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Transcript

Nell Campbell - Unsung Cinema · Movie Meltdown

0:16
Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Linus O'Brien, and you're listening to Movie Meltdown.
0:30
Speaker 1: What's up? I'm Brian.
0:31
Speaker 2: And it's interesting timing, given that the last episode of
0:34
Speaker 2: Unsung Cinema, we were just talking to Linus about his
0:37
Speaker 2: documentary on the Rocky Horror Picture Show. And now this episode,
0:40
Speaker 2: I'm talking with someone I've wanted to get on the
0:42
Speaker 2: show for years now.
0:44
Speaker 1: Little Nell herself.
0:46
Speaker 2: Yes, Nell Campbell has lived one of the more interesting
0:48
Speaker 2: lives out there. If you don't believe me, hit the
0:51
Speaker 2: internet and look up pictures of Nell hanging out with
0:53
Speaker 2: Andy Warhol, proving, regardless of what she says, she was
0:57
Speaker 2: and continues to be the center of coolness. A pop
1:00
Speaker 2: culture icon that has some amazing stories, and since she
1:04
Speaker 2: usually gets asked about playing Columbia, I mean, she's touring
1:07
Speaker 2: the country right now talking about just that, so I
1:09
Speaker 2: thought I would use this episode to talk more about
1:11
Speaker 2: her getting into the entertainment industry, as well as some
1:14
Speaker 2: of the other films she's been in over the years.
1:17
Speaker 2: And along the way, she'll mention some of her favorite filmmakers,
1:19
Speaker 2: and eventually we'll round out the episode with her Unsung
1:22
Speaker 2: Cinema pick, which she didn't want me to get too
1:25
Speaker 2: into the details, because she thinks everyone should go watch
1:27
Speaker 2: the movie and experience it for themselves.
1:29
Speaker 1: Which I agree. So we won't throw out a full spoiler.
1:32
Speaker 2: Warning, just a light one as we keep that specific
1:35
Speaker 2: discussion to a minimum so you can listen to her
1:37
Speaker 2: recommendation and then go watch the movie for yourself. And maybe,
1:42
Speaker 2: in addition to a movie suggestion, Nell might also just
1:44
Speaker 2: give you some pointers on how to live your life.
1:47
Speaker 2: And I feel like she's lived one hell of a life,
1:49
Speaker 2: so she ought to know. So let's hear about all
1:51
Speaker 2: of that right now as we talk with Nell Campbell.
2:00
Speaker 2: I usually start at the very beginning with people and
2:02
Speaker 2: just try to get a sense of, like, how they
2:05
Speaker 2: became interested in the arts and what they were into
2:08
Speaker 2: as a kid.
2:09
Speaker 1: And, I mean, from what I know, you started in Sydney,
2:14
Speaker 1: did you?
2:15
Speaker 3: That's correct.
2:16
Speaker 2: And then you sounded like you had pretty open-minded parents.
2:20
Speaker 1: As far as, you know, the arts.
2:22
Speaker 2: I would think writers and journalists.
2:25
Speaker 3: I very little... intelligent, marvelous parents who encouraged us for
2:34
Speaker 3: children to, you know, do whatever we wanted to do
2:37
Speaker 3: in life. And I'm so blessed to have had the
2:42
Speaker 3: happy childhood I had.
2:44
Speaker 1: Were you already, like, I guess, when did all that
2:46
Speaker 1: kick in?
2:47
Speaker 2: Were you, we know, we know dance came about later.
2:50
Speaker 2: Did you start with dance or was it acting or where, where.
2:52
Speaker 1: Did you begin?
2:54
Speaker 3: Well, I actually was very ill with hepatitis when I
2:57
Speaker 3: was 10 and after three months recovering at home, which
3:02
Speaker 3: I adored, and during that time I started watching, every
3:06
Speaker 3: day had a midday movie and I would watch, that's
3:10
Speaker 3: where my love for movies of the 1930s and 40s
3:15
Speaker 3: began because I'd watch Fred Astaire films and Ginger Rogers
3:21
Speaker 3: and Greta Garbo and old that whole niche of you
3:24
Speaker 3: know musicals and films and so and then once I
3:28
Speaker 3: was strong enough the doctor suggested to build up my
3:32
Speaker 3: strength I do dance classes so that's when I started
3:34
Speaker 3: ballet and modern dance and I was 10 and then
3:38
Speaker 3: when I was 18 I started doing um actually not
3:43
Speaker 3: 17 I started doing tap dancing classes too.
3:46
Speaker 2: So as you're watching those movies that young were you
3:50
Speaker 2: Was it some sort of, you know, hidden away in
3:53
Speaker 2: your head that maybe you.
3:54
Speaker 1: Wanted to do something like that? Or was it something.
3:56
Speaker 3: Darling, I wanted to do... I wanted to be in
3:58
Speaker 3: show business since I was around two. That was just
4:01
Speaker 3: so obvious that I was, you know, a showgirl. I
4:05
Speaker 3: had a very outgoing personality and loved to perform and
4:08
Speaker 3: loved to, you know, make up plays. Well, actually, my
4:11
Speaker 3: mother would write the plays and I'd perform them with
4:13
Speaker 3: my neighbour. So that was all within me from the
4:17
Speaker 3: very beginning. And at school, after when I turned 16,
4:23
Speaker 3: I left school, 16 and a half, and went to
4:27
Speaker 3: drama school. So it was, and seeing all those wonderful
4:31
Speaker 3: performers in those movies, I was just like, yes, this
4:35
Speaker 3: is what I'm going to do. And that's why I
4:36
Speaker 3: wanted to study tap dancing as well once I left school,
4:39
Speaker 3: because I was doing ballet and modern and jazz quite,
4:44
Speaker 3: I was doing at least three or four classes a week,
4:46
Speaker 3: which was a lot. And so, yeah, that's my beginning
4:50
Speaker 3: to that. And then what else would you like to know?
4:53
Speaker 1: I was mostly going to get into films. At what
4:57
Speaker 1: point were you... I know you were already kind of
4:59
Speaker 1: making stuff while you were still in... Before you went
5:03
Speaker 1: to Britain, you were already making film.
5:07
Speaker 3: No, I hadn't. The only thing I'd done before I
5:10
Speaker 3: went to London... I left for London with most of
5:13
Speaker 3: my family when I was eight. I'd just turned 18. But...
5:17
Speaker 3: The only professional role I'd had was in a play, Alfie.
5:23
Speaker 3: So the first, I had a tiny role in a film.
5:26
Speaker 3: I can't remember which was first, but I don't think
5:28
Speaker 3: I'd done any film before. I was in something called
5:32
Speaker 3: Barry McKenzie Holds His Own. But I think, I don't
5:37
Speaker 3: know if that was before or after Rocky, but it
5:39
Speaker 3: was just, you know, a day's work, so I didn't
5:41
Speaker 3: really count. And then I was busking in the streets
5:47
Speaker 3: of London when Jimmy Sharman saw me and then he
5:50
Speaker 3: saw me again just tap dancing in a restaurant where
5:53
Speaker 3: I was a waitress. And he was with Richard O'Brien
5:57
Speaker 3: and I was cast on the spot for Rocky Horror,
6:00
Speaker 3: this tiny little, it was the Rocky Horror show, which
6:03
Speaker 3: was a tiny little musical that he was going to
6:06
Speaker 3: be directing.
6:09
Speaker 2: I'm sure you've discussed Rocky so much over the years.
6:11
Speaker 2: I thought I would try to hit some of the
6:13
Speaker 2: other stuff around, especially the early 70s into the 80s.
6:17
Speaker 2: You were in a lot of really interesting films. So
6:20
Speaker 2: aside from Rocky, I guess, or around that same time,
6:24
Speaker 2: which one did they shoot first?
6:25
Speaker 1: Was it Rocky or Listomania?
6:27
Speaker 3: Listomania was after Rocky Horror. Listomania was just a total treat,
6:33
Speaker 3: directed by the great Ken Russell. whose movies, well, I
6:39
Speaker 3: actually prefer his black and white documentaries on composers that
6:44
Speaker 3: he did for the BBC, I think, before he started
6:47
Speaker 3: doing his crazy movies. Though I loved Women in Love
6:50
Speaker 3: at the time, but I think his movies went a
6:54
Speaker 3: bit over the top. But anyway, I was thrilled to
6:56
Speaker 3: be cast in Listermania and, of course, my scene. I
7:04
Speaker 3: was in bed with Roger Dolch, who had the most
7:06
Speaker 3: divine torso.
7:07
Speaker 1: Which is what's bringing you. I think I see how
7:11
Speaker 1: this is all coming together.
7:13
Speaker 3: Yeah, and then he and I are in bed and
7:17
Speaker 3: then the Pope rushes in and the Pope is played
7:20
Speaker 3: by Ringo Starr. So I can't believe I don't have
7:23
Speaker 3: a still of me with Ringo and Roger. But Ringo
7:27
Speaker 3: then did take us to lunch at the studio canteen.
7:32
Speaker 3: which I was thrilled that someone else was picking up
7:35
Speaker 3: the tab, and why not a Beatle? Yeah, Beatle Trump
7:39
Speaker 3: 2 member.
7:41
Speaker 1: He's got plenty of money. He'll be fine.
7:43
Speaker 3: Yeah. I heard he lost a lot of money, but
7:47
Speaker 3: that's another story.
7:50
Speaker 2: I've heard differing stories on Ken Russell, so you seemed
7:53
Speaker 2: impressed with him, but how was he to work with
7:55
Speaker 2: as a director?
7:56
Speaker 3: Well, I wasn't. When you say impressed, well, he was
8:01
Speaker 3: a very successful filmmaker and I was thrilled to be chosen.
8:05
Speaker 3: When I went to audition, I took with me these
8:08
Speaker 3: Japanese books that opened like concertinas and that I had
8:13
Speaker 3: stuck photographs from photo booths I used to pose in,
8:17
Speaker 3: in different attire and completely different looks. And I would
8:22
Speaker 3: do them in a way that I would each photo,
8:25
Speaker 3: they were long strips, not flat. not two next to
8:28
Speaker 3: each other. They were like one, two, three, four photos
8:31
Speaker 3: in just a long strip, one photo beneath the next.
8:36
Speaker 3: And I would do my head in one and I'd
8:37
Speaker 3: quickly jump up and do, it was like playing heads,
8:40
Speaker 3: legs and bodies, what I would do. Anyway, he loves
8:42
Speaker 3: these and I'm sure that's what got me cast because
8:45
Speaker 3: I'd hardly done anything. Anyway, that was great. And I'll
8:49
Speaker 3: tell you another audition I did that it didn't lead
8:52
Speaker 3: to a role, but it was fun to do. It was,
8:55
Speaker 3: I auditioned for Fellini. Oh, nice. And he kept looking
9:01
Speaker 3: at me with two different pairs of spectacles. He'd look
9:04
Speaker 3: at me with one pair and then he'd take them
9:07
Speaker 3: off and look at me with another. But curiously, the
9:11
Speaker 3: person he cast for the role was the woman that
9:14
Speaker 3: answered the phone in the casting director office that we
9:18
Speaker 3: were all sitting. Isn't that a hoot?
9:20
Speaker 1: I guess you never know.
9:21
Speaker 3: I guess who else got cast like that, who's made
9:24
Speaker 3: a lot more money from her casting? And that is,
9:28
Speaker 3: I'm trying to remember her name, character in the American Office, Phyllis.
9:34
Speaker 3: The terrific actor Phyllis. She worked for the casting director
9:40
Speaker 3: and she would read with the actors that were doing
9:44
Speaker 3: reading lines to be videoed to show them to the directors.
9:49
Speaker 3: And she ended up being cast. Isn't that great?
9:53
Speaker 1: I mean, that's the legend of movies. You know, anybody
9:57
Speaker 1: can be a star.
9:58
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. You don't just have to be selling
10:02
Speaker 3: a milkshake at the soda fountain in Hollywood.
10:06
Speaker 1: Tap dancing while you're waiting tables.
10:08
Speaker 3: Yeah. That's how Lana Turner got discovered.
10:12
Speaker 2: I think a lot of those early actors, that's what
10:16
Speaker 2: everybody did.
10:17
Speaker 3: Yeah.
10:18
Speaker 2: Well, then I recently watched Summer of Secrets sort.
10:21
Speaker 1: Of around that same time.
10:23
Speaker 3: Oh, my God. Yeah. That's so good.
10:25
Speaker 1: I figure that's at least hanging out on the beach,
10:27
Speaker 1: you had some good stories.
10:29
Speaker 3: Well, that's so funny. I haven't seen that film since
10:33
Speaker 3: we made it. And, of course, your listeners, to the
10:37
Speaker 3: listeners that don't know, which will be, I would imagine,
10:39
Speaker 3: every listener listening, that's also directed by Jim Sharma, who
10:44
Speaker 3: directed the Rocky Horror Picture Show, which... No one, sorry,
10:50
Speaker 3: I mean, you'd never guess that, would you?
10:53
Speaker 2: I was surprised, especially coming as quickly behind Rocky as
10:58
Speaker 2: it did, how similar, you don't realize it, but eventually
11:01
Speaker 2: it becomes a very similar story.
11:03
Speaker 3: And of course, one of the actors, one of the
11:05
Speaker 3: Transylvanians is one of the main actors.
11:08
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, your other one of.
11:10
Speaker 3: The main four, yeah. Well, no, one of the Transylvanians.
11:14
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, in this movie, the main forecast there,
11:17
Speaker 2: he's the other guy.
11:18
Speaker 3: Oh, right, right. Exactly, exactly.
11:20
Speaker 2: But yeah, I just thought that was interesting just because
11:23
Speaker 2: it was so different and most of it just kind
11:27
Speaker 2: of hanging out on the beach in the first half.
11:29
Speaker 2: And then you get to that really strange and kind
11:31
Speaker 2: of unusual ending that you didn't see coming as it started.
11:36
Speaker 3: So, Carrot, please just keep asking me questions that you'd
11:38
Speaker 3: like to know about movies I like. Because I'm just
11:41
Speaker 3: going to start telling you what movies I like. So
11:44
Speaker 3: I was living in London in the 70s, right? I
11:47
Speaker 3: arrived in 71. I was 18. So you can do
11:50
Speaker 3: the math from then on. But I was around very
11:54
Speaker 3: much for the French new wave cinema. And this was
11:59
Speaker 3: when people, you know, before we all had smartphones and computers,
12:05
Speaker 3: it was the only way you'd see a movie. Obviously,
12:08
Speaker 3: you went to a cinema. And it was a really...
12:11
Speaker 3: It wasn't that expensive at all. And you so wanted
12:17
Speaker 3: to see, you know, a new movie. But if you
12:19
Speaker 3: were interested in, you know, there was a new French
12:21
Speaker 3: movie out. We all used to go to the cinemas
12:24
Speaker 3: that showed foreign films. They were fantastic. Like, you know,
12:30
Speaker 3: even older movies like Jules Agin. I mean, Truffaut did
12:34
Speaker 3: so many great, the 400 Blows. And then I used
12:38
Speaker 3: to love going to Kurosawa films and Sajit Ray, the
12:43
Speaker 3: great Indian director. So foreign films are very much something
12:47
Speaker 3: I've always loved. And I continue to love and watch.
12:51
Speaker 3: I much prefer seeing them on the big screen. But
12:54
Speaker 3: mercifully in Sydney, they have retrospectives of great directors. And
12:59
Speaker 3: anyone listening, I urge you to... Jump in on a
13:04
Speaker 3: foreign film to take yourself to another time and another
13:08
Speaker 3: country where everything's so different. And I mean, of course,
13:12
Speaker 3: Kurosawa's Seven Samurai. Is that what it's called? It is
13:16
Speaker 3: called Seven Samurai. I'm so used to that. What's the
13:19
Speaker 3: American version is? What's the American version?
13:23
Speaker 1: Magnificent Seven.
13:24
Speaker 3: The Magnificent Seven. Yeah.
13:27
Speaker 2: So many of his have kind of been unofficially remade
13:29
Speaker 2: into our movies.
13:30
Speaker 3: That's right. And that's just the most wonderful film. I
13:36
Speaker 3: recently saw it again at the cinema at a Kurosawa Retrospective,
13:40
Speaker 3: which was so fabulous. But, you know, a lot of
13:44
Speaker 3: fans of Rocky Horror are sci-fi fans. And I'm not
13:51
Speaker 3: really a sci-fi fan. And I was curious that Rocky
13:55
Speaker 3: came under that category. You know, I understand it more now.
14:00
Speaker 3: And I was asking somebody... what is their passion about sci-fi?
14:08
Speaker 3: And when he described it, it was exactly how I
14:11
Speaker 3: describe the joy of reading a book or of being
14:16
Speaker 3: taken to another place, another period, you know, a totally
14:22
Speaker 3: different country. That's the sort of how I like, you know,
14:26
Speaker 3: when I read books or when I go to the
14:28
Speaker 3: cinema and I realised that But that's exactly how sci-fi
14:32
Speaker 3: people see sci-fi movies. That's their version of going to
14:38
Speaker 3: another period in another place. But to me, theirs is
14:43
Speaker 3: more like magic. It is sort of magic. It's a
14:48
Speaker 3: little more fantastical, yeah. Yeah, exactly. And now I totally understand.
14:53
Speaker 3: I've always appreciated that they love something that is not
14:57
Speaker 3: my genre. But I now understand that we all come
15:02
Speaker 3: from the same place in how we like to travel
15:05
Speaker 3: in our minds. And I always encourage people that haven't
15:11
Speaker 3: the joy of reading books because I'm so lucky that
15:15
Speaker 3: I was brought up by a very literary... My father,
15:18
Speaker 3: he was a journalist in one of his jobs. He
15:21
Speaker 3: was a book reviewer. So I grew up in a
15:24
Speaker 3: house full of books and I just... I have a
15:28
Speaker 3: passion for reading and I wish, I hope I would just,
15:32
Speaker 3: if one person listens to this, could this go, you've
15:35
Speaker 3: got libraries, you can get eBooks and libraries as well as,
15:40
Speaker 3: you know, the hard copy. I just urge you to
15:43
Speaker 3: start reading on any subject that you enjoy. Yeah.
15:47
Speaker 2: I mean, I, I've gotten so far away from books,
15:50
Speaker 2: but being into film, like, like you were saying with
15:53
Speaker 2: the immersing yourself in a different time, that's, that's one
15:57
Speaker 2: of my favorite things about film is like specifically watching
16:00
Speaker 2: older film because it puts you, it gives you that
16:02
Speaker 2: snapshot of that place and that time and the people
16:05
Speaker 2: that were making this film. And like, it's so immersive
16:09
Speaker 2: into a culture that's totally different from yours.
16:12
Speaker 3: Yeah. Oh, exactly. And that's why going to like Sergeant
16:16
Speaker 3: Ray takes you to India in an entirely other period.
16:21
Speaker 3: It's just fabulous to see how people live doing. And
16:23
Speaker 3: when you see, The early Kurosawa movies, they're showing you,
16:28
Speaker 3: you can just get a complete feel for what Japan
16:32
Speaker 3: was like, you know, 80, 100 years ago. And to me,
16:37
Speaker 3: that is like science fiction pretty much, if you think,
16:41
Speaker 3: and of course, all the, what they used to wear
16:43
Speaker 3: when they went to battle, et cetera. Yeah.
16:47
Speaker 2: I've done that recently with a movie. It was a
16:49
Speaker 2: very different time and place because I rewatched Jubilee.
16:53
Speaker 3: And oh that was wild wasn't it.
16:57
Speaker 2: That was one of those as I was watching it
16:59
Speaker 2: though I was like I was like this really does
17:01
Speaker 2: like time and a place like it is it is
17:04
Speaker 2: in a different country for me it was in a
17:06
Speaker 2: very different like even if it wasn't a different like
17:09
Speaker 2: people it was definitely people that were experiencing a different
17:13
Speaker 2: life than we have.
17:14
Speaker 3: Now yes and that of course is the director Derek
17:17
Speaker 3: Jarman and his movies were very avant-garde really what would
17:22
Speaker 3: you would you consider them avant-garde?
17:24
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was, I mean, it was a mixture of
17:26
Speaker 2: that punk mentality, but also very theatrical, yeah.
17:31
Speaker 3: Yes, that was a lot of fun to make, and
17:37
Speaker 3: Adam Ant was in that, that was the beginning of
17:39
Speaker 3: his career, really.
17:40
Speaker 2: I figure that was your selling point. You're just there
17:43
Speaker 2: to make out with Adam Ant, we know.
17:46
Speaker 3: Well, not really, that was a very, I mean, he
17:49
Speaker 3: was just a kid that, And so was her name. Oh, anyway,
17:55
Speaker 3: but it's got a lot of interesting people in it.
17:57
Speaker 2: Were you involved in that scene any? I mean, that
17:59
Speaker 2: was definitely a very specific punk scene.
18:03
Speaker 3: Oh, God, no. I've never been involved in any kind
18:06
Speaker 3: of scene. You make the scene.
18:09
Speaker 1: Come on now.
18:10
Speaker 3: No, I just do my own thing always. I've never
18:14
Speaker 3: followed fashion. I can look back on all photos of
18:18
Speaker 3: me and my you know, my haircuts, my incredible dyeing
18:23
Speaker 3: of hair. There was only three of us in London
18:25
Speaker 3: that had bright, like neon, neon, neon colored hair. Zandra Rhodes,
18:32
Speaker 3: Janet Street Porter, myself. And then, I mean, that was
18:36
Speaker 3: way before punk, but yeah, just doing your own thing is,
18:40
Speaker 3: I encourage it. And I think that's what's so, one
18:43
Speaker 3: of the effects of knockoff, sorry, knock on effects of,
18:48
Speaker 3: Rocky Horror that encourages people to do their own thing
18:51
Speaker 3: and express how they feel. That's really, really important.
18:56
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, that's become almost more than the movie itself.
18:59
Speaker 2: It's just sort of what it stands for.
19:01
Speaker 3: Yeah. But also, of course, when children are at school,
19:05
Speaker 3: they understandably very much want to feel that they are
19:10
Speaker 3: accepted and one of just like everybody else. and look
19:17
Speaker 3: like everybody else. And it takes confidence to recognize that
19:23
Speaker 3: you're different. And that sense of being different can mean anything,
19:30
Speaker 3: whether it's your interests, whether it's your sexuality, what's your parents,
19:40
Speaker 3: your ethnicity. The great thing is that you should be
19:44
Speaker 3: proud of being different. I mean, it comes to it,
19:49
Speaker 3: I've always, felt completely individual, but I'm so lucky that
19:54
Speaker 3: I grew up in such a loving family that I
19:58
Speaker 3: embraced the feeling of being different. Yeah, if you're encouraged.
20:04
Speaker 3: To me, it was a plus. So I had an,
20:07
Speaker 3: you know, and I had also, I had an extrovert personality,
20:12
Speaker 3: so it was a win-win for me. But I completely
20:15
Speaker 3: sympathise with people that feel more vulnerable, and particularly when,
20:21
Speaker 3: you know, they're at school, when everyone's trying to fit in.
20:25
Speaker 3: And I just, I'm so upset when I hear about
20:28
Speaker 3: people being bullied. And I met a friend's son recently
20:34
Speaker 3: who's 21, and his pronouns now are Ray, and he
20:39
Speaker 3: told me that he was at English boarding school and
20:41
Speaker 3: was totally bullied. And I just was so shocked. I mean,
20:46
Speaker 3: sadly I wasn't shocked, but so disappointed that people still
20:51
Speaker 3: bully people for reasons like that. And I guess those
20:55
Speaker 3: English boarding schools still, and American schools too, you know,
21:00
Speaker 3: it's the athletic boys that get the athletic males that
21:05
Speaker 3: get the attention and other, you know, if you're not
21:08
Speaker 3: that way inclined.
21:09
Speaker 2: I mean, there's some stuff that's changed, but, but it's still,
21:13
Speaker 2: just when you think we've made a little progress, you
21:15
Speaker 2: hear a story that's equally as bad as it was
21:17
Speaker 2: decades ago.
21:18
Speaker 3: That's right. And I think because in general, America is
21:22
Speaker 3: such a conservative country that it's very, it's still hard
21:26
Speaker 3: for people to come out to their parents. And there was,
21:29
Speaker 3: I mean, so many people are homosexual and bisexual and,
21:36
Speaker 3: you know, a lot of people now feel that they're
21:38
Speaker 3: born in the wrong body. I just think people should
21:41
Speaker 3: be able to express themselves and be what they are.
21:45
Speaker 3: I mean, it's, you know, particularly for transsexual people, it's
21:49
Speaker 3: an incredibly challenging journey for them and for their families.
21:55
Speaker 3: And they need all the love that they can get,
21:58
Speaker 3: you know. And they shouldn't be judged harshly because, I mean,
22:03
Speaker 3: you would not choose that journey on yourself because it's
22:07
Speaker 3: a very hard journey. Being homosexual is an easy journey, really.
22:13
Speaker 3: I mean, you've just got to, as long as you're,
22:15
Speaker 3: I mean, it's just as long as your parents and
22:18
Speaker 3: family accept it, which of course any educated or sophisticated
22:23
Speaker 3: person does. But, you know, I don't, I feel badly
22:27
Speaker 3: even saying that because of, You know, if your parents
22:30
Speaker 3: aren't educated, that's one that just sympathises with them. And
22:35
Speaker 3: also so many people are religious and all religions to
22:38
Speaker 3: me are cults.
22:40
Speaker 1: I'd say that a lot actually.
22:43
Speaker 3: As you should. And the only good cult in the
22:45
Speaker 3: world we know is the cult of Rocky Horror.
22:47
Speaker 1: Obviously.
22:49
Speaker 3: But anyway, I just, it's all about being compassionate and
22:56
Speaker 3: understanding and And I think kindness is the most important
22:59
Speaker 3: quality a person can have. And I always encourage young people,
23:04
Speaker 3: you know, teenagers, when you're looking for friends and also
23:10
Speaker 3: especially in your, well, not especially, but also in your
23:14
Speaker 3: romantic relationships, you know, when you meet somebody, of course,
23:18
Speaker 3: you're much more concerned about whether you fancy them and
23:24
Speaker 3: you know, want to hang out, enjoy their company, then
23:26
Speaker 3: you're not necessarily looking for kindness, but you will find
23:29
Speaker 3: as that relationship continues, that kindness is the most important
23:33
Speaker 3: quality they could have.
23:35
Speaker 1: I mean, that's going to come into play way more often.
23:38
Speaker 3: So absolutely. So you need to, you need to look
23:43
Speaker 3: for that from the very beginning and also, you know,
23:47
Speaker 3: be kind and tolerance. I just, I, I, I make
23:53
Speaker 3: such an effort to be tolerant when perhaps my impatience,
23:58
Speaker 3: which I read is not a, it's not something you're
24:04
Speaker 3: born with. You decide whether to be patient or impatient.
24:08
Speaker 3: And I'm sort of impatient by nature, but I really
24:12
Speaker 3: make an effort to not be impatient. And I was
24:15
Speaker 3: on a bus in London and someone was, you know,
24:17
Speaker 3: had their phone going and didn't have AirPods or anything
24:20
Speaker 3: in and it was just, you know, scrolling through movies
24:23
Speaker 3: and videos or Instagram or whatever. And so we were
24:26
Speaker 3: all having to listen to it. And I thought, no, no,
24:29
Speaker 3: just don't say anything. Sit quietly. That person will be
24:34
Speaker 3: either getting off the bus or you'll be getting off.
24:37
Speaker 3: It's just because I think that everyone's become so intolerant now.
24:41
Speaker 3: And that's why everything's becoming so explosive.
24:45
Speaker 2: Well, people just don't understand anybody else's perspective and don't
24:49
Speaker 2: care most of the time.
24:51
Speaker 3: That's correct. I know that my daughter reminds me to
24:56
Speaker 3: be like this too, that you can't judge somebody by
25:01
Speaker 3: your values.
25:02
Speaker 2: No, you have to be kind of open-minded to what
25:06
Speaker 2: they're going through. People have no empathy either. They don't
25:09
Speaker 2: have any idea what somebody else is going through.
25:11
Speaker 1: On a daily basis.
25:12
Speaker 3: That's right. That is right. And so just because I
25:15
Speaker 3: was brought up knowing that you shouldn't do this and
25:17
Speaker 3: you shouldn't do that, and if someone's behaving, you know,
25:20
Speaker 3: they weren't necessarily brought up that way or feel that way. Therefore,
25:24
Speaker 3: I can't judge them by it.
25:27
Speaker 2: Well, again, the rocky world is always open-minded. I did
25:31
Speaker 2: recently re-watch Shock Treatment. I wanted to get your take
25:34
Speaker 2: on that one.
25:35
Speaker 3: Oh, well, it's funny. It's funny you mentioned I was
25:38
Speaker 3: talking about it over breakfast because I was... staying with
25:44
Speaker 3: Richard O'Brien in New Zealand earlier this year. And I said, Richard,
25:48
Speaker 3: I have to confess, I have no idea what shock
25:51
Speaker 3: treatment is about. And he went, no, nor do I.
25:57
Speaker 1: That sounds like him.
25:59
Speaker 3: So we all know how brilliant, well, how original it is.
26:06
Speaker 3: But I do think that it's a shame that they
26:09
Speaker 3: didn't sort of edit it i think it's too complex
26:12
Speaker 3: that what's going on in it because it is ahead
26:15
Speaker 3: of the truman show it's very much yeah that's what
26:19
Speaker 3: i'm saying yeah everyone i think a lot of people
26:23
Speaker 3: recognize that and i think that um but there's just
26:28
Speaker 3: too many characters too much going on and but the
26:32
Speaker 3: the uh the it looks brilliant again with the brilliant
26:36
Speaker 3: sets of Brian Thompson in costumes of Sue Blaine and
26:41
Speaker 3: the songs that Richard O'Brien and Richard Hartley wrote are
26:45
Speaker 3: just fabulous.
26:46
Speaker 1: Yeah. And the visuals are amazing.
26:49
Speaker 2: Like I just noticed this time, like how many of
26:51
Speaker 2: those great shots in the hallways and like all the weird.
26:54
Speaker 1: Specific set design stuff is so impressive.
26:58
Speaker 3: I totally agree. There's a lot to be said for
27:02
Speaker 3: shot treatment, but it's just a shame it wasn't a
27:05
Speaker 3: bit simpler, I feel.
27:07
Speaker 2: Yeah.
27:08
Speaker 1: When I forgot how much Rick is in it, working.
27:11
Speaker 3: With Rick Veal. Yeah. And also, you know, Jim, Jim
27:15
Speaker 3: had offered the lead role to Tim Curry, who sadly declined.
27:20
Speaker 3: And I think if it had starred Tim, it would
27:22
Speaker 3: have been a whole other thing.
27:25
Speaker 2: Yeah.
27:26
Speaker 1: I mean, by that time he was already in the
27:27
Speaker 1: middle of his music career too. It was so busy.
27:31
Speaker 3: He, you know, but I'm not talking about, I'm talking
27:36
Speaker 3: about the fact that if it had had someone with
27:38
Speaker 3: the charisma like Tim in it it would have been
27:41
Speaker 3: a whole different world game definitely yeah yeah yeah because
27:45
Speaker 3: that's you know Tim brings so much charisma to Rocky
27:49
Speaker 3: and also so does Meatloaf in his very small role
27:52
Speaker 3: which I so wish had been bigger um in Rocky
27:56
Speaker 3: Horror he's so fantastic in that yeah.
28:00
Speaker 2: He was always an underrated actor like all of his
28:02
Speaker 2: performances were really impressive.
28:05
Speaker 3: I haven't actually seen him in anything else, but every
28:07
Speaker 3: time I see that bit of him in that, I go, oh,
28:10
Speaker 3: my God, he's so charismatic in just the way he
28:13
Speaker 3: looks at the camera, everything about him. Yeah. So I
28:18
Speaker 3: guess before I go, I wanted to mention, you know
28:23
Speaker 3: that year when you said, oh, what do I consider
28:24
Speaker 3: an underrated movie?
28:26
Speaker 2: Yes. Alright, if we're getting into the movie, I will
28:29
Speaker 2: usually give the breakdown. So, our unsung cinema feature is
28:32
Speaker 2: The Vanishing. The year is 1988. The director is George Slyzer,
28:36
Speaker 2: and they plot, according to IMDb, Rex and Saskia, a
28:40
Speaker 2: young couple in love, are on vacation.
28:42
Speaker 1: They stop at a busy service station, and Saskia is abducted.
28:45
Speaker 2: After three years and no sign of Saskia, Rex begins
28:48
Speaker 2: receiving letters from the abductor.
28:50
Speaker 3: It wasn't necessarily underrated.
28:53
Speaker 2: I would, definitely in this country, again, I feel like
28:57
Speaker 2: America in general is always sort of undereducated in the
29:00
Speaker 2: ways of international cinema. So it is one of the
29:04
Speaker 2: few that a lot of, it kind of broke through,
29:06
Speaker 2: maybe the only Dutch film that broke through around that time.
29:09
Speaker 2: But even then, I would still say it's massively underseen
29:12
Speaker 2: by people.
29:13
Speaker 3: So it was then remade. And of course, I didn't
29:17
Speaker 3: see the remake, but I would like it to be noted.
29:22
Speaker 3: I mean, as someone that, I love psychological thrillers. And
29:28
Speaker 3: that to me is the best psychological thriller I've ever seen,
29:31
Speaker 3: The Vanishing. And I thought about that film when I
29:37
Speaker 3: left the cinema. Hitchcock would love to have made that film.
29:41
Speaker 2: Oh, yeah.
29:42
Speaker 3: Just up his boulevard. So I really urge anyone listening
29:46
Speaker 3: to try and see it and forget about the remake
29:49
Speaker 3: the Americans did. It's called The Vanishing. And is it–
29:54
Speaker 3: does it come under a Dutch movie? Because it's set
29:57
Speaker 3: in– I.
30:00
Speaker 2: Think it actually had trouble. I think they were trying
30:03
Speaker 2: to submit it as foreign language film to the Oscars
30:07
Speaker 2: as the Dutch entry, but it had so much French
30:09
Speaker 2: language in it, they disqualified it.
30:11
Speaker 1: So it is a mixture of Dutch and French.
30:14
Speaker 3: That's what I was thinking. I wasn't sure if it
30:16
Speaker 3: came under being a French film.
30:19
Speaker 1: But the director is Dutch.
30:22
Speaker 3: That's right. And it was based on a Dutch novella
30:26
Speaker 3: called The Golden Egg. And the film is originally, I think,
30:29
Speaker 3: called The Golden Egg, believe it or not. Anyway, I
30:32
Speaker 3: think that's what it was called when I went to
30:34
Speaker 3: see it. But anyway, it's called The Vanishing.
30:36
Speaker 2: I know it's listed as kind of like one of
30:38
Speaker 2: the scariest movies ever.
30:40
Speaker 1: And it gets into like pure evil.
30:43
Speaker 2: Like he's got that theory of like you can't be
30:45
Speaker 2: a good person unless you experience, you know, at least
30:49
Speaker 2: the thoughts of evil and choose not to do it.
30:51
Speaker 1: I just wanted to get your take on that.
30:55
Speaker 3: First of all, I want you to know that I'm
30:57
Speaker 3: very interested in, I suppose, as a generalisation, serial killers,
31:04
Speaker 3: but I'm not at all interested in the gory details
31:08
Speaker 3: of murder. I'm far more interested in why the person
31:11
Speaker 3: is committing the murder and how the murder is tracked down.
31:15
Speaker 3: And the amazing thing about The vanishing is that you
31:21
Speaker 3: get both sides of the story, which is very unusual
31:26
Speaker 3: in a movie to the degree you do in this
31:29
Speaker 3: particular film. And I've never seen that in another film.
31:33
Speaker 3: And I'm not going to give away any more.
31:35
Speaker 1: No, it's impressive the way it sets everything up.
31:39
Speaker 3: That's right.
31:40
Speaker 2: Even within the character, it's like the character himself wants
31:43
Speaker 2: to know what happened. It's figuring out the murder, figuring
31:46
Speaker 2: out the mystery.
31:47
Speaker 1: And like, are you willing to.
31:49
Speaker 3: Don't say another thing. The fact, I think people, the
31:55
Speaker 3: reason it was so terrifying is that it's such a,
31:59
Speaker 3: the way it all, the way it starts, the very
32:01
Speaker 3: gentle way. And then you see it suddenly, everything, we
32:05
Speaker 3: can all identify with what, how it all began. Yeah.
32:10
Speaker 1: And how much he loves her. Yeah.
32:13
Speaker 3: But know how the original situation starts. You're just stopping
32:17
Speaker 3: in a gas station. So from there, you know what
32:19
Speaker 3: I mean? But I think that everyone can identify. That's
32:22
Speaker 3: why they feel. But it's not a gory. It's a
32:27
Speaker 3: psychological thriller, which is, to me, far more effective. So
32:31
Speaker 3: I'm here. I'm in Detroit right now. And I'm on
32:36
Speaker 3: a tour all October, this spectacular tour. where I'm doing
32:40
Speaker 3: solo appearances all around America. I'm in Toronto. And then
32:45
Speaker 3: I'm also joining Patricia Quinn and Barry Bostwick in some
32:49
Speaker 3: of our venues. So you can either look at my Instagram,
32:52
Speaker 3: at Little Mel Campbell, or my website, some name, or
33:00
Speaker 3: go to the Stander website to get all the dates
33:03
Speaker 3: of where we're appearing. It would be fabulous to meet you.
33:06
Speaker 3: And it's a really fun night. It's like a party
33:08
Speaker 3: night of, fancy dress and meeting the three of us
33:16
Speaker 3: or just one of us and getting a photo with
33:19
Speaker 3: us and an autograph. That's if you do the VIP
33:24
Speaker 3: meet and greet. Otherwise, it's still, if you just get
33:27
Speaker 3: a regular ticket, it's a whole party scene with the
33:29
Speaker 3: shadow cast performing in front of the screen. The shadow
33:32
Speaker 3: casts are amazing. They take their roles very seriously and
33:37
Speaker 3: they're so imaginative. And there's a Q & A with,
33:42
Speaker 3: you know, on stage with whoever is in that particular
33:45
Speaker 3: show with either me or me and the other two.
33:48
Speaker 3: And so there's lots to enjoy. So I hope you
33:51
Speaker 3: can come to one of the shows. That includes you.
33:54
Speaker 1: Definitely.
33:54
Speaker 2: I've seen some clips of it. It looks like you're
33:58
Speaker 2: getting involved a little more than your regular Q & A.
34:00
Speaker 2: There's some dancing going on, I've seen.
34:02
Speaker 3: Oh, well, just you don't want to give everything away.
34:05
Speaker 3: You've got to get some surprises.
34:07
Speaker 2: But that's, yeah, that's impressive because not everybody usually, you know,
34:11
Speaker 2: get up there and sit in a chair and, you know,
34:12
Speaker 2: just answer.
34:13
Speaker 3: No, no, no, no. We like to give everyone a
34:15
Speaker 3: good time.
34:16
Speaker 2: Yeah.
34:18
Speaker 1: Well, thank you for joining me.
34:19
Speaker 3: It's been an absolute pleasure. And to those listening, just
34:23
Speaker 3: remember to try and get out of your comfort zone
34:27
Speaker 3: in every way in your daily life. And in your
34:31
Speaker 3: choices of what movies you watch and what books you read,
34:35
Speaker 3: because the more you know about anything, the more interesting
34:37
Speaker 3: it becomes. I used to have any interest in sport.
34:41
Speaker 3: And then I was my mother who was very interested
34:43
Speaker 3: in every sport, having four brothers. I was watching the
34:47
Speaker 3: world cup one year with her. And ever since that
34:49
Speaker 3: got me into soccer. And I'm also now very interested
34:54
Speaker 3: in tennis. And I even enjoy watching golf, all kinds
34:58
Speaker 3: of things. So it's, You know, once you start following something,
35:02
Speaker 3: it's amazing how more interesting it becomes. And the more
35:07
Speaker 3: things you're interested in in life, the more interesting your
35:10
Speaker 3: life is. So curiosity is the great key of everlasting youth,
35:16
Speaker 3: I think.
35:17
Speaker 2: Yeah.
35:17
Speaker 3: It is the fountain of youth. Absolutely. It's the fountain
35:21
Speaker 3: of youth. Definitely. So onward and upward with all of you,
35:24
Speaker 3: and kindness is everything, and health is the most important
35:27
Speaker 3: thing to it. So look after yourselves. Okay. Well, thank
35:33
Speaker 3: you very much for having me on your show. It's
35:35
Speaker 3: been an absolute pleasure.
35:36
Speaker 1: No problem. Thank you for joining us.
35:39
Speaker 3: Thank you. Okay, then.
35:41
Speaker 2: Bye.
35:41
Speaker 3: Bye. You heard her.
35:43
Speaker 1: Get out there. Live your lives.
35:45
Speaker 2: Be interesting people and open-minded and accepting of others.
35:49
Speaker 1: That's not that much to ask. Otherwise, that about does it.
35:52
Speaker 1: We will return next time. Thanks for listening. This episode
35:55
Speaker 1: is a production of Movie Meltdown. Produced and edited by
35:58
Speaker 1: the Oddity Studios. With music written and performed by Andrea Davidson.
36:03
Speaker 2: For more on how to sponsor or support the show,
36:05
Speaker 2: email producer at newlymeltdown.com.