Latest / Sex Advice for Seniors Podcast / Never too Old to Learn about Sex

Transcript

Never too Old to Learn about Sex · Sex Advice for Seniors Podcast

• 0:07
  SPEAKER_01: Hi, I'm Suzanne and you're listening to Sex Advice for Seniors.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_01: Today I am with a sex educator and a sex therapist.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_01: coming all the way from Seattle, Washington.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks to the beauty of the internet, we're able to connect.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_01: Austin Cressap, so lovely to have you here.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_01: You can't see her, but I'll probably stick a picture in the summary.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_01: Because you're quite a young person to be talking with us old people about our sex lives.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: How did that come about, Austin?
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I am 35.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_02: And depending on who I'm with, that's either old or young.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_02: And when it comes to this topic, I understand that I am definitely on the younger end.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_02: And how I started talking about elderly intimacy and senior sex.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_02: When I started going through the program to become a sex therapist,
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_02: my grandma started calling me with questions.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, wow.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_02: And she would call me maybe once a week.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_02: And the questions progressively got more descriptive.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_02: What there was, you know, can you explain the gender spectrum?
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_02: And what goes where in a threesome?
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_02: And do men use vibrators?
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_02: And
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_02: I was so willing to have these conversations with her and it really made me realize
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_02: how little education and how misinformed she was throughout her whole life.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_02: And that's such a disservice.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like everyone, no matter what age, should be able to feel pleasure and have intimacy.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_02: And so that just kind of
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_02: catered me into creating a space for people to come and ask questions and learn and
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_02: maybe get rid of some bad information and take home some new tips and tools.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_01: And was your grandmother still married to your grandfather at this time?
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, they were high school sweethearts.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_02: They just celebrated, oh gosh,
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_02: Their 67th anniversary, I think.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, wow.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_01: My parents just celebrated their 65th this past weekend.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_01: At this point, you just lose track, right?
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, my relationships barely last 65 days.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how do you do that?
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I think, you know, I don't know how healthy or unhealthy, they're still around, right?
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, they're still around.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_02: They still have their own version of intimacy and slowly learning the different
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_02: ways they can engage with that and try to get both of their needs met and then
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_02: exploring what they can do on their own to also get those needs met.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_01: And is that a revelation for them at this age?
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_01: Are you the sort of mediator in this situation?
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_02: My grandpa doesn't really share too much or ask many questions, but my grandma sure has.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_02: And I...
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_02: She's not going to listen to this, so I think it'd be okay if I share, but, or maybe she will.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_02: I bought her her first toy.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_02: And so that was a brand new experience for her.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_02: And she doesn't get into too much detail, but expresses appreciation.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_01: And can I ask,
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_01: because,
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_01: like I remember finding my mother's vibrator back when I was a kid,
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_01: right?
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_01: It was like this hard plastic bullet-shaped thing that screwed at the bottom.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_01: It had like two big, fat, chunky batteries in it.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_01: And it was really basic, right?
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_01: I don't... If I...
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_01: I'm curious to know, what did you buy your grandma as her first toy?
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_01: I got her a Hitachi wand.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_01: Did you, buddy?
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_01: Hell, that's hardcore.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_01: The mini one, just the mini one.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, the mini one.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I saw one of those.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_01: I still think it's pretty hardcore though.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yes,
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_02: but we talked about,
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_02: trying over different layers of fabric and trying out,
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_02: around areas to see what feels good.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_02: But I didn't want anything with too many bells or whistles or something, you know, that...
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_02: It has multiple components.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_02: I thought it would start off pretty easy.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_01: I'm still – I test loads of toys,
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_01: and I have to say – and my friend is like,
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_01: oh,
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_01: you should really,
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_01: like,
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_01: create your own toy.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_01: And I keep thinking,
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_01: but I'm so basic because no matter – you know,
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_01: I love lots of different toys,
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_01: but honestly,
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_01: most of them have got so many –
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_01: settings.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_01: I mean,
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_01: the other day I was just trying to turn this one on that I got,
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_01: and I couldn't even figure out how to turn it on.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my God, I'm going to have to, because I think all the instructions were on the internet.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_01: I thought I'm going to have to do this.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_01: So I can totally appreciate getting your grandma something that's just got like one button and
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_01: um because my favorite one is just like this little bullet that was like 10 bucks
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_01: and yeah and it's like it's honestly it just does what it needs to do it's got like
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_02: three three speeds and it's yeah and once you're setting and your rhythm you like
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_02: you don't mess with the other ones
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's just fine.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_01: But anyway, yeah.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_01: So that's, that's fascinating.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_01: My mother and I have also like tipped around the edges of this topic.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_01: And my mother actually said to me the other day,
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_01: she's like,
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_01: I think it would shock you if I told you what we were up to.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, love that.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_01: God, now I'm curious, like what is happening?
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_01: But anyway,
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_01: we talk,
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_01: we joke about being older and introducing much older people to new things like toys
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_01: and vibrators and stuff.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_01: But one of the things that I noticed in reading about you was that you
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_01: You were we were we were and we were discussing earlier about,
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_01: what happens when you get to an age where you start experiencing pain or you start
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_01: or illness starts to,
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_01: you start to become chronically ill.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_01: You may need to take drugs.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_01: You know, how does that impact on sex?
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_01: And I know that you've got some thoughts on that.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_02: My foundation for all the work I do is about communication.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_02: And that is going to be communicating with our partners about what we're
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_02: experiencing and then communicating with our doctors.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm not quite sure how it is over there,
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_02: but over here,
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_02: unfortunately,
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_02: the bedside manner is not great.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_02: And doctors don't get a lot of education around sex, especially for sex for older folks.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_02: And so when people are going in for an illness or an injury or a surgery,
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_02: they're not having conversations about how will this impact my intimacy?
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_02: How will this impact my sexual functioning?
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_02: Or they're getting put on medication to help reduce one symptom or one pain point
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_02: and not finding out how this will impact sex drive.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_02: And so I really encourage people to have conversations of,
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_02: okay,
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_02: after we do symptom management,
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_02: how do you want to feel?
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_02: What do you still want to be able to do?
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_02: And how can we navigate that?
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_02: This includes like after surgery,
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_02: like hip surgery or knee surgery,
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_02: what do I need to do if I want to be intimate again?
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_02: And this is where some tools can be really helpful, like a wedge pillow or
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_02: There's this excellent like springy bench that's made for gardening,
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_02: but can hold quite a bit of weight and you can put it right over someone.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_02: And that's really helpful.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_02: So you don't have to use your knees or hips too much.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_02: And there's lots of tools out there to help, but they're not being discussed.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_01: And so I've spoken with them a while back, actually.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_01: I spoke with a sexual health nurse who was somebody who worked alongside doctors
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_01: when people were recovering from surgery or,
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_01: diagnosed with cancer or whatever and wanted to discuss their sexual life.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_01: And she struggled to get referrals.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_01: Like doctors, either they just didn't know that she existed or
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_01: There was a huge amount of discomfort around this topic in relation to everything
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_01: else that they were dealing with,
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_01: right?
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, oh, let's just get you back on your feet again.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_01: Let's not worry too much about whether or not you can have sex, right?
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_01: So how do you, do you work with doctors?
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_01: And is that part of your role?
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_02: I don't at the moment.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_02: I'm trying to figure out how I can.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_02: could do that legally with like being a support or an advocate for someone going to a doctor.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_02: The closest I've been able to get is I'll do a little consulting and help them come
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_02: up with questions to write down because I don't know about you,
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_02: but when I'm in a doctor's office,
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_02: all the questions I had go right out the window because they're poking and pushing
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_02: and they have their 20 minutes or 10 minutes they have with you.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_02: And so having the questions written down is really helpful.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_02: But I wish we had some sort of like liaison that could be going to these visits
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_02: with the patients to really make sure that they're getting the support they need or
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_02: the options.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_01: I mean,
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_01: just generally the feedback that I get from so many older people is that when it
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_01: comes to talking about their intimate life and
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_01: Doctors almost,
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_01: many doctors,
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_01: unfortunately look at them like,
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_01: I don't really understand why we're having this conversation.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_01: Like what's, you know, why do you want this?
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_01: What's this about for you?
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: They don't, they kind of think that that's a nice to have as opposed to a,
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_01: this is a really important part of my life that I want to continue.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_01: I mean,
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_01: it's interesting,
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_01: like one question I,
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_01: and I don't know if there's any symptoms of any of this,
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_01: but you know,
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_01: recently I've been to see a cardiologist because there's a history of,
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_01: of,
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_01: of cardiovascular disease in my family.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_01: So at a certain point, everybody gets offered statins, right.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's just like, you know,
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_01: Do you want statins?
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_01: Because you can have statins, la, la, la, la, la, and all of this.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm just generally against taking any medicine that is not absolutely essential.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm not at risk.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_01: My last test revealed I'm not at risk.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_01: But then I started reading some of the symptoms of statins,
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_01: which is about muscle pain and stuff like that.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_01: And I didn't read anything about sex at all.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_01: And I didn't know, but there was a worry inside me.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_01: If I take this stuff, is it going to make it longer for me to have an orgasm?
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_01: It already takes me ages.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_01: But they don't talk about this.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, they don't.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_02: They really don't.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_02: And
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_02: there's this unfortunate bias that at a certain age,
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_02: people don't want to have sex,
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_02: which just blows my mind.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_02: Cause I, whenever I hear that, I look at the person and say, do you ever want to stop?
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_02: Like, and if they aren't having sex, it feels good.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_02: They'll say like, oh yeah, I can take it or leave it.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that's a different conversation, but there's so many ways to like enjoy and experience pleasure.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_02: And that doesn't have to stop at any age.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_01: No, no.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_01: And as you said,
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_01: one of the things about your grandparents is understanding the importance of self-pleasure,
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_01: which of course,
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_01: even at my age,
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_01: we weren't really taught anything about masturbation.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_01: It wasn't really discussed at all.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_01: We kind of had to, especially as women, we just had to kind of, if we were lucky-
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_01: we happened upon our clitoris when, oh, that feels really good.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I think I'll stay down there for a while.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_01: But for most people older, I suspect it just really wasn't spoken about at all.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_01: So to discover this at this age, it must be quite revolutionary for them.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_02: And having conversations with older folks is also making me realize how many people
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_02: experience pain with penetration.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_02: And because of how little research that's been done or the more recent research on
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_02: female bodies,
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_02: they're just,
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_02: they don't want to have sex because it's been painful their whole lives.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_02: And they didn't know that that's not normal.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_01: I mean,
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_01: somebody told me in one conversation that 50% of all women over 50 struggle with
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_01: vaginal atrophy,
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_01: which I didn't even know about,
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_01: which is a crazy number,
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_01: which of course,
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_01: relatively the same number of men struggle with erectile dysfunction,
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_01: but there's no shortage of information and opportunities for them to get that
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_01: sorted out,
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_01: right?
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_01: We can just go to the local pharmacy and pick something up here by just filling in a questionnaire.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_01: Whereas if you go for,
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_01: well,
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_01: firstly,
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_01: if you go for vaginal dryness here to the pharmacy,
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_01: they'll,
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_01: they'll point you to the loop section,
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_01: right?
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_01: Which we have, um,
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_01: Half those products I would not put in my body if you paid me money, right?
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_01: Because I look at the ingredients and it's like just all chemicals, right?
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_01: And these are like the most popular brands.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_01: So nobody has a clue.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_01: They're going and they're like, oh, orange flavor.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, that sounds lovely.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_01: You know, stick it in my vagina.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_01: Some orange flavored loops, absolutely revolting.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_01: And, and so we, there's no education.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_01: There's not,
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_01: and these,
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_01: and the pharmacies don't know that this stuff isn't good for you either because
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_01: their sales force is just going out and just buying a load of stuff going.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_01: There's that women problem sorted out over there on shelf aisle B, right?
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yup.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_02: I, I recommend coconut oil.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_02: It is natural.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_02: It works.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_02: Um,
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_02: There's different ways you can work with that, especially if you're having like consistent dryness.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_02: A wonderful pelvic floor specialist told me about getting a tiny ice cube tray and
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_02: putting coconut oil and freezing it.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_02: And then pop one up there.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_02: And as it slowly melts, you will be lubricated throughout the day.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_00: Ah, interesting.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: As long as you're not using latex condoms, you're fine.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 15:13
  Yep.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_00: No,
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_00: in fact,
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: somebody was telling me the other day that if you're allergic to vaginal estrogen,
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_01: that coconut oil is one thing that's recommended.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_00: The ice cube trick is a new one.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, interesting.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: And of course,
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: the other thing is,
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_00: of course,
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_00: that,
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_01: when often with pain and illness comes weight gain,
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_00: comes feelings of insecurity about your body and all of that,
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_00: which also can just impact on how attractive you feel.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_02: And there's,
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_02: we mentioned it a little bit,
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_02: there's a lot of discussion about size diverse couples.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, there's a lot of biases connected to that, too.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_02: What shape body is allowed to have sex?
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_02: And that is interesting.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think I can swear here.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_02: That is not good.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_02: I think that's bullshit because that's, you know, it doesn't matter your age or your size.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_02: Like you are allowed to enjoy pleasure.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_02: And there's so many,
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_02: there's so many messages we get all the time about what we aren't or what we should
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_02: be or how we're not enough.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_02: And it is really hard to push against that and try to look at ourselves and enjoy ourselves.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_02: And if we can't,
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_02: find one happy thing or one thing we love while we look in the mirror, then start neutral.
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_02: What can my body do for me?
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_02: I'm so happy.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_02: My lungs are working.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_02: I've got my legs that carry me through the day and you keep on that neutral,
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_02: neutral plane until you can start to add in.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_02: I love my eyelashes.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_02: I love, I love my boobs, whatever it is.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_02: And that is really important.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_02: And then when you're having sex with different size people, like,
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_02: It is okay to say,
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_02: I need to move this part of my body so you can get to that part of my body and find
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_02: ways to make it intimate.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't have to be, I mean, it can be awkward and that's fine.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_02: Be playful.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_02: We need to explore because what's going to feel good one day might not in another week or another year.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_02: And so being open to exploring is really helpful.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and you mentioned like the little pillow.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: I bought one of these.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_01: It was like a blow-up wedge the other day because I saw somebody using one,
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_01: and I was like,
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: oh,
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: that's kind of interesting,
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_01: and it was like $10.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, it was this blow-up thing, and it was brilliant.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_01: It was just like it was great for like lifting up the pelvis,
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_01: great for just like a really useful thing to have made –
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_01: certain positions a lot more comfortable.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's the thing is like,
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_01: there is stuff out there that if stuff feels uncomfortable,
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_01: either go and speak to a specialist or Google,
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_01: like,
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_01: how can I have sex on my side in a comfortable way?
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_01: Or I just had a hip replacement operation.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_01: What can you recommend?
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I said to somebody actually asked me the other day,
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_01: said they had a hip replacement operation.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't know what to say other than possibly spooning.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's a good one.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_02: I always try to recommend like a little bit of stretching around that area.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe even like if you have any
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_02: CBD cream can be really helpful for reducing a little pain,
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_02: but like get some movement in the joints first before you jump right into something.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_02: Like I hope there's some buildup before anyways, but work that in.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_02: So your body is ready to, to be in these different positions.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, I always say, you know, sex shouldn't be painful unless you want it to be.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_02: And there's so many,
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_02: there,
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_02: there's so many tools out there,
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_02: whether it is a wedge pillow to lift up your hips or
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_02: Or a sleeve to put around a penis if you have arthritis in your hands and your
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_02: wrists and you can't do that for your partner or yourself or your jaw can't handle that.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_02: There's plenty of tools out there that can stimulate those sensations without
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_02: putting the strain on your body.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, for sure.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_01: If only they'd learn how to make the instructions with bigger types so that older eyes could read them.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_01: There's one,
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_01: only one toy that's actually been designed for people with mobility issues by Love
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_01: Life called Love Life and Rev by Oh My Bod.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_01: And the instructions are with really big letters.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_01: And Suki, who's the founder of Oh My Bold, actually designed this.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_01: So it's got like,
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_01: you just slip your fingers in and it's got this little shape and you can hold onto
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_01: it like that.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_01: But I was so glad to see that the instructions were actually with big writing
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_01: because mostly I've struggled to read any of the instructions on these things.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_01: I just really do struggle.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, I mean, I think, you know,
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_01: going back to buying a vibrator for your grandma.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_01: There's no cutoff age when it comes to buying sex toys or sex pillows or sex
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_01: furniture or whatever you happen to need.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, the point of sex furniture actually is to make sex more comfortable, right?
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_01: All those wedges and all of that sort of stuff just gets you into the position
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_01: without you having to do too much.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_01: So
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_01: I suspect it's great for people who, you know, who might struggle otherwise.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_01: And, but yet it's never marketed to older people, right?
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's just like, it's always got a picture of some young hot couple on the, on the,
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_01: packaging and you and i suspect people just think oh this stuff's not for me you
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_02: know it's not meant for me yeah i just there is another toy it's uh it's in
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_02: australia i don't know if they're distributing it anywhere else yet called luddy
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_02: l-u-d-d-i oh i don't know that one and it's made for people with pretty extreme
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_02: mobility um
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_02: Differences.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_02: Where it is silicone.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_02: It's in a charging pad.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_02: You can slip it right off and place it where you need it.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_02: It can curve.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, wow.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_02: You can sit on it.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_02: And I don't know how big the type is for the instructions, but they are like disability centered.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_02: So I really hope that they would do that.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_01: That's very, very, very cool.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_01: Luddy.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_01: And did you tell your grandmother about cock rings?
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_02: yes i've had a conversation about that and i i i think that one is not in the cards
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_02: for them at this time but uh definitely learned quite a bit from that yeah i spoke
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_01: to this guy it's like always put a ring on it so i'm always i'm always i'm gonna
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_01: call myself the queen of cock rings because every time
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_01: Every time it's just like there on my bedside,
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_01: never,
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_01: never think like it's always going to,
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_01: yeah,
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_01: it's just,
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_01: it's just what it needs to do.
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_01: But it's,
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_01: you talk about the body confidence thing that there's been this massive uproar this
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_01: week about Bridgerton and the mixed weight debate,
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_01: which has gone viral and people getting very incensed about the fact that this has
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_01: become a
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_01: Such a huge topic of discussion.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_01: And I always think that when we,
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_01: it's hard enough being older,
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_01: looking at your wrinkles and everything without then having to face up to this huge
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_01: furor because God forbid some woman who's,
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_01: a plus size is going out with a guy who's not.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, why is this in the news?
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_01: Why is this of interest to anybody?
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_01: Great question.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_02: Because they can market us and sell things to make us try to be this different thing that we're not.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_02: I think a lot of it comes down to what a professor of mine called visual diet.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_02: And pay attention to what we're watching and reading and listening to.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_02: And what are the body shapes of those people?
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_02: What are the colors and ethnicities?
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_02: And there's so many differences in people that might not be represented in the media we're watching.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_02: And so trying to actively incorporate more shows or books about people who live in
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_02: different bodies than yourself can really help normalize the very wide range
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_02: array of body sizes we have yeah yeah for sure that could be really helpful yeah
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_01: i'm i was in a naked village in france a few weeks ago it's the only naked village
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_01: in the world and most of the people there are older um because a lot of naturists
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_01: just are older and there are some very large bodies there naked bodies and some
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_01: very small body i mean basically like any body shape you can think of and
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_01: is there people with scars people with cellulite people with you know whatever
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_01: wrinkles everything and um and it really when people say god i could never go to a
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_01: place like that i always say well for me it's about it really makes me feel
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_01: positive about my body because i realize we're all a different shape we're all a
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_01: different size and it's just about being comfortable
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_01: And once you remove all that media expectation around what you should or should not be,
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_01: and you see people just wandering around in the nude,
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_01: just happy as anything,
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_01: you realize that,
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_01: yeah,
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_01: it's just,
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_01: it's just what goes on in our own mind.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_01: It's like nothing, nobody's demanding anything out there except, you know, we're, we're,
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_01: except what we think we're being told all the time.
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_01: And it's whether or not we choose to believe it.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_01: But it's hard.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_01: It is hard.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_01: I know people find it really difficult.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_01: I watched a woman doing a TikTok video.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_01: She's about to be 70 and she's,
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_01: doing this thing, I'm 69 and I'm dating, like all her videos start, I'm 69 and I'm dating.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_01: And she got somebody trolling her saying,
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_01: ooh,
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_01: who'd want to see two wrinkly bodies rubbing up against one another,
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_01: right?
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_01: And she just was like, well, because why wouldn't you?
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_01: Because when you're lying down, everything evens out anyway.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_01: And it's just...
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_03: I love it.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's really funny about the whole thing.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_01: I thought she was so sweet.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm meeting her tomorrow.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_01: I'm quite excited.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_01: But I thought you do have to be very resilient to be able to put up with some of
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_01: the nastiness that's out there around body shapes.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_01: Do you have any tips for people who may feel self-conscious about how they look,
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_01: especially as an older person?
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_02: Um,
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_02: well,
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_02: first,
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_02: a lot of those comments from hateful people on the internet or around,
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_02: they're projecting their biases,
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_02: their misinformation and their insecurities out onto others.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_02: And so you don't like that, that saying from childhood, I'm rubber and you're glue.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like that makes so much more sense now that I'm older and understanding,
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_02: like you can say whatever you want.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_02: That is your opinion.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_02: I don't need to hold on to that.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_02: Hmm.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_02: saying that is so much easier than doing it.
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_02: So really practicing gratitude for yourself,
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_02: what you have,
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_02: what you've accomplished in life,
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_02: like just the fact that you've been through life,
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_02: like life,
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_02: life's pretty wild and pretty difficult sometimes.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_02: And being able to get through it is, is wonderful.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_02: And finding out what feels good for you.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_02: And then there's some really great resources out there.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_02: Like the body is not an apology is an incredible book about our bodies.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I haven't heard about that one.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, Sony Renee Taylor is wonderful.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_02: And I try to make every one of my clients read the book.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_02: They don't always,
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_02: but it is so much about how we don't need to apologize for how we take up space,
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_02: whether we're in a larger body or we're white or we're black or whatever.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_02: We don't need to apologize for existing.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_02: And how can we bring that appreciation back and own who we are and the space we
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_02: take up and maybe even take up a little bit more?
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_01: Cool.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's funny because you're just a little bit older than my son.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_01: And I see so much more body dysmorphia and stuff around your age group,
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_00: frankly,
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_01: than I do amongst my own.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, yeah, sure.
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_01: We don't like our wrinkles and we may feel a bit unattractive and fat and wonder
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_01: where did our middle suddenly come from and all of that kind of thing.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_01: But,
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_01: when I see what younger people have to put up with now,
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_01: I think,
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_01: oh,
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_01: God,
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so glad I'm so much older.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't have to put up with a lot.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, sure.
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_01: Of course.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I do.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_01: I'm still very conscious about, like, areas of my body that I wish were a little less wrinkly.
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_01: But it is what it is.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_01: And I can't really do that much about it.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, but when I see younger people, I think, God, we had it pretty easy, actually.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_01: most of us growing up we didn't have too many images being chucked at us and you
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_01: know yeah sure i get trolled this woman gets trolled like i've just decided like
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_01: the good thing about social media is that well at least on tiktok anyway is i don't
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_01: know if you do it on the other ones but you can actually block specific words so i
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_01: just i just block granny it's great
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_01: I just brought granny,
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_01: grandmother,
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_01: like anything,
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_01: because I know that most of the trolls are just going to use the word granny and
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_01: son negative way.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_01: Like, hey, granny or something.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_01: So if they say granny, I don't see their comments.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_02: That's great.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_02: I should probably be a little bit more strategic about that.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_01: So just think about the shit words that people use.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_01: And you can just get them blocked.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, so that's what I do.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_01: Anytime I see a repetitive word come up.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_01: which is always in a negative context.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just like, yeah, I'll just add that word to the words, the block words.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_01: And sometimes they actually often now remove negative comments as well.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_01: So I don't seem to see as many shit ones as I used to.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_01: I did go through a phase where I thought, God, you know, there are...
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_01: there seem to be a huge amount of trolls, but recently it's not been, it's not been so bad.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_01: In fact, everybody's been pretty encouraging.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_01: And the only thing I'm inundated with is young men from Ghana who want to marry me.
• 30:21
  SPEAKER_01: I don't, I don't see them as very harmful, frankly.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_01: But,
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_01: but yeah,
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_01: I mean,
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_01: I think,
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_01: I think as you,
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_01: as you pointed out with your grandparents and with my parents,
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_01: I,
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_01: you're never too old to learn about this shit.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_01: There's no cutoff point.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, if you still have desire, if you still want to experience pleasure, you can be, you can be,
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_01: 60, it can be 70, 80, 90.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_01: It doesn't matter.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and your grandparents are inspirational.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_02: I agree.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_02: I agree.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_02: They've, they've been so wonderful in my journey of this and little do they know.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_02: Um,
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_02: but it's just,
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_02: I feel so grateful that I have a grandma that was willing to,
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_02: well,
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_02: she gave me sex talks until I was 20 with,
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_02: when I gave, when I responded with grandma, I think I could teach you some things.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_02: She didn't like that.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_02: And then now I'm a sex therapist and sex educator and, and I now teach her things.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_02: So it's, um, it's, it's really wonderful to, to have someone being so open to do that.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_02: And I just try to give that space back, um,
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_02: In the workshops I do,
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_02: I've had to shorten the actual workshop part and make more time for the Q&A because
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_02: once one question gets going,
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_02: people just really let them roll and they're curious about so many things.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_02: And why don't we have spaces like that for more people, regardless of age?
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I don't know, but I think we should start them.
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, well, you're doing it.
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_01: I love it.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_01: Another new business opportunity,
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_01: like,
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_01: like consciousness,
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_01: sexual consciousness raising sessions for older people.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_01: Or something.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_01: I need it.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that sounds good.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_02: It does.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_02: It's got a ring to it.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_02: I'm ready.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_02: Let's do it.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_01: I'm going to go and I'm going to go away and think about that one.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_01: Look, honestly, no, seriously, though, I should stop.
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_01: But now you've inspired me in my business head.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_01: But I was thinking one of the things that Ashton Applewhite,
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_01: who you may or may not know,
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_01: she did a book called This Chair Rocks and a TED Talk about getting older.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_01: She doesn't really talk about sex,
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_01: but she just talks about ageism and what it means to be an older person.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_01: And she does these kind of like consciousness raising groups.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_01: And she's got an online toolkit called
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_01: which is basically like if you want to set up a group in your town and you want to
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_01: talk about ageism and stuff,
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_01: like she gives you a format and a way that you can start those conversations and
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_01: some things that you could do.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_01: So we could easily do that and just put it on my website,
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_01: your website,
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_01: as just as an opportunity for people to go and engage
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_01: download something that they could use if they want to start a little group locally
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_01: to open up the conversation about sex and older age.
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 33:30
  SPEAKER_01: Why not?
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_02: I love that idea.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_02: I'll have to get that information before we end.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_02: We need to think about that one.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_02: I thought,
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_02: when I started having these conversations with my grandma and sharing with some
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_02: colleagues and
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_02: um,
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_02: I've been encouraged to do a podcast called sex talks with grandma,
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_02: where I bring on different grandparents and what is the topic we're focusing on?
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, you're, you're very much doing this, but I just creating more spaces would be really helpful.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_01: I think having,
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_01: I've spoken to,
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_01: there's another woman I've spoken to,
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_01: I'll hook you up with called Kelly Connell.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_01: She's another sex educator.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_01: And she goes into like care, you know, social care homes and senior living places.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_01: And she does talk.
• 34:17
  SPEAKER_01: So maybe we can get something together like a little toolkit.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_01: And then I can create a little map so people can find their nearest ones.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that would be difficult to do.
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_01: That would be.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I do them all over Washington.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_02: So if any listeners want that in Washington, I am available.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_02: Brilliant.
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway,
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_01: it's been so lovely to talk to you and you've really inspired me now to think about
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_01: yet another thing that I need to do.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 34:41
  Always.
• 34:41
  Always.