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Should You Get Vaccines During Prostate Cancer Treatment? · Intellectual Medicine

0:00
The research on immunizations is always population based.
0:05
Therefore it's impossible to draw firm conclusions.
0:10
Now I'm a little bit skeptical about the immunization industry.
0:14
Here's the problem. Looking at the broadscape of
0:17
immunizations, there are just too many of them.
0:20
We want people to stay healthy. OK, that's a good thing.
0:24
But do the immunizations do that?
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And you you have prostate cancer.
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And should you then get immunized?
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Stress can invite cancer to progress.
0:39
Immunizations can either cause stress by virtue of the shot
0:43
itself or potentially prevent it by virtue of avoiding an
0:47
illness. But should you get an
0:51
immunization if you're fighting prostate cancer, what effect
0:55
will that have on the underlying malignancy?
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I'm going to break it down for you.
0:59
We're going to go over the adult immunizations, at least those
1:02
that are most commonly recommended, and I'll share with
1:05
you my thoughts. It's a difficult topic to
1:08
tackle. The research on immunizations is
1:11
always population based. Therefore, it's impossible to
1:16
draw firm conclusions. Now, I'm a little bit skeptical
1:21
about the immunization industry. Now we got to separate that from
1:25
individual choices. Here's the problem.
1:28
Looking at the broadscape of immunizations, there are just
1:32
too many of them. A good idea went haywire because
1:37
pharmaceutical companies started to realize they're kind of
1:41
running out of stuff to treat. They have antibiotics, which are
1:44
great when you need them, but it's a limited treatment.
1:48
A7 day run of an antibiotic is not going to keep a company
1:52
profitable. Then you have chronic diseases.
1:55
I mean, how many new blood pressure drugs can they come up
1:58
with? Cholesterol drugs?
2:01
They're starting to scope around looking for profit opportunity.
2:05
Now, if you take the entire population of healthy people and
2:10
you decree that they need an immunization, holy cow, you have
2:16
buckets of money to be made because you don't actually ever
2:19
have to have an illness. You don't need to be sick at all
2:24
for a company to then profit by making you fearful of an entity
2:28
that may or may not happen and give you a treatment that
2:33
doesn't actually need to work. I mean, how many of y'all had a
2:37
COVID shot? How many of y'all got COVID
2:39
afterward? Yeah, OK, me, I can raise my
2:41
hand. I'm not dismissing the value of
2:43
all immunizations, but we have to look at this with our
2:47
skeptical view of big Pharma, of our skeptical view of the
2:52
collusion that often occurs between big medicine, big
2:55
Pharma, big government. And even when that sort of
2:59
impetus has a noble underpinning, we want people to
3:03
stay healthy. OK, that's a good thing.
3:06
But do the immunizations do that?
3:09
And you, you have prostate cancer and should you then get
3:14
immunized? Couple of problems.
3:17
One of them is we just don't know what an immunization will
3:20
do to the underlying disease state itself.
3:22
When you get immunized almost to a shot, there can be an
3:25
immediate short term negative effect, can be a fever,
3:28
headache. In other words, we're inducing A
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transient inflammatory and position on the body, which is
3:34
not a good thing when you're trying to keep your immune
3:37
system pristine. So there's that factor that
3:41
which causes stress to the body equates to a compromise of
3:46
immune resilience that can enable the cancer and a cellular
3:51
level to kind of start to creep forward a little bit.
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So I've seen this happen in clinical practice.
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Somebody's going along pretty well, they're in remission and
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then they get nailed with another illness.
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They go on a cycle of Prednisone or they get a surgical
4:04
intervention and all of a sudden the guard is down.
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So there's that factor, but on the other hand, you're also at
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risk when you have cancer. If you have prostate cancer
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isolated within the gland, it is very unlikely that the cancer
4:20
itself is compromising your immune system because now it's
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pretty isolated, although it certainly can happen.
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Cancer, occult undiagnosed cancer weakens the immune
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system. In fact, one of the
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immunizations I'll be talking about is a Shingrix.
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That's the one for shingles. If you get shingles, it can be
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an early warning sign of a hidden cancer.
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So those of you that have had shingles, you owe it to
4:47
yourselves to scrutinize is a cancer underneath this.
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Typically, that risk, look back, is about 6 to 12 months.
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So the immune system can be weakened by virtue of the
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malignancy. And if you are, if you're sick,
5:02
if you have prostate cancer and you get pneumonia and you get
5:05
hospitalized, what will that do to you?
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So we have to weigh these against the likelihood that
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you're going to get the disease in the 1st place.
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So leading my list of immunizations that I don't
5:17
recommend, it's actually COVID. I just don't feel that this
5:21
immunization has proven its merit to me.
5:25
An immunization works when you don't get the illness.
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By that measure, the COVID shot is a dramatic failure.
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I know the advocates will tell you, well, that would have been
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much worse if you didn't get the shot.
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All right. That's a little bit circular
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logic and self feeding, and there's no way you can prove it.
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So I'm not a advocate of the COVID shot really for anybody.
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I had to get it. I'm a doctor.
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I was required to, I like my job.
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So in order to stay in practice, I had to get the COVID shot.
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Some of you out there that are in the working world, your
6:00
nurses, your healthcare providers, you know, sometimes
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we have to do things that are not necessarily in our best
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interest, at least we don't believe it to be.
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But it is in the interest of the population we serve.
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So bear that in mind as you're contemplating this.
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I don't think it's worth sacrificing your career to avoid
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a COVID shot if you're in the healthcare field.
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You know, we have to just accept more risk by the nature of Our
6:30
Calling, right? How about, how about the tetanus
6:33
shot? Tetanus shot.
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I don't know if there's ever been a case of tetanus in any
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adult who's been primarily immunized as a child.
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The idea that we have to have it, have to have it every 10
6:47
years, speculation at best. The amount of of of tetanus that
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occurs is miniscule. It is hard to even decipher it
6:58
as an illness. On the other hand, it's fatal if
7:01
it happens. So as a routine, I don't
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recommend it as a prophylaxis when you're exposed at a high
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risk. Yes, because there's no other
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cure and you will die from tetanus if you catch it.
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That's called the the Tdap tetanus, diphtheria and a
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cellular pertussis pertussis shot.
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There's a capital T with a lowercase D that refers to the
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diphtheria for adults, which is a little bit weaker than that
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for children because you've already been primarily
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immunized. What about diphtheria?
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Nobody gets it. I mean, practically nobody gets
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it. From 1996 until 2018, fourteen
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reported cases in adults 14 by the research I could acquire,
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Are you really going to get immunized when the disease
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you're immunizing against doesn't really happen?
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So a tetanus booster or Tdap, I think is one that I would not
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support getting for my patients. Anytime you get these shots
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right you could have a fever, headache, it make you feel bad
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for what gain? And pertussis that's equally
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rare from 2002 out of 200 out of 100,000.
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So pertussis in adults, 2 cases out of 100,000 people.
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It's pretty rare. And the notion of a causing
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death unless you're really really weak and feeble to begin
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with, if you do happen to catch it, you're more likely to
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survive it. So it's hard to get excited
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about an immunization that doesn't have a huge upside
8:38
benefit. How about hepatitis B?
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Hepatitis B can't protect against liver cancer.
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The virus can contribute to the formation of liver cancer.
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Those of us in healthcare were required to get it.
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Nowadays they give it to children in a nursery.
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So you may not need this at all. But in the absence of risk, I
9:03
don't recommend it as a routine Hepatitis B for adults.
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It's a sexually transmitted disease or it's transmitted
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through blood exposure. So if you are a low risk
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individual with regard to your sexual activity and with regard
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to blood exposure, it's not a ton of value here getting the
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Hep B shot for you. Hepatitis A is the one that is
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foodborne that gives you diarrhea, not really a fatal
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illness. It's annoying rather not get it,
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but it's not high on my list. Maybe if you're on that safari
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to Africa, right? Immunizations are different if
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you're traveling to third world. So so far we've got the the Tdap
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not really endorsing it. COVID don't see a big upside.
9:54
If you catch COVID while you have prostate cancer, will it
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expose you to this risk escalation?
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It may. The best advice is to keep your
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immune system as strong as you can through your healthy
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lifestyle, good sleep quality, modest exercise.
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You know high intensity exercise will weaken your immune system.
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You go out and do AA10K or you do a marathon, you're going to
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feel bad because your immune system is going to take a dip.
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So if you like vigorous exercise, it's your prerogative,
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but don't do it if you think it's good for your health.
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It is weakening to the immune system.
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High intensity activity, good. You know, ninja workout, killing
10:38
it in the gym, Washboard ABS Crazy.
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What? No, no, just just know if you
10:44
like it, I'm I'm OK with that. Right.
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But as a health enhancer, not so much.
10:48
How about the flu shot? A disappointment, isn't it?
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They come out with us every year, and every year they're
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kind of guessing. Here's what I like about the flu
10:57
shot. At least it's old.
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At least the technology has been around a long time.
11:02
And if you catch the flu, you'll wish you had the shot.
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It's a miserable week. And if you catch the flu, is
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that going to put you at risk for cancer acceleration?
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This is a tough one, folks. I'll leave it to your
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discretion. If you perceive yourself at
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higher risk, you have lung disease, you know, you're
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immunologically weakened, you're past the age of 65, the immune
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system starts to drop. I don't object to a flu shot.
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I think it has a rational place for those of you that are
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philosophically inclined. Some of you will say, yeah, I'm
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not going to get that flu shot because it gives me the flu.
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It can make you sick a little bit, right?
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It can make you feel bad. So you really got to contemplate
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if you want to expose yourself. And if so, what's the game?
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It's an interesting side note, but years ago, before the era of
11:54
antibiotic, there was a Doctor Who was treating advanced stage
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cancer by giving people sepsis, injecting them with bacteria to
12:04
create high fever. Like took 100 and 304 really
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sick people. Now some people died.
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Well, these were folks that were terminal to begin with.
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Not that that's to disregard their quality of life or the
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value of their life, but risk benefit, the doc felt was worth
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it. This back in the 1800s.
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I think some of the people, however, had a striking
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remission, implying that the immune system, when super
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activated through a febrile illness, may actually have anti
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cancer properties. It's a fascinating theory.
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We're seeing it played out in oncological treatment now as
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some of the newer treatments are targeting not necessarily
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killing cancer cells, but helping to support immune
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function. That is interesting to me
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because I'm going to flip it around.
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Maybe it's, I'm not saying to go out and catch the flu guys, but
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maybe catching the flu and having a high fever isn't the
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worst thing. Maybe it would amplify immune
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function in a way that would have an anti cancer attribute.
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This is pure theory guys. So do not run out and say Doctor
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Petroty says I should catch the flu so it fights cancer, right?
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No, it's not what I'm saying. I'm thinking with you
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intellectual medicine, right? Should I get the flu shot or
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not? Maybe I'll take my chances and
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if I catch the flu, I'll just nurse myself through it.
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By the way, while I'm on the topic of fever and flu, do not
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treat a fever. The fever is your friend.
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It helps your immune system work better.
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It helps the way blood cells work better.
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It helps beat the infection. Do not treat a fever unless you
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just feel so God awful. You're so symptomatically
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miserable that you want to lower the temperature.
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A high temperature from an infection will not damage your
14:02
brain, does not cause bodily harm.
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It is controlled. It's Thermo regulated by your
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body. The only time a high temperature
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can damage you is when it's pathologically induced.
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Something's wrong with you medically that you can't control
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that temperature properly. When I was a little kid, my mom
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feared fever so much. When we got a high fever, she
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give us a cold water animal. She said bring that fever down
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like crazy. The number looked good, but it
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was likely harming our recovery because that fever is your
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friend. Another great example of our
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impulse to treat a number rather than focus on the outcome.
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So here we're keeping score. The flu shot is a maybe.
14:43
Tdap is a no go. Hep B generally a no go unless
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you're at risk. Hep A if you're going to Africa.
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Yep. How about varicella?
14:52
How about a chicken pox immunization?
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Look, when I grew up in so you know, I'm 60 something 66.
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I'll let it out when I grew up on we all got chicken pox.
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You know when 1 kid got it, my mom would put all the other kids
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in the room. So to knock it out of the house
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in one sweep. If you've had chicken pox,
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you've got lifetime immunity. If you're one of those rare
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human beings who somehow made it to adulthood without actually
15:21
ever getting chicken pox and you're at risk for it, you want
15:25
to get immunized because chicken pox, primary chicken pox as an
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adult is a horrible hospital level disease, but it's pretty
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rare not to have been exposed as a child.
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So COVID enogo, let's move on to the pneumococcal immunization.
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This is most fascinating because it actually has some protective
15:47
value and it's one that you need to consider.
15:50
The pneumococcal pneumonia has a significant hospitalization rate
15:56
and death rate. This is a far cry from the other
16:00
one, respiratory syncytia virus, the RSVRSV.
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When I was a kid, when I was younger in my profession, we
16:09
call that a cold. Now they're having you fearful
16:13
of it. The triple demic it's COVID,
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it's RSV it's take a deep breath Rs VS been around since like the
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Stone Age and it gives you a cold.
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Do some people die from it? Yes.
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Are those people otherwise intact and immunologically
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healthy? No.
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Do those people likely have a mortal event in the near future?
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Probably. I'm not saying that wishing
16:37
death upon anybody, but we have to put the disease risk in its
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perspective. If you're strong, vital,
16:44
healthy, you're not going to die from RSV, you're not going to
16:47
die from COVID. You don't need the immunization.
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The immunization is a profit engine for the company making
16:53
it, and the only way they can make money on it is if they
16:56
convince the population that this disease is a dread scourge
17:00
needing to be obliterated with a shot.
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I don't buy it. Now pneumococcal, that's a
17:06
little different stats on that 400,000 hospitalizations, of
17:12
which 20,000 will die. The pneumococcal pneumonia is a
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potentially fatal disease. This is not your head cold, it's
17:19
not COVID, it's not respiratory syncytia virus.
17:23
It's in the lung. I can't breathe.
17:25
Who should get it? If you're over 65, you give it
17:29
some thought. You know, at about the late 50s,
17:33
early 60s, probably around 6263, something happens to the human
17:39
body in the arc of aging. It's called somatopause, and
17:43
it's when the pituitary gland is not pumping out growth hormone
17:48
at its historical levels. When that occurs, the thymus
17:52
gland, that's the one underneath the breastbone Withers.
17:55
It turns into a glob of, of impotent fat, something I want
17:59
to make sure never happens to you men, impotent fat.
18:02
You never want to be that. You never want to be a worn out
18:04
thymus gland anyhow. When it happens to the thymus,
18:07
the body has trouble making T cells, making immunoglobulins
18:13
and the immune system drops. So past 65, reasonable to
18:18
consider. If you have a history of asthma,
18:20
chronic lung disease, I recommend this immunization.
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The risk benefit favors it. How about if you're otherwise
18:27
strapping healthy feeling great. I'm going to fight pneumococcal
18:31
with my own immune system. That's cool and I don't
18:35
discourage it and I don't feel the immunization is compulsory,
18:40
but it has advantages and it's worth considering.
18:45
Now on to Shingrix, the dreaded shingles.
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So earlier when they had the old Zosta vax, it was called, it was
18:54
a weakened live virus. It was not terribly effective.
18:59
It's no longer on the market because Shingrix has displaced
19:02
it. I kind of like this one guys.
19:04
The Shingrix has a greater than 90% efficacy.
19:08
That means upwards of 95% success rate in you never
19:14
getting shingles and the duration 7 plus years and
19:18
counting. As we watch this immunization
19:21
over the years, its merit continues to be reinforced.
19:26
Another thing I like about this study done recently correlated
19:31
people getting the Shingrix with the lower incidence of acquiring
19:35
dementia, Alzheimer's disease. Now this makes some biological
19:40
sense because the the virus that causes shingles, the varicella,
19:45
lives in the nerve. And the study was not corporate
19:50
sponsored. In fact, Glaxo, the company that
19:53
makes the Shingrix, they didn't even know the study was being
19:56
done. They didn't know about it until
19:58
it got published, until it was completed.
20:00
I love that they did that because I am skeptical when I
20:04
see a drug company involved in a study in an intimate way.
20:08
They had nothing to do with this one.
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It came out of national funding. So is it worth getting?
20:15
You know, I'm, I'm starting to like lean towards it.
20:18
The old thinking my my old thinking on this was shingles
20:23
doesn't kill people. There is a treatment for it.
20:26
There's a antiviral that you can use that helps mitigate the
20:29
symptom and goes away on its own.
20:35
So those are all reasons to not get the immunization.
20:38
The other reason that I haven't gotten it up until now is
20:42
because I wanted shingles as my early warning system of possible
20:46
cancer or immunological weakness.
20:49
If you catch shingles, something's wrong.
20:52
Not catch shingles if you develop it right, Remember,
20:55
shingles is a reactivation of the chickenpox virus you had as
20:59
a kid that got buried in the nerve and laid dormant.
21:04
This notion of viral dormancy is compelling.
21:09
In fact, it informs us about cancer dormancy.
21:14
It informs us about the capacity for virions and I maintain
21:19
cancer cells to be in a dormant state for decades, maybe
21:25
throughout life, and the only time they peek their head above
21:28
the horizon is when the immune system takes a hit.
21:32
So keeping the immune system strong, yes, avoiding Shingrix
21:36
so that you can catch shingles as an early warning system.
21:40
I don't think that is as relevant with this new
21:43
immunization, you know, highly effective, long duration of
21:47
benefit and oh, by the way, a reduction potentially in
21:52
Alzheimer's. Starting to lean toward
21:56
advocating it. Let's go back to your prostate
21:59
cancer. If you catch shingles and your
22:02
immune system is being drained fighting the shingles, that's
22:06
probably not a good thing. It's like fighting A2 front war.
22:11
So kind of looking back at this, you have to make your own
22:16
decisions, man. You're walking on the frontier
22:20
with an unknown outcome no matter what path you choose.
22:24
But you can tilt things based on specific information.
22:27
COVID, I don't like, Respiratory syncytial virus, I don't like.
22:31
I'm skeptical about the rush for new immunizations to protect us
22:36
from the various diseases that are out there.
22:38
There are too many of them to chase, but it's a bounty of
22:41
profit for the companies. The pneumococcal immunization
22:45
shared with you my thoughts has some logic behind getting it for
22:50
many of you, although I respect those who choose not to.
22:54
A tetanus booster not needed. The flu shot, ambivalent COVID
22:59
shot, just don't like it. I don't like it.
23:02
I did the idea of getting an annual COVID shot.
23:05
We just don't know what we're doing.
23:06
We just don't know what comes next, what happens.
23:09
This is rushed science at the best.
23:12
I think we should put the COVID shot for those of you who choose
23:15
to get it as an ongoing research project.
23:17
The Shingrix, we spoke about that.
23:20
So keep your immune system strong.
23:22
That's universal. Whatever you decide to do.
23:25
Should you get a shot, immunization or not?
23:27
Do I do a flu shot or not? Keeping the immune system
23:30
robust, that's at the base, so we'll be continuing to talk
23:35
about that. Making sure your vitamin C is up
23:37
to date, having lots of it in you.
23:39
Your vitamin D level should be above 50.
23:42
Your percent body fat, keep it in check.
23:45
Modest alcohol use. Take good care of your body and
23:49
your immune system will follow. Well, gang, that's all for now.
23:52
Thanks for sharing time with me. I'll see you next time.