Latest / Foul Territory / Ken Rosenthal on latest extensions, ABS + Jim Bowden talks rookies, Yankees reported Paul Skenes offer

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Ken Rosenthal on latest extensions, ABS + Jim Bowden talks rookies, Yankees reported Paul Skenes offer · Foul Territory

0:04
Speaker 1: The Inside Scoop is presented by MLB nine Innings twenty
0:07
Speaker 1: six great video game. Go check it out. We'll talk
0:09
Speaker 1: more about it later, but let's talk to Ken Rosenthal
0:11
Speaker 1: right now about these extensions. Extension season starting during the season,
0:14
Speaker 1: this time of year. Ken, So what do you think
0:16
Speaker 1: of some of the latest that we just covered. Cooper
0:19
Speaker 1: Pratt for the Brewers, Colt Emerson for the Mariners before
0:22
Speaker 1: they reached the show.
0:24
Speaker 2: Well, I heard you guys talking about the potential of
0:26
Speaker 2: a lockout and a workstoppage and the CBA and how
0:29
Speaker 2: that might be affecting things. I'm not sure that is true.
0:33
Speaker 2: Deals like Emerson's we've seen over the years, and he
0:36
Speaker 2: is a guy who's going to be in the big
0:38
Speaker 2: leagues very soon, and you would expect that, yes, they
0:41
Speaker 2: would try to sign them to an extension. We can
0:43
Speaker 2: cite any number of examples guys like Colt Emerson who
0:47
Speaker 2: received extensions. Cooper Pratt is a little bit different. Obviously,
0:51
Speaker 2: he has not had offensive success even at Double A
0:54
Speaker 2: at this point in his career. But for Milwaukee, a
0:57
Speaker 2: small market team, they're taking a chance, they're gambling that
1:00
Speaker 2: he's going to get to the big leagues and at
1:02
Speaker 2: that point this will work out for them. So in
1:06
Speaker 2: each case, I don't know if you're a team looking
1:09
Speaker 2: at anything going forward and you can say, well, there
1:13
Speaker 2: might be a lockout, we might lose half the season,
1:15
Speaker 2: we might lose all the season, we might lose two weeks.
1:18
Speaker 2: I don't know that you can operate that way. You
1:20
Speaker 2: can't operate in the dark. So you have to do
1:23
Speaker 2: and make moves that are in front of you and
1:27
Speaker 2: do the best things for your organization under the current
1:29
Speaker 2: set of circumstances. And we've seen that with the Cubs
1:32
Speaker 2: signing their big deals with the guys the last couple
1:35
Speaker 2: of weeks, Pete ro Armstrong and Nico Horner. And now
1:37
Speaker 2: we've seen this with these extensions.
1:40
Speaker 3: Do you know the rules on our teams allowed to say, yes,
1:44
Speaker 3: we're gonna call you up if you sign this extension.
1:47
Speaker 3: Is there verbiage where that's not allowed. We assume that,
1:50
Speaker 3: But I hate assuming things.
1:53
Speaker 2: I don't know that it is in the CBA that
1:56
Speaker 2: you can not do that. I don't know, honestly, Eric,
2:00
Speaker 2: And clearly these things are dangled from time to time
2:05
Speaker 2: to players because teams want them to sign the extensions
2:08
Speaker 2: and then get them to the big leagues. That is
2:10
Speaker 2: definitely something that we've speculated on with regard to Connor Griffin,
2:14
Speaker 2: But I don't know that it even affects Emerson. I'm
2:16
Speaker 2: sure he'll be in the big league soon, but he
2:18
Speaker 2: was going to be in the big league soon anyway.
2:19
Speaker 2: And Pratt he's not going to be in the Big
2:22
Speaker 2: league soon and that's not going to change with this extension.
2:26
Speaker 2: So I don't know exactly what the rules are there.
2:29
Speaker 2: My guess is you cannot do that, but I don't
2:32
Speaker 2: know how the CBA reads in that form.
2:35
Speaker 3: Am I correct in saying that when I look at
2:38
Speaker 3: a contract like ninety million for a guy who's not
2:40
Speaker 3: in the big leagues yet will be soon, that that's
2:43
Speaker 3: a way of us as fans valuing what teams actually
2:48
Speaker 3: value ninety million dollars because it is a gamble when
2:51
Speaker 3: you don't have a player that has any big league
2:53
Speaker 3: service time and we don't know if he's going to
2:56
Speaker 3: be able to hack it in the big leagues. Is
3:00
Speaker 3: that showing us ninety millions really not that much for
3:03
Speaker 3: these teams?
3:05
Speaker 2: I don't know that I would say that, Eric. It
3:07
Speaker 2: is interesting that a small market team like the Brewers
3:11
Speaker 2: just plunk down fifty million for a guy who has
3:14
Speaker 2: not even hit in double A. You would say, well,
3:16
Speaker 2: if the sport is so broken, how can that happen.
3:19
Speaker 2: The Brewers would counter by saying, the sport is broken,
3:22
Speaker 2: and we have to do that to make sure we
3:24
Speaker 2: have control over certain players that otherwise we would lose.
3:28
Speaker 2: That's a debate that will of course go on and
3:30
Speaker 2: on throughout. But in terms of col Emerson, these teams
3:36
Speaker 2: all have models, projection models, basically statistically based things that
3:42
Speaker 2: they use to see or envision what a player's performance
3:47
Speaker 2: might be going forward. Sometimes the models are accurate, sometimes
3:50
Speaker 2: they're not, but they believe in them for the most part,
3:53
Speaker 2: and they are seeing something here with Cooper Pratt, the
3:57
Speaker 2: Brewers are, and clearly the Mariners are with Emerson as well,
4:00
Speaker 2: but never sends a top ten prospect in the game. Again,
4:02
Speaker 2: different story entirely. So when these teams look at these
4:07
Speaker 2: models and determine, Okay, we think he's going to be
4:10
Speaker 2: this for this long project him out that way, they
4:14
Speaker 2: value that and they determine whether an extension of this
4:18
Speaker 2: magnitude in Emerson's case, is worth it. And obviously the
4:22
Speaker 2: Mariners believe it is worth it for them, otherwise they
4:25
Speaker 2: wouldn't do it. Same thing with the Brewers. They're not
4:27
Speaker 2: doing this unless they think they're getting a deal.
4:31
Speaker 4: Ken, is there anybody next?
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Speaker 2: I'm sure there are conversations going on. There have been
4:36
Speaker 2: conversations going on with Connor Griffin. And we have a
4:39
Speaker 2: whole host of rookies.
4:41
Speaker 5: Right now that are.
4:43
Speaker 2: In the early season performing extremely well. Go from south
4:46
Speaker 2: Stewart to McGonagall, right down the line Weatherhold and these conversations,
4:51
Speaker 2: AJU know this, They take place all the time. Now.
4:55
Speaker 2: The teams always get them to the finish line. No,
4:57
Speaker 2: they don't, because some players do prefer to go year
5:00
Speaker 2: to year and believe that is in their better interests,
5:02
Speaker 2: and in many cases it is. But then there are
5:05
Speaker 2: examples like Scott Kingery, remember him. He got a deal
5:08
Speaker 2: from the Phillies that belief was twenty five million really early,
5:12
Speaker 2: like within a week or two of his career starting,
5:14
Speaker 2: if I recall correctly. And he has not proven to
5:18
Speaker 2: be a quality major leaguer, So there is some risk involved.
5:21
Speaker 2: I would say there's more risk with Pratt than Emerson
5:23
Speaker 2: because we don't know what the bat is going to be.
5:26
Speaker 2: But At the same time, teams don't do these things
5:29
Speaker 2: unless they feel it's going to work out for them.
5:35
Speaker 1: I've got one more while we're on this topic, Ken,
5:37
Speaker 1: and then we can move on. It sounded like Gunner
5:39
Speaker 1: Henderson was interested in doing something, and I know the
5:42
Speaker 1: Orioles figured it out, Samuel Pisallo, but how important do
5:46
Speaker 1: you think it is for them to try and figure
5:47
Speaker 1: it out with a player who's going to cost significantly
5:51
Speaker 1: more money than the deals that we're talking about. I
5:53
Speaker 1: think some people get confused on what it means for
5:56
Speaker 1: service time and the arbitration number. Some people were confused
5:58
Speaker 1: about PCA and Horner getting the same deal, and I'm like,
6:01
Speaker 1: that is not how it works. We're not comping the players,
6:04
Speaker 1: We're comping the status of where they are in service time.
6:06
Speaker 1: But anyway, Gunner Henderson now a few years into his career,
6:10
Speaker 1: Orioles fans are like, hey, if this guy's saying it,
6:13
Speaker 1: then you should at least make an effort. And then
6:15
Speaker 1: I mean I want to say, like kind of leak
6:16
Speaker 1: it and say, hey, we gave it our best shot.
6:19
Speaker 2: Players are always going to say they're open to extensions,
6:22
Speaker 2: and whenever I see on MLB trade rumors regurgitated story
6:26
Speaker 2: of a player saying, yes, I'd be willing to do
6:28
Speaker 2: an extension, No kidding. Everybody's open to people giving them money. Now,
6:34
Speaker 2: the question is would Gunna Henderson sign an extension that
6:37
Speaker 2: might be below market value, because that's what these things
6:40
Speaker 2: generally are. He is represented by Scott Borris. Scott Boris
6:44
Speaker 2: also represents Cooper Pratt, and from that perspective alone, the
6:48
Speaker 2: extension for Pratt is surprising because Scott Boris in general,
6:52
Speaker 2: not always in general, prefers his clients to go to
6:56
Speaker 2: the open market, and why because he's been very successful
7:00
Speaker 2: at getting big deals for top players on the open market.
7:03
Speaker 2: So I would say the odds of the Oriols signing
7:06
Speaker 2: Gunnar Henderson long term are extremely low. And yes, they
7:09
Speaker 2: could offer him, I don't know, two hundred and fifty
7:12
Speaker 2: million tomorrow, leak it and say we tried, but we
7:16
Speaker 2: all know that it's not going to be easy for
7:18
Speaker 2: them to necessarily one make that offer and two get
7:21
Speaker 2: it done at that number, and at some point it
7:24
Speaker 2: becomes just window dressing eyewash, if you want to call
7:27
Speaker 2: it that, Because the chances are here that Gunner Henderson
7:32
Speaker 2: is going to go to the open market.
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8:35
Speaker 3: You wrote that MLB's highly riveting ABS system is a
8:41
Speaker 3: good call. Do you think that is going to continue
8:45
Speaker 3: or is it going to be something that the fuddy
8:47
Speaker 3: duddies take over and say, no, it should be this,
8:50
Speaker 3: it should be that.
8:52
Speaker 2: Well, there are always tweaks you can make to any
8:55
Speaker 2: new system or innovation. And I'm not saying that this
8:59
Speaker 2: is all and this is great and forget about it.
9:02
Speaker 2: We're good. We don't know that, and we are going
9:05
Speaker 2: to see, as I pointed out in my column, we're
9:06
Speaker 2: going to see some outcomes that are maybe not so desirable.
9:10
Speaker 2: One tenth of an inch deciding a game, and when
9:13
Speaker 2: the margin for era is greater than that. In some
9:15
Speaker 2: cases that's kind of debatable, right, But by and large,
9:19
Speaker 2: what we've seen so far, it's only been less than
9:22
Speaker 2: a week. Fans like this. It moves quickly, the players
9:27
Speaker 2: seem to be fine with it, they're adjusting to how
9:31
Speaker 2: to strategize with it, and ultimately it does seem to
9:34
Speaker 2: me that it's good for the game. I didn't realize
9:36
Speaker 2: the entertainment aspect of it, the entertainment value of it,
9:40
Speaker 2: and it certainly has that. And yes, I know a
9:43
Speaker 2: lot of fans are saying, well, this shows the umps
9:45
Speaker 2: are no good and we're exposing them. The umps are
9:48
Speaker 2: good for the most part. There's exceptions in any profession,
9:51
Speaker 2: but for the most part they do a great job.
9:54
Speaker 2: And yes, this is correcting egregious mistakes. The problem is,
9:59
Speaker 2: the one thing I can see going forward is yes,
10:02
Speaker 2: one tenth of an inch on ABS and it will
10:04
Speaker 2: decide to call one way or the other. In that case,
10:07
Speaker 2: the player is effectively guessing he's not that good, his
10:10
Speaker 2: eye is not that good, and he's taking an educated
10:14
Speaker 2: guess and hopefully it's going to work out for him.
10:17
Speaker 2: That doesn't mean, and I believe AJ was just saying
10:19
Speaker 2: this that the umpire is bad like Mike Esterbrook last
10:22
Speaker 2: night with those margins that he was missing by the
10:25
Speaker 2: plate umpire in the Seattle Yankee game. That doesn't mean
10:29
Speaker 2: he's a bad ump It means, according to ABS, that
10:32
Speaker 2: the pitch is maybe a tenth or a little bit
10:34
Speaker 2: more than that out of the strike zone.
10:37
Speaker 4: What ken I didn't say was bad. I said, I
10:39
Speaker 4: questioned why it's a three D Why it's not a
10:42
Speaker 4: three D strike zone like it should be, because in
10:44
Speaker 4: the rule book it's a three D strike zone, right,
10:46
Speaker 4: So if it's measuring from the middle of the plate,
10:49
Speaker 4: not the front of the plate, now the middle of
10:51
Speaker 4: the plate, that's about six to eight inches, right, I
10:54
Speaker 4: forget exactly how far that back. So if that ball
10:56
Speaker 4: is going down that actually technically he was right and
11:00
Speaker 4: he's getting blasted. So and Kratz said that he heard
11:03
Speaker 4: the three D technology wasn't good enough. But if that
11:06
Speaker 4: strike zone is supposed to be a three D box,
11:09
Speaker 4: not a flat strike zone, why the heck are we
11:11
Speaker 4: using abs if it's not correct.
11:14
Speaker 2: Well, it would be correct, I would think, aj according
11:18
Speaker 2: to what is going on right now now, could they
11:21
Speaker 2: adjust it eventually to three D? I don't know. But
11:25
Speaker 2: the one thing about this right now is everybody knows
11:27
Speaker 2: what the strike zone is and has to adjust to it.
11:30
Speaker 2: It's a new zone. It's different than before. We know that.
11:33
Speaker 2: We've seen the diagrams of that. So it's not like
11:36
Speaker 2: the players are in the dark here. It's not like
11:38
Speaker 2: the umpires are in the dark. But yes, it's a
11:40
Speaker 2: fair question that you raise.
11:42
Speaker 3: Ken. One of our guests coming on later is Joe West.
11:45
Speaker 3: Rarely do we get to hear umpires speak on strike zones,
11:50
Speaker 3: let alone speak on anything. What would be something that
11:53
Speaker 3: you've seen in the first week now that you would
11:55
Speaker 3: want to ask Joe West or a current umpire about
11:59
Speaker 3: what's going on in the game with abs right now.
12:02
Speaker 2: I would want to ask his opinion of it and
12:04
Speaker 2: whether he feels it is something that enhances umpires or
12:11
Speaker 2: detracts from them. And what I mean by that is,
12:14
Speaker 2: is it something umpires welcome, because obviously now the big
12:18
Speaker 2: misses and any human being is going to have misses,
12:21
Speaker 2: they can be corrected. Or does it take an umpire
12:24
Speaker 2: off that, hey, I missed by one tenth of an
12:27
Speaker 2: inch one tenth of an inch and people are thinking, oh,
12:30
Speaker 2: I'm not good. That is kind of the rubber meets
12:34
Speaker 2: the road question that I have here. I would think
12:37
Speaker 2: that some umpires welcome the help, as they did with replay.
12:41
Speaker 2: At the same time, and especially at a time, by
12:43
Speaker 2: the way, let me digress here, especially at a time
12:46
Speaker 2: when the ball is moving like never before and breaking pitches,
12:50
Speaker 2: and when the pitchers are throwing harder than ever before.
12:53
Speaker 2: It's really hard for the umpires played umpires to get
12:56
Speaker 2: everything right. So I would think they would welcome it
12:59
Speaker 2: in that regard. But at the same time, they are
13:02
Speaker 2: getting exposed, if that's the proper word, in a way
13:05
Speaker 2: that they haven't been before. We haven't been able to
13:08
Speaker 2: judge them in real time before, so that would be
13:12
Speaker 2: my question, is it good, Joe or is it bad?
13:16
Speaker 5: Ken?
13:16
Speaker 1: Let's finish with overreactions to the beginning of the season,
13:20
Speaker 1: and I'll try and look at some of the teams
13:22
Speaker 1: that are supposed to be pretty good off to slow
13:24
Speaker 1: ish starts and kind of give you a dealer's choice.
13:27
Speaker 1: You can go off the board too, but I'll look
13:29
Speaker 1: at the Red Sox specifically their offense. I'll look at
13:32
Speaker 1: the Giants, of course, with Tony Vaitello picking up his
13:35
Speaker 1: first win now, and then the Phillies off to a
13:38
Speaker 1: slow start and they got beat up by the Nationals
13:40
Speaker 1: last night. Again, we know for these teams it's like
13:42
Speaker 1: they're four games into the season. But have you learned
13:45
Speaker 1: anything yet from what you've seen?
13:48
Speaker 2: No, I'm least worried about the Phillies, honestly, because we've
13:52
Speaker 2: seen those players perform at a high level before. I've
13:54
Speaker 2: been worried about the Red Sox offense the entire offseason.
13:58
Speaker 2: I'm still not sure they did enough. And it seems
14:01
Speaker 2: to me they've placed a very large bet on Roman
14:03
Speaker 2: Anthony and I'm not talking about his extension. I'm talking
14:07
Speaker 2: about the value that he is going to have to
14:09
Speaker 2: bring to that lineup. All right, the Giants, that's a team.
14:13
Speaker 2: I question whether their offense is good enough period, and
14:16
Speaker 2: we haven't seen any indication yet that it is going
14:19
Speaker 2: to be a dynamic offense. You look at the names
14:22
Speaker 2: and you think, Okay, these guys might be all right.
14:24
Speaker 2: I want to see it, so way too early to
14:27
Speaker 2: judge anything, including Vytello. My gosh, the guy has managed
14:31
Speaker 2: four games. When you did this as the San Francisco Giants,
14:35
Speaker 2: you had to know there was going to be an
14:37
Speaker 2: adjustment period, there was going to be a learning curve.
14:39
Speaker 2: And you can't judge Tony Vattelo, maybe not even on
14:43
Speaker 2: the first season. So let's give it time there and
14:47
Speaker 2: let's just see how they play and how he does
14:49
Speaker 2: as a manager before coming to any vast conclusions about
14:53
Speaker 2: who he is.
14:54
Speaker 3: But can you judge can you judge Mitello and what
14:57
Speaker 3: he means to that clubhouse by the reaction of the play,
15:00
Speaker 3: because when he said the other day, you know, maybe
15:02
Speaker 3: they were a little amped up because of my speech.
15:05
Speaker 3: And then Robbie Ray and Ellie Oramos both came out
15:09
Speaker 3: and were like, we're big leaguers, like it's early.
15:11
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, Eric, and I thought those comments were misplaced.
15:16
Speaker 2: It's two games at that point, and he should not
15:19
Speaker 2: have overreacted in the way he did by what he said,
15:22
Speaker 2: and the players kind of basically said, it's two games,
15:25
Speaker 2: We're not worried. So, yes, you can judge these things
15:28
Speaker 2: in the moment, but I would suggest that comments like
15:31
Speaker 2: that are not ultimately what we're going to be assessing
15:34
Speaker 2: Tony vtelo on and what he says to the media. Yes,
15:38
Speaker 2: it can have an effect on the clubhouse and it
15:40
Speaker 2: can be interpreted by players in a certain way. There
15:43
Speaker 2: is no doubt about that, and it's very easy. It's
15:46
Speaker 2: going to be very easy for him to lose that
15:48
Speaker 2: clubhouse if he says a lot of things that they
15:52
Speaker 2: find wacky and does things within the game. They are
15:55
Speaker 2: major league players, are I think, almost inherently suspicious of
16:00
Speaker 2: a guy like him coming in and that said give
16:04
Speaker 2: him time. My gosh, I just can't get ready to
16:07
Speaker 2: jump on somebody after four games.
16:10
Speaker 1: No, yeah, come on. I mean we even had some
16:13
Speaker 1: fans in the comments that I was going through last
16:14
Speaker 1: night on YouTube saying, what's a good judge thirty games?
16:17
Speaker 1: I'm like, no, I don't think thirty games is even close.
16:19
Speaker 1: I was like at least.
16:20
Speaker 2: Last year, Scott, last year. I don't remember the date exactly.
16:25
Speaker 2: What was a June tenth when the Mets led the majors, right,
16:28
Speaker 2: They led the majors in every category, not every category,
16:32
Speaker 2: but it wins the winning percentage. They had the best
16:34
Speaker 2: record in baseball June whatever that number was. Late in
16:39
Speaker 2: the season, Detroit Tigers way up on the Cleveland Guardians
16:42
Speaker 2: blew that lead. I'm not saying we can never judge,
16:45
Speaker 2: of course not, and that's kind of what my job is,
16:48
Speaker 2: right to evaluate and look at things as we go along.
16:51
Speaker 2: But you got to be reasonable about it, and you
16:53
Speaker 2: have to have in your mind that this is one
16:56
Speaker 2: hundred and sixty two games six months. It is endless,
17:00
Speaker 2: and so much will happen between now and the end
17:03
Speaker 2: of the season.
17:04
Speaker 1: Yeah, good call. The pitching crumbled for the Mess and
17:06
Speaker 1: it was like among the best in baseball for the
17:08
Speaker 1: first couple months of the season. So much will change. Ken,
17:11
Speaker 1: good stuff. We'll catch you later in the week. Thanks guys,
17:14
Speaker 1: Thank you. Ken Rosenthal with fair territory yesterday. The usual
17:18
Speaker 1: schedule here running Mondays and then and those are Live
17:22
Speaker 1: by the Way and then Thursdays Live Extra Grill and
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Speaker 1: Ken Questions for You Thursdays too with Alanaizzo running point
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Speaker 1: Front Office, Unfiltered resident GM Jim and joining us right
18:01
Speaker 1: now and also the star of you see it on
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Speaker 1: his sweatshirt GM Territory. It's a money logo. Make sure
18:06
Speaker 1: you check that show out. But many of these topics
18:09
Speaker 1: get covered over the weekend with him. Let's start with
18:11
Speaker 1: the extensions, perfect timing to have you on JB. What
18:14
Speaker 1: do you think of the latest cold Emerson and Cooper
18:16
Speaker 1: Pratt signing up to big money before they hit the show.
18:19
Speaker 6: Yeah, so let's start with cold Emerson. I think Jerry
18:22
Speaker 6: Depoto and the Mariners did a really good job of
18:25
Speaker 6: tying up a future all star shortstop. You know, eight years,
18:29
Speaker 6: ninety five million. They got a club option that basically
18:32
Speaker 6: you control the player for nine years, So I get
18:35
Speaker 6: three arbitration years and I get three free agent years
18:38
Speaker 6: at one hundred and thirty million.
18:39
Speaker 5: Oh yeah, thank you very much. Might have another, you know.
18:42
Speaker 6: Roman Anthony got nine years, one hundred and thirty million
18:44
Speaker 6: from Boston. Jackson Merrill got nine years, one hundred and
18:47
Speaker 6: thirty five million from San Diego. Cold Emerson belongs in
18:51
Speaker 6: that conversation with those two players. He's going to be
18:54
Speaker 6: a star. And so the club wins these deals.
18:56
Speaker 5: They just do.
18:57
Speaker 6: As long as the player lives up anywhere to how
19:00
Speaker 6: we kind of view that he's going.
19:02
Speaker 5: To they're gonna win.
19:03
Speaker 6: And I guess the example I always use with everybody
19:06
Speaker 6: is Ronal Kunya Junior versus Vladimir Gerro Junior. Right, they
19:10
Speaker 6: both came up at the same time. They were both considered.
19:13
Speaker 5: The two best prospects in baseball.
19:15
Speaker 6: One of them decided they wanted that long term, one
19:17
Speaker 6: hundred million dollar.
19:18
Speaker 5: Deal early, so Ronal Kunya took it. That's great.
19:21
Speaker 6: Vladimir Gerro Junior said, now I'm going to go through
19:23
Speaker 6: the system. So he went through the system. By the
19:26
Speaker 6: time he got to being a five plus and he's
19:29
Speaker 6: getting close to free agency, he got a five.
19:31
Speaker 5: Hundred million dollar deal.
19:33
Speaker 6: So this year, Ronal Kunu will make seventeen million, vladimirk
19:37
Speaker 6: Giro Junior will make forty million. Next year, Roni Kunyu
19:40
Speaker 6: Junior will make seventeen million, Vladimir gir Junior will make
19:44
Speaker 6: forty millions out a twenty three million dollar differential the
19:47
Speaker 6: next couple of years.
19:48
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's what happened.
19:50
Speaker 6: So you get that security early, you get that first
19:53
Speaker 6: contract so you never have to work again, and you
19:55
Speaker 6: leave a lot of money on the table. And that's
19:57
Speaker 6: what cold Emerson just did, just like ron kue you did.
20:00
Speaker 5: Several years ago.
20:02
Speaker 3: Thinking of the cold Emerson contract and then also thinking
20:04
Speaker 3: about Connor Griffin sitting in triple A? Is there a
20:07
Speaker 3: way that those players could increase their value in Triple A?
20:12
Speaker 3: Say cold Emerson said no, And then you know, you
20:15
Speaker 3: spend two months. Who cares if he has even four
20:18
Speaker 3: hundred in Triple A? What's he gonna get ninety two million?
20:21
Speaker 3: So is there a way that a player can increase
20:24
Speaker 3: their value or is it like, hey, the team comes
20:27
Speaker 3: to it, you make your counter, the team counters. That's
20:31
Speaker 3: pretty much all the negotiating you can do.
20:33
Speaker 6: Correct, No, I mean I think, if I'm Connor Griffin,
20:37
Speaker 6: the cold Emerson deal just made me some money because
20:39
Speaker 6: I'm going to argue that the cold Emerson deal that
20:42
Speaker 6: was negotiated by Seth and Sam Levinson of ases.
20:46
Speaker 5: You know, I'm gonna look at it.
20:47
Speaker 6: As one hundred and thirty million over nine years, and
20:49
Speaker 6: so if if you're worth nine one thirty, then my
20:53
Speaker 6: argument is Connor Griffin's now worth nine one fifty or
20:57
Speaker 6: one sixty if he's gonna gonna give that up because
20:59
Speaker 6: he graded a lot higher in terms of how we
21:02
Speaker 6: project the players. So I do think that the Emerson
21:05
Speaker 6: deal does move the market some. So I think Connor Griffin,
21:09
Speaker 6: by waiting a few weeks or whatever.
21:11
Speaker 5: It's going to be, will benefit from that.
21:13
Speaker 6: I think the market change is not because of what
21:14
Speaker 6: he's doing in the minor leagues, of course, but more
21:17
Speaker 6: what the market just did with cold Emerson.
21:19
Speaker 4: By the way, you mentioned Acunya and Glad, there's one
21:22
Speaker 4: difference for me. Jim Flad had a Hall of Fame
21:25
Speaker 4: Dad Ronald Acunya did not have that. So Flad had
21:28
Speaker 4: a little bit more security probably in his family and
21:31
Speaker 4: teams know this. Am I wrong in thinking that teams
21:33
Speaker 4: also know that, hey, backgrounds of players, who's more likely
21:37
Speaker 4: to accept extensions than others?
21:41
Speaker 5: I don't.
21:42
Speaker 6: I never looked at it that way at all. I
21:44
Speaker 6: tried to offer fair deals to players. I think Acunya
21:47
Speaker 6: got a market deal. Look, there's risk on both sides, right,
21:51
Speaker 6: what do we have two acls on Acunya? So I
21:53
Speaker 6: mean the Braves, you know, they paid a little bit
21:55
Speaker 6: of a price there, right for doing it, and Acunya
21:58
Speaker 6: took a risk. Well, look, I don't blame the players
22:02
Speaker 6: that want to do these deals, like you're that young,
22:04
Speaker 6: you haven't proven anything, and you're guaranteed one hundred million
22:08
Speaker 6: with the idea that you know Acuna is going to
22:10
Speaker 6: be able to go back on the market and make
22:11
Speaker 6: another three hundred million. By the way, it's not like
22:13
Speaker 6: this is all he's going to make, but it did
22:16
Speaker 6: he lead money on the table.
22:17
Speaker 5: Sure, but at the same time, he chose to have
22:20
Speaker 5: that job security.
22:21
Speaker 6: And so whether it because of your dad and maybe
22:23
Speaker 6: you're inheriting money, I mean everyone's financial background is different. Certainly,
22:28
Speaker 6: there are some people that just want that guarantee money.
22:30
Speaker 6: They don't want to have to play every year for
22:33
Speaker 6: getting paid. So I think when you're running a club,
22:35
Speaker 6: you know, you want to control players, and you want
22:37
Speaker 6: to get them at the best possible deal. You know,
22:39
Speaker 6: for the Seattle Mariners to get Cold Emerson at this
22:42
Speaker 6: dollar value, it's going to help.
22:44
Speaker 5: Them build the team around him.
22:45
Speaker 6: When he starts to get to being a five plus,
22:48
Speaker 6: a six plus, and.
22:49
Speaker 5: Those first couple of years three years of free.
22:51
Speaker 6: Agency, Mariner is going to have a lot more money
22:54
Speaker 6: than if they had gone through the system with him.
22:57
Speaker 4: The other extension was Cooper Pratt right with the Brewers
23:00
Speaker 4: not a big market team signing to a guy in
23:02
Speaker 4: double A who hit two forty last year, two thirty eight, Right,
23:05
Speaker 4: not a lot of power for fifty million dollars. But
23:08
Speaker 4: I thought the Brewers had no money and no low
23:10
Speaker 4: market teams can't compete, and YadA, yadayada, all the crap
23:13
Speaker 4: here all the time, Jim does the Brewers think there's
23:15
Speaker 4: more tank than what we've seen so far? They must, right,
23:19
Speaker 4: in order to sign him to a deal like this
23:21
Speaker 4: for a guy that, I mean, let's be honest, didn't
23:23
Speaker 4: do great in double A.
23:25
Speaker 5: Yeah, so there's a lot there.
23:26
Speaker 6: First of all, what's eye popping to me is he's
23:28
Speaker 6: a Scott Boris client, and Scott Boritz has only done
23:31
Speaker 6: one pre arbitration deal like this in his career, and
23:35
Speaker 6: that was Lewis Gonzalez, if you remember. So kind of shocking.
23:38
Speaker 6: I reached out to Scott about an hour ago. I
23:40
Speaker 6: haven't heard back yet. I'm really fascinated to kind of
23:43
Speaker 6: understand what his thinking was here, because this is not
23:45
Speaker 6: a normal deal that he would do.
23:47
Speaker 5: You know.
23:48
Speaker 6: I think from the Brewers' perspective, Matt Arnold really likes
23:51
Speaker 6: Cooper Pratt. He and Jesus made their future at shortstop
23:55
Speaker 6: and third base for this team. That's that's what they're
23:58
Speaker 6: waiting for, is those two guys to come around. This
24:00
Speaker 6: guy six four is a really good defender, gonna stay
24:03
Speaker 6: at shortstop. He's a plus defender. This guy's been on
24:06
Speaker 6: base guy, he'll draw walks, he's got great makeup, good
24:09
Speaker 6: baseball IQ. I'm not that worried about the two thirty
24:13
Speaker 6: eight batting average. I think when I'm looking at this
24:16
Speaker 6: dollar figure, though I don't view it, probably the same
24:19
Speaker 6: as you do, and probably the same as people looking
24:22
Speaker 6: at Oh wow, that's fifty million. I look at it
24:24
Speaker 6: as it's only fifty million for eight years. So even
24:28
Speaker 6: if he becomes an average player, even if he becomes
24:32
Speaker 6: a fifth infielder, eight years and fifty million, it's not
24:35
Speaker 6: that bad. I mean the big leagues, we have guys
24:38
Speaker 6: like Nick Martinez to get the qualifying offer and get
24:41
Speaker 6: paid twenty million for one year.
24:43
Speaker 5: So I'm gonna get.
24:43
Speaker 6: Him for six years plus two free agent years at
24:46
Speaker 6: a total value of fifty million. Now, look, we haven't
24:49
Speaker 6: seen the whole contract. There's gonna be escalators and bonuses,
24:52
Speaker 6: and the fifty million is gonna be deceiving. But you know,
24:55
Speaker 6: I looked at it, and what the Brewers need to
24:58
Speaker 6: do and what they should do is how can I
25:00
Speaker 6: keep my players as long as I can.
25:03
Speaker 5: I can't keep Freddy Perrault to past six years. I
25:05
Speaker 5: can't afford it.
25:06
Speaker 6: If I don't sign Jackson Churio before he plays a
25:08
Speaker 6: single game, I won't get to keep him either. But
25:11
Speaker 6: you know, because Churio's got a chance to be thirty
25:14
Speaker 6: thirty or more like, he's going to be a star,
25:16
Speaker 6: and they were able to lock him out, and look
25:18
Speaker 6: at his contract, by the way, his contract was in
25:22
Speaker 6: the eighty five million, I think, if I'm not mistaken,
25:24
Speaker 6: So look what Emerson just got right. So Milwaukee by
25:27
Speaker 6: signing Churio just save millions there. So I just think
25:30
Speaker 6: it's reasonable for the talent, and I don't think there's
25:33
Speaker 6: a lot of risk.
25:34
Speaker 5: At eight years fifty.
25:35
Speaker 6: Million, that's not a lot of money for an eight
25:37
Speaker 6: year major league career, as long as you believe in
25:39
Speaker 6: the player.
25:41
Speaker 2: JB.
25:41
Speaker 1: I'm going to mix in your thoughts on the rookie
25:44
Speaker 1: class by taking what we're talking about here and then
25:47
Speaker 1: asking you who would you be NonStop texting and calling
25:51
Speaker 1: your owner about that you're seeing right now and saying, hey,
25:54
Speaker 1: let's just try and throw the bag at the sky,
25:56
Speaker 1: because he is not going to get any cheaper. I mean,
25:59
Speaker 1: if you want to rank a few after one, but
26:01
Speaker 1: if you want to pick one from what you've seen
26:03
Speaker 1: in this opening week, go for it.
26:05
Speaker 5: Yeah.
26:05
Speaker 6: And these are guys just in the big leagues, right,
26:07
Speaker 6: we're not talking to Okay, So yeah, So Kevin mcgonagall's
26:11
Speaker 6: won for me. And look, we've been comparing him to
26:14
Speaker 6: Chase Utley forever, but he's got a little Tony Gwynn
26:17
Speaker 6: and Wade Boggs in him too. Right, Short, compact to
26:20
Speaker 6: the ball, love the swing, he barrels it, up. This
26:23
Speaker 6: guy's a hitter, a big He's gonna win a batting
26:25
Speaker 6: title in his career. There's no doubt in my mind
26:28
Speaker 6: anybody has that hit tool.
26:29
Speaker 5: Can I have more of him? Please, thank you very much.
26:32
Speaker 5: Not a lot of risk.
26:33
Speaker 6: Love him. South Stewart of the Cincinnati Reds the real deal.
26:37
Speaker 6: I mean Terry Frankcona had a hitting cleanup opening Day.
26:39
Speaker 6: Terry Francona. It's not gonna put a rookie hitting clean up.
26:42
Speaker 6: Tito doesn't do that. You do it with South Stuart.
26:45
Speaker 6: This guy's a pro hitter. And if you watch his
26:48
Speaker 6: home run Saturday, is like I got goosebumps everywhere. It
26:50
Speaker 6: was absolutely stupid. JJ Weatherhold's gonna hit. There's no doubt
26:54
Speaker 6: in my mind. Twenty homers, twenty steals. He's a high
26:57
Speaker 6: baseball IQ. He works hard on his defense. Eventually he's
27:01
Speaker 6: going to be good at second base. Defensively, still has
27:03
Speaker 6: some work to do, especially to his right, but I
27:06
Speaker 6: think he's gonna really hit and chase the lotters. The
27:09
Speaker 6: most fascinating on the ball for me because I had
27:11
Speaker 6: never really seen him until October right of last year
27:14
Speaker 6: in the postseason, and I'm looking at that Swingle and
27:16
Speaker 6: that thing's real. And you watch him take BP and
27:18
Speaker 6: it's like upper deck stuff, and it's like, I went back,
27:21
Speaker 6: I look at the stats. The guy's never at home runs.
27:23
Speaker 6: I'm like, wait a minute, this is not translating. This
27:26
Speaker 6: does not make sense. But you go back and he's
27:28
Speaker 6: had a lot of injuries, and you know, sometimes power
27:31
Speaker 6: usually is the last thing that comes from a guy
27:33
Speaker 6: like this. But yeah, he's also really impressive to me too.
27:36
Speaker 6: I love the start that he's had, especially after he
27:39
Speaker 6: pulled the first three homers, the other one going OPO.
27:42
Speaker 6: I was like, all right with that back spin, thank
27:44
Speaker 6: you very much.
27:44
Speaker 5: So that was great.
27:45
Speaker 6: But to answer your question, mcgonagall's my guy of all
27:48
Speaker 6: of them.
27:50
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28:36
Speaker 2: Now.
28:37
Speaker 3: All right, Well, another guy that I'm pretty sure you're
28:40
Speaker 3: pretty high on, Paul Skeins. It came out that it
28:43
Speaker 3: came out that the Yankees offered for their top prospects.
28:47
Speaker 3: I want you to evaluate from your GM set who
28:51
Speaker 3: got that trade right and who got it wrong? Because
28:54
Speaker 3: the trade didn't happen, obviously the Pirates turned it down,
28:58
Speaker 3: or what else would you have added to say, Okay,
29:01
Speaker 3: the Pirates would accept this.
29:04
Speaker 6: So the Yankees should not have offered what is being
29:07
Speaker 6: said they offered. If they did offer it, I don't
29:10
Speaker 6: have confirmation they offered it, but based on the report
29:13
Speaker 6: that's there, the Pirates should have gone ahead and closed
29:16
Speaker 6: the deal immediately. For me, so let's kind of go
29:19
Speaker 6: through why I view it that way. And I love
29:20
Speaker 6: Paul Skeins, don't get me wrong, but I know that
29:23
Speaker 6: when his free agent days are up. He's not going
29:25
Speaker 6: to be able to sign long term in Pittsburg. They're
29:27
Speaker 6: not going to pay him four hundred million or whatever
29:29
Speaker 6: it's going to take at that time. So you know
29:32
Speaker 6: your your length of life with Skeens in Pittsburgh if
29:36
Speaker 6: in fact you were offered camp Schlitler, I think he's
29:38
Speaker 6: going to be a one. I said that last year,
29:40
Speaker 6: and that's before the development of the cutter. This year,
29:43
Speaker 6: I think at the makeup, the delivery, the stuff, I
29:46
Speaker 6: think he's a one. I just think he's an ace legranier.
29:50
Speaker 6: You watch him in spring training one hundred and two
29:52
Speaker 6: hundred and two hundred and two, easy free makeup character.
29:55
Speaker 6: He's either a top the rotation starter or an impact closer.
29:58
Speaker 6: I don't know which one he's going to be. But
30:00
Speaker 6: we were talking, you know, all Star games for him
30:01
Speaker 6: and Schlitler, so love both of them.
30:04
Speaker 5: I love Lombard.
30:04
Speaker 6: I think he's their best position player prospect in the system.
30:07
Speaker 6: I think you can play second, short, or third wherever
30:10
Speaker 6: they put him. In spring training, you look like a
30:12
Speaker 6: plus defender to me. Great instincts, good blood lines, as
30:15
Speaker 6: we all know, short, quick to the ball, great instincts,
30:18
Speaker 6: reads the ball off the bat extremely well.
30:20
Speaker 5: I love his takes.
30:22
Speaker 6: Going to be a star, and that Spencer Jones is
30:23
Speaker 6: I don't know what he is yet. I know that
30:25
Speaker 6: there's thirty to forty homers in there. I know there's
30:28
Speaker 6: thirty steals in there. I don't know how many strikeouts
30:31
Speaker 6: are one hundred and eighty or two fifty, I don't know.
30:33
Speaker 5: I got to keep watching.
30:34
Speaker 6: It's a very bizarre approach, that two step kind of
30:37
Speaker 6: locked thing in the back. So I haven't figured that
30:39
Speaker 6: out yet, but I know the tools are off.
30:41
Speaker 5: So if I'm Pittsburgh and I got.
30:42
Speaker 6: Offered those four guys that I could control for six
30:46
Speaker 6: years and not have to pay any of them for
30:49
Speaker 6: three years, I have a better chance of winning with
30:52
Speaker 6: those four guys, and I have a better chance of
30:54
Speaker 6: winning longer with those four guys. So, if in fact
30:57
Speaker 6: they were offered that, which I highly doubt, Ben Sherrington
31:00
Speaker 6: should have made that deal immediately and called a press conference.
31:04
Speaker 3: All right, when you make twenty six predictions, like your
31:07
Speaker 3: article is twenty six predictions, you're guaranteed to stir somebody's
31:11
Speaker 3: hornett hornet's nest. But you're also guaranteed to be wrong.
31:15
Speaker 3: So I'm willing to let you whittle it down to
31:18
Speaker 3: your top two predictions that you're like, these are locks,
31:21
Speaker 3: because we always love doing our locks on here.
31:25
Speaker 6: Oh, I'll just take the simple ones. The Los Angeles
31:29
Speaker 6: Dodgers winning the NL West. Okay, I'm going to take that.
31:33
Speaker 6: I love that Aaron Boone leading all managers in ejections
31:37
Speaker 6: with ten. I like that one as well, So I'll
31:38
Speaker 6: go with those two.
31:41
Speaker 3: That was easy.
31:44
Speaker 1: There, you go, very easy.
31:45
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love it. JB.
31:48
Speaker 1: Wanted to get your thoughts on Tony Vytello and the
31:53
Speaker 1: start there for the Giants. I'm not going to take
31:57
Speaker 1: much stock into what's going on on the field yet
32:00
Speaker 1: unless you think we should a few games into the season.
32:04
Speaker 1: But what do you think about the quotes? Do you
32:05
Speaker 1: think that the microscope is going to be on him?
32:07
Speaker 1: That's the biggest take that I have is I'm like,
32:09
Speaker 1: all right, he threw it try hard, and he gave
32:11
Speaker 1: a big speech and stuff like that. We can analyze
32:14
Speaker 1: what he's done in the first week of the year,
32:16
Speaker 1: but also the fact that he's going to have more
32:19
Speaker 1: eyeballs and ears on him because he's doing something that
32:22
Speaker 1: really hasn't been done in our modern game. What do
32:24
Speaker 1: you think?
32:25
Speaker 6: Well, yeah, first of all, of course, the eyeballs. I
32:27
Speaker 6: got my eyeballs on him. I'm fascinated to see if
32:29
Speaker 6: a college coach can go right to the big leagues
32:31
Speaker 6: without any professional experience and succeed. So, you know, I
32:34
Speaker 6: watched Opening Day and I said to myself, why is
32:37
Speaker 6: Logan web still in there? Giving up seven runs on
32:40
Speaker 6: opening Day? Like I understand later in the season, you
32:42
Speaker 6: wanted to pitch through it, you wanted to stay in
32:44
Speaker 6: the game.
32:44
Speaker 5: You know he can get through it. But it's opening day.
32:47
Speaker 6: I mean, he's never given up seven runs in again,
32:49
Speaker 6: why am I leaving him? And on opening Day to
32:52
Speaker 6: give up seven runs, that was kind of perplexing for me.
32:55
Speaker 6: And then on Saturday with the first base open, Ryan Burreket,
33:00
Speaker 6: left hander on the mount airon judge at the plate,
33:03
Speaker 6: two left hand hitters behind him, and you don't pitch
33:06
Speaker 6: the judge there, you walk him, and he pitched a
33:09
Speaker 6: woman he homeward and crushed the ambulance and left field,
33:12
Speaker 6: By the way, what's an ambulance doing there in left field?
33:14
Speaker 6: How many times is that going to get hit this year?
33:15
Speaker 6: That's a pretty stupid place for it, But that's another story.
33:19
Speaker 5: So, you know, there's been.
33:20
Speaker 6: Some things that I'm watching and then as the cameras
33:22
Speaker 6: zoom in and the dugout, I kind of feel like
33:24
Speaker 6: at times he's like deer in headlights, and you watch
33:27
Speaker 6: coaches kind of talk to him and he just kind
33:29
Speaker 6: of stares sometimes, which is kind of concerning in terms
33:33
Speaker 6: of his comments after the game, and to me it
33:35
Speaker 6: looked like a college coach trying to be a big
33:38
Speaker 6: lead manager. Like I, I haven't understood the quotes. You know,
33:43
Speaker 6: I think that when you're coaching college kids, you could
33:46
Speaker 6: say whatever you want and they're going to respect whatever
33:48
Speaker 6: you say, and there's not going to be pushback. And
33:51
Speaker 6: if the media is covering you in college, they're going
33:53
Speaker 6: to say they're going to write what the coach says.
33:55
Speaker 6: They're not going to write what the players say, right,
33:57
Speaker 6: and the players aren't going to contradict the manager.
33:59
Speaker 5: When you get to the big.
34:00
Speaker 6: Leagues, there's not a player in that dugout that doesn't
34:04
Speaker 6: have more professional experience than Tony Vitello. Most of them
34:07
Speaker 6: are getting paid more than Tony Vaytello. So if Tony
34:10
Speaker 6: wants to sit there and say college stuff. The major
34:12
Speaker 6: league players, they're gonna push back, gonna it's not gonna
34:16
Speaker 6: play well. So he's got to figure out. Look, he
34:18
Speaker 6: got to give him time. I like the man. I
34:21
Speaker 6: think he's a good communicator. I think he's got great energy.
34:24
Speaker 6: I think he's a lot of fun. I think he's
34:26
Speaker 6: over his head.
34:27
Speaker 5: So what do we do?
34:28
Speaker 4: Uh?
34:29
Speaker 5: We fix it? So how do we fix it?
34:30
Speaker 6: Well, if I am sitting there and I'm Buster Posey
34:33
Speaker 6: or I'm Zack Manassei and this is what I'm gonna do,
34:35
Speaker 6: I've got two guys on my payroll that are both
34:38
Speaker 6: gonna be in the Hall of Fame someday.
34:39
Speaker 5: One name Bruce Bochio, one named Dusty Baker.
34:42
Speaker 6: I'm gonna let them split the duties. Okay, But what
34:46
Speaker 6: we're gonna do after it every single game and after
34:48
Speaker 6: every single press conference of every single game, one of
34:52
Speaker 6: them is gonna sit down and go through the game
34:53
Speaker 6: with Tony Vitello, gonna talk about all the moves, what
34:56
Speaker 6: he did, what he didn't do, what he could do,
34:58
Speaker 6: what he should do, talk about what he's going to
35:00
Speaker 6: do tomorrow and the next day, what his thoughts on
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Speaker 6: Matt and then We're going to break down what he
35:05
Speaker 6: said to the media and what works and doesn't work.
35:07
Speaker 6: We want him to be himself, but we also want
35:10
Speaker 6: him to be professional and not embarrass us, which right
35:13
Speaker 6: now he's embarrassing us, is my take. So I'm for
35:16
Speaker 6: Tony Vytello. I want this to work. Don't tell me
35:19
Speaker 6: after the first week that it's working.
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Speaker 5: It's not.
35:21
Speaker 6: And by the way, I'm not going by wins and losses.
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Speaker 6: The Yankees have a better team. They went up against
35:26
Speaker 6: amazing pitching in Freed, Schlittler.
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Speaker 5: And Warren.
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Speaker 6: The bullpen was great. The losses weren't on Vitello. But
35:33
Speaker 6: let's evaluate him as a manager.
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Speaker 5: He's not ready.
35:35
Speaker 1: Yet, perfectly stated Mike drop moment there, great way to
35:39
Speaker 1: end this one, JB. It was awesome catching up as always,
35:43
Speaker 1: much more on the show that's on the shirt GM Territory.
35:47
Speaker 2: Check it out.
35:47
Speaker 1: Give it a sub everybody that's watching live right now.
35:50
Speaker 1: That would be great. Thanks again, JB. Subscribe to JAM
35:52
Speaker 1: Territory Jim and his son Trey part of the FT Network.
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Speaker 1: You're getting one episode every single week covering all the
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Speaker 1: topics that we're covering here.
36:00
Speaker 2: Midweek with JB