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Alex Guarnaschelli on The Restaurant Guys LIVE! · The Restaurant Guys

0:57
Good evening and welcome to the New Brunswick Performing Arts Center.
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A portion of the proceeds from your ticket purchase tonight will benefit the Promise Culinary Institute at Elijah's Promise right here in New Brunswick.
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For those of you who don't know, the Promise Culinary School is a state certified vocational school and job chaining program servicing individuals from various social, economic and professional backgrounds with a passion for the culinary arts.
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You can find more about them@elijahpromise.org.
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We would also like to give a special thanks to our friends at Taste of the State for their support of this event.
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The New Brunswick Performing Arts Center doesn't just host great events like this lecture series.
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Make sure you check out their full lineup of musical performances, live theater, ballet, and lectures@nbpac.org.
1:48
Now, without further ado, please welcome everyone's favorite podcast hosts, mark Pascal and Francis Shot.
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Hello everybody and welcome.
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You're here with the Restaurant guys.
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I'm Mark Pascal.
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He's Francis.
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Shop.
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Together, we own those two restaurants right next door, captain Lombardi and Stage Left.
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We are here to bring you the inside track on food, wine, and the finer things in life.
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Hello, mark.
2:30
Hey Francis.
2:31
Hello everybody.
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We are super thrilled to have you here.
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Mark and I usually sit in a little studio with Jennifer, our producer and Mark's wife.
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And we may talk to thousands, but we're really alone in a room, so it's nice to have you all here.
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Thanks for coming out tonight.
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If you've never been in New Brunswick before, it was great to see the, the guest list because we saw that we have a lot of folks who are regulars of our restaurants and, uh, listeners to our show.
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And a bunch of folks from out of town who came in to see, uh, Alex Warn Shelley who's gonna be on stage in just a few minutes.
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And, uh, welcome to New Brunswick.
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If you're new here, you're automatically irregular after your first visit, so welcome aboard.
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So those of you who heard our, uh, theme song, we at live shows, we're probably gonna be doing a live show abroad.
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subscribe to the restaurant guys and follow us, and you'll find out about all our travels.
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We're gonna do something in Europe at the end of this year or next year.
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We're gonna be down in New Orleans and do a live show sometime soon.
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And we have a new show for you every week.
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And, uh, the most interesting correspondence I got from somebody recently was they, we love our, our our theme song.
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It's an original theme song.
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Somebody pointed out that it sounds a lot like the opening of Sanford and Son, which was, and now I can't get that song outta my head.
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Well, what's what's amusing about that is, so Catherine Lombardi's husband, his father owned a junkyard.
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Mm.
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And he used to say all the time, your father was a junk man, you're gonna be a junk man.
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It's in our DNA It is.
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So that's why we like it so much.
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Well, so I, I we're very charming, but, uh, one of the, the reasons you, you came this evening was because we have an extraordinary, this is a wonderful series.
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We have some great chefs visiting New Brunswick in person, and I know that's why you're here.
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And Alice go, Shelly does not need an introduction.
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But I'm being paid to give her one, so I'm going to do it.
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Um, she is a classically trained chef who's cooked in Michelin starred kitchens.
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Of course, she runs her own restaurants butter, and that just opened Clara in New York City.
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She's a bestselling author of several books, including Italian American Forever.
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Of course you've seen her on Chopped, battling it out on Iron Chef and taking Challengers head on in Alex versus America.
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She's one of America's most beloved chefs.
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So please help me in welcoming Iron Chef Alex Quai to New Brunswick.
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How are you?
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I have my, uh, my knuckle sandwich bag.
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How are you?
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This is so serious.
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Front and center.
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How are we?
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I'm telling you, this is gonna go to my head.
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Yeah.
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Hi.
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Are you all locals?
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Yes.
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I love it.
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New Jersey in the house.
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This is the best produce state in the United States.
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I feel the garden state.
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You are you.
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100% correct.
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I read that Progresso Soup when they came to America from Italy, they found that the soil here in New Jersey grew the vegetables that tasted like they did in Italy.
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What bigger compliment is that?
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What else do we need besides people that drive?
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I've never seen people drive like this.
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I do not drive.
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When I'm in New Jersey, I'm literally like, no, I'll take a cab, 500 miles into New Jersey.
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I am not driving you.
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If you're not driving like 89 miles an hour, they're like, beep, beep, brights, flashing, yelling, rolling down windows.
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I'm like, I, I was going 80 in a 50, you know, like what happened?
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I'm on a school street going 69 miles an hour.
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I want to congratulate Alex Warner on really knowing this state.
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So thank you guys.
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Oh my god.
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New Jersey.
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You got, you have been seen, got.
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Yes.
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Well, but if you're, if you're a driver in New Jersey, when you go to other states, you, you can like kill'em all.
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It's fine.
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They all get outta your way.
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We, oh yeah.
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I mean, I take a break by driving in Manhattan.
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That's a break from New Jersey.
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People in New Jersey.
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A drive like they're driving in a video game.
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Yeah.
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And b they're driving like they have a little laser on the front of their car and they, Zack people away.
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Just, I want to get away.
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Well, well, we have a little story that Mark and I were talking before the show before we met you, uh, earlier in, in the green room we were talking about, we have a lot of great chefs who've been on, we've done over 500 shows in the podcast.
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We've done a bunch in the talking series now, but Mark and I have been talking about you to our guests for a couple of months now.
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And so when, we told people about Rocco, I'm gonna say nine outta 10 people.
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Rocco, I love Rocco.
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He's great.
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We talk about Scott and nine out 10 people.
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I love Scott.
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Oh, he's so, he's great.
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He's handsome.
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Oh, he's, oh, he's, we did get a lot of, he's so handsome.
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He's so sick of that.
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I will tell you, do not worry.
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I offset that.
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I will tell you the number of people who snuggled up next to Scott while they, when we were taking pictures afterwards was, I'm, I'm gonna throw up Pretty unreal.
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I'm kidding.
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I love Scott.
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I do love Scott.
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Okay.
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What happened when we said Alex RNA Shelly, every single human that we talked to said, oh my God, I love Alex.
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It's true.
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Man, woman, child, everybody, every dogs and cats, carrot, keets, and cockatoos.
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No, but it was, everybody was like, love her.
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No, but it's, it is no joke.
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It's the same.
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And, you know, we're on the, the mare Ds in the restaurant.
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It's the, it's the same tilt of the head, the same facial expression.
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It's a.
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Oh, I love her.
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I know what it is.
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May I, may I speak out of Turn?
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You.
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It's your turn.
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People are like, you used to be so rude like the first few years you're on Food Network.
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You're so rude.
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You were such a, and I'm like, yeah.
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So I go on Chopped.
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I'm just gonna like, describe to you like, and you do with this what you will.
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I sit between Jefferies and Carrying and Scott Conan on Chopped first episode.
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Scott's like, dude, I gotta tell you, this is so bad.
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I don't know what to do.
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This is so awful what you made.
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And the chef, like, you can see buildings crumbling in his eyes.
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Like the guy's gonna, you know what I'm saying?
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Jeffrey picks up something, he's like, what is this?
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This is disgusting.
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I can't even believe you made this.
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And they come to me and I'm like, I think I could use a little more salt.
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They're like, you're so rude.
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You're the rudest.
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For years.
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I was like, finally.
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I was like, I give up.
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So anything they said, I was like, I disagree.
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For like the whole year, all I did, Scott would be like, it's raining.
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I'm like, I so, you know, eventually, you know, I think, you know, I'm like a sort of like, you know, like, yeah, I like beets and horseradish.
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You know, like if you eat it enough times, you're like, I, I can see the charm in this.
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I think I've worn people down.
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you're very kind.
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But I will tell you something.
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Uhoh, I wouldn't fuck with you.
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I won't.
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If there was an iron podcaster show and you were the judge, yeah, I don't know that I'd go on.
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I don't know the market I want.
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Is this your drink or mine?
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So I see how the, how the evening goes.
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That's all yours.
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That's your drink kind of thing.
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Um, mine is bourbon.
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So that's, uh, okay.
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I'm just having a glass of olive oil.
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Yeah.
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So, Can I, can we start with a, a reading, you know, you have so much on tv, but there's so much more to you than just TV and I wanna talk about some of the other things as well.
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And your, your new book I love, so, oh yeah.
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So can we start?
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The book is Forever Italian and we have an Italian American restaurant next door as well as a steakhouse next door.
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the Italian restaurant is, is Mark's grandmother's cuisine.
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Um, that's why we let Francis read from the books,'cause all the food comes from me.
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Yeah, that's it.
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That's it.
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My Irish grandmother, maybe we will name a bar after her one day, but, uh, yeah, we're gonna make that a pamphlet, not the liver.
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The liver and onions.
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Hey, don't gang up on the Irish A leaflet.
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So only I'm, it's like one sided.
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You can see through it.
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Double space.
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You can read another cookbook through it.
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Large font.
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I've said this joke to audiences before.
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We have some different, this came up when I was talking to Scott and uh, the joke of course is that we own these two restaurants together and.
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Mark is three quarters Italian and a quarter French.
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She had a French grandmother, an Italian grand or Both.
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Who were great cooks?
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I had two Irish grandmothers.
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One of them didn't cook.
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The other one shouldn't have.
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Oh, all right.
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So here, but here's from your book.
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These are your words of wisdom.
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I really do love this.
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You, I think this book is a chef's expression of classic red sauce dishes that have always been an integral part of New York City culture.
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Yeah.
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And therefore my life growing up here.
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Yeah.
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The book is an exploration of my heritage and strangely dishes.
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I have rarely ever cooked in a restaurant.
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These are the dishes we make again and again to perfect them.
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They're the dishes we eat again and again because we crave them endlessly.
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Suffice it to say, this is a book from my heart, but it's also likely already in yours.
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I almost call this book the Things people Always Want to eat.
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I'm hoping that you'll agree after you cook your way through it.
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Yeah, I wrote that.
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That's awesome.
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That's awesome.
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So why?
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Why is Italian American food.
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Basically become America's comfort food again and again.
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Same dishes.
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First of all, how much great Italian food is there in New Jersey?
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Alex: Just as a testament to what we're talking about.
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Alex: Okay.
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Alex: Like seriously.
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Alex: Oh, right.
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Alex: So, uh, because we love it, period.
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Alex: Basically we just wanna eat tomatoes and five pounds of royal cheese.
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Alex: We s you know, people like, you know, tomatoes are fruit.
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Alex: I'm like, be quiet.
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Alex: It's a vegetable.
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Alex: I had a whole salad.
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Alex: I had chicken parm.
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Alex: That's how I think the Mac is.
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Alex: Tomato is not a fruit, it's a vegetable plus cheese, fried chicken, olive oil, parmesano, ano, and garlic.
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Alex: I had like basically a salad with some chicken in it.
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Alex: I feel there's no difference between that and a chicken Caesar, as far as I'm concerned.
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Francis: Your mother was a cookbook author.
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Francis: Cookbook editor.
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Francis: Editor, yeah.
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Francis: So you had great food in the house.
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Francis: Were you embracing of that?
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Alex: Yeah, I've, I, I have so many chefs are like, oh my God.
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Alex: I stood on a stool and I made gnocchi when I was two.
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Alex: And it wasn't like that in my house at all.
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Alex: My mother made stuff.
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Alex: My dad came home and ate it.
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Alex: And that was a whole thing.
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Alex: And I was an only child.
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Alex: Do you know what I'm saying?
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Alex: My mother's name was Maria Albano de Benedetto Garelli.
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Alex: Okay.
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Alex: My mom's like so glad to get rid of the maiden name.
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Alex: I'm like, you went from De Benedetto to Guana.
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Alex: She, where's the math there?
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Alex: Right, right.
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Alex: I think she gained a couple letters and my father, uh, you know, if my dad didn't like something, we didn't eat it.
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Alex: Anybody grew up like that?
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Alex: Yes.
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Alex: My dad was like, I don't like capers.
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Alex: Never saw'em.
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Alex: Carrots, carrots.
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Alex: I don't like chilies.
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Alex: I don't like anchovies.
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Alex: Never saw'em.
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Alex: I, I saw a jalapeno.
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Alex: I was like, what is this?
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Alex: I was like, 40, you know what I'm saying?
12:53
Alex: So I'm an only child.
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Alex: Like there was no sibling to hide behind.
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Alex: You know what I'm saying?
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Alex: We didn't have any pets.
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Alex: You know, I had a gerbil for a couple years, but you know how that goes.
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Alex: Came home for vacation and the person who took care of him, like kept him in the freezer and was like, sorry.
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Alex: So I'm just gonna say it was me, my mom, and my dad and my parents.
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Alex: We made a lot of Italian food.
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Alex: Mm-hmm.
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Alex: Uh, but my father cooked Chinese food for a hobby, so there was a wok on the stove.
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Alex: So this is really weird.
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Alex: Do you know what I mean?
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Alex: Like, I'd come home and my dad would be cooking all this Cantonese food, and then the next night my mom would make marara or like a Pola, and my mom would sear these like ginormous pork ups and just put'em right in the sauce.
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Alex: You know, she had this big pot of sauce, but it was only like a half full.
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Alex: And I was like, this is lame.
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Alex: Why do you have this big pot?
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Alex: And she would take these gargantuan pork chops and sauces.
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Alex: This thing was like, it fed us for three, we could put more things in it.
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Alex: Right.
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Alex: And I would, like, my mom would know,'cause at night, you know, when it gets cold, the tomato sauce in the fridge with all the stuff in it.
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Alex: Mm-hmm.
13:56
Alex: If you pulled something out, it left like a earth, like a crater?
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Alex: Yeah.
14:00
Alex: Trench.
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Alex: Like you knew my trench mom knew.
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Alex: She's like, you ate two sausages and half a pork chop.
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Alex: I'm like, I did not.
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Alex: That was a meatball that I smeared around, so yes, but I was a spectator to my parents cooking.
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Alex: They wouldn't really let me cook a lot.
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Mark: I really frustrated my father as a young person because, so he was born in France and half French and half Italian, and he liked things that really stunk.
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Mark: And I really didn't like things as a young person that really stunk.
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Mark: I, and I, I, you know, my mother reminds me all the time that, so when I went to preschool, the nuns pulled her aside.
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Mark: They're like, he's gonna turn into a peanut butter and jelly sandwich.
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Mark: And I kind of did, but, but I just, at no experimentation till I was 10, 12 years old.
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Mark: Zero.
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Mark: Experimentation.
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Mark: You know, that's, I, I didn't want any of that.
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Mark: I remember my, a hamburger putting cheese on.
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Mark: It was a big deal for me.
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Mark: I had a, I had to overcome the trauma of putting cheese on a hamburger.
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Mark: But,
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Francis: and, and how Well you've done Mark, really good job.
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Francis: Good job.
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Alex: It's the whole dynamic here that I'm not touching.
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Alex: I'm just a guest here.
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Alex: I like being a fly on the wall.
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Alex: Mom, dad, here we're, yeah.
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Francis: Our, our, our staff often says, I can't listen to the radio show.
15:22
Francis: It's just like sitting in the office with the two of you anyway.
15:25
Francis: Uh, the same thing.
15:25
Francis: That's a good thing.
15:26
Francis: So, so your mom was cookbook editor and she's making all this crazy, so your mom made the food for the cookbooks that she was editing very often in the home?
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Francis: Yes.
15:34
Francis: No.
15:34
Alex: So my mom was actually like a Quincy Jones type cookbook editor, Uhhuh.
15:39
Alex: So everybody wanted my mother to edit their cookbooks.
15:43
Alex: My mom has edited a lot of books.
15:44
Alex: I bet you have at home, you know.
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Alex: She did the 1990 revision of the joy of cooking.
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Alex: My mom spent four years just revising the joy of cooking, which was really weird.
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Alex: I mean, I'd come home, I was working at, uh, for Danielle Ballou at Restaurant Danielle, and I would start my, I would go to work at like four o'clock in the morning'cause I couldn't get all the stuff done.
16:03
Alex: So I would get to work at four 30 in the morning to be ready to serve lunch at noon.
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Alex: You see the map there?
16:08
Alex: Yeah.
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Francis: Restaurant math.
16:09
Alex: Yeah.
16:10
Alex: I was like,
16:10
Mark: welcome to the life of a chef.
16:11
Mark: Yeah,
16:12
Alex: yeah.
16:12
Alex: Um, but she was up at the dining room table with this manuscript this big and I'd be like, bye mom.
16:18
Alex: And she would be like, does this look like a blue point oyster, this drawing?
16:22
Alex: You know, she wouldn't be looking at me or the drawing.
16:25
Alex: She was like looking off into the horizon as if she had microdosed for like five hours.
16:31
Alex: So this was like four years of my life.
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Alex: I was just watching her.
16:34
Alex: Um, but she would cook her way through.
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Alex: Her manuscripts and I think, so I would come home and there would be these giant, she would draw a box around the whole manuscript and then X through the whole thing.
16:45
Alex: And then write all the, rewrite, the whole thing in the margins, like all around it.
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Alex: I don't know how anybody like got her edits translated'cause it was like Sanskrit.
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Alex: But the net result was all these great cookbooks.
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Alex: Some great cookbooks.
16:58
Alex: Yeah.
16:58
Alex: The Zuni Cafe.
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Alex: She did all the Frugal Gourmets book.
17:02
Alex: Splendid table.
17:02
Alex: Right.
17:03
Alex: Splendid table.
17:04
Alex: Splendid table.
17:05
Francis: That was Lynn Rosetta Casper's book that started the, the a PM series, uh, American Public Media series.
17:11
Francis: I listened to that radio show.
17:12
Francis: It's in its 30th year.
17:14
Francis: Yeah.
17:14
Francis: And Lynn Rose, atta Casper left in 18.
17:17
Francis: Mm-hmm.
17:17
Francis: But that cookbook is amazing.
17:20
Alex: Yeah.
17:20
Alex: Lemme tell you, that was, that was a, that was a rough one.
17:23
Alex: Why was it rough?
17:24
Alex: A lot of polenta, you know what I'm saying?
17:26
Alex: Yeah.
17:26
Alex: Yeah.
17:27
Alex: So did you get enlisted to help, you know, prepping and doing any of this stuff or?
17:30
Alex: No.
17:30
Alex: My, I was a spectator to a lot of the cooking.
17:33
Alex: My mom did.
17:34
Alex: I don't know about all of you, but I love how people say like, oh, I got to, to cook all the food.
17:39
Alex: My mother was like, you watch peel the potato.
17:43
Alex: So I would like peel the potato.
17:44
Alex: I didn't particularly want to, you know, like, I think people feel like chefs, they got up when they were two and they were like, baba chef.
17:51
Alex: Like you don't, I didn't know I wanted to be a chef till I finished college.
17:55
Alex: Right.
17:56
Alex: So I just was like cooking and then I was, I cooked a lot in college'cause I didn't wanna do any homework.
18:02
Alex: And so I would go to the store and like buy a bunch of stuff.
18:04
Alex: You know those like metallic roaster pans you buy in the supermarket?
18:08
Alex: Yeah.
18:08
Alex: That somehow are paper thin but hold like a 500 pound Turkey and you're just afraid they're gonna twist and buckle and everything's gonna fall on the floor.
18:16
Alex: I would make like a 40 pound lasagna in one of those, um, and cook it like all day.
18:22
Alex: And then people would just come over and we would have like 18 beers and two bites of lasagna.
18:26
Alex: It's a great night.
18:28
Alex: All about the food.
18:29
Mark: Everybody knows lasagna's better the next day anyway, so.
18:32
Alex: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
18:34
Francis: but when you were a kid, did they make you peel the potatoes?
18:36
Alex: Oh yeah, I did a lot of stuff like that.
18:37
Francis: See, but doesn't that speak to like, sometimes you make your kids do stuff that they don't like now, but then they become a famous chef.
18:43
Alex: I don't know.
18:45
Alex: I'll get back to you.
18:46
Alex: Alright.
18:47
Alex: Um, my parents are both big academics, Uhhuh, they both got PhDs at Yale.
18:52
Alex: And they met there.
18:53
Alex: So could you puke?
18:54
Alex: Honestly.
18:56
Alex: And they got married at, in the chapel at Yale.
19:00
Alex: And like, they were the big, like to-do couple.
19:02
Alex: My dad had a PhD in history.
19:04
Alex: My mom had a PhD in Russian.
19:06
Alex: Really?
19:06
Alex: I mean these, yeah, she would talk to the cab drivers.
19:10
Alex: So only people, I was like, I'm not gonna speak Russian right now.
19:14
Alex: I'm six.
19:16
Alex: Um, but they were real academics and I was just not.
19:19
Alex: I went to school and I was like, this skips a generation.
19:23
Alex: I see how this works.
19:24
Francis: So, you went from not being particularly interested in being a chef.
19:27
Francis: You weren't like, I'm destined to be a chef when I'm six.
19:29
Francis: Oh.
19:29
Francis: Why did you tell us about how you got into the kitchen and then you, when you start something, you really start something.
19:34
Francis: So give us, give us the beginning of your professional kitchen career.
19:38
Alex: Oh, boy.
19:39
Alex: Um, I would just say that I made a list of all the things that I could not do.
19:43
Alex: Mm-hmm.
19:43
Alex: And I was like, what's left?
19:46
Alex: Does any, did anybody do this math?
19:48
Alex: No, I, one person was like you.
19:51
Alex: Someone was like, I feel bad for her, Jerry, I'm just gonna say yes.
19:54
Alex: So she doesn't feel alone, whoever you are.
19:56
Alex: Thank you.
19:58
Alex: Um, so I made a list of the genuinely, and like I know that you think I'm trying to be cute, but I'm serious.
20:03
Alex: One, be cooperative for long periods of time every day.
20:08
Alex: Two be on time, consistently three wear color coordinated outfit.
20:12
Alex: It's never gonna happen.
20:14
Alex: Force it at a desk, like a desk to me.
20:16
Alex: But I was like, why do we have to have a desk Like this is giving me anxiety.
20:19
Alex: It's almost a desk.
20:21
Alex: So I was like, what doesn't have those things?
20:23
Alex: Now, if the deadliest catch had been on at that time, I would've gone on a well boat and been a green horn.
20:31
Alex: I would've gone, uh, in the early seasons and you watch a deadliest catch anybody.
20:35
Alex: Yeah.
20:36
Alex: So the same person's like, yeah.
20:38
Alex: Um, I would've gone, they're watching the food network.
20:41
Alex: They're not watching deadliest cats.
20:43
Alex: Same family of networks.
20:44
Alex: I'm not o off Offbrand right now.
20:46
Alex: And, um, I would've gone on the Cornelia Marie,'cause that was the coolest boat.
20:51
Alex: I loved Captain Phil Harris and his two sons.
20:54
Alex: I was like, dude, you, you people need to like hang up the, the substances and get with the crabs.
20:59
Alex: You know what I'm saying?
21:01
Alex: Um, but in any event, I would've done that.
21:03
Alex: And, but that didn't exist, so I decided I was gonna be a plumber and electrician or a chef.
21:07
Alex: That was what I decided.
21:09
Francis: So RAA was on the show.
21:10
Francis: We're talking about the same thing.
21:11
Francis: He's like, I I applied for the plumbing program in high school.
21:14
Francis: I didn't get in, so I became a chef.
21:15
Francis: What's it with?
21:16
Francis: Plumbers and chef Scott.
21:17
Francis: Scott.
21:17
Francis: You, I'm sorry.
21:17
Francis: There's Scott.
21:18
Francis: So, yeah.
21:19
Alex: And isn't that great like that Scott?
21:21
Alex: Like he is, first of all, he's too handsome.
21:24
Alex: He's too handsome.
21:25
Francis: I'm just imagining a truck's rolling all around New Jersey, Guana and Conant Plumbing.
21:29
Francis: Eight years.
21:32
Alex: I don't know about that.
21:32
Alex: Let's put it on.
21:33
Alex: I'd have to wear my shirt down here.
21:34
Alex: I'd have to wear puca shells.
21:36
Alex: It would be a mess.
21:38
Mark: So imagine, imagine Scott with no belt.
21:40
Alex: Yeah, no, I love him so much.
21:43
Alex: So when we started Chopped, which was 17 years ago.
21:46
Alex: Yeah, I know.
21:47
Alex: My daughter's 17.
21:48
Alex: That's how I know.
21:50
Alex: Um.
21:51
Alex: Um, the first day I sat between Scott and Jeffrey and I knew Scott already for like five years, but I didn't know Jeffrey.
21:57
Alex: I, I love, I as much as I love Scott, as much as I love Jeffrey, like I love them to, to pieces, they're like family.
22:04
Alex: Like we'll go to an event with 400 people and we'll see each other all the way across the room and it'll just be like you have people that you just chin talk to.
22:15
Mark: You Sure.
22:15
Mark: You're not from Jersey.
22:16
Mark: 'cause everybody,
22:18
Alex: yeah, it's the chin talk.
22:19
Alex: We might not even speak the whole night, but we just shit each other and we're like, they get it.
22:24
Francis: So let me ask you.
22:25
Francis: Yeah.
22:26
Francis: you are a chef and I do wanna go back to your origins'cause a lot of people are like, oh, I went to France for six months and I learned how to about European cuisine and I came back and you went for seven years.
22:35
Francis: Yeah.
22:35
Francis: And worked at Michelin star restaurants.
22:37
Francis: But to talk about, to stick on what you're talking about right here, one of the great things about a restaurant.
22:43
Francis: Is the family that you get.
22:45
Francis: It's almost sounds like a cliche and a lot of corporations are like, it's a cliche.
22:48
Francis: It's definitely a cliche.
22:49
Francis: Yeah.
22:49
Francis: But like big corporations, like, oh, the family people that work here, you work in a restaurant, man, you're there till two in the morning, you're there crazy hours.
22:55
Francis: And if you're there with somebody for four or five years or 15 or 20 or 25 years, you have three kids.
23:00
Francis: You, you, it becomes a family.
23:03
Francis: And I'm just wondering, is there, is there that sort of comradery in the television chef world?
23:09
Alex: Oh yeah.
23:10
Alex: I think really that's why people watch Chop so much.
23:13
Alex: 'cause they picked like about eight, eight of us.
23:15
Alex: Maybe it was like Marcus Samuelson, Amanda F.
23:17
Alex: Fry tag, Scott Kan, Jeffrey Zaria and Chris Santos, Monique Chohan, me and Mark Murphy Uhhuh.
23:25
Alex: That was like the original.
23:27
Alex: And so all the episodes were some mixture of that.
23:30
Alex: Um, and we were just like, you want us to talk, like we talk in the restaurant?
23:35
Alex: You know, like, yeah, these, this, the feedback we would give each other in the restaurant and I think it didn't bring the restaurant.
23:41
Alex: To the show.
23:42
Alex: Mm-hmm.
23:42
Alex: But it brought that culture, right?
23:44
Alex: Yeah.
23:44
Alex: That, that pirate like just got off the black pearl.
23:46
Alex: Yeah.
23:47
Alex: Had my parakeet and my eye patch and I'm ready to tell you why your spaghetti sucks.
23:51
Alex: And I think that really resonates with people because you wanna know, right?
23:55
Alex: Yep.
23:55
Alex: And I think that, you know, if I'm not wrong, like I feel like the audience could feel that we wanted to tell the truth.
24:01
Alex: Mm-hmm.
24:02
Alex: And, and you know, and I think, which was hard to do, by the way,
24:04
Mark: one of the things they, the, that you do so well on the shows that you judge, literally, that's you said, just said it.
24:10
Mark: Exactly.
24:11
Mark: That is what we do.
24:12
Mark: We sit around the table and we're like, you know, this needs more salt, this needs a little more egg yolk.
24:17
Mark: This needs more cheese.
24:19
Mark: I
24:19
Francis: occasionally, this sucks.
24:21
Francis: So this way can't, we can't.
24:22
Francis: Yeah.
24:22
Francis: Or start over.
24:23
Francis: Right.
24:23
Francis: And we'll, we'll be that way with each other and the chefs will talk to us about.
24:26
Francis: You can't do services, where are you gonna ruin our food?
24:28
Francis: Mm-hmm.
24:28
Francis: But that's, I I, I find that kind of refreshing and it's nice to see it on TV to be honest with you.
24:33
Alex: I think also when you're a chef and you're not a line cook anymore, but you may be a chef you're teaching people and you're ordering food and you're running the place, so you don't really put down your clipboard and have that carefree moment where you're learning or you learn about yourself.
24:45
Alex: Right.
24:45
Alex: And then you cook your food and you serve to a jury of your peers, and you get that feedback mm-hmm.
24:49
Alex: That you actually miss having when you're running the restaurant.
24:52
Alex: Right.
24:52
Alex: You too is wondering if the dishwasher is not quite drunk enough that he can get through it.
24:59
Alex: The grease trap is leaking, but we can mop it up with the dirty laundry that's in the bag downstairs.
25:07
Alex: You don't have a day, you're really taking the,
25:08
Francis: you're really taking the bloom off the rose there.
25:10
Francis: I gotta tell you, these people have a very good impression of what we, we look like in the front of house.
25:14
Mark: And I will tell you from experience, these people are not afraid to tell me when I've done it wrong.
25:18
Mark: Okay.
25:19
Mark: There at least half of you have told me that I've done something wrong.
25:22
Mark: In the, in the dining room.
25:24
Mark: It's,
25:24
Francis: but you, you bring up a good point about pressure and honesty and it's funny'cause one of the things that we find when people, a lot of young people come and work for us.
25:31
Francis: We're in a college town.
25:32
Francis: People work for us when they're 19.
25:33
Francis: Fortunately have people who have worked for us for 20 and 18 and 15 years, but some people work for us for a year or two.
25:39
Francis: And then they go on and they often find that whatever job they've gone in, the other field they've gone into is somewhat frustrating.
25:45
Francis: 'cause the feedback comes at the end of the month, at the end of the quarter, there's, and the restaurant is like, we open at four 30.
25:52
Francis: Those people are going to the theater at eight o'clock.
25:54
Francis: They say they're, if you fail, I mean we fail to get people to the theater two times in 33 years.
26:01
Mark: Not any of you though.
26:02
Mark: You all got here fine.
26:04
Francis: And the reason we know that is'cause those two people have never been back.
26:06
Francis: They hate us.
26:08
Francis: But honestly you, it felt like our world collapsed.
26:11
Francis: Right?
26:11
Francis: It was like we, we failed at that job.
26:14
Francis: But every day there's a deadline and it works or it doesn't.
26:17
Francis: And you, that kind of also builds the comradery.
26:20
Francis: And that's sort of what the shows.
26:22
Francis: You know, you are the final judgment.
26:23
Francis: Your pre-the seven 30 Andre's better hit the table and they better be good.
26:27
Alex: Yeah.
26:27
Alex: I mean, but I don't know if we get a basket with like toilet paper and gummy worms.
26:31
Alex: Yeah, that's true.
26:32
Alex: And that kind of, I think the adversity that the shows inherently present is something that the viewers, I think it resonates with you, right?
28:05
Alex: I mean, I go into the local supermarket and there's like dragon fruit and fresh turmeric and you know, Papino melons and I'm like, I feel like this comes from the fact that we have so much more of awareness of ingredients because of these shows.
28:20
Alex: 'cause they're watching it.
28:20
Alex: People are like, that's a durian.
28:25
Alex: You know?
28:25
Alex: And it's like, come on man.
28:27
Alex: Like, just, just relax.
28:28
Alex: Will you,
28:31
Francis: do you think that America is more conversant with food because of,'cause I think one of the things that's happened, especially since Covid, is people are watching YouTube, people are watching cooking show video and the amount of knowledge that people have, even, you know, people who are cooking at home.
28:47
Francis: They're gonna make a beef Wellington, and they've seen the pictures and they've done it, and it kind of pushes restaurants a little bit forward.
28:54
Francis: What are your thoughts on how, how the media is affecting the environment and especially young cooks coming up?
29:01
Mark: Uh oh.
29:03
Mark: What?
29:03
Mark: I've seen that look before.
29:05
Alex: Oh, I don't know.
29:10
Francis: Alright, well scrap that question.
29:11
Francis: Let's, I waited.
29:13
Alex: I don't know.
29:14
Alex: I, I don't know if people wanna work that hard and I don't know how many people wanna work that hard physically and grind every day like that.
29:22
Alex: You said, I went to France for seven years.
29:24
Alex: I worked in a three star Michelin restaurant for six years.
29:27
Alex: I was supposed to go for two days.
29:29
Alex: I met Vo who was the chef.
29:31
Alex: He has a restaurant in the Caesar's Palace in Las Vegas, and he has a restaurant in Paris.
29:34
Alex: He's amazing.
29:36
Alex: Um, I was supposed to stay there through three days.
29:39
Alex: The third day he, he wasn't there the first two days.
29:43
Alex: Um, I had a plane ticket home, everything, and he walked in and I, I don't know if you ever met someone, I, I just met him and he looked me in the eye and there was 26 men in the room and me, and he walked in the room and he was like, Hey.
29:57
Alex: And I was like, dad, he's, is that you?
30:03
Mark: I'm finally getting the approval.
30:04
Mark: I always cream.
30:05
Alex: Is that you?
30:05
Alex: And he was like, daughter, now I have a dad.
30:10
Alex: I had a dad.
30:11
Alex: He has a daughter.
30:12
Alex: But something happened.
30:14
Alex: Yeah.
30:14
Alex: And I was like, you know what?
30:16
Alex: I'm gonna stay here.
30:17
Alex: It was not a, it was a rough environment.
30:20
Alex: I mean, whatever.
30:21
Alex: Yeah.
30:21
Alex: It was a rough environment.
30:22
Alex: The French restaurant in the Yeah, they were, they were really not the friendliest, this is America.
30:26
Alex: I'll be polite, but let's just say like, I, I, none of them spoke English.
30:30
Alex: So let's start there.
30:31
Alex: And I took French in high school, whatever.
30:32
Alex: But lemme tell you like, you know, so.
30:38
Alex: One of the cooks spoke English somewhat.
30:41
Alex: Right.
30:41
Alex: And he was like, I do not know what is worse that you are American or you are a woman.
30:48
Alex: And I was like, well, I guess we'll do some math upstairs.
30:51
Mark: And, and then when he got up, he said, I think I know.
30:56
Alex: No, you're so funny.
30:57
Alex: No, not at all.
30:58
Alex: Um, you know, you can go homicide or you can go like slow burn bank heist.
31:02
Alex: And I like think I went to slow burn, like, that's great.
31:05
Alex: Gerard Butler and De Thieves type vibes.
31:08
Alex: Like, I'm gonna wait it out, I'm gonna get divorced, I'm gonna do a bunch of like stupid stuff.
31:12
Alex: So I, this is really going wild.
31:15
Alex: Um, no, I just was like, I really wanna learn how to cook and I'm not gonna leave here until I have so much confidence in my abilities that no one can make me doubt what I know I can do.
31:25
Alex: And that's how long it took me.
31:26
Francis: Damn.
31:27
Francis: That's awesome.
31:28
Francis: Yeah.
31:30
Mark: So.
31:33
Mark: I had the good fortune to spend a summer in France.
31:35
Mark: Okay.
31:36
Mark: I spent a summer during, during college in France, not working in restaurants.
31:41
Mark: being able to travel a little bit, being able to absorb the culture again, living with a family that spoke, no English whatsoever.
31:47
Mark: High school French.
31:49
Mark: And I learned more in that summer than my entire five years of college.
31:55
Mark: yeah, I said five years.
31:57
Mark: Okay.
31:57
Alex: You did say five.
31:58
Alex: I said five.
31:59
Alex: What happened?
31:59
Mark: I, I got three majors, but I liked college, so I stayed so's.
32:04
Mark: Why you stayed?
32:04
Mark: Stayed, stayed for a while anyway.
32:06
Mark: I'm still here.
32:06
Mark: Okay.
32:07
Mark: I didn't, I'm still right.
32:08
Mark: Never left.
32:09
Mark: Um, I, I learned so much being in Europe, being with Europeans, living the lifestyle.
32:18
Mark: You spent seven years there.
32:19
Mark: You also lived in la you also lived in New York.
32:21
Mark: Yeah.
32:22
Mark: What a, what a world view you have.
32:26
Mark: I don't see young chefs.
32:29
Mark: Doing that anymore as much.
32:31
Mark: Yeah.
32:32
Mark: And I, and I think that do, do you think it, do you think that they need to do that?
32:35
Mark: No.
32:35
Mark: Or do you think the worldview is permeated here completely?
32:40
Alex: I think, I think you need to put on your phone and start cutting stuff.
32:43
Alex: So I think that's a really big people like, how do I get good at prepping?
32:46
Alex: And I'm like, well, it's not watching YouTube videos.
32:49
Alex: Buy 5,000 onions and call me.
32:51
Alex: You know what I mean?
32:52
Alex: So I think there's a physicality, there's, there's, there's no shortcut to the, to the place.
32:57
Alex: Yeah.
32:57
Alex: For me, there was not also, like, I just followed good produce, honestly.
33:01
Alex: Like all the places you name, where I live, I was just like these, I, I remember being in Paris and I'm walking to work and, you know, like, let me get out the violin.
33:08
Alex: I had no money.
33:09
Alex: I made no money.
33:10
Alex: I would look at stuff.
33:11
Alex: I couldn't buy it.
33:12
Alex: Let's just say I lived on a friend's couch.
33:15
Alex: I didn't get paid for a long time.
33:17
Alex: I ate the leftover cheese from the cheese tray that went out in the dining room.
33:22
Alex: I ate the leftover cheese a lot.
33:26
Alex: I also kept a quart of cream in the refrigerator and I would just slug on it.
33:30
Alex: Really.
33:31
Alex: By the way, for those of you who don't know, leftover cheese is cheese.
33:37
Alex: Okay, so,
33:38
Francis: so while you're doing all this in Paris Yeah, because I have to say really back in the age when it used to be that chef would go and travel and do that and they'd stay six months somewhere.
33:46
Francis: Yeah, maybe a year.
33:47
Francis: not speaking, French, no, I spoke French, but it was not speaking fluent, kind of crappy kitchen French.
33:52
Francis: And you wrote, I call it Tarzan French.
33:54
Francis: That's what I call it.
33:55
Francis: Yeah.
33:55
Francis: So you got in, but then you rose through the ranks.
33:58
Francis: You became a ranking chef.
34:00
Francis: Yeah.
34:00
Francis: In French kitchen.
34:00
Francis: Yeah.
34:01
Francis: As a woman and as an American.
34:02
Francis: How did, I mean, how did, I mean, in
34:03
Alex: 500 years you get the job, you know what I mean?
34:05
Alex: Stand there long enough to like you, everybody else quit.
34:09
Alex: You know what I mean?
34:10
Francis: Well, yeah, don't get fired the longest, but No, it's more than that.
34:13
Francis: Right?
34:13
Francis: You had to, he had to see something in you.
34:14
Francis: And what did you learn?
34:16
Francis: What did you learn when you were there and what did you bring to them that they didn't expect?
34:19
Alex: I mean, they were like, can you make us do cookies?
34:21
Alex: We like to these people in the restaurant, by the way, they all became my dearest frenzy.
34:26
Alex: Dudes like, I love it.
34:27
Alex: I was like a mascot.
34:28
Alex: Do you know what I mean?
34:29
Alex: They're like, pass around like a cheese tray.
34:31
Alex: Not like that.
34:33
Alex: Settle down New Jersey.
34:36
Alex: Okay.
34:36
Alex: In New York.
34:37
Alex: They'd be like, who in New Jersey?
34:38
Alex: They're like, ho, ho, ho.
34:41
Alex: Set it out in the back because remember it's still cheese.
34:46
Alex: but it was like funny.
34:47
Alex: Like they'd be like, I, I had a boyfriend for a long time, uh, who I love.
34:52
Alex: He was was one of, we were still friends.
34:54
Alex: A French boyfriend.
34:55
Alex: Yeah.
34:55
Alex: Oh, and the International Language of love.
34:57
Alex: Yeah.
34:58
Alex: Well, I dunno about that, but that's another podcast.
35:01
Alex: So he's lived in the middle of nowhere in Normandy where they don't make wine.
35:06
Alex: There's some region of France.
35:07
Alex: They don't make make any wine'cause they don't grow grapes.
35:09
Alex: And in those regions they're a little like.
35:12
Alex: Pissed.
35:13
Alex: They're like, we know it's not burgundy, but we're trying.
35:16
Alex: But in Normandy they have cows and apples.
35:19
Alex: Apples we have apples.
35:20
Alex: We have, so they make cider and they make, you know, all sorts of boozy, like caldo, calvados and other stuff.
35:26
Alex: And then they, they make unbelievable butter and cheese.
35:29
Alex: And my boyfriend's father was a char uta.
35:32
Alex: So shark UTA is someone who makes charcuterie.
35:34
Alex: And, and the term is kind of loose, but charcuterie traditionally it means you only make pork, everything.
35:42
Alex: Sausages, feet, legs, ears, nose, tail.
35:46
Alex: You know what I'm saying?
35:47
Alex: The whole store is right.
35:49
Mark: And the whole store would be just that.
35:50
Mark: Just four.
35:51
Mark: Like, and, and usually there'd be a cheese place on one side of it and a bread place on the other side of it.
35:56
Mark: And you didn't need to go anyplace else.
35:58
Mark: I was gonna say move there.
35:58
Mark: There you go.
35:59
Mark: One of those, one of those, one of those.
36:01
Mark: I'll meet you on a park bench.
36:02
Alex: Yeah.
36:03
Alex: So I went over to his family's house.
36:05
Alex: You would've thought I was a martian.
36:08
Alex: I walk in the room, there's like nine of them all sitting around a table and there's like a seat at the head, like for me, like the curiosity freak will sit here.
36:16
Alex: So I sit down and they're like, tell us in America everything's frozen, right?
36:21
Alex: And I was like, what?
36:22
Alex: And they're like, everything you eat is frozen.
36:24
Alex: You eat nothing but frozen food in America.
36:27
Alex: And I was like, this is the question.
36:29
Alex: Like this is the hill you people wanna die on.
36:33
Alex: We have popsicles.
36:34
Alex: I had two choices.
36:35
Alex: I could be like, oh my God, no.
36:36
Alex: It's just so amazing.
36:37
Alex: We love solid and juices and we're just like learning about turmeric.
36:40
Alex: And, or I could be like, I could double down.
36:43
Alex: And I go, yes.
36:46
Alex: I said, sometimes I buy food, cook it, freeze it, defrost it, and eat it.
36:52
Alex: And I, I, I truly said this'cause I was like, this is crazy.
36:55
Alex: I may as well lean in.
36:59
Alex: And I said, sometimes I cook it.
37:01
Alex: Freeze it to frost it and eat it just so it was frozen.
37:04
Alex: And they go say, so like all of them, the whole table, except my boyfriend who was like, yay.
37:14
Alex: So I get up in the morning and the dad's in the garage, like in the blue overalls with the stump of the cigar, and he's poaching this giant like coiled up sausage.
37:25
Alex: I'm like, what is that?
37:26
Alex: And he's like, it's Bud Noir.
37:27
Alex: And I'm like, how do you make it?
37:28
Alex: And he's like, you take pig's blood and mix it with onions and then you put it in the casing and you boil it.
37:35
Alex: he had a gleam in his eye and he looked all beaty.
37:37
Alex: I tell you.
37:38
Alex: I was like, I gotta get outta here.
37:41
Alex: By the way, we ate like two, two meals maybe.
37:44
Alex: Uh, then we went to his uncle's house.
37:46
Alex: And I got there and it was like, so sweet.
37:49
Alex: This little house and then like having Calvados in the yard and whatever.
37:53
Alex: Mm-hmm.
37:53
Alex: And they're like, aren't the chickens cute?
37:54
Alex: And I'm like, they're so cute.
37:55
Alex: These chickens were so pretty.
37:57
Alex: And they're so, they're like, you know, they're like, whatever.
37:59
Alex: What's up?
38:00
Alex: Or they were like, hoo.
38:04
Alex: So I'm like, this, these chickens are so cute.
38:07
Alex: So we go and we sit down and whenever we're eating dinner and they bring out the chicken and I'm like, and they're like, we killed the chicken that you said was so cute, like in honor of you coming.
38:17
Alex: And I was like, okay.
38:19
Alex: Like do we have any CADs?
38:20
Alex: Don't, don't say anything about the other guests.
38:22
Alex: 'cause they might be on the plate next time.
38:23
Alex: Yeah.
38:24
Alex: But amazing culture, amazing, experience.
38:27
Alex: like all jokes to aside, I learned so much about ingredients and food and cooking and ingredients in food in France, it's sacred.
38:35
Alex: the restaurant was in Paris, but these people would come in and just put down like little pails of things with like towels over them.
38:41
Alex: And you would go and lift and it would be these giant like portini mushrooms and someone else would come and leave a pale.
38:47
Alex: And it was these long white asparagus, I mean the nobility of the ingredients.
38:52
Alex: That's why I stayed so long.
38:53
Alex: Yeah.
38:54
Alex: But I can never eat risotto again.
38:56
Alex: And this is because I worked a hot app station for a long time and there was the state, the whole station was real.
39:02
Alex: The station was as big as this table and I had two burners.
39:06
Alex: And people would be like, let me use your burner.
39:08
Alex: I'm like, do not even make eye contact with my burners.
39:12
Alex: And so all night I was like making risotto, but the risotto changed all the time.
39:16
Alex: We had the portini on the risotto, we had the asparagus, sweet breads, fiddlehead ferns, wild asparagus.
39:22
Alex: So this rotating plate of rice became this canvas for all these, so I was cooking all this amazing stuff.
39:30
Alex: and after like a year I was like, look, can I work the fish?
39:33
Alex: Like all I wanted was to work the fish station, and it was right next to the hot apps all night.
39:37
Alex: I'm watching the chef, you know, and I'm like stirring the rice.
39:40
Alex: Like, someone get me outta here.
39:42
Mark: Did you haven't made risotto.
39:44
Mark: You can't do anything else except for make risotto.
39:47
Mark: Right.
39:47
Alex: You're doing that.
39:48
Alex: Doing that.
39:49
Alex: Yeah.
39:49
Alex: That's, that was so now, and so now you've lost your taste for risotto from the So I Too much.
39:52
Alex: Well, I finally got promoted to the fish station.
39:55
Alex: I was so excited.
39:57
Alex: 'cause he told me no, like three times.
39:58
Alex: He was like, no, I'm not good enough.
39:59
Alex: I was like, okay.
40:02
Alex: Then I went back, I was like, I wanna wait to the, this station.
40:03
Alex: He's like, no.
40:04
Alex: Okay.
40:06
Alex: So finally he moves me to the fish station and I'm so excited and the other guy takes over and he's making the risotto.
40:12
Alex: And I'm like, ha.
40:15
Alex: I swear to God, like night three, excuse my French beep show.
40:19
Alex: Uh, the guy can't, a bunch of risottos overcooked.
40:23
Alex: They all came back like this big table and they all, the mare d like brought the plates back and put'em down.
40:28
Alex: And it was like, someone is dying tonight.
40:30
Alex: Yeah.
40:31
Alex: Like right here, right now.
40:33
Alex: And Vos like, that's it.
40:35
Alex: I'm moving the risotto to the fish station.
40:38
Alex: Oh no.
40:40
Alex: So the risotto came with me.
40:42
Alex: Literally when I see a bag of our Oreo rice in the supermarket, it's, it goes.
40:51
Mark: So do you drop a house on it then?
40:52
Alex: I cannot even, people make risotto.
40:55
Alex: They're like, we made risotto.
40:56
Alex: I'm like, great.
40:58
Alex: When they do it on chopped, I'm like, oh, okay.
41:01
Alex: That's when my risotto radar is shut off.
41:03
Alex: That's a respect it.
41:04
Francis: Yeah.
41:05
Francis: I adore risotto, but I've only made it a thousand times in my life.
41:09
Francis: Not a hundred thousand times in my life.
41:10
Mark: still, the greatest plate of risotto in my life was on a flight from Milan to Verona.
41:18
Mark: I was like, you're on an airplane.
41:20
Mark: How did you make the best risotto of my life?
41:23
Mark: I believe, but it was a shrimp risotto.
41:26
Mark: Spectacular.
41:27
Mark: I, I have no idea how they did it, but they, they care more than we do.
41:31
Alex: It was me's the whole,
41:36
Francis: so, I wanna talk about your book.
41:39
Francis: Yeah.
41:40
Francis: Because everyone should buy the book and buy the book.
41:41
Francis: We're gonna support.
41:42
Francis: Alex, um, but one of the things that I read in your book that I, I did not know about before was you have the recipe for 1980s date night angel hair pasta.
41:53
Francis: Oh yeah.
41:55
Francis: And first of all, it looks delicious.
41:56
Francis: And secondly, it reminded me of Marcella Hasan, who was a great cookbook author.
42:01
Francis: If any of you have not had Marcella Hasan's Italian cooking, it's amazing book.
42:05
Francis: She's passed away.
42:06
Francis: And there's a documentary that's just come out about Marcella Hasan, but she was famous for her engagement chicken, right?
42:13
Francis: So the engagement chicken, when she came up with this recipe, she gave it to a someone who's working in the editorial office with her to make for her boyfriend.
42:19
Francis: And it was basically just of a whole lemon in the middle of a ch chicken and put some herbs around it.
42:24
Francis: And she wound up her boyfriend wound up proposing to her.
42:27
Francis: So a bunch of other people asked her for the recipe and a bunch of their boyfriends proposed to her.
42:30
Francis: So it became engagement chicken.
42:33
Francis: You've got date night, angel hair.
42:34
Francis: Is that just less of a commitment?
42:36
Francis: Is that what That's.
42:38
Alex: Yeah, I'm not gonna do engagement chicken.
42:40
Alex: No, no.
42:43
Alex: I'm gonna, that's not gonna be in my cookbook.
42:45
Francis: We could do like divorce, kaori marriage.
42:47
Alex: No, no.
42:49
Alex: Could do a book.
42:49
Alex: No, I definitely think food is a big love language.
42:53
Alex: Yeah.
42:53
Alex: I really do.
42:55
Alex: I think a seduction dinner is awesome.
42:57
Francis: Talk to us about seduction, dinners and this station in particular.
42:59
Alex: I, I think a big fan and I mean, you know, if we're talking about dudes, you know what I'm saying?
43:07
Alex: You can hook a dude in with the right tuna out sandwich.
43:10
Mark: I, I, I tell you, you can do the same thing with a woman if you can cook and, and reel her in.
43:16
Alex: Not my audience.
43:18
Alex: I'm going for the dudes.
43:20
Alex: But whatever you're penchant, so to speak.
43:23
Alex: I, I think it should be something that you've made many times before so that when you make it, you are, um, able to actually think about them.
43:34
Alex: And enjoy the person you're cooking it for.
43:36
Alex: You know, when you work in restaurants, you don't ever know who you're cooking for, rarely.
43:40
Alex: Mm-hmm.
43:40
Alex: And the anonymity of that makes it different than for a chef.
43:44
Alex: So when you're at home and you make, like, when I make something for my daughter, like that's a different feeling.
43:50
Alex: Mm-hmm.
43:51
Alex: You're like, am I taking the minivan or the Ferrari?
43:53
Alex: Like there's different cars for different moods and I think it's the same, but I think a seduction dinner should be something you've made that's like, everybody can make like five or six things.
44:04
Alex: Everybody, even if it's like toast with like an egg on it, there's like five or six things.
44:10
Alex: 'cause everywhere I go, people are like, I can't cook like you.
44:13
Alex: And I'm like, okay.
44:14
Alex: And they're like, but I make a mean tuna melt.
44:17
Alex: And I'm like, okay, get down with your tuna melt.
44:19
Alex: They're like, I use Havarti.
44:21
Alex: Oh.
44:24
Alex: Or whatever it's, yeah.
44:25
Alex: And I'm like, you have already your way Right.
44:27
Alex: To wherever you wanna be.
44:29
Alex: Right.
44:30
Alex: So the date night seduction dinner should be one of those things that is in your heart that you make, like you can make with your eyes closed.
44:39
Alex: You know what I'm saying?
44:40
Alex: So is this your, is this the main course of your date?
44:42
Alex: Night seduction dinner?
44:43
Alex: A hundred percent.
44:43
Alex: What else goes with it?
44:45
Alex: This is nothing else.
44:46
Alex: Whoa.
44:47
Alex: Hey, we can't be spending all night eating.
44:49
Alex: It won't.
44:51
Alex: So you aren't messing around.
44:53
Alex: This is New Jersey.
44:55
Alex: I can say what I want.
44:55
Alex: Well, I, I, I just wanna,
44:57
Francis: I just wanna interject.
44:58
Francis: If you're a guy and you don't know how to cook, uh, one ounce to tin a caviar, a bottle of champagne, you're all set.
45:03
Francis: that's your seduction dinner right there.
45:05
Mark: Jennifer, I apologize for telling this story.
45:08
Mark: And I'm gonna, who's Jennifer?
45:09
Mark: Your wife?
45:10
Mark: My wife.
45:10
Mark: Alright.
45:10
Mark: Well, she's, she's already, yeah.
45:12
Mark: All in.
45:13
Mark: She's hooked.
45:13
Mark: She's hooked.
45:14
Mark: I'm gonna, but I'm gonna tell'em how, I'm about to tell you how I set the hook.
45:17
Mark: Okay.
45:18
Mark: So we were in college, I was living in the fraternity house.
45:22
Mark: I had good beer.
45:22
Mark: Everybody else had crappy beer.
45:24
Mark: Number one, first rule, second rule.
45:27
Mark: I used to go to the store and buy the cheese ends and the salami ends, and I had Ritz crackers.
45:37
Mark: And so I lured her with cheese and salami and, and rich crackers.
45:44
Mark: And it worked.
45:46
Francis: I, I think that might not work today, mark.
45:48
Francis: I think it was, you know, what did you pay for your first house as well?
45:52
Francis: You know, it a, it is a different animal.
45:54
Francis: What you, you said something else that, that you've written about in, in your book.
45:57
Francis: So it's kind of about the love language and how this works into your life.
46:00
Francis: But you wrote, um, in the home cook recipes to know by heart.
46:04
Francis: You talk about you should have a hundred recipes by heart or however many recipes that you have in your repertoire.
46:10
Francis: And I thought, you know, I remember I took a poetry class and, and the professor said, listen.
46:14
Francis: If you, you can pass this past whatever, but if you really want poetry part of your life, you have to memorize a certain number of poems or forget it.
46:21
Francis: You know, you having fun.
46:23
Francis: But it's the same with music.
46:24
Francis: Like you need to know a few songs without looking at the sheet music.
46:27
Francis: If you wanna love music isn't cooking the same is that, don't you have to have five recipes?
46:34
Francis: Sorry.
46:36
Francis: He's scary.
46:37
Francis: He does that to me all the time.
46:38
Alex: Yeah.
46:38
Alex: But I don't like, I think those recipes choose you.
46:41
Alex: Yeah.
46:42
Alex: I think they choose you.
46:43
Alex: Yeah.
46:43
Alex: People are always like, what's your signature dish in your restaurant?
46:45
Alex: I'm like, you tell me you're the one eating.
46:49
Alex: So, you know, butter's been my one restaurant, two restaurants now, but one for 25 years butter.
46:56
Alex: And they're like, tell us the signature dishes.
46:59
Alex: And I'm like, the public's gonna tell me.
47:01
Alex: So our signature dishes are a smoked pork chop.
47:04
Alex: Uh, some these raspberry donuts that we make and this ca topi pasta with yellow tomato sauce and spicy lamb sausage.
47:10
Alex: I mean.
47:12
Alex: No, it's great.
47:12
Alex: But I'm saying, I don't think 20 years ago I would've been like, I'll tell you what, they're gonna be like a pork chop.
47:18
Alex: People like get the pork chop.
47:19
Alex: And I'm like, you know, I would've picked something more like cutesy or whatever.
47:24
Alex: But I think the recipes and like they pick you, part of it is like an ingredient that you always see that you love.
47:30
Alex: Something that your mom made or an ingredient your mom used or didn't use.
47:36
Alex: Like in my case, if my dad didn't like it, we didn't eat it.
47:39
Alex: So when I left home I was like, anchovies, capers, chilies.
47:43
Alex: Like these things are really good.
47:45
Alex: My dad didn't like peanut butter, so my mother hid a jar, you know what I'm saying?
47:49
Alex: Like my mom was from Sicily, but you would've thought my dad was from Sicily and my dad was from Naples.
47:55
Alex: But like somehow, you know what I'm saying?
47:57
Alex: So we had like a whole little thing of stuff we hid.
48:02
Alex: In the bunker
48:05
Francis: We did too.
48:05
Francis: But there were chocolates that my parents did for me.
48:07
Francis: It
48:07
Alex: right, right.
48:08
Alex: There was the fruitcake, right, that no one ate at Christmas.
48:10
Alex: That you were like in June.
48:12
Alex: Like you Right.
48:13
Mark: I'm desperate, right?
48:14
Mark: Yeah.
48:14
Mark: You're just like, it's, it's desperate.
48:16
Mark: Every single sweet thing in this house has gone that the fruit cake
48:19
Alex: took a puff of my mom's weed.
48:20
Alex: And now where's that fruitcake?
48:23
Francis: That is the only way to eat fruitcake, by the way.
48:24
Francis: It really is.
48:25
Francis: Yeah.
48:25
Francis: So it could be a door stop.
48:27
Francis: You're gonna eat it.
48:27
Francis: So you, you, you, um,'cause you mentioned anchovies and in your books you mentioned anchovy paste and this, the nuance things or the things that really pop flavor into me.
48:37
Francis: That's the difference between a, you, you can't be a great cook unless you know how to use, like olive oil or anchovy paste or the canned fish things that you put in a dish to like umami bomb it or to like put a little heat in there and you don't even know that it was a sardine paste that was in there, but you know that it's better'cause it was there.
48:54
Francis: Yeah.
48:54
Francis: So talk to us about, so well sardine paste is, that's a big one of yours.
48:57
Francis: I didn't, yeah.
48:59
Francis: Anchovy paste.
48:59
Francis: An ancho paste.
49:00
Francis: Sorry.
49:00
Francis: Yeah.
49:01
Francis: Um, I use the canned sardines.
49:02
Francis: A tomato paste is another one, and that's in the date night.
49:06
Francis: Escort a tomato paste is like, really?
49:08
Francis: You know what I'm saying?
49:09
Francis: Change, change your whole life.
49:10
Francis: So why
49:11
Alex: change an evening?
49:12
Alex: You know what I mean?
49:13
Alex: Um, what else?
49:15
Alex: Uh, Parmesan cheese.
49:16
Alex: I think soy sauce is a big one.
49:18
Alex: Mm-hmm.
49:18
Alex: I think a little dot of soy sauce everywhere.
49:21
Alex: Like in your salad dressing.
49:23
Alex: little places, you know, when you make a sauce and you're like, this is just missing this thing a hundred percent.
49:28
Alex: Like either little ws shear little soy sauce and you're done.
49:31
Alex: I'm a big Tabasco person sometimes because it's American.
49:34
Alex: A little vinegar of one sort or another.
49:37
Alex: Oh, balsamic or something.
49:37
Alex: And you don't want to taste that.
49:39
Alex: It's there.
49:39
Alex: Like if you, that's right.
49:40
Alex: If you know it was there, but it.
49:42
Alex: Just pops it and meat.
49:43
Alex: That's the date night stuff.
49:44
Alex: Oh, that's the Barry White.
49:46
Alex: And the massage oil starts with tomato paste and Worcester shear sauce and soy sauce.
49:53
Alex: See where this goes.
49:54
Alex: You know, all of a sudden I a gonna give it up.
49:56
Alex: You know that?
49:57
Alex: That's how, that's the bridge.
49:59
Alex: That's Take it to the bridge
50:00
Francis: as a health announcement.
50:01
Francis: Never put the massage oil in the sauce.
50:03
Francis: That's not what she's saying.
50:04
Francis: That's totally different.
50:05
Francis: You can use the olive oil for the other thing, but don't mix the two.
50:08
Francis: Otherwise
50:09
Alex: you're filled with tips.
50:14
Francis: So olive oil, I gotta tell you.
50:15
Francis: So we opened in.
50:16
Mark: Hopefully you're keeping them in different rooms.
50:17
Mark: Exactly.
50:19
Francis: So the olive oil, I have to tell you a story about that.
50:21
Francis: So we opened Italian American restaurant 2005.
50:24
Francis: had already been a more than a decade with stage left, which was considered one of the best restaurants in the state.
50:28
Francis: And we said, what if we turned that care and attention to ingredients and so forth on the Italian American food that mark up with, because Catherine Lemars, his grandmother, So this was eight years before Carbone opened up.
50:40
Francis: And so this was kind of a radical idea.
50:42
Francis: And you know, you have to charge a little more to do the best stuff.
50:45
Francis: And the thing about Italian American food is, you know, it's you know, the old expression, it's like pizza and sex, you know?
50:50
Francis: Even if it's mediocre, it's, it's better than none, you know?
50:53
Francis: And it's pretty good.
50:54
Mark: So, so realize that there was no such thing as free range chicken when my grandmother was cooking that she, went to the, the chicken guy and she got the slowest chicken, was the chicken that they brought home, right?
51:08
Mark: That's, that's the chicken that they brought home.
51:10
Mark: So yeah, we were using free range chicken and, better ingredients, but there was no place to put that on the menu because of course it was a free range chicken.
51:19
Mark: It was a chicken from the chicken coop.
51:20
Mark: It wasn't, some chicken that, was raised on a factory farm and.
51:25
Mark: You know, tasted like sawdust.
51:26
Mark: So in, in doing Catherine Lombardi, we, we tried to, to up the level ingredients, frankly, just to the ingredients that she would've used.
51:35
Mark: Yeah.
51:36
Mark: And, and that happened, and it happened a lot here in Jersey.
51:39
Mark: And, and we've seen it a lot where, you know, the Cisco truck rolls up and a bunch of cans, meat stuff, you know, all the frozen stuff that the French people think we're getting eaten, we're coming out and fill up these restaurants.
51:53
Mark: It, it was, you know, just a thought of, I want to eat the food that I actually ate back then, and we're gonna have to up the ingredients in order to do that.
52:02
Francis: But the, there was a lot of explaining to do because the names of those dishes you saw on pizzerias and you were like, well, you know, that's what.
52:11
Francis: But when we make it, well, you have to charge more for it.
52:13
Francis: And thank you all because we've been around for 20 years, so it seems to have worked out.
52:17
Francis: Um, but the explaining to do is, like, in this book, it's people like you who went out and explained to people the difference between good enough and really good food.
52:26
Alex: So I, I think we wanna cook that at home.
52:28
Alex: I think if we're gonna go and buy all the ingredients, food is expensive.
52:33
Alex: It's a lot of time and energy to go shop for all the ingredients.
52:36
Alex: You may as well go buy the good stuff and eat the good stuff.
52:38
Alex: A hundred percent.
52:39
Alex: I get a lot of, I do a Thanksgiving hotline on Instagram for like a bunch of days before Thanksgiving every year.
52:45
Alex: And the question I get was kind of became a joke.
52:47
Alex: Like it started seriously, but people were like, can I make my mashed potatoes like five days in advance and freeze them and defrost'em?
52:54
Alex: This was all anybody wanted to know, which I thought was so peculiar.
52:58
Alex: So I thought I can double down on this and be like, freeze everything.
53:04
Alex: Put the table and chairs in the freezer, take them out two days before, you know what I mean?
53:09
Alex: And people would be like, all right, when like, what, where?
53:11
Alex: Do you know what I'm saying?
53:14
Alex: Or people get into like the whole B brining thing.
53:17
Alex: People get crazy.
53:17
Alex: I'm like, do you have room for this?
53:19
Alex: Do you have room to brine this?
53:21
Alex: people are like, I bought a 75 pound Turkey help.
53:24
Alex: That's what people write.
53:25
Alex: I'm like, what happened?
53:25
Alex: The Turkey was like, come on babe, we're going home.
53:28
Alex: Like you bought this, you brought it home.
53:30
Alex: You have a chest freezer with your Omaha steaks.
53:33
Alex: You put it in there and now where are we?
53:35
Alex: You know what I mean?
53:36
Mark: You must, you're in Jersey, so every one of us, if we are Italian.
53:40
Mark: Has an entirely second kitchen in our basement.
53:43
Mark: Totally.
53:43
Mark: Okay.
53:43
Mark: There's a stove down there, there's another fridge, there's a freezer, there's a, you know, the, the, the dog, the first dog we owned is their stuffed on side.
53:52
Mark: Okay.
53:55
Alex: Grandmother was really into free range.
53:57
Alex: Sarah, I went.
53:58
Alex: Really?
53:58
Alex: They love that dog.
54:21
Mark: I want to ask you a question that I, that I hear you hardly ever talk about.
54:25
Mark: Okay.
54:25
Mark: Okay.
54:27
Mark: You ready?
54:28
Mark: I dunno.
54:29
Mark: So in 2015 Okay.
54:33
Mark: You did a one woman comedy show.
54:36
Mark: Oh yeah.
54:37
Mark: Oh yeah.
54:38
Mark: So, at Caroline's.
54:40
Mark: At Caroline's, yeah.
54:41
Mark: So I, I got to spend a day, Brian Callen was a guest on our show, he did a, a YouTube show that we were, featured on.
54:49
Mark: And I spent a day with him and he is famous comedian, and I spent a day with him and.
54:56
Mark: Professional comedians are really funny.
55:00
Mark: Okay.
55:01
Mark: And I used to think I was funny and I realized I'm restaurant funny.
55:07
Mark: Okay.
55:08
Mark: Professional comedians are comedy funny and it's a whole different thing.
55:13
Mark: Yeah.
55:14
Mark: And, and a buddy of mine, Ken's tells me all the time, oh, I wanna be a professional comedian.
55:17
Mark: I'm like, Ken, you're electrical engineering.
55:20
Mark: Funny.
55:24
Alex: What's the low, like, what's the least funny
55:26
Mark: Below electrical engineering.
55:27
Mark: Not a lot of space.
55:30
Mark: Not a lot of space.
55:31
Mark: Yeah.
55:31
Mark: So tell us about your life as a comedian.
55:33
Alex: Well, I thought I was funnier than restaurant funny.
55:36
Alex: You know what I mean?
55:36
Alex: And I was like, I'm gonna go out there and this is gonna be great.
55:39
Alex: So, but then I learned about the art of Comedy Uhhuh and the craft is, and I thought, well, I could just like do this.
55:45
Alex: But I realized like for, for as long as I've been cooking, people are like, I grilled swordfish on my patio.
55:51
Alex: For four people.
55:52
Alex: Last Saturday it was, and I'm gonna be a chef.
55:54
Alex: And I'm like, how'd we do that math?
55:56
Alex: Walk me through that.
55:57
Alex: 14 ounces of swordfish.
55:59
Alex: That led to a whole career.
56:00
Alex: And I think I thought I could do that.
56:02
Alex: Like I could go to a comedy club and, and do it.
56:05
Alex: And I realized like, if you wanna be a professional comedian, like you, you hone your craft.
56:10
Alex: You, the hardest thing is timing, right?
56:13
Alex: Like, you obviously have timing.
56:15
Alex: Well, okay, maybe, but I mean, you go on stage and you say one thing and I, I would write five minutes of material and memorize it, and then I'd get on stage and it would be like 30 seconds.
56:25
Alex: 'cause I would just say it all.
56:26
Alex: Mm-hmm.
56:27
Alex: Because that's how you talk, right?
56:28
Alex: Like in the restaurant or in life, you're like, Ozzy, bozzi, ba And then people are like, oh, it's so funny.
56:33
Alex: And then that's it.
56:34
Alex: But this was like, I, I mean, the first time I went on stage, so like, you have five minutes.
56:38
Alex: I'm like five minutes.
56:39
Alex: That's it.
56:40
Alex: I was out there at 42 seconds.
56:41
Alex: Someone's like, are you the girl from Chopped?
56:46
Alex: I had banged through all my jokes.
56:47
Alex: I was like, well, hi.
56:49
Alex: You know, it was like, and I love Lucy where she eats all the chocolates.
56:52
Alex: Like I did not.
56:53
Alex: It's Did you bomb?
56:54
Alex: I did.
56:55
Alex: Oh, oh, I did not know that.
56:57
Alex: I did not ask that question because, no, not at Caroline's.
56:59
Alex: Okay.
56:59
Alex: The show I did, I practiced, I rehearsed, I got to know some comedians and I asked them for help and they were like, you're funny but you're not really not funny restaurant funny.
57:08
Alex: Plus you gotta find somebody to tell you you're not funny.
57:10
Alex: That's the first rule, you know?
57:12
Alex: And then just work your way back from there.
57:14
Mark: People have been telling me that for years.
57:16
Francis: Well, you know, it's funny'cause we've done five five, between five and 600 shows of this sort.
57:22
Francis: there is nothing like watching a comedian die on.
57:24
Francis: Stage.
57:25
Francis: I mean, it's a terrifying Yeah.
57:27
Francis: it's brutal.
57:28
Francis: I can kudos to you for giving that a, giving that a, a go there.
57:31
Alex: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
57:33
Alex: I love it.
57:34
Alex: I, I, I really enjoyed it, but it's not, it's not for me.
57:36
Alex: That's, it's too hard.
57:38
Alex: I'd rather burn myself in a basement with a bunch of people I love and Overcook some chicken that tastes like saw dust.
57:44
Alex: Sounds like a better night than four minutes on stage.
57:48
Alex: It's an eternity when you're bombing.
57:49
Alex: Is it?
57:49
Alex: I went to a club called Bananas too.
57:51
Alex: Okay.
57:52
Alex: That was, have you been to, has anybody been?
57:54
Alex: Someone said, oh God, it's the same person who, let me tell you that was it for me.
58:00
Alex: Yeah.
58:01
Alex: Yeah.
58:01
Alex: And the woman gave me a check for a hundred bucks.
58:03
Alex: I spent like weeks doing the routine and practicing whatever, and she's like, you did great.
58:08
Alex: Just handed me a hundred dollars check.
58:10
Alex: Have you ever been paid a hundred dollars for something you should have been paid$8 million to.
58:16
Alex: I kept the check.
58:18
Francis: I wanna end with this question because I read something that you wrote about, what it is to eat Well.
58:23
Francis: And it reminded me of a wine in one of our favorite movies Big Night
58:26
Alex: I love that movie.
58:27
Francis: We, we cook big night every year.
58:28
Francis: We've been doing it for 25 years.
58:30
Mark: So in August we cook the movie Big night.
58:32
Mark: We show it at the screening room over at the ridge across the street, a hundred of us walk back across the street and we do the feast from Big Night.
58:39
Mark: We cook the exact feast.
58:40
Mark: It is one of my absolute favorite nights of the year.
58:42
Mark: Every year we do it,
58:43
Francis: and if you haven't seen the movie, you should watch it at home.
58:45
Francis: Unless you plan on coming to our dinner later the year, then you can watch it with us.
58:48
Francis: for those of you who've seen it, I've seen it a million times.
58:51
Francis: And Tony Sha Lu's character Primo, who's a chef's a chef, you know this.
58:55
Francis: and you'll remember this when he's in the kitchen, he's talking to Pam and he says, um.
58:58
Francis: Uh, to eat well is to be close to God.
59:01
Francis: I don't know exactly what that means, but, but they say it.
59:04
Francis: and I think that that was a sneaky line in the movie, because I think to eat well is to be close to God was maybe decentralized that movie.
59:10
Francis: And when I heard you talking about eating, well, what is it to eat?
59:13
Francis: Well,
59:14
Alex: it's funny.
59:14
Alex: Um, when I cut open the tomato like an heirloom tomato in September, that's so beautiful.
59:20
Alex: Or you just see an ingredient that's so beautiful, I find, I always say, tell me there's no God when you see this.
59:26
Alex: And I find that just, I've always done that.
59:28
Alex: So for me, I think, I think that there's true godliness and beautiful ingredients and in nature, I think Mother Nature is the bus.
59:37
Alex: You know, I, my daughter's like, you're filled with cliches.
59:40
Alex: she's 17.
59:40
Alex: She's like, mom, you're not giving right now.
59:44
Alex: But um, then sometimes I'll do something and she'll be like, mom, you ate, which I guess is really good.
59:49
Alex: Like, not giving is bad, but you ate is really good.
59:52
Alex: Or you cook.
59:53
Alex: And I'm like, of course I cooked.
59:54
Alex: And she's like, no, no, not like cooked food.
59:56
Alex: Mom, you cooked.
59:57
Alex: I'm like, okay.
59:58
Alex: But I think, it's in the ingredients.
1:00:00
Alex: I really do.
1:00:01
Alex: I think the church of ingredients, I subscribe.
1:00:04
Alex: I, I believe in God when I see ingredients.
1:00:07
Alex: Like if I ever doubt or I ever question, I've seen just mother nature and father time.
1:00:14
Alex: That's all there is.
1:00:15
Alex: You know what I'm saying?
1:00:16
Alex: I love that.
1:00:16
Alex: That's beautiful.
1:00:16
Alex: And so yeah, those asparagus, those fiddle, he fe those portini mushrooms.
1:00:22
Alex: Definitely.
1:00:23
Alex: Well, there's your takeaway for tonight, everybody.
1:00:25
Alex: So that was beautiful.
1:00:26
Alex: Thank you.
1:00:29
Alex: I'll clap to them.
1:00:32
Alex: we couldn't be more happy to have welcomed.
1:00:35
Alex: Alex gonna Shelley to New Brunswick for the first time.
1:00:36
Alex: You are an honorary New Brunswick in.
1:00:44
Alex: And, uh, and the last thing I'll say is, you know, do subscribe to, restaurant guys, podcast restaurant guys podcast.com.
1:00:52
Alex: Come see us at our restaurants right next door.
1:00:54
Alex: Um, this show will be on in the podcast rotation.
1:00:57
Alex: It'll come out in a couple of weeks, and so you get to relive this glorious evening one more time.
1:01:02
Alex: and in a moment they're gonna start to play either this theme from Sanford and Sun, or our theme song and, and that's how we'll conclude the show.
1:01:11
Alex: So thank you so much for joining us tonight.
1:01:13
Alex: Thank you guys for being us.
1:01:14
Alex: Really great to have you.
1:01:15
Alex: Thank you.
1:01:23
Alex: It's, I know I wasn't.
1:01:29
Alex: You see some of you over there?