Latest / The Naked Room / I really was like, what do I want to hear? ... and that's what I created!

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I really was like, what do I want to hear? ... and that's what I created! · The Naked Room

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: We're doing a little special live edition today from Substack,
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_01: and we have a dear
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_00: IRL friend,
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_01: Mariana Bell.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_00: Hello.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, and we're going to talk about her new album that just came out yesterday, Give It A Go.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: Just going through all of the processes of what she did with this new creation.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_01: It's completely different than all of the work that you've done.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_01: So I want to talk about some of the processes behind Your inspiration,
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_01: like whatever kind of got you into this headspace of doing something that's
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_01: so different than what you've always done before.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_00: Well, thank you.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks for having me and hello to anyone, everyone who's here listening either live or later.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just thrilled.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_00: It's like having a baby and I've had two babies.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I know a little bit of this like creative birthing process and And you sometimes,
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_00: you know, usually you never know what you're going to get.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_00: You think you know and you don't.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_00: And the process of this one, though, was very, I would say, the most deliberate record.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: Hello from Brenda and Bill.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_00: Hello.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_00: It was the most deliberate thing I think I've ever done creatively in the sense
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_00: from the minute of conception, I knew what I wanted, what I wanted to feel.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: What I wanted it to look like,
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_00: what I wanted it to sound like, you know, kind of in a broad sense.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_00: And I was just really, I don't think I've ever been clearer about something.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_00: I usually like to let the process kind of take me wherever it's going to go.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_00: And that did happen within reason,
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_00: but it was really so clear from the start that this was going to be a departure in
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_00: a very specific way.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I remember, like...
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_01: I've known you for over 15, 20 years at this point.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_01: We knew of each other for a long time before that,
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_01: but you've always been very singer-songwriter,
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_01: more like a folky kind of sound,
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_01: and now this very 80s synth-y, just kind of a nod to...
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_01: Something that feels more upbeat and this is this new chapter of your life.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_01: We're both over 40 and we can do whatever we want.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_01: We can completely shift and decide to be this different version of ourselves.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_01: I love that you're just putting it out there and doing the thing.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_01: The imagery that you did associated with it is absolutely beautiful.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_01: I've taken...
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_01: A bunch of your photos.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_01: And it's really cool to see this kind of new version.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_01: Are you still there?
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_01: Can you hear me still?
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_01: Well, yeah.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_00: I'm hearing you.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_00: I got you.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, good.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_00: Good.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_00: You got me?
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_00: I still got you.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_00: No, I really wanted to...
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_00: I embraced the sense of joy that I have,
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: you know, by hook or by crook, come hell or high water, have forced
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_00: into my life.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, I,
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: no matter what,
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: and my other records,
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_00: while they have moments of joyfulness in them,
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_00: they were a lot of like Processing and sort of sad bastard contemplation
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: about things that are hard.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_00: And there's a place for that and it's really important.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_00: But I think for this one, I went kind of an outside in approach of like, it's tough out there.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_00: What is happening in the world?
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_00: What is happening now?
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_00: You know, personally and all these things are so hard sometimes.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_00: I really was like, what do I want to hear?
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: What do I need to do?
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like, it might just be have a dance party and have a good time.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_00: And that doesn't mean that the lyrical themes aren't,
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_00: very real and very sincere and some of them blithely a little bit darker or deeper
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: than may first appear.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_00: I wanted it to sound like a good time.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I wanted you to come away from it being like, ah, man, I forgot about that.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_00: I forgot about dancing in my kitchen,
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_01: you know, that kind of thing.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_01: I talk about inner child a lot and it makes me think of that kind of connecting back
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_01: to this like more innocent version of ourselves where we're not overthinking so much
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_01: and we're just kind of letting our freak flag fly
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_01: and not even realizing that's what we're doing.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_01: We're just like enjoying it as we go.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_01: So, um, I don't know if anybody has any questions since this is live,
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_01: write in messages, ask questions.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I know that there's some people,
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_01: some folks on here who I actually know outside of Substack
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_01: who are really big music heads.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_01: So if you want to have a little bit more understanding of like the,
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: the process behind how Mariana like created some of her songs,
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_01: then please ask away because Mariana is an open book about that part.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_01: So, um, I don't know if you want to break down kind of like,
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know if you have like a favorite song on the album or if there's like one
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_01: that you just, I'm sure you love all of them.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_01: They're all like your little children in a way,
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_01: but sometimes there's like a connection to one because it like inspires something
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_01: in you or it was influenced from something
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_01: that like really feels Like you're connected to it in this bigger way.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_01: But I don't know if you have one that you want to pick or like one
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_01: that just makes you feel so freaking proud of what you did.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think there's,
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_00: there might, that might be like twofold because a lot of my album was co-written.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_00: So I have two very wonderful collaborators that co-wrote Either alone or all three
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_00: of us, the songs.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I think a lot of those just always turn out so beautifully.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm not as precious about,
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_00: you know, this is mine and that's yours and anything like that anymore.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm always really proud of those, plus what the band in the studio does.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_00: Because again,
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: while I have this idea of what I think I should have,
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: some of them really become Just incredible.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_00: And there was one song to that end that didn't really have a title.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: It had an idea.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_00: It had a vibe.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: And we kind of had some time and extra space in the studio.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, this could be so fun.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_00: And I didn't really have the lyrics.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_00: And then it became this thing in the studio that was so much fun.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm so lucky that this seems to happen every record.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_00: I get one song like that.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_00: And then I wrote the lyrics after.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_00: I had placeholder lyrics.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, we'll deal with that later.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_00: And then I am so lucky.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_00: The lyrics just came pouring out of me later.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_00: And it became my favorite whole song on the record.
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_00: And it is one of those magical things that comes together like that.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_00: And it's called A Mess.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: And it just comes from a place of love and joy and adulthood as well.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_00: Like realizing,
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_00: because the chorus is,
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_00: why don't we confess to a tidy slice of happiness with the state of the world
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_00: and unrest, you're just the best.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: Because it's not like we're pretending the outside world isn't there and difficult
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  SPEAKER_00: and whatever, and everything is a mess.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_00: But to embrace those little things that make it bearable and then have
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_00: a really good time with it are the only way I think we're going to get through it.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_00: So a mess would be that one because it just blossomed into this beautiful thing
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_00: so organically and wonderfully.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm really, really proud of that song because it's also really fun.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I love, it's so true.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_01: Everything does feel really chaotic right now.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_01: And one of the things that,
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_01: the themes that keeps coming up is like finding joy,
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_01: finding things that make us feel kind of connected back to nature,
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_01: whatever makes us feel as happy as we can be within the chaos.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_01: And so it feels like that's kind of the point that you're hitting home with that song.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I love that you kind of came up with it Hearing the music first,
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_01: which I don't know how often, like I haven't really written many songs.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_01: I've never done a full song, actually.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes Curtis and I will like tinker around with something like that.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_01: And the lyrics I come up with are absolutely terrible.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_01: But you've always been an incredible lyricist.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_01: So that's one of the things that just seems to come really naturally for you.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_01: So to hear that music came first and then the lyrics came after,
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_01: I wonder how often it's usually one or the other for you.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, good question.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean,
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_00: I would definitely say the lyrics are something that is just,
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_00: it comes hot and heavy out of me all the time,
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: just writing in my phone and whatever and all that.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_00: So it's certainly, but you can't, I have what I call my personal bullshit detector.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_00: You can't shoehorn lyrics into music if it doesn't sing right.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_00: You've got to be flexible.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_00: So the lyrics that I did have, my placeholder lyrics, were fine.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_00: But once the joy of the song was there,
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_00: had to throw all of them.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, oh, those were such cool lyrics, though.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, well.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_00: So it also teaches you this sort of non-attachment thing.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_00: And I throw a lot away.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_00: I throw away most of what I write because some things don't need to be said or sung.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_00: And they will have a place maybe someday down the road.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_00: Do you keep notebooks or journals, random thoughts and ideas?
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, my God.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_00: That is so funny.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_00: No, but I get that.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_00: My voice notes section of my phone,
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_00: it would be like in that giant, what's the book called of mental disorders?
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_00: Like the big list of like every feeling every human has ever felt.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_00: Because I do, I both write things down and sing them into my phone quite often.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_00: I'll wake up in the middle of the night and sing a melody.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_00: And then the next morning I'll be like, ugh, were you high?
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_00: And like, no, I definitely wasn't.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_00: I wasn't.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_00: But to that end,
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_00: sometimes
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_00: it's wild because there's one song ...on the record that was this sort
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_00: of crazy 3 a.m.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_00: And then the next day I tried to sit down with my collaborators,
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_00: Rusty and Emily, and I was like, is this in 7, 8?
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_00: Is this in 9, 8?
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_00: What is the time signature of this?
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it is what it is, and it has to be this, but it's not a normal 4-4 song.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_00: And they're like, no, it's really weird.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_00: But it's on the record,
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_00: and you would never know that it's in a very strange time signature,
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_00: but it came like...
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_00: Straight out of me in the middle of the night.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not a standard song at all, but it's really, really cool.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_00: And hopefully it's disguised enough where you still kind of bop along,
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_00: even though it's not in a Western 4-4 time signature.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, I don't know if you said which song it is.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_01: Are we allowed to know or do we have to figure it out?
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I'd love the nerds to try to go find it.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_00: But no, it's called Called It Out.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, okay.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I feel like I remember hearing about it.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_01: Because I feel very fortunate that I was able to be in the studio with you
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_01: while you all were recording.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_01: I knew very,
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_01: I'm kind of more novice as far as my music knowledge comes when you're talking
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_01: about time signatures.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_01: But I appreciated being there for the process because it's just such a,
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_01: it's so fun and it's so interesting and confusing
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_01: and it's like you just have no idea.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_01: Like you were talking about practicing non-attachment.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_01: You really have to surrender so many times to just letting something be.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_01: And it's a really good life lesson.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I think, too,
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_00: there is this balance of also knowing what is worth fighting for,
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_00: you know, when to hang on to something.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_00: Because that song in particular, for example, everybody in the band was like trying to Trying.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_00: And the try was all that we were hearing.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, no, no, no.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_00: I believe that we can find a way to make this...
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_00: Feel instead of do.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_00: Do you know what I mean?
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_00: And so I was like, let's keep working this.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_00: Let's keep trying.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_00: Let's do something else.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_00: Let's take a break from it and come back because it really was worth pushing through
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_00: to where we ended up.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_00: But it did not start that way.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_00: It started out real weird and disjointed and not vibey at all.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_00: And the cool thing is that I always had this vision of this horn section
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_00: That I could hear in my head that made it made sense at the end,
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_00: but that they couldn't hear.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_00: And they were like, what?
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, I guess we'll just do this.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_00: But then once you added the horns at the end and all the post-production stuff
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_00: that we ended up putting there, it suddenly came together.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_00: But it was touch and go.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_00: We weren't sure it was going to work, basically.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_00: So you have to also know what to let go of and also know what to hang on to.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and know...
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_01: That experimentation is necessary throughout the process too.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_01: And I mean, I love a good horn section too.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_01: So I understand that you wanted to add that in there,
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_01: but I love all of the little life lessons that you're giving about being able
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_01: to just kind of trust yourself, but then also know when it's time to let go.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that That kind of comes with experience and getting older
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_01: and understanding that some things just don't work out for a reason and
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_01: then we end up in a place where maybe we were better than we thought we would be
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_01: because we ended up letting go and getting through onto the other side.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_00: Ain't that the truth.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, ain't that the truth, yes.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_01: So, okay.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_01: You have a show coming up for anybody who's in Charlottesville who's listening.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_01: It's the 29th, correct?
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_00: Just about two weeks.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if you want to give more information on that or any of those things.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe some people will
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_01: travel to it.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_01: Peter, Jude, maybe you're going to come and see Mary on a show.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: Woo!
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so we're going to be at the Southern,
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_00: which is a cool venue, downtown Charlottesville, Saturday the 29th of August.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_00: This is going to be our official release gig,
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_00: and I'm playing everything off the record,
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: including one very scary,
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_00: intimate song that's just me and piano,
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_00: which is like, ah,
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_00: that's not something that I do very much,
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_00: but I'm kind of excited because I was thinking about this podcast today,
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_00: and like, The Naked Room is about being exposed, and...
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_00: I've gotten so accustomed to having my beautiful,
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_00: humongous sort of 10-piece band behind me all the time and forcing myself out
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_00: of my comfort zone again to play piano,
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: which is not my primary instrument, and sing alone.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_00: I will feel very naked,
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_00: but it's a song I'm also very proud of that needs to be performed
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_00: and has never been performed live before.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_00: So that's when it's coming.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_01: I think I know the one that you're talking about,
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_01: but I'm going to leave it alone because you're going to perform it and it's going
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_01: to be absolutely beautiful.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_01: And then I'm going to have to hear from the people who are there how validated
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_01: that it's going to be beautiful.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_01: Because I think like you're talking about your voice memos.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like,
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_01: I think I heard that one through a voice memo and it was very rough,
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_01: but we still were like tearing up hearing it.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_01: So it's going to be wonderful.
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_01: What are some of the...
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_01: The things recently,
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_01: like you can dive into this as much as you want or not,
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_01: but like what are some of the things that have really inspired you?
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_01: I know that you like started playing tennis and after 40 and like that's
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: a big thing that's like shifted for you.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_01: You've gotten really good at it and a lot of women are told that Yeah.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_01: It's a great example of how it's never too late for us to do anything new.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_01: We can start something new.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_01: We can put out a completely new record.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_01: We can write a book.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_01: We can do whatever we want.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_01: So can you talk about that a little bit more,
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_01: about deciding to start something new after an age
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_01: when we're told we're not supposed to?
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think so.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_00: My birthday was also yesterday, so I've been thinking about this a lot.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_00: My wonderful partner threw me a surprise party with a bunch of friends.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_00: One of my other friends made a beautiful dinner at her house,
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_00: and there are a small handful of lovely friends there,
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_00: all of whom happen to be a little bit older than me.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_00: So I said, what?
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_00: What do you all think about this sort of midlife moment that we are all going through?
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_00: And what would you say sort of defines it for you?
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I think the overwhelming one was not giving a shit.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_00: You know?
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_01: I heard that part.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_00: You got me?
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_01: Not giving a shit.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_01: You were with, let's recap.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_01: It was mostly older women who were older
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_00: than you.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it was a bunch of couple friends and everybody in the room was older than me.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_00: But I asked them, I said, what are you taking away from midlife in this moment?
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_00: And they all just kind of unilaterally,
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_00: there were beautiful nuanced things that we talked about,
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_00: but it was mostly just caring less about what other people think
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_00: and doing what brings you the most joy and I recently got divorced.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_00: I recently picked up tennis.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_00: I recently decided I get to take up as much or as little space as I want.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not that I've ever been exactly a wilting flower.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_00: You've known me a long time.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_00: I don't suffer from From that terribly much,
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_00: but there was something about trying to make accommodation for things and people
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_00: that really didn't fit me.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_00: And so not only did I sort of take my own physical health very seriously by starting
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_00: a new sport and then falling in love with it,
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_00: which is one of those things of like,
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_00: especially for women,
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_00: we're told,
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_00: you know, get fit, go to the gym, work out, do your Pilates, whatever, whatever.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_00: But under no Umbrella are we told,
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_00: find something joyful and then do that and the fitness will come with it.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_00: Like it just rarely comes that way.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_00: Whereas I think men are like, have hobbies, do fun things.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_00: And then like, you know, they spend all day golfing and walking around.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_00: And so that's what they get to do.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_00: Or they have their bike riding friends and they go out.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_00: But it's like, I think having fun.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_00: Especially physical things be joy-driven.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_00: It's what's going to keep you doing it, right?
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_00: And tennis happens to be the thing that I've found that really brings me so much joy.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's like a very active meditation.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_00: You can't think about anything else when you're playing tennis, you know?
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_00: And so that's been really great.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: And then, yeah,
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_00: just the new sound of the new record and really just coming out of my funk
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_00: that I was in for so long and just taking up all the space and...
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_00: One of my dearest friends,
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_00: our friend Emily,
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_00: in my birthday card she gave me yesterday just said,
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_00: you know, thank you for owning what you deserve.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_00: And that's what I've been doing,
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_00: I think,
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_00: a lot more in my 40s,
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_00: just feeling like I'm not going to apologize for what I want
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_00: and what I think I deserve in life because— That doesn't help anybody.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not the example I want to set for my children either.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_01: We are taught to make ourselves really small a lot of times,
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_01: to make everyone else around us comfortable.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm really exhausted by that too.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_01: And that was a big reason why I wanted to start having more of these conversations
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_01: with women who are reinventing,
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_01: who are choosing to Take up space,
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_01: who are choosing to do the things that bring them joy and want to expand in
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_01: that way.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_01: Because, yeah,
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_01: the societal programming of, like,
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_01: you're washed up, you're done, you can't have what you want after a certain age.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like, there's so many examples of women.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like, Vera Wang is one of the first ones who comes to my mind,
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_01: where she,
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_01: like, had her big break after 40, and she's still fabulous at 80 years old.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know if you've seen one of her photo shoots recently,
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_01: but I'm like, damn, that woman has aged very well and she is kicking ass.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_01: And like,
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_01: why can't that be like,
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_01: instead of feeling like we just have to keep shrinking ourselves.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_01: So, yeah.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway, you're an inspiration to me and I echo what Emily said too.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like, just seeing you,
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_01: knowing you for such a long time and seeing the way that you have I don't want
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_01: to say louder, but it's just out there more.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_01: It's really, cool to see.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_00: Well, thank you.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_00: It's very liberating and a little bit intimidating because as I say these words,
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_00: like, don't give a shit what anybody thinks.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_00: I care very deeply about this thing that I put out and I'm so proud of it and I'm
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_00: so excited about it.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_00: So it's also like, I don't care what you think, but I really hope you like it.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_00: It's really fun.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_00: So it's out there,
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_00: and I think you could tweak these things to death,
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_00: but an artist's primary job,
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_00: I think,
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_00: is deciding when imperfectly done is better than perfectly and never out there.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_00: So that's where we're at, and I'm really psyched that I can finally let it all go.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, and give it a go, too.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_00: And give it a
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_01: go.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_01: Give it a try.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know if you have any...
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_01: Kind of insights or bits of advice.
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_01: Like if there are other women out there,
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_01: you just got some great feedback or great advice from these women who are older
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_01: than you.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_01: So if there's women who are contemplating wanting to make something happen
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_01: for themselves or give it a go,
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_01: like your album said, what's something that you would impart on them?
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like what's just one little bit of like Magic wand advice that you would give to
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_01: a younger woman?
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe a younger music artist, even.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_00: I would say, yeah, I would say don't wait.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_00: You will always do things you do.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_00: I think most people regret what they don't do, what they say no to.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I think it goes past music.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_00: It goes to life where saying yes,
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_00: obviously being smart about stuff, but
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_00: I rarely regret, oh man, I should have gone.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_00: I should have done that.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_00: I can't believe I didn't drag myself out of the house when I was kind of Tired.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_00: I thought in my 20s, I thought I was tired.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_00: You didn't know what tired meant, girl.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_00: Stop it.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_00: Get out of the house.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_00: Go do the thing.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_00: And most importantly, go support other artists now more than ever.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_00: If you want to be an artist,
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_00: you better be an artist supporter because
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_00: the AI fraud jerkholes are making money off of zero talent,
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_00: and we need each other's support more than ever.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_00: Go listen to live music.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_00: Go buy the physical album of somebody you like because your purchase,
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_00: you specifically,
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_00: can move the needle for an artist just the way that they could help you.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's incredible advice and it is true.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_01: There's something that's also so wonderful for yourself to be able to go
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_01: and experience live music too.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_01: It's very good.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's meditative.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_01: You're talking about tennis.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_01: Like going to a live show,
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_01: as long as it's music that you like,
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_01: you know, sometimes you go to a show and you're like, hold on a second.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe I do want to be in bed right now.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just joking.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah,
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_01: supporting other artists is something that's so integral at this point in time
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_01: because AI slap can be damned.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_01: Again, everyone, Mariana has a show, August 29th.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_00: Charlottesville.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it means a lot.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_01: So please go support her show, because...
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_00: Go ahead.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_00: The new record is called Give It A Go, and you can find it everywhere you listen to music.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_00: But iTunes is better than Spotify, please.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, iTunes for the win over Spotify.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_01: Or Tidal is another one.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_01: Isn't Tidal... Do we still like Tidal?
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think I have my stuff on Tidal, but I know that they're better for sure.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_01: They give more royalties back to the artist, I think, than a lot of the other platforms.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_00: Created by other music.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_01: So.
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway, this has been amazing.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know if you have any last little.
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for having me.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, of course.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_01: I wish that I could be with you right now sitting on your porch.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_01: It would be so nice.
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_00: But thank you for having me and thank you everybody that was tuned in.
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, I hope to chat some more and I can't wait to hear the next episodes.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks, darling.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_00: I love you.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_00: Love you.
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_00: Bye.