Latest / Ultimate Rewinds Podcast / SHORTBOXED & The Future of Collecting!

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SHORTBOXED & The Future of Collecting! · Ultimate Rewinds Podcast

• 0:15
  So, welcome to the show, Jean from
• 0:17
  Shortbox. How you doing, bud? Thanks for
• 0:19
  thanks for joining me today.
• 0:20
  >> Hey, how's it going, Lawrence? I'm doing
• 0:22
  all right. How are you?
• 0:23
  >> Good, good. Um, so I I just want to tell
• 0:25
  a quick thing. Me and Gene tried to do
• 0:27
  this the other day and we had a big
• 0:28
  power or internet outage that we had to
• 0:31
  deal with, but we're back on again
• 0:33
  bringing you guys hopefully some great
• 0:34
  content. So again, Jean, thank you for
• 0:36
  hopping back on with me. I appreciate
• 0:37
  it.
• 0:38
  >> Absolutely. Uh episode two, Electric
• 0:40
  Bugaloo for us.
• 0:43
  >> Uh so get started. Tell tell everybody
• 0:46
  out there if they're not familiar with
• 0:47
  Shortboxed, what is the app for people
• 0:50
  that don't know?
• 0:51
  >> Yeah. Well, once again, just thanks for
• 0:52
  having me on the show. um fan of the
• 0:54
  channel, love all the videos that you're
• 0:55
  doing. Um for those who aren't familiar,
• 0:58
  well, one, I'm Gene McGum. I'm the CEO
• 1:00
  and co-founder of Shortbox. We are a
• 1:02
  marketplace for buying and selling comic
• 1:04
  books. Um I'm a collector myself. My
• 1:06
  co-founder and I were both dieh hard,
• 1:07
  passionate, lifelong collectors, and we
• 1:10
  launched Shortbox in 2020. And since
• 1:12
  then, we've grown to be uh you know, the
• 1:15
  second largest graded comic book
• 1:17
  listings marketplace um in the world,
• 1:18
  just behind a little a little company
• 1:20
  called eBay. You may have heard of them.
• 1:22
  I was around when eBay first started.
• 1:24
  So, it's good to see like a a you know,
• 1:26
  a total comic platform come to market.
• 1:29
  You've been around for a little bit, but
• 1:31
  you know, for everybody out there, like
• 1:32
  what made you want to do this and say,
• 1:34
  "I want to start our own platform for
• 1:36
  selling comics."
• 1:37
  >> Oh, thanks for asking. You know, as I
• 1:39
  mentioned, my co-founder, B and I, we're
• 1:41
  both lifelong passionate comic book
• 1:43
  geeks. You know, and I say that as a
• 1:44
  sort of a term of endearment because
• 1:46
  that's we identify as comic book nerds
• 1:48
  ourselves. Um, you know, we've been into
• 1:49
  the space, you know, a really, really
• 1:50
  long time into the hobby and maybe 15
• 1:53
  years ago or so, you know, we were going
• 1:56
  to some local conventions and we
• 1:58
  decided, hey, let's just start selling
• 2:00
  off some of our collection and, you
• 2:01
  know, just like every other collector
• 2:03
  here, you a master collection, you sell
• 2:05
  some books so you can buy other books
• 2:06
  and, you know, rinse and repeat and you
• 2:08
  continue to do that. And so, we decided
• 2:09
  just to be uh dealers, get on the other
• 2:11
  side of the dealer table for once. So,
• 2:13
  um, you know, taking PTO and weekends,
• 2:16
  traveling all over the country, setting
• 2:17
  up at, you know, conventions all over
• 2:19
  the country and going through that
• 2:21
  experience, you know, we kind of got to
• 2:22
  peak behind the curtain of the industry,
• 2:24
  if you will. And we really got to see
• 2:26
  just how poorly and inefficiently this
• 2:29
  entire comic book secondary market is
• 2:31
  run. I don't think that's a bold
• 2:32
  statement to anyone, you know, listening
• 2:34
  right now. It's very old school. It's
• 2:36
  very antiquated. You know, a lot of the
• 2:38
  existing incumbent platforms that have
• 2:40
  been around for 20 or 30 years are still
• 2:42
  built on 20-year-old web technology, and
• 2:45
  comic books as a hobby really just
• 2:47
  haven't pushed the envelope in terms of
• 2:49
  innovation and technology within the
• 2:51
  space. And on a professional side,
• 2:53
  before focusing on Shropbox full-time,
• 2:55
  my co-founder and I, we both have
• 2:56
  backgrounds in tech. Uh we're both
• 2:58
  software people. And so, you know, we
• 2:59
  really wanted to build a platform that
• 3:02
  we truly believe needed to exist just
• 3:05
  because we're collectors ourselves. You
• 3:06
  know, we wanted there to be a modern way
• 3:08
  to just do something as simple as buying
• 3:10
  and selling a comic book. You know, it
• 3:11
  doesn't need to be so complicated and
• 3:14
  full of fraud and confusing and
• 3:16
  complicated. Uh, and that's that's the
• 3:18
  reality of how it's been for decades now
• 3:20
  at this point. And so, you know, a few
• 3:21
  years into this, you know, I think, you
• 3:22
  know, I think we've done a pretty good
• 3:24
  job. Still still a lot more work to be
• 3:26
  done, still a lot more to do. But, um,
• 3:27
  you know, I'm really proud of, uh, you
• 3:28
  know, all the growth in, uh, that we've
• 3:30
  had over the past few years.
• 3:32
  >> Yeah, I I like how you put that with the
• 3:34
  fraud because I think that's a really
• 3:36
  important aspect that a lot of
• 3:37
  collectors themselves, not just in
• 3:39
  comics, but in all of collecting, really
• 3:41
  have to be careful of. So, it's good to
• 3:42
  hear you say that. Uh, for me, I've been
• 3:45
  using the app since you guys literally
• 3:47
  launched. So, I I've been
• 3:49
  >> Yeah. an early adapter. So, I think the
• 3:51
  app is fantastic. I have made a purchase
• 3:53
  on there.
• 3:54
  >> Yeah. We'll talk about my purchase. I've
• 3:56
  only made one because I'm looking for
• 3:57
  like weird and crazy stuff right now.
• 3:59
  We'll talk about it later. But while I
• 4:01
  say weird and crazy, do you know like
• 4:03
  what's the weirdest thing that you guys
• 4:04
  have seen listed on the app or maybe
• 4:08
  >> you know what? I've never actually been
• 4:09
  asked that before. That's an awesome
• 4:10
  question. Uh it's weird is sort of a
• 4:14
  hard because everyone has their personal
• 4:16
  taste. What may be weird to me may be
• 4:17
  the norm for someone else. You know, I I
• 4:19
  think the way you want to look at it is
• 4:20
  there's a lot of quote unquote weird
• 4:22
  stuff out there in comics depending on
• 4:24
  sort of like what your flavor is. And
• 4:26
  we've definitely seen a little bit of
• 4:27
  everything. Um maybe not something
• 4:29
  specific that's been listed, but I will
• 4:31
  say we in terms of weirdness, not items
• 4:34
  that are listed, we've definitely seen a
• 4:36
  lot of weird and let's just say um
• 4:38
  unique ways that people pack their books
• 4:40
  when they ship them out. That that
• 4:42
  that's that was the first thing that
• 4:43
  sort of like popped into my mind when
• 4:44
  you asked that question. It's not not
• 4:45
  weird things that are being listed, but
• 4:46
  we've seen everything. Again, we're a
• 4:47
  marketplace, you know, similar to eBay
• 4:49
  where if you list a book for sale,
• 4:50
  someone buys it, you ship it directly to
• 4:52
  the buyer. And so, you know, we do as
• 4:54
  much as we can to try and provide
• 4:56
  guidance uh to sellers and making sure
• 4:58
  that they know how to pack and ship
• 5:01
  safely. Uh but again, there's always
• 5:02
  some folks that are new to it or they
• 5:04
  just run out of bubble wrap. And so, uh
• 5:06
  you know, one of the weirdest things
• 5:07
  that we ever saw was someone shipped uh
• 5:09
  a slab packed in a huge box just full of
• 5:12
  diapers. Now, oh my
• 5:16
  I should say they were brand new unused
• 5:18
  diapers. Unused diapers. Yeah. So, uh I
• 5:21
  thought that was pretty funny. And
• 5:23
  again, this is pretty early on, you
• 5:24
  know, year one of of launching Shortbox.
• 5:26
  And the recipient of that book, you
• 5:28
  know, he emailed us our our support team
• 5:30
  of he for some reason he was super
• 5:32
  angry. He was like, "Oh my gosh, this is
• 5:34
  ridiculous. This person packed them in
• 5:36
  in diapers." And we had to ask him, "Was
• 5:38
  there any damage?" "No, but you know,
• 5:40
  there were a bunch of like diapers in
• 5:41
  there." I was like, "Hey, at least the
• 5:43
  book arrived like undamaged. You know,
• 5:44
  we'll talk to the seller, tell them not
• 5:46
  to use diapers." And, you know, if
• 5:48
  anything, um, diapers are expensive for
• 5:50
  those of you with kids out there. I have
• 5:52
  a newborn myself and and diapers are
• 5:54
  expensive. And so,
• 5:55
  >> uh, depending on who received that, they
• 5:57
  would probably be happy to receive a
• 5:58
  whole box of of brand new diapers. So, I
• 6:00
  thought that was pretty
• 6:01
  >> That's true. I'm not going to lie,
• 6:03
  that's probably one of the best shipping
• 6:04
  stories that I've ever heard. That's
• 6:06
  >> definitely a first. It was a first and a
• 6:08
  last. So, we never we s never saw it
• 6:09
  again after that.
• 6:12
  All right, so I want to get straight to
• 6:13
  it today. Big announcement. PSA
• 6:17
  basically coming on board with Shortbox
• 6:20
  with the great and sell feature. I think
• 6:21
  most of the people at least I know in
• 6:23
  the community are looking forward to
• 6:25
  this. So talk a little bit about it.
• 6:27
  Tell us how it works or how it's going
• 6:29
  to work and what it's going to look like
• 6:31
  uh when it get when it goes live. I
• 6:32
  don't think it's live yet, right?
• 6:33
  >> No, it actually is live. Yes, it is
• 6:35
  already. So as of this now, it's it's
• 6:37
  live now. And um again, thanks for
• 6:38
  bringing that up. We've partnered with
• 6:40
  PSA. I'm sure everyone listening is
• 6:42
  familiar with PSA. They're the world's
• 6:44
  largest grading company. Not in comics,
• 6:46
  right? That that still belongs to CGC,
• 6:48
  which I think we all we all know and
• 6:49
  understand. But, you know, PSA entering
• 6:51
  the space is is a pretty big deal for
• 6:53
  for us as a community. It's good to have
• 6:54
  a big reputable grading authority um
• 6:56
  entering the space. And so, we partner
• 6:58
  with them to launch this grade program,
• 6:59
  which essentially allows people to
• 7:01
  submit books for grading to PSA. And
• 7:04
  once they get graded, they automatically
• 7:07
  get sent directly from PSA right after
• 7:09
  grading straight to Shortbox. So it
• 7:10
  comes directly to us on consignment and
• 7:12
  then we sell those books on your behalf
• 7:14
  um in auction. And so it's just a really
• 7:16
  easy way for folks to send books for
• 7:18
  grading that they want to sell anyway.
• 7:20
  Because right now, I'm sure maybe you've
• 7:21
  done it and I'm sure a lot of people who
• 7:22
  are watching have done this themselves
• 7:23
  where you get stuff graded, you send
• 7:24
  them into the grading company, you have
• 7:26
  to wait for them to come back to you,
• 7:28
  you pay to ship your books there, you
• 7:29
  pay to ship them back to you, then
• 7:31
  you're like, I want to send these to
• 7:32
  auction on consignment. you pack them up
• 7:34
  a third time and then you pay a third
• 7:36
  time to ship them over to, you know, the
• 7:37
  the auction house to sell on
• 7:39
  consignment. So, again, just goes back
• 7:40
  to me talking about there's a lot of
• 7:42
  inefficiencies in the way um buying and
• 7:43
  selling happens today. And really, we
• 7:45
  wanted to work with PSA to figure out
• 7:46
  just a super clean, seamless way to do
• 7:49
  something as simple as send your books
• 7:50
  in for grading, a few weeks later you
• 7:52
  get paid and you literally have to do
• 7:54
  nothing in between. Um so, yeah, we're
• 7:56
  pretty excited and we launched and the
• 7:58
  the reception has been super positive.
• 7:59
  We've got tons of submissions coming in.
• 8:01
  So, um, there's going to be a lot of PSA
• 8:03
  books, um, hitting the market, you know,
• 8:04
  over the next, you know, few weeks and
• 8:05
  months.
• 8:06
  >> That's fantastic. You know, a quick
• 8:08
  question about like turnaround time. I'm
• 8:10
  not talking about PSA turnaround time
• 8:11
  because I know obviously they need their
• 8:13
  time to grade the books, but once they
• 8:15
  once you guys receive the books from
• 8:17
  PSA, how soon is it before they're
• 8:20
  offered up for auction?
• 8:21
  >> Like within a week.
• 8:22
  >> Within a week. So, relatively quickly.
• 8:24
  >> Yeah, it's it's fast. So the the cool
• 8:26
  thing here is that um again PSA like
• 8:28
  every other it seems like every other
• 8:29
  grading authority out there they have
• 8:31
  massive massive backlogs. You know the
• 8:33
  turnaround times are just getting it
• 8:34
  seems like they're just forever
• 8:35
  extending themselves. The cool thing
• 8:37
  about this program is because it's a new
• 8:38
  program with a new partnership between
• 8:40
  us and PSA. All of the grade and
• 8:42
  submissions are getting expedited. So
• 8:44
  they're getting bumped to the front of
• 8:45
  the line. They're going to get graded
• 8:46
  faster and then they're going going to
• 8:47
  come to us and then we're expediting
• 8:49
  those goes on put in terms of putting
• 8:50
  them up to auction u basically within
• 8:52
  about seven days of us receiving it. So
• 8:53
  you could literally go from sending raw
• 8:55
  books in, having them graded, auctioned
• 8:58
  off, sold and paid in just a matter of
• 8:59
  weeks. Um, which is again that was the
• 9:01
  that was the goal here was how how do we
• 9:03
  just create this easy seamless system
• 9:04
  for for people who just want to send in
• 9:06
  books um and sell books. Again to be
• 9:08
  fair, this isn't for everyone, right?
• 9:10
  Some people, you know, don't sell, some
• 9:11
  people don't like grading, but there are
• 9:12
  folks out there who, you know, volume
• 9:14
  sellers, power sellers, dealers, comic
• 9:16
  shops who, you know, were asking for our
• 9:19
  help to to make this process much
• 9:21
  easier. And so we think this is this is
• 9:22
  great for those types of people.
• 9:23
  >> I think it's great as well. Um I don't
• 9:25
  know if you're going to be able to
• 9:26
  answer this question, but it's something
• 9:27
  I think I should ask you. Obviously,
• 9:28
  you've worked a little bit with PSA in
• 9:30
  the past. Like how did you guys come
• 9:33
  about deciding let's kind of do this
• 9:35
  grade and sell, you know, platform
• 9:37
  together? Was there like long back and
• 9:39
  forth conversations? I don't know how
• 9:40
  much you could say, but at least I
• 9:42
  wanted to throw it out there.
• 9:43
  >> Yeah. No, no, thanks for asking. The the
• 9:44
  cool thing here is that this came
• 9:46
  together pretty quickly. Um we have a
• 9:48
  great relationship with with PSA and a
• 9:50
  number of folks over there and you know
• 9:51
  when they enter the comic space you know
• 9:53
  they are also trying to earn the trust
• 9:56
  and support and credibility among our
• 9:57
  community. When I say our community I
• 9:58
  mean you know the comic book community
• 10:00
  um there's some people who are strictly
• 10:03
  strictly CDC or they're strictly CBCS or
• 10:05
  they're strictly PSA or any other
• 10:07
  grading company and you know they really
• 10:08
  wanted to work with us and we literally
• 10:10
  just sat in a room together and figured
• 10:11
  out how can we work together what are
• 10:13
  some cool things that we can do. We
• 10:14
  started from a clean slate and it was
• 10:16
  just a lot of, you know, fun
• 10:17
  brainstorming and one thing that we
• 10:19
  always wanted to do was how can we make
• 10:20
  that pipeline from submission to grading
• 10:24
  to sold even easier, right? And so
• 10:27
  there's m multiple ways that you can
• 10:28
  they could have come back to us and we
• 10:30
  could have vaulted them and put them up
• 10:31
  for marketplace, but you know,
• 10:32
  marketplace listing could be up there
• 10:34
  for weeks, months, it could never sell.
• 10:36
  You know, people, you know, pricing
• 10:37
  super high. Um, at the end of the day,
• 10:38
  we wanted to create a forcing function
• 10:39
  to get liquidity, you know, out of these
• 10:41
  books. And I think from PSA's point of
• 10:43
  view, they want that as well. You know,
• 10:45
  they're they're new to the comic book
• 10:46
  space, not to grading, but to to the
• 10:48
  comic book space. And, you know, they
• 10:49
  want to see, you know, PSA books out
• 10:51
  there, um, in the market being bought
• 10:54
  and sold. Um, so this was just sort of a
• 10:56
  very natural path that we went down and,
• 10:58
  you know, practically they're, you know,
• 10:59
  easy to work with and we were able to
• 11:01
  get this done, you know, relatively
• 11:02
  quick.
• 11:02
  >> I agree. I think you use the right word
• 11:03
  and liquidity because I know a lot of
• 11:05
  collectors especially on the comic side
• 11:07
  now but I've been doing it for a while
• 11:08
  and I'm sure you have as well because
• 11:10
  you've been a lifelong comic collector
• 11:11
  that you know being able to to buy and
• 11:14
  sell books relatively quickly especially
• 11:16
  if you you know into something and then
• 11:18
  maybe you want to buy something else
• 11:20
  it's a really positive thing to be able
• 11:22
  to do that and reduce that time frame in
• 11:24
  order to sell books. So, I think a lot
• 11:26
  of people who collect anything, and
• 11:28
  we'll talk about other things besides
• 11:30
  comics later, I I'll save that towards
• 11:31
  the end, but it's a really important
• 11:33
  thing with collectibles nowaday. But the
• 11:36
  the main question I wanted to ask on top
• 11:38
  of this, cuz I always think about this
• 11:39
  topic, is newer collectors, right? Newer
• 11:41
  collectors coming into the hobby who
• 11:43
  maybe haven't collected comics forever
• 11:45
  like you and I, but maybe want to dip
• 11:47
  their toes in. How do you think this
• 11:49
  allows newer collectors to kind of
• 11:51
  approach the comic hobby a little
• 11:53
  better, or easier, I should say?
• 11:55
  Oh, I think it's great for newer
• 11:57
  collectors. Um, you know, getting into
• 11:58
  the hobby as a as a newish collector is
• 12:01
  always, I don't say always, it can be, I
• 12:03
  should say it can be intimidating.
• 12:05
  There's a lot of things you need to
• 12:06
  know. There's a lot of experience that
• 12:07
  collectors like you and I have gained
• 12:09
  over many, many years. And, you know,
• 12:10
  there really isn't a fast path to
• 12:12
  figuring that out other than figuring
• 12:14
  out on your own. Probably getting
• 12:15
  scammed, probably getting burned,
• 12:17
  probably overpaying for things, probably
• 12:18
  losing money on doing things. And you
• 12:20
  know, really what this does, it just
• 12:21
  helps them remove some decision-m out of
• 12:24
  the process. Like, hey, I have some
• 12:26
  really cool raw books that I picked up.
• 12:28
  I wanted to get them graded. I want to
• 12:30
  try dipping my toes into, you know,
• 12:32
  auction them off. And really, I I think
• 12:33
  this is a really good spot for people
• 12:34
  just to learn about the whole process
• 12:36
  of, hey, what's it like getting stuff
• 12:38
  graded? What's it like selling stuff at
• 12:39
  auction? What are sort of the
• 12:40
  expectations here? And how do we make
• 12:41
  that as as easy as possible? And um I
• 12:43
  think we we we try and make it as easy
• 12:45
  as possible, not just via auctions, but
• 12:46
  any other sort of you user experience
• 12:48
  across the platform. And so, you know, I
• 12:49
  think this is a great way for for new
• 12:51
  collectors to again dip their toes into
• 12:53
  that pipeline of grading to selling, you
• 12:56
  know, to getting paid out if they're if
• 12:57
  they're not familiar with it.
• 12:59
  >> Technology especially, you know, it's it
• 13:02
  has to be user friendly. So, to me, like
• 13:04
  having a dual service dual service like
• 13:06
  this with two companies, having it
• 13:08
  being, you know, ease of transition is
• 13:10
  so important. But I think everybody out
• 13:12
  there in the community is going to kill
• 13:13
  me if I don't ask you this question.
• 13:15
  But, you know,
• 13:16
  >> why do why do I feel like I know what
• 13:18
  questions coming from?
• 13:19
  >> Yeah.
• 13:21
  >> Could this lead to uh PSA and Shortbox
• 13:25
  doing something else together along this
• 13:27
  line, not just auctions, but something
• 13:29
  else?
• 13:30
  >> Short answer is yes. Yes. You know,
• 13:32
  absolutely. Um, again, we we are a
• 13:35
  platform and so we have a lot of
• 13:37
  partners across the entire industry. You
• 13:39
  know, again, it's our job as a platform
• 13:41
  to make collecting and buying and
• 13:44
  selling accessible, right? And we have
• 13:46
  to make sure that we are aligned with
• 13:48
  companies and grading authorities and
• 13:50
  and other, you know, and publishers and
• 13:52
  dealers and comic shops and basically
• 13:53
  every part of the entire sort of
• 13:55
  collecting ecosystem. Um, you know, we
• 13:57
  want to be involved with that entire
• 13:59
  process, you know, and sort of like be,
• 14:01
  you know, call it the operating system,
• 14:03
  you know, of of this entire ecosystem
• 14:04
  and how we facilitate with different
• 14:06
  partners is going to be different. Um,
• 14:08
  so the short answer is yes. There's
• 14:09
  definitely, you know, other
• 14:10
  opportunities to do more, not just with
• 14:12
  PSA, but with other companies as well.
• 14:14
  >> Well, you just brought it up because
• 14:16
  that was literally the next thing I
• 14:17
  wanted to talk about was the other
• 14:18
  companies that that are out there,
• 14:20
  namely CGC. Obviously, we know CGC has
• 14:22
  been the um at the forefront for for
• 14:24
  comic rating since since I basically got
• 14:27
  back into comics, I think early really
• 14:28
  really early 2000s. So, is there a place
• 14:33
  where you could have PSA and CGC coming
• 14:37
  together on the same platform doing
• 14:39
  something similar? Like obviously we you
• 14:41
  have now something going on with PSA,
• 14:43
  but is there is there an opportunity for
• 14:44
  for CGC to come in and do something
• 14:46
  similar with you guys as well?
• 14:47
  >> Sure. You know, I can say this
• 14:49
  definitively. I think in an ideal world,
• 14:50
  I think the obvious answer is yes.
• 14:52
  That's what we would want. That's what I
• 14:53
  think the community would want and and
• 14:54
  what the community deserves. And we are
• 14:56
  partner with CDC, right? We've been
• 14:57
  partners with CDC for many years now.
• 14:59
  and we've worked with them on a lot of
• 15:00
  different things over the years. Um, a
• 15:02
  lot of sort of like events and
• 15:03
  engagements and different features that
• 15:04
  we've done. And you know, we share CGC
• 15:06
  data on on the app and all that. And so,
• 15:09
  um, all that is obviously open and on
• 15:11
  the table. You know, again, we we want
• 15:12
  to be a partner with with everyone
• 15:14
  because at the end of the day, we want
• 15:15
  to make sure we give options to to
• 15:17
  collectors and buyers and sellers. And
• 15:18
  the only way to do that is is by
• 15:19
  partnering with with every sort of
• 15:21
  authority out there. Um, so that's u
• 15:23
  that's my non-answer answer to that. And
• 15:27
  it was a good one because transparency
• 15:29
  is key. I'll be I'll be the first one to
• 15:30
  say especially with with collecting and
• 15:32
  collectibles. The more transparent you
• 15:34
  are, I think the more collectors will
• 15:36
  flock to your platform or service,
• 15:38
  whatever it is.
• 15:39
  >> We want that. We want that because
• 15:40
  that's what the community deserves. You
• 15:41
  know, there should be options. There
• 15:43
  should be choice. You know, at the end
• 15:44
  of the day, that that's what we need and
• 15:45
  and that's what we want and deserve as
• 15:46
  as consumers.
• 15:49
  >> All right. So, you guys have been around
• 15:50
  for what now? About four years or so. Is
• 15:53
  that right?
• 15:53
  >> No, all like more than five now. We
• 15:56
  launched in in 2020. Well, it's 2020.
• 15:58
  So, let's round up and say coming up on
• 16:01
  6 years now. So, time flies.
• 16:02
  >> Almost 6 years. All right. So, there's
• 16:04
  been a lot of changes to the app since
• 16:06
  its inception. Like obviously when you
• 16:07
  guys first started, you weren't doing
• 16:08
  the auctions. Uh a lot more features
• 16:11
  have been thrown in like um like you
• 16:14
  know the price data that you guys have
• 16:15
  now on the app. Uh I think I remember
• 16:17
  back in the day when it originally
• 16:18
  started, I could be wrong on this.
• 16:20
  Obvious dots, the red dots, the the
• 16:22
  yellow dots, stuff like that. I think
• 16:24
  that was always there since inception or
• 16:25
  did that come up?
• 16:26
  >> We added that later. No, like the the
• 16:28
  app and the platform and the user
• 16:30
  experience has evolved over many years.
• 16:32
  You know, the first version of the app
• 16:33
  is very different than it is today in a
• 16:36
  good way. You know, it's we wanted to
• 16:37
  get the app out there. We wanted to get
• 16:39
  it into the public and into users hands
• 16:41
  and you know, we listen to all our users
• 16:43
  and and we build features that that we
• 16:44
  think collectors need. So, back then we
• 16:46
  didn't have auctions. It was only a
• 16:47
  direct listings marketplace. The first
• 16:49
  version of the app, you couldn't even
• 16:51
  send offers. Again we we built that
• 16:53
  shortly after that but you know it's an
• 16:54
  iterative process you know I mentioned
• 16:56
  before that you know we are software
• 16:57
  people and so the the platform itself is
• 17:00
  never done even the way that is today
• 17:03
  the platform is going to look very
• 17:04
  different 6 months from now 18 months
• 17:07
  from now let alone years from now you
• 17:08
  know it's always going to evolve it's
• 17:09
  really sort of like our job to make sure
• 17:10
  that we're always innovating always
• 17:12
  building new features always giving the
• 17:14
  community what they want uh and
• 17:16
  different ways to buy and sell and um I
• 17:18
  can't predict what that's going to look
• 17:20
  like 10 years from Uh, but you know, I
• 17:22
  can tell you, you know, conflict, it's
• 17:24
  going to look very different, you know,
• 17:25
  10, five, even one year from now.
• 17:27
  >> What do you think are like the most used
• 17:29
  features on the app? You guys have a lot
• 17:31
  of things going on, but what do you
• 17:32
  think most of the collectors out there
• 17:34
  like the most about it?
• 17:35
  >> You know, I would, you know, if I would
• 17:37
  guess, you know, put my finger on it,
• 17:40
  what we get a lot of positive feedback
• 17:43
  on, and you mentioned this already, is
• 17:45
  our pricing data. You know, again, we as
• 17:48
  a platform, we pride ourselves in being
• 17:49
  very transparent um sort of
• 17:51
  philosophically between myself and my
• 17:53
  co-founder. You know, we both believe in
• 17:56
  um access to information, whatever type
• 17:58
  of information that be. You know, we we
• 18:00
  sort of really don't
• 18:01
  >> believe in gating publicly accessible
• 18:04
  information behind a pay wall. That
• 18:06
  that's just not, you know, what we're
• 18:07
  into. So, we're like, hey, we have all
• 18:08
  this amazing data. Let's put both the
• 18:10
  buy side and the sell side on the same
• 18:12
  page. Uh, at the end of the day,
• 18:14
  collectors are smart. They're efficient.
• 18:17
  You like you don't need to have both
• 18:19
  sides kind of like guessing and trying
• 18:21
  to scam one another. It's like we all
• 18:23
  have access to the same information.
• 18:24
  Let's just give it to everyone because
• 18:25
  at the end of the day, every everyone
• 18:26
  knows what a book is worth. Um, you
• 18:28
  know, and it's it's we don't want people
• 18:31
  to feel ripped off. We don't want people
• 18:33
  to overpay. Uh, at the end of the day,
• 18:35
  it's giving, you know, both sides, both
• 18:37
  the buyer side and sell side access to
• 18:38
  the same amount of information because
• 18:39
  at the end, they're going to get access
• 18:40
  to the information anyway. let's just
• 18:42
  give it to them. So, I would say that's
• 18:43
  probably the the the one feature, you
• 18:45
  know, of of the platform that's unique
• 18:47
  to us because no other platform actually
• 18:48
  shows you, you know, FMVs. Um, for
• 18:51
  books, we show you an FMV range recent
• 18:54
  sales. We even show we even make it even
• 18:55
  easier. Like you mentioned, we color
• 18:56
  code it. If there's a green dot, you
• 18:58
  could that's a good deal. Like you could
• 19:00
  just you don't have to look at the
• 19:02
  sales. You see a green dot like, hey,
• 19:03
  it's fairly priced. Sure, you can still
• 19:04
  send an offer. You know, everyone wants
• 19:06
  a good deal no matter what. But, um, you
• 19:08
  know, that's a really really good
• 19:09
  starting point. And uh you know, one
• 19:11
  other interesting thing here is that on
• 19:13
  the on the marketplace, not on the
• 19:14
  auctions, but on you know, like the buy
• 19:16
  it now type listings, the vast majority
• 19:19
  of them are all done via offers. So
• 19:21
  people are sending thousands and
• 19:22
  thousands of offers back and forth every
• 19:24
  single day. That's just the nature of
• 19:26
  collecting. Um you know, sure, yeah, if
• 19:28
  it's priced really well and you think
• 19:29
  it's not going to last, you can just buy
• 19:30
  it, you know, for a full price. But, um
• 19:32
  people like sending offers and counter
• 19:34
  offers, both buyers and sellers, you
• 19:35
  know. So between those two things, it
• 19:36
  creates a lot of lot of good activity.
• 19:39
  >> I agree. And I think now with collectors
• 19:40
  being so savvy, right, we we had that
• 19:42
  market crash, you know, you know, from
• 19:44
  2020 down to 2022 where things just kind
• 19:47
  of took a a real nose dive. But the one
• 19:50
  thing
• 19:50
  >> I would say correction, but that's a
• 19:52
  different discussion or if you want.
• 19:55
  >> Well, it depends when you got in. Let's
• 19:56
  put it that way.
• 19:57
  >> Yes, absolutely.
• 19:58
  >> But the one thing that like people don't
• 20:00
  talk about enough is that it created a
• 20:03
  lot of savvy collectors after that,
• 20:05
  right? Because of that happened, you
• 20:06
  have so many people who know what
• 20:08
  they're doing. They know what to look
• 20:09
  for in a book. Uh they know what
• 20:10
  presentation is. They know what the
• 20:12
  grades are. They know what the price is
• 20:13
  now. So like having all those tools as a
• 20:16
  collector really helps you going
• 20:18
  forward. But back in the day before the
• 20:19
  technology like you talked about, we
• 20:21
  didn't have those things. So
• 20:22
  >> Oh, you were you were referencing um a
• 20:25
  physical print guide that was printed a
• 20:27
  year ago.
• 20:28
  >> Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. So I mean
• 20:30
  >> waiting for like a Wizard magazine to
• 20:32
  come out in a month.
• 20:33
  >> Oh, I I I love that. Don't get me wrong.
• 20:35
  I love the nostalgia wizard and I
• 20:37
  remember had great fond times of those
• 20:39
  um those memories that I have. But
• 20:41
  having that right at your fingertips now
• 20:42
  and having that on the app and just
• 20:44
  making it as simple as like you said the
• 20:46
  dots, the colors, it's such a great
• 20:48
  feature. Um I always say in this market
• 20:50
  that like everybody should be making
• 20:52
  offers unless something is an absolute
• 20:53
  steal and like oh my god that's
• 20:55
  ridiculously underpriced.
• 20:56
  >> Reasons not to. Again, if you're a
• 20:58
  buyer, like why not? Why wouldn't you?
• 20:59
  Again, I think the only time you would
• 21:01
  and is if a book is obviously
• 21:03
  underpriced and you don't want to risk
• 21:05
  waiting for a response and you just want
• 21:06
  to buy it. You know, that happens to all
• 21:07
  of us. But I think from it's it's always
• 21:09
  fair to to send an offer. Nothing wrong
• 21:11
  with that.
• 21:12
  >> I agree. But let me ask you because it's
• 21:16
  also works the opposite way. If if a red
• 21:18
  dot shows people know that, hey, that
• 21:20
  book is really either overpriced or
• 21:23
  maybe it's, you know, not where it
• 21:25
  really should be. If if I'm a savvy
• 21:27
  collector looking at that, what does
• 21:29
  that do for those people listing those
• 21:31
  books? Like, doesn't it make a lot
• 21:32
  harder for them to sell them having that
• 21:34
  data on there?
• 21:35
  >> No. I if anything, it just makes the
• 21:37
  decision easier for a buyer. A buyer,
• 21:39
  even if it didn't have the red dot, a
• 21:40
  buyer isn't going to pay that because if
• 21:41
  there's no dot again, so we don't show
• 21:44
  those dots or a full FMV for every
• 21:46
  single book. We only show it if we have
• 21:48
  enough sales data on that book to come
• 21:51
  up with an FMV. So, we're not just
• 21:52
  making up numbers. We're only we only
• 21:54
  show FMV and those dots if we have a
• 21:56
  high confidence in the data that we
• 21:58
  have. So if there's no dots then that
• 22:00
  may mean maybe there's only a couple
• 22:01
  sales in the past few months. You know
• 22:02
  like we don't feel confident. You know
• 22:03
  our model doesn't feel confident showing
• 22:05
  you an FMV. But for red dots
• 22:07
  >> again you know
• 22:08
  >> buyers are efficient. So you know a lot
• 22:11
  of sellers may say oh I wish you
• 22:15
  wouldn't show the red dot because no
• 22:17
  one's going to buy it. Well if it wasn't
• 22:18
  they weren't going to buy it anyway. you
• 22:20
  know, when you look at the the books
• 22:21
  that actually get sold on the platform,
• 22:24
  the vast majority of them are green or
• 22:26
  yellow dots. They're at or within a
• 22:28
  certain range of FMV. We don't have
• 22:30
  people blindly paying quadruple
• 22:33
  FMV um just because they don't know. And
• 22:35
  and in the few cases where they may be
• 22:38
  an unsavvy collector, you know, we
• 22:41
  actually want to prevent them from doing
• 22:42
  that because we don't want people to get
• 22:44
  burned because they paid 4x of FnB just
• 22:47
  because they didn't know. that person's
• 22:49
  never going to buy a comic ever again.
• 22:50
  They're going to leave the hobby, you
• 22:51
  know, forever. And that probably
• 22:52
  happened during that the big boom a few
• 22:54
  years ago. I think a lot of people got
• 22:55
  burned. A lot of people didn't come back
• 22:57
  to the hobby because of those things.
• 22:59
  >> You know, it's not it's not necessarily
• 23:02
  our job to incentivize sellers to screw
• 23:07
  people over by charging astronomical
• 23:09
  prices over FMV. You know, that's not
• 23:11
  our job. It's it's our job to just
• 23:13
  facilitate transactions, and it's up to
• 23:15
  both sides to come up with a fair price.
• 23:16
  but we can show them what things are
• 23:18
  worth. You know, that's so it's like we
• 23:19
  we just put all the information out
• 23:20
  there and the buyer can make the
• 23:21
  decision on whether or not to buy the
• 23:22
  book. And so, you know, if there has a
• 23:24
  red dot, well, it wasn't going to sell
• 23:27
  anyway if it didn't have that. If
• 23:29
  anything, we're just getting more
• 23:30
  information to to use as to, hey,
• 23:32
  there's other there's better price
• 23:34
  options out there, and they were going
• 23:35
  to find those regardless. We just want
• 23:36
  to make that access to that information
• 23:38
  as easy as possible.
• 23:40
  >> I'll ask this, and I don't even know if
• 23:42
  you can answer this question, but how do
• 23:44
  we deter sellers from doing that?
• 23:46
  Obviously, because if I don't want to
• 23:47
  bring up another platform, but you
• 23:48
  mentioned them earlier, eBay, when you
• 23:50
  go to look up certain things on eBay,
• 23:52
  there are people out there with
• 23:54
  ridiculous like not even close to FMV.
• 23:56
  Like,
• 23:57
  >> like obviously it kind of turns people
• 23:59
  off when you see that type of thing. So,
• 24:01
  I'm asking as a collector yourself,
• 24:03
  >> how can we deter that? Like being that
• 24:05
  the FMV is there, being that you know
• 24:08
  that those green dots or or yellow dots
• 24:10
  are there, how can we kind of deter
• 24:11
  sellers from overpricing books or it
• 24:14
  can't we? I'll put it that way.
• 24:15
  >> No, I I think not. I think this is I
• 24:16
  mean this is a conversation that we
• 24:18
  internally between myself and my product
• 24:19
  engineering teams that we have
• 24:20
  constantly ever since day one. This is
• 24:23
  how you do it. You you incentivize them
• 24:26
  to price well because a book is priced
• 24:27
  fairly then it has a much higher I mean
• 24:30
  this is going to sound super obvious
• 24:31
  here but if a book is priced fairly it
• 24:33
  has a much higher chance of being sold
• 24:35
  than a book that isn't. And so what we
• 24:37
  actually do is when you're searching for
• 24:38
  book let's think of a really popular
• 24:39
  book that probably has multiple listings
• 24:41
  for sale on shore box like an ASM300.
• 24:43
  There's probably tons of ASM300
• 24:45
  listings, all different price points.
• 24:47
  >> Um, when you're searching for it, no, we
• 24:50
  are going to show you the Green Dot
• 24:52
  books first. Those get actually bubbled
• 24:54
  to the top because we want you to say,
• 24:55
  "Hey, these are the fairly priced ones.
• 24:57
  These are the ones that you are most
• 24:58
  likely to purchase because they're
• 25:00
  priced pretty well." Like, why would we
• 25:02
  >> show you the the overpriced listings
• 25:04
  first up top? Yeah,
• 25:06
  >> there's no incentive for us to do that.
• 25:07
  It doesn't help the seller. It doesn't
• 25:08
  Well, it would help the seller, but we
• 25:10
  don't want that. It doesn't help the
• 25:11
  buyer making that decision. So the
• 25:13
  incentive is actually if you overpric
• 25:15
  your books aren't going to sell you know
• 25:16
  and and to be fair you know when you're
• 25:18
  mentioning eBay there's also overpriced
• 25:20
  books on shortbox but we don't police
• 25:22
  the price all we can do is provide
• 25:24
  guidance right so a seller can go on
• 25:26
  they have
• 25:26
  >> an ASM300 98 and if they want to list it
• 25:29
  for $10,000
• 25:31
  they can I don't recommend that the
• 25:34
  system doesn't recommend that we will
• 25:35
  show them by literally putting a red dot
• 25:36
  and saying hey just heads up we'll even
• 25:39
  show you all the recent sales at this
• 25:41
  value and you're pricing it way high,
• 25:43
  but that's up ultimately up to the
• 25:45
  seller and you know that's likely not
• 25:46
  going to sell. And I think that's that's
• 25:48
  the ultimate incentive is if you
• 25:49
  overpric your book isn't going to sell.
• 25:51
  And like I said, you know, markets are
• 25:52
  efficient and they sort of like work
• 25:54
  themselves out. And the irony of that is
• 25:56
  all the good books end up getting bought
• 25:58
  and all that's left are the overpriced
• 26:00
  books. And this happens on eBay, this
• 26:01
  happens on short box. This is not unique
• 26:03
  to us. This is a general sort of like
• 26:05
  marketplace problem where you only see
• 26:07
  overpriced books because all the fairly
• 26:09
  priced books have already sold. all
• 26:10
  that's left over for price books. So,
• 26:12
  there's sort of like a sort of a bitter
• 26:13
  irony there.
• 26:15
  >> But that also is is good engagement
• 26:16
  because if you know that good books at
• 26:19
  good prices are getting listed, you got
• 26:20
  to be on the app constantly looking for
• 26:23
  for stuff because if you're not, you're
• 26:24
  going to miss out on the things that are
• 26:26
  steals. And this is where I'm going to
• 26:28
  talk a little bit about the experience
• 26:30
  that I have with with my purchase, which
• 26:32
  is kind of a wild thing cuz it's one of
• 26:34
  my favorite books in my collection.
• 26:35
  Okay? And I couldn't believe when I saw
• 26:38
  this book. I'm not going to tell you
• 26:39
  what it is yet, but like it's an
• 26:41
  important book. And I don't know if
• 26:43
  maybe other collectors didn't know what
• 26:45
  it was because it was a coverless book
• 26:48
  and it also is missing pieces. That
• 26:49
  could have been another reason. But
• 26:50
  inside,
• 26:51
  >> you know, like collectors, sorry to
• 26:52
  interrupt you, was like we're comic
• 26:53
  collectors. We just can scan it. We can
• 26:55
  see a cover and we we know what book it
• 26:57
  is. It's a visual medium. You know, we
• 26:59
  don't need to to know. But again, a
• 27:00
  cover list that means they would have to
• 27:03
  read the description or read the title
• 27:05
  to see what it is. And I think a lot of
• 27:06
  people probably just skipped over it.
• 27:07
  Again, I don't know what book you're
• 27:08
  talking about yet. So, I'm actually
• 27:09
  really curious to hear what book you
• 27:10
  got.
• 27:11
  >> So, uh I I I've been I was searching for
• 27:13
  this book. So, it's not like I was just
• 27:15
  looking on the app or I was looking
• 27:16
  everywhere for this book uh to try to
• 27:18
  find a a an affordable copy. I'll put it
• 27:21
  that way. And lo and behold, I went on
• 27:22
  the app one day and there it was. It was
• 27:25
  a coverless copy. was missing a few
• 27:27
  things, but I only reason I wanted this
• 27:28
  book is because it has an important
• 27:30
  tidbit on the inside of the book and and
• 27:32
  it's a copy of Action Comics number 12.
• 27:35
  And Action Comics number 12 inside the
• 27:38
  book is a little picture of Batman, but
• 27:42
  it predates Detective Comics number 27.
• 27:45
  >> So, it's technically the first true
• 27:47
  appearance of Batman anywhere, at least
• 27:49
  his face. So to me like I always thought
• 27:51
  I always collect historically. So I like
• 27:53
  you know adding historical items that I
• 27:54
  find to be very interesting and Batman
• 27:56
  was a big part of my life. So
• 27:58
  >> I saw the book and I made an offer on
• 27:59
  the book and the seller um accepted it
• 28:02
  and I got the book and you could I don't
• 28:03
  think you could see it. You might be
• 28:04
  able to see it behind me. I don't know
• 28:05
  if you can you might be able to see it's
• 28:07
  next repro is that a repro cover on it.
• 28:09
  >> Yes. Exactly. Exactly. So I bought a
• 28:12
  repro cover and a couple of repro pages.
• 28:14
  Slapped it together. But any anybody who
• 28:16
  comes in here, I I tell them a story
• 28:18
  like what this book is, where I got it,
• 28:21
  and what the meaning is. So like there
• 28:23
  are some incredible hidden gems on this
• 28:26
  app. So if you guys are not using it,
• 28:28
  like to this day, it's one of my
• 28:29
  favorite purchases that I've ever made
• 28:31
  and I'm really really proud to own the
• 28:34
  book and I wanted to share that with you
• 28:35
  since you know.
• 28:37
  >> Yeah, it was it was a really cool
• 28:38
  >> if one day you come across just the
• 28:40
  cover and then you can marry it.
• 28:42
  >> Yeah. Well, I'd have to get some some
• 28:43
  some other pages, too, just to make it
• 28:45
  complete. But I'm just happy to have the
• 28:47
  coupon, but I wanted to share that
• 28:48
  story. But it it makes me want to ask
• 28:50
  you, I'm sure you didn't even know that
• 28:51
  book was on the site, but what is like I
• 28:53
  know I asked you the weirdest thing
• 28:54
  before, but maybe you don't even know
• 28:56
  this, but what's the best deal you
• 28:58
  think? Or maybe a book that you saw that
• 29:00
  was on there that was like, "Wow, they
• 29:01
  got a crazy deal on that." Or that book
• 29:03
  you don't see that that often. Do you do
• 29:04
  you recall anything like that? not not
• 29:06
  not off the top of my head, but there's
• 29:09
  definitely a lot of good deals that
• 29:10
  happen pretty regularly, you know, on
• 29:12
  there. I think just like most
• 29:13
  collectors, you just have to be sort of
• 29:15
  on it. You have to pay attention um cuz
• 29:17
  it's out there. And I think a lot of the
• 29:18
  more savvy collectors, they sort of have
• 29:20
  this intuition where they just know what
• 29:22
  a book is worth and they don't even have
• 29:24
  to look at recent sales to know that
• 29:25
  it's a good deal. And so this happens
• 29:27
  multiple times a day where we just see
• 29:29
  things all the time like, "Oh, that was
• 29:30
  a good deal. That was a good deal. Oh, I
• 29:31
  should have bought that. That was a
• 29:32
  really good deal, too." Um it happens,
• 29:34
  you know, more often than you think.
• 29:35
  pretty pretty regularly, especially when
• 29:36
  sellers are motivated to sell. Um, and
• 29:38
  and also we have alerts. So, they have
• 29:40
  we have people that set, you know, watch
• 29:42
  alerts or set um search alerts. So, when
• 29:44
  there's a specific book they're looking
• 29:45
  for that comes up, they get notified
• 29:47
  every time it comes up. So, good deals
• 29:49
  tend to go pretty quickly in general.
• 29:58
  So, we talked a little bit about before
• 30:00
  about features. You you made like a like
• 30:02
  you just said it like a like a watch
• 30:03
  list you could put in a books save it so
• 30:05
  this way and when it pops up you get an
• 30:06
  alert. What other features like that are
• 30:08
  on the app?
• 30:09
  >> Yeah, there's a lot of you know I we
• 30:11
  sort of refer to them as you know
• 30:12
  quality of life features that just make
• 30:15
  searching and discovering and finding
• 30:17
  books a little bit easier. So you know
• 30:18
  when you're scrolling through the
• 30:19
  marketplace I mean we get
• 30:21
  >> so there are over 75,000 books listed
• 30:24
  for sale on the marketplace right now.
• 30:25
  There's a lot. I mean there's thousands
• 30:27
  of books that are literally added every
• 30:29
  single week. So there's always new stuff
• 30:31
  going on and so you can imagine
• 30:33
  scrolling through tens of thousands of
• 30:35
  books will take a really really long
• 30:36
  time. And so I think just utilizing a
• 30:39
  combination of know the search bar with
• 30:42
  keywords and filters. You can filter
• 30:44
  down by price range, grade range,
• 30:48
  grading authority. You can even filter
• 30:50
  uh just by green dots, you know, and I
• 30:53
  actually recommend people do that. So if
• 30:54
  you're like, I only want to look for
• 30:55
  books that are good news and why would I
• 30:57
  why would I want to see the overpriced
• 30:58
  ones?
• 30:59
  filter. Just say, "Show me the good
• 31:00
  price books only." You can search for
• 31:03
  Amazing Spider-Man,
• 31:05
  Silver Age, CGC, Green Dot, and it'll
• 31:09
  show you all the Silver Age ASM that are
• 31:10
  priced fairly. And that could just like
• 31:12
  save you a lot of time. And so, like
• 31:14
  that that's sort of a really powerful
• 31:15
  tool that I think a lot of people can
• 31:16
  can benefit from. And then if you like
• 31:18
  if it's something that you're always
• 31:19
  looking for, you can just set a save
• 31:20
  search and just be emailed and notified
• 31:22
  every single time there's new books that
• 31:23
  that that match that. So again, we just
• 31:25
  try to build, you know, again, these
• 31:26
  quality of life features that just make
• 31:28
  things a little bit easier that you
• 31:29
  necessarily won't get on a generic
• 31:32
  marketplace, you know, like an eBay or
• 31:34
  like Facebook marketplace or any other
• 31:36
  sort of like generic marketplace. You
• 31:37
  know, we build tools specifically for
• 31:39
  comic book collectors. And that's really
• 31:41
  sort of what makes Shockbox different
• 31:42
  from from other generic, you know,
• 31:43
  marketplaces that are for everything. We
• 31:46
  >> we talked a lot about the buyer side so
• 31:48
  far, but let's talk a little about the
• 31:49
  seller side, right? What are the
• 31:51
  benefits of selling on shortbox?
• 31:54
  Yeah. So overall, I mean, this is also
• 31:56
  just for buyers and sellers, is that
• 31:58
  it's a very specific marketplace for a
• 32:02
  very specific user, and that's comic
• 32:04
  collectors, and it's only comics and
• 32:06
  comic art on there. Well, we're actually
• 32:07
  branching out to TCG, which is pretty
• 32:09
  exciting. But for sellers, you know, the
• 32:11
  easiest way to compare us to is sort of
• 32:13
  what everybody knows, which is eBay. You
• 32:15
  know, you've probably sold on eBay for
• 32:16
  many years. I've sold on eBay for many
• 32:17
  years. We know all the all the pains
• 32:19
  that are involved with with doing that.
• 32:21
  you have to create your listing and like
• 32:23
  teach yourself HTML so you can format it
• 32:25
  really nicely and make it look good and
• 32:26
  they have to pay for all these um
• 32:29
  promotional features and do all these
• 32:30
  things and get all your keywords right
• 32:32
  and do all this stuff. Um for instance,
• 32:34
  if you want to sell a graded a CDC
• 32:36
  graded book on Tropbox, you literally
• 32:37
  just take a picture of the slab uh and
• 32:39
  we use machine learning and image
• 32:40
  recognition and we're scanning the
• 32:42
  certain number where we are
• 32:43
  automatically creating the listing for
• 32:44
  you. So you're not actually typing out
• 32:46
  for sale Amazing Spider-Man 300 CDC 9.0.
• 32:49
  You're just taking a picture. We know
• 32:50
  what it is in real time. We show you
• 32:52
  what book it is. We fill out all the
• 32:54
  metadata for the book. This goes back to
• 32:55
  our partnership with CDC. And so we have
• 32:57
  all the information. We show you all the
• 32:58
  graders notes for that exact cert
• 33:00
  number. So even show all the graders
• 33:02
  notes. We show all the recent sales for
• 33:03
  that book in that grade. We show you an
• 33:05
  FMV if there are enough sales to show an
• 33:07
  FMV. Um so we give you some pricing
• 33:09
  guidance to say, hey, you know, this is
• 33:10
  probably how we want to price it. You
• 33:12
  can literally list a book in a matter of
• 33:14
  seconds. Um a like a CDC graded book,
• 33:16
  literally seconds to to get it up. And
• 33:18
  compared to, you know, creating a
• 33:20
  listing on eBay, um the the difference
• 33:22
  is huge. And so, just in terms of an
• 33:24
  efficiency standpoint, this one I
• 33:25
  mentioned earlier in the very beginning
• 33:26
  of selling a book doesn't have to be
• 33:28
  complicated. It should it should
• 33:30
  literally be that simple. Um all the
• 33:31
  information is already there. We built a
• 33:33
  really robust database. We have a lot of
• 33:35
  sort of like strong partnerships where
• 33:36
  we can take a picture. We know what it
• 33:37
  is. Creates a listing. Like seven
• 33:39
  seconds, you have a book listed for
• 33:41
  sale. It's it's ridiculously fast. It's
• 33:42
  it's something that we're super proud
• 33:44
  of.
• 33:45
  >> It It's a very userfriendly experience.
• 33:47
  I will say that from a buying aspect and
• 33:50
  a selling aspect. I have not sold
• 33:52
  anything personally yet, but I've gone
• 33:54
  through the steps just like you said of
• 33:56
  entering just to see how easy it is if I
• 33:58
  want to go ahead and sell something. So
• 34:00
  again, I just want to, you know, recap
• 34:03
  everything we've talked about so far
• 34:04
  about, you know, having everything at
• 34:06
  your fingertips with price data.
• 34:08
  Obviously, if you're a seller, entering
• 34:10
  the books, having all that information
• 34:12
  right at your fingertips. If you're a
• 34:14
  buyer, you know what's going on, right?
• 34:16
  Not only do they have auctions and how
• 34:18
  often do the auctions run?
• 34:19
  >> We have auctions running every single
• 34:20
  day, but they may run anywhere from 3
• 34:22
  days up to a week, sometimes a little
• 34:23
  bit longer depending if it's a bigger
• 34:25
  auction or not, but there's multiple
• 34:26
  auctions ending on the platform every
• 34:28
  single day.
• 34:35
  >> You mentioned TCG. Is something else
• 34:39
  besides comics possibly on the horizon
• 34:41
  for Shortbox in the future?
• 34:43
  Yeah. So again, we are primarily, you
• 34:46
  know, first and foremost a platform for
• 34:48
  comic books, comics and comic art. So we
• 34:50
  originally launched it just comic books
• 34:51
  only. Last year we expanded the platform
• 34:53
  to comic book art. And so what we're
• 34:55
  doing here is we literally went out to
• 34:57
  all of our users and asked them, hey,
• 34:58
  what else do you collect besides comics
• 35:00
  and comic art? Are there other things
• 35:02
  that that and of course we could guess,
• 35:04
  you know, my guess, you could probably
• 35:05
  guess, hey, what else do comic
• 35:07
  collectors collect? TCGs, video games,
• 35:09
  toys, posters, coins, sports cards,
• 35:12
  pretty much everything, you know, under
• 35:14
  we all have the collecting gene. And you
• 35:15
  know, the number one response to that
• 35:17
  was TCGs. That had the biggest chunk of
• 35:20
  comic book collectors that also
• 35:21
  collected TCGs. And so we're like, hey,
• 35:23
  well, let's also just expand uh the
• 35:25
  platform just so we can reach a wider
• 35:27
  audience and get more eyeballs, you
• 35:28
  know, on items there. And so, you know,
• 35:30
  our goal from day one has always been to
• 35:32
  be a platform for collectibles, not
• 35:34
  necessarily only comics, but comics is
• 35:36
  our expertise. That is where our
• 35:38
  community is. We were we will always be
• 35:39
  a comic book platform first and
• 35:41
  foremost. But it's about what are the
• 35:42
  adjacent collectibles categories that
• 35:45
  comic book collectors are also into,
• 35:47
  right? We wouldn't just add something
• 35:48
  super random that has nothing to do with
• 35:50
  with comic book collectors. So again,
• 35:51
  you know, everyone watching could
• 35:52
  probably Yes. You know, I mean, even
• 35:54
  behind me, I have multiple collectibles
• 35:55
  behind me. There's like toys, cards,
• 35:57
  there's sneakers, there's posters,
• 35:59
  there's there's a lunch box, there's a
• 36:00
  bunch of like different random things.
• 36:01
  And so I think um everyone's guess would
• 36:03
  probably be pretty accurate in terms of
• 36:05
  you know what what else could we
• 36:06
  possibly get into. But the important
• 36:07
  thing for us is not just randomly adding
• 36:10
  new categories to the platform, right?
• 36:12
  We want to do this in a very
• 36:15
  careful and measured and authentic way
• 36:17
  and making sure that we're engaging with
• 36:19
  the right communities and not um just
• 36:21
  adding just random stuff kind of
• 36:22
  half-hazardly. So we want to make sure
• 36:24
  that we're properly engaging with the
• 36:26
  TCG community and with with the conflict
• 36:28
  community. This is why we went out and
• 36:29
  asked asked our users, "What should we
• 36:31
  add next?" And and they responded. And
• 36:33
  so we've been running some TCG auctions
• 36:35
  for, you know, a few months now. Um we
• 36:37
  run like a a bi-weekly Pokemon auction
• 36:39
  that does really really well. Um and
• 36:41
  then in terms of like what ne what's
• 36:42
  next? Um kind of TBD. We actually don't
• 36:45
  don't really know. Everything is sort of
• 36:46
  like humming along pretty well right
• 36:47
  now.
• 36:48
  >> That's good. I mean TCG is just it's
• 36:50
  it's insanely on fire. It's just crazy
• 36:52
  right now. I don't for
• 36:57
  collectors like myself who collect
• 36:59
  everything just like you. Um I call them
• 37:01
  cross collectors because
• 37:02
  >> I think it's it's a lot of nostalgia
• 37:04
  based items at least it is for me where
• 37:06
  you know I grew up with video games up
• 37:07
  with comics or grew up with trading
• 37:09
  cards. So it's it's kind of all meshed
• 37:10
  into one memory for me which is
• 37:12
  fantastic. So having it in one place, I
• 37:15
  always said this like whoever can kind
• 37:17
  of bring everything on board uh in the
• 37:20
  collectible space and have it in one
• 37:22
  spot so you never have to leave that
• 37:23
  that's really like you you you'd have
• 37:25
  everything. So I think I think the the
• 37:27
  ease of use of your platform is so
• 37:29
  unique that I think it would really work
• 37:32
  for a lot of different collectibles. So
• 37:34
  I'm really looking forward to seeing
• 37:35
  that come to market. But I did want to
• 37:37
  ask you something that I think is
• 37:40
  important right now with the way
• 37:41
  collectibles are going in general and
• 37:43
  that's live selling. Obviously, there
• 37:45
  are other platforms that are dealing
• 37:47
  with live selling. Is that something
• 37:49
  that may be possible in the future with
• 37:51
  Shortbox to offer that as well? Some
• 37:52
  kind of addition onto the app to where
• 37:54
  you can go ahead and do that.
• 37:56
  >> Yeah, as it is a sort of, you know, you
• 37:58
  could replace live selling with any sort
• 38:00
  of other buying and selling format.
• 38:01
  It's, you know, we look at everything
• 38:03
  and we consider everything. You know,
• 38:04
  again, I I've said this multiple times.
• 38:06
  so far is that our job as a platform is
• 38:09
  how can we make buying and selling as
• 38:11
  easy as possible almost regardless of
• 38:13
  format. Whether it's a direct listings
• 38:15
  format, whether it's via auctions within
• 38:17
  auctions, you could have um event sell
• 38:20
  auctions, you can have individual
• 38:21
  auctions for individual books, you can
• 38:23
  have consignment auctions, and we do a
• 38:25
  little bit of everything there. Um
• 38:26
  there's other formats like I said like
• 38:28
  live selling and there's there's
• 38:29
  multiple different ways to buy and sell.
• 38:31
  And for us it ultimately comes down to
• 38:33
  can we take that format and one is it
• 38:36
  something the community really wants and
• 38:39
  needs. Is there something missing here?
• 38:41
  And if that answer is yes, is there a
• 38:44
  way that we can build it in a way that's
• 38:46
  even better and more streamlined and
• 38:48
  easier to use for our existing users
• 38:51
  versus just saying hey we should be
• 38:53
  everything for everyone. you know, we at
• 38:55
  the end of the day, it just comes down
• 38:56
  to like, can we build it in a way that's
• 38:59
  easy and seamless and almost a
• 39:02
  no-brainer um for people to use? And,
• 39:04
  you know, I think the verdict is out
• 39:06
  there. I think I think there is a place
• 39:07
  for social selling, you know, and live
• 39:10
  streaming. Um, I hop on live streams
• 39:12
  myself just as a collector. I like
• 39:13
  watching them. I enjoy them myself. I've
• 39:14
  tried them myself just like out for fun.
• 39:16
  Um, I think there's a place for
• 39:17
  everything. It's just a matter of where
• 39:19
  does that fit in for us and our
• 39:20
  ecosystem and our users. And so far to
• 39:23
  date that has not actually been, you
• 39:25
  know, the most requested feature. And
• 39:27
  that might be a little surprising. You
• 39:28
  might think, oh, I'm sure everyone's
• 39:29
  been asking. Sure, a lot of people do.
• 39:31
  Um, but it hasn't necessarily been
• 39:33
  something that our existing ecosystem
• 39:34
  has really really been pushing for, but
• 39:36
  it's something that we're always
• 39:37
  exploring. We're constantly exploring
• 39:38
  and, you know, we we've built um proof
• 39:40
  of concepts for it. And you know, for us
• 39:42
  it we're not just going to build
• 39:43
  something for the sake of building
• 39:44
  something. It has to be sort of like the
• 39:45
  right time in the right moment and
• 39:46
  something that our users actually want.
• 39:51
  right now in the comic market. I assume
• 39:53
  you have your pulse on a little bit
• 39:54
  being that you guys are of course
• 39:56
  running a a platform that sells comics,
• 39:59
  but what do you think the most
• 40:00
  underrated comic is right now?
• 40:02
  >> Oo, under underrated for collecting or
• 40:06
  for reading? I
• 40:07
  >> I'll tell you what, give me both.
• 40:09
  >> Let's So, let's see. I I So, I also read
• 40:11
  comics, you know, again, I'm a comic
• 40:13
  collector, but I also still try and
• 40:15
  read. I wish I had more time for
• 40:16
  reading. And you know, I think all of us
• 40:17
  are our read piles just get bigger and
• 40:19
  bigger and bigger.
• 40:21
  >> I don't know if this is super
• 40:22
  underrated, but I feel like it should be
• 40:24
  more celebrated. I I'm a huge fan of the
• 40:27
  uh the Energon universe that coming out.
• 40:30
  So like Transformers, G.I. Joe, um Void
• 40:34
  Rivals, all the spin-offs with um
• 40:37
  Scarlet and Duke and the Cobra Commander
• 40:40
  series. Like I I'm I'm reading every
• 40:42
  single title within that series. Again,
• 40:43
  I don't know if it's underrated, but I
• 40:45
  still, as someone who grew up with
• 40:47
  Transformers and G.I. Joe and all these
• 40:49
  universes, it's so cool to me to have a
• 40:52
  new modern take on these characters from
• 40:56
  one of the greatest creators today,
• 40:58
  maybe the greatest creator today in
• 40:59
  Daniel Warren Johnson. For collectibles,
• 41:01
  that's when it gets a little bit, you
• 41:03
  know, more interesting.
• 41:06
  I I find myself, you know, when I'm
• 41:08
  talking to other dealers and collectors,
• 41:10
  something that that I've noticed is that
• 41:14
  highgrade
• 41:15
  copper age books I feel like are just
• 41:18
  call it underrated. Um, call them
• 41:21
  undervalued. Um, that was such a key
• 41:24
  period um in comics now, but
• 41:27
  >> copage books are 40 years old now. Yeah,
• 41:31
  that is the that was the equivalent of,
• 41:33
  you know, new collectors entering the
• 41:34
  space now compared to us going back and
• 41:36
  wanting to collect silver and bronze age
• 41:38
  books because we're super vintage. You
• 41:40
  know, when you think about pop culture
• 41:42
  today, a lot of them start in the 80s
• 41:44
  like the turtles is an obvious one. I
• 41:46
  mean, I just mentioned Transformers and
• 41:48
  G.I. Joe. Uh, and and I think what we're
• 41:51
  going to see is a lot of these copper
• 41:53
  age books, even though they were more
• 41:55
  copies printed of these books compared
• 41:57
  to like silver and bronze age, um,
• 41:59
  getting them in a high grade in 98, um,
• 42:02
  they're still they're still fairly under
• 42:04
  undervalued, I think, especially because
• 42:05
  they've sort of hit this key 40-year
• 42:08
  vintage mark. Um, and I think they're
• 42:10
  only going to keep gaining in
• 42:11
  popularity, especially when you think
• 42:12
  about all the IP out there, which ones
• 42:15
  are going to continue to be popular. I
• 42:16
  think a lot of them are going to be the
• 42:17
  ones that started, you know, in the 80s.
• 42:18
  And so I think that's some there's
• 42:20
  there's there's some definitely some
• 42:21
  underrated books, you know, out there.
• 42:23
  >> Best modern key.
• 42:26
  >> Ah, best mo. Okay. So I I have a soft
• 42:29
  spot for and again I don't I don't think
• 42:32
  this will be a controversial take or
• 42:34
  anything, but I have a very very soft
• 42:35
  spot for Miles Morales. And I know like
• 42:37
  Ultimate Fallout 4 has it's had its ups
• 42:39
  and downs. It was like trading for crazy
• 42:42
  money at peak peak co times. It was
• 42:44
  going for like north of I don't know
• 42:45
  $3,000 at at that point.
• 42:49
  98.
• 42:49
  >> Yeah. And and then now it's like less
• 42:51
  than half of that. But
• 42:53
  >> as a fan, um Miles Morals to me is one
• 42:56
  of the greatest modern characters that
• 42:58
  that Marvel has created. Um he is so so
• 43:02
  popular among kids. You know, I'd
• 43:03
  actually say both Miles and um you know,
• 43:06
  SpiderGwen, you know, Ghost Spider, you
• 43:08
  know, those are those are two very very
• 43:10
  important characters. Now with a lot of
• 43:11
  young kids today, that's Spider-Man to
• 43:14
  them. Spider-Man is Miles Morales or it
• 43:16
  is SpiderGwen.
• 43:17
  >> Prediction for the hobby in the next
• 43:19
  three years.
• 43:22
  >> That's such an open-ended question. Um,
• 43:24
  >> it could be anything. It could be
• 43:25
  anything.
• 43:26
  >> Yeah. Yeah. Um, I think what we're going
• 43:28
  to see now and and since we've mentioned
• 43:29
  a couple times is, you know, there was a
• 43:30
  big boom in collectibles and in comics,
• 43:34
  you know, during sort of like the peak
• 43:35
  co times where values just went
• 43:37
  astronomically high unnaturally. You
• 43:39
  know, earlier, you know, I I jokingly,
• 43:40
  you know, you referred to it as a crash.
• 43:42
  I joke maybe said I think it was more of
• 43:44
  a correction um because
• 43:47
  that was never sustainable right that
• 43:50
  period of time like those values are
• 43:51
  never sustainable values of collectibles
• 43:54
  shouldn't be doubling every 6 months and
• 43:56
  I think right now where we're at uh the
• 43:58
  values of books are in a very stable
• 44:00
  place they're essentially what I think
• 44:02
  where they should be and they where they
• 44:03
  would have been had that bump never
• 44:07
  happened so I think we're actually in a
• 44:08
  good period right now where things are
• 44:09
  remitting stable and like I
• 44:12
  Pop culture today is comic book culture.
• 44:14
  Comic books are the source material for
• 44:16
  nearly every part of pop culture today.
• 44:19
  And so I think, you know, the the
• 44:20
  prediction for myself is I think a lot
• 44:22
  of these call it newer collectors or or
• 44:26
  newer generation collectors, they're
• 44:28
  going to seriously be treating comic
• 44:30
  books as stores of value. I mean, you
• 44:33
  can make the case that's already the
• 44:34
  case now with, you know, so like older
• 44:35
  collectors for you and I, but I think
• 44:37
  there's a new generation that's entering
• 44:39
  the hobby that already treats
• 44:41
  collectibles as stores of value and they
• 44:43
  haven't yet necessarily latched on to
• 44:45
  comic books um up there as they do with
• 44:47
  I mean the obvious comp here is like
• 44:50
  Pokemon cards uh at one point um uh like
• 44:54
  sneakers and baseball cards and sports
• 44:56
  cards, you know, and you know, they they
• 44:57
  each have their ups and downs, but I do
• 44:59
  think sort of from a mainstream
• 45:00
  perspective for more casual a collector,
• 45:02
  especially from a younger generation of
• 45:04
  collector. Um, I think we as an
• 45:06
  industry, as a hobby, have yet to have
• 45:09
  that demographic latch on to comic books
• 45:12
  as actual true stores of value. And I
• 45:13
  think that's just because they're still
• 45:15
  early in their careers or they're just
• 45:16
  now entering the workforce or they will
• 45:17
  be entering the workforce over the
• 45:19
  coming years. And so when that uh
• 45:21
  generation enters the workforce and they
• 45:23
  have more disposable income, they are
• 45:24
  going to want to turn to the source
• 45:27
  material.
• 45:28
  >> What should collectors be paying
• 45:29
  attention to right now? It could be
• 45:31
  anything, but
• 45:33
  >> yeah, I mean, I think it's a little bit
• 45:34
  of what I just mentioned that the
• 45:36
  collectibles hobby right now is so
• 45:38
  fragmented and there's so many different
• 45:40
  things going on. And I think it's just
• 45:42
  understanding where you as a collector
• 45:46
  sort of fit in that ecosystem. And to
• 45:48
  give some sort of like specific examples
• 45:49
  here, there's, you know, there's like
• 45:51
  the comic, there's the comic book
• 45:53
  market, there's like the Pokemon market,
• 45:55
  there's, you know, I don't know, like L
• 45:56
  boooos and video games and VHS and, you
• 45:59
  know, sneakers and and all these other
• 46:01
  things. And, you know, eventually I
• 46:02
  think a lot of that is going to sort of
• 46:04
  like converge and sort of like meld into
• 46:06
  sort of like one one category as a
• 46:09
  whole. And I think collectors right now
• 46:10
  just need to figure out, you know, where
• 46:11
  do they want to be? Like where where do
• 46:13
  they see themselves sort of like fitting
• 46:14
  fitting into it? Um, and it doesn't they
• 46:17
  don't necessarily have to buck them
• 46:18
  like, "Oh, I only collect comics or I
• 46:20
  only collect Pokemon." I think it's just
• 46:21
  understanding where you fit into into
• 46:23
  the hobby as a whole. And what do you
• 46:25
  want out of it? Do you want to just
• 46:28
  collect just for joy, for nostalgia?
• 46:30
  That's perfectly fine. That's how I
• 46:32
  collect. Do you want to collect as an
• 46:34
  investment? Do you want to treat them as
• 46:35
  stores of value? Do you want to treat it
• 46:37
  like a stock market where you're just
• 46:39
  buying and selling and doing arbitrage
• 46:40
  and flipping books and doing that?
• 46:41
  That's also valid, too. Um, you know,
• 46:43
  there's there's different ways to engage
• 46:44
  with the hobby for different people. I
• 46:46
  think it's for most collectors just
• 46:47
  trying to understand sort of where you
• 46:49
  fit in and what you want out of the
• 46:50
  hobby. That way you can sort of like
• 46:51
  navigate those waters um with a much
• 46:53
  more clear path.
• 46:54
  >> I agree. This is supposed to be fun,
• 46:55
  guys. This is supposed to be like
• 46:56
  something we enjoy doing. That's why
• 46:58
  it's called the hobby. So, you know, I
• 47:00
  want to thank thank you for joining me
• 47:01
  today, man. This is a blast. Um,
• 47:03
  obviously for me.
• 47:04
  >> Yeah. If you haven't downloaded the
• 47:06
  Shortboxed app yet, I don't know where
• 47:07
  you've been for almost the past six
• 47:09
  years, but like we talked about, easy,
• 47:11
  convenient, educational. You're going to
• 47:14
  find steals on there like I did with my
• 47:16
  Action 12. So again, I want to thank you
• 47:18
  for coming on the show today.
• 47:20
  >> This is awesome. Thanks for having me.
• 47:21
  And again, for anyone watching, I love
• 47:23
  connecting with the community. My inbox
• 47:25
  is always open. You can always reach out
• 47:26
  if you have questions or if you want to
• 47:28
  talk comics or, you know, whatever it
• 47:29
  is. Um, it's just gene
• 47:31
  gene@shortbox.com.
• 47:33
  So feel free to shoot me note if you
• 47:34
  want to chat or have any questions and
• 47:35
  want to take the conversation elsewhere.
• 47:37
  But again, thanks for having me on. This
• 47:38
  is this was awesome. Also, anyone
• 47:40
  listening, if anyone has an Action 12
• 47:42
  cover, make sure you hit up Lauren.
• 47:44
  Let's get him that complete that
• 47:46
  complete copy of that book.
• 47:48
  >> I would love that. Thank you, Gene. I
• 47:49
  appreciate it, buddy.
• 47:50
  >> Awesome. Thanks. If you'd like to become
• 47:52
  a sponsor here on the Mighty Rewind
• 47:53
  podcast, make sure you reach out at the
• 47:55
  mighty rewind podcast atgmail.com.