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ManTalk133 -Men In Worship With Shatan Mack · Military Broadcast Radio | MBR Talk

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dot. Welcome to Man Talk 133 with
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Welcome to Man Talk 133 with Saul and Daryl tonight tonight
2:10
tonight we have a special topic we're going to talk about
2:14
tonight and we have a special guest tonight we're talking
2:17
about men in worship. Men in worship and tonight we
2:22
have for possible pretend me what's going on, brother?
2:27
What's going on, Sir? All is well.
2:29
Nothing must. Be here.
2:31
I know man, I'm glad to have you on because when it come to
2:34
worship, I know, I know you got some stuff you can for people
2:39
expiring to be in in worship, worship leaders, I know you got
2:44
some information for them. So let's just start with this.
2:47
What does worship personally mean to you?
2:50
Well, worship personally means to me it's it's a it's a hard
2:54
thing. It's a heart posture.
2:56
And for me it's that John 424 they that worship them must
3:01
worship them in spirit and in truth.
3:04
So it's a heart posture. It starts right here in the
3:07
heart. Then it flows from the heart to
3:10
external, right. It's like, so you know, you love
3:14
God and you fall in love with him.
3:16
You fall in love with His Word, your interaction with Him, the
3:20
things that He's does that He does for you, and then you
3:23
express that worship externally. OK.
3:28
So it's a hard posture. Hard posture gadget.
3:31
So let me ask you this. How did you get it?
3:34
How? Well, it's not like you got into
3:36
it. When did you know you were drawn
3:40
to worship? You know, because me, I'm late
3:43
on in life, so it's kind of like I've been wanting to do it, but
3:47
then, you know, you got the fear factor.
3:49
So now I've been in it for what about a year and a half, you
3:53
know, praise team, you know, play the bass and stuff like
3:56
that. So what?
3:57
When did you know that you were That was where you wanted to be?
4:02
Man, I would say it was in church, 6 year old boy, watching
4:07
everybody else play, watching the men worship, watching the
4:10
men in the choir aspiring to be like them.
4:13
You know, as kids we used to mimic people in church and so we
4:18
would say I'm brother so and so or I'm pastor such and such.
4:21
So I knew then watching the other men worship, watching
4:27
other musicians play, I said, man, that's something that I
4:29
want to do. And it wasn't until my aunt said
4:33
to me, what you want for Christmas, do you want a bike or
4:37
do you want a keyboard? Man, I chose the keyboard.
4:44
I chose the keyboard And I was saying I want to play, I want to
4:47
play keys. And so then, man, it was
4:50
amazing. I, I just started picking up
4:52
stuff from church. I would take what I heard and
4:56
repeat it at home. Wow.
4:59
That's the amazing part. Yes, it is that that's good man.
5:03
I, you know, I, like I said, I, I got in at young older because
5:07
I kind of when I was younger, I was didn't care about church too
5:11
much, didn't care about other than Motown and stuff like that.
5:15
I don't really care about music too much.
5:17
So like I know you said you, you was a child when you know when
5:23
you got that, you know, when you was led to that.
5:26
Now as you're older, as a older musician, what are some things
5:31
that people could like worship like me?
5:35
I'm just coming into it. What are things that I should be
5:39
doing? I know prayer.
5:40
I do know that. But what I mean, what is it?
5:43
You know, what is I'm trying to figure out a way to put it, you
5:46
know what I mean? Like some people want to do it.
5:48
They don't want to. They want to take the step, but
5:50
don't know how to take the step. They want to sing, they want to
5:53
play and they see you guys doing it like so easy.
5:58
You know what I'm saying? Like I found out the hard way,
6:01
trying to play the bass. It ain't as easy.
6:02
Look, So what is some stuff, you know, people can can kind of get
6:07
from you to kind of help them move forward in their walk with,
6:11
you know, in worship, especially men.
6:13
Yeah. One of the things I did learn is
6:16
that, you know, we all know this same iron sharpens iron.
6:19
Yeah. So it's always good to be around
6:22
someone who knows more than you. Yeah.
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One of the things that that boosted me as a musician was
6:30
being around other musicians who knew more than I am, got kind of
6:36
got under their wings, right? So they took me under their
6:40
wings and they taught me some things.
6:42
They showed me. So it's very important to be
6:44
around people who knows more, who knows more than you, who can
6:49
do it better than you can, right?
6:53
So they can teach you some things.
6:54
Man, I've been booted off keyboards, booted off organs
6:57
many a times because I didn't know what I was doing.
7:01
But man, I don't want to be booted off.
7:04
I want somebody to show me something.
7:07
And so I just, you know, praise God for the the individuals that
7:11
were in my life that imparted wisdom, that showed me some
7:16
different things on instruments and taught me about worship a
7:20
little bit more. So, yeah, just being around
7:23
someone who knows more than you finding that one.
7:27
And, you know, we're in the community where there's all
7:29
kinds of choirs and musicians in the area, and so, you know the
7:33
ones who you want to sound like, right?
7:35
Yeah, yeah, yeah. You automatically know.
7:38
And so it's like, man, I want to play like that.
7:40
So you know, it's you, You find that person who's like, can you
7:43
teach me something? Can you show me some stuff on
7:45
the keys? And you, you know, give me some,
7:48
give me a little wisdom on this. Yeah, man, how important is men
7:51
in worship? Man, it is very important, it is
7:57
essential man that we have men worship because when men
8:01
worship, they kind of they carry a spiritual weight because men,
8:09
we see men as a leaders in so many different areas of life.
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And so if we're not seeing that in church or in wherever we are
8:17
in our services, we don't see men worshipping crying before
8:22
God. It's it becomes a thing like
8:24
only women do it. Yeah.
8:26
Right. We're not trying to knock the
8:27
women or anything, but. Yeah, yeah.
8:30
We see in church where women are strong worshippers.
8:34
Yep, for sure. And more so than men.
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So it is important that men, we have a culture of men
8:43
worshipping God. Yeah, many men are taught to to
8:46
suppress their emotions. Yeah, talk about it.
8:49
But the worship requires honesty before God, you know, so culture
8:55
teaches men don't cry, you know, don't express, don't appear
9:01
weak, right? But through our Scripture,
9:05
strong men worship deep, deeply. You got David, he danced man,
9:09
you know, you got Moses, he bowed before God.
9:12
Paul wept. You know, they, they sung
9:15
praises in the prison. And so, you know, it's important
9:20
that we see men worship in the church, man Very, very
9:24
important. So why, why do you why do you
9:27
think it's like that? Why do you think men are afraid
9:30
to to worship? I know you mentioned you know
9:33
about the they tried. They've been taught like like
9:37
hide your emotions, like don't you better not cry?
9:40
I don't you better not. So why?
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Why do you think is it? Could it be like fear or they
9:47
just kind of push back and let the women do it?
9:49
Or they just don't understand that men are supposed to be
9:52
leading worship. Well, there's a difference
9:55
between and what men need to understand is the difference
9:58
between masculinity and godly manhood, right?
10:02
And so some things may appear as this is just what women do.
10:06
And as men, we don't do that because there's a way they do
10:09
it. And so if I'm dancing like her,
10:12
that don't seem manly. Yeah, yeah, right.
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I'm lifting my hands like she lifted out.
10:18
No, there's a difference between masculinity and godly manhood.
10:22
Yes, we can lift our hands. Yes, we can dance.
10:26
Yes, we can worship. So I think one of the issues a
10:29
lot of the times is the fear of looking as if I'm not manly.
10:33
Yeah, I agree with that. And then we see a lot of the
10:37
examples set in the church that a lot of our leaders sit down
10:40
during worship. Through that I seen that.
10:43
Too. So it's like your pastor ain't
10:46
worship and dancing and shouting.
10:47
I ain't doing it either. I ain't doing it either.
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If he got the right like shoe, he the pastor, he's the leader.
10:53
And guess what? I'm following the leader.
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Y'all. Women, y'all go ahead and do
11:00
y'all thing. We're going to sit here and
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watch, y'all. That is, that is.
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That is so true though, man. Like a lot of guys, they're
11:06
going to, if they see the Passover, that chili, what they
11:10
going to do? They going to chill too.
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They going. To chill.
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Man, not understanding that when you when you sit there and
11:16
chill, if you got kids, they sit there and chill.
11:20
Now you set an example that worship is not that important.
11:24
You know what I mean? So I'm just saying me and y'all
11:28
got to got to get to it, man. Y'all got to, you know, I found
11:32
you know, when I I bought me AI was doing dance ministry with my
11:37
wife Keisha. And when I bought my little I I
11:41
call it the Jericho. I had my Jericho on and the
11:44
boards clown me so bad. I had a Tutu and all kind of
11:47
stuff, but I knew that God had called me to to do that because
11:54
I I saw God. I was like, hey, you know, it's
11:57
I don't want to do it, but if you asking me to do it, I'm
12:00
going to do it. So I think men have to be more
12:03
submissive when it comes to that because if you don't, you're
12:07
just raising your boys and girls to sit there because how many
12:10
times because you're an apostle, how many times you look out
12:14
there now your church probably different, but how many times
12:17
have you looked out there and just see people sitting down in
12:20
worship on the phone? He is just doing whatever they
12:24
want to do. And how does that how does that
12:26
make you feel? If you up there as a worship,
12:28
you worship and you you're playing and you're singing, how
12:30
does that make you feel? It it feels as if their
12:37
relationship with God isn't there and then the example isn't
12:45
set number one for worship. So they don't know what to do.
12:49
When you think about that Joshua, he said in Joshua 2415,
12:53
he says for me in my house, we're going to serve the Lord.
12:56
And so it was his family. So as, as, as a, as men, we need
13:02
to lead our families into worship as well.
13:05
And so it's in our saying, we going to worship God too.
13:09
Stand up, let's worship God. You know what I'm saying?
13:12
I believe your whole family would do that.
13:13
So we, when I, when I'm sitting there and I'm worshipping or I'm
13:17
playing and I see, you know, like you said, kids on their
13:19
phone, things like that, it's, it's not taught.
13:24
It's it's not a standard, it's not in our home in our home,
13:30
right, So I never see dad worship and I'll never see y'all
13:33
at home right. So Joshua, As for me in my
13:37
house, we going to serve the Lord.
13:39
So men set spiritual tones at home.
13:42
Yeah, that's true. Even we're praying.
13:45
And children often learn worship by watching fathers.
13:49
Yeah, true that and prayer like that, they don't pray, you know,
13:53
they don't pray. They see the kid, they don't see
13:55
the dad. Pray.
13:57
You think they're going to pray? Don't even bless the food, they
14:00
just get to eat. Just start eat.
14:01
Just something because you know why dad reaching the bag, going
14:05
down the highway, eating, he don't bless nothing, you know
14:10
what I mean? And like you said, as leaders,
14:13
you know, as pastors and stuff like that, they got to be mined
14:17
for that too. Because you made a good point.
14:19
If he's sitting down, what the rest of the people feel like
14:24
they can do, Hey, y'all entertain me while I want to.
14:27
I want to sit here and do what pastor doing.
14:30
Right, right, right. You know, and that causes, like
14:33
you said, a kind of, you know, like a a divide because the
14:37
woman she's up sweating her wig out, you know, makeup off of
14:41
whatever she doing. And you sit in, he sit like
14:45
chilling like this with his home on the chair, you know what I'm
14:47
saying? So.
14:48
So it's kind of, yeah, it's kind of some things, man, that we got
14:51
to work on. We got to work on we right up
14:55
against the break. When I come back out to break, I
14:56
got some other stuff to ask you, man, about what instruments you
14:59
play and all this stuff like that, and we'd be right back out
15:01
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16:45
Welcome back to Man Talk 133, which all in thorough we're here
16:49
with Apostle Satan Mack. Give me all some smack on that
16:56
about being a worship right All right, so we went before we went
16:59
to break. Now you brought up something
17:01
that was really really key. Now I know pastors spend time
17:05
with the with with the Lord. I know he, I know they do what,
17:12
what would make them sit down like that doing worship?
17:15
Because I, I've seen that. I've seen that quite a bit.
17:18
Like they would come out and they would sit down where
17:21
everybody else worship and mostly the ladies and some men
17:25
too, but they would sit down. I wonder what causes them to do
17:28
that. Like I don't, I don't understand
17:32
that. You know, growing up in church,
17:34
it is. It's a culture, man.
17:37
So pastors have seen their pastors do it, right?
17:42
And that pastor seen their pastor do it.
17:44
It's something that is culturally brought down through
17:46
the line, man. The the the pastor should be the
17:49
chief worshipper. Right.
17:52
Should be the chief worshipper. Should set the tone in the
17:55
example as to what worship and praise looks like, right,
18:00
because he's the teacher, you know, you know, I'm going to
18:04
show you in my deed, not just in teaching that we should worship
18:07
God. I'm, I'm pretty sure a lot of
18:09
pastors could, could blow the, the wall off, you know, the roof
18:13
off the wall, you know, about worship and teaching on worship.
18:18
But it's the example that is being set before from spiritual
18:24
fathers and it kind of that's kind of passed down through the
18:27
line. So it's a traditional thing now
18:30
that the pastor, when he comes out, he's going to sit.
18:32
I'm saving myself because I got to preach real hard.
18:35
Right. So yeah, that's true, yeah.
18:37
Energy because if I if I get up and start worshiping it with
18:41
everybody else, I'm not going to have enough energy to preach
18:45
discernment so but As for me, you know, I'm a new launch.
18:50
I am the praise and worship leader and then I do preach
18:53
after I leave worship. So, so hey, I know we, we, we
18:59
got our excuses, but we should still set the example and the
19:03
tone. And I believe what how that has
19:07
happened is due to the culture that has been set from other
19:11
pastors and their pastors, you know?
19:13
You know, and you know what's interesting?
19:15
It only effects men. Right only effects men and don't
19:20
bother the women like. You why do not at all.
19:22
Right, because they know that's the culture.
19:25
Yes. They know that the man is going
19:27
to sit. That's why they got them seats
19:29
up there. Yeah, the peeking corner over
19:32
there. What if we come to church one
19:34
day and all them seats gone? What you going to do then?
19:36
What you going to do then bro? For real seats.
19:38
Up the pulpit. Nothing.
19:41
Now you just mentioned something that I I got to ask about.
19:44
You said you worship leader and you teach, right, You preach
19:50
afterwards. So how do you stay spiritually
19:54
grounded when you're being on stage?
19:57
Like for example, you know, different places that you go
20:00
and, and how do you stay grounded?
20:01
Because some people when they start getting a certain a level
20:05
of praise, boy you can boy, you can sing and you can play and
20:10
then you start feeling themselves.
20:12
How do you stay grounded with that?
20:15
Because people can, you know, take it and think it's.
20:19
That is them. Yeah.
20:21
Yeah, yeah, you know what I mean.
20:22
For me, I'm a, I'm a shifter, so I shift people's thought process
20:27
on things. So when people usually come to
20:30
me and say, wow man, how you did so you did so great.
20:34
A lot of times I ask questions, you know?
20:36
So what did God do for you during that worship experience?
20:39
That's good. So we're shifting the attention
20:42
off of me on the person we were worshipping at the moment.
20:47
And so I think a lot of the times the focus is on the praise
20:51
team, those who are there singing.
20:54
It's, it's, it's about the worship experience and not the
20:59
presence of God. So me as a worshipper, I don't
21:03
even, my focus is everyone focusing on God and the presence
21:08
of God. So for me, I, I tell myself, I'm
21:13
not going to take any praise. I'm not going to take any glory.
21:16
No good man. You know we musicians have this
21:20
thing Cheryl, I'm going to tell you when we see each other and
21:24
you're a good musician, we doing this right, We bow and I don't
21:30
know if you've ever seen that before.
21:31
I. Haven't.
21:32
Not yet. OK, so that's a thing in the
21:35
city of Flint, MI OK, where when a great musician come in the
21:40
door, like we got Jeffrey Lavalle who, who lives here in
21:43
the great city of Flint, MI, right?
21:45
He wrote the song Revelation, Hallelujah, salvation and glory,
21:50
honor and power to the Lord our God.
21:51
He wrote that song. So when he come in, everybody
21:53
like woo, Jeffrey Lavalle is entered the room, right?
21:57
Yeah, well, they do the same thing.
21:59
Oh, should I be like, stop, stop it.
22:02
Stop. Uh, uh, Nope.
22:04
So we, we to stay grounded, we have to remind ourselves, what
22:09
is this? Who is this?
22:11
Who are we worshiping? What is this worship about?
22:14
Yeah. Is it about me or the one we're
22:17
worshiping? Yeah, right.
22:19
That's that's good right there for real, man.
22:22
So you know, you know, they give praise and I'm going to be
22:26
criticism. How do you handle criticism?
22:30
Because some people have a hard except in criticism and they
22:35
take all the praise. You can praise them all day
22:37
long. They're good.
22:39
One little thing like, you know, you could have did that note a
22:41
little bit different and that set them off.
22:44
How do you handle like criticism like within ministry, you know,
22:49
and I'll get to something else later inside the group, but how
22:53
do you handle that with inside ministry, You know, the the
22:56
criticism that could come? OK, you talking about like for
23:00
for me as? Towards you, yeah.
23:02
If I came to you, say, for example, I come to you, you
23:04
know, you sweating Utemine up there, running all around the
23:08
church. I'm sitting back there with my
23:09
arm on the chair, wait for you to get finished so I can come up
23:13
and criticize you. Like, you know, on that last
23:15
note, you know, you probably could have, you know, you could
23:17
have crescendoed that a little bit more, but right, right.
23:21
How do you handle stuff if it has happened to you?
23:23
I know I don't know if it has or not, but.
23:26
Yeah, man, like I said, I've, I've been bumped off the organ
23:29
before in the middle of the song.
23:32
Like, man, you ain't playing this song, right.
23:33
Get off. Right.
23:35
And so how, how I would normally handle that is, you know, I'm,
23:40
I'm, I'm humble, you know, and I'm teachable.
23:43
Yeah, but the main focus is the presence of God in his
23:48
anointing. Yes, I agree.
23:50
So you you may have played every note, right, but did God show
23:56
up? Yeah.
23:58
Everyone else might have been pleased or you might not have
24:01
been pleased, but was God pleased, right.
24:04
And So what I kind of once again, I, I, I challenge, I'm a
24:07
challenger now shift people thinking.
24:10
I know you were you heard something.
24:11
You heard me play something. You didn't necessarily felt like
24:14
that it was right. But you know, my worship wasn't
24:18
for you. There you go.
24:20
I think we need to shift that mindset within the church that I
24:24
was you think I was playing for you.
24:26
You thought I was doing this for you.
24:29
Oh, you thought I was singing this for you.
24:31
So you had it has to be it has to be perfect.
24:34
It has to be the way you like it.
24:36
So I want you to understand that when I worship, it's for the for
24:40
the Father. And I'm so sorry if I didn't
24:42
sing that note right the way you thought.
24:44
I didn't like it, But I have someone who is working with me
24:48
and in teaching me. And because skill, right?
24:51
Skill matters, right? It's important because God
24:54
wants, deserves preparation. He deserves preparation,
24:59
excellent matters in worship. Musicians should practice.
25:03
Singers should develop. But talent cannot replace
25:06
intimacy with God. That's a that's a mouthful.
25:10
And that that leads me to my next question to you.
25:12
What what scriptures shape your philosophy on worship?
25:17
Like, you know, some people got scriptures on, they got healing
25:21
scriptures, wealth scriptures and all kind of scriptures, What
25:25
scriptures, you know, you use for worship?
25:27
You know what I mean? That kind of, you know, help you
25:31
get into that pasta if you're praying or you know, whatever
25:34
before you get ready to do what you do.
25:37
The the main scripture, John 424 man John 423 and 24 that Lady
25:43
came to Jesus and said, you know, yo, people say we worship
25:47
on this mountain and my people say we worship over here.
25:50
Where do you say we worship? And Jesus tells him God, God is
25:53
seeking those. He tells the lady God is seeking
25:56
those that they that worship him must worship him in spirit and
26:00
in truth. So God is looking not at where
26:03
you worship, you know, He's looking at how and what heart
26:09
pressure. Was it in spirit?
26:11
Was it in truth? So that's my motivator, that's
26:14
my theme Scripture when it comes to worship, to worship the
26:18
Father in spirit and in truth. That's good, right?
26:22
And how, how much time do you put in?
26:24
Where are you putting in and and like playing and practicing and
26:30
per day, you know, sometimes some people put in hours per
26:34
day, you know, they kind of, you know, perfect what they're
26:37
trying to perfect. But I'm like you.
26:40
I think if you're seeking the Lord, he can.
26:43
It's certain things that he he's going to do.
26:45
But if you're trying to do it on your own strength, how much time
26:49
you have you put do you put in still now you know, Oh.
26:54
It's, it's a lot less than what it used to be.
26:58
I mean, you know, we work and we do a lot of different things.
27:01
It's a lot less. So I would say maybe 3 different
27:04
times throughout the week. I'm, I'm playing, but I'm not,
27:08
I'm not playing to, to develop my craft.
27:13
I'm playing and worshipping there.
27:16
You go. So that's a whole different
27:19
feel. I remember those days, man.
27:21
It would be every day I'm trying to learn these new chords.
27:24
I'm trying to learn these fancy runs and scales because I know
27:28
everybody's listening. But once, once my mind was
27:33
renewed concerning worship, my practice shift from learning all
27:39
these chords to worshipping God. So now when I play I'm I'm, I'm
27:45
worshipping every day. But when I play, I'm playing to
27:48
worship. Of course we got to earn my
27:51
songs and go over my songs and things like that for the Sunday
27:55
service, but I'm worshipping when I.
27:59
Yeah, that's awesome. So, you know, I don't want to, I
28:01
don't want to go to the controversial side, but I do got
28:04
to ask this before. We got to go to that side.
28:09
How you feel about homosexuality?
28:11
The guys. That, oh Lord, you went all the
28:13
way over there. I went all way to I went way
28:16
over there. I'd hate to get controversial,
28:19
but I do want to know from a true worship leader that you
28:26
train people right to do praise and worship.
28:28
You train leaders. So I want to know from a person
28:31
that does this, how does that make you feel?
28:35
If you, if you see it, do you still train him?
28:38
Or you'd be like, Nah, I'm good. Well, I can't.
28:40
I can't do that. Well, the, the something I seen
28:47
my spiritual father do, which was absolutely amazing man.
28:51
He took a young man who was living that lifestyle and he
28:55
shifted him, shifted him man. And it was amazing his, his
29:00
demeanor and everything. He went from this flamboyant
29:04
young man to a manly man. Wow.
29:08
And so it was through that. And So what you don't want to do
29:12
is allow that until you've taken that person to a place to where
29:16
they're, they're shifted their lifestyle because check this
29:19
out, the presence of God, you, the presence of God changes.
29:25
You can't enter into the presence of God and stay the
29:28
same. That's true.
29:30
You can't get the same and, and so you, you, you want someone
29:35
especially who's leading, who's leading worship, who has their
29:40
life completely surrendered to him.
29:45
Because how can I truly worship God in spirit and truth if my
29:49
internal condition is not surrendered to Him?
29:53
That's true. That's a fact.
29:55
Right, that's a fact. But my internal condition, which
29:57
would be my lifestyle. So even with a straight man.
30:01
You. Too internal, your internal
30:02
condition is lustful. Your internal, your internal
30:06
condition is you a lie. You lie all the time.
30:08
Your, your, your, your internal condition is, you mean you hate,
30:12
right? And so if your internal
30:14
condition is not surrendered, God is not accepting your
30:18
worship. Why?
30:18
Because he's looking for those who will worship him in spirit
30:22
and in truth. And so in spirit, if that
30:25
internal condition is not completely surrendered over to
30:28
God, he's not looking. Hey, man.
30:31
Hey, we, we, we up against the break.
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33:05
reflect the views or positions of any entities they represent.
33:10
Welcome back to man talk 1/3 of three with shawl and Daryl got
33:14
Apostle Satan Mack dropping some knowledge on y'all tonight and
33:18
before we went to the break, you were spending the preach.
33:24
If you want to continue what you were saying, handle that, but it
33:27
was it was good what you were saying, though.
33:29
I really you know, I think the people need to really understand
33:32
that, because sometime I think what people do is if they see
33:35
somebody that's a homosexual, they quickly shun them.
33:38
You know not now. You made a good point that the
33:44
the the heterosexual man he deal with the left side of it.
33:49
So it's kind of the same thing. It's just, you know, a different
33:54
ways of you looking at it I guess.
33:55
Yeah, men need purity in worship.
33:59
Yeah. You know, you know, hidden,
34:01
those hidden compromises that affects worship.
34:04
Yeah. Worship is not only an external
34:07
sound, but it's like we were saying earlier, it's an internal
34:09
condition. And God looks at the heart
34:12
before he looks at the gift. Yeah.
34:14
And so a man can have gifted hands and still have an
34:18
unsubmitted heart. Right.
34:20
Amen. Yep.
34:21
So you know, Matthew 5 and eight, you know, tells us we got
34:25
to have a a pure heart. You've.
34:27
Got to have it. Right, right.
34:29
So blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God,
34:33
right? And so we're expecting to see
34:35
God, we're expecting to see a manifestation of his presence.
34:39
But no matter who what man, it is the man who's up there who's
34:44
lusting the right right, or the man who has issued the
34:47
homosexuality, regardless of what man, we need purity and
34:52
worship, right? Yes, Sir.
34:54
I'm grateful to have seen an example set where that person
35:01
was taken. OK, let me help you.
35:02
Let me help you get this right. So it's because if you want to
35:05
worship, you want to leave worship.
35:07
This is what's important. So just just pumping those
35:10
scriptures in that person and giving them the word of God
35:14
concerning purity and worship will help.
35:19
That's awesome. I, I, I really, I totally agree
35:22
with that. I really do totally agree with
35:24
that. So I got, let me ask you this.
35:27
What makes someone an effective worship leader?
35:32
Not that you know, I know you did, I not you, but I know
35:35
people did what they did and they church and they thought
35:38
they was leading effectively. But this is what you do.
35:42
What makes person an effective worship leader?
35:47
When we, when we're talking about effective, you know, I, I
35:51
think people can look at that word effective as the engagement
35:58
and we will say, wow, that was effective because everyone was
36:02
engaged in the worship, right? And you can be engaged in a
36:06
concert that is secular and that's non worship unto God.
36:12
And so we'll say, man, you're an effective worship leader because
36:16
everybody was engaged. I've been part of a ministry
36:18
where this is what they taught you.
36:20
OK, you need to engage the people, gauge the congregation.
36:23
And if they're engaged and we had a powerful worship
36:26
experience, wow, that is far from the truth.
36:30
And way far from. It the truth is the
36:35
effectiveness is when God's presence shows up and you don't
36:39
want to quit, you don't want to stop because you know his
36:40
presence is there. And so the effectiveness, what
36:44
causes me to be an effective worship leader is my time spent
36:48
in the presence of God when I'm not at the church building.
36:54
Because if it's a part of my day-to-day living, I can go in
36:58
and do what I did yesterday, Saturday, on Sunday, and God
37:03
will show up. Right.
37:05
And that's, that's the cool. The the engagement piece is not
37:09
me getting them riled up. The engagement piece is when God
37:12
touched them. Yeah.
37:15
And they can say, man, God showed up in this place.
37:19
Amen. You believe I was saying that?
37:21
Oh, man, that's my, that's my payday.
37:24
My payday isn't when they come up and say, man, you did a great
37:27
job today. I'm like, Lord Jesus, I guess
37:30
just God didn't touch them today.
37:32
It was just my skill. It was.
37:35
Just my skill set, man. You did a great job today.
37:39
But when people say man, did you feel that and you sensed that
37:42
and you man, God was in this place.
37:44
I felt so much better man when you was worshipping.
37:46
I came in with a headache and it's gone now.
37:49
I so now that that effectiveness came from me spending time with
37:55
God, spending time in his word, worshipping at home, right?
37:58
And then consecrating myself as a worshipper or a leader.
38:04
You need to be consecrated. There's some things you can't
38:06
allow in your 5 gates, eyes, ears.
38:11
There's some things you can't allow aside.
38:13
Why? Because what's in you is coming
38:14
out of you, right? And so when we release worship
38:20
unto God, there needs to be evidence of his presence and
38:25
that you've been in it, right? So that's what makes an
38:29
effective musician, singer, choir director is time spent.
38:35
OK, we can be skillful man. But I, you know, I got, I got
38:39
this one, you know, testimony real quick.
38:42
Oh. Yeah, as a kid, when I was a
38:44
kid, you know, we were at a concert and I saw this white guy
38:50
come up and get on the organ and he had all this white suit man.
38:53
We, you know, we aspiring musicians, we like.
38:56
Yeah, man, let's see what he about to do.
38:57
He about to get up there and Jack up how he going to play our
39:00
kind of music and he what he got on the organ, man, and he sound
39:04
horrible. Wow.
39:07
But what we didn't recognize, which is I recognize because
39:10
they started laughing, it was cracking up.
39:12
They were cracking up. But what they didn't recognize
39:15
is that people were falling out. Wow, the floor.
39:20
Wow. Wow.
39:22
It was on the floor. And I started looking around.
39:24
I was like, whoa. And they laughing, Listen over
39:27
there laughing. I'm like, OK, something going.
39:29
On. Something different them like
39:33
right? You get what I'm saying?
39:34
Yeah, yeah, for sure. Like.
39:36
When David played for Saul, three things happened.
39:39
The Bible says he was refreshed, he was made well, and the evil
39:42
spirit left. Him.
39:44
Left him, yes. Right.
39:46
And so I challenged musicians when the last time you played
39:51
and somebody was made well and the evil spirit left them when
39:55
the last time you played. And so this man, he had no
39:57
skill, but he had the anointing. He.
40:00
Had the anointing. He had the power God present
40:02
with him, so it didn't matter if he jacked up or he just swiped
40:05
the organ. But there was an anointing that
40:07
was flowing from him that was causing a tangible impact on the
40:12
people in that service. And I was like, God, I know he
40:16
don't play worth nothing, but I want that.
40:18
I want let me get some of that. Anointed, man.
40:21
I want the anointed because he's an anointed, you know, not so
40:25
great musician. That's good, right?
40:30
Now, anointed. Not so great.
40:32
The thing is, Psalm 33 and three, we got to combine those
40:35
two. Just think about the impact it
40:37
would have on those musicians that was laughing if he did have
40:40
skill. Bible says Psalm 33 and three
40:43
play skillfully with the loud noise.
40:47
Wow right play skillfully with a lot so so David is encouraging
40:51
to play skillfully and if you read in Chronicles the Bible
40:54
talks about there was a 240 skilled singers talk about that
41:02
somebody taught these individuals how to sing.
41:06
So skill is important in the missing and greeting is
41:09
combining those two together skill and anointing within the
41:11
church. Yes, I'm a I'm a stop there
41:14
because I can keep preaching on this doc.
41:15
But hey, that's hey, I got time, you know what I'm saying?
41:19
When you get finished, I just give them the cash app and I'm a
41:21
stop. But yeah, man, that's, you know,
41:26
it's important that you, you combine those two together, the
41:29
skill and the anointing. But you, you need the anointing,
41:34
you need to be consecrated. You need to be set apart only
41:37
allowing those things inside of you that is consecrated unto
41:41
God. That's good, man.
41:43
So, so like, yeah, OK, Now if you take say, now you said it's
41:47
they're skilled. What if you take 4 or 5 or 6 or
41:52
8 or 10 people and they don't have unity?
41:57
How do you build a team like that?
42:00
Because they're like, for example, OK, I'm going to call a
42:03
fast for everybody because we ain't on the same accord right
42:06
now. They don't do the fast right?
42:08
Or you do whatever. How you as a worship leader, how
42:11
do you kind of get that, get them to kind of start coming
42:16
together as one that one sound? So there's there's scriptures
42:22
within the Bible that talks about fur as the the Levites and
42:28
Kenaniah was one of those ones who instructed those people to
42:33
operate in unity. And then we saw the result of
42:36
their unity because the Bible says they were as one, and when
42:41
they were as one, they begin to lift their voice singing unto
42:44
the Lord. And then the glory cloud showed
42:47
up. I like to tell people the reason
42:49
why we don't experience the glory is because we're not
42:51
united. And so once we give scripture on
42:56
that and show in the Word how we see a whole music ministry
43:00
unite, They did everything. They washed their hands a
43:03
certain way. They, they had to wear certain
43:05
linen. You know, this is just an Old
43:07
Testament scripture that's saying that these, they did the
43:10
same things. They prayed a certain time.
43:13
They, they, they put certain linen on.
43:15
They, they did certain rituals and different things that caused
43:18
them to be united, right? And because of that unity, the
43:23
presence of God showed up. Wow.
43:25
So this was missing. That encouraged me, man, because
43:28
if look, we ain't unified, we're not going to experience the
43:32
president of God. God ain't pleased.
43:34
At all, Right, I'm telling you. So how can we please God and we
43:38
not united? I don't care how.
43:39
Will we sound? Yeah.
43:42
And you got people get up there and do it every Sunday.
43:44
Yeah. They don't like each other.
43:46
They going to get up there and sing.
43:48
They they, you know, talk about each other, but they're going to
43:51
get up. They sound good.
43:52
They sound good, yeah. You know, because they got
43:54
skill, but it's just they don't, like you said, they got to put
43:57
them two together to make a certain sound.
44:00
Man, I, you know, and I've seen it so many times where people
44:04
just just, you know, the disunity in other words.
44:08
And I also seen it where, you know, some of the things that
44:12
have like the ASAP and things like that with Apostle Eckhart.
44:15
You know how these got people from all over the places and
44:19
they just get there one time, right?
44:21
You think they you think they're traveling ban, right.
44:24
You know, travel, you know, choir, whatever.
44:26
But they're not just one sound unity.
44:28
Boom. Yeah.
44:29
You. Know what I'm saying?
44:30
That's a lot to do with, that's a lot to do with consecration
44:33
and being set apart as individuals.
44:34
Yes, right. You have your own personal set
44:37
standard. Like look, man, I can't worship
44:39
in a place where there's disunity.
44:41
And if you are uncomfortable with that, something's wrong
44:43
with your worship with God, right?
44:46
You can't be in a place where you worship God and be OK with
44:49
unity. You can't really have the Spirit
44:52
of God in you and be OK with it because something's going to
44:55
say, look, we need to apologize, we need to shift, we need to
44:58
pray, we need to talk. Because I don't feel right.
45:00
I don't feel right going before God, offering him worship.
45:03
And I know I got an issue with you.
45:05
Yeah. The Holy Spirit and you need to
45:09
come. There needs to be a strong
45:10
conviction on the inside, like you need some more Holy Ghost.
45:14
To let you know like something ain't right.
45:15
Hold on, wait a minute. This don't feel right, right.
45:18
And so those times where you, you get your pastor and you get
45:21
your worship leader together and you really, you know, begin to
45:25
teach the word of God. Because if you know, you got
45:27
individuals who are not, we call the fast and you ain't going on
45:30
the fast. You you're not, you're not
45:33
taking this serious. Yeah, yeah, you're not.
45:36
You can tell and you can tell. Hey, we right up against the.
45:39
We up against the break. We'll be right back, y'all.
45:44
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Opinions expressed in this program are those of the
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speakers and do not necessarily reflect the views or positions
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of any entities they represent. All right, we back.
47:27
Welcome back to Man Talk 133 with Shawl and Darrell.
47:30
We have Apostle Chetan Mac and Yo, the last thing you just
47:35
said, you talk about, you know, building unity and some of the
47:42
stuff you shared about, you know, hey, 200 skilled and all
47:46
of them on one accord and stuff like that.
47:49
And we got 10 and they came beyond on the court, bro.
47:53
We got some work to do. We got some work to do.
47:57
Now correct me if I'm wrong. Is that something that you do as
48:03
a as a do you do you train worship leaders and things of
48:09
that nature? Is that something that you do?
48:13
Yes, definitely we have. I have an LLC called Standard
48:18
Bearer Music Ministry Consulting.
48:20
So in that my, my objective is to train up groups, train up
48:25
choirs, train up worship leaders from the ground up, how to run a
48:29
music ministry, how to be a worship leader, how to work
48:32
cohesively with the pastor, how to develop unity within the team
48:36
and within the music ministry. All those things are something
48:38
that I can do through the help of the Holy Spirit, Hallelujah,
48:44
God. But yeah, that's something that
48:46
I do, man. Yeah, give them, give them the
48:48
information again and your contact man.
48:50
So people may want because they may be dealing with some
48:52
difficult people and they may need somebody to come in and
48:55
kind of set a little bit of order because you know,
48:57
sometimes they get that familiar errity and I don't want to hear
49:01
that, you know, I don't want to hurt that we need now you may
49:04
need somebody else to come in like you with structure, you
49:08
know. Well I mean they can.
49:11
I got an e-mail that can e-mail me at a standard 1 dot
49:16
bearer@gmail.com. So standard one and the name of
49:20
the the the company is called Standard Bearer Consulting.
49:23
So Music Ministry Consulting, in particular Standard Bearer Music
49:28
Ministry Consulting. So they can reach me there
49:29
standard1.bearer@gmail.com. And plus, I'm going to put all
49:35
of it, you know, on social media and stuff like that.
49:38
They can reach out to you and stuff like that.
49:40
So now how do you handle man difficult people?
49:43
You know, if you if you got, you know, you're the worship leader
49:46
and and hey, we supposed to be here at 9:00 because we got to
49:50
pray before we go do anything. They get there 9:30 and still
49:54
feel like they supposed to get up there.
49:57
And you know, it ain't following your rules, nobody else's rules.
50:02
How do you handle stuff like that as a, you know, and being
50:05
not being, as I said, a butthole about it, You just kind of how
50:10
do you handle that? Wow.
50:13
So the objective of the worship leader is to create a culture
50:16
where people desire and want to be a part, right?
50:20
They're they're early instead of late because of the culture
50:24
that's created. And so a lot of the times people
50:27
are late because the leaders are late who don't show up on time
50:32
because the leader don't show up on time, right.
50:35
And so in creating this unity, we, we want to share that the
50:40
reason why we here at this specific time, you know, we're
50:43
here to basically prepare. Right.
50:46
And if you missing out on something, there might be a
50:49
change, you might miss out on the change because you weren't
50:52
here on time. And our time is up.
50:55
It's time to execute now. So training and teaching the
51:00
importance of timeliness. A steward must.
51:02
The Scripture says a steward must be found faithful,
51:05
faithful. For.
51:06
Sure. So we have been given
51:08
stewardship of the ministry that God has given us and this is the
51:10
ministry of worship and praise. So, you know, my encouragement
51:15
to the worship leaders and the to team members is that we are
51:20
stewarding this. If our stewardship fails, then
51:23
we fail. So, yeah, my, my encouragement
51:28
also is to create an atmosphere where or culture where people
51:33
want to be there as well, right? So if we just, we're not really,
51:38
you know, because we don't really look too deep into that,
51:41
Cheryl, because sometimes these folks don't know their parts and
51:45
you're teaching, you don't even know how to teach your part,
51:47
right? And so when they get there, it's
51:49
like, man, I'm sitting here wasting my time.
51:52
That's a fact. And so I don't want to be on
51:54
time if he ain't even going to know his parts right.
51:56
And I'm right. You know what I'm?
51:58
Saying that's a fact, I promise you that is a fact.
52:01
I've been there. It's.
52:02
Just parts, right you, don't you?
52:03
I'm the only one beer man like. I've been there, man.
52:06
I, you know, when I first started, I was just like, you
52:08
know, you know, I, I know, I know the songs, I practice them,
52:14
but then this then when it shifts to something else, you
52:17
like, Hey, I practice on this now I got to ship to this and
52:20
I'm just like, I look, just let me get over there on the base.
52:24
I mean, I'm good, you know what I'm saying?
52:27
Even though I, I do, I really do like the praise and worship, you
52:31
know, the singing side of it. But when it get to be too much
52:35
confusion, just let me, let me go sit on the base, bro.
52:40
So, so you basically you set order basically that type of way
52:44
I got you. And then the culture is like,
52:46
you know, we don't come in learning, we come in knowing.
52:52
And so when we're rehearsing something, we're rehearsing what
52:55
we've already learned, right? And so we got to know as the
53:01
leader, are there, there's this going to be a good execution.
53:04
Are they going to think these parts, right?
53:06
They're going to mess up. You know, if if you know that,
53:11
then let's let's not even go over this on let's do something
53:14
that we know well and go from there.
53:17
Because coming in not knowing your parts and I got to teach it
53:22
to you or the leader doesn't know the parts that well and
53:27
they expected the team to learn it and pick it up.
53:31
That's another situation. So there's a specific way how
53:35
that should be done. A team should never come in like
53:38
you've got your pre service rehearsal right before the
53:41
service and you got what? I don't know.
53:43
Some some teams come in an hour before the service.
53:46
You got a whole hour of rehearsing a song, but you're
53:50
still learning it. That's it's too late.
53:53
It's. Too late too.
53:55
Late to be trying to. Learn.
53:57
You learning this song still what?
54:00
And so this is some serious discouragement for that team
54:06
because if you got someone on there who know their parts, but
54:09
the other people they don't know their parts.
54:10
It's like I ain't I ain't wasting my time coming here on
54:14
time for what they and especially if it's consistent.
54:17
So you got to look at that, you know, a couple of ways.
54:21
You know, now if if the leader knows what he's doing, he got,
54:24
you know, everybody should know their parts and they still
54:27
trucking in a little bit late and stuff like that, not on
54:29
time. And that's that individual.
54:33
Sometimes we need to shift and say, OK, you know, you really,
54:37
this ain't for you. Bro, what you're doing is so
54:41
really needed because there's a lot of people that's going
54:47
through this. You got to be here this time.
54:49
They get here when they want the leader get there when he wants
54:52
that. She gets there when she wants.
54:54
All of them get there whenever they want.
54:56
And it comes out like they got there whenever they want it.
55:00
They don't put work on stuff. They, they, you know, even if
55:04
it's the old song or new song, it just comes out like a hot
55:09
mess, you know what I mean? And it's just like what you're
55:12
doing honestly is really needed. They could go in and just reset
55:16
some of these praised teams because some of them they have
55:19
good singers, you know, whatever.
55:21
But they just need to be reset because they just kind of like,
55:25
hey, since he don't do it, I ain't going to do it.
55:27
And if the pastor ain't doing it, I sure ain't doing it.
55:30
I don't care what the worship leaders say.
55:33
You know what I mean? So it's like a it's like a hole
55:36
from top to bottom unity, as you said, from top all the way down.
55:40
If you got that God going to float straight down, you know
55:44
what I mean. Yeah, yeah.
55:46
So, yeah, man. So.
55:48
All right, So what instruments do you play?
55:50
Because we don't wrap this thing.
55:51
I forgot to ask you that. What instruments do you play?
55:54
I know you sing, you know. I know you, you know.
55:58
I started off playing the the drums.
56:00
That was the first very first instrument played.
56:03
It wasn't singing, it wasn't in the choir, wasn't keyboard, It
56:07
was it was drums, man, the first instrument.
56:10
I went from drums to the keyboard, then keyboard to
56:14
Oregon, and then learned a little bass and then played
56:18
trumpet in high school, and that was it.
56:21
Yeah. Wow.
56:23
OK. OK, so before we get out of here
56:25
man, what advice? I know you gave a lot already,
56:30
but to the young people, because I think now we need to start.
56:35
Churches need to start shipping to young people to get them
56:40
involved because now you have the older people that don't want
56:43
to give it up, but you have young people that want to play
56:47
and learn how to play. So what advice could you give to
56:50
like the worship leaders, the young people, whatever you know,
56:55
to kind of help them to, hey, don't quit, stay motivated.
57:00
Well, you know, here's what I see within our churches today,
57:03
man, especially in music ministries.
57:05
See the members of the music ministry getting older and older
57:10
and older and older and older and older.
57:14
And then we got young people who want to sing, but these older
57:19
people are not taking the time to train them to say, hey, you
57:24
need to come and be a part of this.
57:25
You need to come and sing with me, come to our rehearsal,
57:28
things like that. So I do encourage because we got
57:31
to pass the baton, so to speak. Yeah, yeah.
57:34
Because at some point in which we do have people say I'm done,
57:38
I'm too old for this, and I'm just retiring, singing in the
57:41
choir or on the praise team, This ain't.
57:44
I got grandchildren and great grandchildren, and I need to
57:48
spend more time with them. I can't come to rehearsal no
57:50
more, right? But then where's the person to
57:54
replace? That's true.
57:56
So we see that even with, with the pastoral piece, there's no
58:00
one passing the baton, leaving, leaving it for succession,
58:05
right. And so raising up individuals.
58:08
So I'm going to encourage our worship leaders.
58:10
You a worship leader, get a youth that is wanting to be a
58:15
worship leader one day. Choir directors get someone
58:19
that's youth young that wants to learn to be a choir director,
58:23
train them, you know, and so that's what happened with me as,
58:27
as as a kid, they, they scooped me up.
58:30
Come sing next to me. Like there was no I wasn't in
58:35
the kids choir, I was singing in the adult choir.
58:38
Wow. That's great, man.
58:40
So, you know, I was next to someone who was more strong, a
58:44
strong tenor and loud. And I was, you know, I learned
58:49
from that person how to be a strong tenor, right?
58:54
And so the same thing with musicians and drummers and bass
58:57
players. Like you see someone who was
58:59
looking at you and staring at you.
59:01
I've seen it before, man, many of times where kids was just
59:03
looking and they just Buckeye, man.
59:07
I'm like, come here, come here, come here, come here.
59:10
I know what this is. Yes.
59:12
Right, so I'm like, look, play these couple of chords and then
59:14
next thing they they just keep coming.
59:16
They keep coming and they're learning more chord and then and
59:18
then they're playing with you on Sundays.
59:20
Yeah, that's amazing. They're playing with me on
59:24
Sunday, every Sunday they're playing with me and and now
59:26
they've taken it over. Yeah, so before we get out of
59:29
here, any information you need to share, man, you know where
59:33
people can reach you on if you're on social media, you
59:36
know, go for your businesses again, your church, whatever you
59:39
got going on before we get out of here and we're going to end
59:42
this thing. Yeah, I we have a website
59:45
agmi217.com, that's our ministry.
59:50
You can go visit usthereandalsostandard1.bearer@gmail.com.
59:57
That's an e-mail. You can reach us at We're on
59:59
Facebook, Access Granite Ministries Incorporated.
1:00:02
I'm on Facebook. You can reach us there.
1:00:05
So come visit us. We all, we're on Instagram as
1:00:09
well as well as called Access GMI, that's Access Granite
1:00:13
Ministries. So you can find us on Instagram.
1:00:17
So we have those outlets where you can reach out to us if
1:00:19
you're looking to have your ministry, your music ministry
1:00:22
develop, to grow, to advance, get these men in there, you
1:00:26
know, raise up some youth, come and help develop your music
1:00:29
ministry from ground up, from the bottom all the way to the
1:00:33
top. Train a worship leader.
1:00:35
You know how to get your worship leaders and ministers of music
1:00:37
to work with the pastor cohesively.
1:00:40
I can help that happen. So hey, hey.
1:00:43
Y'all reach out to my man Apostle Satan back man this was
1:00:47
fun. Really enjoy the information you
1:00:49
shared man. So hey I appreciate you for
1:00:52
coming on the show man. I really do really appreciate
1:00:55
it. Hey thank y'all for joining Man
1:00:58
Talk 133 with Charlotte and darling.
1:01:00
Till next time, God bless y'all and we out.
1:01:04
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