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Gilmore to Consider: Does Rachel Live Up To Her Hype? · Gilmore To Say: A Gilmore Girls Podcast

0:00
[SPEAKER_05]: Five, six, seven, eight, New Year.
0:02
[SPEAKER_03]: Happy New Year.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Happy New Year.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Buddy.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Day 26.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, here we go.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
0:07
[SPEAKER_03]: Here we go.
0:08
[SPEAKER_03]: I have everybody welcome back to film art to consider with Tara and Haley.
0:17
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm Tara.
0:17
[SPEAKER_03]: This is Haley.
0:18
[SPEAKER_03]: Hi, Tara.
0:20
[SPEAKER_03]: It's January.
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[SPEAKER_03]: It's 20 to 26.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Can you believe?
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[SPEAKER_03]: I love, I love that we're here.
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[SPEAKER_05]: Welcome to the new year, everyone.
0:28
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, it's good.
0:29
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a good one.
0:30
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm so, so, so excited.
0:32
[SPEAKER_03]: By the time this airs, I will be in my new apartment, which I can't wait will be.
0:38
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh my gosh.
0:38
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes, our Patreon members, they know.
0:41
[SPEAKER_05]: They know.
0:42
[SPEAKER_05]: They know.
0:43
[SPEAKER_05]: It's not, but it's been.
0:44
[SPEAKER_05]: But now, now we are starting, turning over a new leaf, starting a new page, a new chapter if you're here.
0:52
[SPEAKER_03]: New year, new us, baby.
0:54
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm so excited.
0:55
[SPEAKER_05]: I had so much new year, same, same me.
0:58
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, that's fair.
0:59
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that's fair.
1:00
[SPEAKER_03]: But what I'm going to feel very brand new, being in a new, love that.
1:04
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, I feel like the new year can mean a lot of different things.
1:07
[SPEAKER_05]: Because of course, we do colors of the year for ourselves, which we'll talk about on Patreon, because we actually, at this point, have not revealed them to ourselves, because we will say that still 2025,
1:21
[SPEAKER_03]: Give us the Oscar.
1:22
[SPEAKER_03]: We're thatching.
1:23
[SPEAKER_03]: We're batching for the new year.
1:25
[SPEAKER_03]: It is still like to take a little break.
1:26
[SPEAKER_03]: Kind of the beginning of December when we're recording this.
1:29
[SPEAKER_05]: But it's okay, but we haven't revealed our years to each other.
1:32
[SPEAKER_05]: So we don't want to.
1:33
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, public.
1:34
[SPEAKER_03]: But last week's episode will have been our GTS wrapped.
1:37
[SPEAKER_03]: And we will have talked about it.
1:39
[SPEAKER_03]: We'll talk about that there.
1:40
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:41
[SPEAKER_05]: You will know.
1:41
[SPEAKER_05]: We don't know.
1:42
[SPEAKER_03]: We don't know.
1:43
[SPEAKER_03]: We don't know.
1:44
[SPEAKER_05]: We don't know yet.
1:45
[SPEAKER_03]: That's hilarious.
1:46
[SPEAKER_03]: That's hilarious.
1:47
[SPEAKER_03]: About batching.
1:48
[SPEAKER_05]: I think that's with New Year.
1:50
[SPEAKER_05]: It can be that like maybe you want to kind of just ease into the winter because it's quite it's still quite cold.
1:57
[SPEAKER_05]: It's not a great time to want to change and make new calls, you know, it's still the same nowhere to be seen nowhere to be found.
2:05
[SPEAKER_05]: freezing cold regardless of where you are.
2:06
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, it's still pretty cold in Florida in January.
2:09
[SPEAKER_05]: So it's like, it's just that time when you just went like cozy up, but sometimes like if you've had like a really hard 25 and if you did, I'm very sorry.
2:17
[SPEAKER_05]: I know a lot of it was a hard time of hard time, but like a new year can sometimes feel like just slipping over a page.
2:22
[SPEAKER_05]: But yeah, we've got this up where you fall in that.
2:25
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I feel like I'm really glad that you're choosing to continue having another year here with the two of us talking about Gilmore girls But speaking of winter the holiday season is over But you can still get our stamps collection because we thought if you girl these because we knew did the holiday stamps But only last for short a little temporary period of time But we do like to celebrate the seasons the same way the Gilmore girls do
2:55
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, but you can still wear until March.
2:58
[SPEAKER_03]: So yeah, it's true.
3:00
[SPEAKER_03]: It's available at www.goomordasay.com Of course, always.
3:07
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, you can visit us there and shop our winter stamps collection still.
3:12
[SPEAKER_03]: I love it.
3:12
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm really excited for another new year of March.
3:15
[SPEAKER_03]: You have some fun ideas planned.
3:17
[SPEAKER_03]: It's going to be great.
3:18
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and technically this is like a weird I feel like this weird period for the podcast because it's like we start season five later this month We did a GTS wrap to last week, but so we're kind of just in that in between time of life.
3:30
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, we're just chillin It's chilly chillin.
3:33
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, here with you bestie and we're glad you're here.
3:36
[SPEAKER_05]: We're glad to hear with you.
3:37
[SPEAKER_05]: Whatever it is you're doing
3:39
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, but to get us excited, both of us and our besties at home for season five of Gilmore to say, which will be happening.
3:47
[SPEAKER_03]: It'll be kicking off in a few short weeks.
3:50
[SPEAKER_03]: I wanted to pick some voicemails that kind of hint at a topic that we wanted to talk about that we've discussed talking about this year.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So I went into the archives and I kind of pulled out some voicemails.
4:08
[SPEAKER_03]: The last year, 25.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So the last year, wow, I know, which is crazy to say last year, last year, like six days ago.
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[SPEAKER_03]: But it actually is from February of 2025, so it is only really, yeah.
4:21
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
4:22
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
4:22
[SPEAKER_03]: So fun.
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[SPEAKER_03]: I'm very excited.
4:24
[SPEAKER_03]: So let's kick it off by hearing from our bestie Francis.
4:29
[SPEAKER_03]: Francis?
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[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
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[SPEAKER_01]: What a name.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Love, gorgeous.
4:32
[SPEAKER_01]: Hi, girlies.
4:36
[SPEAKER_01]: It's Francis.
4:39
[SPEAKER_01]: I've already seen it on board day and until I've been, we just got to the episode, you know, where you like climbing meat Rachel and after hearing all this like crazy stuff about her, she ends up being super boring.
4:51
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're just kind of talking about that and having some light conversations about that.
4:56
[SPEAKER_01]: And we have some ideas, but I mostly was wondering what you guys would like do kind of around Rachel's plot.
5:06
[SPEAKER_01]: I like her storyline, like what do you think would improve her storyline in the show as a character?
5:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Also, me and I just feel like her name should have been so weak.
5:15
[SPEAKER_03]: Francis, I'm obsessed with the fact that her and her 11 year old sister just like talk about the plot of Gilmore girls.
5:22
[SPEAKER_03]: This is like no, when I would have been if we had been friends.
5:25
[SPEAKER_05]: Absolutely.
5:26
[SPEAKER_05]: There would have been you know, we would have been friends and her sister.
5:28
[SPEAKER_05]: I just love the idea.
5:29
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, that's what I was going to say that y'all are watching it together, but you're also talking about it.
5:33
[SPEAKER_05]: Like to the point that like you gave Rachel a new name.
5:36
[SPEAKER_05]: Also love you're like super boring.
5:38
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm 14 and I know she's overboard.
5:40
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and it's so funny because I was 14 and watching the show.
5:44
[SPEAKER_03]: I didn't think of Rachel that way.
5:45
[SPEAKER_03]: I just kind of thought of her as like quote, I don't like the other woman.
5:48
[SPEAKER_03]: I never give her much thought.
5:49
[SPEAKER_03]: I guess because she was super boring.
5:51
[SPEAKER_03]: But one of the things that we want to talk about this season on Gilmore to say is like the other women, the non-Gilmore girls, you know, and Rachel and women if you will.
6:02
[SPEAKER_03]: And Rachel is kind of the one to kick this off.
6:05
[SPEAKER_03]: So I wanted to start with a little
6:07
[SPEAKER_03]: chat about her because I thought this was an interesting ask from our bestie Francis.
6:12
[SPEAKER_03]: Is that like, you know, we have often talked about the fact that Rachel was described as this like very adventurous, very like exciting and ticing woman.
6:23
[SPEAKER_05]: Make up that she jumps out of planes.
6:25
[SPEAKER_05]: No, that just the, no, they, they talk about that or say that.
6:29
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, Suki says, you know, concert interruptors.
6:31
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm pretty sure.
6:32
[SPEAKER_05]: Sometimes I can't tell what has been set on the show, what we exaggerated from the show, or what was an exaggeration on the show that we ran too far with and they were being sarcastic.
6:42
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it's fair.
6:42
[SPEAKER_05]: Sometimes that's where I get a little lost because we're like, she's jumping out of planes and she's literally the most boring person you've ever met.
6:48
[SPEAKER_03]: But that's the thing, like, what would we have needed from her in order to feel like she aligned with the description that was given?
6:57
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, Francis and her sister wanting to name her Zoe, that's already a step on the right direction.
7:03
[SPEAKER_05]: I love it.
7:04
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I don't know that feels fun.
7:06
[SPEAKER_05]: I think that she feels too reserved, reserved, kind of like a blank canvas, like that she's there, or a blank canvas is wrong, a mirror.
7:19
[SPEAKER_05]: She's there to reflect to Luke what he's actually feeling.
7:23
[SPEAKER_05]: And
7:23
[SPEAKER_05]: I kind of wish that she would have been kind of the person who's better as an idea because she's never going to be stable, she's never going to stick around and that we would have seen more of that maybe rather than her being like, don't wait too long to tell her.
7:41
[SPEAKER_05]: that you love, you know, like that kind of vibe, totally, that I think that she could have been maybe a little more flighty, maybe a little less considerate, like she comes across as someone who like super wants to be really invested in Luke, maybe that could have, I'm trying to think that I think I'm trying to, um,
8:04
[SPEAKER_05]: Characterize someone who is maybe a little bit more adventurous.
8:08
[SPEAKER_05]: It's like fair flaws when it comes to the people in their life.
8:12
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, like to me I would seem flighty would be one like if she had a phone She would never respond to text she'd have 400 unread text messages right no, do you know what I mean?
8:22
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I'm trying to think of what would.
8:26
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know that the intention of the writers was for us to be in dear to Rachel or for us to root for Rachel and looped to be together.
8:33
[SPEAKER_05]: I think the word to her though admittedly.
8:35
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, I think, well, that's a thing.
8:39
[SPEAKER_03]: I think worldwide is in dear to her a little bit.
8:42
[SPEAKER_03]: And that was kind of the goal was, oh, this person I heard so much about, that I had a little bit of jealousy for, shows up
8:51
[SPEAKER_03]: And, you know, Rachel feels the same way.
8:55
[SPEAKER_03]: She comes back and she's like, oh, this trick is way more exciting than me.
8:58
[SPEAKER_03]: But I don't think we were meant to think that Laura like Elmore was more exciting than this Rachel.
9:04
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, this no elusive Rachel that was being talked about.
9:07
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like, Laura like almost feels, I think a little intimidated by the idea of Rachel because of how pretty she's described to be and how adventurous she's described to be
9:19
[SPEAKER_03]: feel like that's, I think that's the actor.
9:21
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
9:22
[SPEAKER_03]: But I, like, I think that there is a comparison to Wonder Woman, Laura, I said she sounds like Wonder Woman.
9:29
[SPEAKER_03]: She was to Luke.
9:31
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's like, well, we think that Laura lies Wonder Woman to Luke.
9:34
[SPEAKER_03]: So when this person shows up and we're just kind of like, okay, his reaction is like, oh, my God, you are this ghost from my past.
9:41
[SPEAKER_03]: And here you were seeing it in the diner.
9:42
[SPEAKER_03]: But
9:43
[SPEAKER_03]: I am interested to explore, and maybe we can talk about this more when we have our deep dive on these other women, these non-gill-more girls later this season of what would have made Rachel, a what would have made her believable as like this adventurous type, and b what would have made us think that like
10:06
[SPEAKER_03]: Luke genuinely thought of her as Wonder Woman.
10:08
[SPEAKER_03]: Would it have been seeing them together more?
10:10
[SPEAKER_03]: Would it have been her pulling him out of his shell more?
10:15
[SPEAKER_03]: Because those are the roles that like, that's the role that Laura like kind of plays in his life.
10:20
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, there's like two directions that that immediately made me think of.
10:24
[SPEAKER_05]: for it to be believable that Luke thought of her as Wonder Woman, I think it's just seeing them together and proving that they're not right for each other, because like how many times have you like met someone, put them on a pedestal and like, your friends meet them and you're like,
10:39
[SPEAKER_05]: this is them and it's maybe because it's like maybe you're insecure and they're like they seem really cool, way cooler than you are but they're like invested in you and so like there's a there's like an insecure nature to that that makes them seem fantastic because it's like oh my gosh this incredible person chose me and so like I think sometimes that can cause like a you know a little dilulu vibe that like this person is way better than they actually are and I think
11:09
[SPEAKER_05]: the like, let down, like the build up, the build up of who she wise and then be like, Luke, she kind of doesn't treat you very well.
11:18
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, why, why is this person?
11:20
[SPEAKER_05]: Because I think that I needed her to be a glad she left star's hollow, be like, this is such a cute town, but like, this is not for me.
11:27
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, well, I just see the idea of her coming back and being like, all right, I saw like the sign and I couldn't stop thinking about you.
11:34
[SPEAKER_03]: And I want to come back here and I want to try to make this work.
11:39
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't even know that I want him to have moved on.
11:41
[SPEAKER_05]: I kind of want her to be like, this, I thought of you and the idea of him is always better in the same way that the idea of hers always better.
11:51
[SPEAKER_05]: Because it's like how miraculous would it be?
11:53
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, I saw a sign and I thought of you and so I had to come to town.
11:56
[SPEAKER_05]: It's like that kind of with like mess with your head.
11:59
[SPEAKER_05]: Like you'd be like, yeah, oh my gosh.
12:01
[SPEAKER_05]: This person could drive past here without coming to see me.
12:04
[SPEAKER_05]: It's by the time they have contacted me.
12:08
[SPEAKER_05]: Confusion on that part that like maybe Laura like was saying and I just I think that I needed her to be bigger than the town To be bigger than Luke and I think I would have loved for her to leave without being like I'm leaving because you're into Laura lie.
12:25
[SPEAKER_05]: Mm-hmm.
12:26
[SPEAKER_05]: Like
12:27
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I don't know.
12:28
[SPEAKER_03]: I kind of, I like that she leaves because she's like, I came back thinking that you had kind of waited for me.
12:35
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I like that idea too.
12:37
[SPEAKER_03]: Turns out you, there's nothing else.
12:39
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, there's nothing here for me.
12:41
[SPEAKER_05]: But I kind of thought we'd make her a little bit unlikable, which I kind of wanted from her.
12:45
[SPEAKER_05]: It made it that like I expected to have left you like a little worry Gilmore I expected to have left you here and you'd be nothing to have happened to you Which is like maybe the root of thing that you could say to someone that I left you here in my little corner of the world And it turns out that you didn't stay the same.
13:03
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I don't know how I feel about that.
13:06
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, bye Like you've stayed the same
13:08
[SPEAKER_03]: She though like she really does fit right back in.
13:12
[SPEAKER_03]: She falls back into, I mean, I don't know what her life was like before she decided to Leave and jump out of planes and yeah, you know take photos and live her life her on the world But she kind of just seemingly falls into small town life very well, and I think that's maybe why Yeah, that's what I say hers that like she does you like it.
13:35
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, like I need her to be like
13:39
[SPEAKER_05]: Liz, does she need to be more like Liz?
13:43
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, like, but like Liz kind of falls back into the town too, and she likes it.
13:46
[SPEAKER_05]: She does, but she's cute.
13:47
[SPEAKER_05]: I, she stands out.
13:48
[SPEAKER_05]: I think I, she sticks out.
13:49
[SPEAKER_05]: I think I maybe needed her to be like, not like Nicole, but Nicole sticks out.
13:55
[SPEAKER_05]: Nicole doesn't need to be there.
13:57
[SPEAKER_05]: And like, maybe not in like the seriousness of Nicole, but I think that I need her to like be like, there's nothing here to do.
14:03
[SPEAKER_05]: There isn't quite nothing here to do.
14:06
[SPEAKER_05]: And maybe because she's a photo journalist,
14:09
[SPEAKER_05]: Seemingly, isn't that why her job is, that she maybe sees the town is not like a place to be and not like To live, but just like a subject, maybe.
14:18
[SPEAKER_05]: Hmm.
14:18
[SPEAKER_05]: Like I don't know that I think that there's like I needed to distinct difference that like She left this small town to like go off on adventures and she comes back and she's like Where am I?
14:31
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, how did I end up here?
14:33
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't know, maybe I just don't know any high active people, like very hyperactive people, maybe I'm just a rather boring person and I'm like, I don't know what an interesting person would be doing.
14:45
[SPEAKER_03]: No, no, no, no, I think that this is something we really need to think on and something I'd like to revisit when we talk about the non-go-more roles.
14:53
[SPEAKER_05]: Something I need our besties to call in on.
14:56
[SPEAKER_05]: Any of our besties who are interesting people who love an adventure?
15:00
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it would be cool to like put this out there to our list and our followers on Instagram be like what qualities did Rachel need to have in order to align with the description she was given before she arrived on the scene.
15:11
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe like
15:11
[SPEAKER_03]: double check that other people thought she was boring maybe yeah they might like maybe so excited she was up what an exciting woman but listen you have to your point she did she had girly hair to your point about like you know everybody talking about someone or the person that is emotionally tethered to this other person talking about them and like they're the best and they're this and they're that and then as friends you meet them and you're like
15:37
[SPEAKER_03]: This person, this person, that is kind of represented in us as an audience being like this lady.
15:43
[SPEAKER_05]: I know that, you know, like, but I don't know if that's intentional because it's like never intentional, but it's not addressed in the narrative, you know, like, because I don't feel like one of the characters would have been like, this is Rachel.
15:54
[SPEAKER_03]: Sure, she's beautiful.
15:56
[SPEAKER_03]: She's really nice, but she's she's she's really nice planes.
15:59
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, could we witness it?
16:01
[SPEAKER_03]: You think she could do it today?
16:02
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, like I maybe we needed her to do some things that seemed like really exciting not like flinging herself out of a plane Not like Kirk being a skydiver.
16:11
[SPEAKER_03]: You don't see something like that.
16:12
[SPEAKER_05]: I really thought about that It was like I feel like if Kirk was more established like who he is in like season three season four in that season.
16:19
[SPEAKER_05]: He would have been immediately drawn to Rachel.
16:23
[SPEAKER_05]: And she's like, oh, okay.
16:25
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
16:26
[SPEAKER_05]: And maybe that's it.
16:27
[SPEAKER_05]: Maybe she comes back and she's kind of a spectacle.
16:29
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe she likes that maybe maybe she likes that maybe she likes that maybe she likes that I mean like her taking pictures throughout the town like
16:37
[SPEAKER_03]: in star-crossed lovers and other strangers, like maybe pulling it that thread a little more because we do see her taking pictures, takes pictures of the dragonfly property that's how she and Laura like connect.
16:47
[SPEAKER_03]: But I just like I needed something a little bit more spectacular from her.
16:54
[SPEAKER_05]: And like maybe I like a lot more pointed.
16:56
[SPEAKER_05]: Look at like, she's photographing Luke and Laura lie.
17:00
[SPEAKER_05]: And like, mm, she can see it so clearly through the lens.
17:05
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
17:06
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, we definitely do get that.
17:08
[SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, I really love to hear from our listeners perspective what they think, what they would have liked to have from her.
17:15
[SPEAKER_03]: And maybe this is something that we can revisit a little bit later this season.
17:19
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, definitely.
17:20
[SPEAKER_05]: Definitely talk a little bit more about Rachel.
17:22
[SPEAKER_05]: Boring Rachel.
17:23
[SPEAKER_05]: It's citing Zoe according to my exciting Zoe.
17:27
[SPEAKER_03]: I kind of wonder if you know when Christopher comes back in Christopher returns, and he just kind of returns.
17:34
[SPEAKER_03]: Everybody in town really is like, oh my god, Christopher's here.
17:40
[SPEAKER_03]: I feel like I needed something like that.
17:43
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
17:43
[SPEAKER_05]: Like kind of being like, oh, she's fancy.
17:45
[SPEAKER_05]: Let's pull out the fancy things, you know?
17:47
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
17:48
[SPEAKER_03]: Or just like that Christopher kind of comes in like, Oh, he was a novelty.
17:54
[SPEAKER_03]: He was for sure.
17:56
[SPEAKER_03]: I think Rachel is kind of spoken about is a little bit of the same like as she was in town.
18:03
[SPEAKER_03]: We don't really know a ton of her history, like did she grow up in Stars Hollow?
18:07
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
18:08
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
18:08
[SPEAKER_05]: Do you think that maybe because of like the backstory we got on her through Patty and a little bit through suki that she'd be more infamous in town and people would be like whispering about her and like the way that Jackson was when he was like recounting what happened.
18:23
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
18:23
[SPEAKER_05]: And Chris overheard it.
18:24
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't want to like copy and paste into any storyline.
18:27
[SPEAKER_03]: No, I'm just saying, I'm just comparing, you know, the arrival of exes between Luke and Laura lie in, you know, because they happen around the same time.
18:37
[SPEAKER_03]: And when Chris comes in, it's just, it is a spectacle.
18:41
[SPEAKER_03]: It is like, this is Roy's father.
18:43
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor setting a tone, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side.
18:57
[SPEAKER_03]: he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he writes on a motor side, he
19:00
[SPEAKER_03]: But it's like, Chris, on his motorcycle and he says, and I sure take it off.
19:06
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, you know, that's the first thing he says and then when he comes down stairs in the next episode and he's like, took a shower, he's like, oh, your water pressure sucks and fixing it tomorrow.
19:14
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, that is coming in immediately now.
19:17
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
19:19
[SPEAKER_05]: Whereas Rachel, she walks in, it's like Rachel.
19:21
[SPEAKER_05]: You're Rachel, I'm Rachel.
19:22
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, exactly.
19:23
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, like she definitely is
19:26
[SPEAKER_03]: Again, be beautiful and like you're intrigued by her and you're like okay, like where did you come from kind of a thing I helicopter but at the same time I'm not as like
19:37
[SPEAKER_03]: you know taken with her as with Chris I'm like okay and you can see the chemistry between born and maybe that's it it's not a chemistry between them yeah that's fair that's fair so something to mole over but speaking of Christopher our next voice male is from Kenzie on Chris and Sherry so let's hear from her Mr. Kenzie another other woman
20:03
[SPEAKER_02]: Hi, this is Kenzie.
20:05
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm working here at that BAM Christopher episode, and in regards to if Christopher should have been a Sherry or should have stayed with Laura Leiband who's pregnant, I think he should have been single.
20:18
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't think he should have been with either of them.
20:21
[SPEAKER_02]: I think he should have taken time to be alone and try and figure out what he truly wanted without with as little influence
20:33
[SPEAKER_02]: from Sherry and Gorly, and I know obviously would have been hard to, like, without the input of Sherry team co-parent.
20:42
[SPEAKER_02]: But if you, if he was able to just be single, no influence from Gorly and really just co-parent with Sherry full-stop, nothing else, and really figure out who does he want to be with, as he wants to make it work for Sherry.
20:57
[SPEAKER_02]: With Sherry, or does he want to be with Gorly, and even take, like, do you out of it?
21:03
[SPEAKER_02]: want.
21:04
[SPEAKER_02]: So I think you should have in single.
21:06
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
21:06
[SPEAKER_02]: Love you.
21:06
[SPEAKER_02]: Bye.
21:07
[SPEAKER_03]: So I know that this is a very Christopher board voice mail, but in regards to Sherry.
21:13
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
21:14
[SPEAKER_03]: I wonder if Chris is behavior toward Sherry and this being the scenario of him being like, you know what?
21:24
[SPEAKER_03]: I am going to be single.
21:29
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not just gonna be with Sherry because she is the mother of my child.
21:32
[SPEAKER_03]: if that would have endeared us more to share.
21:35
[SPEAKER_05]: Quite possibly, you know what I mean?
21:37
[SPEAKER_05]: As I was listening to Kenzie's voicemail, the thing that really stuck out to me was the idea of like, he should be single, take a little light out of it, even take Gigi out of it.
21:46
[SPEAKER_05]: And I was like, oh, what a gift for men to have to be able to take their children out of the consideration of what their life is gonna look like, such a male, such a male perspective.
21:55
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, no, no shade to Kenzie on that, but it's just like, it's like really just like men can be like, I'm going to consider what I want from my life And I don't have to consider my children in it because their mothers will definitely be tending to them And so I, in that same vein, I think I would have been in dear to Sherry if Chris was like, I'm not going to be with you And I'm not going to be with Sherry, I'm going to figure out what I want from life and you're like, oh, well as it turns out
22:20
[SPEAKER_05]: There are two women in your life, and both of them have children, and now you're going to figure out what you want in your life.
22:25
[SPEAKER_05]: You're just going to be single.
22:27
[SPEAKER_05]: As it turns out, you have had so much time to do that, my friend.
22:30
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
22:31
[SPEAKER_03]: I know.
22:32
[SPEAKER_03]: Which I think is why he ultimately chooses to not maybe not why, but when he does choose to step up and take responsibility, with Sherry in a way that he seemingly didn't with Laura Lye and Rory.
22:47
[SPEAKER_03]: It is kind of like, okay.
22:49
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, first time around you did this wrong, second time around you want to do this right.
22:52
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think that with Sherry part of the reason that we're not in dear to her is because of the way we need her, which, you know, we've talked about.
23:00
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
23:00
[SPEAKER_03]: And we will, we will.
23:01
[SPEAKER_05]: You just liked her a lot more in that than I did.
23:05
[SPEAKER_03]: But like at the same time, there are ways in which I kind of commend Sherry for, like,
23:11
[SPEAKER_03]: her honesty, her honesty.
23:13
[SPEAKER_03]: She's very direct.
23:15
[SPEAKER_03]: Um, she knows what she wants.
23:17
[SPEAKER_03]: But when she does ultimately in season five, decide, you know what?
23:23
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't want to do this anymore.
23:24
[SPEAKER_03]: It's your turn.
23:26
[SPEAKER_03]: You're going to take care of GG.
23:27
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm leaving.
23:28
[SPEAKER_03]: Goodbye.
23:29
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that also kind of makes her feel like the villain.
23:32
[SPEAKER_03]: Like they're always kind of
23:34
[SPEAKER_03]: positioning Sherry to be the villain a little bit.
23:38
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
23:40
[SPEAKER_03]: And Kenzie's question here really like peaked my interest because I'm like, oh, would we view her the same way?
23:46
[SPEAKER_03]: If Christopher had treated her the same way, he treated Laura Lye.
23:51
[SPEAKER_05]: I think that even if Sherry had acted the same way that she did and that had happened to her, I would have been like,
23:59
[SPEAKER_05]: I would have been a deared.
24:00
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, in deared, maybe it's the wrong word, but I would have been advocating for her.
24:05
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, to be like, don't talk badly about Sherry because her ex is really just like giving up on her.
24:11
[SPEAKER_05]: And like, I think that with Chris, it's kind of the thing of like, he is a failed perfectionist.
24:18
[SPEAKER_05]: It's like kind of like when you get a new notebook, you know, you mess something up in it and you're like, well, I need a new notebook.
24:23
[SPEAKER_05]: And it's like, it's the same thing with worry and lower life that like he mess things up and rather than being like, I want to I want to fix this like I want to be a part of this let me let me work with y'all to like make me a real part of your life again because that's what I want he was like now I actually have this new family brand new fresh that I can just like brand new stuff and yeah clean slate that I can just work with so I'm going to leave the other notebook that I ruined with you guys so goodbye.
24:52
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, you know, because we don't see him again until season five when cherry leaves.
24:57
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, after the birth of G. G. Yeah, I would have I would have made me root for cherry more.
25:03
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, if Chris was like, you know what, I need to figure myself out.
25:07
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, well.
25:07
[SPEAKER_05]: As it turns out, you would guess how that lecture you because you can just walk out on your kids.
25:12
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that's true.
25:23
[SPEAKER_03]: I do think there are a lot of things that could have happened along the way that would have endured sharing more to the audience.
25:29
[SPEAKER_03]: So I'm not 100% certain people aren't endured her.
25:32
[SPEAKER_03]: You know what I mean?
25:33
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, yeah.
25:34
[SPEAKER_05]: No.
25:34
[SPEAKER_03]: I need to pull a pull.
25:36
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, you know, pull.
25:37
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, do you like, share your, do you not?
25:38
[SPEAKER_03]: Because I think, again, like watching it when I was younger, similarly to Rachel, I was like, well, this is the person standing up between Lorla and her happiness and Lorla is my favorite character.
25:46
[SPEAKER_03]: So, therefore, I don't like sharing, but I must dislike blonde women.
25:51
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, but I think the real person standing in between that is Chris and sometimes Laura like herself, so it's 100% you know, her it's difficult to really put that on cherry, but some of the things she said in it should have been Laura like I was like hmm
26:06
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm very interested to hear your sherry theories, if you will.
26:14
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
26:15
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
26:15
[SPEAKER_05]: I really was brandy.
26:16
[SPEAKER_03]: Christopher's brandy.
26:18
[SPEAKER_03]: But in hearing that there would be somewhat of a redemption arc.
26:22
[SPEAKER_03]: So to say, for Sherry in Christopher making a different choice because I do think maybe Christopher like take children out of this, like I think Christopher should have been single and figured out what he wanted instead of just immediately being like, oh, with Sherry like like in narrative-wise, they should have removed Sherry's pregnancy?
26:42
[SPEAKER_03]: No, just meaning he clearly didn't want to be with Sherry.
26:46
[SPEAKER_03]: And yeah,
26:51
[SPEAKER_03]: because he simply didn't want to be with her, I don't think he should have been in a relationship with her.
26:57
[SPEAKER_03]: But I recognize that he, in his mind, was trying to do the right thing.
27:01
[SPEAKER_03]: And so for her, but I do think that you can show up and be a present parent without necessarily being with a wrong person.
27:10
[SPEAKER_05]: I do think that he'd given like in the flashback that he was like kind of for getting married with to lower light in that circumstance that it was like a complete duetfer.
27:22
[SPEAKER_05]: It was a complete clean site and he could be the person that he thought he wanted to be, but unfortunately he is the person that he is and so he messed up.
27:32
[SPEAKER_05]: But did he mess it up?
27:34
[SPEAKER_05]: because we're made to believe that Sherry was the one who left.
27:37
[SPEAKER_05]: Right.
27:37
[SPEAKER_05]: Which is telling me the Chris did leave.
27:40
[SPEAKER_05]: Did mess up.
27:40
[SPEAKER_05]: That's because why does a woman just want to up and move to another country?
27:44
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
27:45
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
27:45
[SPEAKER_03]: Exactly.
27:46
[SPEAKER_03]: Why is she like, it's your turn now.
27:48
[SPEAKER_03]: I've given up a lot.
27:49
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm like,
27:49
[SPEAKER_05]: All right, whoa, it's hopping on over there.
27:52
[SPEAKER_05]: What was going on like I'm still like not entirely convinced because like of course Young me is like, oh, why would Sherry do that to like why would she just be out in the child?
28:01
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm like, well, what was going on in the video?
28:03
[SPEAKER_04]: She did do that.
28:04
[SPEAKER_05]: Why are we never addressing that?
28:06
[SPEAKER_05]: Like why are you like just like no cherry's evil?
28:09
[SPEAKER_03]: Because like she went to another country my girls exactly and that's kind of more of what I want to unpack in our episode about the other women But on that topic of kind of like redemption for some of the women in the show that are not the Gilmore girls that have had a little bit of a bad rap I our last voice mail that I want to play is actually from 2023 is from March of 2023.
28:30
[SPEAKER_03]: It's my gosh
28:32
[SPEAKER_03]: archives.
28:33
[SPEAKER_03]: And this voicemail is about Lindsey and worry and a redemption that could have happened there.
28:38
[SPEAKER_03]: Another blonde.
28:40
[SPEAKER_03]: Another blonde.
28:42
[SPEAKER_00]: Hi, that's these.
28:42
[SPEAKER_00]: It's Leninga.
28:43
[SPEAKER_00]: I just left a voicemail.
28:44
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm so sorry.
28:45
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if I lost service or if you have a time limit on your voicemail.
28:49
[SPEAKER_00]: But I was talking about worry taking accountability for Lindsey.
28:53
[SPEAKER_00]: I just think if she had a polished guy, it would have made a world of difference for me.
28:57
[SPEAKER_00]: And I want to note you think, and if she had a politicized with that change her opinion of her worry, would you respect her more, even if, like I said, she still continues to date Eve, publicly in town where Lindsay is, I think for me, if she had just a politicized that would have changed everything for me, and I think I would not have such commitment towards growing the character.
29:17
[SPEAKER_00]: So love your podcast, love you guys.
29:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you so much.
29:20
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sorry for rambling on and on.
29:21
[SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, I hope you have a great day when you're listening to this.
29:25
[SPEAKER_00]: Bye.
29:25
[SPEAKER_04]: Hey, that's so sweet pasty.
29:28
[SPEAKER_04]: I like it like knowing this is from 2023.
29:30
[SPEAKER_04]: Like I hope you have a good day when you're listening to this.
29:33
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
29:33
[SPEAKER_04]: I have, I did have a good day.
29:34
[SPEAKER_04]: Thank you.
29:35
[SPEAKER_04]: I hope you're having a good day too.
29:37
[SPEAKER_03]: So this is a little less about Lindsey and a little more about worrying, but I think that this is where people get really really down on where you go more is because of the way that she treats I mean the fact that she sleeps with Mary-man and the fact that like that Convertation in the street in episode two season five.
29:58
[SPEAKER_03]: There's no apology made and I wonder how the audience would feel red
30:07
[SPEAKER_03]: But I wonder how the audience would feel towards worry if she really did take ownership and accountability for the way that she treated Lindsay because here's the thing and I want to unpack this later this season is that like This is not an excuse by any stretch of the imagination, but I do think the audience is kind of positioned to like not really like Lindsay when she's dating Dean because of the way
30:28
[SPEAKER_03]: that she acts towards Rory.
30:30
[SPEAKER_03]: And so her push, and so her push, she's so like, I think I remember.
30:34
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, she's just kind of like rude and when she sees Rory and face off, she's kind of like dismissing her eye.
30:41
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so she's just like a little bit of an eye roll.
30:44
[SPEAKER_03]: And then she's kind of positioned in season four as like she steams wife, more like really like sort of like, oh, she's bringing,
30:53
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, baked goods in and they cracked people's teeth, but hey, she's nice and like they seem like the perfect couple and then everything unfolds with worry.
31:03
[SPEAKER_05]: They do a really good job of making it entirely Dean's fault.
31:07
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, Lindsay is like trying her best to be a good wife and be the type of wife that we know that Dean wants and like in her own way because of course she's having to have her mom help her in a lot of regards.
31:22
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, barely, over the age of 18.
31:27
[SPEAKER_05]: So yes, like I see, I see what you mean, like that originally we were like, not supposed to really like her team.
31:35
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't think so.
31:36
[SPEAKER_05]: But then they kind of graduated from that a little bit.
31:38
[SPEAKER_03]: A little bit.
31:39
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, after graduation, they really graduated from it.
31:41
[SPEAKER_03]: They kind of like position Lindsay is this.
31:43
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, doting wife, the wife that Dean seemingly wants.
31:47
[SPEAKER_03]: And then worry kind of comes in.
31:50
[SPEAKER_03]: back into the picture and she and Dean collectively really fuck that up.
31:57
[SPEAKER_03]: And so we're now feeling really sad for Lindsay.
32:01
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, the beginning of season five is really heartbreaking to watch because even though Lindsay is not a character we're necessarily rooting for, she is a victim of
32:10
[SPEAKER_05]: all of this and we're suddenly we feel really bad like for what has transpired because we see kind of her side of her.
32:18
[SPEAKER_05]: Correct.
32:19
[SPEAKER_05]: And so I we don't see her side of things.
32:23
[SPEAKER_05]: We see Dean seeing her exactly.
32:26
[SPEAKER_03]: Fuck off my man.
32:27
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
32:28
[SPEAKER_03]: And so it's funny that like I think you know for an audience
32:39
[SPEAKER_03]: poised in position to root for the Gilmore girls.
32:42
[SPEAKER_03]: Obviously, this is really where we can't anymore.
32:45
[SPEAKER_03]: And differently from Sherry and Laura Lye and Christopher and that scenario where Laura Lye had no idea that Chris and Sherry were even really still a fan, were he knowingly slept with Dean?
32:59
[SPEAKER_03]: while he was married.
33:00
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think I don't know if apologizing to Lindsay would have necessarily fixed anything, but I wonder if it really would have meant it for his relationship with the audience, because she doesn't seem to feel bad about what happened.
33:15
[SPEAKER_05]: No, that's why I'm always mad at Lane.
33:17
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm like, I know.
33:19
[SPEAKER_05]: We had to point it out from someone.
33:20
[SPEAKER_05]: There's a couple of different thoughts that I have there.
33:23
[SPEAKER_05]: The first one is that, of course, we're always trying to service the audience's relationship with the main characters.
33:31
[SPEAKER_05]: But it kind of reminds me of, I think it's in, let the games begin when she goes to talk to Dean in the window.
33:38
[SPEAKER_05]: It's
33:39
[SPEAKER_05]: Famously when Jess and Mori kiss like at gypsies and then she appeared and then she leaves him and she goes to see Dean She climbs the tree and talks to him outside of his window and that seems to be in service between worry and the audience because like
33:56
[SPEAKER_05]: If you're thinking about it in terms of Rory thinking about Dean, this is actually something bad.
34:01
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, you should not be kissing your new boyfriend coming up into the window to talk to your ex-boyfriend because you think that he might be mad at you.
34:10
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah.
34:11
[SPEAKER_05]: And you're like, you know what, Rory?
34:13
[SPEAKER_05]: That's actually, if we're going to name one person, you should be mad at you at him, but we feel like she's doing something right by admitting to him what we do all along and it's kind of relieving some sort of like pressure that we had between her and us is like, finally you're admitting to this thing, but it's like, if you're thinking about it, you're like, worry, this is you are the last person that should be his window unless you're like,
34:36
[SPEAKER_05]: Saying something that's like between the two of you like, I'm sorry, let's talk about us like I broke up with Jess like you know what I mean like you have a new boyfriend like you are doing this all in service to your own feelings You're not really thinking about how deans feeling here because if you did you probably wouldn't be talking to him because You're only here to make sure he's not mad at you
34:56
[SPEAKER_05]: You know what I mean?
34:58
[SPEAKER_05]: And so it's like it's kind of that thing.
34:59
[SPEAKER_05]: If you're apologizing to Lindsay, you don't want Lindsay to be mad at you.
35:03
[SPEAKER_05]: And like you want to because like it's the other point that I have is like, yeah, it's like, don't sleep with a man who's married.
35:09
[SPEAKER_05]: I do think it was very convoluted the way that it went up.
35:12
[SPEAKER_05]: He went about it.
35:13
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, it's explaining.
35:14
[SPEAKER_05]: We are separated.
35:16
[SPEAKER_05]: Like the way that he like talked her into it.
35:19
[SPEAKER_05]: He was she was like not so sure about it.
35:22
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah,
35:26
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, he says it's over.
35:27
[SPEAKER_05]: And so I think there is like a, it's harder because we know it's not over because of the aftermath of it, but the before doesn't seem to matter so much to anyone because we know what really happened.
35:42
[SPEAKER_05]: And it's like, well, don't even mess with it, but it's like, okay, she's 19.
35:45
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and a lot of people are like, I would have known better at 19.
35:47
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm like, no, when am I been pretty old?
35:50
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, it's harder because I really wish we would have played more into that because like maybe it's like he told me it was over.
35:58
[SPEAKER_05]: And I know that means nothing to you now, but like I need you to know that like.
36:02
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I think at that point, she would have to be remorseful and not be with Dean because like he told me it was over.
36:10
[SPEAKER_05]: I didn't realize it all were still together.
36:12
[SPEAKER_05]: I think that maybe that should have been the path that they went on.
36:15
[SPEAKER_05]: I think I would have felt more sympathy for Roy's situation if she had been more adamant about the fact that like they said that they were over, which Lorela is like, did he?
36:26
[SPEAKER_05]: Did he?
36:26
[SPEAKER_05]: like, are they divorced?
36:28
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, and I think that that is maybe why we don't care so much is because Laura lies into her like that.
36:35
[SPEAKER_05]: And we're like, all team, Laura, like, yeah, she'd been a lot of really good points there.
36:38
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
36:39
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, not really being in the presence of mine of like the manipulation of it immediately.
36:43
[SPEAKER_05]: It's worries fall.
36:45
[SPEAKER_05]: So like, I think that we just end up siding with Laura lie despite the fact that like that was kind of a complicated explanation.
36:56
[SPEAKER_03]: things take a turn for me.
36:58
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not about, like, yes, of course it is about the fact that she slept with him.
37:02
[SPEAKER_03]: It's the explanation she gives a lower lie afterwards when she went or lie saying, he's my den.
37:09
[SPEAKER_05]: I kind of love it.
37:10
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, I mean, worry, please.
37:12
[SPEAKER_05]: But I actually really love that scene if I'm being honest, because I feel like it's really
37:17
[SPEAKER_05]: honest to a girl who is just so overwhelmed and having a mental breakdown over this situation about like having like this high-high with this boy and having such a low-low coming back to the reality of it that like I feel like most girls would have been meant to be in terms of this situation.
37:36
[SPEAKER_05]: Do you know what I mean?
37:37
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, that like 100% I guess I like her being a little
37:44
[SPEAKER_05]: And I don't know if she needed to apologize to Lindsay.
37:47
[SPEAKER_05]: I just know that she didn't need to be with Dean.
37:50
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
37:51
[SPEAKER_05]: I think she could have prepared her relationship with us by being like, you were right.
37:56
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, I didn't know.
37:59
[SPEAKER_05]: And when you see them, her throwing things out, she was like, well, I guess they really are.
38:05
[SPEAKER_05]: I guess they really is happening.
38:07
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
38:09
[SPEAKER_05]: And like realizing it has to do with her but like it is Dean Dean is the one that says it's over and I think it's I don't I don't think we put enough pressure on Dean there.
38:18
[SPEAKER_03]: No, definitely.
38:19
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, I mean the show didn't.
38:22
[SPEAKER_03]: I did in 2020.
38:23
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh my god, 2020 is right.
38:25
[SPEAKER_03]: He's so merch.
38:26
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, but it's all very realistic in the way that she spirals It's more of a I think that that is where
38:35
[SPEAKER_03]: the character loses the audience is that she doesn't seem to feel any remorse for sleeping with Dean because she dated him first and it's like that's not a reason to sleep.
38:46
[SPEAKER_03]: That doesn't mean you get dibs once he's married.
38:49
[SPEAKER_03]: That like even if she doesn't.
38:51
[SPEAKER_03]: That's not how that works.
38:52
[SPEAKER_05]: I just think that something we've talked about on Gamoria visited in rewatch club on the podcast a lot is that where he doesn't have a strong connection from her internarworld to the audience.
39:07
[SPEAKER_05]: Like she doesn't externalize a lot.
39:08
[SPEAKER_05]: Like there's not a lot of like Alexis will have dealt like a modding in such a way that we understand what she's thinking.
39:15
[SPEAKER_05]: It's like in the way that Lorelei explains everything one of her feelings that she's ever felt.
39:20
[SPEAKER_05]: that I think that that was really the disconnected, like maybe she did feel were more useful, but it's like if it's not in the narrative, if it's not purposeful, if it's not talked about with another character, if we don't see her feeling that way in some version of like a silent scene where she is really
39:35
[SPEAKER_05]: Showing this to us like I needed something really pointed like an apology toward doesn't have to be Walking around town and apologizing to everyone in fall.
39:44
[SPEAKER_05]: No, of course not though the Barack Obama parade tour of forigomar apologies She doesn't have to do it.
39:50
[SPEAKER_05]: She doesn't have to put it out of press release.
39:51
[SPEAKER_05]: You know like it just has to be Meaningful to us.
39:56
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and I don't entirely know what that looks like.
39:58
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't think it's apologizing to Lindsay though because I don't think we need to make it anymore about us for equal more
40:05
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, it's like when you get the Hagerly text or DM, Hagerly didn't realize he had a girlfriend.
40:11
[SPEAKER_05]: You never really think much about her.
40:14
[SPEAKER_05]: It's always about, oh, okay, cool.
40:16
[SPEAKER_05]: Break up, or if you're a little dilulu, you're like, it is her fault.
40:21
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, yeah, you got some unhealed things before you break up with the man.
40:25
[SPEAKER_05]: It's always the man.
40:26
[SPEAKER_05]: So it's, it's a lot of back and forth, but like at the end of the day, I don't think she should have talked to Lyndsey at all.
40:32
[SPEAKER_05]: I was best.
40:33
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
40:33
[SPEAKER_05]: I just don't think that that would have endeared me to her.
40:38
[SPEAKER_05]: I think I would have been like, oh, once again, Rory is centering, where are you?
40:43
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, would you want an apology if I were Lindsey?
40:47
[SPEAKER_05]: So Brett sleeps with his ex and tells them that it's over with you.
40:52
[SPEAKER_05]: That ex comes to you and's like, hey, sorry, Tara.
40:55
[SPEAKER_05]: I heat on me, it was over with you, guys.
40:58
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know, well, but then they sleep together again.
41:00
[SPEAKER_03]: That's also where she loses us is that like now she lost what's it what's an apology to Lindsey if she sleeps with her husband again, and it's fair, unless she doesn't I mean, like, well, her mother is already pointed it out to her, but God, it's so messy.
41:14
[SPEAKER_03]: It's so, so messy.
41:16
[SPEAKER_03]: I just find the
41:19
[SPEAKER_03]: stance of like, you know, Lindsey is seemingly like the quote unquote other woman doesn't really seem to like worry very much.
41:26
[SPEAKER_03]: It's probably very intimidated by her because she's the ex.
41:28
[SPEAKER_03]: But then she may rest in and seems to be like, hey, hey, everything's good, you know, doesn't really seem to worry, but like has a good relationship with Laura lie and comes and visits the guys and seems to be a little bit more secure in her relationship.
41:43
[SPEAKER_03]: Only for the audience to then like
41:48
[SPEAKER_03]: So it's a wonder.
41:50
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I don't know.
41:51
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a it's a very interesting shift in Perspective on characters, but I mean at the end of the day, I think we can agree it's Dean's fall, but I think it's Dean's audience really A lot of people really really lose their
42:06
[SPEAKER_03]: They're kind of, you know, love for Rory Go More and they're in deerment towards her, I think, in at the end of season for the beginning of season five.
42:14
[SPEAKER_05]: Because it's like a scar, you.
42:16
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, in my episode of season Lee, she talked to that, that was one of her favorite episodes, but she does call it her breakup with Rory Go More.
42:23
[SPEAKER_05]: For Rory Go More.
42:23
[SPEAKER_05]: She can't root for her anymore in that which makes sense and like from the beginning of that situation I would say until like episode three when she goes back to Yale So that's like the end of season four to season five episode three that kind of just like the arc of that Story line, um, at least the cheating part of it because it really doesn't persist much beyond it until she gets with dean And they have to split the car and whatever, but it's not really anything that she needs to feel sorry for
42:51
[SPEAKER_05]: There's so many points of it that you're like, okay, you can redeem yourself here.
42:55
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
42:55
[SPEAKER_05]: After this, you can redeem yourself.
42:58
[SPEAKER_05]: But then she writes the letter.
43:01
[SPEAKER_05]: She sleeps with Dean.
43:02
[SPEAKER_05]: She writes the letter.
43:02
[SPEAKER_05]: All these other things are happening and you're like, girl, there were so many signs that said, turn around.
43:09
[SPEAKER_05]: Do not enter.
43:10
[SPEAKER_05]: Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-Y-
43:19
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't know what the writer's intention with her was.
43:23
[SPEAKER_05]: I personally don't think that Amy was really interested in be like, is this the most likable thing where he could do?
43:29
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, I don't think that that's like a question that was maybe she was approaching.
43:33
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, I think she wanted worried to be flawed.
43:35
[SPEAKER_03]: I think she was like, let's start to peel back the layers of this angel on top of the Christmas tree that she's not perfect.
43:42
[SPEAKER_03]: It just ended up really causing a reft between Rory and the audience.
43:47
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and that never really recovered because then she had a part two in the revival, right?
43:54
[SPEAKER_05]: And it's like this girl just thinks all of the men belonged to her and I would really, really love to know Amy's perspective of what she thought the perception of Rory's decisions would be.
44:04
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
44:04
[SPEAKER_05]: Or if she thought about things like that, does she think about if the audience is going to like it?
44:09
[SPEAKER_05]: Or does she have to put that out of her head?
44:11
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm sure she puts it out of her head and also she was writing this at a time when like on his feedback wasn't necessarily, well definitely it is immediate as it is now.
44:21
[SPEAKER_03]: I talk to Sarah about that and Gilmour to watch with Jenny and George.
44:24
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, because it can be really hard to like quiet that noise.
44:29
[SPEAKER_03]: But I think that luckily Amy was writing the show during a time when
44:34
[SPEAKER_03]: that noise wasn't so instant and you know what was really looking for it like on message boards and things correct but on the press I want to talk about like Lindsey and kind of pull her apart a little bit more later this season but I thought this was
44:51
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, like a nice trio of voicemails to kind of like get us in the mood and the right head space for that asking the right questions.
44:57
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'd love to hear from the besties on what their thoughts are here.
45:00
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
45:01
[SPEAKER_05]: I want more, like, what are your questions that you have for us now after hearing this?
45:04
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
45:05
[SPEAKER_05]: That we can talk about.
45:06
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
45:07
[SPEAKER_03]: We can talk about the season.
45:08
[SPEAKER_03]: The blond season.
45:09
[SPEAKER_03]: Because, you know, most of them are blond.
45:11
[SPEAKER_03]: Most of these other, quote unquote, other women, you've got Rachel, who's like kind of right head blonde.
45:16
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
45:20
[SPEAKER_03]: You've got Shane.
45:21
[SPEAKER_03]: We need to talk about the red hair to blonde hair pipeline.
45:25
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, yeah, especially with the poll and then Nicole Sherry.
45:29
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, Sherry starts out as like a dark blonde brown hair with highlights and then is like platinum platinum got her baby shame.
45:38
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah,
45:50
[SPEAKER_03]: So next week we're going to have one more GTC before we kick off season five and I'm really excited for a season five opener.
45:57
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, it's going to be good.
45:59
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's going to be a lot of fun.
46:01
[SPEAKER_03]: But of course, if you guys have any thoughts, feelings, opinions, hot takes, give us a call.
46:07
[SPEAKER_03]: What's the number?
46:08
[SPEAKER_05]: I can hear eight, six, zero, five, seven, eight, four, six, five, three.
46:12
[SPEAKER_05]: It's also in our show notes and on our Instagram bio.
46:15
[SPEAKER_05]: If you guys are driving and don't want to pull out a pen right now, because that is unsafe, unsafe, don't do that.
46:22
[SPEAKER_05]: Always stay safe, stay safe, stay safe out there.
46:25
[SPEAKER_03]: But how many new year we hope you're having a great start to 2020, six?
46:28
[SPEAKER_03]: And we'll have more to consider in the next episode.