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Rhianon Gelsomino (Part 1) · Rusty's Garage

• 0:02
  A listener production.
• 0:14
  I'm automotive commentator and journalist Greg Rust and this is Rusty's Garage.
• 0:29
  My guest today is at home.
• 0:31
  Well, her adopted home, but she is entrenched there now.
• 0:35
  Rhiannon Gelsimino has gone from rural Victoria to the Idaho Greenbelt.
• 0:40
  Along the way, Rhiannon Gelsimino has gone from rural Victoria to the Idaho Greenbelt.
• 0:43
  Along the way, Rhiannon Gelsimino has done 180 rallies, worked with more than 20 drivers in 18 different countries around the world.
• 0:49
  Rallying, co-driving and motorsport are amazing.
• 0:52
  Her small town Aussie upbringing means Rhiannon hasn't been afraid to wander up to world champions and occasionally those humble convos have led to the chance to actually sit beside them.
• 1:05
  She did the hard yards with her brother Brendan, the PPS.
• 1:07
  winning an opportunity to compete on the international stage before a right turn to live and compete in the USA, where she has just won the American Rally Championship, riding beside dirt bike racing legend Travis Pastrana.
• 1:23
  Rhiannon is so immersed in the sport, she married another co-driver, Ken Blocks in fact.
• 1:29
  Alex Gelsimino has kindly given me a little dirt for this convo.
• 1:33
  The knowledge, garnered over 20 years, is something that they now share, teaching the art of co-driving and pace notes the world over.
• 1:43
  Like Molly Taylor and Jessica Dane, Rhiannon is proud to be a shining light for women in motorsport, but at heart, she's just a competitor.
• 1:52
  A fiercely determined one, a quality instilled in her at a very young age.
• 1:58
  From an early age on our farm in Wedderburn, we were riding motorbikes around and had all sorts of little odysseys and all sorts of crazy farm bikes and things like that.
• 2:09
  But dad was a Speedway driver.
• 2:11
  And when we were born, he'd already given it up.
• 2:13
  So at that point in time, he wasn't racing, but about, I guess I was five years old or something, he started rallying.
• 2:20
  So dad found the passion for rallying after giving up Speedway.
• 2:24
  And then I guess us kids grew up going spectating for dad and
• 2:28
  and things like that.
• 2:29
  And not only was our direct family mom, dad, us kids involved, but dad's mom was also really involved.
• 2:36
  So we've got lots of photos of us out spectating for dad in those rallies.
• 2:40
  And then obviously as we started growing up, it was our passion started coming through and we wanted to start racing.
• 2:47
  I was the oldest of four kids, so I was the one that,
• 2:50
  you know, the girl, and then I had a brother and a sister, another brother, so I was playing tennis and netball and doing girly things, I guess you should say.
• 2:59
  And then when I was 17, dad told me I couldn't get my P plates until I did a go-kart race.
• 3:04
  And so I was like, I'm not doing it, I'm not doing it.
• 3:07
  Anyway, we went to Bendigo and he had, he put witch's hats on all the apexes.
• 3:14
  And if I didn't hit that apex, he was standing there pointing, and this is just practicing for the race he's making me do.
• 3:19
  We practiced at that track all day long.
• 3:21
  I must have been in one of my brother's carts because my brothers were already racing.
• 3:25
  And then we'd go off to the local meet and I do this race.
• 3:29
  And I remember it was daughters and girlfriends and wives and all of that sort of stuff.
• 3:33
  There was a lot of us, I remember.
• 3:35
  And I luckily win the race.
• 3:37
  because I don't think I would have been welcomed back in the Reeves household if I didn't win that race.
• 3:43
  But one of the funniest things about that race was there was another guy who was Australian champion at the time.
• 3:49
  So his wife goes out in his cart, which is like the most awesome cart there, and she comes over the line and her husband's expecting her to win also.
• 3:58
  She's been practising and testing and as we go over the line, she wants to beat me so much that she mounts my cart
• 4:04
  lands on my shoulder and rips open my suit and we go over the line one after the other with her cart on top of me.
• 4:14
  It was just, that was my introduction to me racing.
• 4:18
  So it was quite an experience, let's just say.
• 4:21
  Definitely.
• 4:22
  The generational love of motorsport is something I wanted to tap into a little bit before we venture too much into the rallying.
• 4:29
  Firstly, I think your grandfather was into Speedway too, was he not?
• 4:32
  And he was a man who I think was a bit of a perfectionist in relation to hitting lines and apexes and that sort of thing, wasn't he?
• 4:41
  Yeah, my grandpa was into it first.
• 4:44
  I think they must have built a speedway track quite early at the farm because I remember it my entire life.
• 4:50
  So we had a horse paddock next to our speedway track and there's stories of dad and his dad, which we called Pappy, racing on this speedway track and my grandpa would not let my dad win.
• 5:02
  So apparently at one stage, my grandpa hit my dad or something.
• 5:06
  They went through.
• 5:07
  through the stallion fence and all of a sudden the stallion's out because Dad and Pappy are in, like they've crashed through the fence.
• 5:16
  And I remember riding the dirt bikes around the inside of the dam bank because you'd have that nice berm that you could like.
• 5:23
  And I remember Dad, like we're on our little bikes, like me and my brothers would do it, my sister would be on the horse.
• 5:28
  She wasn't really into the, like the bikes and stuff.
• 5:31
  And Dad, to teach us a lesson, like he'd kick our bike into the dam
• 5:37
  stay on the dam.
• 5:38
  So my grandpa and dad were both into, you know, hard lessons to teach us things.
• 5:44
  And I still remember those times.
• 5:45
  And my bike ended up in the dam so many times and I'd be in tears and I'm like, dad, you've ruined my bike.
• 5:52
  And he's like, no, just pick it up.
• 5:53
  And, oh, and you've got mud everywhere and muddy dam water and
• 5:57
  But I tell you what, for the resilient person I am today, those things taught me so many things.
• 6:02
  At the time when you're crying and you're like, I can't believe that my grandpa or my dad did that, you know what I mean?
• 6:08
  But when you grow up and you become a strong, resilient woman, you're like, oh, all those things taught me many lessons, I guess.
• 6:16
  Your dad was pretty handy.
• 6:17
  We'll get to a little bit of his rally success in a minute.
• 6:19
  But initially he was looking at, in addition to Speedway, I mean, I think Bob Jane had conversations with him.
• 6:26
  There was talk of NASCAR and maybe even some circuit racing in a Monaro too, wasn't there?
• 6:30
  Yeah, dad was very good.
• 6:32
  I think there was even lies about his age when he was doing the...
• 6:37
  the Speedway stuff.
• 6:38
  I remember our grandma kept all the newspaper articles and there was one where, I don't know, he was 15 or 16 and he'd won this big title somewhere.
• 6:47
  And my grandma was like, oh, the story says he was 18, but he was only 15, you know.
• 6:53
  And back then he got paid appearance money and all sorts of crazy things that like to think of now, like growing up, we heard all these amazing stories and dad obviously made the decision not to come to America, which
• 7:07
  I've never really asked him if he regretted it.
• 7:10
  He got married and had a family and all those sort of things.
• 7:13
  But I think that's why he's backed my brother, Brennan and I so much in pursuing our goals and, you know, taking every opportunity because maybe at a young age he was too scared to do that, you know what I mean?
• 7:27
  And from a country boy from Wedderburn, Victoria, like it was a big move to make that decision whether to go or not.
• 7:35
  And, you know, my dad still loves NASCAR.
• 7:38
  I co-drived for Kurt Busch in a rally in Italy a few years ago, and so I'm really good friends with Kurt now.
• 7:43
  So I brought dad over from Australia in 2017 and took him to a NASCAR race.
• 7:48
  And for me it was a huge highlight because I know that,
• 7:52
  maybe if he had have chased his goals, it could have been something that he would do because he was so good.
• 7:57
  So it was one of those things that I was really excited when I could do that.
• 8:01
  But it was embarrassing at the same time because he's on the ground, on his knees, looking under the NASCARs.
• 8:06
  I'm like, Dad, I don't know if you're allowed to do that.
• 8:07
  And he's like, oh, it's fine.
• 8:09
  Like, you know, like even the engineers are like freaking out.
• 8:13
  Who's this crocodile Dundee on his knees, you know, like...
• 8:16
  looking under the cars.
• 8:17
  But I mean, he had a great time and they were fantastic with him.
• 8:20
  So it's hard to know, you know, where he would have gone, I guess, but at least Brendo and I had the opportunity to travel around and race like we did.
• 8:29
  So in the smorgasbord of motorsport then, from Speedway to NASCAR and things like that, somewhere along the line, a friend of his loans him, I think, a Datsun 1600 and says, hey, why don't you try some rallying?
• 8:40
  I'll leave the
• 8:46
  It got him back in the motorsport game again because family had become a priority for him.
• 8:51
  And away he went.
• 8:52
  He would go on to win two state titles in Victoria, wouldn't he?
• 8:55
  He was a win it or been it sort of person.
• 8:58
  You know, dad always wanted to win.
• 9:00
  That was just the way he was.
• 9:01
  I remember being at rallies and...
• 9:03
  he'd be leading or if he wasn't leading, he was coming second, the likelihood was there was going to be an accident because he'd be trying to win the race.
• 9:11
  But, yeah, I mean, he was someone who didn't have a huge budget.
• 9:15
  So, you know, he was in Datsun 1600s and then he worked his way through
• 9:19
  He had a VR4 Galant, an Evo 3, like lots of different cars.
• 9:24
  And, you know, he won a couple of Victorian Rally Championships.
• 9:27
  And I mean, I think it was 1997 he had his best.
• 9:31
  We saved up the money and he went and did a round of the Australian Rally Championship, which was Rally in Melbourne at the time.
• 9:37
  And he comes something like fifth overall when, you know, when you had your Cody Crockers, your Simon Evansers, your Neil Batesers, your Dean Herridges, all those like Subaru, Toyota, all those guys in there.
• 9:48
  I think the Pedders were there in their Mitsubishis as well.
• 9:51
  He come fifth or sixth or something like that.
• 9:53
  And Dad didn't know anything about pace notes or anything like that.
• 9:56
  From memory, he, Robin, he's co-driver.
• 9:59
  Yeah.
• 9:59
  got Neil on Coral's pace notes or something like that and called them to dad because dad, I don't think dad even had time to do recce or anything.
• 10:08
  So even recce now, he doesn't really understand it because he didn't really do it.
• 10:14
  So yeah, he was just a natural talent and that passion and love he had, I guess, shone through for all of us kids.
• 10:22
  You did compete in a driving sense in autocross.
• 10:26
  I have a couple of sources for this discussion.
• 10:28
  One of them we'll call Brendan, who may or may not be your youngest brother.
• 10:31
  He says you're a bit of an understeery driver.
• 10:34
  Is that right?
• 10:36
  And Dad would talk to you about, hey, Rhiannon, there is no more lock.
• 10:40
  There is no more steering lock available.
• 10:42
  Let's just say I was best in autocross when it was like tarmac and...
• 10:48
  And understeering wasn't a problem.
• 10:50
  One day I come back and I'm like, the steering's broken.
• 10:53
  And Dad's like, the steering's not broken.
• 10:55
  There is just no more steering.
• 10:56
  You're a full lock.
• 10:57
  And I'm like, no, it's broken.
• 10:59
  And my brothers and Dad were giving it to me.
• 11:03
  You know what I mean?
• 11:04
  Like autocross was so much fun.
• 11:06
  Like two kilometre gravel stage, you go on green, you do like six laps a day, your best three count.
• 11:12
  Dad and my brothers would go.
• 11:14
  We had the best time.
• 11:15
  I had a Datsun 1600.
• 11:17
  And then after that I bought myself a Subaru GCA and then after that I had a Subaru RS, which is non-turbo.
• 11:25
  So I had three different cars for autocross that I raced and they were great times and yeah, it was just a really good fun family thing that we could do.
• 11:34
  Brendo usually won, but I think one time I crazily got like, there was a hundred cars and I got third overall or something, but it was purely because this stage was like tarmac.
• 11:46
  there was no sideways I was just flat out and it suited my driving so it was quite funny really we love to zero in during the podcast discussion on a couple of key cars so of those three that you've just rattled off a moment ago in the autocross pick one that you had a soft spot for and tell the audience a bit more about the car maybe some of the mods you made maybe some of the prep you did as a family things like that
• 12:08
  I must admit the Datsun 1600 was just a road car that we found and we put a half cage in it and I got some of my brother's old rally seats or dad's old rally seats.
• 12:20
  I always had a passenger seat even though you didn't need to because I usually had dad or one of my brothers coming in yelling at me to go faster and...
• 12:28
  hit the apex here and all those sort of things.
• 12:30
  So that little Datsun 1600, there's a pretty cool story to that because that car I sold to someone in Ballarat from memory, somehow Brendo bought that car back and now Brendo's Datsun that he's built up is that car.
• 12:48
  So it's just crazy that it come back to our family after I got it when I was, I don't know, 18 or 19 and...
• 12:55
  And then, you know, after I bought the Subaru, I sold it on to someone else and then eventually it come back to the family.
• 13:02
  So it's got a bit of history to it.
• 13:04
  And that's why that car is so special.
• 13:05
  And now I've done a rally with Brendo in it, the Alpine rally in 2019.
• 13:11
  And that was that car that I learned to drive quite fast and stuff.
• 13:15
  So it's pretty cool.
• 13:16
  Amazing bit of kit.
• 13:17
  And I love when he shares some video of it on social media.
• 13:21
  It's an amazing car now.
• 13:22
  Hey, around that time when we're talking 17, 18, you did spend a month on the pavement.
• 13:31
  Is that right?
• 13:33
  What happened there?
• 13:34
  How can your father ground you when you're 18?
• 13:37
  I still don't understand.
• 13:40
  I'm still confused about to this day, and I don't have children, so I don't really know what I would do, but let's just say I got a car for my 18th, which is a Toyota Corolla.
• 13:50
  It was a great little car.
• 13:52
  100,000 kilometres on it had been from, I think it was the Swan Hill Library car.
• 13:56
  So my parents give it to me for my 18th, which was in November.
• 14:00
  And then in December, I decided to not really tell my parents where I'm going and I was going out and things like that.
• 14:07
  I was 18 though, so I figured I could do what I wanted.
• 14:11
  And mum and dad found out and I got in a lot of trouble and they grounded me when I was 18 years old and they took my car.
• 14:18
  So I was like,
• 14:19
  Let's just say I learned a hard lesson.
• 14:22
  It didn't matter how many nights I told them they can't ground me because I'm 18 years old.
• 14:26
  That didn't work.
• 14:27
  And to make it worse, my dad made me go work on the railway lines and I had a whippersnapper and a chainsaw and I had to...
• 14:36
  Whippersnip the side of the railway lines and then I had to use a chainsaw to cut trees that like might have fallen because we had some, I don't know, contract that we were doing on the railways.
• 14:46
  And I still to this day, I can't, I'm like, I can't believe it, Dad.
• 14:50
  I'm like, no wonder I'm such a tomboy.
• 14:52
  You made me use a whippersnipper and a chainsaw at 18.
• 14:56
  He's like, well, you were grounded.
• 14:58
  We start to get an idea of just how determined you are as a human being.
• 15:04
  So you venture down the path of school teaching and studying at university.
• 15:09
  You would ultimately become graduate of the year there.
• 15:13
  Tell us a little bit about university life and things like that.
• 15:16
  Yeah, so obviously I was a little small country girl, you know, from Wedderburn.
• 15:21
  There was not many people, 800 people.
• 15:22
  I went to a tiny high school.
• 15:24
  So going off to Ballarat to study to be a PE teacher was quite a big move for me.
• 15:30
  Even though it was only two hour drive from Wedderburn, it was a big change.
• 15:35
  So I wasn't living on campus and I was living with a local boy that also needed accommodation.
• 15:41
  So I did the first year of university.
• 15:42
  I wasn't a drinker.
• 15:43
  I loved to party, but I didn't drink.
• 15:46
  All of that was good and I had a great time and I finished the first year with really good results and everything.
• 15:51
  But then the second year of university, I'd been home for months, like in school holidays and with mum and dad and stuff and my family.
• 15:59
  And so I go back to university and after six weeks, I decided I was deferring.
• 16:04
  And dad's like, well, what are you going to do?
• 16:06
  And I'm like, I'm going to be a hairdresser.
• 16:09
  And my dad's like, wait, you're studying to be a PE teacher.
• 16:12
  You're going to be a hairdresser.
• 16:13
  Okay.
• 16:14
  So I go off to Bendigo then and then when I'm nearly finished out, I'm nearly fully qualified after 12 months, I come back home and I say to mum and dad, I think I want to be a PE teacher.
• 16:25
  So off I go back to Ballarat and that all goes really well.
• 16:29
  And in 2005 I won the Graduate High School Teacher of the Year for Victoria.
• 16:35
  I still remember going to the Herald Sun Tower in Melbourne
• 16:39
  and having this interview and my mum had bought me this gorgeous little suit I was in this heels and a skirt no trackies and we're going up and and I remember how it worked they sent principals and whatever to come and watch me teach and they'd just randomly turn up to the classroom and you wouldn't even know so you know it wasn't like you know you could be prepared for them coming so I do this interview and I walk out mum's like how did you go and I'm like I'm going
• 17:09
  And then we had to go to this big gala dinner and there was four that they'd cut it down to.
• 17:15
  And I won and it was just crazy.
• 17:17
  I think I won two and a half thousand dollars just for doing my job.
• 17:20
  Like for me, it was just my job.
• 17:21
  You know what I mean?
• 17:23
  The funny thing is in my hairdressing school, I actually won hairdresser of the year as well.
• 17:27
  So I've got a few different things that I've done throughout my life, I guess you can say.
• 17:34
  You're an achiever.
• 17:35
  We know that.
• 17:36
  The thing that I'm intrigued about very quickly before we move on to co-driving here, the school teaching is that...
• 17:44
  you know, the skill set from that, a natural complement to the co-driving stuff, because you've got to be prepared, you've got to be organised.
• 17:51
  A lot of those traits, although very different disciplines, would follow through, would they not?
• 17:56
  Yeah, 100%.
• 17:57
  I always say to co-drivers, because obviously Alex and I have a training business now, Australia Pro, and I always say to co-drivers that
• 18:05
  main skills that I say you need to have is organisational skills and multitasking skills.
• 18:10
  And as a PE teacher, if I wasn't organised for my lessons, I obviously couldn't do the job I needed to do for the students.
• 18:17
  And then multitasking, there was chaos going on sometimes.
• 18:21
  You know, I remember one little kid, he was a great little kid, but he had lots of issues at home and
• 18:26
  We're out playing basketball and I had CPEP set up, which means the kids would score and they'd umpire and they had different roles.
• 18:33
  And this kid decided that one of the other kids had made a bad decision and he hadn't done a foul.
• 18:38
  So he climbs up the fence, which is really high, and he's up the top of the fence and he's yelling and swearing and I'm like, oh, I don't really know what I'm going to do right now.
• 18:48
  So I just left him up there.
• 18:50
  I'm like, if I tell him to get down and he falls, like, I'm in trouble.
• 18:53
  So I'm just like, I'll just leave him, you know.
• 18:56
  And eventually he decided that it wasn't so good up the fence.
• 18:59
  He climbs down and I thought, you know what, he must have had a really bad day at home to really be like that.
• 19:06
  You know what I mean?
• 19:07
  He loved PE.
• 19:08
  The multitasking that's going on, I'm still trying to run this program with the kids.
• 19:12
  I'm worried about him falling off the fence and saying the F word countless times.
• 19:16
  And I'm just like, oh, man.
• 19:18
  And, you know, the kids sort of are laughing, you know, what are you going to do, Miss?
• 19:21
  And I'm like, well, let's just leave him there.
• 19:23
  And they're like, OK.
• 19:24
  I definitely feel that, you know, the skills that you learn being a teacher and all the different challenges that you face set you up for so many of the challenges we face as a co-driver.
• 19:35
  You have done something like 80 plus rallies with your younger brother, Brendan, who you've, Brendo, who you've talked about already.
• 19:42
  You're the oldest.
• 19:42
  He's the youngest.
• 19:44
  But initially, the co-driving didn't start with him.
• 19:46
  I think it started with your brother, Nathan.
• 19:47
  Yeah.
• 19:48
  And you used to get car sick.
• 19:52
  You have done your research.
• 19:55
  Nathan's nearly two years younger than me and he had a Datsun 1600 and when my dad and my brothers finally convinced me that I should take up co-driving, the best scenario was to get in with Nathan because Brendo was still only 17 at that time and on his old place.
• 20:12
  So, Nathan and I did a couple of rallies to start off with and I got sick and I still remember getting back to Service Park and Nathan being mad at Dad because she's getting sick
• 20:24
  And I said to Dad, but ask him, have I missed a note?
• 20:27
  And Dad's like, has she missed a note?
• 20:28
  Has she made a mistake?
• 20:29
  And Nathan's like, no.
• 20:30
  And Dad's like, well, I think she's doing a good job.
• 20:33
  So he got told he had to shut up and keep going.
• 20:37
  He was just a bit miffed about you getting car sick, I think, in his car.
• 20:40
  But ever the determined person that you are, within sort of four or so rallies,
• 20:47
  You managed to get on top of it.
• 20:49
  I don't think you've ever been sick again.
• 20:50
  How did you do that?
• 20:52
  I think it was only, it was either two or three rallies that I got sick.
• 20:56
  I honestly, I thought that it was a car sickness problem, but I quickly realised it was more like a nerves issue.
• 21:02
  You know what I mean?
• 21:03
  Like getting into racing for the first time and just worrying about making a mistake.
• 21:08
  I come from a perfectionist family.
• 21:10
  Yeah.
• 21:10
  And I'm a perfectionist.
• 21:12
  So I was so nervous because the first rallies I did with my brother Nathan were actually on map.
• 21:18
  And so you'd go from map to road book to.
• 21:21
  And so I'm jumping around.
• 21:22
  They're all in the night.
• 21:24
  It was a lot going on.
• 21:25
  I didn't enjoy the map rallies.
• 21:27
  It taught me other things for my career with my racing.
• 21:30
  But I was struggling with racing.
• 21:32
  you know, in the dark, jumping on the maps from road book to map and stuff like that.
• 21:37
  And so I was eating like just, you know, dry toast and things like that because I was nervous of being sick.
• 21:42
  But it pretty quickly after two or three rallies stopped and I realised that it was more of a nerves issue than me being car sick.
• 21:50
  I think you've actually beaten your dad in that regard too.
• 21:52
  He needs ginger and all those sorts of things to get on top of it, doesn't he?
• 21:55
  He's a driver.
• 21:56
  That's the worry.
• 21:58
  I'm like, Dad, how do drivers get sick?
• 22:00
  It's supposed to be the co-drivers.
• 22:01
  I always give him hell because I'm like, you must be a bad driver if you make yourself sick.
• 22:06
  You would ultimately end up in the co-driving seat beside your younger brother.
• 22:11
  And there's a bit of an age gap between you guys.
• 22:13
  And ironically, the rallying helped bring you closer, didn't it, as brother and sister?
• 22:19
  Is that a fair assessment, do you reckon?
• 22:21
  For sure.
• 22:21
  I mean, I was 18 years old leaving home and he was 10 years old.
• 22:25
  So...
• 22:26
  you know, that's a big age gap and you've got two siblings in between.
• 22:31
  So I guess Nathan and I did a lot of things together.
• 22:34
  I remember us training for triathlons and going out running and being on our bikes and all those sort of things because we were a similar age, so we'd push each other.
• 22:42
  But Brenda was a lot younger.
• 22:45
  And so when, you know, when we did decide to start rallying together, obviously it was one of those things that
• 22:52
  he become my best friend, do you know what I mean?
• 22:54
  Like we were traveling the world, we had so much faith in each other as far as what we were doing in the car.
• 23:00
  We had to believe in each other, you know, and we got to do so many incredible things all over the world together that it does bring you closer and it makes you learn so much about each other.
• 23:09
  And I guess my middle brother and sister Nathan and Bianca, they're more similar, those two, whereas Brendo and I are actually really similar.
• 23:17
  And you don't really know that until
• 23:19
  you put yourself in that position where you have done what we have done and we've realised that our personalities are very similar.
• 23:26
  Idols, I want to chat about that for a moment because you have had the chance to meet and get to know yours and probably even have a friendship.
• 23:34
  For people that don't know in rallying, the whole female aspect of our game has gone through, thankfully and quite rightly, a lot more...
• 23:45
  attention in recent time.
• 23:46
  There's greater involvement because of people like you shining a light along the way.
• 23:50
  But the pioneers, maybe in some ways, were Michel Mouton and Fabrizia Pons in the 80s in their factory Audi.
• 23:59
  Molly Taylor looks up to them.
• 24:01
  And I know you've had the chance to work with Fabrizia and even kind of compare injury notes, haven't you?
• 24:07
  Yeah, I mean, those women are incredible and they've always been someone that you look up to.
• 24:12
  How can you not?
• 24:13
  I think even many guys look up to those two women.
• 24:16
  And I've been so lucky that Molly and I have had the opportunity to work with these women.
• 24:23
  Molly and I both went to Qatar.
• 24:25
  I was among the eight best female co-drivers in the world and Molly was among the eight best drivers in the world in females.
• 24:32
  And so we went and this was all organised.
• 24:34
  You know, Michelle put it all together because of her role in the FIA.
• 24:38
  And then when we were there, Fabrizia was training us and Yuta Clinesmith, who's one, I think she's the only woman to ever win Dakar.
• 24:45
  And so they were our trainers and mentors.
• 24:47
  And what an incredible experience for seven days for us, 16 women that are inspiring to be just like those women.
• 24:56
  And you get sent away because of an opportunity you were given through the FIA to learn and train with people that you grew up, you know, bowing to.
• 25:06
  So that's been incredible.
• 25:08
  And like Fabrizia and I, we message on WhatsApp quite often.
• 25:11
  She's still racing.
• 25:12
  She's incredible, you know.
• 25:13
  So last year she broke her collarbone and I broke my collarbone in a mountain biking accident, not rallying, but she's.
• 25:20
  She had a rallying accident last year and she contacted me straight away to find out about my carbon fiber brace that I had made for me to be able to get back rallying as quickly as I could, rather than the prescribed amount of time I was told to sit out.
• 25:36
  It blew my mind that she could be the age she is and still so passionate and willing to jump back in a car when you've just had surgery and an injury like that.
• 25:45
  So it made me realise that, you know, I'm now 40 years old and she's close to 30 years older than me and she's still that passionate about it that she's getting a brace made to get back and rally.
• 25:57
  I think any young girl, if they're into motorsport, I hope that their parents show them those, you know, videos of Michelle and Fabrizio all those years back and what they were able to achieve in the World Rally Championship against the guys.
• 26:10
  I may have just had a little message go into my DMs here from one Alex Gelsimino, your husband.
• 26:18
  He says to ask you about the clavicle incident.
• 26:23
  Is there a story?
• 26:24
  Is there a backstory about the mountain bike crash?
• 26:26
  What happened?
• 26:27
  It was so embarrassing though.
• 26:29
  I mean, I say it's a mountain biking incident and this is why it's so embarrassing because I think I live my life with pretty little fear.
• 26:38
  I mean, I went skydiving with Travis Pastrano.
• 26:40
  Who's dumb enough to do that?
• 26:42
  And so Alex and I, there's in Boise, Idaho, where we live, there's this thing called the Greenbelt and it's just a tarmac road that runs next to the river.
• 26:52
  It's flat.
• 26:53
  It's very basic and gentle.
• 26:55
  It's not mountain biking.
• 26:56
  So Alex and I buy these two new mountain bikes.
• 27:00
  They've got the wide fat tires.
• 27:01
  They've got the wider handlebars and we're going to go mountain biking.
• 27:05
  So anyway, we decide that we should just test them out on the green belt first because we're getting, you know, you're setting them up and all those sort of things.
• 27:13
  So we tell people that we're mountain biking, but it's a complete lie.
• 27:17
  And so Alex is riding in front, I'm behind, and this really cool little kid's bike goes past, like a little road bike sort of thing.
• 27:25
  And Alex says something to me and I can't really understand him.
• 27:28
  So I ride my bike up next to Alex and we hit handlebars and,
• 27:33
  And I go flying off my bike and break my collarbone.
• 27:36
  And everyone got the story that we were mountain biking, so they think we're downhill mountain biking.
• 27:41
  Oh, those two are crazy.
• 27:43
  The reality is we were on a casual ride and we hit handlebars and
• 27:48
  And so then I'm laying on the ground and I said, Alex, I've broken my collarbone.
• 27:52
  And he's like looking at me and he's like, get up.
• 27:54
  And I'm like, no, I've broken my collarbone.
• 27:56
  And he doesn't believe me and I'm holding my collarbone.
• 27:58
  So he grabs my shoulders to lift me up and I scream.
• 28:02
  And then I lift my hand off and he can see my bone in my skin.
• 28:05
  And he's like, he's like, oh, no.
• 28:08
  Broken in four places, a plate and eight screws later.
• 28:10
  And all we were doing was a nice casual ride.
• 28:26
  If you ever need someone to teach your kids PE, call Rhiannon.
• 28:30
  If you ever need a hairdresser, call Rhiannon.
• 28:34
  If you ever need a great co-driver, call Rhiannon.
• 28:37
  If you ever need someone to ride mountain bikes with, don't call Rhiannon.
• 28:43
  I want to pick up with the whole notion of learning pace notes here as the co-driving really began to be a serious pursuit for you.
• 28:54
  How did you learn about that?
• 28:55
  Because you teach it now, but how did you learn about that back then?
• 28:58
  Who helped you with that and how easy was it to adapt to?
• 29:02
  Yeah, so back when Brendo and I were learning, it was a lot of us just teaching each other what we thought would work for us.
• 29:09
  So Brendo uses a 1 to 10 system.
• 29:12
  So 10 is his fastest number and a 1 would be a hairpin, for example.
• 29:16
  So we were just teaching each other.
• 29:18
  And then we started driving for Les Walkden from Tasmania for the people who've heard of him and
• 29:23
  And Les was great for, you know, bringing up young rally drivers and supporting them.
• 29:27
  He also supported Eli Evans and things like that.
• 29:31
  So when we started working with Les, one of the people he had worked with was Cody Crocker.
• 29:36
  And so he decided that it was important for Cody to come in and work with Brenda and I.
• 29:41
  So Cody come up.
• 29:42
  We have a 1.8 kilometre test track at our farm in Wedderburn and it's a beautiful rally stage.
• 29:48
  And so Cody come up for a day, Brenda was getting in left hand drive.
• 29:52
  So he had to learn that.
• 29:53
  And also we needed to learn some more ideas with pace noting.
• 29:57
  So we did a lot of work with Cody on that.
• 29:59
  And then the other person who Les got us to work with was Ed Odinski.
• 30:03
  So those two guys were really crucial for Brenda and I, 2007, 2008, when we were, you know, just, Brenda was only 18, 19, we're getting into the Australian Championship.
• 30:15
  new brother and sister that is just learning as they go.
• 30:19
  Like I said, dad didn't know much about pace notes.
• 30:22
  So those guys definitely had a huge influence on us at those times.
• 30:27
  And then when we got to the WRC, we were lucky that Chris Atkinson was doing some rallies.
• 30:31
  And
• 30:32
  He was a 1 to 10 system like Brendo as well.
• 30:34
  So I remember at WRC Finland, we met with Chris and also did some work with him on ideas and suggestions for our pace notes in that event and, you know, moving forward.
• 30:45
  We've got to get Cody on the podcast because he's been a multiple Australian champion.
• 30:49
  He's been successful in the Asia Pacific and so on.
• 30:52
  It's great that you rattle off those names.
• 30:54
  I mean, even Chris, who's been a recent guest on the podcast, but Ed, Cody, that period for the Australian Championship, there were some good names in it, wasn't there?
• 31:03
  Yeah, great names.
• 31:04
  And I think Ed may have been a PE, not a PE teacher, but maybe a teacher at some stage too.
• 31:09
  I can't remember.
• 31:10
  But
• 31:10
  I remember he come to Ballarat and Brendo and I did the two days of training with Ed and he was so great with feedback and all those things.
• 31:18
  I've still got the actual feedback sheet he wrote after our training because to me it was such a crucial point in our rallying to work with Ed and be in the car with him for two days and, you know, just driving around roads around Ballarat.
• 31:33
  And just learning from his wealth and knowledge to Brendo and I was an inspiration, you know what I mean?
• 31:39
  And he messaged me the other day when I'd won the championship here.
• 31:43
  And I thought to myself, it's going to be important I actually send him a message and say, hey, thanks.
• 31:48
  You know, you played a part in this all those years ago when we went and did the training with you.
• 31:52
  And the things that we learn in those two days, I've held on.
• 31:55
  And like I say, I still have, you know, his debrief points on my laptop today.
• 32:01
  So did it come easily?
• 32:02
  And your brother and sister, you're driving and co-driving together.
• 32:06
  Was there any bickering?
• 32:08
  Did things not gel straight away?
• 32:10
  How did you go?
• 32:11
  The funniest part is I don't know if Brendo can remember, but I don't ever remember actually ever having an argument in our time at all, which is pretty amazing for a brother and sister.
• 32:21
  Nathan and I definitely didn't work, you know,
• 32:24
  I think maybe because we're only two years apart, there was that clash growing up that you're a brother and sister that bicker and fight.
• 32:30
  Whereas with Brendo, because we never had that, I feel like, you know, when we started rallying, yes, we were brother and sister, but we'd become more friends than anything else.
• 32:39
  So it meant that we didn't have those challenges that most brothers and sisters would have of,
• 32:43
  no, you need to listen to me or vice versa.
• 32:46
  I think the other important thing is we virtually started rallying at the same time.
• 32:50
  So it wasn't like one of us had more experience than the other.
• 32:54
  At the end of the day, we started both in 2005 and worked with separate people before we come together.
• 33:00
  And I think that that meant there was never a challenge of one or the other thinking that they knew more than each other.
• 33:06
  What was the car early on that you guys were competing in together?
• 33:08
  And tell us a bit more about it.
• 33:10
  In 2007, we were with Les in the Australian Rally Championship in a Subaru STI.
• 33:16
  And then we come back in for a full attack for the Australian Rally Championship in 2013 and 14 in a little Mazda, run by Rally School Australia.
• 33:26
  And, you know, Scott Petter, Eli Evans were our two main competitors at those times.
• 33:31
  And it was great.
• 33:32
  You know, 2013, Brenda and I were doing the Australian Rally Championship and the American Rally Championship.
• 33:38
  So it was incredible times.
• 33:39
  We'd just come off two years in the Junior World Rally Championship.
• 33:43
  And in 2014, we had our best attack at the Australian Rally Championship.
• 33:47
  And we got to the last round and we were either leading by a point or a draw.
• 33:51
  can't remember today and our brakes failed on us and Scott Peddle won the championship and it was so close.
• 33:55
  I remember that we were, you know, it was within a point anyway and it was just great times and Scott and Brendo and I and Dale Moskett, we had a fantastic time, the four of us, you know, you know, we were going to be a part of it.
• 34:01
  And, you know, we were going to be a part of it.
• 34:03
  And, you know, we were going to be a part of it.
• 34:05
  And, you know, we were going to be a part of it.
• 34:07
  And, you know, we were going to be a part of it.
• 34:08
  And, you know, we were going to be a part of it.
• 34:09
  And, you know, we were going to be a part of it.
• 34:10
  And, you know, we were going to be a part of it.
• 34:12
  And, you know, we were going to be a part of it.
• 34:13
  And, you know, we were going to be a part of
• 34:15
  At the end of the day, some of these guys competed against our dad as well.
• 34:19
  So dad must have been like, I don't know, in his 30s.
• 34:22
  Scott was the young hot shot coming up and dad was older.
• 34:25
  And so for us to go race those guys was pretty amazing.
• 34:28
  There has been injuries too, Rhiannon, hasn't there?
• 34:31
  So let's talk firstly about the one that nearly left you in a wheelchair where you more or less had to learn to walk again.
• 34:39
  Yeah.
• 34:40
  If you're okay with it, step us through the crash.
• 34:42
  What happened where you were and yeah.
• 34:47
  I mean, you know the sport's dangerous and you know the risk you're putting yourself in.
• 34:51
  I mean, you're racing through trees that are lined on a gravel road, you know, at 200 kilometres per hour and you're relying on the fact that you're calling notes and the driver has to drive accordingly.
• 35:03
  So you know the risk but at the same time I think,
• 35:07
  I shouldn't say you never think it'll happen to you, but I guess that's the way you sort of go about it.
• 35:12
  And it was 2009.
• 35:15
  Brendo and I had raced a lot together by that stage.
• 35:18
  And we'd done a few rounds of the South Australian Rally Championship that year in New South Wales as well from memory in a rally school Subaru STI that Mick Ryan had been loaning to us.
• 35:29
  So Brendo and I had been doing bits and pieces and we went to the Australian Rally Championship in South Australia and we just entered the state part of it, not the Australian Rally Championship part.
• 35:39
  We're winning the state part, final stage of the rally one kilometre to go.
• 35:45
  And there was a jump that we obviously, we knew was gonna be a jump, but did we realize how big a jump?
• 35:51
  I don't think so.
• 35:52
  Brenda and I have no recollection of the crash at all.
• 35:55
  We don't, I mean, I can remember parts of that day.
• 35:59
  I know that our exhaust fell off and we were dealing with something like that, but neither of us remember what happened, but we had a serious crash over a jump, which we had marked as like something like a nine leftover jump, which is flat out 180 kilometers per hour.
• 36:14
  and jumped into trees and stumps and all of those crazy things.
• 36:19
  And then I woke up in hospital and the first person I see in front of me is actually Sue Evans and Jack Monkhouse and Simon Evans and Coral Taylor and all these people.
• 36:29
  And I'm like in hospital and I'm like, oh, I don't know what's happened here.
• 36:33
  And I just woke up after 11 hours of surgery and unfortunately I'd broken both my femurs right and left in two spots already.
• 36:41
  my right tibia and fibula in two spots, my left heel, my left foot had been hanging off.
• 36:48
  It was, I was a mess.
• 36:49
  And then to make it worse, after three hours, I got, I told the doctors, like, I kept saying my right leg is really bad and they were saying, well, of course it's bad.
• 36:59
  You've got, you know, your femur's broke, your right, every bone's broke, like sort of thing, you know, your big bones.
• 37:05
  And I said, no, this is something more severe.
• 37:07
  And so they took me in and I had compartment syndrome.
• 37:10
  So...
• 37:11
  That was another three hours of surgery and I was meant to be flying to Malaysia.
• 37:16
  That was on a Sunday and I guess I woke up on the Monday.
• 37:18
  I was meant to be flying to Malaysia on the Friday for the Asia Pacific with Emma Gilmore from New Zealand.
• 37:24
  And I said to Dad, how am I getting to Malaysia?
• 37:26
  And he was like, okay, looks like she's going to keep racing.
• 37:31
  And so the next day, I don't know, I think maybe Coral Taylor helped him, I'm not sure.
• 37:36
  Anyway, he turned up with a carbon fibre stillo helmet and sat it in my hospital room.
• 37:41
  And this is in Adelaide.
• 37:43
  I think it was the Royal Adelaide Hospital, I think it was called.
• 37:45
  And he sat it there and it was like, okay, she knows she wants to keep racing.
• 37:49
  And I'll put this beautiful new helmet here as her motivation for that.
• 37:53
  But like just...
• 37:54
  I mean, it makes you realize how lucky we are for safety because hands devices, for example, my hands device had had a crack across the back of it.
• 38:03
  So, I mean, I would have broke my neck at 100% saved my life that day.
• 38:08
  And when people started complaining about, oh, we don't want to use hands devices and we don't want to do this and that.
• 38:14
  And for me who I 100% believe it saved my life that day, you know, I just couldn't believe that people would be so anti all the safety that we had.
• 38:24
  And, yeah, but my brother luckily, well, he fractured his neck in three places.
• 38:30
  But I have a funny story about this.
• 38:32
  And it was a terrible time.
• 38:34
  But at the same time, I don't know if he told you this, but when he was recovering, he wakes up and he's, let's just say his boy parts were a bit sore.
• 38:44
  The crutch strap had somehow ripped a hole in his ball bag.
• 38:52
  And he had to get stitches.
• 38:54
  And so the poor kid wakes up.
• 38:56
  I think he must have been 19 or 20.
• 38:59
  He was young.
• 39:00
  And so he says to Dad, I'm really sore down there.
• 39:03
  And Dad's like, yeah, mate, you had to get stitches down there.
• 39:06
  And he was just mortified that, like, he couldn't remember anything that happened.
• 39:11
  And also someone had to go down there and put stitches, you know, and I was like,
• 39:15
  broken and sore and I keep laughing because dad's told me this story and brendo's like this is not funny and I'm like this is funny he says that may have been um aided by some happy gas I think there was some funny happy gas combos that the peer review had I want to get to though uh do you still
• 39:35
  kind of bear the scars from that?
• 39:36
  Like, are there things that give you grief to this day from that crash?
• 39:40
  And how did you, because you are so determined, you kind of had to learn to walk again, didn't you?
• 39:46
  Yeah, so I, it's pretty crazy, but I live with a broken fibula.
• 39:50
  So...
• 39:51
  And when they did the surgeries, they put a rod through both my femurs and a rod through my tibia, but they left my right fibula broken.
• 39:58
  Alex tells people a shark bit me, or he'll tell people a crocodile bit me, or, you know, I've got a big dent in my leg, let's just say, because your fibula is a non-weight-bearing bone.
• 40:08
  So technically you can live your life with it broken, but ideally you want it fixed.
• 40:13
  So 12 weeks...
• 40:16
  It was before I could attempt to get out of the wheelchair.
• 40:20
  And when you've like I was tiny, I was like 40 something kilos and all the muscle dystrophy and everything that's obviously happened because you're just laying in a bed, you know, you lose all your muscles and and things like that.
• 40:32
  So I remember the doctor gave me all the the all clear.
• 40:36
  It was 12 or 14 weeks after I don't remember to start trying to walk.
• 40:40
  And they got me back to Ballarat by that stage because that's where I was living.
• 40:44
  And I remember I'm in rehab and they've got the handrails and that that you need to use to...
• 40:51
  learn to walk.
• 40:52
  And I was thinking, I don't need them.
• 40:54
  I know how to walk because my mind was like all the plaster's off, all the stitches are out.
• 41:00
  I like, I don't understand why I need to learn to walk.
• 41:03
  You know what I mean?
• 41:03
  I didn't understand that.
• 41:05
  And all of a sudden I go to stand up and I don't hold onto the rails and I fell flat on my face and the rehab people are like, what are you doing?
• 41:14
  And I'm like, well, why won't my legs move?
• 41:17
  Like, and they're like,
• 41:19
  you need to learn to walk again.
• 41:21
  Like, and my mind just couldn't figure that out.
• 41:25
  Finally, I got to go into school where I was a PE teacher and see the kids, that was great.
• 41:30
  They had a big assembly and there was lots of tears from the kids because they thought that I was permanently in a wheelchair and I'm like, I'm not, it's fine.
• 41:39
  So, but yeah, so then I finally got back on crutches.
• 41:43
  The doctors gave me permission to go back to school maybe, I think it was 20 weeks after my crash.
• 41:50
  And they're like, you're not allowed to be PE teaching.
• 41:52
  Well, what was I doing the first thing on my crutches PE teaching?
• 41:54
  I thought it was great.
• 41:56
  And then it was six months later after the initial crash that I was back in a rally car.
• 42:02
  Amazing.
• 42:02
  No trepidation.
• 42:04
  And, you know, like if you kind of fast forward 12 months on from the accident, you were back significantly too.
• 42:10
  Yeah, I mean, like the doctors told me I could never run.
• 42:13
  They told me all these strict things because obviously I had this broken fibula that I was living with and I'd had all these injuries and I had compartment syndrome.
• 42:22
  I think it was 11 surgeries or something I've had altogether.
• 42:25
  It's been crazy because it wasn't just those initial surgeries.
• 42:28
  I had to go back and have more surgeries.
• 42:31
  I had to get out the rods because if I was going to continue racing, there were risks to stay in my legs.
• 42:36
  When I come back that six months later, Brenda and I did a
• 42:40
  Tarmac rally in Tasmania in, I think it was Les's, yeah, Les walked in Subaru STI and we come second overall.
• 42:47
  Only Steve Glennie beat us.
• 42:49
  And it was incredible because my family, obviously, my family was 100% behind me.
• 42:54
  They just said, if you are not okay, Brendo stops immediately.
• 42:58
  You know what I mean?
• 42:59
  Like, just say, okay, I'm not okay.
• 43:01
  Like, if you're not coping or anything, and I remember 5, 4, 3, 2, 1 and go and that...
• 43:06
  feeling come back and the fear was gone.
• 43:09
  And I just realized that this is what I love and this is what I have to do.
• 43:13
  And, you know, that was 2010.
• 43:15
  I got back in the car, then end of 2010, Brendo and I had had a great year.
• 43:20
  We'd won the Pacific Cup in the Asia Pacific Championship.
• 43:24
  And we went off to Spain because he was selected as a Pirelli Star driver for the Asia Pacific region.
• 43:30
  And so off to Spain, we went and Brendo actually, out of 16 kids chosen from all over the world, he wins the shootout for the Pirelli Star driver.
• 43:39
  that shoots us into the Junior World Championship the next year.
• 43:43
  So we went from the lowest low of, you know, me, you know, nearly dying to the highest high of our career when we're these two little Australians from country Victoria that go there and work our butts off and we win this shootout, which to us was just an opportunity that we couldn't have afforded.
• 44:03
  So by winning it meant that we got to
• 44:05
  you know, do six rounds of the world championship the next year in the juniors for free.
• 44:09
  So it was incredible.
• 44:16
  That's the end of part one of my podcast with Aussie co-driver turned American champion Rhiannon Gelsimino.
• 44:22
  If you'd like to continue listening to our conversation, you can jump back to the Rusty's Garage Library and hit the start button on part two.
• 44:29
  It's all there.
• 44:30
  Good to go right now.
• 44:32
  Surviving a fiery crash, telling Travis Pastrana where to go and teaching the art of co-driving.
• 44:39
  Plus a whole lot more.
• 44:45
  Listener.