Latest / The Fourcast / Russia’s ambassador: what Putin really wants from Trump’s peace deal

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Russia’s ambassador: what Putin really wants from Trump’s peace deal · The Fourcast

0:00
At the moment we have to talk about surrender because Keef
0:03
should think not about the deal. So you're saying it should be a
0:06
surrender? It should be definitely.
0:08
That is not the basis for peace talks is.
0:09
It but there is no balance for the.
0:11
Field you think you're winning? We are in the winning situation,
0:13
definitely. Europe is also now talking about
0:16
seizing Russian assets and giving them effectively to
0:19
Ukraine to use. What Europe is suggesting is
0:23
absolutely illegal. It is simply stealing.
0:26
They will say you steal land, will steal your money.
0:28
We will see you there also in the course in London.
0:36
Hello and welcome to a special edition of the Forecast.
0:38
We are in the residence of the Russian ambassador to the United
0:43
Kingdom today here with Ambassador Andrei Kellin.
0:46
It is obviously an important time in the talks over a
0:51
possible peace in Ukraine. Donald Trump says he has a plan
0:54
that he says Russia is fine with, but there have obviously
0:57
been intense talks in Europe as well.
1:00
And we've also seen what Trump's new national security strategy
1:04
might mean for Europe. So there is lots to talk about.
1:07
Ambassador, thank you for having us.
1:09
So Donald Trump says Russia is fine with his peace plan.
1:13
Is that true? I haven't seen the peace plan.
1:17
That is not true to presuppose that it is in the papers, in the
1:22
newspapers, but I can't imagine several parts of it, because it
1:25
is understandable for us. So this is not about a simple
1:29
ceasefire. It should be a comprehensive
1:32
long term solution for everything.
1:33
It is not for only Ukraine. Security guarantees should be
1:37
given to Russia as well. Security guarantees should be
1:40
given to all European countries over over here.
1:45
It is an issue of NATO, of course, should be resolved once
1:48
and forever. We should think about also how
1:51
to reconstruction of Ukraine probably and the change of of
1:56
it. So it's a lot of papers and
1:59
should be done and a lot of commitments should be done in
2:02
it. It it needs a work of
2:04
professionals of course to to formulate it legally as as a
2:09
document I mean. You have always said you want a
2:11
comprehensive plan, but Trump is clearly impatient and he wants
2:15
some progress quickly. Now, there was a 28 point plan.
2:18
I don't know whether you know what was in it.
2:19
And then there was a new version that he talked about last week.
2:23
What do you understand his plan to be?
2:26
His plan to be definitely it should not be a deal.
2:31
We at the moment we have to talk about surrender because Kiev
2:35
should think not about the deal, but definitely it the situation
2:39
on the ground, situation in economics of Ukraine, situation
2:43
in Europe where there is no more money, spare money for Ukraine.
2:48
They put Kiev in condition when they have to think how to save
2:53
the state, not to be a failed. You're saying it should be a
2:57
surrender? It should be definitely certain.
3:00
Surrender. I mean that that is not the
3:01
basis for peace talks, is it? Peace talks have to be about a
3:04
deal and a compromise, not a surrender.
3:07
Nobody wants to surrender. No, the issue of talks, talks
3:13
probably. I'm not sure what about
3:15
Europeans, they're talking about a deal, but a deal is a
3:19
different thing. A deal when there is a certain
3:22
balance balance of on the on the field, but there is no balance
3:26
on the field. You think you're winning?
3:27
There is a winning, we are in the winning situation definitely
3:31
because the front line is moving very quickly, very.
3:34
Quickly. I mean very quickly is a big
3:36
claim, isn't it? It's actually moved very slowly
3:38
over 4 years. It is in your newspapers.
3:41
But in fact what is happening is that it is becoming quicker and
3:45
quicker. We have during the autumn we
3:48
have liberated 87 settlements. At the moment there is a
3:53
cauldron in Mirangrat where is the thousands of UK troops,
3:58
elite united Ukraine troops, elite troops as have been
4:02
surrounded. We have a situation of cauldrons
4:05
nearly formed in three or four areas along the front line.
4:09
So this is an issue. We are moving to Scramatursk
4:12
because Seversk is fallen down, nearly fallen down.
4:15
Nova Pavlovka is nearly falling down.
4:18
Gullaipoli is very famous. I will say on Ukrainian map in
4:22
in early 20s it is nearly four. No, I wouldn't say it has fallen
4:26
down, but it is. It is now being attacked and
4:29
surrendered, which nobody is expected to be.
4:31
So this is moving quicker and quicker.
4:34
So. So Trump's talking nonsense then
4:37
if he says Russia's fine with a deal?
4:39
I mean, you're sounding like you're you're nowhere near a
4:41
deal. Expectations, of course, to have
4:44
it as quick as possible and I wouldn't say that we are alien
4:47
to this expectation because we would like to finish it by
4:50
diplomatic efforts and also as quick as possible, but of
4:53
course, it will be on our terms. Right.
4:56
Well, what are your terms? Terms has been laid down by by
5:00
President a year ago and we we do not change our positions.
5:03
It is, it is will know and simply do not what repeat what
5:06
has been said many times. So I mean that, but that that's
5:08
interesting, isn't it, that you, you have been consistent in your
5:11
message and you're saying Russia's position has not
5:14
changed and will not change. Will not change, no.
5:17
So you'll fight for as long as you need to.
5:19
Yes. Well, I can state absolutely
5:22
clearly that we have laid out our position in the very
5:26
beginning of the conflict, then later on has repeated and I I
5:30
don't see any deviation from what has been said.
5:33
I mean, is that why Russia seems to be stepping up what the
5:37
British government regards increasingly as hybrid war in
5:41
Europe? Well, British government London
5:44
is very experienced in hybrid war.
5:48
I can remember Zeno if later in early 20s when they have first
5:52
of all invented this hybrid war and and there are repeated
5:56
issues concerning that so. You accept it's going on others.
5:59
Are only learning from London how to do it.
6:02
So right, but you're, you're accepting them that there is a
6:04
hybrid war effectively between. Well, Europe, there is no
6:08
definition. By the way, what is it and?
6:10
Well, they they say it's about flights, it's about boats, it's
6:14
about the spy boats off the northern coast, it's about
6:18
submarines. We can say absolutely the same
6:21
about European efforts, about British air.
6:23
I'm sure you can, but you're accepting that it happens.
6:26
No, it happens that everybody is doing what it is.
6:29
So the hybrid war which is waged against Russia is very active.
6:34
It is just we have given an official note about the issue of
6:38
Aeroflot that has been attacked from the cyber company here in
6:42
United Kingdom. This is an official note because
6:45
we traced it. I think you're also under cyber
6:47
attack. Absolutely right.
6:48
So. So in that case, you must accept
6:50
that you're also doing it to us. Differently from Brits,
6:53
differently from London. Because it doesn't give us any
6:56
official grounds, any official basis for this.
7:00
We have sent this note with absolutely tracing it.
7:04
How it is happened is. This what you told the foreign
7:06
Secretary? I didn't talk with the foreign
7:08
secretary. I I did talk with first deputy
7:11
of it. Yes, we have exactly talked
7:13
about that so. So in that case, if you say
7:15
Russia is under attack in a, in a, in a hybrid war in terms of
7:20
surveillance and cyber, you're doing it to us as well, aren't
7:25
you? I do not know.
7:27
Simply, this is not my cup of tea I'm doing.
7:30
Well, you're very sure of one side, but not sure of your own
7:33
side. What I'm doing here is a
7:35
representing Russia, representing our public policy
7:39
views and I have now and in the other occasions just to lay it
7:43
out what what we are doing and how we're doing.
7:45
But if you're representing Russia, then you can also say
7:47
what Russia is doing. You know, you're very keen to
7:49
say what Britain is doing when you you don't actually know the
7:53
detail of that. I'm just asking you, what's
7:55
Russia doing? Krishnan, we are talking about
7:58
conflict in Ukraine. I just lead it out.
8:00
The situation on the ground in Ukraine, Ukraine has and you ask
8:04
me why? Because Ukraine has no more
8:06
manpower, they have no more reserves.
8:09
That's the main question. You also have that problem in
8:11
Russia. It's it is important.
8:13
We have huge reserves and manpower.
8:15
We are many times bigger than Ukraine.
8:17
And why are you sending African imported labour to the to the
8:21
front? This is nonsense.
8:23
I haven't seen any substance for reports about Africans.
8:27
And North Koreans. North Koreans, they volunteer to
8:30
do this. They would like to get some
8:31
experience. Now it looks like they're
8:34
they're helping us in demining they're helping us in the
8:37
reconstruction of the devastated terms which has been already
8:44
liberated. But their mission is a combat
8:47
mission in ranked in liberation of area occupied by When it is
8:53
accomplished and they return back I.
8:55
Mean the estimates are that up to 1,000,000 people have been
8:59
affected in Russia, either in terms of injuries or, or, or
9:04
deaths. I mean, that's an enormous cost,
9:07
isn't it, for Russia? Well, all these figures, they
9:10
have been taken from the ceiling, but there is an
9:12
official figure which has been agreed between Russia and
9:16
Ukraine. We have had an exchange of
9:19
bodies recently, in recent three months.
9:22
So we have given and returned to Ukrainians 9000 bodies and we
9:28
got in return 143. That is all it is.
9:32
It is simply a saying by itself. Are you are you claiming the
9:36
Russian deaths are in the hundreds?
9:37
Ciphers are simply saying themselves how it works.
9:42
All the rest, all the rest is all the rest is absolutely
9:45
nonsense. And I, I am not going to
9:46
speculate on this. What are the losses of Ukrainian
9:50
side? What are the losses of the?
9:51
Russian people know, don't they, that that hundreds of thousands
9:54
of families that have been affected by.
9:56
The Christian Probably you have another question.
9:58
Then yeah, of course. But I mean, well, I mean.
10:01
Beyond these things. That you don't.
10:02
Want to ignore beyond this discussion which which makes no
10:05
sense because there is no knowledge.
10:07
Of I'm asking you to acknowledge the impact on the Russian people
10:10
of this war, a war you didn't even want to call a war for the
10:14
last four years. Well, it does.
10:16
This is not a question about the name of what is happening.
10:20
This is a conflict, what we are doing, We are trying to save
10:23
people. We are trying to save Russian
10:25
people, Russian speaking people in these territories from
10:28
oppression or suppression, from the, the human rights are
10:34
important to us. And actually, you know that they
10:37
have prohibited even the Orthodox Church over there,
10:40
which is they are prohibiting to talk in Russian language, which
10:44
is absolutely unthinkable in any.
10:47
Banning the Russian language, full stop.
10:51
Don't interrupt well. There's not, there's not a total
10:53
ban on speaking Russian. Oh, there is a ban and ban in
10:58
the last decree by their home era that this is a Parliament in
11:01
Ukraine, that it is will not be protected that was before the
11:05
day before yesterday, that it will not be protected by the
11:08
Council of Europe, by the Council of of Europe treaty
11:14
about regional languages. Now, you say this is not about a
11:18
ceasefire and it's not about a deal.
11:20
If Zelensky were to say ceasefire and I'll call
11:24
elections, he's saying he's prepared to hold elections.
11:28
Is yes. I mean, is that something Russia
11:31
would consider? Because you want you want him
11:33
out and you believe he would lose an election.
11:36
So if there's an opportunity for an election, is that something
11:39
Russia would consider having a ceasefire for?
11:43
There are very many questions about this statement, how
11:46
serious it is. It is just first pronunciation
11:49
about the necessity hold elections, which has been done
11:51
definitely under impressions of what Trump has said yesterday in
11:55
and he's talking to the interviewer.
11:58
What we can say is that under the current law of Ukraine and
12:03
other constitution, it is only the Hovner rather the parliament
12:07
who can continue to exist under martial law.
12:11
But a presidential elections should have been happened a year
12:15
and a half ago. So at the moment he is illegal
12:18
and we are not very eager to go into the agreement or a treaty
12:23
with a person who is going, who is illegal is who is going to
12:27
sign it. We can negotiate with him, but
12:30
the person who is going to send it should be absolutely legal
12:34
and has the support of of of people in his country.
12:38
Otherwise the other one will come and say, well if this is
12:40
nonsense, I didn't send it. Europe is also now talking about
12:45
making rapid progress on seizing Russian assets and giving them
12:49
effectively to Ukraine to use. Now.
12:52
This has been, you know, held in in in a freeze for years.
12:56
They're now talking about actually using that money.
12:59
What? What would you know?
13:00
How important is that in the negotiation?
13:05
Well, first of all, I don't think that we will introduce
13:08
this issue in the negotiations because what Europe is
13:11
suggesting, and it is only European Commission is
13:14
suggesting is absolutely illegal.
13:16
And under domestic law, international law, whatever it
13:19
is, it is simply stealing money. Even during the Second World
13:23
War, there is no use of money of Nazi Germany, which has been in
13:30
the banks over the year. But this is will be a first
13:32
example. Of course it it, it will bring a
13:36
consequences for those who has who, if they will decide to do
13:41
this, it will be very serious consequences.
13:44
Well, we have also assets in Russia, British assets, Belgian
13:49
assets, others as well. So what what they are going to
13:53
do is a step which will be which has will have very serious
13:59
because the current leaders, they do not think about the
14:01
future. They would like to win it today,
14:04
to do something today. But they have absence of
14:06
strategic perspective and they say well, tomorrow we will be
14:09
probably it is this President, President of France, President
14:14
of Germany. They think about how to handle
14:18
it at the moment, but they have to think about a year after.
14:21
And that will come you, you believe me, this will come.
14:25
We are we in Moscow. We are preparing an answer to
14:28
this. If ever it is going to happen,
14:31
then it we are not disclosed what we are going to do.
14:34
But since the very beginning of the conflict, I think that the
14:38
answer has been was being prepared in the preparation.
14:41
But isn't there more Russian cash in Britain than there is
14:46
British cash in Russia? I mean, does Britain have
14:48
anything much to fear from retaliation?
14:51
We do not reveal it, but I'm sure because during well, dozens
14:56
of years that we, we have had British investors, we have had
15:00
Belgian investors, we have had French investors, German
15:03
investors. And I'm sure that we, I, I
15:07
cannot, I do not think about anything in particular, but I
15:10
can imagine how many efforts has been done during that time.
15:14
And and you don't think that would be part of the peace
15:17
negotiation to get the money back I.
15:19
Do not know, I do not know. There are different ideas on
15:23
American says how to to make how to make it I simply at the
15:27
moment I have no idea I. Mean the the answer, I suppose,
15:30
when you talk about international law is, well,
15:33
that's a bit rich given you're breaking international law in
15:36
Ukraine. You know they will say you steal
15:39
land, we'll steal your money. We will see you there also in
15:44
the course in London, those people and it will be very long
15:47
time. You know how there is, there are
15:49
an attempts to get some money from Abramovich.
15:52
It is lasting now for three years with no result.
15:55
You'll see them in court. We will see them in court, Yes,
15:58
definitely. Can I talk about the other very
16:01
interesting thing that's come out of America in the last few
16:03
days, which is the national security strategy?
16:05
It's quite extraordinary as a document.
16:08
Your, your, your spokesman in Moscow, Mr. Peskov welcomed it
16:13
and said that there are aspects to this that are in line with
16:17
Russia's. What is it you like about the
16:20
Trump national security? Document.
16:22
I read the document. In fact, yes, it is an
16:24
interesting document because it differs very much from the
16:27
previous year, such kind of strategies done by the previous
16:31
administration. I will point out three things
16:33
which are in particular positive for us.
16:37
First, it is refusal to be to of refusal of supremacy of the
16:43
United States all over the world.
16:44
Hegemony is was always the main card of the previous
16:50
administration. US is hegemonic, should do
16:54
everything about the world and everything.
16:55
Now it is said no more probably Western Hemisphere.
16:59
That is one thing. Another thing.
17:01
The other thing is that no more enlargement of NATO, which is
17:05
important. It is now in the concept.
17:08
That's right. And a third thing is that they
17:11
stand not for confrontation with Russia, but for strategic
17:15
stability, for establishment of strategic stability.
17:18
I mean, he he is now saying Europe is weak.
17:21
Is, is that a Russian strategic success?
17:25
Is that what you have achieved? It's a, it is just a result of
17:29
development of liberal development in Europe.
17:32
It is, I wouldn't say that we have contributed much because
17:35
recently our relations with Europe deteriorated very
17:38
strongly. And it is not only in the last
17:41
four years, but much earlier because Europe treated us as a
17:45
minor, as some regional power. And this is a result of internal
17:49
European development which we have predicted.
17:52
I mean, the, the thing that has caused a lot of anger in Europe
17:55
is also is talk about civilizational erasure.
17:59
Do you think he's right about that?
18:01
I have no comment on that. I have no comment on that, no.
18:05
Well, this is an American view on on the neighbors, but many
18:10
things that has been pronounced by the Vice President Vance in
18:14
Munich conference and it is reflected in this strategy.
18:17
And of course Europe is not no partner at at at the moment at
18:24
all. It is adversarial party which
18:26
describes itself. It is in this strategy of the
18:29
United Kingdom. It is said that we are in, we
18:32
have adversarial relations. Do you think that Trump view of
18:35
Europe and the threat to Europe from immigration is, is in line
18:40
with Russia's nationalism at home?
18:45
No, we have. We don't have.
18:46
Yes, of course there are some nationalism over the year.
18:51
I, I mean in Russia in some corners of it as I wouldn't say
18:55
which one, but well, nationalism is, it is a very, I will say, I
19:02
would say it is a bad thing. It is nationalism definitely.
19:05
I have seen as well here in London, not in London, but it's
19:09
in one of these cities nearby, some defenders of white movement
19:16
which has been standing in front of the church.
19:19
So nationalism exists over the world, but it is not my
19:24
estimation that migration is threatening to United Kingdom,
19:28
to France, to Germany. You don't think it is, You don't
19:31
think it. Is no, it is the current, the
19:34
estimation here by the politicians, what I'm seeing,
19:37
they are better about eternal life, not me, of course it's.
19:42
You see some some people say it, it it's.
19:44
A child. One thing more, the issue of
19:47
migration in our country in in Russia is now treated also very
19:51
seriously because we did have sort of unlimited migration from
19:55
mainly for from the Central Central Asia who has come to
19:59
work in Russia and then providing us income and money to
20:04
to their own country where there is no job, no no work, no jobs.
20:08
And we have taken a new strategy to that, which is limiting
20:12
migration, which does not give a very favourable conditions for
20:16
movement or forces. So they should register, they
20:19
should learn the Russian language, they should be
20:22
civilized, they should be part of society, not forming the
20:27
walls of their own on our part of Russia.
20:29
So we take it very seriously, but we're discussing our own
20:32
migration. We do not discuss much of what
20:34
is happening in Europe. No, but but what people wonder
20:37
is if, if the Trump foreign policy were to work, he says
20:41
he's encouraging, he wants to encourage nationalist parties in
20:45
Europe. That is a world that is a Europe
20:50
Russia would like, isn't it? I have.
20:53
I don't think that we have any point of view about it.
20:56
We are we we are more or less friendly with those movements in
21:01
Europe who do not consider Russia as an enemy.
21:05
And and they tend to be the nationalists.
21:06
Do not expect, well, whatever, whatever colour they are,
21:09
doesn't matter. It is so you have here in
21:12
Britain at least three or four communist parties.
21:14
They're very friendly to us. I will say we talk to them as
21:17
well, of course, as we talk to the others who are friendly, but
21:20
we do not, we, we cannot have similar relationship with other
21:25
who say that Russia is is a main threat to us, which is
21:28
absolutely has no substance at all.
21:30
But. But it I mean, you, you say you
21:32
like the fact that America is no longer talking about American
21:35
hegemony. Isn't this a different kind of
21:40
hegemony? It is trying to mould Europe in
21:43
in the same way as the MAGA movement in America.
21:47
You know it is Trump spreading his wings around the world.
21:50
I will say it is just a realisation of facts that
21:53
America has no dominance all over the world.
21:56
And this is good, as I have said, because this concept of
22:00
domination of United States in the world, it just LED United
22:04
States and others to the impasse.
22:06
And this is also one of the origin of the conflict that we
22:09
have in Ukraine as well do. Do you believe it as a strategy?
22:12
I mean, when Trump publishes a document like that, do you take
22:16
it on face value? As far as all my experience for
22:20
a long time, I know that American diplomats take this
22:24
type of guidances very seriously and the following them, but also
22:28
very seriously in the negotiations in international
22:31
forest and in provision of in in in providing diplomacy all over
22:36
the world. It is a guidelines for American
22:39
diplomacy and politics around the world.
22:42
And, and do you see Trump? I mean, I think over the last
22:44
year we've talked before about how Trump is coming round to, to
22:49
Russia's way of thinking on many issues.
22:53
Do you see this as a further step towards your world view?
22:57
I don't think no, it is. It is coming from his conviction
23:00
which has he has already unveiled during his pre election
23:05
campaign, he he, he said. And now it is on paper it is, so
23:09
why not? But do you think it's in line
23:10
with Russia's world for you? Is there more agreement between
23:14
you now? We have much more complicated
23:16
view on the world. It is.
23:18
It is not just to please Americans or to please the
23:21
current government. We have our own strategy.
23:24
It is laid down. We have a concept of foreign
23:27
policy. It is laid out I guess a year
23:30
ago or a year and a half, something like that.
23:33
It is not in line. It is just some indications,
23:36
some points that I have singled out.
23:38
These points are in line, yes, about strategic, strategic
23:42
stability, about stopping enlargement of NATO because it
23:45
is detrimental to our security, absolutely.
23:48
And it is about multipolarity in the world multipolar world is
23:53
this is what most important, which is in our United States is
23:56
recognizing. When when President Putin said
23:59
we don't want war with Europe, but we're ready for war, what
24:03
does that? Mean it means that well,
24:07
President Putin has said many times that we do not want and we
24:11
have no plans, no intentions and no reason to have war with
24:16
Europe. And we always need to, that is
24:19
absolutely clear. But by by, by the situation is
24:24
that here in Europe, the leaders of those who are speaking about
24:28
the war in two years, they simply do not hear it.
24:31
They do not listen to what President is saying.
24:34
That is why he was a bit, he he said of this thing that we are
24:37
ready and that is absolutely true that we can do it now.
24:41
We do not want to delay. We we are not, we are prepared
24:45
to anything. We have a strong army, we have
24:47
very strong and modernised forces on all sides.
24:51
So, but we still do not understand why Europeans, why
24:54
European leaders, special defence ministers, generals,
24:58
brigades, they speak about the war.
25:00
We have a conflict in Ukraine when we have resolved to resolve
25:03
this issue, which is serious for our security, which is a vital
25:06
for our security. But do you nothing else.
25:08
And then we we need as coming back to our initial
25:12
conversation, we need a comprehensive peace agreement.
25:16
But do you understand why people don't believe Putin?
25:20
Because so many things he said over the years turned out not to
25:23
be true. Issue of believe or not believe.
25:26
Well, it's quite important, isn't?
25:27
It and why it has it has no nothing about it.
25:31
It is an American concept. I don't believe you.
25:33
Well, he, he's a man who said he wasn't going to annex Crimea and
25:36
he annexed Crimea. He said he wasn't going to
25:38
invade Ukraine, He invades Ukraine.
25:40
So so so trust is a is a huge problem when it comes to
25:45
believing what president. Do you believe your own
25:47
politicians when when they're saying that we have that?
25:51
So you're agreeing with me? I agree.
25:54
I agree in a sense. Do you believe your Minister of
25:57
Finance, who has said there was a gap, enormous gap in the
26:00
budget and turned out to be no gap in the.
26:02
So you don't believe Putin either?
26:03
I don't believe, I don't believe to your politician neither.
26:07
So the question of belief or non belief should be resolved in
26:11
negotiations. But but but belief is is
26:14
fundamental to a negotiation, isn't it?
26:16
Because you have to believe and trust that the person who is
26:19
sitting across the table from you means it, and we'll stick to
26:22
what they're saying. In 1975 when we have, we're
26:27
close to concluding Health and Care Decalogue or Health and
26:30
Care Act, which has a tremendous importance for the European
26:33
security and nobody, no one believed to nobody to anybody or
26:37
to this stage. We didn't believe Americans for
26:39
very many years. Americans didn't believe to us
26:42
on us, we didn't believe Europeans.
26:45
And and So what we have come to an agreement because we have a
26:48
joint project, very serious joint project how to settle
26:51
security in Europe and all over the world.
26:54
And we have done this and from this trust has started to
26:57
evolve. And then we have come to much
26:59
more agreements in Paris. We have we have come to
27:03
strategic, strategic weapon limitation agreements.
27:07
Most fundamental was ABM agreement and ballistic missile
27:12
agreement was that cornerstone of strategic stability in in in
27:17
a climate of total unbelief to each other.
27:21
And what that suggests is that each side will regard security
27:25
and strength as fundamental to underpinning any kind of future
27:30
agreement. So we are looking at escalation,
27:32
aren't we, An arms race? Why It depends, of course.
27:36
It depends of those if someone would like to escalate, we are
27:40
ready. If we can settle and de
27:44
escalate, we are ready to. What else I can tell you about
27:50
that? Nothing, not not very much about
27:54
it. De escalation is now in high in
27:56
the agenda, not escalation. And one should speak not about
28:01
terms of remilitarisation, remilitarisation, but in terms
28:05
of de escalation of current tension, which is important,
28:09
about re establishment of strategic stability, which is
28:13
absolutely vital now for Europeans and for the Americans
28:17
because we are coming, that strategic limitation treaty is
28:20
coming to an end, end of February.
28:23
This is vital of course as well. We have to take, we have to
28:27
think about curbing arms race, not increasing arms race.
28:31
That is most important. And we have to talk about how to
28:35
finish up the issue in Ukrainian conflict.
28:39
Just just finally, how much economic pressure do you think
28:44
both sides are under? We know that Ukraine has a
28:48
problem paying it's bills, but Russia also is facing a much
28:52
lower oil price. Underpinning your economy.
28:55
You're facing inflation at a much higher level, lower growth.
29:00
Isn't that a pressure on you to? We have had a lower growth
29:05
because previous years we have had previous two or three years
29:09
we have had more than 4% and it is absolutely normal that we
29:14
have a lower growth. Yes, we do have inflation which
29:17
is about 8%, I guess something like that.
29:19
But Britain has 8% inflation 2 years ago.
29:23
Well, you have done it by 4. We are trying to bring it also
29:27
by 4. So I wouldn't say that we feel
29:30
economically serious pressure because we did have several
29:33
conferences right now with including which including
29:36
business people, bank people, governmental people, nobody
29:40
complained so far. And and thanks to India and
29:43
China, I suppose. Not only we we have we are
29:47
trading with 85% of the world which is non Western countries.
29:51
It's the majority of the world. Ambassador, thank you very much
29:54
indeed.