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Would John F. Kennedy Have Been In The Epstein Files? · Politix

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  I would love to see the members of Congress who are complaining
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  about this try to
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  SPEAKER_02: get together with some people,
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  SPEAKER_02: try to stop this from happening.
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  SPEAKER_02: Like, let's do it.
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  SPEAKER_02: Like, let's let's have a nice, like unifying battle about this.
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  SPEAKER_00: I have totally come around to this and like would participate myself.
• 0:22
  Hey everyone,
• 0:22
  you're listening to a free preview of the Politics Podcast.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_00: This week, it's ice-cold Epstein winter.
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  Donald Trump ate up several weeks and caused tons of damage as
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  he sought to delay
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  SPEAKER_00: further production of the Epstein files.
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  But now,
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  the files,
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  or millions of them anyway,
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  are right back in the news.
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  What have we learned,
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  and what's our recourse to end the ongoing cover-up?
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_00: Then, is Trump really going to demolish the Kennedy Center?
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_00: After witnessing the backlash to the demolition of the East Wing,
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_00: will anyone try in earnest to stop him?
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: If you want to listen to the whole conversation,
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: you can upgrade your subscription to paid at politics.fm.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_00: Hey everyone, welcome to the Politics Podcast.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Brian Boyler.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Matthew Glacius.
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  SPEAKER_00: And we're going to talk about Jeffrey Epstein again, finally.
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  And I don't know if it makes sense to just check off a few
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  other ancillary things
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  SPEAKER_00: that are in the news and important,
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  SPEAKER_00: but that we're just going to gloss over because of all the Epstein news.
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  SPEAKER_00: Like, there was the special election in...
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  SPEAKER_00: The suburbs of Fort Worth, Texas that went really well.
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  Everything that happens is Trump trying to distract from the
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  Epstein files.
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  He deliberately tanked a special election in the northern
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  suburbs of Fort Worth
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  just so that we would talk about this guy's like because of the
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  way the Texas
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  SPEAKER_02: legislature works,
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  SPEAKER_02: like I feel like this guy's actually not going to be seated.
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  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
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  because they're in session so rarely and the upcoming midterms
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  are in a few months.
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  SPEAKER_02: So the whole thing is an Epstein distraction.
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  SPEAKER_00: That's a great theory.
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  SPEAKER_00: That's a great theory.
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  SPEAKER_00: Here's the thing though.
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  You know,
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  when Conor Lamb won his race,
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  I think,
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  you know,
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  he swung it 20-ish points.
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  SPEAKER_00: The district swung 20-ish points back in 2018.
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  Enough to give him like a half a point victory or a one point
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  victory is really close.
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: And so then it was like a nail biter.
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  Is he going to win when it's not a special election and it's
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  just the regular 2018 midterms?
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  SPEAKER_00: And the answer is yes, he did.
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  The swing in this- And then he ran for Senate and progressives
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  rallied behind John
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  SPEAKER_02: Fetterman to defeat him.
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  SPEAKER_00: Rallied behind the moderate John Fetterman.
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  SPEAKER_02: Their greatest victory.
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  SPEAKER_00: But in this Texas state Senate race-
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  SPEAKER_00: The district swung 31 points.
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  So if they're going to – if the Texas Republicans are going to
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  try to win the seat
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  SPEAKER_00: back in the general election,
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  SPEAKER_00: it's not like they have to win back a half a point like in the Conor Lamb
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  SPEAKER_00: situation.
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  SPEAKER_00: They have to win back like – he won in a landslide.
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  It's hard even when you adjust for turnout to make up that much
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  lost ground,
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  I feel like.
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  SPEAKER_02: He did great.
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  SPEAKER_00: He did great.
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  SPEAKER_02: It seemed like, well, whatever.
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  SPEAKER_02: It seemed like there were some problems on the Republican side there.
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  SPEAKER_02: Some bitter internal factional divisions that I don't totally understand.
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  SPEAKER_02: Also, their Republican candidate had a very strange name.
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  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_02: Like Wambigans or something.
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: This is the name of the family from whatever.
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  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_02: I have a weird name so I can say it.
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  SPEAKER_02: It's OK.
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  SPEAKER_02: You don't.
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  SPEAKER_02: This is not this is not what people want in politics.
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  SPEAKER_02: You want easy to pronounce names.
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  SPEAKER_00: They also want Epstein files gossip.
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  SPEAKER_02: Epstein.
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  SPEAKER_02: Epstein.
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  SPEAKER_02: So we got a new trench of Epstein files.
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  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_02: Which is not,
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  SPEAKER_02: at least according to the Trump administration,
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  SPEAKER_02: part of a scheduled plan to release all of the files in trenches.
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  They just like released some after dragging their feet and not
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  releasing the files
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  SPEAKER_02: they were supposed to release.
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  SPEAKER_02: They released a bunch of files and then they said that they're done.
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: Not.
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: The drop is large in volume.
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  SPEAKER_00: It's about three million documents,
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  SPEAKER_00: I think,
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  but constitutes less than half of the overall material thought
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  to be in the Epstein
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  SPEAKER_00: files.
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  SPEAKER_00: So I feel like they're trying to snow us with the magnitude of the drop.
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  SPEAKER_00: and hide from the fact that it's actually a minority of the files,
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  and assume that we'll all just be impressed with how many
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  documents there are,
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  SPEAKER_00: and that they'll benefit from the sort of haphazard nature.
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  SPEAKER_00: Like,
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  SPEAKER_00: they just kind of drop them on the internet without any kind of...
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  SPEAKER_00: Like,
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  SPEAKER_00: so people have to sift through them themselves and make judgment calls.
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  SPEAKER_00: It's like, what is revelatory evidence versus what is...
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  Some crazy person,
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  you know,
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  sending the FBI a note in an election year about Donald Trump.
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  SPEAKER_02: So they left out this smoking gun where Trump says to Alex Acosta,
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  I would like to put you in the cabinet specifically because you
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  made a sweetheart
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  SPEAKER_02: plea deal with my good friend Jeffrey Epstein,
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  SPEAKER_02: whose crimes I was deeply familiar with.
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  SPEAKER_02: Unfortunately, we got to wait for that.
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  SPEAKER_02: But we got...
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  SPEAKER_02: You know,
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  SPEAKER_02: Larry Summers,
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  SPEAKER_02: I guess,
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  wound up being the main victim of the first set of Epstein file
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  document drops in
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  SPEAKER_02: which,
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  SPEAKER_02: you know,
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  SPEAKER_02: I...
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  It's just like he was revealed to have been doing things that
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  were embarrassing and
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  SPEAKER_02: inappropriate,
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  SPEAKER_02: although not criminal.
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  SPEAKER_02: The version of that for this time,
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  SPEAKER_02: I would say,
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  SPEAKER_02: is Peter Atiyah,
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  SPEAKER_02: or I don't know how to say his name.
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  SPEAKER_02: Atiyah, I believe.
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  SPEAKER_02: Atiyah, who's like a health and longevity influencer who...
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  SPEAKER_02: had written specifically in his book about his deep shame in retrospect,
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  about a time when his then very young son was in the hospital
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  with a serious
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  ailment and his wife was calling him and he stayed in New York
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  City on an important
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  SPEAKER_02: work trip.
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  And in his book,
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  he talks about how,
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  you know,
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  like this was bad and,
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  you know,
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  SPEAKER_02: You need to understand what's most important in life,
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  SPEAKER_02: your family and things like that,
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  SPEAKER_02: not your work.
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  It turns out from some of the correspondence released in these
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  files that the
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  important work trip he had in New York seemed to consist of
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  hanging out with
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  Jeffrey Epstein and joking about how he was going to give him
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  advice on how to live
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  SPEAKER_02: forever for the ladies and
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  SPEAKER_02: And this was, again, this was after the initial Epstein.
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  SPEAKER_00: Wait, did I screw this up?
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  I thought that it revealed that Atiyah wasn't in New York at
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  all,
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  but he was on the island.
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  SPEAKER_00: But maybe I overread.
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  SPEAKER_02: I think that's overreading.
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  SPEAKER_02: I think he was chilling.
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  SPEAKER_02: Anyway, I don't want to libel anyone.
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  SPEAKER_00: Go take care of your dying son.
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  SPEAKER_02: It's in the sweet spot, right?
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  I mean,
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  the sort of,
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  the soft Epstein cover-up theory,
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  right,
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  was that like,
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  Jeffrey Epstein was clearly palling around with a wide range of
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  prominent and
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  SPEAKER_02: influential people.
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  Like very wide ranging,
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  like people who have nothing in particular to do with each
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  other.
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  SPEAKER_02: And that, you know, going through all of this evidence...
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  SPEAKER_02: would be embarrassing to this wide range of influential people.
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  And so that therefore there's like a kind of broad social
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  consensus in the United
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  SPEAKER_02: States of America,
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  SPEAKER_02: you know,
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  SPEAKER_02: elite driven that like we need to somehow hush this up.
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  SPEAKER_02: And the Atea revelations are completely in line with that.
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  SPEAKER_02: You know,
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  SPEAKER_02: like now there's a big question at CBS News as to whether they should...
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  He was one of the people who Barry Weiss recently brought on as
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  part of their new
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  SPEAKER_02: commentators.
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  SPEAKER_02: And now there's a push to say, you know, maybe we should get rid of him.
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  SPEAKER_02: Like, this guy is embarrassing.
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  SPEAKER_02: We saw something similar with Summers at Harvard.
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  Now,
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  like what you're not seeing with any of these people is,
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  right,
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  like the...
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  SPEAKER_02: The fabled,
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  SPEAKER_02: the idea of an Epstein client list,
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  SPEAKER_02: right,
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  or something where these people are going to be confessing to
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  criminal involvement
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  SPEAKER_02: in sex trafficking is not visible in any of these documents.
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  What you're seeing is an unseemly level of social proximity to
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  Jeffrey Epstein and
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  SPEAKER_02: an unseemly level of,
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  SPEAKER_02: you know,
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  SPEAKER_02: an awareness that he's up to
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  SPEAKER_02: something sketchy and people wanting to hang out with him.
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  SPEAKER_02: I would say not despite that, but because of it.
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  Um,
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  and,
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  and you really see that with Elon Musk,
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  um,
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  and,
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  and his appearance in these files.
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
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  SPEAKER_00: I feel like we're maybe like even a half step closer to the,
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  SPEAKER_00: to the darker conspiracy because like prior to the sweetheart deal,
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  SPEAKER_00: uh,
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  SPEAKER_00: The prosecutors working the first steps of the investigation,
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  SPEAKER_00: I think they were intent to really go after him.
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  SPEAKER_00: And they drafted an indictment that included co-conspirators, I think.
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  SPEAKER_00: And that draft is out now, but all the names are redacted.
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  SPEAKER_00: So we don't totally know.
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  SPEAKER_00: what that means, right?
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  SPEAKER_00: Like,
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  like were these sort of Penny Annie co-conspirators who didn't
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  fully realize what
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  SPEAKER_00: they were up to,
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  SPEAKER_00: or maybe they were acting under duress or were they people that like,
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  SPEAKER_00: or was it really just like Jeffrey Epstein,
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  SPEAKER_00: Glenn Maxwell,
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  SPEAKER_00: then Prince Andrew and that's it.
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  SPEAKER_00: And, and, and nobody else got girls traffic to them.
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  SPEAKER_00: Like the, the way that,
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  SPEAKER_00: Like,
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  even the way Epstein joked with Musk or communicated with Musk
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  is indicative of
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  SPEAKER_00: some kind of,
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  SPEAKER_00: like,
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  SPEAKER_00: you know,
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  SPEAKER_00: he's trying to test Musk's interest in the kind of stuff that he's into,
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  SPEAKER_00: right?
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  Like,
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  in September of 2013,
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  Epstein contacted Musk about plans that he had
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  SPEAKER_00: around the time of the United Nations General Assembly in New York.
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  SPEAKER_00: And so he's like, do you have any plans for New York?
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  The opening of the General Assembly has many interesting people
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  coming to the house.
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  And Musk,
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  because he's a neurodivergent weirdo,
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  didn't realize that this was Epstein's
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  dangling right like like trying to tempt him and he wrote back
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  like i run and lead
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  product design slash engineering for two complicated companies
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  moreover spacex is
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  about to launch what is arguably the most advanced rocket in
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  history flying to ny
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  to see un diplomats do nothing would be an unwise use of time
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  and epstein wrote
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  back the same day he said uh just kidding there was no one over
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  25 and they're all
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  SPEAKER_00: very cute
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  SPEAKER_00: And he was just saying,
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  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to have a sex party with young,
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  maybe underage women to coincide with all the important people
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  being in town at the
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  SPEAKER_00: UN and you should come.
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: And so it's like, is that...
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  SPEAKER_00: this side of the line from the,
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  from the dark conspiracy where there's a client list or is it
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  on the other side?
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  SPEAKER_00: It's like, it's a little bit ambiguous to me.
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  SPEAKER_02: Well,
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  SPEAKER_02: but I mean,
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  SPEAKER_02: again,
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  SPEAKER_02: you see,
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  SPEAKER_02: you see what the,
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  SPEAKER_02: Musk,
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  SPEAKER_02: you know,
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  SPEAKER_02: he's been quite striking an indignant pose about all of this,
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  SPEAKER_02: talking about how he never went to the island.
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  SPEAKER_02: He's always supported the release of all the documents.
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  SPEAKER_02: And you see that like,
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  SPEAKER_02: In the correspondence,
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  SPEAKER_02: it seems like Musk did not go to the island,
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  SPEAKER_02: but there's like,
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  SPEAKER_02: he spends both Thanksgiving and Christmas one year,
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  like emailing Jeffrey Epstein about when can I come to have
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  wild parties on your
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  SPEAKER_02: island?
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  SPEAKER_02: And like Epstein at one point is like,
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  SPEAKER_02: well,
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  SPEAKER_02: you know,
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  SPEAKER_02: like you're welcome to come,
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  SPEAKER_02: but like there's not a wild party happening this week.
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  And another time Epstein seems like he's making an excuse to
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  like disinvite
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  SPEAKER_02: Musk or something.
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  SPEAKER_02: It's like, yeah, maybe I'll see you in New York, something like that.
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  SPEAKER_02: But like clearly something that
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  SPEAKER_02: Elon Musk did was that,
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  SPEAKER_02: you know,
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  SPEAKER_02: as happens with people in the technology industry,
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  he went very quickly from being a kind of obscure guy who had
• 11:59
  made some money off
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_02: of PayPal to being like a well-known person,
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  SPEAKER_02: you know,
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  who's like name people would recognize and started getting
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  invited to new kinds of
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  SPEAKER_02: stuff that obscure rich guys don't get invited to.
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  SPEAKER_02: And he
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  SPEAKER_02: was like, yeah, I've made it in the world.
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  Now I want to get in on these crazy parties that I hear Jeffrey
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  Epstein holds on
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  SPEAKER_02: his secret island.
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  SPEAKER_02: And it seems like he didn't succeed in,
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  SPEAKER_02: at least in the documents that we know,
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  SPEAKER_02: of getting invited there.
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  But,
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  you know,
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  to your point about like,
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  well,
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  there'll be nobody there over 25,
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  right?
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_02: It's like, well, that's not illegal.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_00: It depends on the definition, right?
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_00: It depends what...
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_01: But I just mean,
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_00: as stated...
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_00: You need to know what the floor is,
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_00: not the ceiling.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, but I just mean, like, as stated, it's not illegal.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_02: But similar to,
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_02: the Trump on the record quote with New York Magazine,
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  SPEAKER_02: where he's like,
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
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  SPEAKER_02: Jeffrey Epstein,
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  SPEAKER_02: he's a great guy.
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  He loves to be surrounded by beautiful women,
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  especially on the younger side.
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  SPEAKER_02: Is this like, you know...
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_02: You know,
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_02: you go to court,
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  SPEAKER_02: you take it to trial,
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  and it's like nobody's getting convicted on the basis of that
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  kind of stuff.
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  SPEAKER_02: If you're trying to understand,
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  SPEAKER_02: like,
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  what is the behavior that is going on here in not like
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  pervasively throughout the
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_02: American elite,
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  but throughout a swath of the American elite that enjoyed being
• 13:29
  in Jeffrey
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_02: Epstein's social circle,
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  SPEAKER_02: it's not like these people are saying,
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  SPEAKER_02: you know,
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  SPEAKER_02: I really love Jeffrey Epstein's art collection.
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  And like,
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  I think it's kind of weird that he's constantly partying with
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  barely legal girls.
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  SPEAKER_02: Like, it's the opposite.
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  SPEAKER_02: It's like, that is the draw.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_02: of Epstein.
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  SPEAKER_02: That's what he is known for.
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  SPEAKER_02: That's what Elon Musk is trying to get in on.
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  He's not like,
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  I would love to sit down and have a quiet conversation with
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  you.
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  SPEAKER_02: He's talking about how incredibly busy he is,
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  SPEAKER_02: how he can't waste time on anything,
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  SPEAKER_02: but he would love to go to a wild party.
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  SPEAKER_02: uh, at Epstein's Island.
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  SPEAKER_00: Did you see, did you see his reasoning to excuse all this?
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_00: Those basically like,
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  I am so rich and smart that if I wanted to be at the center of
• 14:21
  a pedophile ring,
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  SPEAKER_00: I wouldn't have needed Jeffrey Epstein's help to do that.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_02: Um, which I don't think is true.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_02: You know, um, this is, uh, you know, a, a challenging, uh, kind of thing.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_00: And Epstein was much handsomer than Elon Musk is.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, that's a fact.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_02: No, I'm not, I'm not going there.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um,
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_02: But, you know, but it's part of the Epstein circuit, right?
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_02: Is that like,
• 14:48
  because Epstein has this wide ranging set of influential
• 14:53
  acquaintances throughout
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_02: the worlds of business,
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_02: politics,
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_02: academia,
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_02: et cetera,
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_02: right?
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_02: It's like the scope of the Epstein circle becomes its own,
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_02: like,
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_02: it's like,
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_02: like,
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_02: why are you going to this party?
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_02: It's like, well, all these other important people.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_02: are going to be there, right?
• 15:13
  It's like self-perpetuating in a way that like it would
• 15:15
  actually be challenging,
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_02: I think,
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_02: to get,
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_02: a sex party circle off the ground all on your own,
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_02: even if you're rich,
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_02: right?
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_02: This is like,
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_02: actually in the realm of like things that are hard to pull off,
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_02: even if you have a lot of money is like,
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_02: what's the,
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_02: what's the social cover for like,
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_02: why are you doing this?
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_02: You know,
• 15:38
  which I think we see in the still not fully explored Bill Gates
• 15:43
  divorce situation
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_02: and other things like that.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_02: But Trump is,
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_02: Does not use email as far as we know.
• 15:53
  Trump is like a like a real I mean,
• 15:56
  not just with regard to Jeffrey Epstein.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_02: But like everything.
• 16:00
  He's like a Tony Soprano level criminal operator who does not
• 16:04
  believe in putting
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_02: anything in writing in his name.
• 16:08
  There's almost no documentary evidence of Donald Trump saying
• 16:12
  anything to anyone at
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_02: any time on any subject.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, that's a sort of important part of the Trump mystique.
• 16:20
  But we do have a lot of,
• 16:23
  you know,
• 16:23
  unverified tips to the FBI,
• 16:26
  some of which name Trump.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_00: So I have a I have a.
• 16:30
  I have two hypotheses about this document dump that pertain to
• 16:35
  partisan politics.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_00: One is that it increases my sense,
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: or I would bet more money now,
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_00: that in the unreleased documents,
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_00: the ones they're still hiding,
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_00: that there is...
• 16:50
  like either smoking gun or like very credible evidence that
• 16:53
  Trump did something
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_00: really,
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_00: really wrong,
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_00: not just hung out with Epstein a lot,
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: but like,
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_00: like,
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_00: used Epstein to procure girls and women.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_00: And it's because of this,
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_00: it's because one is that Todd Blanche's line,
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_00: the deputy attorney general like went on TV and was like,
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_00: it's not a crime to party with Mr.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_00: Epstein,
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_00: which yes,
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_00: like,
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_00: Correct.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_00: But we want to know what else was going on.
• 17:19
  And the the the approach with Trump seems to have been to drop
• 17:26
  much of the evidence
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_00: of all the time they spent together.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: And then also these unsubstantiated and sort of suspiciously timed.
• 17:37
  reports about what trump may have done right so that they can
• 17:40
  say look every time
• 17:41
  an election was coming up people wrote in claiming donald trump
• 17:45
  did all kinds of
• 17:45
  crazy things you can see that some of these people are clearly
• 17:48
  like yanking our
• 17:49
  chains or maybe they're they're mentally ill and we all know
• 17:52
  that trump partied
• 17:52
  with epstein but he's always maintained that he did nothing
• 17:54
  wrong and that's why
• 17:55
  we're going to leave three million documents undisclosed right
• 17:58
  like that tells me
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_00: that
• 17:59
  They pushed out everything that while possibly embarrassing on
• 18:02
  the face of it is
• 18:04
  explicable and not particularly inculpatory and left all that
• 18:09
  stuff in the
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_00: unreleased documents.
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_00: So that's like hypothesis one.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_00: Hypothesis,
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_00: too,
• 18:16
  is that the people who were perpetuating the Republican
• 18:20
  conspiracy version of the
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: Epstein files did so knowing that Epstein's like most.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_00: Epstein's closest,
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_00: the people who communicated with Epstein the most,
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_00: et cetera,
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_00: weren't like evenly divided between Democratic and Republican elites.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_00: Like.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_00: They are they hung a lot on Bill Clinton.
• 18:44
  And then in reality,
• 18:46
  what they got was,
• 18:46
  like,
• 18:46
  Kathy Rumler and maybe,
• 18:50
  like,
• 18:51
  Bill Gates.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_00: But you'd have to,
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_00: like,
• 18:55
  trace way outside the lines to loop in all the various
• 18:59
  Hollywood types and,
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_00: like,
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_00: define those as if they were the same as Democratic Party officials.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_00: But the...
• 19:07
  The right wing associates of Jeffrey Epstein were like Donald
• 19:10
  Trump himself and
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_00: Steve Bannon and Elon Musk and Peter Thiel.
• 19:15
  Like these much of Republican royalty was like in the files in
• 19:20
  a meaningful way.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_00: And so when they were spending,
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 19:24
  2023 and 2024 playing up like the Epstein files is like a
• 19:29
  conspiracy theory where
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_00: it's like a scandal that the Democrats are trying to cover up.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_00: They did so knowing that they were the ones.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_00: Which I find to be,
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_00: like,
• 19:40
  it would be strange if I didn't know that this is sort of how
• 19:45
  our partisan fighting
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_00: goes,
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_00: where Republicans are aggressive on all fronts,
• 19:49
  anticipating that Democrats don't want any part of these kinds
• 19:52
  of rhetorical games,
• 19:54
  and so they can kind of get away with all kinds of false
• 19:58
  accusations about
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_00: Democrats.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_00: I mean...
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_02: You know, we gotta see.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um,
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_02: Republicans have just also like,
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_02: I,
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_02: I was seeing a survey recently and it was like rank and file.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_02: Republicans have just like dramatically higher levels of belief in JFK
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_02: assassination conspiracy theories.
• 20:19
  Uh,
• 20:20
  which like,
• 20:20
  I just like,
• 20:21
  like that's a,
• 20:23
  that's a,
• 20:23
  that's a crying shame to me.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_02: Everybody knows that like right wing Cuban emigres,
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_02: mafia,
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_02: Richard Nixon,
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_02: the military industrial company,
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_02: right wing forces killed JFK,
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_02: our great society hero.
• 20:37
  But,
• 20:38
  you know,
• 20:38
  on an authentic level,
• 20:40
  the Republican base has become like way kookier.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_02: And like more into deranged conspiracy theories.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like it's harder to get people get people going.
• 20:52
  Like I see some people on Twitter trying to like link Epstein
• 20:55
  to Russiagate,
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_02: which it seems like they've got a few good emails to go on.
• 21:00
  But it's like nobody's biting,
• 21:02
  you know,
• 21:02
  like those tweets aren't going viral.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_02: And if you really want to do numbers on social media,
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_02: you've got to be like,
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_02: look,
• 21:11
  Trump's declining immigration enforcement polling in the wake
• 21:14
  of ICE killing two
• 21:15
  people completely discredits Matt Iglesias' commentary about
• 21:19
  Kilmar Garcia back in
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_02: March.
• 21:21
  That's what the resistance wants to read about,
• 21:24
  is extreme public policy opinions.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_02: But, like, I'm, you know, I'm interested in Epstein.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I think it's great.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like in the old resistance,
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_00: like the Krasensteins and Louise Minch,
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: even if Louise Minch still tweets,
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_00: but the,
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_00: like,
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_00: Epstein,
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_00: Trump,
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_00: Russia thing is kind of gurgling.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I do want to say that, like,
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_00: whether there's any kind of grand,
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_00: definable conspiracy that they're onto,
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_00: there is,
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_00: like,
• 21:58
  you do get from reading Epstein's communications with some of
• 22:05
  these rich people
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_00: that rich people around the world really did kind of share a desire to...
• 22:16
  break the rule of law in America in order to make getting rich
• 22:20
  easier for themselves.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: Like,
• 22:22
  that doesn't necessarily mean that they all convened somewhere
• 22:27
  and drew up a plot
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_00: against America that Donald Trump would be the tip of the spear of,
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_00: and then they pulled it off,
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_00: and now we're seeing anti-corruption law going enforced,
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_00: and the United States,
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_00: like,
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_00: saddling up to kleptocrats all over the world.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_00: But, like, they wanted that.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_00: Like, they talk about
• 22:46
  achieving that as if it's like a no-brainer that that's what
• 22:50
  you would want to do.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_00: I'm thinking in particular of a...
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_00: correspondence between Epstein and Peter Thiel,
• 22:58
  where Trump has just done something to sow discord between the
• 23:03
  US and Europe.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_00: And he's like, it's just step one or whatever.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_00: And Peter Thiel's like, of what?
• 23:11
  And he's like,
• 23:12
  shattering alliances and forming new ones and blah,
• 23:15
  blah,
• 23:15
  blah.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_00: And zero interest rates are still too high.
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_00: And how can we...
• 23:21
  exert influence over the global system in order to make it
• 23:25
  easier for us to get richer.
• 23:26
  It was just like,
• 23:27
  that's what they woke up and spent their time thinking a lot
• 23:30
  about.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I don't disagree.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_02: I mean,
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_02: I think there's a world in which,
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 23:37
  you can center your politics on more or less conspiratorial
• 23:44
  readings of the Epstein
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_02: documents and Trump's
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 23:49
  more or less penny-ante and grandiose acts of corruption and
• 23:53
  his pardoning of
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_02: various fraudsters and so on and so forth.
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_02: But,
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_02: this has just always been,
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_02: I think,
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_02: inside the Democratic Party,
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_02: the threat that,
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_02: like,
• 24:05
  all of the institutional forces operate relentlessly to
• 24:10
  mobilize against the risk
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_02: of,
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_02: like,
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_02: de minimis resistance politics.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_02: Where like, you just try to defeat Donald Trump.
• 24:22
  You try to hold Donald Trump accountable for things that Donald
• 24:25
  Trump has done.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_02: You try to reverse egregious things that Donald Trump did.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_02: You try to just like not, you know, and like have the return to normalcy.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_02: The Joe Biden,
• 24:38
  nothing will fundamentally change versus the yearning demands
• 24:42
  for sweeping
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_02: structural public policy reform.
• 24:46
  But I feel like if you are the last best hope for liberal
• 24:50
  democracy in the world,
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_00: that is the Democratic Party,
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_00: and you see the world as this dangerous place.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_02: Not the Canadian Liberal Party?
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_00: What are we doing?
• 25:03
  You see the world as this dangerous place where all these
• 25:06
  wealthy and powerful and
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_00: shadowy forces are aligned on the other side.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_00: And that if you don't play it safe and win every election,
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_00: they're going to take over and dismantle the system.
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_00: So if you really want to protect 80 years of global prosperity and blah,
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_00: blah,
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_00: blah,
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_00: what you do is you is you play the game the way Joe Biden played it.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_00: You play it super safe.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_00: And for me, it's like.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_00: No,
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_00: that's why you released the Epstein files,
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_00: even though it would violate precious norms so that you can show.
• 25:34
  I'm just saying like,
• 25:35
  I just like,
• 25:36
  I disagree that like Joe Biden played it safe.
• 25:38
  Like what Joe Biden did was he sunk his political capital into
• 25:42
  a giant effort to
• 25:43
  transform the American energy system to bring us closer to
• 25:47
  hitting IPCC targets.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_02: He wanted a childcare reform.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it's like he wanted to do progressive public policy.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_02: Like this is what Democrats are doing.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_02: And like,
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 25:59
  I would love for the Democratic Party to be primarily about the
• 26:03
  Epstein files and
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_00: the Kennedy Center.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_00: Like,
• 26:06
  what can they do now then to try to pry the rest of the files
• 26:11
  loose between now and
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_00: next year when presumably they'll control at least one election?
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_00: of the two chambers of Congress.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it seems hard, right?
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_02: But I think,
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_02: I think like rule number one of conspiracy mongering,
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_02: right,
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_02: is that,
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_02: you always have optionality,
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_02: right?
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_02: It's like,
• 26:36
  Do you actually want the files to be released or do you want
• 26:39
  the opportunity to go
• 26:40
  on television and assert that in the files that the Trump
• 26:43
  administration is
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_02: covering up is damning evidence of his guilt?
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like, that's the frame that you want.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_02: ultimately,
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_02: is that the cover-up is a cover-up of a serious crime,
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_02: and you want as many people as possible to believe that.
• 27:04
  Not to believe any specific thing about the procedural
• 27:07
  mechanics around how will
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_02: you get the files released.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_00: See, my fear is that the...
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_00: is that Democrats want the issue rather than, you know what I mean?
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_00: Like the,
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_00: the,
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_00: this is like the common way of putting it when it comes to policy is like
• 27:20
  Republicans didn't want to solve the immigration crisis because
• 27:23
  they wanted the
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_00: issue.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_00: And so right.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_00: And so do you want the issue or do you want resolution?
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 27:27
  And my fear is that part of the reason Democrats want the issue
• 27:33
  and they want
• 27:33
  Republicans to continue to perpetrate the coverup is less
• 27:37
  because they think that
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_00: that makes the
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_00: political value of the Epstein scandal greater,
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_00: although it might,
• 27:45
  than that they don't know what they would do if the files all
• 27:49
  came out tomorrow and
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_00: there was smoking gun evidence that Trump had
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_00: had raped a child.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_00: Like, what would they say and do?
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_00: I think that,
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_00: like,
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_00: there's some risks that they would not know what to do,
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_00: not know what to demand,
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_00: not know,
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_00: like,
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_00: how to conduct themselves in the midst of that revelation,
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_00: and that in the same way that,
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_00: like,
• 28:12
  Republicans are just leaning on time to fog everyone's memories
• 28:18
  of the Alex Preddy
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_00: situation,
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_00: killing and so on,
• 28:21
  that they would just wait it out and expect that humans do what
• 28:26
  humans will do and
• 28:26
  get used to the fact that the president is a pedophile and that
• 28:30
  there's nothing
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_00: that can be done about it.
• 28:32
  And so then,
• 28:33
  now you've shot your shot,
• 28:34
  but you have no...
• 28:36
  And then what,
• 28:37
  right?
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_00: So,
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_00: better to just live in traffic in the world of innuendo and never...
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_02: Well,
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not saying that.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I'm just saying that part of how you get...
• 28:49
  To disclosure on things is you do have to like win the argument
• 28:55
  about about the cover up.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 28:59
  Like you make people you make Republicans in swing districts
• 29:05
  feel that like they
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_02: are having a problem.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 29:10
  in the minds of the voters because the voters believe that the
• 29:15
  Epstein files are
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_02: being covered up because there's a,
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_02: there's a crime in it.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, that was how the initial vote sort of came together.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_02: I mean,
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_02: it was a mix of like real MAGA kooks who were out of their skis on this,
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_02: but like eventually it became a problematic sort of political thing.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that like,
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_00: I think like the way to get at what you're doing,
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_00: you need a sort of like,
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_00: a rhetorical trick to keep this all relevant.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_00: And when they were literally just trying to block this bill,
• 29:49
  you could say that the 218th Republican that could have signed
• 29:53
  that discharge
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_00: petition,
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_00: every Republican who hadn't signed it was the decisive signatory.
• 29:59
  And so they are single-handedly responsible for concealing this
• 30:02
  pedophilia thing.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_00: Now that stuff has come out, but a lot of it's been improperly redacted,
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_00: You just say that,
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_00: like,
• 30:09
  we have to presume that every improper redaction is redacted to
• 30:12
  protect Trump and
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_00: that,
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_00: my opponent is partaking in that cover.
• 30:19
  I mean,
• 30:20
  if also if you control the House a year from now,
• 30:23
  you can start attaching.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_02: You know,
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_02: riders to various things,
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 30:32
  you're going to I think what I think what you really need is a
• 30:34
  private cause of
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_00: action for.
• 30:37
  various people whose interests are affected by the release or
• 30:41
  non-release of the files.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_00: Like,
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_00: I think that that is ultimately what's bedeviling,
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_00: like,
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_00: why Ro Khanna and Tom Massey can't sue,
• 30:50
  and why even certain Epstein victims seem like their hands are
• 30:54
  tied legally,
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_00: except insofar as,
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_00: like,
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_00: their names have been released unredacted.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_00: Is that the legislation didn't give anyone standing.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_00: And that was probably a mistake.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: And,
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: like,
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like,
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_00: somebody like Reid Hoffman,
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_00: who is in the files for sure,
• 31:13
  but is acting like somebody who genuinely feels like they did
• 31:17
  nothing wrong.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_00: And so is, like, being harmed reputationally by innuendo.
• 31:27
  My thinking was somebody like him should just sue,
• 31:29
  say that the cover-up is...
• 31:33
  SPEAKER_00: like increasing my harm day by day,
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_00: because if all the files were released,
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_00: I would be exonerated.
• 31:39
  And so I am suing in order to ensure compliance with this law
• 31:43
  so that the injury will go away.
• 31:45
  And I,
• 31:46
  I don't believe that the law is written that allows him to do
• 31:48
  that.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, he could try, he should try, he's rich, just do it.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_02: I mean,
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_02: I mean,
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_02: that could,
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_02: that could,
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_02: but I mean,
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_02: also this could be a next thing to push for,
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_02: in,
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_02: in legislative battles and to come on in and do it.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_01: But, you know, Trump is going to keep doing things, right?
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's like, there's always a...
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_02: You know, a lot of like, what are we going to do?
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_02: I mean,
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_02: somewhere in between this Epstein files thing,
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_02: it was like,
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_02: how are we going to stop Trump from bombing these boats in the Caribbean?
• 32:26
  And then like that was rendered obsolete by pulling off some
• 32:29
  actual coup in Venezuela.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_02: And then I don't know,
• 32:33
  like we just stopped talking about that whole situation because
• 32:36
  the page has turned
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_02: to Iran and a million other things.
• 32:40
  What's nice about Epstein— Now we're going to talk about the
• 32:43
  Tulsi Gabbard,
• 32:45
  Hugo Chavez ghost slash Fulton County conspiracy that she's
• 32:52
  about to blow wide
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_00: open.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, what happened there?
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, she— I don't understand this story at all.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah, it's crazy.
• 33:01
  The FBI or some federal agency raided Fulton County's election
• 33:05
  offices and seized
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_00: the actual ballots from—
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_00: From 2020 and photographers,
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_00: photojournalists captured Tulsi Gabbard on scene,
• 33:15
  like at the trucks where that where they were hauling all these
• 33:18
  boxes of documents
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_00: and like lurking and being on her phone.
• 33:23
  And like it turns out that Trump essentially told her to be
• 33:26
  there and that she is.
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_00: leading an effort to determine,
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 33:32
  essentially whether like foreign influence in that headquarters
• 33:37
  or whatever.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_00: Cost him the election in Georgia in 2020.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_00: And that ties back into conspiracy theories that Trump,
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_00: played footsie with at the time,
• 33:51
  but that were ultimately deemed too crazy for most of the MAGA
• 33:54
  elite that like,
• 33:56
  um the ghost of hugo chavez had hacked voting machines and
• 34:00
  flipped votes to to
• 34:03
  biden from trump or whatever it's all it's all madness but it's
• 34:06
  like it's very
• 34:07
  concerning because like they're proving that they can just
• 34:09
  muscle their way in and
• 34:10
  commandeer ballots from a past election but you know
• 34:13
  nevertheless and uh um and i
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_00: feel like it's a bad omen for having a
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_00: having a simple, straightforward midterm election in November.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_02: Well,
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_02: I mean,
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_02: it seemed like Tulsi was like getting back,
• 34:29
  SPEAKER_02: back on the team after she'd been on the,
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_02: on the losing.
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah.
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_00: And we don't know if these two things are related,
• 34:36
  SPEAKER_00: but like,
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_00: but like just on Monday,
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_00: the Wall Street Journal reported that,
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_00: her office,
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_00: the ODNI,
• 34:43
  has been sitting on a whistleblower allegation about her since
• 34:47
  May for like eight
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_00: months.
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_00: And that the allegation is so sensitive that it is like –
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_00: is being stored in a safe and they're,
• 34:57
  they're hiding it from the intelligence committee and from the
• 35:00
  gang of eight on
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_00: Capitol Hill.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um,
• 35:03
  and even like the lawyer for the whistleblower doesn't know
• 35:06
  what the actual
• 35:07
  SPEAKER_00: allegation is,
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_00: but just that there's a big coverup going on.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_00: And it could be that it has nothing to do with this Fulton County thing.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_00: Like, like Tulsi Gabbard's weird foreign connections were a problem with,
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_00: Before the 2020 election.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_00: But these things are happening simultaneously.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_00: And I think you're right that as the weeks tick by,
• 35:34
  things that Republicans are doing in that realm are going to
• 35:37
  come to overtake this
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_00: latest flurry of Epstein issues.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_00: Files attention.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_00: And I just think it's like,
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_00: it's good to think creatively about how to keep re-elevating the issue.
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_00: Like,
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_00: um,
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_00: Tom Massey does a good job of it in his own personal politics,
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_00: bringing everything back to Epstein.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_00: And like, I think, uh,
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_00: A,
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 36:01
  playing a hardball in September when it's time to fund the
• 36:05
  government again and not
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_00: funding DOJ unless they comply fully with the Epstein files.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_00: That would be good.
• 36:10
  You know,
• 36:10
  basically just asserting that every improper redaction is
• 36:14
  covering Trump's name.
• 36:15
  It's not a bad idea,
• 36:16
  like,
• 36:18
  in the spirit of,
• 36:18
  like,
• 36:19
  I want to hear the fucker deny it.
• 36:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_02: I mean,
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_02: I just think,
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_02: it's a question of maintaining focus to some extent because,
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 36:28
  Democratic Party politics continues to be roiled by many
• 36:31
  controversies about
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_02: questions of deep substance.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_02: You know,
• 36:35
  so like Matt Duss had a tweet about how the Epstein files is
• 36:40
  part of the pattern of
• 36:41
  elite impunity in America that connects directly to Joe Biden's
• 36:46
  handling of the
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_02: Gaza War.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_02: right?
• 36:48
  Because like Matt Duss is like a single issue anti-Israel
• 36:51
  foreign policy guy and
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_02: like Bernie factionalist.
• 36:55
  SPEAKER_02: So like Epstein's in the news.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_02: So he wants to like pivot that to his issue, right?
• 37:02
  And then I saw somebody else linking it to tax enforcement,
• 37:07
  which is an issue I am into.
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_02: And like, I sort of, you know, I like that pivot.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_02: But, you know, it's like,
• 37:16
  The nature of a good like scandal mongering is like you have to
• 37:21
  focus on the
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_02: scandal that you are trying to monger.
• 37:23
  SPEAKER_02: I agree.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_02: And not other things.
• 37:25
  SPEAKER_02: Here, wait, I want to I want to toss out one Tulsi theory.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_00: And then we should talk about the Kennedy Center.
• 37:33
  Yeah,
• 37:33
  this came to us from Izzy Breen,
• 37:38
  who worked for Ilhan Omar and worked for Keith Ellison.
• 37:43
  But he reminded us of a tweet that he'd put out in the past
• 37:48
  that he said was his
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_02: favorite DC story.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_02: He says, early in my career, I interviewed to be Tulsi's press secretary.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_02: During the interview,
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_02: the chief said,
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_02: quote,
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_02: a big part of your job will be fielding questions about the cult.
• 38:00
  SPEAKER_02: I said, is she in a cult?
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_02: And the chief says, eh, it depends how you define cult.
• 38:08
  So he thinks the Tulsi cover-up is something to do with the
• 38:11
  cult that she may or
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_02: may not be in,
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_02: depending on how you define cult.
• 38:15
  SPEAKER_01: I can believe it.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_02: So we'll see what's up.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_02: We'll see what's up.
• 38:18
  SPEAKER_02: I like that one.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_02: And then I'll just take a break and talk about the Trump Center.
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you had a really good theory about this.
• 38:26
  So if people want to hear about that,
• 38:27
  they can go to politics.fm and upgrade your subscription.