Latest / Podcast Extra Anormal / viajé hasta un bosque de méxico en busca de BRUJAS NAHUALES

Transcript

viajé hasta un bosque de méxico en busca de BRUJAS NAHUALES · Podcast Extra Anormal

0:01
Speaker 1: Not only women, there were men too. There were meetings,
0:06
Speaker 1: which today is known as Kelarres, of which there were
0:09
Speaker 1: specific dates. And those dates were taxed. They taxed, they
0:15
Speaker 1: offered something. And usually, and I don't say it, it's
0:18
Speaker 1: in the Martillo de las Brujas, it's in other very
0:21
Speaker 1: old texts, where women sacrificed children. One thing is to
0:28
Speaker 1: be the Guanabí witch. Yo te tiro locos pocos,¿ no?
0:33
Speaker 1: Yo le llamo así locos pocos,¿ no? Y otra es
0:36
Speaker 1: la bruja, una criatura de la noche. Fíjense cómo lo
0:40
Speaker 1: estoy diciendo.
0:41
Speaker 2: No lo dije mal. Criatura de la noche.¿ Por qué?
0:45
Speaker 2: Porque se crea per se en vivo.¿ Qué quiere decir esto?
0:51
Speaker 1: Que es una persona que por medio de rituales y
0:55
Speaker 1: por medio de.
0:57
Speaker 2: Muchos es conocido como el paganismo,¿ no?
1:01
Speaker 1: And Valpurgis can be represented as a woman, as a man,
1:05
Speaker 1: as whatever. Valpurgis is an essence that feeds on children. Ok.
1:10
Speaker 2: And do you know what date it.
1:14
Speaker 1: Is?
1:14
Speaker 2: October 30th of April.
1:16
Speaker 1: And suddenly we even went back and I said, no,
1:21
Speaker 1: wait for me, how?
1:22
Speaker 2: Let's see, wait for me.
1:23
Speaker 1: It has coordination with the animal, with the animal. Well,
1:27
Speaker 1: we are all involved. Llega el que nos está esperando.
1:33
Speaker 1: Estoy omitiendo nombres.¿ Puedo revelarlo? Y me dice, justo estás
1:38
Speaker 1: viendo la vinculación con el amigo.
1:56
Speaker 2: Hello, how are you, friends?
1:57
Speaker 3: Welcome to another chapter of Extra Anormal Podcast. My name
2:01
Speaker 3: is Paco Arias and I am very happy to be
2:03
Speaker 3: here with all of you again. This occasion is a
2:07
Speaker 3: truly special occasion because.
2:10
Speaker 4: I am with one of the extra mega paranormal people.
2:14
Speaker 2: De todo México.
2:16
Speaker 4: El día de hoy me acompaña el señor Antonio Zamudio.
2:19
Speaker 2: Cómo estás, Antonio? Mi queridísimo Paco, un honor y un
2:22
Speaker 2: verdadero privilegio que vengan hasta acá. Muchas gracias. A hacer
2:26
Speaker 2: este podcast. Muchas gracias.
2:28
Speaker 3: Para la gente, Zamudio, que no te ubica, cuéntanos quién
2:32
Speaker 3: eres y a qué te dedicas, porque cuando se den
2:34
Speaker 3: cuenta quién está conmigo, tremendo monstruo, ahorita.
2:39
Speaker 1: Van a ver. Who does not locate the Mexican Research
2:42
Speaker 1: Agency Paranormal, they are living under.
2:44
Speaker 2: The stones, damn it. Exactly.
2:47
Speaker 1: Well, indeed, I am an investigator, I am already 27
2:50
Speaker 1: years old in the area, I am the founding president
2:53
Speaker 1: of the Mexican Research Agency Paranormal and we are the
2:58
Speaker 1: first organization of research, classification and evidence of phenomena. When
3:03
Speaker 1: I talk about the first organization, Hablo de la, estamos
3:08
Speaker 1: hablando del siglo XXI, siglo XX, siglo XXI. De alguna
3:13
Speaker 1: forma somos un equipo, un colectivo de expertos en distintas áreas,
3:21
Speaker 1: de los cuales nos gusta el tema, evidentemente nos apasiona,
3:25
Speaker 1: y lo que queremos es mostrar realmente lo que significa
3:29
Speaker 1: un fenómeno paranormal.
3:31
Speaker 2: Nunca estamos liados a que nos crean.
3:35
Speaker 1: Because suddenly there are many people who say, ah, I
3:37
Speaker 1: don't believe him.
3:40
Speaker 2: I'm honest. Sorry to tell you, I'm very brutally honest.
3:45
Speaker 1: So I never originated this organism to say, I want
3:52
Speaker 1: to make everyone see us and tell us, ah, they
3:56
Speaker 1: are the investigators that all of Mexico expected. No. We
4:00
Speaker 1: are the first in these times. But we are the
4:04
Speaker 1: second in Mexico.
4:05
Speaker 2: Wow.
4:06
Speaker 1: The second in Mexico because the first, I'm going to
4:09
Speaker 1: give you a historical fact that many times, some know it,
4:12
Speaker 1: others don't.
4:14
Speaker 2: Know it, others had no idea.
4:16
Speaker 1: The first to evaluate the psychic investigation in Mexico is
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Speaker 1: nothing more and nothing less than Francisco Ignacio Madero.
4:24
Speaker 2: Wow. The revolutionary. Why do you say that?
4:28
Speaker 1: Porque él hizo muchos estudios en Francia y gracias a.
4:33
Speaker 2: Esos estudios, pues sí conoció la doctrina de Allan Kardec.
4:38
Speaker 1: Allan Kardec, para quien no lo sepa, es el padre
4:40
Speaker 1: del espiritismo, es como conocemos el espiritismo.
4:43
Speaker 2: Entonces, él funda la Asociación de Investigación Psíquica de Coahuila. Ok.
4:50
Speaker 1: Si estoy un poquito mal en el nombre, de repente
4:53
Speaker 1: se me olvida alguna palabra, pero es Investigación psíquica.
4:57
Speaker 2: Entonces, Madero era un medium de escribiente.¡ Guau! Tremendo. Sí, sí, sí.
5:04
Speaker 1: Entonces, para nosotros es un balbarte, no solamente por ser
5:07
Speaker 1: un revolucionario, sino también por llegar a México con.
5:13
Speaker 2: Esta revolución espírita. Estuvo muy, muy underground.
5:17
Speaker 1: Entonces, para nosotros es el primer organismo y la agencia
5:21
Speaker 1: es prácticamente el segundo.
5:22
Speaker 2: El segundo.
5:23
Speaker 4: Guau!
5:24
Speaker 3: Flota, no se vayan, quédense hasta el final, porque los
5:27
Speaker 3: temas que vamos ahorita a hablar van a ser de
5:30
Speaker 3: suma importancia, porque el día de hoy, como ustedes lo
5:32
Speaker 3: acaban de ver, yo traigo varias preguntas, la verdad, te
5:36
Speaker 3: soy honesto, traje bastantes preguntas, porque dentro de este lado,
5:41
Speaker 3: aquí en el canal, he platicado con mucha gente que
5:43
Speaker 3: ha tenido infinidad de experiencias, pero qué buena suerte el
5:48
Speaker 3: tener un experto que me pueda decir,¿ sabes qué?
5:50
Speaker 2: Esto es por esto, porque.
5:52
Speaker 3: Algo que yo escuché mucho hace unos días que estuvimos
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Speaker 3: también platicando es que del 100% de fenómenos paranormales, no
5:59
Speaker 3: todos son reales.
6:00
Speaker 4: O sea, eso es de ley. Tú decías algo muy importante.
6:03
Speaker 3: Los videos que estás viendo en TikTok, los videos que
6:05
Speaker 3: estás viendo en YouTube, casi en su mayoría, un 99.9%
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Speaker 3: son falsos. Pero realmente existen aquellos que son sumamente reales
6:15
Speaker 3: y que si se puede que nos puedas mostrar algunos
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Speaker 3: para que la gente también los pueda ver.
6:18
Speaker 2: Sí, claro.
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Speaker 4: Y se den cuenta donde sí hay falsos.
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Speaker 3: A 100% real evidence that has already passed through a
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Speaker 3: check of experts where different tests have already been carried
6:28
Speaker 3: out to do it, you will see that there is
6:31
Speaker 3: no trick, it.
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Speaker 4: Is not modified in any.
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Speaker 3: Software, there is nothing, that is, it is really something
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Speaker 3: 100% native, recorded in a camera where they are capturing
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Speaker 3: real evidence that is paranormal. So family, before, if you
6:45
Speaker 3: are not subscribed, I invite you to subscribe to the channel,
6:47
Speaker 3: activate the bell because this is extremely interesting. Look at
6:51
Speaker 3: I have a question that I ask a lot of people,
6:53
Speaker 3: but I'm going to feel offended if I do it
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Speaker 3: to you, because I always tell people if they believe
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Speaker 3: in the paranormal.
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Speaker 2: Okay.
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Speaker 3: I'm going to go ahead with the question. Here the
7:03
Speaker 3: question would be, what made you believe in this? It's
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Speaker 3: that I'm.
7:08
Speaker 1: Going to give you a discernment there. The paranormal phenomenon,
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Speaker 1: for all people to know, is not belief.
7:16
Speaker 2: Watch out for that. Notice how I'm telling you. Okay.
7:22
Speaker 1: Well, that something happens to me and I say, I
7:24
Speaker 1: think something happened to me, because at the moment of
7:26
Speaker 1: the dialectic itself to say I think, is that I
7:30
Speaker 1: am supposing, there is a speculation.
7:33
Speaker 2: Yes.
7:33
Speaker 1: However, when we have an organism that we begin to
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Speaker 1: carry out methodology, we begin to apply certain hypotheses and, well,
7:42
Speaker 1: all the deep context of a research where it involves
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Speaker 1: scientific research, is when you reach the point of confirmation.
7:52
Speaker 2: Yes. So it's not a belief. It's a fact. It's
7:55
Speaker 2: a fact. Exactly.
7:57
Speaker 1: So that's why I always tell you, paranormal investigation is
8:00
Speaker 1: not a belief, it's an investigation.
8:03
Speaker 3: Within all these investigations, tell us which was one of
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Speaker 3: the ones that even you, being already an expert in
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Speaker 3: the matter, has caused you, I don't know, some feeling,
8:13
Speaker 3: not to say fear, but yes, like you say, man,
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Speaker 3: I respect this a lot.
8:16
Speaker 1: Well, look... Evidentemente respetas desde el punto de vista de testigo,¿ no?
8:25
Speaker 1: Siempre somos como muy responsables de tomar un caso.
8:31
Speaker 2: Para nosotros un caso.
8:32
Speaker 1: En evidencia es de suma importancia el individuo receptor, en
8:36
Speaker 1: este caso el testigo, el que está presenciando los hechos,
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Speaker 1: el que de alguna forma vive los fenómenos,¿ no? Más
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Speaker 1: allá del fantasma, el espíritu, como quieras verlo, para nosotros
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Speaker 1: es parte de la consecuencia del receptor.
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Speaker 2: Ok.
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Speaker 1: Y no quiere decir estrechamente que ese receptor esté mintiendo.
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Speaker 2: Sí.
8:56
Speaker 1: Nuestro trabajo es saber que no se está mintiendo a
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Speaker 1: sí mismo, por ejemplo,¿ no?
8:59
Speaker 2: Ok.
9:00
Speaker 1: Nuestro trabajo es tener un discernimiento lógico para que en
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Speaker 1: su mente no le afecte del todo.
9:06
Speaker 2: Sí. Porque yo lo comenté, hace poco.
9:10
Speaker 1: Tuvimos una grabación, Paco estuvo con nosotros en una grabación
9:13
Speaker 1: con Jordi Rosado.
9:14
Speaker 2: Y yo lo comenté en el panel.
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Speaker 1: Dije, es más feo para una persona que lo vive.
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Speaker 1: O sea, una persona testigo no está como muy animada
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Speaker 1: para decirte, yo a mí me pasó, yo les platico.
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Speaker 2: No es cierto. La persona que lo vive, lo que
9:30
Speaker 2: menos quiere es recordarlo.
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Speaker 3: Claro, porque algo que yo te decía incluso es que,
9:35
Speaker 3: A veces esto te genera un trauma tan fuerte. O
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Speaker 3: sea que el hecho de recordarlo ya te está generando
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Speaker 3: también otra vez volver a vivir y revivir los sentimientos.
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Speaker 4: Y es algo que yo siempre se lo he dicho
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Speaker 4: a la gente. Hablar de fantasmas, sí, suena.
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Speaker 2: Muy cool,¿ no?
9:50
Speaker 4: Está chido el espíritu y el espectro.
9:53
Speaker 3: Pero realmente vivir una experiencia real es algo que.
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Speaker 2: Sí.¿ Y sabes por qué?
9:50
Speaker 3: It's cool, the spirit and the spectrum. But really, living
9:54
Speaker 3: a real experience is something that.
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Speaker 2: Yes.
9:57
Speaker 3: And you know why?
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Speaker 1: It's not cool, it's traumatic, it's dramatic, and not only
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Speaker 1: for the receptor individual, but for all the people around him.
10:07
Speaker 2: Yes. I mean, no, no, no, it's not a horror story, guys, really, I....
10:14
Speaker 1: I respect a lot of the channels that talk about this,
10:17
Speaker 1: but above all, I am very emphatic in saying, okay,
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Speaker 1: explain a little more.
10:21
Speaker 2: Yes.
10:22
Speaker 1: Because maybe the context of saying, I'm going to tell
10:25
Speaker 1: you a ghost story, because it attracts many people.
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Speaker 2: Of course. It is very evident, because.
10:30
Speaker 1: The people who are sitting on their computer, on their device,
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Speaker 1: and they are listening, they think.
10:35
Speaker 2: It's a story that maybe can be fiction, and no.
10:39
Speaker 2: Of course.
10:40
Speaker 1: Because if they lived it in their shoes, believe me.
10:43
Speaker 1: Que ni siquiera estuvieran ni cinco minutos escuchándose.
10:46
Speaker 4: Y sabes cuál es el colmo?
10:48
Speaker 3: Hay gente que me dice, Paco, he hecho de todo
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Speaker 3: para vivir algo paranormal porque nunca me ha pasado nada.
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Speaker 2: Y no le va a pasar nada a esa persona.
10:55
Speaker 3: Y me ha dicho, ya jugué la ouija, el juego
10:58
Speaker 3: de los tres reyes, ya hice una invocación frente al espejo,
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Speaker 3: puse velas. Y mi única respuesta es, hermano, si no
11:05
Speaker 3: te ha pasado nada, créeme que eres afortunado.
11:08
Speaker 2: A ver, insisto, yo siempre lo pongo en la mesa.
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Speaker 1: La mayor parte del punto porcentual más alto de nuestras
11:17
Speaker 1: investigaciones y de los casos son personas que.
11:21
Speaker 2: No quieren saber ya del tema.
11:24
Speaker 1: A ver, algo tan sencillo, así como en tu canal
11:29
Speaker 1: o en nuestro canal de YouTube, también pueden ahí suscribirse
11:32
Speaker 1: a Gentes de Negro. o en mi paranormal de los
11:35
Speaker 1: agentes de negro. Nos subimos casi testigos. Apenas estamos armando.
11:40
Speaker 1: Yo estoy dando, fíjense, años después. Por ejemplo, hay casos
11:44
Speaker 1: que tenemos desde el año 2006 y estoy en pláticas
11:48
Speaker 1: con las personas que ya evolucionaron ese proceso, ese trauma.
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Speaker 4: Ese trauma,¿ no?
11:53
Speaker 1: Y nosotros tenemos materiales de las video entrevistas. Entonces, apenas
11:57
Speaker 1: estoy acercándome con ellos para decirles, oye,¿ cómo ves?
12:01
Speaker 2: Me autorizas? revelar tu caso. Sí. Y me ha costado,¿ eh? Créanme.
12:07
Speaker 3: Sí, es que son cosas que guardan muy en el
12:09
Speaker 3: fondo de su ser, o sea, lo encajonan y es
12:12
Speaker 3: un lugar donde no quieren ni siquiera volver a pensarlo. Entonces,
12:15
Speaker 3: cuando se viven ese tipo de experiencias, es muy traumático,
12:19
Speaker 3: pero yo tengo una duda.
12:21
Speaker 4: La gente aquí del canal ya.
12:22
Speaker 3: Conoce mi historia que pasó, mi vivencia, que ya te
12:26
Speaker 3: conté también que pasó con los cuadros. Me llamó mucho
12:28
Speaker 3: la atención algo que me dijiste.¿ Tienes los cuadros?¿ Por qué?
12:31
Speaker 1: Ajá. Yes, what happens is that for us, one, the
12:35
Speaker 1: experience of the person is the main thing. Of course,
12:38
Speaker 1: from my point of view as an expert, I tell
12:40
Speaker 1: you from the area of the research trench, you
12:42
Speaker 1: are not affected. No, I mean, it is clear to
12:45
Speaker 1: me that it happened, it got you out of the way,
12:48
Speaker 1: it was fortuitous. Yes. As our dear friend and colleague
12:51
Speaker 1: would say, I send a greeting to Pedro Amorós from Spain,
12:54
Speaker 1: a great researcher, also Valuarte, he said the phenomenon usually
13:00
Speaker 1: has the three Cs, ephemeral, esporádico y efímero esporádico. Oh,
13:07
Speaker 1: sí me olvidó la otra. Luego me voy a recordar durante,
13:10
Speaker 1: perdóname Pedro, la clase. No, no, no, es un gran
13:15
Speaker 1: amigo y colega, pero es un tipo que yo leí
13:18
Speaker 1: mucho cuando estaba chavo,¿ sabes?
13:20
Speaker 2: O sea, tuve la oportunidad de entrevistarlo.
13:23
Speaker 1: Y de verdad, pues si es cuando dices, wey, esa
13:26
Speaker 1: es la cara de la investigación que yo lo leía
13:29
Speaker 1: en una revista que se llama Año Cero, que se
13:31
Speaker 1: llama Año Cero.
13:32
Speaker 2: Entonces, este, bueno, no me quiero desviar.
13:36
Speaker 1: Bueno, la persona que vive un fenómeno fortuito, que es
13:40
Speaker 1: justamente lo que estábamos hablando de efímero y esporádico, simplemente
13:44
Speaker 1: le sucedió, no se, pues bueno, no se enganchó del todo.
13:48
Speaker 2: Tal vez sí, tal vez dices.
13:49
Speaker 1: Bueno, mi experiencia sí no tiene una explicación y sí
13:51
Speaker 1: me sacó de onda. But it doesn't affect you.
13:54
Speaker 2: Of course.
13:55
Speaker 1: It's different, it cuts to the person who constantly lives
14:00
Speaker 1: besotted by a phenomenon that cannot be explained.
14:04
Speaker 3: Those are the marks that people sometimes carry throughout their lives.
14:08
Speaker 1: Totally, because imagine, you, for example, you and I are
14:11
Speaker 1: talking here, if I had a phenomenon of this kind
14:13
Speaker 1: and I was affected, I would say, I'm going to
14:17
Speaker 1: talk about this and at night this.
14:19
Speaker 2: Guy is not going to be there. at night I
14:22
Speaker 2: will be alone with.
14:23
Speaker 1: That thing and you come back again to bring and
14:26
Speaker 1: evidently my mind begins to travel and say if that
14:29
Speaker 1: night there was no manifestation because I am segregating enough
14:33
Speaker 1: energy for that spiritual entity that is making connection connection
14:38
Speaker 1: with me and that made a match so to speak
14:42
Speaker 1: so that they understand it is an entity begins to
14:44
Speaker 1: manifest and tries to make match with the person receiver
14:48
Speaker 1: ok if the person receiver simply does not peel it Sema,
14:52
Speaker 1: I've said it banally. How can you avoid this? Don't
14:56
Speaker 1: fight it, period. But if there are cases like the
15:01
Speaker 1: videos that I'm going to show you here, which is
15:04
Speaker 1: the Poltergeist of the Narvarte, which are consecutive, day after day,
15:10
Speaker 1: night after night, and they are as forceful as the
15:13
Speaker 1: movement of objects in apparent reason, that person has nothing
15:17
Speaker 1: else to say but, Perch, what is this?
15:21
Speaker 4: What do you recommend to people who are living.
15:24
Speaker 3: Because a lot of people have written to me, and
15:26
Speaker 3: I take the opportunity to tell them, I'm not an
15:29
Speaker 3: expert to tell them, do this, do that, because believe me,
15:32
Speaker 3: a lot of people who do see the content and
15:34
Speaker 3: follow it, send me stories where currently, even in the
15:39
Speaker 3: title of the post, they put, help, please. So, I'm honest,
15:43
Speaker 3: I'm not an expert, I can't tell them, do this,
15:46
Speaker 3: because I'm really a person who likes to talk about
15:48
Speaker 3: the subject, who is passionate about this subject, But I'm
15:51
Speaker 3: not an expert, but you are. What can you recommend
15:54
Speaker 3: to someone who is experiencing paranormal harassment?
16:01
Speaker 1: Can I call it that? Yes, yes, yes, it is
16:04
Speaker 1: called harassment. Well, mainly in our case, when they approach
16:07
Speaker 1: the agency, we have to carry out a survey, an investigation,
16:13
Speaker 1: properly and very openly of.
16:16
Speaker 2: The phenomena of all.
16:18
Speaker 1: Entonces es una plática, es una plática, una dialéctica profunda
16:22
Speaker 1: del fenómeno que esa persona está viviendo.
16:25
Speaker 2: Sí.
16:26
Speaker 1: Para empezar y entender nosotros por dónde tenemos que hacer
16:30
Speaker 1: la asesoría, por dónde podemos apoyar o en qué sentido
16:33
Speaker 1: a nivel psicológico, psiquiátrico, podemos explicarlo. Entonces, esto de ayuda,
16:40
Speaker 1: necesito esto, eso no ayuda en nada, ni te va
16:43
Speaker 1: a ayudar a ti, ni nada ayuda. Como consejo y
16:46
Speaker 1: para el canal de YouTube de Paco y para nuestro
16:50
Speaker 1: inbox es, no me.
16:52
Speaker 2: Dice nada ayuda.
16:53
Speaker 1: Claro, prefiero que me digas, oye, yo tengo esto en
16:57
Speaker 1: mi casa, me pasa a tales horas de la noche.
16:59
Speaker 1: O sea, bien descriptivo, como dicen hoy los chavos.
17:03
Speaker 2: El contexto procedente. Eso de contexto tienes que decirlo.¿ Por qué?
17:08
Speaker 1: Porque no sabes si él tiene el tiempo de verlo,
17:11
Speaker 1: si yo tengo el tiempo de leerlo, y pueden pasar meses.
17:14
Speaker 2: Si hay una persona que de plano dice, ya no
17:18
Speaker 2: puedo más.
17:18
Speaker 1: Como nos ha tocado en los casos, nosotros tenemos nuestros
17:22
Speaker 1: números WhatsApp al público,¿ sabes? O sea, esa persona que
17:25
Speaker 1: sí necesita la ayuda, porque, ojo, hay muchos ahí afuera
17:29
Speaker 1: que quieren como ver.
17:30
Speaker 2: A ver qué onda.
17:30
Speaker 4: Sí, sí, sí, sí, aprovechan la ocasión.
17:33
Speaker 1: El clásico, güey, que dice, yo viví un fenómeno, brother, neta,
17:37
Speaker 1: o sea, te lo digo así, si lo viviera ni siquiera.
17:40
Speaker 2: Estuvieras hablándolo, claro, ni en un chat.
17:44
Speaker 1: Entonces, este, es clásico decir, yo quiero, porque quiero sondear,
17:48
Speaker 1: o quiero, no sé, igual hay gente ahí afuera que
17:51
Speaker 1: luego dice, no te creo, no, está bien, no me creas,
17:57
Speaker 1: no vamos a dejar de investigar por eso, no, entonces...
18:01
Speaker 1: Pero les digo de antemano, una persona real que tiene
18:04
Speaker 1: un fenómeno, lo que menos quiere es exponerse en un
18:09
Speaker 1: chat público.
18:11
Speaker 2: Ahí ya con eso los debatí.
18:13
Speaker 3: Por qué opinas que una persona puede vivir alguna experiencia paranormal?
18:19
Speaker 3: Porque algo que me gusta mucho de cómo lo manejas
18:23
Speaker 3: es que usas mucho la lógica, obviamente.
18:27
Speaker 2: Y la ciencia.
18:28
Speaker 3: O sea, no te quedas con el hecho de que No,
18:31
Speaker 3: pues el espíritu chocarrero, este, pues, o sea,¿ por qué
18:35
Speaker 3: pasa a veces esto que alguien empieza a vivir algo?
18:38
Speaker 1: Lo que pasa es que tienes que tener como todo
18:40
Speaker 1: el diagrama, todo el mapa, para que nosotros entendamos la
18:43
Speaker 1: psique de una persona, tenemos que hacer una lectura de
18:47
Speaker 1: todo su diagrama familiar, incluso. O sea, no solamente tu
18:51
Speaker 1: testimonial es importante, sino si tú se lo platicaste a
18:54
Speaker 1: tu mamá, a tu papá, a tu pareja, a tus amigos, anyway,
19:00
Speaker 1: Those people have to tell us exactly what you told them.
19:04
Speaker 1: And there are specifically questions that I ask. In my case,
19:10
Speaker 1: I studied psychology by academy. So a structural basis of
19:14
Speaker 1: parapsychology is conventional psychology.
19:17
Speaker 2: If you don't go through this science, you're not a parapsychologist.
19:21
Speaker 1: So you don't understand how you can make a dialectic
19:24
Speaker 1: with someone who is being perhaps tormented by their own
19:28
Speaker 1: nocturnal terrors, for example, or it may simply be that
19:32
Speaker 1: he lived an ephemeral phenomenon, sporadic, and fortuitous. I forgot
19:39
Speaker 1: the other E, but I put the F for fortuitous.
19:43
Speaker 1: So it's instantaneous, because you don't have an explanation and
19:46
Speaker 1: your life is normal.
19:47
Speaker 2: But there are people who get hooked on it, right?
19:50
Speaker 1: There are people who say I can no longer go
19:52
Speaker 1: through the corridor chin I turn off the light and
19:54
Speaker 1: I can no longer sleep with the light off because
19:57
Speaker 1: evidently there is something that happens in your psyche you
20:00
Speaker 1: did yes that so that I understand all the people
20:02
Speaker 1: is the psychology that we have your psychology in my
20:05
Speaker 1: psychology the ok this.
20:08
Speaker 2: Pues es lo mismo que pasa cuando ves una película
20:10
Speaker 2: de terror.
20:11
Speaker 4: Que te llegas también como a sugestionar.
20:13
Speaker 2: Totalmente. Eso se llama autosugestión. O simplemente te gustó. Claro.
20:18
Speaker 1: O sea, ese tipo de procesos químicos en tu cerebro,
20:22
Speaker 1: cuando tú estás viendo una película de terror, tú la
20:24
Speaker 1: estás viendo por voluntad.
20:25
Speaker 2: No te está obligando a ir. Porque te gusta.
20:27
Speaker 1: Exacto.
20:28
Speaker 2: Y si te gusta a ti el rush, el estrés,¿ no?
20:32
Speaker 1: No. Evidentemente, gozas esa película, aunque te dé miedo. Claro,
20:36
Speaker 1: seguramente trabaja en un call center, si le gusta.
20:38
Speaker 2: No, por ejemplo.
20:40
Speaker 1: Y esa sensación de miedo es agradable para las personas.
20:45
Speaker 1: Tal es el caso de las propias personas que van
20:47
Speaker 1: al tour insólito, por ejemplo. Al tour insólito, no vas
20:50
Speaker 1: a que te espantes, vas a que analices, pero les
20:52
Speaker 1: gusta ese tipo de sensaciones. Esas personas suelen tener enganches
20:57
Speaker 1: muy efímeros.
20:59
Speaker 2: Por ejemplo, llegas a tu casa después de la película
21:01
Speaker 2: de terror, Y las sueñas.
21:04
Speaker 1: O sueñas un acontecimiento específico o una escena específica.¿ Qué
21:08
Speaker 1: sucede con esos conceptos?
21:09
Speaker 2: Es cerebral.
21:11
Speaker 1: Aplicación total y absolutamente psicológica.
21:14
Speaker 2: Por qué?
21:15
Speaker 1: Porque al final del día, el cerebro te dice, ok,
21:17
Speaker 1: gozamos viendo la película.¿ Te gusta que te anden correteando
21:21
Speaker 1: con un cuchillo?
21:22
Speaker 2: Vamos a soñar que te corretean con un cuchillo.
21:25
Speaker 4: Sí, sí, sí.
21:26
Speaker 2: Yo tengo una duda que....
21:29
Speaker 4: They make me think at that moment.
21:30
Speaker 1: Wait a minute, but before I go in so that
21:31
Speaker 1: it doesn't stay live. Why did I explain this to you?
21:35
Speaker 1: That's the big difference between a person who, for example,
21:39
Speaker 1: the guy who told me that I.
21:40
Speaker 2: Already played, I already did.
21:41
Speaker 1: Well, in his life nothing is going to happen to
21:44
Speaker 1: him because in his brain there is a predisposition to
21:49
Speaker 1: look for a meeting that knows that the moment he
21:52
Speaker 1: has it, the less he expects.
21:54
Speaker 2: It, he goes away. Definitely.
21:58
Speaker 3: It happens like when they say that the bravest is
22:01
Speaker 3: the one who goes to the mere hour.
22:03
Speaker 2: I've always said something, look.
22:06
Speaker 3: A paranormal event, because people sometimes think this. No, it's
22:10
Speaker 3: that it has to be at 3 in the morning.
22:12
Speaker 3: It has to be on Friday or Friday 13 or Halloween.
22:16
Speaker 3: I've always said it. And the people who have been
22:19
Speaker 3: with me at the time, who have experienced a real
22:22
Speaker 3: paranormal experience. It was 12 o'clock in the morning. I
22:25
Speaker 3: was gazing. Tenía mi bebé en la cuna. Ahí es
22:31
Speaker 3: donde se presentó este fenómeno. Y de donde soy, que
22:35
Speaker 3: es más al sur, que es Oaxaca, la gente ahí
22:37
Speaker 3: habla mucho del fenómeno de los chaneques. Conocidos en algunas
22:42
Speaker 3: partes como aluches, como duendes. Es una parte, fíjate, que
22:45
Speaker 3: donde ya me di cuenta que es muy común que
22:49
Speaker 3: se roben a los niños. Tengo familia y tengo conocidos
22:54
Speaker 3: que han estado con nosotros en el podcast Que les
22:57
Speaker 3: han robado a sus hijos, fíjate.
22:58
Speaker 4: O sea,¿ cómo explicas eso?
23:00
Speaker 3: El más fuerte que ahorita me viene a la mente
23:01
Speaker 3: es de mi amigo Jaciel, que le mando un saludo,
23:03
Speaker 3: que ya estuvo con nosotros. Su bebé recién nacido, recién nacido,
23:08
Speaker 3: que no tenía ni, o sea, bebé que no levanta
23:09
Speaker 3: ni la cabecita.
23:11
Speaker 1: Ajá.
23:11
Speaker 3: En menos de 30 segundos, desaparece de la coma.
23:17
Speaker 2: Ok.
23:17
Speaker 3: Estando en una casa, siendo las 12 del día.
23:20
Speaker 4: Empiezan a buscar por todos lados.
23:23
Speaker 2: La niña no está.
23:24
Speaker 4: La niña no está.
23:25
Speaker 2: Llega él, se espanta.
23:26
Speaker 4: La puerta cerrada, la cuna no estaba nada.
23:30
Speaker 3: Un desastre. Pensando lo peor. Buscando,¿ sabes dónde estaba la bebé?
23:35
Speaker 4: Abajo de la cuna. O sea, abajo, con todo y almohadita.
23:39
Speaker 4: O sea, estaba en esta posición.
23:41
Speaker 2: Si la acomodaron, pues.
23:43
Speaker 4: Dice Paco, en ese.
23:44
Speaker 3: Momento mi esposa, yo, no tenemos ni pinche idea cómo
23:50
Speaker 3: una bebé atravesó la cuna con todo y almohada y
23:54
Speaker 3: estuvo ahí, incluso no se despertó.
23:56
Speaker 2: Claro.
23:57
Speaker 3: Entonces, lo que la familia dijo enseguida, hay que bautizar
24:01
Speaker 3: a la niña, hay que bautizar a la niña.
24:02
Speaker 2: Ya, ya, ya.
24:03
Speaker 4: Pero,¿ cómo es que pasa este fenómeno?
24:06
Speaker 1: A ver, de primera mano, también ojo, pues no voy
24:11
Speaker 1: a hablar de esas asociaciones, pero los delincuentes ocupan también
24:17
Speaker 1: las clásicas leyendas.
24:19
Speaker 2: Ok. O sea, es decir.
24:23
Speaker 1: For example, the people who get lost in the forest,
24:26
Speaker 1: mainly civil protection, the assembly, they have to do the
24:30
Speaker 1: search and the sweep until they find those people.
24:34
Speaker 2: But there are those who say, the forest took it away,
24:37
Speaker 2: the spirits of the forest.
24:38
Speaker 1: Well, be careful, because it can be hidden, it can
24:41
Speaker 1: be a screen of an organization, of a criminal organization,
24:45
Speaker 1: of a criminal organization that is subtracting tourists. Y pues
24:50
Speaker 1: les funciona este tema.
24:52
Speaker 2: De que, no, es la bruja, es el Nahual. Sí,
24:54
Speaker 2: ojo con eso. Se descarta primero esto.
24:57
Speaker 1: En el caso que me planteas, encontraron afortunadamente a la niña.
25:01
Speaker 2: Sí. O sea, a ver, nosotros hemos.
25:03
Speaker 1: Investigado tres casos de registro de brujas Nahuales en México,¿ no?
25:08
Speaker 2: Por ejemplo. Ok.
25:10
Speaker 4: Eso me interesa bastante porque es algo que le encanta
25:12
Speaker 4: aquí a las.
25:13
Speaker 2: Sí.
25:13
Speaker 4: Hablar de Nahuales, puta, les encanta.
25:16
Speaker 1: Sí. Bueno, uno de los casos más representativos de nosotros
25:20
Speaker 1: es la Bruja Nahual de Peñalobos, donde hay un registro
25:24
Speaker 1: en el Estado de México, en el poblado de Xiloxingo,
25:28
Speaker 1: que no data de ayer, o sea, te estoy hablando
25:31
Speaker 1: de cinco generaciones atrás, incluso un poco más atrás, donde
25:37
Speaker 1: se habla incluso de la época de la conquista, fíjense,¿ eh?
25:42
Speaker 2: Why do we have this information?
25:44
Speaker 1: Because we don't just go with the issue that, ok,
25:47
Speaker 1: here there are witches who steal children.
25:49
Speaker 2: Yes. That's why I said the quotation.
25:51
Speaker 1: There are utensils of rituals in certain specific areas of
25:55
Speaker 1: Peña de Lobos, Las Peñas, as it is due to
25:59
Speaker 1: a place that is known there, and the Centro Ceremonial Otomi.
26:02
Speaker 2: For example. So it starts to throw you as variants.
26:06
Speaker 1: Not only that children are robbed, there is a deep
26:09
Speaker 1: investigation in medieval times, mainly in Europe, where women, not
26:17
Speaker 1: only women, there were also men, there were meetings that
26:21
Speaker 1: today are known as calarres, of which there were specific dates,
26:25
Speaker 1: and those dates were taxed, they taxed, they offered something,
26:30
Speaker 1: and usually, and I don't say it, it's in the
26:33
Speaker 1: Martillo de las Brujas, It is in other very ancient
26:36
Speaker 1: texts where women sacrificed children. Well, they were a direct
26:41
Speaker 1: tribute to that pagan god called Baphomet, devil, demon, whatever
26:47
Speaker 1: you want to call it.
26:49
Speaker 2: That existed in the 16th and 17th centuries.
26:51
Speaker 1: We are not talking about something that is usually found.
26:53
Speaker 2: No, if there is data, it happened.
27:02
Speaker 1: Corte a, Giloxingo, decimos, ok, brujas en México, híjole, pues
27:07
Speaker 1: sí hay ahí en el mercado de Sonora,¿ no?
27:11
Speaker 2: O muchas ya en TikTok,¿ no? Ya muchos son brujas.
27:14
Speaker 2: Que te unes al en vivo y te leen el futuro. Sí,
27:18
Speaker 2: me he topado.
27:19
Speaker 1: Pero quiero marcar una diferencia, Paco. Una cosa es la
27:23
Speaker 1: bruja Guanaví, perdón, si piso callos, pues lo siento. Una
27:27
Speaker 1: cosa es ser la bruja Guanaví. Yo te tiro locos pocos.
27:32
Speaker 1: I call him like that, the little crazy and the
27:36
Speaker 1: other is the witch, a creature of the night. I
27:40
Speaker 1: don't know how I'm saying it, I didn't say it wrong.
27:42
Speaker 2: Creature of the night. Why?
27:45
Speaker 1: Because it is created in person, in vivo.
27:49
Speaker 2: What does this mean? What is a person?
27:53
Speaker 1: That through rituals and through what is often known as paganism,
27:58
Speaker 1: it is not confused with the Wicca.
28:00
Speaker 2: Look, it has nothing to do with the Wicca.
28:02
Speaker 4: I was thinking, in fact, precisely in the Wiccas.
28:05
Speaker 1: Well, it has its background, but that is a religion.
28:08
Speaker 1: What I am talking about is the true daughters of.
28:11
Speaker 2: that there were. Okay.
28:15
Speaker 1: I mean, I understand perfectly the historical concept of the
28:19
Speaker 1: Puritans at that time.
28:20
Speaker 2: Yes.
28:22
Speaker 1: And from the misogynistic religion as well. I can't go
28:25
Speaker 1: over it, but one thing is the screen of what
28:28
Speaker 1: I'm talking about, the legend of such and another thing
28:33
Speaker 1: is the reality. That is, if there were witches who
28:36
Speaker 1: were sinister and kidnapped children and sacrificed children as well.
28:41
Speaker 1: And if there was this connection or this communion with
28:45
Speaker 1: the pagan god, devil or demon, whatever, in tribute to. Yes.
28:50
Speaker 2: What did they offer them? Obviously, children.
28:53
Speaker 1: Yes. So, when you have a case, in the case
28:56
Speaker 1: of the agency, we go to a historical level, brother.
29:00
Speaker 2: As I am already mentioning. They review the whole experience.
29:03
Speaker 2: All the background. Let's see, ok. Why the Hilo-Xingo area?
29:05
Speaker 1: What does Hilo-Xingo have to do, what.
29:09
Speaker 2: Is special about Hilo-Xingo? Yes. And especially the Peña de
29:12
Speaker 2: Lobos Reserve.
29:13
Speaker 1: Well, the Peña de Lobos Reserve makes an electromagnetic vortex. Ok.
29:19
Speaker 1: which is Peña de Lobos, Las Peñas, as they call it,
29:24
Speaker 1: Las Peñas, which are some rocks there, and the Otomino
29:27
Speaker 1: Ceremonial Center. They make a triangulation and what is inside
29:31
Speaker 1: the triangle is the electromagnetic field, where everything happens, where
29:36
Speaker 1: the most underground is. And anyone who is an investigator
29:39
Speaker 1: will recognize that the concept of electromagnetism is very linked
29:43
Speaker 1: to the energies, absolutely.
29:44
Speaker 3: Do you consider that these, I'm not going to say
29:48
Speaker 3: the word, you just gave exactly the concept, these creatures
29:53
Speaker 3: of the night to this day exist?
29:55
Speaker 2: Tenemos registro. Sí. O sea, yo te hablo de una investigación,
29:59
Speaker 2: esto pasó en 2004. 2004.
30:00
Speaker 1: 2004 cuando nos enteramos. 2006 regresamos, 2008 regresamos, 2011 regresamos, 2015, 2016,
30:04
Speaker 1: apenas 2021 también regresamos.¿ Pero qué fue lo que pasó ahí?
30:08
Speaker 1: O sea, van, la ubican o platican con la gente
30:10
Speaker 1: que estuvo afectada. a very deep context, brother, that the
30:26
Speaker 1: truth is that we would not have time to talk
30:29
Speaker 1: about everything. I'm going to give you the summary, the
30:33
Speaker 1: general context, synthesized, very synthesized. I'm talking about the beginnings,
30:39
Speaker 1: Hilux 5. We are talking about the magnetic vortex that
30:43
Speaker 1: is made there. And a special night that they make
30:46
Speaker 1: in that area. They pay tribute to Valpurgis. Do you
30:52
Speaker 1: know who Valpurgis is?
30:55
Speaker 4: Quiero creer que es el nombre de algún ángel caído?
30:58
Speaker 2: Algún demonio? No.
31:00
Speaker 1: No.
31:02
Speaker 2: Falso.
31:04
Speaker 1: Está bien porque le estoy haciendo un cuestionamiento. Valpurgis es
31:10
Speaker 1: como una deidad, un dios pagano. Cuando hablo de paganismo,
31:15
Speaker 1: no estoy hablando de Wicca estrechamente, sino estamos hablando de
31:19
Speaker 1: un espíritu de la naturaleza que es mal. And Valpurgis
31:24
Speaker 1: can be represented as a woman, as a man, as whatever.
31:27
Speaker 2: Valpurgis is an essence that feeds on children.
31:31
Speaker 1: Ok.
31:31
Speaker 2: And do you know what date it is? October? April 30th. April. Uh, yeah.
31:41
Speaker 1: Ah, that is, many people then suddenly say, this day
31:44
Speaker 1: of the child, of the child, of the child. There
31:45
Speaker 1: is a lot, there is a lot of controversy that
31:49
Speaker 1: the day of the child was founded by an ex-Mexican president.
31:53
Speaker 2: No recuerdo quién, la verdad. Pero viene mucho más atrás. Sí.
31:58
Speaker 1: Nos estamos hablando del 30 de abril. Es el tributo
32:00
Speaker 1: a Valpurgis. Se alimenta de niños y, pues sí, la
32:04
Speaker 1: festividad 30 de abril, Día del Niño, hace que el
32:07
Speaker 1: adulto esté supervisando a los niños.
32:09
Speaker 2: Ok.
32:10
Speaker 4: Es que ese contexto oscuro me acaba de impresionar.
32:14
Speaker 3: O sea, realmente nunca lo imaginé precisamente del 30 de abril,
32:18
Speaker 3: que es un día muy representativo, al menos aquí en México,
32:20
Speaker 3: que es.
32:21
Speaker 2: Es que te vas encontrando como.
32:23
Speaker 1: Insisto, la investigación paranormal no es creencia, me creo que,
32:29
Speaker 1: por ejemplo, en el pueblo de Hiloximo, cuando fuimos a
32:31
Speaker 1: hacer levantamiento de testimoniales, hay un programa que nosotros hicimos
32:36
Speaker 1: en el 2011 justo, regresamos a Peña de Lobos y
32:39
Speaker 1: fuimos a recabar testimoniales y.
32:41
Speaker 2: La gente de ahí te habla, la gente adulta, la
32:43
Speaker 2: adulta mayor, la sabia.
32:45
Speaker 1: It talks about the witches, always the witches, the barbecues
32:49
Speaker 1: that took the children. I mean, they talk to you
32:53
Speaker 1: about the crazy people themselves, that the witches give the
32:56
Speaker 1: dream to pregnant women, for.
32:59
Speaker 2: Example, right? That's what you said.
33:01
Speaker 3: That says that the people who have had an experience
33:03
Speaker 3: that they say that it is true, that it gives
33:05
Speaker 3: them like a dream, that you sleep them. And the
33:07
Speaker 3: same people, the neighbors, hey, I mean, there's a roider
33:09
Speaker 3: and they... Like stones.
33:11
Speaker 1: That's what Locus Pocus says, but real. No, it's not
33:14
Speaker 1: the one of I'm going to keep you forever.
33:17
Speaker 2: No, those are bad.
33:17
Speaker 1: Sorry.
33:17
Speaker 2: What I'm talking about is great sorceresses.
33:19
Speaker 1: I'm talking about nocturnal creatures that with the passage of
33:25
Speaker 1: rituals and the passage of these tributes.
33:33
Speaker 2: They are given.
33:34
Speaker 1: Mysteries, and the mysteries are how to make a posthumous,
33:38
Speaker 1: how to do it through the herbs, and apart from
33:43
Speaker 1: the grimoires, the great grimoires that they have to make
33:46
Speaker 1: a pregnant woman lose her knowledge in the dream and
33:51
Speaker 1: can distract the creature.
33:53
Speaker 2: That is possible. That's how it happened.
33:58
Speaker 4: Eso fue lo que pasó cuando...? A.
34:00
Speaker 2: Ver, cuando nosotros llegamos a Giloxingo... Ajá, es que ya
34:02
Speaker 2: no nos desviamos. Justo por eso es lo que te decía.
34:05
Speaker 1: Cuando llegamos a Giloxingo, el antecedente en años pasados era.
34:12
Speaker 2: Ese. Y no un caso,¿ eh? Como 20, 30 casos.
34:16
Speaker 2: O sea, las mujeres despertaban.
34:18
Speaker 1: Despertaban y encontraban, o no encontraban a la criatura, o
34:21
Speaker 1: la encontraban enamoratada. O sea, decían, los del pueblo luego
34:26
Speaker 1: nos decían, es que les chupan el alma, les chupan
34:30
Speaker 1: el alma,¿ no?
34:31
Speaker 2: Sí. El alma.
34:33
Speaker 1: Y al momento de instruccionar el alma, el niño amanece amoratado.
34:36
Speaker 1: Principalmente del mentón a la nariz. O sea, la bruja literal, toda.
34:42
Speaker 2: Su boca aquí. Así están muertos.
34:46
Speaker 1: O sea, es que ese es el punto donde entra
34:48
Speaker 1: el asunto de, Mark the difference between what is a
34:51
Speaker 1: fiction and what is a reality, what is a legend,
34:54
Speaker 1: an ear to voices.
34:56
Speaker 2: Yes.
34:57
Speaker 1: What is the antecedent of children trapped or children who
35:01
Speaker 1: had this type of death? Evidently, when you go to
35:04
Speaker 1: investigate the.
35:06
Speaker 2: Records, the records of those times, I'm talking about 50,
35:09
Speaker 2: 60 years ago.
35:13
Speaker 1: The deaths will be explained as simple as, well, this
35:15
Speaker 1: suffocated died, this... Cunea's death. Cunea's death, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
35:21
Speaker 1: But when you say, man, 30 cases in... Just on
35:24
Speaker 1: the date of April 30th, what a pain, you know?
35:28
Speaker 2: That's the researcher's job.
35:30
Speaker 1: So, at the end of the day, even if people
35:32
Speaker 1: have said, no, well, your baby died from Cunea's death.
35:35
Speaker 2: For us, it could have been causative. A causal, eye,
35:39
Speaker 2: we are accelerating at the beginning of.
35:41
Speaker 1: Yo lo que te puedo decir es que la investigación
35:45
Speaker 1: tiene 2004 a la fecha.
35:46
Speaker 4: Ya va para 20 años. O sea, está tremendo.
35:49
Speaker 1: O sea, si me explico, ves el contexto del por qué.
35:53
Speaker 1: Y a veces hay personas, nosotros encontramos una superviviente de
35:57
Speaker 1: esa época.
35:58
Speaker 4: Ah, sí lo hay.
35:59
Speaker 1: Que este, pues superviviente en el sentido que le pasó
36:02
Speaker 1: eso a su hijo. Y cuando hablamos con ella, nos
36:05
Speaker 1: confirmó que ella vio la bruja en Aguala.
36:08
Speaker 2: Cómo la describe?
36:09
Speaker 3: O sea, porque ese es un enigma aquí, la gente
36:13
Speaker 3: siempre nos guiamos siempre por suposiciones, por leyendas, por creencias,
36:17
Speaker 3: pero una realmente superviviente o sobreviviente.
36:21
Speaker 1: Pues mira, superviviente porque la vio, y vio como en
36:25
Speaker 1: la cuna de su hijo estaba postrada una especie de sombra,
36:28
Speaker 1: decía ella, una sombra muy enorme, estamos hablando de 50,
36:32
Speaker 1: 60 años atrás, a partir del 2006, ojo, 2006, 50 años,
36:35
Speaker 1: 60 atrás. In that area of Quiloccingo, like all rural areas,
36:42
Speaker 1: the technology, electricity, blah, blah, blah, begins to get into
36:46
Speaker 1: it little by little. So this person lived in a
36:52
Speaker 1: rural place with lights, with candles. So that's where our
36:56
Speaker 1: discernment comes in to say, okay, he might have imagined it,
36:59
Speaker 1: he might have created it, you know? That's why I
37:02
Speaker 1: insist that we don't, I mean, it's not that we
37:04
Speaker 1: don't believe it, it's that we are more objective.
37:07
Speaker 4: Yes, I mean, they go to the tangible, to the fact.
37:11
Speaker 1: Because, okay, that's where the rhetoric begins with my experts.
37:16
Speaker 2: In fact, we.
37:16
Speaker 1: Have two excellent psychiatrists and it is when we do
37:21
Speaker 1: this exploration or research through interviews.
37:25
Speaker 2: They are present when it is in person.
37:28
Speaker 1: O cuando nosotros ahorita que hacemos videollamadas, ellos ven toda
37:31
Speaker 1: la entrevista con el testigo, y ellos hacen una valoración psiquiátrica, fíjate.
37:36
Speaker 3: Ok, está impresionante porque algo que me acaba de quedar claro, digo,
37:41
Speaker 3: aparte de eso del país, pueblos donde electricidad todavía pues
37:45
Speaker 3: no hay, yo he escuchado y me han contado infinidad
37:50
Speaker 3: de experiencias como la que tú describes, que son lugares
37:54
Speaker 3: donde realmente son muy alejados, de hecho, mi mamá It
37:58
Speaker 3: happened to one of those, being a teacher, people already.
38:02
Speaker 2: Know the experience. The witches do.
38:05
Speaker 1: Not fear adults, but they do not want to face them.
38:09
Speaker 1: They repress them, but a child does.
38:11
Speaker 2: Not, a child attracts them. A child is tribute, is energy,
38:14
Speaker 2: is everything. So it does sound.
38:16
Speaker 1: Very crazy, and yes, sorry, mainly it is in the
38:20
Speaker 1: gender woman. The witches, that's why we are not saying
38:26
Speaker 1: the witches, they.
38:27
Speaker 2: Are witches, women.
38:29
Speaker 1: Well, to give you a little, let's leave it to
38:34
Speaker 1: the air, because I tell you, the investigation is so extensive,
38:38
Speaker 1: that is, to tell you that we reached.
38:41
Speaker 2: The construction of the Atomic Ceremonial Center.
38:44
Speaker 1: We interviewed several shamans from there, we interviewed a lot
38:47
Speaker 1: of people from the town, the people who live around,
38:49
Speaker 1: the barbeques and all this, and they all tell you
38:51
Speaker 1: about witches.
38:54
Speaker 2: Witches and witches, witches here, witches there, witches.
38:59
Speaker 1: So, as we always say, he acts like a dog,
39:01
Speaker 1: he looks like a dog and he barks like a dog.
39:05
Speaker 2: Of course, definitely. You agree that you can't say, no,
39:07
Speaker 2: I still doubt it. After a lot of work and
39:09
Speaker 2: a lot of.
39:09
Speaker 1: Scientific discernment, because what I just explained can also happen.
39:14
Speaker 2: Yes.
39:20
Speaker 1: A pile of myths in someone's voice, in the oratory
39:25
Speaker 1: of the legends, and from there they say, ah, well,
39:27
Speaker 1: they get lost because they are the witches.
39:29
Speaker 2: No, you have to see. un cúmulo de mito en la.
39:23
Speaker 1: Voz de alguien, en la oratoria de las leyendas, y
39:26
Speaker 1: de ahí dicen, ah, pues se pierden porque son las brujas.
39:29
Speaker 2: No, hay que averiguar. A ver, autoridades también averigüen.
39:32
Speaker 4: Sí, o sea, no lo dejen como que... Sí, no, no, no.
39:35
Speaker 1: No, no. Por eso también nuestra agencia alba hay veces
39:38
Speaker 1: tiene conexiones con el gobierno,¿ no?
39:41
Speaker 2: Sí, sí, sí.
39:41
Speaker 1: Y esas conexiones son principalmente de casos de estos. O sea,
39:44
Speaker 1: nosotros también tenemos que dar parte de las autoridades,¿ eh?
39:47
Speaker 2: Ok. Entonces, sí.
39:49
Speaker 3: Cómo ustedes manejan, o cómo, sobre todo, cómo tú manejas, digo,
39:51
Speaker 3: ahorita hablamos de las criaturas de la noche, con los Nahuales?
39:55
Speaker 3: O sea,¿ viene siendo lo mismo, o es, digamos, que
39:58
Speaker 3: un rango todavía más.
40:00
Speaker 1: Ahí está lo interesantísimo del caso de la bruja Nahual,
40:02
Speaker 1: por eso le pusimos la bruja Nahual de Peña de Lobos,
40:05
Speaker 1: es así se llama el caso.
40:06
Speaker 2: El expediente es eso. Ok. Este... Because.
40:10
Speaker 1: In Nahual, because in the time of what is the
40:14
Speaker 1: conquest and all this matter of evangelization and all this,
40:20
Speaker 1: in that area of the state.
40:22
Speaker 2: Of Mexico, the shamans are very predominant. Yes. Real shamans. No, no,
40:27
Speaker 2: the guy who sells you mushrooms. Real shamans.
40:31
Speaker 1: So these guys have the oral tradition, the ritualistic tradition
40:35
Speaker 1: of that many, many generations ago and they also tell
40:43
Speaker 1: you that when the Spaniards arrive they arrive with their evangelization,
40:48
Speaker 1: but some Spaniards also arrive with the purgatory context, for example.
40:53
Speaker 2: Okay.
40:54
Speaker 1: So they say the mixture comes not only from the gospel,
40:58
Speaker 1: but also the mixture of paganism, talking about this devil, Baphomet.
41:03
Speaker 2: And things like that. Because it was another version in
41:06
Speaker 2: the original language, right? It was another.
41:09
Speaker 1: Concept, although it does have its balance between good and evil.
41:12
Speaker 2: Okay.
41:13
Speaker 1: Well, when you hear those wise people talk, that's why
41:18
Speaker 1: I insist, our data are specifically from people who have
41:21
Speaker 1: already passed on, but fortunately we have all the testimonials
41:26
Speaker 1: of those people, many spoken as well as with you,
41:29
Speaker 1: but not recorded.
41:31
Speaker 2: There are people who say, no, no, I give it
41:33
Speaker 2: to you, but I don't want you to spread it.
41:34
Speaker 1: Like others that we do have, we have a very
41:37
Speaker 1: extensive library of witnesses of the case of the Nehual witch.
41:40
Speaker 1: And they tell you about that in the pines, under
41:42
Speaker 1: what you go up through, as if they were climbing,
41:43
Speaker 1: and below there are some caves. Y en las cuevas
41:58
Speaker 1: se encontraron vestigios de figuras.
42:03
Speaker 2: Como bestias, pero humanoides. Ok. Que son vestigios originales.
42:10
Speaker 1: O sea, son de aquellos entonces, de las etnias de
42:13
Speaker 1: esa época. Y te hablo, si son 50, 60 años atrás,
42:17
Speaker 1: todavía más atrás. Sí, sí, sí.
42:18
Speaker 2: Estoy hablando de la conquista. Sí. Entonces, casi 500 años.
42:23
Speaker 1: Y en esas figurillas se ven, le llaman ellos los chamanes,
42:29
Speaker 1: así le llaman, y no fue Netflix el primero porque
42:31
Speaker 1: no fue así.
42:32
Speaker 2: A pesar que es mi empresa,¿ no? Les llaman diableros.
42:37
Speaker 4: Diableros.
42:38
Speaker 2: Diableros.
42:39
Speaker 1: El diablero no es el contexto de un brujo que
42:42
Speaker 1: maneja exactamente solamente demonios, sino es un güey que por
42:48
Speaker 1: sus atributos y misterios mágicos y And, well, very, very
42:54
Speaker 1: potent rituals can be transmuted.
42:56
Speaker 2: Into an animal.
42:57
Speaker 1: That's a Diablero. But there are also shamans. Shamans are
43:01
Speaker 1: also Nahuales. It's that also in this concept there are
43:04
Speaker 1: good and bad.
43:06
Speaker 2: Yes.
43:06
Speaker 1: The Diablero usually is the one who does fechorías. The good,
43:10
Speaker 1: the good shaman is the one who usually cures, heals,
43:14
Speaker 1: is protecting the people from the bad spirits.
43:17
Speaker 3: No, the one who doesn't charge. Some tell me that they...
43:21
Speaker 3: The people, for example, who have talked, is that they
43:24
Speaker 3: say that they do not put a price on it.
43:26
Speaker 1: It is that it is that it would not even
43:28
Speaker 1: enter the issue of the cost, because the shaman of
43:32
Speaker 1: which I am talking to you is the great wise
43:35
Speaker 1: man of an ethnic group, is the great wise man
43:37
Speaker 1: of a people, which is a person very respected by
43:40
Speaker 1: all the whole community and to which that person lives
43:45
Speaker 1: from the community.
43:47
Speaker 2: No exactamente de lo.
43:49
Speaker 1: Que él cobre, sino de que le otorgan, le otorgan
43:51
Speaker 1: animales para su subsistencia, ropa, cosas así. Pero en intercambio,
43:57
Speaker 1: el shaman procura al pueblo,¿ no?
44:00
Speaker 2: Sí, la protección.
44:01
Speaker 1: Exacto, que los llevan, que llevan a los niños porque
44:03
Speaker 1: tienen espanto, que llevan a los niños porque les duele
44:06
Speaker 1: el estómago incluso. Hablo de estos grandes hermularios, o sea, yo.
44:12
Speaker 2: No estoy hablando de Locuspocus ni nada de esos güeyes,¿ no?
44:16
Speaker 2: Those guys are discarded here, those guys are not in
44:18
Speaker 2: my figure.
44:19
Speaker 4: From now on I'm going to start using that term,
44:21
Speaker 4: I'm going to steal.
44:22
Speaker 2: It from you.
44:22
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm talking about the great masters of high magic.
44:27
Speaker 1: In that concept there are two branches and there is
44:30
Speaker 1: the devil too. The devil, put that guy and if
44:32
Speaker 1: he covers them.
44:33
Speaker 2: Yes.
44:33
Speaker 1: And he covers them for, I want the animals to
44:36
Speaker 1: die to the neighbor because I get fat, that kind
44:38
Speaker 1: of thing happens.
44:42
Speaker 2: Or, I don't know, I don't want their lands to prosper,
44:45
Speaker 2: for example. Yes.
44:48
Speaker 1: I'm talking about not a prosperity in itself of the
44:52
Speaker 1: person's wealth, but of their own.
44:54
Speaker 2: Crops, which is practically their subsistence. Sure.
44:58
Speaker 1: So that's where I'm talking about the fight between the
45:02
Speaker 1: devil and the shaman.
45:04
Speaker 2: And this has been going on for more than 500 years.
45:06
Speaker 2: It's very powerful. And it continues today.
45:11
Speaker 1: Ah.
45:11
Speaker 2: You didn't expect it.
45:13
Speaker 4: No, it's very interesting.
45:14
Speaker 3: The truth is that where or normally in which parts
45:19
Speaker 3: or in which areas we can find this type of people.
45:22
Speaker 4: Because of the fact that there are.
45:24
Speaker 2: There are.
45:24
Speaker 1: Let's see, I'm going to give you another context of
45:26
Speaker 1: one of the many times that we returned here to
45:29
Speaker 1: Luxingo and to the Peñalobos area. I had to live
45:33
Speaker 1: an experience that when I talk about it, it always
45:35
Speaker 1: gets on my skin and it excites me a lot
45:38
Speaker 1: because I had the opportunity to see it with my
45:40
Speaker 1: own eyes. Okay. De repente, nosotros llegamos ciertos días justo
45:45
Speaker 1: antes de la fecha del 30 de abril.
45:46
Speaker 2: Ojo, fíjense por.
45:48
Speaker 1: Qué dura tanto una investigación, porque si nada más tienes
45:51
Speaker 1: una sola fecha al año para poder receptar un montón
45:56
Speaker 1: de evidencia, pues te toca ir por año, hermano.
45:59
Speaker 2: Sí.
45:59
Speaker 1: O sea, por mucho que tú quieras decir, yo me
46:02
Speaker 1: quiero quedar seis meses, pues sí, güey, te tienes que
46:04
Speaker 1: esperar hasta el 30 de abril del próximo año.
46:06
Speaker 2: Para poder. Sí, claro. Exacto. Sí, sí, sí. Bueno.
46:10
Speaker 1: Ya les di un tip, el 30 de abril es
46:12
Speaker 1: la fecha específica para recabar información de Peña de Lobos.
46:15
Speaker 1: Pero bueno, más allá de este contexto, de esas maneras
46:21
Speaker 1: que íbamos nosotros a buscar más información, yo quería buscar
46:25
Speaker 1: un chamán,¿ no? Siempre busqué al diablero también, porque quería
46:28
Speaker 1: entrevistar al diablero. Y ellos, los mismos chamanes, te decían, no,
46:32
Speaker 1: el diablero es peligroso, el diablero te puede matar.
46:35
Speaker 2: Y yo,¿ cómo? Pues a balazos,¿ o cómo? Dicen, no, no, no,
46:38
Speaker 2: en forma animal.¿ Qué? Y yo, a ver,¿ cómo?¿ En
46:42
Speaker 2: forma animal? Ojo,¿ estás hablando? Yo les digo en mi persona.
46:46
Speaker 1: Yo soy una persona y conoce Paco y soy enfáticamente
46:51
Speaker 1: escéptico y súper objetivo.
46:54
Speaker 4: Sí, o sea, no es de los que, digamos que
46:57
Speaker 4: esto es paranormal.
46:57
Speaker 3: O sea, es una persona que tiene que darle muchas
47:00
Speaker 3: vueltas al asunto para decir, esto es así porque ya
47:03
Speaker 3: te lo comprobé de mil y un formas.
47:05
Speaker 4: O sea, no es de los que... pasa el gato
47:08
Speaker 4: negro y no.
47:09
Speaker 1: Sí, sí, no es como la primera, digo, ah, sí, sí, no, no, no, no,
47:12
Speaker 1: le busco toda la, todas las derivantes. Bueno, entonces yo dije,
47:17
Speaker 1: pues necesito buscar un diablero o un shaman,¿ no?
47:20
Speaker 2: Yo ya había.
47:20
Speaker 1: Hecho tres viajes en tres años y me dice el shaman,
47:25
Speaker 1: uno de ellos, que sí lo entreviste, me dice, va
47:27
Speaker 1: a haber una ceremonia en el centro ceremonial Otomi, este,
47:31
Speaker 1: vente el próximo año y vente antes para que luego
47:35
Speaker 1: se encontrara Tal vez tú uno que otro te va
47:38
Speaker 1: a dar información.
47:40
Speaker 2: Un diablero. No, un shaman.
47:43
Speaker 1: Porque ellos te dicen, no, los diableros los encuentras adentrándose
47:47
Speaker 1: al bosque, Samudio, pero¿ sabes qué?
47:49
Speaker 2: Bajo tu responsabilidad. O no vayas solo. Sí. Hay veces,
47:54
Speaker 2: hay algo que, esto no lo he.
47:56
Speaker 1: Contado en ningún otro podcast, vas a tener el honor de.
48:00
Speaker 2: Gracias, amigo, gracias.
48:01
Speaker 1: Perdón, pero no es presunción, pero nunca lo había hecho,
48:04
Speaker 1: del caso de Peñalosa. En aquellos entonces, cuando yo iba consecutivamente,
48:09
Speaker 1: de repente me decían,¿ qué quieres ir?
48:10
Speaker 2: Próximo año.
48:11
Speaker 1: Y en uno de esos años llegó un colectivo como
48:14
Speaker 1: de seis chamanes. Y me dicen, ahora sí vamos a
48:18
Speaker 1: buscar tu diablero. Te digo una cosa, es más, no
48:22
Speaker 1: es que otro día aquí tengo un.
48:25
Speaker 2: Báculo que me regalaron. Va. Ellos me lo regalaron este. Guau.
48:35
Speaker 2: Ellos entraron... Ah, sí, perdón. Sí, sí, no te preocupes.
48:39
Speaker 1: Bueno, ellos entraron, llegaron con su indumentaria ritual. Había muchos
48:45
Speaker 1: personajes que yo se los puedo describir como muchos de
48:48
Speaker 1: barbas muy largas. Yo no tenía esta barba, tenía barba
48:52
Speaker 1: de candado. Y llegaban varios con báculos de este estilo.
48:56
Speaker 2: Sí, sí, sí.
48:57
Speaker 1: Más este... con más cosas,¿ no? A mí el que
49:01
Speaker 1: me lo preparó fue uno de esos chamanes y me dijo...
49:04
Speaker 1: Tienes que proteger, pero no, no, no te, no te
49:06
Speaker 1: va a proteger tu coraza de no creencia.
49:10
Speaker 2: Sí, fíjate. Así me decían. Sí, sí, sí.
49:13
Speaker 1: Tu coraza de, de escepticismo, esa, esa vale gorro aquí, Samudio.
49:18
Speaker 1: Porque en el bosque tú estás sentado. That's how they
49:12
Speaker 1: told me. Your heart of skepticism is worth a lot here, Samuel.
49:18
Speaker 2: Because in the forest you are in his field. Yes, definitely.
49:23
Speaker 1: And so I said, when he told me that, I said, yes,
49:26
Speaker 1: of course, I'm going. And one of my investigators tells me,
49:29
Speaker 1: now you're going to become the shaman, Samuel.
49:33
Speaker 2: I mean, even we cuss, because evidently.
49:37
Speaker 1: We respect people's beliefs a lot, right?
49:40
Speaker 2: We respect them. Yes. But we don't adjudicate them. Okay.
49:45
Speaker 1: Well, they gave me this. We went for a walk
49:47
Speaker 1: in the forest at night. We collected some information. We
49:50
Speaker 1: collected certain strange situations that are in the archives. I'm
49:56
Speaker 1: going to leave it here. Well, this is for you
49:59
Speaker 1: to see. Then it's going to be a paneo.
50:02
Speaker 2: Yes. The skull is a lince skull.
50:04
Speaker 1: Okay.
50:04
Speaker 2: So, there you go. Don't worry.
50:07
Speaker 3: It's impressive, look, I've seen those when they do the
50:11
Speaker 3: famous black mass in Catemaco. I see, then, there are
50:16
Speaker 3: images of shamanic people who also have some, as you say,
50:20
Speaker 3: more elaborate, they.
50:21
Speaker 2: Have more things. I mean, they did it to me
50:23
Speaker 2: like saying, hey, let him take something, right? At least, right?
50:27
Speaker 1: I mean, like saying, well, no, not demeriting because... We
50:32
Speaker 1: did it for you.
50:33
Speaker 4: Of course, it's just for you.
50:36
Speaker 2: It's special.
50:37
Speaker 1: So I, at the end of the day, I, as
50:39
Speaker 1: an investigator, well, if I get stuck in that, because
50:42
Speaker 1: it's very retributive on the part of those people.
50:45
Speaker 2: And I'm very grateful to those shamans who are watching me.
50:47
Speaker 2: Thank you. Because regardless of the fact.
50:51
Speaker 1: That I have not seen specifically something that I expected
50:55
Speaker 1: at the psyche level, that is, my psyche level is
50:59
Speaker 1: a beast man.
51:01
Speaker 2: Yes.¿ Cómo será, cabrón?
51:03
Speaker 1: Entonces, la verdad es que ahí me entraba el fervor
51:06
Speaker 1: y la emoción de seguir investigando y yo creme ruidito
51:08
Speaker 1: y me volteaba y metía cámaras,¿ sabes?
51:10
Speaker 2: Sí, sí, sí. Sí, íbamos con equipo en mano y
51:13
Speaker 2: todo el asunto.
51:14
Speaker 1: Bueno, esa es una anécdota que queda en stand-by porque
51:20
Speaker 1: tiene toda su historia cuando fuimos a adentrarnos al bosque
51:23
Speaker 1: profundo de Peñalobos, pero bueno. Corte, ah, voy otro año,
51:28
Speaker 1: no encontré como lo que yo quisiera y yo seguía
51:31
Speaker 1: de intenso. A ver, necesito saber y hablar con un...
51:34
Speaker 1: porque solamente tengo la oratoria.
51:37
Speaker 2: Claro.
51:38
Speaker 1: Tengo nada más el testimonial de ellos, me dieron un
51:41
Speaker 1: bastón ritual, está padre, digo.
51:43
Speaker 2: O sea, sí, pero... Sí, pero no. Sí, yo como
51:46
Speaker 2: investigador digo, quiero más. Sí, o sea, quiero información.
51:49
Speaker 1: O sea, me estás enseñando figuras de hombres con cabezas
51:54
Speaker 1: de coyotes. Because that's how the figures are made, bipedal,
51:57
Speaker 1: even half-simiesque sometimes. You say, well, I have several elements,
52:02
Speaker 1: but I don't have anything. And I, as an investigator,
52:07
Speaker 1: that's how I am. So, in one of those years,
52:10
Speaker 1: he tells me, let's have a special ceremony, I want
52:12
Speaker 1: you to come. You have to arrive days before, you
52:16
Speaker 1: stay here, and that's it, perfect.
52:18
Speaker 2: We always stay in the caballos of Peña de Lobos.
52:23
Speaker 2: Highly recommended.
52:24
Speaker 1: It is not so that they do not freak out
52:27
Speaker 1: and it is not that they are.
52:29
Speaker 2: Around the cabin of the reserve. Yes. I'm talking because
52:33
Speaker 2: the reference is Peña de Lobos. Ok.
52:34
Speaker 1: But they are not in the cabins where they rent.
52:37
Speaker 1: They go on weekends, they are beautiful. Well, total that
52:41
Speaker 1: I arrived.
52:43
Speaker 2: One of those days, which was a Friday, it seems
52:45
Speaker 2: to me, if I remember correctly, Friday, Thursday.
52:47
Speaker 1: Well, there we go, we already saw the way, the path,
52:49
Speaker 1: whatever you want. And in that I see in one
52:53
Speaker 1: of the pines, because there is a lot of pine there,
52:56
Speaker 1: in one of the pines, a person like that.
53:00
Speaker 2: Person.
53:02
Speaker 1: When we are entering the place of the ceremonial center,
53:05
Speaker 1: and I tell one of my investigators, hey, I'm looking good,
53:09
Speaker 1: it's a guy in a pine. And he stays watching,
53:15
Speaker 1: wait a minute, and he takes out the camera and
53:18
Speaker 1: starts doing the zoom.
53:20
Speaker 2: Sí, güey, es un güey.
53:22
Speaker 1: Sí.
53:22
Speaker 2: Digo, pero¿ en dónde está?¿ Está en un pino?¿ En
53:24
Speaker 2: dónde está? No, se ve como un pedestal, me dijo. Ajá.
53:28
Speaker 1: Digo, ah, debe ser como un, ah, pues sí, cierto,
53:31
Speaker 1: nos dijeron que esas ceremonias, debe ser como.
53:34
Speaker 2: Los voladores de Papantla, algo así,¿ no? A mí se
53:36
Speaker 2: me ocurrió algo así. Ah, pues está padre, le digo,
53:39
Speaker 2: pues saque a puranos, güey, pues está padre,¿ no?
53:41
Speaker 1: Sí.
53:41
Speaker 2: Nos vamos a perder, por lo menos lo grabamos siquiera. Órale,
53:44
Speaker 2: y ahí fuimos,¿ no?
53:45
Speaker 1: Bueno. El wey traía cámara fotográfica reflex, no como las
53:49
Speaker 1: de ahora, la reflex antigüita.
53:51
Speaker 2: Ok.
53:52
Speaker 1: Bueno, la de, sí, no la de tarjeta, la de rollo, casi, casi.
53:56
Speaker 2: Ah, la vida. Sí, pues estamos hablando de muchos años atrás.
54:00
Speaker 1: Sí, sí, sí.
54:00
Speaker 2: Entonces, 2006, 2007.
54:02
Speaker 1: Bueno. Y aparte, aunque hubiese, no teníamos la capacidad monetaria
54:07
Speaker 1: para comprar una, bueno, en ese entonces no.
54:09
Speaker 2: Total que traemos cámara a final del día. Sí, pues
54:12
Speaker 2: eso es lo importante.
54:13
Speaker 1: La mejor cámara que tienes para detectar un fenómeno es
54:15
Speaker 1: la cámara que tienes en la mano, señor.
54:17
Speaker 2: Punto. Bueno. Entonces ahí vamos, cabrón. Y le digo al güey,¿
54:21
Speaker 2: sabes qué?
54:21
Speaker 1: No hay que perdernos esta ceremonia porque me gusta la
54:23
Speaker 1: idea de que grabemos todo el contexto de ellos como un.
54:27
Speaker 2: Sincretismo,¿ no? Va, suma el caso, suma. Listo.
54:31
Speaker 1: Vamos avanzando y vamos viendo cómo se, nos vamos acercando
54:35
Speaker 1: y dice, ya estoy viendo al tipo este, no en
54:38
Speaker 1: un pedestal, güey, estaba en el árbol, cabrón.
54:42
Speaker 2: Y estaba haciendo esto There was air, man. You saw
54:47
Speaker 2: the pine tree like this, man. And that guy was
54:49
Speaker 2: like that, just like that, man. And I said, how
54:52
Speaker 2: does it sustain? Where, man?
54:53
Speaker 1: I was amazed to see it, because we already had
54:56
Speaker 1: a distance of a little more than 12 meters, but
55:00
Speaker 1: it looked good, right? I saw the dimension of that type,
55:04
Speaker 1: with a shaman-type clothing, and on the tree, man. But
55:09
Speaker 1: the most impressive thing, Paco, was when you heard an alcohol.
55:15
Speaker 1: Y el halcón era un aguililla de Harris. En México hay.
55:19
Speaker 2: Dos especies principales.
55:21
Speaker 1: Incluso uno de ellos es utilizado por la Sedena.
55:24
Speaker 2: Sí.
55:25
Speaker 1: Que es el aguililla de Harris y el símbolo patrio
55:28
Speaker 1: es el águila real.
55:28
Speaker 2: Sí.
55:29
Speaker 1: Los cadetes usualmente traen aguililla de Harris. Entonces, es como
55:34
Speaker 1: un águila más pequeña.
55:35
Speaker 2: Bueno, entonces empezó a surcar.
55:39
Speaker 1: Estaba el cuate este aquí y el águila empezó a
55:42
Speaker 1: hacer estos círculos.
55:43
Speaker 4: Lo rodeó, lo puso a.
55:46
Speaker 1: And, well, I call him Grasneado because he has his name,
55:49
Speaker 1: but they do it like this, right?
55:51
Speaker 2: The falcons.
55:53
Speaker 1: So I said, man, why is he there? I even
55:57
Speaker 1: told one of them, I said, it's a cetrero. That
56:00
Speaker 1: guy knows, he's training his eagle.
56:03
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, yes. And obviously he calls him and he.
56:05
Speaker 1: Listens to him because that's how they are. They need
56:07
Speaker 1: the training of the cetrería. I tell you because I
56:10
Speaker 1: know the cetrería. I had the afición de cetrería hace
56:13
Speaker 1: muchos años.
56:13
Speaker 2: Bueno. So I said, dude, well, he's in his eagle roll. Well,
56:16
Speaker 2: that's it, right?
56:17
Speaker 1: Yes.
56:18
Speaker 2: He passes, and we're still there, like, moved, and he says, no, no, no, listen.
56:22
Speaker 2: And now I see his mouth. And I, well, I
56:26
Speaker 2: don't see it. I said, look, camera, zoom.
56:30
Speaker 1: And when he opened his mouth, and he did like the...
56:33
Speaker 1: It was the... Well, not only that, man. I said, nah,
56:37
Speaker 1: you're going to have to be super trained.
56:39
Speaker 2: Look at you. O sea, siempre buscando.
56:42
Speaker 1: Nuestra mente siempre está en explicación lógica coherente.
56:46
Speaker 2: Sí. Cuando me quede frío como él.
56:50
Speaker 1: Es cuando él empieza a agitar sus brazos así, y
56:53
Speaker 1: el halcón hace lo mismo.
56:55
Speaker 2: Güey, mira, no es mamada.¡ Hala, bestia!
56:58
Speaker 1: Pero tú lo ves en perspectiva, y de repente hasta
57:01
Speaker 1: nos hicimos para atrás, y dije, no, espérame,¿ cómo?
57:03
Speaker 2: A ver, espérame, tiene coordinación con el animal. Con el animal, güey. Bueno,
57:09
Speaker 2: estamos nosotros embobados.
57:11
Speaker 1: Llega el que nos estaba esperando, estoy omitiendo nombres, no
57:16
Speaker 1: puedo revelarlo, y me dice, justo estás viendo la vinculación.
57:20
Speaker 2: Con el animal. Ah, la bestia.
57:26
Speaker 1: Es que era impresionante, y estoy viendo un shaman, no
57:29
Speaker 1: estoy viendo un malero. Entonces me dice, lo que está
57:32
Speaker 1: haciendo es que el shaman está vinculando con la psique
57:35
Speaker 1: del animal, y el animal con el shaman. Yo ahorita
57:40
Speaker 1: te puedo decir que él This shaman is seeing.
57:43
Speaker 2: Us from the eagle. Yes. I mean, I stayed like this, man. No,
57:48
Speaker 2: you're an asshole, man. He says, these are the good Nahuales. Wow.
57:56
Speaker 3: Tremendous privilege to be able to observe that.
58:00
Speaker 4: I mean, it's a phenomenon.
58:03
Speaker 3: Very, let's say, it's very well known, but it's of
58:08
Speaker 3: which there is almost no information. As I told you
58:11
Speaker 3: at the beginning, we base ourselves on legends, on stories.
58:15
Speaker 4: But to say, I saw the link between a canijo
58:17
Speaker 4: and an animal.
58:18
Speaker 1: When he told me it's the link between the animal,
58:22
Speaker 1: I said, it's the duality. Yes, it's the duality, what
58:26
Speaker 1: Don Juan Matus calls the totem animal. Within the shamanic
58:31
Speaker 1: concept and not the devil's. So I say, the one
58:34
Speaker 1: who transmutes is because he wins the psyche of the animal.
58:37
Speaker 1: Entonces el diablero siempre le va a ganar la psique
58:40
Speaker 1: del animal.
58:41
Speaker 2: Ok. Y dices, wow, güey, o sea, esto no.
58:45
Speaker 3: Sí, o sea, yo lo estoy entendiendo ahorita de una
58:48
Speaker 3: forma sumamente diferente.
58:49
Speaker 2: Sí, claro. Pero es total, la verdad, es un pinche misterio.
58:54
Speaker 4: Tremendo.
58:55
Speaker 1: Todo tiene un contexto, chicos, y todo tiene una historia,
58:58
Speaker 1: tiene un fundamento. Por eso no podemos quedarnos con nada
59:01
Speaker 1: más lo que dice la gente.
59:03
Speaker 2: Sí, sí, sí.
59:04
Speaker 1: Es lo que nosotros hacemos, Paco. O sea, entonces llegó, fíjate,
59:07
Speaker 1: esa fue una experiencia de vivencia.
59:09
Speaker 4: Claro.
59:09
Speaker 2: Nosotros la vimos. Y yo te digo, güey, fotografía lo
59:13
Speaker 2: que hiciste, grabaste.
59:15
Speaker 1: No, no, los dos nos quedamos fríos viendo porque fue
59:18
Speaker 1: tan impresionante.
59:20
Speaker 2: Te olvidas de grabar.
59:21
Speaker 1: Yo les voy a decir algo, no sé si fue
59:23
Speaker 1: también confabulado de los chamanes, o vete a saber si
59:26
Speaker 1: nos clavó tanto, Gauss, That no, well, this guy didn't
59:31
Speaker 1: take photos, man.
59:33
Speaker 2: But imagine having that evidence, wow.
59:35
Speaker 1: What I can tell you is that, well, it happened
59:38
Speaker 1: to us at the time that we went to look
59:41
Speaker 1: for shamans and naguales.
59:42
Speaker 2: Well, naguales, diableros. Yes.
59:44
Speaker 1: So there he gave me the context a little deeper.
59:46
Speaker 1: He says, yes, it is that the shamans, the whites,
59:50
Speaker 1: occupy the psyche of the animal. Yes.
59:54
Speaker 2: That shaman is seeing from the air.
59:56
Speaker 1: Yes.
59:56
Speaker 2: Look at that.
59:58
Speaker 1: And then when he started doing this, well, then he
1:00:00
Speaker 1: started to do it slower and the arch.
1:00:02
Speaker 2: Began to go down. And the shaman went down. The shaman,
1:00:08
Speaker 2: I don't know in what branch he stopped, I don't know,
1:00:11
Speaker 2: he was resting.
1:00:13
Speaker 4: Impressive, impressive.
1:00:14
Speaker 2: So you say, imagine the power of the mind of
1:00:18
Speaker 2: these guys.
1:00:19
Speaker 4: It's a level of consciousness.
1:00:21
Speaker 2: Fuck.
1:00:22
Speaker 1: Y ojo, ninguno de ellos usó ni hongos, ni peyote,
1:00:26
Speaker 1: ni ninguna sustancia sacada de nada, ni el sapo, ni
1:00:31
Speaker 1: la chingada.
1:00:33
Speaker 2: Simple y sencillamente susichis. El poder de su mente. El
1:00:37
Speaker 2: poder de la mente.
1:00:38
Speaker 3: Guau, es que aquí es cuando ya hablamos realmente de
1:00:43
Speaker 3: los verdaderos fenómenos extranormales, vamos a ponerle, pero vistos From
1:00:50
Speaker 3: the angle, how would you call it? I, from my
1:00:54
Speaker 3: point of view, as an investigator and explorer, because we
1:00:57
Speaker 3: go every year, right?
1:00:59
Speaker 2: So I was looking for more information.
1:01:01
Speaker 1: In this case, you will be able to see it
1:01:04
Speaker 1: on the YouTube channel that we have, Agentes de Negro,
1:01:07
Speaker 1: and a paranormal of the Agentes de Negro, or Agencia
1:01:10
Speaker 1: Mexicana de Investigación Paranormal. It's a lot of information, friends.
1:01:16
Speaker 1: Se va a llevar mínimo 10 capítulos esta investigación.
1:01:19
Speaker 2: Wow!
1:01:20
Speaker 1: Y deja de eso, tenemos bastón ritual, no solo este.
1:01:23
Speaker 1: Nosotros recabamos el bastón ritual de la Bruja Nahual. Tenemos
1:01:27
Speaker 1: este video directamente de la Bruja Nahual de Peñalobos siendo ritual.
1:01:32
Speaker 2: Y eso lo tienes o dices que apenas se va a...? Sí,
1:01:35
Speaker 2: es que sí, sí. Ese sí nos podría ofrecerte lo
1:01:37
Speaker 2: de tu canal, amigo, porque va para el canal. Sí, sí.
1:01:39
Speaker 3: De hecho, le digo a la gente en este momento
1:01:42
Speaker 3: que recuerden que yo dejo los links directos Aquí en
1:01:45
Speaker 3: la descripción para que puedan conocer el trabajo de Antonio Zamudio.
1:01:49
Speaker 3: Ahí están todos para que conozcas el trabajo. La verdad
1:01:51
Speaker 3: es que es impresionante el nivel de profesionalismo, una, que maneja. Dos,
1:01:56
Speaker 3: el equipo paranormal o el equipo de investigadores que ellos
1:01:59
Speaker 3: se adentran demasiado. Ya ustedes están viendo el tipo de persona,
1:02:03
Speaker 3: o sea, una persona que, como ustedes no lo dicen,
1:02:06
Speaker 3: que ve el gato negro y es la bruja. O sea,
1:02:07
Speaker 3: realmente entrar en esos terrenos es buscar realmente el fenómeno.
1:02:12
Speaker 2: Sí, claro.
1:02:12
Speaker 3: Irnos sobre el fenómeno. Y las variantes que rodean el fenómeno.¿
1:02:16
Speaker 3: Por qué está aquí?¿ Por qué se produjo acá?¿ Qué
1:02:18
Speaker 3: pasa en el entorno? O sea, es un análisis tremendo.
1:02:21
Speaker 1: Y no tienes idea de las ochorrocientas mil preguntas que
1:02:26
Speaker 1: le hicimos a ese shaman cuando.
1:02:27
Speaker 2: Bajó con nosotros. Evidentemente yo decía, wey,¿ cómo le hiciste, cabrón? Sí.
1:02:33
Speaker 2: Checamos el árbol, vimos si no hubiera una mar.
1:02:36
Speaker 1: O sea, todos somos quisquillosos hasta exquisitos para eso.
1:02:42
Speaker 2: No? Y los chamanes muy amables dijeron, adelante, por.
1:02:45
Speaker 1: Favor, no nos ofenda, al contrario, nos soporta lo que
1:02:49
Speaker 1: nosotros estamos defendiendo.
1:02:50
Speaker 2: Es lo que me decían.
1:02:52
Speaker 1: Wow. Es que ya les va, nada más para darles
1:02:55
Speaker 1: para que se piquen un poquito más. Hay una guerra
1:02:57
Speaker 1: de cientos de años entre diableros y chamanes y sigue
1:03:01
Speaker 1: estando vigente.
1:03:03
Speaker 2: Wow.
1:03:04
Speaker 1: Imagínate, o sea, cuando te dicen eso, dices, O sea,
1:03:08
Speaker 1: explota todo en tu cabeza, porque dije, de una testimonial
1:03:15
Speaker 1: de todo lo que llevamos.
1:03:17
Speaker 2: Wow.
1:03:18
Speaker 3: Imagínate, digo, el hecho, en este momento entiendo perfectamente, digo,
1:03:22
Speaker 3: lo entendí en ese momento, pero ahorita me queda clarísimo
1:03:24
Speaker 3: el por qué te dijeron, ni se.
1:03:26
Speaker 2: Te ocurre ir a buscar uno. Sí, no, no, no.
1:03:28
Speaker 2: O sea, ni se te ocurre. No, te va a destrozar.
1:03:29
Speaker 1: A mí me dijeron, a ver, un diablero transmutado en animal,
1:03:35
Speaker 1: tal cual como me dijeron los chamanes.
1:03:39
Speaker 2: It's the soul. It's going to tear you apart. I mean, no, no, no, no.
1:03:42
Speaker 2: It's not in any moment. Its psyche is human. Yes,
1:03:46
Speaker 2: there is no conscience. It doesn't have a conscience.
1:03:48
Speaker 1: It doesn't have just this. I'm going to stop because
1:03:51
Speaker 1: I'm going to damage it.
1:03:53
Speaker 2: No.
1:03:54
Speaker 1: If a devil attacks you, they told me, with the
1:03:56
Speaker 1: top of a coyote, grab it. Because you're talking about
1:03:59
Speaker 1: a coyote of the weight of the human. You're talking
1:04:03
Speaker 1: about the behavior of the coyote as if it were
1:04:05
Speaker 1: angry and.
1:04:05
Speaker 2: Hungry, man.
1:04:08
Speaker 1: Estás hablando de que va a usar sus garras. Y
1:04:12
Speaker 1: yo decía,¿ tiene garras? No, son sus dedos. Pero el
1:04:16
Speaker 1: poderío que le da el diablero a la psiquis del
1:04:19
Speaker 1: animal es bestia. Y todos nos dijimos, nos vimos hasta
1:04:25
Speaker 1: las caras, los.
1:04:26
Speaker 2: Semestres, y dijimos, el hombre lobo. Sí, pasó por la mente.
1:04:32
Speaker 1: Tengo un gran colega amigo que le mando un saludo.
1:04:36
Speaker 2: That he said, no, man, I mean, a crinus? No, no, man. No, no,
1:04:41
Speaker 2: put it with a crinus.
1:04:42
Speaker 1: Who doesn't know what a crinus is, who knows role-playing games,
1:04:45
Speaker 1: go look for what a crinus is.
1:04:47
Speaker 2: And he's a beast man.
1:04:49
Speaker 1: I mean, no, not a crinus, man, but he's telling you, Shaman,
1:04:53
Speaker 1: that in humans, maybe you're not seeing the animal.
1:04:55
Speaker 2: Yes. They shut my mouth. But that's for the episode
1:04:59
Speaker 2: that I'm going to show you. Wow, tremendous. It's awesome.
1:05:03
Speaker 2: It's awesome. It's awesome. Hey, and they never told you.
1:05:06
Speaker 4: El secreto para poder enfrentar a uno de esos diablos.
1:05:10
Speaker 2: No, no, no. Nosotros, seres humanos comunes, ni nosotros como investigadores, hermano. No.
1:05:14
Speaker 2: Te digo,¿ por qué?
1:05:15
Speaker 3: Porque hay infinidad de leyendas donde dicen, no, que con
1:05:18
Speaker 3: armas de fuego no se puede.
1:05:19
Speaker 2: No, no, no.
1:05:20
Speaker 3: Armas blancas que tienen que estar bañadas en agua bendita.
1:05:24
Speaker 2: No, es una falacia. Eso sí es una falacia.
1:05:26
Speaker 1: Y ojo, también hay mucha mala pata y mala ignorancia.
1:05:32
Speaker 2: O sea, digo, Ignorance is bad, but when it's used
1:05:36
Speaker 2: in fanaticism, watch out for that.
1:05:38
Speaker 1: There are a lot of people from a very ignorant people,
1:05:43
Speaker 1: sorry to tell you, but there are a lot of
1:05:45
Speaker 1: very ignorant people who go with the myth and there
1:05:48
Speaker 1: is stoning a senior adult.
1:05:50
Speaker 2: Lady, for example.
1:05:51
Speaker 1: Ah, life.
1:05:52
Speaker 2: Don't fuck, bastard.
1:05:53
Speaker 1: I mean, no, don't be, I mean, a little mother,
1:05:56
Speaker 1: for example. I mean, if she's like that.
1:05:57
Speaker 2: She's a witch, well, talk to the authorities to take
1:06:00
Speaker 2: care of it. Of course.
1:06:01
Speaker 1: No hagan justicia por su propia mano. Dos, los animales
1:06:05
Speaker 1: no tienen nada que ver,¿ eh? Tienen un contexto totalmente distinto, güey.
1:06:09
Speaker 3: Y eso lo dices porque,¿ cómo me he topado con
1:06:11
Speaker 3: que agarran esas lechuzas?
1:06:13
Speaker 2: Esa,¿ a dónde iba?
1:06:14
Speaker 3: Hay cantidad de videos ahí donde,¡ ay, tenemos una bruja!
1:06:17
Speaker 3: Está el pobre animalito sufriendo.
1:06:18
Speaker 1: Pura gente ignorante, perdón, pero sí da coraje, cabrón, porque dices, no, cabrón,
1:06:24
Speaker 1: a ver, espérate.
1:06:24
Speaker 2: A ver, y ojo, esta comunidad que les hablo, tienen una.
1:06:45
Speaker 1: Porque hay un clásico, el clásico, güey, ignorante que fomenta
1:06:48
Speaker 1: el placebo a decir, yo vi un Nahual y estás
1:06:51
Speaker 1: más idiota que.
1:06:52
Speaker 4: Nada, cabrón.
1:06:53
Speaker 2: No, no mames.
1:06:55
Speaker 4: No, si hubiera sido, realmente uno lo destroza.
1:06:58
Speaker 2: No, se caga de miedo, Paco. No viviría, para contarlo.
1:07:03
Speaker 2: Se le cagan los calzones, güey. O sea, no, no, no.
1:07:05
Speaker 2: A ver, yo lo que les digo es cero ficción.
1:07:09
Speaker 1: O sea, yo se los digo como investigador que soy
1:07:12
Speaker 1: enérgicamente escéptico.
1:07:15
Speaker 2: Sí está, o sea, sí está cabrón, o sea, sí es.
1:07:19
Speaker 1: Y no solamente es uno, han visto varios en forma animal,
1:07:22
Speaker 1: pero no van.
1:07:24
Speaker 2: Tal vez algunos poblados dicen, como en las películas.
1:07:29
Speaker 1: Vamos con escopetas y picos, no le van a dar,
1:07:31
Speaker 1: no lo van a matar, no van a.
1:07:33
Speaker 2: Si está en forma humanoide, sí.
1:07:34
Speaker 1: Sí.
1:07:35
Speaker 2: Pero si está en animal, ni lo vas a ver. No,
1:07:38
Speaker 2: o sea, hablamos ya de otra cosa. Pero insisto, hasta
1:07:41
Speaker 2: suena tan inverosímil para mí, cabrón. King Digo, me cayeron
1:07:46
Speaker 2: la boca. Y eso está cañón.
1:07:48
Speaker 1: O sea, y no porque yo sea el gran supremo escéptico,
1:07:52
Speaker 1: pero pues yo fui hasta el fondo, hasta el quinto
1:07:55
Speaker 1: infierno de Giloxingo y de Peña de Lobos para buscar
1:07:58
Speaker 1: un diablero.
1:07:58
Speaker 2: Yo quería buscar un diablero. Está impresionante. Y lo encontramos.
1:08:03
Speaker 2: Pero bueno, ya. Eso queda.
1:08:05
Speaker 1: Eso queda para el canal de YouTube Agentes de Negro.
1:08:08
Speaker 2: Y Agencia Mexicana de Investigación Panamericana. Hermanos, discúlpame, pero... No, no,
1:08:12
Speaker 2: sí está perfecto.
1:08:13
Speaker 3: De hecho, le recuerdo a la gente, acá está la descripción,
1:08:16
Speaker 3: todos los links para que ya no tengas que ir
1:08:17
Speaker 3: a buscar nada, ya te vayas directamente al canal, porque
1:08:20
Speaker 3: la verdad es que el contenido que generas está bastante padre,
1:08:24
Speaker 3: es muy interesante, yo lo respeto muchísimo y la neta
1:08:27
Speaker 3: me gusta bastante porque yo soy un fanático. Yo soy
1:08:29
Speaker 3: un fanático, yo, como lo dije en su momento, hoy
1:08:32
Speaker 3: estoy con el maestro porque yo me considero un fanático
1:08:36
Speaker 3: nada más, apasionado del tema, escucho, cuento relatos Pero realmente, Samudio,
1:08:41
Speaker 3: muchísimas gracias por la oportunidad, por prestarnos aquí también el
1:08:44
Speaker 3: lugar para poder hacer real esa entrevista. Y pues para
1:08:48
Speaker 3: toda la gente que le gustó, ya tiene las redes sociales.
1:08:50
Speaker 3: Y gracias a todos los que se quedaron hasta el final.
1:08:52
Speaker 3: Nos vemos en la próxima. Y pues muchísimas gracias.
1:08:55
Speaker 1: Hombre gracias de su casa de ustedes buenísima onda síganlo
1:09:00
Speaker 1: la verdad es que está haciendo muy buen trabajo y
1:09:02
Speaker 1: sobre todo que seas analítico hermano esa es la única
1:09:05
Speaker 1: recomendación que te doy ok informa acá tú tienes una
1:09:09
Speaker 1: gran reverberancia con tus seguidores informalos ok
1:09:13
Speaker 3: Muchísimas gracias nos vemos en la próxima familia gracias bye