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Who Am I Beyond the Roles I Play? Identity & Change with Jennifer Speciale · Wake Up with Marci

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Proving yourself is almost your own internal map where you're
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: trying to convince the listener. At its root means you
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: on some level have your own doubts rather than pausing
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: and thinking deeply about what it is and realizing that
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: you did achieve those things. There's no sort of false
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: convincing necessary. And I think that it can be challenging
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: because Some of the best people really suffer from imposter
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: syndrome or wondering if the perception of them is accurate.
• 0:35
  Speaker 2: This is Wake Up With Marci, a space for honest
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: conversations about healing, recovery, and women's wellness. I'm Marci Hopkins.
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: Take a breath. You're safe here. Let's begin. Who are
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: we when the title, the company, and the logo are
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: no longer what people see first? So many of us
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: build our identity around what we do, the roles we play,
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: and how others see us. But what happens when that changes?
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: What is different because you are there? Today, we're talking
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: about identity, vulnerability, influence, and what happens when we stop
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: trying to prove ourselves and start recognizing the impact we're really,
• 1:21
  Speaker 2: truly capable of making. If you've ever asked yourself, Who
• 1:26
  Speaker 2: am I now? This conversation is for you. Hello all,
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: I'm Marci Hopkins. Welcome back to Wake Up with Marci.
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: I am your host. I am in long-term recovery. I'm
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: about to celebrate 11 years sobriety. TV host, author, keynote speaker,
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: and a mental health advocate. I'm the author of Wake Up,
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: You're Not Broken, a companion for your first 30 days
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: of sobriety. and the founder of the Wake Up, You're
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: Not Broken workshop, a two-hour program designed to help people
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: in early recovery build a strong foundation for lasting sobriety.
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: Through my seven bricks framework and care method, I help
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: people develop practical tools for triggers, boundaries, nervous system regulation, coping, self-worth,
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: and connection so they can begin a life with recovery
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: that lasts. And I created Wake Up With Marci because
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: I believe honest conversations can change lives. Here we talk
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: about mental health, recovery, women's health, self-discovery, and what it
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: really takes to create a life you don't need to
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: escape from. And today we're talking about something that touches
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: all of us. Who are you when the role you
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: thought defined you changes? If this conversation hits home, please like, comment,
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: and share this episode with someone who may need it.
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: And you can find me, my book, and everything about
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: my workshop at wakeupwithmarci.com. My guest today is Jennifer Special,
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: founder and CEO of Special Executive Leadership. Jennifer spent more
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: than two decades as an executive recruiter and leadership advisor
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: with companies including Google, Indeed.com, McKinsey & Company, and Amazon.
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  Speaker 2: During those years, she noticed something important. Exceptional leaders were
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: sometimes being overlooked, not because they lacked talent, but because
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: no one had taught them how executive leadership was actually
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: perceived and evaluated. That realization eventually led Jennifer to make
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: a major life change herself. She decided she no longer
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: wanted to simply select leaders. She wanted to help develop them. Today,
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: Jennifer helps senior executives and high-performing leaders build great influence,
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: executive presence, and lasting organizational impact. Now let's meet Jennifer. Hello, Jennifer.
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: Welcome to Wake Up with Marci.
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: Thank you. It's great to be here.
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: I love that we finally made it happen. We were
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: just talking about sometimes life gets in the way and
• 4:08
  Speaker 2: you have to make schedule changes and that's okay because
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: life happens, right? It's Part of being human. Right. We're
• 4:16
  Speaker 2: human and we just kind of go with the flow.
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: Yes, definitely.
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  Speaker 2: We can't control everything. But you yourself, you have worked
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: in leadership for so long. And one of the things
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: we're going to talk about is like tying our worth
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: and our identity to our titles. And that's something that
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: I like to talk about a lot. And I know
• 4:41
  Speaker 2: you have created a lot of changes around that, but
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: before you've done the work that you do, what was
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: happening for you before you started the career, right? Before
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  Speaker 2: you did all of these major things and the accolades
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: came to you, who were you before you started work?
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: Before I started work, the funny thing is I don't
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: feel like I was much different than I am now.
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  Speaker 1: Maybe I'm just more educated and even have the insight
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: that I think a lot of people really have these
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: kinds of feelings about questioning what their identity means with
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  Speaker 1: or without the brand and how to sort of get
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: behind that. So, yeah.
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah. But I mean, I think that... we're talking about
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  Speaker 2: the brand and the work and this is what the
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  Speaker 2: work that you do today. But we, we so often
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: feel as we're growing up, right? Maybe we were people
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: pleasers or perfectionist and we're looking for our coaches, our teachers,
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  Speaker 2: our parents to, to give us the accolades or the
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: praise we're looking for to validate us. Right. And so
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  Speaker 2: we're looking for the titles and the titles for when
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: you're younger or straight A's or maybe doing the best
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: on the track team or whatever the case be. We're
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  Speaker 2: always tying our, our, who we are to a title,
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  Speaker 2: if you will.
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  Speaker 1: Right.
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  Speaker 2: To a label. To a label or, or just being
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  Speaker 2: the best. And somehow that's like, we have to be
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: the best and, and have everybody validate us to, to
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  Speaker 2: feel our worth. Right. So, my question is more, did
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: you grow up that way? And did you feel like
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: you were always trying to prove yourself?
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  Speaker 1: I think, yes, if anything, I was definitely very, very
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  Speaker 1: talkative in, in class. I had a lot of trouble
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  Speaker 1: just sitting still and paying attention. And I can remember
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  Speaker 1: when I landed my first recruiting job, um, telling my
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  Speaker 1: mom and anybody who would listen to me that, you know,
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: all those years of bad conduct grades for talking too much.
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  Speaker 1: And now I'm paid to talk to people. I was thinking,
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  Speaker 1: this is perfect.
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  Speaker 2: Yes. Yeah. And I love that because we're all so different.
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  Speaker 1: Right.
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  Speaker 2: And I feel we're kind of confined in the classroom
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  Speaker 2: and to be talkative, to be inquisitive, to be social is,
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  Speaker 2: That's a gift a lot of people don't have. And
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: especially today, there are so many people that are struggling
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: with that, right? With the loneliness and they're behind the
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: computer and they don't know how to be someone that's outgoing.
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: They haven't really learned how to do that. So that
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: was your superpower, right?
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah. It probably could have been reined in a little bit,
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: a little less cape and a little more focus. But
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: when I was at McKinsey, people really, everything was all
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: about your MBTI. Are you an introvert or an extrovert?
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  Speaker 1: And what are your four letters? And it was kind
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: of a brilliant tool because it meant consultants could say,
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: I'm this kind of, I'm ENTJ or whatever. And So
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: many people would describe themselves as I'm a very well-trained I,
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: meaning I'm an introvert, but I can function and I
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: can pretend that I'm an extrovert. And I would say, well,
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: I'm a well-trained E, meaning I had finally learned to
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: like rein it in a little bit.
• 8:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I like that. I think that I'm a well-trained I.
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: I could do both, but I do have to have
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: my quiet and I enjoy my alone time.
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think I do too. I think the older
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: I get, the more my eye comes out a little bit,
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: particularly after a long day with clients. I need that
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: recharge to just decompress everything.
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: Absolutely. So what about yourself? What did you discover? I mean,
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: you had all the titles, right? But what happened for
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: you when the logo came off and you had to
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: stand behind you, your name, yourself? Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: I really felt like a sheared sheep, a really big
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: sheared sheep behind a very small tree. And it was
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: trying to get on board with me being the brand
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  Speaker 1: and what I wanted my brand to be, what I
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: believed in and what I wanted to do. I took
• 9:41
  Speaker 1: an amazing class at Wharton. And one of the first
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: things that we did was develop our leadership principles. And
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: I thought that was such a great concept because they
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  Speaker 1: should be something that don't apply just for work or
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: just for personal. They should be kind of your common denominator.
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  Speaker 1: And so developing those leadership principles was very instructive and
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  Speaker 1: informative and has become a big part of my practice.
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  Speaker 1: I love for people to think about what are their
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  Speaker 1: sort of non-negotiables? What are the things that they stand for?
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  Speaker 1: What are the kinds of behaviors and characteristics do they
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  Speaker 1: want to display and utilize in their own day-to-day?
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  Speaker 2: Yeah. Can you help us a little bit with that?
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: Because I go to a lot of functions and they
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: ask who you are. And the first thing you say is,
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: I'm Marcy Hopkins and I am this, this, this, and that, right?
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  Speaker 2: It's not really like, who are you as a person?
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  Speaker 2: So how can we kind of retrain how we think
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  Speaker 2: about that? And I feel like a lot of people
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  Speaker 2: don't even know.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, I completely agree with that. We're really tied to
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  Speaker 1: the title and to our function, not to how we
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  Speaker 1: live our lives or what we value about our lives
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  Speaker 1: or even what we value about our work. There are
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  Speaker 1: no sort of canned responses for Who are you beyond
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  Speaker 1: your name? At least your name can be that consistent
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  Speaker 1: brand and title. And hopefully you have a name that
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  Speaker 1: works for you. I know I struggled with mine for
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: a lot of years, but I'm finally behind it. I
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  Speaker 1: was not going to change it when I got married.
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  Speaker 1: I'm loyal.
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  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah. I love that. I did. I did change
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  Speaker 2: my name. Um, And, but thankfully I didn't have, I
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: was in the workplace, but I left. So I, it
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: was okay for me to change it. I know that that's,
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  Speaker 2: that's hard, right? If you have built up your name and, and, uh,
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: to then change it and then you have to start
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: all over. Right.
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  Speaker 1: And hyphenating would be very long.
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: Very long, very long. People get confused. So how do
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: we begin separating who we are from those roles and
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: those titles? Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: I like to think about and tell my clients, think
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: about your work, not only in terms of the impact
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: that you delivered, but what is different in your work
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  Speaker 1: because you were there. Certainly you could be in a
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  Speaker 1: room with, you know, two, three, five different people, 10
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: different people that have a similar skillset to you, maybe
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: the same title, maybe the same company, but what is
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: different because you are there and why is the work?
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  Speaker 1: Why was the deliverable? Why was X different? Because it
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: was you. And I sort of set it up to say,
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: you know, if you were hit by a bus and
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: God forbid stuck in the hospital for a month, why
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: would that have gone in a different direction? Why would
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: the deliverable not have been made? Or why would it
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: have had this kind of outcome or over budget or
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: whatever that deliverable is that you're proud of? What was
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: it that really made it unique because of you?
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: I love that you're saying that, but I think it's
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: sometimes hard for someone to look at themselves and figure
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: that out.
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: It's very hard. I think it is as difficult as
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: it is important.
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. So how did they begin to recognize their
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: own impact?
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: You have to think very deeply about the kinds of
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: decisions you made. What kind of judgment did you implement?
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: What kind of trade-offs were you thinking about when you
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: were analyzing what to do in X certain situation? And
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: Realizing that those decisions were made based on your own upbringing, education, experience,
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: life experiences, and how you interpret those and then what
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: you do with that interpretation. Putting all those things together
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: and applying it to your work and thinking about how
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: you want to live your life is, I think it's
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: something that when you come right down to it, your
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: decisions are yours and yours alone. They could be similar
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: to somebody else's, but they won't be identical. You might
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: come together for group think and have the most amazing
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: team in the world. But ultimately if you're interviewing or
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: if you're talking to stakeholders or whatever it is, and
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: you've got to present your work, your results, they want
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: to hear what, what it was that you did. They're not,
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: they're not really thinking about the whole team. Of course,
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: you can pepper in language that references your team because
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: everybody knows there's no way you would have achieved those
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: goals without the team. But at the end of the day,
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: people want to hear what was your unique contribution because
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: they want to extract you or think about you on
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: your own and visualize you in their company or on
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: their project or whatever. Right. you're talking about.
• 15:13
  Speaker 2: So when you have a team, right, I think sometimes
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: it's hard to be in a team and be authentic
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: to yourself. And you shared about some of the greatest
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: breakthroughs are when someone stops trying to prove themselves and
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: start showing up as themselves. So what what does that
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: look like? What is proving yourself look like, especially in
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: a high achieving person?
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: I think proving yourself is almost your own internal map
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: where you're trying to convince the listener, which at its
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: root means you on some level have your own doubts
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: rather than pausing and thinking deeply about what it is
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: and realizing that you did achieve those things. There's no
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: sort of false convincing necessary. And I think that it
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: can be challenging because usually some of the best people
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: really suffer from imposter syndrome who are wondering if the
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: perception of them is accurate. And you have to just
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: make the decision, even if it's not internalized yet, you
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: have to logically make the decision. People decided you were
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: worthy of that role and in that role for a reason.
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: And so you are not an imposter. You're just building
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: up your skillset.
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: I love that you said that because I don't care
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: at what level you are at. I think that we
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: all carry that a little bit, feeling like we have
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: that imposter syndrome, like how am I at this table?
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: I love what you said is that They have decided
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: that you are worthy of being at that table and
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: you need to believe that for yourself. There is a reason.
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: They see it in you.
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: So how do you help people to feel that for themselves?
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  Speaker 1: I think that it can really come across as inauthentic.
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: to just be like, I'm your biggest fan, or that
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: was amazing. You did great. People don't really need platitudes,
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: especially as you get older and evolve in your career.
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: You need to feel the evidence. And so I like
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: for people to create that evidence. Tell me about a
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: time when you did more with less, or tell me
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: about a time that you delivered something on time against
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: all odds or under budget or with a constrained budget.
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: And articulating that story with the very concrete details helps
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: a person to realize they're not bragging. They're not making
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: any of it up. They were there and they indeed
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: did those things. And so it's not bragging at all.
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: It's very matter of fact. It's logical. You did those
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: things and you need to articulate those things. And I
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: think something that can really help in that effort is
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: making sure that your story is not compressed because far
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: too often people sort of wrongly assume that the listener
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: is impatient and waiting for the result. But actually people
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: want to hear all of the good, bad, and ugly
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: in the in-between, how it started, not just the rainbow,
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: not just the pot of gold at the end of
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: the rainbow, but all of those steps in between what
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: it took and what it took from you, what you
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: knew about yourself. I have clients from a lot of
• 19:02
  Speaker 1: different countries and different cultural backgrounds. Sometimes they struggle with
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: respect or old ways of being raised that you always
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: respect authority. All of those things go into your ingredients
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: and create who you are. And I don't want that
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: to hold people back, but rather see that as a strength. Again,
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: it's part of your unique composition.
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: It's so true. I mean, we're programmed, right? We really are.
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: By who our upbringing, what we've been told, what we
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: haven't been told, the expectations, whatever it is, right? Whatever
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: your upbringing, was with your family unit, your culture, whatever
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: it may be, society. And so as you get older,
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: you get to make that choice what it is that
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: you continue to believe or don't. and I realized it's
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: not that easy, but thankfully we do get a choice
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: as to what we believe. And we can, if it's
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: something that's deep inside of us, like you're talking about,
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: like respecting authority, but maybe just reframing that if it's
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: still important for you to, that's the, you know, something
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: that's important to you. And yeah, changing our story and
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: our identity, we don't have to be tied to our
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: past and what we've been told. And that's one of
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: the things that I really like to talk about because
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: it's not easy to do. It's not easy to do.
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: So one of the things that I talk about and
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: you have shared about already in our conversation is about
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: being authentic. I think it's hard to be authentic and
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: I think it's hard, like you're saying, like feeling like
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: you're bragging. I know that I thankfully, I didn't used
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: to be who I am today. I used to think
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: very little of myself and I used to be a
• 21:19
  Speaker 2: people pleaser and I used to feel like I would
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: do nothing in my life. And I guess of worth, really,
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: whatever worth I thought. But now I've turned my story around.
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: I've built a brand. I'm doing things to help other people.
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: And I am being rewarded. But I will tell you,
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: a lot of times you stay small because you feel
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: bad in some way, like you are bragging.
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So it's like, I know you've talked about a
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: little bit, but even for me, like if I'm up
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: on a stage, sometimes I'll tailor it down because I
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: don't want people to think I'm bragging.
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Interesting.
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, how can I change that?
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think, you know, again, look to your own
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: experiences and the details of those for the evidence. You
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: don't have to brag. You are stating facts. You've built
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: a brand. The fact that the brand is successful and well-known,
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: those are also facts. You know, the numbers don't lie.
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: If you have to always resort to metrics... And stating
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: those facts and being proud of it and seeing it
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: for what it is, is a part of just owning that.
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: And like you said, it's hard to untie yourself from
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: your past. I think, I don't know how you do that.
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: So I try to rather than somehow untie from the past,
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: except the past, see it as one of your ingredients.
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: Maybe it's not serving you anymore. Maybe it's not adaptive anymore.
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: maybe you had to stay small in certain environments. Maybe
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: you weren't surrounded by people that let you be big
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: and have your full wingspan. Well, that doesn't work for
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: you anymore. Now you're on the stage. You have a
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: lot of things to say, a lot of things to share.
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: And if it helps to sort of intellectualize it and say, well,
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: these are facts, then so be it. Whatever it takes
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: for you to to, to own it and to own
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: it proudly because you have evolved and part of your background, good, bad,
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: or ugly is, has gone into how you are today
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: and has maybe probably made you more empathetic and better
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: in your own right and, and built a better brand
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: than the next person. Yeah.
• 23:51
  Speaker 2: It's, it is a constant. And one of the things
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: that I love and I love to talk about is
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: vulnerability was getting vulnerable for yourself. Was that hard?
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: Yes, of course. Nobody likes to stand, you know, feeling
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: like you're naked in front of whomever, anyone, even just yourself.
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: How do you think about yourself and how do you
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: start to, um, create a sort of talk track? How
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: do you, um, make sure that your new identity aligns
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: with maybe old identities and, and put it all together
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: in a way that works for you now and helps
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: you to achieve your goals now.
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: So tell us how you're helping others to, to build
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: their brands and to not tie themselves to other companies necessarily.
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's I have a, I have a number of
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: clients coming out of Google and, you know, Google is,
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: a big, well-known brand. And how do you do anything
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: without that behind you? I think that it is important
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: to recognize what the significance of having been at Google means.
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: You've had a certain kind of training. You've had a
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: certain kind of exposure. You've had to survive in a
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: very difficult, very regimented, very curated kind of environment. And
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: to do all of those things is not easy. So
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: to extract yourself from those things, it's a good exercise
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: to realize there are things that you've learned that you
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: want to do more of those things and things that
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: you learned and you want to leave behind. But that
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: combination is building your brand and starting to go deep
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: on what your values are. And it's okay to leave
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: some things behind, even if they're amazing and they work
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: for Google or whatever. it may not work for you
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: and for your brand. You learned those things and you
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: are now very informed about how you want to take
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: the next step for yourself. So feeling very grounded and justified.
• 26:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So how do you even start building a brand?
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: How do you guide someone to even start Because that's
• 26:16
  Speaker 2: a lot on its own, right? Like, what's my message?
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: What is my brand? Who am I? What do I
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: want to teach the world? Yeah.
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: Well, you probably know better than I am. You're a
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: little bit longer in your business than I am. I'm
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: still growing too.
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you're helping so many. And it's so important because
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: I think, especially now, I feel like so many people
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: are becoming entrepreneurs or going on their own or recognizing
• 26:43
  Speaker 2: that I don't need to be with Google or the
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: big brands. I can do this on my own, especially
• 26:51
  Speaker 2: as we get older and we come into our own.
• 26:55
  Speaker 2: But how do we do it?
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: I think really crafting the kind of message that you
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: want to share, making sure the message is really, truly
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: an extension of yourself and the kind of work you
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: want to do going forward. And then understanding what aspect
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: of all of your learnings you want to go deep on.
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: And I think it's important too that whatever brand you
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: come right out the door with doesn't necessarily mean that's
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: the same brand you'll have in six months or a year.
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: It can be a living brand. Maybe it should be
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: a living brand. There's no reasons to put boundaries around yourself.
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: You could have boundaries around yourself at a big, big company.
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: where they're very happy to put boundaries around you. So
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: be a little bit fearless and very much trust yourself
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: in building that message. And then like you said, use
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: the environment, use the market to prototype your brand. How
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: are different concepts received? How is it received from you
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: with that background?
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: How is it.
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: Received based on your education or lack of education or whatever,
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: how do all of those things feed into you being
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: the best person for whatever it is you're trying to accomplish?
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And you said it and it's so true. We
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: are ever evolving. So where I started is certainly not
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: where I am today. I do not have the same messaging.
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: I'm not doing the same thing. I'm still true to
• 28:37
  Speaker 2: my brand. But I'm very much like if I released
• 28:44
  Speaker 2: a book and now that's changing the narrative and what
• 28:47
  Speaker 2: I'm sharing, right? With the audience. So just to be
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: open with that, but always stay anchored to your why.
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: I think that's very, very important and to be authentic
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: to that. And I think people.
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: Struggle to find the why too. Finding the why is
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: very difficult. Yeah. And the why may fluctuate.
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah. That definitely could change. Absolutely. But I think, I
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: think that just, and you've talked about it, it's just
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: like really owning what you have to share with the world.
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: People, we're all going through very similar things. Actually, there's
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: always a group of people that are going through the same.
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: And if you've gone through something or you, have knowledge.
• 29:40
  Speaker 2: of something and you can help someone, people need that.
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: People need your knowledge and education to be shared. And
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: it's just recognizing what, like you say, and your why
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: and what that is. And that took me a minute too.
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: And I think in that sharing, it becomes its own
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: virtuous cycle because you get something from sharing, even if
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: it's just appreciation or somebody's very obvious, you know, thankfully
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: I'm not the only person on the planet feeling this.
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: It's that spreading of knowledge and information that we are
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: all human. Every day is not perfect. And, um, And
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: so there is its own benefit in sharing the message
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: and realizing the benefit and the humility of it. I
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: had a professor, an undergraduate who said his favorite characteristic
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: of intelligence was humility, the ability to admit you don't
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: know everything. And I've always carried that. I think it's
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: so valuable. It's kind of the difference between the person
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: who stops wearing a helmet on a motorcycle, that's the
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: moment that something bad could go wrong. You've got to
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: admit that there are things out of your control and
• 31:01
  Speaker 1: mistakes could happen that, you know, you could be the
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: best motorcycle driver on the planet, but you know, somebody
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: could hit you that you didn't happen to see. So
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: always having that humility to feed your intuition and also
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: your curiosity. Yeah.
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I love that curiosity, right? I mean, being curious
• 31:24
  Speaker 2: and creative, like that changes the world. And I just
• 31:27
  Speaker 2: want to say the best motorcycle rider out there is
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: always wearing a helmet. You know what I mean? Like,
• 31:35
  Speaker 2: so follow the leader. But with that, you, you help
• 31:41
  Speaker 2: leaders that are developing something and we hear it a
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: lot and that's executive presence. What is that exactly?
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: I feel like it's the big mystery of the universe.
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: And more and more, I'm referring to it as executive storytelling,
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: because I think some people inadvertently assume executive presence means
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: how loud you are, how much you're talking, what you're wearing,
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: how you walk, all of these sort of external loud indicators.
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: But there are so many amazing leaders that are strong eyes.
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: And they are not loud or saying the most or
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: wearing the flashiest, whatever. And so I feel like a
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: more accurate, less sort of mystical way of thinking about
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: executive presence is executive storytelling. What kind of details do
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: you articulate? What kind of information do you exclude, which
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: can be often just as important as what you include?
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: And how do you articulate your contribution in that? Which again,
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: gets us back to not wanting to blow your own horn,
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: but think about it logically. And so I think executive
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: storytelling kind of helps people to unlock what they want
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: to do. I have a new client and she had
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: a coach for a little while who told her, you
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: need to be more aggressive. You have to be more
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: assertive with this. this client was not aggressive or assertive
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: in any way. She probably did need those things, but
• 33:19
  Speaker 1: that advice can really fall flat. Because again, how do
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: you define that? What you consider aggressive, a New Yorker
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: might consider like just completely matter of fact, not aggressive
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: in the least. So helping a person to unlock what
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: it is they need to do. And I try to
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: really extract people's stories from them in a sense, almost
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: making them tell me what it is that makes them
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: good at what they do. And then of course, really
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: refine the details that they insert. And I think that
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: is the essence of executive storytelling, staying true to yourself
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: and not being something different, not being too aggressive because
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: what happened to her at that time, she started to alienate.
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: She had you know, super political environment, very difficult stakeholders
• 34:15
  Speaker 1: and leadership, but her team loved her. But with her
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: flip and her, in her way of doing things, she
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: started to alienate her team and was not increasing her
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: effectiveness with leadership and her peers. So when we flipped
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: that around and started to go deep on what her
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: style was, which was more introverted, more, a little bit quieter,
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: not necessarily softer or weaker, just true to herself and
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: start to build the stories in that way.
• 34:48
  Speaker 2: It, it helped.
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: It had that, that cyclical effect of, you know, I'm
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: not bragging at all. I know my facts and I
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: know what needs to be done. And so that can
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: really help you to, to accomplish your goals.
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I love that. It's a really about the, the
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: storytelling and what you put out there. And I say,
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: be careful of the quietest person in the room.
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly.
• 35:17
  Speaker 2: You hear that so often.
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: The one who's not just going on and on.
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. Because they're really the ones taking everything in.
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: And then they say something when it really needs to
• 35:28
  Speaker 2: be said.
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: Right. Or ask the most amazing question that unlocks everything else.
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: Exactly. Exactly. And I like that because- Sometimes in working
• 35:41
  Speaker 2: with someone, this really helps because the questions that are
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: asked of the person that needs the support and the
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: help may unlock something that they don't even know that
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: is there, right? And that's exactly what the support that
• 35:57
  Speaker 2: you're offering is. We're just going to take a quick moment.
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: I'm going to share about my new book, Wake Up,
• 36:03
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• 36:06
  Speaker 2: who's ready to stop drinking and taking their life back
• 36:10
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• 36:16
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• 36:19
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• 36:22
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• 36:37
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• 36:42
  Speaker 2: You're not broken. You're waking up.
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: Hello, all.
• 36:46
  Speaker 2: Welcome back. I'm talking with Jennifer Special about identity, leadership, influence,
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: and what happens when we stop trying to prove ourselves.
• 36:55
  Speaker 2: And begin recognizing the impact we're actually capable of making.
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: And we were just talking about getting vulnerable and sharing
• 37:05
  Speaker 2: our story, developing our story. And you keep saying this
• 37:10
  Speaker 2: is that it's facts. When things that we're saying about
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: ourselves are facts and we're not boasting about ourselves. And remember,
• 37:21
  Speaker 2: it's how we say it too, right?
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 37:24
  Speaker 2: Because it could be boasting. But yeah, it is in
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: how we say it. This is a fact about me.
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: That's part of the storytelling. And I find that it
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: is so common for people to just compress all of
• 37:40
  Speaker 1: those amazing leadership moments. And so I'll start with clients
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: by having them just tell me about a specific moment
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: in time. It doesn't matter if it was like last
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: week or 10 years ago. Tell me about a specific
• 37:54
  Speaker 1: moment in time that they're very proud of and they know,
• 37:59
  Speaker 1: despite them not wanting to admit it at first, they
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: know that the results were different because of their work
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: and because of their contribution. And when they go through
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: that storytelling informally, there are so many very clear stories
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: that have been buried. And so we work to decompress
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: those stories because it's really important. For example, with design leaders,
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: it's so common that when they start on something, it's
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: hard for them to talk about the metrics because there
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: was no design research. Well, that becomes the story, articulating
• 38:36
  Speaker 1: the fact that they needed all that data and it
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: didn't even exist. Then your story is, what did you
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: do after that? Did you just panic? Did you badmouth
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: the organization or leadership? Or did you put a team
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: together or find a way to do research on your own? Like,
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: what did you do? How did you deal with that?
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: and understanding how you cope with those kinds of things.
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: Tell your listeners how you'll cope with other difficult things
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: and how you'll lead people through difficult moments and be
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: the calm in the storm and still accomplish what needs
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: to be done.
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: Be the calm in the storm. That's what we need.
• 39:15
  Speaker 2: So how can someone become more confident And what makes
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: someone more influential in the room?
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: I think helping somebody to be more confident. I try
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: to start with an experience. sense, and of course I
• 39:31
  Speaker 1: don't say this, but in a sense, fake it till
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: you make it. You know, be aware of how you're sitting,
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: be aware of where you're sitting. If it's on Zoom, that's,
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: you know, a little bit of a democratizer, but be
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: aware of those things that have given you feedback. And
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: come prepared. I'm a huge fan of an agenda. My
• 39:54
  Speaker 1: clients know I love a good agenda. With a well-crafted agenda,
• 39:59
  Speaker 1: you know exactly the direction you want to go. You
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: know exactly what questions you need answers to. You know
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: what information you need to leave a meeting with. And
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: having that level of preparedness almost distracts you from being
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: nervous or not being as confident as you wish you were.
• 40:18
  Speaker 1: You have a mission. And you know, you want to
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: accomplish that mission. And so be prepared. Some people love
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: to wing it and that's great too. But usually if
• 40:29
  Speaker 1: you've got to really push yourself forward and do something,
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: it starts with some of that internal framework.
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: Oh my God, Jennifer, you said exactly what I think.
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: You got to be prepared. It changes everything in the room.
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I totally agree. I totally agree.
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: I was recently talking with someone and there's some people
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: that get up on stage, right? And they just wing it.
• 40:55
  Speaker 2: And you know what? If you're good at that, fantastic.
• 40:58
  Speaker 1: Good for you.
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: Right? But reality is you're not really winging it because
• 41:04
  Speaker 2: you already have a framework and you have a way
• 41:06
  Speaker 2: that you're speaking in a formula, right? So it's really
• 41:09
  Speaker 2: not winging it.
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 41:10
  Speaker 2: But I know for me, I mean, I show up
• 41:14
  Speaker 2: very differently when I am prepared and I feel confident
• 41:18
  Speaker 2: in what I am going to do, right? Because even
• 41:23
  Speaker 2: if I don't do exactly how I prepared, at least
• 41:27
  Speaker 2: I'm prepared and it may change and that's okay. But
• 41:32
  Speaker 2: I think being prepared is really very, very important and
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: doing the research. And if you don't understand something, You
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: don't have to know it all. Get someone that's better
• 41:45
  Speaker 2: than you at a specific thing and lean on them.
• 41:49
  Speaker 2: Or like you've said, educate yourself, you know, do the
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: research about it because nowadays it is so easy to do. Yeah.
• 41:58
  Speaker 1: I think also I love to tell people like, don't
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: be afraid to ask questions. There's no reason you should
• 42:05
  Speaker 1: know everything. And in fact, asking questions is a sign
• 42:10
  Speaker 1: of intelligence. to just sit back and take in information
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: may not be the best sign of intelligence or sign
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: of preparedness. Whereas if you have prepared and you know
• 42:22
  Speaker 1: certain things, or even if you haven't prepared, but you
• 42:25
  Speaker 1: still know certain things, think about what is happening and
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: what the problem is or whatever the situation is, and
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: be very confident in yourself to ask clarifying questions. And
• 42:38
  Speaker 1: sometimes it is through those questions that you really develop
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: the confidence because you'll see people's reaction like, that's a
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: really good question. I hadn't seen it from that point
• 42:47
  Speaker 1: of view, which helps bring you back to your own
• 42:51
  Speaker 1: personal expertise, whatever that is. And a direct continuation of
• 42:57
  Speaker 1: that is I love to constantly tell people, be unapologetic.
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: As far as we know, we're on this planet once.
• 43:07
  Speaker 1: There's no reason to apologize in any way for who
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: you are or what you've done or what you haven't
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: done or what you may not know. Be very confident
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: to answer a question with a question. Try to narrow
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: in on the scope. If the question is asked and
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: you have no answers in your mind, it might be
• 43:28
  Speaker 1: because it's a terrible question and has nothing to do
• 43:31
  Speaker 1: with you.
• 43:34
  Speaker 2: And also sometimes I just got to expand on a
• 43:37
  Speaker 2: few things. Sometimes if I don't know the answer or
• 43:41
  Speaker 2: I haven't done something, I just put it back on
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: the person and it just continues the conversation.
• 43:48
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 43:49
  Speaker 2: And I just think that a lot of times we
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: are afraid to ask the question because way back when,
• 43:56
  Speaker 2: when we were in school, we were made to feel stupid, right.
• 43:59
  Speaker 2: To ask a question. And so that kind of stays
• 44:02
  Speaker 2: with us, but yeah. I agree that, well, I was
• 44:08
  Speaker 2: going to say there's no stupid question. And I really
• 44:10
  Speaker 2: do get behind it. If you have a question about
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: something and you need the answer, then that's something that
• 44:17
  Speaker 2: you need. And there's nothing wrong with that at all.
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: I totally agree.
• 44:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: And it could be because somebody's forgotten to mention it
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: or left it out, or they in fact don't have
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: the answer themselves. Maybe they were trying to hide behind
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: the fact that they didn't have those answers.
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: But when my clients are, if they're looking for a
• 44:38
  Speaker 1: new role and they're interviewing, I talk all the time
• 44:41
  Speaker 1: about that horrible question, tell me about yourself.
• 44:44
  Speaker 2: Oh God, that was so bad.
• 44:46
  Speaker 1: Ridiculous question. And I like to say, I think that
• 44:50
  Speaker 1: is a lack of interviewer training through maybe no fault
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: of their own. Maybe they're uncomfortable themselves. Maybe they aren't prepared.
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: Maybe they have no idea. They didn't look at your
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: resume or your LinkedIn profile. Whatever it is, feel free
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: to answer that question with a follow-up question. What aspect
• 45:12
  Speaker 1: of me would you like to know? I usually make
• 45:15
  Speaker 1: a joke like, I'm super old. That could go in
• 45:18
  Speaker 1: a lot of different directions.
• 45:19
  Speaker 2: What would you like to hear? Right? Love that. I
• 45:23
  Speaker 2: love that so much. So tell us, you have special
• 45:29
  Speaker 2: executive leadership. That's something you've created and you're helping other
• 45:33
  Speaker 2: executives and helping people to build the brand. Tell us
• 45:37
  Speaker 2: exactly who you're working with and how we can find you.
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: You can always find me on LinkedIn. I also have
• 45:44
  Speaker 1: a website, jenniferspecial.com, justmyname.com. And I work with a lot
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: of different leaders. I'm pretty much industry agnostic. Of course,
• 45:55
  Speaker 1: I have a specialization in technology and experience design or
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: product experience design. The name is evolving. But I have
• 46:05
  Speaker 1: clients that are in sales or I had a client
• 46:09
  Speaker 1: that was a lawyer recently. Lots and lots of different backgrounds.
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: And like you said, all of these amazing people have
• 46:16
  Speaker 1: that common thread of trying to figure it out. And
• 46:19
  Speaker 1: so these kinds of things we've talked about, the frameworks,
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: They are industry and in many cases, role agnostic. The
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: common denominator is that we're all human. So trying to
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: make it work and trying to create that thread helps
• 46:36
  Speaker 1: people to get over to the next level.
• 46:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Jennifer, thank you so much for coming on Wake Up.
• 46:43
  Speaker 2: It's been an amazing conversation and just love what you're doing.
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much.
• 46:49
  Speaker 2: Thank you. And for all of you out there, I mean,
• 46:53
  Speaker 2: you do not have to have everything figured out. There
• 46:56
  Speaker 2: are people all around you like Jennifer Special that's helping.
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: And you just need to find that courage. And just
• 47:05
  Speaker 2: even if you have a little glimmer of courage, it
• 47:07
  Speaker 2: helps you to take that next step. It's just about starting.
• 47:11
  Speaker 2: And remember, you are not broken. You're beginning. And please,
• 47:17
  Speaker 2: if this resonated with you, please like. share, let's create
• 47:21
  Speaker 2: a ripple effect to help others because you don't know
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: who out there needs to hear this message. So this
• 47:28
  Speaker 2: is Wake Up With Marci. I'm Marci Hopkins. Thank you
• 47:31
  Speaker 2: again for being here and I'll see you next Thursday.