this church. Yeah, yeah, it's been.
26:07
Paul's unique relationship with this particular church.
26:11
Especially the second-half, like the first half is much more
26:14
theological. It's like the imperative, the
26:17
indicative, and then like all his imperative stuff in the
26:20
second-half is like you should do this and this, you should do
26:23
that. And like, if you still don't
26:25
accept me and all of a sudden you're just like, I'm reading
26:28
someone else's mail for sure. Even the bit where he's like, I
26:31
continue to talk as a fool would talk, Yeah.
26:34
And he's like, wow, you're like throwing it all out there.
26:37
I'm not sure Paul knows he's writing the scripture.
26:40
Like when I'm reading the second-half of Second
26:42
Corinthians, I'm like, I don't think he knows, but isn't that?
26:44
Isn't that the beauty of it? Like I I've often thought of
26:47
like our understanding of Scripture has been inspired by
26:50
the Spirit has no requirement that the person writing it knows
26:55
they're doing it. Totally.
26:57
You know, it's it's a spirit work because the spirit says
27:00
it's a spirit work, not because the person who writes it down
27:04
knows that that's what happened is happening.
27:07
Yeah, I was kind of pondering with a new lens, You know, the
27:12
more I preach you sort of when you read scripture, you kind of
27:14
think, how would I approach this book or that book or this book?
27:17
I was like this book, I was like, wow.
27:20
Like he just rambles on about giving for like 6 chapters and
27:24
then and then there's this like goldmine verse, one verse in
27:29
there that you hear on a giving Sunday sermon or something.
27:32
But the rest is just like, you know, the other churches gave
27:35
more than you. You should probably like
27:38
remember that time you made that promise?
27:40
You should probably follow through with that promise about
27:41
giving. You're just like on and on and
27:43
on. And you're like, all right,
27:46
total rabbit trail. I'm sorry, but the point is that
27:51
like, yeah, some of these, some of these scripture writers may
27:54
not even know. I don't think there's any
27:56
certainty that they know. Yeah, sure.
27:59
Yeah. All right, So why?
28:03
In a very roundabout way, I do think we answered the question.
28:06
We don't know all the details of the He's embodied post Jesus is
28:12
embodied post resurrection, but there's some definite
28:14
distinctiveness about his embodiment.
28:19
We're really aware that Jesus is in control of his physicality
28:23
like how he appears and he's absolutely in control of how
28:28
he's revealed to his disciples and and broader than just the 12
28:32
to marry to the other women like he is to Clearpass and he's and
28:39
who's the is it? Is there only Clearpass that's
28:41
named in the Road to Emmaus? I think so, but the assumption
28:45
is that. Yeah, yeah, he, it's very clear
28:49
that he's in complete control of the when, of that, the where of
28:54
that, the why of that. It's a process that he's dealing
28:58
with masterfully to invite them back into the story.
29:02
And so for whatever reason, Peter has to wait the longest,
29:06
like he's the last one to get that invite.
29:08
Yep, awesome. All right, so we got another
29:11
question here. First off, your song was
29:15
awesome. Aaron, thank you.
29:19
I did not write the song. I need to clear the I've had so
29:22
many people compliment me on the song I wrote.
29:24
I did not write the song. Maybe you already know that this
29:27
is the risk of doing a special where we don't put the lyrics on
29:30
the screen. I wanted you to think about
29:32
these lyrics. And so we didn't.
29:34
And then inadvertently means I some people think I wrote the
29:38
song. I love that for you.
29:39
My default, if it's that good, I probably didn't write it OK,
29:45
just. That's not true because you did
29:47
that amazing one. Just an advent that was super
29:51
good. OK, so I'm just saying.
29:53
But yeah. Then I'll take full credit.
29:56
I'll put my name at the top. Written by Aaron Berkland no.
30:00
But this one, yeah, that that. Generally speaking, most songs
30:03
specials that we do, I do not write.
30:04
So that's poor Bishop Hooper. Poor Bishop Hooper.
30:07
An amazing job. And I did if there were several
30:10
people who commented about loving another few of the songs,
30:13
things we did at Good on Good Friday, which I did that poor
30:17
Bishop Hooper song two years ago, Good Friday or last year
30:20
ago? Yeah, last year.
30:22
And then there we did another poor Bishop Hooper song, this
30:26
Good Friday, the Crucifixion. So, yeah, brilliant.
30:29
So good at, like, these really artistic expressions of these
30:34
movements in Scripture. So cool.
30:36
Thank you, though. I'm glad you enjoyed it.
30:39
Also, please talk about the language part of the Jesus.
30:43
Do you love me the verse? I believe it's about the
30:46
different translations. The word love you.
30:48
You mentioned that you weren't going to and they're asking you
30:52
to go ahead. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
30:53
And, and so this is an interesting one.
30:54
Like I have definitely preached it this way that Jesus
30:58
intentionally like uses different words for love.
31:02
So, so the, the Greek language has at least 4 words for love
31:07
that reflect everything from like the love of like, you know,
31:11
like an honor type love, a brotherly love, a sexual type
31:15
love. And then the love that God has
31:17
is like the one that seems like a unique creation of Jesus.
31:22
Like it's very, very much starts here with the Christian journey.
31:26
Yep. And so in the flow of the
31:28
passage, he says Simon son of Law, son, son of John DU Agape
31:33
me. Yep, so we have that right here,
31:36
Agape. And then Peter replies, Yes, I
31:42
phileo you brother. Yeah.
31:44
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then Jesus says again, do
31:46
you agape me? And Peter says, do you phileo
31:49
me? And then finally Jesus says, do
31:51
you phileo me? And Peter says, you know, I
31:56
phileo you. And so there's been like streams
31:59
of thought, like specially in some of the older commentaries,
32:03
the Well, this is an intentional change of language that that
32:08
Jesus asks something of Peter that he can't live up to.
32:12
And then finally, in the last ask, Jesus brings it down to a
32:16
level that Peter can handle and says, yes, you, you know, and he
32:22
says, yes, I, you know, you know, I love you.
32:25
Well, I fillet are you? The problem is Jesus seems to
32:31
have some, or at least John especially has has some
32:34
arbitrariness for how agape and phileo were used at different
32:38
points. So there's even parts where
32:41
Jesus is specifically talking about the way that God loves and
32:46
uses the word phileo. So while there's a general use,
32:51
it seems that it's not as concrete as we as Westerners
32:55
would like it to be. And so a lot of the more more
32:58
modern commentary writers would say don't overpay, don't, don't
33:03
pay too much attention to the language shifts.
33:06
Maybe they point to something, but it's not certain.
33:09
And, and it's certainly not as important as the mirroring with
33:14
the three denials, which seems the most intentional part of the
33:18
passage. Yeah.
33:20
So, so I kind of made that decision that I think there's
33:23
probably something there. I think it's a perfectly good
33:26
take away that that maybe Peter can't yet say yes to the the
33:30
love of God and that later maybe can, you know, years after this
33:35
passage perhaps. Yeah, yeah.
33:37
But but for this week especially, I was like, I do not
33:42
want people to get lost in that and miss the mirroring of the
33:46
denials and the invitation back into the story.
33:50
Yes, because that felt like I was like, you know, I was
33:53
actually risking the main point at the of the sermon for a sub
33:59
point of the sermon, which is really easy to do when you like.
34:02
Especially in John, which we've had that conversation a dozen
34:05
times, which is like, because raw John is so good at writing
34:09
in 4456 dimensions like he'll, well, I think I joked about the
34:15
week I preached where I was like, I spent two hours chasing
34:18
a rabbit trail just to find at the end of the rabbit trail.
34:21
It didn't connect to the main idea.
34:23
And you're like, well, thank you John for wasting two hours of my
34:26
study thinking that I'm I'm just trying to see if this is part of
34:30
his thesis. And I concluded that it's like,
34:33
it's definitely there, but it's tertiary to his primary success.
34:38
And when you're preaching, you're trying to just get those
34:40
primaries. And so you decided it might be
34:43
there and it's a reasonable take.
34:46
Yeah, there's no reason it's not, but but it's certainly not
34:49
when you look at the language used for love across the New
34:52
Testament and specifically in John, it's not concrete all the
34:56
time. It seems like the some wiggle
34:58
room, like if it's concrete God, Jesus talks about God having a
35:03
brotherly love for a person. And so, yeah, it felt like a
35:11
thing that I could just know and pass on because I wanted to make
35:15
sure it stayed in the realms of like, this is the central thing
35:19
Jesus is doing both with the fishing and the welcome back,
35:25
you know, the invite back to the first moment.
35:27
Sorry, both with the fire and the breakfast and then with the
35:31
three questions and the final follow me.
35:34
Which brings Peter back to the beginning of his story arc.
35:37
So it's almost like Jesus skillfully weaves this relate
35:42
reaction. The entire book of John A
35:44
Chiasm. Maybe.
35:47
Yeah, that would make total sense.
35:49
Yeah. Begins with Follow me and it
35:51
ends with Follow me and. Riddle me.
35:53
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
35:54
And. What's in the middle?
35:56
Yeah, although it's it's really hard to believe that the
35:59
crucifixion and resurrection isn't the central.
36:01
Yeah. But but, yeah, there's this
36:04
skillful weaving of everything that happens in John 21.
36:08
Yeah, Yeah. To bring Peter back to this
36:10
moment where he was invited in. Yeah.
36:12
And he's beginning again as though it never happened.
36:15
In some ways, he's learned all these lessons, but Jesus brings
36:19
him in with the same lack of judgement.
36:21
I did it the first time, yeah. And then he says follow me.
36:24
So I that that was the choice there.
36:27
Yeah. So, OK, I do think this gives us
36:31
an opportunity to like briefly address like some some biblical
36:35
interpretation principles. We've talked a lot about this
36:38
maybe in the past, but it might be worthwhile just bringing it
36:41
back to the forefront because of this context.
36:45
So when you're, when you, when you're studying a passage of
36:48
scripture, context is so, so important.
36:50
And so there's like these concentric search circles of
36:54
context as you're studying like 1 would be the immediate
36:59
context. So what was said right before,
37:01
what's said right after? Do they relate?
37:03
Is there a common thread those kinds of questions?
37:06
Is there, is there a building argument, all those sorts of
37:09
things. Then there's the entire book.
37:12
There's usually a larger thesis or there might be a section
37:16
wherein Section 2 or chapter like not the chapter markers
37:22
aren't there in the original text, but like maybe you can
37:25
sense that there's like a an opening movement and then a
37:28
central movement and a closing movement.
37:31
So that will be the next section.
37:33
Then the full book will be like the the thesis of the entire
37:37
book. And then the next context would
37:40
be other literature by the same authors.
37:44
That's when you're looking at the terminology for this would
37:46
be Johannian literature. So you're looking at the Book of
37:48
Revelation, all those other things.
37:53
So when you're trying to figure out, for example, the reason I
37:55
brought this up is the word love, Leo versus agape.
37:58
When you look at all of John's writings, he is the most Willy
38:02
nilly with those two. So that's why you said, you said
38:06
I do think it's a thing. But because he's Willy nilly,
38:09
it's not it. I'm a little on a slightly
38:12
shakier ground anchoring my entire sermon on that.
38:16
And then when you're doing a whole chapter, you're like, it
38:19
is a distinct moment in a chapter, but it doesn't match
38:23
the theme of the whole chapter. Whereas the redemption piece of
38:26
Peter story is the whole chapter.
38:29
There's nothing else on John's mind.
38:32
I say nothing. That's the central thing on
38:35
John's mind. And, and, and the, the, the
38:37
mystery for us as preachers who usually tap into original
38:41
languages a lot in a church like South is that sometimes, like in
38:47
this instance, the Greek language has way more words than
38:52
the English language. And then most of the time it has
38:56
way less words. So we've got all these like
38:59
myriad of words, we have new words to the English Dictionary
39:02
every single year and we've got all these options because of the
39:05
different language. Extremes.
39:08
Pouring into it. So sometimes you're like, oh
39:12
man, this is so like, so simple, almost like so like, there's
39:20
nothing to it. There's no it could mean any
39:23
anything. It could mean like 10 or
39:26
different words that we have in the English language.
39:29
You. Often times when you, when you
39:30
pull up, like if, if I were to put this on the screen and pull
39:33
up one of these Greek words and I do a deep dive into this word,
39:36
it pulls up this resource called Brown driver Briggs or or B dag.
39:43
And there's this is the word, and it's got meaning, one
39:46
meaning 2 meaning sometimes 6. Yeah.
39:50
Based upon the context, based upon the author, it's probably
39:54
one of these. Yeah, yeah, 6 potential.
39:57
So there's all these different like things you're like, well,
39:59
in this instance, is it, this, is it, this is it this?
40:02
And then sometimes like with the word love, like we just say
40:04
love. And so we love.
40:06
I love my shoes, I wear them a lot.
40:08
I love my kids, I love my parents, I love my house, I love
40:12
my lunch. I love my like.
40:15
Like we we we almost overused the one word that we have
40:18
because it has to mean everything.
40:22
So, yeah, yeah. So to close the loop like that,
40:25
there's that immediate context. Then you look at all the content
40:28
by a specific author. Then you look at all the content
40:30
within a specific genre, and then you look at the content
40:33
within a probably within a covenant era, and then the
40:38
content within the entire scripture.
40:39
And so that so if you wanted to test this out, one of the books
40:42
I think is really readable is Jesus Through Middle Eastern
40:46
Eyes by Kenneth Bailey, and he does an amazing job.
40:50
He lived in the Middle East for a long time.
40:52
He sees ways in which some of the things that are reflected on
40:56
in the New Testament, there's communities that still live that
40:59
way today. That's he'll kind of take you
41:02
back through the lens he has today into that moment.
41:08
And so that that's a great book to dabble with some of this
41:10
stuff. We haven't even gotten to like
41:12
word play and all those different things which are
41:14
constant in the Greek and and even more in Hebrew languages.
41:20
But that's all the undercurrent and why we say things like, you
41:25
know, our job is to be translators to a degree.
41:29
And there's people that have said things like, you know,
41:31
without being able to do the original languages, you miss
41:35
like huge percentages of the intent of the author.
41:40
Yeah. All right.
41:43
So I have a question and then we kind of have to wrap up so I can
41:45
go get to my 3 year olds parent teacher conference where they're
41:50
going to be like she's 3. She's amazing.
41:54
She's 3 and she does 3 year old things like I don't know.
41:57
OK sorry I shouldn't talk that way.
42:00
Let me read this chapter 21 verse 10 says says this Jesus
42:06
said to them, bring me some of the fish you've caught just
42:08
caught. Simon Peter climbed back into
42:11
the boat and dragged the net to the shore, and it was full of
42:14
large fish. 153 But even with so many, the net was not torn.
42:20
Oh my goodness. Why 153?
42:24
Fascinating. Well, one first, like let me
42:26
just know the original story, the 1:00 where they're called
42:31
the net does break. So there's a whole thing there
42:35
like the net broke, net began to tear like they it can't hold the
42:40
goodness, the provision, whatever.
42:41
Now the net doesn't break, so there's something going on
42:44
there. Chase that rabbit trail, Yeah.
42:46
And then 153. I feel like I've heard so many
42:52
different ideas for this. OK, A. 100 the right one. 100
42:56
and 53153 different types of fish in the world, at least from
43:03
a Middle Eastern perspective 153 like nationalities or language
43:09
groups or whatever it's all the people in the world like you
43:12
know it's. Admissions push.
43:14
Yeah, yeah. 153, the number of John's community, like he was
43:18
pastoring a group of 153 people. So he's like, there you are.
43:23
You're in my own book. And that's how much I love you
43:25
guys. I have no idea what it means.
43:30
I I really am like in this place where I'm like, yeah, sure.
43:33
Any of those sound good, but also just like it's a lot of
43:37
fish, but it is it is an unusually specific.
43:41
Number and not. For a scripture.
43:43
Writer and not like John to just waste yeah that that on
43:48
something. So, so like, oh, oh, oh, one of
43:51
the things that we know about the biblical, the biblical books
43:55
is 40 comes up a lot, 12 comes up a lot, 7 comes up a lot, 3
44:01
comes up a lot. So there's a lot of numbers that
44:04
are repeat numbers. And so when it says 40 days and
44:08
40 nights, does it mean exactly 40 days or 40 nights?
44:11
Or does it mean a lot of nights and a lot of days?
44:15
Seven seems to reflect completeness.
44:17
It's the number of days of creation.
44:21
And, you know, there's actually a whole bunch of ideas about
44:24
what it means for Thomas Thomas to be met by Jesus on the eighth
44:28
day. Yeah.
44:29
Yeah. So all this different stuff
44:31
going on there. And then 3C comes up over and
44:34
over again in Trinity 1212, Tribes in the Old Testament, 12
44:38
disciples in the New Testament. You know, all these different
44:41
like parallels. Yeah, and there's like similar
44:45
to chiasms, like if you can get the idea.
44:50
Once you discover what a chiasm is, then you see them
44:53
everywhere. Yeah.
44:54
Oh yeah. Yeah.
44:54
Yeah, save there's definitely, Numbers are definitely
44:59
significant, especially in the Hebrew Bible, and they do have
45:03
subtle meanings and also in the New Testament.
45:05
But then you also will meet some people who are like, every
45:08
number means everything all the time.
45:11
And it's like they're just like so obsessed about it starts to
45:15
go a little bit beyond what it's intended to do.
45:18
So yeah, these are tricky. So, so I, I think like this is
45:22
maybe one of the reasons that some people have tried to
45:25
suggest that John 21 isn't original, but you know, the
45:29
language, the idea that John 20 has a perfect ending.
45:34
Yes, in the story, Peter's still like an uncertain figure, but
45:39
Jesus has met with the 10 and then with Thomas makes the 11
45:43
and the this language is very unjohn like, very unlike
45:48
biblical authors. Like it's, it's hard to find
45:51
anywhere where there's a number this unspecific or sorry, this
45:56
specific and that doesn't reflect anything in the New
46:00
Testament. There's always like, you know,
46:03
even 144,000, well, it's you know, 12 * 12 * 12 or whatever.
46:09
Or, you know, like it's got some kind of like tracking with, you
46:14
know, it's a round Number at least 153 is so specific, like
46:22
it's, it's hard to track with at times.
46:24
So I tend to hold on to John 21 as being an original, original
46:29
to the book 'cause it feels so like John.
46:32
Yeah, to wrap up in but. It does all it.
46:35
I could actually see a case and then, you know, we're getting to
46:37
hypothetical theology here, but interpretation.
46:40
But I could see a case where he's written the rest of the
46:45
book through 20 and then he's like about to mail and he's
46:48
like, I wanted to talk about a couple other things and it's
46:54
like 2 months later. Yeah, yeah, it's really quick.
46:57
Like he, he closes the loop on the Peter story, closes the loop
47:02
a little bit on his own story, which you didn't even get into
47:04
because there's a reference to John in this.
47:07
And then, and then right before I mail it, Jesus did a whole
47:11
bunch of other stuff. Yeah, yeah.
47:13
Yeah, goodbye. So just I, I was just looking
47:15
like, like, and, and this is an obvious deal when, when we're so
47:18
trained to look for what's the meaning?
47:22
Like one of the potential explanations is it's just an
47:25
eyewitness detail. They actually counted the fish
47:29
and that's the number that was. And all it means is there were
47:33
153 fish. What you know, it's just.
47:38
Like John? Yeah.
47:39
So instead of estimating like, oh, there's 5000 people here at
47:42
this crowd, it's like, you know, feeding of the 5000 and someone
47:45
actually going around and counting and saying, oh,
47:48
actually, no, with women and children, there's actually 9212,
47:54
you know, And again, not like John, you're right.
47:56
But but is it just a very specific detail?
47:59
Another idea that I had not read before, it's a triangular
48:03
number. So 1 + 2 + 3 + 4 + 5 all the way
48:08
to 17 = 153. No idea what that means.
48:14
But yeah, this is this is what? I wonder maybe if eventually we
48:17
come back and we like crack the quantum physics problems.
48:21
It's all going to be 153. It's like.
48:24
It's like the meaning of life is what, 24?
48:25
4242 He tracked his hide. A Guide to the Galaxy.
48:28
Yeah, it's actually 153. I'm going to write a book.
48:33
There you go. Yeah, you should, you'll make a
48:35
lot of money, man, right from this verse.
48:38
And the, the fun part is no one can prove you wrong because
48:41
you're, you can just make up whatever.
48:42
And sure. And some, some in 100 years from
48:46
now, some 2 crazy pastors are going to be doing a podcast and
48:51
they'll and they'll be like. But yeah, looking back across
48:55
these notes, that's all I had on it.
48:56
Yeah, it's crazy. But again, yeah, the the the
48:59
idea that it's all the fish across history, that's
49:05
definitely there. OK.
49:07
So I do have to leave in a few minutes, but one final question
49:11
and if you can give it to us sort of efficiently, there's
49:15
this interesting, you know, interchange around Peter and
49:18
John. I don't know if you can't even
49:20
treat it with efficiency or not, but they're walking along the
49:24
beach. Yeah.
49:28
So let's see. They're walking along the beach.
49:31
Peter turned and saw the disciple who who Jesus loved.
49:34
So referring back to John, who's the author of this book, was
49:37
following them. This was the one who had leaned
49:40
back against Jesus at the summer and said, Lord, who's going to
49:43
betray you? When Peter saw him, he asked,
49:45
Lord, what about him? Yeah, Peter's just heard he's
49:48
going to die. Yeah, but he's not going to
49:50
deny, which was beautiful. I love the way you describe that
49:52
of like he's going to get a chance to like almost reverse
49:56
the script. He's going to pass the test that
49:58
he failed. The first time.
49:59
And then Jesus says if you want him to remain alive until I
50:02
return or if I want him to remain alive until I return.
50:04
What is that to you? You must follow me.
50:08
Yeah. What's going on here?
50:09
Well, it seems like there's been a rumor that like so.
50:13
So you think about the the 12 of them and Judas betrays him and
50:17
then he, you know, he, he either kills himself or dies in
50:22
depending on the story. And then over the course of the
50:26
next 40 years, all the other disciples are killed.
50:32
They go off to all sorts of parts of the world and they all
50:34
die. And according to the legends of
50:37
stories, at least John, they tried to kill John a couple of
50:40
times. Yeah, which they actually, he
50:41
actually says that in verse 3. Because of this, the rumor
50:44
spread among the believers that this disciple would not die.
50:47
Totally. Yeah, Yeah.
50:48
And then John's like, that's not exactly what he said.
50:50
Feels like the clarification, like John is like maybe feeling
50:54
old, maybe like, you know, but it's, it's this sense of like,
50:58
oh, if you think that I'm die, if I die, that's a problem.
51:02
Like something's gone wrong that was never stated.
51:05
It was just like it was a question.
51:07
So it feels like a very accurate recollection of a conversation
51:13
on the surface. It's just like, yeah, I want to
51:15
clarify, like, I'm not, I'm not as important as you think I am.
51:20
I'm not a big marker for anything.
51:22
I'm just like the others. And God kept me here for as long
51:27
as he wanted to. But I'm not central to the
51:30
story. Jesus is central to the story.
51:33
Yeah, awesome. Well, thanks so much and thanks
51:37
for tuning in and. Thanks guys, love you.
51:40
Later if I can find the stop button.
51:46
Expired. What?
51:50
Logging in, logging in and goodbye.