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The Art of Walking Away (Before You Lose Yourself) with Ashlyn Harris · QUESTION EVERYTHING

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: No one has all the answers, but when we ask
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: the right questions, we get a little closer, closer to truths,
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: closer to each other, even closer to ourselves. I'm journalist
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: Danielle Robe and each week, my guests and I come
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: together to challenge the status quo and our own ways
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: of thinking by daring to ask what if, why not?
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: And who says?
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: So?
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: Come curious, dig deep, and join the conversation. It's time
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: to question everything. Hello, I hope you're having a great week.
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: I am recording this from Miami. I'm hosting it the
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: World Happiness Summit, and after it's over next week I'll
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: debrief on how it was. But for this week, I'm
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: trying to get to the beach, so I am going
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: to jump into this episode.
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: So.
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: I really liked our guests this week. She was fun
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: and I think really honest. You know, there's something that
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: I've come to learn in storytelling or journalism over the
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: last you know, twelve years. I always thought that the
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: more broad a story was, the more relatable. It was, right, like,
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: you didn't you wanted to tell a story that didn't
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: leave anybody out. But it's so interesting the more I
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: do this. The more I know for sure that the
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: more unique and specific a story is, the more universal
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: it is. Think of the books that you love the most,
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: or even the podcast episodes on here that you love
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: the most. I guarantee their stories were super specific, and
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: we all carry our pain or the stories with us
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: so differently. I think some people carry their stories quietly,
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: They move through the world without reviewing the battles that
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: they fought, you know. But Ashlyn Harris is not one
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: of those people. She lives really fiercely, really boldly, really honestly,
• 2:13
  Speaker 1: and in full view of the world, and today she's
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: telling her truth. For decades, she was the last line
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: of defense on the field in love, in life, a
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: goalkeeper with the weight of a national women's soccer team
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: on her back, a warrior in the fight for equality
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: in women's sports, and a mother navigating the complexities of
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: raising children in the public eye with another female athlete.
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: But behind the strength and the accolades, there was something
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: a lot deeper happening.
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: I spent a decade creating a life for myself that
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: I thought was meant for me. That wasn't.
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: She had to walk away from the sport that shaped
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: her from the marriage that no longer fit, from the
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: version of herself that the world wanted her to be,
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: and walking away from things you dedicated your entire life too.
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: That's not just hard, it's excruciated. Today we're going to
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: dive deep because that's who Ashland is. I got the
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: feeling she doesn't really like all that surface stuff. She
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: wants to dive in head first, So you know, I
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: had to meet her in the deep end. I don't
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: know if you guys know this, but I'm fascinated by
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: sports psychology. I had to ask Ashland about the intensity
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: of being an elite athlete. That relentless drive that made
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: her one of the best in the world.
• 3:41
  Speaker 3: Isn't that crazy? One of the best in the world?
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: And how does that same drive make it almost impossible
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: to know when to stop? She's only ever known how
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: to operate at the very highest level.
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: I don't fuck with average people. They make me uncomfortable.
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: I don't like to be in the same rooms, in
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: the same spaces.
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: I told you she wasn't messing around.
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: But when your entire identity is built on pushing through
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: and winning at all costs, what happens when you stop
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: for years, she trained herself to embrace suffering, to expect it.
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: I don't run out to training, I'm like, I'm get
• 4:21
  Speaker 2: out a joyful day. No, I'm gonna suffer. I'm gonna
• 4:24
  Speaker 2: fucking suffer today.
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: And when her marriage started to feel untenable, when she
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: had to face herself outside of her sport, she realized
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: something even more difficult than suffering. She didn't like herself,
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: and that's where the work really began. Today, Ashlyn is
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: talking about something I've never heard her share on camera,
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: her battle with adderall addiction, how she hid it, how
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: she clawed her way back, and how she now protects
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: her peace.
• 4:52
  Speaker 3: She talks about the moment she knew she had to.
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: Leave her marriage, how she protected her children from the storm.
• 4:59
  Speaker 3: She talks about falling.
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: In love with her new partner, Sophia Bush, and why,
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: for the first time, she feels fully seen and fully chosen.
• 5:09
  Speaker 3: I have a feeling y'all really are gonna love her.
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: So if you want some more Ashlyn, She's now telling
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: her own story fully on her own terms. Her new podcast,
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: Wide Open, produced by Ihearts Women's Sports, is a full
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: picture look at her and her guests beyond the headlines
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: just raw conversations about struggle and triumph and joy every
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: single Monday. But this conversation, this one right here, is
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: about reclaiming your own life. One of the things I
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: took from our back and forth is that I think
• 5:42
  Speaker 1: sometimes you have to be brave enough to break your
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: own heart. I'm not sure I've ever been that brave.
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: I look back and I've wanted to be. I've done
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: things that are courageous or I don't know, feels like
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: they're betting on myself. But the courage to break your
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: own heart, to walk away, I don't know. I think
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: I learned from Ashland that sometimes the bravest thing you
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: can do is walk away, and if you do, you
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: just might find yourself again. Oh and she gave us
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: some very important advice. What's something every woman should try once.
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: To be with a woman, We wouldn't have so many
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: unhappy women out there.
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: I had to throw that in there.
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: So the question we're circling today is how do you
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: know when it's time to walk away? This is question
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: everything with Ashland Harris. Let's begin. I was going to
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: start the podcast totally differently, but I noticed your nails.
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: I stopped wearing nail polish. Oh are you a no
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: nail polish person?
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: No, I do nothing.
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: You do nothing absolutely forever and ever, forever and ever.
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: I mean, I guess it's a goalie, you're not really no,
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: I yeah.
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: And you know what the biggest issue for me is
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: I never wore lotion as a player. Okay, oh yeah
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: you can, because it's it would make my glove slimy butterfingers. Yeah,
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: so I am used to like snake skin dry like
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: hands and my partner hates it. She was like, we
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: need to oil those cuticles, we need to put you
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: need lotion, You need lotion, And I'm like, I hate it.
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: That is really funny. I don't touch my hands.
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: So being a goalie completely fascinates me because you are
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: you have this vantage point of the field and the
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: team that nobody else does. You are alone a lot
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: of the times. It's definitely the highest pressure position. Is
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: that something that you were drawn to?
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: Huh? I think it's interesting. I played with boys growing up.
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: I played on all boys teams and that was baseball, Oh,
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: that was basketball, that was soccer, And it got to
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: a point where I really was an angry little kid
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: and I felt like the only way I could hold
• 8:13
  Speaker 2: my own a lot was like I was a little asshole.
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: Like I would fight, I would like slide tackle boys
• 8:20
  Speaker 2: like double both my feet, I'm like, or I'd like
• 8:24
  Speaker 2: scissor both of their legs. I would do crazy stuff
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: to show I belonged, like it was my bossy way
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: to say. They would always make fun of me, like, oh,
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: you a girl on your team, and I'm like, well
• 8:38
  Speaker 2: watch this, y asshole. And I loved the game so much,
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: and I felt so disrespected because I played with boys
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: and I was always made fun of that. I started
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: to foul people so often and get a lot of
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: like yellow and red cards. My coach was like, your liability,
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: We're going to put you in goal because like you
• 8:58
  Speaker 2: can get away with that kind of stuff back there.
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: And also like as I got older, the boys were
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: a little bit faster than me, so I was like
• 9:06
  Speaker 2: always on the ground, always leaving my feet, and my
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: coach was like, you know what, you are born for
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: this position, We're going to put you in it. And
• 9:13
  Speaker 2: I loved it. You liked being alone, or you liked
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: the pressure. I just liked being able to get away
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: with whatever I wanted like I could do anything I could. Yeah,
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: I was left alone. I didn't have to run all
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: over the place. I loved it when you were playing
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: on the women's team.
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: Did you like when you're a goalie you can have
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: ten saves and you let one through and you're the
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: villain of the game.
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah? Does that play a role into your mental
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: health or is it just like no, they always say
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: the best athletes have short term memory.
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: Really, yeah, you have to. They say that about journalists too,
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: really yeah.
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: Oh I love that. Look at us just using the
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: same little, cute little tactics.
• 9:56
  Speaker 4: You know.
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: The thing is the hardest part for a goalkeeper is
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: we're not perfect. None of us are perfect, and we
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: don't get to touch the ball very often. So I
• 10:08
  Speaker 2: had this like really bullish personality and like had this
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: crazy ego in my head that I was like really good,
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: So I like really enjoyed the pressure. I can see
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: people who get so nervous and they make really costly
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: mistakes and then one mistake turns into ten, and I
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: kind of just have this like personality where I'm like,
• 10:33
  Speaker 2: I'm not caring fucking cancer. Like if I make a
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: mistake and a goal goes in my life will go on,
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: my children will still be at home. I still have
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: this beautiful family. Like I always just had a different
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: perspective on life. Soccer was just what I did. It
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: wasn't who I was. I never spoke about soccer outside
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: of my life. I just had a really rich, beautiful,
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: full of substance lifestyle that I never took my job
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: so seriously, so I never put that much pressure on myself.
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: Do you know how rare that is for an elite athlete.
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: Maybe I'm a unicorn.
• 11:10
  Speaker 2: I don't know. Here's another thing, Okay, I'll tell you this,
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: especially someone who's been on camera and you've done this
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: for a long time. I think preparation for me always
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: made me confident and not nervous. I think the only
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: time I'm ever nervous, especially in life, the way I
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: show up if I'm doing a fucking test or if
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: I'm doing like the SATs, I'm only nervous if I'm
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: not prepared period. So I'm never not prepared in soccer.
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: Do you feel that way in life? Though?
• 11:44
  Speaker 3: Now?
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: I do, Like if I show up to an interview
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: and I'm not prepared, I'm a little more nervous. Yeah,
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: but if I'm like, I know my shit, I'm good.
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: I don't have to like question anything. I'm just natural.
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: I love hearing you that because as an outsider, you
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: look like you move through the world with ease, and
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: I think that people that do that actually work really
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: hard behind the scenes, but we don't ever really get
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: to see that. So I think it's cool to hear
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: you talk about it.
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean I'm also like a total basket case
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: and I'm such an emo and impath and everything hurts
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: my feeling. So it's like I told you, I have
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: a lot of personalities. You take everything personally, Oh god, yeah.
• 12:26
  Speaker 4: I mean I could have seven hundred like I'm just
• 12:28
  Speaker 4: like everyone else, Like I could have seven hundred nice
• 12:32
  Speaker 4: comments on a post and one is like really mean
• 12:36
  Speaker 4: and I'm like, oh.
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: That just ruined my day.
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: Thinks Well, the women's team fought for equal pay like
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: it was a World Cup final. Yeah, were you taking
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: it personally? Did you take that fight personally? I think
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: we understood the magnitude. I think we are also just
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: tired of being treated like shit. I think you get
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: to a point where you're just like.
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: Wow, this is really how you view us and how
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: much we show up and how much we win, and
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: how much we sell out stadiums and how little we
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: get paid for it, and how little we complain about it.
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: We just got to the point where like, this is
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: never going to change unless we really double down and
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: do it as a team, and it's going to be painful.
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: But we had such a team that had the right
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: personalities that honestly just didn't give a shit. Like we
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: were like, well, let's risk it all, because what are
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: they going to do? Fire all of us? Then who's
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: going to go win the World Cup? So I think
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: we also had this really crazy ego type of team
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: vibe where we were like, what's the worst thing that
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: can happen?
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: To do it all together is powerful because if one
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: or two people come out, it's too easy to dismiss them.
• 13:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think once we had that conversation as
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: a team, everyone was like, you know, you're stronger in numbers.
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: At the end of the day, everyone knew we're being mistreated. Ever,
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: we're still underpaid. It's not like we've made all these
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: crazy gains like everyone's talking about Caitlin Clark is still
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: making an eighty four thousand dollars a year. Yeah, and
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: making twenty five million outside of sport. It's like Babe
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: Ruth in nineteen thirty made more than eighty thousand dollars.
• 14:19
  Speaker 2: So what progress are we really talking about? I think
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: social Like I think sometimes we equity in sports is
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: really really hard to talk about, period, And I don't
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: think we're anywhere close where we need to be a
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: quality in sport, like we should all have a level
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: playing field. Period. Yeah.
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: Well, to me, your fight was particularly interesting because I
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: don't agree, but I think you can make a case
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: for the WNBA that not as many people show up,
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: it's not making as much money as the men's teams.
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: You were winning more.
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: Than the men's team of people were coming to your games,
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: Like there was really no refuting what you guys were
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: talking about.
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: Numbers don't lie. Well, Also, like the men made more
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: money just to show up and lose, which was like
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: like put that in perspective, that says so much about
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: our culture, like kind of like oh oh oh, And
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: we actually we were with the US team more, We
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: trained more than the men. I mean we used to
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: have like residencies and I spent more time training with
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: that team than I did my club team. That never
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: happens with the men's game. So we were investing and
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: pouring so much more time, Like we played a lot
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: more games. Yeah, and we were like, well, where the
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: hell is all this money going? Years later?
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: Is there something that you feel like we as the
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: public didn't understand about that fight? Were you guys dealing
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: with crazy stuff behind the scenes, Like we're people talking
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: to you crazy, Oh my god.
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: You know, we started sacrificing our ticket sales to go
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: towards lawyer fees. We sacrificed a lot, like it was messy.
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: We said no to a bunch of like behind the
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: scenes docuseries and movies and all of these things, because
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: all it was was bringing more attention to the federation,
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: more money in their pockets and not ours. So we
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: turned down a lot of things, which it's also money.
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: So I do think people don't understand the cost and
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: the time that had to be poured into doing that.
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: I think we didn't realize the magnitude of how big
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: it was going to get. I mean, it was everywhere,
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: and we were also like partying and doing ticker tape
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: parades and chants were going on in the middle of
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: the World Cup, like it got wild at one point,
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: and I remember in the World Cup in twenty nineteen,
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: we had to completely shut down a hotel. Like there
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: was one point where me and Megan Rapino tried to
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: go get coffee or I don't remember if it was
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: like Indian food or something, and we got chased. We
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: had to run, and I was like, what the hell
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: is going on? Are we okay? Like this is serious? Well,
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: they had to like frost the first floor of the hotel,
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: Like it was wild. Did it feel like a windy?
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: It felt like a win that people started to pay attention,
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: and then people started to be like, oh, well, my
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: industry deals with this too, Like let's jump on board.
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: And then we started teaming up with Times, up with
• 17:37
  Speaker 2: like entertainers in Hollywood, and it just became huge.
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's pretty cool that that's part of
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: your legacy. Like not everybody gets to stand for something,
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: and the fact that all of you guys decided to
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: do it, it's just I get chills. It's like pretty miraculous.
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: We have really smart women on our team, Like we
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: have some of the smartest people out there. You played
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: with Hope solo for ten years. Right, So I love
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: Carrie Champion. I saw you on her podcast.
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: It was a great conversation and you were talking to
• 18:12
  Speaker 1: her about how Hope had like a very different style
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: than you did in terms of.
• 18:20
  Speaker 2: Like showing up every day.
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: She kind of stayed to herself, it sounded like, and
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: you were like more gregarious and more part of the team.
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: I know what it's like to have co hosts, and
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: when we have different styles and we show up and
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: it's so vastly different, it's hard for me. Like I
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: start to feel like, because I'm a friendly girl. So
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: if I show up and my co host isn't friendly,
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: I'm like, what is wrong with her?
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: What happens when you two are such prominent people on
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: the team and come from such different ideas of what
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: team means and how to lead.
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that My biggest thing that I had
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: a really big issue with, like as I was behind
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: her for a very long time, is there was one
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: thing I wasn't willing to like compromise, and that was
• 19:14
  Speaker 2: how I showed up in the world and how I
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: moved And like, if you don't like the way like
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: I am, then like unsubscribed like it's not I'm not
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: going to change. And what I loved about her too
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: is like she showed up exactly who she was. And
• 19:35
  Speaker 2: I think the difference between when I was playing and
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: it was like the early I mean I think it
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: was like two thousand and nine twenty ten, every coach
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: was like, you have to be more like Hope Solo. Well,
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: I don't want to fucking be Hope Solo. Coaches said that,
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: oh kay, yeah, he's so offensive. You need to be this,
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: you need to like you like how I trained. They
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: would they were like the next Hope Solo, and I'm like,
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: I just want to fucking be Ashlyn Harris. I don't
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: want to be Hope Solo, and I'm not going to
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: sell myself sold to the devil and try to like
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: be this blend of what you expect. And it's not
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: even about being uncoachable. It's just something I wasn't willing
• 20:20
  Speaker 2: to lose. Like I think in our industry, whether it's
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: sports or entertainment, you have to never like I am
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: the same little grum who grew up in Satellite Beach,
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: Cocoa Beach, Florida. Drop it in on a half pipe,
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: like I just never wanted to lose sight of who
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: I was, where I came from, and I think for
• 20:43
  Speaker 2: a very long time coaches kept being like, you gotta
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: fit this mold, you got to act this way. And
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: what I love most about Emma Hayes when she came
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: in as now the new coach and won the Olympics,
• 20:55
  Speaker 2: she was on Good Morning America and she said, my
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: job is to allow them to be exactly who they are,
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: and that maybe is the secret sauce because I think
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: for so long with the national team there's such rich
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: history of such successful people. It's like, you gotta be
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: like this. You got to be like Abby Womback, you
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: gotta be like Brandy Chastain. Well, no, Megan Rappino is
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: Megan Rappino. You are not going to change her. So
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: you might as well let her bring her full self
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: to the picture and let's like find a balance of
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: good chemistry that is going to make us electric on
• 21:33
  Speaker 2: the field, but not compromise who we are.
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: So I've always I love sports movies and I watch
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: these coaches like Coach Carter, tough on the players, but
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: very inspiring.
• 21:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: I have a friend who plays basketball and he was
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: telling me that growing up, most of his coaches were
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: pretty toxic.
• 21:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, is that a thing? Yeah, absolutely, Kyleie. I just
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: like shock, it's a softer culture. We are in a
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: place where things are easier for the younger generation. And
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: that's okay because I'm sure the older group. You know,
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: when I got on the scene, a lot of these
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: women were used to carrying their own bringing their own water,
• 22:16
  Speaker 2: bringing their own soccer balls, moving goals on and off.
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: Like when I got there, there was equipment mient like
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: doing this, and laundry, dudes doing this, and people they're
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: just fucking everywhere. We didn't have to do anything, which
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: made my life easier. I just had to focus on
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: my performance. So, like, I get it. But these this
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: younger generation, the work ethic is different. Huh. It is
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: just a different mentality, it's a different entitlement. And this
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: is just the evolution of what we do to make
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: life easier for every generation. And we can't like be
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: pissed and disgruntled about it. Like, yeah, the way I
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: was raised was a really in your face type of
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: coaching and the kind of get on the line and
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: run suicides and until you throw up and life is
• 23:15
  Speaker 2: hard and suck it up and rub dirt on it.
• 23:17
  Speaker 2: It was just the different culture. And like kids don't
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: respond to that anymore, Like that's abuse or that's like targeting.
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: As somebody who takes everything personally. Like you said, were
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: you ever upset by them? Or do you feel like
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: it made you a better player?
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: I think the key for a successful player is having
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: to learn your environment. And the coach is different, every
• 23:43
  Speaker 2: team is different, every personality is different, and you like,
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: taken pieces here and they're like, I've had so much information,
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: so many great mentors, so many great coaches, so many
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: great people around me who have lifted me and made
• 24:00
  Speaker 2: me better. And then you know, you kind of take
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: what you think is going to serve you well as
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: a human or you know, hey, I really like that,
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: or I don't like that, or it's like at the end.
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: Of the day, it's up to me, you know. So
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: I grew up playing only solo sports. Love this, No,
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: it's horrible. When I have I hopefully have kids one day,
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: I want them to play team sports. So I have
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: a lot of curiosities around this.
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: Love this.
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: I'm obsessed with great teams. There's this book called Dream Teams.
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: The author is this guy Shane Snow and he breaks
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: down like great teams over the course of history, and
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: what that secret sauce is.
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: It's different for all of them. Okay, Like what is
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: the secret sauce? So that's my question for you. What
• 24:41
  Speaker 2: do you think?
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: I mean, you've been playing a team sport your entire life,
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: and I'm sure you've been on teams that didn't have
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: great camaraderie and teams that just had that that thing.
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, do you know what it is? Huh? I think
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: with the US team we are machines. Like the US
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: women's national team. We don't have the option for second place.
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: It doesn't exist like to us, it's like a participation award,
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: Like I don't even know what that's like. But the
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: expectation is winning at all costs, Like you sacrifice yourself,
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: your family, your own wants and needs for the greater
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: good of that team. And that's what it takes to
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: be a champion. And we just we understood it. We
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: knew that no one was cheating the system when people
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: weren't watching, we were doing the work. We trained harder,
• 25:41
  Speaker 2: we just didn't cut corners, and we knew what it
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: took to win. And we weren't. We would never be
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: settled with anything less than that. And it was this
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: like competitive spirit that we were just we had this
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: mentality and we say this often. We could have been
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: down three to zero in a game and at halftime
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: we're like we walk in and we're like, we're gonna
• 26:05
  Speaker 2: win this thing.
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: I'm not.
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: Are you stressed? You really think we were not going
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: to score one goal this entire game? Like we just
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: had that kind of mentality that has had been instilled
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: in us for so long that we always expected and
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: thought we would win.
• 26:21
  Speaker 1: Do you try and instill that in your kids, because
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: that's so powerful, Like I think at half of achieving
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: anything is just believing you can. Yeah, And that's a
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: very rare thing for like all to talk about imposter
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: syndrome all this stuff in our culture nowadays.
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: Like I feel like people need that. Yeah, I do,
• 26:38
  Speaker 2: I think. But here's here's the difference. Like we did
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: the work right, Like people say that, you know, I
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: want to do this and I want this, ah, but
• 26:49
  Speaker 2: it's like what are you Are you willing to risk
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: it all at all costs to go for it right?
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: And not many people feel like they give themselves permission
• 27:02
  Speaker 2: to do that and listen, that's a whole other topic.
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: I think there are great qualities that served us as
• 27:09
  Speaker 2: professional athletes and absolutely hinder us as normal moving people
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: in the world. I have a lot of unlearning to do.
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: Why do you want to unlearn? Because I have a
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: certain expectation. I only know what it's like to live
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: at the top and the air is very thin, and
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: I choose to be exceptional every single day, Like it
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: is literally a choice, Like I don't know what it's
• 27:38
  Speaker 2: like just to choose to be average. Like I don't
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: fuck with average people. They make me uncomfortable. I don't
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: like to be in the same rooms, in the same spaces.
• 27:47
  Speaker 2: I think, like it's contagious. It's just yeah, I don't know,
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: but it's also not not everyone moves in the world
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: the way I do, and I have to be able
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: to be okay with that. Like, think about it, I
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: had the most exceptional twenty three players in the world,
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: because it's not just the US. I had the best
• 28:09
  Speaker 2: team in the world. We were the best team in
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: the world. Everything I did and how I moved every
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: day was the most exceptional people. So I don't understand
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: how to be and be amongst people who just are like,
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: you know, I'm fucking good. I just want to like
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: show up, do my nine to five, and leave. But
• 28:32
  Speaker 2: do you really want to understand that I do? Because
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: I think as you become a business person and you
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: start running businesses and you start building and you start
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: being in rooms that not everyone moves and shows up
• 28:49
  Speaker 2: the way I do, and that's okay, And I have
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: to learn, like still how to get the best of
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: people who maybe don't know how to choose greatness just yet,
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: or they don't see themselves that way just yet.
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: I really like that I have a low tolerance for
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: it as well, So I'm actually kind of learning from
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: you in this moment.
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And I like that's the thing that's where like
• 29:13
  Speaker 2: your ego kind of I have to leave it at
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: the door. Like I had this insane ego that I
• 29:20
  Speaker 2: could accomplish everything in anything I put my mind to,
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: and it was really simple. I just did the work
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: no one else was willing to do. And if one
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: door shut, like I always found a different path. I
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: think in life there's two types of people. When you
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: see a speed bump, do you go around it because
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: you don't want to hit the bumps. I'm fucking charging
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: that thing. I'm catching air girl, I'm like in it.
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: So I just think I also have to check my
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: ego and say not everyone has to be and live
• 29:54
  Speaker 2: up to the standards that I place on myself, and
• 29:59
  Speaker 2: that could be a huge turn off for a lot
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: of people. I have a question about hard work versus talent.
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I was thinking about this last night because I
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: really love Doci. I feel like she's like our generation's
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: Missy Elliott in some ways, and it's just it oozes
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: out of her, like that's I don't know how hard
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: she works. She seems like she works hard, but she
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: has just this natural talent. Yeah, somebody like Jennifer Lopez.
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: I used to work at Entertainment Tonight and I would
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: stay and listen to interviews late and she always talked
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: about how she was like I'm she said it herself,
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: I'm not the most talented singer, but I work harder
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: than everybody else. She's gotten pretty far too. There's hard
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: work and then there's just like natural talent. Does there
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: have to be a combination of both to be at
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: the highest level of whatever professions you do.
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: Everyone's talented, but do you see players that just like
• 30:54
  Speaker 2: oohs it, Like you're like, oh my god, how do
• 30:56
  Speaker 2: they like? Running that fast? Is just so easy to them? Well,
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: that's what I love. I say this all the time.
• 31:01
  Speaker 2: You know, we throw around the term potential in sports.
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: Potential just means you're not worth shit. Now potential means
• 31:10
  Speaker 2: nothing like, yeah, we all have potential, but like, what
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: are you willing to do to get there? Right? Are
• 31:17
  Speaker 2: you willing to do the shit no one else is
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: willing to do? Do you cut corners? Do you expect
• 31:24
  Speaker 2: other people to do things for you? Like? I don't know,
• 31:29
  Speaker 2: I was just a kid that was like, I'm going
• 31:32
  Speaker 2: to do this on my own. I'm going to do
• 31:34
  Speaker 2: it my way, and I'm yeah, I'm gonna while everyone's sleeping,
• 31:38
  Speaker 2: I'm working hard. Like I literally never questioned how hard
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: I was working, and that, I think is what kept
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: me so driven and at the top, I always felt
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: like someone was chasing me. Were they? I don't know,
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: I mean I felt like it. You know, it's it's
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: just like we're so replaceable, Like anyone everyone's talented at
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: the top, it is so easy to be replaced. So
• 32:07
  Speaker 2: it's like, what do you bring to the table that
• 32:11
  Speaker 2: maybe is a different piece of the pie that's gonna
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: make the entire group move and function better as a collective.
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: Like that's the secret sauce.
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: House post soccer life, is it more joyful?
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think joy is a hard word for me.
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: I think joy is a practice art for me. I
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: feel much calmer and I feel more at home and
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: suffering and pain because that is the unlearning I will
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: have to do as a professional athlete. I don't run
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: out to training and I'm like, I'm gonna have a
• 32:47
  Speaker 2: joyful day. No, I'm gonna suffer. I'm gonna fucking suffer
• 32:50
  Speaker 2: today and it's gonna be hard. And once I feel
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: like I'm about to hit that brick wall, I have
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: to go through it right. And it's like I went
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: to North Carolina. I went to Carolina. I won three
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: national championships. My coach, Anson Drance, was one of the
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: most incredible humans I have ever got the pleasure to
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: be around for an extended period of time. And he
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: would always say during fitness day, you'll pass out before
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: you die. So I feel okay that when you feel
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: like you're gonna die, you'll pass out before that happens,
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: and it's like we would run until we could we
• 33:28
  Speaker 2: were empty, like we were peeing ourselves and we were
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: throwing up, and it's like that's what sports, that's what
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: we show these kids. What it takes, no pay, no gain,
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: you know, all the stupid shit we say. So yeah,
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: we find more. If I could sit in a dark hole,
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: I feel it. I feel as calm as you, as
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: fucking you would believe. It's wild. Is your family like that?
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: Is that like a thing?
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: Or is just it?
• 34:02
  Speaker 4: No?
• 34:03
  Speaker 2: Like even my partner now, she's like, I can't work
• 34:07
  Speaker 2: out with you. You're unbearable, And I'm like, oh why
• 34:12
  Speaker 2: because your ability to want to suffer and then like you,
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: it's almost like you punish yourself. But I'm not going
• 34:20
  Speaker 2: to a gym to work out to just be like,
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: oh I don't want to be able to sit on
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: the toilet the next day like always. Yeah you can't
• 34:28
  Speaker 2: just take a little No, do not play me in
• 34:31
  Speaker 2: ping pong, do not. I am a liability. But you're
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: so competitive and everything. I can't do anything with my friends.
• 34:37
  Speaker 2: I love people like you. Yeah no, no, no, like
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: like you were good at badminton in school. I think
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: I'm better that and that than everyone at anything. That
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: is my problem, and I am so cuckoos. Like in
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: New York everyone walks fast. Yeah, I'm not a fast
• 34:54
  Speaker 2: walker from sunny Cocoa Beach, Florida. Surfer girl just always
• 34:59
  Speaker 2: like oh, when people are walking faster than me, or
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: trying to go upstairs faster than me, I will fucking run.
• 35:07
  Speaker 2: I'm nuts on the streets. Even if you don't need
• 35:11
  Speaker 2: to mush no, I will beat you. How Darry walk
• 35:14
  Speaker 2: past me, their legs are longer and you're still guys.
• 35:18
  Speaker 2: I am a competitor. It's awful.
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: So you announced your retirement in twenty twenty two and
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: you said soccer wasn't enough. I think that's a pretty
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: big statement for somebody to say. When I interview people
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: that are at the elite level of anything, it many
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: times is their life like it is enough. It fed
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: everything that they were ever running towards. When did you
• 35:42
  Speaker 1: first feel like something was missing?
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: Sports for me was a means to an end. Sports
• 35:50
  Speaker 2: it was my ticket out of my circumstance at home.
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: It was a way to get an education. It was
• 35:58
  Speaker 2: a way to make sure I was able to provide
• 36:02
  Speaker 2: for myself. And for my family, and I wanted a
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: better life than what I saw as a kid. I
• 36:10
  Speaker 2: just had a different mindset because sport was such a
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: necessity for me to not become a statistic, to not
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: become a drug addict, to not be fucking around on
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: the streets. Like I didn't know you grew up like that.
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: It's not that I grew up like that. It was
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: a tough time. Like my dad was hit by a
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: boat when I was very young, and he could you know,
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: had to be in the hospital for a very long
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: time and lost his business, and we lost our house,
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: and my parents lost their fucking mind. And yeah, and
• 36:49
  Speaker 2: it affects, you know, life, things you can't predict or plan.
• 36:55
  Speaker 2: It affects everyone. And everyone's doing the best they can
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: with what being dealt. But you have young kids who
• 37:02
  Speaker 2: are watching it, and I think I've had not I
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: think I've had addiction issues, which for me is just
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: unfiltered pain. It really is, like you know, my brother's
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: going through it right now, and it's it's just and
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: I say this to them all the time, and you know,
• 37:20
  Speaker 2: we spoke about this earlier, like we have to do
• 37:25
  Speaker 2: the work, We have to really unpack the things that
• 37:30
  Speaker 2: scar us and we carry it, you know, a lot
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: in our lives. And I never took soccer too seriously
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: because for me, it was like, great, I can't my
• 37:41
  Speaker 2: family can't pay for an education. Great, I'll just get
• 37:45
  Speaker 2: a soccer scholarship. People seem to really think I'm doing
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: something here, and that's just the way I kind of rolled.
• 37:52
  Speaker 2: I was like, this is my ticket out.
• 37:54
  Speaker 1: But it's added pressure though, because because like what if
• 37:58
  Speaker 1: you lose your soccer scholarship.
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: I've dealt with a lot worse things than that. I
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: am one of those people that will always find a way.
• 38:06
  Speaker 2: I think I'm not scared to fail. I don't know,
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: like I'm not scared, like what I've already been on
• 38:15
  Speaker 2: food stamps. I've already been on government money. Like I've
• 38:18
  Speaker 2: already watched, you know, my dad go bankrupt in the
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: happ Like I've already seen so much bad that like
• 38:29
  Speaker 2: what's the worst, what's the worst that could happen? You know?
• 38:32
  Speaker 2: And I'm lucky enough I have an education I valued
• 38:36
  Speaker 2: as an athlete, not building for four years of my life,
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: but forty Like I really am a creative human. I'm
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: an educated woman, Like I just have so many assets
• 38:49
  Speaker 2: to contribute to the world that like playing a little
• 38:52
  Speaker 2: soccer doesn't define like me or the way I parent
• 38:58
  Speaker 2: or the way I show up as a partner. Like
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: I just love life and I want to live it
• 39:04
  Speaker 2: to the fullest, and I don't take my job so seriously.
• 39:07
  Speaker 2: And I think that is the problem why you see
• 39:10
  Speaker 2: so many athletes go into like serious addiction issues, and
• 39:15
  Speaker 2: so much of their identity is wrapped up in what
• 39:18
  Speaker 2: they do. I'm like, bro, you're not curing cancer. That
• 39:21
  Speaker 2: would give me stress, you know if I'm like having
• 39:25
  Speaker 2: to find the COVID vaccine and this epidemic, and then yeah,
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: I'm stressed. When did you start going to therapy? Wow?
• 39:33
  Speaker 2: I started therapy very young, when I started acting out
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: when my parents were going through like a really bad time.
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: I think fifteen, I started to go to therapy, and
• 39:49
  Speaker 2: then I went into it, and I kind of got
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: away from it. Then I went into it in college,
• 39:55
  Speaker 2: got back into it because I was like getting really
• 39:57
  Speaker 2: heavily addicted to adderall and misusing it. And then you know,
• 40:03
  Speaker 2: started having kids and life was wild. Had access to
• 40:07
  Speaker 2: every sports psychologist, and then you know, my life started changing.
• 40:13
  Speaker 2: My marriage started failing, and then that's when everything picked
• 40:17
  Speaker 2: back up. I was like, wow, I have a lot
• 40:18
  Speaker 2: of work to do.
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: That adderall was did you start taking it because of
• 40:24
  Speaker 1: like the crazy hours that you had or wait or
• 40:28
  Speaker 1: what was the Just.
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: Like I think I just love to party. I loved
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: being out. I mean I was just taking it all
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: the time. I would go days without sleeping. It was wild,
• 40:42
  Speaker 2: like I would take it before fitness to I mean
• 40:45
  Speaker 2: I felt like I was going to give myself a
• 40:46
  Speaker 2: heart attack, but I was crushing it. I was snorting it.
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: It was like it was so problematic. Then I was like, oh,
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: it makes me skinny, it curbs my appetite. I mean
• 40:58
  Speaker 2: it was just a talk sick, toxic time for me
• 41:02
  Speaker 2: because it was the first time that I started to
• 41:06
  Speaker 2: have my character tested because I started to get injured.
• 41:10
  Speaker 2: I tore both my acls in college. So I was
• 41:13
  Speaker 2: this like prodigy, four time All American, and you know,
• 41:18
  Speaker 2: I was could go to any college I wanted. I
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: was playing for the youth national team, getting invited to
• 41:26
  Speaker 2: play with the full squad, and then boom one ACL,
• 41:31
  Speaker 2: boom another ACL. Then I ripped my labrum off of
• 41:34
  Speaker 2: my head. Then I mean just was one thing after another,
• 41:38
  Speaker 2: and I was like, oh, so this is like the reality.
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: Maybe I'm not gonna have the life I imagine. And
• 41:47
  Speaker 2: then I dug into After I pulled myself out of
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: a really really dark hole, I like really focused on
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: my academics and I graduated Carolina with honors above three
• 42:00
  Speaker 2: point five GPA. Like I just turned all my focus
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: into my studies. Did you just go cold turkey one
• 42:07
  Speaker 2: day a little bit? Yeah? Yeah, I had to. It
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: got really really dark. Yeah, and then like I had
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: to make some serious adjustments and antson would have me
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: read books, and I started reading like this, this this
• 42:23
  Speaker 2: book called man Searches for Meaning and it's literally about
• 42:27
  Speaker 2: suffering and putting it reframing it and changed my life.
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: Do you feel like you've been through a lot? I
• 42:35
  Speaker 2: think we all, I mean that's life. I think we
• 42:38
  Speaker 2: all have a story. I think we all go through
• 42:42
  Speaker 2: a lot of heartache and pain and beautiful moments, and
• 42:46
  Speaker 2: I think that's what creates us. Like a lot of
• 42:49
  Speaker 2: people are always like, wow, you're so wise, so wise,
• 42:55
  Speaker 2: so wise. Way you show up. I'm like, I just
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: really lived. I'm thirty nine, but I've lived a hard,
• 43:03
  Speaker 2: long life with everything and anything in between it, and
• 43:08
  Speaker 2: I just like have a choice every day how I
• 43:10
  Speaker 2: want to show up. But that's the thing.
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: Not everybody takes the pain and tries to turn something
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: or turn it into something. One of the things that
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: I noticed when I was preparing for this conversation is
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: you are really dedicated to personal growth. Is that a
• 43:31
  Speaker 1: must when you wake up every morning or is it?
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: Like where is that coming from? Do you enjoy teaching
• 43:38
  Speaker 1: people things? I think that I have a lot.
• 43:40
  Speaker 2: Of trauma in my life, and I think I have
• 43:44
  Speaker 2: a lot of scars. I have a lot of wounds,
• 43:48
  Speaker 2: and I do not want to project and place that
• 43:52
  Speaker 2: on my children. I think when you become a mom
• 43:55
  Speaker 2: and you're molding young humans, your perspective life changes a lot.
• 44:01
  Speaker 2: You have to get your shit together because they see
• 44:03
  Speaker 2: and hear everything, and I want to model for them.
• 44:10
  Speaker 2: I just want to give my kids the best tools
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: to be whoever they want to be. But at the
• 44:16
  Speaker 2: core of them, they need to be good people. They
• 44:20
  Speaker 2: have to be good people. How they serve their community,
• 44:24
  Speaker 2: how they show up for their friends, like that matters.
• 44:28
  Speaker 2: Like I'm not asking you know. When I was a kid,
• 44:31
  Speaker 2: it was like, you want to be a pros soccer player,
• 44:34
  Speaker 2: Like I'd write that on all my papers. I wanted
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: to be like a police you know man of a
• 44:41
  Speaker 2: time that's a you know, police officer, fire fighter, Like
• 44:44
  Speaker 2: I wanted to be all these people. And when I'm
• 44:47
  Speaker 2: actually teaching my children is like I always we have
• 44:51
  Speaker 2: rules and kindness is contagious, kindness is currency, like we
• 44:56
  Speaker 2: have words like of affirmation, and I want my children
• 45:01
  Speaker 2: to want to be good people.
• 45:05
  Speaker 1: You know, all the things you mentioned are people of service. Yeah,
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: so that must be a big thing for you.
• 45:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I think there's no coincidence of why I'm such
• 45:15
  Speaker 2: a big activist in my community. I'm lucky enough to
• 45:19
  Speaker 2: have won at every level. I don't have one trophy
• 45:22
  Speaker 2: up in my house. I have my gold medals rotting
• 45:26
  Speaker 2: in my closet and a ziploc bag Like that's just
• 45:29
  Speaker 2: not my late legacy. What for to fucking collect dust
• 45:33
  Speaker 2: on a shelf? Like I just don't care. And that's
• 45:37
  Speaker 2: why I laughing. Cool, But that's why I laugh with you.
• 45:39
  Speaker 2: I'm like, I'm not cool. You want a medal? Cool?
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: But I'm the same way. I like no pretense. Yeah,
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: but where does that come from?
• 45:51
  Speaker 2: I'm on this pursuit of excellence, not just in my career,
• 45:56
  Speaker 2: but in my life. I want to be the best
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: fucking mom. I want to be the best partner. I
• 46:01
  Speaker 2: want to be the best friend. I want to be
• 46:03
  Speaker 2: the best daughter and the best sister. And I get
• 46:06
  Speaker 2: it wrong all the time, but I learn from it
• 46:09
  Speaker 2: and I grow and it's uncomfortable, and it's like I
• 46:11
  Speaker 2: stretch myself and I learn, and I learn and I
• 46:14
  Speaker 2: learn and I dive in and like, I think that's
• 46:18
  Speaker 2: the beauty of evolving. Like I want to evolve as
• 46:22
  Speaker 2: a human. I don't want to stay the same. And
• 46:26
  Speaker 2: I work on myself because I'm a reflection of what
• 46:30
  Speaker 2: my children see. And that's in my relationships. How I
• 46:33
  Speaker 2: show up for friends, how I show up for them,
• 46:36
  Speaker 2: how I show up and work my ass off for work.
• 46:38
  Speaker 2: They see it for the first time in me. So
• 46:42
  Speaker 2: I want to be the best version of myself for them.
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: You know that friend who always has the best cocktails
• 46:51
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• 47:24
  Speaker 1: seeds Diagio, New York, New York. Your podcast Wide Open
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: makes more sense to me now because I was thinking
• 47:35
  Speaker 1: you could have chosen a lot of different avenues, but
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: you really have something to say and share with the world.
• 47:42
  Speaker 2: I do. I live life through storytelling, and I find
• 47:46
  Speaker 2: that we are in a really, really bad mental health
• 47:53
  Speaker 2: crisis because of social media, because we're able to portray
• 48:00
  Speaker 2: this bullshit fake life that doesn't exist we like, of
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: course I could on my social media, I could put
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: every highlight reel to make myself look like I got
• 48:11
  Speaker 2: no problems. But that's just not like, that's not life.
• 48:16
  Speaker 2: Like life is full of suffering. Life is full of
• 48:20
  Speaker 2: ups and downs, and like I rather be prepared for
• 48:24
  Speaker 2: it and have the tools like I had this this
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: analogy I said the other day, and I fucking came
• 48:31
  Speaker 2: to be out of nowhere. But like I said, if
• 48:33
  Speaker 2: I'm a firefighter running into a fire, I better have
• 48:36
  Speaker 2: all the equipment on or I'm gonna fucking burn. And
• 48:39
  Speaker 2: that's how I show up for life. I need all
• 48:42
  Speaker 2: the tools and I need to do all the work.
• 48:46
  Speaker 2: So I'm strapped and ready for whatever life gives me.
• 48:49
  Speaker 2: And it's not always good. Why'd you name it wide open?
• 48:53
  Speaker 2: Wide open? For me because of my sports sports background
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: and the context, being wide open is really like separating
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: yourself from the pack right seizing the opportunity or the
• 49:05
  Speaker 2: moment to execute. But for me, like I see people
• 49:10
  Speaker 2: like I love storytelling, like I will sit whether it's
• 49:15
  Speaker 2: three minutes with you, thirty seconds with you, three hours
• 49:18
  Speaker 2: with you, and I'm gonna look you in the eyes.
• 49:19
  Speaker 2: I'm going to meet you right where you're at. And
• 49:22
  Speaker 2: if we have to cry together, let's cry together. If
• 49:24
  Speaker 2: we want to laugh, if we want to talk shit,
• 49:26
  Speaker 2: We're going to do it together. And I'm going to
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: meet you right where you are because I do feel
• 49:32
  Speaker 2: that life is meant to be led with people, and like,
• 49:37
  Speaker 2: what's the best thing we can give that's like I
• 49:42
  Speaker 2: just want to give people my time.
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: I just had this light ball moment as you were speaking,
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: because I got to meet you at shine Away originally
• 49:49
  Speaker 1: and you and Sophia left and everybody I was with me,
• 49:53
  Speaker 1: we had to be there all day.
• 49:55
  Speaker 2: They were like.
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: Everyone was like there was like a thing, like it
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: was a magnetism. And there were a ton of people
• 50:03
  Speaker 1: there that day and they were left talking about you,
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: and I was thinking to myself, she's really beautiful, she's
• 50:10
  Speaker 1: well dressed, Like is it the vibe?
• 50:13
  Speaker 2: Like what is it?
• 50:14
  Speaker 1: And it's that it's because you are present and you
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: see people and you are so there. Yeah, and that
• 50:21
  Speaker 1: is the magic.
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I think it's a gift. I do. Yeah. I
• 50:24
  Speaker 2: don't think too. I don't think it's a coincidence. I
• 50:27
  Speaker 2: think we all are so unique and the way we
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: show up and it's like, find your gift. Soccer was
• 50:34
  Speaker 2: never my fucking gift. It's not my gift to the world.
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: It was the avenue. Yeah, what I will never forget.
• 50:42
  Speaker 2: It allows me to sit in rooms, to be able
• 50:45
  Speaker 2: to talk about the things I've experienced in life, Yeah,
• 50:51
  Speaker 2: and really connect with people on a deep, rich level
• 50:54
  Speaker 2: because like that's what life is like. I'm not above anyone.
• 51:00
  Speaker 2: I don't have it all right. I'm very open with
• 51:02
  Speaker 2: my children. If I need to cry, I fucking cry
• 51:05
  Speaker 2: in front of my daughter. I'm not a holder, and
• 51:08
  Speaker 2: I'll cry and then she'll say, Mama, are you not happy?
• 51:12
  Speaker 2: And I have to explain to her that sometimes it's
• 51:17
  Speaker 2: okay to just let it out, like mama has hard
• 51:20
  Speaker 2: days too, not a reflection of you. I'm not sad
• 51:24
  Speaker 2: because of you. I'm not sad because of this or that.
• 51:27
  Speaker 2: It's an emotional process. I'm just letting it come out
• 51:31
  Speaker 2: of my body. And for me, I don't want to
• 51:33
  Speaker 2: teach my children to be perfect. We're not perfect humans.
• 51:37
  Speaker 2: Like I want to show them what strong looks like,
• 51:42
  Speaker 2: what bravery looks like. Well, also like empathy and sadness
• 51:47
  Speaker 2: and all the things that life gives us, like I'm
• 51:51
  Speaker 2: not going to hide it from them. You've had such
• 51:54
  Speaker 2: a transformative few years. Do you feel like there's a
• 51:56
  Speaker 2: part of you that you're learning to embrace recently? You
• 52:01
  Speaker 2: know what, I'm doing a better job protecting my peace.
• 52:04
  Speaker 2: I'm doing a better job with that house. There are
• 52:07
  Speaker 2: more headlines about you than ever before. Well fair it
• 52:11
  Speaker 2: doesn't help that I'm dating someone who happens to be
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: clickbait clearly for every fucking tabloid. But honestly, I'm happy
• 52:22
  Speaker 2: and I am in a position now where I can
• 52:26
  Speaker 2: protect that joy and happiness. And I think it takes
• 52:30
  Speaker 2: a lot of work, because I'm not going to say, like,
• 52:32
  Speaker 2: I am human and things hurt and things do penetrate, Yeah,
• 52:36
  Speaker 2: but I just protect my overall bubble. Everything has gotten
• 52:41
  Speaker 2: tight and small and intentional, and it's okay to make
• 52:51
  Speaker 2: big changes in your life if they bring you joy
• 52:56
  Speaker 2: and they are right for you. I've made a lot
• 52:59
  Speaker 2: of hard decisions to change my life where it wasn't
• 53:04
  Speaker 2: serving me, and now my boundaries are very clear. It's
• 53:08
  Speaker 2: not me being disrespectful or oh she just doesn't talk
• 53:12
  Speaker 2: to this, or you know, like friends come in and out.
• 53:15
  Speaker 2: I think we all need to learn. This is one
• 53:18
  Speaker 2: of the greatest Like Anson gave me this advice when
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: I was younger, because I was, you know, doing I
• 53:25
  Speaker 2: was into all the fucking things I shouldn't have been into,
• 53:28
  Speaker 2: and he was like, you're an average of like the
• 53:30
  Speaker 2: five people you surround yourself. Why do you surround yourself
• 53:34
  Speaker 2: with those kind of people like find the smartest people
• 53:37
  Speaker 2: in the room, sit with them, be friends with the scientists,
• 53:40
  Speaker 2: be friends with the doctors, like and it's the truth.
• 53:43
  Speaker 2: It's like, now I'm in a position where I can
• 53:47
  Speaker 2: choose who comes into my space, and I choose wisely. Yeah,
• 53:51
  Speaker 2: and I know that like hurts people's feelings. But at
• 53:54
  Speaker 2: the end of the day, like, I am such a giver,
• 53:58
  Speaker 2: and I am in industry with such takers, like I
• 54:02
  Speaker 2: have to protect my piece and energy.
• 54:04
  Speaker 1: But this is a different sort of tune than I
• 54:08
  Speaker 1: heard a year ago because that interview with Carrie Champion,
• 54:11
  Speaker 1: you said you didn't like yourself. No, I like almost
• 54:15
  Speaker 1: teared up hearing that, because.
• 54:16
  Speaker 2: Like, because you give so much, I couldn't believe you
• 54:20
  Speaker 2: didn't like the person you were. Well, I spent a
• 54:25
  Speaker 2: decade creating a life for myself that I thought was
• 54:29
  Speaker 2: meant for me that wasn't. And I built this beautiful
• 54:35
  Speaker 2: life with these beautiful kids and their mom. Once I
• 54:39
  Speaker 2: got in the walls of it, I was like, I
• 54:41
  Speaker 2: don't belong here. Like it's the most like, yeah, I mean,
• 54:45
  Speaker 2: it's the scariest thing to come to realize. It's hard
• 54:49
  Speaker 2: because as women, it's not easy for us to do
• 54:53
  Speaker 2: the brave thing we're taught that like especially and this
• 54:57
  Speaker 2: is the unlearning. Like I played a team sport, my
• 55:01
  Speaker 2: shit and struggle can't impact other people, right, My job
• 55:07
  Speaker 2: is to show up and leave my bullshit at the
• 55:10
  Speaker 2: door and give this team what it needs in this moment.
• 55:14
  Speaker 2: Come to find out in therapy working on myself, it's
• 55:18
  Speaker 2: a really fucking toxic trait because my problem is I
• 55:22
  Speaker 2: rather lose myself in the process to serve the team
• 55:26
  Speaker 2: than myself. Of course, I hated myself. I didn't even
• 55:30
  Speaker 2: know who I was. What was the spark for you? Then?
• 55:33
  Speaker 2: I don't know if there's necessarily a spark. I think
• 55:37
  Speaker 2: it comes to a point where you are at the
• 55:42
  Speaker 2: end of the rope and you either put it around
• 55:44
  Speaker 2: your neck or you drop it. That's where I was.
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: You were that on hippy or I was miserable. I'm
• 55:49
  Speaker 2: so sorry. I wanted more for myself and I wanted
• 55:53
  Speaker 2: more for my children on what their expectation of love is. Like,
• 56:00
  Speaker 2: how am I going to try to teach my four
• 56:02
  Speaker 2: year old daughter about being like strong and independent and
• 56:07
  Speaker 2: loving her body and her and herself and her worth
• 56:10
  Speaker 2: and all these things? When I fucking hated myself even
• 56:13
  Speaker 2: though you didn't like yourself, Did you love yourself still
• 56:16
  Speaker 2: or no? Like, did you let things go, like things
• 56:19
  Speaker 2: that make you happy, like eating well and working out?
• 56:22
  Speaker 2: And yeah, I mean I was a mess. I looked terrible.
• 56:26
  Speaker 2: I gained weight, I wasn't working out like, I wasn't
• 56:29
  Speaker 2: eating healthy, like I was using a lot of like
• 56:35
  Speaker 2: smoking a lot, and just numbing, just unprocessed pain. Yeah.
• 56:41
  Speaker 2: I think in therapy when I finally heard my therapist
• 56:44
  Speaker 2: say to me, is this the type of relationship you
• 56:49
  Speaker 2: would want for your daughter? I was like, oh fuck,
• 56:52
  Speaker 2: Like what Glennon Doyle say that once? In it not
• 56:54
  Speaker 2: off my chair, but it's the truth. It really is
• 56:57
  Speaker 2: the truth. Like so much much of who we are
• 57:01
  Speaker 2: as moms is really trying to give the best to
• 57:04
  Speaker 2: our children, but weirdly not willing to give the best
• 57:09
  Speaker 2: and feed yourself. You know, there's a reason why they're like,
• 57:12
  Speaker 2: put your oxygen mask on first before you help anyone else.
• 57:17
  Speaker 2: And I think for so long I was catering to
• 57:21
  Speaker 2: the needs of everyone around me but my own, and
• 57:23
  Speaker 2: I lost myself in the process. Well, you lost two
• 57:26
  Speaker 2: big parts.
• 57:27
  Speaker 1: Of your identity at once, even though I know you
• 57:29
  Speaker 1: said you don't put that much stock in soccer. Like
• 57:32
  Speaker 1: your career and your marriage kind of all unraveled around
• 57:36
  Speaker 1: the same time. Did it feel like you were uncovering
• 57:39
  Speaker 1: parts of yourself in this process or were you always
• 57:42
  Speaker 1: there and you were just rebuilding.
• 57:44
  Speaker 2: I don't really know. I don't feel any kind of way.
• 57:47
  Speaker 2: Like when I walked off the field, you know, when
• 57:50
  Speaker 2: you see people who like really tear up and really
• 57:52
  Speaker 2: like take a moment and have a retirement game. I
• 57:56
  Speaker 2: had another year like on my contract. I just like
• 57:59
  Speaker 2: didn't enjoy it. Mm hmm. And like if I'm not
• 58:01
  Speaker 2: enjoying it, that means like I'm not a good energy
• 58:06
  Speaker 2: or light to be around, because I'm not Like if
• 58:08
  Speaker 2: I'm not enjoying it and I'm away from my children,
• 58:13
  Speaker 2: you know, it's not like I made life changing money
• 58:16
  Speaker 2: for me. It just like it wasn't fun, and it
• 58:17
  Speaker 2: wasn't fun for a long time, and I felt like
• 58:21
  Speaker 2: I had to do it, Like I felt like this,
• 58:23
  Speaker 2: well this, you know, I got to live this long
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: career and I've got to check all these boxes. And
• 58:28
  Speaker 2: I was tired of fighting. I think that's what people
• 58:31
  Speaker 2: don't realize. I was tired of fighting every day for
• 58:35
  Speaker 2: the most basic shit like good accommodations, good food. Just
• 58:40
  Speaker 2: like in women's sports, everything is a fight. Wow. At
• 58:44
  Speaker 2: some point, you're just like this is just taking so
• 58:47
  Speaker 2: much energy and I'm not enjoying being in the space anymore.
• 58:52
  Speaker 2: I just like, I gotta get out. That's crazy that
• 58:56
  Speaker 2: that wore you down. Oh, I was exhausted. I was
• 58:58
  Speaker 2: just so tired of the be Yes, does any part
• 59:01
  Speaker 2: of you want to do it on your own? Like
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: would you ever kind of try and build out your
• 59:07
  Speaker 2: own program? Or is that they always say if you're
• 59:10
  Speaker 2: a billionaire and you want to become a millionaire, buy
• 59:13
  Speaker 2: a team. It's the best way to lose money. So
• 59:17
  Speaker 2: I'm good, got it, and I don't have billions at
• 59:20
  Speaker 2: dollars to piss away. So I think for me right now,
• 59:24
  Speaker 2: I have a lot of healing to do. I think
• 59:27
  Speaker 2: there's no coincidence why so many players step away from
• 59:32
  Speaker 2: the game and don't really come back. You see that
• 59:36
  Speaker 2: a lot. You're right, think about it right, Think about
• 59:38
  Speaker 2: like Abby womback, think about Lauren Cheney holiday now, you know,
• 59:44
  Speaker 2: even look at Megan Rapino, Like Alex Morgan is really
• 59:48
  Speaker 2: heavily involved, and you know, always has been in investing
• 59:52
  Speaker 2: money into women's sports. But I think we have to
• 59:56
  Speaker 2: heal and take space to appreciate the pain, the struggle,
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 2: the sacrifice, the joys, like all of the things in between.
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 2: It is it's like it's like a breakup. Yeah, it's
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 2: a process. It sounds like it the way you described
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 2: it. It is.
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 1: You've gone on record in almost every interview talking about
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 1: your divorce. I'm so curious about how you decide to
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 1: talk about it because I think if I were you,
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 1: I'd be so nervous about every Like how do I
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 1: even describe all of this?
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 2: I mean, I heal by like talking about it, and yeah,
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 2: you know a lot of people go through it, Like
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 2: a lot of people have gone through such pain and
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 2: making hard decisions and somewhat very selfish decisions, And I like,
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 2: I don't have anything bad to say. Like the difference is,
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 2: yeah I talk about it, but I talk about how
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 2: great she is. All I want is for her to
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 2: be happy. Yeah, just wasn't with me, And that's okay,
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 2: Like that is okay. We have two beautiful children that
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 2: I am absolutely obsessed with, and they have two great
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 2: moms and they have two very amazing safe homes where
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 2: they feel loved, and that is okay too.
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 1: I read that you said you didn't want your storm
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 1: to become your kids to bear. Do you feel like
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 1: you've sacrificed for them? I think we all sacrifice for
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 1: our kids. Like that's one hundred percent. I had a
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 1: choice every day when you know I was it was.
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 1: I felt like it was a success. Waking up like
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 1: that was enough for me.
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 2: Like I had to wake up, put both feet on
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 2: the ground and put one foot in front of the other.
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 2: Life was really really hard for me when I made
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 2: that decision to leave and move out and start over.
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 2: And it's a scary, scary decision to make. It takes
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 2: a lot of good takes. It does, it does, and
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 2: people don't talk about it, and people are so quick
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 2: to judge. People are so quick to think they know someone.
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 2: You don't know shit until you've walked in my shoes.
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 2: You don't know what I've gone through. And the hardest
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 2: part was I had to show up for those kids
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 2: in the hardest season of my life, and my pain
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 2: could not become their. So it really Legit was like
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 2: in a fucking time of complete storm. It's like I
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 2: was just holding the umbrella up and protecting us, like
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 2: I could not let my shit storm become theirs. Like
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 2: you talk about this evolution of being a better human
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 2: and doing the work, Like, yeah, I had to because
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 2: I was damaged. I'm still damaged, Like I'm still figuring
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 2: it out. I'm still doing the work, and I still
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 2: get it wrong.
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 1: You look glowy though, Oh that's you're glowy doing that
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 1: March Charlotte Tilbry makeup.
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 2: Actually, I'm just kidding.
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 1: So I ask almost everybody who is in a partnership
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 1: that they seem really happy, and mostly because I don't
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 1: know that I've ever felt that thing. What does it
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 1: feel like when you meet your person? Like, how do
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 1: you know?
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 2: Oh gosh, everyone is in search and need something different,
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 2: Like we all have such different love languages. I think
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 2: for me, I just always wanted a certain type of
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 2: love and I was like, oh, that shit's only in
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 2: fairy tales and books. And then when I like really
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 2: allowed myself to receive the kind like I had to
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 2: be worthy enough. I don't necessarily think it's about anyone else.
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 2: We have to be selfish enough and know ourself enough
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 2: to know the things we want and need to move
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 2: in this life that makes us happy. And I I
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 2: don't know if I knew that in my last relationship.
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 2: So I always felt like I had to convince someone
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 2: to love me this way, or want me this way,
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 2: or show up for me this way. And I think
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 2: I constantly was let down because I was never met
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 2: with that. So you feel fully seen now, That's what
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 2: I'm hearing. Yes, But I'm also very clear with the
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 2: things I want and need. And I don't know if
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 2: I really knew that in my last relationship.
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 1: But do you feel like it would have gone differently
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 1: if you had more of a voice. Sometimes I feel
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 1: like it's just the person, right.
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I mean like I'm a very affectionate human
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 2: and I love the fact that my partner now literally
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 2: if she could crawl in my skin, she would. I
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 2: just know the things I'm willing to compromise and the
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 2: things I'm not. Yeah, and I wasn't there before. I
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 2: think we don't ever have to feel trapped in something
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 2: that doesn't serve us. And I think as women, we
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 2: get this idea that we've kind of dug this hole,
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 2: we've got to like sit in it and make our bed. Yeah,
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 2: and I kind of just was like, I have one
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 2: life to live, I'm on borrowed time. I just wanted more.
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 2: I was so scared to say that and acknowledge that,
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 2: because I knew I was going to hurt people. One way,
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 2: I was going to really hurt people. But do I
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 2: minimize myself and live a life full of regret and
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 2: the things I don't preach? Or do I make the
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 2: hard decision, do the brave thing and be ready to
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 2: receive the love I've always imagined? And now this fucking
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 2: unicorn fell on my lap. You know there's no coincidence, right, Like, oh,
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 2: you think like the universe showed up for you because
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 2: you showed the universe you were courageous. I mean, it's
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 2: just like the way it all happened in the friendship
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 2: groups and being open and honest about not being happy,
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 2: and it was just like wildly timing, Like timing is everything.
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 1: One of the things that I think is really cool
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 1: is you both have a real heart of service, Like
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 1: advocacy seems so important to both of you. Do you
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 1: feel like her commitment to advocacy has fueled yours or
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 1: you've always been in that space?
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so she's very political forward in terms of activism,
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 2: which is like she's so informative and so like she's smart. No,
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 2: she's like really good. I saw.
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 1: I was at the Times Women event last week, and
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 1: a lot of times you would not expect an actor
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 1: to be the most interesting person on the panel when
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 1: you have like experts in their fields.
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 2: She was by far the best. It's insane. She's the
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 2: smartest human I know. And it's like so sexy and
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 2: fun because I'm like, you are such a nerd and
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 2: I am such a jock. She's a theater baby with
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 2: as I am this like unhinged, unfiltered, unbuttoned tattoo athlete.
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 2: Like we are so different, and it's we just were
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 2: such impaths, we're such lovers, we're such givers, and she
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 2: makes me better every day, Like I'm the luckiest human alive.
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 2: And I've always been a huge advocate for the queer
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 2: community as that's something I'm really proud of and how
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 2: I identify, and now I've really been able. She's always
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 2: you know, been an ally of the queer community, but
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 2: now bringing her in as like really a part of
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 2: it has been so cool for me.
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 1: What does that mean well, I mean she you know,
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 1: she was married to a man. Are there like things
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 1: that people have to learn?
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 2: Fuck, I don't know. But like all of a sudden
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 2: she woke up and she's like, well, you know what,
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 2: I've tried to check all these boxes with all these
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 2: different situations. It's just not for me. Yeah, I'm proud
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 2: of her for doing that at forty two. Like, that's
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 2: a really brave thing to be like, Okay, this is
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 2: not making me happy. And I've always thought about this,
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 2: but I was like, never felt like I had a place.
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 2: And now she's like, you know what, I'm just gonna
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 2: be me. And she grew up early bots of Hollywood.
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 2: She's been in the d with she's been through it.
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 2: We were, you know, like lucky. We say this all
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 2: the time. Her best friend says this, and it fucking
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 2: kills me. We always laugh that she is so good,
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 2: she's so well rounded, she's so incredibly intelligent. The way
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 2: she was like raised by one Tree Hill and all
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 2: these early social stigmas and skinny this and this, and
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 2: paired against every other girl. I'm like, we always laugh.
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 2: We're like, no, wonder you're not chewing your hair in
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 2: the corner, like it's the truth, like we were shitty
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 2: to all of those women who grew up in that
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 2: early generation. It's the Paris Hilton's, it's the fucking like
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 2: Lindsay Lohan. No wonder Britney Spears has gone. I mean
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 2: we did that tour. We did that.
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 1: I just was talking to Raven Simone. Yeah, has so
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 1: much PTSD from that time, yes.
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 2: Like it really affects people to those women awful and
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 2: media is still awful. It's like twenty years later, so
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 2: it still deals with it. The tabloids, clip, clickbait, shit,
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 2: everything full of stories that just aren't even true to
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 2: attack people. I mean they're awful.
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 1: But what's it like for you to be a part
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 1: of that now? Because you had a certain level of
• 1:09:40
  Speaker 1: fame before, but this is like very different for people
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 1: to be in your personal life like this, do care
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 1: or you don't? Like yeah no Google.
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 2: Or no no no no. If I've learned anything, the
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 2: tabloid lloyds are an absolute joke. Yeah, and they literally
• 1:09:59
  Speaker 2: will run with anything and that's how they make money.
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 2: Like it's all good, Like no one cares about this
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 2: beautiful love story. People want like the drama, like humans
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 2: thrive off of the drama, and like, you know, we're
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 2: just so desensitized to reality and we've done it to ourselves.
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 2: Is there a part of like Hollywood life that is fun? Actually?
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 2: Is there anything? All the events? I go to, all
• 1:10:29
  Speaker 2: these events, and she loves it. She you really hate
• 1:10:31
  Speaker 2: all of them. There's something that must be the only
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 2: part I liked was the Elton John event we went
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 2: to on Sunday, the Oscars party when Elton and Chapel
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 2: Roone started singing because no one can talk to me
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 2: and I can just enjoy the music. Okay, yeah, I
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 2: just introverted those things. Oh my god, I've exhausted. She
• 1:10:52
  Speaker 2: she goes into these rooms and she's like lighty, she
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 2: yucking it up. I can't even I can't even move.
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 2: She talks to every single human. She has a spiritual
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 2: gift of something that allows her to do so. She's
• 1:11:06
  Speaker 2: never met a stranger. And then I'm an EmPATH, Like
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 2: I can look at someone for thirty seconds or they
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 2: make eye contact with me, and I'm like, I like
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 2: take on their emotions weirdly, or I feel their pain,
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 2: or I leave those rooms and I'm like I need
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 2: to lock myself in a room for three days.
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 1: It must be hard for you to get into an uber.
• 1:11:27
  Speaker 1: You can feel every if you feel everything. Yeah, talk
• 1:11:30
  Speaker 1: to me about your fashion. I was looking at old photos.
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 1: It's really evolved over the years. Yeah, and you seem
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 1: like such a deeply creative person.
• 1:11:37
  Speaker 2: Is it an outlet for you? I love it. Whatever
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 2: I wear is based on how I feel in the moment.
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 1: Okay, so talk me through this outfit today. You get
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 1: up and you're like, what are we feeling? I just
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 1: throw on clothes. I don't think I'll be honest. I
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 1: think it's not the clothes, it's how you wear them.
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 2: Okay. Like I I'm confident in myself. I know exactly
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 2: who I am. I don't walk into a room feeling
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 2: like I'm less than or I don't belong. I'm just me.
• 1:12:06
  Speaker 2: And I think it's contagious and I think some some
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 2: people view it as, oh, you have great sense societ.
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 2: I'm just like not really, I just like I have
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 2: a pair of like I got these from like the flea.
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 2: This is from like an outlet, you know. No, No,
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 2: it is giving though you give, thank you you do.
• 1:12:23
  Speaker 2: But I don't try to fit in. I don't try
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 2: to like fit the mold. I'm just me. Okay.
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 1: So the pot is called question everything, So I usually
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 1: take one topic, break it down.
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 2: I came up with a bunch of them. Pick one
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 2: that you feel. Oh my gosh, you tell me what
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 2: you want to unpack. Tipping culture. Let's go. Okay, I
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 2: have a lot to say about this. You do, yeah,
• 1:12:48
  Speaker 2: because I pay off Queen. I played in Germany, I
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 2: played in Sweden, and like, you don't tip. You just
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 2: pay people what they're worth. No one knows that more
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 2: than I do. Why are we paying people so shitty
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 2: that we have the need in this country to have
• 1:13:05
  Speaker 2: to tip twenty plus percent? It drives me nuts. I'm like,
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 2: just pay people what they're worth.
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 1: But do you tip differently if somebody is with you
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 1: and can see, Like, if you're at the register at
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 1: a coffee shop and you're alone, will you tip less
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 1: or more than if somebody is with you watching how
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 1: much you're tipping.
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 2: I'm consistent. One coffee, I tip two dollars, you do
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 2: two bucks. I'm consistent unless somebody is extra nice to me.
• 1:13:33
  Speaker 1: I don't tip on my coffee because I'm like, it's
• 1:13:35
  Speaker 1: already seven dollars.
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 2: No it's so wonky. It's madness. Everyone's losing their mind.
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 2: And I also think it's so crazy that just because
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 2: I decide to order an expensive steak on one plate,
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 2: I have to pay twenty percent more because the food's expensive.
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 2: Like make it makes sense if you would have given
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 2: me a ten dollars fuck in salad. It's the same
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 2: damn plate and same energy, and I got a tip
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 2: twenty percent on the price. I hate it. I think
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 2: it's whack. But where in this we live in America,
• 1:14:12
  Speaker 2: everything's asked backwards. I'm not surprised at all. But I
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 2: always tip twenty percent. That's really nice. Always. And then
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 2: what's so annoying is I like, nice wine? Oh? Do
• 1:14:24
  Speaker 2: you tip with the alcohol? Include it's my question to you,
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 2: you know, because you get a let's say you get
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 2: one hundred and seventy dollars bottle of wine. Huh with
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 2: your steak dinner? Do you tip? You know, half the
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 2: fucking bill is just they're opening a bottle of wine? Yeah?
• 1:14:40
  Speaker 2: Do you tip twenty percent?
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 1: So I used to, And then I was at a
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 1: restaurant with my parents and they were like, you're not
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 1: supposed to. You have to take the alcohol off, and
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 1: I was like, but is that enough for the server?
• 1:14:51
  Speaker 2: It's very complicated, complicated. What are the rules? What are
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 2: the rules? I wish they were extreamlined. I absolutely tip
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 2: twenty percent because I'm like, people in this country are
• 1:15:01
  Speaker 2: so unhinged. I will walk out of there and then
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 2: all of a sudden, they're gonna say, Ashland Harris is
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 2: so cheap. She only tipped me fifteen dollar hairs on
• 1:15:12
  Speaker 2: this meal. And then I'll be known forever, you know,
• 1:15:15
  Speaker 2: for god knows something else I did wrong.
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 1: She was a waitress in college and it was in Chicago,
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 1: so Scottie Pippen would come in all the time, and
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 1: all the waiters were like, I don't want that table,
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 1: and I was like, why I want the table, like
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 1: it was so fun. And they were like, oh, no
• 1:15:31
  Speaker 1: tip and Pippin' And I was like, oh see, you
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 1: don't want that kind of reputation.
• 1:15:36
  Speaker 2: It's brutal. You just give him the fifteen bucks and
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 2: keep a pushing. He always tipped me, so, yeah, sure
• 1:15:43
  Speaker 2: those dinners were a lot more than yeah, fifteen dollars.
• 1:15:46
  Speaker 2: But I have some rapid fire questions.
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, let's go. I love this first of all, favorite
• 1:15:51
  Speaker 1: bottle of wine. Now that I know, I really like Quintessa.
• 1:15:56
  Speaker 1: A red bottle of Quintessa is like one of my favorites.
• 1:16:00
  Speaker 1: When did you get your first tattoo? Eighteen seventeen?
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 2: What was it? I got my whole damn side done.
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 2: It wasn't even like I went little any regrets. Yeah,
• 1:16:10
  Speaker 2: I got it in color. It was the last one
• 1:16:12
  Speaker 2: I ever have in color. Color fades though, right. Well,
• 1:16:16
  Speaker 2: it's on my side, so not really. Your most meaningful
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 2: tattoo probably this one on my hand. It has my
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 2: kid's name and the heart of the family and the
• 1:16:26
  Speaker 2: protector and the eye, and then I have the wave
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 2: for ocean, so that would be my little I just
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 2: noticed all your rings too, they're cute. Oh, thank you.
• 1:16:35
  Speaker 2: Something you've done that's wild in the name of love
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 2: or friendship? Wild? I'm always wild. I'm so unhinged all
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 2: the time, I really am.
• 1:16:46
  Speaker 1: I need to see this aspect of you, because you
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 1: don't seem unhinged.
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 2: Oh I'm really unhitched. You seem like wise and together
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 2: and excellent. No, okay, you know, I let my hair down.
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 2: I like to have a good time.
• 1:16:58
  Speaker 1: Best advice you learned in therapy or like a phrase
• 1:17:01
  Speaker 1: that you think about.
• 1:17:03
  Speaker 2: I don't know what kind of therapy, like you're getting advice.
• 1:17:07
  Speaker 2: I do feel like I think the best gift you
• 1:17:10
  Speaker 2: can give yourself is to like work on the things
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 2: like that you want to be better at. I think
• 1:17:18
  Speaker 2: my therapist is so great with me that they help
• 1:17:22
  Speaker 2: me like walk myself into the answer. They don't give
• 1:17:25
  Speaker 2: it to me, and it drives me nuts and I'm like,
• 1:17:28
  Speaker 2: just tell me what a fucking deal I need help,
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 2: and like that's not their job. Their job is to
• 1:17:36
  Speaker 2: hold me accountable and really let me process and work
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 2: through it. I don't know what a good advice would be,
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 2: but in life in general, I definitely think time is
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 2: the greatest gift you can give to someone. So show
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 2: up and be present. I think that is something I
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 2: live by. What's something every woman should try once to
• 1:17:59
  Speaker 2: be with a woman, we wouldn't have so many unhappy
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 2: women out there. Do you think people are holding themselves back? Yeah?
• 1:18:06
  Speaker 2: I think fear is a big component of that. I
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 2: think people, and it's not just women, people are so
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 2: fearful all the time that they really miss out on
• 1:18:20
  Speaker 2: a lot of things in life. And I think that
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 2: is one thing I've been lucky enough to just like
• 1:18:27
  Speaker 2: you don't really have much fear. I don't like heights,
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 2: It's really it. I'm not jumping out of an airplane.
• 1:18:32
  Speaker 2: Will you do like a cliff into the ocean? Absolutely?
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 2: I don't even want to go up and I don't
• 1:18:38
  Speaker 2: even want to look out of the edge.
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 1: What is one podcast episode of yours that everyone should
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 1: start with if they haven't tuned in yet.
• 1:18:46
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I think they all give different insight.
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 2: I think where you know, whether you're a man a woman,
• 1:18:54
  Speaker 2: however you identify whatever makes you happy, there's always something there.
• 1:18:59
  Speaker 2: You know, there's there's athletes, there's queer people, there's straight people,
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 2: there's the you know, I did the episode with Julian
• 1:19:08
  Speaker 2: Tareki about that this great relationship and love and you
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 2: know it hasn't come out yet, but I did a
• 1:19:14
  Speaker 2: really great episode with Billy Jean King. I'm really excited
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 2: about because she's just so smart and she's lived such
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 2: a beautiful life and she's so wise. And then I like,
• 1:19:27
  Speaker 2: I got to like unpack happiness with doctor Lorie Santos,
• 1:19:33
  Speaker 2: and I think we all need to unpack happiness enjoy
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 2: right now in a world that feels like it's absolutely
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 2: on fire. There's something for everyone. Yeah, and it's real
• 1:19:46
  Speaker 2: and it's honest and it's raw and it's not we're
• 1:19:50
  Speaker 2: not pretending. We're just like peeling back the layers and
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 2: just being and whatever comes out in that hour, like
• 1:19:57
  Speaker 2: you get, it's and I think that is the beauty.
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 2: Like nothing's edited, nothing is pulled out. It's like really
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 2: an open book to deep, thoughtful conversation. I really liked
• 1:20:10
  Speaker 2: your episode with Brick Baldwin. Yes, she's awesome. She's awesome,
• 1:20:14
  Speaker 2: and she was really honest and raw, which I loved too.
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Okay, grab that card game, Oh dear, pick whichever
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 1: card calls to you.
• 1:20:25
  Speaker 2: Oh my god, Oh my god. What's the weirdest thing
• 1:20:29
  Speaker 2: you've ever done in your car? I don't know what
• 1:20:32
  Speaker 2: would be weird. I mean I've done a hard one.
• 1:20:35
  Speaker 2: I've done a lot in a car. Honey, Me and
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 2: my high school sweetheart Tyler back in those straight days.
• 1:20:42
  Speaker 2: I was gonna say, it's Tyler a man or a woman.
• 1:20:44
  Speaker 2: Tyler is a man. Well, and we really love that
• 1:20:49
  Speaker 2: backseat in high school and really place to go. I'm
• 1:20:52
  Speaker 2: really airing out all my secrets for me to think back.
• 1:20:56
  Speaker 2: It's highly weird. Really, I was having sex with a man.
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 2: I am gay? How did no one know? Did no
• 1:21:03
  Speaker 2: one know? I mean I played it off quite well.
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 2: I told my dad. He said, sweetheart, I raised you.
• 1:21:09
  Speaker 2: We knew.
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 1: Really, Yeah, I actually don't know this. Did you like
• 1:21:12
  Speaker 1: have a formal coming out?
• 1:21:14
  Speaker 2: Oh? I dated, I had boyfriends in college, my little
• 1:21:18
  Speaker 2: high school sweetheart. Yeah. And then I like left all
• 1:21:23
  Speaker 2: of that and I was like, oh, no, wonder I
• 1:21:26
  Speaker 2: didn't enjoy a minute of it. Were you nervous at all?
• 1:21:30
  Speaker 2: I like kissed a girl and I really liked it.
• 1:21:34
  Speaker 2: I really did. I was like, that's it. Bye, she's
• 1:21:39
  Speaker 2: on the good side. I'm done. But thank you. I
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 2: love this. I mean, you gotta try a little bit
• 1:21:44
  Speaker 2: of everything, I guess to really know your flavor just
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 2: wasn't mine.
• 1:21:48
  Speaker 1: I feel like the two things that I'm going to
• 1:21:50
  Speaker 1: take from this episode, besides having a little bit more
• 1:21:53
  Speaker 1: courage to just be vulnerable, is that everyone needs to
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 1: try and kiss a woman.
• 1:21:58
  Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, please, I'm taken, But I know a lot
• 1:22:02
  Speaker 2: of really beautiful single women, so I can help you.
• 1:22:06
  Speaker 1: You let me know, Okay, I'm in and everybody out
• 1:22:08
  Speaker 1: here they might call you done.
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 2: I'm a very lovely woman. I am.
• 1:22:13
  Speaker 1: I'm not a good wing woman, but I'm a good matchmaker.
• 1:22:16
  Speaker 1: Ooh yeah, okay, okay. My last question for you. A
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 1: book that you've read that has changed your life, something
• 1:22:21
  Speaker 1: you think everybody should read.
• 1:22:23
  Speaker 2: I think all of us have, like so many of
• 1:22:26
  Speaker 2: us women. I really like Glennon's writing. I think she's
• 1:22:30
  Speaker 2: an incredible writer with an incredible perspective that has influence
• 1:22:35
  Speaker 2: and changed a lot of women's lives, and I think
• 1:22:39
  Speaker 2: that's a really powerful gift. But like, I also like
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 2: the bs of like Chelsea Handler. I love Chelsea Handler's writing.
• 1:22:47
  Speaker 2: I love how you're getting something on two totally different
• 1:22:51
  Speaker 2: spectrums that are so important because, like Chelsea Handler just
• 1:22:55
  Speaker 2: is so outwardly unhinged and so unapologetic. Normalizes what we're
• 1:23:02
  Speaker 2: all thinking but can't say. I think it's good for us,
• 1:23:05
  Speaker 2: Like we need to be more like that. We need
• 1:23:08
  Speaker 2: to just be more who we want to be and
• 1:23:13
  Speaker 2: feel really okay with it and not apologize like everyone's
• 1:23:18
  Speaker 2: always like I got a fit in this box? What
• 1:23:20
  Speaker 2: is the box? What does that even mean?
• 1:23:23
  Speaker 3: Yeah?
• 1:23:24
  Speaker 2: Be more like Chelsea in a world that's unforgiving for women,
• 1:23:29
  Speaker 2: right now. Amen.
• 1:23:35
  Speaker 3: Okay, you know what time it is.
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 1: Today's a good day to have a good day.
• 1:23:40
  Speaker 3: I'll see you next week