Latest / On Your Own Time Podcast / My Story | From Podcast Host to Guest | Athlone Ireland
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- speaker-0: Hi, Ray. Top of the morning to you, Dick. Top of the morning. And good, and good. speaker-1: So you've been talking about this all week to me, wrecking me fucking head about this thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Saying he's gonna destroy me on this podcast. But as we said, today's episode's a small bit different. I'm usually the host, but now I'm the guest. We've Rick Conlon in as a special host, so Ray, your show. speaker-0: Hi guys, welcome to this special episode of On Your Own Time. Normally a DeccaDit likes to ask the questions and put us on the spot and tries to squeeze everything out of our brain we can but this time it's my opportunity to squeeze the brain a Decca. But look, before we start, I just have a few things to say about this lad. Since the first day met him he's been an absolute inspiration to me personally but not only me, to everyone else. speaker-1: Bye. speaker-0: He gets the best out of people. And I just want to know what makes Decky tick. speaker-1: Jesus, what's making me tick? I said this to you before and I said this to lot of people that have asked me, it's kind of a similar enough question, what makes me tick, but in terms of helping others, is it? Yeah. Yeah, so I like to see, like I got great opportunities when I was young, we'll talk about in a few minutes, when I started, I got great opportunities and people helped me and so like seeing others achieve their goals is probably my biggest, like. I like seeing others getting the best out of themselves. So that's what makes me tick. Is that what you're looking for? Yeah, yeah. speaker-0: But like as a motivator, you always see a person doing well, but you know that they can go that extra step. You push them not to their limits, but to the limits that you know they can get to. There's not too many people that have that quality in them, but you see something extra in people when you push them. And you don't over push them, but that's a special quality some people don't have. So even... speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: in your personal life, your football life. That's a great quality to have. speaker-1: Motivation, I think motivation comes with many factors. think there's many ways to motivate people. We've been saying in the Army, there's many ways, it's kind of ca- But in terms of motivation, like, everybody's motivated by different ways. People are motivated by giving them, like, we've been saying, they're not saying in the Army, he's never trusted PTI in terms of his distance. Because they might say to you here, let's push out for the next 500 metres. But that 500 metres could be a K. So you get the best out of motivating people, like, they just want to achieve, they want to be the army very very competitive but in the referee terms, I just revert back to you, I found you being motivated but I used to give you a hard time and you used to always think, we fell out, not fell out but we had disagreements one or two times and I found that was your best motivation because I found when you're annoyed, when you're annoyed you go onto the pitch and you actually fix them things and like I've never said it to you before but I'm the same, I'm the exact same. someone says to me, Dicky you fucked up there today, or Dicky you're shit there today. In my head I'm saying, I'm fucking gonna destroy that game the next time, I'm do it fucking better. That's it there. speaker-0: I can remember a few years ago I was given a special ticket to go to a game in the Aviva Stadium with the FAI Cup final, Dundalk and Cork. It was one of the proudest moments of my life for you. You were one of the officials in that game. There was a full crowd in the Aviva. How did you feel in the dressing room before? speaker-1: You actually know the answer to this. Not many people know this. I actually told the referee at the just last year and I touched on him a few of the while but I was in the Jacks getting sick before the game. They very nervous. You weren't meant to bring the whole pair. Nerves is a good thing I think as well. speaker-0: or you're going to tell everybody else. speaker-1: I think if you're not nervous in any game you go into it and nervous doesn't mean that you're afraid to go to the game. Nervous is you're given the game that it's worth, you're given the game the respect that it deserves. So being nervous is a good thing for me, I think it's been good. If you walk out to the pitch or walk out with anything and you're not nervous at times then do you really care? speaker-0: A nervous reaction makes you improve your performance. Yeah. Okay. So let's, let's, ⁓ get away from that topic for a minute and let's move forward with some ordinary questions. Why the podcast? speaker-1: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, so like, I've been thinking this for a good few years now, in terms of why you want to do a podcast. And a lot of people actually said to me, ⁓ sure, you wouldn't be able to do a podcast because you talk too fast, I curse a lot. You've a lisp. I've a bit of a lisp, yeah. A bit of a stutter at times as well. And usually I go off on rants. When they care about something, I go off on rants. And they're like, ⁓ this podcast wouldn't suit you. And I said to myself, do you know what? Fuck it. And I'd rather try something and... fuck it up and no idea I fucked it up than in 10 years time looking back and saying why didn't I give it a go? So like if I give it a go now and it doesn't work, well fair enough there's no pressure, there's nothing, I'm doing it for a bit of crack, I'm not doing it for anything else. I'm doing it because I'd rather give it a go and regret it in a few years' time. Because I think it's a good platform as well. I know we have to be careful what we say in terms of my job in the FAE and the League of Ireland. But it's an open platform. I don't, I love hearing stories. I've always been... I love people, I see a lot of people, like stories, people have, what they've achieved in life. But then I also love hearing like that we've known a few people on next week in terms of their jobs. If one fell on next week, he's a firefighter, he's a paramedic. He's a bodybuilder, he's a personal trainer. Like we talk about time, we talk about how much time people have in a day. That fellow does multiple jobs. Tony. Tony, yeah. And like, how does he like, like... So hearing that story and seeing it and hearing what he does and how he gets to the gym and how he does that is fascinating in terms of just them stories. That's the reason I want to do it. speaker-0: Yeah, it's great to get the best of our people and some people are humble and don't like talking about themselves but you can make them share your story and help other people that haven't got the motivation themselves. You can inspire them by just getting other people to talk. Which is another quality that you have like which some people don't know how to do it but you're good at doing it. ⁓ Question about your growing up. as a human being. What did you want to do? What did you want to be? speaker-1: Jesus, I want to lie, when I grew up I was a messer. I definitely was a messer. I could have went down many different routes to be honest with you. I could have gone down a bad route early on. I went to school, I went to school after I did my junior cert, I left school, never went any further. I went to do an apprenticeship then. and in around finishing junior certain in my apprenticeship I think I started refereeing and I remember refereeing during the beginners course we talked about in a few minutes but bring it back some of it. Growing up yeah growing up was a mad old time because I think in any time I think any I think every child in their life will have, any young person in their life will have a crossroads in terms of when they could go bad or could go good, in terms of what route to go down. I have a lot of friends that went down the bad route and they're my very, very good friends. I give credit to Michaela at the time and Michaela said to me, it's either me or go down that route. Thank God I went with Michaela. I was that close, there was a situation that she actually just said to me, Dece, it's either me or go down that route. And she went off, we fucked off. then about three or four days later, then we went down the good route. So I changed my kind of way of thinking. Yeah, was it. I got into refereeing and I'd have to say, refereeing changed my whole outset in terms of my whole life. I have to give lot of credit to Micaela, but in terms of refereeing and we talked a small bit about in a few minutes, about the branches and the people around you and stuff like that. But it was, if I look back and say to myself, was I a good young lad? I wouldn't say I was a good young lad. speaker-0: If you had a chance to change anything about yourself growing up, what to change? speaker-1: I wouldn't say I was an asshole years ago. were an asshole. Yeah, probably was. If I had to change, if I said to Billy, if you asked me question in terms of Billy, would I like Billy to be like me as growing up? Absolutely not. Okay, so I hope that answers the question. speaker-0: Okay. Yeah does. You don't have a whole lot of family. I've got six older brothers, two older sisters. So I was kind of given a road to go down. And I made some good and bad choices. You had to go your own route a lot and you had some relations and some family but you had no big brother there to drag you down the street. So you had to make lot of your own choices like in Michaela as you said, made you take the good choice. speaker-1: sisters. Yeah, and I think that's an important factor you made as well because family can bring you down a bad road as well at times. So to take that step back and realise. Yeah, they kick up the fuck on. So Michaela was that, but again I have to say big credit to her obviously, but big credit to football and refereeing. I just started my job, I started my apprenticeship then, I talked about apprenticeship. I went off the camera alarms and the business actually folded. So I ended up not doing my apprenticeship, finishing my apprenticeship and I actually weren't working in the wet lit. You're going to slag now. I'm actually working in boots, chemist. speaker-0: Go on, go on, I'm not going have hear this. speaker-1: So a boot chemist, yeah, so I was in there Farming, no, it's just a stockroom usually and storing shelves and stuff like that and serving customers the odd time and Yeah, some funny stories in there, but again, yeah, like I started, I was young lad I was probably 16, started referee in 17, 16 maybe, yeah 16 I think I was in boots at 16, nearly sure I was in boots at 16, 17 What do you think 16, would have been 16, yeah speaker-0: pharmacist. speaker-1: Yeah, I'm telling a funny story about boots actually. Christmas time, actually we didn't boot until Christmas time. I was in as a temporary staff first and I was on the till and came off the till a few minutes later then because some older woman wanted me to help her get her something on the shelf and I think she knew well right down that she was trying to make me uncomfortable and so they don't avoid wearing rings Christmas for men. Yeah. She came up to me and said, this doesn't work anymore. Doesn't work anymore. I said what? She said, yeah. It doesn't work but is there any chance they're going to return it? I ended up getting the stores and all the stuff so I called the manager and the manager came down and I just left over her and I walked off. that was the sum of all those dangerous stories. But as I'm saying it wasn't working so how did you know it wasn't working? ⁓ yeah that's really it right. speaker-0: Hopefully it wasn't used. Yeah, it's amazing when you're young, you still don't know what path you're going down. People say they don't know what to do when they're older, they don't know what to do now. I'm 54 and I still don't know what I want to do. So your mind is never made up. But working in boots, Christmas, by breaking rings. We'll move on away from that for a minute. As you started refereeing and even in the Army, who inspired you? speaker-1: Yeah. Yeah, so I started refereeing first actually. I started refereeing, I probably wasn't allowed to start refereeing at 15, but I my beginners course at 15. It's not the same now, I had done it in Seamark Lodge, was a Wednesday evening. And I walked into the room and there was a... League of Ireland, they currently on the League of Ireland panel, but that's the way used to be done, the shutters at the time, were just referees I think at the... So we had John Stacey, had Tony Kelly, Mick Gillivan, and I'm nearly sure Paul Murphy was there. So four current League of Ireland members. And there's a man there from the ADSL, Par Quinn. He was the chairman of the ADSL at the time. So anyway, done it, it was a couple of hours long. And it was actually all video clips and interesting. It was old school, like, ⁓ piece of paper, laws of the game tests and stuff like that. But again, I was 15 in the Shannach Lodge doing this. And... I'd that couple of hours there and Par Quinn came up to me afterwards and said to me, how are you fixed for a few games on Saturday? Sure, how are you fixed for a few games on Saturday? He started laughing and he said to me, we're stuck for referees on Saturday, will you do a game for me? So I said, yeah, no bother. So I got a text message from the students to go home, two games two games Sunday. So beginners course on the Wednesday, referee Saturday and Sunday. speaker-0: straight away. Did you have any socks or jerseys or catering? speaker-1: No, that was the thing about it. John Stacey had awards, we were talking about League of Ireland members, and I still do to this day, I still do it if I have spare kit, I give it out to new referees, but they gave me the kit that they had to go refereeing. And I'll never forget that we were actually refereeing. My first game was in, actually it in the Army of Arrogance pitch, I'd nearly saw it, I forget the name of team, was like a Batch of Heights team. But I remember it was on the pitch down there, it was ⁓ only a seven side pitch. and Port Nicholson was there, Port Quinn was there and Breff from your own was there. The legend. The legend Breff from your own. And he came over to me and he said me, he said, Dickie, says, you're running up and down the pitch, says, the sun is in your eyes. He said, stop running. He said, half of through the game, he said, you ran and you just ran on the shade side. So it's like doing a system referee running up and down the line in the shade. Shady character. Shady character, yeah. So that was my first game. But then it was interesting because I got into the Army shortly after. So I actually done my referees course 15 and I got into the School of Excellency at 16. So I was in the School of Excellency at 16. 16? Yeah, so 16. And that's a two year programme, which you went through. It's two year programme and I was on the League of Ireland panel at 17. So I'd still had another year on the School of Excellencies when I was on the League of Ireland panel. So mad because only about five of us got onto the League of Ireland panel after the first year. School of Excellence but we still have obviously a full-on year left and that's probably down to where I live because at the time there was Marvue, was Galway United, was Salt Hill, was three teams in Galway, Atlan was obviously in it so I was out every weekend and that at the dawn of Galway at the early stages and that was it. Going to the Army around the same time as well so it a busy time and period around that time. speaker-0: Did you go to many games to watch these lads ref while you were starting out or did you just pick things up yourself because my advice was always go to games, watch the assistant, watch the referee for positioning. Did you go to games? There's always mad stories. speaker-1: was actually just a mad story because... It was actually a mad story. It was actually a funny story. ⁓ So I said I didn't do my junior stuff but I actually tried to go back to school. I tried to actually go back to school between refereeing and before joining the... Sorry, between Boots and the Army I tried to go back to school. It didn't really work for me. ⁓ And we had a League of referee who was teaching me in John McLaughlin. John McLaughlin, yeah. And this is mad story though. So John McLaughlin, were in Alavish at the time and I was saying I was a blackout, messer, messer. I was. So something happened in the school, we got into a bit of a brawl with one of the fellas. Yeah, so we into a bit of a brawl with a fella and John McLaughlin was the first teacher there and he said to me, I forget what day of the week it was, and he said to me, don't do it, Decky, don't do it. But two of us had an argument, two of me and this other student had an argument and I obviously got myself in trouble. And John Stacy. speaker-0: somebody else. speaker-1: John Stacey. John McLaughlin brought me to the principles office and got me suspended. John did. Got me suspended. The funny story was, I was with him on a Friday night in the League of Ireland match, going to Galway. And he had to pick me up in the car and bring me to Galway. So the teacher got me suspended. speaker-0: John did. while you're turning all the way there. speaker-1: was a a But that story is still this day a week slag about. It's funny because it wasn't just me, were other lads in the car. I was sitting in the back. it was funny and John was kind of slagging me on the way off the road. Yeah, but like I it was a bit blagger. speaker-0: the conversation in the car going down. ⁓ students. Talking about young referees, what mistake did you make as a young ref or did you learn and find your mistakes? speaker-1: I think every referee, even to this day, every referee makes mistakes. speaker-0: No we don't. We don't. We do. We don't. ⁓ speaker-1: You have a big game today, no rest. I made loads of mistakes growing up. Being a young referee growing up and being in the School of Excellence and being in the League of Ireland, probably was, and probably a few people agree with me, I was probably an arrogant count of a referee. So when I grew up, I refereed the game and it lasted maybe five years, I came around to this thinking. speaker-0: Thank you. Yes. speaker-1: Obviously the laws of the game is the laws of the game but I referee them with no common sense. So I referee the game as per the laws of the game said. Yes I was on the League of Ireland plan, yes I was on the School of Excellence but I think I knew the game but I didn't understand the game. If that's right to say, correct to I've made so much, I've made loads of mistakes but if I look them back I tell you I was an arrogant cunt. Players couldn't talk to me because I was the referee. and I think you said this me before, you to calm down and go back. ⁓ I think that's down to understanding the game a bit more. speaker-0: Was there an issue where you overseas with the army to military games and you're an assistant referee and you were underlying one of the games and all of sudden you went missing. You went missing and Lon could find you for a while. Explain to everyone what happened. I want to picture this again. speaker-1: Yeah. When you go out, that wasn't ⁓ I was selected to do the Military World Cup in Oman and there was a system referee and we were at a TV game over there and I'll never forget because it very very warm over there and I went for a sprint, so I went to turn a straddle into a sprint and I fell, okay, and slipped. The flag fell out of my hand and the ball broke for an offside. That's the one you're on about. Yeah, so I fell and slipped and... speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: I'm not too sure if it a goal involved or an offside goal or something like that. yeah, I missing that time. But I never lived it down for the rest of the tournament because the Irish team were actually watching the match on live, watching the match live on TV, the Irish team that were over there, the military team. And every time I seen them, they like, ⁓ did you have a nice fall? Nice one, have a nice fall. But I think that's a running team at me, isn't it? The refereeing. speaker-0: Yeah and it's also falling because I can remember about four years ago you were a referee and I was over in Longford as an assistant. Longford were playing Shalbourne. Damon Duff was managing Longford and you see me come and they go ⁓ Blaise and Jason, ⁓ you again and then all of a sudden you fell again. speaker-1: You have to understand what the conditions were like. was pissing out of heavens in Longford. was pitchy, it was slippy. So I slipped on my arse. I slipped on my arse and I did a bit of a tumble. And I have to say I was very quick in up. speaker-0: Thank you. and out. You were crawling around on your knees for four steps going, ⁓ fuck, ⁓ fuck, ⁓ fuck, ⁓ fuck. And the crowd behind me absolutely hurting themselves. Where's the phone, where's the phone? Lino, do you see that? And sure I was nearly in bits and digs laughing at you as well. speaker-1: I knew it was on cams. So that speaker-0: No that was good, was just a fact you have not had to fall in. And did you not do a game many years ago when you started out first? Could have been in shells or bows, not sure. And you're on the line and you don't put your flag and then the flag went missing. speaker-1: It was with John McLaughlin as well actually. John McLaughlin was refereeing and I went to give it offside and I was in Tolka Park and I went to give it an offside with a flag but the old flags, well they still have to send flags but the screw comes off the top. So the screw came off the top and then the whole flag and the screw went into the Shell's fans. Into the fans there. I love that. We never got back but it was mad because it an offside decision and I'm standing there with a stick in my hand with no flag on it. Class. speaker-0: into the fight. As you were in the system for probably, was it 11 years on the panel? 12 years. You stepped up to being a referee and I congratulate you still because you're flying and it's great to see you out there and even seeing the mistakes you make. do you find players are more difficult in the League of Ireland, elite level, than as in junior football? Do you have to rope them in and manage them differently? speaker-1: I wouldn't say, no, not difficult, at that level we're all professional, the players are professional and the referees are professional. think at times in the game, it's a heated game and people have, there's a lot on the lines and stuff like that, people get passionate about the game, that's what I'm passionate about. So I wouldn't say it's difficult. have lot of Greek junior footballers out there as well that should be on the League of Ireland as well. Because it could have been, could be on the League of Ireland. But I wouldn't say they're more difficult though. speaker-0: For a young referee, what advice would you give them if they're stepping up a grade to go onto the pitch into a difficult game, top of the table clash, the young referee gets an opportunity. What advice would you give him? speaker-1: I said this to you lot of before as well, you're there for a reason, you're selected to do the big game for a reason, you're selected down for your ability and someone sees something in you, so someone sees that you're good enough to be in that game. So do your preparation, go in with the right headspace, nerves are okay, but you're there as a team, so remember that, have team officials who there for a reason, they're not there to be an arrogant cunt either, you're there to work as a team. and I was saying if one fails in the team we all fail. So go to pre-mass instructions, go to tell the assistant or freeman if you have a fort official exactly what you need from them and then to achieve the same goal as to get in and get out. speaker-0: When you know you've got a fixture in the League of Ireland, the fixture will probably come out on Sunday, and you know the team that's with you, when do you start your match prep with your team? speaker-1: This time I'm a bit OCD and you'll notice I will always text my team on a Wednesday. So if I'm in a game on a Friday, I'll always text my team on a Wednesday. So it gives them two days for what time I meet at the hotel or meet at the ground. It gives them two days. So my prep kind of starts when my fixture comes out because the first thing any referee will do, if anybody says they don't... they're lying to you, is to look and see where the teams are at the table. And see what the last few games were, are they on a good run or on a bad run. And that kind of gets you into the right mindset because on a Sunday, if I'm Fort official on Friday, my preparation, my training for the week is different. So my training will be a small bit harder on Fort official weeks. But from refereeing, it's a small bit less. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: It's hard but it's a small bit less. So when it comes to a Thursday evening, the Thursday, mean match preparations on a Thursday, if I'm refereeing it's a small bit less, but a small bit more speed, limited speed, but it's like a small bit more speed but short distance. But I'm in fourth fish line, might get a bit of an endurance run on a Thursday and a small bit of finish off, a small bit of strides at the end. So that's how I plan for my week. speaker-0: Yeah, as you just said, running and training. ⁓ Even away from football, you do a lot of running as well. What's your goal for your running and your training? speaker-1: Yeah. I'm probably in terms of why I run. I run because running is great for headspace. But it also keeps me, so I know, I've gone into my fifth marathon, was just here in Dublin Marathon. So I think having something to aim for keeps me on, keeps me taking over. Keeps me having a goal in mind in terms of my fitness. I'm probably, in terms of my refereeing, in terms of my pitch stuff, I probably don't do enough of that on the pitch. But in terms of running itself, I started running very, early. I started running probably at the age of 16, but I was never a competitive runner, if you get me. I was always like, I go for 10K today, or I go for 12K today. But over the last maybe 10 years, I got into a bit more speed sessions, then as I got into the marathons, I got into more like the... proper structure training and I actually have a running coach at the moment. He's actually a former FIA coach, know, Fiannais coach Cairn McKeown and he's very, very good. So he's pushed me through the marathons, he's got me through the last three marathons. So having him just clears the head, keeps me having a goal in mind. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: Actually, remember you helped me a couple of years ago, we did the charity event during Covid. We did that four mile every four hours for 40 hours. And then don't have to pay the house. That was a major challenge. Points? Well, we're not meant to points, it was during Covid. Yes, we're not meant to have points. Yeah, but it was good, was a crack. Tough. speaker-0: That was a major challenge. The punch are nice afterwards. We went to your house. We didn't go for drinks. We did the Limerick Marathon this year. At the very very start you said you were doing the Marathon. And then during the week you came back and said to me, we're going to do the half Marathon. And I said fair play, that's okay. But in the morning of the race you said you doing the full speaker-1: Yeah, Why? I ⁓ remember, and obviously the situation you went through, was two years ago, I booked you for Christmas. We got you into there doing the relay, Martin. So, it's kind of, so we do it every year. So, I said to you, last year, said to you, Ray, I'm gonna do the full Martin next year. And I actually roped J. Morgan into it this year. So, myself and J, we booked us straight away. And we booked the relay. So, I was training okay up to about, speaker-0: This isn't about me now, did it? speaker-1: eight weeks, no, what was eight weeks, Jesus, was probably nine weeks before the marathon, was training okay. I got a small bit of an injury and I was like, ⁓ fuck it, I'm not doing the marathon here. So it's nine weeks before the marathon, I decided, I decided I'm not doing the marathon, I said I'll do the relay because one of the fellas dropped out and another fella needed to do another half, so obviously the relay, there one fella doing the first half, another fella doing the second half. sort of nine weeks before the marathon and roll on anyway so I still in my mind I was going to do the relay marathon half marathon part of it and the night before I'll never forget it six o'clock the night before the marathon the slagging started slagging started they pulled out you can't the full you're not able to do the full yeah you pull out merchant and all this stuff like so six o'clock I'll never forget it I in the house and I said I said I said I went straight down to Roma Chippers got a pizza speaker-0: Second. speaker-1: The night before the marathon, sat down at 6 o'clock, got a pizza, got a big 2 litre bottle of water. This is not... This is not a voice that anybody would in a marathon. Then they got a 2 litre bottle of water and I drank that all night and had a pizza. And I got up at 6 o'clock in the morning, it? 6 o'clock in the next morning and I down and done that. And still at that stage, ⁓ at the start of the marathon, ⁓ myself and Paul at Bury were doing the... He needed someone else to do with him, so he started. speaker-0: and set two leaders. Yeah. speaker-1: And I said to him, sure, you know what, I'll decide half the truth if I'm gonna do the full. So at 10k, even starting the race, I wasn't 100 % sure what I was gonna do. I wasn't sure if I was do just half the speaker-0: were sitting right on New Well, you weren't going to be go to work on Monday, Tuesday or Wednesday because these boys are going to tear the whole of it. speaker-1: Yeah, so like, and then after 10k, you were actually with us at the time, you and Paul were with us at that time as well, and I said, fuck this thing going on. Yeah, yeah. So I just ran on. And actually, like, it done very well. For a fella that hasn't trained, nine weeks before the Martin, the longest run I'd done was 16 mile. That was nine weeks before the Martin. And then after that, I was just doing tens and 12ks. But, Ray, my God. Like, we talk about, like, I'd done Dublin the day before that, and I actually felt fresh finishing it. But with Limerick, my mother of God. I was in bits for 70 miler I was in bits. speaker-0: But that's brute ignorance and stubbornness on your behalf to say I'm not taking the slagging I'd rather be in pain for the fucking week Yeah, and have the fucker slag the hell off me speaker-1: I'm still half plantar fasciitis from it. My feet are still in bits from it. Jay's injured as well. Jay's knee is at me as well. It's mad. You can get away with a half martin or get away with 10k race with limited training but you will not get through it. You might get through it but you've been bit. Yeah, actually. speaker-0: As long as you can see in JMR, you can see. Yeah, as I said, you couldn't take the slagging. You'd rather put yourself through pain and ignorance. ⁓ talk to me about banter. You have to enjoy what you do because you can't go out there and take it serious all the time because then you won't enjoy it. What banter would you have during a game even with players, your own team of officials? It's all about enjoying it. speaker-1: Yeah, I think banter is good and banter can be bad. Sometimes I think when some people try to be the funny man in the room they can be offensive at times. But with me I try to have a small bit of banter and try to a bit of crack in the situation we're in. I've seen another saying in the Army, if you look left and right there's always someone in more bits than you are. So like if you're on the ground and it's pissing rain and you're after walking for fucking hours and they've got a amount of weight on you, if you look left, you look right, someone's in bits. Yeah, so gives you that kind of, it's a small bit of crack like and you might tap them on the shoulders and heck man, there's always something worse than this, come on, keep going. But banter, think banter is very important. Banter can be a sign of show of nervousness at times as well. So for me, think banter can be a... Like me and you were always at each other. speaker-0: some of the worst things. can be good. It's shocking whenever I love doing games when I know I'm on the team with you. I know when I'm an assistant we have got our concept and we're talking. You give me your endless abuse to players. Look at the old man over there don't trust his flag. Like it goes on for 90 minutes plus you just slag me off consistently to players and then the players end up slagging me off as well. But the thing is I love that. I love that better. speaker-1: It's good at junior football, it's good at the different types of games. We do games that people we know, players we know, and they know the situation. Or someone might be getting a situation in junior football, like the player might be getting wound up about an offside or something like that. I might slack them, I might leave them alone, he's nearly 60. It just kills that bit of tension between the two of us and we have a bit of a laugh. It's never done it in badness, but it's probably my way of coping. speaker-0: Yeah, yeah, yeah. with him. It's hard to accept the banter as well, it's most important thing. When you're on the pitch as well as a referee, that's one thing which a lot of people wouldn't understand and I'd love to squeeze your brain off you on this one. People think Forteficial is in a tough position, people think Forteficial just stands there and has a chat with everyone. Will you go into detail and say how it's like when you're a fourth official, if Damon Duff on your left, have Olly Horgan on your right. Rest in peace, today's his anniversary, we're going to do him in silence today for him in Sawtill. as a fourth official, even people look at the Premier League all the time, they think a fourth official just stands here with his arms folded. Will you explain how tough a fourth official can be? speaker-1: I'll talk about it much as I possibly allow to talk about it. Fort Fisher can be, Fort Fisher is very, very challenging position. can be like, it depends who the managers are, it depends what teams you're in. But again, you're there to offer support to your team, to offer support to your referee. You're there, in my opinion, the best Fort Fishers are the ones that are able to communicate. the Cattrachie Cam and I have an observer mentioned a couple of years ago, Dickie, he says, in one game I've seen five different types of management styles from you and I start laughing, I say what do mean? And he says, every different, five different cultures, five different situations you're talking to different people and you had five different types of management styles. So did you ever watch Split, the movie? Split is the one with all the different types of personalities. So you have to have, I think at times, have to have all the different... So sometimes it's a... Sometimes you're calm, most of time you have to be calm, but sometimes you have to be assertive in terms of like, this is the law, this is this, this is that. If you're giving a player on the pitch a caution for visual dissent, if the manager does the same, he has to get the same because that's consistent role of it. ⁓ But it's very, very tough. speaker-0: ⁓ I actually do remember it since glitch. speaker-1: But as a fort official, you're responsible for the admin side of it as well. So you have multiple things happening, multiple things, especially the new laws, timings and stuff like that as well. Yeah, and the good things about the commons at times, and having active listening at times, and having, sometimes you just turn yourself off and not hear that what they're saying. Yeah, so that's a moral factor as well. speaker-0: I'm your ear non-stop. As a ref and as a Fort official and soccer and the rest of question, you have a massive passion for football and the Army and your personal life as well. That's huge. Can you explain what gave you all the love for football? speaker-1: So I talked about making mistakes. I talked about starting refereeing very, young. As I said to you, I started refereeing very, young and joined the Midlands branch. You probably don't even know this. I actually joined the Midlands branch and only spent a couple of weeks in the Midlands. speaker-0: Yeah, you went off to the other dark speaker-1: Yes, I went to Roscommon and it was actually a funny story because Tony Kelly and John Sherlock were asking me in Saver Faire in town in a lawn here and they said to me any interest in coming over to Roscommon. said no, I I'd be happy in the Midlands branch because my cousin Ian Stacey was there. speaker-0: Peace. speaker-1: John Stacey was retired at that stage. A lot of people, Joe Cassidy was there in the Midlands branch. Great, great guys. But Tony was like, come over, we'll look after you. You a good pathway and stuff like that. So anyway, I ended up going over to Ross Coman and I have to say a fair play to Patti Nolan at the time. He was the chairman at the time and he just signed the transfer and he was like, you want, he's not going to stop a young fella transferring because it's what he wants. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: which was good. Eventually I went over to Roscommon and started refereeing in Roscommon. I remember the very first game I refereed in Roscommon and I nearly killed two records. It was a local derby, primary division local derby in Roscommon. First match. Very first match in At 17. I wasn't even 17, was only 16. Like late 16. speaker-0: money rights. 17. speaker-1: because I was in Commons at the time, I was in the Midlands, I was in the of Excellence at time, I went over, so I would have been known 16, nearly 17. And referee the primary division match, Sky Valley versus Moore. speaker-0: that's a tough one. That's a nice feisty one. speaker-1: I remember, and I talked about their feminists, I understand in the game, and I had two red cards in the game for a violent conduct, two lads hitting each other in the match. it was a very, very good game, very, very tough, tough game. And I remember after the game, Tony Kelly came over to me and said, you done well, you done very well. And you talk, I give you tough love, that's the way he was of me. So, I've done well, yeah, but you should have done this, this, and this, Yeah, but we need to be, you were not wanting too bad, all right? So, but again, first game over and understanding the game. But I have to give a lot of credit to one person, there's a of them, Tony Kelly, John Stacey. But one particular fellow that helped me and shaped me who I was at that stage was the late John Sherlock. speaker-0: I was my soccer manager for a few years when I was playing here. speaker-1: But John Sherlock, Jesus. I remember Tony Kelly ending up leaving the Roscommon match. So he left a couple of weeks into it. And it was just me and it was just me and Roscommon. And he was looking at it kind of, he said to me, I brought you over so I'm going to look after you. Give me good games. Looked after me. was three times, maybe three times a week I was ringing him. were having a conversation. was driving in the car today, Driving on and on Roscommon. But Jesus, he looked him back at that man. speaker-0: Did you drive your car at this stage? speaker-1: the stuff that he does for us, Calme League, my God. I could drive by the pitch at 10 o'clock at night and he'd be cutting the grass. He shaped me honestly, he shaped me and looking back the values he had, everybody respected him. Referees respected him, clubs respected him, everybody respected him. He was well gotten in the FEI. Even on Sunday evening, I'd ring him and the first conversation was actually something you just said to me minute ago, how many reds do you have? So that's what he said to me. every weekend. He would nail a club if they were wrong, but he'd nail a referee if they wrong. Which I think he got a lot of respect for. But I remember getting a phone call, John and Sherlock passed away. was actually after I think it was after the AGM, the mid-FIAGM. I was driving home, crashed the car, he crashed into a graveyard outside, and we were a phone call, and just around about 100 metres from his house, about 200 metres from his house, and my God, like... speaker-0: I'll be going home. speaker-1: That would have been a culture shock for me. That nearly gave me a kick in the bum. I actually didn't referee for a couple of weeks after that. And then I eventually joined the Midlands match. But lot of my... the way I am today, I will go down to a credit for John Shortwrap, the way he moulded me into being the man I was at that time during the refraining. speaker-0: Yeah, that's great to hear you saying kind words about good people because it took a lot of good people to bring you on the journey that you're in right now. speaker-1: ⁓ yeah, absolutely. I was in the right place at the right time. I in the right place at right time. I've made loads of mistakes, big mistakes in the League of Not only in the of Ireland, I've made lot of mistakes, big mistakes in my personal life. But I'm believer in terms of life's a big wheel. I got help during my younger days in getting into the League of Ireland. I hope someday... speaker-0: course out. speaker-1: I'm giving help now and someone might turn around and say they'll pass it on. So it's a big wheel. So someday you need help, someday you'll give help to someone and someday you will definitely need help. And that's a life, everybody will need help at times. But I'd like to say someone turn around in years to come and say, well, just thank you for you go to me, gave me this opportunity. But to everybody, ⁓ I'm across the board in terms of that way. I've been helping doing fixtures in the League of Ireland probably since 18. I was doing fixtures with John Stacey and Pat Kelly and John Moore at the time. Doing fixtures. That's ⁓ a long, long time ago. speaker-0: That was in the Midlands branch. speaker-1: I was back in the Midlands branch, was helping out, they'd ring me in, I'd lay out the referees and stuff like that. Obviously it's changed now, no referees can do that now. That's what helped me and we talked about the branch, Midlands branch. speaker-0: You were chairman at a very young age as well. speaker-1: So I got the chairman very, very young. I was in branch probably less than a year. I think had to be a year to be the branch. I had to help the executive in liaising with fixtures. And then the following year I got asked would you go as chairman. So I went as chairman. And I don't know, 10 years. 10 years, was asked. 10 years. Back to back as chairman. And ended up being the youngest ever chairman in the country. So being that age, being a young man, being in the League of Ireland, being in the army, running the branch. It's a lot of work. And I remember someone asked me recently actually someone asked me, you look back on your chairman role, do you think that you made mistakes as a chairman? I think everybody makes mistakes. think in no matter what position you're in, in any job you're going to make mistakes. Maybe because mistake probably... speaker-0: lot of speaker-1: I loads of mistakes but my biggest mistake probably holds me bit more is the biggest, I won't say the referee's name but the major assault that happened to one of our referees. speaker-0: Okay, that was tough to deal with. speaker-1: Yeah, like I was only a young chairman and I remember I was on the NCO course at the time and I was going up to the hills. So that was the Sunday that happened. So I was dealing and we were back in the barracks at six o'clock on Monday morning. So I trying to deal with it on the Sunday night, help out as much as possible. And then they went mad on the Monday, there was news and I had to go on to our secretary's name was Paul and Paul did an awful lot of liaising with the news because they were onto the interviews and everything. But looking back, yes, did I do as much, did I do everything I could as chairman? Absolutely. I've everything in terms of what we had to do. think in terms of, we were very, very, very, very strong. think in terms of the rules, the new rules that the FA put in place, it's very, very good from that. it's mad that it takes something like that to happen. But looking back, what should I have done better? I probably could have helped, I probably could have communicated, I probably could have talked to the family more, to the referee and the family more. But I remember I was on the NSO course at the time. That happened on a Sunday and I always gone until a Wednesday or The referee in question, he was in hospital for a couple of days. It was probably the biggest assault ever happened in this country. But looking back, would have loved, if I had to do it now, I'd love to give more support to the family. I don't think I'd done anything wrong as a share man, but as a personal level. speaker-0: Yeah. You didn't do anything wrong. There wasn't an awful lot more you could have done because you have to balance off your life. His situation was quite tough. Then you were trying to train with the Army. We did that as best we could ⁓ as a branch. You were more so doing your best and the RTU were involved. But the outcome came that the way you dealt with it, the branch was nominated, the best branch in the country for dealing with basically that issue. speaker-1: Yeah, it was down to the whole branch. At the time, the branch was saying, remember, I don't want a referee, I want a referee. We lost loads of referees over. I remember saying in the meeting, we're stronger as a group than we are as individuals. So we have to stick together on this. Let the league deal with it and the FAO deal with it and the law deal with it. and we keep professional and keep our things in place. But by God, if that happened to another referee then it probably would have been a different situation and it could have been a second time. But I think at the time we were very, strong as a branch. We very, strong as an executive. I don't think we've done anything wrong as a branch. In terms of the club, we met the club. Myself and Paul Malone went and met the club. They got rid of the players, the whole team was nearly gone. We met two really good individuals from the club, from the team in question, I don't want to say the names, but two really good football people from the club. I remember was 8 o'clock in the in clubhouse, myself and Paul went over. And, in all fairness to the club, to the league, the league left it in the branches hands in terms of, you go and meet them and whatever decision, if you don't want them in the league, they're gone. And we met them and they told us, that was a freak thing and the players are never going to be involved again and all this stuff. And then we had a nice conversation and the outcome was the outcome. But I have to give credit to the league and have to give credit to the FAO. for the sport, particularly the I think the league backed us to the hill. speaker-0: Yeah, I'm pretty sure that everyone agreed with that. was a ⁓ very difficult time. That was difficult for the man's family, for the branch, for the whole of Ireland got involved. was even emails coming from UK, bigger clubs, which was amazing support for him. I was part of the fixtures at the time when I was getting boxes of speaker-1: Okay, and. speaker-0: sent to me from Referee World for the individual in question. He was calling to my house every other weekend getting boxes and boxes and stuff so the support he got was really good and the support from you as a leader of the branch not just the chairman is what helped to get us where we are today and helped him to recover mentally from where been. speaker-1: Yeah, again, if I look back again, I think we don't have everything as a branch, but think in a personal level, I probably could have been a bit more, I was there for him, but I probably could have been there more for him. That's just my look back at it. But anyway, so we went on to refereeing and talked to Smaave about, made it my, chairman role, we got branch of the year that year. My proudest moment ever as probably as chairman is bringing the branch into, well one of them, that's probably one of them, is winning the branch of the year. But bringing the branch into the 50th anniversary. And we had it in the Shama Cláidh, it was an absolute great night. And we honoured the late Brefnion Oán. Brefnion Oán was a great inspiration to me and to the branch. He's an honorary member of the branch. He's a former League of Ireland observer. speaker-0: Yep. speaker-1: and he was a founder of the ADSL as well, one of the founders of the ADSL. And I remember I played for the Kennedy Cup team down in Limerick with the ADSL. You played? I played, yeah. I played in goal. It's actually, I claimed the fame and played in the semi-final of the Kennedy Cup final and I referee to Kennedy Cup final a few years later. That's when I claimed the fame. But I, by the I remember sitting in the house in Limerick and he was telling us his poems. speaker-0: Yeah. The Pawns, speaker-1: Big, big interport. You sit down and they tell you, I'm convinced you never knew anybody's name, it was always you blaggard. they sit down and they tell you their stories and they tell you their lovely poems. But Jesus, my God, that fella was everywhere. Matches, referee and football, everything. He was a great inspiration for us. speaker-0: Growing up then, you said, the chairman role you stepped into, that was a very young position. It's not only a chairman, you're a leader. And you take serious interest in your leadership positions. So what has being a leader taught you in life in general, not just football? speaker-1: Well I think in terms of the branch, I took over as a young, very young chairman but I have to say I probably had good people around me in terms of the branch and I good people I always went to for a voice if I needed it. A good leader is not, in my opinion, a good leader is you can't do everything yourself. You have to listen to people, listen to the experienced people and listen to the people that want you to achieve and want you to do well. But then obviously there's people out there that doesn't want you to do well and they'll always give you a voice. speaker-0: See you. speaker-1: But what I found as a chairman is to communicate to the members, just be open. All the members want to do is, all the members want to be is want you to be open to them, to be honest and to be transparent. That's it. speaker-0: Yeah, that's true. You learned a lot in your journey as well. I could ask you thousand questions but the one question on a lighter note, what would you tell a 19 year old you? speaker-1: Jesus, by God. I'm close to 19 now. Jesus, I can't even drink anymore. Brutal. 19 year old me, probably around 19 I was probably on the right track. 18, 19, matter of course, was around 19, I was on the right track but made a few good mistakes in Made a mistake in 19. Top of the lid. speaker-0: We'll go for four points. speaker-1: I just said to if had to say to myself, if looking back at 19, you trip me up on this one, looking back at 19, I would say, cop on the fuck. Get yourself back on track. speaker-0: Okay. What age did join the Army at? So you had your head together with the Army-wise. Yeah. So at 19... speaker-1: I was in the Army in 19, was in the Army, like, at 19, I was young. Just made mistakes, just made mistakes at the time. speaker-0: We're all now like what you're young and empty. Did you think you'd be where you are now at 19, or did you think this far ahead of you? speaker-1: To be honest with you, at 19 I actually taught, and that's probably my mistake at time, probably taught I was going to go places and I probably thought I was going to get something that, I thought I had it. been cocky about it and went down the wrong road for a short period of time. Not in terms of ending personal life but made a poor decision. speaker-0: Yeah, it's important to know that you make your own mistakes and you're never going to always think you're perfect and you have to learn from your mistakes. I'm not going to bring up the football issue you spoke about but if you're on a game and you make a mistake, how do you fix it? You've only got a few seconds to fix it. speaker-1: Yeah, in a game they can make a mistake. But you know what the biggest thing I find in games, if people make a mistake in a game, they realise they've made a mistake. They dwell on it too long. then they make one mistake, which is the two mistakes, two mistakes with the three mistakes. If you, in your opinion, make a mistake in a game, you have to pack it and move on. You can't fix it. You can't fix the past. And I'm a believer in that in life. I'm believer in whatever's in the past is in the past. Like I'm living in the present now. I can only fix... speaker-0: Because as you said, we all do. speaker-1: what I'm doing next, or now or next. I can't fix what I've done or what happened in the past. The same happens in a match. The minute you blow the whistle, time is one thing, you don't get back. So once you make that mistake, you've made that mistake. But dwelling in a situation in the game, you have to park it and move on. I always say, cross the bridge when you come to it. That's it. speaker-0: Yeah. Now that the factors are 38, what is your plan, what is your goal now? speaker-1: Okay, so in terms of refereeing, I want to be the best referee I possibly can. In terms of everything else, I want to be just the best person I can be. ⁓ That's it, just to the best person I can be. speaker-0: A lot of people have really good qualities to say about you because all you do is help them out. You know, as I said, you're a motivator, you're an inspiration to a lot of people, but no one else really knows the real way that it takes and for the last few minutes I'm trying to get as much out of you as I can, but your personal life, your family life, your football, it's a huge balance, Declan. You balance it off. speaker-1: At the minute I'm promoted and work and I'm working between Ait Lóin and Dublin at the moment with the Army and then refereeing anywhere in the country and then try to do the podcast and try to my own life. It's very very hard to balance it but I'm in a unique position about training. At my job I'm allowed to train during work. speaker-0: Happy days. speaker-1: I always look at people that actually have to work proper jobs. speaker-0: I have a proper job. I truck in, I do my job, and truck out with you coming in and go training. speaker-1: Now like builders, look at builders, there people that are commuting to work every day, like they're on the road, they don't get work training until 9 o'clock at night. If you walk around town at 9 o'clock at night to people who training, the gyms are busy. I look at that, I look back at myself and say, you've no excuse, Dicky, to say you don't have time to Like you've probably seen me marathon training times, I go up at 5 o'clock in the morning and do my long runs. That's time. speaker-0: Yeah. That's the life you live, that's the look of having a part-time job at the army. speaker-1: I wasn't so hearty. No, but it's your time. I find getting up early in the morning, training, and then I have to go to Dublin, I have to go to Dublin, but I get up training and do it early. speaker-0: No one's going do it for you, you have to do it yourself. You're not going to let anybody else get you fit. Someone's to help you along and show you what to do, but you've got to go and do it. And you're a drill for that. You just love doing it. speaker-1: But I don't want people to come up with this thinking that Jesus, he's best things are sliced and bread. Jesus Christ, I'm out of fucking help with mistakes. The reason I've done this, reason I'm, I am actually a private person. I actually am, I don't telling my story. I don't like talking about what I've achieved. Barred tea when I slag you the whole time. But I actually don't like talking about it. I actually don't like talking about... what I've done in referee and I've done in personal life or what I've achieved in the Army or what I've done in the Midlands stuff. But I'd like to, I've made lots of mistakes but I'm happy for the achievements I've made, absolutely, but we've made lots of mistakes along the way. But I think that's human. think people, someone texted me yesterday and I was telling him I was doing the story and he was like, ⁓ I'm definitely listening to this one. And I said, this fella wouldn't text me for about three months. He wouldn't text me, very very seldom text me. And I just text him back, who's this? No one who it was. And he texts back his name and I was like, well sorry, I haven't heard you in a long time and you want to hear my story. So I said, what's your story? And he never texts back. speaker-0: Sorry. ⁓ But this is a great platform for stories to squeeze as much knowledge as you can of people and I know that's your intention with this show but what does the whole podcast mean to you? speaker-1: Yeah, so as I said to you before, the reason why I think a lot of people come out with a shout when they start talking. Like the first time, like I'm used to standing up in a class environment and teaching, teaching, that's my job, teaching, But to come on a screen and talk or one on one with people, like I think it can be nerve-racking. I think if someone has said to me, and you're now the chairman of the branch and people will come to you at times and tell you situations that they're in, they might tell you stories. ⁓ this has happened or whatever. But I find, I work, I actually find that I can be an arsehole times, obviously at my job, but can be an open book. I think I'm very, very good at active listening. Like there's one thing listening, but active listening. Sorry, bit of a head call. speaker-0: Climb through drains again, they're great. speaker-1: I don't I haven't fucked all actually this week. Yeah, so the podcast to me is a platform for someone just to come on and let loose. So if someone could spend 20 minutes talking, it might make them feel better. There might be, someone might be listening or watching here and thinking, like for next week, Tony, Tony's gonna talk about his ADHD, he's gonna talk about his fire service, joining the fire service, being a paramedic. speaker-0: Yep. speaker-1: and the challenges he's placed. That story is amazing. I know Tony a long time. I have another fellow on coming with Comeback as well, an entrepreneur left the guards, set up his own business. They're mad stories, they're great stories. speaker-0: They're in all 20 pretty ways. Yeah, the stories were really good because I would think I was the first interviewer that you had on your podcast and you wouldn't believe the amount of calls and texts I got just because of this. I've inspired some people, which is wonderful. speaker-1: Yeah. Yeah. But you, was, even for that day, that was emotional because I'm a friend of yours. It was very, very emotional for both of us. I remember, I actually remember, and don't mind me bringing it back up, Brian, and we talk about my story and we're talking some other bit about your story. That's probably one thing I probably regret as well, and I probably never said it to you. The day you were in hospital, the days you were in hospital, I never visited you. speaker-0: very tough day. Didn't need to see it. speaker-1: That hit me, that actually hit me only a few weeks ago. After the conversation. That I actually never went to see you in the hospital. I know Billy was young and Michaela, everything was a situation we were going through at time. I think that was my biggest regret. One of my biggest regrets is not to go see you. I know I wasn't communicating with you the whole time but not actually go up to see you. I don't think it, to be honest with I don't think I thought at the time it was as serious as it was. Is that easy to say? I think it was because we were having a conversation and the night we were in the hospital I was on the way to match and I was slagging it for not going to toilet. And I went for an ambulance, said, go here, I'll ball it to you, was not an issue. I think that was because I processed it, they'd given medication, they'd be granted to not, to the extent it was and I'm sorry for that. speaker-0: I'm just Yeah, yeah. Lumbar roast. Yeah, you gave me an eye for that. Don't feel bad, Dech, don't feel bad. Look, every time we talk, it's nothing but banter. But we've only ever had two straight conversations. One was my first interview and now it's this opportunity to talk to you. I'm just trying to get what Dechid Holland is. speaker-1: Yeah, I, Deccy Toland, Jesus, we talked about the last 40, 50 minutes, Jesus, nearly 55 minutes actually. I try to be, I want, someone turns back, well I'm at your age, 70, and says, what has... Can I... If someone says to me at 70 and says, are you happy with your life? Yes, I'm happy with my life. Good. I'm happy for what I achieved in my life. I'm happy I made mistakes in my life and overcame them. speaker-0: safe fuck off. speaker-1: I'm happy the route went down and I'm happy for no matter where the refereeing takes me or where any takes me in life, I'm happy. speaker-0: Good. And as you said, we're at this 58 minutes now. Before we go, will you just give a final description of who and what you are and if you can inspire someone and tell them not to go down that road. Be the best you can be. speaker-1: So as I said I could have went down a very very bad route and it's mad you you anyway listen anybody actually knows me probably knows the route we could have went down and some of my friends you see them on the street some of my friends are probably on death's door at this day it's like so like I'm I want someone that's probably in the same situation that I find something you like doing so there's always someone there to talk to. There's always someone who wants to help you but the problem with people in that situation, you either want to help or you don't want to help or they might say to you, I want to help but they don't really want to help. But if you want to help with that situation and you want to achieve your goals, that's mad to say. Stick in school. If you want to go on the refereeing route, get a beginners course done. Surprised what referee does to you. Get into a group, get into something. Yes, you'll have challenges in life, you'll over- but the best... Everybody makes mistakes, it's the best thing for mistakes, you have to learn from them move on. The biggest thing, if you make a mistake twice, then it's your fault. Try to achieve the best you can. In any job, in my job, ⁓ in the Army, I want to be the best person, I want to achieve the highest rank I want to get at. speaker-0: Great. speaker-1: But I want to do it in a way that I don't step on people. I want to do it the way I respect people. In every job, people can step on people to get to what they want. Same in refereeing, same in anything. I want someone to say that Dickey is honest. He tells me he's honest. Sometimes you have to have them awkward conversations and say, here, you're fucked up here. ⁓ I had them conversations many times. But if you want to be the best person, You want to be honest. Just be honest. That's the biggest thing. Don't be a dickhead. If you're a young referee coming up, understand that just because you're referee doesn't mean that you're the most important person on the pitch. The best referees on the pitch are usually the most quietest people on the pitch. speaker-0: True words, if any young, inspired referee needs to see how a referee treats players, treats the laws of the game, in my opinion, this is going to you. speaker-1: Yeah, well I'm a believer in society. I'm a big believer in joining society, into the local branches if you want to be a young referee. I'm definitely a believer in getting into a branch because if you're in a branch, you're around good people, you're around experienced people, you're around people that want the branch to achieve, that want to get to the high, the branch to do well, but they also want the referees to do well. ⁓ So definitely... ⁓ You can touch base with me on anything you want but touch base with yourself or any experienced referee in your area. But the biggest thing is you have to make sure that they have the right goals for you in mind. speaker-0: Because refereeing for young people, they don't see the love for it yet. But it's a huge career. It's not just a game on a Saturday or Sunday. It's a 24-7 thing. And when a person gets started as young as you and has the love for this for you, can, I won't say rule the world, but they can be who they want to be. Just like what you did. And it's taken over people's lives as a love of a career, which is fabulous. speaker-1: There's great opportunities for referees out there now, both male and female. There's great opportunities out there. And any young people out there that even half-thinking about wanting to be a referee, don't think anymore, just go and do it. speaker-0: do it because now that you've gone from the chairman role to the FAI ever and the younger development leagues it's a structure of under 15s, 17s, 19s and you're also the allocator. speaker-1: Yeah, like, when I started out we only had like five or six in the area, now we've 12. We've good referees there and it again is up to referees that want to get the best out of each other. Want to get the best, like you see the games that they're getting, so yeah. speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah, because it's not just going down to a local football pitch down the side of the morning. These young referees are getting opportunities in the Lone Town Stadium to go over to Longford. Longford Stadium is very, very good over there. And for young referees to get opportunities to ref in the League of Ireland development leagues. It's fabulous for a young referee because once you open that door, there's so many doors that will open for you. speaker-1: And they like let school of excellence as good lads in the school of I run in the school of accent So if you want to achieve to get higher in refereeing as good lads just run the school of excellence and all that stuff like so That's it speaker-0: Yeah and I think I've another question but before I do go I just gonna be honest with you that you're probably the most amazing individual I've met. Some days I regret it but some days I don't. But you've been a true inspiration. You're one of the most honest trustworthy loyal friends and I appreciate your friendship. I'll psych him off afterwards but that's being honest. speaker-1: I didn't pay you to say that either did I? No, Thanks very much for coming on to a special episode with me. It's my story. I'm actually going to have you on the next few times again. I'm going to put you live on here. Once a month we'll have a bit of a banter about what's happening in football as you're a branch chairman. It's going to live on YouTube once a month. We'll in few different referees with us to talk. Not just referees but any situation. speaker-0: So can I slide? I have to be nice to you? Lovely, I'll take that. speaker-1: Yeah, so you're for that. Thanks very much, man. speaker-0: I'm up for that.