Latest / The Bold Lounge / Ukeme Awakessien Jeter: Bold Leadership in Action- Amplifying Voices and Breaking Barriers

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Ukeme Awakessien Jeter: Bold Leadership in Action- Amplifying Voices and Breaking Barriers · The Bold Lounge

• 0:07
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bold Lounge podcast.
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: My name is Leigh Burgess and I will be your host.
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: If you're anything like me, you love hearing inspiring stories of people who have gone on bold journeys and made a positive impact in the world.
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: This podcast is all about those kinds of stories.
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: Every week, we'll hear from someone who has taken a leap or embarked on an extraordinary journey.
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: In addition to hearing their stories, we'll also learn about their bold growth mindset that they use to make things happen.
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: Whether they face challenges or doubts along the way, they persisted and ultimately achieved their goals.
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: These impactful stories will leave you feeling motivated and inspired to pursue your own bold journey.
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: I believe everyone has a bold story waiting to be freed.
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: Tune in and get ready to be inspired.
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bold Lounge.
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: Today I have you Kemi.
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: She is an engineer turned lawyer, keynote speaker and history maker on a mission to transform leadership.
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: She's the author of Immigrant how Immigrant Leadership Drives Business Success.
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: For over two decades, she has held positions with Fortune 500 companies, national law firms, universities, local governments and specialized agencies of the United Nations.
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: Having lived and worked in eight cities across four countries, which I hope we get to talk about some of that, yukemi has a profound understanding of diverse cultures.
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: She is a trailblazer.
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: Columbus CEO Magazine named her one of its future 50 leaders in 2021.
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: And I don't think there's any future about this.
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: I think you're already a leader.
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: We'll tell Columbus that Ukemi works as an intellectual property attorney for a national law firm.
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: She's made history twice and I'm sure she will continue to make history, but first by becoming the first person of color and immigrant elected to the city council in her 103-year-old community.
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: Then, just two years later, she became the first immigrant and person of color elected council president and mayor of her city.
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: So congratulations on that.
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: That is no small undertaking.
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: You, kemi, resides in upper arlington, ohio, with her two children and dogs, so welcome you, kimmy.
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: Awakaseen jeter to the bold lounge thank you, that was a fantastic intro.
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: I'm I'm always catching up to myself.
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: I'm like yeah, right, you're like, wow, that is me.
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: Who's she talking to?
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: Right, right, thank you.
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: You are the awesome one we just spoke about, so I want to jump into being bold in all things bold in your world.
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: But first let's start with how you define bold.
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: What does bold mean in your world?
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: I thought about that question because it can take so many different directions and it was hard to crystallize it to one but just one.
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: But you know, for me, I think I believe that being bold is giving voice to others.
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: It's easier to speak up for others, but being able to give others a voice, I think, is bold.
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that definition and actually that's one I haven't heard in 200 episodes taped.
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: So giving voice to others.
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: I've heard serving others, you know, speaking for those they can't speak, which I think would be the closest one, and I think when you think about that, when you think about giving voice to others, that could, could be scary, it could be, hard.
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: It could be stepping out of your own comfort zone.
• 3:30
  Speaker 1: Most definitely.
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: It could mean that you are doing things that you never thought you'd be doing, but you're doing them anyway because they're on behalf of someone else.
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely.
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: When you think about your definition of it, what's your lived bold moment that comes to mind for you?
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: You know I had to go back to like the earliest.
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: I can remember being bold and giving voice to others, and that was in middle school for me.
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: Ok, I went to an all girls boarding school.
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: That's tough right there, that's, bold, that's tough.
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: So it's an all girls boarding school and this was in Nigeria and I remember I was sitting around we were having dinner in the cafeteria and there was a girl that came from the rural parts of Nigeria too, and this is a boarding school within kind of like city limits, so it was a cultural shock for her kind of coming to a school with city girls.
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: But I remember sitting at the table and she endured a lot of, you know, people making fun of how she sounded with certain things and generally I'd be quiet, you know.
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: And that particular day I just remember looking over and kind of giving that look like, quit being silly guys.
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: But then I got off and I pulled her aside and I said to her you have got to speak up for yourself.
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: You know I wasn't her friend, so it wasn't like I was.
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: I was 13, 14 at the time, okay, and I wasn't her friend per se, but I just didn't like that.
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: She let it go on.
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: You were her friend in that moment.
• 5:17
  Speaker 2: I was her friend.
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: In that moment I just I I felt, gosh, what can I do?
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: How can I help you?
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: And we developed a friendship where I was like, okay, what were you feeling in that moment.
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: How would it help for you to be able to say something for yourself, because I can speak up for you, but I don't think it's going to be as powerful as you putting a stop to things.
• 5:38
  Speaker 2: And so we kind of worked on a plan and I was like I'll be your backup, I'll be there.
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: I'll be your, I'll be your backup, I'll be there, I'll be your wing girl.
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: We kind of role play different situations and it happened again because you know I was used to seeing this and she spoke up and in that moment I just felt so proud and so happy for her and we stayed friends kind of through high school, kind of lost touch, because I moved, moved here to the United States, and three years ago we found each other again on Facebook oh wow, and she, uh, she sent me a message on Facebook remembering that and I had kind of like forgotten it.
• 6:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah and um, reading that note on how she's been able to find her voice repeatedly just warmed my heart.
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: But also you know that saying of giving you can, you can give a man a fish or you can teach him how to fish.
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: And teaching her how to speak up for herself, it's just a life thing that she's just going to have forever, and just hearing that warmed my heart and I've done it.
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: I've gone on to do it repeatedly.
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: Were you doing it on stage?
• 6:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I do it on stage.
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: It's the reason I got into a life of public service.
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: I've just found that my voice is is better and stronger when I'm able to teach other people to use theirs.
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that.
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: I love that.
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: I'll stick up for you, but it's going to be more powerful if you do it and I'll be kind of in the wing if you need me, but you can do it, and I love that too.
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: You didn't know her, you just thought this isn't right.
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: This isn't the way we should talk to each other.
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: This isn't the way people should treat one another.
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: So I'm going to say something, but I'm going to do it in a way that empowers the individual to make the change right Versus.
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: You know, doing them for her would have been easy to do, but it wouldn't have stuck, most likely, right.
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: And they can do things when you're not around or those types of things, and it's so important that we start as early as we can doing that.
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: At least, that's how I feel.
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: You know we see the world today and, I think, ongoing challenges of people being unkind and not caring.
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: You know there's a difference between being nice and kind.
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: I had a conversation this morning about that and I think it's just really, really important to learn that early on.
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: Where'd that come from?
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: Did that get instilled in you by how you were brought up or how you were treated or like?
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: Where did that?
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: I want to stand for others and help them find their voice and take up space.
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: Where'd that come from?
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: You know I'm not sure I know I grew up in a household that was very curious.
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: It was driven by curiosity.
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: We were we were empowered to ask questions.
• 8:21
  Speaker 2: I mean Sunday dinners.
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: My dad will say bring a clipping from the newspaper that you want to know more about.
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: Oh cool.
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: So this gives you an idea of how I grew up.
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: So there's certainly that, but I think it was this feeling that sometimes people don't know what to say and it's helpful and I grew up with a lot of siblings and it's helpful to bounce ideas off another uh, so that you do know to role play, so that you do know what to say yeah yeah, I just have that feeling yeah, and I think that it kind of ingrained in you.
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: It sounds like since sunday yeah like being curious, learning, asking questions, putting out your opinion and knowing it might not be what everybody might not be popular yeah, yeah, yeah, I think I grew up the same way.
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: I think what was interesting in my 20s?
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: I thought everyone wanted to hear my opinion, and I learned very quickly that was not the case.
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: I was like, oh, you don't want to hear my opinion in this meeting, but okay noted, so I learned kind of how to tune it a little better, I think in my 20s and 30s.
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: Yes, that's a good point, you come out of your parents' house in college and you're just like, hey, like I'm giving it whether you've asked for it or not.
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: Oh, you didn't want it, so yeah.
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: So I think it sounds like it started early.
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: I think one of the things I've heard you say is leaders see, and then they influence change.
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: So they see the change needed to be made and then they start to influence it.
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: So it sounds even as early as 13 or 14, you were seeing that.
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: How did that kind of move through and extrapolate into kind of you know your later teens or you know college years and kind of where you came into wanting to be in public service?
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: Yes, you know.
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: I do know one thing that I grew up in my household hearing a lot is be the change you wish to see, be the change you want to see.
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: Right, and practically that meant we can't phone in change, we can't write in change.
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: You know when you, you're in elementary school like, you know you like, oh right.
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: So, you're a senator, all right, and that's all fine and dandy Right, but you really have to act.
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: if you want something to change, it takes action.
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: It takes that memo.
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: I think they missed the memo on that.
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: Like I want to change but I'm not going to do anything, or I'm not going to take an action, or I'm not going to stand up, but they just want it to happen.
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: And so, knowing that, that's where it's kind of been for me, like, okay to lead change, you've got to act on it.
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: So, but you just don't change for the sake of changing.
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: Why does that have to change?
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: What have you seen right?
• 11:08
  Speaker 2: What are you seeing and what do you think it's going to take for that change?
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: So being able being able to lead changes, that you see it, you corral the people, you share the vision.
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: You also get everyone marching in the same direction or marching in different directions towards the, towards a visionary goal, but you're not going to change by just being the seer of it.
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: Everyone sees issues and problems and things that need change and all of that, but very few people are willing to act on it.
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they kind of be the bystander to it, right, they talk about it, they don't do anything about it, and that.
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: And talk is being nice.
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: Sometimes we complain, and my dad hated complainers.
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: He's just like you know.
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: You can keep complaining.
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you can keep complaining or you can do something about it, yeah, and so I think we're both in the camp of do something about it, yes.
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: So when you were going through figuring out your space, the space that you take up, and how you can be that change maker, what are some of the things that helped you?
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: Because sometimes that's the hardest thing for someone to do, especially women, I think, women of color, you know, anyone who's in a minority.
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: I think it becomes like another level of challenge to doing the standout, like another level of challenge to doing the standout.
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: I think being bold actually is a privilege, like because you're not always able to stand out and do that and it isn't always equal field for being bold.
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: So how did you do it?
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: What were some of the ingredients?
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: Well, kind of like this triple minority in the United States right, I'm a female, I'm Black.
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: In the United States, right, I'm a female, I'm Black and I'm an immigrant.
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: So almost always in every room, I'm either the first, the only, or one of very few.
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: In those situations it's not hard to see what needs change.
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: What's hard is how to bring about the change right, because I'm a unicorn in that room.
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: People are trying to figure me out, and so I want more people like me in rooms, I want more ideas like mine around the table, and that's not going to happen if I don't bring people along, if I don't recognize well what got me into this room in the first place and what's the multiplier, and it's always people.
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: It's always people.
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: It's actually not systems and processes, although certainly we can change those, but it's always the minds of people.
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: It's always breaking down those unconscious biases, it's always surprising and delighting them in what they didn't know.
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: Right, and so they are comfortable with making the next ask, with bringing along the next person, with bringing along the next you.
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: And that for me is kind of like what I saw and what gives me comfort to do it repeatedly.
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so like if I captured that, it would be like a sense of openness.
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: It would be inclusivity, meaning all voices matter and we should listen.
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: I think I'd bring back your word curiosity, because what was your experience and what?
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: What do I not understand?
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: What am I?
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: Ignorant, meaning, not knowing about no-transcript?
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: Think it's just that curiosity, openness, inclusivity, and then knowing that action has to happen for it to change Right, and so someone stepping up and into taking action.
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: I think those sound like some of the key ingredients to what you've been working on, absolutely, absolutely.
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: So when you went to write your book, what made you want to write it?
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: Why?
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: Why does the world need this book?
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: What can we learn from it?
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: Like with everything you've already said here, it was seeing the change that was needed and I, again, didn't.
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: It wasn't an idea that came from me.
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: So when I won my historic election in 2021, I was invited by my alma mater, the University of Maine, to give the commencement speech.
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: Right, and so I gave the commencement speech in 2022, returning to this place that I had immigrated to come to college.
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: At Right, my American story is the immigrant story, and so I get back to campus, university of Maine, and as I was thinking about and putting together my commencement speech, I'm thinking about me sitting in that audience.
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: Almost two decades ago, life for me was very unknown.
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: I was this international student graduating.
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: I didn't know whether I was staying or going back to my country.
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: I knew I had done some internships and I liked some of the companies I worked with here.
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: There was a lot of uncertainty about what I was going to do.
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: Add that to being an immigrant.
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: Your dreams are in accordance to or limited by, whatever immigration policy is going on, whatever visa status you're on.
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: There's a lot of other dynamics.
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: External things that you have no control over.
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: That you have no control over.
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and this was a class in 2022.
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: They had endured two years of the pandemic, so they were the pandemic graduates.
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: They had to pivot very quickly.
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: They had to pivot very quickly.
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: They had to be resourceful, learn new networks, learn how to do classes on Zoom.
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: So my message to these students was like listen, I don't know exactly what it's like going through an education during a pandemic and the uncertainties coming with a job market that you're going into, but I do know the uncertainties of being an immigrant and the rapid adaptability that it takes to learn a new culture, building new social networks all of these things, which is what you've had to do as a pandemic graduate, and I can tell you from my immigrant experience and my immigrant story that these are leadership qualities that are lacking in our workplace, that we need, that our future leaders need, and so I encourage them to live life off script, go out there, kind of elevate these skills that they have learned during the pandemic.
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: I get off that commencement stage and, of course, a lot of international students come up to me because the message resonated with them.
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: The message resonated with them, but one particular student said I had never considered my immigrant experience as leadership skills.
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: Until your speech, I'd always kind of seen my immigrant experiences like this immigrant struggle that I had to be so quick to bury, that I'd failed to see how that rapid adaptability, that resourcefulness, the grit is actually skills, because I'm trying too fast to melt into a pot.
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: And again, going back to when I see kind of how do we change a narrative, what are the actions I need to take?
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: And so I left and I thought, well, why is that happening?
• 18:14
  Speaker 2: And I obviously thought about my immigrant experience and I had very, very similar.
• 18:19
  Speaker 2: I could relate to that 20 years ago.
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: Right, it took like probably not till a decade into my career where I remember a boss asking well, do you have project management skills?
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: And I was like I do, but let's also tell you how to project manage all my immigrant statuses and my life as an immigrant, like.
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: it's clear you don't know the immigrant story right Because it's filled with like rhetoric, and it became obvious to me that our workplaces, our leaders, don't know how to cultivate immigrant talent, don't know how to see that as leadership skills.
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: One in five people by 2035 is going to be an immigrant in the workplace.
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: Birth rates in the United States are alluring.
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: We are the land of immigrants, so if any country should know how to do this well, it is these united states.
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: And what was happening is we were making border issues right.
• 19:10
  Speaker 2: What we see in the news is border issues, making them the workplace story for immigrants, and that's just not true.
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, actually, more immigrants are high skilled immigrants than they are the border immigrants, right.
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: And so the narrative needed to change.
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: And this thought that we just grant immigrants and which is why I replaced the word grant an immigrant with grit as a quality that immigrants have.
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: It's not a hand-me-down, it's not a.
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: Immigrants are not just the social drain, they're actually like, they're contributors to society, they're contributors to the workplace and they should duly be in C-suites, they should duly be leading major corporations.
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: Only 3% of Fortune 100 CEOs right now are immigrants.
• 19:56
  Speaker 2: And it blew my mind.
• 19:56
  Speaker 2: The stats blew my mind, and so I thought writing a book for leaders to understand this.
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: Leadership has tend to pun the issue of immigration to politicians rather than how we do in the workplace.
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: A book was the way to do it.
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and it scales the message right, you know.
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: So I feel the message yeah just knowing that.
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: You know, with my own book, like I, just my goal is to scale the message of possibility and what's possible, right, when you're bold, when you take that step, when you step into fear and do it anyway, you know it's a freeing feeling.
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: That, I think, is the very first thing.
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: It doesn't mean for me like it, fear is my partner.
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: It's how I talk to them, how, what I do with it when I say, hey, get in the back seat, Cause we're doing it.
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: I think that's really important too, for your book is just it scales the message of how and what to do and what to become aware of and educate yourself on Right.
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: You know, so I think leaders across organizations are working hard to try to figure things out, but I think they get sometimes into here's the way we've always done it, which is I can't stand that statement.
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: Or I'm going to buy a module and we're going to do it, and then we click the box and we can say, oh yeah.
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: So when it comes to your book, how do you walk them through, like you know, from the perspective of being able to understand how to one identify talent, how to see it and then then how to actually embrace it and then utilize it to drive better performance, better success, longevity you know of of individual staying within the organization and so much more.
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a great question.
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: There was a reviewer that said the book is part memoir, part research and part blueprint or instruction manual in a way like instruction manual and I love that review because that kind of encapsulates the book.
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: So I wrote the book in three parts.
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: First of all, we know that the best leaders are readers, but also leaders are busy people.
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: So I wanted to write a book that was functional, a snappy read for leaders, and so, as I thought about doing that, I thought let's write it in three parts.
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: All parts go together but they can be independently read, depending on what you need and from that part.
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: So part one of the book puts immigration in context.
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: You know we say we're the land of immigrants, but what does that mean?
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: How did immigration start?
• 22:22
  Speaker 2: Like you know and it's not a history lesson but it's more of a, let's put it in context how is immigration shaping us?
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: How's immigration shaping our culture?
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: How's immigration shaping our workplace, right?
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: So that's kind of like part one of the book.
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: And then in part two of the book I talk about how immigration is missing in discourse around diversity.
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: It's missing in discourse around unconscious biases.
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: So when I think about unconscious biases that are unique to your immigrant talent, I think like the accent bias.
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: You know, I did a fun exercise where I said how many leaders in your C-suite have an accent.
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: How many leaders with an accent have given company-wide presentations beside your chief technology officer and you get this?
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: Nope, can't think you have an accent bias and it's unconscious, you don't know it Like.
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: These are unique to the immigrant talent.
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: Foreign education bias another bias that's very unique to the immigrant talent.
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: It's tongue in cheek, but I say the law of gravity is the same whether you learn it in Arabic or whether you learn it in English or whether you learn it in French.
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: What we're talking about is not the knowledge of gravity, but the application, which is what we should be using in our workplace, not just judging people based on where the degree came from.
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: So I talk about in part two of the book how we're missing it in discourse around our biases right, and we need to dial in.
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: And how we're missing it in discourse around leadership right Again, 3% of Fortune 100 CEOs are immigrants.
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: We don't track immigrants In our voluntary tracking.
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: We know gender, we know race, we know sexual orientation, but we don't know origin status.
• 24:05
  Speaker 2: We're not going to change something we don't know, so it's missing.
• 24:08
  Speaker 2: It's kind of like going back to that melting pot theory.
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: We just were like, okay, figure it out.
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: We missed the intersectionality.
• 24:14
  Speaker 2: So that's part two of the book and then's part two of the book and then in part three of the book, I now talk about immigrant like.
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: Immigrants are not a monolithic group by any means, but the very experience of leaving your homeland and coming to a new has unifying qualities, right, how we adapt rapidly.
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: The resourcefulness and I say this it doesn't matter what your socioeconomic status is.
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: Even if you have a million dollars, you still need to think well, what bank am I going to use?
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: Do I know that bank?
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: I was like that's resourcefulness.
• 24:46
  Speaker 2: Right, you got to build new social networks.
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: Sure, has social media and kind of like.
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: You know, whatsapp helped us a little bit with kind of keeping the connections.
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: But the new connections that you have here, even if you just have one family member, how do you build out the rest of all the things you need?
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: So I talk about understanding immigrant, how you cultivate it, how you harness it in the workplace and how you sustain it, because the reality is that we're becoming a global, every, every company, regardless of whether you're just a straight national organization, because I'll hear some people say to me well, you can't be, I'm just based in the U S, I don't have international operations.
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: I'm like do you have an e-commerce platform?
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: Okay, you're global, right, your customer base is probably multicultural, which means your sales tactics, your marketing tactics, you're going to have to know your customers very well.
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: You're going to have to have cultural intelligence to be able to market and sell to these different populations.
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: So you don't have to be physically global to improve your cultural intelligence so that you can service those customers.
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: So I kind of talk about that with immigrants.
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: So these are the three parts that you know the leader just said I'm going to read part one this weekend and part two next weekend.
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: They that you know.
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: The leader just said I'm going to read part one this weekend and part two next weekend what they can functionally get through the book.
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's an easy read in the sense of that, and I think I love how you divide it up because I think, like anything like the bold framework that I created, the B stands for belief.
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: So our beliefs, I think, are the foundation for every action.
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: Everything we lever off of it's a springboard.
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: So our beliefs around immigration, our beliefs about what we understood it to be or what we were taught.
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: You know, you may be taught that it's one thing, and then, as you get older, like wow, that doesn't match what I was told.
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: So you know, I've been ascribed, as Marcus Collins would say.
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: I've been ascribed, that's my opinion, but or that's what I, I'm supposed to see immigration as, but I don't want to subscribe to that anymore, so I'm going to think differently.
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: So I love that the base of the book is really what it is, kind of the factual piece and so that we can then all begin from the same place, because I think if we don't have that, then we don't have a common language around.
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: Yes, that's what you help, I think, and then it kind of pulls that string through you know your experiences, the things you've done, and then, as leaders, what we can start opening our eyes to and understanding, and it's not a condemnation of like you're not a good leader, you're not seeing it, and shame on you.
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: It's hey, I want you to know what's happening so that you can use it, so that you can help others, so you can understand others too you know, kind of their shoes, that they've walked in and the things that they've had to deal with that you haven't, and not good or bad, but it's different, right?
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, absolutely.
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: So when you see it, do you feel that women immigrants have another layer of things to move through and you talk about specifically, sometimes, the permission myth?
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: So, when it comes to that, tell me a little bit about the permission myth and then how that, particularly for women, is something that we need to be aware of.
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: So the permission myth.
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: Going back to the other thing on the B, the belief.
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: Belief, and I bet you've heard the saying ask for what you want, right, if you were raised in any kind of biblical household, like I was.
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: There's the ask and you shall receive.
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: That's the biblical orientation.
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: So we grow up rooted in this always seeking permission.
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: You want something, you ask for it, right, and then you get the okay, and then you proceed, and this is particularly for immigrant women, damning for us, right?
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: I think yes, if you want to.
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: If you want that Tiffany purse, you know it might take some kindness, ask for it and maybe it's going to take 20 years.
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, get them as a sponsor for your next speaking.
• 28:44
  Speaker 2: Yes, get that Tiffany necklace, get that purse yes, ask for that.
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: But for leadership, you don't need to ask to lead.
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: If you see something that needs change, you don't need to ask.
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: And I think we have the permission myth, for two reasons.
• 28:59
  Speaker 2: One, it's validation.
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: We all, as humans, we're wired to get that validation where it's like, yeah, that's a great idea, go for it.
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: And two, we want someone to share the risk.
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: Again, as humans, we're not wired to just take on the risk by ourselves.
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: It's easier for us to take risk when you've received the validation and you kind of have someone in your back corner that says that's kind of like, if this fails altogether, you told me that it was okay, right, we're sharing the risk, and so because of that, we're trapped.
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: To debunk that myth, you have to believe strongly in the change that you're going after and be okay to go it alone and fall alone if it doesn't work out.
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: Right, you say sometimes trust the risk taker, right?
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: Yes?
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: Trust the risk taker.
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: The risk taker is the person with mud on their face, right, and so they don't need your permission.
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: You're not going to wear the mud, you're not going to wear the scars.
• 29:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah, if you really want to be there for them, maybe put a bandaid on it, but you don't own the risk.
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: Why would you want to inhibit, limit, share, whatever it is, be the one to give the permission and for the person taking the risk themselves.
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: Why would you give that person that much power?
• 30:19
  Speaker 2: Right, right.
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think a lot of the time I think about my own.
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: Not, I have not had an immigrant experience and and you know my obviously my family immigrated here, right, you know so, cause that's how this world came about.
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: That's the American story.
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: So I'm connected to immigrants who really started with nothing.
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: You know, my grandmother survived the famine and a bunch of other things.
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: You know that I think I consider very, very bold moves in her life and kind of also seeing my grandfather do what he did.
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: So like I look to that and so that's my, that's my connection to the experience, and it was a lot of grit but I think you know, just even as someone who has been bold but never called myself bold like you can't run away from the word now in my day, but I never was.
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: Like I entered a room and like I'm bold and I'm here, I was just being me, seeing what needed to be done and talking about it.
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: I think I got better at how to talk about it as I grew up and continue to grow up, but in some of it was bumpy and some of it wasn't, but in the end I could sleep at night.
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: I felt like it was doing the right thing.
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: So sometimes I think we overcomplicate what leadership means too right, or we put layers on it, like when your mind like, what does it mean to lead?
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: I know I said you know, you see, you know the change that needs to be made and you work to influence it.
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: You take action.
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: Is it that or is it anything that you would add to the definition of what does it mean to lead?
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: So let's just pause and applaud the.
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: We give leadership this grandiose title you know what you just say, yeah, we just just get the stage.
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: And I see leadership again as influencing change.
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: You know, going along to get the change, collaborating.
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: They're quiet leaders, right.
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: Especially, we need people that look like me to be in positional leadership.
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: It's why I wrote immigrant.
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: We need immigrants to positionally have that.
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: Immigrants are leading change all the time in different levels in the organization, whatever, but we're not elevating to the C-suite.
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: That's a positional leadership, is a completely different thing, ben.
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: What I think about as just being a leader right, and it is not a grandiose thing it is seeing the change and influencing the change.
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: That's purely what it is for me.
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I write about boldness, being quiet as much as loud and so you said that I really think leadership is quiet and it can be seen and loud like a position or role or those types of things and I always say my boldest moments actually were very quiet and they couldn't be between my ears.
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: You know just me, myself and I, you know we're being bold, like and moving through it and I think when we see the possibility of being in a role and see others in those positions that are louder or more seen, we then see some of those possibilities.
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: But it doesn't mean you can't be leading today, it doesn't mean you can't be helping or part of the solution, or creating conversation that might not always be in agreement, meaning discourse which you use that but to me it's like let's talk about it, ok, I don't get it but I want to learn and I'm here and I'm not leaving and you know I want to really stick in this conversation, which is uncomfortable, but I just want to figure it out and that's to me, leading just as much as anyone with a title or a name.
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: I also think, at least in my experience, just because someone has a title, it doesn't mean they're a leader.
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, you agree with that.
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: I completely agree Because I have seen it many times, I've experienced it many times.
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we all know, in workplaces you're like, okay, that's the leader.
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: Everyone listening this is who I need to go talk with if I need that thing to happen, right?
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: So I've seen it many times Right yeah.
• 34:30
  Speaker 1: So when you think about all the things that you've learned, the places you've gone, the places you've been on stage, the book you wrote, how does that bring you to want to be the mayor?
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: Oh, my goodness.
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: And what do we need to know about the impact of that person in our city?
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: That's helping us create change and lead that we don't.
• 34:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah Well, I think first of all you need to understand why I entered Torrid into public service in the first place.
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: OK, yeah, let's start there.
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: Most of my bold moves and this just even just ties a bow and brings it back full circle Most of my bold moves have been about giving a voice to others.
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: I entered the realm of public service because my daughter came home.
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: I had moved, I was a new member of the community.
• 35:14
  Speaker 2: I had moved to Upper Arlington in 2018.
• 35:17
  Speaker 2: And the first month that my daughter was in school kindergarten we had moved here.
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: She started kindergarten.
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: That's why we chose a community good schools, all the things and she comes home the first month of school.
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: And for those that don't know Upper Arlington, just to give you a listen to some context Upper Arlington is the predominantly white community.
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: It's 105 year old community now.
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: It's 103.
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: At the time, and it was one of the communities that had redlining right.
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: Deeds and titles were transferred to people that look like me, and 1% of the population currently is Black.
• 35:53
  Speaker 2: There's almost 40,000 residents in Upper Arlington, so a little bit of math that tells you this, but maybe 450 to 500 people that are Black that look like me of those 400,000.
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: Well, what ended up happening is that now, while I have been the only one, a few in rooms.
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: That, for me, did not happen till I was 18.
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: You have to remember, I'm Nigerian.
• 36:18
  Speaker 2: I was born in Nigeria, I spent some time in Nigeria, I went to school in Nigeria, so I've always kind of been around Black people.
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: I have never understood the experience of being one of few till I was an adult and had words and could put some words around my emotion and all what I was feeling.
• 36:35
  Speaker 2: And so when my five-year-old daughter came home a month after being in school, she was the only in her class in her kindergarten class, the only Black kid in the kindergarten class, and she came home and said mom, can you straighten my hair for school tomorrow?
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: She wanted to straighten her hair.
• 36:49
  Speaker 2: She had only done that once in her life and she had done it for a wedding.
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: And the Black community knows we just don't.
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: I mean, if you wear your hair natural, it's like straightening your hair is not.
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: So it was a very odd request coming from my five-year-old daughter coming from kindergarten In middle school, you can expect them wanting to do all these things, and so it stopped me.
• 37:10
  Speaker 2: I was like what, why?
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: And wanting to understand what she was experiencing, that the only word she could tell me to put around her feelings was I need to change something about me in order to be part of this community.
• 37:27
  Speaker 2: Like in other times, I have, like, slowly gone into action.
• 37:31
  Speaker 2: I sprung you know, that's that visceral.
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: I sprung into action quickly.
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: I wanted to know her environment, and that led me to making sure I understood my city.
• 37:45
  Speaker 2: I signed up for a leadership program within the city to understand the different functions of the city.
• 37:49
  Speaker 2: How do we recruit?
• 37:51
  Speaker 2: I understand the population is the way the population is, but what other ways can we build belonging, inclusivity, all of those things?
• 37:59
  Speaker 2: I'm not gonna change the percentage of people that live there because you buy a house and that's the school you go to.
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: But what about recruiting of staff and teachers that doesn't have a residential requirement?
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: What about how we bring people to our parks and rec?
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: We have music in the park.
• 38:17
  Speaker 2: Why is it one type of music?
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: Jazz maybe?
• 38:21
  Speaker 2: How is procurement working?
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: When we dole our city taxpayers money to different vendors?
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: What percentage of that goes to MBEs?
• 38:31
  Speaker 2: These are all things that happen by the governing body, and so it quickly made me realize if I am going to give a voice to my daughter.
• 38:42
  Speaker 2: Have you listened to the Hamilton soundtrack or seen Hamilton?
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: There's that song.
• 38:46
  Speaker 2: No one was.
• 38:46
  Speaker 2: No one else was in the room where it happened.
• 38:49
  Speaker 2: The room where it happened, the room where it happened, and I love that song because it's like you've got to be in the room.
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: You have to be in the arena.
• 38:57
  Speaker 2: Yep, the decisions about you are happening in rooms.
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: Right, and so very quickly.
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: I was like you identified the room you needed to be in.
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: I identified the room I needed to be in.
• 39:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 39:08
  Speaker 2: And the scary part was like other people had to vote for you to be in that room.
• 39:12
  Speaker 2: That's never happened for me, but I don't even know.
• 39:14
  Speaker 2: I didn't do student government, I don't.
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: I'm like what.
• 39:17
  Speaker 2: I can't work my way into the situation in corporate.
• 39:31
  Speaker 1: I know how to.
• 39:31
  Speaker 1: I know how to get to the promotion Right.
• 39:31
  Speaker 1: I know how to get to the promotion right, I know how to get.
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's an interesting thing, isn't it Right, like it's such an I did.
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: I definitely did the student council stuff and I never made class president, but I was always like on the council or running and that kind of thing.
• 39:36
  Speaker 1: But it always kind of early on like you figure out like this is kind of popularity, at least when you're in high school, and they're like as an adult you're kind of realizing it is that way a bit too.
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: Yes, but here's the thing I had zero name recognition At the point I ran for office.
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: I'd only lived in the city for three years, so I had a lot of perceived, kind of like barriers.
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: But when I thought about my why, it was so strong that I knew that I had to do a grassroots campaign.
• 40:05
  Speaker 2: I knew to your point because it's a popularity context, because you have to have name recognition I had to get to doors.
• 40:12
  Speaker 2: This was again another change.
• 40:14
  Speaker 2: I couldn't just phone it in.
• 40:15
  Speaker 2: I couldn't have a glossy ad.
• 40:17
  Speaker 2: I couldn't just do a zoom.
• 40:18
  Speaker 2: I can't just have a campaign video.
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: Hi, like it's not.
• 40:25
  Speaker 2: That was not going to work for someone like me.
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: Instead, I needed face to face.
• 40:29
  Speaker 2: I needed to get to all those doors at Upper Arlington.
• 40:33
  Speaker 2: I needed to knock on it.
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: I needed them to understand why I was running and I needed them to connect with the message I needed them to understand.
• 40:39
  Speaker 2: I needed to be in the room and the only way I was going to be in the room was because of your vote.
• 41:10
  Speaker 2: And that's what I did.
• 41:11
  Speaker 2: It was making sure that my someone else, a voice, it is my.
• 41:12
  Speaker 2: Not only is that severe, the just fulfillment in that like warms my whole heart, but it is when I am at my boldest.
• 41:15
  Speaker 2: It's not about you, it's for others.
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly yeah.
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: Now I can relate to that in a different way, but in the sense of like, just when you're doing it for someone other than you, a higher purpose, a higher mission, it fuels you and it makes you move, when you may feel scared or may feel like I don't know, or should I or am I the right?
• 41:36
  Speaker 1: Yes, you are, you know, like in that's where you just kind of do that right left, right left, keep moving forward, yeah, and look where you are, look at the room you're in and who knows where the next room will be, where you continue to have that impact, Because I think you have definitely opened the doors for in so many different ways of understanding and awareness and education.
• 41:58
  Speaker 1: And I think what I also want listeners to hear is like you didn't go like A to Z, you went A, B, C, like you're, like okay, I need to learn more, I need to get curious about, I need to understand.
• 42:11
  Speaker 1: And so it wasn't like you, out of the gates, that I'm going to run for mayor, although you could have.
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: It would have been a very different type of experience, most likely, right.
• 42:19
  Speaker 1: So just take that first bold step, which was you just learning, which I think people think bold means.
• 42:25
  Speaker 1: Like this big thing Sometimes, when it's truly it could be just being curious and learning something new, and yours led to, you know, impact in your local area and ultimately your region and your state.
• 42:35
  Speaker 1: So I think it's people understanding the ripple effect of just being curious, where it's led to.
• 42:41
  Speaker 1: Thank you.
• 42:43
  Speaker 1: What guidance would you give to someone as we kind of end of just taking that first step to get curious?
• 42:49
  Speaker 1: What would you tell them?
• 42:51
  Speaker 2: Conversation.
• 42:51
  Speaker 2: At the very heart of curiosity is conversation.
• 42:56
  Speaker 2: Start talking about start talking and let's do it from a place of openness, right, don't go in any preconceived.
• 43:06
  Speaker 2: It's funny, going back to my book a little bit.
• 43:08
  Speaker 2: I give a tool on how to have curious conversation and we are so wired to ask why?
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: Well, why do you believe that?
• 43:17
  Speaker 2: Why actually makes us a little bit defensive, like we have to defend our reasoning.
• 43:23
  Speaker 2: If we phrase the question more like how did you come to believe that you disarm people, you're able to have better curious conversations that don't seem defensive, because why do you believe that?
• 43:36
  Speaker 2: Sometimes I'm just like because I do.
• 43:38
  Speaker 2: You know that may be my answer.
• 43:41
  Speaker 2: But if you ask how did you come to believe that?
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: Notice how that shifts, and I'm like well, you know, I think it was that day, my mom.
• 43:48
  Speaker 2: You have to pause I think it was the day, my mom and then it unfolds oh, how did that feel?
• 43:54
  Speaker 2: How has that changed since?
• 43:56
  Speaker 2: You see what that does, yeah, and then do it in a place when you're having curious conversations, and I think it's how to have the conversation.
• 44:04
  Speaker 2: But the second thing is the environment in which we have the conversation.
• 44:07
  Speaker 2: Can we not do it in the office?
• 44:08
  Speaker 2: Can we take a walk?
• 44:09
  Speaker 2: Can we, like, sit at a coffee shop, can we?
• 44:13
  Speaker 1: you know, not have a desk in between you, right?
• 44:15
  Speaker 1: Like how about a blanket and sitting in the grass, like whatever it is, at a coffee shop, like you said, but not, it's really difficult, I think, when there's things that also are in place, that have a power differential right.
• 44:31
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: Some of those conversations of being curious or learning, yeah.
• 44:35
  Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, so that would be about that.
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so that would be the conversation and doing well and that really is the jumping off point.
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: Okay, Well, we're going to end with that.
• 44:45
  Speaker 1: So go be boldly curious and start having some conversations that may be uncomfortable or may just be unknown for you, but try it out, and that is going to be your first step towards understanding you know what could be, or also learning more about what you didn't know before.
• 45:03
  Speaker 2: Hear, hear.
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you so much for being on the Bold Lounge.
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: All the information about Ykemi is below her book and her speaking and everything she does.
• 45:11
  Speaker 1: Check it out.
• 45:12
  Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to the Bold Lounge podcast.
• 45:19
  Speaker 1: Through the continuum of bold stories vulnerability to taking a leap you will meet more extraordinary people making a positive impact for others through their unique and important story.
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: By highlighting these stories, we hope to inspire others and share the journey of those with a bold mindset.
• 45:35
  Speaker 1: We hope you've enjoyed this podcast and look forward to sharing the next bold journey with you.