Latest / Outside Issues / 36 Cents and a Pair of Sunglasses

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36 Cents and a Pair of Sunglasses · Outside Issues

• 0:00
  Speaker A: I think domestic violence is so normalized and was normalized to me, that I couldn't see a crime being committed when it was being committed. I just didn't know. I was so young. I didn't know that you could be raped by your partner. And even if I did know that, I don't think I would have thought that anybody would ever believe me, because how do you prove that? Part of the conditioning when you're in that relationship is believing that your fault and that you've done something to deserve this. What people don't tell you is there's a period where everything's fine, you know, or seemingly fine, and this person's treating you like a princess and they're grooming you and they're making you. They're luring you into this, you know, illusion of safety and stability. And if you're already kind of an angry, lonely kid, that just reinforces kind of everything you're already feeling. They present themselves as the savior. And then something happens, and it's shocking, and you feel like, what happened? This person that I love, that's so nice, just did this. And it was so out of character.
• 1:09
  Speaker B: It must have been me.
• 1:10
  Speaker A: I must have done this.
• 1:29
  Speaker C: Welcome to outside issues with Audrey and Patrick.
• 1:33
  Speaker B: There's a lot of white privilege.
• 1:35
  Speaker C: Yeah.
• 1:36
  Speaker B: And they're now being exposed to images and sounds and events that, like, show, hey, like, you've got white privilege. Like, if you were white, this would not. You're white, this would not be happening to you. And so my clients have been particularly distressed this past week because of not knowing what to do. Right.
• 2:07
  Speaker C: Well, when we were talking earlier, I was actually. I'm glad you brought it up, because you were saying that it's not really your part of your mandate as therapists to, like, explain white privilege to people who were previously unaware of it. But, I mean, of course, I mean, you must wear appropriate. I'm sure you jump at the opportunity to basically, like, we should. I mean, for even the person with the least amount of consciousness or awareness surrounding these issues, educate where we can. And if we find an opportunity to, you know, talk somebody's ear off about some of these things, we should go for it. Right. Because what they're seeing, what you're describing, is people going into Home Depot to get tools who are attacked by federal agents because they look a certain way. You know, and you watch these images and you're like, well, there's very clearly, there's a type of person who is not being targeted for the crime of being a working Person going into a Home Depot and, you know, it's like if you've got just a little bit of curiosity, if you follow that trail of breadcrumbs, it's going to lead you to. Yeah, like white privilege and racism and institutionalized racism and this kind of Trumpian eugenics policy that's being enacted right now by Stephen Miller.
• 3:24
  Speaker B: Yeah, good old Stephen Miller. Somebody brought up Stephen Miller in a session and I apologize on behalf of LA residents. I swear to God, Santa Monica is not evil.
• 3:35
  Speaker C: Yeah, he's from Santa Monica, Right. I always think about that and it's just like such a stain and it's like it's from a place that's pretty similar to where I hail from. You know, where you've spent some time. You know, just the beach, cities, you know, we're all supposed to be chilled out liberals out there. But that's not always how it works out.
• 3:50
  Speaker B: He grew up to be something, something else, something out of this world.
• 3:55
  Speaker C: We're all dressing up for Halloween soon. And, you know, I was saying the other day that I'm leaning vampire. Like, I want to get some vampire duds and some teeth and it's just like, there's gotta. There's gotta be some Stephen Miller Nosferatu costumes going around this year because he's just like the most vampiric human being I think I've ever seen. I think a good friend of mine that we could have on sometime, if he's open to it, would be my friend Carlton, who. He was sounding the alarm about Project 2025 very clearly from early in the election last year. And I think, like, I always. I always believed in the alarm, but I didn't know how intense and, like, fast it would come on and, like, how. How serious they would be about implementing it and how few guardrails there have been preventing them from doing it. And like. Yeah, and it's my friend who's mad at me because I was kind of banging more of like the leftist drum. And, you know, maybe I wasn't scared enough last year about what we're seeing right now. Something that I'll need to work out with him over time. But.
• 5:04
  Speaker B: Yeah, well, yeah, those kind of conflicts can resolve over time. You know, that's like. I think kind of a part of being a true leftist is sometimes it's like. Like getting out of alcohol. Sometimes it's. It's losing people. And it's kind of weird because, you know, people's opinions on things are so strong that you had no idea and you Know, going towards such the left, where it's like Medicare for all, like, free college, free everything, which is basically just like, how scary is that? You know, like talking about Halloween.
• 5:50
  Speaker C: Woohoo.
• 5:51
  Speaker B: That's so terrifying. But, you know, they. They all hear the word socialist and they'll hear the word Marxist and communist and, you know, Marxist ideals. So it's. They get scared. And I've. I've had a few friends who just like, stop. Stop talking to me. Because they just got kind of scared.
• 6:13
  Speaker C: Stellan Skarsgard, he's a movie star and he's in a bunch of stuff. He's in that leftist Star wars show andor. And he had this. He had this quote in Vulture recently that's been going around. My father told me something when I was very small to instill confidence in me. Nobody in the world is worth more than you, but nobody's worth less. It's an egalitarian view that I've carried around in my life. That's why I am for free schools, free universities, free healthcare and free babysitting because our society could afford it. In America, people think social democracy is some kind of communism. They think capitalism is freedom. It's not. It's only freedom to exploit people.
• 6:48
  Speaker B: I hope to instill my kids with that quote for sure. Nobody is greater than you and nobody is less than you. I saw. I saw the tattoo of an adult film star one time. Her tattoo. It was on her finger. It said, you are number one. And then the other one said, you are no. 1. So it's like the duality thing, I just thought that was kind of funny.
• 7:17
  Speaker C: But we're moving past it now, or many liberals have moved past it. To defeat fascism, we need to. We need to focus on electability in our electoral politics and that. That a socialist vision is not electable in the United States and that we're much too individualistic, we're much too capitalistic here. And in order to keep the hellhounds at bay, you know, we need to kind of compromise and we need to kind of find some language with which to kind of keep. Keep everything glued, you know, seem. Keep some semblance of democracy, keep essentially what we're seeing right now from happening. And so, yeah, socialism is viewed as dangerous to, like, certainly, like in. In 2020, during the second Bernie campaign, that was the argument for Biden, right? Was that, like that if we run Bernie, we're going to get another term of Trump. And so Biden was the alternative. But now that Trump's won a second time, I Think it's been a radicalizing moment for a lot more liberals than we saw before. Now that centralist liberalism has failed to keep the wheels on the bus. Maybe, maybe we've got another shot now to kind of like, advocate for something a little bit more progressive, social democratic. There's no need to be scared of that anymore because we're really in the shit. So. Graham Platner.
• 8:40
  Speaker B: Graham Platner, that's right. I was thinking like, okay, there's a food involved.
• 8:45
  Speaker C: Graham Cracker Platner.
• 8:47
  Speaker B: I remember seeing his first things that he was doing. I don't remember when. It must have been last year at some point. And then you texted me a little bit about some shady shit that he was involved in. And like, you know, especially about, like, the, the tattoo that he got. And you, you said the Blackwater incident. Right.
• 9:07
  Speaker C: He was an employee of Blackwater. He was a State Department employee. And according to him, he was not a mercenary. He was not a killer for hire. Like, a lot of those guys were during the Iraq war. But, you know, he was more of like, a guard for, like, government buildings and stuff, so. But yeah, he's, he's a troop, and he's like to leftists, like, and I think for a lot of us, it's for, like, Earnest, and it's for good reasons, and it's that we don't like the wars. We don't like that the outcome of these wars has been a lot of the needless killing of brown people in other countries who didn't deserve it. And so I think this has been a real, at least for the left broadly. I think people in America like the troops, and they'll even see kind of criticisms that the left have of Platinum many normies would see as assets. And, you know, I think that it's really going to help him probably in the long run to win this election or win the primary at least. But, but yeah, you know, he's like, got some skeletons in the closet, but kind of per what you were saying earlier about learning from our mistakes and growing, like, as opposed to somebody like Andrew Cuomo mired in scandal, not, not, not looking at any of it, not taking accountability for any of it.
• 10:33
  Speaker B: Mr. Mr. Riz King.
• 10:36
  Speaker C: Yeah, exactly. And very. And real establishment candidate, you know, he's, he's a guy. I think if Chuck Schumer had his way, you know, like, he'd be installed as the mayor of New York instead of Mamdani. But, like, but anyway, Graham Platner, yeah, he's got maybe some skeleton in his closet. But I was watching Majority Report, and they made a good argument, or an argument that I needed to be reminded of, which is that, like, if we're still looking at things like Senate seats and House seats and judges and, you know, like, the institutional power, and we've got to, like, you know, hold on to it and take it back from the Republicans, it's very important that Graham Platner unseat Susan Collins, because it'd be better to have Platner in that position than Collins for the long term health of our democracy.
• 11:29
  Speaker B: Graham Platner was born in 1984, which is, like, you know, what, two years? Two years older than you and three years.
• 11:37
  Speaker C: Yeah, exactly.
• 11:38
  Speaker B: We're needing to have these elder millennials, Gen Xers, like, young Gen X people our age, people in their 30s. And of course, Mandami, who's in his early 30s, which I was like, oh, my God, I can't believe he's in his early 30s.
• 11:56
  Speaker C: Makes me feel he's just a baby.
• 11:58
  Speaker B: He's just a baby, but baby with some great ideas.
• 12:01
  Speaker C: He always looks. It's funny, they're trying to paint him. His opposition is trying to paint him as some weirdo, but he's always just, like, bursting into the frame like a young jfk. Just. Just charisma just shooting out of him like fireworks. And, like. And it's such a. It's such a early Obama vibe in the sense of, you just can't hate the guy. He manages to get into a room and he just works it and, you know, like, his policy. His policies are good. You know, it's like, a lot further left than we are used to seeing, you know, ever kind of, like, rise to that level of prominence or consideration. And I don't know, like, do you know Andrew Scholes? He's, like, one of the manosphere assholes, but he went on the Andrew Scholz show the other day, and I just saw a clip of it, and they're all just, like, laughing like, they look like just the boys on poker night. This is. This is where we're at, is that some people are just entirely viable tribes based in the way that they look at politics. And if you invite Mandani ON Instead of J.D. vance or Trump, and you can make these guys laugh, then sometimes that's game, set, match, right?
• 13:09
  Speaker B: You gotta have someone with the Riz.
• 13:11
  Speaker C: The Riz.
• 13:12
  Speaker B: My God, that mayoral debate, the. The. Just the quickness. I'm like, dude, you've been blessed with something. Like, there's no way I could Ever do that? Like, I had. I would have. I have the same ideas.
• 13:26
  Speaker C: But, you know, it's no surprise that like a lot of narcissists and like, unwell people get drawn to it and find like an aptitude in doing it. But that's not to say that, you know, there aren't some kind of like, positive forces that could like, equip themselves. Well, I mean, I think AOC is like, also like an incredible communicator.
• 13:43
  Speaker B: Speaking of narcissism. October. October is Domestic Violence Awareness Month.
• 13:49
  Speaker C: I was trying to find a purple shirt for domestic violence, but I couldn't. This is the closest I could get. It's my House of Pies shirt, which is kind of like a close to purple.
• 13:57
  Speaker B: Yeah, I should have have worn purple too. Or at least a ribbon or bracelets. I have. So October's Domestic Violence Awareness Month. Interpersonal violence can come in any form, of course, but domestic specifically is what, in your home. As a survivor, which I'll likely reference my story. It's a thing that you don't expect that this. This world would have. I heard somebody say one time actually, when I was still in, for lack of a better word, captivity, home is the place that you should be most safe at. You should feel most safe and with the safest people. But when home is a war zone and you have to walk on eggshells, I think it's important, like right away to state that. I'm not saying this to you, of course, or like anybody else, but for the love of God. Yes, I understand that. There's that. That sentence of why doesn't she. They. He just leave. On average, it takes seven times seven tries to leave an abuser. And then you hear. Some people will hear that statistic and be like, well, why didn't they just leave that one time? They know how to do it. People need to be educated on what the psychology and the emotions and the mental abuse goes behind. Domestic violence goes behind this nightmare that we unfortunately have to have a whole month to be aware of. You know, it wasn't too long ago that, you know, there was. I don't know which state it was, but they took off the like, husband rape charge. Like, so. Like, you know, if you're in and you're married and they. If they rape you, there's. It's not considered rape because it's your husband. There's a saying called about narcissists. Like, every narcissist is an abuser, but not every abuser is a narcissist because Narcissists typically take their, their, their M.O. is power and control over other. Someone else or other people, as plain and simple as it can be. And that's the definition of abuse to have somebody have power and control over you. Obviously we're living in an entire country run by a narcissist. Oh yeah, there's a lot of mental health ramifications that come along with being with a narcissist. It's not in the DSM or anything, but there's a lot of, a lot of terminology like narcissist, narcissist victim syndrome, I believe, something like that. And it wreaks havoc on your, your self image and your. Just your ego. Like your, your general ego, your general person, because you think that you're, you're a horrible person. And you know, like I said, domestic violence is so, so complicated and, and my story is so complicated, but I suffered, I suffered severe emotional and mental abuse in, in addition to physical and sexual and financial abuse.
• 17:31
  Speaker C: This was a guy you did not deserve what happened to you, no matter what your struggles were. And this was a person that kind of opportunistically preyed upon you because they sensed that they could get away with it. And they did get away with it for a little while, right?
• 17:48
  Speaker B: Yeah, they did. He did. And yeah, it's quite the story where it comes from. If I want to think clinically, emotionally as myself, different story. But if you want to think clinically, it comes from an abusive childhood and specifically narcissist. Narcissistic behavior a lot of the time comes with the dynamic, a disorganized family dynamic in which the father is extremely violent towards the child and the mother. And then because of, because of that, the mother will try to take the child on her own and put it, to put it up on a pedestal just so she can be distracted from the abuse she's going through, hate him, they, etc. But this disorganized dynamic, it's so this narcissist, this person who's developing narcissism from a very young age is being told that they're the best thing in the world. Putting up on a, being put up on a pedestal, but also the worst thing in the world. And so when I've, I started researching, malignant narcissism is another term to look up. I'll maybe put it in, put it in a link. Malignant narcissism is the worst kind of narcissism, usually comes with severe domestic violence. So they're, they're they're thinking, oh, I'm either the best or the worst, so what am I? So they create these Personas, and these Personas, like, hide who they really are. Who. But. But who knows who they really are because they have these Personas. I. When I first started researching narcissism, when I was still in my domestic violence relationship, I read things and I was like, oh, my God, everything makes sense. You know, it was. It was a moment. It was a moment everything made sense. And the way. The reason why I googled this and the way I found this was I googled why is everything always my fault? And then a bunch of links came up of narcissism, like, narcissistic people and what to do about it.
• 20:35
  Speaker C: Were you still with this person at the time that you googled?
• 20:39
  Speaker B: And ever since.
• 20:40
  Speaker C: I'm glad you did.
• 20:43
  Speaker B: Yeah, me too. And I tried to watch some documentaries on psychopaths and sociopaths, which I'm sure can be thrown into to abusers in.
• 20:55
  Speaker C: General to be physically and emotionally and sexually abused. But then to have the added sting of all of that pain is being redirected now back onto yourself. So the pain that I'm experiencing from this very real abuse, it turns into a form of self hatred almost.
• 21:17
  Speaker B: The impact is great. It can leave. It's bigger than any asteroid you can ever imagine impacting. Impacting Earth. It feels. And that's why, of course, I. I abused drugs and alcohol after I got out of this situation. Luckily not for very long because I knew that. Holy. I just got out of a deadly situation. Like, actually a forensic psychologist. I went to sort of like an inpatient PTSD ward, I guess you want to say it. To escape him, I think. I don't know if I've brought this up here, but it's kind of a long story. But I went to a facility to escape from him and to get some help with ptsd, because clearly I would have PTSD after this situation. So we had a forensic psychologist come in. I don't know why, but I do remember him saying, you were in the 90th percentile of being a homicide victim of this man. And so those kinds of things is what that kind of stuff is, what Domestic Violence Awareness Month is all about, how dangerous it is and how we need to have. How we need to have, like, what's it. What's the word? How we need to have compassion and understanding towards victims who are still in there, victims who have been out and are still suffering, victims who are healed, victims who are still healing and of course, I just caught myself saying the word victim. The word I use is survivor. Always, always, always use survivor.
• 23:13
  Speaker C: How can you help somebody who, you know, who's in an abusive relationship or like, what is, like, what do you think is like a helpful way to try and talk to that person and to try and show up for them.
• 23:23
  Speaker B: Believe them, first of all, listen and listen at the correct. At the right times, especially if they're still in the situation. Personally, for me, I found out through my mom that my friends, like my part of my friend group were having like, they had like a summit each, each week to see if I was like, still alive, you know, to see if, you know, I was still existing in this apartment. I don't know what, how, what they would talk about, but just getting together and having support for a person that is in this kind of situation that they didn't ask to be in. And like, how I emphasized earlier, never ever say, why don't you just leave? And I've, I've heard folks unfortunately in the rooms say things like that and it breaks my heart. Oh, you, you know, why don't you do a, A ninth step with your abuser? Because, you know, everybody's. We all have things that we did to people that, that, that's harming, that's harming me, that's harming us. Like there's no way. And you know, thinking about the 12 step model on how we do have, you know, we play a part in things. We didn't play a part in this. Like, we didn't. And it's. That's that. So to anybody, like in the, in 12 step, in 12 steps programs who want to say that being in an, in an abusive situation, you had a part in it, I say off thinking of somebody's specific back in 2017, actually, who told me that. And I just want now if, you know, in hindsight I want to be like, off tell. Tell that to somebody else because she was a survivor too. And that. That's your shit, you know, that's your. I gotta deal with my. Go try to, you know, deal with your own somewhere else without projecting it onto, onto another survivor. We should be working together, especially in early sobriety, we should be working together as domestic violence survivors instead of one saying, oh, you know, you had a part in that, right, right off, you.
• 26:01
  Speaker C: Had significant trauma from that relationship. How do you medicate that trauma today? And like, how has that changed you? Like the process of healing from those wounds, which I'm sure it still fucks with you. I mean, even as much progress as you made, you know, this is really serious stuff. And I mean, what do you have any experience, strength, and hope you can share about that?
• 26:23
  Speaker B: Just like I tell everybody I treat in the mental health field, you have to sit through the uncomfortability of the memories of it. You have to have those memories be supported through those memories and process them. Looking at the memory of possibly a violent incident when somebody said, like, you're nothing. Sitting through that specific memory and telling yourself, I am something, fuck you. And it's. It's so uncomfortable. But that's how healing works. Uncomfortability and unfortunately, a lot of people don't know that, but that's how healing works is. It sucks. It sucks going through essentially playing back what you went through in the first place. That's why I sometimes I get a lot of therapy clients that drop out of my. Drop out of my caseload because I ask them to heal and be uncomfortable and they're like, nope, never mind. Which is the de facto reaction, I think, that people would go to if they're having, like, feelings and remembering and having legitimate flashbacks from their abuse. You don't. You don't want to think about it. You want to put it. You want to put it aside, and that's perfect. Drugs and alcohol are perfect for that, right? So, you know, sitting through the uncomfortability with no drugs, no alcohol, you know, I can't speak for anybody else, but having a support system, knowing that these feelings are feelings and they're not going to last forever, they're just feelings. You survived, but these are just feelings. And even though it sucks, I. I say it sucks all the time. Even though it's incredibly painful, it's incredibly necessary. And that's how I got through my healing journey. I'm still healing. I will always be healing. I'm always on a healing journey. I work with a different sort of counselor who's specific to up here, who works with a lot of like, deep, deep trauma and deep healing. And so I've been lucky enough to cross paths with him and work with him for the last three years. So I owe him a lot of. I owe him a lot for the healing that I've done through not just my domestic violence, but through other things. And going through, going through the pain is, you got to do it. I shouldn't be so blase, but, like, you know, I. You got to do it. But we're here for you. We're here for you. You can do it.
• 29:29
  Speaker C: One of my favorite Things about you, Audrey. And I see it showing up in different areas of your life. And, you know, because I see the way anger is, the way anger rises up in people, in the way that it's both summoned and deployed. And it can be very not useful. You know, it can be counterproductive. It can be, it could be self immolating. But with you, you summon your anger, I feel like for righteousness. And I feel like, you know, you really try and direct that anger that you have towards the places where it needs to go. And I think, like, anger can be very useful and it can be righteous. And I think that, you know, in your reaction to someone trying to someone who harmed you, that, that's, that's a place where anger is warranted and that's a place where you need to turn it away from yourself and out towards the place where it needs to go. And I see that in the way that you talk about politics and you talk about sticking up for people. And, you know, it's a beautiful thing. I think it's a really beautiful quality you have.
• 30:32
  Speaker B: Well, thank you. I appreciate that. Anger. I was just, I've been doing a lot of anger work with a lot of the people that I see and learning, and I'm still learning, you know, like learning the anger is, is valid to feel no matter who told you it wasn't. If you grew up being told that being angry is scary or seeing that anger is scary, Anger is valid. Anger is an emotion that we are allowed to and should express in a way that doesn't hurt you or someone else. Like the classic scream into a pillow or the classic punch a pillow. Pillows are really poor pillows.
• 31:23
  Speaker C: JD Vance looks like a pillow.
• 31:25
  Speaker B: Exactly. Just put, just put a big thing of J.D. vance's head right on, on a couch. Like maybe multiple. Fuck these politicians. Fuck Trump, Fuck Vance, fuck Stephen Miller, Fuck rfk. Especially Fudge rfk. Because I, for some reason I have, you know, I got my thing with rfk, like, imagine hitting the shit out of them, punching the shit out of them, but you're not actually doing it. You're not doing it to yourself. You're doing it to a pillow or just something else like a punching bag.
• 32:00
  Speaker C: Another side of this, just briefly, is the way that boys and men are acculturated to misogyny. And I watched this really great clip from Yanis Varoufakis the other day, who's a leftist, says a lot of smart things. You know, he always tends to have like a very economic, populist message. But you Know, you look at the manosphere, you look at figures like Andrew Tate, these, like, personalities that have kind of like, been birthed along with the, like the right wing political victories. There's been right wing political victories and there have been right wing cultural victories. And I think that, like, men. Boys being raised into men to hate women and treat them like shit, you know, is something that. It hasn't gotten better. And, you know, it got. It got a little bit better and then it got worse. And that's kind of where we're at right now. But I think that one of many reasons where men. Sorry, One of many places where men can contribute positively to this problem is by setting the example and by calling out bad behavior from other men where they see it, not just leaving it to women to look after women.
• 33:14
  Speaker B: Right. Don't be a bystander. It's the. That's always told in Title 9 classes, which was like, you know, sort of the. And if you're going into college, like, you take a Title 9 class that talks about sexual assault, domestic violence, all interpersonal violence, all that kind of stuff, which I believe is gone now because, of course, it teaches you how to not be a bystander, to, especially if you're a man, jump in and be like, what? What? Like this. I need this person to be safe. There's a couple of YouTube videos I've seen where the international symbol for help me. I'm in a. I'm in a, like an abusive situation. I can't really do it because I have weird hands, but it's this. And so if you're walking past somebody, you go like this. That's the signal for I'm in danger. Please help me.
• 34:11
  Speaker C: Yeah, I'll make sure that it shows up in our graphics for this episode or, you know, along with our other resources for domestic violence survivors and people who may be suffering from abusers right now. I didn't want to let the episode finish without paying lip service to the no Kings protest, which was one of the largest single protests in American history. And it was last week and I had the privilege of being able to. To march in Culver City. How was the showing in Seattle? Did you hear about any cool stories or anything like that?
• 34:42
  Speaker B: I heard that there were lots of inflatable things. I heard that there. Yeah, there was a lot of. There's just a lot of hugging. A lot of hugging. And just. I mean, it was pretty cold and I don't know if it rained, but it was. It was the same kind of experience as other major cities. Our governor in particular is pretty. I want to say he's progressive, and so he. I believe he was there and making speeches. Don't quote me on that. But he's, He's a great one. And I'm sure that there were marches in Olympia, a couple of them, I think I've shown you a little video of the, like, the, the little progress line of, like, mainly, like, folks who are in their 60s and 70s on the corner of my. Of, like, the grocery store in the little town that I live on. And they always have signs and they're just always out there all the time being spreading awareness. And a lot of people love that.
• 35:54
  Speaker C: I love that Steve Bannon is saying there's a plan in place for Trump to run for a third term, and that's what they're using the troops for, is to kind of, along with appointing loyalists, you know, to these positions where they're going to be counting votes and everything is that they're going to try to rig it, they're going to try to steal it, and they're going to try to intimidate people into going along with it. And I think things like the no Kings protests are a way of counting heads and of showing just how many of us there are compared to them. And, you know, we're going to, hopefully that energy will build and we'll be able to use that to continue fighting fascism, which is intent on burning us all up. So, yeah, it's positive just to see how many people are out there who really give a shit.