Latest / The BioHub - by Avetix / Episode 241 - Howard Berman & Kia Motesharei - ReAlta Life Sciences

Transcript

Episode 241 - Howard Berman & Kia Motesharei - ReAlta Life Sciences · The BioHub - by Avetix

• 0:06
  So welcome back to another episode of the Biohub, the
• 0:09
  Evetics podcast. Today, I'm delighted to be
• 0:11
  joined by Kia Montescheri, who's the president and CEOCOO and
• 0:15
  Howard Berman, who's the CEO of Rialto Life Sciences.
• 0:19
  Rialto is a biotech focused on developing treatments for
• 0:22
  serious diseases where inflammation causes significant
• 0:25
  damage to the body. Its lead drug is designed to
• 0:28
  control this harmful inflammatory response, with a
• 0:30
  particular focus on conditions such as HIE, which is a serious
• 0:34
  form of brain injury in newborns.
• 0:37
  Here and Howard both have fascinating journeys across
• 0:39
  biotech and pharma and have now come together to lead Rialta
• 0:42
  through an important stage of its development.
• 0:45
  Today we're going to talk about their journeys into Rialto and
• 0:48
  why they decided to take on these roles at this this stage
• 0:51
  of their career, the science behind the company, the
• 0:54
  opportunity in HIE and what they're looking to achieve next.
• 0:58
  So guys, it's an absolute pleasure to have you.
• 1:01
  How are you both? We're doing well.
• 1:04
  I'm doing well. Thank you for having us on the.
• 1:06
  Call. Thank you for having us.
• 1:11
  Yeah, look super excited to have you guys on.
• 1:13
  So appreciate you making the time.
• 1:15
  So let's just start off with a little bit about both of your
• 1:18
  journeys through the field. Howard, we'll we'll start with
• 1:20
  you. You've obviously experienced the
• 1:22
  industry from a number of different angles.
• 1:25
  Now can you just talk as high level your story and and
• 1:28
  ultimately how you got to where you are today?
• 1:32
  Well, my story I, there was never any doubt that I would be
• 1:36
  in the medical field. And the reason is, is everyone
• 1:40
  in my family was in the medical field.
• 1:42
  My, and not just not just doing pedestrian things, but doing
• 1:48
  very big important things. My father was a triple board
• 1:51
  certified physician. My, my mom was a world leading
• 1:56
  expert, probably the world leading expert in cancer
• 1:59
  epidemiology at MD Anderson discovered a number of very
• 2:05
  unique findings in lung cancer. My sister's a breast
• 2:09
  radiologist. My brother is an MDPHD who then
• 2:14
  moved into pharma and now he's the head of he's the chief
• 2:18
  development officer at Moderna, working on their oncology
• 2:22
  platform. So the genesis of my interest
• 2:26
  was because of the push for my family, but it also began
• 2:30
  because of a strong proclivity and interest that I have in
• 2:34
  science, basic science, how the body works, how the brain works.
• 2:39
  And that then pushed me to study at the University of Michigan in
• 2:45
  biology and then at Cornell for my PhD, and then move into the
• 2:49
  Pharmaceutical industry and then of course, into the
• 2:52
  entrepreneurial regime, which I've now really established
• 2:58
  myself in starting and founding and leading biotech companies.
• 3:03
  Amazing. Kate, your career you've
• 3:06
  obviously been more on the the business development, corporate
• 3:08
  strategy, financing and and company building site again.
• 3:12
  Can you just give us a high level run through on on yourself
• 3:15
  as well? Sure.
• 3:19
  Similar to Howard, I've always been interested in the
• 3:22
  healthcare side of things ever since I was a teenager, but my
• 3:28
  focus has always been more on the business end of it than the
• 3:33
  practice side of the healthcare. Drug discovery seemed, you know,
• 3:39
  an entry point for me. And for me it was very important
• 3:43
  to know the science of it to be in order to be successful on the
• 3:47
  business side of it. I think what drug developers do
• 3:53
  is equally as important as what physicians do.
• 3:58
  Besides the surgeons that actually cut, almost every other
• 4:01
  group of physicians utilize drugs to treat their patients.
• 4:07
  So, you know, drug developers are equally as important in
• 4:11
  healthcare of the patients that physicians are treating.
• 4:16
  I completed my graduate work in chemistry and entered in an
• 4:22
  industry and from the very beginning I made the transition
• 4:26
  into the, you know, business, corporate development strategy
• 4:30
  side of it. And it's been 25 plus years that
• 4:35
  I've been doing and I've enjoyed it.
• 4:40
  It's an extremely rewarding career, I can tell you.
• 4:46
  Amazing. And look, you've obviously both
• 4:49
  joined Rialto recently, although both of you have been involved
• 4:54
  in the company for a while now. Kia, we'll start with you.
• 4:58
  You were on the board before stepping into the president and
• 5:01
  COO role. What what did you see in the
• 5:03
  company, the science and the opportunity and HIV that made
• 5:07
  you want to move from being involved at board level to take
• 5:10
  in on a much more kind of hands on leadership role within the
• 5:13
  company? Sure, short answer opportunity.
• 5:20
  So being on the board you, you have the advantage of being
• 5:25
  exposed to everything that the company is doing.
• 5:28
  And it, it really helped me to really dig into the science
• 5:34
  behind the product, understand the insurance and out of the
• 5:40
  what the company has done developing the asset and
• 5:43
  ultimately becomes a risk reward analysis.
• 5:47
  And for me, it was a great opportunity where we can bring a
• 5:52
  drug to market to a group of patients that are an extreme
• 5:58
  high unmet need. There is no therapeutic products
• 6:02
  on the market for these group of patients.
• 6:06
  And also the parallels that the opportunity has to my previous
• 6:10
  experience at Madrigal where we develop the first therapeutic
• 6:16
  product to treat Nash slash mash fatty liver disease.
• 6:21
  So All in all, it, it, it, it resembled the similar experience
• 6:27
  that you know, we not only have to develop a drug in where
• 6:31
  nobody has gone before or been successful, I should say before
• 6:36
  work within the regulatory environment that is itself
• 6:42
  learning and adjusting, not having had a drug already
• 6:47
  approved for the indication. So All in all very similar
• 6:52
  experience and ultimately getting a product to the
• 6:55
  patients that have huge unmet need.
• 6:59
  So putting all of that together, it it was a very compelling
• 7:03
  reason for me to join Rialta in an operational role.
• 7:09
  Nice. And and how would you initially
• 7:11
  came into Realtor as executive Chairman before moving into the
• 7:14
  CEO role? What, what did you see during
• 7:17
  those early conversations and your time with the company as as
• 7:20
  chairman that ultimately made you think that this is, you
• 7:23
  know, a company that you you actually wanted to be at the
• 7:25
  helm of and lead as CEO? And why was this the right
• 7:28
  timing for you personally as well to to take on this role?
• 7:32
  Yeah, well, similar to Kia, I would say opportunity,
• 7:36
  opportunity in many different directions to make a major
• 7:39
  difference for for patients. I had also taken an assessment
• 7:44
  of the science, the basic science, how the drug was
• 7:47
  discovered, the regulatory dynamics, the intellectual
• 7:51
  property. It gave me a, an ability to look
• 7:53
  at the, the full spectrum of the, the possibilities and the
• 7:58
  opportunities with the drug. And I was amazed to see the just
• 8:04
  the incredible science behind how this was discovered and also
• 8:08
  the the data that we've already achieved in some in clinical
• 8:12
  trials. And so all of that said, I think
• 8:15
  when I assess the high end need in HIV and these babies who have
• 8:20
  nothing else similar to my my past and my history, I like
• 8:25
  taking on challenges where there is a high unmet need and there's
• 8:28
  nothing really out there for patients.
• 8:30
  And HIV is probably among the disorders where that's, you
• 8:35
  know, one of the most unmet cases of unmet need.
• 8:42
  Yeah, Just to move into the HIE space a little bit more, can you
• 8:46
  just like kind of at high level talk about what like what
• 8:49
  actually happens when a newborn experiences a lack of oxygen or
• 8:52
  blood flow to the brain? Like what does that initial
• 8:55
  injury look like and why can the damage continue even after the
• 8:58
  event has been treated as well? Just just give us a high level
• 9:01
  overview through this this space that you guys are working in.
• 9:06
  I I can take that question as as you pointed out, HIV happens as
• 9:11
  a consequence of lack of oxygen, which is due to lack of blood
• 9:18
  flow to the brain. The cause of it often is
• 9:24
  something mechanical that happens during the birth,
• 9:28
  whether umbilical cord gets wrapped around baby's neck or
• 9:34
  gets, you know, tied around itself.
• 9:37
  There is an issue with placenta, but regardless, there is an
• 9:41
  interruption of the blood flow to the baby and the baby's
• 9:46
  brain. It is not something that can be
• 9:49
  predicted, so there are no testings that can be done.
• 9:56
  As I mentioned, it happens during the labor, so there's not
• 10:01
  much you can do in preparing for the condition.
• 10:05
  Babies are born within, you know, minutes.
• 10:09
  They're diagnosed to have HIV. They're often very blue.
• 10:15
  They outcourt scores are extremely low in the 123 type
• 10:22
  range, you know, 8910 being more normal range that you'll observe
• 10:27
  with healthy babies. The blood gases are low so
• 10:32
  physicians can identify and diagnose the treatment rather
• 10:36
  quickly. From then on, the standard of
• 10:40
  care is pretty well established. The babies are transported to
• 10:45
  NICU's. These are neonatal ICUICU unit.
• 10:52
  They're cooled in cooling blankets.
• 10:55
  They're essentially wrapped in the cooling blankets.
• 10:57
  There are cooling caps that go on their head and their body
• 11:00
  temperatures are lower to about 92 or so degrees.
• 11:05
  It's very similar to if you have an ankle injury and you put ice
• 11:09
  on it, it decreases the inflammation.
• 11:13
  Typically the babies are kept in these nikus for a period of
• 11:18
  three days or so in cooling before they're gradually warmed
• 11:23
  up. What our drug does and how it
• 11:27
  can get into more of the science and the biology of the drug is
• 11:33
  decreases. It helps decreasing the
• 11:35
  inflammation therapeutically and our process, we have done it in
• 11:41
  such way that is fully aligned with the standard of care.
• 11:46
  So as the babies are transferred to nicuse, which we have about
• 11:51
  400 units around the United States.
• 11:54
  So it's not a huge number of Nicuse that we have and
• 11:59
  ultimately are going to be our point of sales for the drug and
• 12:03
  administration of our drugs. The we start the administration
• 12:08
  of our drugs within six hours or between 6:00 and 10:00 hours
• 12:14
  after birth. We do 10 injection of our drugs
• 12:19
  in an 8 hour intervals during the three days that the babies
• 12:23
  are in Nikus before obtaining an MRI of the brain on day four
• 12:29
  looking for brain injury. Our goal and objective is to
• 12:33
  demonstrate reduction or hopefully prevention of brain
• 12:38
  injury that is caused by the inflammation that it itself is
• 12:44
  caused by restoration of the blood flow to the brain and how
• 12:48
  it can get into more biology of it.
• 12:50
  As to, you know, how the immune system is acting and causing the
• 12:54
  inflammation and how our drug prevents that inflammation.
• 12:59
  And by reducing the inflammation, we hope to reduce
• 13:03
  the brain injury and ultimately what this brain injury may lead
• 13:09
  into, whether it's cerebral palsy, epilepsy, or all sorts of
• 13:13
  other neural or cognitive or, you know, motor deficiencies
• 13:21
  that the kids, the babies will have as they grow older.
• 13:25
  So maybe I can hand it to Howard to walk you through the biology
• 13:30
  of what our drug does. Sure, happy to.
• 13:33
  I've always been attracted to drugs that act not on one
• 13:37
  pathway but on multiple pathways.
• 13:39
  Pectorazimod is a drug just like that.
• 13:42
  It targets both complement. It targets the C1 complement
• 13:46
  pathway by binding extracellularly and blocking it,
• 13:50
  but it also targets activated neutrophils.
• 13:53
  And by doing both it is, I think has has a very unique place in,
• 13:59
  in modern, in if, if this should be approved in modern medicine.
• 14:03
  The way that was discovered is pretty remarkable.
• 14:07
  Originally, there's a astrovirus that's existed for billions of
• 14:11
  years and there are babies, who and young children who are
• 14:16
  affected by this astrovirus. It causes a self limiting
• 14:19
  gastroenteritis on the outside of the the the the protein of
• 14:24
  the capsid protein of the astrovirus.
• 14:27
  It was discovered that there is a sequence and let me step back
• 14:31
  for a second. One of the features of the
• 14:34
  gastroenteritis was that there's no inflammation and that's
• 14:38
  unique among viruses. So we or the scientists who
• 14:45
  we're working on this program discovered that this there was a
• 14:48
  15 amino acid sequence on the outside of the capsid protein
• 14:52
  that was the responsible party for this anti-inflammatory
• 14:56
  activity. So the drug was discovered by
• 14:58
  isolating that a 15 amino acid peptide sequence and that's what
• 15:03
  blocks very potently the complement as well as the
• 15:06
  activated neutrophil pathways. That's very important in
• 15:10
  diseases like HIE which are driven specifically by
• 15:14
  neutrophils, by the innate immune system, by complement, by
• 15:18
  my activated myeloperoxidase, which is an enzyme kicked off by
• 15:23
  activated neutrophils. And that makes this a very
• 15:26
  unique drug and it's been now run in many patients clinically
• 15:31
  across multiple indications. And now I think we're
• 15:35
  approaching many babies. I don't know the number, but Kia
• 15:40
  can talk about the number because we're enrolling very
• 15:43
  efficiently. But we've, you know, we're very
• 15:46
  excited about our upcoming data readouts, particularly in HIE.
• 15:50
  And you know, we think that this this is a very unique mechanism
• 15:55
  that is it doesn't have a peer in its class of drug.
• 16:01
  Yeah. Looking at some of the data that
• 16:04
  you've generated so far, what what have been some of the most
• 16:06
  encouraging signals for you guys that you've seen so far?
• 16:10
  Is there a particular result or or observation that's increased
• 16:14
  your conviction in the program just based on based on what
• 16:17
  you've seen so far? Well, we, there's been a lot of
• 16:21
  pre clinical data that's, that's been compelling that's LED us to
• 16:24
  where we are today. There's also been clinical data
• 16:27
  and unfortunately I cannot share a number of the clinical data
• 16:32
  points because it's a we are a private company and those are
• 16:36
  still under, under confidentiality.
• 16:38
  But suffice it to say we've been very, we found it very promising
• 16:45
  in terms of the the safety profile and also preliminary
• 16:48
  efficacy signals. And you know, I think this trial
• 16:53
  that we're reading out very soon hopefully will re hopefully
• 16:58
  reinforce the signals that we've seen.
• 17:03
  Yeah, sounds super exciting. As you guys look ahead over the
• 17:07
  next 12 to 24 months, what are some of the major clinical and
• 17:11
  corporate inflection points for Realtor over the next year or
• 17:14
  two? What are the kind of key
• 17:16
  milestones that will kind of really determine the trajectory
• 17:19
  of the company over the next year or two?
• 17:23
  Sure. I can take that question.
• 17:27
  As we stated previously publicly our first inflection point is
• 17:34
  readout of our phase two study or STAR study.
• 17:39
  We mentioned that by the end of third quarter that study is
• 17:44
  going to come to completion. This is a phase two
• 17:48
  placebo-controlled double bind study that we're conducting with
• 17:52
  70 babies. We are on target to complete
• 17:58
  this study as described before. So that would be their first
• 18:03
  objective to conclude and analyze the results of that
• 18:10
  study based on those results working with the FDA, as I
• 18:16
  mentioned before that when you're developing the first drug
• 18:22
  for a disease, the guidelines are draft guidelines.
• 18:26
  We are working with FDA closely similar to what you know I did
• 18:31
  with my colleagues at Madrigal, mapping out the road map, the
• 18:36
  regulatory road map into really an approved product.
• 18:41
  And we're going to do this similar thing.
• 18:44
  And actually the work has been started years ago with the
• 18:48
  regulatory to find the fact and agree on what endpoints we're
• 18:55
  going to be looking at for ultimately getting a product
• 18:59
  approved and available to these babies.
• 19:03
  So the next phase of our progress would be that
• 19:08
  collaborative work that we'll be doing with FDA in paving the
• 19:13
  path and identifying the path to approval.
• 19:16
  Obviously, this is a rare disease indication that means
• 19:22
  there's quite a bit of flexibility looking at and the
• 19:26
  huge unmet need that exists allows for a great deal of
• 19:30
  flexibility from the regulatory side of things to hopefully
• 19:35
  creating easier path to an approval.
• 19:40
  I'm not going to get into the details of it, but that's
• 19:42
  something that is going to come next for us to have those
• 19:46
  discussions and identifying A surrogate marker for an
• 19:51
  accelerated approval path. Typically babies, as you know,
• 19:58
  do not have much of motor skills or cognitive skills when they're
• 20:02
  born. So analysis and looking at the
• 20:05
  babies for the sign of improvement after our therapy is
• 20:11
  going to be difficult. If we were to show the signs of
• 20:16
  reduction in brain injury or perhaps elimination of the brain
• 20:20
  injury after administration of our drug, that would be a good
• 20:24
  surrogate. To use as an accelerated
• 20:27
  approval market for our drug, which we can continue to show
• 20:34
  the correlation that exists between this reduction in brain
• 20:39
  injury and ultimately in two years time, for example, when
• 20:44
  babies do develop motor skills and cognitive skills that can be
• 20:49
  tested relative to healthy babies.
• 20:52
  That would be an ultimate, you know, full approval marker that
• 20:58
  the regulatories are more accustomed to.
• 21:01
  So that's going to be the next phase of our discussion with the
• 21:05
  FDA to really pave and clear the path to an approval and then
• 21:13
  continuing our studies, whether it's a continuation of what we
• 21:17
  are doing now or in a new form in a new study according to an
• 21:23
  agreed path for approval with the FDA along the way, there are
• 21:28
  a lot that needs to be done, particularly with increasing the
• 21:33
  awareness. So we have campaigns to educate,
• 21:38
  increase the awareness of the HIE with parents, with families
• 21:44
  that unfortunately may be faced with this horrific disease.
• 21:51
  So these are all the ongoing work that goes on and working to
• 21:56
  create a commercial strategy post approval for the launch of
• 22:01
  the drug. All in all, all of these efforts
• 22:05
  need to be financed. So we're going to look to doing
• 22:09
  another round of financing. Right now we're financed.
• 22:13
  We announced the company has raised over $150 million.
• 22:17
  We announced another $40 million round of financing earlier this
• 22:22
  year. And while we are finance into
• 22:28
  2027, well after the milestones that I just described, we still
• 22:33
  need to do another round of financing to essentially be able
• 22:37
  to get ourselves to the approval point.
• 22:41
  So sometime in 2027, you would expect that round of financing
• 22:46
  that we'll do to prepare us for hopefully approval and launch of
• 22:52
  the drug and that should take us the next, you know, 12 to 18
• 22:58
  months from now. Nice.
• 23:02
  That sounds super exciting for you guys.
• 23:04
  And if you just step away from from reality, why is the HIE
• 23:09
  such an important area of medicine for the biotech
• 23:12
  industry to focus on? I know you said there's a, you
• 23:14
  know, a significant medical need here, but what is the potential
• 23:17
  of getting an effective therapy into the hands of physicians,
• 23:21
  both in terms of the individual patient and the wider and on
• 23:24
  families and healthcare systems? Just just talk about like the
• 23:27
  the impact that this could have. Sure.
• 23:31
  Do you want me to take it our? Sure.
• 23:34
  So I mean, look at the patient population.
• 23:37
  That's probably the most important.
• 23:40
  We're talking about a patient population just born perhaps the
• 23:47
  most defenseless group of patients that unfortunately have
• 23:51
  been handed a very, you know, bad hand to start their lives.
• 23:58
  So being able to help that patient group itself is
• 24:02
  extremely rewarding. We're looking at severe
• 24:08
  developmental issues that these babies will go through through
• 24:12
  their entire lives, essentially from minute one all all the way
• 24:17
  through the rest of their lives beyond the mortality rate that
• 24:24
  exists, You know, somewhere in the 20th or so percent of these
• 24:27
  babies unfortunately pass. So the, the IT is a horrific
• 24:37
  problem that they have. And then even if they can, you
• 24:41
  know, live their livelihoods are not going to be normal.
• 24:46
  More moderate to severe patients are going to have lifelong
• 24:53
  severe developmental issues. So being able to help these
• 24:58
  patients to have a better quality of life, that would be
• 25:04
  great. It will be extremely rewarding.
• 25:07
  And, and also looking at the burden that the these babies and
• 25:13
  as they grow up, these adults with perhaps cerebral palsy and
• 25:18
  all the other medical conditions issues that they may have, the,
• 25:22
  the burden that they will have in the healthcare industry
• 25:25
  itself would be huge. So reducing or perhaps
• 25:30
  eliminating all of these would be a huge win for the healthcare
• 25:35
  system. And beyond the fact that at the
• 25:38
  personal level, just, it warms up my heart knowing that, you
• 25:43
  know, we could help these defenseless babies to overcome
• 25:48
  such a, you know, nasty problems and disease.
• 25:53
  Yeah, I'll, yeah, I'll, I'll reinforce what Kia said.
• 25:57
  These are the most vulnerable patient populations that exist
• 26:01
  and meant similar to what I've worked on in the past.
• 26:06
  And my last indication is ALS. These are just devastating
• 26:12
  diseases where it affects not just the, the the patient, but
• 26:16
  also the families, the caregivers.
• 26:18
  And it's a a tremendous, tremendous need for new
• 26:23
  therapeutics or a new or a therapeutic that works, the
• 26:27
  first one that may work. So we like big challenges here
• 26:31
  at Rialta. I personally like a big
• 26:34
  challenge. I know Kia does as well.
• 26:37
  We're trailblazing new grounds here in the field of HIE, very
• 26:41
  similar to what Kia did at Madrigal with MASH.
• 26:44
  So we are we're up for the challenge and hopefully with
• 26:50
  your upcoming data, we're going to be in a very good position.
• 26:55
  Yeah, sounds super exciting for you guys.
• 26:58
  If we were to come back and have this same conversation in three
• 27:02
  years time from now, what would you both ideally like to say has
• 27:05
  has happened at reality? What what do you think would
• 27:07
  need to have happened, you know, clinically, commercially and
• 27:10
  organizationally for you to consider this next chapter as a
• 27:13
  success? Yeah.
• 27:16
  Well, I'll comment, I'll just from my perspective, of course
• 27:20
  continue to execute in the company will continue the
• 27:23
  regulatory pathway on what we're working on with the agency,
• 27:27
  continue enrolling babies, reading out our clinical data,
• 27:32
  getting good data and then of course starting to build a
• 27:35
  commercial infrastructure to launch this drug.
• 27:38
  The, the one has to start in advance of a drug approval.
• 27:43
  As everyone knows, the, we've mapped out the commercial
• 27:47
  infrastructure and so we're actively working in that
• 27:49
  capacity. And we anticipate 3 years from
• 27:53
  now all being well is we're going to have not just a, a
• 27:57
  successful drug, but also a, a, an incredible commercial team
• 28:02
  with the, with the lead and you know, a large presence across
• 28:07
  all the neonatology centers around the United States.
• 28:11
  And you know, I think Kia has done it before and at Madrigal,
• 28:15
  he's been affiliated with the a drug that's been hugely
• 28:18
  successful. And I think with this drug,
• 28:20
  we're going to see a tremendous ramp up given the fact that
• 28:23
  there is no other therapeutic available.
• 28:29
  I mean, I will add that just looking at the journey it
• 28:33
  started at the bench level, you know, scientists making the
• 28:38
  discovery that Howard alluded to before taking it into clinic.
• 28:44
  We've done great work in optimizing and increasing the
• 28:49
  efficiency of clinical studies. The recruitment, just imagine
• 28:55
  what we have to go through because the babies need to get
• 28:58
  on drug within 6 to 10 hours from birth.
• 29:02
  So the efficiency of the clinical operation that we need
• 29:06
  to have in order to get these people, babies enrolled in our
• 29:10
  study. Our ultimate goal is to get an
• 29:15
  approval for our drug and making it available to the patients.
• 29:19
  So going back to the point that Howard just made commercial, you
• 29:24
  know having the commercial capabilities which we need to
• 29:27
  build on and we're taking the initial steps in building that
• 29:31
  capabilities comes next to pave a way in making the drug
• 29:38
  available to the patient. So these are all the some of the
• 29:42
  next steps that we have in mind that hopefully in three years
• 29:45
  time it's all going to be worked out and we're going to see these
• 29:49
  drug available to the 400 Nikus around the United States and
• 29:54
  maybe even perhaps outside the United States.
• 29:58
  For sure. This is a question that we would
• 30:01
  always finish with on on the podcast as well.
• 30:04
  If you were to sit down and have dinner with with any free people
• 30:07
  from past or present, it can be from any industry, including
• 30:11
  biotech, sports, history, music. Who would you pick and why?
• 30:16
  What would you want to learn from them?
• 30:18
  Yeah, who? Who would the three that you
• 30:20
  would go with? Howard, we'll start with you.
• 30:23
  Right, sure. So I have three.
• 30:24
  I'll just, I'll quickly mention them.
• 30:28
  My, my father is number 1. My father is no longer with us,
• 30:32
  but he was the inspiration for me for my prior company I
• 30:36
  founded. And certainly I, he was the
• 30:41
  probably the most brilliant physician and, and person that I
• 30:45
  knew. So just to have him there and
• 30:47
  update him on all the developments and everything I'm
• 30:50
  working on, I know he'd be very proud of me.
• 30:52
  Second, second are Banting and Best.
• 30:56
  Banting and Best were the discoverers of insulin in the
• 31:00
  1920s. They it was a phenomenal
• 31:03
  discovery from the pancreas. They isolated insulin and
• 31:07
  interestingly enough, they sold, they sold their patent back to
• 31:11
  the University of Toronto for a dollar.
• 31:14
  They sold insulin back for a dollar.
• 31:16
  Eli Lilly ended up developing it and we know the history of
• 31:19
  insulin, but it transformed medicine and they a strong
• 31:24
  inspiration of mine. I would love to sit face to face
• 31:27
  with them. The last would be a gentleman by
• 31:30
  the name of Penfield Wilder. Penfield was a neurosurgeon in
• 31:36
  Canada at McGill and he was probably the most famous
• 31:43
  neurosurgeon responsible for mapping the human brain.
• 31:46
  He was my inspiration to go into neuroscience and get a PhD in
• 31:50
  neuropharmacology. He mapped out the homunculus.
• 31:54
  The homunculus is this area of the brain that is maps out to
• 31:58
  your body in the somatosensory cortex.
• 32:01
  So those are my three. IKEA may may have a different
• 32:06
  industry or a different thought, but that's sort of a wrap for me
• 32:11
  in in terms of my inspirations. I have a different view.
• 32:18
  For me, it would be former colleagues and the list is
• 32:23
  actually quite longer than three people.
• 32:26
  I would love to just sit there and actually we do that quite
• 32:30
  often, have dinner with former colleagues, reminisce about our
• 32:34
  experience together, the path that we took together.
• 32:39
  You know, what we do in this industry is very collaborative.
• 32:42
  No one person can take a drug from the beginning to the end
• 32:47
  and making it available to the patients.
• 32:50
  So the element of team works and there there goes a lot into
• 32:54
  that. You build relationships.
• 32:58
  There are tense moments, there are sad moments, there are very
• 33:02
  difficult moments that you overcome.
• 33:06
  But ultimately when you overcome, it is a great feeling.
• 33:10
  And being able to sit together, have a meal, reminisce, talk
• 33:15
  about the experiences that we have together and ultimately the
• 33:19
  success that we have together is, you know, perhaps the best
• 33:24
  thing I can do with a group of all colleagues.
• 33:28
  Yeah, well, I love all of those answers and thanks so much guys
• 33:32
  for coming on and helping us out with this.
• 33:33
  It sounds super exciting what you're building at reality.
• 33:37
  So I'm looking forward to seeing those inflection points come to
• 33:40
  fruition. And yeah, thanks again.
• 33:43
  It was an absolute pleasure to to catch up with you both.
• 33:46
  Same here. Thank you so much for having us
• 33:48
  on this podcast. Thank you.