Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Moms, grandmothers in a nursing home killed in order of their names to spell MURDER. Now their killer is walking FREE?

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Moms, grandmothers in a nursing home killed in order of their names to spell MURDER. Now their killer is walking FREE? · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:06
  Speaker 1: Five dead women that we know of, possibly twelve, and
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: this so called nurse serial killer, Catherine Wood has been released.
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: It's amazing to me. Potentially twelve dead bodies. Think about it,
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: Think about your mother, your grandmother, lying in a rest home,
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: a nursing home. And to have this evil duo at
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: Satan and Billzebub and skirts crime stories with Nancy Grace.
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: Suton Mill is a new neighborhood off Harris Road in
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: Fort Mill. No one here was aware that they have
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: a new serial killer, Cathy Wood, and it's just kind
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: of surprising. Early, I guess to the least, I have
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: mild concerns. Yeah, I think you'd be an idiot now
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: to have a concern. Would and her girlfriend Gwen Graham
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: killed at least five elderly women at a Michigan nursing
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: home in the eighties and what some called a lover's packed.
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: One smothered them with linen's in their beds, while the
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: other acted as a lookout. Prosecutors said they did it
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: to forge a bond between them so one would never
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: leave the other. Police could only prove five killings, but
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: believed there was many as a dozen. Today we ran
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: into Michigan TV reporter Ken Kolker in Fort Mill. He
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: covered the court case thirty years ago for a newspaper.
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: It was bizarre. I mean, we were watching bodies being exhumed,
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: you know, going to cemeteries. Yesterday, Kolker went to Tallahassee, Florida,
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: to be there for Wood's release from prison. He then
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: followed her to her new home in Fort Mill today.
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: Good Lord in heaven, how many did bodies does it
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: take before you stay in jail forever? I don't understand this.
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: What a lover's packed, my rear end, What a lover's packed?
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: That's why one was the lookout while the other smothered
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: one little old lady after the next. I Meancy Grace,
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: this is crime Stories. Thank you for being with us.
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: Why and the hey? Has this serial killer been released?
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: With me? An all star panel to break it down
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: and put it back together again? Judge, trial lawyer, anchor
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: Court TV. Ashley Wilcott, Chief of Police one Robins, Georgia,
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: A newcomer, John Wagner, South Carolina medical examiner, author, homicide
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: investigation field guy, doctor Michelle Dupree, And boy do we
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: need us shrink? Psychoanalyst to the stars joining us out
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: of Beverly Hills. Doctor Bethany Marshall at doctor Bethany Marshall
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: dot com. But right now to crime online dot Com
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: Levi pa Age, investigative reporter. Levi, I don't get it.
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: Let's just start at the beginning. What can you tell
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: me about the nature of the Alpine Manor nursing home murders.
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: So this nursing home is in Grand Rapids, Michigan. Nancy
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: and in the late eighties, May Mason she seventy nine,
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: she was she died, Edith Cole eighty nine died, Margaret
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: Chambers sixty died, and Myrtle Loose ninety five died along
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: with Belle bucknerd seventy four. They all died. They all
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: had dementia or Alzheimer's and Nancy the death I'm in it. Wait,
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: I'm in it. What are you a MD? Now? Dementia
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: that's a pretty broad structum. Who spectrum who said they
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: had dementia. That's what's been reported. That's why they preyed
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: on these victims because they were so vulnerable. Nancy. They
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: chose the most vulnerable women at this nursing home to pray.
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: Can you tell me whether it's true that these two
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: female killers smothered five women that we know of, trying
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: to pick victims who initials would spell murder m U
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: R d R. So your life is just part of
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: a crap sheet. What your last name starts with. Yes,
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: they thought that that would bond them together for the
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: rest of their life, Nancy, but that was too complicated
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: to pick out victims with the names that spelled out murder,
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: so they just started doing it to what they considered
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: the easiest targets and Nancy. The deaths were initially classified
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: as natural causes. They had to actually exhume the bodies
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: and perform an autopsy to discover that they were murdered
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: using a washcloth. They were all suffocated. I don't I
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: don't get how it was just naturally assumed they what
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: did you say, they naturally assumed they died of what
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: LEVI natural causes? I guess it's because of their age.
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: You know that doesn't sound kosher to me. He just
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: assumes somebody dies of natural causes, and then the bodies
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: start piling up up to twelve. Take a list of
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: our friends at w S OCTV. Catherine Wood walked out
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: of this federal prison in Tallahassee today released over the
• 5:17
  Speaker 1: objections of the relatives of the women she helped kill.
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: They fear that you'll kill again. It's more than one
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: thousand miles from the old Alpine Man nursing home and
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: walker to the Tallahassee Federal prison that Wood has called
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: home for most of the last three decades. But conditions
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: of Wood's paroles show that she won't be coming back
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: to live in Michigan, at least for now. Instead, Target
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: eight has learned that she has headed to live with
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: her sister in Fort Mills, South Carolina, a city of
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: seventeen thousand people just outside Charlotte, North Carolina. I am
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: glad she's not coming back here, okay, But on the
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: other side of the decline, I sympathize with the people
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: Woods to be living around her wherever she goes. Attorney
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: John Ingman's son in law, Victim May Mason, helped lead
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: the fight to keep Wood locked up after the Michigan
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: Parole Board in twenty eighteen ordered her release. I guess
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: they did fight. I find it very difficult to believe
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: to Ashley Wilcot, judge, trial lawyer, anchor court TV. You
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: can find her at Ashley Wilcot dot com. That over
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: the objections of the victims, five victims that we know of,
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: potentially twelve dead bodies, they opposed this so called serial
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: nurse killer getting out. Why let her out? Ashley? All right,
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: so we all know that the goal is if the
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: parole board finds that they're not a threat to society
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: and it's safe to let them out, that they let
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: them out. But when you have victims protesting, and in
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: this case Nancy, don't forget she had been denied parole
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: eight times because they found she was still a danger.
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: So I cannot figure out what changed for them to say, oh,
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: she's no longer a danger. I think it was a misstep.
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: Take a listen to friends that would TV target A
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: parole board had denied Wood's release eight times before finding
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: she was a potential danger and was not remorseful. If
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: I was a neighbor, I'd want to death help that
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: we have a siliory of killer living next door. Retired
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: Walker police sergeant Roger Kaliniak, who helped investigate the murders
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: at Alpine Man nursing home in nineteen eighty seven, fears
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: that the fifty seven year old would could kill again.
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: She's a serial killer and she can do it again,
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: and most of them do. Would spent most of her
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: old doll life in the Federal Correctional Institution in Tallahassee,
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: kept separate from her accomplice in the murders, Gwendolen Graham,
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: who was serving life without parole in Michigan. We started
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: talking about killing people. She testified against Graham, saying that
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: Graham had suffocated the victims with washcloths as she acted
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: as a lookout. But investigators believed that Wood was more
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: involved and there could have been as many as a
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: dozen victims. Crime stories with Nancy Grace. I believe that
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: Cathy Wood was the mastermind. She was the one that
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: was poland strings on Guandol and Graham. Guendolen Graham handled
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: the dirty work and Cathy Wood was the brains behind it.
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: They killed to bind their love and at first tried
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: to spell murder with their victims initials. The victims, ages
• 8:50
  Speaker 1: sixty to ninety eight, all suffered from demetio or Alzheimer's disease.
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: Clinia's partner in the investigation, retired Detective Sergeant Tom Freeman,
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: believes that Wood has earned her freedom. She got twenty
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: to forty years in prison in exchange for her testimony,
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: but Kaliniac disagrees. Oh, it's a horrific crime that these
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: two people were involved in, and I think that both
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: of them should be in prison forever. My fear is
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: that she will find some old person or old people,
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: incorporate herself into their family, take their property, and take
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: their lives, and move on and do it again. You're
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: hearing our friends at Wood TV. That's Target eight reporter
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: Ken Kolker. They wanted to spell out murde are like
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: a game. Some of these women as young as sixty
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: years old. To doctor Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst joining us out
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: of Beverly Hills at doctor Bethany Marshall dot com, Doctor Bethany,
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: what did they hate old people? I don't know understand.
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: I've never heard of that before. Nancy. I've thought so
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: much about this crime. And part of the report is
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: that they had a lover's pack, But I don't believe that.
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: If two men kill in concert, do you say they
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: have a lover's pack? Or did the DC snipers have
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: a lover's pack? No, it's the same psychology as we
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: see with two men killing together. There's usually one ring leader.
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: It's a stronger person that leads the other person along.
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: And I think Wood was the ringleader. Graham did her
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: dirty work. But I also think there's a layer. This
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: is very layered. I think that they resented that these
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: older women were getting their needs met, they were getting
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: their meals, they're being nurtured, they're being visited by their families,
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: and there was a tremendous amount of envy. And this
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: is what we see when caregivers kill their patients, whether
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: it's a nurse killing a patient or a nanny killing children.
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: Usually they feel that this vulnerable person who was receiving
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: nurturing and care is getting something that they're not getting.
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: It makes them envious and they want to strike out
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: and torture and kill. I wonder, doctor Bethany, it was
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: if it was they had to wait on these ladies,
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: these elderly all day long, and frustration and resentment grew.
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: What about that, doctor Bethany? I think so. There was
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: a case we covered on the Nancy Grace Show many
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: years ago of a woman, a nanny who was taking
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: care of an infant who could barely sit up. If
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: you remember this footage, she would throw a ball at
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: the infant all day long. The ball would bounce off
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: the infant, the infant would fall over. She brought the
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: infant up, and then she'd throw this ball at it
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: all day long. And we talked about this. Very thing
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: you're bringing up is that here she had to render
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: care to the infant. She had to a incent weight
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: on the infant, nurture for the infant, care for the infant.
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: Sometimes some of these caregivers have very low wages, and
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: instead of accessing a part of themselves that can be nurturing,
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: they fall into a state of horrible, horrible resentment. Joining
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: me special guest Chief of Police from Warner Robins, Georgia,
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: Chief John Wagner. Chief Wagner, how do you believe as
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: a career lawman, this makes the police and investigators feel
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: when they go through all of this and it's tough
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: to get an order of eximation. Chief Wagner, you know
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: that as well as I do very very tough. They
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: go through all of this intricate detective work, follow all
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: the leads, do all of the investigations, and finally secure
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: convictions on five female victims, helpless victims. And now this
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: woman walks out of jail is about six years behind
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: bars per dead body. That's for five victims. I'm not
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: even counting the other seven victims we believe these two
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: nuts killed. It's terribly demoralizing. Um for law enforcement in general.
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: You put in so much time and work. It's time
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: away from family, it's time away from working on other crimes.
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: It's it's a lot, and it really is demorlizing for
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: all of law enforcement, you know, altogether, but as well
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: as the uh the detectives and officers that work that personally. Um,
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: you remember all these crimes and specifically this one. You
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: know this is a serial criminal. Ummue. Why do you
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: say that, Chief Wagner, why do you say she'll do
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: it again? Because I remember when you're in Vanderslute left
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: the country, left uh Neville antilities, and to cough, I said,
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: mark my words, I don't know when and I don't
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: know how, but he'll kill again. He will, and he did. Um.
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: You know, J's they've already you know, we're successful with five.
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: You know, the rumor is that there was at least
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: a dozen. UM. So they were always trying and in
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: some cases they were trying to get better of these
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: five ladies died and they were listed as natural causes.
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: And only by speaking to an ex husband did anybody
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: ever find out or suspect that there was another person
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: or that these these deaths were criminal in themselves. And
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: you're right, we have to you have to get warrants
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: to get these folks exumed. Um. There's a tremendous amount
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: of of UM word that you have to get with
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: the judge and paperwork to get persons exumed and and
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: then to go back into do another autopsy and find
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: out what was wrong because most of these cases with
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: natural natural cause UM desk, you're just gonna do a
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: body inspection. You're not gonna do an autopsy. And and
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: in in some cases, UM, you know, they just may
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: be looked at and and do their age and in
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: their medical um problems, they you would never suspected that
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: a crime had been committed. Well, indeed, you find out
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: after you've you've dug up five more bodies and find
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: out that they were suffocated, and a lot of that
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: stuff you find out through lab results. But again that's sadly,
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: that's an expectation of what's going to happen in the
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: nursing home. And you've prayed on a person that has
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: Alzheimer dementia, the ones that you run successful with, how
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: are you going to interview them? You know they have dementia,
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: they couldn't even remember what had happened before, or they
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: have Alzheimer's, it's expected for them to not remember. So
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: it's really a terribly sad case. You know what, You're
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: absolutely right, Chief Wagner. What I don't understand. Doctor Michelle Dupree,
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: renowned South Carolina medical examiner, author of Homicide Investigation Field Guide.
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: Doctor Dupree, You've got to write another book. I mean,
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: I've already read Homicide Investigation Field Guide. I need more,
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: Doctor Duprey. That's something fun for you to do in
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: all your spare time. To dupre why wouldn't they do
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: I had no idea that autopsy were not performed in
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: rest homes. You just assume people die of quote old age.
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: This is it's a travesty, but in all honesty, for
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: the most cases, if an elderly person dies, unfortunately, it
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: is assumed that they died because they were old. I
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: often say just because they're old, doesn't mean they died
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: of natural causes, but given the constraints of most medical
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: examiner or corner offices, if they are elderly and they
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: do have a medical history, then it does not typically
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: fall under the jurisdiction of a medical examiner. Medical examiners
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: only assumed jurisdictions when there is not a physician who
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: is willing to sign the death certificates. If these patients
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: have been under the care of a physician at the
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: nursing home and they have a history of dementia or
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: other illnesses, they most likely will not get an autopsy,
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: and it does not mean that they died from natural
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: causes as we see here. Listen. On October sixth, nineteen
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: eighty eight, a man named ken Wood arrives at the Walker,
• 17:08
  Speaker 1: Michigan Police Department with a bizarre tale. Ken Wood proceeded
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: to tell me that his ex wife had been involved
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: with some promicides a local nursing home. Ken's ex wife,
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: Cathy Wood, is a nurse's aid at the Alpine Manor
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: nursing Home. Ken tells police she confessed to helping murder
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: five patients with a fellow nurse's aid during the winter
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: of nineteen eighty seven, Authorities remains silent as he pours
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: out the details of his life with Kathy. After a
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: short courtship with twenty year old ken Wood, Kathy, aged seventeen,
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: became pregnant and the two were married right away. She
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: gave birth to a daughter in February of nineteen eighty
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: I was a new mother. Ken Is really struck by
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: the fact that she can't seem to bond with the child.
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: She's irritated by the child she won't spend time with
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: her Time Stories with Nancy Grace. On October sixth, nineteen
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: eighty eight, a man named ken Wood arrives at the Walker,
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: Michigan Police Department with a bizarre tale. Kenwood proceeded to
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: follow me that his ex wife had been involved in
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: some pomicides a local nursing home. Ken's ex wife, Cathy Wood,
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: is a nurse's aid at the Alpine Manor In nursing home.
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: Ken tells police infest to helping murder five patients with
• 19:02
  Speaker 1: a fellow nurse's aid during the winter of nineteen eighty seven.
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: Authorities remains silent as he pours out the details of
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: his life with Kathy. After a short courtship with twenty
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: year old ken Wood. Kathy, aged seventeen, became pregnant and
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: the two were married right away. She gave birth to
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: a daughter in February of nineteen eighty. I was a
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: new mother. Ken is really struck by the fact that
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: she can't seem to bond with the child. She's irritated
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: by the child. She won't spend time with her. You
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: were hearing our friends at TV show Wicked Attraction, our
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: little secret. That was Pete to me a speaking so
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: many questions swirling about a serial killer whose lover turns
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: on her. They have a lover's packed to bind each
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: other together and they agree to kill we believe twelve
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: women in a nursing home. They were prosecuted for five
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: of those murders. That was a twisted in circuitous route
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: to be exposed. Leavi page investigative reporter, Crime online dot
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: Com leavi page. How did it unfold? How they ever
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: get caught because all of these victims May Mason, Edith Cole,
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: Marguerite Chambers, Myrtle Loose, Bill Burkhard, and we believe seven
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: more were intentionally murdered and it was choked off as
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: dying of old age essentially, So how did it all
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: crack wide open? Levi Page? So Katherine would confessed it
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: to her ex husband, and then her ex husband went
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: to police, and then police arrested Katherine Wood. They questioned
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: her and she said, I didn't actually physically commit the murders.
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: I was the lookout and it was my lover, Gwendolen
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: Graham that was the actual killer that suffocated these women.
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: They charged Gwendolen Graham with murder and she turned on
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: her lover and testified against her at trial. Gwendolen Graham
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: was ultimately convicted. Take a listener friends at Wicked Attraction.
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: There was a court her for Nursia's aids there. This
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: seemed to socialize together and many of them were gay.
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: They spent a lot of their time hanging out at
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: a gay club, and Canthy became quickly caught up in
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: that whole social world, capitol life change. She was having fun.
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: They're having parties, going to the gay bars. It's not
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: long before she had an affair with one of her
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: co workers. She had found in a lesbian relationships the
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: ability to communicate in a way that she never had
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: with her husband. She was on an equal par with
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: her partner and found it much more rewarding than a
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: heterosexual relationship. Ken was humiliated and troubled by Kathy's behavior.
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: That's when he noticed her dark side. You know what,
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: I appreciate all the information with This doesn't have a
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: thing to do with whether you're a straight or gay.
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: This has to do with down right murder. Murder. Take
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: a listen to this. Gwen worked in the nursing home.
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: I didn't pay much attention, but one day I was
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: sitting in the break room and Gwen walked in, and
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: that's the first time I noticed her scars. So I
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: started watching her a little bit. She made me feel pretty,
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: She made me feel special. She would do things that
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: I wanted to do. The two had a relationship that
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: lasted nine months before Gwen abruptly moved back to her hometown, Tyler, Texas.
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: That's when Kathy told Ken that while they were lovers,
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: they murdered five patients. Walker detectives don't know what to
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: think with such bold allegations. Police must consider that Ken
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: is seeking revenge over a failed relationship. Our friends at
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: Wicked Attraction, well, that lover's pack there was meant to last.
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: For all I turn on, they only lasted nine months
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: as the body count rose. Sounds like the defendant in
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: this case. Gwendoline Graham quit and left town. Wow, I
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: wonder why doctor Bethany Marshall. She couldn't get away fast enough. Well,
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: can you imagine your lover encourages you to kill other
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: people and then turns it into a game looking for
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: women whose initials spell the word murder? I was thinking,
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: why don't they just play scrabble at night? No, but seriously,
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: what this heinous, malicious hatred that you used to rightly said.
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: I think is fueled and spurred by the fact that
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: they have to maybe work wages, work all day long.
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: They'll example of their patients. A minute, hold it, I'm
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: not buying that for one second. Why did you even
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: say that, doctor Bethany? You know how many jobs I
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: had at a sandwich shop where I had mopped the
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: floors and cling the bathrooms, And yes, I did wash
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: my hands before I made sandwiches, work till eleven o'clock
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: at nine, all alone in a strip center where everything
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: else was closed. I mean, you name it, I did it.
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: I never thought of killing the customers, doctor Bethany. But
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: you know, Nancy, it seems to me that that becomes
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: a rationalization and it exacerbates an underlying murderous aspect to
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: their personalities. Do you remember the nanny in New York
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: City that killed three children and piled them in the
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: bathtub while I remember the mother was gone taking one
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: of the fourth child to a swim lesson. And I
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: looked extensively at that case, because again, another caregiver killing
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: her charges, and she had a nineteen year old at
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: home who she felt she couldn't feed, she couldn't send
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: to school, whose needs were being neglected. So here she's
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: indulging in taking care of these children that she horribly resents,
• 24:49
  Speaker 1: all the while living with her own sister and not
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: being able to care for the needs of her own child. Now,
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: of course that doesn't make someone homicidal, of course not.
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: But that is a factor. Nanswer, that's not really what
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: you said, doctor Bethany. I mean Chief Wagner joining me
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: out of one of robin as Georgia. Chief Wagner, how
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: much does it get under your skin when someone liked
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: doctor Bethany Marshall says things like, well, they were underpaid
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: and they were overworked. B S. That's right. Now, we've
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: all worked for little of no wages. And I never
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: had any homicidal thoughts like any means. Are you sure
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: about that? Jam? You sure about that? Neither have I
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: neither of I want people think I want to kill them.
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: I actually have never actually thought of killing them. Take
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: a listen to this. Kathy gives detectives the exact same
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: story she told her husband ken Wood. Gwen would roll
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: up a wash pot and place it over the nose
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: and mouth of the potential victim and smother them. Today,
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: according to Kathy's version of events, Gwen killed patients and
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: orage or quote unquote relieve her at tension. That she
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: would become very tense, but when she killed somebody she
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: would always feel better afterwards. These are a kind of
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: for thrill killing. Thrill killings are much more an expression
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: of a deviant personalities. And if these women kill these
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: people would be for something crime stories with Nancy Grace,
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: they would all our favorite phrase they had they'd say,
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: I love you forever, and then it became I love
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: you forever in a day, and then it became forever
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: in two days. And supposedly each day represented and the
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: murder it occurred. So after five murders, it was I
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: love you for forever in five days, and that was
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: symbolic of the murderous bond that they had together. But
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: after a while it became more than Kathy could handle it.
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: According to Kathy, she took part as a lookout in
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: these killings because she was so in love with and
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: wanted Gwenn to love her, and was willing to do
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: that until it came to the point supposedly that it
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: was Kathy's turn to kill somebody with Gwen serving as
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: a lookout, and that was too much for her. That's
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: when she supposedly stopped. Soon after Gwen left her for
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: another woman. Well, that fizzled out pretty quickly, but in
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: the meantime, in just nine short months together, these two
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: managed to wreak havoc Listen to our friends that wakelt attraction.
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: Kathy admits she and Gwen planned the killings together when
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: they invented a new game called the Murder Game. In
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: the world that Glenn and Kathy existed, they were perfectly
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: matched because what the other one lacked, her partner fulfilled.
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: And so when you put these two chemicals these two
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: things together, it created an explosion, and in an explosion,
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: people died. The object of the game was to kill
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: patients in a certain order, so their first initials spelled
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: the word murder. The problem with spelling out the word
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: murder as the homicides occurred was that there were several
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: patients that were very active and struggling, and they couldn't
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: actually kill them, and so the game itself was spelling
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: out the word murder never got finished. You know what
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: to think that the life of your mother, or your
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: grandmother or your great grandmother. It's just part of a crapshoot,
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: a game that these two women came up with to
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: leavipage crime online dot Com investigative reporter. It turns out
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: that Catherine Wood, the mastermind, flipped on her lover, Gwendolen Graham.
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: Gwendolen Graham is still behind bars. Tell me about the
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: plea deal. What happened, so she got the possibility of parole.
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: Catherine Wood did if she would testify for the prosecution
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: against Gwendolen Graham, and she did. She testified. Gwendolen Graham
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: was convicted. She was sentenced to life without the possibility
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: of parole, and Catherine Wood was sentenced to life with
• 29:37
  Speaker 1: the possibility of parole, and she's come up for parole
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: many times, was denied, and then ultimately was granted parole
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: despite the fact Nancy, that court documents were released and
• 29:49
  Speaker 1: they were trying to use these court documents to keep
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: her behind bars, and they cited the fact that she
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: said they tried to kill at least ten patients, but
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: they fought back, And Nancy, you have to wonder how
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: did they get away with trying to kill them and
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: these people survived they fought back. Well, when you think
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: about it, maybe that's why they preyed on people with
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: Alzheimer's and dementia, because a symptom of that is hallucinations.
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: Maybe if they tried to tell other personal at the
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: hospital or the nursing home, hey, I was attacked, they
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: nurses would just say, oh, they're hallucinating. You can't believe them.
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: And that's really said. What a feeling of helplessness these victims,
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: these patients that lived, must have felt. I mean, Ash
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: you Wilcot, judge and trial lawyer, anchor court TV as
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: WoT dot com, have you ever seen anything like it? No?
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: I mean this is an unbelievable case. And the thing
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: that bothers me so much is, yes, they pick very
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: vulnerable victims, but I believe individuals like this, they're going
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: to find vulnerable victims, whether it's in an old folksome
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: or in a daycare. Right. Things are creminals and minds
• 31:01
  Speaker 1: that are not going to not prey on people, but
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: rather they will seek out their victims and kill and kill.
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: And I'm shocked this individual was allowed to get out
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: of jail. I am too, I mean to doctor Bethany Marshall.
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: Psychoanais joining us from Beverly Hills. Doctor Bethany, I've always said,
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: when you don't know a horse, look at his track record.
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: And I say that usually after one violent offense, because
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: if you've got that in you, that well, you will
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: commit a violent crime on another person. You can't. I
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: don't think you can rehab that away. I think that's
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: something in you. And I use this example, doctor Bethany.
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: Say you're walking along out in Hancock Park and you
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: see little rabbit cross your path. I don't think your
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: instinct is to chase it down and then tear us
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: neck out with your teeth. Your instinct may be to pettit.
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: But that's the difference between you and someone who was
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: prone to commit a violent crime. There's something in them,
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: and I don't think that can change. Do you believe
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: this woman is still a threat? She's just fifty seven
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: years old, Nancy. She's a threat because she actually has
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: a compulsion to kill. This is not just a crime
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: of passion, which I still think is always premeditated pretty much.
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: This is something that they thought out over time. It
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: was very compulsive, it was very methodical. I think she
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: will strike again, and even not an overway such as
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: actually committing murder, small types of behaviors that lead up
• 32:36
  Speaker 1: like a ritualistic around the final act of murder. For instance, sadism.
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: These two were sadists. Would was a sadist. And so
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: we know of these victims who die because they murder them,
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: But what about all the smaller acts of sadism, maybe
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: like hitting them over the head, or you know, tying
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: their clothing too tightly, pushing food down their throat. You
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: know a lot of scoff must have happened to these
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: victims before they were finally killed. And so what is
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: going to have many vulnerable people around her? I think
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: it's so fascinating that the insect. Wait a minute, you've
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: got to hear something, Bethany, It's exactly what you're saying.
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: Listen to this. These are games, by all accounts, were
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: instigated by Kathy. They switched patients from room to room,
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: putting them in the wrong rooms to confuse other staff members.
• 33:26
  Speaker 1: According to co workers, when in Kathy's antics, when far
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: beyond seemingly harmless pranks, Kathy seemed to get a thrill
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: out of stirring up trouble. She would call the husbands
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: and say, do you have any idea what your wife
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: is doing? And then she would talk to the wife
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: and say, do you have any idea what her husband
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: is doing? Planning half truths among people, keeping the place
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: in turmoil, keeping the place in drama. She seemed to
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: get a kick out of exerting control over people's lives.
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: When asked if they thought Kathy and Gwen killed five patients,
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: the nurse's aids are divided. Some of the co workers
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: thought that possibly these murders did occur, and some didn't
• 34:13
  Speaker 1: believe it. They didn't think that they were capel doing that. Yeah,
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: I don't think they killed five patients either. I think
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: they killed at least twelve patients. But hey, that's just me.
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: You're hearing our friends that we could attraction our little secret.
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: I mean, circle back to doctor Bethany Marshall changing patience
• 34:30
  Speaker 1: from room to room to confuse patience and staff. These
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: old people that are helpless, starting up trouble, causing a
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: husband calling a husband, suggesting the wives having an affair,
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: calling the wife, you know, vice versa, just causing all
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: sorts of draw a planting half truths among co workers.
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: And it was all a game to them. What is that.
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: I've never really heard of anything like that, doctor Bethany Dadley, Nancy,
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: I have. This is a very poor feature of something
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: that we call cluster B personality style. Cluster B is
• 35:06
  Speaker 1: a grouping of borderline sociopathy and narcissism. These three personality
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: disorders when they clustered together, what you find it usually
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: at the female that the poison in their mind they
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: seep into everybody else around them. They love to dump
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: toxic psychological waste on people. Have you ever had someone
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: in their life, Nancy, where whenever you were around them,
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: they just seem to cause trouble everywhere in your life
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: and you don't even know how it happened. It just
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: happened at the speed of light. They plant out, They
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: bring negative legal consequences into your life. They make you
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: suspicious of your own spouse. This is this kind of
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: personality disorder they stir every time. I mean, I've really
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: never been suspicious of David. Once I broke into is email,
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: I thought I was going to pass out. My eyes
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: were bleeding. It was so boring. No, I'm not suspicious
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: of David. I love him, but no, go ahead, I
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: remember you mentioning that once on air. Nancy just cracked
• 36:03
  Speaker 1: me up. But it's true that these people like to
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: push poison into the lives of people around them. And
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: I think it's a part of sadism. I think they're bored.
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: I think they're envious. I don't think they want other
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: people to be happy, so they keep things stirred up.
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: And I think also these women may have hated men
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: as well, and so to call them the husbands and
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: say your wife's having an affair. And they were also
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: envious of people who had happy relationships, you know, So
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: they're planning a set of doubt in relationships and people
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: with dementia are very reliant on having a predictable environment, right,
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: even when we know what sundowners is. When I so
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: longer light outside and the sun goes down, they start
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: to get confused. So they took their patient's core vulnerability
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: and they preyed upon it to leave page. Catherine is
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: arguably one of the most high profile US serial killers
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: to get out of prison recently. What do you think
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: she can expect the outside, Well, Nancy, she is living
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: now in South Carolina, outside of Charlotte, and this is
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: a very high profile case, Nancy, so you can bet
• 37:11
  Speaker 1: that the tongues will be wagging. She's fifty seven years
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: old now, and I'm assuming that she would probably, if
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: she was smart, would lead a very low profile life.
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: But who knows a lot of these people they get
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: out of prison and they reoffend, even though they were
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: given the chance of a lifetime considering the crimes they committed. Well, true, true.
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: I mean to Chief Wagner, John Wagner joining us from
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: one robin, Chief Wagner, I hope the cops are on
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: her like a cheap suit, all over her. If she's
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: so much as Jaywalks, I want her back in jail
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: and I'm sorry it's come to this, but really, police
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: are so thinly distributed. How can they monitor this one woman. Well,
• 37:58
  Speaker 1: you're correct with it, Nancy, and you know, I'm sure
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: the Pearl board will be doing visits with her. But
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: um but yeah, well local law enforcement wouldn't even know,
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: and that will be always good bug in the back
• 38:10
  Speaker 1: of their ear. Don't you remember the case of J. C. Duger?
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: Do you remember that, Ashley Willcott, let me just jog
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: chief Why? Oh? He say? He remembers that this girl
• 38:23
  Speaker 1: had been kidnaped when she was a little girl. By
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: the time the fans finally found her with a convicted
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: criminal that they were supposed to be checking on, he
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: had already built a shed in the backyard and she'd
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: had two children by him. So I'm not relying on
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: home visits by part and parole. Please Ashley help me.
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: H No, I completely agree. You also hear stories where
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: sex offenders are living in fact close to a school
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: bus stop right or a school where they're not supposed
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: to live, and they may be under pearls. So it
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: doesn't solve the issue of criminals who are predisposed to
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: the primes that are committed, which I believe a serial
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: killer is and is not going to just let go
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: of being a serial killer. They are going to continue
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: criminal activity regardless of whether or not someone is checking
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: on them. We wait as justice unfolds. At least your
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: codefendant still behind bars. Nancy Grace Crime Story, signing off,
• 39:16
  Speaker 1: goodbye friend,