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SMNTY Classics: Women <3 Monsters? · Stuff Mom Never Told You

0:05
Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie, Samantha. I'm welcome to stuff I've
0:07
Speaker 1: never told your protection of by High Radio. So it's Samantha.
0:21
Speaker 1: You have talked a lot about monsters and shipping and
0:24
Speaker 1: all of these things, which is related to what episode
0:28
Speaker 1: of Bringing Back Today, But I'm not sure I've ever
0:30
Speaker 1: asked you this. You have a favorite horror movie villain? Yeah,
0:35
Speaker 1: I know you've never asked me that, and now we
0:37
Speaker 1: have to think about it because villain wise, m h yeah,
0:43
Speaker 1: you know you got your classics. We've been talking a
0:46
Speaker 1: lot about, Like you know, I said, I really like
0:48
Speaker 1: vampires like that. That's stuffing that I really do like.
0:51
Speaker 1: But honestly, I love a good demon possession. I feel
0:55
Speaker 1: like those are the ones that can get you the best.
0:58
Speaker 1: At time, will say, and I'm so sad it's a
1:02
Speaker 1: Roman Polinski film because I don't like him and I
1:05
Speaker 1: can no longer watch this. But Rosemary's Baby, the antagonist
1:09
Speaker 1: was a whole like to me, so it always but
1:14
Speaker 1: what it was for being a horror movie to me,
1:18
Speaker 1: that was one of the ones that still stand today
1:22
Speaker 1: as a horror movie, you know, because a lot of
1:24
Speaker 1: the old ones are really cheesy and you're like what
1:26
Speaker 1: is that, right? Or you know, uh, even Jaws to
1:30
Speaker 1: a certain degree, Like you're like, okay, but I feel
1:34
Speaker 1: like things like that when it comes to an idea. Yeah,
1:38
Speaker 1: what gets me more than anything else, right, I mean
1:41
Speaker 1: it's upsetting how much that movie still holds up for sure. Yeah.
1:45
Speaker 1: I'm somebody who's oddly like very competitive about things that
1:49
Speaker 1: don't matter. Like I don't really care, but like if
1:51
Speaker 1: a movie comes out and it's like Freddie versus Jason,
1:53
Speaker 1: I have an immediate like, oh, this one should win.
1:58
Speaker 1: And I don't know why that is, but so I
1:59
Speaker 1: have like rankings of you know, you got your hell
2:01
Speaker 1: Raiser and your candy Man and Freddie and Jason and
2:04
Speaker 1: Michael and all of those people. One of the reasons
2:06
Speaker 1: I was thinking about this is I was talking about
2:08
Speaker 1: with some friends of ours this past weekend. It's getting
2:10
Speaker 1: dead by daylight I think that's what it's called. But
2:13
Speaker 1: you get to pick like a popular villain and everyone
2:16
Speaker 1: else is trying to survive, and you're, you know, Michael
2:21
Speaker 1: trying to kill them and you have to survive till
2:22
Speaker 1: daylight or kill them all to win, depending on who
2:25
Speaker 1: you are. I really like Samaraw from the Ring, the
2:30
Speaker 1: Original Ring. I really like Pyramid and from Silent Hill
2:34
Speaker 1: the game, but you know it's also represented in the movie.
2:36
Speaker 1: You much more messed up. Perhaps well I don't know,
2:38
Speaker 1: it's messed up all around. That's not my next watch list.
2:43
Speaker 1: Oh gosh, I'm interested to hear what you think. Yeah,
2:49
Speaker 1: for sure. I mean there's really if you can do
2:52
Speaker 1: a good villain in a Halloween movie, even if it's
2:55
Speaker 1: kind of cheesier, kind of fun funny like that can
2:59
Speaker 1: that really is what makes said a lot of times,
3:01
Speaker 1: you've got to have that villain that either really scares
3:03
Speaker 1: you and or is somehow like you can see they're
3:08
Speaker 1: they're not maybe their side of it, but kind of
3:10
Speaker 1: like their origins to where you kind of understand. Or
3:13
Speaker 1: they might not even have one at all and that's
3:14
Speaker 1: even terrifying. Or they're funny. Are there something about them
3:17
Speaker 1: that's kind of like pretty with his puns or whatever. Ye, yes, yes,
3:24
Speaker 1: I've thought about this a lot. Link But yes, all
3:30
Speaker 1: of that being said, you wanted to bring back this
3:32
Speaker 1: episode about women and their their love of monsters, so
3:37
Speaker 1: please enjoy. Hey this is Annie and I'm Samantha and
3:45
Speaker 1: welcome to stuff and I'll never told your protection of
3:47
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio's house stuff works. Okay, all right, here
3:58
Speaker 1: we go today. We are finally tackling a topic I
4:02
Speaker 1: have wanted to talk about for a long time. I
4:05
Speaker 1: believe in the first ever episode that I was on
4:07
Speaker 1: that wasn't kind of an intro episode, I mentioned that
4:11
Speaker 1: I wanted to talk about this, right. I think you
4:13
Speaker 1: told me that pretty quickly as one of your ideas
4:15
Speaker 1: when we were discussing the future a sementy and I'm like,
4:18
Speaker 1: I don't know if I can contribute to this, but
4:20
Speaker 1: I will be there to listen. Perfect, Yes, And I've
4:23
Speaker 1: wanted to talk about this, like just not even on podcasts,
4:28
Speaker 1: but just a woman about town, a woman in southtown,
4:32
Speaker 1: even else, I'm a woman about town since Twilight was
4:38
Speaker 1: at its cheek because I I was just so kind
4:42
Speaker 1: of befuddled and intrigued about what was happening. So did
4:46
Speaker 1: you watch any of the Twilight? I watched the first one.
4:49
Speaker 1: And I'm not here to make fun of what anyone enjoys. Um,
4:53
Speaker 1: I just wasn't right. I went in blind and I
4:57
Speaker 1: laughed at a part I'm not sure I was supposed
4:58
Speaker 1: to laugh at. This movie was kind of laughing. It
5:01
Speaker 1: was the first movie and this young girl behind me
5:05
Speaker 1: threatened to cut me in an alleyway, and I was like,
5:08
Speaker 1: I want to talk about this one day. I'll have
5:10
Speaker 1: a podcast of my own and I can I can
5:14
Speaker 1: delve into your So I was in the middle of
5:17
Speaker 1: the Twilight frenzy as well, and I was much older
5:20
Speaker 1: than the majority of the Twilight people who Twilight fans.
5:23
Speaker 1: I think the fandom um and I will say it
5:25
Speaker 1: was really enjoyable, and I did like it because it
5:27
Speaker 1: was an easy read and it was really like mind
5:31
Speaker 1: numbing in the sense of like you don't have to
5:33
Speaker 1: think too hard into it. And as any other thing,
5:36
Speaker 1: we talked about fan girling, which is sexist in a comment,
5:39
Speaker 1: but essentially um the idea that you get really obsessive
5:44
Speaker 1: with the character and or an idea. And this is
5:47
Speaker 1: kind of that world of that fantasy world which also
5:49
Speaker 1: translated into Fifts of Gray. Yes, Twilight, right, but it
5:54
Speaker 1: brought that same kind of satuation, brought that for older
5:57
Speaker 1: women and older generations that would have been the for Twilight.
6:01
Speaker 1: I think, yeah, And I that's why I don't want
6:05
Speaker 1: to be judgmental of that, because I think because I
6:09
Speaker 1: don't like romance. That's why I didn't like Twilight. But
6:12
Speaker 1: if I fan girl about so much stuff, I was
6:17
Speaker 1: believe me, Harry Potter, I went and it's still still
6:20
Speaker 1: um right, And I think for me, I'm not necessarily
6:22
Speaker 1: all about romance, but as a person who wished to
6:25
Speaker 1: have romance or wish for the perfect idea of romance. Um.
6:29
Speaker 1: But I'm cynical in real life oddly enough that I'm like, yeah,
6:33
Speaker 1: this would be awesome. Yeah, I'll take your word for it.
6:37
Speaker 1: I'm just saying we will be returning to Twilight. I
6:40
Speaker 1: love how we always bury the lead of what the
6:41
Speaker 1: episode is about. So we're talking about no, no, no, no no,
6:46
Speaker 1: I love it. We're talking about women and monsters and
6:48
Speaker 1: kind of this this trope and this attraction of it
6:53
Speaker 1: seems and a lot of our media women and monsters, right,
6:57
Speaker 1: vampires being one of those. And before we get into it,
7:01
Speaker 1: trigger warnings were I mean, this is just going to
7:03
Speaker 1: kind of come up. We're not going to delve into it,
7:05
Speaker 1: but lighthearted. Yeah, esque, there is one thing that I
7:10
Speaker 1: will maybe say it's not but it's it's generally we're
7:14
Speaker 1: just kind of mentioning these things, rape, sexual assault, and
7:18
Speaker 1: general warning about porn and fetishes, and um, we do
7:22
Speaker 1: want to be careful to not judge any consensual, safe,
7:25
Speaker 1: healthy things that people are into, right and again, and
7:30
Speaker 1: we'll be talking more and more about this with like
7:32
Speaker 1: the b d s M and bondage. But everything has
7:35
Speaker 1: to do with consent and communication in being an adult
7:39
Speaker 1: who can consent legally. Yes, um, so let's get into it.
7:47
Speaker 1: I'm so excited. Even if there's no sexual attraction. It's
7:51
Speaker 1: hard to deny after looking at our pop culture that
7:54
Speaker 1: we don't find monsters, especially the more human esque humanoid
7:58
Speaker 1: ones appealing. People writing about the popularity of monsters point
8:02
Speaker 1: to their relatability. They're different than us humans here, but
8:08
Speaker 1: we can see ourselves in them, and a lot of
8:10
Speaker 1: us can connect with that feeling of being outcasts. Right,
8:13
Speaker 1: you want to be the underdog that comes out on top. Yes, Yes,
8:17
Speaker 1: we love an underdog. And like I've said many times,
8:19
Speaker 1: I think horror movies are great mirrors to reflect back
8:23
Speaker 1: what we as a society have hang ups around. Um
8:27
Speaker 1: and something similar can be said around monsters. They embody
8:31
Speaker 1: both fear and desirability, and fear around desirability and really
8:36
Speaker 1: doesn't that sound like we're describing attitudes around sex. I mean,
8:41
Speaker 1: I will say for me, and it's not exactly a
8:43
Speaker 1: monster monster, but like Dexter uh huh. His character was
8:46
Speaker 1: intriguing to me because it had a bit of my
8:48
Speaker 1: biggest fear of who I could be. Oh really right, yeah,
8:52
Speaker 1: getting up? Are you a little nervous? Now? Are you
8:55
Speaker 1: a little nervous? Because he reflects to a lot about
8:58
Speaker 1: trauma and has But at the same time, Kada is
9:03
Speaker 1: that guy that as the monster you want to make
9:06
Speaker 1: better somehow. Yeah. Yeah, it's a really interesting dichotomy. I
9:11
Speaker 1: was trying to explain to a friend after perhaps one
9:14
Speaker 1: too many tea glasses of wine at five am. Um, yes,
9:19
Speaker 1: this is after we karaokee. This is why I can't
9:22
Speaker 1: hang with you past like am we had to wait
9:25
Speaker 1: for our pizza to um. And I was just explaining
9:29
Speaker 1: to her she does this thing where she becomes contrary
9:33
Speaker 1: when she's drunk. Um, And she was picking a fight
9:36
Speaker 1: with me, but she was like, I don't understand why
9:38
Speaker 1: you like the Winner Soldier so much because his hair
9:40
Speaker 1: parts so weird. And I'm like, it has nothing to
9:42
Speaker 1: do with looks. It's all about the trauma. He represents right,
9:46
Speaker 1: and that's very true. Anyway, we're getting away from the point.
9:49
Speaker 1: I'm so sorry. No, no, there's so many examples of this,
9:53
Speaker 1: so many, Um, Beauty and the Beast, Dracula, Twilight, Buffy
9:58
Speaker 1: the Vampire Slayer, Vampire Diaries, True Blood. Although there's a
10:02
Speaker 1: lot of attraction going on in True Blood, they have
10:04
Speaker 1: all the monsters. In True Blood you have from like
10:06
Speaker 1: Werewolves two which is to vampires too, Ferries. Yeah, I
10:13
Speaker 1: guess that's not really a monster is actually they turned
10:15
Speaker 1: out to be monsters in True True Blood? Oh dear,
10:20
Speaker 1: I mean that makes sense. I included. I just wanted
10:22
Speaker 1: to include that because they think in True Blood it's
10:24
Speaker 1: just generally a lot of attraction desirability, but there are
10:27
Speaker 1: a lot of monsters, and they're all the whole like
10:29
Speaker 1: idea of saving that one, Like what is that innocent character? Yeah,
10:37
Speaker 1: she's kind of the innocent virgin that they're trying to
10:42
Speaker 1: take care of. All of them are fighting over her,
10:44
Speaker 1: one pure, very white, very blonde girl with all the
10:47
Speaker 1: monsters around her, and how she attracts those people. That's
10:50
Speaker 1: part of our sexuality as well. To me, it's absolutely
10:52
Speaker 1: a part of this for sure. Um, Shape of Water
10:56
Speaker 1: is a big recent one Venom, which apparently caused a
11:00
Speaker 1: lot of excitement for some folks. I can't remember it's called.
11:02
Speaker 1: There's a name for it, but because I was gonna say,
11:05
Speaker 1: Tom Hardy, right, yeah, in the story, I've never seen
11:09
Speaker 1: this movie, but double Hardys. Oh, I've seen it in
11:11
Speaker 1: an embarrassing amount of times because of my parody that
11:14
Speaker 1: I'm making. Yes, it's all for oh well you will
11:20
Speaker 1: be so good. Um. And it's slightly different for this
11:24
Speaker 1: example of Venom because this was the audience being attracted
11:29
Speaker 1: to the monster as opposed to like in the movie.
11:31
Speaker 1: I think it's an interpretation from the audience. But I
11:35
Speaker 1: want to concluded Tom Hardy, Yeah, but there's a even
11:39
Speaker 1: the It was big enough that the company that produced this,
11:41
Speaker 1: which I believe is Sony, Um, they released a trailer
11:45
Speaker 1: after the movie came out that painted it as a
11:47
Speaker 1: rum com. It was that big of a kidding me. No,
11:51
Speaker 1: and it's great, It's it's great. I guess I need
11:54
Speaker 1: to watch it. I have not seen anything. I mean, yes,
11:57
Speaker 1: but it's not good. But you know, apologies to anyone
12:01
Speaker 1: who likes me about there. I mean but I mean yes,
12:04
Speaker 1: I mean do you do know what you want to do?
12:06
Speaker 1: I'm just a kind of warn you. It's fun, but
12:08
Speaker 1: perhaps not okay. Older movies were likely to include a
12:13
Speaker 1: less human looking creature lusting after a human woman, like
12:17
Speaker 1: King Kong. I think there is something different about these
12:20
Speaker 1: old school monster movies too, because they were less about
12:22
Speaker 1: female desire and how we view it and more about
12:25
Speaker 1: the male gaze. And we're almost entirely written by men.
12:29
Speaker 1: It's like male creatures assaulting women, right. I guess if
12:32
Speaker 1: you think about how Dracula has changed over time, like
12:36
Speaker 1: he was really big monster, pointy year guy, and now
12:39
Speaker 1: it's all of a sudden, this beautiful man like listens,
12:44
Speaker 1: doesn't listen well corn Twilight, he listens. Sorry, he sparkles. Yeah,
12:51
Speaker 1: that that was That wasn't the scene. I laughed, but
12:54
Speaker 1: I almost laughed at that. That wasn't like a laughable scene.
12:56
Speaker 1: I laughed when he walked in and smelled Bella for
12:58
Speaker 1: the first time and he made that faces they covered
13:00
Speaker 1: his nose. I just didn't know what's going on. I
13:03
Speaker 1: know it's funny anyway. If if we can include fan fiction,
13:07
Speaker 1: which everyone knows I'm I'm want to do, it's everywhere
13:11
Speaker 1: Harry Potter, which is my specialty. There are irresistible were wolves,
13:16
Speaker 1: vampires vila. Um, it's more like they can't resist the
13:20
Speaker 1: human character they are infatuated infatuated with most of the time,
13:24
Speaker 1: which doesn't really and in the books the centaurs are
13:27
Speaker 1: are seen as sexual objects like the women, like the
13:30
Speaker 1: girls are aremagly. I tried it to them. It doesn't
13:32
Speaker 1: show them much so much in the movie books they do. Yeah,
13:36
Speaker 1: video games have some interesting examples where a player can
13:39
Speaker 1: choose to pursue a relationship with a non human. I
13:42
Speaker 1: still don't get that. Oh I've done it, I know.
13:44
Speaker 1: I mean like my friend who plays the video games,
13:47
Speaker 1: he does it too, and I'm like, why, Okay, here
13:50
Speaker 1: we go. Um. So usually in this case it's an alien,
13:53
Speaker 1: not of the monster variety. But you know, depending on
13:56
Speaker 1: your take of aliens, I guess anyway. Um, I always
14:01
Speaker 1: went for Garris are Li Area, both of whom are alien.
14:04
Speaker 1: When playing the human female character in Mass Effect. It's
14:07
Speaker 1: like a foreign language to me to the Mass Effect players. Um.
14:11
Speaker 1: There's a game called Coming Out on Top, which is
14:13
Speaker 1: about queer folks exploring their sexuality, where you can opt
14:17
Speaker 1: for a goldfish as a sexual partner, um as one
14:20
Speaker 1: of many paths, many many pass um. It's really hard
14:23
Speaker 1: to describe. Why why why a goldfish? I mean, I
14:26
Speaker 1: think it's just about options. Um. That's the same with
14:31
Speaker 1: you know, mass affect and Garris. I liked his voice
14:33
Speaker 1: and he seemed even even cute. It was all about personnel,
14:37
Speaker 1: his personality. I got you, I got you. And then
14:41
Speaker 1: there is monster porn our cryptozoological rotica, which generally involves
14:46
Speaker 1: a human woman having sexual encounters with some type of creature.
14:50
Speaker 1: And this is actually largely written by women. Really, there
14:54
Speaker 1: is perhaps a surprising amount of science looking to why
14:57
Speaker 1: this is a thing, or perhaps it's not surprising at all. Um.
15:00
Speaker 1: The current consensus is it has to do with usually
15:04
Speaker 1: women wanting to explore a wider variety of erotic experiences
15:09
Speaker 1: on the internet porn side of it, though, one mystery
15:12
Speaker 1: German dude has produced almost all of the C creature
15:16
Speaker 1: porn that exists, so he does all the tentaical porn.
15:19
Speaker 1: I don't think it's tentical porn. I think it's more
15:21
Speaker 1: like creature from the Black Lagoon because, um, when the
15:24
Speaker 1: company that makes the C creature outfit that is almost
15:27
Speaker 1: always featured in these porn videos. Were asked about it
15:30
Speaker 1: um and and told you know, hey, did you know
15:32
Speaker 1: that your sea creature all this porno? They responded, quote,
15:38
Speaker 1: we did not know that our c creature costume was
15:40
Speaker 1: being used in pornographic films. We hope the actors find
15:43
Speaker 1: the costume comfortable, easy to wear, and that the audience
15:45
Speaker 1: enjoys the artistic beauty of the costume. That is the
15:49
Speaker 1: most generic like um company like corporate answer, that's pretty happy.
15:56
Speaker 1: I enjoy it unbiased, like, oh yeah, it was fantastic.
15:59
Speaker 1: We like and you can appreciate that. Due to calls
16:05
Speaker 1: that it promoted bestiality and brutality, Amazon and other websites
16:08
Speaker 1: took down some monster point, including that big Foot one
16:11
Speaker 1: everyone always uses as an example. I think probably most
16:14
Speaker 1: of you have seen it or heard of it in passing.
16:17
Speaker 1: Even if you don't know it bad. I don't want
16:21
Speaker 1: to look it up. It's just popular. I read it.
16:24
Speaker 1: I wouldn't be ashamed. My head. It's interesting, like I
16:27
Speaker 1: don't understand, like I didn't know this was an option?
16:30
Speaker 1: YEA very naive right now? Well I usually feel that way.
16:33
Speaker 1: So it's good to happen at first I wasn't going
16:38
Speaker 1: to include robots. Oh what a fun sentence that is.
16:43
Speaker 1: But then I got to thinking about the symbolism and
16:45
Speaker 1: the alien movies of the Android trying to kill Ripley
16:49
Speaker 1: in the first one and the newer ones. How David Um,
16:53
Speaker 1: who's an android like always falls in love for the
16:56
Speaker 1: lead female character and or wants to kill her despite
17:00
Speaker 1: being a robot that shouldn't in this in this movie
17:04
Speaker 1: shouldn't have those feelings Um, and all the hubbub about
17:07
Speaker 1: how hot the robot was and lost his face the
17:10
Speaker 1: new Netflix sauce in his face. Okay, so I think
17:13
Speaker 1: he related but different? I mean, would that include like
17:15
Speaker 1: Blade Runner. Aren't they all like some have Android? Yeah, yeah,
17:20
Speaker 1: I guess so. I guess so, and they have creation
17:22
Speaker 1: of life and that becomes problematic because they have created
17:25
Speaker 1: life somehow. Is that right? I've not watched it fully,
17:28
Speaker 1: but I know people are really big fans of this, Yes,
17:32
Speaker 1: and they love this idea. And the last one had
17:34
Speaker 1: Ryan Gosling, who was a beautiful, beautiful man playing a
17:36
Speaker 1: beautiful beautiful robot. Right. I was on the Ryan Gosling
17:40
Speaker 1: chain way before me. I was. I was nine years old. Hey, young,
17:44
Speaker 1: Hercules had a big crush. Oh that's right, he was
17:47
Speaker 1: all there episode What if I told you I liked
17:51
Speaker 1: him from Mickey mouse Club? Oh no, you're right. Oh no,
17:56
Speaker 1: I don't want to know the truth in this world.
17:59
Speaker 1: But I mean, I guess that would be like the
18:01
Speaker 1: objectification objectification of robots, right, Yeah, I think there's that
18:08
Speaker 1: could be a hole and I would love to talk
18:09
Speaker 1: about that as well a different episode, but just them
18:12
Speaker 1: like they're you but not quite right, Like there's something
18:15
Speaker 1: I better patorus about it. Kind of unpredictable. Yeah, So
18:20
Speaker 1: those those are a lot of the examples, and um,
18:24
Speaker 1: we have a lot more to discuss, but first we're
18:26
Speaker 1: gonna pause for a quick fick for work from our sponsor,
18:41
Speaker 1: and we're back, Thank you. Sponsored. We're not the only
18:45
Speaker 1: ones who are curious about this, or I'm not. I mean,
18:47
Speaker 1: Samantha's just kind of just learning. This is a fascinating topic,
18:51
Speaker 1: so let's keep going, okay. Psychologists think that it in
18:54
Speaker 1: part has to do with the allure and thrill of
18:57
Speaker 1: the unknown. There's also an inherent poward dynamic, a submissive
19:01
Speaker 1: dominant layer that some people are attracted to. On top
19:05
Speaker 1: of that, monsters can often represent repressed sexuality, especially things
19:08
Speaker 1: that are taboo or perverse, and sexual desire. Monsters can
19:14
Speaker 1: represent raw animal passion and also often exemplify exaggerated masculine traits.
19:20
Speaker 1: Can be exciting and different, and sometimes people are attracted
19:24
Speaker 1: to that danger kind of like we were just talking
19:25
Speaker 1: about something else. I found said. Early examples of this,
19:28
Speaker 1: especially in children's movies like Beauty and the Beast, were
19:31
Speaker 1: meant as almost moral tales of male predatory behavior and
19:35
Speaker 1: gender roles in scripts. So men in this case are
19:38
Speaker 1: animalistic with insatiable desires, and women either will fall victim
19:42
Speaker 1: to that desire or have to cater to it. Right.
19:44
Speaker 1: I guess you could say that about the red riding
19:46
Speaker 1: Hood A little red riding hood. Yeah, yeah, that came
19:49
Speaker 1: up as an example as well um Bell's love, and
19:54
Speaker 1: in this case you can read it as femininity and
19:56
Speaker 1: her sex makes the beast human. It redeems his animalistic,
20:01
Speaker 1: brutish nature, brings out his best qualities. Without it, he
20:05
Speaker 1: is a monster. But Gia Tolentino wrote in The New Yorker,
20:09
Speaker 1: the half buried truth about Disney's Beauty and the Beast
20:11
Speaker 1: is that in the end, the Prince is a let down.
20:14
Speaker 1: I thought so too, like it's not as good as
20:17
Speaker 1: the Beast. No, Like, it's not even that for me.
20:20
Speaker 1: It was for a lot of people because you do
20:22
Speaker 1: spend the whole movie with this character and then it's
20:24
Speaker 1: like a blonde ponytail dude. Right wait. I just remember thinking, no,
20:33
Speaker 1: you like the goofy manner. I guess I think I
20:36
Speaker 1: was just I'm thinking about the scene where she's teaching
20:39
Speaker 1: him how to eat correct and he's like, oh, it
20:42
Speaker 1: was always like a big bumbling guy who stopped and he
20:45
Speaker 1: he was like, well, thank you. Yes. I think it's
20:48
Speaker 1: just you spend time like it's kind of odd at
20:52
Speaker 1: the end. Here is this character and it just feels
20:54
Speaker 1: jarring kind of um, and if it is like the
20:57
Speaker 1: top search result if you type in Beauty and the
21:01
Speaker 1: Beast Prince, and it's like, it's a let down. So
21:03
Speaker 1: a lot of people think that. And there's also Stockholm
21:07
Speaker 1: syndrome involved in that. That particular example can also be
21:11
Speaker 1: interpreted as Bell sacrificing her freedom and the Beast sacrificing
21:15
Speaker 1: what made him different. M and then um kind of related.
21:22
Speaker 1: Buffy has that, and I love Buffy. Damn Parcelor but
21:24
Speaker 1: it has that problematic thing with Angel and Buffy where
21:28
Speaker 1: the seconds after they have sex he becomes a mindless
21:32
Speaker 1: monster and she loses him. Um. And then there's also
21:36
Speaker 1: the problematic thing of the attempted rape of Buffy by Spike.
21:39
Speaker 1: Don't they get together in the end? They get together
21:42
Speaker 1: at some points over I can't remember how it ends.
21:47
Speaker 1: I just remember that being a thing. They do get together.
21:50
Speaker 1: So he tried to rape her, but then they got together. Yeah,
21:53
Speaker 1: that is so many things. And then then this is
21:55
Speaker 1: a whole cautionary tell if you have sex, it's going
21:57
Speaker 1: to be really bad. The guy who you like will
22:00
Speaker 1: be an ass. Yes, that was you were going, I
22:08
Speaker 1: got you, I got you. Yeah. And then there's a book.
22:10
Speaker 1: I think it's written by rol Stein. Um. It was
22:13
Speaker 1: definitely one of those teen thriller slash horror riders that
22:17
Speaker 1: I love. Wrote an adult book, adult novel which included
22:21
Speaker 1: this like monster character that I think came from incests somehow,
22:26
Speaker 1: and he's he's a horrible man, horrible thing with no mind,
22:31
Speaker 1: and the mother's trying to control him or whatever, and
22:33
Speaker 1: then he goes out and eats people. But one of
22:35
Speaker 1: the scenes he's raping a woman that he's essentially eating
22:38
Speaker 1: at the same time on a carnival ride. I believe
22:40
Speaker 1: it was really like what is going on? And of
22:44
Speaker 1: course the woman who was eaten was the slut of
22:48
Speaker 1: the characters, so that was like that was like four
22:50
Speaker 1: college friends and the virginal not a word where the
22:55
Speaker 1: virginal one was like protected somehow, but the slut character
22:59
Speaker 1: was one that ended up being eaten and raped as
23:02
Speaker 1: though she deserved it, and she tried to I think,
23:07
Speaker 1: entice him. It has a way to try to get
23:09
Speaker 1: away from him, as if like giving what he wanted,
23:11
Speaker 1: what the monster wanted, she could maybe live, but she
23:13
Speaker 1: of course doesn't. I just remember that being like, oh
23:16
Speaker 1: my god, what is happening? So he kind of took
23:18
Speaker 1: all the tropes of the cliches of monsters and films
23:23
Speaker 1: and all of that, and women within monsters and books.
23:25
Speaker 1: It's kind of like, what what the hell just happened?
23:29
Speaker 1: It was really weird. Yeah, that that sounds a lot
23:31
Speaker 1: like have you ever seen Cavin in the Woods? Yes,
23:33
Speaker 1: it sounds like that, but Kevin and the Woods is
23:35
Speaker 1: a parody. Um. Also, when Samantha brought this up in
23:39
Speaker 1: the studio that there was an arl Stein, I don't
23:41
Speaker 1: book me and super producer Andrew got so excited started
23:46
Speaker 1: explaining what it was. They were like, oh no, that
23:49
Speaker 1: sounds terrible. I need to go back and make sure.
23:52
Speaker 1: Either it was arl Stein, maybe Christopher Pike, but it
23:54
Speaker 1: was definitely one of those. And the reason I read
23:56
Speaker 1: it was because I love them both so much growing up.
23:59
Speaker 1: You know who doesn't love the Fear Straight Chronicles It's
24:01
Speaker 1: fantastic or all of the goodn't like Goosebumps as much.
24:05
Speaker 1: I like the Fear Street, I like the Witches. I
24:08
Speaker 1: like the one with the two girls who go hit
24:10
Speaker 1: hiking and one of the girls as the murdyrer. But
24:12
Speaker 1: you think it's the guy that they picked up the
24:14
Speaker 1: entire time that he knew had to do a good
24:16
Speaker 1: plot twist, twist twist. Some studies have shown that despite
24:21
Speaker 1: finding the possibility or reality of real life rape horrifying
24:26
Speaker 1: and traumatic, up to six of women admit to fantasizing
24:30
Speaker 1: about having sex. I guess there will, particularly with monsters,
24:34
Speaker 1: and we sort of touched on this. It depends on
24:38
Speaker 1: publishing schedules, um, but I think it's super complicated, and I,
24:43
Speaker 1: along with the study authors, want to emphatically drive home,
24:47
Speaker 1: this is not me that women want to be raped
24:49
Speaker 1: in real life. No, no, no, no, not coerced, forced,
24:53
Speaker 1: nothing of the sort. Um Like some men disgustingly and
24:56
Speaker 1: excitedly claimed when these survey results came out, it's um,
25:01
Speaker 1: there's a lot of reasons behind it. But like we
25:03
Speaker 1: were saying, they are too consenting. Adults can agree to
25:07
Speaker 1: like plays or scenes as we all learn the terms
25:11
Speaker 1: for yes as in fact in what you do in
25:14
Speaker 1: the privacy of your own home with your partner or
25:17
Speaker 1: whomever you do with that day, and you have an
25:19
Speaker 1: established actual play things consent, consenting thing you want, whatever
25:26
Speaker 1: it does, and that's fine. But once again, they're still
25:28
Speaker 1: consent and play. Whether it's like there's a time in
25:31
Speaker 1: frame at whatever scenario you've got for yourself. UM. And
25:36
Speaker 1: I have a lot of my own theories on why
25:38
Speaker 1: this is, and I think, like most things, there's a
25:41
Speaker 1: lot going on and everybody is different. But um science
25:46
Speaker 1: people who studied this and conducted the survey think it
25:50
Speaker 1: has to do UM with with both people who generally
25:59
Speaker 1: take charge and things and find it a relief to
26:02
Speaker 1: not take charge of something, to like relinquish control or
26:06
Speaker 1: responsibility um. And then there is also women feeling like
26:11
Speaker 1: she can't say yes to something she wants are simultaneously
26:16
Speaker 1: fearing and desiring sex um. Are wanting her beauty and
26:20
Speaker 1: desirable desirability, which is our currency in this society, confirmed
26:24
Speaker 1: as irresistible. And these are like fantasies again like just
26:28
Speaker 1: to drive the home its fantasies um. Some psychologists think
26:32
Speaker 1: has to do with the woman fearing emasculating the man
26:36
Speaker 1: and promoting violence and diminishing her desirability if refusing sex.
26:41
Speaker 1: And yes, all of this is very hetero research um.
26:46
Speaker 1: And a couple of things to add here is the
26:48
Speaker 1: women who reported having these fantasies also reported higher levels
26:51
Speaker 1: of consensual fantasies and higher levels of openness and positivity
26:55
Speaker 1: when it comes to sex as opposed to the women
26:57
Speaker 1: who didn't. Because of that, some psychologists this fantasy might
27:00
Speaker 1: be an underlying desire to explore more sexual scenarios like
27:04
Speaker 1: bondage or some other kink. Again. Again, again, do not
27:08
Speaker 1: take this as women secretly want for sex, because that
27:12
Speaker 1: is not a thing. It is not ever ever a thing,
27:15
Speaker 1: not a thing. You will know from the mouth of
27:17
Speaker 1: the woman if she wants to have sex, yes, yes, um.
27:23
Speaker 1: And because we are going to discuss bondage and um
27:29
Speaker 1: fetishes the partner yes, mouth of partner consent on all parties,
27:34
Speaker 1: on every party. And again, fantasy different fantasy, and the
27:40
Speaker 1: likelihood of someone acting out their fantasies are going to
27:44
Speaker 1: be still in the conversation, right and communication mm hmm. Yeah,
27:51
Speaker 1: So just keep that in mind. Uh, and we will
27:55
Speaker 1: be returning returning to that a little bit in upcoming episodes.
27:59
Speaker 1: So distant psychologists take issue with the term rape fantasy
28:02
Speaker 1: to saying it should be more accurately described as consensual
28:06
Speaker 1: ravishment or agreed to aggression. And again, I think this
28:09
Speaker 1: is a lot to do with our own, um past
28:12
Speaker 1: socidal ideas of being manly or masculine. And again this
28:17
Speaker 1: is very heteronormative. But if you look at things like
28:21
Speaker 1: The fountain Head, there's a pretty intense scene of this
28:24
Speaker 1: guy coming after her, who is the main protagonist and
28:28
Speaker 1: the hero of the book, with this girl who is
28:31
Speaker 1: snobby enrich that gets taken by him, and the same
28:34
Speaker 1: idea with gone with a win when he picks her
28:37
Speaker 1: up and ravishes her essentially and he feels regret the
28:39
Speaker 1: next day that is not the same thing, and for
28:43
Speaker 1: some reason it is romanticized. So thatfore the idea of
28:46
Speaker 1: having a rep butler in your life sweeping your way
28:50
Speaker 1: as opposed to, hey, this is any other the guy
28:52
Speaker 1: tried to touch me on punch him in the throat
28:54
Speaker 1: and thick, I guess I can't say that, I think
28:57
Speaker 1: so okay, well I just did m But I mean
29:00
Speaker 1: that's the difference is like this is a whole picture,
29:02
Speaker 1: and again breaking down what is norm and what is
29:05
Speaker 1: not norm, and then breaking down what is acceptable and
29:08
Speaker 1: not acceptable. Yeah, um, and I know I was reading
29:14
Speaker 1: some other studies about how, um, there's a fear of
29:18
Speaker 1: communicating like what you want if it's not quote unquote
29:23
Speaker 1: normal when it comes to sex, if it is kind
29:25
Speaker 1: of a fantasy or something that might be a little
29:28
Speaker 1: um more scaye. So it is hard to get good
29:34
Speaker 1: numbers around it because you know, people are a little
29:36
Speaker 1: so it can be a little shy. Well. And also
29:38
Speaker 1: there's still that shape factor that happens, as we talked
29:40
Speaker 1: about many many times, and whether or not we can
29:43
Speaker 1: say what we want because will you look on me
29:46
Speaker 1: with shame? What do I have guilt about these feelings? Whatever? What? Not? Um,
29:50
Speaker 1: there's a huge cloud over everyone, um with whatever they
29:54
Speaker 1: think is not normal based on their experiences or their
29:57
Speaker 1: environment or their social ideas. Um. And so therefore they
30:01
Speaker 1: would rather just sit in silence that actually communicate and
30:05
Speaker 1: be open. Yeah. Yeah, but I think things that are
30:08
Speaker 1: changing slowly. Yes, there are a lot of dudes and
30:13
Speaker 1: some women who like to argue that the attraction of
30:15
Speaker 1: monsters thing demonstrates that toxic masculinity doesn't exist and that
30:20
Speaker 1: it's what women really want. And also no, also no,
30:25
Speaker 1: like what, yeah, I just saw that in a lot
30:28
Speaker 1: of places, and I was like, Okay, well no, but
30:31
Speaker 1: I want to address it. Side issue female sea creatures
30:35
Speaker 1: giving up power and family to be with human men,
30:38
Speaker 1: because I've seen that in a couple of things Allan,
30:40
Speaker 1: you are the Little Mermaid. The related side issue the
30:44
Speaker 1: quote monster hotness gap. I did not coin that, or
30:47
Speaker 1: the fact that generally speaking, female monsters have to be
30:51
Speaker 1: hot and overly sexualized, but this isn't as often the
30:55
Speaker 1: case with women and male monsters. Just think of Monster
30:59
Speaker 1: Halloween teams from men versus women. Yeah, like, I mean
31:03
Speaker 1: you and I are talking. Also the fact that when
31:05
Speaker 1: we look at the movie with Megan fox. Oh, Jennifer's body. Yeah,
31:10
Speaker 1: Jennifer's body. She's a monster, but she's this hot ass
31:13
Speaker 1: monster that comes around and he knows seduce his boys. Um.
31:16
Speaker 1: And many of the times you see these monsters being
31:19
Speaker 1: really beautiful females and then transforming into this ugly thing
31:23
Speaker 1: later on in time monster within and right right, um
31:31
Speaker 1: as where the monsters of men are just out there.
31:34
Speaker 1: And I mean, have you ever heard of the reverse
31:36
Speaker 1: Beauty and the beast? Beauty and the hunk, hunking the beast?
31:43
Speaker 1: Not beauty and the beasts? So I we hunk and
31:45
Speaker 1: the beast, And no it shouldn't beauty and the honk.
31:50
Speaker 1: That's just like that's the reality show happening on the beach. Right. Um.
31:58
Speaker 1: I just dated myself by using the term, didn't I
32:01
Speaker 1: I don't know. I think hunks still has a thing,
32:03
Speaker 1: I think so. Um. There's also a female monsters sympathy gap.
32:08
Speaker 1: We're more likely as audiences to sympathize with male monsters
32:11
Speaker 1: than we are with female monsters. I wonder why that
32:14
Speaker 1: could be. Also, female monsters are almost always single. And
32:20
Speaker 1: I almost went into a huge tangent about it, but
32:21
Speaker 1: then I was like, you gotta range almost always go
32:24
Speaker 1: after their best friends guys. I've noticed that a lot
32:27
Speaker 1: like they go after something that is right, you know,
32:30
Speaker 1: supposed to be priority for females, being caddy as it were. Um,
32:35
Speaker 1: some of the things we're talking about here can and
32:36
Speaker 1: sometimes do fall under the umbrella of fetish or kinks,
32:39
Speaker 1: but not always. I do want to mention that a
32:43
Speaker 1: Shape of Water themed dildo on Etsy keeps selling out
32:48
Speaker 1: and after it's Oscar when it's sold out in twenty deepness,
32:53
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna lie I've never seen that movie just
32:55
Speaker 1: because I couldn't understand the premise, and I get it.
32:58
Speaker 1: I get it. By the same time, I was like,
33:01
Speaker 1: there's a really interesting take on that movie about how
33:06
Speaker 1: it's supposed to be you know, romantic. But at the
33:11
Speaker 1: same time, the director's skim adults for right. He kind
33:15
Speaker 1: of has publicly looked down on people fetishizing. Um, the
33:21
Speaker 1: monster are not even fetishizing, but just kind of romanticizing.
33:24
Speaker 1: And but but at the same time, it's like, this
33:26
Speaker 1: is what the movie is. It's it's weird. I saw
33:31
Speaker 1: that came up a lot when I was researching this,
33:32
Speaker 1: but it wasn't exactly what we're talking about so I
33:34
Speaker 1: didn't include a lot of it. Um. I've always thought
33:38
Speaker 1: this whole thing had something to do with how women
33:41
Speaker 1: and society at large are taught to fear female sexual
33:44
Speaker 1: desire and pleasure, going back to like the taboo thing,
33:47
Speaker 1: so a lot of us have difficulty expressing it and
33:50
Speaker 1: also suffer from low self esteem. Into a sexy, powerful
33:54
Speaker 1: vampire who literally cannot resist you, who is so in
33:57
Speaker 1: love heavy quotes with you, he watches usually bit Night
34:00
Speaker 1: and wants to hear your every thought. Creepy. But I
34:04
Speaker 1: found some pieces that argued it might have to do
34:06
Speaker 1: with marginalized people emphasizing with creatures on the outside of society.
34:10
Speaker 1: There's some criticism in that vein to that rather than
34:13
Speaker 1: depict sex outside of our sis, hetero noorms, pop culture
34:17
Speaker 1: ops for monsters instead. Yeah, I found that interesting. And
34:22
Speaker 1: related to this are more modern take on more respectful,
34:26
Speaker 1: consensual monsters with women. Pairings and attraction to them is
34:29
Speaker 1: sometimes credited to our desire to see stories that allow
34:32
Speaker 1: women more sexual agency, that depict more queer lead relationships
34:36
Speaker 1: and or depict more non white leading relationships, and Hollywood's
34:40
Speaker 1: resistance to that because these are still straight, white ladies
34:44
Speaker 1: falling from monsters as opposed to doing that. But like
34:46
Speaker 1: we're craving something else so much then what we've seen
34:51
Speaker 1: that I guess for monsters or the way we're going
34:54
Speaker 1: with it, Okay, something else. I read claim that vampires
34:58
Speaker 1: and werewolves, often especially in older works, were layered with
35:01
Speaker 1: homosexual overtones and thus a fear of spreading homosexuality. Yes, yes, um.
35:09
Speaker 1: And I also want to add that I think writing
35:12
Speaker 1: fan fiction that involves sex with the monster that isn't
35:14
Speaker 1: consensual is often a way of working through complicated feelings
35:18
Speaker 1: around sex or past sexual experiences. Is easier to think
35:22
Speaker 1: of someone as a straight at monster than a human
35:24
Speaker 1: person who victimized you. That's just my theory about some
35:27
Speaker 1: of it, not all of it at all, but some
35:29
Speaker 1: of it. And another theory I have, because I have
35:32
Speaker 1: thought of episode, is that all of this might have
35:36
Speaker 1: to do with male writers grappling with the societal scripts
35:40
Speaker 1: that tell them that they can't control their desires and
35:43
Speaker 1: women will love them no matter their monstrous attitude. Anyway,
35:47
Speaker 1: Are that that the love of a woman will make
35:50
Speaker 1: them better? Love of a pure woman? Yes, I will
35:53
Speaker 1: make them pure as well, exactly so, there's a lot
35:56
Speaker 1: going on here. Um, but we're not done. But first
36:01
Speaker 1: we have one more quick break for a word from
36:02
Speaker 1: our sponsor, the Vampire st and we're back. Thank you sponsor,
36:18
Speaker 1: And we are back with Vampire Vanpa. Because I didn't
36:23
Speaker 1: want to look at them specifically for a second and
36:25
Speaker 1: I was. I asked you before we did this if
36:27
Speaker 1: you had any kind of monster attraction things going on,
36:31
Speaker 1: and you said the one thing that I've always really
36:33
Speaker 1: really liked our vampire stories, and I've loved them from
36:36
Speaker 1: the beginning. And this is why I also say I
36:38
Speaker 1: did know about Twilight. I also loved um Interview with
36:41
Speaker 1: a Vampire that was one of my favorites. I even
36:43
Speaker 1: watched the one with Jim Carrey, the really really old
36:47
Speaker 1: school one. What is it like a comedy? Uh? Good, gosh,
36:51
Speaker 1: it's so old was a vampire? Yes, he he transforms
36:57
Speaker 1: into a new vampire. Oh and it was um on
37:03
Speaker 1: rotten tomatoes but it was film. And yeah, he gets bitten.
37:08
Speaker 1: I can't remember the quite premise. He gets bitten and
37:10
Speaker 1: he's slowly transforming and it's obviously a bit of a comedy. Um.
37:14
Speaker 1: But yeah, I even watched that one because I really
37:16
Speaker 1: liked it. I liked the idea, Yeah, there's something to
37:22
Speaker 1: me when you see this kind of like darkness and
37:25
Speaker 1: defying death. I think was part of my fascination. Also,
37:29
Speaker 1: Brad Pitt was beautiful. I will say this thing between
37:32
Speaker 1: him and Kirsten Does was really really creepy and almost
37:36
Speaker 1: did not make me happy. It definitely didn't make me happy.
37:38
Speaker 1: But it's very sexualized. Of all, I feel like all
37:41
Speaker 1: of the monster movies or like that type of non
37:45
Speaker 1: human movies, vampires are the most sexualized me that anything else.
37:50
Speaker 1: I would agree. I would agree with that, and that's
37:52
Speaker 1: why we have this whole section specific Um what does
37:58
Speaker 1: that say about me? Then? Damn? Oh no, No, you
38:01
Speaker 1: were definitely not alone. Um. So I found a lot
38:05
Speaker 1: of theories about why we have a fascination with vampires,
38:11
Speaker 1: and one of the and while they're so sexualized, I'm
38:14
Speaker 1: one of the first things that I ran into that
38:16
Speaker 1: was really obvious when I read it, but I was
38:18
Speaker 1: still sort of surprised, is that it's a replacement for sex,
38:21
Speaker 1: because you're like exchanging bodily wods, but you're not having sex. Again,
38:29
Speaker 1: it's someone who maybe can't resist you, who might bite
38:33
Speaker 1: you at any time can offer you eternal life, eternal youth.
38:38
Speaker 1: Um is unchanging in city. I thought that was such
38:40
Speaker 1: a funny argument. But again, I guess that makes sense.
38:43
Speaker 1: Like if you're you want somebody steady at commitment in
38:46
Speaker 1: your life, then someone who could commit to you. Right
38:49
Speaker 1: there you go a safe sex symbol. I found that argument.
38:54
Speaker 1: Um the bad boy and the allure of reforming him
38:59
Speaker 1: or the tortured sensitive soul. I do love a really
39:03
Speaker 1: sad boy. I do too, and I don't. I have
39:06
Speaker 1: a lot of friends that make fun of me for that,
39:07
Speaker 1: But oh my goodness, I did. I like the tortured
39:10
Speaker 1: artist guy. That was my thing. That on another episode
39:13
Speaker 1: to come back to the fact that they're mesmerizing um
39:19
Speaker 1: the fantasy of not having to be responsible and almost
39:23
Speaker 1: always played by conventionally attractive actors. Although the original Dracula,
39:29
Speaker 1: sure this is our newer Sparato was not a pretty boy. No, no,
39:35
Speaker 1: have you seen um? As we lie in the shadows?
39:38
Speaker 1: What we do in the what we do in the shadow?
39:40
Speaker 1: I love that. I love the show. I haven't watched
39:44
Speaker 1: the show, but I know the movie in itself. It
39:46
Speaker 1: kind of goes back to the old school idea of like, yeah,
39:48
Speaker 1: it's not a sexy as you think, and I do
39:50
Speaker 1: love their takes on that. Yes, I love it any
39:53
Speaker 1: listeners who are interested. Highly recommended good movie. Um. Twilight
39:59
Speaker 1: is often seen is a metaphor for abstinence. Oh absolutely
40:03
Speaker 1: before marriage. Edward can hardly resist Bill's sent but he
40:06
Speaker 1: must or she will be condemned to be a monster
40:09
Speaker 1: to putting the responsibility on the woman for the man's
40:13
Speaker 1: desires and actions. Another example of that, um, but also
40:15
Speaker 1: complicated by the fact that she does love him right um,
40:19
Speaker 1: And also complicated by the fact that I suppose the
40:21
Speaker 1: message there is premarrital sex as monstrous yeah, um, and
40:25
Speaker 1: I think you're going to talk about it, but actually
40:27
Speaker 1: he refuses to sleep with her because she wants to
40:31
Speaker 1: be with him so badly. And I don't think ever
40:32
Speaker 1: they've ever mentioned sex in the book or in the movie,
40:35
Speaker 1: because well, now, I'm sorry beforehand that they don't talk
40:38
Speaker 1: about it. Um. But she says something along the time
40:42
Speaker 1: learned like because the whole bag, oh my god, I
40:44
Speaker 1: can't believe I know so much of the whole back
40:46
Speaker 1: and forth is that she wants to be with him
40:48
Speaker 1: forever and she doesn't want to grow old and die
40:51
Speaker 1: he lives or whatever, and he doesn't want her to
40:52
Speaker 1: be a monster as he is quote unquote, um. But
40:56
Speaker 1: she also wants to sleep with him, and she wants
40:59
Speaker 1: to sleep with him while she's still human because she
41:02
Speaker 1: doesn't know that things will change when she's not anymore.
41:04
Speaker 1: And the only way he will do that is if
41:06
Speaker 1: they get married. So he is the one that puts
41:08
Speaker 1: it on her. So she gets married at eighteen eighteen,
41:11
Speaker 1: and for some reason that it's acceptable even this day
41:15
Speaker 1: and age, and everybody's like super excited and no one's
41:17
Speaker 1: really creeped out by the fight. Hey, that's really weird.
41:21
Speaker 1: But this is also that religious dance, which is the
41:24
Speaker 1: writer was very religious, is very I don't know, and
41:28
Speaker 1: that was part of her thing, is the pale the
41:30
Speaker 1: sexual attraction. But he was such a good guy, and
41:33
Speaker 1: it's such a good man that he makes sure that
41:36
Speaker 1: they're married first, and the's her her reputation. It's not
41:42
Speaker 1: yet because you know at eighteen, when you get married
41:45
Speaker 1: in two thousand and five, it's completely normal. Um. And
41:50
Speaker 1: I did read that part of the appeal of Edward
41:52
Speaker 1: is that his love for Bella propels him to combat
41:56
Speaker 1: his monstrous urges interest. Um. And I've said it before,
42:02
Speaker 1: We've talked about in other episodes around stalking is not romantic.
42:05
Speaker 1: But the romance between Bella and Edward displays many signs
42:09
Speaker 1: that are precursors to abuse, if not outright abuse and
42:13
Speaker 1: stalking and controlling behavior. Pop culture has for so long
42:19
Speaker 1: painted that as romance, and it can be hard to
42:22
Speaker 1: unlearn what we have taught. Like Twilight is by no
42:25
Speaker 1: means the only offender here. This is everywhere. Right, Oh no,
42:28
Speaker 1: it still is every day. Once again, we talked about
42:31
Speaker 1: Gray fifty Shades of Gray, and that just happened the
42:34
Speaker 1: news word just released a few years ago. Right, yeah,
42:36
Speaker 1: I mean it's everywhere. Um, but I did want to
42:40
Speaker 1: put that in there. We are a where that watching
42:42
Speaker 1: someone sleep against that will perhaps super creepy. Um. One
42:48
Speaker 1: article claimed that the popularity of Twilight and other modern
42:51
Speaker 1: vampires um is almost entirely straight women being attracted to game. Um, okay,
42:59
Speaker 1: and women being attracted to something dangerous yet safe, like
43:03
Speaker 1: they're powerful, but they also have a lot of self control,
43:06
Speaker 1: like they can protect you. I don't know, it's this
43:10
Speaker 1: whole like being saved idea. Yeah, and being pure and
43:15
Speaker 1: walking into something dangerous once again, because both Bella and
43:18
Speaker 1: even in Trubla, that's the same idea, and in the
43:21
Speaker 1: old school bram Strokers Jacula with Gary Oldman in one
43:25
Speaker 1: no writer, UM, it's the same thing, and she's a
43:28
Speaker 1: pure woman that comes through as an idea of saving
43:32
Speaker 1: an Individuals say True Blood did a better job of
43:36
Speaker 1: at least I guess because I had like, what's like
43:38
Speaker 1: seven seasons long of exploring her sexuality a little more
43:41
Speaker 1: and her being a little more demanding. She dreams that
43:44
Speaker 1: she has a three some of them, oh yeah, it
43:47
Speaker 1: was very stuck. But two of the vampires though, oh okay.
43:53
Speaker 1: I I don't remember that show very well. I only
43:56
Speaker 1: watched the first two seasons and with my friends, and
43:58
Speaker 1: again I really like that show. But I did like Godrick.
44:02
Speaker 1: I remember Godrick very vaguely, and I liked him. Alex Carscar,
44:07
Speaker 1: I don't know who he was. He was the one that,
44:10
Speaker 1: oh yeah, the old human character, and he was one
44:15
Speaker 1: of the first vampires. Yes, I think it really is
44:19
Speaker 1: a desire to see something different than what we have seen. UM.
44:22
Speaker 1: I also wanted to include in here briefly that when
44:24
Speaker 1: I was researching this, UM Some examples included things for
44:29
Speaker 1: monsters that I found troubling, and I think there is
44:33
Speaker 1: a layer of um able is um and misunderstanding of
44:38
Speaker 1: mental illness that is at play, and a lot of
44:42
Speaker 1: this UM. I just wanted to mention that I came
44:47
Speaker 1: across some examples that I was like, um, um the whole,
44:51
Speaker 1: this whole idea is so um the meaning two women
44:54
Speaker 1: in general um and those who identified them all just
44:57
Speaker 1: anybody who UM. I mean, there's nothing wrong in delving
45:03
Speaker 1: into an imagining world, imaginary world where you want more
45:07
Speaker 1: or you want something that is purely your fantasy. You
45:10
Speaker 1: can think what you want. Again, I still like vampires.
45:14
Speaker 1: I still think it's fantastic. I still like the idea
45:17
Speaker 1: um of that kind of fantasy realm. But A, I
45:21
Speaker 1: don't want to be stalked. B I don't want anyone
45:23
Speaker 1: to draw blood from me. So yeah, you know what
45:27
Speaker 1: I mean. But like, there is that fine line of
45:31
Speaker 1: where do we push this idea where women become these
45:36
Speaker 1: objects of whether it's they have to be the representation
45:39
Speaker 1: of purity um and they should be always pure and
45:44
Speaker 1: gentle and kind and and giving and change people, which
45:48
Speaker 1: is my like my own personal struggle in trying to
45:50
Speaker 1: be like I gotta help and fix people. That's not
45:53
Speaker 1: a true thing, but these films oftentimes portray that as
45:57
Speaker 1: this is the best way to be a woman, you
45:59
Speaker 1: know what I mean, um or this is the best
46:01
Speaker 1: way to be a good partner, and you start looking
46:04
Speaker 1: at things like fifty Shades of Gray and understand. I
46:07
Speaker 1: think what I do like about all these things is
46:09
Speaker 1: it does portray that women are sexual and do desire
46:12
Speaker 1: to have to be a part of that fantasy life
46:16
Speaker 1: and to do some more exploration and that these conversations
46:20
Speaker 1: should happen. But they do definitely like put women in
46:23
Speaker 1: a box and you have to be careful on both
46:25
Speaker 1: of those levels. Yeah. And also, I mean with most
46:31
Speaker 1: media that we enjoyed, well, I don't know about most,
46:33
Speaker 1: but a lot of media is an exaggeration of life, right,
46:38
Speaker 1: Like that's why we're going is because it takes something
46:41
Speaker 1: that maybe we feel and exaggerates it. Like superhero movies
46:45
Speaker 1: are a great example. They're still human character. I mean,
46:48
Speaker 1: when it's done well, they're human characters you can relate to,
46:50
Speaker 1: and they're dealing with things we can relate to. But
46:52
Speaker 1: on a bigger scale, like on a on a more exciting,
46:56
Speaker 1: imaginative scale. Right, So I think that is play here
47:01
Speaker 1: as well, because I mean it's just different than a
47:05
Speaker 1: rom column. It's a little a little more dangerous. You
47:09
Speaker 1: want something a little dangerous? Yeah, Um, so we're about
47:14
Speaker 1: gonna wrap this up. Um, we didn't really get into
47:18
Speaker 1: you except for you briefly, Samantha. Human monsters are like
47:23
Speaker 1: dexter because I think that that is a different thing.
47:28
Speaker 1: That is is a whole different level of like serial killer. Yeah,
47:32
Speaker 1: and we kind of briefly touched on that with the
47:34
Speaker 1: recent like the Ted Bundy documentary and the You on Netflix.
47:40
Speaker 1: That is a different thing. Um, Happy to talk about
47:42
Speaker 1: it at a future date. But basically, human sexuality is
47:47
Speaker 1: complicated and is influenced and shaped by a plusora of thing. Man,
47:51
Speaker 1: it comes out in many different forms in many different ways,
47:53
Speaker 1: it does, indeed, And UM, we would love to hear
47:56
Speaker 1: from listeners about your favorite monster movies. If you've written
48:00
Speaker 1: any stories are fan fiction, UM would love to read it.
48:05
Speaker 1: You can email us at Stuff Media, mom Stuff at
48:07
Speaker 1: i heeart media dot com. You can also find us
48:09
Speaker 1: on Twitter at moms Stuff Podcasts and on Instagram at
48:13
Speaker 1: stuff I've Never told you. Thanks as always to our
48:16
Speaker 1: super producer Andrew Howard, Mr Howard, and thanks to you
48:19
Speaker 1: for listening stuff I've never told you. The production of
48:21
Speaker 1: I Heart Radios how Stuff Works. For more podcasts from
48:24
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple
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Speaker 1: Podcast wherever you listen to your favorite show