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Your Home is Your First Ministry · Main Thing Podcast

• 0:02
  SPEAKER_03: Main Thing Podcast with Pastor Steve, equipping you to respond and thrive in the world we live in today.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_03: Keep the main thing the main thing has been a saying that Pastor Steve has told for decades.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_03: It means no matter what is happening around us, Jesus is what we need to have front and center in our lives.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_03: There couldn't be a more powerful reminder for us to recall in today's divisive and dark culture.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_03: From foundational truths and scripture to the hot topics of today's culture, allow this podcast to inspire and motivate you on your faith journey.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_03: Well, hello, Pastor Brent.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_03: How are we doing?
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_03: Doing good, doing good.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_03: We are on episode 47.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_03: That's amazing.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_03: And uh, since you're the math guy, what how long have we been doing this now?
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_03: Almost two years, yeah.
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_03: Almost two years.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_03: Almost two years, yeah.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_03: Uh we're gonna have to do something special for episode 50.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe like give some handouts.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_03: If someone actually writes a review, we'll give them a covenant church shirt or something.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe we can do a do a giveaway.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_03: Oh man.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_03: So the title of this episode is Your Home is Your First Ministry.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_03: And um, we have a lot of young families in our church, and through the last, especially the last decade, we have seen an epidemic of busyness taking a hold of families.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_03: And I think this is a great opportunity to look at what the scripture says and then kind of dive into it a little bit.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_03: Absolutely.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_03: So Deuteronomy 6, verses 4 through 9 says, Hear, O Israel, the Lord is our God, the Lord is one.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_03: You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your might.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_03: These words which I am commanding you today shall be on your heart.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_03: You shall teach them diligently to your sons, and shall talk to them when you sit in your house, and when you walk by the way, and when you lie down, and when you rise up.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_03: You shall bind them as a sign on your hand, and they shall be as frontals on your forehead.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_03: You shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_03: And there's another scripture, Psalm seventy eight, starting in verse four.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_03: We will not conceal them from our children, but tell the generation to come the praises of the Lord, and his strength and his wondrous works that he has done.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_03: For he established a testimony in Jacob and appointed a law in Israel, which he commanded our fathers that they should teach them to their children, that the generation to come might know, even the children yet to be born, that they may arise and tell them to their children, that they that their confidence would be in God and not forget the works of God, but keep his commandments.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_03: So we read those scriptures, and the thing that comes to my mind is the parents' number one responsibility is to disciple their kids at home at home.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_03: But what we're seeing is the school system disciples kids, and then a new study just came out in Barn a couple of years ago.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_03: The average dad spends 12 minutes with his kids a day.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_03: And you and me both know you cannot disciple someone with 12 minutes a day adequately.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_00: Well, look, I I think one thing you you gotta keep in mind is uh if we put verse three in there with Psalm 78, right before there, it says, the stories we've heard and known, stories our ancestors handed down to us.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_00: And what that tells me is discipleship in your home is a lifestyle, not a uh a set time.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_00: What I mean by that is we always talk about having like family devotions.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_00: Family devotions are good.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: I am not saying they're not good at all, but you can't do that and call that your discipleship.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_00: It has to be a lifestyle.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_00: Your kids have to see that it's real in your life.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and so I that just struck me that verse, stories we've heard known, stories our hands' ancestors handed down to us.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_00: They need to know that history of faith in our family.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I know uh uh there there have been times over the years we've we've talked about um, you know, in our family, uh the journey of our family to where we are, you know, uh how my dad came to Christ, how my mom uh lived out her faith, you know, as as she was growing up.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that's uh I think that's an important uh consideration there.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's gotta be a lifestyle, it doesn't ever change.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_03: And it it seems, you know, when you when I think of the word lifestyle, I think of an investment of time, an investment of yourself.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_03: And um, if if all you're doing as a family is running around ragged, not even having time to cook meals at home and sit down together.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_03: You know, for example, I mean, we homeschool, right?
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_03: Nicole stays home and homeschools the kids, and we are still flat busy.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_03: I cannot imagine what families go through.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_03: And I say I can't imagine, I know because many of them are our dear friends, but like the both parents working full-time, sometimes overtime, uh, daycare for the kids, you know, extracurricular for the kids.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_03: It's like it seems like most families don't get a break nowadays unless it's Thanksgiving, summer, or you know, Christmas.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_03: Um and I I think I think what we s we'll see here is like the first topic of discussion is like outsourcing spiritual growth to the church.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_03: You and I both, you've been in children's ministry, youth ministry, and the a common theme is that parents are like, oh, the church will take care of the spiritual development, you know.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_03: And so what's the pitfalls to that?
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_00: There's a lot of pitfalls.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_00: One, you don't know exactly what they're teaching.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_00: And so let's take here.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_00: I uh I I completely trust what our children's ministry teaches here.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_00: I I'm I completely trust what they're, I know it's biblical, I know uh that Christ is glorified, but I still don't always know what it is, so there's no follow-up, right, you know, unless we specifically ask.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think that's one of them.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_00: The second one is that is somebody who's not they're in that your child's life, but not intimately.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_00: We're the ones intimately in our our child's life.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_00: We're the ones still who have the greatest influence on our children, right?
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um, even if our children don't want to admit it, yeah, they grow up to be a lot like us, you know, unless they just absolutely uh deliberately try to move away from that.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that's I think that's two of the pitfalls right there.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, absolutely.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_03: And um a couple of these kind of go together.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_03: It's it's busy schedules replacing family discipleship and it's sports and extracurricular activities dominating family life.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_03: There has been a shift.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_03: When I was playing ball as a kid, it was it's basketball season.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_03: You get a few weeks' break, and the next sport, few break, next sport, few weeks break.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_03: But now it's like each sport is running into the next season, and they're like they're they're competing against each other.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_03: There's all stores stars, there's travel league and all these things.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_03: And I see parents feel like feel like they have to do it for their kids.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_03: Um and look, one of my one of my sons is extremely talented.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_03: He's athletic.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, but we told him we were not doing anything this spring because fall was super busy, the summer before that was super busy.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_03: We took a whole season break.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_03: And look, was he upset about it at first?
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_03: He was, but we let him know like these are the values of our family, and we have goals we want to set for this spring, things we want to do.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_03: And um, it's a busy season in life.
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_03: So we decided as a family not to not to partake in sports and extracurricular.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_03: And it has been a wonderful season of rest for my family.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_03: It was much needed.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_03: Now, come fall, we're getting right back in it.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_03: They're gonna have their fun and do what they want to do.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_03: But I think I think some parents are scared to tell their kids no because coaches are saying one thing or their friends are saying one thing and they feel pressured.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that that so much reminds me of a tweet that went out years ago from a TCA TCU baseball coach.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_00: He said, We give uh to our coaches things we'd never dream of giving to God.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_00: You know, wow, that's powerful.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_00: Coach says, Hey, 20 hours this week, we practicing five days.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_00: God comes along, hey, I I'm calling you to do this.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_00: Are you crazy?
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_00: I can't give 20 hours a week to God.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and it's it's a mindset shift.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and I and I think at least in the sports world, things have changed.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_00: Now you you talked about growing up with sports.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_00: So I grew up 15 years before you with sports.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_00: And it was it was the same thing.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_00: But I grew up in a I don't even know if they they do this anymore, but I grew up in a traditional little league that had six teams, and we played a 20-game schedule, and you played one game during the week, and you played one game on Friday night.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, when it was over, it was over.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_00: And you didn't, I'm sure you picked up a bat, but we didn't play anymore until the next spring.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_00: And so that mindset shift has been this is what is most important.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_00: I think the the college scholarship has become the holy grail of parenting.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_00: You know, like uh I'm not really being a good parent unless my kid is good enough to get a college scholarship.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_00: And obviously that's not everybody.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I think deep down that's the thing, you know.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_00: And and look, when when Bradley was young, he played baseball, and there came time he he said, I I just don't want to play, I don't like it, I don't want to play anymore.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: And it was like I grieved over that, yeah, you know, and I look back now and say, Why, why would that have been so important to me?
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's way more important to me than it was to him.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but we I think I don't think anybody sets out to give their life over to sports, but it's a gradual movement into it, you know.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_00: And all of a sudden one more thing is asked, one more thing is asked, and it it kind of crowds out uh everything else that's important, right?
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_03: You know, right.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_03: No, that's good.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_03: I I'm reading a book right now called Intercessor, but have you ever heard of Reese Howells?
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_03: I have not, no.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, so he was uh he was like during the time, the early 1900s, during the Wales revival, but he was actually not in Wales, and it was he was a young man that gave his life totally to the Lord.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_03: And so just one story about him.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_03: During that time, it was extremely taboo for a man to take off his hat.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_03: Like it's almost as if you're like uncovering a private, like it's a big deal, right?
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_03: And um, the Lord at that time in his life was the Holy Spirit was dealing with him about taking off his hat for his two-mile walk back and forth from the coal mine in his house.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_03: And he struggled with that.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_03: But when he obeyed and surrendered that that hat to the Lord, he got victory over that, and the Lord kept bringing him closer to himself through intercessory.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_03: And it's the the book, it's a phenomenal book, very powerful.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_03: But I I fear that we as families are scared to give the Lord things because of what our kids might think or because of what other people might think.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_03: A lot of times, I don't think it's necessarily sin that holds us back from a relationship with God.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_03: I think it's self.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_03: Now, self is inherently sin, but it's because of what other people might think of us or what other people may do to us if we were to act a certain way or surrender certain things.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_03: Um, people already think we're crazy because we homeschool, especially in Virginia, not so much here.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_03: But um, I I can remember the kids walking into church one day with no shoes on.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_03: We were done fighting, right?
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_03: It was a bad morning.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_03: Like one of the kids didn't want to wear shoes, so he just walked into the house and walked into the church with no shoes.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_03: And a couple of ladies were like, Oh my goodness, you don't put shoes on your kids.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_03: And we're like, Lady, if you had to fight that fight this morning, you know.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_00: See, you you missed right there, you missed a chance to be really holy.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_00: You just says, uh ma'am, we are on holy ground here and we do not wear our shoes.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_00: You missed that chance.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_01: I missed it, I missed it.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_00: I missed it.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_03: And so years back, we've just come to a place as a family where we're we're not worried about what other people think because of the decisions we make, if that makes sense.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, how many how many things do we think are important just because other people say they're important?
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_00: And they're not really that important.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and then the next one is lack of intentional spiritual discussions.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_03: And I know, I know you've experienced the same thing.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_03: It is difficult to carve out time for that because either the kids are fighting or screaming or there's schedules that get in the way, but it's those moments that you carve out with one-on-one to truly try to pour into your child.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_03: And I think that that is lacking in the home as well.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think it's because we we may not know our kids as well as we we should.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_00: Going back to that 12 minutes a day with your children.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_00: You know, if you're if you're blessed that your wife can can be at home, you know, whether you homeschool or not.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_00: And once again, we always have to do disclaimers right in 2026.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_00: I don't believe you're sinning by your wife working outside the home.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_00: You're not saying that's not um that's not something that's against God.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_00: We we take so many things and um and make those like the mark of a true Christian, and that's not the mark of a true Christian.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_00: So I say all that to say if you are blessed in that way.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um, as a dad, that's where you you die to self, and that's where you love your wife as Christ loves the church, because you have to sacrifice some things you would want to do to make sure you spend that time right with your kids.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they have to uh you know, do priority uh or be the be the priority in the afternoons, I think, if you're going to have that time with them.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, and that means we have to say no to some things we want to do.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you know, but those spiritual conversations, I I I don't know, at least in our home, it hasn't been uh, you know, at four o'clock this afternoon, we're going to sit down and have a spiritual conversation.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_00: You have to look for those moments that flow into it naturally.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you know.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I'll give you an example.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_00: So uh my oldest son, uh, he went to Utah this summer uh as a um a summer missionary.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_00: And so he's he's near Provo, Utah, um, and doing some evangelism and a lot of mission stuff.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_00: Well, when he was thinking about it, we had a chance to sit down and I I was able to talk to him about one of my biggest regrets is turning down that opportunity when I was his age uh to go to Colorado.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_00: And I I decided there were more important things back home.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_00: And so we were able to have that conversation about regret and about how God works through our uh our disobedience, you know, and He is great, He is gracious, but I sure chose to do it the hard way, you know.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_00: So that was um I guess that would be an example of that, of that conversation flowing naturally out uh through what his life was going on right now.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_03: That's good.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_03: So let's talk about some dangers and pitfalls.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_03: Um a lot of families, unfortunately, through lack of understanding or lack of trying to see the truth or just not knowing, assume that church attendance equals discipleship, where they think, oh, as long as my kid shows up, everything's good.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_03: But to your point earlier, follow-up is crucial.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_03: If you're just if we're just dropping our kids off at church and we're not following up with what's going on at church, the world is still influencing them.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_03: And so I think it's helpful for families to realize that we are in a deep spiritual battle.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_03: And that spiritual battle is coming after our children.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_03: And so if we're not following up, if we don't know how to have spiritual discussions, then we need to seek the Lord.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_03: We need to either be saved, we need to be discipled, we need to get deeper in our faith so we can pour into our children.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_03: And so speak on that a little bit.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, that idea that, hey, as long as I'm in church, I'm being discipled, all is good.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_03: Don't need to do anything after that.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_00: Well, look, we'll we'll just start with the easiest questions.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_00: If you're like, I don't know how to do that, I don't know how to follow up with church, just ask questions.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_00: You know, what do you think we were talking about today?
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: You know, what do you think the sermon was about?
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_00: Is there anything that uh that jumped out at you?
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's you don't have to have your you know, your theology degree to discuss the sermon, yeah, you know, after um after church in the morning.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_00: But also I think we I think we all do this to some extent.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_00: We assume we went to church this Sunday, we're we're all good.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_00: And especially with your kids.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_00: So if I'm taking my kids to church on Sunday, they're gonna see whether God has any influence on my life Monday through Saturday.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_00: That's right.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_00: And so if there is no change in me Monday through Saturday, I mean, our kids are our kids are smart.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: They know it really doesn't mean anything to me.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_00: So if if if we you know have a knockdown drag out just to get to church on Sunday morning, and then as soon as church is over, we leave and I start acting like a donkey's rear end, they're gonna know church is is not important, God is not important to me.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: It's just something we do.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I think I I honestly, this is my opinion.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I think when when we live that way, if we're not careful, I think that hurts worse than if we didn't take them to church at all.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_03: Yep.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_00: Because at least if we never took them to church, they can they can come from an honest spot.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_00: But when they've seen it all their lives, dad says church is important, dad says we're gonna go, dad acts like a rumpus, you know, the rest of the week.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_00: That's not real.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_00: That can't be real, right?
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_00: Because it doesn't change them, you know.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_00: So I I think that's one of the biggest keys.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_00: If if you're gonna bring your family to church, it needs to change who you are.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_00: Because of what God did, not because the church changed you, but because the Holy Spirit changed you.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_03: And I I I love the idea, like to flip that on its head.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_03: Church should be a time of worship and fellowship.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_03: We should have already repented of our sins and got right with the Lord before we came to church.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_03: I'm talking about a mature believer.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_03: And church should be a place where we can freely come together, freely love each other, freely be a place of no shame, no guilt, because we're all we've already been right with the Lord.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_03: We're seeking, we're seeking those who may not know Jesus.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_03: We're we're going, we're getting outside of ourselves, right?
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but so often people use church as a crutch.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_03: Like the the church, we gather together on Sunday, um, and they're not involved in discipleship groups, they're not involved in covenant groups, they're not involved in serving.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_03: And so there's really one of the things that I love seeing is when when that light bulb comes on for someone, when they start serving, they're like, oh my goodness, this is awesome.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_03: I love this, you know?
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_03: And I I think sometimes that's the hardest thing for us as pastors is to get people to see, like, hey, this is where you need to be.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_03: I know you can't see this is where you need to be right now, but that's where you need to be, you know.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_03: And um, I think Steve has said it before.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_03: The greatest calling of a pastor is to bring people where they are to where they need to be, and they don't necessarily see that that's where they need to be.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I think of Moses in the wilderness with Israel, you know, that those stories.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_00: Well, that's one of the things we talk about in New Member Class is you are most satisfied when you find out what God has gifted you for and you are serving him in that way.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_00: You know?
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_00: That's right.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_03: And so I would agree with that totally.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_03: The next one is prioritizing success over spiritual maturity.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_03: So let let's let's bring it home.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_03: All right.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_03: You got average homes being two, two fifty, right, for small homes in decent neighborhoods.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_03: You got the average vehicle being$30,000,$40,000.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_03: You got food prices through the roof.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, you got all these things that are parents are like, well, how in the world am I supposed to spend more time with my kids if we both have to work and make ends meet?
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_03: You know, we're we're living through some unprecedented times financially as a culture.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_03: And so what are some things we can say to encourage parents and encourage families right now living through this time?
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_03: They're wanting to give more time to their kids, they're wanting to do these things, but they find themselves trapped.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's where we gotta make hard decisions.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_00: We've we've got to um be intentional.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_00: But also our our kids are not dumb, you know.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_00: Our kids, kids know their parents.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, absolutely.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_00: They know their parents' heart, they know um what's important to their parents, and so we we have to show that they are important to us, that they're more important than uh, you know, than the extra money or the the frills and stuff.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um I I think one of the things we we have to acknowledge with with the climate we live in is let me think of the best way to say this.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_00: So um missing out on the extras in life doesn't mean that you're struggling.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_00: In other words, um not getting to go on a vacation this year to somewhere else in the United States, that's not struggling.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_00: That's just missing out on an extra.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_00: Now, if we're eating bologna sandwiches seven days a week, that's struggling, yeah.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_00: Um so we have to acknowledge that then you know what in this season of life for for a lot of people that's just not possible.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and so if we can embrace that, um then that extra time needs to be spent with our kids.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_00: So let me let me turn around and play a host a second.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_00: So you got four kids.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_00: Remind me of oldest Cadence 10.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_00: Ten ten on down.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_00: 10 to 6.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_00: 10 to 6.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_00: What what do you guys do?
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_00: What are some practical things you guys do to lead your kids spiritually?
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so when I'm when I'm at Church or on the road for ministry, even during the summer, Nicole not only teaches them school, but she she teaches them the word as well.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_03: Um, as a family, I have this thing.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_03: This is a neat little thing.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_03: I have a list on my phone.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_03: I have four kids, so I gotta keep lists.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_03: And if I'm going somewhere and I see an opportunity, I'm like, okay, who's next?
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_03: And I just bring that one kid with me and we have quality time.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_03: And believe it or not, those 15 20-minute trips turn out to be the best conversations.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_03: They're just with dad.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_03: They've they feel like they're comfortable, they don't have the other kids to compete for my time, and I'm all theirs, right?
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not on my phone, I'm not doing anything.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_03: I'm just I'm listening.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_03: Normally they talk the whole time because they just are excited to be with me.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_03: And um, I feel like at our stage, that's important for me at their age for them just to know that I'm there.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_03: Um, another thing is uh when the boys turn about nine, we start talking about sex.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_03: That's just something we decided.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_03: I decided as the father of the home, I want my boys to know everything there is to know before anybody says anything to them.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_03: And so we go out on, we call it the man outing.
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_03: You know, uh we haven't camped, which I know that's probably sacrilegious to most men, but we uh we go stay in a a hotel somewhere and we just we hang out, we eat, we go hiking or whatever, and we just talk that weekend.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_03: And for for a couple of them, I I did it with my first two so far.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_03: And um, there's only so far, you so much you can explain depending on where their mind is, you know.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_03: So that's an ongoing conversation, but those are just some examples.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_03: Um, Gracie and Nicole, Nicole makes an effort to just spend time with Gracie, and I make an effort to just spend time with her as well.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_03: And so those are some some practical things we do.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_03: And every night, every night, uh Nicole and I pray over the kids, and we specifically pray that all of them have trusted in Christ.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_03: We pray that the Lord will sustain their faith, and we pray that God would send his angels charge concerning them to guard them in all their ways.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_03: That's our prayer for them every single night.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_03: And so one of the things that uh Grant picked up a number of years back is every time I leave, he said, he says, Dad, may the Lord overshadow you, you know.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_03: And so he picked that up in one of the Psalms.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_03: So that's kind of our family, my family thing.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_03: May the Lord overshadow you as you go out.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_00: It's funny you said prayer at night.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's a a big one.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_00: A sincere prayer every night over your kids.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_00: I like that.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it's funny what you know, you said Nicole, uh, with homeschooling, that's a natural uh time to teach the word, right?
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's funny that's that's when the mom gets to teach the word.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_00: And so we have to, as dads, be intentional about how we would do that.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and I I don't know about you guys.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I've heard so many stories over the years of people who say, Man, we we try to do family devotion, and it ends up in WrestleMania six, you know.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_00: And so that's a hard I've not met a family yet that said, Man, that 30 minutes is just the most beautiful you can hear the winds of heaven blow through the house.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's hard.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_00: Why I I think one of the reasons it's hard is because you know, this world does not want families doing that.
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_03: That's right, you know.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_03: I I I think if we would, Brent, before we end, is to say a little word towards the um the single men and women.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_03: And um, I just want to encourage them right now to know that you know, this podcast may be talking about family, and maybe they whoever's listening or watching may desire to have a family.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_03: And so I would say, and the the number one thing to do is to pray, to pray for us the specific family your heart desires, and like to bring that desire before the Lord and um and to model your life in a way that attracts that type of woman or attracts that type of man to have the family that you desire to have.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_00: And so Well, not just that, but but know right now God sees you.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_00: Correct.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_00: You know, God knows that that's a hard place uh to be, and it's hard to disciple your kids by yourself, but he sees you.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_00: You know, he knows, he knows your heart and knows what you're doing to do that.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_03: You know, you brought up something.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_03: My superheroes are these single parents, absolute rock stars.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_03: I know single dads, I know single moms that are just they it's tough, but they are doing it.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_03: Like they're sacrificing everything they can to make sure that their kids are getting what their kids need from them and from uh from the church and and everywhere else.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_03: It just total rock stars in my mind.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I I remember, oh gosh, 25, 25 years ago now, when I first got here uh to Homa, there was a there was a man in our church who had three three children, all by full custody, all by himself.
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_00: And I can remember seeing them every Sunday, every Wednesday.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_00: He he had this backpack and it had all their stuff, and they'd walk in the door, he'd pull that thing off, he'd start pulling Bibles out and stuff, you know.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_00: And just seeing that was always so encouraging, you know, that here was a guy who could have mailed it in said nope, not gonna mail it in.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's gonna be it's gonna be tough.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_00: But he he did it, you know.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_00: And so I I was always so encouraging to me to s to see somebody who was important too.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_00: Right, you know.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe we should mention one more thing.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_03: All right, um, to the families who are struggling, uh, either thinking about divorce, thinking about splitting up.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_03: Um I one of the things I've noticed through the years is it's it's it's a it's multifaceted issues with with couples who are at odds.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_03: And I think a lot of it has to do with the attention that they give each other.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_03: They might be totally focused on work or totally focused on a hobby.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_03: Or there could be some sins in one of their lives that are just destroying the family.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_03: I I I just want to encourage whoever's listening and watching right now that seek really seek help and really try.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_03: Because there there's a lot of times I meet with couples and they're like, We tried everything, and I meet with them and they haven't even tried the very first thing.
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_03: Like they haven't even really tried to listen to each other or figure out what the other person is thinking or feeling.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_03: And so if there's someone out there struggling, you could speak to a little bit to this too, Brent, but um to to truly seek the the Lord on behalf of your marriage and your family, because the last thing, the last thing, oh my goodness, I cannot stress this enough.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_03: A broken marriage destroys kids.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_03: You people can say whatever they want, they can say that, oh, the kids will be fine, or in two years they'll get over it.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_03: No, they it's God never designed a marriage or a family to be broken up, unless, of course, there's like some physical abuse or there's some things that you have to get out quickly, right?
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_03: But God's covenant is is is represented between a man and a woman, and it's very important.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_03: So see if you had any words on that.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I I can think of multiple children who grew up as adults that their their parents' divorce still to this day affects them, you know.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_00: And you remember when we we did Prepare Enrich when we took that training?
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_00: I still actually use that.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um one of the you were talking about communicating and and they telling them what they feel, you know.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_00: Every time I've used that with couples, the hardest thing for a couple to do, and I would put myself in this category because I think it's just as humans, we have it hard to do.
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_00: But it is hard for a man or woman to not talk at the counselor, but talk to their spouse and say, This is what you've done, this is how it makes me feel.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_00: That is that's the hardest thing.
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_00: I can't tell you how many times in a counseling session I'll say, Wait, don't look at me.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, yeah, right.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_00: Turn to your wife, you know, tell her.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and so yeah, you're right.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_00: That that key thing.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_00: And and look, I I think it can probably feel overwhelming.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_00: We've just talked about all these things.
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_00: Dad, spend time with your kids.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_00: More than 12 minutes a day.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, make sure you're a spiritual leader.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_00: Make sure uh that you you guys are um spending time talking about spiritual things.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_00: Make sure you spend time with your wife, okay?
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_00: It can feel overwhelming, right?
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_00: That's true.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_00: It really does.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_00: And so uh all I can say is God's grace will bring us through that when we have that desire to do that.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_00: That's right.
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_00: And we can't look at it as this is just one more thing we have to do.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_00: We have to look as this is one more thing we get to do.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_03: And and if it is, if we are looking at it as, oh, this is great, one more thing, what can I cut out?
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_03: What can I stop doing to prioritize what's important?
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_03: And that's a valid question.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_00: Well, look, look, I I know in our home, okay, we have seven children.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_00: So right there, if I'm going to spend more than 12 minutes a day with each child, I'm in trouble.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_03: You have to cut back on work.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_00: You know, so but it's like you guys, I'm clogging on at one today.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_00: That's right.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_00: So for Kelly and I to spend intentional time together, during the school year, we get up at 4 30 because that that's the time.
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_00: So 4 45 to 6 a.m.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_00: That is that is our time.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_00: That's our date night, so to speak.
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_00: And thankfully the summer has hit.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_00: So we we get to sleep in a little bit because the kids don't get up till till later.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_00: But you sometimes you just have to be intentional in that, right?
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and so uh I I just I guess I wanted to acknowledge that uh I hope they don't hear us sitting there going, man, yeah, so easy.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, not easy at all.
• 31:41
  SPEAKER_00: We ain't got it figured out, not at all.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_00: Oh gosh, no.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_00: Oh gosh, no.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_00: The um time and embarrassment prevents me from saying all the regrets I have as a parent.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_00: You're in good company, brother.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_03: Yep.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_03: Well, Pastor Brent, thank you for being here, and I'll see you actually on the next episode.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_03: All right, man.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_00: Take care.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks.