Latest / Simply Bitcoin / Did BlackRock Hijack Bitcoin? | British HODL Warns What’s Next!

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Did BlackRock Hijack Bitcoin? | British HODL Warns What’s Next! · Simply Bitcoin

0:00
I want every bitcoiner that can't handle it to get their
0:03
Bitcoin taken away. Go trade meme coins.
0:06
What are you doing here? You got the hardest asset
0:08
humanity has ever created and gold pumps 40% and you're like
0:12
selling your Bitcoin now Sell it.
0:15
I want, I love it. Sell it.
0:17
Sell it to BlackRock. It's great.
0:18
The game absolutely changed and everyone who's been sitting
0:21
around can twiddling their thumbs talking about how we're
0:24
fighting the system with your $10,000 net worth.
0:27
You are now completely an utterly because interesting
0:34
tradfy drives Bitcoin, and when a tradfy drives an asset, you're
0:40
going to have to follow the rules.
0:41
That Triedfy sets bitcoiners are going to be 20 to 30% of the
0:46
ultra high net worth class, right?
0:49
And by definition, that someone who's worth $30 million or more.
0:52
You will have tools to never, ever have to sell your Bitcoin
0:55
and you can huddle into the grave.
0:57
And the asset of which you're holding is going through.
1:00
It's maturing, it's getting out of those crazy, turbulent
1:04
teenage years and it's becoming an adult.
1:06
Damn right. Yeah.
1:10
Welcome to another episode of simple Bitcoin IRO.
1:12
I'm joined with the one the only legendary British model.
1:15
What's up, bro? As I said when we.
1:18
Got on here just surviving, surviving, surviving.
1:22
Why are you just surviving? Why are you just surviving?
1:25
Why are you not thriving? I feel like it's firstly, that's
1:29
a quote from from Die Another Day.
1:33
Pierce Brosnan's James Bond comes out of an ocean basically
1:36
in somewhere in Hong Kong. And the hotel manager says, how
1:41
are we, Mr. Bond? And he says just surviving,
1:43
surviving Mr. Chang. So yeah, I, I think it's, I
1:48
think that's what we're doing right now, right?
1:49
Like our job is to survive. Our job is just not to get, not
1:53
to screw ourselves. It's there's nothing else here.
1:56
There's nothing else interesting in Bitcoin, Nico.
1:59
Absolutely 0. Your job is to buy Bitcoin.
2:02
Shut the fuck up. And based on price action this
2:06
last weekend, you're about to get fabulously wealthy.
2:10
Let's talk about that because I remember one of the videos, by
2:13
the way, I love your content and one of the videos that you made.
2:16
Thank you. That I saw I think it was like a
2:18
couple weeks ago or something and you're basically like, and I
2:21
actually even use it on the show, the same talking point,
2:24
but you were just basically like, we're not in a bull market
2:26
right now. Yeah, we're not.
2:28
Yeah, that's that's very true. And then if you look at the
2:31
numbers, I actually posted this on X the other day, it did
2:34
pretty well. But if you look at the numbers,
2:37
Trump was inaugurated and the price of Bitcoin was at 109 Ki
2:41
know we've pumped a little bit. You know, we've definitely got
2:44
out of the gulags, right? We had a nice little 10K pump.
2:48
But in the grand scheme of things, like in Bitcoin land,
2:52
it's really not that exciting. It's really not that exciting.
2:57
Is Bitcoin boring now? British Huddle.
2:59
Yeah, absolutely. It was meant.
3:01
It's meant to be. It is a maturing asset.
3:04
And as an asset, you don't like babies, right?
3:07
Babies are very interesting when they're young and then they get
3:10
like annoying and then they get boring, right?
3:15
Like that's what's happening to Bitcoin.
3:17
It was very interesting, but everyone's dopamine firing and
3:20
everything else and now it is getting boring, which is what
3:25
it's supposed to do, right? Michael Saylor understands this.
3:28
The good news for everyone is that Bitcoin is going to get
3:30
boring at a 30% keger, while the stock market is boring at a like
3:35
a, you know, 11/12/13 percent keger.
3:38
So it's great, it's awesome, but you know, it's going to, it's
3:43
going to catch people off guard, especially people that do what
3:46
we do right, because we thrive on on being able to talk about
3:51
something and the assets just kind of care for more boring.
3:56
It's like, what do you, what do you talk about?
3:58
We want to talk about how everyone's getting continuously
4:01
screwed on on buying Bitcoin, treasury companies at 7 XM Navs
4:05
and swapping their Bitcoin for it.
4:07
Like what else is there to talk about?
4:09
Everyone's, every the people that hold Bitcoin right now are
4:12
going to be tomorrow's idiots, right?
4:14
Because they're going to sell it.
4:15
They're going to get bored. They're going to buy treasury
4:17
companies, they're going to do fancy things because the asset
4:21
is just boring. And you realize that they were
4:24
never in Bitcoin for Bitcoin. They were in Bitcoin for the
4:27
dopamine hit and that's going away.
4:30
Yeah, Yeah, it is. It's definitely I, I definitely
4:33
feel it this year specifically that that dopamine hit is, it's,
4:37
it's a lot more muted than I was in the past.
4:41
So you're not feeling optimistic about Q4 as everyone else?
4:45
That's the crazy part. I'm saying all of this to say
4:49
that what the price action that we've had this weekend has just
4:51
made me more bullish as fuck than I've been for months
4:54
because what's happened this weekend, all of a sudden October
4:58
is here, right? But this is the point of saying
5:00
that. And to say surviving at the
5:02
beginning is because you're going to have to survive through
5:05
these boring periods now with Bitcoin and what have we seen
5:08
this past weekend? We've got Bitcoin right now
5:10
sitting at 124,685 and we hit 125.
5:16
Everyone was super excited that dopamine started firing and then
5:20
we had to pull back. Why did we have to pull back?
5:22
I knew we were going to pull back because there was a CME.
5:27
There was a CME gap that would have been created if we hadn't
5:30
pulled back. Triadfi drives Bitcoin now,
5:34
right? And when when a Triadfi drives
5:37
an asset, you're going to have to follow the rules that Triadfi
5:40
sets. And Trap Fight doesn't like CME
5:43
gaps. As much as all these people want
5:45
to lose their minds every time I tweet that they're saying oh,
5:47
new CME gap opened up is a 90% fill rate on these things.
5:53
This is not, you know something that is just created out of thin
5:57
air right there. There is a gravitational pull
6:01
towards CME gaps. 90% of the time they get filled.
6:04
And I'm so bullish because we are getting this price action
6:08
with MSTR buying 0 Bitcoin this week and we came down and filled
6:14
Acme gap. This is institutional buying
6:18
going on right now. This is a setup.
6:21
This is this is remarkable. This price action is great and I
6:26
think Q4 is going to be great, but it's only going to be great
6:30
for you if you can survive the pullbacks and survive the boring
6:35
periods and survive the sell in maze and go aways and all of the
6:39
traditional tribe by bullshit that have been driving
6:42
traditional markets. And most Bitcoin is current.
6:45
So they're going to get screwed and I'm here for it because I
6:48
want them to get screwed. I want every bitcoiner that
6:52
can't handle it to get their Bitcoin taken away.
6:55
Go trade meme coins. What are you doing here?
6:57
You got the hardest asset humanity has ever created and
7:00
gold pumps 40% and you're like selling your Bitcoin now sell
7:06
it. I want, I love it.
7:07
Sell it, sell it to BlackRock. It's great.
7:10
So that's interesting. So Tradfi is trying to squeeze
7:15
you out by boring you to death. That's so they always do.
7:19
That's basically what I'm understanding.
7:20
They've got 2 tricks, they've got 2 tricks, and they've got 2
7:24
tricks forever. It's boredom and over leverage.
7:28
That's it. Tradfi has no other tricks.
7:31
If you can get over boredom and over leverage, you win well it.
7:36
Doesn't seem like you're too bored, it seems like you're very
7:37
excited. Well, I'm excited because you're
7:39
here. I'm excited, 'cause you're here.
7:42
That's right. That's right.
7:44
Absolutely. Mutual excitement.
7:46
Absolutely. Oh, man.
7:47
OK, so, all right, so lots to unpack.
7:50
And by the way, I agree with you this this cycle in particular
7:54
after the, I mean, you had an episode about this after the ETF
7:59
got approved in January of 2024, things have been different.
8:03
Things have been very different in terms of price action
8:06
performance. And I think you actually
8:08
predicted this last time. I don't know if it was the
8:11
previous show, but the show before that we were talking
8:13
about the ETFs. You're like Nico is one of the
8:15
biggest game changers ever. But the price action has been
8:19
different since then. And I think, you know, this is
8:23
the year after the having, you know, I think Bitcoiners all
8:26
expected like a kind of that that dopamine hit that I think
8:30
we're all used to. And I think that this year has
8:33
been this kind of slow grind, you know, kind of sideways chop
8:39
solidation type of action. And then at the end of September
8:44
really felt like, OK, pack it up, time to go home.
8:47
And then the moment the government closed in October 1st
8:51
hit. I don't know what happened, but
8:53
just Bitcoin pumped like I think it was like 10K or something in
8:58
a relatively short amount of time.
9:00
And then, you know, it kissed an all time high on a Saturday out
9:03
of all out of all times on a Saturday.
9:05
That's so strange, right? And then here we are on Monday.
9:10
We're sitting at $124,741.00. So you know, and it looks like
9:16
this week is going to be a fantastic week.
9:19
So I want to get your take on that man.
9:22
Here's the thing. Here's the thing, right?
9:24
Personally, I'm about to put a video out today.
9:27
I just recorded it. Like I think this is early.
9:31
I like so all bitcoiners are excited everyone's super excited
9:38
now. If you were trad fi now's the
9:41
perfect time to kill that final hope right?
9:44
So I wouldn't be surprised if we see a retracement back down to
9:47
114 right now and this just continues until I I, I
9:51
originally thought we'd see like a second to third week breakout.
9:54
This is early. So I I wouldn't I really
9:57
wouldn't be surprised if we start seeing, you know, a
9:59
pullback, but again, the price action looks very solid.
10:03
So who knows? This is the beautiful thing
10:05
about it. This is how you get dopamine
10:08
receptors completely fried, completely exhausted, and all of
10:12
the all of the new peasants that thought they were going to get
10:15
really rich and break out of their shitty lives.
10:17
You send them packing. This is how it works.
10:23
Man, so it is Bitcoin not the money of the people anymore, is
10:27
it? Bitcoin is the money of
10:28
institutions. Now it.
10:30
Never was. It never was.
10:32
It's a monetary. This is the craziest part.
10:34
Like I've been saying, people hated me for saying this like 2
10:37
years ago, right? But it never was.
10:39
It is a monetary network, right? Sailor understood this better
10:45
than anyone, right? I kind of was saying it and then
10:48
Sailor just articulate it. At the best, it is a monetary
10:51
network. It solves the problems of the
10:53
poor at the same time as it solves the problem of the rich,
10:56
right? Because the underlying problem
10:57
is the dollar. So therefore the person with the
11:00
biggest problem is the one with the most dollars because it's a
11:03
monetary network. It's not a human network.
11:06
And that's why I always like railed against and, and, and,
11:08
and, you know, potentially offended a lot of Bitcoiners
11:12
that are for the people. Because at the end of the day, a
11:15
billionaire with a billion dollars is more important to
11:18
Bitcoin than a billion people with $1.00.
11:21
It's easier to convert that one person.
11:24
That's why the money teams involved now.
11:27
That's why this is happening. This is all Bitcoin is, a
11:32
monetary network. It's never was a human network.
11:35
You need dollars. And the beautiful thing is the
11:38
fact that a billionaire can solve his problems or her
11:41
problems with Bitcoin by putting in a billion dollars and someone
11:46
who's working with just a hundred $200 a month in spare
11:50
income can also have their problems solved, is great.
11:54
The one problem that it doesn't solve for the person with 100 or
11:58
$200 a month of spare income is it doesn't get them rich
12:03
tomorrow, which is what they're all fucking addicted to.
12:07
They want to be rich tomorrow, which is why the dopamine is not
12:10
enough. The billionaire is going to get
12:12
in here and buy a billion dollars of Bitcoin and tomorrow,
12:15
or you know, within the next few years, now that position is now
12:19
going to be worth 3 or 4 or $5 billion.
12:22
But the person with a hundred $200 a month, this is not for
12:27
getting you extremely rich. It's solving the same problem as
12:31
the billionaire, which is the depreciation in the value of the
12:34
dollars. It's just that person, the
12:37
billionaire, has a bigger problem and so therefore it's
12:41
going to look like it benefits them more.
12:43
But the Bitcoin is a monetary network.
12:45
It's not a human network. It ain't for the tree huggers
12:47
and the happy hippies. I've been saying this forever.
12:49
Yeah. I mean, and I think that's the
12:51
part where perhaps a lot of people, you know, and again,
12:55
I'm, I'm, I'm an observer here and, and I've been in, you know,
12:59
been, I've been around the block a little bit, you know, in this
13:02
industry and I'm just a. You've been essential to this
13:05
industry. What are you talking about?
13:06
Thanks. Man, I appreciate.
13:07
It quit the humble bullshit. I appreciate that.
13:10
There you go. There's.
13:11
A smile. There's a money smile right
13:12
there. I appreciate that dude.
13:14
But yeah, no, I've been, I've been just observing from the
13:17
sidelines and I'm watching this industry change right from the
13:20
Wild West days of kind of like the 20/16/2017 ICO boom to kind
13:26
of like the layer one, the layer one type of 2021 pump.
13:31
Michael Saylor got involved 9 Bukele Bitcoin legal tender and
13:36
then four years later kind of this institutional wave.
13:40
And you were talking about treasury companies earlier and I
13:42
wanted to get your opinion on that.
13:44
So other than Sailors initial MicroStrategy outperforming
13:50
Bitcoin significantly in the beginning part of this cycle,
13:55
Metaplanet also performing extremely well.
13:57
It seems like all the other ones are are not doing so hot these
14:01
days. Do you have an explanation?
14:04
For that, yeah, it's exactly what I said.
14:07
No one has a unique selling point.
14:09
Sale is the biggest one in the in in the whole game, right?
14:12
So he gets he gets his first mover advantage and unique
14:15
selling point is done right. You, you've got the biggest
14:18
stack in the game, No one's ever going to come close to you,
14:20
right? All the other treasury
14:21
companies, I think if you combine all of their Bitcoin,
14:23
they're basically at like 15% of seller's stack and sell is about
14:28
to have the fixed income products and everything else
14:30
STRCSTRKSTRFSTRD, all of them are about to get graded.
14:36
And what that means is when that debt is graded, all of the hedge
14:40
funds, all of the income funds, all of everyone institutionally
14:44
can now finally allocate capital, which they haven't
14:47
managed to do yet, right. So when the, when that product
14:50
gets graded is a, is a very, very important thing, which is
14:52
why Michael Saylor and the team at MSTR has been doing a great
14:57
job at trying to figure out how do we get this, how do we get
14:59
the product graded? And they will that will that
15:01
will happen at some point, then they'll join the S&P and then
15:03
that will cause a different, you know, as the MSTR true North
15:08
boys pointed out, like it causes a flywheel of capital that
15:12
starts coming into Bitcoin. So all of that's good Mana
15:16
planet, amazing job, amazing execution, right?
15:19
What they, what have they managed to do?
15:20
First mover advantage in Japan, there's a trend growing here,
15:25
right? First mover advantage is very,
15:28
very important when it comes to trapped capital.
15:31
These markets have trapped capital and the first time they
15:34
see a solution, they're going to run towards it and they're going
15:37
to run towards the 1st and the biggest.
15:39
And that's what we're seeing here.
15:41
So there's a lot of opportunities for the first and
15:44
the biggest and the rest of them are struggling because they're
15:47
not the first and they're not the biggest.
15:49
So Japan has has, you know, trillions of U.S. dollars worth
15:54
of trapped capital if they buy Bitcoin to get hit with a 55%
15:57
tax rate, There's no ETFs in Japan.
16:00
And the only solution they got for their retirement accounts is
16:03
to buy Metaplanet. And so that's what they're
16:05
doing. And Dylan and and Simon and the
16:07
whole team over there is doing an amazing job.
16:10
I'm allocated to MSTR. I've got a small position in, in
16:14
Metaplanet and, and all of them. But you know, like for me, MSTR
16:18
is the overwhelming winner in the game.
16:20
It's got the biggest amount of Bitcoin.
16:21
Can you trade these treasury companies?
16:24
Sure, but I don't know how to trade right.
16:26
I'm not a trader. I, I've never been a trader.
16:29
Every time I trade I end up losing money, so it didn't take
16:31
me that long to figure out I should probably not trade.
16:33
But there seems to be, at least what I see on Twitter, people
16:37
making millions and millions of dollars trading in and out of
16:40
these treasury companies. It's just funny that they
16:43
disappear after a few months. So it's like, I don't know,
16:45
maybe they got super rich and disappeared or they got super
16:47
broke and disappeared. I don't know which one it is,
16:50
but it seems like they're trading in and out of these
16:53
things and making shit tons of money because they know
16:55
something I don't, which is fine.
16:57
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17:01
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17:05
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You're ready to buy Bitcoin. So let's talk about the the
17:42
right 'cause you know there has been a lot of volatility with
17:45
these with these ones early on, specifically sailors, I think it
17:48
was like a 26 X metaplan. It was like a 48 X over a a a
17:53
relatively short amount of time, right?
17:55
But that all hinges on the fact that you you bought the bottom
17:58
essentially, right? And this wasn't a sure thing
18:02
before Sailor paid his dues during the 21202122 bear market.
18:08
I never forget watching him first row Pacific Bitcoin.
18:12
He's down billions of dollars and he's paying his prices,
18:14
tuition, like I think every Bitcoiner normally does, because
18:19
most people get in at the top. And then, you know, he paid his
18:23
price to tuition. The market started to pick up
18:25
again. And the man was absolutely
18:27
vindicated. And his stock, you know, it's a,
18:30
it's a wonder story. You know, when you went from 20
18:33
years of, of sideways action, You know, he said it himself,
18:37
like, I was thinking about retiring.
18:38
There was nothing else I could do with my company.
18:42
And then he basically threw a Hail Mary and it worked out
18:46
wonders. A metaplan.
18:48
It's very similar story. It was a zombie hotel chain.
18:50
It was about to go on there because of the pandemic.
18:54
And they, you know, they jumped on the opportunity.
18:57
And then there it seems like there's other companies that are
19:00
following suit in different countries.
19:03
But what I will say though, is you're not getting those returns
19:07
anymore, right? You're not getting those 48 X
19:11
26. X which is.
19:13
Sound very mean, Coiny to me actually, you know those types
19:16
of returns and it's such a short period of time you're not
19:20
getting those types of returns on the other ones.
19:22
I'm I'm, I'm going to be nice here.
19:24
No, not right now for sure. A lot of them, but some are even
19:28
down like 9596% which you and I both know is incredibly hard to
19:33
come back from so and some of the bigger ones are down like
19:37
that. So I want to get your thoughts
19:39
on that. British Auto.
19:40
Yeah, here's the crazy part. The crazy part about this is
19:43
that they don't like trying to beat bitcoins returns over an
19:48
extended period is hard enough. These treasury companies are not
19:51
even going to, not even trying. They they they don't.
19:54
They're not Bitcoin is not even their hurdle rate because their
19:58
hurdle rate is MSTR because if you're a treasury company
20:01
investor, you're not going I want to buy Bitcoin or
20:05
Metaplanet or I want to buy Bitcoin or, you know, SWC in the
20:09
UK By the way, another one first mover advantage and the biggest,
20:12
right? So your thought process as an
20:16
investor is not Bitcoin or one of these, it is MSTR or one of
20:22
these. So now you have to do the.
20:25
You know, the seemingly impossible, which is to attract
20:28
a shit ton of capital unless it's just trapped capital in
20:32
your country. You got to be MSTR, right?
20:37
Which is why I think all treasury companies will collapse
20:41
into MSTR and that will be the biggest in in in, you know, in
20:47
the game. There's a couple of interesting
20:49
things that people are doing trying to find their lane Strive
20:52
with the acquisition of of similar.
20:54
You know, you've got Nakamoto trying to create, you know,
20:58
there's a platform for launching treasury companies.
21:00
We'll see how that goes. You know, Metaplan, it's
21:03
obviously the one unique one biggest and, and 1st mover
21:06
advantage in Japan. So they're, they're, they're
21:08
pretty solid, like SWC pretty solid like, so you've got some
21:12
of these that are bubbling, right and got their own unique
21:15
selling points and those first two points, but you know, the
21:18
majority of them are going to collapse into the biggest.
21:20
And that's just, that's just how the story always goes and is
21:22
always going to Bitcoiners have this tendency to think like
21:25
we're rebuilding something fucking new, right?
21:28
And that's just not the case. Like I am, it's all egos and
21:31
it's all young egos and it's all that shit.
21:34
The suit wearers are here, the money team is here and they're
21:37
here to, to, to basically figure out like, OK, look at look at
21:41
what happened to Coinbase. Coinbase went from a very risky
21:44
exchange to the safest exchange in the world.
21:47
Why? Because BlackRock stood on their
21:49
shoulders and said you got to get this, this, this, this and
21:52
this sorted and then we're going to custody.
21:54
I bit with you and that's how it's going to work.
21:56
Coinbase is right now the, at least from what it seems, the
22:00
safest exchange to use in the world.
22:03
The premier jurisdiction if you want to buy Bitcoin through an
22:07
exchange is going to be Coinbase because of, you know, just like
22:10
for example, when Apple partners with a chip manufacturer or
22:14
wants to buy Beats by Dre, for example, they go in and they
22:17
have a checklist of things to maintain standards.
22:21
And that's what BlackRock did to Coinbase, right?
22:23
And that's what's going on here. This industry is being brought
22:26
up to Tranfi standards and that's going to be advantageous.
22:30
And there's going to be heart breaks for a lot of for a lot
22:33
for a lot of happy hippies. And that's just what it is.
22:35
That's where we're at. So what are you thinking about
22:40
this cycle right now? Because I think people are on
22:44
the fence in terms of, you know, it is different, right?
22:48
The Bitcoin peaked before the having, I think a lot of that
22:52
had to do with the ETF approval, which was an absolute disaster
22:56
with the previous administration.
22:59
Now you have a pro pro pro Bitcoin administration.
23:03
The president I think owns the 6th largest treasury company.
23:08
It's under Trump Media Group, which I find absolutely
23:10
hilarious and a lot of people. Are isn't that great?
23:14
It's it's fantastic. It's fabulous.
23:16
I love it. Absolutely.
23:17
It's great. I mean we, I.
23:18
Trust human incentives, we went. Exactly.
23:21
I've been saying that for so long.
23:22
I, we, we went from being attacked, right?
23:25
Because that's what it was last year, like straight up being
23:27
attacked to, you know, the president just straight up just,
23:32
you know, by like launching his meme coin, launching his own
23:36
Bitcoin treasury company. His sons are speaking at every
23:39
single conference. I think it's I think it's a
23:42
great thing. There's a lot of there's a lot
23:44
of Trump haters. I'm like, no, that that's pretty
23:46
good for Bitcoin. I don't think you guys
23:47
understand we got Ross free. Like people aren't paying
23:50
attention to that, that fact, right?
23:52
But what I wanted to say is, you know, what do you think about
23:56
this cycle? Are are we going to break it?
23:58
Like, are we going, are we extending it to 2026?
24:01
Michael Saylor is going. On the street and saying, hey,
24:03
listen, there's no more bear markets, it's only bull markets
24:06
now. What's your take, British
24:08
huddle? Yeah, I mean, look, you know, I,
24:11
I, I think that there's two ways this is going to go, right.
24:15
Number one way is we're going to see a repeat of a four year
24:17
cycle. Now what does that mean?
24:20
It means we're going to see some kind of blow off top and then
24:23
we're going to see a massive retracement and consolidation.
24:27
Or the second way is that we're going to just basically, you
24:30
know, crab sideways and go up crab sideways and go up crab
24:34
sideways and go up. Like what happened to gold after
24:37
the 2004 approval of GLD, right? There was 8 years of of
24:41
basically straight up including 2008, right, Which everything
24:45
was down and gold was was still green.
24:47
So, you know, I, I'll tell you what, I am more inclined.
24:53
I was thinking that the cycle was going to basically, you
24:58
know, change. I'm more inclined right now to
25:02
think that we're going to see a repeat.
25:04
Now the caveat I will say is I don't think the draw down is
25:08
going to be as big, which would be an order of magnitude
25:11
difference in terms of what type of market we have.
25:14
Like I don't think we're going to see an 8090% draw down.
25:17
I think we could see a blow off top.
25:19
And then I think we see a 60% draw down, which sounds like a
25:22
lot. But in the grand scheme of what
25:25
Bitcoin is, that's not a lot at all because that would be like,
25:28
let's say the stock market corrects 30%, right?
25:30
That's a massive draw down in the stock market.
25:32
Bitcoin go down 60% right. So I think it coincides with
25:36
what happens with with risk capital.
25:39
I think that liquidity is just about starting to flow.
25:42
I think the interest rate cut last site last time point you
25:45
know .25 was completely you know shit.
25:49
It doesn't do anything to drive any liquidity in anywhere
25:52
because most people have got their properties refinance that,
25:55
you know, really low rates. I think to really get any
25:59
significant movement on that side, you're going to need to
26:02
get to at least a 3% interest rate.
26:04
So was it, which by the way is coming, We just don't know when
26:07
that's going to come. And we don't know whether
26:09
Bitcoin has the ability to sniff out future liquidity, bring
26:14
price action of that future liquidity forward and then
26:18
handle a correction while that liquidity is still pumping,
26:22
right. That's what we don't know and
26:24
we're about to find out. So I mean, those are the really
26:28
the options here. What do I think is going to
26:29
happen? I was on the side of, I think
26:32
the cycle's broken and I think the cycle's changed.
26:35
I think the cycle's changed, but I don't think it's broken.
26:38
I, I'm more and more inclined to think that we're going to see a
26:41
repeat of a four year cycle. It's just going to be slightly
26:45
different. And that's what I'm watching for
26:47
to see. By the way, it'd be huge
26:49
opportunities in the market because now we have options.
26:51
We have MSTR, we have I bit, we got all these things.
26:54
So before when you wanted to hedge, you know you had to
26:58
actually. Sell your Bitcoin, right, which
27:00
drove the 90% corrections, whereas now if you want to
27:03
hedge, you just go buy, put options and so, and let's talk
27:08
about that too. So, so your your feeling on this
27:12
four year cycle, there's more financial instruments, more
27:16
tools that you can use. Where is in your mind?
27:21
Where does Bitcoin and self custody fit and all this?
27:25
Yeah, I think it goes down to your pro just like gold, right?
27:29
It goes down to your and I'm talking specifically about self
27:33
custody. I'm not talking about Bitcoin
27:35
right in a portfolio as a global as like a macro idea.
27:38
I'm just talking about self custody.
27:40
I think the self custody argument is, you know, what
27:45
probability do you assign to the US completely failing in the
27:49
next decade? And whatever that probability
27:52
is, that should be yourself custody amount.
27:55
Because right now I can take my Bitcoin spot, right?
27:59
Self custody, Bitcoin, take it out of self custody, which by
28:03
the way, if I put my assets into a trust, right, for future
28:07
generations, then I can't have self custody anyway, right?
28:11
It's already got collaborative shared custody or something else
28:14
as a mechanism of how trust trusts work.
28:19
So now if I take it out of that and put it into a trust broker
28:23
account and have Ibid, I can now borrow against that at Swiss
28:28
National Bank rates on the Swiss franc or U.S. central US Fed
28:34
rates on in U.S. dollars. So and I've already got 2
28:38
private bankers that have approached me to do that.
28:40
So it's like at some point the incentives are too big to to
28:45
hold spot and you have to start thinking about, OK, you know
28:48
what, what do I do with this capital?
28:50
I can borrow like at Fed rates against Ibit right now in
28:55
Switzerland or in Singapore. I can't do that on spot, Yeah.
29:00
And do you think there's going to be a difference between the
29:02
ETF volatility and the spot volatility?
29:06
No, I think they it would, it would cease the usefulness of an
29:11
ETF if that was if that was the case.
29:14
OK, gotcha. So basically you're making the
29:16
case that it's like, OK, so you know, the Bitcoin in in self
29:21
custody, which I come from the belief Hoddle, because I I you
29:26
know, again, there wasn't there wasn't these tools before last
29:30
year, right? So the only tool really was you
29:35
leave your Bitcoin on an exchange, which I think is a
29:38
terrible idea or you took it into self custody right now.
29:42
You know, there's these institution like BlackRock isn't
29:45
going to rug you. I mean, they could, but a lot of
29:50
things would have to go down, you know, for.
29:53
That to happen, right? Well, it's just never happened.
29:57
Yeah, I mean. Like people always say that
29:59
these things are, it's never. Happened, I would say like
30:01
basically the, the, the, you know, you've heard the theory
30:05
British auto, which is basically the US government 61-O twos, all
30:10
the Bitcoin in BlackRock and Coinbase and all the ETFs and
30:16
they just take all the Bitcoin and they just give everyone
30:18
dollars in return. So I, I, I come from kind of
30:22
like the traditional school of thought where, you know, yeah, I
30:26
think self custody Bitcoin is the way.
30:28
However, just educating Bitcoin, educating people on Bitcoin
30:32
specifically, like if you're part of the older generation,
30:36
you're a high net worth individual, if you're used to
30:39
owning real estate, you know, equities, all that stuff.
30:42
It's a lot easier for me to convince you to buy Bitcoin with
30:47
these products that are currently on the market.
30:50
It was a lot harder for me to convince you to buy Bitcoin when
30:54
it was just spot Bitcoin and then you had to basically you
30:57
ended up being an Uncle Jim for a lot of these people because it
31:00
doesn't matter how many times you taught them how to self
31:02
custody, they're still going to give you a call when they want
31:05
to access their Bitcoin. That that's been my experience
31:07
and I've been doing this for a decade basically.
31:11
So now that you have these products and it's like hate,
31:14
just go on your Schwab account, you know?
31:17
Go on your Schwab. Account.
31:19
You know, there's the I bet. Boom, you can buy it.
31:22
By the way, it might be the only way, right?
31:24
Like there might not be a possibility to educate.
31:26
Like for example, me mentioning just just now that having a
31:29
trust account, like if your assets are in a trust and you've
31:33
got trustees, those trustees might only operate through a
31:36
broker account. In which case at least you now
31:38
have the ability to gain some exposure where you couldn't even
31:40
put Bitcoin in the trust because they didn't understand self
31:43
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let's talk about too, because I think I think a lot of people, a
33:02
lot of Bitcoiners, which is I would say the majority of our
33:05
audience hoto. I know that you you have, you
33:08
have, you have a little bit of a different audience, but I would
33:10
say a big portion of your audience is Bitcoiners.
33:14
I think Bitcoiners are not aware of all the financial instruments
33:18
and tools that people can use the the traditional financial
33:22
system offers that perhaps Bitcoin does not offer.
33:26
So can you talk a little bit about that 'cause you're talking
33:28
about how a bank in Switzerland would, you know, give you allow
33:32
you to borrow against your pick, right?
33:33
The thing you said is like 4% or something like that.
33:36
So yeah. So can you talk a little bit
33:37
about that some of the some of the most interesting tools that
33:40
you think are the most useful? Yeah, I mean, this is the type
33:44
of thing that I'm trying to get Bitcoiners to pull their heads
33:47
out of their asses and start understanding like, OK, you
33:50
know, trad fires here, trad fires utilizing his asset.
33:54
I've got private bankers coming up to me at events and quietly
33:58
saying that Bitcoin is the best private banking asset that has
34:01
ever been thought of. And, and they're, they're
34:04
orchestrating and they're, and they're assimilating and they're
34:07
putting things together to take advantage of that.
34:10
And here are the tools. It's very, very simple, right?
34:13
You've got derivatives markets that allow you to hedge.
34:16
So for example, let's say Bitcoin right now, right?
34:18
Just like tomorrow we wake up and it's 350,000, right?
34:23
I can go and buy put options at 350,000, basically hedge 5060%
34:29
draw downs effortlessly with let's say I can take 5% of my
34:32
profits and hedge that. So I no longer need to sell my
34:34
Bitcoin and I can hedge that. If the price comes and retraces
34:38
back down 5060%. I've now let's say I put
34:41
$1,000,000 into that hedge. I can now take $3,000,000 back
34:45
and buy more Bitcoin with it without selling any of my
34:47
original Bitcoin or traditional Bitcoin.
34:49
If they wanted to hedge that. If they did they would have to
34:52
sell that Bitcoin right and hope they're right.
34:54
Worst case scenario I'm wrong and I lose 5%.
34:57
Yeah, right. So that's, that's one tool.
35:00
Second tool, I can now go and borrow against my I bit.
35:03
For example, if I put my wealth and I set up a private banking
35:07
relationship with, you know, several banks right now and I
35:13
can borrow against let's say I've got $10 million of I bit or
35:16
$15 million of I bit or $20 million I bit.
35:19
I can go and take a 25% loan against that at central bank
35:23
rates of any currency that you want right now, right?
35:27
So I no longer need to ever sell my Bitcoin in order to take, in
35:30
order to, to generate any, any profits or generate any, any
35:35
cash flow, right? That's one way.
35:37
That's another way of doing it. The other way of doing it is by
35:39
using fixed income products like STRC.
35:42
You got, let's say what you got $5,000,000 in STRC.
35:46
You now have a top 1% of America salary on an annual basis,
35:51
right? They're paying 10%.
35:52
You put $5,000,000 in, you got $500,000 in in net income
35:56
without doing a single fucking thing.
35:59
I will. Personally, I prefer STRK
36:02
because I like the, I like the upside on, on, on MSTR.
36:06
That's another product. You got MSTY, right?
36:09
If you want to take a little bit more risk, you want yield
36:11
harvesting. So you want them to actually go
36:13
to work for you and actually generate yield out of the
36:15
market's volatility. There's a difference between
36:18
like fixed, fixed income. A lot of people are thinking
36:20
like, do I invest in STRC, which is a fixed income product or
36:23
MSTY? And these are two different
36:25
products for two different purposes.
36:27
If you want to, you know, use opportunistically the volatility
36:31
that's going on, then you use MSTY.
36:33
If you want a guaranteed fixed income, then you use CRC.
36:37
Like these are two different products, but they're now
36:39
available and they weren't before.
36:41
So now you can go and take like I did.
36:43
I put 7% of my overall net worth.
36:46
Maybe it's slightly less now because of the uplifting price,
36:49
but 5 to 7% of my overall portfolio.
36:53
And I have, you know, more than a top 1% net income, net income
36:59
quote, UN quote salary just from My Portfolio.
37:02
And it's only 5 to 7% exposure that allows you to hold your
37:06
position without having to sell at potential tops and time
37:09
potential tops. So there's lots of things you
37:12
can do. You can borrow against margin,
37:13
right? If you got a big enough account,
37:15
you can say, OK, I want to take a margin on my position on IB
37:18
and buy MSTR with it. So you got further leverage to
37:21
the upside on that. Like all of these tools are now
37:24
available in the markets and and Bitcoiners need to pull their
37:29
heads out of their asses if they ever want, you know, a chance to
37:32
stay in this game. Otherwise, what you're going to
37:34
get by the way, is you got to defeat those two demons, right,
37:38
which is boredom and over leverage.
37:41
That's it. Those are the 2 tricks of
37:43
Triadfly. You can, if you can defeat
37:45
boredom and over leverage, you win.
37:47
One of the ways to defeat over leverage, by the way, is just
37:50
hold spot Bitcoin, right, because you won't be over
37:52
leveraged no matter what happens, you won't be over
37:54
leveraged and you're and you're set.
37:56
That's one way to do it for sure.
37:58
I'm not discounting that, but the boredom thing is going to be
38:02
interesting, right? We've got to see how how people
38:04
manage to stay consistent and stay focused.
38:06
So a. Couple questions, Richardo, what
38:10
would you say? Because I've heard Jack Dorsey
38:12
say this and again, a lot of the concepts, a lot of the things
38:16
that you're talking about with specifically within the Bitcoin
38:19
community, I would say they're very, I would say they were
38:22
popular. I would, I'm, I'm open minded to
38:24
this because I think I see the, the inevitability of, of Bitcoin
38:30
being embrace by traditional finance and then not only that,
38:35
the success of its embrace. I mean like this.
38:38
And this is something because like look at the end of the day,
38:40
guys, this is the same approach that I've taken with stablecoins
38:43
because the theory originally was if you are in the developing
38:47
world and your currency had double digit inflation, you
38:53
would adopt Bitcoin as an alternative.
38:56
That's not what happened. What happened was people adopted
38:59
the dollar via stable coins, right?
39:01
So at the end of the day, I'm a free market maximalist.
39:05
I, I, I look at what the market is saying, the market speaks,
39:08
you listen, right? That's, that's what I like to
39:10
do. And what I've seen with sailor
39:14
was that's a Unicorn. You're looking all you're
39:18
looking at a one in a, you know, that is a, that is a, a super
39:22
story. 20 years of sideways action peaked in the 90s when
39:27
sailor was 30 years old or 40 years old or whatnot.
39:32
And then 20 years later, Cinderella story, you know, this
39:36
stock just comes back to life. Now it's on the verge of being
39:40
added to the Fortune 500. So again, like if you're looking
39:44
at it from a market perspective, like and I get, I understand
39:48
traditional Bitcoiners where they have the hesitancy of not
39:51
your keys, not your cheese. And I agree with them.
39:54
That's why, you know, actually I don't, I don't own any Bitcoin
39:57
actually. But you know, that's why I
39:59
always advocate for people, you know, taking Bitcoin into self
40:02
custody, of course. But simultaneously, I think it
40:07
would be like kind of pulling an ostrich and putting your head in
40:12
the sand and just not really acknowledging what happened with
40:17
MSTR, with Metaplanet, with the potential of a strategic Bitcoin
40:22
reserve in the United States on the federal level, on the state
40:24
level. You can't deny that the that the
40:29
game has changed. You can't deny that the game has
40:31
changed. So you either pay attention to
40:33
it, either acknowledge it, either kind of stand to benefit
40:38
from it, or you just pretend that it's not there.
40:41
Because I will tell you something else.
40:43
I think that the amount of products that are going to be
40:46
built out for bit corners over the next 10 years is going to be
40:50
mind breaking to a lot of people because Bitcoiners are going to
40:54
be 20 to 30% of the ultra high net worth class, right?
41:00
And by definition, that someone who's worth $30 million or more,
41:03
right? Can I just ask what you mean by
41:05
that? Like products that will be built
41:07
out for bitcoiners. What do you mean by that?
41:09
If you are, if you're an investment bank or you're a
41:13
wealth manager, right, And 20 to 30% of your clientele is now
41:19
Bitcoiners, meaning they got to that 2030 percent, 20 to $30
41:25
million number, not by selling your company or selling a piece
41:30
of real estate they bought whatever, but holders.
41:34
These are people that bought Bitcoin 10 years ago.
41:37
And as the price of Bitcoin appreciates, all of a sudden
41:40
they get into that category of people.
41:43
And the the amount of people that fit into that category
41:46
isn't very big. It's not more than a million
41:48
people that fit into this category.
41:50
So there's only so much, there's only so much of these
41:54
individuals that these wealth management banks that these
41:56
investment banks can go after. And if 20 and 20 to 30% of their
42:02
clientele is now Bitcoiners, right, they're going to have to
42:06
come up with some type of value add to give them.
42:10
Yeah, that capital. Yep.
42:11
For them to bank with them, essentially for them to do
42:14
business with them. You know these?
42:17
Are, by the way, that involves handing over custody.
42:19
Correct, But again, there needs to be an incentive there, right?
42:22
Because if you go and you tell me again, I don't own any
42:25
Bitcoin, but you tell me, you say, Nico, hey, you know, I'm
42:29
from this bank. I don't want to name any
42:32
specific ones because I have friends, but I'm from this
42:35
investment bank that all you guys have heard of.
42:37
You know, if if you watch the movie The Big Short, you know
42:41
what? So one of the big ones, hey, and
42:45
you know, I can now, you know, I could.
42:48
You want to, you want to diversify, man, you want to, you
42:52
want to maintain your wealth. You already took the risk.
42:55
You want to maintain your wealth now.
42:57
And I'm going to look at him. I'm going to say, or look at him
43:00
or her. I'm going to say, listen, so
43:02
you're trying to tell me that you're going to get better than
43:05
a 30% kagar yearly basis. And they're going to look at me
43:09
and they're going to be like, I'm going to be like, and you
43:13
also want me to give up my keys if I had Bitcoin, of course.
43:17
And you also want me to pay you a fee, right?
43:20
I don't know. I don't know.
43:22
So what I'm trying to say is, you know, that is a very well
43:27
financed industry. That's an industry that's been
43:29
around for like over 100 years. They're they're not going to go
43:33
over, they're not going to go away overnight.
43:36
And I'm already starting to see it on my end where I see
43:40
entrepreneurs that offer these services to high net worth
43:44
individuals. British huddle and they'll come
43:47
to me and they'll start having conversations with me.
43:49
Mind you, these are people that are, you know, offering these
43:53
services to traditionally wealthy people here in Miami.
43:57
And all of a sudden they see, you know, the bitcoiner in the
44:00
hoodie and they're like, hey, wait a second.
44:02
You know, that's a whole different type of clientele,
44:07
right? That I haven't really tapped
44:09
into. So I want to get your thoughts
44:12
on that, man. Because they're going to be,
44:13
they're going to, they're going to be forced, they're going to
44:15
be forced to have to act right? And they're going to be forced
44:18
to have to provide some type of value in order to acquire at
44:23
least a percentage of those customers.
44:24
I know a percentage of them would never do anything, you
44:28
know, for ideological reasons. But, you know, I think at least
44:31
a percentage can be incentivized.
44:35
Yeah. I mean, look, firstly, I think
44:36
Bitcoiners have to accept that they're going to hand over their
44:38
custody, right? In order for that to work, for
44:42
that pitch to work, you're going to hand over custody.
44:44
There is not a scenario in hell where you're going to get a, you
44:49
know, all Bitcoiners love this acronym of a or, or, or a phrase
44:53
of a buy, borrow or die strategy, right?
44:54
And everyone's saying the same fucking thing over and over
44:57
again, like bunch of yapping seals and they don't actually
44:59
understand how the buy, borrow, die strategy works.
45:01
Firstly, you have to have to actually hand over custody in
45:05
order for that to even start to work right?
45:08
And then you're going to have to pay back the loan.
45:10
So how are you going to be paying back the loan on an
45:13
ongoing basis? The way buy borrowed I actually
45:15
works for wealthy individuals is they buy assets that go up a
45:19
lot. They borrow against them, they
45:20
buy cash flowing assets so they can actually continuously pay
45:23
off that loan and then do a refi at some point.
45:27
And Bitcoiners have no desire to learn about cash flowing assets,
45:30
which is ridiculous, right? Which is why I continue to
45:34
believe that again, boredom and over leverage is going to figure
45:38
out its way. And it's going to take your
45:41
Bitcoin and hand it to the people that know how to actually
45:44
manage assets, know how to manage portfolios, know how to
45:48
manage cash flows, know how to manage these things.
45:52
So that's, that's what I think is an app.
45:54
But yeah, look, I, I think products are coming.
45:56
I don't think there's going to be products built for
45:57
bitcoiners. I think Bitcoin is going to be
45:59
integrated into the products that already exist for real
46:02
estate equities, gold and everything else.
46:05
And one of those mechanisms was ibit and and all the of the
46:08
other Bitcoin ETFs that are out there.
46:10
So, you know, you got to figure out how you're going to get with
46:13
the program or not. Yeah, I think and I think that
46:18
there is going to be bitcoiners that you know, I think are going
46:21
to see it's like the the, you know the the story of the of the
46:27
Bitcoiner that he sold like 80,000 Bitcoin via Galaxy and
46:32
then his reasoning was for estate planning and whatnot.
46:39
That was the official reason given, I think eventually.
46:43
By the way, what a, what an amazing, what an amazing story
46:47
to in life be able to sell 80,000 Bitcoin.
46:51
I can't, I can never ever claim to be able to do that.
46:55
So that's an amazing story. And for it being estate planning
46:59
is, again, evidence on exactly what I'm saying.
47:03
Yeah, I didn't actually know that until you just said it.
47:05
I didn't even look into it even more any more than that.
47:08
But if that was the official story, then that, you know,
47:12
backs up what I've been saying. Yeah.
47:14
I mean, it's again, I think it has to do with.
47:19
I think it has to do with like you know you have to you have to
47:26
put yourself in in this person's shoes right for you to acquire
47:30
80,000 Bitcoin, you were buying at under $10 or under $100,
47:38
unless you had a lot of capital to begin with.
47:42
But for you to acquire that quantity, you got in early
47:47
right? And this is what some people
47:50
don't understand too, as well as like if you got in that early,
47:57
you've been holding for more than 15 years at this point.
48:01
That's 15 years, right? So if you were 30, you're now
48:04
45. If you're 45, you're 60
48:07
essentially, right? That's a long time.
48:11
That's a very long. Many things change, right?
48:15
And boredom and over lever. Many things change in 15 years
48:19
at the end of the day, right? What are we all?
48:23
What are we all huddling for? Right?
48:26
I was like, you're not gonna huddle into the grave
48:28
eventually, Why not? Why not?
48:31
I mean, but eventually, eventually you're gonna wanna,
48:33
eventually you're gonna wanna see the benefits of the huddle.
48:37
Boredom and over leverage. That's the only tools they got.
48:41
Nico bought them and over leverage and you want to buy a
48:44
new fucking house? They bored you into it.
48:46
You want to buy a car and you want to sell your Bitcoin?
48:48
They bored you into it. You want to figure out, oh, I
48:51
need to take care of my kids? This, that and the other.
48:53
They bored you into it and now you have the tools.
48:56
If you're wealthy enough, which is why I was fucking shouting
48:59
for three years that people need to get to 1 Bitcoin.
49:02
You will have tools to never, ever have to sell you Bitcoin
49:06
and you can huddle into the grave.
49:08
Do you think people like bought land in Manhattan and then were
49:12
like, oh, what happens if I want to buy a house?
49:16
Am I going to sell my land in Manhattan?
49:18
No, they huddled that land into the grave.
49:21
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50:17
But I think it reaches a point where what is 80,000 Bitcoin
50:22
these days? I don't even know 80,000 Bitcoin
50:25
what's. What's a few billion amongst
50:27
friends 80? 1000 Bitcoin is yeah, it's a
50:32
it's a ridiculous amount of money.
50:34
It's it's a Yep, it's a lot of money.
50:38
It's a lot of money. So 9.6 billion.
50:42
So that person is one of the wealthiest people on planet
50:45
Earth right now. And he probably bought those
50:48
Bitcoin for a couple dollars a coin.
50:51
So he became a multi billionaire.
50:54
Yeah. I mean, at what?
50:55
At that point, what you could always buy back in, you know?
50:59
Well, that's what I think is based on you saying that it was
51:01
estate planning was the official reason.
51:03
Like that kind of feels like what happened and it kind of
51:06
makes sense on the fact that the price only dropped by 3% over
51:09
that window. So it basically looks like
51:12
what's happened is Galaxy has dumped that Bitcoin into the
51:14
market and bought it back via ETFs for this person or whoever
51:18
that whoever it was. Interesting.
51:21
Because the price only moved by 3%.
51:24
So it's like, OK, that kind of makes makes more sense now based
51:27
on what you've just said to me. You know it's also.
51:30
Too. I think it was Willy Woo that
51:33
said this too was basically like look like I'm selling my spot
51:38
and I'm buying the ETF. Plan B also did the same thing,
51:42
right? Yeah.
51:43
So it's interesting to see that, but I mean, would it, but would
51:47
it Bitcoin be a failure if individuals aren't taking self
51:50
custody of it 'cause I come from that camp, I got come from that.
51:53
I don't own any Bitcoin, but if I did, you know.
51:57
You got straight, I bet. You know, I don't know any
52:02
Bitcoin, but if I did, you know, I would definitely self custody,
52:06
you know at least a large portion of it if I did on
52:10
Bitcoin. That's a philosophical question.
52:14
That's for people much better than than me.
52:17
I can't answer that. I'm not.
52:19
I'm not from that world. I didn't come into Bitcoin
52:21
thinking it was some kind of political movement.
52:23
That's not what, that's not what drove me into it.
52:25
Bitcoin is a solution to a problem, and that problem is
52:30
unlimited money printing, and Bitcoin is the solution for
52:33
that. When it comes to a philosophical
52:35
question, you going to ask someone that's a better human
52:37
being? Than me.
52:38
OK, so let me let me rephrase that then.
52:40
Let me rephrase that. I respect that answer.
52:42
But let me rephrase that question then.
52:44
So the reason I think people say it would have failed if people
52:50
weren't taking custody of it is the danger of potential
52:53
rehypothecation, right? Because I get the end of the
52:55
day, a lot of people speculate. I mean, you come from the gold
52:59
world, bro. Wasn't gold like, you know, and
53:03
I was talking to Larry Laparte about this, Caitlin Long.
53:05
They're very intelligent people, right?
53:08
Decades in the industry and and they're just basically like,
53:11
look like gold was suppressed for a long time because of
53:15
rehypothecation, right? Isn't Bitcoin at a?
53:20
Isn't it at a similar risk if you just have a handful of
53:24
institutions cussing it on behalf of everyone?
53:30
Did the did the two people you mentioned say that it was
53:32
illegal to do that? No, they didn't.
53:36
Mention that it was either. That's a very interesting
53:38
question. Of course, because there's no
53:40
fucking lawsuit on rehypothecation of of of of of
53:44
gold. That's the thing, like everyone
53:47
in the gold space. And I was one of these people
53:49
parroting this bullshit as well. And the reality is this, there's
53:53
no, there's no law against anything that happens in the
53:58
space. And the only lawsuit that anyone
54:00
can turn to and like cuss out JP Morgan for was price spoofing.
54:06
And you can go look this up, by the way, it's not just me making
54:09
this shit up. And I'm not supporting these
54:11
people doing what they were doing, but this is the only
54:13
lawsuit that JP Morgan ever paid a fine on or the biggest one was
54:18
for like, let's say gold is approaching 2000.
54:21
They would go put in more market orders for 2100 people.
54:24
You know, retail will come in, buy up and move the price to
54:28
2100. As the price came to 2100, they
54:30
would move those orders off the market, which is basically, you
54:34
know, kind of market manipulation and any, all of the
54:39
data research that JP Morgan got screwed on with that lawsuit
54:44
affected the price on any day by 0.3%.
54:50
So gold bugs like myself in my past love using these things of
54:56
the markets being suppressed. All this other shit is
54:59
happening. And the real reason why gold has
55:02
been down, basically is because gold miners can manipulate the
55:08
price of gold, and they need it manipulated in order to sell
55:12
enough gold to make enough profits.
55:14
That's it. I don't believe in anything
55:15
else. I don't believe in that
55:16
rehypothecation race. Because if that was the case in
55:19
2008, GLD would have blown up. If it was truly being real, it
55:23
didn't, right? So I don't believe in any of
55:26
that. These people that you mentioned
55:27
are really smart people. I like them both.
55:29
But again, it is a parroting of the same bullshit in the gold
55:33
space that by the way, I was also parroting.
55:35
So I'll take some personal responsibility on that too.
55:38
But yeah, no, I, I don't believe.
55:39
So you have a very unique perspective and I'll, I'll tell
55:42
you why. So, and I, he was also Caitlin
55:45
that was talking about this before this ETF approval that
55:51
happened in January 2024. The people that were in the
55:55
Bitcoin space or Bitcoiners, right?
55:57
In one way or the other, right? Some more than others and blah,
56:01
blah, blah, blah, blah. But they were into the Bitcoin
56:03
crypto sphere, right? So they went to, you know, Mount
56:07
Gox, they went to Coinbase, they went to their favorite exchange
56:14
and you know, they, they, they bought Bitcoin, right?
56:17
That's what they did or they bought, they bought alt #53 or
56:21
alt #2 or #3, whatever. But what's really interesting is
56:27
I think bit corners underestimate that traditional
56:32
finance is now here a whole new sub sect of people that don't
56:41
think the way you do have now entered the space.
56:44
And I think a good representation of that was the
56:47
unconference conference and New York City and Michael Saylor's
56:52
keynote. I remember I was watching it and
56:55
Opti was next to me. I was like, Opti, like, what's
56:56
he saying? You know, Cuz it again, it
57:00
wasn't really up my, my, it wasn't really up my alley in
57:04
terms of, you know, just kind of talking about this is very
57:07
traditional finance. It's just.
57:09
The way that he was talking, he was talking to that audience.
57:12
This is the audience. He was not.
57:13
By the way, credit, credit to you for being able to turn to
57:17
someone and say, what the hell is he actually going on about?
57:20
Because in my experience with Bitcoiners, the experience has
57:24
been, I don't give a shit what he's talking about, right?
57:28
That's why I called them gold bug bitcoiners.
57:30
Now credit to you for actually taking a second and going, what
57:32
the hell is he actually saying? Trying to understand it because
57:35
that's important. I appreciate that.
57:37
And yeah, I mean, bro, it's, it goes back to the free market
57:41
principles, right? British huddle, like at the
57:43
fundamentally at the end of the day, bro, like, like, and again,
57:47
this might be unpopular, but so was me.
57:49
I I've been telling because I've been saying people about tether
57:52
for I've been saying that for a long time.
57:54
And it's like somewhat unpopular in my, in my circle.
57:57
And I say like, look, like boys, you guys, you guys have to
58:01
understand, right? Like we had a theory about what
58:04
stable coins would do. We had a theory about what
58:07
Bitcoin would do in developing countries.
58:09
That's not what happened. What happened was the wide
58:12
adoption of the dollar versus via stablecoins.
58:17
And I'm seeing tremendous success in Bitcoin in the
58:21
traditional, in the traditional financial markets, but it's
58:26
being done through MicroStrategy.
58:28
So I think it would be very dumb for you to ignore that as a
58:34
bitcoiner for you, not for you, at least not to basic, basic
58:39
understanding of understanding of what the hell is going on.
58:44
Bravo. So this is the message that's
58:45
needed and you are a mouthpiece of, you know, the traditional
58:50
Bitcoin for how long you've been doing this.
58:51
You are a pivotal part of this content world for the
58:54
traditional Bitcoin space. They, you know, they don't
58:58
really relate to me and my background and where I come
59:00
from. And so I'm, I'm very, very happy
59:03
that you are saying this and you know, God is as well because as
59:06
you said that Bitcoin cross 125 again, woo.
59:10
That's fantastic. That's incredible. 125 at the
59:13
time of recording. Smash, Smash the like button.
59:17
Smash the buy button and yeah, this is a very interesting.
59:22
Don't even smash. No, no, don't even.
59:23
I don't want to lie to these people.
59:25
Don't even smash the buy button because your buys, your retail
59:28
buys are fucking irrelevant now. That's why I was shouting for so
59:31
long saying you better get to 1 Bitcoin because you are
59:35
completely and utterly irrelevant to this market at
59:38
this point. The big boys are here.
59:40
They were here June 15th, 2023. The game absolutely changed and
59:46
everyone who's been sitting around fucking twiddling their
59:49
thumbs talking about how we're fighting the system with your
59:51
$10,000 net worth, you are now completely and utterly fucked
59:55
because that you are not driving this market anymore.
59:59
I'm sorry your ego is done. It is over.
1:00:02
The best that you can do right now if you're one of those
1:00:05
people is hold on tight and hug your Bitcoin as tight as humanly
1:00:08
possible. Because if you don't want to
1:00:10
learn how Tradfi works, you don't want to learn what other
1:00:12
options there are like Nico is saying, and you don't want to
1:00:15
learn, you know all of the tools available to you.
1:00:18
Good fucking luck because boredom and over leverage is
1:00:21
coming for you. Yeah, man, it's I, I'm telling
1:00:25
you that it, it, it, you have to under you at least have to as a,
1:00:29
as a Bitcoiner, I completely, I love British Hollow because he
1:00:32
doesn't censor his mind, right? He speaks exactly his mind.
1:00:36
And one of the things that really resonated with me as a
1:00:39
content creator, just the pitch. It's like, you know, get to at
1:00:43
least one Bitcoin, you know, shut the F up, you know, buy
1:00:47
Bitcoin, get fabulously wealthy. Is is great.
1:00:49
You know, it's had a had a had a rhythm to it.
1:00:53
But one of the things that I really one of the things that I
1:00:58
I really liked, man. And just now with what you're
1:01:01
saying this message is, and again, I'm just using common
1:01:04
sense and I don't have this background, ladies and
1:01:06
gentlemen, I don't have the background.
1:01:07
The British huddle does. I'm just using like just free
1:01:13
market basic common sense. That's what I'm I'm looking at
1:01:16
it right. And does that does that mean
1:01:19
that my that my strategy is going to change?
1:01:21
Is the bitcoiner? Like am I not advocating for
1:01:24
self because you know, none of that changes.
1:01:26
But what I'm trying to say is you have to learn about the
1:01:29
asset of which you're holding and the asset of which you're
1:01:32
holding is going through. It's maturing, it's getting out
1:01:36
of those crazy turbulent teenage years and it's becoming an
1:01:40
adult. It's becoming a maturing asset,
1:01:42
as you said. And not to understand the
1:01:45
process I think is incredibly naive.
1:01:50
And I think also too, if you've been a Bitcoiner, going back to
1:01:53
what I was saying, you know, like 20 minutes ago or what not,
1:01:57
if you've been a Bitcoiner for these last 15 years or whatnot,
1:02:01
last 10 years, last five years, last six years, and you've
1:02:05
huddled, you've kept the majority of your huddle, at
1:02:08
least a portion of your huddle. There's going to be a lot of
1:02:12
people that are going to want your business over the next
1:02:15
decade. There's been a lot of people
1:02:17
that don't want your business. And I know them, they're at the
1:02:21
conferences they're at, they're looking, they're trying to
1:02:23
figure out how this how this is going to work.
1:02:26
And they're bitcoiners, too. Yeah, yeah, it's, it's, it's
1:02:31
very, very interesting, man. But anyways, dude, we are
1:02:34
getting to the top of the hour Bitcoins at 125 KA 125 K 100.
1:02:39
So it's, it's a it's a good recording session.
1:02:41
We all all this, all these good vibes, man, made the price go
1:02:44
up. I'm taking credit for it.
1:02:46
We're taking credit for it, bro. What are your final thoughts on
1:02:50
2025? Where we ending up?
1:02:54
You're you told me you're feeling bullish, but you're also
1:02:57
telling me we're going to get bored to death.
1:02:59
What are your expectations for Q4 of 2025?
1:03:03
Yeah, I think so. Right now what's going to happen
1:03:05
is Bitcoin's going to start building up over the next few
1:03:08
months. I think it's not going to be
1:03:10
that long. I think we're going to, I think
1:03:12
we're going to head towards the 180 level, something like that.
1:03:15
And then retail is going to figure out that they fucked up
1:03:18
again as usual and then they going to come storming in.
1:03:21
Something crazy is going to happen to the price.
1:03:23
And then I think we're going to see a draw down and I think this
1:03:25
is going to last somewhere between now in February next
1:03:28
year. And then where I'm leaning right
1:03:31
now, I think we're going to see some kind of massive drawdown
1:03:34
and consolidation as bitcoins going to sniff outcoming income
1:03:37
and liquidity and then, you know, take a take a breather for
1:03:43
a year or so. I don't think we're going to see
1:03:44
a massive drawdown. Like I said, 7090%, I don't
1:03:47
think that's going to happen, but I think it's going to be
1:03:49
sizable enough to, you know, to to keep dopamine receptors
1:03:52
happy. Do you think some of these some
1:03:56
of these treasury? Companies spin out at that
1:03:58
point. No, I think again, you know, I
1:04:02
think the, the similar blueprint is basically what happens.
1:04:05
They get bought out at, at discounts or, or slight premiums
1:04:09
or something like that. I, I don't think treasury
1:04:11
companies are going to cause the next bear market.
1:04:13
I, I, I just can't see that happening.
1:04:15
They're all buying Bitcoin by selling stock right now, right?
1:04:18
MSTR is the only one with its own damn, you know, an idea of
1:04:22
multiple different ways to buy Bitcoin.
1:04:24
Everyone else is basically ATM ING the stock to to buy more
1:04:27
Bitcoin. In that environment.
1:04:28
I don't think we see any kind of, you know, sell out.
1:04:32
I think the worst thing that happens is they trade below 1 M
1:04:34
NAV and then they're acquired by someone else for stock.
1:04:37
Yeah, Yeah, that seems very, very interesting.
1:04:40
Well, dude, always a fabulous conversation with you, man.
1:04:43
Always enjoy it. Always learn so much.
1:04:47
And yeah, go check out British Huddle's channel.
1:04:50
It's fantastic. I'm a big fan.
1:04:51
I learned things when I watch his content.
1:04:54
Another another aspect. And yeah, man, thank you so much
1:04:59
for joining me today. I appreciate it.
1:05:01
My pleasure, thanks for having me.