Latest / INSPIRE STORY / #0129 _STORY INSPIRE: Decisions that transforman, with Ryan Bingham

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#0129 _STORY INSPIRE: Decisions that transforman, with Ryan Bingham · INSPIRE STORY

• 0:04
  Speaker 1: The Joe Rogan Experience.
• 0:06
  Speaker 2: Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night. All day.
• 0:08
  What's happening, man?
• 0:09
  Speaker 3: Good to.
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: See you.
• 0:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you too, man.
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: Hold on to that microphone, sir. All right. You were
• 0:21
  fucking great at that McConaughey thing last year. I really
• 0:23
  enjoyed that. That was my first time seeing you perform live.
• 0:26
  Speaker 3: It was really cool.
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: Thank you, man. It was very cool. You're so relaxed
• 0:29
  up there, man. It was like you brought everybody into
• 0:32
  a nice... like comfortable chill vibe it was.
• 0:35
  Speaker 3: Cool i'm glad you guys felt felt that way sometimes
• 0:38
  it's uh it takes me a minute to get into
• 0:41
  the groove you know.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah but it felt like that you know it felt
• 0:44
  like you were in it like it brought us brought
• 0:46
  the whole crowd into it too that that event that
• 0:48
  he does the two events the one the singer songwriter
• 0:51
  one and then the other one with the auction and
• 0:53
  everything they're so cool such.
• 0:55
  Speaker 3: Good events yeah they're good people too you know that's
• 0:58
  uh i uh I've really grown to just appreciate the
• 1:01
  community around here in Austin and the Hill Country area
• 1:04
  and all of that stuff. I definitely wouldn't have the career,
• 1:08
  I don't think, if it wouldn't have been for the
• 1:10
  community around here, just supporting songwriters and music in the
• 1:13
  way that they do. It's pretty incredible. When they get
• 1:16
  behind anything, it just feels so good to see that
• 1:19
  many people come together and have that support.
• 1:22
  Speaker 2: It's a really good place, man. Austin is a really
• 1:25
  good community. It really is. It's a very positive place.
• 1:28
  In a lot of ways.
• 1:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: I mean, nothing's perfect. There's no perfect places, but it's
• 1:33
  really good. Yeah. I like it so much better than
• 1:35
  when I was living in California.
• 1:37
  Speaker 3: It just feels.
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: Like real people.
• 1:40
  Speaker 3: I miss it, man. I mean, I'm in the process
• 1:43
  of moving back to Texas as well.
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: Where are you at right now?
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: Outside of Dallas, Texas, out by Tyler.
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 1:49
  Speaker 3: I've been in Topanga Canyon in L.A. for years.
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: Oh, Jesus.
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: You know, so I've been in the middle of it.
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Doing that Hollywood thing.
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: Every time I get across the state line, it's just
• 1:59
  like that weight comes off. And you're just like, oh, man,
• 2:02
  I'm home, you know.
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: So, yeah. Dude, you had the coolest fucking character on Yellowstone.
• 2:08
  It must be so fun to play.
• 2:10
  Speaker 3: It was so much fun, man. I laughed. I always
• 2:14
  talk about it. I felt like I had, like, one
• 2:15
  of the easiest jobs there, you know. It's because my.
• 2:18
  The character was kind of a smaller role. You know,
• 2:20
  most of the time I'd work like one or two
• 2:22
  days a week. And then the rest of the time
• 2:24
  I'd just be like fly fishing and get lost in
• 2:26
  the mountains and just disappear out there.
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it was awesome. God, Montana's awesome. That show made
• 2:32
  so many people move out there, though.
• 2:34
  Speaker 3: I know. You're going to take your license plate off
• 2:36
  your car before you go.
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: Right. You better not have a California plate. Better not.
• 2:40
  They will fucking write things on your hood.
• 2:43
  Speaker 3: Run you off the road.
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they get upset. It's very interesting. They're very proud
• 2:46
  to be from Montana, and they want to keep it
• 2:49
  to themselves. Like, let it go, motherfucker. We're all Americans,
• 2:52
  all right? If you got a good spot, you should
• 2:54
  be happy that people from California figure it out. Don't
• 2:57
  be a dick. Like, you're American, bitch. It's not the
• 3:01
  United States of Montana. Shut the fuck up.
• 3:04
  Speaker 3: I guess it's kind of anywhere, right?
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: Not that much here. Here's pretty inviting. I've never had
• 3:10
  that experience here. Not really.
• 3:13
  Speaker 3: Texas is a pretty friendly place.
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 3:16
  Speaker 3: And there's so many different walks of life that have
• 3:18
  been here for so long. I think up there in
• 3:21
  Montana and stuff, man, if you were tough enough to
• 3:23
  survive those winters and stake a claim up there back
• 3:26
  in the day, you had to fight for it, and
• 3:27
  they're still fighting for it now.
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: That does make sense. I mean, and that's also one
• 3:31
  of the things that's highlighted by the whole series, all
• 3:34
  the different Yellowstone series, the older ones with Harrison Ford.
• 3:39
  They really do explain in a lot. I mean, it's
• 3:41
  kind of a a cool chunk of history to see
• 3:44
  like how this all got started, how the kind of
• 3:47
  people that had to survive out there when, you know,
• 3:50
  all you had is a fireplace.
• 3:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: That's it. You got a fireplace.
• 3:55
  Speaker 3: I love all those mountain men stories, you know, Jim
• 3:57
  Bridger and all that stuff. It's just like, man. And
• 4:00
  there is something, you get up there in those mountains,
• 4:02
  it gets into your bones, it gets into your blood.
• 4:06
  And it's a, it's a different thing, man. It's a
• 4:09
  spiritual place.
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: It is. And it's also, it's like, the most potent
• 4:14
  art like it's it's nature's art and you don't think
• 4:18
  of it as art but god it's so beautiful it's
• 4:22
  like stunt like sometimes when you're up there you just
• 4:24
  have to stop and look like god this is gorgeous
• 4:28
  and it's overwhelming if you have it gives you a
• 4:31
  feeling there's like it's a almost like a drug that
• 4:34
  hits you because of the beauty of it all like
• 4:36
  you take it in with the blue sky you see
• 4:38
  the clouds and the mountain and maybe there's a lake
• 4:40
  below you in the canyon you're like God, this is gorgeous.
• 4:45
  It's like you feel it in your DNA, man. It's
• 4:49
  like your body knows like this is a fertile, beautiful
• 4:53
  place that's filled with life. And this should excite you.
• 4:56
  So all your natural human reward instincts are all like
• 5:00
  this is the place I should be. Like look at
• 5:03
  the sky. Look at the lake. Look at the mountains.
• 5:06
  This is fertile. This is like life-giving.
• 5:08
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, several years ago. um I went to a
• 5:12
  guide school up there like a hunting guide school and
• 5:16
  uh it was a whole pack squad part of it
• 5:19
  I grew up cowboying and ranching but I've never really
• 5:21
  been up there in those mountains like that and I'm
• 5:23
  my dad would always fantasize about that we'd talk you
• 5:26
  know one day we're gonna go on like a pack
• 5:27
  trip up in Montana and you know we'd watch all
• 5:30
  those movies like Lonesome Dove and all of that stuff
• 5:32
  so it was always just kind of a daydream and
• 5:35
  um Years ago, I was just kind of overwhelmed with
• 5:38
  music stuff and all that and didn't know what I
• 5:40
  was going to do. And I ended up– I just
• 5:41
  wanted to go up there for a trip, you know,
• 5:43
  maybe go on a pack trip. And I started looking
• 5:45
  up places, and I found this place called Royal Tyne Outfitters.
• 5:50
  And they're like, yeah, you know, we'd come up and
• 5:51
  you can take you on a pack trip. But we
• 5:54
  also have, like, this six-week school, you know, that you
• 5:57
  can train to be a guide. It's all mule pack
• 6:01
  and all kinds of stuff, you know. And so I
• 6:03
  was like, man, I'm going to sign up for that,
• 6:04
  you know. And it was– Life-changing. There was only six
• 6:07
  of us in the class, and, you know, spent weeks
• 6:11
  back in the backcountry packing mules and horses.
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: Oh, wow.
• 6:15
  Speaker 3: We'd just tie a rope between two trees with a
• 6:17
  tarp for sleeping at night and always post up a
• 6:19
  couple of guys to watch over the horses at night.
• 6:22
  And I remember one morning I woke up, and it
• 6:24
  was in June, you know, but we were way back
• 6:26
  in there. And I woke up, and the snow was
• 6:28
  coming down. And I just kind of raised my head up,
• 6:31
  and I was looking out at the horses, and the
• 6:33
  snow was just falling down on their backs. And there
• 6:36
  was that moment in me, I was like, I don't
• 6:38
  know if I'm ever going back. I was like, this
• 6:42
  is right where I need to be. It was tough
• 6:47
  to come back to civilization after that.
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: I think we're doing something with ourselves, to ourselves, with
• 6:54
  civilization that we can't really fully appreciate because we're wrapped
• 6:59
  in it. And it's not until you get to nature
• 7:01
  where all that weight just gets lifted off of you
• 7:04
  and you feel more normal. And you're like, oh, this
• 7:07
  is where people are supposed to be.
• 7:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, no phones. There's no nothing, no distractions.
• 7:12
  And it's just like all your senses heightened, your eyesight,
• 7:16
  your hearing, your sense of smell, like all of that stuff. And,
• 7:20
  you know, I remember going into it. You know, I
• 7:22
  didn't know what to expect, really. I've done some camping
• 7:25
  and things like that and grew up ranching and all that.
• 7:28
  But this was a way different deal. And I remember
• 7:30
  I just had this, like, backpack full of gear, you know.
• 7:33
  And by the time I got out of there, I
• 7:36
  just felt like all I needed was a pair of
• 7:37
  scissors and some way to start some fire, and that
• 7:41
  was about it.
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I follow this one dude. God, I'm trying to
• 7:48
  remember his name. Clay... Let me pull it up, because
• 7:52
  I really enjoy his videos. But this dude, he lives...
• 7:57
  I believe he lives in Alaska, but he does a
• 8:00
  lot of trips in America, like all over America, in
• 8:03
  the lower 48, and he.
• 8:05
  Goes and like lives by himself in some kind of
• 8:10
  harsh environment. Like he's done it in the swamps. Clay A's.
• 8:15
  That's it.
• 8:16
  Speaker 3: Does he like take his kid out there?
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: I believe he has. He's taken his dog. But a
• 8:22
  lot of times he just goes entirely by himself. And
• 8:27
  they're very, very interesting. Like he starts his own fire.
• 8:30
  He'll figure out how to get food. He figures out
• 8:33
  how to purify water. He's taken salt water and made
• 8:36
  his own thing that kind of distills it into fresh
• 8:39
  water and removes the salt like very slowly by using
• 8:43
  a piece of bamboo and fire and boiling the water
• 8:47
  in the bamboo so that like the water evaporates and
• 8:50
  then drips down and it doesn't have salt in it apparently.
• 8:52
  Speaker 3: I love that stuff. I love it. Just to have
• 8:55
  those skills, just to know how to do it like.
• 8:57
  whether you'll ever need it or not just to know
• 8:59
  how to do that. It's just so cool. I remember, um,
• 9:03
  in that, that guide school, there's a lot of different
• 9:05
  parts to it, which was so cool. It was like,
• 9:07
  we did a whole week of like back country, um,
• 9:10
  like wilderness first aid, you know, he had got, had
• 9:13
  a paramedic come in and teach us all this stuff.
• 9:15
  And then it was a whole week of just like
• 9:17
  leather work. There was a whole week of shoe and horses.
• 9:20
  There was a fly fishing and entomology and all these,
• 9:23
  this kind of little skills. But one thing that really
• 9:26
  stuck with me was, uh, uh a fire building uh
• 9:29
  kind of drill when we started when it was kind
• 9:31
  of right when we first got there and it was
• 9:32
  pretty wet and it'd been snowing and um there's only
• 9:35
  six of us you know and we're guys from kind
• 9:37
  of all over the country and i grew up in
• 9:39
  new mexico and west texas where it's pretty dry you
• 9:42
  know and you kind of build a fire you can
• 9:44
  kind of just take some little small twigs and get
• 9:46
  a little fire going you know and so it goes
• 9:49
  all right you got two minutes to build a fire
• 9:50
  and you need to have you know like a flame
• 9:53
  to be three or four feet high And, man, I'm
• 9:55
  running around grabbing, like, little sticks and twigs. And I'm just,
• 9:58
  and we have a lighter too, you know, I'm just struggling.
• 10:00
  It's just smoking and we can't get it going. I
• 10:02
  look over and there's a kid from Alaska in the
• 10:05
  class and he just runs over to this big dead
• 10:08
  pine tree and just breaks off the biggest branch of dead,
• 10:13
  you know, pine needles and takes his lighter and.
• 10:15
  Speaker 4: Just within like five seconds, As this massive fire going,
• 10:20
  I was like, okay, that's how you do that, you know,
• 10:23
  and it was so just the littlest things, you know,
• 10:25
  to have that knowledge, you know, and part of it was,
• 10:28
  you know, he was explaining to us the instructors like, yeah,
• 10:30
  you know, if you're out here with your guidance, somebody
• 10:33
  that's hunting, maybe he's an elderly guy or somebody gets
• 10:35
  hurt and.
• 10:36
  Speaker 3: You get caught back in the mountains and it's snowing.
• 10:38
  It was like, you better get a fire going and
• 10:39
  keep them warm real quick. You know, so it was
• 10:42
  always a, you know, a reason and a purpose behind it,
• 10:44
  which was really cool. And, um, I'll never, those are some,
• 10:47
  some of the things I'll, I'll never forget.
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: Did they teach you how to start fires with like
• 10:52
  a piece of metal and like flint? Like, you know,
• 10:54
  what is that? A striking rod?
• 10:56
  Speaker 3: Yeah, we did some flint stuff and with, um, like
• 10:59
  the pitch wood from some of the old pine trees,
• 11:01
  you know, you can find that pitch wood. And, uh,
• 11:04
  we did some, Bow and wood drills, not a whole lot.
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: That fucking shit is hard. That's hard. So hard. I
• 11:10
  did that in the Boy Scouts, and it took like
• 11:13
  hours to start a fire. You have to fucking keep sawing.
• 11:18
  And if you're doing it with your hand, you're going
• 11:19
  to blow your hands out. You better get a bow.
• 11:22
  Speaker 3: Get your technique down. You've got to.
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: Have the stick on the top and the stick that
• 11:27
  goes all the way to the base thing, and you
• 11:28
  cut a little hole in the base thing. So that, like,
• 11:31
  all the little embers can fall into your kindling, and
• 11:34
  you got to saw the shit out of that fucker.
• 11:36
  Speaker 3: And imagine trying to do that, you know, in the snow,
• 11:38
  or it's wet.
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 11:40
  Speaker 3: You know, it's like, man, that's just incredible.
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: Very, very unlikely. You know what's really good for kindling? Fritos. Really?
• 11:48
  Those chips?
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: All the oil that's in it?
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: It's kind of shocking.
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: We were in Alaska, and it was raining all the time,
• 11:54
  and there was one day where it stopped. I was
• 11:56
  with my friend Steve Rinella took me up there. Okay, yeah.
• 11:59
  My friend Brian Cowan.
• 12:00
  Speaker 3: Mm-hmm.
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: Ryan Callahan, all these guys. So we went up there
• 12:04
  and when we got one day, like a 10 hour
• 12:07
  stretch where it was not raining, we're like, we got
• 12:10
  to start a fucking fire. Cause it was, it was
• 12:12
  raining every day for like five days in a row
• 12:15
  and we couldn't find any deer. It was a nightmare.
• 12:18
  It was tough hunting. Yeah. So we, this one day
• 12:21
  and we were trying to figure out things to light
• 12:23
  on fire cause everything's soaking wet. And so we got
• 12:26
  some pieces of wood from like underneath the bottom of
• 12:29
  trees and shit and dead trees that were covered by
• 12:33
  other things that were kind of, sort of, a little
• 12:35
  bit dry. And we used Fritos. And Fritos, when you
• 12:39
  light them, man, it's crazy how much oil is in
• 12:42
  those things. They just... And they stay lit for a
• 12:45
  long time like a candle.
• 12:46
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: And so we started like piling little things. We got
• 12:50
  that fire. I was like the happiest I've ever been
• 12:51
  in my life. I bet.
• 12:53
  Speaker 3: Soaking wet. Once you get that kind of cold too,
• 12:56
  it's just like there's almost nothing to get you warm.
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: It wasn't that bad cold-wise. It was like in the
• 13:03
  50s or 60s. Yeah. It was just the wetness. The
• 13:05
  wetness was impossible to get away from. I thought once
• 13:08
  you get in your tent, you'd be dry. You get
• 13:11
  in your sleeping bag, you'd be dry. But no. I
• 13:13
  had to take a piss in the middle of the night,
• 13:14
  and I had to turn on my headlamp in the tent.
• 13:16
  And when I did, it was all just mist everywhere.
• 13:20
  It was moisture. And I was like, oh, my God,
• 13:22
  I'm never going to be dry. I had to just accept, like,
• 13:25
  there's no drying here.
• 13:27
  Speaker 3: How long were you guys back in there?
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: About six days. We had to leave. We were supposed
• 13:31
  to be there for seven, but we had to leave
• 13:33
  on the sixth day because a storm was coming in.
• 13:34
  I was like, I could get stuck. Because you can
• 13:36
  get stuck up there. We were on, I guess, Prince Edwards.
• 13:39
  Is that what the island is? Yeah, you get stuck
• 13:43
  up there. And I was like, I got to get
• 13:44
  back home. I got to work.
• 13:45
  Speaker 3: Did y'all get to fly in like on a– On
• 13:47
  a puddle jumper.
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: A little bush plane. Yeah, we landed in the pond.
• 13:49
  And you could drink right out of the pond.
• 13:50
  Speaker 3: So they had certain windows to get you in and
• 13:51
  out of there, huh?
• 13:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. And you could drink right out of the pond.
• 13:55
  Like the pond was all rainwater and there was no–
• 13:57
  it was too high for beavers. So you didn't have
• 13:59
  to worry about giardia or anything in the water. You
• 14:01
  could just drink right out of the pond. Like this
• 14:03
  is crazy. Yeah, it's the best.
• 14:04
  Speaker 3: I've never been– I've been to Alaska only like in
• 14:07
  the winter on a like skiing thing. But I've always
• 14:09
  wanted to go up there to hunt and fish and.
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: The people are extraordinary. Those are rugged people. Like when
• 14:16
  I did a gig with my friend Ari in Anchorage
• 14:19
  and one of the things– and it was weird because
• 14:21
  you get there. It's 11 p.m. It's bright out. Like
• 14:23
  this is weird. One of the things that we talked
• 14:25
  about after was like those people were fucking cool. Like
• 14:28
  there's something about living up there like– Where you could
• 14:32
  die going outside like a good six months out of
• 14:35
  the year. There's fucking bears everywhere. If you look sideways
• 14:41
  at a moose, it will stomp you to death in
• 14:42
  a fucking Walmart parking lot.
• 14:44
  Speaker 3: You better have your shit together. You better have your
• 14:47
  shit together.
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: There's bald eagles everywhere. The salmon are as big as
• 14:52
  your thigh. I mean the people there are– they work
• 14:56
  together well. there's like they're very friendly but they're very
• 15:01
  rugged but they're also like they realize you need each
• 15:04
  other like there's a sense of like community and coolness
• 15:08
  yeah you need each other if your fucking car breaks
• 15:11
  down on the side of the road you could die
• 15:13
  like someone's not gonna let you die they're gonna pull
• 15:15
  over in California they're like someone will get them they
• 15:18
  just keep driving so you just lose this sense of community.
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: Yeah you're not calling you're not that's who you're calling
• 15:23
  for help in times of need is your neighbor exactly
• 15:26
  I mean even if like the bridge washes out. It's like,
• 15:29
  here comes your neighbor with the backhoe and the tractor
• 15:31
  and like, you just do it yourselves.
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: And that makes a cool friendship when your friend helps
• 15:36
  you out or when you help your friend out.
• 15:38
  Speaker 3: That's what I miss about living in Texas too. You know,
• 15:40
  it's just like, just some of the small things or
• 15:43
  whatever that you, like, even up at my place in Topanga,
• 15:47
  you know, you want to build some fence or whatever. Like,
• 15:49
  I do, I feel lucky. I've got a couple of
• 15:51
  really good friends up there and neighbors that, you know,
• 15:53
  love to come, you know, work with their hands and, or,
• 15:56
  get their hands dirty and we'll build stuff. And like, man,
• 15:59
  in Texas, you want to like weld something or you
• 16:01
  need something with a tractor, some heavy equipment thing, you know,
• 16:04
  like you're not getting that done in California. Right. It's
• 16:06
  going to cost you a fortune to, you know, get
• 16:09
  someone with a skid steer up to your house to
• 16:12
  help you move some dirt around, you know, but here
• 16:13
  in Texas, it's like, oh man, just call Frank down
• 16:16
  the road.
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: There's people that have a long tradition of doing stuff,
• 16:23
  you know, it's like, It's a real place.
• 16:26
  Speaker 3: I grew up like that, too. You know, people cutting
• 16:30
  hay and stuff like that, especially when you're young. Like, man,
• 16:32
  we would go stack hay for everybody around. You know,
• 16:36
  it's like that was the summer job. You know, it's like,
• 16:38
  let's just go.
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: That makes a strong person. People that throw hay around.
• 16:44
  those are strong mother like that term like farmer strength
• 16:48
  that shit's real.
• 16:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah you better say I was always a little guy
• 16:50
  too so I had to use and learn how to
• 16:52
  use leverage real quick yeah roll those bells up on
• 16:55
  your knee I think one of the last times I
• 16:57
  did that I remember is uh I was going to
• 16:59
  school in Stephenville Texas and had a good friend over
• 17:02
  in Glen Rose and it was the middle of July
• 17:04
  and And he's an older man and asked us to
• 17:07
  come help him stack hay in his barn. And it was,
• 17:09
  you know, we're stacking it in the barn, you know.
• 17:11
  And it's just like you're inside the barn. It's just hot.
• 17:13
  It could have been 110 degrees in there, you know.
• 17:16
  And we're talking hundreds of bales of hay. And it
• 17:18
  was just all we could do. And, of course, we're hungover.
• 17:20
  You know, in college, we're stacking hay. And I was like,
• 17:24
  I think this is my last hay hauling job right now.
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, those jobs. Those are good for letting you know
• 17:30
  that this is not the life you want.
• 17:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 17:31
  Speaker 2: Like get a good rugged manual labor job. It'll knock
• 17:35
  some fucking sense at you.
• 17:36
  Speaker 3: That's why I got the guitar, man. I learned pretty
• 17:38
  quick that the guitar felt a lot better in my
• 17:40
  hands than that shovel did. Yeah.
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: I know that feeling. I spent one summer doing insulation
• 17:47
  in an attic. It was all that fiberglass insulation. I
• 17:51
  had it in all my skin. In your nose, in
• 17:54
  your eyes. Yeah, you're sweating because it's hot and it's
• 17:56
  the summer, so it's getting into your pores and you're
• 17:59
  always itchy. You feel like it's on you all the time. Also,
• 18:03
  it's got to be terrible to be breathing that shit in. Oh,
• 18:06
  the worst, yeah. And I don't even think we were
• 18:08
  using equipment. I don't think we used any safety equipment.
• 18:11
  Speaker 3: Heck no, you didn't have a mask on or anything.
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: I don't believe so. I think we just installed it,
• 18:16
  just unrolled that shit and stuffed it into the Into
• 18:20
  the rafters.
• 18:21
  Speaker 3: Using paint with lead in it.
• 18:25
  Speaker 2: And back then, the gasoline had lead, too.
• 18:28
  Speaker 3: So drinking out of the water hose.
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: Right. Oh, yeah. I think it makes a resilient person
• 18:33
  to drink out of water hoses. Heck, yeah.
• 18:35
  Speaker 3: You get tough or die.
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: You get extra minerals from the fucking copper on the faucet. Yeah,
• 18:44
  it's– those jobs are really important like for a young
• 18:48
  person to figure out what they don't want to do.
• 18:51
  It teaches you work ethic. It teaches you like, hey,
• 18:53
  like this is– you can get some satisfaction out of
• 18:56
  a hard day's work and a hard week. Like you
• 18:59
  did it. You put it in. You feel good about yourself.
• 19:01
  You know it was difficult to do, but don't keep
• 19:05
  doing that.
• 19:05
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: Figure out a way out of this. Yeah. You got
• 19:09
  to understand that you understand it. You got to feel
• 19:12
  for it. You know what hard labor is, but don't
• 19:16
  ruin your life. Yeah.
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: I feel real grateful. My granddad was always a real
• 19:20
  hard worker. And even when I was 12 and 13,
• 19:23
  you know, in the summers or I spent a lot
• 19:25
  of time living with them and he always had a
• 19:28
  job lined up for me. You know, it's like, Hey,
• 19:30
  you're going to go over here and we're going to
• 19:31
  mow so-and-so's lawn this morning. And we're going to go
• 19:34
  over here. We're going to, send you out to Ken's
• 19:36
  and you're going to build some fence this weekend. And
• 19:39
  I always enjoyed it, though. I enjoyed those guys. I
• 19:42
  was around and, you know, I'd work all day and
• 19:45
  then we'd sit around and they'd drink beer in the
• 19:47
  afternoon and tell me stories. And, you know, and even now,
• 19:51
  like on my own place, you know, it's like, I
• 19:53
  don't want to be building somebody else's fence, but I'm
• 19:56
  glad I know how to build my own or things
• 19:58
  like that and have those skills. I still love working
• 20:00
  around the house and doing little projects and things like that.
• 20:04
  I meet a lot of younger guys and kids that
• 20:07
  sometimes I, I, uh, I guess I have an expectation
• 20:11
  that they know how to do that kind of stuff,
• 20:12
  you know? Right. They want to come over to the
• 20:14
  house and help us in projects and stuff. And I'm like, oh, yeah, cool.
• 20:18
  We'll just, you know, I already dug those holes and
• 20:21
  set up a string line and we'll set these posts.
• 20:23
  And they're like, okay. And then after about a half hour,
• 20:26
  I look over and they're just kind of looking at
• 20:27
  the ground. I'm like, what are we doing here? You know,
• 20:31
  they're like, I don't have a clue what you want
• 20:33
  me to do.
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: That's hilarious.
• 20:35
  Speaker 3: That's hilarious. But... Yeah, it's wild. It's changed, man. Kids
• 20:43
  ain't out there mowing lawns no more, that's for sure.
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: No.
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: Well, there's something about that kind of work, like putting
• 20:49
  in fences and all the stuff that you see the
• 20:52
  Cowboys doing on Yellowstone and then hanging out together afterwards
• 20:57
  that's so viscerally appealing to people. There's something about watching
• 21:02
  that life. You would say it's like a simple, difficult life. Maybe.
• 21:08
  I don't know what it is, but whatever it is,
• 21:10
  it's so appealing. So many people wanted to be cowboys
• 21:14
  after they watched your show.
• 21:16
  Speaker 3: I think something goes to you. You were talking about
• 21:18
  that guy living off the land and stuff like that.
• 21:21
  It's just something that's been ingrained in us over thousands
• 21:26
  of years of survival. We all have that in us
• 21:29
  still today. We just unfortunately lose in touch with it
• 21:33
  because we're not doing it as much. When you get
• 21:35
  the opportunity to even just go plant a garden or
• 21:38
  something like that. I think that's it. It's in us,
• 21:41
  you know, and it's a, it wakes up something within
• 21:43
  that's just been a little bit dormant for a while,
• 21:46
  you know?
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: And I think you're right. You know, I think that's
• 21:48
  exactly what it is. I think it is like, it's
• 21:51
  in our memory, like the memory of our genes, that
• 21:54
  this is like a pleasing life. This is a satisfying life.
• 21:58
  Speaker 3: It's like that mama bear energy, you know, kids come,
• 22:00
  it's just like, I was like, Oh man, you know?
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 22:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah it's it's there you know and it's just like
• 22:09
  i realized that having kids it's just like oh man
• 22:11
  it wakes something up within you that's always been there
• 22:14
  right that you were born to have you know that
• 22:17
  survival instinct and all of those things and i still
• 22:22
  that's what i still love about it like i even
• 22:24
  at home being on the road and being in big
• 22:26
  cities all the time and you're just surrounded with information
• 22:29
  and screens man as soon as i can get home
• 22:31
  or get outside or get into nature it just it
• 22:34
  wakes that stuff back up in me and it i
• 22:36
  feel like it puts that spark back in my eye
• 22:39
  you know yeah i uh try to stay in tune
• 22:42
  with that as.
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: Much as i can well it's clearly so appealing to
• 22:45
  people that don't experience it i mean how many people
• 22:48
  that are watching shows like yellowstone never go into those
• 22:52
  areas but they watch it like oh yeah I want
• 22:55
  to live like that.
• 22:56
  Speaker 3: We see the, like, prices of horses just skyrocketing. Oh,
• 23:00
  I'm sure. Like, buying all the vans for, like, five grand. Oh,
• 23:04
  I'm sure. Like, 50,000 bucks for a trail horse, you know,
• 23:07
  which is cool. You know, I hope people are enjoying
• 23:10
  that and getting something out of it. You know, I still,
• 23:14
  I mean, I'm not running a bunch of cows these days,
• 23:16
  but I keep a few horses around, and especially for
• 23:18
  the kids, you know, and whether they want anything to
• 23:20
  do with them or not, like, We enjoy so much
• 23:23
  in the afternoons to go out and feed them some
• 23:24
  carrots or brushing their tails and just being around that energy.
• 23:28
  My youngest little boy, he's just got some kind of
• 23:31
  mojo with the animals. I've got this old mule, and
• 23:35
  her name's Honey, and she's got these big ears, and
• 23:37
  she's massive. I remember when he was like three or four,
• 23:41
  I'd be looking around for him in the backyard, and
• 23:44
  I'd look out in the pasture, and he'd be out
• 23:45
  there with that mule, and she'd have her head down,
• 23:47
  and he's just out there petting her ears.
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: Aww.
• 23:50
  Speaker 3: You know? Aww. and just like his connection with those animals.
• 23:53
  And then, you know, getting kids up to the house or,
• 23:57
  or from the city that aren't around those animals, their
• 23:59
  first time around horses or maybe even dogs and stuff
• 24:02
  like that. And you can see they're, they're so anxious or,
• 24:05
  you know, not maybe so scared, but it's just nervous,
• 24:08
  you know, this is big animals and stuff. And within
• 24:10
  like 20 minutes of just sitting them on their back
• 24:12
  or petting them. And then you see them relax and
• 24:15
  you see that energy kind of slow down. And, uh,
• 24:19
  I love that. I think it's so magical to watch.
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's another relationship that's like primal, the relationship between
• 24:25
  people and horses. They do that with addicts. They do
• 24:29
  equine therapy where they just have people that have heavy
• 24:33
  anxiety and depression. They have them hang out with horses.
• 24:37
  Speaker 3: I think even me. It really works. I still do.
• 24:38
  I mean, I get depressed and stuff like that every
• 24:41
  now and then, and I love being around them. I
• 24:43
  can walk out to the barn and just being around them.
• 24:46
  Laying on their backs. And it's just like, ah, yeah,
• 24:49
  all right, here we go.
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: Just touching their head makes you feel better. Like, hey,
• 24:53
  how are you, honey? What's happening?
• 24:55
  Speaker 3: When they look at me, I get eye contact with them.
• 25:00
  I think it's an ancient thing.
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: I mean, they helped us survive. And we took care
• 25:06
  of them. It's like this ancient relationship. And then when
• 25:09
  you're around them, that connection immediately rebonds, reestablishes. I think
• 25:15
  it's in our DNA. I mean, just think about, like,
• 25:17
  how many generations of humans had to survive on horseback
• 25:21
  before anybody invented anything else. It's like if you wanted
• 25:24
  to travel faster than you could run, it had to
• 25:26
  be a fucking horse. Yeah. So that was probably thousands
• 25:29
  and thousands and thousands of years just cooked into our DNA.
• 25:32
  And when you're around them, it's like, oh, my friend.
• 25:35
  This is my friend.
• 25:36
  Speaker 3: It's waking it back up. Yeah, it's weird. It's there, yeah.
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: It's weird that that stuff is in you. Mm-hmm. That
• 25:42
  nature stuff is in you. I mean, that's why we
• 25:44
  like watching shows like this Clay Guy.
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: I love that, too. I love that Steve Rinella show,
• 25:50
  that Meat Eater. I like watching that with my kids.
• 25:53
  Aren't you friends with Remy Warren?
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah, real good friends.
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: He ended up being my neighbor when I was in
• 25:57
  Montana working on Yellowstone. Oh, really?
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Oh, that's crazy.
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: You know, what I really liked up there was where
• 26:04
  they filmed the show. You know, it was kind of
• 26:07
  way out there, southwestern Montana. And a lot of folks
• 26:10
  that were working on the show would go back to
• 26:11
  Missoula or in the cities. But I was like, man,
• 26:13
  I want to go get as far away out there
• 26:15
  as I can. And so I kind of went down
• 26:17
  this West Fork area that's on the right on the
• 26:21
  edge of the most massive wilderness areas out there. It
• 26:23
  goes into Idaho. And the road I was on, you know,
• 26:27
  is paved dirt, then it dead ended and it turned
• 26:30
  into a dirt road. And then I got this cabin
• 26:32
  that was just way back up and there was no wifi,
• 26:34
  no nothing, you know, and I just, um, just disappeared
• 26:38
  out there and, um, and ended up meeting some folks
• 26:42
  and Remy was just right down the road, uh, going
• 26:45
  towards Sula. And so I got the chance to just
• 26:47
  go over there and hang out with him and go
• 26:48
  stomp around the mountains with him. It's such a cool dude.
• 26:51
  It's like.
• 26:51
  Speaker 2: Remy's the best. Just.
• 26:53
  Speaker 3: You know, like you're talking about going to Alaska. You know,
• 26:55
  I love going into those places. But, like, you want
• 26:56
  somebody like that with you when you go.
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: For sure.
• 26:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he knows how to get around.
• 27:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: And he used to have a great show. Well, first
• 27:05
  of all, he had Solo Hunter where he'd go and
• 27:09
  film everything himself, which is so much more difficult than
• 27:12
  just hunting. Yeah. He'd set up the– he would carry
• 27:14
  tripods with him and shit and set it up and
• 27:17
  make sure the camera's on the animal before he would
• 27:19
  shoot it and then film himself.
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: Filming himself moving up to there, set up different cameras
• 27:24
  that could show him executing the shot. I'm like, God,
• 27:27
  that's so complicated.
• 27:28
  Speaker 3: He's a beast, man. Just trying to keep up with him,
• 27:31
  you know, just walking around the mountains with that guy.
• 27:34
  I'm like, oh, man, wait up. I'm coming.
• 27:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they get that mountain cardio.
• 27:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, he's like a mountain goat.
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: Well, you know, he hunts probably 200 plus days a year.
• 27:45
  And on top of that, he does a lot of guiding.
• 27:47
  And when he's doing guiding, he's like always in the mountains,
• 27:50
  always hiking. It's like you just get conditioned to it.
• 27:53
  He's fit.
• 27:54
  Speaker 3: I went to Hawaii with him and did an axis
• 27:56
  hunt over there.
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: Cool.
• 27:57
  Speaker 3: One of the coolest things I ever did. And I
• 28:00
  got this buck and. We would load him up in
• 28:04
  the truck and all that, and he was like, man,
• 28:06
  I'll meet you guys back at camp. It was dark already,
• 28:09
  and I know during the day we were hunting, it
• 28:11
  was just steep mountains up and down. I said, you're
• 28:15
  just going to meet us back? He's like, yeah, I'll
• 28:16
  meet you back. He just put on his backpack and
• 28:18
  just took off running, and we drove down this mountain
• 28:21
  road to go back. He beat us there by like
• 28:23
  a half an hour. That was his workout, though. He's like, yeah,
• 28:27
  it's part of my workout. I'll meet you guys back there.
• 28:29
  I was like, oh, you're an animal.
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: That's funny. Axis deer in Hawaii is very interesting because
• 28:36
  they were given to King Kamehameha in like, I don't
• 28:41
  remember what year it was. I don't know what year
• 28:44
  they got introduced there, but they're everywhere now. I've gone
• 28:47
  to Lanai a bunch of times.
• 28:49
  Speaker 3: That's where we went.
• 28:49
  Speaker 2: Bow hunting.
• 28:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it was wild. There are thousands of them everywhere.
• 28:53
  You're trying to sneak up on a group of 10,
• 28:55
  and then you don't even realize there's like 100 right
• 28:58
  here laying down. That you didn't even see, and then
• 29:00
  they'd get up and spook the rest and stand, well,
• 29:02
  you know, you've been there.
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: Okay, it was in the 1800s. A gift to Kim
• 29:08
  Kamehameha from India. And there's 30,000 of them in Lanai
• 29:15
  and only 3,000 people. I mean, it's crazy. It's the
• 29:18
  only place where you can go hunting, bow hunting, and
• 29:21
  you stay at the Four Seasons.
• 29:22
  Speaker 3: Right? I think Remy said he got kicked out of there, though, because...
• 29:28
  He was hunting so much and, you know, all that
• 29:30
  red clay there, you know, on your boots and stuff.
• 29:32
  He said, so the whole hotel was just like red
• 29:34
  clay everywhere. The fridge is just full of meat, you know,
• 29:38
  like blood dripping out. They kicked him out of there? Oh,
• 29:40
  I don't know if they kicked him out. Oh, that's hilarious.
• 29:42
  He's like, well, maybe we ought to go find somewhere
• 29:44
  else to stay, you know.
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: Well, just take off your boots before you come inside.
• 29:47
  That's all it is. But yeah, it's that weird red clay.
• 29:50
  And it all used to be part of the Dole
• 29:53
  Pineapple Plantation. So when you're around there, one of the
• 29:57
  things you notice is like there's layers of dirt but
• 29:59
  then there's like– almost looks like plastic bag underneath it,
• 30:02
  like a hefty bag.
• 30:04
  Speaker 3: From all the farming?
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So I guess they had a layer of like
• 30:08
  that kind of whatever the fuck a hefty bag is
• 30:11
  made out of, whatever that plastic is. And then the
• 30:14
  dirt was on top of that somehow and then the
• 30:16
  pineapples would grow up through it.
• 30:18
  Speaker 3: I just have to keep moisture and stuff like that
• 30:20
  in the ground.
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I would imagine. But it's disconcerting because it doesn't
• 30:24
  feel like nature. It feels weird.
• 30:25
  Speaker 3: It does.
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: It's like this is weird. There's plastic everywhere on the ground. Yeah.
• 30:29
  Speaker 3: And then you get in the mountains and like those
• 30:30
  old World War II turrets and stuff that are up there.
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah.
• 30:33
  Speaker 3: Do you come across any of that stuff? I mean,
• 30:34
  it's just like.
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 30:35
  Speaker 3: First of all, like hunting axis deer in Lanai and
• 30:39
  like you get up on the top and you're surrounded
• 30:41
  by the ocean. I mean, what a trip, you know.
• 30:43
  Speaker 2: I know.
• 30:43
  Speaker 3: Just seeing that and then coming across all those old
• 30:46
  relics and just. all the history there is just something
• 30:49
  to take into. And we are laughing because obviously they're
• 30:52
  trying to control the population of the axis deer there.
• 30:55
  And I think somebody, somebody mentioned like, man, just get
• 30:59
  a couple of Bengal tigers out here. Exactly. That'll thin
• 31:04
  out the population.
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: It's thin out the population of people too, unfortunately. Yeah.
• 31:08
  The thing about them is that they did evolve around tigers.
• 31:10
  That's why they're so fast. Like, They'll jump a string
• 31:14
  faster than any animal I've ever seen in my life.
• 31:16
  I have a video of me shooting at an axis
• 31:18
  deer at 80 yards, and we have a slow-mo of
• 31:22
  the arrow. So as the arrow's coming, it's a perfect
• 31:26
  shot within 10 yards of him. He hears it, and phew,
• 31:32
  and he's gone. It's the craziest thing. Like, you look
• 31:36
  at it, you're like, how the fuck did he move
• 31:38
  that fast? This thing's going at least from the actual, like,
• 31:43
  leaving the bow, it's going 275 feet per second.
• 31:47
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 31:47
  Speaker 3: And he can get out of there within 10 yards.
• 31:50
  Speaker 2: Within 10 yards, he's hearing it coming, and he's like,
• 31:52
  see ya.
• 31:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: And nowhere near him. Like, he was a foot in
• 31:57
  front of, it was, the arrow landed a foot behind
• 31:59
  his ass. Jeez. That's how fast they move. Yeah.
• 32:02
  Speaker 3: It's crazy. Yeah. How long did you go there for
• 32:05
  a while or just kind of like a few time trips?
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: We found that the best time to hunt is actually
• 32:10
  in the afternoon because in the afternoon it's really windy.
• 32:14
  And when it's really windy, it covers your sound a
• 32:16
  little bit.
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: The morning's rough.
• 32:18
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: The morning's rough. Like the morning, I got a couple
• 32:22
  of them in the morning, couple of times morning hunting
• 32:24
  I got a deer, but it's a lot of blown stalks.
• 32:28
  You got to walk super slow. You got to be
• 32:31
  real cautious. And again, there's a lot of high brush
• 32:34
  and you don't know where the fuck they're hiding. Yeah.
• 32:36
  You got to kind of find a pinch point.
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you jump one and then the rest of them
• 32:40
  sound off. The way they bark and all of that's
• 32:42
  pretty crazy too, huh?
• 32:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's weird. It's a weird noise. What you got
• 32:45
  to kind of do is like find where they're going
• 32:47
  to be and just wait because they travel so much.
• 32:50
  They do so much moving. You think I'm just going
• 32:52
  to go still hunt and spot and stalk and I'll
• 32:56
  find one. You're almost better off just staying put. Just
• 33:00
  stay and put and wait for them because they're moving
• 33:02
  all over the place. There's so fucking many of them.
• 33:04
  Speaker 3: It's crazy.
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: But it's amazing how unsuccessful people are bow hunting them. Rifle,
• 33:11
  it's a done deal. If you want meat and it's
• 33:15
  the best meat in the world. So it's– for the
• 33:17
  people that live there, it's incredible. I mean they have
• 33:20
  access to the best meat in the world. Hundred percent
• 33:23
  they're going to get a deer. And so if you
• 33:25
  have a– but if you have a bow– We went
• 33:28
  there and then– so I went with Remy. I went
• 33:31
  with John Dudley, Cam Haynes, and Adam Greentree. They're like
• 33:35
  all seasoned bow hunters. Everybody got a deer and we
• 33:39
  made a podcast about it. We had a good old time.
• 33:42
  They had 150 people go over the next year and
• 33:46
  one was successful with a bow. Yeah. That's crazy.
• 33:50
  Speaker 3: Take your chances, yeah.
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: That's how hard it is.
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: Because it's like these fuckers are– they're dialed in, man.
• 33:56
  And they move– A lot.
• 33:57
  Speaker 3: Of people chasing them too. They know the game, right?
• 34:00
  Speaker 2: 365 days a year they get hunted. There's no season.
• 34:03
  And then they have snipers that are after them at
• 34:05
  night because they use it for meat for the restaurants
• 34:09
  and meat for people. And they just have to control
• 34:11
  the population. There's so many of them and no predators.
• 34:15
  Speaker 3: And still can't thin them out, right?
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: I know.
• 34:16
  Speaker 3: It's crazy.
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: I think they got a good head start. They eradicated
• 34:20
  them from the big islands. Oh, did they?
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: Somebody tried to reintroduce them or introduce, I should say,
• 34:26
  to the Big Island. And they're like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
• 34:28
  We know where this is going. He's going to destroy
• 34:31
  people's crops and destroy people's gardens.
• 34:34
  Speaker 3: Take over.
• 34:35
  Speaker 2: And they already have plenty of wild pigs on the
• 34:37
  Big Island. So they just whacked them all, unfortunately.
• 34:40
  Speaker 3: It's kind of like the pigs here in Texas, right? Crazy.
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: Wild.
• 34:44
  Speaker 3: I don't, you know, growing up here when I was younger,
• 34:46
  I'd never remember them being like how they are now.
• 34:48
  Speaker 2: They don't stop. They have three or four litters a
• 34:51
  year and each litter has, I think they can have
• 34:55
  as many as six piglets. It's crazy. They just, and
• 34:58
  they can get pregnant six months old. At six months old,
• 35:01
  they can get pregnant and they're ready to rock and
• 35:03
  they're just spitting out pigs.
• 35:05
  Speaker 3: And just tearing, tearing shit up.
• 35:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I, we have a lease out here for a
• 35:10
  hunting land, me and some of my friends. And, the
• 35:13
  amount of pigs is disturbing. It's like, you hear them everywhere.
• 35:18
  You hear them in the bushes. They're all over the
• 35:20
  fucking place. It's like most of Texas, probably that's not
• 35:24
  like city has wild pigs in it.
• 35:28
  Speaker 3: It's just like taking over, man.
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: And it's all came over on boats. Yeah. That's how
• 35:33
  it all got here.
• 35:34
  Speaker 3: Is that how they all got? Yeah.
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 35:36
  Speaker 3: It's important to men.
• 35:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Guys from Europe, they brought boats and in the boats,
• 35:41
  some of them brought pigs. And then they let them loose.
• 35:43
  Speaker 3: It's crazy, man. Tearing stuff up. Yeah, I don't ever
• 35:48
  remember them being as bad as they were in the
• 35:50
  last 15 years or so.
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: It's actually bad in California, too. And California has them
• 35:54
  from William Randolph Hearst.
• 35:56
  Speaker 3: Didn't they eradicate them off the Channel Islands out there?
• 36:00
  Speaker 2: I think so. I think the islands... And they had
• 36:04
  mule deer on some of the islands out there, too, right? Yeah,
• 36:06
  I think so. I forget which island had mule deer.
• 36:10
  But apparently they had like a... like you could go
• 36:14
  hunt on one.
• 36:15
  Speaker 3: Of these islands yeah i think you think you might
• 36:17
  still be able to like on catalina or a couple
• 36:19
  but maybe do they really santa cruz they did because
• 36:23
  i know my uh my buddy matt he did it
• 36:26
  like maybe the last year the year before but i
• 36:28
  think they're trying to put a stop to it and
• 36:30
  you know and kind of stop it that was those
• 36:32
  channel islands are pretty interesting i remember first moving out
• 36:35
  there even just going out there 15 years ago and
• 36:38
  um seeing the islands out there you know and I'd
• 36:41
  ask people all around I was like man what's the
• 36:43
  deal with these islands out there and half the people
• 36:45
  that I would talk to would be like what are
• 36:46
  you talking about islands and I'm like that island right
• 36:50
  out there they're like oh I thought that was Long
• 36:52
  Beach you know I'm like really I was like have
• 36:55
  you looked at a map you know I love maps
• 36:59
  so I started you know doing some research and figuring
• 37:01
  out all about it and they're really cool and over
• 37:04
  the years I've met some really cool guys go out
• 37:07
  there a lot and spearfish and Just to go out
• 37:09
  there to them. And besides Catalina, like Santa Cruz and
• 37:13
  San Miguel, they're all nature preserves and protected. So it's
• 37:16
  like going back in time when you get out there.
• 37:19
  And I love it out there. It's such a cool spot.
• 37:23
  Speaker 2: Are they trying to eradicate deer from Catalina? I think
• 37:28
  I've read something about that. Let's see if that's true.
• 37:31
  I think they're trying to remove the deer because they
• 37:34
  said the deer were non-native to the island. Yeah.
• 37:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's what they did with the hogs,
• 37:41
  and I don't know. There's like a specific island fox
• 37:43
  out there.
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, here it is. As of early 2026, California officials
• 37:48
  have approved a controversial plan to fully eradicate the non-native
• 37:52
  mule deer population on Santa Catalina Island to restore the ecosystem.
• 37:57
  Around 2,000 deer introduced in the 1930s for hunting will
• 38:01
  be removed by ground-based hunters to protect native biodiversity. Come on.
• 38:09
  That sounds crazy. How about just let people hunt them?
• 38:12
  What the fuck's wrong with you? So the issue is
• 38:15
  Catalina Island Conservancy considers the mule deer an invasive species
• 38:20
  that disrupts the ecosystem as they consume native plants and
• 38:23
  seedlings while spreading fire-prone invasive grasses. Really? I just always
• 38:33
  worry about conservancies and their their judgments on things like that,
• 38:38
  because there's a lot of, they want to eradicate all
• 38:41
  the pigs from Texas or the, uh, from, uh, California rather.
• 38:45
  They think of them as non-native and they want them
• 38:48
  out too, but you're not going to, they want to
• 38:51
  eradicate D uh, there's like elk in California that are
• 38:55
  Yellowstone elk that were brought there in like the 1950s
• 38:58
  that they're, they want to eradicate.
• 39:00
  Speaker 3: Like the two, like the Thule elk.
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: No, they're actually, they're actually Rocky mountain elk.
• 39:05
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 39:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: But they're, They're a larger breed of Rocky Mountain elk.
• 39:10
  They're called yellow, apparently.
• 39:11
  Speaker 3: Like in the Sierras or down along the coast and stuff?
• 39:14
  Speaker 2: Tatchpee.
• 39:15
  Speaker 3: Tatchpee, yeah.
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: Up in that area on those mountains. Big fucking elk,
• 39:20
  like 400-inch elk. Like a couple of those elk out
• 39:23
  there that are in the front, that's what they're from.
• 39:25
  Speaker 3: That's from there? Those are massive.
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's from Tohon Ranch. Okay. Okay.
• 39:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's like going up over the grapevine.
• 39:33
  Speaker 2: Exactly.
• 39:33
  Speaker 3: That's where you got those?
• 39:34
  Speaker 2: Uh-huh.
• 39:35
  Speaker 3: Wow, I had no idea that they were that big
• 39:37
  out there.
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: It's the biggest private ranch in California. It's like 270,000 acres.
• 39:43
  Speaker 3: I've heard of the ranch, but I didn't know that
• 39:45
  they had elk like that up there.
• 39:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, one of the rare places. Gorgeous fucking places. But
• 39:50
  they also go up– it's kind of funny. They go
• 39:52
  up to– there's a golfing community higher up in Tatchpee.
• 39:58
  And the elk just hang out on the golf course.
• 40:01
  Just tearing it up. Like giant elk, like 400-inch elk
• 40:05
  just chilling, hanging out together on the golf course. And
• 40:08
  dudes are playing golf. that's while they're lying down next
• 40:12
  to them like 20 yards away it's crazy.
• 40:14
  Speaker 3: I've seen i saw someone time i was driving up
• 40:16
  the coast i think i was going up to san
• 40:18
  francisco to play a gig and uh maybe they're the
• 40:22
  tule elk i'm not sure what they were but i
• 40:24
  was along the coast there and i looked over in
• 40:25
  a field and there was like 30 head of them
• 40:27
  just laying down over there i'm like oh man i
• 40:30
  didn't even know they were elk down here it's just
• 40:33
  i love seeing uh wildlife that in unexpected places you
• 40:37
  know yeah.
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: They recently just found a wolf.
• 40:40
  Speaker 3: Or unexpected for me anyway oh really.
• 40:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah see see if you can find the story about
• 40:45
  that wolf that they just discovered in los.
• 40:48
  Speaker 3: Angeles there's a mama mama bear black bear with three
• 40:51
  cubs now running around in topanga.
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah there's a lot of those a lot of
• 40:55
  lions running around there's a lot of bears. I've seen
• 41:00
  them in Pasadena in people's pools.
• 41:03
  Speaker 3: I knew there was a bunch out in Pasadena in Glendale.
• 41:06
  Speaker 2: Wolf detected in Los Angeles County for the first time
• 41:09
  in more than a century. Crazy. Isn't that nuts? Those
• 41:16
  guys can fucking travel. I had a lady on who
• 41:20
  was a wolf biologist and she was talking about like
• 41:23
  the You know, they'd collar some of these wolves and
• 41:26
  they would track them. They would go 500 miles.
• 41:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: Like, it's kind of insane.
• 41:31
  Speaker 3: I didn't know that.
• 41:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 41:32
  Speaker 3: That's incredible.
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: Well, that's how they learned about them. It's really the
• 41:35
  only way to tell is to, like, put a collar
• 41:37
  on them and track them by GPS. Mm-hmm. And, you know,
• 41:41
  they mean they're extraordinary animals.
• 41:43
  Speaker 3: Where were they originating from in Montana, Wyoming, and where
• 41:48
  were they going, the ones that they were tracking?
• 41:50
  Speaker 2: I think the ones that they were tracking were the
• 41:52
  part of the group that was brought in. you know,
• 41:54
  in the 1990s. You know, so there was that pack
• 41:58
  and the subsequent packs that came after that. There were
• 42:01
  all the reintroduced wolves. And so they would, you know,
• 42:04
  dart and call or some of them. And when they
• 42:06
  would do that, they would just track their motion. They're like, Jesus.
• 42:09
  Speaker 3: They're covering some ground.
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: They're covering some ground. It's interesting, too, that they actually
• 42:17
  make mountain lions kill more deer.
• 42:19
  Speaker 3: They're competing with them.
• 42:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because the mountain lions kill a deer, and then
• 42:24
  the wolves will steal it. Oh, okay. So they'll come
• 42:27
  up on the mountain lion, and they'll surround them, and
• 42:29
  the mountain lion will go, fuck this, I'm out of here,
• 42:30
  and he'll just go kill another deer. So he doesn't
• 42:33
  even get a chance to eat his deer because the
• 42:34
  wolves keep stealing his deer.
• 42:36
  Speaker 3: They keep tracking the lions, probably just following them around.
• 42:38
  Speaker 2: They're smart, man.
• 42:39
  Speaker 3: Let them do the dirty work, yeah.
• 42:40
  Speaker 2: They do. They let them do the dirty work, and
• 42:42
  then they steal their food.
• 42:43
  Speaker 3: Work smarter, not harder, huh?
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: What does it say? The wolf that they found?
• 42:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, this is from February when they first spotted it.
• 42:50
  Speaker 2: So the Wolf was born in 2023, Plumas County's– where's
• 42:54
  Plumas County? It's traveled more than 370 miles. Wow. Including
• 42:59
  crossing State Route 59 near Tachipi. There you go. They
• 43:04
  had one up in Tachipi too that a buddy of
• 43:06
  mine– it was actually closer to the city that's down there.
• 43:12
  What is that fucking city?
• 43:14
  Speaker 3: Bakersfield?
• 43:14
  Speaker 2: Bakersfield.
• 43:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: Exactly. Exactly. Wildlife officials now estimate at least 60 wolves
• 43:19
  live in the state. Wow.
• 43:21
  Speaker 3: One crossed over in 2011.
• 43:23
  Speaker 2: Wow. From California, from Oregon. So they find them in
• 43:29
  the Tachipi Mountains. Interesting. Biologists told newspapers that she could
• 43:35
  encounter a mate in the nearby region, such as Tachipi Mountains,
• 43:39
  potentially forming a new pack or continue to roam. What
• 43:42
  was that picture you just had of the elk? Yeah,
• 43:43
  that's that golf course. Look at that. Giant fucking elk
• 43:48
  chilling on the golf course.
• 43:50
  Speaker 3: On the flag.
• 43:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, look how beautiful that is. God, it's so pretty
• 43:54
  out there. massive elk oak tree country.
• 43:57
  Speaker 3: Club perfect sanctuary for them right oh yeah man.
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: And it's just it adds to the coolness of playing
• 44:03
  golf i mean you're playing golf around giant beautiful.
• 44:06
  Speaker 3: Animals i bet those greens keepers love them though they
• 44:11
  probably fuck up all kinds of things out there yeah it's.
• 44:15
  Speaker 2: Uh the wolf thing is interesting because they they just
• 44:18
  brought them back to aspin And they did a really
• 44:21
  stupid thing. They brought them into an area where it
• 44:24
  has a lot of livestock. And they brought them in
• 44:27
  from a place in Oregon where these wolves had all
• 44:30
  been captured because they were killing agriculture. So what did
• 44:34
  they do? They captured them and they– Dropped them off
• 44:37
  in Colorado where they started killing cows again. In the
• 44:41
  national park. Well, it's on people's– my friend's ranch. One
• 44:44
  of them, they dropped three wolves off on my friend's ranch.
• 44:47
  Speaker 3: That's tough, man. Even with the bears and stuff. You
• 44:50
  get some problem bears or whatever and then they go
• 44:52
  drop them out where the farmers and ranches are living.
• 44:55
  It's like, man, how is that going to work?
• 44:57
  Speaker 2: Well, it's the people in charge of these things and
• 45:00
  making these decisions. They don't understand what they're doing. They're
• 45:03
  monkeying around with wildlife. nature, biology, and you don't know
• 45:07
  what you're doing. Yeah. You have no idea. Also, like,
• 45:11
  how the fuck are you in good conscience to take
• 45:13
  a wolf that's used to killing cows and put them
• 45:16
  around other people's cows? Yeah.
• 45:18
  Speaker 3: It's already programmed, man. The dinner bell's ringing.
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: It knows exactly how to do it. It knows it's easy.
• 45:23
  They're all fenced in. They taste delicious. Why would it stop?
• 45:28
  Or why would it.
• 45:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah, why would it go chase... Chase tougher prey, right?
• 45:32
  Speaker 2: So now these poor ranchers have to have people monitoring
• 45:35
  their cows 24-7. They have to have cowboys up all
• 45:39
  night that are wandering around and on horseback and just
• 45:43
  looking for wolves. I mean, it's a disaster. It's tough.
• 45:46
  They've killed dozens of cows.
• 45:48
  Speaker 3: And these are folks that, you know, have been surviving
• 45:52
  on this land for generations and dealing with that and,
• 45:54
  you know— Have a history with managing that stuff. It
• 45:59
  would probably be the folks I'd want to ask.
• 46:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 46:02
  Speaker 3: How to handle it.
• 46:03
  Speaker 2: Well, they would certainly tell you don't let the wolves in.
• 46:06
  And if you do, kill them. But now it's gotten
• 46:10
  to the point where I think they're going to have
• 46:12
  to do something about them.
• 46:13
  Speaker 3: Well, they put a hunting limit on them, you think?
• 46:17
  Speaker 2: Honestly, that would probably do something. But really what you
• 46:22
  should do is hire someone to recapture them. And don't
• 46:26
  drop them off there. Don't drop them off in fucking Aspen,
• 46:29
  you idiot. Because they're going to eat people's poodles, too.
• 46:32
  They don't give a shit. If they run out of cows,
• 46:35
  if somehow or another the ranchers scare them away from
• 46:37
  the cows and they make it into the town of Aspen,
• 46:40
  you don't think they're going to eat your golden retriever?
• 46:42
  They're going to eat all kinds of dogs. They eat
• 46:44
  dogs in Alaska all the time. Yeah.
• 46:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I hear a lot of those, like the lions
• 46:49
  and stuff, man. They're coming after your kids. Yeah. That
• 46:53
  Malibu Creek Park, you know, I've heard... couple of incidents there,
• 46:57
  you know, hits like, man, they're, they're going to go
• 47:00
  eat something.
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: Especially when they're old. Yeah. When they get old, you know,
• 47:04
  they can't catch a deer anymore and they're hungry and
• 47:07
  they haven't eaten in a few days. And then they
• 47:09
  see a kid hanging around a little too close to
• 47:11
  the outside of the woods.
• 47:13
  Speaker 3: I got a big one that comes right by my house.
• 47:14
  I got a little game trail cameras set up and
• 47:17
  I got a little fountain right in the front. It
• 47:18
  doesn't come around when I'm there. Cause we got the dogs,
• 47:21
  you know, a lot, but, uh, Whenever I'm out of
• 47:23
  town for weeks at a time, I'll come back, and
• 47:24
  that sucker's just laying on my front porch. Whoa.
• 47:27
  Speaker 2: Just massive.
• 47:28
  Speaker 3: And then the other day, a friend of mine was
• 47:31
  taking the trash out, and it was around lunchtime, and
• 47:35
  it jumped over the fence into the driveway and had
• 47:37
  a dead rabbit in its mouth just looking at her.
• 47:41
  Speaker 2: And she's like, holy shit. They're there.
• 47:43
  Speaker 3: So every time I'm even walking around by myself or
• 47:46
  with the dogs, you're just like, man, sucker, you're just
• 47:48
  being a tree looking at me right now.
• 47:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you're just living with monsters.
• 47:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 47:53
  Speaker 2: You're there. California spent more than $ 100 million trying to
• 47:59
  make a bridge over, I forget which freeway it is.
• 48:03
  I think it's the 101.
• 48:05
  Speaker 3: Is it the 101?
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: I think you're right. So they spent over $ 100 million
• 48:10
  and it's still not done. Oh, my gosh. For a bridge.
• 48:13
  A bridge for the mountain lions. Like, you fucking dorks.
• 48:18
  Speaker 3: Ugh.
• 48:19
  Speaker 2: It's like this idea of like it's going to be
• 48:21
  a bridge, but it's going to have dirt and grass
• 48:23
  on it. So it'll encourage them to walk across so
• 48:25
  they don't have to go over the highway and die.
• 48:27
  Speaker 3: It's a bit nicer than the roads we're driving on.
• 48:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, $ 110 million is crazy. And it's still not
• 48:35
  even done. It's so crazy. So that's what it– early 2026.
• 48:42
  Speaker 3: It's like going up to Ventura, right? Yeah.
• 48:46
  Speaker 2: So they want to have this bridge. this big dirt
• 48:49
  mound and this bridge so the animals can get across
• 48:52
  the highway but it's just like it's so goofy and
• 48:56
  they never want people to do anything about the population
• 48:59
  of mountain lions regardless of how out of control they
• 49:01
  are they don't do anything about it they have to
• 49:03
  hire people the state has to hire people to go
• 49:06
  and get the bad mountain lions the ones that are
• 49:08
  problems and when they capture them one of the things
• 49:10
  they find out is they actually kill them right so
• 49:13
  one of the things they find out when they examine
• 49:15
  their diet it's like 50% pets.
• 49:18
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 49:18
  Speaker 2: 50%. 50% dogs and cats. That's what your mountain lions
• 49:22
  are eating.
• 49:22
  Speaker 3: That's crazy.
• 49:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And they spend money, like a lot of money,
• 49:28
  going after these mountain lions. And instead, they could make
• 49:32
  money by letting people hunt these mountain lions and giving
• 49:35
  them tags and control the numbers and And that place,
• 49:39
  Tohono Ranch, one of my buddies works there, and they
• 49:42
  have a trail camera set up on a pond, and
• 49:44
  they found 16 different cats that were drinking out of
• 49:48
  that pond.
• 49:49
  Speaker 3: Oh, my gosh.
• 49:50
  Speaker 2: That's insane.
• 49:52
  Speaker 3: I was like, when I first started going out there, too,
• 49:54
  the coyotes, you know, and even around like in Hollywood
• 49:57
  and stuff. Man, I swear I just saw a coyote
• 50:00
  running down the street with a pair of sunglasses on
• 50:02
  and a gold chain, eating better than any of us.
• 50:07
  Speaker 2: When I went there in 94, that was the first
• 50:09
  time I ever saw a coyote. I couldn't believe it.
• 50:11
  I was staying at– you know they have those furnished apartments,
• 50:14
  the Oakwood furnished apartments?
• 50:16
  Speaker 3: Oh, no, not really.
• 50:17
  Speaker 2: It's like temporary. Like for people that are like– don't
• 50:20
  have a house yet and you got to move to
• 50:21
  California quick, they have this place called Oakwoods. You go
• 50:24
  in there. It's already got a couch. It's already got
• 50:26
  a TV. It's already got a bed. You're like, okay.
• 50:28
  Speaker 3: Like an Airbnb type of thing?
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah, almost like you just move in. And I was
• 50:32
  driving up to the– Entrance to the place, and I
• 50:36
  see these little dogs on the street. I was like,
• 50:38
  what the fuck is going on? That ain't no dog.
• 50:42
  I was like, oh, my God, they're coyotes. Like, this
• 50:47
  is weird. And so this is like 94. I had
• 50:50
  never seen a fucking coyote. I hadn't even heard of
• 50:52
  a coyote being out just wandering in the street. I
• 50:55
  just couldn't believe it, that they just wander around on
• 50:58
  the concrete.
• 50:59
  Speaker 3: Man, they're everywhere. I feel like I've seen more there
• 51:02
  than anywhere. You see them more in town than you
• 51:04
  do anywhere else.
• 51:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, they have large populations of them in downtown
• 51:10
  where they know where they den up. They den up
• 51:12
  in certain warehouse buildings.
• 51:13
  Speaker 3: Okay. Like abandoned buildings and under bridges and freeways and stuff.
• 51:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah. They live there. They probably keep the rat population.
• 51:21
  Speaker 3: Nature will take back over one day, won't it?
• 51:24
  Speaker 2: Exactly.
• 51:25
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 51:25
  Speaker 2: I think they probably keep the rat population in check, though.
• 51:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah.
• 51:29
  Speaker 2: If you think about it. Yeah.
• 51:31
  Speaker 3: I keep a lot of other things in check too.
• 51:33
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 51:33
  Speaker 3: Cats.
• 51:35
  Speaker 2: Well, there's a terrible video from Woodland Hills a few
• 51:38
  years back where a guy was unloading his car and
• 51:41
  his toddler was out there in the grass.
• 51:45
  Speaker 3: I saw that.
• 51:46
  Speaker 2: And the coyote grabbed his toddler and tried to run
• 51:48
  away with his kid.
• 51:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah. I saw that, man. I, you know, I'm always
• 51:52
  watching around for stuff and with my, our kiddos or
• 51:56
  just people around the neighborhood and stuff, you gotta remind,
• 51:58
  remind yourself, you know, they're, they're there and they're not
• 52:00
  scared of you, you know, they're not afraid. I remember the,
• 52:04
  one of the first times, um, I went up to
• 52:06
  Ojai just north of, uh, LA there, you know, and
• 52:08
  I just wanted to go up there and go hike
• 52:10
  around and check out the area. And, uh, those, uh,
• 52:14
  an archery shop up there and I had this old
• 52:16
  guy kind of looked like Charlie Daniels, just big overalls,
• 52:19
  big old beard, you know, and I walked in there
• 52:20
  and just to, check out the shop and also just
• 52:23
  ask him about, you know, some areas to go stomp around. And,
• 52:27
  and I had a, uh, uh, Australian shepherd dog at
• 52:30
  the time. And, uh, just ask him where, you know,
• 52:33
  good places to go stomp around. He said, yeah, you know,
• 52:35
  you go up there. He goes, but I wouldn't take
• 52:37
  your dog with you. I was like, really?
• 52:39
  Speaker 2: Why?
• 52:39
  Speaker 3: And he's like, man, those lions are real deal up here.
• 52:42
  You know? And he's like, you, he goes, you won't
• 52:44
  see them, you know, until they're on you. Yeah. And
• 52:48
  I just, yeah, I knew that. They're lying to stuff
• 52:50
  like that, but hearing it from that guy, maybe he's
• 52:53
  trying to scare me a little bit, but it's a
• 52:57
  real deal.
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: It's real. It's real, and they try to downplay it
• 53:01
  because all the wildlife lovers, all the greenies, they don't
• 53:06
  want you sounding the alarm and killing them. But their
• 53:11
  goal is to have zero hunting. Their goal is to
• 53:14
  have all the animals just balance each other out. I
• 53:17
  think it will happen.
• 53:20
  Speaker 3: Not with humans in the mix. No.
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: The humans have interrupted that whole idea, right? So if
• 53:24
  you've got a city and then you've got wild giant
• 53:28
  predators like 170-pound cats that are killing dogs and they're like,
• 53:33
  you've got to control them.
• 53:35
  Speaker 3: Can't manage one without managing the other, right?
• 53:38
  Speaker 2: And so the first thing they did to stop people
• 53:41
  from doing it is they banned hunting with dogs. So
• 53:44
  if you've been hunting with dogs, guess what? You basically–
• 53:46
  you're killing most of the hunting because the reality of
• 53:49
  mountain lions is you can't find them. They're really hard
• 53:51
  to find, really hard to catch, really hard to find.
• 53:54
  And the best way to control their population is to
• 53:57
  tree them and you get dogs to– because that way
• 54:00
  you know if it's a tom or if it's a female.
• 54:03
  You know if it's mature. You know what size it is.
• 54:05
  You have a really accurate estimation. You can look up
• 54:09
  at it. Oh, that's a mature tom. That's what we're
• 54:11
  looking to kill. And then you can control their population.
• 54:14
  That's the only way. Same with bears.
• 54:15
  Speaker 3: It's a great way to control bears. Yeah, see what
• 54:17
  it is and decide if it needs to go or
• 54:19
  if it needs to stay, right? Yeah.
• 54:22
  Speaker 2: But they do little things to stop the effective hunting first.
• 54:26
  So California, you can still hunt for black bears, but
• 54:30
  you can't use dogs anymore. So as soon as they
• 54:32
  stopped the use of dogs, the amount of black bears
• 54:35
  they harvested went way down. So the amount of bears
• 54:37
  in the population went way up.
• 54:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't think they've, I mean, I know they've
• 54:41
  been around in Pasadena a lot, but I don't think
• 54:43
  there's been one in Topanga for a while. I mean,
• 54:45
  I've been up there, shoot, almost 15 years and hadn't
• 54:48
  heard of one. This is the first time that one's
• 54:50
  kind of made it over into that area that I
• 54:53
  know of anyway, maybe up, you know, around the Malibu
• 54:57
  Creek and those state parks.
• 54:59
  Speaker 2: In Topanga, there's probably people feeding them. Oh, 100%.
• 55:02
  Speaker 3: I've got berries for you, my friend. Giving them weed.
• 55:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 55:10
  Speaker 3: Some berries.
• 55:13
  Speaker 2: The bang is great but it always catches me out
• 55:15
  of a fire catches.
• 55:17
  Speaker 3: Oh man we got hit hard last year as you
• 55:20
  know the palisades stuff and man I didn't that was
• 55:24
  kind of it for me too I was like I'm
• 55:26
  out you know it's terrifying I've evacuated out of there
• 55:29
  several times over the years but I've got horses up
• 55:32
  there now and stuff like that and luckily I had
• 55:35
  like a I always keep a big truck and a
• 55:38
  trailer just in case and got some friends down in
• 55:40
  Burbank that have some stables, you know, that I'll have
• 55:43
  like as a backup plan. And, uh, but this was
• 55:45
  just a different deal. I, as a crow flies, I
• 55:48
  could see the smoke from the Palisades, you know, it's
• 55:50
  like a mile away, you know, and we were actually
• 55:53
  working in our arena there and smoke came up and
• 55:56
  I was like, shoot, let's just go. Every time I
• 55:58
  see the smoke, like I don't wait. I'm just like,
• 56:00
  we'll be the first ones out and beat the, beat
• 56:03
  the mad rush of everybody that's going to decide to
• 56:05
  try to stay and loaded up the, The trailer and
• 56:09
  the truck and the camper and the dogs and all
• 56:11
  that stuff. And I was like, let's go. And my
• 56:13
  wife and I went down to Burbank. And I remember
• 56:17
  we were driving through the night and the wind was
• 56:19
  just howling like I've never seen before. And power lines
• 56:23
  are snapping. And it's just like trees are coming down.
• 56:26
  And it just felt like the end of the world,
• 56:28
  you know. And we get to Burbank and we pull
• 56:32
  back in these stables and there's a kind of a
• 56:34
  big cinder block wall. And I just got as close
• 56:37
  to that as I could because it was blocking the
• 56:39
  wind from hitting us. And the next morning I woke
• 56:43
  up and my throat was sore and hurting. I could
• 56:46
  hardly breathe. And I opened the camper door and the
• 56:48
  Altadena fire had started. And it was right there. And
• 56:51
  so it was just a mountain of black smoke coming
• 56:54
  over the top of us there. And so I was like,
• 56:57
  let's go and let's get out of here. Let's head north.
• 56:59
  And I had some friends in Moore Park up in
• 57:02
  that area going towards Ventura that had horses. trying to
• 57:05
  find some places to go with some horses. And they're like, yeah,
• 57:08
  come on up here. So we went up there, stayed
• 57:10
  there a night, and then they cut all the power
• 57:12
  off up in that area because the winds were snapping
• 57:14
  power lines and they were worried about fires. And, you know,
• 57:18
  after doing that a few nights, I was like, let's
• 57:20
  just head east and go to Texas. There's only so
• 57:26
  many friends you can, like, show up with five horses
• 57:29
  and a bunch of dogs, you know, like, hey, we're
• 57:30
  going to stay for a while, you know.
• 57:32
  Speaker 2: Especially in California.
• 57:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah, we're like, let's just get out of here and
• 57:37
  head back. And you didn't know when we were going
• 57:38
  to make it back, and they closed indefinitely or whatever.
• 57:42
  I was just like, man, I'm over it.
• 57:44
  Speaker 2: I got evacuated a bunch of times when I lived there,
• 57:46
  but the last one was 2018. And when the last one,
• 57:51
  we got out early. I came home from the comedy store,
• 57:54
  and we saw fire coming over the top of this hill.
• 57:57
  And it was probably like 1 o'clock in the morning,
• 57:59
  and me and my wife were sitting there. I go—
• 58:01
  What do you think? She's like, let's get the fuck
• 58:03
  out of here. Let's get the fuck out of here.
• 58:05
  Let's just grab some shit and maybe it'll come this way.
• 58:08
  Maybe it won't. So it didn't burn the house down.
• 58:11
  But my neighbors, the front three neighbors all lost their house.
• 58:15
  And my next door neighbor, his roof caught on fire.
• 58:18
  But my friend who refused to leave, he stayed in
• 58:22
  the neighborhood and protected his house and guided firefighters. He
• 58:26
  brought the firefighters to that house and showed them. that
• 58:28
  had just started on this guy's roof, and they hosed
• 58:30
  it down. They stopped it in its tracks. But it
• 58:33
  was pretty fucking bad.
• 58:35
  Speaker 3: It's wild because you know it's going to burn. I mean,
• 58:36
  it's not a matter of if. It's just a win.
• 58:40
  I mean, canyons have been burning like that for thousands
• 58:43
  of years. And even the Chumash were setting them on
• 58:45
  fire on purpose to get ahead of it, right, and
• 58:47
  control and all of that stuff. And now there's just
• 58:50
  so many houses and communities back up in there. It's
• 58:54
  a tough thing. But when they hit, man, it's– They're
• 58:59
  rolling through how fast they come through. Those Santa Ana
• 59:01
  winds are blowing like that.
• 59:03
  Speaker 2: It's just very surreal in person. You can watch it
• 59:06
  on the news and you kind of get a feeling
• 59:08
  of it. But when you're there and you're driving. down
• 59:10
  the one-on-one and you look at the side of the
• 59:12
  highway and you see like these hills in the distance
• 59:14
  that are just covered in fire, hundreds of yards of
• 59:19
  fields of fire, just making their way over the top
• 59:23
  of this hill and burning houses.
• 59:25
  Speaker 3: And We saw it when the Palisades thing would start.
• 59:29
  From our house, there's kind of a little mountain that
• 59:32
  comes up on the back. And I hiked up there
• 59:34
  and was watching it. And you could see the smoke.
• 59:36
  And then you could start seeing little flickers of the flames.
• 59:40
  And then it was just like somebody dumped gasoline on
• 59:43
  this thing. And I mean, the flames shot up hundreds
• 59:48
  of feet into the air. And my wife was on
• 59:51
  the balcony of the house. And I'm kind of up
• 59:53
  on this little mountain. I'm looking over, looking in her eyes.
• 59:55
  I'm like, Start packing up. I'll go hook up the
• 1:00:00
  horse trailer. I'll be up in a second. Let's load
• 1:00:02
  up and just. And, you know, the wind was blowing
• 1:00:06
  like offshore then, you know, so the fire is like
• 1:00:09
  on the coast, you know, and just depending on where that,
• 1:00:13
  how that wind is blowing, you know, at the beginning
• 1:00:15
  it was blowing offshore. And then within a half an hour,
• 1:00:19
  it just shot up the coastline and just ripped up
• 1:00:22
  through Malibu and burned all that coast. Like that's the,
• 1:00:25
  the stuff that you always thought was the safest. Right.
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 2: You know? Yeah.
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 3: And then the next day the wind shifts coming back
• 1:00:31
  on shore and it blows it back towards Burbank, you know,
• 1:00:35
  going back up like the fourth up that way. And
• 1:00:38
  then the winds are shifting again and then coming back across,
• 1:00:41
  you know, so I was amazed at the, I've seen
• 1:00:45
  some of the fires that I've been through, seeing the
• 1:00:47
  firefighters up there. Those guys are incredible, man. Those helicopter pilots,
• 1:00:51
  the airplane pilots, seeing those tankers fly through there. I mean,
• 1:00:55
  it's just incredible what those guys can do. I mean,
• 1:00:59
  they saved that whole canyon of Topanga, at least. It's like, man,
• 1:01:03
  there's so much brush in there that probably needs to burn.
• 1:01:07
  It's been accumulating over years, you know, and cutting those
• 1:01:10
  fire breaks and seeing them drop the retardant on the
• 1:01:14
  ridge lines and stuff and watching the wind. It's just like, man,
• 1:01:18
  hats off to those guys.
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 2: Absolutely.
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 2: I mean, think about. the amount of damage that was
• 1:01:23
  done in that fire and how much more would have
• 1:01:25
  been done if it wasn't for the firefighters. That's how
• 1:01:27
  crazy it is. Yeah.
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it is. And I met one of the helicopter pilots.
• 1:01:34
  I was on a flight somewhere and we just happened
• 1:01:37
  to be sitting next to each other and we were
• 1:01:38
  talking about it and just, you know, learning from him,
• 1:01:42
  you know, about, you know, the thermals that come up
• 1:01:44
  from underneath and trying to hold those helicopters and, you know,
• 1:01:49
  in formation and all of that stuff and how heavy
• 1:01:51
  they are when they're full.
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 3: And then as soon as you release all that water,
• 1:01:55
  whatever's in them that, you know, all of a sudden
• 1:01:57
  that the power that they got, you know, throttles full throttle,
• 1:02:00
  you know, when they're loaded down and then they drop
• 1:02:02
  all that water and then, you know, trying to get
• 1:02:04
  back a hold of it.
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 2: And I never even thought of that.
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 3: And then you got, then you got 90 mile an
• 1:02:10
  hour winds blowing and, you know, and I could see
• 1:02:14
  them from the house, you know, there'd be like two
• 1:02:16
  or three helicopters that would come in. start dropping water
• 1:02:19
  and then they would move out and then the tank,
• 1:02:21
  the planes would come in and then helicopters back in.
• 1:02:25
  And then you had the guys on the ground, you know,
• 1:02:28
  trying to contain it as well. Just the, the coordinated
• 1:02:31
  effort between them. You know, I can imagine the conversations there. Yeah.
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 2: Hey man. It's so crazy that they didn't have the
• 1:02:38
  reservoirs ready.
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 3: Oh dude, so sad.
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 2: I had Spencer Pratt on, you know, he's running for
• 1:02:44
  mayor now. He was explaining it like how bad it was.
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 2: How do you fuck that up that bad?
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 3: It's devastating to hear that it's like... You know that
• 1:02:54
  that stuff's coming. Yeah. You know?
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 2: It's just.
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 3: To not be prepared for that.
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 2: Is just unacceptable. Complete incompetence.
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 2: Just complete, total incompetence, and yet they still are there. Yeah. Like,
• 1:03:09
  you're definitely not good at the job. Gosh. And yet
• 1:03:12
  you don't take any personal responsibility and blame everybody else.
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 3: Mm-hmm.
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 2: The problem.
• 1:03:20
  It's just fucking, it's a problem that happens every few years.
• 1:03:24
  You're going to get fires, period. The fact that you
• 1:03:26
  don't have a full reservoir is crazy. It's crazy. You
• 1:03:30
  should dump all your resources into fixing that fucking reservoir stack.
• 1:03:34
  Get that shit filled up.
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 3: The residents are more prepared than anybody, you know, because
• 1:03:39
  I think they just got to where you can't depend
• 1:03:41
  on it, you know? I mean, I know our neighbors
• 1:03:44
  and stuff have a pretty good program in place. We'll
• 1:03:47
  all get together and talk about, you know, who's got
• 1:03:50
  fire hoses and swimming pools with access to water and where,
• 1:03:53
  you know, evacuation plans or, you know, there's some folks that, uh,
• 1:03:58
  will have horses, but they don't even have a horse
• 1:03:59
  trailer up there. And, you know, I'm like, okay, I'll
• 1:04:01
  come get yours too, or whatever, you know, you know, we,
• 1:04:03
  we need to do. And, um, you kind of just
• 1:04:06
  have to have that mentality, I think, you know?
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely. Definitely. It's, you know, what really freaking me
• 1:04:13
  out about like the Palisades is what is in the
• 1:04:17
  ground now? You know, how much toxic shit got melted
• 1:04:22
  into that ground? Because think about how many people have
• 1:04:25
  electric cars now.
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 3: Well, all those old houses, too. You know what I'm
• 1:04:28
  talking about? Right. The materials that they're made out of,
• 1:04:31
  asbestos or lead. I mean, the stuff in the air
• 1:04:35
  that was, even if you, you know, you were several
• 1:04:38
  miles away from the actual fires, the wind and blowing
• 1:04:41
  all the ashes and the smoke and all that stuff over.
• 1:04:43
  I remember going back up in there, you know, weeks
• 1:04:47
  and just trying to get stuff out. out of the
• 1:04:49
  house or whatever when they let us back up and
• 1:04:50
  you could still it would just make your throat hurt
• 1:04:53
  you know breathing that air and stuff so right that's
• 1:04:56
  bad stuff it's not just wood fire yeah no no
• 1:04:59
  like chemicals.
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah wood fire is hard enough but the chemicals burnt
• 1:05:03
  tvs and computers and hard drives and electronics and refrigerators
• 1:05:10
  treated lumber yeah yeah All that shit's going to get
• 1:05:14
  in your groundwater. Like it's on the surface. It's going
• 1:05:18
  to rain. It's going to seep through. Like what happens
• 1:05:21
  to the water? Is anybody checking the water out there?
• 1:05:23
  You know, you got to imagine. I doubt it. Especially
• 1:05:28
  like Topanga. I bet a lot of folks have wells.
• 1:05:30
  Don't you think?
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 3: I think there's some. You know, it's definitely all like
• 1:05:33
  on septic up there too. You know, I mean, all
• 1:05:36
  of the building code stuff's pretty crazy up there. I
• 1:05:40
  don't know.
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 2: It's a mess. I would just worry about even breathing
• 1:05:44
  the air that has the dust of all that shit
• 1:05:46
  in it. Like I probably wouldn't want to live there anymore.
• 1:05:51
  If I was in a place where all the houses
• 1:05:53
  burnt to the ground and I knew there was toxic
• 1:05:54
  shit in the ground, I'd be like, hey, let's get
• 1:05:57
  the fuck out of here and sell our house to China.
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 3: Oh, man.
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 2: Because that's the other thing Spencer said. They're the ones
• 1:06:05
  who are the number one land buyers. It's China.
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 3: Is it going to be a golf course resort up
• 1:06:11
  there before we know it?
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 2: Who knows? Yeah. Or affordable housing.
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 2: One or the other.
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 3: I don't know either.
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 2: I don't know. But it's just I really wonder what
• 1:06:22
  the long-term damage of all those chemicals in the ground is.
• 1:06:25
  It has to be pretty high.
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 3: It's got to be. I don't know. I was talking
• 1:06:30
  to some friends of mine out the other day that
• 1:06:32
  have grown up there, lived out there their whole lives.
• 1:06:34
  And going over to the Channel Islands, they've got those
• 1:06:37
  oil– platforms out there in the water and there's been
• 1:06:40
  oil spills obviously throughout there through history and um but
• 1:06:44
  also like when you're surfing and stuff like that there's
• 1:06:46
  oil that's been on top of the ground it's just
• 1:06:48
  like so surface level it's been there for millions of
• 1:06:51
  years you know and so i don't know you know
• 1:06:55
  it's like i'm sure all the toxic stuff that happens
• 1:06:58
  how long does it take for it to dilute you
• 1:06:59
  know there's not much rain or the wind or like
• 1:07:02
  what you know i'm not an expert on it but
• 1:07:05
  i I feel like Mother Nature takes pretty good care
• 1:07:08
  of herself. We're the ones in trouble, right?
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 2: Right. Mother Nature will sort it out over time, but
• 1:07:14
  I just don't know how good it's going to be
• 1:07:16
  for the people that live there.
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 3: It can't be the long term.
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 2: I have a buddy that has a house out there,
• 1:07:21
  and he lost his house and it burnt down, and
• 1:07:23
  I asked him about it. He said, I think what
• 1:07:24
  they're going to do is take all the dirt out
• 1:07:26
  of their backyard and then replace the dirt. And I'm like, okay. Okay.
• 1:07:32
  I don't know if that's enough. Because what about his dirt?
• 1:07:35
  What about your neighbor's dirt? What about all the toxic
• 1:07:37
  shit that's in his dirt that's going to get down
• 1:07:39
  into your ground as soon as it rains? And also
• 1:07:43
  the air.
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 3: Along with all the Roundup and everything else that's coming down.
• 1:07:48
  It's sad, man. It's sad. That's just kind of the
• 1:07:54
  state of it. It's like it's. It seems like just
• 1:07:57
  it's so far of a mess that even the folks
• 1:07:59
  that do have answers that do want to fix stuff,
• 1:08:01
  it just kind of becomes impossible for any solution. You know,
• 1:08:05
  it's like all the red tape and all the hoops
• 1:08:08
  and things and all the permits or whatever. Like you
• 1:08:11
  can't even, you know. The road's blocked.
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 3: Well, before we could even get somebody out here with
• 1:08:17
  a tractor to move the rocks, you got to call
• 1:08:19
  10 other people to get it approved and in the process.
• 1:08:21
  And then it's not. And it's like, that's the part
• 1:08:23
  I'm just like, man, I wish I could just call
• 1:08:24
  Frank down the street.
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 2: With his bulldozer.
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 3: We'll just go, we'll just go and move this right now,
• 1:08:29
  you know? And it's like, you know?
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 2: Well, government has increased so much in California and they
• 1:08:35
  just want more regulations so they could justify more government.
• 1:08:39
  And so they just regulate themselves to a place where
• 1:08:41
  people just want to leave. They just go, look, I
• 1:08:43
  can't fucking do this anymore. Let me get out of here.
• 1:08:45
  Speaker 3: And it's expensive, man. It's so expensive to live there.
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 2: Meanwhile, it's beautiful. It's such a great place. They fucked
• 1:08:52
  it up so hard. It's paradise.
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 3: It's paradise. The mountains within like two, three hours, you
• 1:08:58
  can be in the Sierras.
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 2: The beach.
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 3: Or the mountains. Joshua Tree National Park.
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 2: You can go skiing and then swim in the ocean
• 1:09:05
  on the same day. It's gorgeous.
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 3: Beautiful places I've ever been. Yosemite. I mean, get out
• 1:09:09
  of town.
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 2: Incredible weather.
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 3: Kern River. Yeah. Man, it's beautiful.
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 2: But they got ruined.
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 2: They got ruined with progressive politics and bureaucracy that just
• 1:09:23
  ramped up all the control they have over people to
• 1:09:26
  the point where you can't even buy flavored zins. They
• 1:09:31
  banned blackjack. You can't have blackjack anymore. They just stopped
• 1:09:35
  blackjack in the casinos. They stopped flavored zins. They just
• 1:09:40
  regulated into oblivion. They're all these people that want to
• 1:09:44
  be the mommy of the world. And tell you what
• 1:09:48
  to do. Like, fuck off.
• 1:09:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 2: Like, fuck off with all your goddamn rules. You're just
• 1:09:54
  making your government bigger so you can justify all these
• 1:09:58
  fucking rules. And you need the rules for the government
• 1:10:01
  to sustain itself. So you just keep adding more rules
• 1:10:04
  and adding more government.
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 2: We were reading about it the other day. Like, what
• 1:10:08
  was the number that California's government went up by, like,
• 1:10:11
  24% and their population went up by, like, 1%? Yeah.
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 3: I know, and now we're running out of places to go.
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 2: I forget what the actual numbers were that we found,
• 1:10:22
  but it's... Yeah.
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 3: I'm always looking for hideouts, you know, to kind of
• 1:10:26
  get away from. It's like, man, you find a spot
• 1:10:29
  to go to, you kind of don't want to tell
• 1:10:30
  nobody about it. I know, right?
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 2: That's what I hear about West Texas.
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 3: I think that's what's hard about Montana. You know, when
• 1:10:36
  I first started going up there years ago, I mean,
• 1:10:39
  it was just such a... And it still is. It's
• 1:10:42
  a paradise.
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 2: It's just, you know.
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 3: And I think that's probably what a lot of people
• 1:10:46
  are upset about. I lived up there. It's like, man,
• 1:10:48
  the seeker got out a little bit and I can
• 1:10:50
  understand that.
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 2: I get it. I get it from that perspective. They
• 1:10:53
  got to let that go.
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 3: Where's the next place, you know?
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 2: The thing about Montana, though, or like Wyoming, another example,
• 1:10:59
  is that winter will thin the herd.
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 3: It's like West Texas. That's funny. Same kind of thing. Like,
• 1:11:06
  you know, Marfa and that area, you know, I grew
• 1:11:09
  up all out there going to junior rodeos and all
• 1:11:11
  kinds of stuff. And it was just ranches, you know,
• 1:11:13
  and you know, local diners and stuff like that. And, um,
• 1:11:18
  you know, I hear people going out there and buying
• 1:11:20
  houses and, you know, all that stuff. And then they
• 1:11:22
  go out there for like a week and they realize
• 1:11:23
  that the only thing open at night is the Dairy Queen.
• 1:11:26
  And they're heading back to New York pretty quick.
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:11:30
  Speaker 3: But you're right about those winters. Those thin them out. Yeah.
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 2: Winter gets you. The winter's rough. It's cold. We were, uh,
• 1:11:39
  the first time I ever went hunting was with Rinella.
• 1:11:41
  That's where I got that mule deer that's on the
• 1:11:42
  table right there. And it was nine degrees in October
• 1:11:48
  and we're camping. And so we're sleeping on the ground
• 1:11:50
  at nine degrees. I'm like, bro, how did these fucking
• 1:11:53
  people– and you also– you go by these old homesteads.
• 1:11:58
  So they were giving land out there for people. You
• 1:12:01
  just– you can get a chunk of land, just start
• 1:12:03
  farming on it, and the government was encouraging people to
• 1:12:06
  move there. But it's all this like muddy ground. Like
• 1:12:11
  the ground is like mucky. Like when you hike in
• 1:12:14
  it after, you know, a while, your boots are so
• 1:12:17
  heavy because.
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 3: They're just thick with this clay.
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Just muck all over your boots. And so it's
• 1:12:23
  not fertile. It's not good. Like in the Missouri breaks,
• 1:12:26
  like that area, it's not good for growing things. So
• 1:12:29
  you find these abandoned homesteads. It's really eerie. Yeah. And
• 1:12:34
  you just think like this family that came out here
• 1:12:37
  in like the 1800s and they tried to set up shop.
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 3: Mm-hmm.
• 1:12:41
  Speaker 2: Maybe got killed by Indians. All the way.
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 3: I think about my family. I've got stories of them
• 1:12:48
  settling in New Mexico and coming out on a covered
• 1:12:52
  wagon with maybe a steer and a pig. And they're like, yeah,
• 1:12:55
  here's a bunch of acres, and you've got to prove
• 1:12:58
  it up. Dig a hole in the ground is what
• 1:13:01
  they're living in, a dugout. Dig a hole in the ground,
• 1:13:03
  that's where you're living, and you try to build a
• 1:13:05
  ranch out of it. I always laugh when I talk
• 1:13:09
  to them. family or my grandparents i was like why
• 1:13:11
  did y'all stop here.
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 1: You just like you were so beat down you're like
• 1:13:16
  oh this is the driest flattest place you know but
• 1:13:21
  we're here the most roughest you know i was like
• 1:13:23
  it's only maybe another thousand miles out to california or
• 1:13:27
  just keep going they're like nope.
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 3: This is it we're done you know.
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah i guess people didn't know what they were gonna
• 1:13:33
  find if they kept going either like you want to
• 1:13:35
  keep going for like another month.
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 3: Oh, yeah, just miles and miles of more desert and
• 1:13:41
  no water.
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 2: I mean, how long would that wagon trail take?
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 3: Weeks. Even just like Missouri, Texas, and out to— even like
• 1:13:51
  just going through west Texas to get to southeast New
• 1:13:54
  Mexico and all that. That's just rough country, and the
• 1:13:58
  people have always been tough out there to.
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 2: Survive out there. And you're a sitting duck. Yeah. You're
• 1:14:02
  a sitting duck. You're slow moving with a wagon pulling
• 1:14:06
  the horn. You got all your shit in the wagon
• 1:14:08
  and they just looking at you from the hills.
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Wasn't glamorous.
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 2: No.
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 3: I know my, you know, my granddad was pretty tough
• 1:14:18
  old guy and is real a Cowboys. You'd ever want
• 1:14:22
  to know or meet, you know, but he wasn't really
• 1:14:25
  one to ever brag or, you know, talk or fantasize
• 1:14:28
  or romanticize about the Cowboys stuff, you know, cause it,
• 1:14:31
  It wasn't romantic then, you know. It was survival, and
• 1:14:35
  it was rough, and it was work, and you had
• 1:14:37
  no running water. And I remember him having a conversation
• 1:14:42
  with this guy, and he was like a tech guy,
• 1:14:44
  you know, invented all this website shit or whatever. And
• 1:14:47
  he was asking my granddad, he said, you know, what's
• 1:14:50
  the most important invention of your lifetime? And I think
• 1:14:53
  he was expecting my granddad to say, like, the computer
• 1:14:56
  or the Internet. And my granddad said refrigeration. It was
• 1:15:00
  the most important invention, you know. Yeah. When he was
• 1:15:03
  growing up, he was like they had no way to
• 1:15:05
  keep their food cold, you know, other than like a
• 1:15:07
  root cellar. You kept it underground, you know. So it
• 1:15:10
  was just a perspective, you know. I think everybody was
• 1:15:13
  surprised to hear it, you know.
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 2: Well, I think people are so accustomed to electricity and
• 1:15:17
  so accustomed to things like refrigeration. Yeah.
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 3: They're running water, yeah. Yeah.
• 1:15:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, when there was no refrigeration, you had
• 1:15:25
  to eat what you had. You know, like that day.
• 1:15:28
  And then the next day you had to get something else.
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:15:31
  Speaker 2: And unless you knew a place that was an ice house,
• 1:15:36
  you know, that would get a giant chunk of ice
• 1:15:39
  and you could have a nice box and stick it
• 1:15:41
  in there and cool things. Like, you're fucked.
• 1:15:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah. You're on your own.
• 1:15:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, you had to learn how to dry meat.
• 1:15:49
  That was a lot of it. Make pemmican, dry meat,
• 1:15:52
  make things that'll survive and last forever. And, you know,
• 1:15:58
  that's also how market hunting almost wiped out all the
• 1:16:01
  deer in this country because people needed fresh meat every day.
• 1:16:05
  So they were just shooting everything that existed.
• 1:16:08
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:16:08
  Speaker 2: And then finally they started looking around and going, hey,
• 1:16:11
  we lost all the elk. There's no more deer left. Like,
• 1:16:13
  let's make some fucking regulations on this shit. And they
• 1:16:17
  stopped market hunting.
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 3: I did not know that.
• 1:16:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah. It's interesting. Beginning of the 1800s by, you know,
• 1:16:25
  the time, I guess... When did they start doing regulations
• 1:16:30
  in terms of hunting regulations in this country? Because obviously
• 1:16:34
  they wiped out almost entirely the American bison. They were
• 1:16:39
  almost gone completely. And, you know, a lot of that
• 1:16:41
  was just for tongues.
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 3: No, man, that's crazy.
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they would send them back east. They would pickle
• 1:16:47
  their tongues.
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 3: Didn't Steve Rinella have something like a show on? My
• 1:16:51
  buddy was telling me. He's got a great book, too.
• 1:16:52
  I haven't seen it yet. It's really interesting. He's talking
• 1:16:54
  about the history of the bison and hunting and all
• 1:16:56
  of that, yeah.
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think his book is called American Buffalo, but
• 1:16:59
  it's really good. First hunting regulations appeared in colonial laws
• 1:17:05
  in the 1600s, mainly as seasonal closed seasons for certain
• 1:17:09
  game like deer. In terms of nationwide U.S. law, the
• 1:17:13
  first major federal game protection statute was the Lacey Act
• 1:17:16
  of 1900, which targeted commercial and market hunting and interstate
• 1:17:21
  trade in illegally taken wildlife. Yeah, there was elk in
• 1:17:26
  every state. And we wiped them out. And there was
• 1:17:29
  deer in every state. But now there's more deer than
• 1:17:32
  there ever has been before, which is interesting. Congress passed
• 1:17:36
  the Lacey Act when modern regulations start. So the 1900s,
• 1:17:42
  most states had game and fish commissions, hunting seasons, bag
• 1:17:46
  limits and license requirements, all reinforced by federal laws like
• 1:17:50
  the Lacey Act and later migratory bird protections. Well, it's
• 1:17:56
  amazing that they did that. We have an amazing system too.
• 1:17:59
  Like the fact that the United States has so much
• 1:18:02
  public land. There's so many different places where people can
• 1:18:06
  go and they can hike. They can whitewater raft. They
• 1:18:09
  can fish. They can hunt. They can camp. I mean
• 1:18:12
  we're unlike any country when it comes to that. It's
• 1:18:15
  like the amount of land that we have that's available
• 1:18:19
  to Americans that every– it's public for everybody.
• 1:18:22
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:18:22
  Speaker 2: It's fucking incredible.
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 3: Yeah. I mean, being up in Montana, New Mexico is
• 1:18:26
  like that too in California. But up in Montana, you know,
• 1:18:29
  staying in that wilderness area, like that little cabin that
• 1:18:32
  I stayed in, you know, probably didn't have much land
• 1:18:35
  with the cabin. But, man, there's thousands and thousands of
• 1:18:39
  acres of wilderness public land with dirt roads everywhere. And, man,
• 1:18:43
  I would, you know, on those days off that I had,
• 1:18:47
  I would just drive back in there for miles. man,
• 1:18:50
  and just see the most beautiful country, you know, and,
• 1:18:53
  and I'd haul my horse back in the way of
• 1:18:55
  the trail heads and just go explore stuff, you know,
• 1:18:57
  and you had to go over one ridge into the
• 1:19:01
  next and there's a waterfall and there's, and there's another drainage.
• 1:19:04
  And it's just like, You know, and this is the
• 1:19:06
  wilderness area, too. This isn't even a national park. You know,
• 1:19:09
  I was like, man, this is as beautiful country as
• 1:19:12
  I've ever seen anywhere.
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 2: Did you run into any grizzlies?
• 1:19:15
  Speaker 3: I never did. You know, I was always on my
• 1:19:18
  toes about it. And I'd talk, you know, knowing Remy
• 1:19:21
  up there, he knew that area really well. So I'd
• 1:19:23
  kind of ask him spots to go check out and
• 1:19:26
  about bears and stuff. And he said, man, there weren't
• 1:19:28
  too many grizzlies back in there, but you never know,
• 1:19:30
  you know, especially coming over from Idaho and stuff like that.
• 1:19:33
  Speaker 2: So.
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 3: I never did. I've run into some black bears, never
• 1:19:37
  in any wolves and all that. But, you know, I
• 1:19:42
  don't know, maybe being horseback, too. I don't know. A
• 1:19:44
  lot of those places I never did. But I definitely
• 1:19:48
  had my eyes open.
• 1:19:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's another animal that they want to list again
• 1:19:53
  and make them available for hunting, particularly in Montana and Wyoming.
• 1:19:57
  They just have a lot of grizzlies.
• 1:19:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 2: They have a lot, and people don't want you to
• 1:20:02
  shoot them. They think of it as trophy hunting or
• 1:20:05
  whatever it is.
• 1:20:06
  Speaker 3: It's tough, man. But, man, you live, like you say,
• 1:20:08
  like those folks that live back up in there. All
• 1:20:11
  they have is their neighbors and people to depend on.
• 1:20:14
  It's like, man, you get mauled by a bear taking
• 1:20:16
  your trash out or something like that. That's what you do.
• 1:20:20
  your experiences with them, and, you know, everybody wants to
• 1:20:23
  keep them as pets until they're in the backyard with you.
• 1:20:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah. They don't play by the rules. They don't play
• 1:20:30
  by the rules, and they're 900 pounds. Good luck. A
• 1:20:34
  900-pound giant fucking wild animal that eats everything it can.
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, even like that lion hanging around my house. I
• 1:20:40
  was like, man, cool, you're fine, but why don't you
• 1:20:43
  go on down the road, you know?
• 1:20:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:20:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah. I don't need you in my backyard.
• 1:20:48
  Speaker 2: The thing is that you can't do anything about it either.
• 1:20:50
  In Texas, you could just shoot them.
• 1:20:51
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, we don't have that problem.
• 1:20:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's how it should be.
• 1:20:56
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 2: Like you shouldn't have wild monsters living in your yard.
• 1:21:00
  Speaker 3: No. You should have the right to decide that for yourself.
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 2: 100%. Not only that, they're going to be fine. There's
• 1:21:07
  still going to be plenty of them.
• 1:21:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:21:09
  Speaker 2: Okay, but it'll probably be a more healthy number if
• 1:21:11
  they get whacked whenever they eat someone's dog.
• 1:21:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and have a healthy respect for coming in your
• 1:21:16
  backyard or coming after your animals or your kids.
• 1:21:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they should understand that. But just like we're so goofy.
• 1:21:24
  We make laws to protect them that don't protect us. Like,
• 1:21:30
  help me out. Like, do you love animals more than people? Like,
• 1:21:34
  I love animals, but I'm. I'm on team people. Yeah.
• 1:21:38
  Speaker 1: 100%.
• 1:21:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Everybody else is cool, but team people first.
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 2: You know, oh, we got monsters in our neighborhood? No, no, no, no, no, no.
• 1:21:46
  We got to kill the monsters so the kids can
• 1:21:48
  play outside. You don't have to worry about them getting eaten. Yeah,
• 1:21:51
  me too.
• 1:21:51
  Speaker 3: I mean, growing up ranching or farming or whatever, I mean,
• 1:21:55
  that's your job is to take care of animals, you know? Yeah.
• 1:21:58
  It's animal husbandry. That's your job.
• 1:22:01
  Speaker 2: I mean, to.
• 1:22:03
  Speaker 3: take care and provide for these animals to provide food
• 1:22:06
  for your family you know and um and the wildlife
• 1:22:09
  that's around it you know it's like and to take
• 1:22:11
  care of the land and the dirt and the water
• 1:22:14
  and the grasses and all of that stuff has to
• 1:22:16
  be supporting each other to make it all work you
• 1:22:19
  know and uh at the end of the day i
• 1:22:22
  just feel like we've just lost touch It's cities.
• 1:22:26
  Speaker 2: It's urban environments. It's unnatural environments that have given people
• 1:22:30
  this delusional idea of what our relationship is with nature.
• 1:22:35
  And people just think food comes from a restaurant. And
• 1:22:40
  the ground is for streets. And you drive around. Sidewalks.
• 1:22:44
  Speaker 3: Just pave it all.
• 1:22:45
  Speaker 2: It's all just this delusional perspective that comes from that
• 1:22:48
  sort of urban existence. And I just think that's why
• 1:22:52
  people that live in the country and live in, you know,
• 1:22:55
  environments like Alaska where you're confronted by nature, they're like
• 1:23:00
  more interesting people. They're more robust. They're cooler. Were you
• 1:23:05
  saying out there earlier that you rode bulls?
• 1:23:08
  Speaker 3: Mm-hmm. Yeah.
• 1:23:09
  Speaker 2: Dude. How many times?
• 1:23:13
  Speaker 3: Shoot, I started when I was a kid, you know,
• 1:23:15
  riding steers when I was like 10 in the junior
• 1:23:17
  rodeos and then– You were.
• 1:23:19
  Speaker 2: 10 years old and someone let you ride a fucking steer?
• 1:23:22
  Speaker 3: Really?
• 1:23:24
  Speaker 2: That's so crazy.
• 1:23:24
  Speaker 3: It was like Little League Baseball, you know, when I
• 1:23:26
  grew up.
• 1:23:29
  Speaker 2: So a steer is a bull that doesn't have its nuts. Yeah.
• 1:23:32
  And so how much less do they kick when they
• 1:23:35
  don't have their nuts?
• 1:23:36
  Speaker 3: Oh, they're pretty docile.
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 2: Is this you?
• 1:23:38
  Speaker 3: Oh, you found the video.
• 1:23:40
  Speaker 2: How old are you here?
• 1:23:42
  Speaker 3: This is, I was like 17. This is in Monterey, Mexico, actually. Wow.
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 2: Why in Mexico? Look at you, dog. Damn, that's crazy. Damn, dude,
• 1:23:56
  you're good. And you got off without getting stomped, too.
• 1:24:00
  Is it just knowing when to release?
• 1:24:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you got to know when to get off.
• 1:24:05
  Speaker 2: That's for sure. And right there, you're like, that's a wrap.
• 1:24:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah, he kind of bucked me off there. He kind
• 1:24:11
  of had me over to the side there, you know,
• 1:24:12
  but that's a good time to check out. There's like
• 1:24:15
  that gray zone, you know. Either that or you hang
• 1:24:17
  on and you end up underneath them.
• 1:24:19
  Speaker 2: You started out when you were 10 years old, though.
• 1:24:21
  How wild are your parents? Like, yeah, that's a good age.
• 1:24:25
  Speaker 3: They've ranched and grew up out there. And my uncle
• 1:24:29
  rode bulls professionally.
• 1:24:30
  Speaker 2: Oh, really? Yeah.
• 1:24:32
  Speaker 3: And that's kind of how I got into it, too.
• 1:24:34
  I looked up to him a lot and see pictures
• 1:24:37
  of him riding bulls. And then it was just around.
• 1:24:39
  And I was like, I want to try that, you know.
• 1:24:42
  And then I just got the bug for it, like
• 1:24:44
  super young. I was like just. ate up with it just.
• 1:24:47
  Speaker 2: Wow from 10 years old that's nuts yeah and so
• 1:24:51
  how do you teach someone how to fall off of
• 1:24:54
  a bull without getting stomped when they're.
• 1:24:56
  Speaker 3: 10 well when you're riding those little steers you know
• 1:24:58
  a lot of time they cut bulls and turn them
• 1:25:01
  to steers because it makes them a lot more docile
• 1:25:03
  steers are you know typically like 600 pounds 600 700
• 1:25:08
  pounds you know compared to 1500 pound bull that's aggressive
• 1:25:12
  and you know back that wide and horns like that
• 1:25:15
  you know They're like little steer, you know. I remember
• 1:25:18
  my dad or uncle would get in the chute with
• 1:25:20
  me and hold their horns, you know. And, like, they
• 1:25:23
  just kind of run out there and jump and kick
• 1:25:25
  and fall off on the side. Yeah, not too bad.
• 1:25:28
  And then you kind of graduate up into, like, the
• 1:25:31
  junior bulls and then the bigger bulls and then the
• 1:25:35
  harder they buck, you know. So there's kind of different
• 1:25:37
  levels you can progress as you go. But it was
• 1:25:42
  a lot different deal back then when I was riding
• 1:25:43
  it was– Really before the PBR started, you know, there
• 1:25:46
  was no helmets. There was no vests. There was like
• 1:25:49
  none of that stuff. It was just old school rodeo,
• 1:25:52
  you know. But at the same time, I say that, but,
• 1:25:56
  you know, it's evolved in such a sport now. Like
• 1:25:59
  the bulls are just so much ranker now than they
• 1:26:02
  were back then, you know. It's like now they're breeding
• 1:26:04
  them like racehorses and the genetics where every one of
• 1:26:08
  those bulls, you know, bucks, you know, and like, you
• 1:26:10
  got to go to get on three or four of
• 1:26:12
  them in the night, you know, back when I was
• 1:26:13
  doing it, we'd go to the, they were still kind
• 1:26:15
  of full rodeos with all the other events. And, you know,
• 1:26:19
  out of 15 or 20 bulls, there might be one
• 1:26:21
  or two in there that were like bad to get on.
• 1:26:23
  They would hurt you, you know, the, the rest of
• 1:26:26
  them were, were pretty rideable, you know, just to say so. And,
• 1:26:30
  you know, we're smoking cigarettes and drinking beer back behind
• 1:26:32
  the sheets. So, you know, that kind of a thing,
• 1:26:34
  you know, we, we, We weren't training and doing yoga.
• 1:26:37
  I like how these guys are today. I loved it.
• 1:26:44
  I had so much fun, and I loved the road
• 1:26:45
  part of it. Get in the truck with your best
• 1:26:48
  buds and go down the road on the weekends. There
• 1:26:51
  was always a band playing. It was so much fun.
• 1:26:55
  I loved the culture of it. It was just good times.
• 1:27:00
  Speaker 2: How many times do you think you've rode bulls?
• 1:27:02
  Speaker 3: I rode until I was about 23.
• 1:27:05
  Speaker 2: From 10 to 23? Mm-hmm. Wow.
• 1:27:07
  Speaker 3: That was all I ever wanted to do. Really? Yeah,
• 1:27:10
  I wanted to just ride bulls, yeah. And, you know,
• 1:27:14
  I rode in high school. I rode junior rodeos, rode
• 1:27:16
  bulls in high school. And then I went to Tarleton
• 1:27:18
  State and Stephenville and rode bulls for Tarleton. And then
• 1:27:23
  I got my pro card for a couple of years.
• 1:27:26
  And that was when, like, the PBR was, like, starting
• 1:27:28
  up and all of that. And, yeah.
• 1:27:33
  Speaker 2: Wow.
• 1:27:33
  Speaker 3: It got intense. I just saw a picture of you
• 1:27:35
  backwards on one.
• 1:27:36
  Speaker 2: What, Jamie? There's one picture I just lost.
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 3: He was backwards on it. Oh, yeah. I was probably
• 1:27:40
  getting dusted. Oh, no, that's not me.
• 1:27:44
  Speaker 2: That's not backwards.
• 1:27:46
  Speaker 3: That guy is riding backwards.
• 1:27:47
  Speaker 2: It is.
• 1:27:48
  Speaker 3: I don't know if that's on purpose.
• 1:27:52
  Speaker 2: That seems like a ridiculous choice.
• 1:27:55
  Speaker 3: He pulled it off if he did.
• 1:27:56
  Speaker 2: What a terrible choice.
• 1:27:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. It was cool, though. I loved it, man.
• 1:28:03
  I loved it.
• 1:28:05
  Speaker 2: How do you go from that to anything else? Like,
• 1:28:08
  how do you stop riding bulls and eventually become an
• 1:28:12
  actor and a singer?
• 1:28:13
  Speaker 3: It was all very much kind of a natural progression,
• 1:28:16
  you know. Really? Since I was a kid at the
• 1:28:18
  junior rodeos, there was always a dance afterward and a
• 1:28:21
  band playing, you know. And it was very much a family,
• 1:28:23
  community deal, you know. Like, you go to these towns
• 1:28:27
  and the rodeo was going on and the dance was
• 1:28:28
  going on. street dance and food and music and growing
• 1:28:35
  up listening to bands play, especially in Texas. You know,
• 1:28:37
  you got all the guys like Gary P. Nunn. I
• 1:28:39
  remember he, he always played the dance halls and you
• 1:28:42
  get Robert O'Keen and some of the, you know, growing
• 1:28:45
  up here in those bands. And, um, I moved to Laredo,
• 1:28:49
  Texas when I was like 16 or 17, when my
• 1:28:52
  dad and my mother had bought me a guitar and, uh,
• 1:28:56
  didn't know how to play it much. And, uh, walked
• 1:28:59
  into this place my dad was living at, and he
• 1:29:01
  was playing dominoes with these guys, and this guy saw
• 1:29:04
  my guitar, and he's like, yeah, you know how to
• 1:29:06
  play that thing? I said, no. He said, well, let
• 1:29:09
  me see it. And he picked it up, and he
• 1:29:10
  played this killer, like, mariachi song called La Malagueña. And
• 1:29:13
  I was just fascinated with it. I was just like, wow,
• 1:29:16
  I can't believe you made that guitar sound like that,
• 1:29:18
  you know? I've been dragging that thing around for a
• 1:29:20
  couple years. I don't even know how to tune it up.
• 1:29:22
  And he's like, you want to learn how to play
• 1:29:24
  this guitar? I said, yeah. He said, let me show
• 1:29:27
  you this song. He taught me the Malagaña. It had
• 1:29:30
  a couple little parts, you know, a finger-picking part, a
• 1:29:32
  strumming part, and it really kind of gave me that foundation,
• 1:29:37
  you know, just kind of those few little tools. And
• 1:29:40
  then I went up to Stephenville to ride bulls at
• 1:29:42
  Tarleton after that, and a couple other friends that I'd
• 1:29:45
  met there that rodeoed could play the guitar a little bit,
• 1:29:48
  and they had bands that played every weekend in the town.
• 1:29:51
  There was a little bar there called City Limits where
• 1:29:53
  all these bands would come play, like Jason Bolin and
• 1:29:55
  the cross Canadian ragweed guys and Pat Green and, uh,
• 1:30:00
  Robert O'Keefe, like all the Texas guys would come play,
• 1:30:02
  you know? So I was like, I went from being
• 1:30:04
  on the border and just kind of just mostly like
• 1:30:07
  the Carrillos and Tejano bands that I would see, which
• 1:30:09
  was really cool. But when I got up there, I
• 1:30:11
  was like, Oh man, there's all these like cool kind
• 1:30:13
  of song, you know, guys writing the original music and
• 1:30:16
  songs and playing in bands. And, um, we'd, we'd go
• 1:30:20
  watch them all the time. And, uh, as I was
• 1:30:22
  still rodeoing, the only song I knew was that, um,
• 1:30:26
  model gang, the tune. So I was like, I got
• 1:30:28
  to come up with some new stuff. That's all I
• 1:30:29
  know how to play. I went and got a book
• 1:30:31
  of chords to teach myself some new chords on the guitar.
• 1:30:34
  And we just learned one or two at a time.
• 1:30:37
  And I'd start making up songs about our adventures on
• 1:30:39
  the weekends. You know, a lot of it was just
• 1:30:41
  sitting in the back of the truck and being in
• 1:30:43
  places where you didn't have radio signal or, you know,
• 1:30:46
  nothing to really listen to. You're tired of listening to
• 1:30:48
  the same old stuff. And I'd make up songs and
• 1:30:50
  then whatever town we would get to my buddies be
• 1:30:53
  like man play that song you were singing in the
• 1:30:55
  back seat you know and and so that's how the
• 1:30:57
  whole songwriting thing started and then um i ended up
• 1:31:01
  getting a job working for a guy named mac altizer
• 1:31:04
  he had a rodeo company called bag company rodeo in
• 1:31:06
  del rio and i'd ridden bulls at some of his
• 1:31:11
  rodeos and knew him my uncle knew him you know
• 1:31:13
  over the years and so i was kind of familiar
• 1:31:15
  with with uh that whole thing and uh Started working
• 1:31:19
  for him on the ranch and helping with some of
• 1:31:21
  the rodeo stuff and still riding bulls. And he found
• 1:31:24
  out that I could play the guitar and sing a
• 1:31:26
  few songs. And he always had a party at the rodeo.
• 1:31:29
  He was kind of notorious and famous for having, like,
• 1:31:32
  just awesome parties. And he's like, man, all right, Bingham,
• 1:31:34
  get your guitar. You're going to play, like, the after party.
• 1:31:37
  You know, and pull the flatbed trailer up there for
• 1:31:39
  the hospitality tent for all the contestants after the rodeo.
• 1:31:42
  And those are, like, the first. He really encouraged me to, like,
• 1:31:45
  start playing for people and doing that. And then it
• 1:31:48
  would just spill over into the bars afterwards, after the
• 1:31:50
  rodeo and everybody would end up going to the bar.
• 1:31:52
  And I was like, bring your guitar with you. And, uh,
• 1:31:56
  I started getting gigs in the bars. The bars would
• 1:31:59
  ask me to, if I wanted to come back and play.
• 1:32:00
  And just after like, I feel like a few years
• 1:32:03
  of that, it was just like, you know, I was
• 1:32:06
  kind of a weekend warrior riding bulls. I was definitely
• 1:32:09
  not going to making a living doing it. Always had
• 1:32:11
  to have a day job during the week, you know,
• 1:32:13
  either working on the ranch or doing something. And, uh,
• 1:32:17
  I started getting to where I could go to these
• 1:32:19
  bars and make like a hundred bucks in tips, you know,
• 1:32:21
  within a couple of hours and get free beer and
• 1:32:24
  free food. And I was like, man, this is almost
• 1:32:27
  as much as I made all day digging holes with
• 1:32:29
  the shovel. It didn't take me long to figure out
• 1:32:32
  that that was pretty cool. And I was just like,
• 1:32:36
  I'm going to stick with it.
• 1:32:38
  Speaker 2: What an organic sort of a journey, you know, like
• 1:32:41
  a natural progression.
• 1:32:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah. And I didn't have high expectations, you know, but
• 1:32:46
  I just like, And I was talking about kind of
• 1:32:49
  community in this Austin area and in Texas in general.
• 1:32:52
  It's just like, man, people were so supportive then of
• 1:32:54
  just like, if you had a song to play it,
• 1:32:56
  people love live music. They're like, yeah, get up and play,
• 1:32:58
  you know, like Mac with the rodeo company and all
• 1:33:01
  the guys that worked there, Dave Jennings and Casey and Smyrna.
• 1:33:06
  There's a whole crew of the bad company crew from
• 1:33:08
  those days. And they always had kind of the bad
• 1:33:10
  company house band too, where everybody would get up and
• 1:33:12
  try to play a song. And it's just like, man,
• 1:33:14
  we don't, care if it's any good or not, just
• 1:33:16
  get up there and play. We're all, we're all in
• 1:33:18
  it together. And there were so many like places that
• 1:33:20
  were like that, that I don't think if I was
• 1:33:22
  in that environment, I probably would have never pursued it.
• 1:33:25
  You know, I just had so many people, you know,
• 1:33:28
  supporting you and encouraging you to try it. And it
• 1:33:30
  took me a long time, you know, to, uh, work
• 1:33:33
  stuff out and learn. Cause I didn't have any really
• 1:33:36
  formal music, musical background or lessons or training. I had
• 1:33:40
  to really just learned it on the road and playing
• 1:33:42
  in bars and, from other musicians. Really?
• 1:33:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So no lessons at all, just kind of figuring
• 1:33:48
  it out along the way.
• 1:33:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, they got, you know, the guy taught me
• 1:33:51
  the La Malagaña there, but then after that, it was just,
• 1:33:55
  you know, anybody else who had a guitar and might
• 1:33:58
  know a song, you know, I'm like, Oh, what cool,
• 1:33:59
  how do you play that chord? You know, like, Oh,
• 1:34:01
  you play it like this.
• 1:34:02
  Speaker 2: You know? Wow. So how many years were you doing
• 1:34:09
  that before you got Yellowstone?
• 1:34:13
  Speaker 3: Oh, gosh, for a while. I mean, I think my,
• 1:34:16
  you know, I was 22 or something like that in Stephenville.
• 1:34:22
  You know, Ryan Bull was starting to play songs, trying
• 1:34:24
  to play gigs. After, you know, ended up moving down
• 1:34:31
  here to New Braunfels in the Austin area playing music
• 1:34:34
  for a while and then ended up going out to
• 1:34:36
  Los Angeles and playing and then hit the road with
• 1:34:38
  a band for, I think I had four or five
• 1:34:42
  albums or so. You know, out, you know, I've been
• 1:34:44
  touring for five or six years. I think, how old
• 1:34:48
  was I, like, when Yellowstone started? Like, 36, 37. So, yeah,
• 1:34:55
  I'd been playing, doing the music stuff for a long time.
• 1:34:59
  Speaker 2: And so how did the Yellowstone, how did you go
• 1:35:01
  from music to Yellowstone? Like, how did you even, did
• 1:35:03
  you do any acting before that?
• 1:35:06
  Speaker 3: No, I'd been one, I'd done a film with Jeff
• 1:35:09
  Bridges years ago called Crazy Heart and wrote some songs
• 1:35:12
  for that movie. And that was really my own thing.
• 1:35:15
  Speaker 2: That was a good movie.
• 1:35:17
  Speaker 3: It was pretty cool. You know, I w I was
• 1:35:18
  just like, uh, Jeff Bridges plays a musician in the
• 1:35:22
  show and I, and we're like the backup band at
• 1:35:24
  the bowling alley for one of the scenes, you know,
• 1:35:27
  which was really cool. Um, and then, uh, written some
• 1:35:31
  songs for some other films and some TV shows since then.
• 1:35:34
  And I, uh, met a guy named John Linson out in, uh,
• 1:35:38
  in Los Angeles, a producer and his, him and, His dad,
• 1:35:41
  Art Lentz, and they did like Sons of Anarchy, a
• 1:35:44
  bunch of shows and a bunch of great movies. And
• 1:35:48
  he introduced me to Taylor. And Taylor was, I think
• 1:35:52
  it was that movie Wind River, his first movie. I'd
• 1:35:54
  met Taylor and just kind of talk about music and stuff.
• 1:35:58
  And he wanted me to write a song for Wind River.
• 1:36:00
  And I'd given it a shot a couple of times,
• 1:36:02
  never really had anything that fit for what he wanted.
• 1:36:05
  But he ended up using a song that I'd already written.
• 1:36:08
  And we just kind of kept in touch. And then
• 1:36:10
  when the Yellowstone thing came up, he got in touch
• 1:36:13
  again about writing some songs for the show. And then
• 1:36:16
  he learned that I used to do all the rodeo stuff,
• 1:36:18
  I think, and grew up ranching. And he's like, well, shoot,
• 1:36:20
  you can do a lot of this stuff. I've got
• 1:36:22
  to find a way to get you in the show,
• 1:36:24
  you know. And it literally went from the conversation. He
• 1:36:27
  was like, well, I don't know what I'm going to
• 1:36:29
  do with you, but I'll find something to do with you,
• 1:36:32
  you know. And he literally said, he's like, you know,
• 1:36:34
  if you do good, I'll, you know, you guys, if
• 1:36:36
  you suck, I'll kill you off. If you do good,
• 1:36:39
  I'll keep you on. Something like that. You know what
• 1:36:42
  I'm like? So you had.
• 1:36:44
  Speaker 2: No formal acting, like training or anything?
• 1:36:47
  Speaker 3: No, not at all.
• 1:36:49
  Speaker 2: That's what's amazing, dude. You're really good.
• 1:36:51
  Speaker 3: Oh, I appreciate that. You know, I get to kind
• 1:36:54
  of play a cowboy and be a little bit of myself.
• 1:36:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's, that role's got some complexity to it.
• 1:37:01
  It's not just a cowboy. It's like, you've got some,
• 1:37:04
  complicated scenes, you know, some emotional scenes, some deep scenes
• 1:37:08
  and you're really good, man.
• 1:37:10
  Speaker 3: Thank you.
• 1:37:10
  Speaker 2: That's impressive.
• 1:37:11
  Speaker 3: I appreciate that. It was, I enjoyed it. You know,
• 1:37:14
  I hadn't done much acting at all. And, um, I
• 1:37:17
  gotta give a lot of credit to the actors that
• 1:37:19
  are on the show too. You know, those folks that
• 1:37:21
  have really studied it and paid their dues, learning that craft,
• 1:37:26
  you know, they really create the environment, you know, especially
• 1:37:29
  for me, not knowing much about it, you know, and
• 1:37:32
  just kind of being a part of the scene. Like
• 1:37:33
  they're so good that, they make you react in a
• 1:37:36
  certain way.
• 1:37:37
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:37:37
  Speaker 3: You know, they, they know how to get it out
• 1:37:39
  of you.
• 1:37:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:37:40
  Speaker 3: You know, Cole and Luke and all those folks, you know,
• 1:37:44
  they're like, they, they know how to set up the
• 1:37:46
  scene and they know what they're doing. So they already
• 1:37:47
  kind of have the whole thing set up. And so
• 1:37:50
  when I walk into a scene and they say they're
• 1:37:53
  lying to me, it's just like, Oh, okay.
• 1:37:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I got to answer. Right.
• 1:37:56
  Speaker 3: I like, I'm just like, kind of like naturally answering that,
• 1:38:00
  you know?
• 1:38:01
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:38:01
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 1:38:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah. It's like, If you work with a really good actor,
• 1:38:04
  sometimes you forget they're acting. You're like, oh, yeah, we're acting.
• 1:38:09
  You seem like this is really happening. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:38:12
  Speaker 3: For me, I think it was the moments where I
• 1:38:14
  thought it was really happening.
• 1:38:16
  Speaker 2: How long did it take before you got comfortable doing
• 1:38:18
  that on camera? Still not. Really?
• 1:38:21
  Speaker 3: Yeah, still not, yeah.
• 1:38:22
  Speaker 2: Well, you play it off good.
• 1:38:23
  Speaker 3: Well, thanks, you know. I think some of it comes
• 1:38:26
  from the riding bulls. You know, you learn how to
• 1:38:28
  channel that anxiety or fear into just like, oh, okay,
• 1:38:32
  it's go time. Let's just kind of pull it together
• 1:38:35
  and channel that, you know.
• 1:38:37
  Speaker 2: If you could ride a bull, I think you could
• 1:38:39
  kind of do basically anything.
• 1:38:41
  Speaker 3: Man, you know, that's one thing my uncle taught me
• 1:38:44
  when I was young. You know, he was really quick
• 1:38:46
  to be like, man, it doesn't matter how strong you are.
• 1:38:49
  you know, it's not about, it's all mental. It's all
• 1:38:51
  in your mind and it's all, uh, it's not, I
• 1:38:55
  think I can, it's, I know I can and I will,
• 1:38:58
  you know, and he goes, if you don't, if you
• 1:39:00
  don't believe that every time you go put your rope
• 1:39:02
  on one of those, on their backs, he's like, it
• 1:39:05
  ain't gonna happen. Yeah. He says, you don't, it's not
• 1:39:08
  being cocky. It's just being confident, you know, and believing
• 1:39:12
  in yourself and, and having that, that power of mind
• 1:39:15
  over matter, you know?
• 1:39:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah. If you could do that, acting's easy.
• 1:39:19
  Speaker 3: And take that into anything in life.
• 1:39:20
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:39:21
  Speaker 3: And I do because I definitely have moments where, you know,
• 1:39:24
  I'm like, whew, okay, take a deep breath. Right. It's
• 1:39:29
  go time. Let's go, you know.
• 1:39:30
  Speaker 2: Well, especially having more than a decade of doing that
• 1:39:34
  with bulls. Like that's so uncontrollable. Like it is like
• 1:39:41
  you're at the mercy of fate and how this plays out. Yeah.
• 1:39:45
  And you have this enormous beast and you've chosen– to
• 1:39:49
  scare the shit out of yourself. Get on top of
• 1:39:51
  this thing and try to ride it.
• 1:39:53
  Speaker 3: You chose it to join the dance. If you can
• 1:39:56
  do that, if.
• 1:39:56
  Speaker 2: You can do that and be successful at that, I
• 1:39:59
  kind of think you could do anything. I think that,
• 1:40:02
  I mean, I wouldn't want my kid to do it
• 1:40:03
  at 10, but fuck, it's probably, if they could survive...
• 1:40:07
  pretty valuable. I laugh.
• 1:40:08
  Speaker 3: I really picked two of the easiest professions, you know,
• 1:40:12
  riding bulls and playing music.
• 1:40:14
  Speaker 2: Two that have the least amount of success ratio.
• 1:40:18
  Speaker 3: Impossible tasks. Right.
• 1:40:21
  Speaker 2: Well, did you ever get any serious injuries?
• 1:40:24
  Speaker 3: Uh, you know, I was fortunate, like not serious. There
• 1:40:29
  was one of the worst I ever, I got knocked
• 1:40:30
  all these teeth out and I got jerked down one
• 1:40:32
  night in Weatherford. And, um, took my lip off and
• 1:40:35
  my teeth went through down here and these are all
• 1:40:39
  fake up here and then my lip was just hanging
• 1:40:41
  right there what was why it didn't knock me out
• 1:40:43
  which was wild though i got on this bull and
• 1:40:46
  uh i remember it was in weatherford texas and uh
• 1:40:50
  it's got a butler arena there and he had this
• 1:40:54
  um little angus bull there didn't have horns on him
• 1:40:57
  little muley and uh usually you can go up to
• 1:40:59
  the guys that own the bulls and a lot of
• 1:41:01
  the bulls have patterns you know that they that they'll
• 1:41:03
  do over and over, you know, so you can kind
• 1:41:05
  of talk to the stock contractor or the guys that
• 1:41:07
  own them and be like, hey, you know, what's this
• 1:41:08
  bull generally do? And he's like, ah, most of the
• 1:41:11
  time they'll take two jumps out and they spin to
• 1:41:13
  the left. Or they take two jumps and they go
• 1:41:14
  to the right. Or, oh, they just, you know, they'll
• 1:41:16
  jump kick around and make a circle. And he goes, man,
• 1:41:19
  he goes, I don't know. He's like, the last two
• 1:41:21
  times I bucked, he hadn't been ridden. He usually jumps
• 1:41:24
  out there and just spins right in the gate. And
• 1:41:26
  he said, nobody's really ridden him past three or four seconds.
• 1:41:28
  So he goes, I don't know what he's going to
• 1:41:30
  do after that. And sure enough, That's what happened. I
• 1:41:33
  got on him and he jumped out and just got
• 1:41:37
  it on right there in the gate, just spinning right there.
• 1:41:39
  And I rode him through it like three or four rounds.
• 1:41:42
  And after I rode him, like, I think the bully
• 1:41:44
  didn't know what to do next. He got a little
• 1:41:45
  frustrated and he just stopped and just stopped dead still
• 1:41:49
  and just blowing and just, you know, just mad. And
• 1:41:53
  you never really want to jump off of them when
• 1:41:55
  they're still like that. Cause you just, you'll fall right beside.
• 1:41:58
  Speaker 2: Them, you know?
• 1:41:59
  Speaker 3: So you want them to have a little momentum. So
• 1:42:01
  when you, you know, you're checking out, they can, you
• 1:42:03
  can get away from them.
• 1:42:04
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:42:05
  Speaker 3: And so I spurred him a little bit to get
• 1:42:07
  him to jump. So when he jumped, I could jump off.
• 1:42:10
  But when I spurred him, it just jumped off straight
• 1:42:13
  up off the ground, like a cat off all fours.
• 1:42:16
  And when he came crack and when he jumped up
• 1:42:18
  like that, I, you know, kind of rocked me back
• 1:42:20
  on back like that. My hands still tied in the rope.
• 1:42:23
  And then when he came down, he just brought all
• 1:42:25
  that jerk me down with the fours. And I came
• 1:42:27
  forward and he threw his head back and I just
• 1:42:29
  head butted him. Oh, yeah. And when he did, my
• 1:42:34
  hand was still caught in the rope, and then he
• 1:42:36
  took off running around and just drug me around and
• 1:42:38
  just stomped the crap out of me for a bit.
• 1:42:42
  And I finally got loose, and I remember running over
• 1:42:45
  to the fence, and I just kind of had my
• 1:42:48
  arms on the fence, and I could see all the
• 1:42:49
  blood just kind of pouring down all over me. And
• 1:42:52
  one of the bullfighters ran up, and he looks at
• 1:42:54
  me and goes, Oh, buddy. He's like, whoo.
• 1:43:00
  Speaker 2: So they have to stitch your lip back on?
• 1:43:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and the shock was just, I didn't feel anything.
• 1:43:06
  I was just in shock. I was like, oh, man.
• 1:43:09
  I remember my girlfriend was there from high school and
• 1:43:11
  my buddy, and we drove to the little, they're like,
• 1:43:15
  you want to call an ambulance? I was like, no,
• 1:43:16
  I don't have health insurance to call an ambulance. Got
• 1:43:21
  in my buddy's car, and we drove her over to
• 1:43:23
  the emergency room in Weatherford, and I go in, and
• 1:43:26
  the nurse, she's just like, oh, man. She's like, we
• 1:43:28
  can't do anything for you here. You're going to have
• 1:43:30
  to go to like Dallas to like trauma. You know,
• 1:43:32
  you have to get like an oral surgeon to put
• 1:43:34
  you back together. And she goes, you want me to,
• 1:43:38
  you know, get you an ambulance there? And I was like, no,
• 1:43:41
  I think we can make it. You know, she's like
• 1:43:43
  she gave me some pain pills. She goes, don't take
• 1:43:45
  these now. She goes, hold on to these. And then
• 1:43:47
  when you get to Dallas, then take them because you're
• 1:43:50
  probably going to have to wait, you know, before they
• 1:43:52
  can because three or four in the morning. where they
• 1:43:55
  can get somebody in there to see us and sure
• 1:43:57
  enough we got to Dallas and I'm just sitting there
• 1:43:59
  in the weight room and I had a rag and
• 1:44:01
  I was just holding my mouth together and the shock
• 1:44:05
  wore off man and then it's you know I was
• 1:44:08
  starting to feel it took those pain meds and then
• 1:44:11
  doctor came in and held me back and gave me
• 1:44:14
  a big shot in the roof of my mouth tried
• 1:44:17
  to numb everything and just I think it took them
• 1:44:19
  longer to clean it all up you know pull all
• 1:44:21
  the hair and dirt out of there and sew me
• 1:44:23
  up and Oh, it was an ordeal, you know, for sure.
• 1:44:27
  For months after that, you know, getting the dental work done,
• 1:44:31
  all that crap.
• 1:44:32
  Speaker 2: So how was the lip hanging off?
• 1:44:35
  Speaker 3: It bit it. It would have came all the way off.
• 1:44:38
  It was just hanging on right here by the side,
• 1:44:40
  so it was just hanging down.
• 1:44:41
  Speaker 2: And so they just had to stitch the lower part
• 1:44:43
  to the upper part and put it all together again?
• 1:44:45
  Speaker 3: Yeah, just all across, right through the middle. And if
• 1:44:48
  I shave, I got a big scar that kind of
• 1:44:49
  goes down there.
• 1:44:50
  Speaker 2: Wow.
• 1:44:50
  Speaker 3: And then they went through down here. So I got
• 1:44:53
  some stitches down there, and then most of the stitches
• 1:44:55
  were all in my gums and all of that.
• 1:44:58
  Speaker 2: So they had to put like posts and implants and
• 1:45:00
  all that stuff? Wow.
• 1:45:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:45:03
  Speaker 2: That shit takes forever, huh?
• 1:45:04
  Speaker 3: Kind of knocked the front four out, and then it
• 1:45:06
  just dominoed the rest of them.
• 1:45:11
  Speaker 2: Riding bulls with no health insurance is wild. That's crazy, man.
• 1:45:16
  That's crazy. That's crazy.
• 1:45:21
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it was just life back then for me. I
• 1:45:23
  think going into the music stuff was like, I don't know.
• 1:45:28
  I just wasn't really scared about it or even the
• 1:45:31
  expectations of making it. I mean, to me, at the time,
• 1:45:33
  I had a truck and a camper on it, and
• 1:45:36
  I was like, man, I got no bills. I got
• 1:45:39
  no responsibilities. I can just go make $ 100 a night
• 1:45:42
  playing music in a bar. I was like, this is
• 1:45:44
  the dream. I made it. Yeah.
• 1:45:49
  Speaker 2: Well, I think when you've done something super, super difficult,
• 1:45:52
  everything else seems easier. And if you've done what you
• 1:45:56
  did with riding bulls for that long, like the music
• 1:46:00
  business is like, that's the worst thing that could happen.
• 1:46:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Even the travel part, you know, like, you know,
• 1:46:05
  in the early days of playing, when I really decided
• 1:46:07
  I was going to try to make a run and play,
• 1:46:10
  you know, and it was like, oh, well, we got
• 1:46:12
  to get in the van and go drive around and
• 1:46:15
  play in bars, you know? And I was like, we've
• 1:46:17
  been doing that rodeoing for years, you know, where you
• 1:46:19
  sleep in the back of the truck or whatever.
• 1:46:21
  Speaker 2: And it was fun for us.
• 1:46:22
  Speaker 3: We loved it. Yeah. So the idea of like starving
• 1:46:25
  on the road, playing in a band, playing music, I
• 1:46:27
  was like, let's go. And getting a guaranteed paycheck every night,
• 1:46:35
  you know. Right.
• 1:46:36
  Speaker 2: The gratitude you must have.
• 1:46:37
  Speaker 3: The riding bulls. I mean, half the time, you know,
• 1:46:39
  you walked away with nothing.
• 1:46:40
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:46:41
  Speaker 3: You know? And you're risking your life. A busted lip.
• 1:46:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And no health insurance. And you're risking your life.
• 1:46:47
  And there's not a bunch of people that love you. No.
• 1:46:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:46:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, it's a great base to start out from.
• 1:46:55
  You know? I mean, it sounds like it's almost like
• 1:46:59
  the universe engineered this path for you to go down. Like,
• 1:47:02
  if you wanted to pick a path that would bring
• 1:47:05
  you to where you are right now, it is the
• 1:47:07
  perfect set of circumstances.
• 1:47:09
  Speaker 3: Oh, I, I, I look at it all the time,
• 1:47:12
  you know, just from an outside perspective, I guess, and
• 1:47:15
  just like, wow, how in the world did all this
• 1:47:17
  come together? And just a lot of luck and perseverance
• 1:47:22
  or whatever. And I, I wouldn't say I haven't worked
• 1:47:24
  hard at it, you know, I feel like I have
• 1:47:26
  and all that, but there's a lot of luck out
• 1:47:28
  there and a lot of good people too, you know,
• 1:47:30
  a lot of good people helped me out along the
• 1:47:32
  way and gave me gas money and, gave me a
• 1:47:35
  place to sleep or place to eat and helped us
• 1:47:38
  get other gigs. I mean, I remember going from one
• 1:47:41
  town to the next and not having gas money to
• 1:47:44
  get to the next and having no plan other than like,
• 1:47:46
  let's just head west or head east. And, you know,
• 1:47:50
  you'd go play at a bar and sure enough, there'd
• 1:47:52
  be somebody there that were like, oh man, y'all should
• 1:47:54
  come back to my house. We'll have bonfire and play
• 1:47:57
  some songs. And he's like, oh, my brother's got a
• 1:47:58
  bar in Phoenix. And he's like, call them on your
• 1:48:01
  way out. You know, we'd go there and And we'd
• 1:48:04
  always like chop firewood or wash dishes or wouldn't mow
• 1:48:07
  your lawn or wash your car on the way to
• 1:48:09
  like to get gas money and keep on going, you know.
• 1:48:11
  Speaker 2: Wow.
• 1:48:12
  Speaker 3: So that was just kind of how it always felt
• 1:48:15
  like I learned early. If you were willing to help yourself,
• 1:48:18
  people would help you all day long.
• 1:48:20
  Speaker 2: I think luck is a factor, but it's only a
• 1:48:26
  factor if you've already had all those other experiences. Think
• 1:48:30
  about it. If you hadn't ridden bulls, you hadn't gone
• 1:48:33
  through all the ranching, all the hard labor, all the
• 1:48:35
  different things, Then, like, you probably wouldn't have capitalized on
• 1:48:40
  that luck the same way.
• 1:48:42
  Speaker 3: No, not at all.
• 1:48:43
  Speaker 2: Your character wouldn't be the same.
• 1:48:45
  Speaker 3: No.
• 1:48:45
  Speaker 2: You know, it's like part of who you are is
• 1:48:49
  the character that you've developed from what you've done.
• 1:48:52
  Speaker 3: It kind of conditioned me to do it in a
• 1:48:54
  big way.
• 1:48:55
  Speaker 2: And it seems like it's your life. It's almost like
• 1:48:57
  it's engineered for this to happen the way it happened,
• 1:49:00
  which is kind of crazy.
• 1:49:01
  Speaker 3: It's been cool, man.
• 1:49:04
  Speaker 2: Very storybook.
• 1:49:05
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:49:06
  Speaker 2: You know very like movie like a plot in a
• 1:49:09
  movie guy who's a cowboy bull rider starts singing songs
• 1:49:13
  people are like hey you should probably do this for
• 1:49:15
  a living and then someone's like hey man you should
• 1:49:17
  be on TV you know and the next thing you
• 1:49:20
  know you're on one of the biggest hits in the world.
• 1:49:23
  Speaker 3: I feel like it's that song one day they're gonna
• 1:49:25
  put me in the movie yeah I was like how
• 1:49:29
  am I living this thing right now you know it's
• 1:49:31
  like I know I meet people all the time they're
• 1:49:33
  like oh like you know They can't really believe where
• 1:49:37
  I'm from or whatever. They just think it's some made-up story.
• 1:49:41
  I'm like, yeah, all right, man.
• 1:49:44
  Speaker 2: Well, it seems like a story that someone would make
• 1:49:46
  up if they wanted to pretend to be a cowboy.
• 1:49:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, I think a lot of people have.
• 1:49:50
  Speaker 2: I bet, right? I bet.
• 1:49:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah. And a lot of people still do. Yeah.
• 1:49:54
  Speaker 2: Isn't that funny? Uh-huh. That's funny. That's like stolen valor almost. Yeah.
• 1:50:00
  You know what I mean?
• 1:50:01
  Speaker 3: I think like in all kinds of stuff, you know,
• 1:50:02
  professions or whatever, you know, people pretend to.
• 1:50:05
  Speaker 2: Be the– Oh, yeah. What it is.
• 1:50:06
  Speaker 3: Oh, yeah. Would you mind if I went to the
• 1:50:09
  restroom real quick? Oh, no, no, no, no.
• 1:50:10
  Speaker 2: Not at all. I totally understand.
• 1:50:11
  Speaker 3: I want to keep talking about– I don't want to
• 1:50:13
  stop this.
• 1:50:14
  Speaker 2: Let's pause, take a leak. We'll be right back, folks.
• 1:50:17
  And we're back. Yeah, it's kind of funny that people
• 1:50:21
  would want to fake the life that you've lived. But
• 1:50:24
  that is– such a romantic story. Like, it's such a
• 1:50:29
  movie that it makes sense that people want to fake it.
• 1:50:32
  It's got to be weird walking around, like, having lived
• 1:50:35
  a life that people would want to fake and pretend
• 1:50:38
  that they lived.
• 1:50:40
  Speaker 3: It is sometimes, you know, and it's like, you know,
• 1:50:44
  I remember when I really started for, you know, playing
• 1:50:48
  music and stuff. I mean, I wore a cowboy hat
• 1:50:49
  all the time. I rode bulls and, you know, it
• 1:50:52
  was nice. very much my identity. Cowboy stuff wasn't really
• 1:50:57
  cool then. I feel like in the early 2000s and
• 1:51:01
  all of that, there wasn't a big Americana scene or
• 1:51:06
  any of that kind of stuff. Definitely going to New
• 1:51:10
  York or going to Los Angeles and touring around, I'd
• 1:51:14
  be the only one wearing a cowboy hat. I think
• 1:51:19
  the first time, one time I was in L.A., we
• 1:51:21
  were out on the Santa Monica Pier And there was
• 1:51:24
  a guy that had like the one-man band thing, you know,
• 1:51:27
  out there. And there's all these tourists on the pier.
• 1:51:29
  And I'm just like out there checking out the scenery
• 1:51:31
  and just minding my own business. And this guy gets
• 1:51:34
  on the microphone and he just points over at me
• 1:51:36
  and goes, oh, Brokeback Mountain. And everybody on the pier
• 1:51:42
  turned around and looked at me. They're just pointing at
• 1:51:43
  me and laughing at me. And I'm just like, ah. Okay,
• 1:51:46
  you know, so I was like, that was the association
• 1:51:48
  with the cowboy hat at the time, you know.
• 1:51:49
  Speaker 2: That's hilarious. Yeah, they changed cowboys for a while.
• 1:51:56
  Speaker 3: Now it's a whole new ballgame, you know.
• 1:51:58
  Speaker 2: A whole new monkey wrench to that legend.
• 1:52:03
  Speaker 3: But, you know, now playing and, man, I'm so stoked
• 1:52:06
  to see all these new bands out there and, like,
• 1:52:09
  so many young folks playing actual instruments, you know. I
• 1:52:11
  felt like for a long time they were so good.
• 1:52:13
  electronic and DJs and all that stuff, you know.
• 1:52:16
  Speaker 2: Well, there's a giant country comeback that's going on right now,
• 1:52:20
  kind of nationwide. I'm sure you love Open the Gates,
• 1:52:23
  the Zach Bryan song. Yeah. That's such a great bull
• 1:52:26
  riding song.
• 1:52:27
  Speaker 3: Man, they got some great tunes, man.
• 1:52:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah. That's a great bull riding song. But there's so
• 1:52:33
  many great musicians out there now and also who've lived, like,
• 1:52:37
  different but very... Like, Charlie Crockett. What a fascinating dude
• 1:52:41
  that guy is. Like, just... kind of performing on the
• 1:52:44
  streets and, you know, just being kind of a vagabond
• 1:52:48
  traveling around and then finally catches and people are like, damn,
• 1:52:52
  this music is fucking great, man.
• 1:52:55
  Speaker 3: Yeah, like wearing it on their sleeves, you know, and
• 1:52:57
  having the confidence to, I think people have always been,
• 1:53:01
  I think there has been plenty of folks out there,
• 1:53:03
  you know, writing from the heart and so to speak
• 1:53:06
  and all of that and, you know, having a certain
• 1:53:09
  integrity to the things that they're saying and wanting, you know,
• 1:53:13
  truth and they're speaking into their songs and things like
• 1:53:15
  that and now there's just a there's a lot more
• 1:53:18
  of a platform to support them you know and like
• 1:53:20
  people like oh wow there's a there's a bunch of
• 1:53:22
  this stuff out there you know there's.
• 1:53:24
  Speaker 2: Also an appreciation for it because i think we're all
• 1:53:27
  fearful that people like you won't exist in the future
• 1:53:31
  because it seems like a guy like you you know
• 1:53:34
  bull riding living on a ranch like the singing songs
• 1:53:37
  in bars like That almost is like a thing of
• 1:53:40
  the past.
• 1:53:41
  Speaker 3: Oh, very much.
• 1:53:42
  Speaker 2: But it's so romantic to people that like when we
• 1:53:45
  meet a guy like you in real life, you're like, oh,
• 1:53:48
  keep him around. You want to make sure that people
• 1:53:52
  like you still exist. It's a very exciting thing for
• 1:53:56
  people to have a person who's lived an authentically interesting life.
• 1:54:01
  And authentically interesting. out of the box life it's not
• 1:54:04
  a normal life like you you're if you meet a
• 1:54:08
  million people the odds of you meeting one guy who
• 1:54:12
  used to bull ride and then started singing in bars
• 1:54:15
  with his friends and was happy living on the road
• 1:54:17
  now all of a sudden he's on a fucking gigantic
• 1:54:20
  television show it's not even one in a.
• 1:54:23
  Speaker 3: Million it's pretty it's strange sometimes i you know i
• 1:54:28
  meet people and i you know i'm like oh yeah
• 1:54:30
  i grew up just like you you know and then
• 1:54:32
  i realize like I don't think I did. I kind
• 1:54:38
  of had to think about it myself.
• 1:54:40
  Speaker 2: No, you definitely didn't. You rode a bull when you
• 1:54:42
  were fucking 10, dude. Most people when they're 10, they're
• 1:54:44
  playing with GI Joes. They're not riding bulls. That's a
• 1:54:48
  very unusual setup for the rest of your life. I
• 1:54:52
  think if you do some things difficult when you're really young,
• 1:54:56
  you get accustomed to fear. You get accustomed to anxiety
• 1:54:59
  and nerves. The thing that I mean that is like
• 1:55:05
  the mark of a man. Like a man is his
• 1:55:08
  ability to be in a very high stress situation and
• 1:55:11
  keep his shit together. And to have gone through a
• 1:55:14
  lot of that when you're very young, like riding a
• 1:55:17
  bull at 10 is crazy. To have gone through that
• 1:55:20
  when you're very young, it just develops the kind of
• 1:55:23
  character that allows you to kind of do anything in life.
• 1:55:26
  And I think most men see that and they wish
• 1:55:30
  they were like that.
• 1:55:32
  Speaker 3: I remember a moment. You know, it was really when
• 1:55:35
  I was, you know, riding steers, and then I made
• 1:55:38
  that transition to the big bulls, you know. And it
• 1:55:41
  wasn't like, oh, here's just like this little steer, and
• 1:55:43
  then there's an in-between, and then there's the big. It
• 1:55:45
  was like this little steer and then this big bull,
• 1:55:48
  you know. It was a junior rodeo in Odessa, Texas,
• 1:55:52
  and it was my first year to ride junior bulls.
• 1:55:54
  And I entered the bull ride, and my uncle was
• 1:55:58
  there with me, and they started running the bulls up
• 1:56:01
  into the chutes, and.
• 1:56:02
  Speaker 2: They were big.
• 1:56:03
  Speaker 3: They were like backs that wide and horns sticking outside
• 1:56:06
  of the chutes, you know? And, uh, they were big,
• 1:56:08
  but they didn't, they didn't buck that hard. You know,
• 1:56:10
  they just kind of jumped, kicked down, but they were
• 1:56:12
  still big, you know? And like, I remember like scared
• 1:56:15
  and like in tears, you know, kind of, I was scared. And, uh,
• 1:56:19
  my uncle, you know, was super cool about it. He
• 1:56:22
  wasn't like, you have to do this or you have to,
• 1:56:24
  he's like, man, whatever you want to do, you know,
• 1:56:25
  you want to pack it up. We'll, we'll get out
• 1:56:27
  of here right now. It's like, this is either for
• 1:56:29
  you or it's not for you, you know? And, uh,
• 1:56:33
  I remember just him telling me, you want to take
• 1:56:35
  like 20, 30 minutes and just kind of think about
• 1:56:38
  it and whatever you want to do, we'll, we'll make happen,
• 1:56:40
  you know? And I did, I kind of walked around
• 1:56:43
  there for a bit and, um, I just had this
• 1:56:47
  some kind of like, I knew I would regret it
• 1:56:49
  if I didn't do it, didn't try it. You know,
• 1:56:52
  there was something in me where like, I mean, cause
• 1:56:53
  I slept it, I dreamt about it, you know, I just,
• 1:56:56
  I loved it. And, uh, I was like, nah, I'm
• 1:56:58
  going to do this, you know? And I put my
• 1:57:00
  rope on him and, had all the sport there that
• 1:57:02
  I needed in that moment. And they opened the gate
• 1:57:05
  and this big old high horn bullion, he just turned
• 1:57:08
  and kind of jumped out there real docile. And I
• 1:57:11
  think I rode him two or three jumps and fell off.
• 1:57:14
  And it was just like, I'm the king of the world.
• 1:57:17
  I was like, I'm a bull rider now, you know,
• 1:57:21
  I'm not just the steer rider kid, you know, I
• 1:57:23
  kind of made that level. And I remember after that,
• 1:57:26
  I just, uh, man, I just craved it. Like just,
• 1:57:31
  The higher they jump, the faster they spin, the better.
• 1:57:34
  Speaker 2: I like it. Really?
• 1:57:35
  Speaker 3: Oh, just, yeah. Dirty rank. Just run them in there.
• 1:57:38
  Speaker 2: Let's go.
• 1:57:39
  Speaker 3: And when I was little, I mean, even when I was, like,
• 1:57:43
  14 or 15, you know, the guys were starting to
• 1:57:45
  breed the bulls for, like, the PBR. Like, they full-on
• 1:57:48
  started these, like, breeding programs. You know, I used to,
• 1:57:50
  you could go to a practice pen and, you know,
• 1:57:53
  be an old farmer that had two or three old
• 1:57:55
  bulls that you could get on and practice, and they'd
• 1:57:57
  just jump around and just, you know... Nothing else was
• 1:58:00
  really going to hurt you bad, you know. And then
• 1:58:02
  they started breeding these young bulls. Man, you go to
• 1:58:04
  the the practice pen there'd be 10 or 15 of
• 1:58:07
  these like yearlings that bucked and they needed somebody to
• 1:58:10
  get on them you know like test pilot and i
• 1:58:13
  was the test pilot there's a guy named bradley uh
• 1:58:16
  raspberry i believe uh kind of out in brownwood i
• 1:58:19
  remember going to his house and uh I could ride.
• 1:58:23
  I was pretty sticky. I could ride a lot better
• 1:58:25
  when I was younger than I was when I got older.
• 1:58:28
  For some reason, I just had that no fear or
• 1:58:31
  whatever that was. I'd get on 10 or 15 a day.
• 1:58:35
  They just kept running them in there, man. They'd be
• 1:58:37
  trying to flip over in the chute. They're young, green
• 1:58:41
  bulls that were half wild. They're just trying to figure
• 1:58:45
  out which ones bucked and which ones didn't. They'd get
• 1:58:48
  rid of the ones that didn't buck and keep the
• 1:58:49
  ones that did. Man, I'd just be like, The wilder
• 1:58:53
  they got in the shoot, like, the more aggressive I got. Like,
• 1:58:57
  I just, like, was like, oh, okay, that's what we're
• 1:58:59
  going to do? Come on, let's go. Let's do this,
• 1:59:01
  you know? I don't know, I was nuts, you know?
• 1:59:06
  Speaker 2: God, that's so crazy. Yeah. That's such a crazy way
• 1:59:09
  to live your life. You know, wild bulls, when you
• 1:59:11
  say wild, like the ones that are out there in
• 1:59:13
  the wild, they're some of the most dangerous animals that
• 1:59:16
  you could ever encounter. Mm-hmm. Like, they call them scrub bulls. Mm-hmm.
• 1:59:20
  Like my buddy Adam, he lives in Australia or he's
• 1:59:23
  moving to America. But when he lived in Australia, he
• 1:59:28
  said that they would encounter these scrub bulls, which is
• 1:59:30
  like wild domestic bulls that got out and started breeding.
• 1:59:35
  And then many generations later, they're now completely wild.
• 1:59:39
  Speaker 3: They're like deer out there.
• 1:59:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and they will run after you.
• 1:59:43
  Speaker 3: I knew these three guys from Australia that, that, uh,
• 1:59:46
  several Australian guys that came over, lived in Stephenville. A
• 1:59:48
  lot of these cowboys have moved to Stephenville cause it
• 1:59:50
  was so central. It was kind of cowboy capital there. And, uh,
• 1:59:53
  his name was Lance Kelly, had some brothers and they
• 1:59:56
  were from up there in North Queensland somewhere. And one
• 2:00:00
  summer he went back to work. And then when he
• 2:00:01
  came back, he wanted, he'd tell me about where he
• 2:00:04
  was from all the time. You know, I'm, I was young, curious.
• 2:00:07
  I was always fascinated. I was like, wow, you're from Australia.
• 2:00:09
  You know, I've only seen movies, you know, like, uh,
• 2:00:13
  What's the– oh, gosh.
• 2:00:16
  Speaker 2: Crocodile Dundee?
• 2:00:17
  Speaker 3: No, a man from Snowy River, which was– anyway. But
• 2:00:22
  I was fascinated with Australia and him and his brothers.
• 2:00:25
  And so he went home and he videotaped a VHS.
• 2:00:29
  He didn't have phones back then, but it was like
• 2:00:31
  the old VHS tape recorder. And he duct taped it
• 2:00:36
  around his body while he was walking around working on
• 2:00:39
  the ranch. And he'd have this four-wheeler and they're chasing
• 2:00:42
  these wild cattle and rounding them up, him and his brothers.
• 2:00:46
  And he would just like chase them on a four-wheeler
• 2:00:49
  as long as, you know, keep them running until they
• 2:00:51
  got so tired they couldn't go anymore. And then he
• 2:00:52
  had this piece of pipe on there he could run
• 2:00:54
  up behind them and kind of knock them down. And
• 2:00:56
  then he'd jump off and tie their legs together. And
• 2:00:58
  they would catch a bunch of them like that. And
• 2:01:00
  then his brother would come by, you know, later with
• 2:01:03
  a truck and a winch and. winch them up into
• 2:01:05
  the trailer and they would catch all these wild cows
• 2:01:08
  like that and to be able to see that footage
• 2:01:10
  and stuff and have him tell me how they were
• 2:01:12
  doing it and show them and I was like oh
• 2:01:14
  that's the coolest thing in the world I want to
• 2:01:16
  go when can I go you know Australia is such
• 2:01:20
  a crazy place man I mean it's bigger than the
• 2:01:24
  United States Or the size of the United States, roughly.
• 2:01:28
  Speaker 2: And it has less people than Los Angeles.
• 2:01:30
  Speaker 3: And everything will.
• 2:01:31
  Speaker 2: Kill you over there. Everything will kill you.
• 2:01:33
  Speaker 3: Every snake, spider.
• 2:01:34
  Speaker 2: Every snake, crocodiles. They have saltwater crocodiles and giant fucking
• 2:01:40
  great white sharks. And hardy people, man.
• 2:01:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 2:01:45
  Speaker 2: Hardy motherfuckers come from that place.
• 2:01:47
  Speaker 3: I feel like Texas and a lot of folks in
• 2:01:49
  Australia are a bit kindred spirits.
• 2:01:51
  Speaker 2: Yes. I think so, too. My buddy James McCann was
• 2:01:54
  on the podcast yesterday. He's a comic out of Australia.
• 2:01:57
  And he's from there and he spends time here. He
• 2:02:00
  was living here for a while, but he had to
• 2:02:01
  move back because he had another kid. And, but now
• 2:02:04
  he's coming back and forth and trying to figure, he's
• 2:02:06
  really talented.
• 2:02:07
  Speaker 3: He's trying to figure out.
• 2:02:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah. He was living in Austin for a couple of
• 2:02:10
  years and living in America for a couple of years,
• 2:02:13
  living in Austin for about a year. But, you know,
• 2:02:16
  his wife's about to have another kid and they just
• 2:02:18
  decided to go back to Australia where she's got support.
• 2:02:21
  But man, he fucking misses it. He was here. He's like, mate,
• 2:02:24
  I miss it so much. Yeah. I miss it so much. Like,
• 2:02:27
  I don't think there's any place like this place. It's
• 2:02:32
  pretty awesome. But Australia, it's like, It's the same kind
• 2:02:35
  of thing. It's like it's a rugged place, and the
• 2:02:37
  kind of people that live there, they're fun. They're fun,
• 2:02:41
  kind of got a super fucked up oppressive government, unfortunately.
• 2:02:45
  Speaker 3: I think it's a lot about what you say, too.
• 2:02:47
  You know, when you survive certain things in your life, and,
• 2:02:51
  you know, it puts things in perspective of what you're
• 2:02:55
  taking seriously anymore. What's an emergency?
• 2:02:58
  Speaker 2: Right, right.
• 2:02:59
  Speaker 3: Oh, is this– this is– Life or death or is
• 2:03:04
  it not? And to be able to laugh at stuff.
• 2:03:08
  I love comedians. It's just like, man, to be able
• 2:03:11
  to just joke and cut stuff about the most serious
• 2:03:14
  things or whatever it is. It's like, God, we need
• 2:03:16
  that so much.
• 2:03:17
  Speaker 2: It's an important service. It doesn't seem like it is
• 2:03:20
  to people because it seems stupid. Like, oh, you're just
• 2:03:22
  telling jokes. For me, when I go and watch a
• 2:03:26
  good comedy show, I feel better. It's medicine. And I
• 2:03:30
  think it also puts life into perspective with a sense
• 2:03:33
  of humor. You can kind of look at things through
• 2:03:35
  a different lens and go, yeah, we're probably going to
• 2:03:38
  be all right.
• 2:03:39
  Speaker 3: I get a feeling like, you know, I think a
• 2:03:41
  lot of folks have this idea that songwriters or where,
• 2:03:43
  you know, especially, you know, have a bunch of sad
• 2:03:45
  songs or whatever to go to that deep place and
• 2:03:48
  you live through stuff that you write about. But man,
• 2:03:51
  I find in comics, man, I feel like there's some
• 2:03:54
  of the heaviest stuff in the world that those folks
• 2:03:57
  have experienced to be able to, You know, come up
• 2:04:01
  and tell these kinds of jokes and stories and the
• 2:04:04
  educational part of it with it. You know, it's so much.
• 2:04:06
  I don't know. For me, it seems like so much
• 2:04:08
  more than just a joke.
• 2:04:10
  Speaker 2: It is with some. I mean, some people just do jokes.
• 2:04:13
  It really depends on your style. But I mean, if
• 2:04:15
  you go back to like Richard Pryor, his whole thing
• 2:04:17
  was like explaining life and telling stories. Yeah. But with
• 2:04:21
  an amazing sense of humor. And that you would leave
• 2:04:24
  that and everybody feels like more united. They feel better.
• 2:04:27
  It's what everybody was thinking. It was everybody's thinking, afraid
• 2:04:33
  to say. And also he would look at things from
• 2:04:36
  a very wise perspective that was also hilarious. So you
• 2:04:39
  walked out of there feeling better. You felt like you
• 2:04:42
  were better.
• 2:04:43
  Speaker 3: It felt like there's bringing some hope.
• 2:04:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. There's hope in humor. Yeah, for sure. But
• 2:04:49
  there's hope in music, too.
• 2:04:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 2:04:51
  Speaker 2: You know, I don't have any musical talent at all,
• 2:04:53
  but I always think of music as almost like a
• 2:04:56
  drug because music when when a good song hits, you're like,
• 2:05:00
  but like you're if you're in the car. And a
• 2:05:03
  good tune comes on, especially back when I used to
• 2:05:05
  listen to the radio. And you didn't expect what was
• 2:05:08
  coming on.
• 2:05:09
  Speaker 3: You can't rewind it.
• 2:05:10
  Speaker 2: All of a sudden it's Radar Love by Golden Earring.
• 2:05:13
  Fuck yeah, let's go. You feel different. It changes your mood.
• 2:05:19
  You hear Freebird. like you're flipping through the channels and
• 2:05:24
  the fucking guitar solo for Freebird comes on, you're like, yes!
• 2:05:28
  You feel better. Like, it excites all these parts of
• 2:05:32
  your senses, your consciousness, your feelings. It's a drug. I mean,
• 2:05:37
  it's an amazing thing.
• 2:05:38
  Speaker 3: It's always been real therapeutic for me at the very beginning.
• 2:05:41
  Like I said, I didn't have high expectations, but I
• 2:05:45
  knew when I kind of wrote some of the first
• 2:05:47
  songs that I wrote and I got some of that
• 2:05:50
  stuff off my chest, like, it changed me, you know?
• 2:05:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 2:05:54
  Speaker 3: It like, it became a tool that all of a
• 2:05:57
  sudden I had access to this thing that like was
• 2:06:01
  helping me heal in a way. Like I could get,
• 2:06:02
  I could get stuff off my chest. Like the things that, uh,
• 2:06:06
  I was uncomfortable talking about in conversation with folks. Like
• 2:06:09
  I could put them into a song and like sing
• 2:06:11
  them to the wall. And I was just like getting
• 2:06:14
  that stuff out. Like there wasn't anybody in the room.
• 2:06:16
  I was just like, you know, but I was getting
• 2:06:19
  this stuff out, out of me, you know?
• 2:06:21
  Speaker 2: And it's also a way for people to hear it
• 2:06:23
  where it's not annoying. You know what I mean? Like
• 2:06:25
  if you just tell some sad story about your life,
• 2:06:27
  people are like, oh, geez. You're like, here we go.
• 2:06:31
  Speaker 3: Cry me a river, kid. Everybody's got a story.
• 2:06:33
  Speaker 2: But if you have a sad story in a song,
• 2:06:37
  it's like fucking, it's beautiful. Like I love a good
• 2:06:41
  sad song. You know, a song that has like real
• 2:06:45
  emotion in it, whether it's a real story or whether,
• 2:06:48
  like one of my favorite, Colter Wall songs as Kate McKinnon. Yeah.
• 2:06:53
  Jamie turned me on to that song. He said it
• 2:06:55
  to me.
• 2:06:55
  Speaker 3: Colter's a gem.
• 2:06:57
  Speaker 2: He was fucking 21 when he made that song, which
• 2:07:00
  is crazy. Yeah. You listen to that song, it sounds
• 2:07:03
  like a 58-year-old man who's been smoking cigarettes his whole life. Yeah.
• 2:07:08
  And that dude is interesting, too, because he still works
• 2:07:11
  on a ranch. Yeah. Yeah.
• 2:07:13
  Speaker 3: He's a great guy. He's one of my favorites of
• 2:07:15
  the younger guys that have come up and been doing this.
• 2:07:17
  Speaker 2: He's just....
• 2:07:19
  Speaker 3: Same way when I first heard those first songs, I
• 2:07:21
  was like, who the fuck is this?
• 2:07:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 2:07:24
  Speaker 3: You know? Then I saw like a picture of him.
• 2:07:27
  I'm like, oh man, he's a kid, you know?
• 2:07:29
  Speaker 2: Crazy.
• 2:07:29
  Speaker 3: And just a fabulous songwriter.
• 2:07:33
  Speaker 2: Raven is a wicked bird. You hear that, you're like,
• 2:07:36
  what is this? Yeah. Who is this guy? And I
• 2:07:41
  couldn't believe he was 21. I'm like, that makes zero sense.
• 2:07:45
  Speaker 3: Yeah. He's got it though, man. And there's a Bunch
• 2:07:49
  of them out there now that I'm hearing, too. I'm like, man,
• 2:07:52
  how cool.
• 2:07:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah. How cool.
• 2:07:53
  Speaker 3: I'm so glad that they're getting a shot at it
• 2:07:56
  or just getting the support. I don't know if it's
• 2:07:59
  saying getting a shot at it but it's like getting
• 2:08:01
  the the love and support that they deserve for the
• 2:08:03
  it's good music man yeah.
• 2:08:04
  Speaker 2: It's great it's great music and there's a thing now
• 2:08:07
  with the internet where it's so easy to share something
• 2:08:10
  you know like someone's got a good song and it's
• 2:08:12
  on youtube or spotify and then you just send a
• 2:08:15
  link to your buddy yeah you go bro check this
• 2:08:17
  out like I got to say like half the songs
• 2:08:20
  I find out about my friends just send me. And
• 2:08:22
  then all of a sudden I'm like, oh, shit.
• 2:08:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 2:08:25
  Speaker 2: And then I'll add it to my playlist. It's like
• 2:08:28
  it's easy to share things now where you don't have
• 2:08:31
  to go to the record store and pick up the record. And,
• 2:08:34
  you know, now it's just like within seconds of you
• 2:08:37
  getting it in your phone, you're listening to it.
• 2:08:40
  Speaker 3: And it's easier to record the stuff, too.
• 2:08:42
  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah.
• 2:08:42
  Speaker 3: You don't need it. Half a million bucks in a
• 2:08:45
  studio and all that stuff. It's like, man, half the
• 2:08:47
  stuff you can record on your phone.
• 2:08:49
  Speaker 2: Well, look at Oliver Anthony. Yeah. One fucking song.
• 2:08:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 2:08:53
  Speaker 2: One song and the first show he ever does is
• 2:08:56
  like 18,000 people. That is the first show that dude
• 2:09:01
  ever performed at.
• 2:09:03
  Speaker 3: I feel for him. I would never have been able
• 2:09:05
  to do that when I started. I was not prepared
• 2:09:08
  for anything. I don't know. Maybe they're not, but that's
• 2:09:12
  a lot to carry.
• 2:09:14
  Speaker 2: He settled in pretty easy. He figured it out. He's
• 2:09:17
  a smart cat.
• 2:09:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 2:09:18
  Speaker 2: He's a really smart dude and he settled in really easy.
• 2:09:21
  Speaker 3: I guess they have to you know i mean i
• 2:09:23
  always think like you know gosh it's changed so much
• 2:09:26
  since i started out you know i mean we didn't
• 2:09:29
  even have like you know if you wanted to learn
• 2:09:31
  how to play a song you kind of had to
• 2:09:32
  go listen to the record and just try to figure
• 2:09:34
  it out you know and rewind it now they're like
• 2:09:37
  oh here's a guy that'll just show you every note
• 2:09:38
  and this.
• 2:09:39
  Speaker 2: And that yeah there's a guy on youtube that'll show
• 2:09:41
  you exactly how.
• 2:09:42
  Speaker 3: To do it yeah and that took me years to
• 2:09:44
  figure out you know and um Maybe that is like today.
• 2:09:48
  These guys, they're learning how to do it at such
• 2:09:52
  a quicker rate and they know how to handle the
• 2:09:55
  crowds and do all the stuff and it's just like, boom,
• 2:09:57
  there you go.
• 2:09:58
  Speaker 2: Well, that's with everything today. I think that's also why
• 2:10:02
  in martial arts and UFC, there's a reason why the
• 2:10:06
  guys are so much better today and it's because they
• 2:10:08
  get to see everything that everybody's ever done and then
• 2:10:11
  they practice it and improve upon it and they get
• 2:10:13
  it at an early age. You can essentially just on
• 2:10:16
  your phone watch every fight that's ever taken place ever
• 2:10:19
  in human history that's been recorded.
• 2:10:21
  Speaker 3: I did that on the road a few years ago.
• 2:10:23
  I mean I've still– I've always been a pretty rudimentary
• 2:10:26
  guitar player. I can't solo all over the place and
• 2:10:30
  all of that stuff. I think it was like 2019.
• 2:10:34
  I put it out on a record and I was
• 2:10:35
  going on a tour. And my friend Charlie Sexton produced
• 2:10:38
  the album. He's a wonderful guitar player.
• 2:10:41
  Speaker 2: Charlie Sexton, the guy from the 80s, Beat So Lonely?
• 2:10:44
  From Austin, yeah. That guy?
• 2:10:46
  Speaker 3: Played with Dylan, played Archangel.
• 2:10:48
  Speaker 2: He was like really young when Beat So Lonely came out, right?
• 2:10:52
  Speaker 3: Oh, man. Yeah, legend. And I remember calling him though.
• 2:10:55
  I was like, man, I really want to get better
• 2:10:56
  at the guitar, you know? And he's like, well, just
• 2:10:59
  listen to all the stuff that you really like. He's like,
• 2:11:01
  don't try to play it all note for note. He's like,
• 2:11:03
  just keep listening to it, and you'll start eventually finding
• 2:11:07
  those places and develop your style. But it was, when
• 2:11:10
  I got on the road as well, man, I had
• 2:11:12
  access on YouTube to all of my favorite musicians and
• 2:11:17
  guitar players, and I just kind of made a point
• 2:11:18
  of sitting down. And I even found this guy that
• 2:11:21
  was just breaking down and giving simple blues guitar lessons
• 2:11:24
  for kids. I was like, man, this is great. Never
• 2:11:26
  done anything like this. And just, like, went through. I
• 2:11:28
  went back, you know. Right. I got to memorize all
• 2:11:31
  the notes on the fretboard. And I needed, you know,
• 2:11:33
  and it was just, it was so, I had so
• 2:11:35
  much fun doing it. And, you know, and also give
• 2:11:38
  confidence to get up and jam with other musicians and
• 2:11:40
  play and kind of know what key you're in, what
• 2:11:43
  you're doing. And, you know, I went years, you know,
• 2:11:47
  without having any kind of lessons or training. And then
• 2:11:49
  I'm just, like, within that. three weeks of being on
• 2:11:52
  tour and watching YouTube videos of it just stepped it
• 2:11:55
  up so much. They're like, how'd you learn how to
• 2:11:58
  do it? About 20 years later in my career, I
• 2:12:00
  decided to learn how to play the guitar on YouTube.
• 2:12:03
  It is amazing.
• 2:12:04
  Speaker 2: I mean, that's the positive part of the Internet. If
• 2:12:08
  you can avoid the negative parts, there's a lot of
• 2:12:09
  great positive stuff on the Internet. And the access to
• 2:12:12
  stuff like that is amazing.
• 2:12:14
  Speaker 3: If we all could just avoid the negative of everything, right? Right.
• 2:12:18
  Speaker 2: Unfortunately, there's a lot of people that don't have good
• 2:12:21
  lives and they do have a lot of extra time
• 2:12:23
  because they're not really investing in their own life. So
• 2:12:25
  they're just spreading negativity online. Yeah. And it's just human nature.
• 2:12:31
  Speaker 3: Wild world.
• 2:12:32
  Speaker 2: It is. It's a wild world, but it's also a
• 2:12:34
  wildly positive world too. Just what you just said about
• 2:12:37
  the guitar stuff or with the Oliver Anthony stuff. Yeah.
• 2:12:40
  This guy standing there with a guitar in front of
• 2:12:44
  a field with no production value at all. but has
• 2:12:47
  a song that he's singing from the heart. Like how many,
• 2:12:50
  how many views does that shit have on YouTube? It's
• 2:12:54
  gotta be like a hundred million views or something nuts.
• 2:12:58
  I mean, that song was fucking gigantic.
• 2:13:01
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 2:13:01
  Speaker 2: Richmond North.
• 2:13:03
  Speaker 3: I remember my wife playing it for me for the
• 2:13:05
  first time. And I was just like, what the, I
• 2:13:07
  was like, what is that? And she's like, Oh man,
• 2:13:08
  check this out. You know, I was like, That's so
• 2:13:11
  fucking rad.
• 2:13:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I got a chance to see him perform live, too,
• 2:13:14
  with his band. They're fucking fantastic. He's completely settled into
• 2:13:18
  being famous now. He's cool with it. He's still the
• 2:13:22
  same dude. I met him real early on, and I
• 2:13:25
  actually talked to him on the phone. How much was it, guys?
• 2:13:27
  $ 236 million. Holy shit.
• 2:13:28
  Speaker 3: Wow. When you say he settled it, I didn't know.
• 2:13:37
  Was he having a hard time with it?
• 2:13:38
  Speaker 2: He was freaking out in the beginning. And I contacted
• 2:13:41
  him early on, and he said, hey, can I ask
• 2:13:43
  you some advice? And we talked on the phone. I said, yeah, sure.
• 2:13:48
  So I called him up, and he was just telling
• 2:13:49
  me that he was getting hit up by all these
• 2:13:51
  different people that were trying to give him money to
• 2:13:52
  sign a contract. And then I go, hey, hey, hey,
• 2:13:55
  don't sign nothing. I go, you don't need nobody. You
• 2:13:59
  don't need to be locked up in any contracts with nobody.
• 2:14:02
  And he was like, they're all telling me I got
• 2:14:03
  to strike while the iron's hot. I'm like, fuck them.
• 2:14:06
  I go, you got talent, dude. Talent is the number
• 2:14:09
  one thing. You already have that. You're going to be fine.
• 2:14:12
  You just keep making songs like that. You can't fucking lose.
• 2:14:17
  is be tied with some legal contract to some assholes
• 2:14:21
  just sucking you like a vampire. And they're going to
• 2:14:24
  be stuck with you for years, and then you're going
• 2:14:26
  to have to go to court to get out of
• 2:14:27
  that shit. Exactly.
• 2:14:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and you have the opportunity, like you said. Man,
• 2:14:32
  you're writing good songs, you're doing good stuff, and you
• 2:14:34
  have a way to give it to the people.
• 2:14:36
  Speaker 2: But he's getting an offer for like $ 7 million to
• 2:14:39
  sign this. I'm like, don't do it. I know it
• 2:14:41
  sounds like, but that $ 7 million, they're giving you that
• 2:14:44
  because they're going to make $ 14 million. There's not a
• 2:14:46
  chance in hell— And you don't need them. You don't
• 2:14:49
  need them. You should get all the money. You should
• 2:14:51
  get it all. You shouldn't give any money to anybody else.
• 2:14:54
  You don't need it. You can make your own records.
• 2:14:56
  You can put it all together yourself. You don't need nobody.
• 2:14:59
  Speaker 3: I guess you always got to remember they're going to
• 2:15:01
  buy for one, sell for two. Yeah, exactly.
• 2:15:04
  Speaker 2: There's no way they're going to give you that money
• 2:15:06
  unless they're going to make a lot more. And then
• 2:15:08
  you're going to get stuck with them. Don't do it.
• 2:15:10
  And he's like, they're all telling me I got to
• 2:15:11
  do it now. Because if I miss this opportunity, I'm like,
• 2:15:14
  you ain't missing shit. Yeah. You ain't missing. There's not
• 2:15:17
  a chance you're going to miss it.
• 2:15:18
  Speaker 3: Especially when you're that young.
• 2:15:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And good. Yeah. And just fucking good.
• 2:15:23
  Speaker 3: Who knows what they're going to be writing in the
• 2:15:25
  next 10 years.
• 2:15:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Have you heard that song, Woman Scorned?
• 2:15:29
  Speaker 3: I haven't, no. Is that one of his new ones? Woo!
• 2:15:33
  Speaker 2: He wrote that one after a breakup, and it's just woo!
• 2:15:35
  Speaker 3: Woo!
• 2:15:36
  Speaker 2: You hear that fucker, it just gets you right in
• 2:15:38
  the bone marrow.
• 2:15:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I get you.
• 2:15:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's fantastic. It's so good. But it's just like,
• 2:15:45
  you know, it's a beautiful story. And I love a
• 2:15:48
  story like that. He was selling heavy equipment. He was
• 2:15:53
  a salesman, just like fucking machinery and shit. And then
• 2:15:57
  writing songs, and he gets fed up one day, and
• 2:16:00
  he puts this song, let's make a video of this
• 2:16:02
  fucking song. And then all of a sudden, boom.
• 2:16:05
  Speaker 3: People ask me all the time. They're like, man, who
• 2:16:07
  do you think is the best young songwriter out there, musician,
• 2:16:11
  guitar player? I'm like, man, I don't know. It's probably
• 2:16:14
  some 16-year-old kid in the garage that nobody's heard of.
• 2:16:17
  That's probably the best guy out there.
• 2:16:19
  Speaker 2: He's ready to jump off.
• 2:16:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah. He's going to hit you with some song that
• 2:16:23
  just crushes you. Yeah.
• 2:16:26
  Speaker 2: They're out there. But that's the thing that I was
• 2:16:29
  saying about guys like you, that people look at guys
• 2:16:32
  like you and it's such a romantic story. They worry
• 2:16:35
  that there's not going to be any more of you.
• 2:16:38
  You know what I mean? Like this weird digital world
• 2:16:41
  and AI and just the strange fucking life that we're
• 2:16:47
  all living right now that are not, I don't want
• 2:16:50
  to say simple cause it's not simple, but it's unencumbered
• 2:16:54
  by all the bullshit of the, the world that we
• 2:16:57
  think is fake and unfortunate.
• 2:16:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 2:17:00
  Speaker 2: Like to, to have this pure life and this wild
• 2:17:03
  romantic story, When people meet a guy like you, they're like, oh, man,
• 2:17:07
  there probably ain't going to be many more of them.
• 2:17:09
  Speaker 3: Oh, no, man. I mean, look at this guy, you know. Yeah.
• 2:17:13
  I feel so fortunate, too. Like, when I did come
• 2:17:16
  to Austin, like, in my, you know, mid-20s, you know,
• 2:17:20
  I met guys like Joe Ely and Terry Allen and
• 2:17:25
  Guy Clark and, like, these little Steve Earle legendary kind
• 2:17:28
  of guys that I looked up to. And I remember
• 2:17:29
  being young then and being like, oh, man, these are
• 2:17:33
  the last guys left. Right. And so, you know, I
• 2:17:38
  don't know. There's so many of these young folks out
• 2:17:41
  there that are doing it that I think crave it.
• 2:17:44
  And that's what they're interested in. They wouldn't want to
• 2:17:47
  hear play that music you know they want to feel
• 2:17:49
  that stuff so i'm optimistic about it but i can
• 2:17:53
  i can it definitely is a different world out there
• 2:17:56
  these days and i you know even for myself you
• 2:17:59
  know just going with the flow and like well where
• 2:18:01
  are we going tomorrow you know how's this like i
• 2:18:03
  have no idea how so much of this social media
• 2:18:06
  stuff is working or what you know and how you
• 2:18:08
  put out an album or songs. And it was like,
• 2:18:12
  don't worry about all that jazz. It's like, just keep writing.
• 2:18:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 2:18:15
  Speaker 3: Just keep writing, keep making it and just be undeniable.
• 2:18:19
  And at the end of the day, if all of
• 2:18:21
  that stuff disappears, like, you know, you can always go
• 2:18:25
  sit on the sidewalk and put your tip jar out
• 2:18:28
  there and play a song for people who are walking
• 2:18:29
  down the street. And I guarantee you, there's going to
• 2:18:31
  be somebody that's going to stop and appreciate it. You know?
• 2:18:34
  Speaker 2: Well, that's what got Charlie Crockett started.
• 2:18:35
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. I've had plenty of gigs where like, you know,
• 2:18:38
  you go into some bar and, you know, my wife
• 2:18:41
  always says, go where you're celebrated, not where you're tolerated.
• 2:18:45
  You go into some bar and they kind of, you
• 2:18:47
  can tell they don't really want, you know, they're not
• 2:18:49
  excited about you playing or whatever. Like, yeah, shit, I'll
• 2:18:51
  just go. I'll go park in the parking lot across
• 2:18:54
  the street and sit on the tailgate of my truck
• 2:18:55
  and play. We'll have a party over there, you know?
• 2:18:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah. That is the crazy thing about music. Yeah. You
• 2:19:01
  can just kind of set up anywhere.
• 2:19:02
  Speaker 3: You don't need all that stuff. You know what I'm
• 2:19:04
  talking about? Just signing contracts and deals and all that.
• 2:19:07
  It's like, man, just like you got that guitar in
• 2:19:08
  your hand, you got your song, you know?
• 2:19:11
  Speaker 2: Hold on to it. Yeah.
• 2:19:14
  Speaker 3: And protect it, you know? That's what's... It's something that's
• 2:19:17
  special to you. I think when I talk about the
• 2:19:19
  therapy of songwriting, that's what's... I hold on and protect
• 2:19:23
  that ruthlessly. I'm not just giving that away. That part
• 2:19:28
  of it's way more important than selling an album or
• 2:19:33
  a concert ticket or going on the road touring and
• 2:19:37
  all that. What I get out of music is when
• 2:19:40
  I'm sitting at home in a room all by myself
• 2:19:43
  and letting that stuff pour out of me and I'm
• 2:19:45
  just singing it to the wall. That's what's saved my life.
• 2:19:50
  Speaker 2: That's awesome.
• 2:19:51
  Speaker 3: And any of the rest of it.
• 2:19:53
  Speaker 2: I'm glad that you articulate it that way too because
• 2:19:55
  I think there's young aspiring songwriters and singers out there
• 2:20:00
  that are listening to this right now that are feeling
• 2:20:02
  this and they just can't wait to get to a
• 2:20:04
  pad right now and start writing. Pick up their guitar
• 2:20:06
  and start writing. Because it's like stories like yours and
• 2:20:09
  the way you express it, it inspires people to get
• 2:20:13
  excited about it. It inspires people to really dig in.
• 2:20:18
  Speaker 3: I hope so. I definitely had folks that mentored me
• 2:20:22
  like that and steered me in the right direction in
• 2:20:25
  a lot of ways. Terry Allen, the guy, definitely. I'm
• 2:20:29
  just like, man, just keep writing. Whatever it's making you
• 2:20:34
  want to do that in the first place, hold on
• 2:20:37
  to that and protect it. The rest will always be
• 2:20:40
  around and always come and it'll change and a good
• 2:20:43
  song will survive and find its way just like the
• 2:20:48
  guy you know that song you just played me like
• 2:20:50
  you said 200 million people and it just they'll find
• 2:20:54
  its way you know yeah find it find find its
• 2:20:56
  way into people's hearts you know yeah and like.
• 2:21:00
  Speaker 2: I said it's just it's important for people like you
• 2:21:02
  to tell your story it really is thank you it's
• 2:21:05
  it's fuel for people thanks thank you for being here
• 2:21:09
  i really appreciate it it was a lot of fun
• 2:21:11
  i really enjoyed it uh and uh tell everybody they
• 2:21:14
  want to Find you performing anywhere, where they can catch you.
• 2:21:17
  You got a website that shows where you're.
• 2:21:19
  Speaker 3: Going to be at? All over the interwebs. Yeah, it's
• 2:21:21
  all out there.
• 2:21:22
  Speaker 2: Do you have your own personal website?
• 2:21:25
  Speaker 3: I do. It's probably just ryanbingham.com or binghammusic.com, something like that.
• 2:21:31
  Speaker 2: All the dates are up there. Do you use social
• 2:21:34
  media at all?
• 2:21:35
  Speaker 3: Yeah, we're on all this stuff.
• 2:21:37
  Speaker 2: Do you pay attention to it or you got somebody
• 2:21:39
  who does it for you?
• 2:21:39
  Speaker 1: Both.
• 2:21:40
  Speaker 2: We both, yeah.
• 2:21:41
  Speaker 3: Mostly on Instagram, I pay attention to that one and
• 2:21:44
  check in and stuff like that. There's so much of
• 2:21:46
  it these days, I can't keep up with all of it.
• 2:21:50
  Speaker 2: It'll rob your time.
• 2:21:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah. I'm trying to go get away where all that
• 2:21:55
  stuff's turned off. That's where I'm going to find me.
• 2:21:57
  Speaker 2: Beautiful. Thanks, brother.
• 2:21:59
  Speaker 3: Appreciate it.
• 2:22:00
  Speaker 2: It was a lot of fun. Thank you. Bye, everybody.