Latest / Books4Guys / Turning Trauma into Purpose: Sussi Mattsson on Healing, Resilience, Leadership, and the Power of Writing

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Turning Trauma into Purpose: Sussi Mattsson on Healing, Resilience, Leadership, and the Power of Writing · Books4Guys

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Before we jump into today's episode, I want to thank our executive development partner, Standard Pursuit.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_01: Founded by Hunter Didrickson, Standard Pursuit is a coaching community built for founders, entrepreneurs, and high performers who are ready to step into the next version of themselves.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_01: Through one-on-one coaching and the Standard Training Club, Hunter helps people strengthen both their physical and mental operating systems so they can think more clearly, lead more effectively, and perform at a higher level.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_01: One of the things I appreciate most about what Hunter is building is that he understands success isn't just about business.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_01: It's about health, mindset, discipline, leadership, and becoming the type of person capable of achieving the goals you set for yourself.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: If you're looking to sharpen your performance, improve your habits, and operate at a higher level both personally and professionally, I encourage you to check out StandardPursuit at standardpursuit.com.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_01: Now let's get to today's episode.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_01: Do you typically spend like half the year there and half the year in the US?
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: Or does it kind of just depend on what work you're doing?
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_00: That depends.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_00: It depends on family situation.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_00: I have my daughter in the US.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_00: I have work to consider, you know.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_00: So very flexible.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_01: Well, both are cool places.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_01: Sweden, obviously, very beautiful.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_01: Like we were talking, my wife got to visit last month, I guess it was now, and she couldn't say enough positive things.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_01: She was like, We are going to go here again because it is like the most incredible people, the great food, um, just the culture of it all.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_01: She was like, You're gonna love it.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, All right, let's go.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, that's so Susie, this is amazing.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_01: I'm glad we're able to to have a podcast.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_01: You and I met a couple of months ago and got to get introduced, and and you shared a lot about your story and and just your background, which is incredible.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_01: I for what and I'll let you say a little bit more of it, but I you know you're working on a book, you're a founder, um, but you you had a experience, you know, growing up that a lot of people don't don't have to go through.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_01: And it could have gone, you know, it could have gone a totally different direction.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_01: You you could have gone down a path that is totally opposite of the one you've gone down, but instead you chose to to break through and do some really incredible things, and you've created a company and processes and ways that people can deal with these situations, and you're an international keynote speaker now.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_01: Uh like I said, I already said founder, you've got a book in the work.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_01: So it's just it's incredible what all your doing have done and what you're going to continue to do.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_01: But Susie, for those who have have not been introduced to you before and they don't know your story, would you mind sharing a little bit about that?
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, of course.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, well, I now as an adult, I can see that my all my work started way back when I was eight years old.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_00: And uh what happened then was that my mom she died from cancer, and my parents were divorced at the time, and I haven't seen my father for f over four years, and I was only eight years old.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_00: So when she died, uh by the Swedish law, we um uh my father got custody, even though we didn't have any contact or relationship with him.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_00: So coming to live with my dad was um a totally different um environment of uh abuse, different kind of abuse.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: And after six months living with him, we found out that he had bought me a one-where airline ticket and uh made a false passport to take me, fly me to strangers in a foreign country down to Southern Europe.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_00: And um when I found out that was actually uh the ticket was um for the following evening, which meant you need to act fast.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_00: And how do you do that when you are eight-year-old?
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, yeah.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_00: So um I ran away from home to uh save myself, and also now I can understand that I was also fighting for the dream of a better life.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_00: So um then it took me like a bunch of years to um live all that trauma and and uh all that questi all all of the questions that you have and all the unhealed wounds that you have stored in your body and all the subconscious survival patterns that we tend to create when we're going through trauma.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_00: And then uh 2012 I started to dig in this uh this past, and that was the starting point of why what I have been creating since then.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, again, I can't imagine what that was like.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_01: I've never met anyone who's gone through that before.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_01: I I can only imagine what I think it would be like, but as a eight-year-old kid, uh again, I don't I I don't even want to pretend it's it's an awful situation, but again, it's turned into such an incredible story because you've decided to own your story and do some powerful and amazing things with it.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_01: And I love for you would to talk more about because I know you've developed a four-step wisdom letter writing method that has been super popular, the bridge.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um I know for me to you is a movement you've been working on, and and I know that transitions into your book, but can you talk into about some of the work that you've created and some of these um these steps that you've put together for people?
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_00: So it all started when I um when I processed my own past, um, I came to a point where I couldn't recognize and I couldn't identify myself with that little eight-year-old girl who was so courageous and she also followed through with actions.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_00: So I decided I I need to at least write her a letter to say thank you.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for the courage, for taking action, for actually saving my life.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_00: And through that spontaneous process of writing that letter to her, I felt that something changed within me because my pain and my subconsciously suffering that I have been carrying for all those years suddenly belonged to the letter.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_00: And it was such an impactful experience that I decided to, I need to dive in into this, how writing is healing, and what specific factors do we need to address, and in which order do we need to do that in order to actually write a healing letter to ourselves.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_00: So that was the starting point of me studying for several years, and then I developed this the four-step method, and through networking and clients in the US and all over, they started using this.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_00: And suddenly we had like thousands and thousands of of the wisdom letter writers, and they were sending in their letters, and I was surprised, I was totally overwhelmed in a positive way that this simple yet profound method had made such an impact on other people's lives.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_00: And then I studied more and doing interviews, and I can now I can see and and say that it is bulletproof uh to use because you are uh reframing your experience to discover the wisdom from it, and you're also transforming your relationship to the trauma, and and by doing so and acknowledging everything that happened to you, you also create greater resilience and strength.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_00: And um so it helps you bridge the gap between the past and and your future.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_00: And uh and it's it's amazing to see the results, not just after they have written the letter, but also what they are choosing doing with the life now, with new confidence and also free from the burden of pain and and suffering and and uh and also stop this generational cycle of trauma that we pass on subconsciously.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_00: So the whole experience was uh happy.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_00: Uh it was uh kind of in some way enormously grateful for that I have spent so much time studying all this and developed it, and then I could see the results and and turning my pain into something meaningful and purposeful for other people to heal as well.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_00: So um, so we now have this four-step method that has been used of thousands of people, and people are still sending in all those letters that we are collecting in in a book series, and uh, and then of course, my own book with my own story will come out in in September.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_03: So it's exciting.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it's super exciting.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_01: Susie, when you when you first wrote your letter, where did that idea come from?
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_01: Were you at the time going through any sort of counseling or therapy, or or how did you decide that you needed to write that letter to your eight-year-old self?
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_00: No, because when I when I left that city uh where I ran away from home, when I left that city, I pro I made a promise to myself to never come back.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_00: And I kept that promise for like 30 years or something.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_00: And then uh when I started to feel this um hollow in my life that being successful in my work didn't equal being successful successful personally.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't feel that my personal life was meaningful and purposeful.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_00: I was just a smart, quick um businesswoman doing all this coaching and leadership program and stuff.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_00: So I knew that I needed to go back in time.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_00: And I came to that point that wow, this little girl, she did something truly amazing because she didn't know where to run, she didn't know how to run, she didn't have just one dollar in her pocket.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, the odds was really not good.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_00: And so that was when I thought that I need to just write a letter to just get it out of my system and say thank you to her.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_00: And and that was that was the starting point because we can have different endings when we're going through uh trauma, we can have different endings, but what we choose to do in the middle that is going to decide um which version of ourselves we're showing up at the end, and also um which outcome do we experience at the end.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_00: So um, yeah, it's um it's powerful to finally feel aligned with uh soul, heart, and brain and mind, all the four human experiences, and and put that together to help other people.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_00: Because when you have known pain and you have known suffering, you have known hunger, you have known abandonment, you have known bullying, you know, when you have experienced all that yourself, at least for me, I can feel your pain.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_00: And and so you want to help because it's kind of selfish to keep your story to yourself.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_00: If you can pull out the wisdom from it, then that could be the key to somebody else that unlocks somebody else's pain.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_00: So I do believe that the story we tell ourselves and the meaning we attach to what happened actually is super important.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um how we want the outcome to be and what life we want to create for ourselves.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_01: No, that and then that spot on, Susie.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_01: I I talk about that with books is just, you know, there's a lot of people who have gone through a lot of things, and most of the time there's someone out there who has experienced what you have or what you're going through.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_01: And it's good to be able to go hear that story or read their book and see what they did to overcome because someone out there uh in an unfortunate situation could be in a similar situation that you were, but if they didn't have anyone to to see an example of, they may go down a different path that they go, oh, Susie went through this and look at all she's done.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_01: Like if she can do it, I can do it too.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it gives hope.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think that is very important and very powerful of you to share your story in many different ways, um, so that maybe it does reach somebody and it'll have an impact regardless.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_01: But maybe there is someone out there that really could use that story as inspiration to overcome some of those things.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_01: With the the individuals, you know, I was really like you said, thousands of people have written letters.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_01: Do you have a team of people that that go through each letter and and how does that work?
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_01: Because I'm assuming for just you that would be a lot of letters and really a lot of emotion to have to sort through and and be, you know, being there for people takes a lot of energy, and and it's a good thing, but that's a lot of letters.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_00: But um the UPS guy where I have my um box uh post box is not happy uh because of so many letters.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: But um, but yeah, of course we we needed to gather a team to to read letters.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_00: But but I think that even though you have other people reading, I want to read myself because I want to know how did you experience this?
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_00: What was your life lessons?
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_00: What was your w wisdom to keep learning and to keep um learning from the human experience?
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_00: Because if I detach myself from the actual users of the method, then I think I've lose it.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: So I need to be, I want to be close and and read the stories and hear from people and talk to people.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_00: And and uh when I'm out in different workshops or networking or people approaching and want to, oh, I have this story.
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_00: I have never told anybody, this is my secret, I have never told my wife, you know, there is a lot of of that.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_00: But reading a lot of wisdom letters, I can say with 100% certainty that our pain is universal.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, we are suffering exactly the same.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_00: We cry, we feel guilt, we feel shame, we do all the things the same.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_00: And um, and there is a remarkable hope in human kindness that has been gathering around this movement that a lot of people want to give back.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_00: They are not getting paid or anything, but they want to give back to help a stranger.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_00: If I can write this letter and Susie are willing to put it in the book collection, then somebody else can just buy that book and find a lot of good life lessons and wisdom that can help somebody else.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_00: And that is so beautiful that we live in a world that is currently pretty harsh.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, but there is this humanity um feeling and kindness that I'm willing to reach out, I'm willing to give back even to strangers that I don't know about.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_00: So um, yeah, it it is surprising at the same time, but um but it's also keep coming evidence of people wanted to join, wanted to help, want to be volunteers for this and that.
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_00: And so um yeah, I think that this is the time, I do believe that we have an opportunity to expand our horizon and um and also expand our consciousness and go back to being humans instead of just label us like the CEO or the influencer or the carpenter or whatever label we have, just just be you.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_00: Um so yeah, it's really interesting.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, it is.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_00: It is I can talk forever and ever.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_01: No, and I I I want you to.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: I you know, this is important, and and your message and and story and just your thoughts are are important to get out there.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but that kind of leads into another question I've got for you because you're unique in a way.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_01: So I mean you you do executive coaching, leadership coaching, you're building things, but then you also have this mission of you know, the letters and then people that are they're sharing their trauma.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_01: And so you're you're sorting things that most people aren't doing.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like you've got two different, totally different paths that you're managing and trying to stay balanced with, all while you know you're being asked to come on podcasts and asked to speak and travel and and uh be in tune with everything going on, write a book, you know, and they're all good things, but how do you personally, I guess, manage your bandwidth and and balancing, you know, this more professional, you know, corporate style work you've got to do or want to do, and then also this this mission, um, uh, because it's not just a project, it's a movement.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_01: It there's it's very valuable, and so it's very important.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_00: And it's growing.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_01: And it's growing.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm sure you're you're as it's growing, your time just gets taken a little bit more and more there.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_01: And it and I'm sure you're more almost probably more interested in in that approach.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, how do you balance it all?
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_01: And what what kind of limitations do you set for yourself on on both sides?
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_00: Well, um last I see here, la what was it last year or 2024 maybe.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_00: I decided to not take any coaching clients.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_00: I said this I I have like coaching in like a season from September to June.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_00: So I decided from September to June, I'm not taking any coaching clients because now I need to just focus on this.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_00: So that is a decision that was deliberate to be able to focus at the same time.
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_00: You don't want to lose your clients as well.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_00: So so but what happened was that everybody is so supportive, and my coaching clients usually want to write a wisdom letter because they see patterns in their behavior and in their leadership style that they can connect the dots from past trauma that has been unhealed.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_00: They can see that I am this kind of leader because when this happened to me, that affected my values and my decision making, how I am as a father, as a mother, as a brother, as a leader, etc.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_00: So they can now see that oh my gosh, you are onto something because in our coaching, we can see this and this happened to me when we go back in time.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_00: So, what happened after that period of just not doing any coaching was that all the coaching clients wanted to.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: Write wisdom letters instead.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_00: And what happened next is pretty amazing because the wisdom letter method actually works in a corporate environment that you can see 100% evidence that when you go back and when you heal past trauma, you are showing up differently and you are a different leader, you are a different employee because the trauma and the survival patterns that you have been creating has subconsciously become your normal.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_00: If you do that over and over year after year, it's your new normal, and you're not aware of that that's just who I am, but it's not, it's just the trauma responding to your actions.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_00: So we know that unhealed trauma lives in our actions, in our behavior.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_00: And so it was really interesting that the shift happened that we could see that it's not just a personal matter, but it's also a corporate matter that we can have better leaders if they heal uh past trauma.
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_00: So um so balancing up, Chris, is I think it's all about being true and honest to yourself first.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_00: I I don't do uh I don't do to-do list like this is what I'm going to do today and this is what I'm going to do tomorrow.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_00: But every morning I do another thing, and that is the top three.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_00: If I can achieve this top three, the most important thing today, then I have a victory today.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_00: And that is how I manage my days.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_00: Like um the top three most important things, do them first and then be for victory, and then I move on.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_00: So um I think when you operate from from uh from within and you're true to yourself, then it's not a balancing act.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's just that you you find yourself in that flow of of uh of happiness and meaningful and meaningfulness and and uh and fulfillment of doing truly making a difference, uh, instead of just um yeah, by default, you know, working uh through your to-do list.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_00: So I don't know if that answered your questions, but Christian, but yeah.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_01: No, perfectly.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_01: And uh how cool is that though, that when you you kind of had that internal struggle of how do I continue to work with my coaching clients, but also go do what I really need to do.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_01: But I think that I think that means I think that shows you were making the right decisions to see your coaching clients adopt what you were doing over here and be able to implement that into business.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's just validation that what you were doing was important, is important, and they saw that as well.
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think there was your answer.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_01: Hey, this is what I need to do, and oh, okay, they're gonna come on board too with it.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_01: That's a great thing.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_01: And I it's funny you say the three things you know that you need to get done.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_01: I actually spoke with the CEO yesterday and he had the same approach.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, uh, he manages many different clients, and he was like, I just usually have three things that if I can accomplish those three things, yeah, it should be a successful day for me.
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_01: And excellent.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_01: Um that way you don't get overwhelmed and and bogged down with just feeling like you've got to do everything, you know, it'll get done.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_01: But if you can get those three important things done, it just kind of sets you up for little victories, and that way you feel accomplished.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_01: So it's funny you said the same thing.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_01: I I need to adopt that role, three things.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, because you know, you know the three things that it's most important for the day.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_00: And and I also I also believe that before you start your day, that is super important.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, some people just get up and they got get in the car or on the train or on the bus and then they arrive at the work and then just started working.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_00: But have some meaningful I mean, it it's enough with just 10 minutes, just meaningful time to just be with yourself and write in your journal or something and and start your day because it changes your body language and changes your emotional state in your body.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_00: And and whatever comes that day, I I I do believe, and I have seen witnessed uh clients that you you can better handle um problems and setbacks or whatever uh your day is going to be.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I I think it's also preparing yourself and setting yourself up for success um before you arrive.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_00: Uh no, I agree.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_01: I that that morning time for me is is sacred.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_01: Get my coffee, yeah, kind of get settled for the day, figure out what I need to do, and just kind of breathe before the chaos kicks in.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_01: But then you're running 100 miles an hour.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_01: So, no, I totally agree.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um, Susie, I just got one more question for you.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_01: This has been such an incredible conversation, and and thank you for sharing.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and this question I asked everyone who comes on the podcast, just from a book standpoint.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm always curious to know has there been a book or two that you've read that has meant a lot to you personally or professionally?
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_01: And is there a book that you like to recommend to other people?
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my god, there's a lot of good books out there.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, wow.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_00: Do I only have to choose one?
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_01: You can choose as many as you want.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I do read a lot of books, but I have I I actually have one book that is uh that is something that I come back to over and over again, and that is actually how to live and how to love.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_00: Have you have you read this book?
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_01: I have not read that yet.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_01: You're the first person to recommend it.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, you must read that.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_00: It's just a teeny tiny little book.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_00: It's full of beautiful um life, wisdom, and it's just a lovely little book.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I have read it a couple of times, but every time I read it, I am different, meaning I also see different things.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_00: So that is absol absolutely one of my favorites.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_00: And then I have uh this book, and this is um everyday Ubuntu, Living Better Together, the African Way.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_00: Have you heard of this book?
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_01: I oh, I think I've heard of it.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_01: I have not read it though.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my god.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_00: That is that is really um that is giving you like a life perspective of of humanity.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_00: And and also for me, when I read that book, it was more like a reflection of oh my god, I'm so happy and grateful that I'm changing path and have been for a couple of years to something more meaningful and purposeful and helping others and serve others, not just be here on the earth for my ego.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_00: No, those are both so it's yeah, it's giving you it's giving you the message that we are we are here for each other, uh in a in a very beautiful way.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_00: So those two books is uh actually I have read them a couple of times, and every time they give me something else, depending on where which state my I am and um so yeah, I love those two.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_01: No, and those are great recommendations because if you've if you've read them more than once, that means they've meant a lot to you and you've gotten a lot out of them.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's those are two books I'll add to my list.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I usually the the ones that people have read more than once are the ones I want to read because that means there's something there, and so I will certainly add both of those to my list and and knock those out.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um but Susie, we're so excited for you.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you again for sharing your story.
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we're excited for your book to come out in September, and when it does, we will put that on the website so people can find it and we'll post about it and we'll share it so that everybody can see it and read your story.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but keep keep doing what you're doing, Susie.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's powerful, it's impactful, and we can't wait to see just just what all the the impact you continue to have.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_01: And so very proud and honored to have had this conversation with you and to share your work.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much, Chris.
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_00: It's been honored to be here.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.