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Fossil fuels and nuclear power kept the lights on during February’s cold snap · Cultural Wars | America Out Loud News

• 0:07
  Mainstream media has betrayed our trust.
• 0:10
  Rather than tell us the whole story about the important issues of the day, they tell us only what they want us to hear.
• 0:16
  Your hosts, Tom Harris and Todd Royal will bring you the other side of the story.
• 0:27
  According to uninformed environmental activists, we must switch from coal, oil, natural gas, and nuclear power to wind and solar power to supposedly save the climate.
• 0:38
  Todd and I have repeatedly shown in this program that there's nothing wrong with the climate.
• 0:43
  Sure, it's changing as it always has.
• 0:45
  But today's climate is relatively benign in comparison with many events during Earth's long history.
• 0:52
  However, the ideologically driven climate scare is not just causing a colossal waste of taxpayers' money, it's also making our power grids less reliable when we need them the most.
• 1:02
  And sadly, that translates into real world deaths when power goes out during our coldest nights in the depths of winter.
• 1:10
  To give us a better understanding of the impact of trying to transition from a reliable fossil fuels and nuclear to flimsy wind and solar power, we have invited Wisconsin-based champion for climate and energy truth, Frank Lesay back to the program.
• 1:25
  Frank is senior policy analyst with the committee for Constructive Tomorrow or CFAC and is the author of an important 2024 book, Climate and Energy Lies.
• 1:35
  Expensive, dangerous, and destructive.
• 1:38
  Frank also leads a group called Truth and Energy and Climate.
• 1:42
  And you can check them out at Truth and Energy and Climate.com.
• 1:46
  He has great weekly curated energy and climate information, in short, easily digested and very entertaining format.
• 1:53
  You should check it out.
• 1:54
  Truth and Climate and Energy.com.
• 1:57
  In Frank's campaign in support of reliable power and against the unscientific idea that our emissions are causing a climate emergency.
• 2:05
  Frank meets with politicians and regularly appears on TV and radio.
• 2:10
  He's had articles published in media across the political spectrum.
• 2:14
  He served as the Ledgeville, Wisconsin town board chair, and also in the Wisconsin State Assembly and the Wisconsin State Senate.
• 2:22
  So Frank, welcome to the show.
• 2:24
  Well, thanks for having me on.
• 2:26
  Yeah, I think we have you more than any other guest.
• 2:29
  Obviously, you're a popular guest with our listeners too.
• 2:33
  So you've actually started working with committee for a constructive tomorrow or CFAC.
• 2:38
  Can you tell us about that group and what you're doing with them?
• 2:42
  Yeah, I'm I'm um CFACT is a think tank that has a lot of different arms.
• 2:49
  They they work in the climate and the energy world quite a bit.
• 2:51
  They also work on college campuses.
• 2:54
  They actually have a branch doing good humanitarian things like getting water to people in Africa.
• 2:59
  Um so they're doing a variety of kind of things, but they're a think tank that provides ideas, free market ideas for a free market economy, and that really segues in.
• 3:09
  And I work in the climate and the energy world, and that's really where where I spend my time and uh as a my work with them.
• 3:16
  I do writing for them and consult on and provide information and do research on different topics um under that umbrella of energy and climate.
• 3:24
  Yeah, well, that's I also you know, still still run truth and energy and climate, and people we have a weekly uh weekly newsletter.
• 3:32
  You can sign up online, go to truth and energy and climate.com, and a lot of people like it, it's growing um because what I do is find five curated articles, most of them about energy, but usually one or two at least about climate, and then I um cut them down to five bullet points, and there's always a link to the original story, which is a lot longer, but people can then ride the read the five bullet points of something that's interesting to them or all of them and get their information real fast.
• 3:59
  And I provide an alternative perspective that you're not generally getting.
• 4:03
  It's not the propaganda of of energy and climate, but it's a lot of the truth that's actually happening out there.
• 4:09
  Yeah, so that's truth in energy and climate.com.
• 4:12
  That's correct.
• 4:13
  Yes.
• 4:14
  Yeah, a link to that under the podcast.
• 4:16
  It's a very interesting site, it's also very entertaining.
• 4:19
  You know, like I love the way you've set it up, it's really fun.
• 4:21
  Now that you're with CFAC, are you gonna jump out of airplanes?
• 4:24
  They do all kinds of crazy things, don't they?
• 4:27
  Well, that sounds like a lot of fun, but no, I I'm they've got the crazies who get to do that kind of fun stuff, but um yeah, enjoy it.
• 4:35
  Yeah, well, they also do a lot to help young people come along, which I think is really important.
• 4:40
  That's very, very important.
• 4:42
  And I was just doing some writing on it today.
• 4:45
  Um in that, you know, we've sold decades, two generations of young people on this climate propaganda, and things are bad, things are bad, things are bad, the world's gonna be uh overheat, you know, there's no future.
• 4:58
  And uh, you know, 30, 40 percent of them believe it and buy it and are losing hope.
• 5:03
  And you know, about 40 percent of the kids are like, you know, maybe I shouldn't have kids or even think about that, because you know, the planet's terrible.
• 5:10
  So this so they've taken what we should be optimistic, because people, if you look at the facts, uh worldwide crop yields and harvests are up, the world is greening, uh, CO2 makes the world greener.
• 5:23
  That means more food for animals, that means more greenery everywhere.
• 5:27
  Um, you know, prosperity, people are living longer than ever.
• 5:31
  There's more prosperity, there's more education, except for in some of the third world countries and particularly Muslim world countries.
• 5:38
  Um, you have people women have have gained so much, families are so better off.
• 5:43
  We we are better off in so many ways, but yet they give you got sold this propaganda, slump their shoulders and go, oh, I'm not even gonna really participate in the world.
• 5:52
  I'm not gonna be excited and optimistic and do my contribution, making the world a better place, because oh, it's just hopeless, we're all just gonna burn up.
• 6:01
  Yeah, and the media are fanning that flame because you know, in the case of Vogue magazine, which I guess young women must read, it says the greatest act of environmental terrorism is having a child, and they go through all the carbon footprints and all this sort of thing.
• 6:16
  You know, like I think it's very sad.
• 6:18
  There is one hope that I have to tell you about, and I'll include a link to it.
• 6:22
  There's a rap star called Tom McDonald.
• 6:25
  Have you heard of him?
• 6:26
  No, I have not.
• 6:27
  Well, he's out of Vancouver, but he lives in Hollywood now because he's been very successful.
• 6:31
  And he has one video called Brainwashed, okay?
• 6:35
  And he says, you know, he doesn't want his son to grow up to be his daughter and don't defund me.
• 6:40
  The police defund the media who lie through their teeth.
• 6:43
  And the it the nice thing about it though is that he gets tens of millions of views and tens of thousands of comments on that video in particular.
• 6:52
  So while you look at him and you see tattoos on his face and everything, you think, oh man, this is a typical rapper.
• 6:58
  He's gonna shooting cops and stuff.
• 7:00
  No, he's not like that at all.
• 7:02
  He's Christian, he actually promotes positive visions of the future, and he's criticizing the system, you know, that we're actually under.
• 7:10
  And the kids, you look see what the comments underneath.
• 7:13
  He says they're saying, Wow, he's so right.
• 7:15
  He's so right, you know.
• 7:17
  So I think there is, and CFAC are promoting this as well.
• 7:20
  There is an awakening going on among some young people, isn't there?
• 7:25
  Uh yeah, there is.
• 7:26
  There's more of them coming online, and and um Lucy Biggers is a great example of that.
• 7:31
  And she worked with and was out protesting for climate change, and she's woken up and said, wait a minute, I I started learning the facts, and they're different from what they told me in school.
• 7:41
  They're different from what the propaganda says, and she's doing a very nice job exposing that and just talking to regular people, which is helping more of them wake up.
• 7:49
  Of course, she only can probably be seen on X because of the other platforms are um, you know, trying to do censorship, they're trying to do more censorship in Europe and in Canada.
• 7:59
  Uh, thank goodness we elected Trump, or we'd have we'd be full on censorship here in America as well had we elected the other pro other candidate.
• 8:07
  Um, so she's done well.
• 8:09
  There's there's um, and I forget her last name, her first name is Annika, which I have a daughter named Annika, so that's an easier way to remember.
• 8:16
  But she's a British uh climatologist who learned all of this, learned all the propaganda, and then started to look under the hood at the facts and said, wait a minute, this is this isn't true.
• 8:26
  And now she's doing the same thing as Lucy Biggers is doing as well.
• 8:29
  And she goes on X just says Annika with one N.
• 8:33
  Well, look at that.
• 8:34
  And she's she's good to watch as well.
• 8:36
  She's attractive blonde, so that's kind of helpful as well.
• 8:39
  That helps.
• 8:39
  She's a pretty she's a pretty young woman, and um, but she's speaking the truth.
• 8:43
  And as more people, I think in that age group speak the truth, a little different than you and I that are our age group.
• 8:50
  Um, but that that I think is going to help as well, because the the facts simply don't support the narrative we are told on a regular basis.
• 8:59
  And and that's really a major problem.
• 9:02
  And that's what drives and makes so many young people lose hope because they're they're sold a false narrative, and um you know they believe it and they don't do any of the research in the, you know, unfortunately, the search engines are in on it as well, and AI is in on it as well because AI will go out and just synthesize uh the most common and and top articles from the consensus, and um, you know, science isn't done by consensus, as you and I know.
• 9:27
  You you have an hypothesis, an idea, and you go out and test it in the real world.
• 9:31
  And if your tests prove true, well, then it works that way, we believe.
• 9:35
  And if the pri if the test proved false, well, you go, well, well, that's bad one, let's move on.
• 9:40
  And CO2 really we should be moving on from CO2.
• 9:44
  I mean, it's just it's it's crazy.
• 9:46
  Um, the loss and opportunity cost.
• 9:49
  I mean, you know, in Canada, we spent 200 billion dollars on climate change.
• 9:53
  And you remember, we're at one tenth your population.
• 9:56
  That's the equivalent of you spending two trillion.
• 9:58
  Uh, but we
• 10:00
  We spent 200 billion since the liberals came in in 2015.
• 10:03
  You know, and then they turn around and say, oh, we don't have enough money for health care or whatever.
• 10:07
  Well, of course, if you're waiting on something stupid like climate change, you know, across the world now, you won't believe this, but the climate policy initiative out of San Francisco, and they think we should spend more money on climate change.
• 10:21
  They calculate that we're now spending five billion US dollars a day across the world on climate.
• 10:29
  It's incredible.
• 10:30
  It's just it really is incredible.
• 10:32
  And it's and it's really wrong.
• 10:34
  And you raise a great point because that is money that we should be spending on real things on real environmental protections on real people that can help real people.
• 10:45
  So we take this money, and and often, you know, the wind and solar answer, and I'm sorry, folks.
• 10:50
  If you do your research even for a little bit of a while, you can't run and get full-time electricity.
• 10:56
  And the big woke tech companies are pointing to this now.
• 10:58
  They're they were openly admitting it.
• 11:00
  You can't get reliable 24-7 affordable electricity from wind and solar.
• 11:07
  It's just not real.
• 11:08
  And that's one of those big propaganda things.
• 11:10
  And I guess, and if you buy into the other propaganda, which we know we've talked talked through, well, geez, then there's no hope whatsoever.
• 11:16
  The world is greening and getting better.
• 11:18
  And what I like to open my speeches with, and what other people could use as well, is I say, you know, take a deep breath, exhale, take another deep breath, exhale.
• 11:28
  You just released 80,000 parts per million of CO2 into the atmosphere, and there's 420 in the in the air right now.
• 11:36
  So unfortunately, you pointed this out earlier.
• 11:39
  In many places, I think we are the CO2, the carbon they want to reduce.
• 11:43
  I mean, it is a prescription for less of everything.
• 11:48
  The French government is now come out advising people to eat less meat.
• 11:52
  Uh, there isn't a directive yet.
• 11:54
  This is all soft, you know, at the beginning.
• 11:57
  There's no directive yet, but eat less meat for the climate.
• 12:00
  They say all for your health and climate.
• 12:02
  But the fact is, there's a lot of evidence if you aren't eating processed meat, uh, but eating regular real meat, it's a lot very healthy for you, particularly from good sources.
• 12:12
  It's very so they want to denigrate our health for the climate and what you eat.
• 12:17
  So they're they they picked this on purpose because it allows them to meddle in virtually every single thing that we do everywhere.
• 12:26
  Yeah, for sure.
• 12:27
  Just two quick points.
• 12:28
  Did you know that there is now more forest in New England than there was at the time of the civil war?
• 12:34
  Because our farms are so much more efficient, you know.
• 12:37
  I find that kind of interesting.
• 12:39
  And the other thing is you said 80,000 parts per million is what we're breathing out.
• 12:43
  Well, I worked as a lifeguard when I was a teenager, and you know, we had to do mouth to mouth direct direct artificial respiration.
• 12:50
  So I would save someone's life with that 80,000.
• 12:54
  Yeah, we're saying 40%.
• 12:56
  40,000 per breath.
• 12:57
  Yeah.
• 12:57
  So 40,000 percent.
• 12:59
  So when you do two breasts, it's eight, yeah.
• 13:00
  When you do two breasts, it's 80,000, and you're absolutely right.
• 13:03
  Well, uh in submarines, uh nuclear submarines, they'll go below the the ocean for six months at a time with no fresh air at all.
• 13:11
  And the CO2 there will be 3,000 to 5,000 parts per million regularly.
• 13:16
  It's sometimes up to 20, 30, 40,000 parts per million.
• 13:20
  Um, at the 40,000, and I believe it's when you get that high, it really means that you don't have enough oxygen in the air.
• 13:26
  It's probably what's very likely, you start to have some ill effects.
• 13:30
  But we've tested it for the Navy, the the soldier or not the soldiers, but the sailors who are in nuclear powered subs.
• 13:36
  And there's no problems at 3,000, 5,000 parts per million.
• 13:41
  Doubling ours from 400 to 800 parts per million would likely increase crop harvest yields by another 20, 30, 40 percent for most crops.
• 13:50
  I mean, these are good things that we should be talking about, but of course, the the media doesn't want to let that out.
• 13:55
  The schools aren't aren't teaching this alongside the propaganda.
• 13:59
  There should be a balance.
• 14:00
  I mean, yeah, if you if you believe in the theory, and it is only a theory, folks, that CO2 causes warming.
• 14:06
  Um it is only a theory, but if you believe in that, then you should also get the other parts of it.
• 14:11
  But that but they don't ever talk about the other parts.
• 14:14
  So just to underline the the numbers there, you're saying that in submarines, it's 10 times higher than the CO2 in our atmosphere, and there's no ill effects.
• 14:25
  Exactly.
• 14:25
  That's absolutely true.
• 14:27
  And and greenhouses add CO2.
• 14:30
  Um, they pay to put it in because it makes plants grow so much better, bigger, faster, stronger.
• 14:35
  I mean, the naysayers, the the climate alarmists go, oh yeah, but but you know, they aren't as good or they aren't as healthy, and you got to put fertilizer.
• 14:41
  Well, yeah, of course you have to put fertilizer on them.
• 14:43
  Uh yeah, growing faster.
• 14:45
  They grow better and they grow better.
• 14:47
  And the other interesting thing is that plants grow better and tolerate when there's more CO2 in the atmosphere, they tolerate heat and drought better.
• 14:57
  So both of those things, and the reason is is they have little breathing holes called stomata on the leaves, and when there's more CO2, they don't need as many, so they don't lose as much water, so they tolerate heat and drought better because they don't wilt when it gets hot and dry, um, or not as easily.
• 15:13
  So it kind of all fits together, and it serves plants really well.
• 15:17
  Warm we all know plants grow better in the warmth.
• 15:20
  You get more warmth, more CO2, they tolerate heat and drought better.
• 15:24
  I mean, it's all good things.
• 15:26
  Yeah, exactly.
• 15:27
  You know, it it's interesting.
• 15:29
  I don't know if you've seen Patrick Boom Moore, he was one of the original founders of Greenpeace.
• 15:34
  He has been touring the world, basically, telling people that CO2 was headed down from uh, you know, the thousands of parts per million that we had millions of years ago.
• 15:45
  He said it was headed down, and of course, it got very low during the last glacial, down to around 180 parts per million.
• 15:52
  He said, But if we hadn't come along and started to release CO2 through you know, fossil fuel production or cement or whatever, he said we were headed down to the end of life on Earth.
• 16:04
  So he has a big slide saying humans saved life on Earth with our CO2 emissions.
• 16:09
  Do you think he's exaggerating, or is that is that true?
• 16:13
  He's not exaggerating at all.
• 16:15
  And plants grow better at a thousand to two thousand parts per million, nearly all plants do, and we were dangerously low, just uh, you know, just a few a little bit lower, and he's he's absolutely correct.
• 16:28
  Uh, all of photosynthesis would have stopped on Earth, and without that, we all die because we have nothing to eat.
• 16:34
  I mean, it'd be very short time before all the animals and everything were were gone, and us as well.
• 16:40
  So, no, he's not exaggerating at all.
• 16:42
  And in the long term, we should be looking at it as we know over the last millions of years, not just the last million, but multi multi-millions, we go through a period of time of about 100 to 120,000 years of glacial times.
• 16:54
  And I mean, that's when Canada's completely under the ice.
• 16:57
  Kind of as an aside to that, there used to be this is key.
• 17:01
  I served in the Wisconsin legislature in Madison, Wisconsin, and right across from the Capitol, there used to be this nice small monument on the corner made out of granite and brass, and it just had a little plaque there with a map, and and it said to the effect that where you're standing 20,000 years ago was under a mile and a half of ice.
• 17:22
  Wow.
• 17:22
  Now they they spent the money and took that out.
• 17:25
  It was on a little grassy corner right across from the state capital.
• 17:29
  Because they don't want people knowing things like that.
• 17:33
  But it's far better when we're ice-free in Canada and Wisconsin.
• 17:38
  Um, at least I think so.
• 17:40
  But you know, people might argue the polar bears would love it.
• 17:43
  And um, you know, and I don't think they'd love it either, because it wouldn't be a lot of food for them to eat.
• 17:47
  Yeah, polar bears, you know, if it gets too cold, the ice gets too thick, and they starve, you know.
• 17:53
  So I mean, and of course, polar bears are doing great.
• 17:55
  I mean, there's something like five times as many now as there was in 1960.
• 17:59
  Susan Crockford, a friend of mine who's specialist in polar bears, she says, well, the polar bear is a success story.
• 18:05
  So, you know, like it's so much in the climate issue is backwards to reality.
• 18:10
  It reminds me of 1984, you know, and we say, oh, CO2 is pollution.
• 18:15
  No, it isn't, it's great, you know.
• 18:17
  Warming is bad.
• 18:18
  No, it isn't, it's great.
• 18:20
  Yeah, it is.
• 18:21
  It's and that's why you know the European nations in Canada are working towards censorship and controlling the narrative.
• 18:28
  And they they in 1984 of the book, they call it ducks beat, because duckspeak, and everybody just has to, you know, be a duck and say whatever the duck says, you know, whatever we're supposed to say.
• 18:39
  And um it's really wrong.
• 18:41
  And you know, things like the you know, we talked about the polar bears, the Great Barrier Reef.
• 18:46
  It's at all time highs.
• 18:47
  Now, in 2023, it was at an absolute high.
• 18:50
  Now it's come down a little bit, but these last three, four years, it's the most extent that it's ever had, but you you're told exactly the opposite.
• 18:58
  And then they make a big deal out of it.
• 18:59
  It peaked in 20, you know, two years, two years ago.
• 19:02
  So, oh, it's down terribly.
• 19:04
  Well, it peaked, and it's still way higher than it has been for I think they have records back 30 years.
• 19:10
  And this is according to the Australian government figures.
• 19:13
  So this isn't you know, other realists out there, it's the government itself that takes a real survey of it.
• 19:20
  And um, and they're in on it, by the way, as we know.
• 19:23
  Yeah, and you know, you know, it's interesting, you were talking about censorship.
• 19:26
  There's a good reason why there's so much in Canada during the COVID crisis, or semi-crisis or whatever you want to call it, fake crisis, who knows?
• 19:36
  But the government decided they had to fund the media to keep them in business.
• 19:40
  Now, of course, in Canada, they pay for the CBC, which is our national broadcaster, but they also started paying half of the salaries of all the journalists, up to half of the salaries.
• 19:51
  Now they've continued that.
• 19:52
  They didn't stop it when the crisis was over.
• 19:55
  So, right now, if you're working for C T V or Global News or the Ottawa citizen.
• 20:00
  Or the Globe and Mail and National Posts.
• 20:02
  All those media, the reporters have half of their salary paid by the government.
• 20:07
  You know, so they're not going to criticize the government.
• 20:10
  Are they?
• 20:11
  Very dangerous.
• 20:12
  Yeah.
• 20:13
  Surely they don't have that in the in the U.S., you know, you don't have government paying media, do you?
• 20:18
  Except for maybe No, we don't, but but we do have pharmaceuticals advertising on TV and send sending them billions of dollars in advertising revenue.
• 20:27
  So then they don't cover the negative things about big pharma because they lose their their coverage.
• 20:34
  And that's that's been an issue that our our FDA and Kennedy was looking at it.
• 20:40
  Um, but was it was if it bumps up against our free speech things.
• 20:45
  But Biden and his regime last time, they completely ignored that, really work to on the COVID issue and other issues.
• 20:53
  Uh use the big tech to throttle out any message they didn't like and spread the message they did like.
• 20:59
  That's not free speech at all, but you know, hey, violate away.
• 21:03
  I guess there's you know no penalty, and that's what people do.
• 21:06
  Well, I'll give you a funny example, and then we have to go for a break.
• 21:10
  Um during the COVID crisis, the Ontario government put out a graph that showed the rate that people were getting COVID if they were partially vaccinated, fully vaccinated, and not vaccinated.
• 21:23
  And what they showed is that the people who got COVID the most were the ones who were most vaccinated.
• 21:29
  So CBC had an article, and you used to be able to put comments under the article.
• 21:33
  They don't allow it anymore.
• 21:35
  But they had comment sections, so I put up I said, You do you realize that according to this graph, if you get the vaccine, you're more likely to get COVID.
• 21:43
  And I said, I know there can be various factors besides the vaccine that drive it.
• 21:48
  You know, people who haven't been vaccinated might not go out as much, you know, so they might not be exposed to as much.
• 21:53
  But I said, that is the real statistics.
• 21:56
  CBC instantly canceled my posting.
• 21:58
  They wouldn't allow it on.
• 21:59
  So I thought, well, you know, they must have an algorithm that looks for certain wording because it was within seconds, eh?
• 22:05
  So I took a screen capture of the actual graph from the Ontario government, and I put it in the comment section.
• 22:12
  And they didn't notice it for a day or so.
• 22:15
  And then they deleted it, and they banned me for life from ever posting on any CBC article ever again.
• 22:23
  So I contacted their audience relations and I said, This is official government data.
• 22:27
  And you can interpret it in different different ways.
• 22:30
  Like, why are you banning me for life?
• 22:32
  And they said the decision is to be made, the case is closed.
• 22:34
  Goodbye.
• 22:35
  Quick.
• 22:37
  So you end up with media uh not allowing us to hear the truth on all sorts of issues.
• 22:43
  And I think you're right.
• 22:44
  That is 1984 newspeak.
• 22:46
  That is dangerous stuff.
• 22:49
  It's really scary.
• 22:50
  It's very, very scary because um because folks, you say, well, yeah, you know, those people know what they're doing.
• 22:58
  Eventually it gets worse and worse and worse and worse.
• 23:03
  And no one can speak out except for what the government party line tells you to.
• 23:08
  And that's what goes on in communist countries that goes on in dictatorships and fascist countries.
• 23:14
  And if you step out of line or say something wrong, then you get arrested.
• 23:17
  It's going on in Britain.
• 23:18
  They're arresting tens of thousands of people now because they're post they're criticizing what's going on.
• 23:24
  You know, these illegal immigrants, I don't want them in this country.
• 23:26
  Oh, you get a visit, and a lot of them are just annoyance visits.
• 23:29
  They don't actually arrest you.
• 23:30
  They just come to your house at twelve o'clock at night, drag you out of bed, and confiscate your phone for a few months.
• 23:36
  Or your computer and your computer for a few months, and then give it back to you.
• 23:40
  But I mean, for regular person, that that's a big deal.
• 23:44
  And uh this is the sort of stuff that's going on, it scares everybody, and that's their intent.
• 23:48
  Stop criticizing us.
• 23:49
  We're gonna do what we want to do no matter what, and that's what happens then.
• 23:52
  And what I find interesting sidewalk, but it fits in with this because that's what climate is being used for is worldwide socialism or government growth or someone else taking care of it.
• 24:03
  You know, regular people say, well, capitalism bad, you know, and do you trust the politicians?
• 24:08
  We no, I don't.
• 24:10
  But you want the politicians to run everything under socialism.
• 24:14
  Somehow that would be better.
• 24:16
  And you can't, and of course, people who hold that view, you can't talk to them because as soon as you start giving them that just that little bit of critical thinking to get angry at you.
• 24:24
  You can't, you know, tell them that.
• 24:27
  But this is a tool.
• 24:29
  Uh, climate change and the energy policy.
• 24:32
  They're they're working to make our energy expensive, our food expensive.
• 24:37
  And now the latest thing is is the UN is harping about water shortages.
• 24:41
  Oh, food, energy, and water.
• 24:44
  I mean, you've gotta really think about that.
• 24:48
  Oh, yeah, for sure.
• 24:49
  We have to go for a break now, but when we get back from the break, let's drill down to the energy issue and find out what was it that kept the lights on and people warm during the cold spell that just happened.
• 25:00
  Is that okay with you?
• 25:02
  Yeah, that sounds great.
• 25:03
  Let's do that.
• 25:04
  Okay, stay tuned.
• 25:04
  We'll be right back after the break.
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• 31:32
  So we're back with Frank Lisa from Truth in Energy and Climate.com.
• 31:37
  Is that the website, Frank?
• 31:39
  Yes.
• 31:39
  And you can sign up for our newsletter there.
• 31:41
  It's weekly, and uh we don't sell the list.
• 31:44
  And you're able to um learn more about these really important topics because without good energy, uh, without a good supply of reliable affordable energy, really our modern lives come to a screeching halt, and people don't understand that.
• 31:57
  And we try to make these more complicated issues understandable and interesting for regular people.
• 32:03
  Yeah, for sure.
• 32:04
  Now, I'd like to drill down on looking at the cold snap that gripped the United States and Canada a couple of weeks back.
• 32:12
  So, what was it that kept the the lights on and kept people from freezing to death?
• 32:16
  Was it these wind and solar power?
• 32:18
  They're supposed to be the solution to everything.
• 32:21
  Well, and interestingly, during this period, um eastern Canada is normally an exporter of hydroelectric electricity, but during the major storm, they had to import electricity from the United States.
• 32:36
  They were not exporting it because they needed more power than they could get from the hydroelectric, which they were normally sending to America.
• 32:43
  So it tells you the increase in demand.
• 32:45
  And New England area was we're relied about 40% of their energy came from burning oil, the dirtiest, most expensive form of electricity that we have.
• 32:55
  Um, but they they ramped up oil.
• 32:57
  They have no more coal in the northeast at all.
• 32:59
  So they used oil and natural gas, and um that really turned things wind and solar produced a lot less across the country than they're normally doing.
• 33:09
  But and that's naturally, if you think about it, that's often the case because when it's snowy, cold and dark and stormy, the solar, and when it gets and when they get snow on them, they produce no electricity at all.
• 33:19
  Then it gets dark and it gets dark earlier when it's really stormy and cold.
• 33:23
  And then because it's cold, often the wind isn't blowing it like it normally does or it blows in different patterns.
• 33:30
  So you can't depend on those either.
• 33:31
  So their production was down, not as much as during that really bad storm where more than 500 people died in Texas, uh, winter storm Uri a few years ago.
• 33:41
  That that they they almost completely stopped altogether.
• 33:45
  And coal, coal usage went up, um, went up, I think, by about 40% to about 35% of all of our electricity.
• 33:53
  And coal is important, and and I highly recommend we keep coal um as part of our electricity mix because it's an alternative if natural gas gets expensive.
• 34:04
  You can store store coal on site.
• 34:06
  Typically, they used to have several weeks to several months of coal uh next to the coal plant.
• 34:12
  Natural gas, people don't know this, but natural gas has to come out of the ground, get in a pipe, um, and be pushed through a pipe to to when it's used.
• 34:21
  There's no storage on site.
• 34:23
  So if that gets interrupted at all, and often when it's really cold, natural gas, if they don't heat the pipes along the way and the interconnections and it isn't handled properly, um, or it can just slow down in the pipeline if it's not warm enough.
• 34:36
  If the pipe gets colder, it slows down, and then you aren't able to draw as much to do to uh run your natural gas plant at full blast.
• 34:44
  So these issues we should have choices, and and heaven forbid we ever go to a major war with a country like China.
• 34:51
  Um we need to have coal plants that are reliable to give us electricity all the time because maybe our natural gas would be interrupted or there'd be a problem with it.
• 35:00
  Nuclear is really great and it's growing, and that's full-time electricity all the time.
• 35:05
  Uh 50 51 weeks of the year, they close down typically all the plants close down for a week a year of maintenance, and then they're off.
• 35:11
  Um, so they're they're part of the mix.
• 35:14
  Wind and solar, and I try to help regular people understand this, and you can tell your friends this or your kids this to help your grandkids to help them understand why wind and solar drive up the costs on our electric grid.
• 35:25
  For um, the big part is is because they're part-time.
• 35:28
  So you're a family and you have a couple gas cars, everything's working good for you.
• 35:32
  You can drive whenever you want to.
• 35:34
  You got a busy life, you're taking the kids to things, you're working, you're going to school.
• 35:38
  So you got a busy life and it's working all the time for you.
• 35:41
  Then the government comes along and says, no, no, that's bad for the climate.
• 35:44
  You need to have a solar car.
• 35:46
  It works just like solar panels.
• 35:48
  Only when the sun's shining, you can drive it as much as you want, and it's cheap, doesn't have any fuel costs.
• 35:53
  And we'll pay for half of it.
• 35:55
  That's what we until until July of this year, we're going to be paying for half of them here in America.
• 36:00
  I mean, we're ending that.
• 36:01
  I know Canada heavily subsidized them as well.
• 36:03
  So we're going to give you a big subsidy on top of it.
• 36:05
  And you buy that solar car and you find out it doesn't replace one of your cars.
• 36:09
  You have to pay for that third car now, too, because you still need to get to things at night in the evening.
• 36:15
  And you also learn solar produces very little electricity the first hour and last hour of the day.
• 36:21
  Just when you need it to get to work or get home from work.
• 36:24
  And so now you say, Well, now I'm paying for three cars.
• 36:26
  And they go, We got an answer for you.
• 36:28
  Get a wind car.
• 36:30
  Works just like big wind towers.
• 36:31
  Whenever the wind blows, you can drive your wind car.
• 36:33
  It'll be great.
• 36:34
  So you can use that when you can't use your solar car.
• 36:37
  And um, you know, and in fact, we can retrofit your solar cars so it can do both.
• 36:41
  So it can run whatever.
• 36:42
  And then you say, oh, fine, and we'll subsidize it again.
• 36:45
  So you buy that one too, and you go, well, wait a minute.
• 36:47
  I I can't even take that to the kids' soccer game or the kids' hockey game.
• 36:52
  Because the wind might not be blowing when they get done.
• 36:55
  So now you're paying for four cars.
• 36:58
  And to make the analogy further, you can't just park those new cars you just bought on the street.
• 37:04
  You have to build a driveway and you have to build garages to house them, just like you have to build transmission wires to move the electrons from wherever you have the solar and wind to the cities where it's needed.
• 37:15
  So this is why it adds a lot of cost.
• 37:17
  And then, like your car, if people who bought new cars know the the real cost of a car isn't the gas that you're putting into it, the fuel that you're putting into it, it's the capital costs of paying it off, the maintenance and the insurance and all of those sort of things cost more than the fuel cost.
• 37:34
  So all you're doing when you're using your uh solar car or your your wind car is saving a little bit of fuel.
• 37:41
  And then, like that, though, because you're driving your gas car less, you still have to pay the same other costs for it, just less fuel cost.
• 37:49
  So now your price per mile goes up.
• 37:52
  So you're paying more for per mile.
• 37:54
  And then you couple that with the way the wholesale electricity market works, is they say, well, you know, when we need electricity, some utilities produce all their own, and many of them buy and sell their excess, or sometimes like Canada needed it, Quebec needed it to import it during those times.
• 38:14
  You buy it on the open market.
• 38:15
  The way they set it up is it's pay the clearing price.
• 38:18
  It's pay the highest price that you take.
• 38:21
  It's the take and pay system, they call it.
• 38:23
  So wind and solar bid very low because they don't have fuel costs, and then these plants that are continuing to run more and more part-time because you have more and more wind and solar, charge higher prices to stay in business.
• 38:36
  The the wholesale cost goes up and they wind and solar and the highest price they take, which they help make go up.
• 38:42
  And then we all pay them.
• 38:44
  What a mess.
• 38:46
  There's two things that you said that I want to really underline.
• 38:49
  One of them is the idea that you actually pile up coal on your local station, and you might have as much as a year's supply.
• 38:57
  Just like nuclear, you have your power source right on the station.
• 39:02
  And that is much better at securing the grid, isn't it, than bringing in pipelines, which could be sabotaged.
• 39:08
  I mean, in a war, you blow up, I think it's three pipelines into Winnipeg, and you know, in Manitoba, and you've cut the city off.
• 39:17
  But you got big piles of coal there, it's much more secure, isn't it?
• 39:22
  Absolutely it is.
• 39:23
  Now now, of course, any plant is is vulnerable, and we're learning that the lessons of Ukraine.
• 39:28
  But once you blow up a pipeline, it's hard to repair and hard to get it back on, and that natural gas plant couldn't produce any electricity until that pipe pipeline is prepared.
• 39:38
  And the other aspect of it is is that you have to pump that natural gas out of the ground.
• 39:43
  So you have to keep harvesting it to fill the pipeline to get it to the natural gas plant.
• 39:48
  And um, it's good to have alternatives, it's good to have a mix.
• 39:52
  Wind and solar in isolated places.
• 39:54
  I'm not absolutely against them, but I don't believe they should be grid scale on our grids at all because they just add cost.
• 40:00
  They're parasitic.
• 40:01
  Um, they just take away a little bit of usage from full-time plants.
• 40:04
  It's kind of like a pitcher.
• 40:06
  You kind of like what we do is we call the the pitcher that can only pitch when the sun is shining and there's no clouds.
• 40:12
  The full-time pitcher in his backup pitcher is the pitcher who can pitch all the time.
• 40:16
  And that's what they kind of are selling us on, you know, coal and natural gas are just backups for wind and solar.
• 40:22
  No, they certainly aren't.
• 40:23
  Uh, you know, there's the other way around pitchers.
• 40:26
  The way around there's so much misinformation in what we do.
• 40:29
  Yeah, and it's interesting because basically what you're saying then is wind and solar, they don't replace solid back solid uh baseline power.
• 40:38
  All they do is replace a little bit of the fuel cost.
• 40:41
  That's it.
• 40:42
  And that's really just not worth the cost, is it?
• 40:45
  That's exactly correct.
• 40:47
  And it even gets worse is when you get to about 40% of your electricity coming from wind and solar, you start to run a lot of your full-time plants in um in what they call spinning reserve or idle.
• 41:00
  I mean, so it's like sitting in a parking lot where your car's idling, you still burn fuel, granted, it's about 10% of the fuel you'd burn if you were running and moving, but you have to sit and idle all the time, and they learn this very expensive lesson when all of Spain and Portugal and part of France um heavily reliant on solar.
• 41:18
  They I think they get 70% of their there, sometimes 70 or 80 percent, and it's sunny and that's another difference.
• 41:24
  Their days are long and sunny down there in Spain, not like Wisconsin or Canada.
• 41:30
  Um, so they have a lot of solar, but they didn't have enough natural gas and coal.
• 41:34
  Well, they don't have any coal plants anymore, they close them all down, but they didn't have enough natural gas plants running on what's called spinning reserve, providing they call inertia, and our our electric systems have to vibrate at just the right 60 hertz and um uh 60 or 50 hertz, depending on where you are in the world, and that's just the vibrations per second, and it has to be precise, they can't be off at all.
• 41:57
  And that really means supply has to meet demand all the time, precisely.
• 42:03
  So it's a big system, and you got to put that electricity on as soon as other one electricity saw, you know, wind stops, something else has to step in, or you got to turn it off.
• 42:12
  And that's when you get blackouts.
• 42:13
  Yeah, and it strikes me that if you're running your backup, which is of course the primary power source, like like coal or natural gas, in you know, you it's varying up and down, up and down to compensate for the you know, variable wind or sun.
• 42:28
  Surely it's a lot less efficient than if you're just running them full blast all the time as your only energy source.
• 42:36
  You know, you're you're absolutely right.
• 42:38
  And another part of that is like your car.
• 42:40
  Everybody knows that a car that's driven and stop and grow traffic all the time wears out faster than a car driven on the highway almost all the time, and on cruise control almost all the time.
• 42:50
  The same principle applies to these plants.
• 42:52
  If you're turning them off and on and up and down and up and down and off and on, they wear out faster, and your maintenance costs are higher.
• 42:59
  That's one part of it, and you're you're absolutely correct.
• 43:02
  Um that you're just simply displacing that power.
• 43:06
  Yeah, exactly.
• 43:07
  And and I think that's worth really worth emphasizing.
• 43:10
  If you want to have efficient use of resources, you want to have your power source running as close to 100% as long as possible.
• 43:18
  You don't want them, you know, take in an efficient gas plant and then make it a backup to wind and solar, it's going up and down and up and down, and that's really inefficient and wears out the whole system much faster.
• 43:30
  That's something we really have to emphasize.
• 43:33
  Well, you're you're absolutely correct.
• 43:35
  And they by efficiency, what they mean is is you you put in um uh a hundred percent natural gas goes in, and you get about 40% electricity on a single cycle natural gas plant.
• 43:47
  So the absolute energy that comes in with with um at 100% 100% of the natural gas goes in as that energy amount, then you can generate electricity for 40% of that energy.
• 43:58
  So you so you lose 60% of the energy for a single cycle plant, and that's what most of the plants are, and that's what plants natural gas plants when they're turned up and down, like you described to match the load at extreme levels, they can only run in single cycle.
• 44:14
  The most efficient gas plant gets 65 to 70 percent 60 uh 60 to 70 percent efficiency, 65% efficiency when because it's a dual cycle.
• 44:25
  So it runs the first cycle that gets you 40%, and they capture that energy and that heat, and they run a second uh spinning cycle because these are great big turbines they spin, and that second one gets them up to a 60, 65 percent efficiency.
• 44:38
  You can't run a dual cycle natural gas plant.
• 44:43
  You have to run it at single cycle if you're cycling up and down all the time.
• 44:46
  So, to your point, it's like going on cruise control with a booster that gives you a lot better return on your investments, a lot cleaner then as well, because you're getting you you burn less natural gas to get more energy.
• 45:00
  Yeah.
• 45:00
  So it's a double lammy.
• 45:02
  Not only is your plant less efficient because it has to run up and down, up and down, but you can't even use the most efficient plants when you're using it as backup for wind and solar.
• 45:14
  Exactly.
• 45:15
  That's exactly right.
• 45:16
  Wow.
• 45:17
  Can you give us some idea?
• 45:18
  Not exact figures, but some idea of how much money is being poured into this uh mostly useless wind and solar power in the United States.
• 45:27
  Well, hundreds of billions of dollars, and it's still working it through the system.
• 45:31
  The Democrats and Joe Biden uh on complete party line votes uh put in put in the you know the Green New Deal, uh and Trump calls it the green new scam to pay 50%, 50% uh of wind and solar out there, so it would get built into the system, and that and the Republicans didn't have the nerve to end it immediately.
• 45:50
  Uh, some claimed it wouldn't be fair.
• 45:52
  There were others who never want to end it ever, the gra the green grift and graft, but they're ending it now in July, and they also put in a provision that they have to break ground by the middle of July, or they can't.
• 46:03
  But we're gonna work through this system because those are all gonna come online over the next year or two or three.
• 46:08
  So electric prices in the United States are not coming down.
• 46:12
  And then you add on there in the wind and solar crowd really love to divert to, and there's some truth to it, so they're good at getting a little bit of truth and then blowing it up to a BLI, is that it's the AI data centers that are causing all of this by their increasing demand.
• 46:26
  Um, there's there's a little truth in that, but a big part of it is is this wind and solar mantra that they've shoved down our throats.
• 46:33
  And the blue states in America have much higher electric rates on average than the red states do that have been less aggressive.
• 46:39
  And the states that have been very non-aggressive about adding wind and soil, like West Virginia and Kentucky and Tennessee, they have very low electric rates, very low electric rates, and they've kept their coal plants, they've maintained them well.
• 46:54
  And in fact, West Virginia is a huge exporter of cheap electricity to the surrounding states, and it comes from coal, they harvest right there, employing people, and we have clean coal technology.
• 47:05
  Something else people don't understand about coal, and I know in Canada I don't think you have any coal plants anymore.
• 47:10
  Um, is that clean coal we still have some in Alberta and New Brunswick?
• 47:17
  Oh, good.
• 47:17
  Well, what they produce is they use the solids out of them, the sulfur's out of those to make drywall.
• 47:23
  So near any natural gas plant, they also use the fly ash as a necessary ingredient for concrete cement making.
• 47:30
  You add it to cement, about 20 to 30 percent of of cement is is fly ash because it makes it stronger, and it's a a lower cost than actual cement, and it has a lower CO2 output, if that's concerns people, or it shouldn't, because it's a waste product that would be landfilled or otherwise put to use, but it gets put mixed into cement instead of cement which people don't understand or know, it also releases a lot of CO2 because you got to heat it and cook it and break that down in that process.
• 48:02
  So it's a necessary ingredient ingredient, fly ash is, and then our drywall for building purposes is comes from the solids from clean coal technology, which take out almost every bit of solids through the smokestack process and scrub it.
• 48:17
  So it is very it's not just a nice name, it truly is clean coal.
• 48:21
  Yeah, no, that's interesting because in 2002, our premier here in Ontario, he had a pile of coal beside him at a press conference, and he said, This is old technology, we're gonna get rid of it and save the climate, which of course is silly.
• 48:36
  Ontario is a quarter of Canada's emissions and Canada's 1.6% of the world, so it wasn't going to have any impact on climate.
• 48:44
  But it's not dirty, is it?
• 48:46
  I mean, it depends how you burn it.
• 48:48
  Yeah, that's absolutely right.
• 48:49
  Most of Asia is not using clean coal technology because you have to burn 10 to 20% more coal to get the same amount of energy.
• 48:56
  So it costs you more because you got to you know, the increased costs, it costs you more, and you have to pay another half a billion to a billion dollars per plant to put it on.
• 49:06
  So you know, then granted you do get to make some drywall out of it, but I don't know how long it takes, how much drywall you got to sell to pick up 500 million dollars.
• 49:14
  Um you you you know, there are a lot of the rest of the world, and they're still building hundreds of coal plants now, and that's the other part of this whole aspect of the climate scam, is nobody wants to talk about the people who harp and harp and harp on us, we should choke ourselves to death, raise our energy prices, get more on unreliable energy, but it's built by China, made in China with coal plants that they keep building more of.
• 49:38
  Both India and China get the majority of their energy from coal, and they're building hundreds of plants that'll last at least 50 years.
• 49:46
  And um they're they're selling us this stuff made with cheap labor, no environmental protections, and coal electricity.
• 49:56
  It's the craziest thing in the world.
• 49:57
  So we can't afford to build it here because our
• 50:00
  Electricity is too expensive and unreliable.
• 50:02
  Um, so we export it to places that pollute far more than we do to use their cheap power that we say we can't use here.
• 50:09
  Yeah, so you could put a big sign on your wind turbine from China made with coal, so you don't get away from coal at all.
• 50:16
  Now we're gonna be able to do that.
• 50:17
  Not at all in the cement, the cement steel to go into that big tower.
• 50:21
  The same thing, you gotta have coal to meet those things.
• 50:24
  Now, I had a strategic question to ask you, because I know some of the people listening to this will be anti-wind turbine activists, people who understand the ridiculous economics of wind turbines and also understand the detrimental health impacts of wind turbines, the infrasound, all the birds that are killed.
• 50:42
  They understand all that.
• 50:44
  And when they act when they're active, you know, when they speak at political events uh against wind turbines, the one thing they don't bring up is the elephant in the room, and that is that they're not needed because there's no climate emergency.
• 50:58
  So I mean, strategically, do you think that they're right to avoid saying that they're not needed because there's no climate emergency because they're afraid to say that.
• 51:08
  I mean, that's a toughie because they've done a good job that the leftists do this thing that you know, as soon as someone says, you know, that there is no climate emergency, oh well, bug our years, we don't have to talk about them anymore.
• 51:19
  You know, they're just crazy, blah la la la la.
• 51:21
  Yeah, yeah, which is really too bad.
• 51:23
  And I mean that's that's what they're concerned about is being completely marginalized.
• 51:27
  But if nobody says it, nobody says it and never gets out there.
• 51:31
  And another point is is you know what we just talked about.
• 51:34
  You know, hey, you're gonna put in wind and solar panels made in China with coal while they build hundreds of coal plants to pollute the world worse, and we're gonna buy their technology from them, but in the steel and the concrete, and all of this is made with with coal and oil and shipped across the world.
• 51:53
  And somehow you think that is better than us just using our our natural gas or coal plants right here that we harvest right here.
• 52:01
  Yeah.
• 52:02
  Well, you know, here's the strategy I think that might work.
• 52:04
  And tell me if you agree.
• 52:06
  If you were to outline, let's say you go to the microphone, you've got five minutes.
• 52:09
  They call it a delegation when you're speaking to council, and you point out these negative aspects of use of wind and solar, and of course, how they're uh, you know, not working very well in the cold as well.
• 52:23
  And then you bring up, and they're not required either, because it strikes me that if you get all these negatives put out, then people will say in the back of their mind, oh man, what a mess.
• 52:33
  Do we really have to do it?
• 52:35
  And the answer is no.
• 52:36
  So maybe that's the sequence.
• 52:38
  They should present the negatives first, you know, which are real world negative impacts of wind turbines and solar power, and the fact that they don't give you much anyway, and then say, and they're not even needed.
• 52:51
  Would that make sense?
• 52:52
  Well, and and perhaps a softer way for some of those people, because I think some of I think you're right.
• 52:57
  I think you should talk about that, and I also think you should talk real briefly about you know China and India building hundreds of coal plants and using those to sell us those things.
• 53:06
  And now, and also, and maybe rather than saying, well, they're not necessary, and maybe some people can and should say that, um, but they aren't a good deal to us when we're or the the world environment is point out the the facts of climate change.
• 53:20
  Polar bears are doing great, clout crop yields are increasing.
• 53:24
  Um, you know, we we aren't having more uh tornadoes or or things like that, hurricanes aren't worse.
• 53:30
  We aren't getting more floods and droughts.
• 53:31
  Well, you know, the the barrier, the reefs are doing just fine.
• 53:35
  I mean, and maybe point out some of the facts and arm them with those facts that rather than then coming out and saying, well, it doesn't, you know, we don't we don't need these because there's no climate change problem.
• 53:45
  You could just highlight some of the facts that are and and use them even locally, like you know, Canada is now producing more.
• 53:53
  I'm I'm just saying I'm I'm betting they have higher wheat yields, they have higher corn yields, they're growing crops further north.
• 54:00
  That's another thing that should be a benefit to Canadians.
• 54:02
  I've seen some articles, and I was really surprised by that.
• 54:05
  The cropland in northern Alberta has gone up in value because they're growing crops there that couldn't grow 15 and 20 and 30 years ago.
• 54:12
  So to emphasize and maybe use some local, those sort of local things to emphasize the benefits that have been going on because we have a slightly warming um warming environment.
• 54:23
  Yeah, that's a good idea.
• 54:24
  When I was working in the House of Commons, I was a legislative assistant for about a year for the opposition environment critic.
• 54:30
  My MP couldn't go to a presentation from the World Bank.
• 54:34
  Actually, Dr.
• 54:34
  Watson was giving it.
• 54:36
  You've probably heard of him.
• 54:37
  And he showed during the presentation, he showed a map of productivity across the world in the year 2050.
• 54:44
  And it showed Canada doing great, you know.
• 54:47
  So I put up my hand, and I didn't realize in these presentations that you're not supposed to question the the wise man up front.
• 54:54
  I said, you know, you're speaking to a group of Canadian MPs to try to get us to stop climate change, but your map shows that Canada's gonna do great, as dead silence, and you can see all the MPs looking at it say, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right.
• 55:08
  You want us to spend how many billion to stop something that's good for Canada?
• 55:12
  It's hilarious.
• 55:14
  Yeah, you know, it really is interesting to me that Canadians would want to stop a warming climate when it has so many benefits for Canadians.
• 55:22
  Yeah, why you would spend a penny, a penny on it makes zero sense to me.
• 55:28
  Um but I guess it's that socialist mechanism thought process.
• 55:32
  I mean uh uh doing it for the whole rest of the world, you know, heck with the individual, you know, it's about the collective and you know, making sacrifices of individuals okay for the collective, and we're a world collective, the globalist theme, instead of hey, no, we're Canadians, we should do what's best for Canadians.
• 55:50
  So, yeah, circling back to the earlier segment.
• 55:52
  I wonder if Albertans are gonna wake up to the fact that they can do far better without the rest of Canada.
• 55:58
  Right, and that's actually an interesting point.
• 56:00
  We should we'll see how it goes in Canada.
• 56:02
  I mean, I sure as heck hope Canada retains Alberta, they're our piggy bank.
• 56:07
  So my guest today, yeah.
• 56:10
  But my guest today has been Frank Lesay.
• 56:13
  He's a senior policy analyst with the committee for a constructive tomorrow.
• 56:17
  And he's also running a website.
• 56:19
  What's the link again, Frank?
• 56:21
  Uh, Truth in Energy and Climate.com.
• 56:23
  Yes.
• 56:24
  Yeah, exactly.
• 56:25
  And people should look up his new book, Climate and Energy Lies, expensive, dangerous, and destructive.
• 56:30
  And I think we've shown that today.
• 56:31
  So thanks so much for being my guest today, Frank.
• 56:34
  Hey, you're very welcome, and thanks for having me on, and thanks for listening, folks.
• 56:38
  And talk to some other people.
• 56:39
  I I employ you, go out and talk to them, try to talk a little sense to them.
• 56:43
  Yeah, exactly.
• 56:44
  So this is Tom Harrison, my guest Frank Lessay, signing out from the other side of the story.