Latest / The Commercial Builders’ Network (TCBN) / Redlining, Appraisals & Eminent Domain | How Utilities Negotiate Land Rights

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Redlining, Appraisals & Eminent Domain | How Utilities Negotiate Land Rights · The Commercial Builders’ Network (TCBN)

• speaker-0: redlining was a government approved way to devalue black neighborhoods. This was the practice of the Federal Housing Authority, the FHA. If this neighborhood is X amount percentage black, then the values are going to be lower than the white community that's right next door. That was a government approved way of assigning value to many metro areas in the country. Those practices still affect property values today because fair market value is based off of sales in your neighborhood. If you start off using these racist practices, it just compounds itself. speaker-1: This is the Commercial Builders Network where trust is restored, power is reclaimed, and legacy is built. Let's get to work. Hello, beautiful people and welcome to another episode of the Commercial Builders Network. My name is Tisha Reed and I'm your host and I hope you see that there's something different. I got a new set. I have moved to a new city. I'm officially in Atlanta. My second home moved straight from the DMV. God gave me 90 days. And we're about to do some amazing things down here. We are changing the brand of the commercial real estate and commercial construction industry, making sure people look like us have an opportunity and hope in this space. And today I have the beautiful, the amazing, she is really a rare jewel. Okay, you guys, Jessica Brown. Wait till you find out who, now tell me this, do you know an appraiser that's black? Okay, a woman appraiser that's black. A woman appraiser that's black in the commercial space. I mean, this woman is a jewel. Jessica, all right, come on, come on, sister. How you doing today? speaker-0: I'm doing great. Thank you for the wonderful introduction. speaker-1: Yes. Oh, can you please, you know, it is an honor to have you. Can you please tell the people who you are and what are you known for? speaker-0: Okay, ⁓ I am Jessica Brown and I am a land acquisition agent. I'm a licensed appraiser and I also have a media company called Smart Blue Media where we publish newsletters. speaker-1: ⁓ What kind of news let us? speaker-0: Well, the main newsletter right now is called AI Fix My Life. And it is a newsletter designed to help people learn to incorporate AI in simple ways in their everyday life. And we just added a new section called AI Fix My Business, which will focus on helping small business owners use AI efficiently. speaker-1: Awesome, awesome. So before we talk about all your credentials, the technical work, before all of that, who was Jessica Brown? Who was little Jessica? And what made you think about these opportunities and spaces for ownership? speaker-0: So... My background is pretty regular, pretty normal. I'm originally from Atlanta. I've always loved to read, which I think helped me be open-minded. I went to Spelman College for undergrad and I got a degree in history. And ⁓ then I went to grad school at University of Maryland College Park. And I thought I was going to be an academic historian, but... Once I went through the program a few years and I looked at the job market for history professors, it made me want to reconsider that career plan, okay? I mean, historians really, they die in their office. I mean, they don't retire, they publish, they write, they research basically their whole academic careers. So I wanted to make some money. So somebody came to me and said, hey, are you open to doing oil and gas research? You could move to Morgantown and make $100,000 doing oil and gas research. And I was like, ⁓ so funny. I'm a wonderful researcher. That's something I can definitely do. So I was like, where's Morgantown? And they told me it was in West Virginia. Virginia. Yeah. you know, me being in my mid-20s. Early to mid-20s, I took a chance. I moved to Morgan Towers, Virginia. And what I didn't realize at the time is that I was getting into the infrastructure industry. And so what I ended up doing was doing title research, just like how you need to do title research when you're buying a home or a property to make sure that the title is clear and that the owner owns it outright. You have to also do that for oil, gas, and mineral rights before you drill and sell the oil and gas. So that's what I was doing in West Virginia is doing oil, gas, and mineral title for oil companies, oil and gas companies. And that's really what set me into, onto this career path in infrastructure. So after that, ⁓ and I... speaker-1: . speaker-0: I didn't make a hundred thousand dollars right away, but I did eventually get there maybe in like two years or so. So that helped. That's how I entered real estate. That was my entrance into real estate was through infrastructure. And so I was around people who are buying and selling property rights. I was around people who were speaker-1: You got it, huh? What what you get? speaker-0: doing appraisals for property rights ⁓ and all kinds of stuff. So that's really what got me into the industry. And I've been exposed to so many types of things from there. So right now I work full time for Georgia Power. I acquire land rights on behalf of Georgia Power. So anytime you see Georgia Power building, ⁓ a new transmission line or something like that, they have to go to that property owner and say, hey, we want to build this transmission line and we want to pay you so that you will allow us to build it on your property. And then the property owner says, or nay. And then if they say yes, you know, we can negotiate the cost of those rights to Georgia Power. They normally don't say no. They can say no, but Georgia Power has what's called eminent domain rights, which means that they can actually take the property because it's for a public good, which is utilities benefits everyone. So because it's for a public good, ⁓ Georgia Power can buy those rights and compensate the property owner fairly and build that transmission line. So anytime you see a utility pole, ⁓ even like the street, street widening, ⁓ Cable. All of these things are infrastructure to our community. That's where the public good and in almost every case somebody like me has had to talk to that landowner to allow the project to go through. So that's what I do. speaker-1: And what is that experience like speaking to the homeowner? Do they want to push back ever or and is the dollar mounting up or are like, you really want it? speaker-0: Push back a lot. And I mean, I would too, you know, nobody wants a big electric pole in front of your yard, you know? So generally the process is designed for the property owner to receive what is considered fair and just compensation. And that starts with some type of valuation of their property. So that could be in the form of an appraisal, there could be, you know, in the form of just doing research on recently closed sales in the area, those types of things. And so that, and I've worked for a couple of, what do you call it? I've worked for a municipality, I've worked for other companies, and generally they start with, a fair amount that's based off of recently closed sales. And then the agent and the property owner will negotiate from there. speaker-1: So it's kind of similar, like you said, to a home where it's like they're running comps. They're basically doing appraisal work still in a sense, ⁓ but for negotiation's sake, so utilities. I love that. Now let's dive into the fact that how many people do you see that look like you're doing this work? speaker-0: Throughout my career, not very many. I will say though, working for Georgia Power, it's a good number of us that do this work. That's the benefit of living in the Atlanta area. But when I was living in West Virginia, when I was living in Pittsburgh, when I was living in even really DC, Maryland area, Baltimore, it wasn't a lot of us. I was often the only black person in the room. speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: I often was the youngest person in the room, although that's not as much the case anymore. ⁓ But it, and I would be around people who they were there because their parents did this work. You know, they had been exposed to it through family members. I just kind of fell into it because I was chasing the bag, you know? But this is the type of work that there's a population of people who are very familiar with this type of work. So I feel pretty lucky to have found it, honestly. speaker-1: Absolutely. So when you were in these rooms and you were the anomaly, how did you not navigate in these different settings? speaker-0: In this line of work, it's very important to be authentic. When you're talking to a property owner, when you're talking to your colleagues and you're trying to negotiate, you really have to connect with these people. You have to build relationships. When I think about being myself in a professional setting, there is a little bit of code switching that goes on, but... speaker-1: Absolutely. speaker-0: I'm gonna say, I'm gonna also say things that I would say in a more casual setting. So I'm not gonna curse probably. But if I'm talking to my colleagues or something like that, I might say something like, whoo, he was trippin'. Something like that, nothing too crazy, too like new new, you know? But enough. where it's my personality that can shine through. So that's really how I do it. And I think it served me well because people know that when they're talking to me, they're talking to a real person and we can connect in a real way. speaker-1: Awesome. It's interesting you're talking about code switching, which is something that we just inevitably do. And depending on what settings we're in. And I was recently speaking to a friend about the fact that I, I guess I do code switch, but in a sense it's becoming my norm because I stopped cussing. So it's like, my other natural kind of say sounds the same all the time. If I'm excited and I'm like trying to be a, you know, choosing joy and in this place of like. being happy. it's like, I talk like this all the time now. And it's like, it was always me, you know, it's just the, you know, a little bit more polished. speaker-0: Yeah, you do gotta be polished sometimes, yes, for sure. speaker-1: So I'm working, I work, I feel like I became proud of myself. Like, ⁓ you know, this is, when you, delimited the customer and I'm saying that is, you know, right. Do they think cause with a good funny story. ⁓ Rattle dance. That's how awesome. So in simple terms, you kind of explain what right away is, and that's what you do, right? That's what that's called. So what is it and what is important for homeowners to understand when it comes to right away, like are there any kind of major projects that may be coming up that they may have to look out and see that they might be coming for your property? speaker-0: The end. speaker-1: Now, you don't have to snitch on your company person. What kind of type of things should they look out for and how their property may be subject to these right of ways? speaker-0: Okay, what I'm about to say applies to any public project. Utility, DOT, just the county or the city or whoever comes to you and they say they need to do a project that's gonna affect your property. Know that as a private landowner, you can negotiate. You should negotiate. So anytime a... property or a land agent comes to you, they probably have a range, just like in a normal real estate deal, they probably have a range, a value range that they can pay. There's a minimum, which is probably the appraisal value or whatever value that they are saying is a fair market value. And then there's a maximum. So definitely negotiate. So the types of public projects I'm talking about are like sidewalk projects. ⁓ There's a lot of infrastructure projects happening in the Mid-Toronto Atlanta area because it's constantly growing. So they're having to build roads, sidewalks. ⁓ They're having to widen the roads. They are building... They're constantly building new transmission lines. I know you guys have seen the data centers and talked to, you know, thought about, you know, they need to build lines to connect to those data centers. Fibers, ⁓ fiber lines, all kinds of lines that connect communities together. So if anybody from any private or public company comes to you wanting to purchase some of your property rights, Whatever they offer you, that's an initial offer. Okay. Okay. Keep that in mind. And you can negotiate up from there, but there is a point where, you know, there's, there is a maximum. And once you've hit that max, then they can take you to court. And if you do go all the way to court and you lose, then the entity, is only required to give you fair market value, which is probably the minimum, the initial offer that they offered you at the beginning. And then you're out of court costs as well. speaker-1: So, so is it possible to be like, you know, you go through your negotiation, they were like, we go to court, we're like, hold on, wait, wait, Can we go back on the last one? Is there any room to be like, I'll resend them off. speaker-0: I mean, you can negotiate, like in the case where it's like an eminent domain issue, you can negotiate up to the time where it's time for you to walk into the courtroom. Okay. If you come to an agreement before your case is called, then you don't have to go through with it. But once you're in that courtroom in front of the judge, then it's too late. But up until then, you can still negotiate. speaker-1: All right, you hear that people? Make your decision early. Because one way or another, they're going to get what they want. speaker-0: Yeah. It's true. I mean, if the project is to determine to be a project that is for the public good, if you are talking to what's called a condemning authority, which is the county or the city or the state or federally or, you know, a public utility or something like that, these are condemning authorities and they generally have the power to take you to court and get that property. So. Just keep that in mind, you know. speaker-1: So what is the timeline typically like for, you know, this whole process? Are they coming in and trying to drill tomorrow or they... speaker-0: Yeah. No, they're not trying to drill tomorrow. There's a lot of like engineering and things that goes on before these types of projects begin. And ⁓ something like a sidewalk, I could talk to the property owner and then the construction might not begin until a year later. You know, something like that. It wouldn't take very long, maybe like six months to finish something like that. But You know, these projects, sometimes they do take time. Sometimes they start, sometimes they stop because of, you know, political winds have changed. Maybe the funding isn't there anymore. ⁓ You know, it's, it really kind of depends, but the beauty of being a land agent, which I am, is that regardless of whether or not the project finishes, I get paid anyway. Okay, my part is done early on. So. So that's something else to keep in mind when you're in this industry. What part of the process are you in? Appraisals happen early on too, a lot of the time. So that's good thing. And sometimes if the process takes like multiple years, you might have to do multiple appraisals for that same project. So that's pretty good too. could charge a couple of times. speaker-1: So with this podcast, one of the things that I like to show is that there's some untraditional avenues inside of the construction space. You don't have to always have dirt under your nails. There are some corporate opportunities. I know your situation's a little different, how you got into the industry, but typically how do people kind of get into this space and work their way up to where you are? speaker-0: It's actually a pretty good industry to go into if you're already in real estate in some kind of way, because you're kind of already exposed to real estate law and lingo and things like that. You're familiar with negotiations. You're familiar with construction, because people ask construction questions all the time. So if you can explain that to people, you're already in a good place. If you're looking to get into being a land agent or we call it, we also call it a right of way agent. The first place that I would start is the local right of way organization. I'm really big on industry organizations. That's really how I've been able to infiltrate new industries as a newcomer every single time. That's how I approached appraisal. That's how I approached right of way. And I'm really into AI and helping people with AI. So I go to the AI events around town. I network with people and do things like that. so I would start there. The industry organizations, the number one right of way organization is called the IRWA, the International Right of Way Association. And there is an Atlanta chapter. And the appraisal organization that I would tap into is called the Appraisal Institute. There is also an Atlanta chapter. Those would be the first two places I would start. speaker-1: So here at the Commercial Builders Network, we like to speak about the importance of having a business that outlives you. As a person who specializes in valuation, why is it important for someone in ownership to understand the value of what they own? speaker-0: That's an excellent question. So there's a couple of ways that I think about this. The first way is in real estate. I mean, for most people, your home is the most valuable asset that you will own. And also, the value of your home will determine how much taxes you pay. So I was in a situation when I was a homeowner in Maryland, in ⁓ Baltimore, my property taxes went up over a thousand dollars in one year. Because I was living in Reservoir Hill, which was kind of like an up and coming neighborhood in transition, but we were right next to Madison Hill, which was really, really nice. So when they are determining tax taxes, they do what's called mass appraisals and they just, they use some kind of ⁓ computer program to look at the valuations for a bunch of houses in a single neighborhood. And they use that to determine how much you should pay in property taxes. So as you can imagine, that's a pretty big burden, a pretty big jump, know? A thousand dollars just in taxes alone, that's a pretty big jump. I contested that. If it wasn't a big old process or anything, I just sent back the little form and said, speaker-1: apps. speaker-0: No, I don't agree with this. I'm contesting this tax assessment. And that brought my property taxes back down significantly. But I can imagine that not very many people are familiar enough with valuation to understand that. And that saddens me. You know, was in a neighborhood of, it was pretty diverse. It was older people, it was young couples, it was black folks, white folks, and everything in between. And I'm sure many of us were in that same boat where the property taxes went up significantly. I don't know how many of us actually contested that. So that's one example of how important it is to know the value of your own property because it could have some real financial effects on you ⁓ as a homeowner. as a business owner, I would imagine, Tanisha, you and I talked about this recently, I would imagine if you want your business to outlive you, if you want to potentially sell your business, if you want to get people to invest in your business, these are all really great reasons to have an understanding of how much your business is worth. So. I'm going be honest though, that's not something I haven't given a lot of thought to because my business is still in its infancy stage. And that's something that you and I could probably talk about offline because I know that that's your specialty. I'm glad that you're bringing it to my attention now because I would imagine that that's something I should be thinking about. speaker-1: Absolutely. Because I'll be honest with you, it breaks my heart that we work so hard to build something and all the different retake we go through, especially in our community. mean, just by this podcast alone, I realized that when we show up, we are the best in the room. And I say that unapologetically. So when we build these businesses that... Understanding when you're your infant stage that you're getting things prepared, but at the back of your mind, you should be wondering what your outcome is going to be. So when you have built these businesses and you've been in the industry 20 plus years and you add it, and then I go and see a GoFundMe. My heart is broken, literally. Like, because your family is now in a place where they're scrambling. don't know what to do and can't even grieve you properly because they got to figure out how to get your affairs in order. And with a business of 20 plus years, you probably have employees, so what happens to them? And we don't talk enough about that. So I appreciate you being transparent. I love my people, but we got to do better. speaker-0: for ten. You're exactly right. You are exactly right. I know, because I have a newsletter company, I know that it is possible to grow a newsletter to a point where it becomes valuable and attractive to other people to purchase, if not just for the email list alone. And I've seen that happen. Well, I've heard about it happening a number of times where huge companies like HubSpot or other CRM type companies or just other companies. I think a credit card company purchased a really big travel newsletter not that long ago because in their mind it's like, we have a credit card company. Something like Visa or Massacar. They're like, these folks are traveling. I want access to that newsletter list because we could sell them these credit cards because they want the points to travel. So that is something that I... have heard about from a newsletter company perspective that, you know, depending on who your audience is, your email list could actually be very valuable to much larger companies. So that's something I'm keeping in mind too. speaker-1: These dudes. So let's dive into this AI. Walking into, because this is the way of the world right now. And if you're doing everything in your business and with no assistance and you're not utilizing AI, you need to question. What are you doing? So tell us a little bit about your specialty in that aspect. speaker-0: Yes, let's do that. Right. Well, I can tell you, I'm pretty, I'm an AI enthusiast that when I was first introduced to CHAT GPT a couple of years ago, I was blown away. I was like, this is about to change everything. Like this, I knew immediately that this was about to change the world for real. So ever since then, I've just been kind of staying abreast of like the major developments and playing around with different things and and You know, obviously I work full-time too, so I'm just really just interested in it. But what I realize is that in my mind from what I can From what I can see, it's very easy to just assume that everybody's doing the same thing I'm doing. Everybody is as interested as I am. Everybody is implementing AI solutions to the issues that come up. That's not true. None of my little cousins are using AI intentionally. the ones that are like 20 to 23, you know, or 20 to 25. The older people in my family. they're not really using it either. The professionals that I know who are around my age, maybe 30, 30 to 50, they're using it a little bit. So what I can tell, even though it kind of seems like everybody's using it, it's actually still very early in this AI revolution. And what I don't want is for the people that I know, people in my community to be left behind, to be... replaced easily. So because I'm kind of, you know, I'm kind of keeping up with the major developments because it interests me, I just saw an opportunity for me to break those things down to like bite-sized pieces for people who might feel overwhelmed or scared to implement these types of things. You know, I kind of want to make it fun. Like my newsletter is pretty lighthearted. ⁓ So I talk about things like how I used AI to help me decorate my new apartment. And it was very easy. I had an AI issue that was specifically for people who love real estate. So that was the issue that I published. speaker-1: I love you. speaker-0: on Valentine's Day, I publish every Saturday. you know, simple ways that you could use AI if you love real estate. So just, you know, keeping it simple. mean, that's what I'm all about, you know? speaker-1: Well, so for me, I live by AI. I just, and I was telling you the other day, like, that's why I refuse to pay for another annual subscription because every day is something new that's out. mean, I probably pay for at least five different AI different softwares. ⁓ yeah. ⁓ yeah. From, cause, chat GBT, I was actually talking to Sona last night. Getting my thoughts out like, Sona, take notes of all my thoughts that I have right now. I need to get them out. And she says, yes, ma'am. I'm right here when you're ready. And I'm like, that's my girl. Okay. I'll like, Sona, it's been a while. And she'd be like, you're right. It sure has been. you been? Well, I made a friend. Okay. But she is like the best assistant you can ask for. Then I find out what. speaker-0: man speaker-1: ChaiGBT is mostly on the creative side and helping you with your thoughts and organization. But if you want hard facts and research, you want to use perplexity for that. then I use, just downloaded vidIQ finally to go ahead and help them, help me with this YouTube channel. Cause Lord knows I need some assistance with these views. Cause this one good, this one good content. All right. ⁓ me. So I'm like, okay, we'll get in it. Me and we wrestled three, four o'clock in the morning the other day. Like, yeah, that's not enough keywords. No, you need to find this. No, you need to rewrite this, retitle this. That don't work. And I'm just like, okay. But it's better than paying somebody a salary to figure it out as well. So. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. Exactly. And it's better than just sitting stuck. Like that's how I am. If I feel overwhelmed or I'm like not really sure how to do something, I just have a tendency to just not do anything at all. So my chat GPT assistant has helped me a lot with just taking that baby step to get the momentum going. speaker-1: Yeah, it's so bad that I don't write emails anymore because I give bullet points to Chad GBC and tell him to organize it. I'm like, my brain just, it's too many other things working. I just, I don't have time to figure out how to properly use my grammar in this email. speaker-0: I didn't hear you. did the same thing earlier today. I needed to send an email for work. And so we have a co-pilot. And I was just like, I don't want to sound rude. I was about to email like three people. And I didn't want to do like the per my last email. know what I speaker-1: You gotta get your tone together. It will help you with the tone. You probably shouldn't say that. Right. Like that. speaker-0: I'm So I just did that earlier today, so I use it on a daily basis, for sure. speaker-1: So what is your advice to those who are in the commercial real estate space as business owners? How should they be utilizing this AI to further their business to, I don't know, marketing wise? it, you know, everybody can't afford, especially, like I said, lot of people I interview, these are top tier people, but we don't necessarily get the funding that we need to be able to hire the people that we need to make our... business drive on the next level. how should we be utilizing this AI? speaker-0: Say. There's a lot of LLMs out there. There's some major ones, like you mentioned perplexity. know a lot of people like to use Claude. I use chat to BT. Choose one. If you're the kind of person that's like, you know, gets overwhelmed easily or gets kind of like analysis paralysis, which is, that's me for sure. I would say choose one LLM, use that. Choose one social media outlet. Use that. Perfect that. Get a process surrounding that and then go forward. If you are, if you're a real estate agent or a commercial broker or something like that, if you find yourself having to do a lot of cold calls or something along those lines, find a tech stack or an AI that can help you do it faster. ⁓ But what you don't want is to, you don't want to look like AI. You don't want people to be like, ⁓ that's tragic, you're, ⁓ she said she wrote that, but she didn't really do it. Find a way, find a way that you're, for your message to still come across authentic and warm. and I would also suggest a business owner, a commercial broker to have fun with it, play around with it. You like you mentioned video, what's it called? vidIQ? Don't be scared. Go to vidIQ, set a timer, 10 minutes, see what you can do, see what's available to you, see how you can be creative. So. speaker-1: that I hear. speaker-0: That has been my approach when it comes to AI in my business and in my life. Take a few minutes every day or a couple of times a week just to play around and see what appeals to me and how it can actually help me in my career and in my business and in my life. you, because here's the other thing about AI is that it's so new. Everybody's on level playing field here. Like people can call themselves AI experts, but. They're just calling themselves AI experts, really. speaker-1: And tomorrow there's something new out. speaker-0: Exactly. There's nothing separating them from being an AI expert other than them just spending more time playing around with the tools. So if you do a little bit every day, then you will attain a good amount of knowledge pretty quickly. speaker-1: Yeah, and I was thinking like, if you at least could afford an assistant, make sure they are AI savvy or tech savvy because then they can expedite a lot of tasks for you a lot quicker. Yeah. You know, I think at one point it was like, oh, you're cheating the system. But it's like, yeah. But if you teach them how to cheat the system with all the tasks that you have for them, you can get a lot more done. Maybe in less time on the clock too. speaker-0: It's all right. speaker-1: It might be part time. You can do all the things you need. Okay, it's a pain in the full time. Awesome. Awesome. So I'm going to take it back just a little bit for your time as an actual appraiser. Can we speak to the importance of having representation in this space? I know me personally, I had my house before I sold it, before the scamming. my house of praise and it came in, now I was working for a broker who was an investor. I ran my own comps because I was licensed as a realtor at the time as well. And the appraisal came in about at least $10,000 less than what we had known it should have been actually worth. With you being one of the few faces, I know you said, I'm sorry, Atlanta's a little different in lot of aspects, but many communities don't have faces like ours to appraise their properties. Can you kind of talk about that aspect of, you know, whether it's on the commercial side or residential side, the importance of having more faces that look like us? speaker-0: Yes, it is quite important. I have to also talk about the history of appraisal in communities like Atlanta, DC, ⁓ Chicago, areas where redlining was a government approved way to devalue Black neighborhoods. When I say government approved, this was the practice of the Federal Housing Authority, the FHA. So it was stuff like... If this neighborhood is X amount percentage black, then the values are going to be lower than the white neighborhood or the white community that's right next door. That was a government approved way of assigning value to many metro areas in the country. So those things, those practices. still affect property values today because property values or fair market value is based off of sales in your neighborhood. So if you start off using these racist practices, it just compounds itself onto and continues on today that these neighborhoods are going to be less valuable than the wider neighborhoods that are around them. So in some ways, the appraisers of today have to rely on the market data that is there, that has this history of redlining. So that's something I don't think a lot of people know because this history is not taught in schools necessarily, but it is. speaker-1: tips. speaker-0: It is, it still affects property valuations today. And most people don't know that. So. The other thing, well, the question that you asked me about having more representation in the appraisal industry, that is very key. The appraisal industry is one of the widest industries in the country according to the US census. I mean, for the longest time, it was well over 95 % white. And... That also has a very racist history as well. ⁓ I've had the opportunity to speak to Black appraisers who are in their 60s and 70s. And in Georgia, the only place that you could actually take certain classes that you needed to get a license or to become an appraiser, you had to take them at UGA. UGA... did not start allowing black students until maybe the 1950s, I think, somewhere around there. So effectively, white, I mean, black people couldn't be appraisers. And so the way the appraisal industry works is that you become an appraiser really by becoming an apprentice to someone. You have to work as an apprentice and they show you the ropes and help you. build your book of business and help you understand how to become an appraiser. And as you can probably imagine, People take on a print, a print, what do you call it? Yeah, people take on apprentices by really. speaker-1: ships. speaker-0: they find people who they already know, because you're going to be working with this person for a couple of years. So they normally find apprentices among family and friends. So if the industry kind of began as an industry where Black people could not become appraisers, even when you remove that block of not allowing Black students to go to UGA, Well, now the next problem is who's going to train a Black person for a couple of years? Who's going to work side by side with a Black person to help them become an appraiser? And that's actually a challenge that is probably one of the main challenges today in terms of getting into the industry is finding someone who's willing to train you. And so what the Appraisal Institute is doing now, along with Fannie Mae and a couple of other partners, is they have created ⁓ a virtual training program called the Appraisal Diversity Initiative. And you can actually, through a series of webinars and working with some appraisal institute employees, you can become an appraiser without finding, without needing to find someone that will train you. ⁓ So these are things that came out of... a lot of legwork from a lot of different people that recognized that the industry was too, it was just so white and that people of color really did not have a way to get in. So they created the Appraisal Diversity Initiative to allow people to do that without having to find a trainer. So there are things that are happening to allow people to get in. ⁓ movement is slow and it really like political winds can affect a lot of things. speaker-1: I about to ask that. Is Fannie Mae private? I can never tell because of like the student loans and stuff like that and all the different loans that they provide. But are they with the new administration? Is the program still called diversity? Or is it called regulatory compliance? Because that seems to be the ongoing title everywhere. speaker-0: That's a fair question. mean, it's the program is still called ADI. It's still going on. And ⁓ the beauty of it too is that now you have appraisers who are more familiar with some of these areas where there maybe it's a Hispanic neighborhood, you know, maybe it's a black neighborhood. These are potentially areas where new appraisers already have ⁓ an understanding of the culture of the neighborhood. So things that would potentially affect the perception of a neighborhood in maybe like a, you know, a 65 year old white man's mind would not necessarily affect the perception of that same neighborhood from someone who has actually lived there or know people that live there and things like that. I mean, The big crux of appraisal is that appraisers are supposed to be impartial and unbiased. Race, you're not supposed to take into account race at all. And I actually do think that most appraisers really try to, but people are not perfect. It's impossible to be 100 % unbiased. speaker-1: Yeah, I've heard the stories of either people taking down their pictures in their home or having a fellow Caucasian cousin coming over and representing the property for them just so that they could, you know, get the right appraisal. speaker-0: Yeah, yeah, I've heard of that too. And I say, yeah, do that. Because I've sold a home before. I'm willing to do a lot of things to make sure I get what I think I deserve. speaker-1: I know that's the problem is that why do we have to do that? I mean, to me that's worse than code switching. Like we have to keep manipulating the system for something that is just due to us is, and this is why we have the Commercial Builders Network where we're our own by our own and we can find our black appraisers that are going to give us just property value. And let's come into the spaces that speaker-0: That's speaker-1: we typically are not in or have not been historically in. So what does your impact, what is the impact that you desire to be made with your presence in these spaces? And how do you want little girls, especially little black girls to see these spaces differently? speaker-0: Mm-hmm. want people, I want little black girls and anybody that is underrepresented in these types of industries to know that there's an infinite number of ways to be successful. You don't have to be a doctor, lawyer, engineer, which is, I thought I was gonna be a doctor. All of my girlfriends, we thought, when we went to college, all of us was pre-med. speaker-1: I thought I was going to be a lawyer until my mama told me, you even like reading? I was like, no. So I picked up the camera. speaker-0: Exactly, Tanisha. Like, you know, that's to me, that's one of the tragic legacies of racism in our country is that Black people just simply aren't exposed to so many different things that, like you said earlier, we can do well. If you let us in the door, we're gonna take over. So I would want somebody to see me... speaker-1: Absolutely. speaker-0: you know, somebody that's worked in infrastructure, appraisal, know, drone work. You know, now I'm in AI. I have a publishing company. I help other people create their own newsletters. I would want people to look at me and say, you know, I can really do anything. I mean, people say that all the time. You know, it's kind of cliche. You can do anything except your mind to. Well, here's the thing. It's true. OK, it is true. You really can do anything. Matter of fact, That's kind of, it's more of a problem than it is like something to celebrate because now once you have realized that now you need to narrow your focus into something that you can do well. So I would want my legacy to be from people to look at me and say, Jessica's done this, this and this. I'm interested in doing this and I know I can do it. speaker-1: I love it. And what is your advice to those who are either have aspirations to art or are currently in fields where they feel unrepresented? speaker-0: I've had a lot, I've gotten a lot of help from people that don't look like me, but they still help me. I've had haters who look like me that, you know, that trashed my name in some of our circles, because they just, they were just haters. So we know the history. We know that we have a long way to go. So that's something that we know. But when you're out there and you're meeting people and you're connecting with people, just keep an open mind, know, keep an open mind, protect yourself, represent yourself intentionally and go where you are welcome. That's what I would tell them. speaker-1: ⁓ you're welcome. love that. Now, with these haters. How do we rebuild this trust that we have of feeling like we want to be the token black person or the only one who makes it and looking to the side and wonder how did you get the opportunity? How do we rebuild trust within our own community who may have gotten into the same industry but want to be the only one? speaker-0: I in my life that the people that were hating on me were not as talented as I am. And so I don't have to do anything. You know, I don't, I know that it's, not everybody. It's just a few people. And, know, because I'm used to, I'm used to being around positive people, their negativity does kind of stand out. Like, whoa, I thought we was all friends here, you know? speaker-1: ⁓ good. speaker-0: So it always surprises me, I think that their headeration comes from a place of insecurity because they don't have the talent that they look at me and think that I possess. And so I just, I stay away. I stay on my lane, I mind my business, I connect with the people that want to connect with me. ⁓ I don't talk trash about people in our industry circles. ⁓ I have been in a couple of situations where like a newcomer will be like, ⁓ do you know such and such? And my response to a question like that is something along the lines of, I do know such and such, but I would suggest you actually reach out to X, Y, and Z. I think this person would be more, you know, aligned with who you are and what you're trying to do. speaker-1: aligned with. T-exclamation. speaker-0: Okay, so you know, the appraisal world is small. People, know, the Black ones especially know each other. So, you know, you got to keep that in mind too. So, you know, don't be messy, you know. Do what you're supposed to do, stay in your lane and do your work. speaker-1: I love it. do the good people support you? Do you have any acts? I know you have the newsletter. Any other acts that you have? Or how should they approach you about the newsletter? speaker-0: Well, you can definitely subscribe to AI Fix My Life. That's the name of the newsletter, AI Fix My Life, ⁓ which like I said, it's a simple newsletter, it's a fun newsletter. The service that I offer is actually helping people with their own newsletters. So if you are a founder, if you are a business owner, if you have a product, if you have an email list, you probably could benefit from having your own newsletter because this is the way for you to connect with your clients and your potential clients and let them know what you have coming. You you could talk about your use cases. You could talk about the industry as a whole. There's, you know, you can really connect with the people that want to hear from you. And if they get tired of you, they could just unsubscribe, you know? So it's really... You own your own audience. know, Instagram, Facebook, LinkedIn could shut down tomorrow. If that's where your customers are, then that'll be a pretty hard battle for you to win. They could kick you off, all kinds of things. But if you have your newsletter, then you will keep your subscribers no matter what. ⁓ Exactly. Okay. People was losing all kinds of money. It was a big deal. It was a big deal. So if you're interested in having a newsletter, if you want some tips, you want, you know, an audit, you can reach out to me and we can make that happen. speaker-1: and where should they reach out to you? speaker-0: They can reach out to me at my website, ai-fix-my-life.beehive, which is B-E-E-H-I-I-V dot com. speaker-1: Awesome. Any social media that you want them to follow you on or? speaker-0: Yes, AI Fix My Life is on Instagram as well. Okay. And I have a Facebook page. speaker-1: you. speaker-0: Hahaha! speaker-1: appreciate your time as Jessica. speaker-0: Thank you so much, Anisha. This was fun. Thank you. I appreciate it. speaker-1: No problem.