Latest / Juicy Scoop with Heather McDonald / Blake Lively Win, Bravo Shakeups and Climbing in Heels

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Blake Lively Win, Bravo Shakeups and Climbing in Heels · Juicy Scoop with Heather McDonald

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to Juicy Scoop. Make sure you go
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: over to heathermcdonald.net because I just dropped new merch special
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: for the 10 year anniversary. Yes, Juicy Scoop has been
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: around for 10 years, 10 years. So you want to
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: get the limited edition merch now because once it's gone,
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: it's gone. So go over to heathermcdonald.net and click on
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: the shop and find some real cute items like the
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: one I'm wearing right now. And now for our show.
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: Heather McDonald. Has got the Juicy Scoop. When you're on
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: the road, when you're on the go, Juicy Scoop is
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: the show to know. She talks Hollywood tales for real life.
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: Mr.
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: Saving serial data and serial sisters. You'll be addicted and addicted.
• 0:44
  Speaker 3: Fast to the number one tabloid real life podcast.
• 0:47
  Speaker 4: Listen in, listen up. Woo, woo.
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: Hannah McDonald.
• 0:52
  Speaker 4: Juicy Scoop.
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: First, let's talk about the latest news just popped up
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: on my TMZ. This is huge. In the Blake Lively,
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: Justin Baldoni case, a judge just dismissed Justin's defamation lawsuit,
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: which was against Blake Lively, Ryan Reynolds, and the New
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: York Times for defamation. He believed by the article that
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: was written in the New York Times that that was
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: defaming him. And the judge said, no. Because the article
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  Speaker 1: that was written in the New York Times was based
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  Speaker 1: on a legal complaint that Blake made. And you really
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: can't do that. Otherwise, anyone that would try to make
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: a complaint about sexual harassment or anything, then the person
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  Speaker 1: could come back and say, you're defaming me by suing
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: me or going to the police or whatever. So that
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: is what I think is kind of behind it. Again,
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: not a lawyer, but that's a huge win for her. Also,
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: it is dismissed with prejudice, meaning he can't refile something
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: similar based on a smear campaign defamation. And also that
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  Speaker 1: he could be liable for her legal fees, which has
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: cost millions of dollars that she spent so far. So,
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: you know, I don't think this is where we thought
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  Speaker 1: this was going. I'm kind of shocked, but I can
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  Speaker 1: see the logic behind it, the legal logic behind it. Um, however,
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: also in Blake Lively news, I thought this was kind
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: of interesting. A girl, what I always say, you know,
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  Speaker 1: a TikToker left a shopping experience in New York and
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  Speaker 1: immediately got out of her phone and she had like 197,000
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  Speaker 1: followers and is like, I don't know how anyone can
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  Speaker 1: be a Blake Lively fan. I was just in a
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  Speaker 1: store in New York and she was, you know, so rude.
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: And she said to the person working there, can I
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  Speaker 1: see a fresh one? of this item, something that, you know,
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  Speaker 1: hasn't been out on display and other people have touched.
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: And then her security came around and she was ignoring
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: her kids and she was ignoring her nanny. And I
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  Speaker 1: don't know why anyone's her fan. So listen, I always
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: think these stories, I think these stories have gotten out
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: of hand because if every person that wasn't famous was
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: being judged when they walked into a store or a
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  Speaker 1: restaurant on their behavior, I just I don't know. It's
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  Speaker 1: your right to see that behavior and make content out
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: of it. But at the same time, I'm like, look,
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  Speaker 1: she's shopping. She's not there to watch her kids. She
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: has a nanny. She's shopping. She's going to get what
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: she wanted. And then I saw in the New York
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  Speaker 1: Post article that wrote about it or whoever read about it,
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: Daily Mail or Page Six, that then she got these
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: little patches for this little bag. And she promoted the
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: store and was like, look how cute this is. Blake
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: did that. So I'm sure the store was more than
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  Speaker 1: thrilled to have her come shop. And, you know, I
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: don't know what this TikToker did, you know, how many
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: patches she bought, but I'm just saying, let's keep an
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: open mind a little bit.
• 4:02
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• 4:15
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• 4:20
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• 4:24
  Speaker 1: Big Bravo news. Rachel Zoe of the Rachel Zoe Project
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: of the Rachel Zoe Lifestyle Line has made the announcement.
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: It is 100% true. She has joined the Real Housewives
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: of Beverly Hills. I talked about this on my Patreon,
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: which came out Friday, but I record on a Thursday,
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  Speaker 1: that I had heard this and it is true and
• 4:46
  Speaker 1: everybody's thrilled. I don't think I saw one comment that
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: was negative. And she has since gone on her Instagram
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: to say how pleased she is with the response, how
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: much it means to her. She always said she would
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: come back to TV when it felt right. It's totally right.
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: I mean... Her kids are older. She got divorced. So
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: we're going to see her dating, um, and see her
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: life a little bit. Uh, I don't know what's going
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: on with actual, like her brands, but obviously she's very successful.
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: I know there was a time where she had one
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: of those, remember FabFitFun boxes. I, I remember I promoted
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: them and it would be like all these like products
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: and then you'd get them and, oh, you get four
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: a year and whatever. She did something like that. Um,
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: I know she had that thing. I know she had
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: a podcast with her husband because I interviewed her. Obviously,
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: I think she still has a podcast, but it's obviously
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: not with a husband. And so I'm very intrigued. Like,
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: they were college sweethearts. Just a few years ago when
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: I interviewed the two, it was her. No, maybe it
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: was just her and she talked about him. I can't
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: remember if he came on or not. But it really
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: seemed like they had such a great partnership and everything. But,
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: you know, something. marriages don't last forever, still very successful union.
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: And I wonder if it's friendly. I wonder if he
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: has another girlfriend or partner or whatever, but that will
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: be fun to see. Some people wonder how is she
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: going to work with Dorit being that Dorit is known
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: as the fashionista and everything. And I think that it's
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: going to be just great. Like I think Dorit will
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: be so excited to meet her. And I think she'll
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: be kissing her ass. And then Bose will feel left
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: out and it's going to be good. So we'll see
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: who else, if there's anybody else that's going to be announced.
• 6:37
  Speaker 1: Bryn from Real Housewives of New York made a big
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: announcement today. I'm not coming back. Well, I don't think
• 6:43
  Speaker 1: the show is coming. We didn't think the show was
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: coming back, or at least they're going to start with
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: a fresh slate. We don't know. But it was kind
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: of smart of her just to be like, I know
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  Speaker 1: I'm not being asked back. So let me take this moment.
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: and get some press out of not coming back. And
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: the second part of her statement on Instagram story was,
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: but I created this dating app and it's doing so well.
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: I have to bounce between my London and New York offices.
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: It's going to be the greatest date. It's the greatest
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  Speaker 1: dating app ever. And I have my book coming out.
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: So be excited for that. So I thought it was
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: pretty nice. And I want to say Brynn, come on
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: Juicy Scoop, because now that you Don't have the Bravo
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: golden handcuffs. I want to get more and know a
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: little bit more about what you were thinking when people
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: were saying things about you that weren't true. What all
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: went down last season, which got weird and dark, or
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: we don't have to talk about that. I don't know.
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: But I find, yes, I can see why the audience
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: didn't necessarily like her. But I have to say, it
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: is very hard for someone to be a real housewife because...
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: When people say, you know, you're not doing a good
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: job or we don't want you here anymore. It's not
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: because you fumbled the football. It's because we hate your personality.
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: Like you can't really change your personality. It really is you.
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: So whether she chose to do this on her own
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: or was just being savvy, you know, she wasn't really
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  Speaker 1: well liked at the end. People didn't like her though.
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: They did like her in the beginning. And I just
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  Speaker 1: think that is a lot for your mental health because
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: it's like you just feel like everyone hates you and
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  Speaker 1: it's like this is you. I'm being me. I'm not
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: playing a role. I'm not executing a design for a
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: home or something. This isn't HGTV. It's just me being
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: me walking around talking to people and you guys all
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: find me annoying. So goodbye. Brit. Goes by Brit. on
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: Real Housewives of New York, I'm sorry, Real Housewives of
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: Atlanta is suing Bravo for $ 20 million. This is the
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  Speaker 1: woman who is behind the, really one of the most
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: horrific things that have happened on Real Housewives of Atlanta.
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: This girl Britt and Kenya Moore were getting a little tiff.
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  Speaker 1: It seemed a little weird. It did seem like Britt
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  Speaker 1: was trying to engage with the big dog and the
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  Speaker 1: big dog being Kenya was like, why are you trying
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  Speaker 1: to get your moment on TV? Somehow that really pissed
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: off Kenya. She also felt threatened because she heard Britt
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: say like, I'm packing, meaning I carry a gun or something.
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: So then when Kenya had her big Kenya Moore hair care,
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  Speaker 1: the first brick and mortar store that's kind of like
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: a hair care center or whatever that she wanted to
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: make it like a blow dry bar eventually, she decides
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: to have this party. Britt comes, gives her some flowers.
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  Speaker 1: She's like, just please leave. I don't like you. And
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: she's like, okay. And then she's like, my, I've been threatened, everybody.
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: Thanks for coming to my event, but I've been threatened.
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  Speaker 1: And I did some research on this woman who threatened
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  Speaker 1: me and is trying to take food out of my
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: daughter's mouth. Here you go. And she went and had
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: some people do research. Then she went to Michael's and
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: Kinko's and made a big, like a science project thing. Like,
• 10:03
  Speaker 1: like it was like one of those, you know, how
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: the board has the two sides. Like, I don't even
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: know what she was doing. And showed these explicit photos
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: of this girl back in the day when she was
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: a webcam girl or a video cam girl. I don't
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  Speaker 1: even know. And it was her with a man's in
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  Speaker 1: her mouth, okay? And everyone's like, oh my God, the
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: next day she finds out that this happened when she
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: wasn't there. She's totally mortified. Kenya gets asked to stop filming.
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: And according to Britt in her lawsuit, she just found
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: out that the woman that was displayed at the party
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: for the cameras for everyone to talk and blog and
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: everything about wasn't even her. It wasn't her. According to her,
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: it was not her. So she stressed about all of
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: this stuff, was horrified, was like, I don't know. I've
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: done a lot of things in my life. There was
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: some revenge porn of me out there. And, you know,
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: so now she's suing Bravo. Bravo has very strict contracts
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: about suing each other for defamation. We're filming the way
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: the show goes. You know, we can't keep what someone
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: says out of their mouth. We let it unfold as
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: it was. We did reprimand Kenya for it. Kenya, whoever
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: she got to be her investigators, really fucking dropped the ball,
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: if this is in fact true, and this was just
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: some other girl that resembled her. It's just a mess.
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: It's dark. And out of all the lawsuits that have
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: been made through Leah from Real Housewives of New York,
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: and I don't know if Brandi Glanville was suing and
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: her lawyers dropped her, pushing like alcohol and this and that.
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: This one, I feel like, I don't know. This one
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: is going to be a hard one because it's like
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: they were just filming what was going on. If they can't,
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: if none of the producers were involved in going to
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: Kinko's or Michael's and none of the producers even knew
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: that she was bringing these boards, which if they can
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: prove that they did not know that she was bringing
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: these explicit photos of this other cast member onto her event,
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: then I think that they'll win the case. But obviously
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: for her, I mean, talk about some major vindication. It
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: reminds me of when the earrings were fake, that feeling
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: of like, oh my God, they were worth $ 40. They
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: were not worth $ 10, 000 or $ 3, 000. Hello. And then everyone's like,
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: I'm tired of that story. Well, I'm not. And if
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: this is in fact true, whether you don't like her
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: nasal voice or not, she deserves to have her day.
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: Jax from the Valley, Jax Taylor says, From what I see,
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: he was doing a podcast tour that has been canceled
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: due to the backlash of the viewers that are seeing
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: him as a husband to Brittany, seeing that, you know,
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: he was, um, the last episode, she's talking to his
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: sister on the phone and they're filming at their house
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: and she covers all the Nest Cams in the house,
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: but I guess they have audio as well. And all
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: of a sudden she's like, oh my God, the producer
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: just came up to me and said that Jax was
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: listening to us. This is crazy. He's rage texting me
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: right now. Like, oh my God, Jax is like the worst.
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: I don't even know what I'm going to do with him. Like,
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: this is crazy. But I just, it is kind of
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: great that she just has to laugh because it really
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: is so insane. But I think to the women at home,
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: That was like a final straw. I mean, already they
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: didn't like seeing what we'd already seen, the way he
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: talks and everything to her and the fighting. But also
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: I think him doing a podcast tour when he just
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: started his new podcast without Brittany, it might be a
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: tad premature, but you got to strike while the iron
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: is hot. But the popularity is just not where it's at.
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: He's got to have like a little redemption. He's got to...
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: You know, find a new girlfriend who then Brit loves
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: and they co-parent together. But right now in the dark
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: thick of this divorce, it's just not on his side.
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: Also fun, oh, also fun news of the weekend is
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: I came across Ramona's Instagram story that just keeps giving.
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: And she was like, hello. Hello. She's like, you know what?
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: It's so gorgeous out. I'm in the Hamptons and I
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: am enjoying myself because I'm at a friend's house and
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: they are actually serving the food. So I don't have
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: to do anything. Isn't that great? And then the next one,
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: she's even like a little more buzzed about to sit.
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: Look at this beautiful table that I didn't have to
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: set up because I'm a guest for once and it's
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: just beautiful. And I was like, you know what? Good
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: for her. She is having the time of her life.
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: She was, you know... a bottle of Pinot Grigio in,
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: in the sun, feeling grateful, picked up her phone and
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: just wanted the world to know how great her life is.
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: And you know what? I've been there. So, okay. Um, uh,
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: also JLo was performing, uh, this weekend, which we get
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: talk about JLo in my interview at a worldwide pride day. And,
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: you know, some people were a little shocked by her bodysuit,
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: which was extremely tiny on the actual, uh, vajayjay area.
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: So you got this side cleavage of the, of the
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: vagina or whatever you want to call it. And, um,
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: some people were like, Heather, I want to know what
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: you think. Well, first of all, the body was banging.
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: It got us talking. Also, you know, the outfit requires
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: like really good tight tights and then like a fishnet
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: over it to like camouflage. So you're really sucked in.
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: Like you're, you're, it didn't look comfortable. It didn't look comfortable.
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: And thank you. Everyone said, Heather, your prediction is right.
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: You said vagina cleavage was going to be all the
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: rage this year. And here we are. It's been proven
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: many times to be true that that particular prediction is true. Also,
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: just recently, I mean, you guys, it is getting kind
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: of scary. The things I say on the show and
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: then like articles come out. Just recently, I said, I
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: really hope some news comes out that cold plunges aren't
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: that good for you or don't do anything for you.
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: Because I'm not cold plunging, everybody else is, and I
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: really can't stand going in cold water. I like my
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: pool warm. I like a hot jacuzzi. Well, this week,
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: multiple articles came out saying it actually shrinks the growth
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: of your muscles plunging all the time. I'm just saying
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: what the article says. Don't come for me. Don't drain
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: your cold plunge. I mean, whatever your story is, is
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: your story. But it's more about me saying it and
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: then it comes back. It's okay. Whatever. Also on the
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: Hulu show, Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, Demi and her husband,
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: who are at the center of the whole Vanderpump Villa
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: guy flirting with her, And then it turned out he
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: was actually flirting with Jesse. And anyway, they did not
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: make the reunion. And when asked about it, she posted
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: on social media, Demi, well, they told us the date
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: very last minute. And we had a whole Disney World
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: thing planned with hotel rooms or Airbnb. And we already
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: bought the tickets. We already got the flights. And so
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: we didn't go. And I don't know, you know, Hulu
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: is different than Bravo. Bravo, you don't show up to
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: a reunion and it's like a huge no-no. Like you
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: get in a lot of trouble. You lose out on
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: a lot of money, especially if you've been in there
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: for a long time. And they really don't like it
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: at all. But maybe when they were filming this show,
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: maybe the reunion was not something that they had planned for. Maybe,
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: you know. I don't know, maybe it was a last
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: minute thing, but I'm sure the next contract will include
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: a reunion and a penalty if you don't show up. P. Diddy,
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: the trial continues. At the end of last week, there
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: was another girlfriend after Cassie that last couple of years
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: that was with him. And she was anonymous, going by
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: a Jane Doe, but she's on the stand. There are
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: people in the courtroom. It's a federal case. So there's no...
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: like court TV filming it. That's why we just get
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: the sketches of like Diddy. And you see just a woman,
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: you know, of tan complexion, like crying. And people believe
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: that this is 50 cents, ex-girlfriend, baby mama of his,
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: of the child that he had in like 2012. When
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: someone had said this on a podcast a while ago,
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: Fitty got very mad at that person. So I'm just
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: saying what people are talking about on TikTok, that this
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: is in fact her. She got sucked into the world
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: of P. Diddy, feeling special that she's with a powerful guy,
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: agreeing to do these freak-offs, very similar to what Cassie said.
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: They'd go for three to four days. She'd get the UTIs.
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: She'd be exhausted. She'd get you know, um, yeast infections
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: every time he'd promise her, you know, she'd be like,
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: does every time we get together have to involve three
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: or four other paid escorts? And he'd be like, okay,
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: I mean, fine if you're not down, but like, you know, I'll,
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: I'll see you soon. It'll just be us. And then
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: she'd get all excited. And then you'd be like, are
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: you ready to bring me some entertainment? What have you
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: got for me? And then she'd have to set it
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: up and find the guys. And at one point, one
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: of the guys was like so gross and smelled that
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: after 30 minutes, she's like, I just cannot, Diddy. I
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: cannot be with this gross guy. And he's like, fine.
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: And then he flew out another, which, you know, crossed
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: state lines, which that is a crime. Sex work is
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: not legal. And so... in proving that the racketeering case,
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: that's all goes into play. And that the assistants were like,
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: one time she was like, just excited to be with
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: him alone. And then she sees, oh God, she looks
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: up in the hotel room. She's like the red lights
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: that he wants and the assistants there getting the baby
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: oil and the, you know, candles ready. And it just
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: seems awful. And then why didn't you leave? Well, I
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: was a single mom and then he agreed to pay me,
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: I think he was paying her rent and $ 10, 000 a month. Okay.
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: She said she would do these weekly, these freak offs
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: with three to four men that would go on for
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: several days. And then when they weren't freaking, they were
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: like sleeping. Okay. And trying to recover and getting like
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: an IV and like a collagen smoothie or something. And
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: so therefore, if you do the math, she was a
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: very poorly paid, uh, sex worker, girlfriend, whatever you want
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: to say, only 10,000. And if she is in fact
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: the mother of Fiddy's child, what was that about? How
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: was she not getting enough money from him? She did
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: say on the stand that my ex and Sean did
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: not get along. So, I mean, I don't know if
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: it's been confirmed, but very juicy. If not, not a
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: great deal for you, poor thing. And it sounded awful. Um,
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: Justin Bieber, it looks like shit. Everyone's concerned. It's turning
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: into a Britney Spears account. He's posting weird stuff. He's
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: looking awful. He's just like doing like photos, like to
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: a friend, like, you know, and weird cryptic things. He's
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: not dancing around in Brown's sensible pumps, um, in front of,
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: in front of an open fireplace like this one, but it's,
• 22:04
  Speaker 1: it seems to be heading in that direction. He and
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: Hailey Bieber are still together. They were over the weekend
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: with security going to get, you know, something to eat.
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: A lot of people also think that her billion dollar
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: road sale doesn't really make sense for her makeup. People like,
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: haven't I even heard of it? How many products are there?
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: Is this even, what is this? So there's a lot
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: of talk of the conspiracy behind all of that. Um,
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: let's see. Oh, and then, uh, Karen Reed trial is
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: continuing and I, you know, we've all talked about all
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: the different theories and first and foremost, there is enough
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: doubt that she should not be convicted of any kind
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: of murder or anything like that. Okay. So I'm going
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: to say that, but I feel like this could have happened.
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: And the only person that knows the truth is the
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: dog who's missing. Okay. The German shepherd. If once AI
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: is able to read the minds of dogs, we are
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: going to be able to solve so many murders because
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: the dog always knows what the fuck happened. The dog
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: in the OJ case saw it all. That dog named Kato. Yes,
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: there was Kato Kaling, but there was the dog was
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: named Kato. Dogs see and know everything. If we could
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: only just get them to talk. But what if he
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: did go in the house? She's waiting for him because
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: she said he went in the house. She's waiting, waiting, waiting.
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: He gets in an argument with people in the house.
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: It gets very physical. Maybe something's hit on his head,
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: like a weight or something. It's down in the basement
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: where they change that floor immediately after. The dog gets
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: involved either protecting its owner, who is someone who lives
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: in the house, or trying to break it up or whatever,
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: causing the scratches and the bites on his arm. He
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: gets out there. They see him leave. He's like, you're
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: fucking crazy or whatever. And he leaves. So they think
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: he leaves beat up but alive. And they're all wasted.
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: As he's leaving, he's like, oh, thank God she's here.
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: But he sees her backing up. So he tries to
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: stop her to get her attention. And she inadvertently hits him.
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: But maybe like midway in the three-point turn. And then
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: he is left in the snow and is unconscious and dies.
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: When the people are leaving the party wasted, they don't
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: see him in the corner of the yard. But when
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: it turns out in the morning that he's found on
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: the lawn, that's when they all start scrambling and being like,
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: oh my God, she says she hit him. But let's
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: say he never even came into the house because let's,
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: get ourselves out of this narrative. We definitely don't want
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: people to know that there was a fight. We don't
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: want people to know that we were drinking, maybe doing drugs.
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: We don't want people to know that we drove home
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: from the bar drunk. We don't want anyone to know.
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: So that is when they started to scramble and get
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: rid of all their information. Now, the only reason I
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: think this is a possibility is because I just think
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: that Jen McCabe, even though she's like the worst friend
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: on earth, I don't think she consciously knew that a
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: man that she knew was dead when she was looking
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: up the, um, how long does it, how, how is
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: my daughter's a soccer or whatever volleyball team doing this week?
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: Like what, what, that's what she was doing at two 45.
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: Then the, how long does it, how long does it
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: take to die in the cold? She said that's from
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: the open tab from when she looked up the daughter's
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: thing at 2 AM and not, looking at it too,
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: that it was at 6 a.m. That was the technical
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: thing that's still very hard. But I'm just, I still
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: think she should be acquitted and she should not be
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: tried again. But I'm just saying, we will never really
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: know unless someone in that house speaks. And I definitely
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: think he went into the house. That's what I think.
• 26:13
  Speaker 5: They think you're done for the day, but they don't
• 26:15
  Speaker 5: know about the drawer.
• 26:18
  Speaker 4: The drawer. Just the one square before bed.
• 26:23
  Speaker 5: Or two, you know, nobody's watching.
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: You deserve a treat.
• 26:32
  Speaker 5: With eight flavors to choose from, you can choose the
• 26:34
  Speaker 5: flavor you favor with Cadbury Dairy Milk.
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: I'm Darman, and this is What Happens Next. Each week
• 26:46
  Speaker 3: on the show, I sit down with extraordinary people who
• 26:49
  Speaker 3: have faced tremendous setbacks. And yet somehow have found a
• 26:54
  Speaker 3: way to turn them into their greatest strengths.
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: Life is one long lesson of chaos.
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: I'm heading to the Emmys and I have police complaints
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: filed against me.
• 27:03
  Speaker 4: When your free will was about to be taken from you,
• 27:05
  Speaker 4: what would you do if it was given back?
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: Where did that need come from where you thought that
• 27:10
  Speaker 2: you had to succeed in order to feel loved?
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: He said, I have a work dad.
• 27:14
  Speaker 4: I need a home dad.
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: What happens next?
• 27:16
  Speaker 4: When I came in, he started crying.
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: Everybody in life encounters hardships. What defines them is not
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: those hard moments that they go through. It's about what
• 27:25
  Speaker 2: happens next.
• 27:26
  Speaker 4: I decided to risk it all.
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: I realized how valuable every day was. You're worth the work.
• 27:30
  Speaker 4: Listen, Dara, I'm not going to pull punches. You can
• 27:33
  Speaker 4: use your voice even if it's shaped.
• 27:35
  Speaker 3: The stories are different, but the impact is the same.
• 27:38
  Speaker 3: Only one question matters. What happens next?
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to Juicy Scoop. I'm really excited to
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: talk to a very juicy interview. I know it will
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: be because she is a Hollywood agent, was a Hollywood agent,
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: turned author, executive producer of movie and TV shows, your
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: own book, Climbing in Heels, which is all about, it's
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: a fictional book based on some real characters, maybe, but
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: about women trying to make it in Hollywood and In
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: the 80s on the executive side. And I've heard so
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: much about it. So like I was following Kyle and
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: Kyle from Beverly Hills went to your book party. And
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: that's where I first was like, oh, this is cool.
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: And I think I followed you. And then you DM
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: to me.
• 28:35
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: And I was like, yeah, I'd love to have you on.
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: I think this is like a fascinating book. But also
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: I want to know about your life.
• 28:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah. It's not a straight line, right? Did I DM you? Wow,
• 28:50
  Speaker 4: that's so bold of me. That's so unlike me. But okay,
• 28:53
  Speaker 4: I'll take it.
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: Or maybe I DMed you and you responded.
• 28:57
  Speaker 4: I don't know.
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: Who cares?
• 28:59
  Speaker 4: Either way, it was, yeah. I mean, you know, I
• 29:02
  Speaker 4: think life is about the pivot. I think, you know,
• 29:07
  Speaker 4: this book is a fictional tale about three secretaries who
• 29:12
  Speaker 4: come from very different backgrounds who meet at the Sylvan
• 29:16
  Speaker 4: Light Agency in 1980 Hollywood. And the terrain is rough,
• 29:21
  Speaker 4: especially if in one of their cases, their wiggle was
• 29:24
  Speaker 4: more waddle. They were not the cheese in the mousetrap
• 29:29
  Speaker 4: that they were forced to run in. So they had
• 29:31
  Speaker 4: to become different cheese. They had to figure out a
• 29:33
  Speaker 4: way in. And it's before Me Too. And I don't
• 29:38
  Speaker 4: know if I'm allowed to say this, but they're a
• 29:40
  Speaker 4: lot of blow and blow jobs. It's the 1980s. But
• 29:44
  Speaker 4: there's also a lot of tenacity. There's a lot of
• 29:47
  Speaker 4: standing up when they pass you by and saying, I
• 29:51
  Speaker 4: won't quit when they want you to. It's the story
• 29:54
  Speaker 4: of survival and friendship and betrayal and how some of
• 29:58
  Speaker 4: the women become A lot like the monsters they worked for, right?
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: That is so true. And I don't think people recognize
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: that enough about executives in this business that are female
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: or in any business. I've said it. I feel like
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: sometimes they are not champions of other women because.
• 30:16
  Speaker 4: Well, I can't I don't want to judge. I certainly
• 30:19
  Speaker 4: don't want to judge the characters in my book through
• 30:21
  Speaker 4: the prism of 2025. Right. And I'd like to think
• 30:24
  Speaker 4: that they think they are.
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 30:26
  Speaker 4: But that they it was funny. You magazine did this
• 30:30
  Speaker 4: article on me and they said, well, were you a monster?
• 30:32
  Speaker 4: I said at some point I probably was. you do
• 30:36
  Speaker 4: your best to uphold your integrity. And then you look
• 30:41
  Speaker 4: at the people around you and you become a force.
• 30:45
  Speaker 4: When I was a little girl, there was a cartoon.
• 30:48
  Speaker 4: I think his name was Baboom. It would be before
• 30:51
  Speaker 4: your time. And he would go up to mountains. He
• 30:54
  Speaker 4: was a little Eskimo and he went up to mountains
• 30:56
  Speaker 4: and he went Baboom and the mountain blew apart. And
• 31:00
  Speaker 4: that image, my sister-in-law Mimi gave me actually a sell
• 31:05
  Speaker 4: from that cartoon because that image is emblazoned in my mind.
• 31:09
  Speaker 4: I wanted in so badly. All of these characters in
• 31:14
  Speaker 4: this book wanted to invent or reinvent their lives. And
• 31:19
  Speaker 4: they were all formed and I guess informed by their
• 31:23
  Speaker 4: mothers who were their fuel and their kryptonite, right? Nobody
• 31:28
  Speaker 4: can bring you to your knees better than your mom.
• 31:31
  Speaker 4: And I think that can't judge them. I'd like to
• 31:38
  Speaker 4: think that women now are more aware and more empowering.
• 31:44
  Speaker 4: I know my producing partner, Jennifer Lopez, has put me
• 31:49
  Speaker 4: on her shoulders, on her skinny shoulders, but I've stood there,
• 31:53
  Speaker 4: and has promoted my book and has embraced the fact
• 31:59
  Speaker 4: that I'm not only a producer, I'm a writer. And
• 32:03
  Speaker 4: I was her agent. So kind of reinforcing this idea
• 32:10
  Speaker 4: that we can do more than one thing in life.
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: So, okay, let's just go back. So you, now you
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: weren't really an agent in the 80s. You're too young
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: for that.
• 32:21
  Speaker 4: I wasn't an agent in the, no, I'm not too young.
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: Thank you.
• 32:25
  Speaker 4: Oh, thank you. I must look good today. I was
• 32:29
  Speaker 4: an agent in the 80s. I started very young. I
• 32:31
  Speaker 4: started at the age of 20. I graduated college early.
• 32:34
  Speaker 4: And I was a secretary who, like Beanie Rosen in
• 32:38
  Speaker 4: my book, whose wiggle was more waddle. I was too loud.
• 32:41
  Speaker 4: I was too bold. I was too smart. I was
• 32:43
  Speaker 4: too ambitious. And in those days, secretaries had to say
• 32:46
  Speaker 4: they just wanted to be secretaries. The mailroom was the
• 32:49
  Speaker 4: M-A-L-E room. And that's where the trainees went. That's where
• 32:53
  Speaker 4: the boys went because they were training to be agents.
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: And I.
• 32:58
  Speaker 4: Finagled my way through. I found women who did support me.
• 33:02
  Speaker 4: A woman named Toni Howard, who's still agenting. A woman
• 33:06
  Speaker 4: named Sue Mengers, who was a legend, who was hard
• 33:09
  Speaker 4: on me, but who saw my talent. And I think
• 33:12
  Speaker 4: she saw herself in me. And they helped me through.
• 33:16
  Speaker 4: They helped me navigate around the system that was designed
• 33:20
  Speaker 4: to keep me out. And I became an agent in
• 33:24
  Speaker 4: the late 80s. And I came out fast. I wanted,
• 33:28
  Speaker 4: you know.
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: So did you ever work with the agent Iris Burton?
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: Iris Burton, the child agent.
• 33:35
  Speaker 4: I remember, I mean, I may have spoken to her.
• 33:40
  Speaker 4: She was a generation before me. But I know that
• 33:44
  Speaker 4: she represented, I think her son was Barry Miller. It's
• 33:50
  Speaker 4: Barry Miller.
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: She represented children.
• 33:51
  Speaker 4: Yeah, but you know her son, do you remember the
• 33:53
  Speaker 4: movie Fame?
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: Uh-huh.
• 33:55
  Speaker 4: Did you ever see the movie Fame? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 33:57
  Speaker 4: The young guy in it, Barry Miller, who was a
• 34:02
  Speaker 4: brilliant actor, is her son.
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: Oh, wow.
• 34:04
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah. She was an agent of child actors in
• 34:08
  Speaker 4: the 80s, I think, but before me.
• 34:11
  Speaker 1: So she was like very harsh, right? And so we
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: lived in Woodland Hills and this neighbor had these friends
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: come over and their kids had an agent. And my
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: mom was like, I think my kids, my daughters would
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: love to have an agent. And she goes, oh, well,
• 34:30
  Speaker 1: then we'll introduce you to Iris Burton, our agent. And
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: so anyway, we went up to her house, the three
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: of us, like I remember going up these steps. And
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: she looked at all three of us, my two sisters
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: and I, and was like, okay, like I'll represent you. Oh, wow.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: And then the other girls.
• 34:51
  Speaker 4: Is this the 80s?
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: This is the 80s. This would have been, even before then,
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: this would have been like 1975 or 6.
• 34:58
  Speaker 4: I see.
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: And then I just remember my mom thought it was
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: like so harsh because this other family that had come
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: to see if she wanted, she didn't want them. And
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: she said, leave the light on for the McDonald's. as
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: they were going down these like scary steps in Hollywood.
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: Then years later, you know, she was still around and
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: representing another person. I knew another, and I actually did
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: like a caricature of her at the Groundlings because it
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: was like, she wanted identical twins. I haven't had a
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: good set of twins since like, you know, because twins
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: would work twice the amount of time. And so I
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: always just think of that as like, you know, the
• 35:42
  Speaker 1: harshness of seeing how hard, you know, and then I
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: never booked anything.
• 35:46
  Speaker 4: It was a little bit, yeah. I mean, I think
• 35:48
  Speaker 4: I spoke to her a few times because, but I
• 35:52
  Speaker 4: worked at the William Morris Agency. So what happened to
• 35:56
  Speaker 4: me was- Can you.
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: Tell them I'm their client? I've been there for a
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: long time.
• 35:59
  Speaker 4: No, that's an interesting testimony.
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: Just kidding, everybody.
• 36:06
  Speaker 4: I was in love with this guy. in love with him.
• 36:09
  Speaker 4: I grew up in the valley. I grew up, you know,
• 36:13
  Speaker 4: I was born in Pacoima. My mom called it Arlita.
• 36:16
  Speaker 4: We moved to Sepulveda. My mom called it Northridge. I
• 36:19
  Speaker 4: never knew where I lived. I just knew it wasn't
• 36:21
  Speaker 4: good enough for my mom. But I also learned that
• 36:25
  Speaker 4: image was more important than truth. And I think that,
• 36:29
  Speaker 4: you know, for my mom, the measure of success was
• 36:32
  Speaker 4: if you live south of the boulevard, boulevard being Ventura Boulevard.
• 36:36
  Speaker 4: There was like the hills and the hills not. and
• 36:39
  Speaker 4: we were in the Hills Knot, but she kind of,
• 36:41
  Speaker 4: you know the guy on the ice, the Zamboni machine?
• 36:45
  Speaker 4: She sort of nudged our reality into her truth, or
• 36:49
  Speaker 4: her truth into our reality. So suddenly we were, where
• 36:52
  Speaker 4: are you from? We're from south of the boulevard. Our temple,
• 36:58
  Speaker 4: it was always the aspiration to just, I never thought
• 37:01
  Speaker 4: about living in Beverly Hills. It was just, the Encino
• 37:05
  Speaker 4: Hills would have been fine. But I was in love
• 37:09
  Speaker 4: with a boy who was Hills, and I was Hills not.
• 37:13
  Speaker 4: And he was short. He went to our temple, a
• 37:16
  Speaker 4: very upscale temple. He was, I don't know, he said
• 37:21
  Speaker 4: he was 5'8. He was probably 5'5 with lifts, which
• 37:24
  Speaker 4: meant he was 5'3. And I'm like 5'7. And we
• 37:28
  Speaker 4: looked like Mutt and Jif. And I just wanted anything
• 37:31
  Speaker 4: for him to like me. And my dad was a salesman,
• 37:36
  Speaker 4: and he had taught me that no just meant try again,
• 37:39
  Speaker 4: try harder, which was good in some instances, but was
• 37:41
  Speaker 4: bad when somebody wasn't into you. And he wanted an agent,
• 37:47
  Speaker 4: this guy. And I said, guffaw, I'll help you get
• 37:51
  Speaker 4: an agent. Not even knowing what an agent was, I
• 37:54
  Speaker 4: bullshitted my way. I zambonied my truth. Oh, my father
• 37:59
  Speaker 4: is related to somebody who can help you. I zambonied it.
• 38:02
  Speaker 4: Or you might say I manifested my reality because I
• 38:06
  Speaker 4: said to him, I'll do it. And I was going
• 38:08
  Speaker 4: away to Berkeley and he was staying local and I
• 38:12
  Speaker 4: had the summer to do it. So I put a
• 38:15
  Speaker 4: list of franchised agents together from the Screen Actors Guild
• 38:18
  Speaker 4: and there must have been 5,000. I'm not kidding. Tiny,
• 38:20
  Speaker 4: tiny print. I had the girls at the card store
• 38:23
  Speaker 4: I was working at help me. And every day I
• 38:25
  Speaker 4: went out with his headshot, which I had paid for.
• 38:30
  Speaker 4: And I went to the receptionist to get to the agent. No,
• 38:35
  Speaker 4: you go to the receptionist to get the secretary, the
• 38:37
  Speaker 4: secretary to get to the agent. All summer it's taking
• 38:40
  Speaker 4: me just to get to the secretary. Meanwhile, I'm tap
• 38:44
  Speaker 4: dancing for this idiot. Oh, any day now, oh, my
• 38:47
  Speaker 4: dad's going to help. Don't worry. I'm just trying to
• 38:50
  Speaker 4: deliver the yes for him. Finally, at the end of summer,
• 38:53
  Speaker 4: I went to this one agency. And I saw the
• 38:56
  Speaker 4: agent behind a scrim and I was desperate. And I
• 38:59
  Speaker 4: started jumping up and down, holding his picture, saying, I
• 39:02
  Speaker 4: have Al Pacino in here. I have Dustin, every short
• 39:04
  Speaker 4: actor I could think of. Dustin Hoffman, Steve McQueen. So
• 39:08
  Speaker 4: he comes out and he goes, who is he? I said,
• 39:12
  Speaker 4: he's brilliant. You've got to just meet him. It'll take
• 39:15
  Speaker 4: 10 minutes. What do you have to lose? He said,
• 39:16
  Speaker 4: 10 minutes. And I said, and if you don't, you're
• 39:19
  Speaker 4: going to be walking down Hollywood Boulevard. You're going to
• 39:23
  Speaker 4: see his picture on every billboard. And you're not going
• 39:27
  Speaker 4: to ask how short he is or what's wrong with him.
• 39:29
  Speaker 4: You're going to say, I could have met this kid,
• 39:32
  Speaker 4: and I didn't.
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: And this kid was named Tom Cruise?
• 39:35
  Speaker 4: No, but he said to me, the best thing about
• 39:38
  Speaker 4: this kid is you. But Heather, I got the yes.
• 39:43
  Speaker 4: And I went to a payphone for mobiles, and I
• 39:45
  Speaker 4: called him. And I was so excited. And this loser
• 39:50
  Speaker 4: gets picked up by this agent. And I don't know,
• 39:54
  Speaker 4: maybe two months later, he gets this little roll on chips.
• 39:57
  Speaker 4: And I think, oh my God, he's going to be
• 39:59
  Speaker 4: carved out into the Mount Rushmore Hall of Fame. Then
• 40:02
  Speaker 4: he gets a semi-regular roll on happy days. So he's
• 40:06
  Speaker 4: really taken off.
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 40:08
  Speaker 4: And shortly thereafter, he dumps me. But, you know, I
• 40:13
  Speaker 4: never forgot the thrill of getting the yes. And because
• 40:18
  Speaker 4: of him and that stupid situation, I found my way
• 40:23
  Speaker 4: to being an agent because I knew I was good
• 40:26
  Speaker 4: at selling people I believed in. I knew I could
• 40:30
  Speaker 4: manifest his career. I understood the architecture of the sell.
• 40:37
  Speaker 4: And that's how I became an agent.
• 40:39
  Speaker 1: So how did you then start representing or meet Jennifer Lopez?
• 40:43
  Speaker 4: Oh, well, Years later. I mean, I became a secretary
• 40:47
  Speaker 4: who found my way to becoming an agent. I came
• 40:50
  Speaker 4: out fast. I represented Nicolas Cage. I represented Julia Roberts.
• 40:56
  Speaker 4: And I spent the 90s building my career.
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: So was she your client during Pretty Woman?
• 41:02
  Speaker 4: Yeah. I signed her at Mystic Pizza.
• 41:06
  Speaker 1: I loved that movie too.
• 41:08
  Speaker 4: And all the way till Erin Brockovich. So that was
• 41:11
  Speaker 4: my trajectory as an agent. And we grew up together.
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: Let me ask you a question. I always wondered how
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: is it– because as someone who was aspiring to be
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: an actor back in the day, how is it that
• 41:25
  Speaker 1: you get a young talent like Julia Roberts– And, you know, no,
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: she's for movies, not for TV and not for a soap.
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: Like it always used to be like, OK, you start
• 41:37
  Speaker 1: out with commercials, then you might get a soap and
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: you move your way up. But I'm always like, how
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: do some of these really young, talented people just get
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: like plucked and then on the movie train?
• 41:48
  Speaker 4: Well, they have the right people in back of them.
• 41:50
  Speaker 4: I mean, I was a motion picture agent. OK. I
• 41:53
  Speaker 4: didn't do TV. That was the area I found, I
• 41:57
  Speaker 4: wanted to do TV, but I was in the motion
• 41:59
  Speaker 4: picture department. She was signed by a friend of mine
• 42:03
  Speaker 4: in New York by a woman named Risa Shapiro and
• 42:05
  Speaker 4: Kevin Uvain. They signed her in New York. I was
• 42:10
  Speaker 4: the West Coast contact. And she and I just clicked
• 42:15
  Speaker 4: that we had an overlap. And, you know, she was
• 42:21
  Speaker 4: raw talent. You could see it. Brilliant talent. lovely, funny, beautiful,
• 42:29
  Speaker 4: and smart.
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: Did you have any idea when a script like Pretty
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: Woman would come across that it would be such a
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: phenomenal hit? Because when you think about it today, the concept,
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: it is a fantasy. It doesn't make sense that a
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: girl that looked like her would actually be on the
• 42:47
  Speaker 1: streets giving blowjobs.
• 42:49
  Speaker 4: It was the darkest script you've ever seen called 3,000.
• 42:52
  Speaker 4: And Julia was attached to do it at a place
• 42:56
  Speaker 4: called Vestron. And they went out of business. And the
• 42:59
  Speaker 4: guy who ran it, rest in peace, Steve Ruther, went
• 43:02
  Speaker 4: over as a producer, Laura Ziskin, all these people that
• 43:05
  Speaker 4: were involved. And I chased it hard. It went to Disney.
• 43:10
  Speaker 4: And we were like, Disney? And Jeffrey Katzenberg, who is
• 43:14
  Speaker 4: a genius, saw the potential in what it could be.
• 43:20
  Speaker 4: the pig million of it all. And he hired Gary Marshall, genius. And, um, Julia,
• 43:27
  Speaker 4: we really had to campaign for that. And, um, she
• 43:30
  Speaker 4: tested and then we had to get the guy and,
• 43:33
  Speaker 4: and we watched it sort of blossom into pretty woman. It,
• 43:39
  Speaker 4: it was a dark, um, script called 3000 written by, um, uh,
• 43:45
  Speaker 4: Gary Lawton. I think that was his name. Um, and, uh,
• 43:49
  Speaker 4: And it was remarkable. And, you know, I always thought, oddly,
• 43:54
  Speaker 4: being from the Valley, because I grew up with Valley Girl, right?
• 43:59
  Speaker 4: And it was like a joke.
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: And I'm sorry, but I was raised south of Boulevard.
• 44:03
  Speaker 1: And it was a big thing that we talked about.
• 44:06
  Speaker 4: You were south of the Boulevard. Yes, because my.
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: Parents were realtors, so they would constantly talk about south
• 44:10
  Speaker 1: of Boulevard.
• 44:10
  Speaker 4: Yeah, we lived where the housekeepers lived. I didn't know
• 44:14
  Speaker 4: the difference, except my mom did. But But then, you.
• 44:17
  Speaker 1: Know, when I got to SC with the first time,
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: I realized to be from the Valley was trash.
• 44:23
  Speaker 4: Well, that's the thing.
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: I thought I was killing it.
• 44:26
  Speaker 4: You didn't know. You didn't know that it was until
• 44:28
  Speaker 4: Valley Girl happened for me. I thought it was the
• 44:31
  Speaker 4: best place to be from. And then I started not
• 44:35
  Speaker 4: telling people I'm from the Valley. But you know what? Again,
• 44:39
  Speaker 4: me being from the Valley informed my commercial instincts because
• 44:45
  Speaker 4: the Valley is your local mall. By the way, to
• 44:47
  Speaker 4: this day, I'm very happy in a mall. You know,
• 44:50
  Speaker 4: the Valley is very middle America. So my tastes, I found,
• 44:55
  Speaker 4: were very similar to female tastes, and they still are
• 44:59
  Speaker 4: across the country. I learned to trust my instincts on material.
• 45:05
  Speaker 4: And oddly, you know, if it hadn't happened with my boyfriend,
• 45:08
  Speaker 4: me getting him an agent, I think I would have
• 45:10
  Speaker 4: just become a writer. But I realized I was good
• 45:14
  Speaker 4: at more than one thing. And so I became an
• 45:17
  Speaker 4: agent and then I became a very successful agent. And
• 45:20
  Speaker 4: in the nineties I represented, yes, Julia and, and, and, and, um, gosh,
• 45:27
  Speaker 4: you know, Susan Sarandon.
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: So was part of your job then being able to
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: detect if you thought a script had legs or not?
• 45:35
  Speaker 4: Absolutely. It wasn't the ones we said yes to, it
• 45:38
  Speaker 4: was the ones we said no to. And we were
• 45:40
  Speaker 4: smart about it. And Julia had really good instincts as well. And, um,
• 45:45
  Speaker 4: I also worked with Madonna in the 90s.
• 45:49
  Speaker 1: Speaking of Pretty Woman, I remember reading a story that
• 45:52
  Speaker 1: they thought Madonna would be good for Pretty Woman. And
• 45:55
  Speaker 1: she said, oh, no, you need a much younger girl,
• 45:58
  Speaker 1: like a 21-year-old. That's just something I remember reading in
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: an article.
• 46:01
  Speaker 4: I don't think that was accurate. I mean, I don't know.
• 46:08
  Speaker 4: Pretty Woman was, I think, 89. No. I remember when
• 46:14
  Speaker 4: they changed the title to pretty woman, we went, what?
• 46:17
  Speaker 4: But Jeffrey Katzenberg, it's his genius. It's his genius. Um,
• 46:22
  Speaker 4: that movie, he was the architect, honestly. And, um, uh,
• 46:27
  Speaker 4: I can't say it enough. He, especially in looking back
• 46:30
  Speaker 4: and having a front row seat to all of that,
• 46:32
  Speaker 4: it was wildly fun, but I didn't sign. By the
• 46:37
  Speaker 4: time I signed Jennifer, it was, um, I don't know, 1998. And, um,
• 46:42
  Speaker 4: my husband saw her in a movie. And at that point,
• 46:46
  Speaker 4: you know, I was this big deal agent. I, you know,
• 46:50
  Speaker 4: represented big stars, Cage and, you know, really big stars.
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: So then you were successful. So then you were, where
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: were you living then in the Hollywood Hills, Beverly Hills?
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: Where were you living when you were having to go
• 47:02
  Speaker 1: to your office every day?
• 47:03
  Speaker 4: Well, I'll, I'll tell you, I was, I was at
• 47:07
  Speaker 4: William Morris until 1990. And it, kind of like what
• 47:12
  Speaker 4: happens in the book that, you know, CAA was very
• 47:15
  Speaker 4: much on the rise and they were picking off the
• 47:19
  Speaker 4: clients at William Morris. I felt like I was in
• 47:21
  Speaker 4: a target practice and I knew I had to leave. And,
• 47:24
  Speaker 4: and so it was, do I go to CAA with
• 47:27
  Speaker 4: a man named Michael Ovitz who ran it, or do
• 47:30
  Speaker 4: I go to ICM? And I, um, brilliant man named
• 47:34
  Speaker 4: Jeff Berg, um, called me and And my partner at
• 47:40
  Speaker 4: the time, Risa Shapiro, and we went to ICM with
• 47:43
  Speaker 4: a group of other women. We all went there, causing
• 47:47
  Speaker 4: William Morris to have to acquire another agency. It was
• 47:50
  Speaker 4: pretty titanic. It was like a big tsunami when we went.
• 47:55
  Speaker 4: I think it was six women who went. And on
• 47:58
  Speaker 4: the cover of Los Angeles Magazine back then, it had
• 48:01
  Speaker 4: William Morris with the Titanic sinking because we had tipped them.
• 48:06
  Speaker 4: And part of us went because we weren't recognized the
• 48:09
  Speaker 4: way the men were.
• 48:10
  Speaker 1: And so then you were able to bring your top
• 48:12
  Speaker 1: clients with you.
• 48:13
  Speaker 4: My clients came with us. Yes, our clients came with us.
• 48:19
  Speaker 4: But in 94, I wanted to move to New York.
• 48:24
  Speaker 4: I had met my husband through Julia, actually. And he
• 48:30
  Speaker 4: lived in New York. And I'd always wanted to live there.
• 48:32
  Speaker 4: I always thought people thought I was from there. It
• 48:34
  Speaker 4: sounded cool. It would be fun. And somebody at my
• 48:38
  Speaker 4: agency said, if you do that, it'll kill your career.
• 48:41
  Speaker 4: If you move to New York, it'll kill your career.
• 48:43
  Speaker 4: No one will sign with you. You won't be hot anymore.
• 48:46
  Speaker 4: And I was afraid. I didn't recognize my power, Heather.
• 48:49
  Speaker 4: I didn't realize, wait, I have the biggest star in
• 48:52
  Speaker 4: the world. I was afraid. And then someone else came
• 48:55
  Speaker 4: to me and said, do it. Always vote for yourself.
• 49:00
  Speaker 4: And I'll never forget that advice because I went to
• 49:04
  Speaker 4: New York and then immediately I signed Madonna and Spike
• 49:08
  Speaker 4: Lee and Matt Dillon, all of these people who at
• 49:10
  Speaker 4: the time were just huge, and Jennifer Lopez. And Jennifer,
• 49:17
  Speaker 4: I kind of felt like, and I was representing a
• 49:22
  Speaker 4: lot of people in those days, but I thought if
• 49:25
  Speaker 4: I don't represent you, I'm going to feel devastated. I
• 49:33
  Speaker 4: loved her because when I met her, first of all,
• 49:36
  Speaker 4: I loved her talent. I loved the fact that she
• 49:39
  Speaker 4: wanted to do more than one thing. I loved her resilience.
• 49:42
  Speaker 4: But when I met her, the thing I noticed most
• 49:45
  Speaker 4: was she's not judgmental. We had gone to this concert,
• 49:50
  Speaker 4: this thing, and Barry Manilow was playing. And so I
• 49:53
  Speaker 4: thought to be cool, I would say, you know, Barry Manilow.
• 49:56
  Speaker 4: And she looked at me and she said, I love him.
• 49:59
  Speaker 4: I love his music. There's not a judgmental bone in
• 50:03
  Speaker 4: this woman's body. She is somebody who looks at you
• 50:08
  Speaker 4: and says, you know, you can be and you should
• 50:11
  Speaker 4: be whatever you need to be. And I had never
• 50:14
  Speaker 4: met anybody like her.
• 50:15
  Speaker 1: That's great. And so then when you, then when did
• 50:19
  Speaker 1: you go from agent to let's produce these projects together?
• 50:23
  Speaker 4: In 2000, I knew I wanted to write. And other
• 50:26
  Speaker 4: than Jennifer, not a lot of my clients were excited
• 50:30
  Speaker 4: about the idea of their agent being a writer. You know,
• 50:33
  Speaker 4: it's weird how we keep people in one lane, right?
• 50:36
  Speaker 4: If you As if you should make one decision your
• 50:39
  Speaker 4: whole life and that's all you should do. God, it's
• 50:42
  Speaker 4: not that you only live once. You only die once.
• 50:47
  Speaker 4: You live every day. So if you have a passion
• 50:50
  Speaker 4: to do more than one thing, don't marginalize yourself. Don't
• 50:54
  Speaker 4: minimize your talent. The fact that I'm a good writer
• 50:58
  Speaker 4: made me a better agent. And it's kind of like Jennifer.
• 51:02
  Speaker 4: Here's this woman who's this dancer. Who became this amazing actor.
• 51:08
  Speaker 4: When you look at the breadth of her career, the
• 51:11
  Speaker 4: role she's done, and how long she's been doing it.
• 51:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 51:15
  Speaker 4: And then who became this beautiful singer who's had like
• 51:19
  Speaker 4: 80 billion streams. I mean, massive amounts of hits. And
• 51:24
  Speaker 4: yet she's marginalized. You know, I saw this interview. It
• 51:27
  Speaker 4: was resurfaced recently. Made me enraged. And look, it's old.
• 51:33
  Speaker 4: I'm sure it's... Not the way she feels anymore, I
• 51:37
  Speaker 4: would hope. But it was such an interesting interview that
• 51:40
  Speaker 4: Larry King did with Mariah Carey, where Mariah said, he said,
• 51:44
  Speaker 4: does it make you upset that Jennifer Lopez is such
• 51:47
  Speaker 4: a big superstar? And she said, well, I'm a singer. Implying,
• 51:51
  Speaker 4: of course, that Jennifer wasn't. Now, our next movie is
• 51:54
  Speaker 4: A Kiss of the Spider Woman. John Kander, who wrote
• 51:58
  Speaker 4: the music for that, who wrote the music for Cabaret,
• 52:00
  Speaker 4: who's 97, cried when he heard doing her prerecord. She
• 52:06
  Speaker 4: has a beautiful voice. But yet, we, and sometimes women
• 52:11
  Speaker 4: do this.
• 52:11
  Speaker 1: Wait, Kiss the Spider Woman is something you are doing
• 52:13
  Speaker 1: right now?
• 52:14
  Speaker 4: It's coming out in October.
• 52:15
  Speaker 1: Oh, wow, cool.
• 52:15
  Speaker 4: You're going to see Jennifer. It's a story about love
• 52:18
  Speaker 4: is love.
• 52:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 52:20
  Speaker 4: It is a beautiful movie.
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: No, it came out like 30 years ago, right? Yes.
• 52:24
  Speaker 1: This is a remake?
• 52:25
  Speaker 4: This is a, what came out 30 years ago was
• 52:27
  Speaker 4: Bill Hurt and Raul Julia. This is a musical about
• 52:31
  Speaker 4: two men who are in prison who ultimately fall in love.
• 52:36
  Speaker 4: And they do it through the imaginings of this movie
• 52:40
  Speaker 4: that one tells the other about. And Jennifer is the
• 52:43
  Speaker 4: star of that movie. It is a beautiful movie that
• 52:46
  Speaker 4: Bill Condon directed. And her voice is pristine. And I
• 52:52
  Speaker 4: just think, you know, it's a shame that we marginalize
• 52:56
  Speaker 4: people for doing more than one thing. It's almost as
• 53:00
  Speaker 4: if our fear that we only do one thing causes
• 53:03
  Speaker 4: us to limit them or limit their talent. She's extraordinary.
• 53:07
  Speaker 4: And because of her, I was able to sort of
• 53:09
  Speaker 4: stand in my truth and go, I'm a pretty good writer.
• 53:13
  Speaker 4: And I'm a good producer. And I've never stopped being
• 53:16
  Speaker 4: an agent. You know, you can do more than one
• 53:19
  Speaker 4: thing in life. Heather, you're a brilliant stand-up. I love Groundlings,
• 53:24
  Speaker 4: by the way. I didn't realize that you were in
• 53:26
  Speaker 4: the Groundlings. I loved, I used to go there.
• 53:29
  Speaker 1: It's funny because you say about, you know, Oh, you know,
• 53:33
  Speaker 1: you pivoted whatever from stand-up to this. I still am
• 53:36
  Speaker 1: a stand-up. But now I want people to say I'm
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: a stand-up because everyone has a podcast. So, you know,
• 53:46
  Speaker 1: in talking about how, you know, people are– it's like
• 53:50
  Speaker 1: everyone's an influencer. Everyone is on Instagram. Like we were
• 53:54
  Speaker 1: watching this– the Pee Wee Herman doc last night. And
• 53:59
  Speaker 1: I was saying to my son, it was good. It
• 54:02
  Speaker 1: was a little too much about the shows, to be honest.
• 54:04
  Speaker 1: Like I want to just kind of get more to
• 54:06
  Speaker 1: like his life and, you know, he's passed and he's
• 54:10
  Speaker 1: really brilliant in the documentary. Like he's funny as he's
• 54:12
  Speaker 1: just like messing with the documentarian. But, um, You know,
• 54:17
  Speaker 1: unless you were a super fan of the– it was
• 54:19
  Speaker 1: a little too much on like– and then in this episode,
• 54:21
  Speaker 1: I was like, okay, come on.
• 54:22
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah.
• 54:24
  Speaker 1: But I was trying to explain that like there were
• 54:26
  Speaker 1: only like a handful of famous people, you know, and
• 54:29
  Speaker 1: they were– it was special when a famous person did
• 54:33
  Speaker 1: a TV appearance. Like if Cher was going to be
• 54:36
  Speaker 1: on his, it was a big deal. Now the most
• 54:39
  Speaker 1: famous people are on Instagram. We see their outfits before
• 54:42
  Speaker 1: the Oscars. We– they're, you know– Selling just like a
• 54:47
  Speaker 1: 25-year-old is selling, which I get. That's life. Hollywood's changed.
• 54:51
  Speaker 1: But I think– so then sometimes when you're doing something
• 54:54
  Speaker 1: that then everybody's doing, you're like, well, everyone can have
• 54:59
  Speaker 1: a podcast in my case. Not everyone can do stand-up.
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: So it's like I kind of want to like– and
• 55:05
  Speaker 1: so when I did this thing the other day, their
• 55:10
  Speaker 1: description of me, which I changed, and they didn't make
• 55:12
  Speaker 1: the change in time, which is fine, was– Our next presenter,
• 55:17
  Speaker 1: you know, is a great comedian, and she also has
• 55:22
  Speaker 1: her own podcast called Juicy Scoop. I'm like, who doesn't
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: have their own podcast? There's literally two billion podcasts. I'm like, no,
• 55:31
  Speaker 1: that's not– I was like, that's not really how I
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: want to be because– like, just because. You know, so
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: I get how people sometimes are thinking, like, wow, my
• 55:40
  Speaker 1: identity has changed because so many other people have maybe.
• 55:43
  Speaker 4: But here's the thing, you have a really fun podcast
• 55:50
  Speaker 4: because I'm getting asked to do so many of them.
• 55:53
  Speaker 4: I was like, hmm, hmm. And I watched yours and
• 55:55
  Speaker 4: it's fun, but you're also a phenomenal comedian. And if
• 55:59
  Speaker 4: you wanted to be a writer.
• 56:02
  Speaker 1: I have. I've written two books, but that's okay.
• 56:04
  Speaker 4: Okay, there you go. But the point is that in life,
• 56:08
  Speaker 4: I don't think it's ever too late to pivot.
• 56:10
  Speaker 1: No, it's never too late, and I think it's really great.
• 56:13
  Speaker 1: And I'm curious to, like, did you always have this idea,
• 56:18
  Speaker 1: and why did you decide to do it? fiction instead
• 56:21
  Speaker 1: of a nonfiction like memoir of.
• 56:23
  Speaker 4: Like, Oh, I, because this is far more interesting than
• 56:26
  Speaker 4: my life. I mean, these girls are far more body
• 56:28
  Speaker 4: and brave and, and, and witty and, and, um, and desperate.
• 56:33
  Speaker 4: And you can turn left in fiction. I, I, in
• 56:37
  Speaker 4: the book, I go back, it takes place in the eighties.
• 56:40
  Speaker 4: So I do flashbacks to show who they were. So
• 56:43
  Speaker 4: I mean, back in the sixties, In some cases, I'm
• 56:46
  Speaker 4: back in the 50s. In some cases, I'm back in
• 56:48
  Speaker 4: the 30s. There's a character, a woman who is a
• 56:51
  Speaker 4: ball buster in the 80s. She's already achieved her success.
• 56:54
  Speaker 4: And I go back to watching how she achieved it.
• 56:58
  Speaker 4: And I do use, I season it with real people,
• 57:04
  Speaker 4: you know, with people who were famous in those days,
• 57:09
  Speaker 4: in the 30s, in the 50s, in the 60s, in
• 57:10
  Speaker 4: the 80s. So I season it that way, but the
• 57:13
  Speaker 4: characters are fictional. But there's some things in there that
• 57:18
  Speaker 4: I'd heard about. I remember so clearly this assistant saying
• 57:23
  Speaker 4: to me, and I dramatize this in the book, where
• 57:27
  Speaker 4: an actress, where the secretary came into this agent's office
• 57:33
  Speaker 4: and found an earring. And the secretary says to the trainee,
• 57:37
  Speaker 4: whose is this? And what you discover is that the
• 57:40
  Speaker 4: agent would audition actresses every Wednesday. And, you know, he'd
• 57:46
  Speaker 4: ask them, you know, he'd get a casting director on
• 57:49
  Speaker 4: the phone and the casting director would say, well, what's
• 57:52
  Speaker 4: she look like? Is she tall? Is she sexy? Is
• 57:55
  Speaker 4: she fun? Well, she's tall and she's sexy, but are
• 57:57
  Speaker 4: you fun? And she'd giggle. And then she'd take off
• 58:00
  Speaker 4: her shoes and take off her sweater and so on
• 58:03
  Speaker 4: and take off her earrings. And the secretary said to
• 58:07
  Speaker 4: the trainee, well, how do you know? How do you
• 58:09
  Speaker 4: know how it transpires? And the agent would let him
• 58:13
  Speaker 4: listen as a bonus if he did a good job
• 58:15
  Speaker 4: or if he worked on weekends. He'd let him listen
• 58:18
  Speaker 4: as he messed around with these secretaries. I mean, actresses.
• 58:26
  Speaker 4: I mean, actresses, also secretaries. When they were interviewing them
• 58:31
  Speaker 4: for different roles, different positions. Sometimes they wanted spinners. Sometimes
• 58:37
  Speaker 4: they wanted long legs and no last name. Now, not
• 58:41
  Speaker 4: every person was like that, but it was real. And
• 58:45
  Speaker 4: you tell it to young, like young women today are
• 58:47
  Speaker 4: reading my book. I'm thrilled and it's a bestseller. It's
• 58:52
  Speaker 4: taken off, all of that. But they're reading it going, God,
• 58:55
  Speaker 4: the 80s seems so great.
• 58:59
  Speaker 1: Well, I think it's really brilliant that A, that you
• 59:03
  Speaker 1: wrote it from that era. There's obviously the hits that
• 59:08
  Speaker 1: have come in the last couple of years. that have
• 59:10
  Speaker 1: been from that time, whether it's the Menendez Brothers or whatever,
• 59:15
  Speaker 1: the nostalgia that's on TikTok of kids wanting to see.
• 59:19
  Speaker 1: And even when I talk to young people, they're like,
• 59:22
  Speaker 1: because I wrote a book about my dating adventures before.
• 59:27
  Speaker 1: like in the early 90s, and I called it You'll
• 59:29
  Speaker 1: Never Blue Ball in This Town Again because I was
• 59:31
  Speaker 1: an old virgin who was trying to make it in Hollywood.
• 59:34
  Speaker 1: And you remember those books, You'll Never Make Love in
• 59:36
  Speaker 1: This Town Again, and You'll Never Nanny in This Town Again,
• 59:39
  Speaker 1: You'll Never Have Lunch in This Town Again was the
• 59:40
  Speaker 1: first one. And then the one about being like a
• 59:44
  Speaker 1: high-class hooker in Hollywood was You'll Never Make Love in
• 59:47
  Speaker 1: This Town Again, which was so juicy. Wow. And so anyway,
• 59:50
  Speaker 1: I was like, I'm just going to, you know, play
• 59:52
  Speaker 1: off of that and make fun of these things.
• 59:55
  Speaker 4: And.
• 59:56
  Speaker 1: Because it's a time where there was no social media
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 1: and you had to call or leave a message or
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 1: maybe you would miss a call and you wouldn't know
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 1: what the person was doing so you could be coy
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 1: and all of that. I feel like the Gen Z,
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 1: it's like, what was that like? They want to dive
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 1: into that world.
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 4: They do.
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 1: And watch it and read about it and imagine what
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 1: life was like before everything was online.
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 4: And it's fun. I mean, look, the hair was big.
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 4: The shoulder pads were big. The phones were big. But
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 4: there were other things that weren't so big, even though
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 4: they thought they were. You know, it was fun. But
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 4: the truth is, it was all we knew. I didn't
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 4: take a moment to think, gee, this is unfair, or gee,
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 4: this is hard. It was just the terrain that I
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 4: was facing. So I had to think, how do I
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 4: get in? How do I get the yes? Because no
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 4: just meant try again, try harder, which is really great
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 4: if you want to be an agent. It may not
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 4: be so great personally, but it's really great if you
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 4: want to be an agent. And it was a great
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 4: training ground, my mother sort of manifesting the life She
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 4: wanted and my father teaching me that no just meant
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 4: try again.
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 1: Was there any client or project that you did turn
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 1: down that you maybe didn't regret, but they went on
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 1: to enormous success? And you're like, oh, you know, like
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: when you hear about actors passing on big scripts and stuff.
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 4: I had a client who shall remain nameless. I never,
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 4: ever want to tell tales, nor will I. They were
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 4: offered Sleepless in Seattle and did not do it. And
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 4: I was on my knees. But again, out of that,
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 4: I was able to develop a great friendship with Nora Ephron,
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 4: rest her soul, who told me back in 2000, you know,
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 4: you need to write. You need to write. There's a
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 4: lovely man named Ron Bass. He was a lawyer who
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 4: became a screenwriter. He wrote some of our favorite movies.
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 4: He wrote sleeping with the enemy, he wrote My Best
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 4: Friend's Wedding and they were doing a reshoot on it.
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 4: So he came into my office and we were bullshitting around.
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 4: We always used to talk about ideas, he and I,
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 4: and I loved it. And he came in and he
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 4: said they're doing a reshoot on it and this is
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 4: what we're trying to figure out. So I pitched him
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 4: something and he called me later, he said, would you
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 4: write that down? Just the way you pitched it. And
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 4: I said, No, he brought me the next day Final Draft,
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 4: which is a computer program. Computers were kind of new then.
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 4: It was like 95, I guess. And he taught me
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 4: how to use it. And he said, just write this
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 4: scene and this other scene that they were reshooting in
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 4: a bathroom. And he said, just for the heck of it.
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 1: So I did.
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 4: And he ended up showing it to the studio. And,
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 4: you know, bless him, he gave me credit. In other words,
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 4: he told them I did it. And he made me
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 4: believe in myself in a way that really helped me
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 4: stop being afraid. I was afraid to admit I wanted
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 4: to do anything other than agent or anything other than produce.
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 4: I was afraid I'd be judged. I was afraid it
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 4: would somehow minimize one. So I guess that's why I'm
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 4: so enamored with Jennifer, because she recognized that my ability
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 4: to be a storyteller made me a better agent and
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 4: She didn't make me stay in one lane. I wasn't
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 4: ever afraid that, oh gosh, if I tell her I
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 4: want to write, she'll get another producing partner. If anything,
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 4: she stood beside me and shouted louder. And it says
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 4: a lot about her.
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 1: And then, so this has already been.
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 1: Made into going to be made into.
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 4: A series darren star for peacock darren star read it
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 4: darren star who does sex in the city and emily
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 4: in paris and younger and many others read it when
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 4: he when it was in its infancy and um and
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 4: i he was a friend of mine so i was
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 4: just wanted to know is it too steamy because there's
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 4: lots of it's very spicy this book very belly of
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 4: the dolls and so um He went, I not only
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 4: love it, I want to option it. I said, come on.
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 4: He said, no, I want to. Then he called me
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 4: three days later. He said, Universal wants to option it.
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 4: I was like, guffaw, my favorite word. He said, I'm serious.
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 4: Universal wants to option it. I said, I haven't even,
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 4: it's not even published. Universal optioned it. Then we got
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 4: a call from Peacock who said, we will give you
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 4: a straight to series order if you don't go anywhere else.
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 4: So we're going to be a series. So right now
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 4: we're writing the outline.
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 1: And then, so is, will Jennifer be a producer on
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 1: it as well?
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's great.
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 4: Of course.
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah. So, so, I mean, that's going to be really fun.
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 1: Do you say, will you be a really big part
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 1: of that or, or not? I.
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 4: I, I, I want to be, I mean, I want to,
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 4: I'm writing the pilot right now with Jet, with Darren. Yeah. I, I,
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 4: people say, well, how are you going to do both?
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 4: And I guess I say, Watch me.
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 1: No, it'll be, yeah.
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 4: I'll figure it out. You know, again, these rules that
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 4: we have to do this or we have to do that.
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 4: Emancipate yourself from other people's idea of your life and
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 4: design your own.
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 1: Do you like the casting process? Like, do you sit
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 1: in the room through all these projects that you've done
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 1: with Jennifer and watch people read for it? And is
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 1: there something, as an actor, I've always... I'm not good
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 1: at auditioning. I'd get so nervous. And then I'd hear
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 1: people would take beta blockers. And I'm like, should I
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 1: take a pill before I.
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 4: Really?
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 1: But then I could go do stand-up like in front of,
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 1: you know, whatever, thousands of people.
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 4: Wow.
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 1: And like not be nervous. But something about like parking
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 1: at the studio, like walking... you know, hoping to have
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 1: it memorized, but maybe not have it memorized because some
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 1: acting coaches would say, don't have it memorized, hold the
• 1:06:20
  Speaker 1: thing and act like you don't care. I don't know.
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 1: I would say memorize it. But, and then like, then
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 1: the distraction that happens in the room of like, hi girl.
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 1: And you see people and then there'd be someone else
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 1: that would just be reading a book. I'm like, how
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 1: could they be reading a book right before they go? Like,
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 1: there's so much. So I always wonder like, and what
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 1: I tell people now is like, They want it to
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 1: be you. They want their job to end. They don't
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 1: want like, but I think going in, there was something
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 1: in my mindset that like, they weren't going to like
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 1: me or they didn't like me, you know, instead of like, oh,
• 1:06:53
  Speaker 1: you're going to be so happy I arrived because I'm
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 1: the one. Like, I didn't have that attitude. Now I do,
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 1: but I didn't.
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 4: I believe, listen, you know, abracadabra in ancient Hebrew translates
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 4: to say it, see it, be it. Abracadabra. I have
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 4: a chapter in the book called The Abracadabra Girls. I
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 4: believe in manifesting your reality, I guess, from my mom.
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 4: So when I'm in the casting process and I'm looking
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 4: at people reading, I have great empathy because I represented actors.
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 4: I try to make everyone as comfortable as possible. But
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 4: I'm looking for someone who can play the lie, who
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 4: It's just so natural. It's like they embody it. They don't...
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 4: They're not... They're not reading their being.
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 4: Because then they're manifesting right in front of me. And
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 4: then you can't shake it. Then you can't shake it.
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 1: Was there any time that, like, you wanted someone that was, like,
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 1: less famous for the part, but then the studio or
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 1: the network was, like, pushing the name?
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 4: No, but there was a time where one of the
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 4: best things that... Well, not best, but I was... I
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 4: represented an actor named Tim Robbins, who, you know, I
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 4: would read every script early. I'm a voracious reader. And
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 4: you have to be able to read quickly. And I
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 4: think my talent was most honed in knowing great material.
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 4: And I read a script called Rita Hayworth and the
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 4: Shawshank Redemption. And I loved it. And I sent it
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 4: to Tim. I said, they want Tom Cruise. I mean,
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 4: you know, but Maybe one of these other. And he
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 4: was obsessed. And he was really hot at the time.
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 4: He was sort of coming up. He had done this.
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 4: I think he had done The Player. He had done
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 4: this kind of mock you series.
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 1: I loved The Player.
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 4: Thank you. Yeah.
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 1: That was about the industry too.
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 4: Yes, it was.
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 4: And I had put that movie together.
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 1: Oh, that was so good. That's a good Juicy Scoop
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 1: classic history type of show.
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 4: Bob Altman directed it.
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 4: Rest in peace. But anyway, I chased that movie for him,
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 4: Shawshank Redemption, so hard and talked to them because Cruise
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 4: wasn't doing it. And They didn't know which way. And
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 4: I said, you need somebody who could become it. And
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 4: then I said to Tim, if you want this, you
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 4: fly out. And he was hot at the time. You audition,
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 4: and then you audition again. And he did. And he
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 4: got it. And to me, it's one of the best
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 4: movies ever made.
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 1: And was he nominated for it?
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 4: I think so. I know Morgan was. It's probably one
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 4: of the most beloved, I call it love stories, ever made. Anyway, yeah,
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 4: was there anybody I wanted to, that I said no
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 4: to who became a big star? Was that your question?
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 1: Or a script that you didn't think would be a
• 1:09:54
  Speaker 1: hit or?
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 4: I'm pretty good with scripts.
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 4: I'm pretty good with scripts. Look, sometimes things can hit
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 4: and they aren't great and they hit.
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 4: But I'm pretty good. And you know, You can't base
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 4: success on box office. You have to base success on
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 4: are you happy with it? Are you proud of it?
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 4: Are you happy to have it on your resume?
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 1: Here's like a hard question. What about when you have
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 1: to call the client?
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and say they didn't get something.
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 1: Well, that's hard, but also tell me that and then
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 1: I have my next question.
• 1:10:31
  Speaker 4: These are fun questions. Nobody's asked me these. This is fun. Well,
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 4: it's devastating. When my clients got a yes, It was
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 4: like I got a yes. When Julia won the Oscar
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 4: for Aaron Burr, I won that Oscar. Conversely, when I
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 4: have to call somebody and say.
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 1: Here, let's just do it because I've heard it a lot. OK,
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 1: I'm not getting it. So ding-a-ling-a-ling. Hello.
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 4: Hi, Heather.
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 1: Hi.
• 1:11:03
  Speaker 4: So they're going a different way. And I think it's ridiculous. And,
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 4: you know, but here's the thing. The casting director loves you.
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 4: The director wants to find something else. And inside, though,
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 4: while I'm telling you this, I'm dying with you. I'm
• 1:11:19
  Speaker 4: dying with you. But my goal is not to show
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 4: you I'm dying with you. My goal is to show
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 4: you that there's another life ahead.
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 1: But I just want to ask you. A big B.
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 4: Oh, you're being you now.
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 1: Because I thought, like, I totally... Are they going with
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 1: a blonde? Because I told you I would have dyed
• 1:11:37
  Speaker 1: my hair blonde. And I'm just wondering, should I have
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 1: dyed my hair blonde with that last callback?
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 4: No, they're going with a guy.
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 1: Oh, well, then I guess I can't compete with that.
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 4: No, but when you have to say no to somebody,
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 4: you also have to keep them afloat.
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 4: Because the truth is, I would do such a good
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 4: job keeping them afloat.
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 4: Zamboning the truth. Yeah. So that... they felt a little
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 4: bit better, but inside I was dying because I felt
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 4: so bad. So then I'd go and eat. I'm not kidding.
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 4: Like I, to quiet the noise, I would eat and, and,
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 4: and it would quiet my own devastation because nobody was
• 1:12:19
  Speaker 4: comforting me. But I, when I, I was a good agent.
• 1:12:23
  Speaker 4: I made sure that my client was comforted.
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 1: Okay, so now I have another uncomfortable call that you
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 1: have to make. You hired me. I mean, not hired me,
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 1: but we were working together. You're my agent. And, you know,
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 1: I just haven't booked anything. And it's just not– I'm
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 1: not the next Ellen like you thought I was going
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 1: to be. And you've got to, like, just set me
• 1:12:45
  Speaker 1: free because you're not– It's just not popping, okay? So
• 1:12:50
  Speaker 1: now you've got to let me go.
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 4: So we're doing improvs now, right?
• 1:12:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:12:54
  Speaker 1: I just want to know what it's like to have
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 1: to be on the other side because I've been on
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 1: the receiving of all these calls.
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 4: All right. Well, Heather, listen.
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 1: And I want to know what goes through your head
• 1:13:02
  Speaker 1: as the agent.
• 1:13:02
  Speaker 4: Okay. So they had this internal meeting, and they're making
• 1:13:06
  Speaker 4: us cull our lists. And here's the truth. This agency
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 4: is not doing the job for you they should be.
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 4: And I think you felt it, and I felt it.
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 4: And I am going to recommend you to this other
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 4: agency and screw them for making me do this because
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 4: I believe in you and I'm never going to stop
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 4: believing in you.
• 1:13:26
  Speaker 1: And that's what you would say even if you did
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 1: kind of want to dump me too?
• 1:13:31
  Speaker 4: If you were my client, I wouldn't want to dump
• 1:13:35
  Speaker 4: you even if you weren't getting jobs. I would be
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 4: blaming everyone else. I didn't turn on people. I was
• 1:13:43
  Speaker 4: very select who I represented. I didn't represent hundreds. And
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 4: I believed in them, even when the town didn't.
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 1: Now, did you ever have somebody, a client that you
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 1: worked very hard for, that either got poached or they
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 1: called you and said, I'm so sorry.
• 1:14:02
  Speaker 4: You're great. I had a guy who.
• 1:14:06
  Speaker 4: Who was a bit of a pain in the ass.
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 4: He was a filmmaker who was a bit of a
• 1:14:09
  Speaker 4: pain in the ass. I was like, fuck, I can't
• 1:14:12
  Speaker 4: believe I have to talk to him again. He's going
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 4: to ask me about why nobody's buying his script. And
• 1:14:18
  Speaker 4: oh God. And then he really was upset that nobody
• 1:14:22
  Speaker 4: was buying the script. And he called me and he said, look,
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 4: I think I'm going to have to find another agent.
• 1:14:27
  Speaker 4: And I was devastated. You know, yeah. And did I
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 4: have clients that got poached? I had, I had people
• 1:14:37
  Speaker 4: trying to poach my clients. So I had to be careful.
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 4: Like the, the Oscars wasn't, weren't fun for me because
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 4: I would think, because then the agents, if your client
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 4: went one, then all the other agents from the other
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 4: agencies would sort of circle. And, and you, you, you,
• 1:14:51
  Speaker 4: you was just you alone, you know, and they might
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 4: mention a script that you hadn't mentioned and, oh my God.
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 4: And why didn't you think of that? And it was
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 4: a lot of pressure. It was, it was hard back
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 4: in the, Yeah, I mean, it was the 90s.
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 1: I'm just wondering, like, now, if you, you know, have
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 1: a client or whatever, and you open up their Instagram,
• 1:15:12
  Speaker 1: you think everything's good, and then there just happens to
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 1: be a photo of them with, like, a competition agent, like, smiling.
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 1: You're like, oh, fuck, they talked, like.
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 4: If I was an agent, yeah. You know, it's funny.
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 4: Our next movie, Jenna and I are making a movie
• 1:15:25
  Speaker 4: with Robert Zemeckis in the fall. We're excited about. Really
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 4: fun thriller. I was talking to Mr. Zemeckis about movie stars,
• 1:15:34
  Speaker 4: he said, you know, Jennifer's one of the few remaining
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 4: movie stars. I mean, other than like Leonardo DiCaprio, Sandra Bullock,
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 4: Jennifer Lopez, Margot Robbie, Scarlett Johansson, Tom Cruise, but there
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 4: aren't a lot, as you said, they're like influencers. They're,
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 4: I don't know, they own makeup lines. It's as theatrical
• 1:15:58
  Speaker 4: business is waning, Yeah.
• 1:16:04
  Speaker 1: I mean, I can't blame them. Like I can't blame
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 1: anybody for doing it all. Like you got to, you know,
• 1:16:10
  Speaker 1: you got it, like you said, got to pivot, got
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 1: to make it happen, you know, but then.
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 4: Oh, I don't blame, believe me, I don't blame them.
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 4: I think it's great to do more than one thing
• 1:16:20
  Speaker 4: and I don't judge anybody, but the way of the
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 4: movie star in the nineties, I guess maybe the reason
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 4: this book is resonating.
• 1:16:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:16:27
  Speaker 4: It was a different time.
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a different time.
• 1:16:29
  Speaker 4: People went to movies every Friday and Saturday. Every single
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 4: week you went to movies. That's what you did on
• 1:16:35
  Speaker 4: the weekends. Yeah.
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 1: And it was like, yeah, if you didn't, you know,
• 1:16:41
  Speaker 1: maybe there'd be one movie that was nominated for the
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 1: Oscars that you hadn't seen. But most of them, I
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 1: would make sure I saw every single one. Now it's like,
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 1: I don't know. It's just, it's like, it's so weird
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 1: and there's too much.
• 1:16:54
  Speaker 4: Now they're streaming. Now you're watching them at home. Every
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 4: Friday and Saturday in the 90s, what movie are you
• 1:17:01
  Speaker 4: going to go see? Well, I'm going to go see
• 1:17:03
  Speaker 4: this Friday and this Saturday. Maybe Sunday you'd see an
• 1:17:06
  Speaker 4: afternoon movie. It was just the thing you did. Kids
• 1:17:09
  Speaker 4: did it. Parents did it. Children did it. So the
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 4: Disney movies, it was what you did. So the culture
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 4: has changed.
• 1:17:17
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 1:17:18
  Speaker 4: And with it, I don't fault anybody for doing more
• 1:17:22
  Speaker 4: than one thing. And I celebrate them. But the way
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 4: of the movie star has changed.
• 1:17:28
  Speaker 1: Right. Yeah, it doesn't really– it has a different– yeah,
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 1: there's– but, you know, like anything, you know, the way
• 1:17:35
  Speaker 1: you would do something, you know, changes. So it's like
• 1:17:38
  Speaker 1: how you– now you can do your own, you know,
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 1: you can do your own thing. You can do your
• 1:17:44
  Speaker 1: own thing on YouTube. You can finance, self-finance, you know.
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:17:49
  Speaker 1: All of that.
• 1:17:50
  Speaker 4: And you have to be okay with it. Somebody said
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 4: to me, well, God, what do you think? Kim Kardashian's
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 4: an actress now. I said, good for her.
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 1: Good for her.
• 1:17:58
  Speaker 4: I mean, you can play the referee, right? And you
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 4: could call foul. But the game's down here. So play
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 4: the game. Life is about the pivot. Play the game.
• 1:18:09
  Speaker 4: You know, back in the day, in the 90s, no
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 4: star would do endorsements. They wouldn't do commercials. Mm-hmm. At all.
• 1:18:17
  Speaker 4: Now you see Clooney and Pitt and everybody. They judged television.
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 4: They judged commercials. Now they aren't. Right.
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 1: Well, that's where I think sometimes it's like, yeah. I mean,
• 1:18:30
  Speaker 1: I remember on a smaller level when I was at
• 1:18:32
  Speaker 1: the Groundlings, I was also pursuing stand-up. And they were
• 1:18:36
  Speaker 1: really snobby to me. Wow. They were like, oh, you're
• 1:18:41
  Speaker 1: at the chuckle hot, like you're hokey or hacky or whatever.
• 1:18:45
  Speaker 1: And then they realized, and I was like, well, I
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 1: like standup because I only need me. You guys need
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 1: four other people to do your sketch or whatever. And then,
• 1:18:55
  Speaker 1: then they, that's when like, they started doing this hot
• 1:18:58
  Speaker 1: cup of talk and like Kathy Griffin and they started
• 1:19:01
  Speaker 1: to realize, oh, we'll just do like an alternative way
• 1:19:03
  Speaker 1: of doing standup, which is just basically storytelling and, But
• 1:19:06
  Speaker 1: then they all kind of started to become stand-ups too
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 1: because it's just another– it's an easier way to go. Like,
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 1: you know, not to depend on another player.
• 1:19:15
  Speaker 4: Is that what you love to do most?
• 1:19:18
  Speaker 1: I mean, I feel like it is the most– like
• 1:19:21
  Speaker 1: I said, I think it's very few people can do stand-up.
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 1: People can act in a sitcom. People can get comedic timing.
• 1:19:29
  Speaker 1: People can do podcasting. People can do sketch. But, like,
• 1:19:33
  Speaker 1: to actually stand on stage for, like, an hour and
• 1:19:35
  Speaker 1: 15 or an hour and a half and keep the audience, like,
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 1: rolling and laughing is such a unique talent. So I'll never, like,
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 1: stop doing it. But it's hard. Like, you got to
• 1:19:47
  Speaker 1: sell tickets. You got to pack a bag. You got
• 1:19:50
  Speaker 1: to book. You got to get on a flight. You
• 1:19:52
  Speaker 1: got to hope that flight's not late. Like, all of
• 1:19:54
  Speaker 1: that part is hard. Not the fun part.
• 1:19:57
  Speaker 4: Do you like acting?
• 1:19:58
  Speaker 1: But actually getting on stage is fun. Yeah, I mean,
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 1: I loved, I, you know, have done it and everything.
• 1:20:07
  Speaker 1: But then it was interesting how the, so then when,
• 1:20:11
  Speaker 1: I was on Chelsea Lately for many years writing and
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 1: producing that. We had this like secondary show called After Lately,
• 1:20:16
  Speaker 1: which was like.
• 1:20:17
  Speaker 4: Oh, yeah, I remember.
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 1: It was kind of like a Curb Your Enthusiasm, but
• 1:20:20
  Speaker 1: we were playing ourselves, but like exaggerated. And things would
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 1: happen throughout the year, like to me or my kids.
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 1: And then we had like a second team that would go, oh,
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 1: my God, that that's great for After Lately. Let's save
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 1: that story and like, you know, finesse it. And so
• 1:20:35
  Speaker 1: then after the show ended, I was like, OK, so
• 1:20:39
  Speaker 1: now I want to like get back to acting, go
• 1:20:42
  Speaker 1: out on auditions.
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 4: And.
• 1:20:44
  Speaker 1: Basically, the people that were representing me at the time,
• 1:20:47
  Speaker 1: which I don't I like honesty. So it didn't matter.
• 1:20:50
  Speaker 1: They basically said, look, at your age, like I was
• 1:20:54
  Speaker 1: like 43. Wait, let me think how old I would
• 1:20:56
  Speaker 1: have been when the show ended. Yeah, like 43 or 44, whatever.
• 1:21:00
  Speaker 1: And they're like, there's so many other women that have
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 1: been the sitcom mom that have the shows to back
• 1:21:08
  Speaker 1: it up that. It's going to be really hard for
• 1:21:12
  Speaker 1: someone to want to take a gamble on you, even
• 1:21:15
  Speaker 1: though I'm kind of a known name and funny over,
• 1:21:19
  Speaker 1: you know, the Jolie, you know, Jolie, is that her name?
• 1:21:22
  Speaker 1: Jolie Fisher, you know, Leah Remini, all those type of,
• 1:21:28
  Speaker 1: you know, Cheryl Hines, all those people that had consecutively
• 1:21:31
  Speaker 1: booked things. They were always the wife. They're always the
• 1:21:34
  Speaker 1: next door neighbor. Like, and so I was kind of like,
• 1:21:37
  Speaker 1: all right, I can see that. Like, if I'm going
• 1:21:39
  Speaker 1: to build a pool. this guy might have the coolest design,
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 1: but if he's only built two pools, I think I'm
• 1:21:44
  Speaker 1: going to go with a person that built 50 pools.
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 1: So I kind of got it. And I was like,
• 1:21:50
  Speaker 1: all right, well, then I just will have to continue
• 1:21:54
  Speaker 1: making my own thing. And I'm so grateful.
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 4: But it's so odd that you felt or they felt
• 1:21:59
  Speaker 4: you had to choose because you don't. I guess that's
• 1:22:03
  Speaker 4: my point.
• 1:22:03
  Speaker 1: I don't know. Well, they weren't going to send me
• 1:22:05
  Speaker 1: out on things.
• 1:22:06
  Speaker 4: So then I know.
• 1:22:08
  Speaker 1: How I was going to get them. And then I
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 1: was like, And then I was literally like, well, you're right.
• 1:22:12
  Speaker 1: If it's such a challenge and it took, you know,
• 1:22:14
  Speaker 1: it takes a whole day to audition. Like you have
• 1:22:16
  Speaker 1: to practice. You have to get your outfit. You have
• 1:22:17
  Speaker 1: to drive down there. Then during.
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 4: You're really into the whole prep of these things.
• 1:22:23
  Speaker 1: Well, because maybe I made too big of a deal
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 1: out of it. Maybe I should have, you know, but
• 1:22:27
  Speaker 1: to me it would take a whole day out.
• 1:22:29
  Speaker 4: No, it does.
• 1:22:30
  Speaker 1: And so then I was kind of like, well, I'm
• 1:22:32
  Speaker 1: not doing any making, you know, I'm not booking whatever.
• 1:22:35
  Speaker 1: I never turned down an audition in my life. Would
• 1:22:39
  Speaker 1: never turn down an audition or work. But then I
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 1: sort of like stopped bugging them because I just was like,
• 1:22:47
  Speaker 1: all right. And then I was like, well, why am
• 1:22:51
  Speaker 1: I not going out on like talk show things anymore?
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 1: Because I was like, I was up for actually. Jennifer
• 1:22:56
  Speaker 1: Lopez and her sister were going to do a talk show,
• 1:22:59
  Speaker 1: like a younger hip review. And I tested for that,
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 1: but I didn't get it. But that's fine. It didn't go.
• 1:23:06
  Speaker 1: But anyway, but I remember meeting her sister and really
• 1:23:10
  Speaker 1: loving that. I was like, oh my God, that was
• 1:23:12
  Speaker 1: before Chelsea Lilley. And so then I was like, why
• 1:23:16
  Speaker 1: isn't this happening for me anymore? And they basically were like, Well,
• 1:23:20
  Speaker 1: you're just not what they're looking for. They're either looking,
• 1:23:22
  Speaker 1: you know, for young and not famous or diverse and whatever.
• 1:23:27
  Speaker 1: And I'm neither. So then I was like, all right.
• 1:23:31
  Speaker 1: And then I literally only had this. I literally had
• 1:23:34
  Speaker 1: only this podcast to make a living at. at this
• 1:23:38
  Speaker 1: in standup. And even when I told my agents I
• 1:23:41
  Speaker 1: was going to do this, they were like, fine. They
• 1:23:43
  Speaker 1: didn't even try at that time to try to get.
• 1:23:46
  Speaker 4: A cut of it. Are they the same agents you
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 4: have now?
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 3: No.
• 1:23:49
  Speaker 1: But they didn't even try to get a cut of
• 1:23:51
  Speaker 1: it because there was no money in it. I made
• 1:23:53
  Speaker 1: $ 250 a month for doing four shows that had 100,000 listeners.
• 1:23:58
  Speaker 1: I was just like, oh, this is what you do
• 1:24:00
  Speaker 1: just to get people to know I'm going to the
• 1:24:02
  Speaker 1: chuckle hut or whatever. And so, yeah, so now that
• 1:24:05
  Speaker 1: it's here, like now that it's at everybody and every
• 1:24:09
  Speaker 1: star is trying to do it, I don't blame them.
• 1:24:12
  Speaker 1: But it's like, you know, we the veterans of podcasting
• 1:24:17
  Speaker 1: kind of do go. It feels a little like less,
• 1:24:21
  Speaker 1: you know, because it was the thing that like, you know,
• 1:24:23
  Speaker 1: was sort.
• 1:24:24
  Speaker 4: Of made you special. But yeah, but here's my thing.
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 4: After listening to your story, I would say. It's not
• 1:24:32
  Speaker 4: too late. You should start auditioning. And stop breaking it down.
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 4: I mean, look, I do that too when I, because
• 1:24:38
  Speaker 4: I have to figure out my time.
• 1:24:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:24:40
  Speaker 4: Like, you know, because here I wrote a book about
• 1:24:43
  Speaker 4: background people and suddenly I'm in the foreground. So I
• 1:24:46
  Speaker 4: have like a day job where I'm producing and I'm
• 1:24:48
  Speaker 4: running a company. And then I have this job where
• 1:24:50
  Speaker 4: I'm promoting, you know, my series. It's psycho. But so
• 1:24:55
  Speaker 4: I do do that. I go, okay, so if I'm
• 1:24:56
  Speaker 4: going to do this, it's going to take this amount
• 1:24:58
  Speaker 4: of time and I got to put some makeup on and,
• 1:25:00
  Speaker 4: you know. But I would say get out of your
• 1:25:03
  Speaker 4: head and audition. Tell your agents that you want to audition.
• 1:25:07
  Speaker 1: If anybody would like to send me an audition.
• 1:25:10
  Speaker 4: I will go. No, no, no. You've got to be
• 1:25:12
  Speaker 4: the fuel for your own career. You can't just wait
• 1:25:14
  Speaker 4: for them. Tell them.
• 1:25:16
  Speaker 1: I mean, honestly, that's why I did just kind of–
• 1:25:19
  Speaker 1: that's why I made this because I was tired of, like,
• 1:25:22
  Speaker 1: waiting and asking and begging. And honestly, like, it would
• 1:25:27
  Speaker 1: be fun– But I'm also extremely creatively satisfied being my
• 1:25:34
  Speaker 1: own boss doing this.
• 1:25:37
  Speaker 4: They're not mutually exclusive. Again, you need to do what
• 1:25:41
  Speaker 4: you want to do. I love talking to you about this.
• 1:25:43
  Speaker 4: And my point is that really for anybody listening that,
• 1:25:47
  Speaker 4: you know, figure out a way. There aren't, I'm looking
• 1:25:50
  Speaker 4: at this, whatever that is, that piece of art, that's careers.
• 1:25:54
  Speaker 4: There's no straight line. You, you, you, you, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm, I, I,
• 1:26:01
  Speaker 4: you know, I, I have an age range. I never
• 1:26:03
  Speaker 4: say my age, but you know, I'm, I'm, I'm north
• 1:26:07
  Speaker 4: of the Boulevard, north of 50. And I, uh, quite
• 1:26:11
  Speaker 4: north of 50. Um, and, and I wrote a book. right?
• 1:26:16
  Speaker 4: And because it was the right time. And I've been
• 1:26:19
  Speaker 4: a writer my whole life. So my point is that,
• 1:26:23
  Speaker 4: you know, okay, tell your agents, you know, put me
• 1:26:26
  Speaker 4: up for things, put me up for things, put me
• 1:26:28
  Speaker 4: up for things where they need somebody. You know, they
• 1:26:31
  Speaker 4: now have these web shows. The idea of YouTube is
• 1:26:35
  Speaker 4: so interesting, because it's sort of, to me, it just
• 1:26:37
  Speaker 4: promotes the narcissistic idea of us filming ourselves, but that's
• 1:26:42
  Speaker 4: the world we live in.
• 1:26:42
  Speaker 1: But this show is on YouTube. Okay.
• 1:26:45
  Speaker 4: And that's the world we live in.
• 1:26:46
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:26:46
  Speaker 1: I don't, I think, yeah, I think it's.
• 1:26:49
  Speaker 4: Oh, I don't mind YouTube. I'm saying that it's an interesting,
• 1:26:53
  Speaker 4: it's an interesting title for what the world has become.
• 1:26:57
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 1:26:58
  Speaker 4: Where we film ourselves, where we sit like this and
• 1:27:02
  Speaker 4: we validate ourselves this way. Of course it's the next
• 1:27:06
  Speaker 4: generation for it. There's no judgment in it. Because again,
• 1:27:09
  Speaker 4: I'm not playing the ref. I'm playing the game. I'm
• 1:27:11
  Speaker 4: on YouTube. But they also have these micro shows now
• 1:27:15
  Speaker 4: on YouTube. These little soap operas which are taking off.
• 1:27:18
  Speaker 1: I was just seeing a whole thing on that.
• 1:27:21
  Speaker 4: And you should explore that.
• 1:27:21
  Speaker 1: That the studios are putting money into those like 90
• 1:27:24
  Speaker 1: second little soaps.
• 1:27:25
  Speaker 4: I don't think they're 90 seconds.
• 1:27:27
  Speaker 1: Those are the teasers. The teasers are 90 seconds.
• 1:27:30
  Speaker 4: I think they're maybe four or five minutes. But my
• 1:27:33
  Speaker 4: point is that, you know, Wouldn't that be interesting at
• 1:27:36
  Speaker 4: this stage of your life to explore that and its
• 1:27:40
  Speaker 4: sort of formation and get involved with one of those?
• 1:27:44
  Speaker 4: Just like you did 10 years ago on your podcast.
• 1:27:47
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 1:27:47
  Speaker 4: Be on the frontier of it.
• 1:27:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:27:50
  Speaker 4: That's what I would say as an ex-architect of careers.
• 1:27:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's a great idea. Yeah, I love it. Yeah,
• 1:27:55
  Speaker 1: it's true.
• 1:27:56
  Speaker 4: Free advice.
• 1:27:56
  Speaker 1: It's funny because I just saw like a TikTok video
• 1:28:01
  Speaker 1: on that, on all these like the apps that like,
• 1:28:05
  Speaker 1: you know, are going crazy in these smaller like little soaps,
• 1:28:08
  Speaker 1: little movies.
• 1:28:09
  Speaker 4: People have the attention span of gnats because of our electronics.
• 1:28:15
  Speaker 4: So they may only want to watch like a five-minute
• 1:28:17
  Speaker 4: thing and then go, oh, I want to see what
• 1:28:19
  Speaker 4: happens next. And then they download– you know, the whole
• 1:28:22
  Speaker 4: 20 minutes, which is, you know, 20 episodes. And it's
• 1:28:26
  Speaker 4: a way of you having fun without the commitment of
• 1:28:30
  Speaker 4: something else. It's just an idea, I'm saying. But again,
• 1:28:33
  Speaker 4: there's no straight lines. Figure out your way. Be Vavum.
• 1:28:37
  Speaker 4: Be my little cartoon character back in the, whatever it was,
• 1:28:40
  Speaker 4: the 60s, when he busted every mountain in front of him.
• 1:28:44
  Speaker 4: And keep climbing in heels.
• 1:28:48
  Speaker 1: I love it. Well, I am really excited to read
• 1:28:51
  Speaker 1: the book. Thank you for bringing me my copy.
• 1:28:52
  Speaker 4: I'm going to sign it for you.
• 1:28:55
  Speaker 1: And then, of course, we'll look forward to watching it. Oh, yes.
• 1:28:59
  Speaker 4: It's going to be an interesting one to write and
• 1:29:01
  Speaker 4: to cast and to all of that.
• 1:29:03
  Speaker 1: And then you and J-Lo have a new movie, Office Romance.
• 1:29:06
  Speaker 4: We do.
• 1:29:06
  Speaker 1: We do. When is that coming out?
• 1:29:07
  Speaker 4: It's so fun. She did this with Brett Goldstein, who
• 1:29:10
  Speaker 4: wrote it. Talk about manifest. He wrote it for her.
• 1:29:14
  Speaker 4: He manifested this. And I read it and I went, oh,
• 1:29:19
  Speaker 4: my God, this is funny. It's funny and it's topical
• 1:29:23
  Speaker 4: and it's smart. I guess it's coming out next year.
• 1:29:26
  Speaker 4: We just wrapped it.
• 1:29:27
  Speaker 1: Oh, you just wrapped it.
• 1:29:27
  Speaker 4: Yeah, we just wrapped it, and we're starting another one
• 1:29:30
  Speaker 4: in the fall. Yikes.
• 1:29:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:29:35
  Speaker 4: She's amazing. She's like the Energizer bunny, like, you know,
• 1:29:39
  Speaker 4: the rest.
• 1:29:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I've always just loved her look and style and face. Like,
• 1:29:45
  Speaker 1: I just can't. Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:29:47
  Speaker 4: I mean, look at her.
• 1:29:48
  Speaker 1: Amazing.
• 1:29:49
  Speaker 4: Amazing. And J-Lo Glow. J.Lo Glow. But a girl's girl
• 1:29:53
  Speaker 4: to the nth degree. Yeah. And people, I mean, listen,
• 1:29:57
  Speaker 4: they tear you down one year, then they celebrate you.
• 1:30:00
  Speaker 4: They're like worshiping her this year. And again, Kiss of
• 1:30:03
  Speaker 4: the Spider Woman, I can't wait for people to see it.
• 1:30:06
  Speaker 4: But the thing I want people to know about her,
• 1:30:09
  Speaker 4: it's not that she's, I mean, yes, she's a great actress.
• 1:30:11
  Speaker 4: She's a great singer. She's a great dancer. She's an icon.
• 1:30:14
  Speaker 4: She's a girl's girl. She's a girl's girl. And she,
• 1:30:19
  Speaker 4: without cameras... helps more women than anyone knows. And, um,
• 1:30:24
  Speaker 4: if I could, if I could tell the world anything
• 1:30:27
  Speaker 4: about her, I'd say that's, that's my girl. She's a
• 1:30:30
  Speaker 4: good one.
• 1:30:30
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's so great. That's so great. That is something
• 1:30:33
  Speaker 1: that we don't really see. We see her as a mom.
• 1:30:35
  Speaker 1: We see her as, you know, like we see her
• 1:30:38
  Speaker 1: as a romantic partner because she, you.
• 1:30:40
  Speaker 4: Know, she gets, and she also gets, um, stereotyped.
• 1:30:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:30:44
  Speaker 4: Um, she's, she's, she has the audacity to want to
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 4: do more than one thing. And she lives out loud
• 1:30:51
  Speaker 4: and she gets stereotyped, I think, because she's a woman.
• 1:30:53
  Speaker 4: And I think it's because she's a woman of color.
• 1:30:56
  Speaker 4: And I'm going to marginalize what you do. I'm going
• 1:30:59
  Speaker 4: to reduce it because if you can do so many
• 1:31:02
  Speaker 4: things so well, what does that say about me? So
• 1:31:06
  Speaker 4: screw them.
• 1:31:07
  Speaker 1: Great. Well, I love it. And everybody follow Elaine Goldsmith
• 1:31:10
  Speaker 1: Thomas on Instagram as well. So you can keep up
• 1:31:13
  Speaker 1: on all the exciting things.
• 1:31:15
  Speaker 4: But It's really fun meeting you. It's so fun meeting you, Heather.
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 4: And I love this whole juicy scoop.
• 1:31:21
  Speaker 1: Thank you. It's been good for me.
• 1:31:23
  Speaker 4: I want to see you acting next. That's what I
• 1:31:25
  Speaker 4: think is your next step.
• 1:31:27
  Speaker 1: Just call me. You can DM me.
• 1:31:28
  Speaker 4: Thank you. Abracadabra.
• 1:31:30
  Speaker 1: Slide in there. Abracadabra.
• 1:31:32
  Speaker 5: Bye.
• 1:31:34
  Speaker 2: One reward.
• 1:31:35
  Speaker 4: Endless choice.
• 1:31:36
  Speaker 1: Skip the hassle, reward the easy way.