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Leading Through Transition: Navigating New Roles and Responsibilities · Business Roundtable

0:01
All right, good evening, and welcome back to the Business Roundtable podcast.
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I am one of your hosts here, David Carr of Steward your Business.
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Thanks so much for joining us. For those of you that are new to
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the podcast, I work as a coach and consultant in organizational help and leadership
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of teams, and so I'm excited to get into the topic today. We're
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going to talk about transition and taking in new roles of management and leadership,
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and so to help me tackle that discussion tonight, we have returning guests in
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one of our regulars, Bill Hatch. Welcome back, Bill, thank you,
0:40
glad to be back, Glad to have you. Podcasts are extraordinaire.
0:46
He'cause so many podcasts. You just got to go up Bill and look at
0:49
what bald Spots productions, right, Bald Spots productions. Yeah. Yeah.
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You can find us on Facebook, YouTube and wherever find podcasts are there.
0:59
You go, you go, and he's got some great podcast episodes, so
1:02
go check them out. And we've got doc C back. Welcome doc C.
1:06
How you're doing. Glad to be here. It's been a while.
1:07
I've been been absent the past couple of times. Been traveling and working and
1:14
you know, all that good stuff. But I'm glad to be here.
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We're glad to have you here. You're you're you're working in all your mergers
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and acquisitions and transitions, so we're really happy to have you share your insights
1:26
and history background in this area. So I thought we've talked about roles and
1:32
responsibilities. We've talked about capacity and management to a certain degree, company culture,
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your book on winning culture, Doc c, which was a great conversation,
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And I thought, you know, there's a lot of people that go
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through a transition phase and I've been through them, where we're doing a role,
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oftentimes a technical role, we may be a subject matter expert, and
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then we're asked to step into some form of leadership role or management role.
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And so I thought it would be great to talk and get your guys's opinion
2:01
and insights here to help the business owner or help that person that's just literally
2:06
in that transition place or looking to maybe transition in the coming months or years
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here and help address some of the expectations for themselves, for maybe their team,
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their their upper management. And so maybe I'll start with you, Doc
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Seed tonight and we'll come back to you built for both of your inputs here.
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But you know, what are some of the challenges we could anticipate or
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be aware of Because some of it sounds all great, I'm getting promoted,
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I'm going to this new role or coming into this new company. But what
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from you, doc, what would you say are some of the challenges you
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need to be prepared to face. Well, you know, I've always even
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helped people when they get into these situations. I always I always telling them
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that there's you know, really the expectations not only from leadership and the people
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even above you, but even the people below you. There's really uh,
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some certain qualities that you really need to bring to the table. One is
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uh and this is a big integrity mh. You really have to you know,
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you have to even if you think it's something that you don't like,
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you you have to do what's best for the organization and and you have to
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be honest about it. So I always tell them, you know, integrity,
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You you have to be gold driven and you have to along with the
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goals, you're going to have to be able to motivate your team, your
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people, and you've got to have innovation and collaboration I mean those those if
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you have those qualities, you will be a great leader. But you know,
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integrity is the top of my list. You know, that's a that's
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a baby. The rest, you know, you can actually learn. But
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you know, you really you got that position probably because the people above you
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saw that you had some integrity and ability to do all those other things.
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Motivate and you know, all those things. So that's what I always I
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always look at trying to keep it minimal when you get out of gate because
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it's going to be a learning curve for anybody. But if you could just
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have those things written on your wall or your iPad or somewhere just to remember,
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I think you'll you'll you'll be moving forward quickly. Yeah, integrity,
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that's that's a great word. I think as you said, that made me
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think doxy is when you're in that new role too, you're not going to
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have all the answers. It's new. So living in a integrity means you
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have to be able to say I don't know or I'm not clear, but
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I'll find the answer right instead of putting errors that you got it all together.
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You've got to figure it all out. Yeah, Yeah, that's that's
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really you hit it right right there. And because we don't know, and
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why try to come up with an answer, you know, do some research,
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you know, find some facts and see what you can come up with.
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But don't you know, just say you don't know. I'll get back
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to you on it, you know, whenever absolutely I agree. Well,
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how about you, Bill, I mean, you've talked before we got on
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the air tonight. You mentioned you've talked about this in the past, and
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you've been through these challenges of transition. So what's been your history and in
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dealing with this, Well, I have to concur with the good doctor.
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Integrity is integral and but but I would also throw at adaptability. You know.
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Uh, you may be in a position where you were you had you
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had specific relationships with the people around you, and if you get promoted up
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above them, well those relationships are all going to change, you know,
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especially especially friends and family, those kinds of relationships which you can find yourself
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in. When a family business decides to expand, they may be bringing in
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people from outside and uh, and so you need to learn to adapt to
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to those situations. But uh, yeah, it's it's really important two change
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to be ready for change because you know, yeah, that's that's just the
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way the way it is. U. Bill ask you the question, Well,
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you you made a statement that I think I hadn't thought about for a
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while, but a really important statement, especially when you're all at the same
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level and then you you're promoted up or you're setting a new role. The
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dynamic of power and positioning. You're right, is very real, and some
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people are supportive of it, and some people are not so supportive of it,
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right, like who is this guy? The people you're now above may
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have expectations that they'll get preferential treatment, right, you know, and you
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have to you have to stand strong against those kinds of those kinds of feelings.
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You know, you can't. You can't give someone you know, the
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better the better seat, the better office, just because you used to like
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them, you know. You you have to understand that you're in a position
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now where you have to make the decisions that are best for the company and
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the people in the company. Yeah, Doc, you're gonna say something there,
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Yeah, you know, because yeah, Bill, hit on, hit
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on. You know, have you either one of you or even the people
8:05
that are listening to this podcast read the forty eight Laws of Power. Oh,
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I know, I've heard of it. I've never actually read it.
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It's actually I'm and you know what, I'm gonna give me a second and
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I will I will look it up so I can have the yeah and find
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the author real quick. And the reason why I mentioned that forty Laws of
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Power is that, gosh, I don't know what it is, but it's
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because it talks about what Bill was mentioning. It said, when you get
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into that power position, you get you have to be ready for all of
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these these attacks because of the emotion, you know, the envy, the
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jealousy, you know, all of those things that come about. And so
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that it's a great book. I just can't find that. I looked it
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up. Robert Green. Yeah, there you go. There it is absolutely
9:03
Robert Green. That's a great And some of you that are listening to this
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podcast, you might you might disagree with some of those those laws, but
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they are actually real. They are actually real. So it's pretty good read
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and it's something that you if you put into a leadership role, is to
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especially in a power position, you need to read that to be aware of
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those things. Yeah, that's great. I just looked it up. On
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Amazon, it's got like over seventy six thousand reviews. It's like almost like
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one half star book. So yeah, we were all about writing value and
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references here. So hey, guys, look, you just got a nugget
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from Doxy, who's read a lot of books and written books. There's one.
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You guys can go put it on your reading list. I'll put it
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on mine. But I think that is that's a really important We could probably
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just have an episode on this alone, just navigating the power side of things
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and what does that look like? Yeah, that alone is podcast. Right,
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Yeah, we always come up with new new topics. So we're going
10:03
to come back. You guys have to come back and listen to this one.
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So you know, so we're so we're you know, addressing this idea.
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There's you know, be aware. I'm hearing you both say this is
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be aware of these dynamics up and down. Your upper management has expectations of
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you and those below you, and as you serve in the leaders who will
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have expectations and understanding and so this can be really challenging, like you guys
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both said, especially if you have friends and colleagues and you're like, oh,
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are you going to get me for referential treatment. No, No,
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it's you know, we've got to look at the best inte of the company,
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like you said, Bill, So Bill coming back to you here from
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a minute. Then what would you say is as okay, I'm coming in
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there, and Doc, you talked a little bit about this. But you
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know, now you're in a new role and we've talked a little bit about
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you know, you and I Bill about like capacity and how can we could
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you know, get more production? Right? So what are the things that
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you need to be aware of? I've done certain roles and responsibil it is
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non stepping into this new one and you know and and and more in a
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management role, not just technical, right, maybe work at management. What
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are the things that you've seen that we need to be considering? Well,
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you know, your own your own capacities are really what you what you need
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to be aware of. First, you know, what are you capable of
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doing? What do you already know? And uh and what do you not
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know? Of course there are going to be things that you don't know,
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you don't know, especially moving into uh into a higher position. But but
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most people have seen what managers do and and have some idea of what's going
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to be required of them. So, yeah, you need to you need
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to be self aware and yeah, put yourself into the new position and be
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ready to learn. Yeah, be teachable, be humble. You don't know
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at all? Well you you know, And I'll piggyback up what Bill was
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saying is that you know the other thing that you need to really because each
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of us, by the time you're in a leadership role, you probably have
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a good idea of your strengths and weaknesses. So you want to make sure
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that you put a bring a team around you that supports your weaknesses for sure,
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and you and you put them like like they're your best friends, because
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because that's exactly what's going to happen is you know, people will identify your
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weaknesses and they'll they'll attack those weaknesses. And they might they might not even
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do this or in front of you, and they'll do it behind you.
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But my point is really simple, is that you you just rally some troops
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that kind of support all your weaknesses, and you continue, if you are
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in this leadership role, to hone in on your strengths because weaknesses can be
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overcome by those that have that. As your strengths. So that would be
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my point if anybody was actually jumping into a leadership role. Well, I
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want to follow up on that, Doxee, because I'll give you a personal
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experience I had where I was a senior biologist and then I started to take
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on managing these projects and staff and talking about weaknesses or I would say related
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to that was delegating and finding people that you can delegate to you because I
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found I felt into this trap personally where I felt like I had to do
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it all and I was really struggling to do it all, and I didn't
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really realize I should be asking for help or looking for people. I just
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thought, Oh, I'm just supposed to do this. I'm just supposed to
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figure this out. Be talk a little bit about that too, about Doxy,
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about when you're in a management in a leadership position, how crucial it
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is that you, like I said, find the right people, and how
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do you how would you say, okay, if you found the right person
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too, Doxy, how do you make sure you're actually delegating effectively to that
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person. Okay, you found them? Like, what would success look like
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to you? Well, you know it's you know, it's kind of like
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if you're the if you're the quarterback. I always use this analogy. At
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your quarterback of a football team, and you you want the best offensive line
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to protect you. And really that's exactly what you're doing in a leadership roles.
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You are finding people around you to protect you, to protect you.
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But at the same point, at the same time, you're you're actually moving
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forward down the field to score a touchdown, to score a win, and
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in order to do that, you you cannot what's the word I'm looking for.
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You need to always be supportive of your frontline, even they're going to
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make mistakes. We're all going to make mistakes, so we still focus on
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what our job is at that particular time, whatever the task is, and
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you do that daily and you support them, say hey, you know,
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give them, give them roles, give them what you do not want to
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do. Well, it's not so much, and you you hit it,
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you know, David, is when you're in a leadership role, when you
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think that you have to do everything because you just increase your salary fifty percent
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or eighty percent, whatever it is, and now I need to show everybody
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that I'm worth those dollars. But in reality, you just do the opposite.
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You you actually engage everybody, You bring everybody along and you just oversee
16:00
all the all all their duties because you cannot do everything. And that's for
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sure, as you probably found out. So when you and this is what
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I teach even you know, small business owners who are actually trying to increase
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their you know, business from a million dollars to five million or even tend
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I go, you have to find a way to get rid of the hub
16:22
and spoke. And what that means, of course, is you're right there
16:26
in the middle and everything is coming towards you. The distributors, this,
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you know, sales, everything, you can't do that. You just you
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just have to find people and trust that they're going to do that. And
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they're going to make mistakes, period. Will you just hope that it's not
16:42
a costly one. But at the same time you just have to you just
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have to trust that they're going to do the right thing. So that's how
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that's how you build any company or any team winning team is trust to trust.
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You've got to trust. And I've seen a lot of the struggle with
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that Doxy struggling with trust, trusting the team they got in this position,
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and like, oh, I don't I don't want to lie in But what
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I hear you saying is that's the only way you're going to be able to
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grow. Otherwise you're just going to stay at a certain level that you're you're
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the you're the limitter, right yep. Yeah, And that's that's true.
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Uh. You know, if you've ever read the book No Man's Land,
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it's it kind of illustrates that. And that is because you if you're a
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small business owner, everybody thinks that you have a culture. Well know,
17:30
your your culture is actually you And the only way to grow is to get
17:36
outside of you your comfort zone and trust that people can actually make some decisions
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and build a better team or better company for sure. Yeah. Maybe and
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Bill, maybe you can speak to this too, because I think building on
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this, you know that you identifying, like you said, Doxy, your
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your your strengths and your weaknesses and being okay with that, recognizing that I
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don't don't have to do anything right, get your ego out of the way,
18:03
and like understand, lean into what you do best, right Bill,
18:07
and and and so just speaking to that again, Bill, of like we
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talked a little bit about previous episodes about managing our time and how to like
18:15
focus on them things, but like, how do we continue to build our
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credibility as a leader as a manager with that group that those individuals bill as
18:25
we're trying to delegate and you know, I've seen people abuse that too,
18:27
where they're not doing they're just like pushing everything off, and it's like,
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Okay, we've got to figure out a good balance here. You're responsible for
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certain things that you're really good at, but then there's other things that you
18:37
do need to to let lose. So thoughts feedback on those adiens. Well,
18:44
I really think that one of the most important things you can do is
18:47
learn your own limits you and how to delegate appropriately. You know, most
18:53
most modern leaders that have that have done something incredible are surrounded by people who
19:00
are smarter than they are in a certain way. So there's a there's a
19:03
little bit of humility there. I mean, Elon Musk doesn't know how to
19:08
build spaceships or electric cars, but he knew how to get in there,
19:15
and he knew to surround himself with people who knew those things. You know,
19:19
going going way back, a a the perhaps the world's greatest conqueror Timo
19:26
Jean, more commonly known by his by his title. Genghis Khan even had
19:33
a military strategist, Subutai, who without him, Genghis Khan would not have
19:38
been the conqueror he was. He would have been limited in his in his
19:42
ability to to to take over so much of what he took over, you
19:48
know. So so getting the people, the right people and putting them in
19:53
positions where their strengths shine, you know, because so much of what people
20:00
do is is about, oh, you've got to work on your weaknesses.
20:03
It's like, well, why not work on your strengths. We we've talked
20:07
about that before too. You know, make your strengths stronger and utilize the
20:12
strengths of those around you, and you know you will of course find people
20:18
to fill in for those weaknesses. And uh yeah, you just need to.
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You need to put together a team of people who have strengths you don't.
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Not well not not even just about the strengths you don't have, it's
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also about strengths you do have, because like you said, you are the
20:37
limitter. You know, you are the limitter and your own success. So
20:42
so get people who have strengths you do and then you can spend time on
20:48
other things on you know, and uh and getting getting the team together,
20:55
getting them put into positions where were they feel useful m h. And feel
21:04
that you rely on them because people feel good when that happens. You know,
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that makes the team feel good. So even if you can do something,
21:12
get to get somebody else who can do it too, right, you
21:15
know, and uh and trust them to do the job. I think that's
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a great point in something I experienced in a small company and docs and you
21:25
probably address this too. But when you're in a small company, like I
21:27
said, you're in those growth days, DOCX, you have like one to
21:30
five million, let's just say I've been in that place with a company your
21:34
role and responsibility changes about every six to twelve months. It's been my experience,
21:40
absolutely right, Yeah, you know, and build touched on something.
21:45
I'm sure you guys are familiar with the point Hills Think and Grow Rich book,
21:48
Yep, you know. And he of course interviewed Andrew Carnegie that actually
21:53
produced that book. But you know, he he even asked Andrew carr and
22:00
regardnesses, I don't I know nothing about steel nothing. And he was the
22:07
richest man in the world by manufacturingness and and he says, I know nothing
22:11
about it, but I know a lot about people, and I know a
22:15
lot about strengths and weaknesses regarding the people. And that's really what it's what
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it's all about, is finding a way to move people from point A to
22:29
point B. For sure. Absolutely. Well, I mean that gets into
22:33
so we've you know, I've talked a bit about kind of some management skills.
22:36
We may come back to these things, but I think really what we're
22:37
what you're pointing to, Doxy, is really how do you show up as
22:41
a truly a leader and not just a manager. We need both being your
22:47
managing things but leading people and how you know, how do you adapt your
22:52
particular leaders leadership style so that you have impact? Like what you said,
22:56
Doxy, that motivation. So you've you've obviously learned your strengths and abilities,
23:02
but now you're stepping into this role and there's different team dynamics. So how
23:07
do you assess that as as a leader in adapting to that group or folks
23:11
that you're called to lead and step in there? Doxy? Can you clarify
23:18
that question? Yeah, so so so, so you have a certain style
23:22
or a way of being. We've talked about this in the past with our
23:26
leadership voices, right. And so when you're you're coming into a new group,
23:32
we talked there's new dynamics there, right, So you don't know necessarily
23:36
all the players, uh, and how they show up, how, how
23:38
do they what? What? Again? Again, what motivates them is different
23:41
for different people, Right, So, how do you as a leader come
23:45
in and assess that team? And what do you look at? What are
23:48
you looking at as as coming as a leader, You're you're in a new
23:52
new role, and what are you looking at your team? How do you
23:53
assess what's maybe tools or resources or the things that you should be considering when
23:59
you're like, Okay, I'm lead this team, but I need to know
24:00
some of the dynamics here of the players, if you will. And the
24:06
very first thing that I that I do, and I even recommend two people
24:11
that actually are going to be in leadershiples, is to listen. Listen to
24:17
the people as they talk, as they communicate. You have those that speak
24:25
from emotion, You have those that speak using their rational thought, their their
24:33
facts and figures. You have so many different variables or shall we say,
24:40
emotions that that people love, people talk about and if you listen and you
24:45
listen, you can actually see and hear I'd rather, uh, what what's
24:52
going on within the organization, within that team, and and you just simply
24:57
ask questions, ask questions and listen and be absolutely specific. And that it
25:04
goes back to that integrity. You just listen to what they say and by
25:10
the way, respond to what they actually say and not not not tell your
25:15
opinion as a leader, but you want to find out who who's the movers,
25:21
who's the shakers, and you also want to find out the strengths and
25:25
weaknesses of each player, and the only way to do that is to observe,
25:30
to listen to everything that's going on everything. And now that that's what
25:33
you want to do, probably for the first six months in that position,
25:38
is to listen to everything. Every meeting, you go to everything, everything
25:42
you see. That would be my advice. Mm hmm, yeah, listen,
25:47
ask questions. That's that's a great great observation. Doxy. How about
25:52
you, Bill, what what what you know? Coming into a new a
25:56
new position here in a leadership role, and you don't and this in this
26:00
case, let's just say you don't know all the players or you're unaware you
26:03
know of that. Besides, in addition to listening and asking these questions,
26:07
like Doxy said, what are other proactive things that you can do well to
26:12
kind of piggyback on what Doxy said, you need to you need to actually
26:18
be listening when someone's speaking. Like as he was speaking, I wrote down
26:22
a note about, you know, what I wanted to talk about, and
26:26
then I started listening to him again. You know, you can't think of
26:30
thinking about what you're about to say while you're listening to what somebody else is
26:34
saying. So you need to get used to those silences while you're thinking of
26:40
what to say. You know, if somebody else speaks, you listen to
26:45
them, then you think about what it is you're going to say in response,
26:48
and uh. And those silences can be uncomfortable, but but we have
26:53
to get used to them because, like we've said before, you know,
26:59
disc comfort is where growth happens. So be uncomfortable in the silence, think
27:04
about what you're going to say and then say it. Don't don't don't think
27:08
about it while they're speaking. That's just that's rude. You might as well
27:12
be talking over them. Mm hm you know, for for all that matters.
27:17
But but yeah, I've I've always, I've often said before, keep
27:21
your ear to the ground and your mouth shut, you know, uh,
27:25
listen to uh, listen to what others are saying and uh, and listen
27:29
to what's not being said. That that can also be quite important, because
27:33
people don't always want to talk to management about what's wrong. They they may
27:40
be they may be hesitant to do so because they're they're afraid that they're going
27:45
to get in trouble for for criticizing, if you will, or to be
27:48
seen as criticizing even if they're not being overly critical. And uh so that
27:55
goes again back to back to another episode where we talked about company culture.
27:59
Yeah, you know, you need to create a culture where talking is a
28:03
good thing and where it's appreciated and rewarded in fact, yeah, rewards,
28:12
Yeah, yeah, rewarding, rewarding people for for saying what's really going on?
28:21
And that could be hard, right everything, Yeah, I mean,
28:23
because you're again we're back to humility again. You know, you don't have
28:30
all the answers and uh, and you better get used to that. Well,
28:36
and here's here's another situation. I asked for both of you guys your
28:38
opinion on you're a leader, you're stepping up into a new management role and
28:44
and sometimes it's great, it's being promoted within. Sometimes there's there's a major
28:48
problem in the organization, there's real pain, there's a gap there, like
28:52
we got to fill this hole, We've got to address this. And so
28:55
you're stepping into this, you know, situation again, not knowing all the
29:00
dynamics that are going on there. And I think what you said Doxy about
29:06
asking questions, looking around and kind of being situationally aware, emotionally aware,
29:15
and being prepared that you may have people coming to talk to you about issues
29:19
that you are inheriting if you will. Right, You're like, I don't
29:26
know about the history here. I'm just I'm stepping into this. So what
29:29
could you guys say, I'll come to you manby do first here when you're
29:32
coming into situations and this could be leadership, management, could be this could
29:37
be a project. Right, you've stepped in, you're taking over a project.
29:38
You don't know all the details, and now fix it. Right,
29:44
You're like transition and you fix it, and like what do you do?
29:47
What do you tell the person where it's like you don't have all the pieces
29:49
of the puzzle and you're coming in there and you're kind of like you're you're
29:52
actually unfortunately you're put in a bad situation because you're you're you're steps behind and
29:57
now you're you're being expected leader up or something to kind of solve this problem,
30:03
be the problem, solve or make this go away. What would you
30:06
say, Doxy to somebody that's stepping into a situation like that? Yeah,
30:10
what what you In my experience, what I what you usually get from people
30:17
a male or female, it doesn't matter, is emotion. And they just
30:22
start rattling off all different types of problems, issues, you name it it
30:30
just and then and then they go, oh and then department he over here,
30:34
they don't, and then the department. So then I tell I stopped
30:38
them and I asked them for clarification. And when when you do that and
30:47
you ask for and you can even say, I want some definitions. I
30:52
want you to define what it is that you are trying to tell me.
30:56
And I don't say it emotionally, but I just I need to understand what
31:02
it is that you're trying to tell me, because you're bouncing all over the
31:06
place. And that's one of the things if you can slow people down when
31:11
it comes to these types of problems as a leader, you are asking them
31:18
to clarify what it is that they because sometimes they don't even know what it
31:25
is that they're just rattling up. They're just emotion. There's emotion behind it.
31:30
So you have to slow down, ask for clarification, get some definitions,
31:36
and then you can start moving forward analyzing the issues the problems. But
31:42
we are emotional beings, and so the very first thing that we have to
31:47
understand is that slow down unless figure this out and go from their period.
31:56
I mean, that's how I approach different issues that when I go in and
32:00
I deal with evaluations and company culture and how to grow businesses, I ask
32:06
these questions. But I asked these questions. Hey, I understand what you're
32:08
saying to a degree, but I need you to clarify because I really don't.
32:15
And maybe others don't understand what you're where you're coming from. That's how
32:17
I approach it. Yeah, No, I think that's that's some great insights
32:22
there, and and yeah they may not know. And and Bill, what's
32:25
your been experienced this where maybe you've got you've stepped into in a new role.
32:30
You transition to a new role as a leader, a point of contact,
32:32
and people start to come with you with all their problems or like,
32:36
hey, you got you're the new guy. Let me let me come and
32:37
just dump on you here right right. Actually, it reminded me of a
32:44
of an old joke about three envelopes. The new the new I T manager
32:49
gets promoted up and uh, and in his desk he finds three envelopes,
32:52
each one mark you know when first when something goes when the first thing goes
32:55
wrong, open this one, second one, and so so on. And
33:00
he opens and something goes wrong, and he opens up the first envelope and
33:04
it says, blame the last guy who was here in your position, and
33:09
so he does, and everything gets smoothed over. And then something else goes
33:13
wrong, and he opens up the second envelope and uh, and it says,
33:16
blame the operating system, and so he does, and everything gets smoothed
33:21
over. And then he opens up the third and then the third thing goes
33:23
wrong and he opens up the envelope he said, and it says, write
33:27
out three envelopes and resign. You know, But but yeah, it's it
33:37
can be really difficult moving into a position that often has issues or or as
33:43
my old mentor used to say, opportunities for improvement, and uh, you
33:46
know, we have to we have to be ready for those and there can
33:52
be a lot of a lot of trouble ahead. It's it's not all smooth
33:57
sailing. And but we need to have we need to have plans at the
34:02
ready for for when something does go wrong, and we have to know who
34:07
to listen to and and who we can trust to to tell us the things
34:14
that are going that are really wrong with the boots on the ground, you
34:17
know, where where really where the problems really matter. So so yeah,
34:23
so so having plan, having a plan, and certainly not the three envelope
34:28
plan, but uh, you know, having a plan at the ready for
34:34
when you know, I mean, we know, we have a plan written
34:37
out for how we're going to get in the building if it catches fire,
34:40
you know. And this is the same kind of thing. You know,
34:44
when you have a problem going on, you need to have a plan and
34:46
know how to navigate it. Well, I think that's a great that's a
34:52
great observation. And a couple things that you spur to my mind. Bill,
34:55
you talked about that I I I did this actually interviewing for a job
35:04
one time, for a high level position, and they were going they didn't
35:09
have everything mapped out, which is okay to a certain degree, but I
35:14
recognize, how do I win in this position when I'm transitioning and taking on
35:19
this rule? How do I win? What's what's the what's the wins here?
35:22
And and sometimes it's not always clear. So like to your point,
35:25
Bill, like you have to have some plan, you have to have some
35:28
markers that you know we're going in the right direction. But if you leave
35:30
it too wide open, your higher upsothles, I feel like they're gonna get
35:35
frustrated with you because you're not fulfilling. But then they're not clear on this.
35:37
So again, when you're transitioning into this role, if you don't have
35:40
a plan or some kind of way of going, you're you're you're with intention,
35:45
You're you're you're warning warning you know, you might get into trouble.
35:52
And I would say for any of you listening here, uh, well,
35:57
the reason why we have this podcast is that you have resources where you can
36:00
call Bill or Doxy or myself. That is a message and say hey,
36:04
guys, I'm calling the bat phone. I'm calling out because I may have
36:07
some trouble here and talk with us and we can find out and help you
36:10
see if we can help you where your position. All of us have different
36:14
backgrounds, and that's why we have this podcast is to give you, you
36:17
know, a little insight, little help, but we're here for more.
36:21
And I think your point, Bill is like who can you talk to?
36:23
Sometimes you can't talk to people in the organization unfortunately. Right, that's why
36:28
docy you come into businesses, right, you're helping them with transition all the
36:31
time. Absolutely, you know, it's interesting in what we're talking about here
36:37
is he's just thinking that. You know, sometimes you get into positions or
36:45
and it's really a losing battle. You can't fix the problem. The problem,
36:51
the culture and the organization is so dysfunctional that not one person's going to
36:55
do it. And so that's also something you've got to look at as a
37:01
leader, because if people are behind you to to as a quarterback an now
37:08
I use the quarterback. If they're going to make me look good as a
37:13
quarterback, then then we're going to be all right. But man if an
37:19
organization behind all of that. You know, the the owners of the football
37:24
team, speaking of an NFL team or even a college team, if they
37:29
don't support the leaders, uh, there's a problem. And we've all been
37:35
there. I mean I've been there before too, and it's and a leader
37:39
might stand up and say, okay, we're going to go from point A
37:43
to point B and and tomorrow it doesn't happen. So you just have to
37:46
be aware of things, and you have to you know, surround yourself with
37:51
people that like minded, people that want want success. Bottom line, yep,
37:58
yeah, no, you're you're right, doc C. Is that yeah,
38:01
But there is that place you have to face the reality sometimes that you
38:05
you don't have that you're you're in a losing proposition. Uh, and and
38:09
and and be real with it. There's some things in there. But I
38:12
encourage people to ask questions about this. And and when you're stepping into a
38:16
new role or responsibility, there's some transition there. I remember I was with
38:22
the company for many years, and first I was a project manager. Then
38:24
I started to managing some teams, and then it was like, uh,
38:28
some individuals, and then it was a group. And I was struggling as
38:31
I transitioned into different elements within the company as to well, how much time
38:36
do we need to be spending doing these things, because I could spend a
38:39
lot of time and a lot of things, and and what I found was
38:44
it wasn't clear and so that caused some conflicts and some challenges there. I
38:49
thought, hey, that priorities were one thing, and somebody else thought the
38:52
priorities for something else, and it was there was not a meeting of the
38:53
mind. That wasn't understanding. And so, like you said, you're trying
38:57
to lead something and if you don't have the support there because it's like,
39:00
well, we don't really think that's as important, and the resources are there,
39:04
and you're like, well, I thought this was so I think it's
39:06
really important Bill, what you're talking about having a plan, being clear about
39:08
that, and realizing that if you're in that role, if you're really if
39:15
you're stepping into that leadership role, you've got to lead yourself at least come
39:17
up with a plan. I remember having to come up with a sales plan
39:22
and a kind of a guide for the department I was managing at the time,
39:28
because it was it was just so open ended. They're like what's your
39:30
sales goal for this year. I'm like, I don't know, I can
39:32
give you any sales. Well, I want what are we? What are
39:35
we lygning? What's the clients, what's the services we're doing? What?
39:37
What's what are we? You know, it was just it wasn't there,
39:39
and so I was really struggling as a leader and stepping into this role of
39:44
like, oh, I'm not sure. So I had to do more work
39:45
on myself and I didn't, like you, Bill necessarily knew all the resources
39:50
at the time, especially outside of the company as a new leader. You
39:54
know, yeah, yeah, knowing, knowing the unknown is the heart of
40:00
part I think. But but yeah, you you know when you were starting,
40:06
when you're with a company, especially one that doesn't have deep knowledge of
40:12
itself. You know, a company that's been around for a long time,
40:15
Oh, we know these are the last three years sales project. You know,
40:19
sales, the actual sales that we had over the last three years.
40:22
You know, a newer company where they don't have that kind of information.
40:27
Well, how do you figure that information out? Well, you go and
40:30
you look at comparable companies. You know, who's the who's the competition,
40:36
and what are they doing, you know, so which can really help you
40:39
you figure out what your goal should be and uh, you know, and
40:45
start figuring out ways to actually achieve those goals, whether they're sales numbers or
40:51
production numbers of other kinds, and you know, going about that way.
40:58
Yeah, so again just being aware, you know, as the last kind
41:01
of component I wanted to talk a little bit more about with you guys,
41:05
and I you know, is really as we as we step in. This
41:08
is kind of this idea of balance and well being because we talked about maybe
41:12
trying to do it all and making sure that we're and you know, I'm
41:15
fifty now and I've gone through the phase of my kids were younger and I
41:20
was trying to do all this work and at the expense of you know,
41:22
at some point my marriage was struggling and I was dealing with all the kids
41:27
issues. Because we're like, oh my goodness, I'm in this role,
41:29
this leadership role of transition. I've got to do all this. So talk
41:31
about how we can as leaders of taking these roles to be mindful. I
41:37
think I think it was Bill who was being self aware, if you will,
41:42
and I'll start with you Doxy first, but you know, understanding like,
41:45
okay, when you take on a new role, it's important to help
41:49
healthy boundaries for yourself setting this up. And Charlie's talked about boundaries in the
41:53
past. But you know, I'm sure you've seen a doxy with many business
41:57
owners where they've this off kilter and they're you know, speak to that a
42:00
little bit about balance well being, you know, and making sure and how
42:05
does that affect your production. Honestly, well, I've taken this from my
42:10
father who owned his own business and everything, and and he he told me,
42:21
look, and you've probably heard this before because you know so he so
42:28
you just don't take yourself seriously. You just I'm sorry because this this leadership
42:35
role is going to be short in a lifespan of your life. It could
42:43
be one year, it could be three years. It's not going to be
42:45
fifty years in that leadership role. You're not going to be the president of
42:50
the United States for fifty years. I'm sorry. It's just not going to
42:52
happen. And maybe that's a good, good thing that we change every four
42:55
years or you know, if it's say, but the point is that,
43:00
you know, don't ever take take take yourself serious. I know, you
43:06
have to support your family. I know you have to do all of these
43:08
things. But at the same time, understand, it's just a geno b
43:13
It's just and and you have to look at it to to a point that
43:21
not only are you trying to make a living for your family, but you're
43:24
doing it for others as well. And and so you have to make sure
43:30
that when you look at the the P and L or the finances of each
43:36
quarter, that you're not going in the red. I mean, it's that
43:40
simple. But at the same time, again, you know, don't take
43:45
yourself that serious because it's not going to last. Uh. And that just
43:52
kind of helps with the stress part of it. Yeah, for sure.
43:55
And that's just my opinion that that's that's I mean, if if if,
44:01
if, if that is your identity, and I've seen that where they're their
44:06
their role or job is their identity. That really is a kind of one
44:08
dimensional, if you will, and their self worth, their self identity is
44:14
tied to that position, that title. To your point, Doxy yere,
44:16
I think you're in trouble if that is very much so, I mean,
44:22
you know, and I get this all the time, gentlemen, and the
44:25
people that are listening to this. When I walk into a business, you
44:29
know, and they they address me as you know, doccy or whatever,
44:32
but I don't. I don't really run with that, and they say,
44:37
well, you know, I you know, I graduated from s C or
44:42
whatever. I don't really care about those things, and you just hit it,
44:46
David. Those are just I did those things. But that isn't who
44:52
I am. And sometimes we get into that. You know, I'm now
44:58
the president of the company. I'm the president. What does that really mean?
45:01
Now? I have certain things I need to you know, expectations and
45:06
all of these, you know, just just be yourself and surround your people,
45:10
surround yourself with great people and and you'll be fine. Yeah. How
45:15
about you, Bill, what's your what's your thought here on? You know
45:19
this well we well being and and and identity here, Well, you really
45:25
do have to take care of yourself. The stresses of of being in charge,
45:30
if you will, at any level, can easily get to get to
45:35
someone you know. To to Doxy's point, uh, you know, your
45:40
identity is not your position, and you have to remember that. You know,
45:46
you have family and friends and people who people who yes, people who
45:53
rely on you, but people who make you more than some little part of
45:58
you that's going to last couple of years. You know. I love the
46:02
I love the the equation to uh, you know, the equating your position
46:07
to the president of the United States. You know, who's got who's going
46:10
to keep a position for more than four years. It's just probably not gonna
46:15
happen, you know. And uh, you know, you'll either get promoted
46:20
or you'll resign, or you'll get fired or something like that. Things happen,
46:24
and uh, you know, you have to be ready to roll with
46:28
the punches. You have to relax. Yeah, it's it's not gonna kill
46:32
you. Yeah, I mean if you don't relax, it might kill you.
46:36
But that you know, and uh, and it's and it's also a
46:42
good thing to keep that in mind for the people under you as well,
46:46
that you need to keep them relaxed and uh and not take things so seriously.
46:53
You know, have have a have a nice relatively well maybe not us
47:00
free, because that's that's I think that's asking too much, but but a
47:05
place where you can deal with the stress and you know where it's like,
47:09
oh this happened, we deal with it, we move on, and you
47:15
know, and uh, and yeah, having having programs in place like like
47:22
like retreats and or or something as small as says getting getting one of those
47:28
massage chairs for the office. You know, it can be. It can
47:31
be all sorts of all sorts of different things too to help people go with
47:37
the flow well. And and as you were, as you were saying,
47:43
Bill, both of you too. In transition, we're talking about people coming
47:45
into new positions, but I think also transitioning out of a position in a
47:49
good way. We can talk too much about that, but I think,
47:52
I mean, I've seen people in positions that they should have transitioned out of
47:55
a long time ago, that they held on to that thing right, and
48:00
they were not very happy people in my experience. They were not a joy
48:04
to be around. And checking yourself in that, you know, are you
48:10
serving the company the best and highest good and be real with yourself about maybe
48:15
I need to transition. It could be a lateral moved. There's nothing wrong
48:19
with that. Maybe it's just you know, sometimes there's there's power in mixing
48:22
it up. And I think it's important to be as a leader consider where
48:28
we were talking earlier about your strengths, where you can have the most impact
48:30
again. Being with a small company for four and a half years, while
48:35
we help grow the company, my role kept changing and I learned, like
48:37
you said, Troxy, to hold lightly to roles and more to the point,
48:44
titles became less important to me as well. Right, what's my title
48:47
today? You know, just as we're wrapping up here, I think it
48:54
probably I had a guest on, sorry to go ahead, I had a
49:00
guest on. I guess I had a guest on on one of my shows
49:04
a couple of weeks back who called himself the president of office plans. Okay,
49:13
a lot office plans here. But we've we've come, I've hearned a
49:19
lot of good topics tonight from kind of this transition to management leadership. Wellness,
49:24
Uh, there's a lot more. We could go in here and we'll
49:27
talk. I'm sure Power was a great one. I'm I'm excited to come
49:30
back on that one. You guys, so please both ox and build them
49:31
back. But as as we kind of wrap up here, you know,
49:36
just last party thoughts. I'll come to you Bill first and then Doc see,
49:38
but just last party thoughts here, as you know, somebody that's facing
49:42
these transitions kind of you know, a lasting bit of advice insight that you'd
49:46
want to share a Bill, like, Hey, they're facing this, they're
49:50
just transitioning there, you know, just that considering what would you say?
49:53
Is that kind of key takeaway? You have to do what it's best for
50:01
well. You have to think about yourself first. I mean, I hate
50:05
to say it that way because I'm definitely a love others kind of guy.
50:08
But but it's not love others before you know, before yourself. It's love
50:15
others as you love yourself. So you have to first know how to treat
50:19
yourself well and you know, just just to continue on the the wellness thing
50:24
and then you can figure out, you know, what's going to be best
50:28
for your team and the company at large. So so everything starts with you.
50:37
Yeah, I love that come from a place of wellness abundance, like
50:40
you're giving. You're right, you're not coming in there taking what can it?
50:44
What what can I what can I get for me? It's coming from
50:46
a place of observing others. Yeah, by taking care of yourself first.
50:52
Yeah, No, that's that's that's an important reminder. Bill, Thank you
50:54
for thank you for that. How about you, Doxy, what what are
50:57
some final thoughts here tonight as we wrap up, Well, I'm gonna I'm
51:00
gonna have to to tell you again another one of my father's grade lines that
51:06
he told me when I was a kid, and I never understood it until
51:10
you kind of go through. He told me it doesn't matter if you win
51:17
or lose, it's how you play the game. And when he told me
51:22
that, I never understood because everybody wants to win. But if you understand
51:28
that, yeah, everybody wants to win, but you have to lose as
51:32
well, and you will lose by the way. And so as you as
51:39
I got older, I began and I was playing sports, and of course
51:44
in visit I understood what he was actually referring to. He passed away when
51:50
I was when I was eighteen, so I didn't get an opportunity to catch
51:53
more of his wisdom, but I really understood what he was saying, and
51:58
that is it is is, it's it's integrity, it's how it's how you
52:02
play the game, because it's all a game, and it really is,
52:08
and there's winners and losers, but how are you addressing your day to day
52:15
to actually get the best out of everybody? And it's really how you play
52:21
it in. Yeah now, well said Doxie. You both have just great,
52:28
great insights tonight. I really appreciate you guys both coming back on here.
52:32
I hope you guys all enjoyed the podcast. For those of you that
52:37
are checking us out for the first time, we let welcome your feedback,
52:40
comments always welcome. Of course, reviews leave us leave us your review well,
52:45
welcome a great five star review on Like Apple Podcasts, we're on YouTube
52:50
as well, like us and subscribing all that good stuff. We do appreciate
52:53
the community that we're creating here. If you'd like to learn more, please
52:57
leave a message, or you know, contact any one of us directly.
53:00
Simply look us up online, leave a comment. We're really grateful for you
53:04
here. Thank you Bill and Doxy for being back here. Until next time,
53:08
have a great night, guys. Bye. Nice