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Major General Ryan Janovic · Five Questions for a General

• 0:00
  Speaker A: Foreign.
• 0:03
  Speaker B: You're listening to Five Questions for a General, a production of the Modern Morris Institute at West point. I am Dr. Charles Feint, the team lead for this podcast series which features interviews of senior military leaders conducted by specially selected and trained West Point cadet hosts. These exchanges produce timely, relevant and inspirational insights for professional development of leaders at all levels.
• 0:25
  Speaker A: Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the class of 1974 recording studio and the five questions for a General podcast. I'm Cadet Henry Kaye, your host, and it is my pleasure to be here today with Major General Ryan Janavik, the commanding general of the U.S. army Cyber center of Excellence. Today's discussion with General Janovic will focus on cyber operations, junior leader development and crisis management. General, welcome to the show.
• 0:47
  Speaker C: Well, thank you, Henry. It's an honor to be here with you and with the whole team here at the Modern Warrior Institute in West Point.
• 0:53
  Speaker A: Thank you. So, sir, we're going to jump into five questions today that we'd like to discuss and potential follow on questions. The first question today, sir, is you joined the army before cyber was its own branch and before you were a general, you were a military intelligence officer. What attracted you about the cyber branch and what makes you excited to work in the cyber field?
• 1:09
  Speaker C: Well, you don't hesitate with starting with difficult, hard questions. So I like that about you. The way you asked the question is what attracted me to the branch? And the truth is that I didn't elect, I didn't transfer to the branch. I didn't put in a 4187 to say I want to be cyber. At that time of my career, I was serving in Korea as the XO to the commanding general there. As they looked at next opportunities for me and for our army, the fit was to take my experience and intelligence and give me exposure to cyber and have me run a perhaps one or two year assignment in cyber that would make me a better officer, a better general officer, a better intelligence officer. So I joined the team at Joint Force Headquarters, Cyber army, which is in Augusta, Georgia in Fort Eisenhower, and began to experience what cyber was doing, the men and women doing it, the organizations that our nation and our army has built to do it. And there was an idea perhaps that I would go back into, you know, pure intel job if you will, but I didn't. I stayed there a little bit longer and was subsequently asked to be the Cybercom J3, the director of operations for United States Cyber Command, and since then bounced back into cyber yet again in my current position. So I can answer the second part of the Question a little bit better in that, well, what's exciting about it? And I think the answer, and not to simplify it too much, but it's the people within the branch. I'm here at West Point this week because there's a Cyber Leaders Conference and it's the cadets of not only West Point, not only the service academies, but the entirety of the cadets coming out of the ROTC programs as well that are going to be meeting me at Fort Eisenhower as they jump into our school there later this year and begin their basic Officer leader course. And so it's the people, it's the talent, it's the technical acumen, the brilliance that exists in the branch. And yet these are men and women who still want to do all the things that young platoon leaders want to do. Deploy lead work with non commissioned officers. So it's exciting and it's been exciting since I first joined about six years ago and got started. It was exciting at Fort Meade at Cyber Command. And it's exciting again today being a part of transforming the future of our army through what we're doing at the center of Excellence.
• 3:19
  Speaker A: Yes sir. Coming off of a branch such as military intelligence and moving into cyber, do you feel that you were technically prepared to move into a branch as technical as cyber or.
• 3:27
  Speaker C: That's a great question. We talked about it at this conference I'm attending and there's a theory that says, you know, that technical leadership is required, that it'd be hard for a non technical leader, if you will. I went to West Point here and I was in the life sciences program and had a lot of chemistry courses in my background and in intel we do technical things. But I understand that. I'm not a computer science major, I'm not a coder. And so my reflection on that has been. And with you today, I'd share the idea that, well, it's a two way street. I as the leader have to be a little bit vulnerable in my ability, but confident in my ability to be an integral part of a technical team and learn the questions I need to ask to understand how to orchestrate all that they bring. Second part of the responsibility is folks with technical backgrounds also need to understand that they have a mandate to learn how to communicate technical things in ways where decision makers can make action happen based on what they recommend. It's a two way street. I'm of the belief that I'm probably not the best at it, but I'm learning a lot about what it means to master the ability to appreciate, cultivate and Train technical brilliance and then apply my 32 years of experience of taking their brilliance and translating it in outcomes for the joint force or for our army.
• 4:43
  Speaker A: Yes, sir. And when you're looking to assess junior officers into the branch, are you looking for the more technical aspect or that more communicative leadership aspect, or is there that mix?
• 4:51
  Speaker C: Well, I think by definition there's kind of a, I'll say an entry idea that we want cyber officers, electronic warfare officers, to have some background in it, not to say they couldn't. For example, we have evidence of folks who have liberal arts degrees, but they have also done an asi, an additional skill identifier, producing experience in an ROTC program, or they have demonstrated some real world additional training or certifications since their degree. So there's a balance there. I think what we see is traditionally computer science, engineering, mathematics, kind of STEM program degrees, but the mandate that I then put on them and I put on the cadets last night at a dinner was you have to become an effective strategic communicator. And it doesn't happen instantly in anyone's career in any branch. But that's what we're going to work on together.
• 5:43
  Speaker A: Thank you, sir. What do you see the cyber community's most significant public accomplishment as?
• 5:47
  Speaker C: That's an interesting question. The cyber community, how we would define that a public contribution. I'm sure there are scores of things that, that we could use as examples that wouldn't be known to the public. The way the work is done. When I hear you ask the question, the immediate thing that pops into my mind after observing the force and working with the force and operating with the past six years is, and I would equate this to a public contribution is we're really helping define our cyber community. The Army Cyber Force, the Joint Cyber Force, Cyber Command's relationship to private industry and those partnerships and as they continue to develop, I think are going to be important for our country to think about. What does that look like? What does it look like at scale? And how can we both understand where talent exists in both those communities and understand how we can benefit the outcome of protecting and defending the nation?
• 6:42
  Speaker A: Yes, sir. You mentioned that you're working with private industry. Does that bring up on any retention issues with people moving back and forth or gaining the skills in the cyber field and then subsequently transitioning out into the private industry or.
• 6:52
  Speaker C: Well, my experience has been there are anecdotes that would suggest, oh, we've lost this, this highly talented young woman, she went out and she's working for private industry after six years or, or we've lost this young man. He left after 10 years and I don't really consider it a loss. I think we need to be comfortable with the idea that if I benefited from their extreme talent for 10 years and they understand us and they're working in private industry and there's partnerships between our organizations moving forward in defense of the nation, maybe I continue to benefit from it. But I do also recognize that we need to keep what we're doing engaging, exciting, rewarding for officers, for non commissioned officers, for warrant officers, so that they see a path to continue in service. If we're losing people because they lose interest in the people of our army and the excitement of our mission, that's a significant problem. I don't think that's what we see. People are making family decisions, perhaps career decisions, but I still see them as part of the enterprise of cyber as they depart and be ready to welcome them back. We'll find ways to do that and they can work as civilians in these organizations as well. So I don't suggest it as a major point of contention. I think it's an opportunity.
• 8:05
  Speaker A: Yes sir. And you mentioned that one of your goals is to keep the cyber branch rewarding, interesting and engaging. In what ways does is your army changing to do that more and specifically the cyber branch, in what ways are you keeping the branch rewarding, interesting and engaging for NCOs and officers to want to stay in?
• 8:21
  Speaker C: It's a really thoughtful question. I'll try to match you with a thoughtful answer. The army that the young men and women of your classmates and classmates at other schools in this next few year period, if you join our army, you're joining an army that's transforming in contact, getting ready for a future conflict quite different than anything we've experienced in the past 20 years, if not longer. And that requires a lot of change to happen. So by definition it's an exciting time to join the force. If you get very particular with what that means for us at the Cyber center of Excellence and parts of our force, the growth of electronic warfare, not only from just the force structure alone, the amount of force structure we're going to build, the amount of equipment going to put back into the force so that electronic warfare can happen at echelon, drawing upon great lessons about what we've seen happen in the Ukraine, Russia conflict, and learning from that, and applying those lessons relatively quickly. If you compare it to other lessons in our absorption of those lessons, I think you join the force today and you look at it in five years and you measure just that window alone, you're going to see this magnificent change in cyber electromagnetic warfare, SEMA activity, SEMA officers and formations at Echelon, all in support support of multi domain operations. Things you're probably studying now. But it's a really exciting time to come into the army. And that by itself creates that excitement. We're trying to build that excitement as everyone walks into the gates of Fort Eisenhower for training and talk about it in ways that is not formulaic PowerPoint but is a real world application. What a lot of people don't know about Fort Eisenhower is 70% of what happens on the installation there is an operational mission. So I have the great benefit of taking young men and women who are joining the army for the first time time or lieutenants who are coming into the army after a commissioning source has said, you're ready to go now, go get more ready for your branch. I can show them what's exciting about what we're doing on Fort Eisenhower as it's happening in the back 40. So it's really cool. Yes, sir.
• 10:24
  Speaker A: Thank you. The next question is one of the positions you served in while deployed to Iraq was as an aide de camp in multinational forces Iraq. What kind of things can junior officers learn while serving in positions like that or on unit staffs as they prepare for higher levels of command?
• 10:38
  Speaker C: That job you highlighted in particular, my experience would suggest that whenever you have the opportunity to see how senior organizations are making decisions, see how senior leaders are making decisions and the information that they need to make those decisions, those are lessons you should observe, study and pack away in your own repertoire. Because that to me is what you're going to need later. And your ability to take a lot of information, condense it, synthesize it, translate it, communicate it. The higher I've moved through staffs and seen it at different levels and echelons, it's always cemented to me more and more how important it is to be able to effectively communicate complexity, to be able to reduce that complexity in communications, but ultimately to be convincing that you understand the problem, that you understand our craft, our profession, and that your recommendation is valid because of your ability to communicate your thinking. Pretty important. And I saw it in that job, I've seen it in many others. And it'd be the thing that for me, I would excite anybody that's in a job where you get to observe a senior leader, watch how they make decisions and think about what you're going to do differently to help others make those Decisions.
• 11:49
  Speaker A: Sir, as the commander of U.S. army Cyber center of Excellence, what are your greatest concerns now and for the future?
• 11:55
  Speaker C: I alluded to what I'm trying to do as part of a team at the Cyber center of Excellence, to carry the mantle of my predecessor, to set conditions for the future. We have the opportunity to. We're creating a 21st century campus there. If you come visit us, you'll see a billion dollars worth of construction to revitalize the infrastructure. And we could talk about that in many ways. But if your question is what am I concerned about? It's a little bit of the question about what keeps you up at night, but what am I concerned about? I'm not concerned about it in a way that's threatening, but the energy that I'm trying to build right now is if we are a center of excellence for signal network operations, cyber electronic warfare, information advantage. If that's the charge, then I would have to think that our army senior leaders want us to be excellent at all those things. And my measurement of that perhaps is do the men and women who come through the gates feel that they're in the hands of experts who they trust, and when they leave, they're prepared to go out into the Army. But if they run into a hard problem, do they call us back? Do they want to come back for advanced training? Do they see it as a place that they trust, an alma mater that they'll call back to when they're in trouble and need to learn something new? Are we evolving our training in a way that excites them to want to be a part of the center of excellence throughout their career? That's what I'm working on. And great, great leaderships and the commandants there and the schools across the entirety of the formation, we'll get there. But it is what concerns me because being a center of excellence to me carries a mandate to have a strong reputation, not only with the people you're training, but with the operational force. When they need something solved, they're going to call. We're doing that in many areas. I need to do it more wholeheartedly in all the areas that we have responsibility for.
• 13:52
  Speaker A: Yes, sir. The following question is, in the fall of 2024, your command confronted Hurricane Helen. The deadliest hurricane destroyed the United States mainland since Hurricane Katrina in 2005. As a leader, how do you prepare for large scale catastrophes in either the physical world or the online cyber world, and how do you manage the aftermath?
• 14:10
  Speaker C: Hurricane Helene, we weren't prepared for, to be honest. The city of Augusta, Fort Eisenhower. We weren't as prepared as perhaps we should have been. But I think crises like that, the reason things are often crisis because you weren't thinking that it was going to impact you the way it did in this case. That storm was predicted to move westward towards Atlanta, towards Fort Moore. My good friend and the commanding general at Fort Moore had done a lot more of preparation because we saw the storm path going over Fort Moore. So we, in many respects, both the city, the mayor of Augusta and I spoke, we weren't as prepared because we saw a different path. So I can't say that I can give you deep insights into what the preparation resulted in. We can talk a lot about what we did after we realized that we were the eye of the storm, if you will, for me today, as I answer your question, I think about where we are. We did a lot of great things and immediate care for families and communities and on post housing and the families living in those homes that were impacted. We're proud of all that work. The Garrison team, if it reminded me of anything, it is that take rehearsals that your team does for anything more seriously than sometimes we do that because you don't know when you're going to be put to a fuller test. And so I think it reminded our team that annual certifications and reviews of standard operating procedures and tabletop exercises, while they might seem monotonous or they might seem not, the urgency of the day, the investment pays off when you're asked to bring it to scale very quickly. But what I recognized is that if you have the right team of talent with you and you empower them and you bring them together and excite over communication during a crisis and get everyone talking with clarity and purpose, focused on priorities, that you're going to be okay. And that's what we found. We've learned some great lessons from it. Certainly we'll invest those lessons, but far be it for me to say, therefore we'll never be fooled again into thinking we're always and forever safe.
• 16:24
  Speaker A: Yes, sir. Thank you for that. We'll move on to the final question that we'll discuss today. Knowing what you know now, what advice would you give to your younger self if you were starting your career over today?
• 16:35
  Speaker C: There, you know, there's probably a lot of things I, I, I'd probably work harder at West Point, to be honest. I'm back here and it's nostalgic and I came back from my reunion and I, you know, there's a part of me and I, it's Probably common. You look back and say, I, I, I, I should have done better, harder work in some of the academic departments. I should have. And so I have that feeling sometimes as I, if I could go back and do it again, if that's your question, I'd work harder when I was here. Still try to have fun, keep balance, great friends I've made. I'm talking to a couple company mates that are here stationed here. Brian Gibbe leads the Department of History. He's my classmate Jen Boatschild. She's the historian. And when I look back, I'm like, did I do everything I could have when I was here? Overall, I would translate that idea into the larger frame of the army. And was I always as good as I could have been? And continue to try and practice today to maintain friendships. And friendships can come and go and get redefined by pcss, but it's up to us to invest in them over time and they change and they migrate. Some of my best friends in the army and some who have gotten out of the Army, I didn't really know well here at West Point. They're my classmates, but I didn't know them well. Turns out we served together at Fort Hood, Texas at the time as an example, both in Brigade command and lifelong friends. Families are close. So I think the value of friendships is something that, again, it sounds like an easy throwaway answer to you. Don't take it that way. People are our business. Maintaining relationships is the core competency of maintaining friendships and relationships. It's really, really important. Still today, 32 years practicing the art, staying in touch with people, being there for them when they need my help, and maintaining relationships.
• 18:22
  Speaker A: General Janavik, thank you for sharing your time with us today and for the great discussion on junior leader development, crisis management and emerging cyber threats. On behalf of Colonel Pat Sullivan, the director of MWI, the Modern War Institute, and Dr. Charlie Feint, the director of this podcast series, I'd like to present you with this rare and coveted MWI pen case and pen as a token of our appreciation.
• 18:43
  Speaker C: Well, Henry, thanks to you. Again, thanks to the entire team. I don't, I don't know many cadets in your class, but now I know you. And if you're emblematic of what's happening in your class and across this academy, it's exciting. You're awesome. And it reminds me that I could have done better and been more like you when I was here. But I appreciate the gift, I appreciate your time, and I look forward to joining you in our army.
• 19:11
  Speaker A: Thank you, sir.
• 19:11
  Speaker C: Thank you.
• 19:15
  Speaker B: This has been an episode of Five Questions for a General, a production of the Modern War Institute of West Point. If you like what you heard today, please download, like, subscribe and share this podcast to help us reach an even larger audience. All statements in this podcast represent the personal views of the speakers and do not represent an official position of the United States Military Academy or the United States government.