Latest / The Lone Gunman Podcast : JFK Assassination / JFK Assassination - Ep. 264 ~ The Jolliest of Joes

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JFK Assassination - Ep. 264 ~ The Jolliest of Joes · The Lone Gunman Podcast : JFK Assassination

0:08
This josh around free crazy in you we go and here we go. What's
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up? Everybody? Welcome to the show. This is episode number two hundred
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and sixty four, the jolliest of Joe's and that includes my co host here
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today, mister Joe BURRELLI what's up, Hey, what's up buddy? Yeah.
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When I saw the title, I was like, great, this episode
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is going to be all about me. I was so pumped. And yeah
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it wasn't. It's nothing about you. You're you're rarely jolly, you know,
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but tis the season, Joe, So that's that's not true. We'll
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have to get you an ugly, ugly JFK sweater to wear for Christmas.
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Okay, I'll wear it. We can design one, you know. Yeah
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talking about designs, Yeah, which brings us to a point. So if
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you look underneath this here video, you should see hopefully our spreadshirt shop where
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you can cop some merch from the longom And podcast and support the show and
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uh, you know, represent your favorite podcast out there with some very cool
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stuff. And these are the preliminary designs. We've got some really awesome,
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funny things coming if they get there's still pending review, so you know,
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Hopefully in the very near future there will be some excellently cool designs coming Joe,
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yes, sir, maybe even of one of someone falling off a scooter
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most definitely, most definitely. Yeah, and also a Jack Ruby he just
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eat him and stuff a T shirt, hat, hoodie, whatever you want
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to rep so look out for that. Hopefully you see it under the here.
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If not, ah, go check on the main channel page. It
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would definitely be there. Very cool stuff. Yeah, yeah, And I
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want to add that by you know that by supporting us by buying merch It's
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We're not like going on vacation. We have big plans next year, including
3:10
possibly going to different states to interview certain Martins and addition, and you know,
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improving our stream quality microphones, a ton of things, but it's all
3:28
going to go to moving this case forward, trips, getting Big Bad Bob
3:34
to Lancer next year, things like that. Yeah. How cool would it
3:38
be to see the lungom And podcast live at Lancer in Dallas? And you
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know, I think that'd be pretty cool. That would be epic. Definitely
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we could do some more of the Unholy Twinny with Doug and Chuck live.
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I mean, the possibilities are endless, and I think it and I have
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my Chucklelli pen here I'm running with that, says a little Lorenzo Hotel.
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Oh, this one is the one. He's a great guy. He's a
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great guy. So yes, we love Chuck. Yeah, oh man,
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thank you typing chimp much appreciated. Yes, nice to see you in here.
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And we moved it back to eleven for now to one of my girlfriends.
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Uh satisfaction. She likes sleeping in and uh, how old is she?
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Joe seventeen? I mean, come on, we're growing as adults here.
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Get your ass up and out of bed by ten. She's older than
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I am. Put it that way, bless her little heart. Yeah,
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I'm still determining if I got honey dropped or not. But that's tv D.
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Is her name Marina? No, but it ends with the same vowel
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letter close. But notice to go for you, not a J. Martin
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as far as I could tell yet, or J Martina Marina Martin. Tell
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them about this story, okay, So quickly I got a little excited.
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I was looking through, uh some folders for John Martin Thorn, Marina's lawyer,
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and I came across a little ebscerpt about how James Herbert Martin was going
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to be able to open bank accounts for Marina and deposit money and withdraw money,
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and he came up with a solution by opening them in the name of
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Marina Martin, which Marina agreed to do. So, yeah, we have
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another Martin, Marina Martin, it's not a j Martin. Yeah. And
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guess who helped her open that account, mister Rob And we have this document
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in our drop box who mister Harry to the Holmes opened up a he helped
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and yes, to receive donations, but now to receive checks, right,
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it wasn't the bank account, right, Yes, two totally different things.
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Yeah, but also help from Harry Holmes is very interesting. And wonder what
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that po box was under. But Marina Martin is the fact that they'd share
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a bank account name that you know Mark and Martin was promising to divorce his
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wife and be with Marina forever. And I don't know if it was just
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the money grab or yeah, I don't know. Uh, you know,
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when I'll just say this, folks, you're not gonna want to miss our
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James Herbert Martin show because we have some delightful tidbits you have definitely not heard
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anywhere else. We couldn't do it in the Lancer presentation, so stay tuned
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for that. But today we're gonna be focusing on the jolly's of Joe's Jolly
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Joe Martin and a couple other ones, U Joe. Who else are we
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going to touch on? After we hit Jolly Joe here, we're gonna talk
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about a couple DPD officers and uh and the last is a surprise. I
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can't spoil little well now close, But no vodka. I like that.
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Not yet too early for vodka. Sorry, As I said, my coffee
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with vodka. Ah, I thought coffee goes with whiskey. Isn't that like
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an Irish coffee? I've never done. I'm not Irish either, so neither
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am I. I'm obviously Leon. All right, do you see what I
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am seeing, mister robb I do see what you're seeing. Thank you Joe
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for bringing up a beautiful card for Jolly Joe Martin, so folks in the
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in the you pull it down for a second. Joe, I got to
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talk to the people. I want to look at the people. I want
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to see the people every day you're a man of the people. So just
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a little preface, a little backstory, here is how I stumbled across Jolly
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Joe Martin. And it was in the course of reading Jones or Helmet said
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Jones Mellen Joan Mellon's book of Farewell is Justice. And you know, I
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was scanning the appendix or the the index for Jay Martin, Jack Martin stuff,
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because she's pretty much the only author that's really focused on Jack Martin at
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all. But so I'm in the I'm in the index, I'm looking for
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Jack Martin, and I see Jack Martin, and I see Joe Martin,
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and I'm like, Okay, who the hell is that. It's another Jay
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Martin name. I do know that, Excuse me. So I immediately went
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to that chapter and started reading, and what I read I couldn't hardly believe
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it. So with anything else, you know, it for a fantastical story,
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especially one that's told by Thomas Beckham, who is a known teller of
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tall tales, folks, But just because they're fantastical tales doesn't mean that they're
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not true. A lot of people would like for Beckham's tales to be not
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true. So I did a little digging on my own because he asserted that
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this Joe Martin fellow, well, he has sorted a lot of stuff about
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him working for the CIA, getting kidnapped, helping him out when he was
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trying to get away from Garrison's probe in New Orleans. And you know,
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there's little things mentioned in Beckham's story that you could definitely go down rabbit holes
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with. So I did so, all right, Joe, with that being
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said, let's dive down the rabbit hole. Oh, Jolly Joe Martin.
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My favorite thing to do, diving off scooters. No probles. Okay.
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Now, the couple interesting things about Jolly Joe Martin is he was past the
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baton. When Johnny Carson left WOW Radio station in nineteen fifty one, Martin
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had been with the station since nineteen forty eight, and he took over Johnny
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Carson's morning show renamed the five ninety Hour. Martin would spend hours going through
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newspapers seeking show content. Martin's breakfast band segment with sidekick Al Lamb at the
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keyboards, claim fifty three percent of the radio audience. In the early nineteen
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fifties, Joe Martin became the station's major air personality, working hard and doing
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multiple shows. Besides this morning show, he would sometimes host a daily late
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night show, and on weekends hosted Saturday's Breakfast Bandstand at seven thirty am,
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followed by his doing the Town noontime show and as you can see here,
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sponsored by Quick Service Lawnmower Company. You can't make this stuff up, folks.
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Now, not only did he do radio, he also did TV.
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He hosted a daily show on camera called snicker Flickers, where he would do
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funny dialogue and sound effects to go along with old silent movies, you know,
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something like Mystery Science Theater three thousand and This noontime show was aimed at
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the many elementary school kids who went home for lunch and would tune in and
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watch this stuff while they ate their lunch and then went back to school.
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So, you know, this guy was a pretty big deal in Omaha,
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Nebraska, which is kind of like being you know, a big deal and
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Death Valley, California. I mean, I don't know, but we'll see.
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As we'll see, he became a much bigger deal. Yeah yeah,
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I mean this guy was no slouch for sure. So let's get into what
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Beckham had to say. According to Joan Mellon about Jolly Joe Martin. So
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Jack orders Thomas Beckham to go to a safe house and Council Bluffs, Iowa
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and just across the bridge, Iowa being a state where Beckham, like Sandra
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Moffatt, can avoid extradition to Louisiana. To avoid Jim Garrison subpoena, Beckham
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moves back and forth between Omaha, Nebraska, and Iowa. The one person
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who helps is a man named Joe Martin, a dj at Kowh a m
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and Omaha. This Martin is a mild, unassuming man, a right wing
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Republican who began in radio in the forties, like I said, with Johnny
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Carson, and he was selected to compose the theme song for the nineteen sixty
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four Republican National Convention. Wow, it's just a random fact, that's not
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doesn't sound like a thing for a minor guy and Omaha to be doing.
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Huh. Yeah. He was a man of many talents, Joe very talented.
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You know, he could do radio, TV, he could compose music
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and apparently, you know, save people from extradition or not. A lot
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of people at the radio station KOWH had Air Force backgrounds. According to Joe
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Mellon. The majority owner of this station following the untimely passing of its owner
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was William F. Buckley Junior, who you folks may have heard of,
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I think firing line with William F. Buckley Junior, a CIA sponsored journalist,
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if you will, with a very questionable background. Most people don't know
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that William F. Buckley Junior had a brother named Ross and he lived in
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New Orleans in the twelve hundred block of Dauphine Street, the same street as
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clay Shaw. Folks. Ross also participated in the Friday night discussion groups at
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the Writer Coffee House with Carrie Thornland and William Cupper Brady. Together with Brady
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in nineteen sixty two, Ross Buckley organized something called Fair Cuba Committee, not
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Fair Play for Cuba Committee, but Fair Cuba Committee. Yeah. Like I
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said, you can't make this stuff up. These connections just keep going on
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and on. So the station manager is a guy at the time named Mike
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Starr, and from his employees star hearers of secret phone calls to Joe Martin
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and whispered conversations. Martin would disappear with no explanation for hours at a time.
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He is in fact involved in shielding and protecting Garrison witnesses and helping them
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avoid his subpoenas. After he hears from Thomas Beckham, whom he has now
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ordered to shield, Joe Martin confided in Mike's Starr he is running a CIA
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safehouse. He reveals Star a young graduate of the Georgetown School of Law,
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which we'll come into play later. Put a pin in that, who serves
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as a Judge Advocate general at Offit Air Force Base. Raises an eyebrow.
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It sure does, because if you look and the stuff of Thomas Beckham,
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what's that? Joe? Do you want to slide up right now? No?
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Okay, thank you? Just making sure where was I? So?
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If you know anything about Thomas Beckham and his story about fred Lee Christmin,
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He tells of fred Lee Crispin taking him into Offit Air Force Base and getting
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the Grand Tour, being treated like royalty and talking about Project Looking Glass.
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But anyway, back to Beckham at the safe house, Martin says he has
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been recording the stories of those he is shielding on tapes he plans to play
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on the air on KOWH. Mike Starr feels he will lose his SCC license
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over this or be prosecuted, and tells Martin absolutely not. And a little
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while later, well six weeks later, one night, there was a loud
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banging on the door of radio station KOWH and everybody in there but Mike Starr
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and Joe Martin has left for the evening. The porch light's on, and
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through the circular plate glass window, Mike Starr sees two men standing there in
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trench coats. He opens the door a crack and tries to prevent them from
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entering, flashing badges with photo ID cards. They brush past Star and proclaim
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CIA. One of them says CIA. Star says in Omaha now. Meanwhile,
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Joe Martin has bolted from the studio and raced down to the basement fallout
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shelter. In pursuit. The government agents grab him. One clutches his right
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arm, the other is left, and they drag old jolly Joe off into
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the night. Where are you taking him? When will he be back?
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Star ask them, we don't know, one of the men says, and
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they disappear, And when Star telephones, the CIA denies that it has any
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men on the ground in Omaha, Nebraska. Now Beckham believes that one of
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them men must have been Fred Lee Christmin because suddenly there he was. Beckham
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says, I might as well return to New Orleans. I can lie or
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say nothing. Fred says, you might say something you shouldn't say. Smart
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as I am, even though I'm making mistakes. So Beckham returned to New
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Orleans to testify before the Orleans Grand Jury, the Orleans Perish Grand Jury,
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and Christmas sent him one message through Bob Lavender. If I'm subpoenaed as a
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result of anything you say, I'll kill you. So three days after Joe
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Martin disappeared was taken off into the night by the CIA agents, Mike Starr,
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station manager, received a phone call from the psycho psychiatric unit of Saint
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Mary's Hospital. Did he want to pick up Joe Martin? I guess he
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did, And when or arrived, Jolly Joe was cowering in a corner of
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the room, unshaven and disheveled. Martin tried to talk, but could not
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remember anything about the last three days. He would be unable to ever go
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on the air again. According to Joan Mellon, all he would say when
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he finally could speak was that he had been working with somebody who had tried
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to get away from him. So with everything, there's a lot to unpack
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with that little story. While maybe two pages in a book, there's a
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lot of information there that can be verified or unverified. So you know,
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I went checking, did this Mike Star person exist? Yeah? You know,
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is this a real guy? Turns out he's a real guy. Did
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William F. Buckley own that radio station? He did? He did?
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Uh? Did Did William F. Buckley have a brother who lived in New
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Orleans on the Finn Street? He did? And uh? So you know
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there here, here's the graphic of mister Starr right here. Yeah, we'll
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get to him morning in a minute. I just wanted to bring it up
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quickly. Yep, thank you. So. Joan Mellon stated that Jolly Joe
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Martin would never be able to go on the air again. But after some
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checking I found out that Jolly Joe did go on to have a long career
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and managed to be on cage As TV in the seventies and eighties and km
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VT TV in Twin Falls, Idaho and passed away in nineteen ninety five.
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So even the great authors can be wrong, can get stuff wrong. That's
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why it's always good to fact check things, folks. Now, some interesting
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things about this radio station came across it. There was a thing a lightning
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strike happened in June sixty seven that caused enough damage to take the station off
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the air for a few weeks. In August, the Oulers delayed the start
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of a new format planned for September first. After returning to the air,
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the program changes was further delayed until October first, while waiting for new stereo
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tape equipment to arrive. KOWHFM returned to the air with a classical jazz fine
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arts format, and Joe Martin was given an afternoon show called Martin at his
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Best Afternoons one to three that featured poetry readings and interviews with fine arts personalities.
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Sounds thrilling, right, But the interesting thing here is that is that
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John Mellan actually says in a book that during the time that the station was
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off the air due to this lightning strike, that Jolly Joe was playing his
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assassination tapes basically on a very short radio wave, very low signal. So
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maybe if you lived within a couple miles of the station, you got to
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hear some crazy stuff. So there's that. So how reliable is Thomas Beckham,
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that's the question. Well, so far what he's told. John Mellan
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checks out, and in nineteen seventy eight HC and investigators Robert Burris and LJ.
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Delsa received permission for the polygraph of Thomas Edward Beckham. Richard Hunter of
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the New Orleans Police Department and a former partner of Buris, did the polygraph
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at no cost to the committee. Was he being truthful? Buris and Delsa
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asked Hunter as soon as it was over. Delsa had believed Beckham because he
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always made distinctions when he didn't know something. He said, so with liars,
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Delsa had discovered from years in homicide, water swells over the levee without
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control. Beckham says he told Buris and Delsa the truth. So after two
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days of you know, going over the results, Hunter revealed his conclusion.
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He discovered no deception. Asked whether Fredley Christman had conveyed him into secret areas
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where he needed security clearance, Beckham said that he had the machine revealed no
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deception. Did Chrismin bring him on to off at Air Force Base? Beckham
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said yes, and there was no sign of deception. This guy is amazing,
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the hunter said. Despite Beckham's lack of any formal education whatsoever, he
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was a very intelligent man. Now, for those of be out there and
26:27
not familiar with Beckham's story, I don't think he had anything past like a
26:32
fourth or fifth grade education. Beckham resembled no liar Hunter had ever encountered,
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and he was telling the truth Like Oswald. Buris and Delton concluded Beckham had
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been a young, uneducated kid grabbed up by intelligence. Now, the next
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day, on March the tenth, Delson Buris were summoned to Washington by their
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immediate supervisor, Cliff Fenton. They were questioned separately, then charged with conducting
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conducting an unauthorized polygraph examination. They had questioned an important witness with CIA connections,
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Zerring and on Truce that that that the compromised CIA controlled committee cannot tolerate.
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I looked you right in the eye and requested permission for the polygraph brea,
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Burist told Gary Cornwell, did I give you a specific reply? Cornwell
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shot back, would be fair to say that by not replying, why I
27:33
looked right at you, that you took that as TACIT approval. Cornwell denied
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he had ever heard the request for permission to administer a polygraph to Beckham.
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When Delsa supported Buris, Cornwell scanned the horizon very suitable scape yet and this
27:52
came in the form of Jonathan Blackmer. Anyway, there would be no investigation
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by the HSCA into Fredlee Crismin, who had died in seventy five, and
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Buis and Delsa were punished with a two week administrative suspension. Blackmer was also
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suspended, and grudgingly, on March thirteenth, nineteen seventy eight, the committee
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constructed and after the fact paper authorization of the polygraph so that Buis and Delsa
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could be reimbursed for their airfare in bringing Beckham to Louisiana for the polygraph.
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So interesting stuff here, Joe. Yeah, and for those of you are
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not familiar with the story that Beckham told the HSCA, I would highly recommend
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you going and checking it out, because if you think this story is crazy,
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wait till you hear that one from Thomas Beckham. Fredley Cristman was protected
28:52
from the highest levels. Yeah, and the HSCA did not want to hear
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anything that will about what Beckham had to say whatsoever. Yeah, so I
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found this other little tidbit when researching into KOWH Radio. Do you want me
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to bring that up? Rob, Yeah you can, Okay, while Joe
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brings it up, gets it up for a contracted number of weeks. In
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nineteen sixty two, not that Bill Dalzel hosted an hour long show called The
29:45
Cameo Coffee Club, live from the Crossroads Shopping Mall cafeteria at ten am.
29:55
It featured interviews, prizes, free coffee and donuts for shoppers, and fashions.
30:02
Now a lot of you out there are probably thinking, Okay, who
30:07
the hell is Bill Dalzel. Well, I let's just say I recently did
30:21
a deep dive into William Dalzel called Big Man Little Horse a couple episodes ago
30:26
on the Lone Goming podcast. Go back and check it out. But I'm
30:30
gonna tell you all here today a little bit about William Dalzel. So Jack
30:37
Martin, at various times had been associated with William Wayne Dalzel and also w
30:45
Guy Banister, a former Bureau employee who operates a private detective agency in New
30:52
Orleans, Louisiana. William Dalzel claims to be an American Indian native of Oklahoma
31:00
who has been arrested in New Orleans, Louisiana for fraudulent checks and one time
31:07
was accused of stealing a valuable ring from a woman with whom he was living
31:11
with in New York. He was not charged with its offense. Dalzel also
31:17
claimed in the past to be an oil promoter, an independent oil promoter Joe
31:22
working for various oil companies in Arabia and Ethiopia. Now. Dalzel Banister and
31:32
Grady Durham were active in the formation of the Free Voice of Latin America,
31:37
which was formed on December fifth, nineteen sixty to transmit information via shortwave radio
31:42
to the people of Cuba. Durham is possibly identical with a former assistant collector
31:48
of the US IRS in New Orleans, and according to Jack Martin, holds
31:52
the rank of major either in the Louisiana National Guard or the US Army Reserves.
32:01
We did him as colonel, so maybe he got a promotion. Yeah.
32:07
It has been established that Grady Durham is missing from New Orleans and there
32:13
is a criminal charge filed against him for misappropriation of a client's funds. In
32:17
view of the current charge outstanding against Grady Durham. The information supplied by Jack
32:22
Martin regarding the manner in which he disposed of Durham's files will be furnished to
32:28
Jim Garrison, District Attorney of the Parish of Orleans, Orleans now Okay.
32:37
This establishes that Dalzell was from Oklahoma. He had ties with all these colorful
32:44
characters in New Orleans, some anti Castro organizations, and the Free Voice of
32:53
Latin America, which was a shortwave radio operation. But he was also on
33:00
WNE W n OE radio station as a newscaster from November the first, nineteen
33:09
sixty till it says the present. And I'm trying to find when this document
33:19
was January thirty or sixty one. So you've been employed as a newscaster for
33:29
at least a year almost two previously worked as a statewide bail bondsman. And
33:37
I'm not sure if this is the same organization that Hardy Davis worked for as
33:43
a bail bondsman who dropped the dime on Jack Martin, who dropped the dime
33:46
on David Ferry. But if it was, that'd be crazy. So yeah,
34:00
yeah, thank you, John. I think you are the man.
34:05
I think my Uh, there's an apparent front runner in my nickname, Joey
34:12
Scars. Yeah. I was going to put that on my instead of joe
34:16
By. But we're gonna wait till the listeners of quick hits give their opinions
34:22
first. Yeah, I've heard from a lot of people they like they like
34:25
the scars better than scams. He told me that scams are gross scars.
34:32
Yeah. Yeah, and it sounds like Mafio's you know, yeah, Joey
34:37
Joey Joey wounds. No, No, that sounds not like negative Joey scars
34:45
means like you prevailed, You got scars from your battles. Yeah, you
34:50
did something. He did something me. But thank you for the super jet
34:55
John absolutely pray continue, sir. Yes, Now, Dalzel was no slouch.
35:08
Mister Dalzel actually went to Georgetown School of Law, majoring in languages.
35:20
He spoke six of them, and I believe that is where Mike Starr also
35:29
went to university. Right now in nineteen well, in nineteen sixty one,
35:42
here there was a woman. Well let's go back a little bit, sorry,
35:52
going back into the late fifties with William Dalzel. I have here an
35:57
office memorandum to the Director of the FBI from the Special Agent in charge of
36:01
Butte Montana. Now you might remember, folks, the ones out there paying
36:08
attention that god Banister was at one time the Special Agent in charge of Butte
36:14
Montana in the late forties, not at this time. Whether they're looking for
36:20
Billy Wayne Dalzel. They were looking for William Wayne Dalzel for violation of the
36:28
Registration Act, whatever that is. They placed a cover on his mail on
36:37
his wife, who they did track down, but she refused to cooperate with
36:42
them to find her husband. So when they were talking to him, I
36:54
believe, I can't remember what this was for, might have been the the
37:00
Garrison Grand Jury. But they asked Dogzell, what languages do you speak?
37:07
Arabic, Spanish, Italian, Joe, a little bit of Ethiopian, French.
37:15
There's a remarkable variety of languages. Well he spoke six six They didn't
37:22
list them all there. I mean, you gotta include English too, I
37:25
guess yeah. And he was American Indian, so he might have known some
37:35
what do you call them grunts and how he says, I major in languages
37:44
at Georgetown University in Washington, d c. And he was a diplomat in
37:47
foreign relations. When did you finish at Georgetown in nineteen fifty three? Sir?
37:53
Where did you go to work when you finished Georgetown? To Peru,
37:57
South America? For what employers? Independent? Have you ever worked for the
38:02
United States government? I did during what years? Fifty one to fifty three?
38:10
Just those three years? Yes? What kind of work did you do?
38:17
Consulting? So those dates? Yeah, So you know, there's there's
38:30
a lot of speculation that William Dalzel was some kind of a CIA operative in
38:35
New Orleans at the time that you know, Oswald is there, banisters up
38:42
and running and all this other crazy stuff is going on in New Orleans.
38:47
He's there, and it's crazy that he's associated with this radio station you know
38:54
where all this was happening, and you know when to Georgetown where William F.
39:04
Buckley went. And I'm sorry, not William F. Buckley, the
39:08
station manager, Mike Starr. So getting back to the radio station real quick,
39:15
and Joe, you can go ahead and pull up that graphic for the
39:17
book, because we're going to get into Mike Starr a little bit here.
39:31
So William F. Buckley paid in nineteen sixty four eight hundred and twenty two
39:43
thousand dollars for this oh Maha radio station. To me, that's a lot
39:50
of money for a radio one radio station in Omai in nineteen sixty four.
39:57
Yeah, that's crazy. Let's see in nineteen sixty nine sixty nine or Radio
40:15
Free Oprah Omaha sponsored the Grateful Dead appearing at the music Box. The music
40:23
Box was a popular live music venue with the dance floor and a bowling alley
40:28
at one eighteen North nineteenth Street. It closed in nineteen eighty. But again
40:35
you have possible CIA ties with the Grateful Dead and MK Ultra and LSD and
40:46
Jolly Joe getting dosed out of his mind for three days. Yeah, more
40:52
than likely. They took him in a you know, put the Grateful Dead
40:55
on a loop and put about six six squares on his tongue and set him
41:00
in a dark room somewhere for a couple of days. Poor Jolly Joe.
41:09
All right, So let's get into the Star broadcasting group. William F.
41:16
Buckley and Mike Starr and Peter Starr his brother. He had known the Stars
41:24
from growing up in Connecticut. Joe, they live right down the street from
41:30
William F. Buckley and would spend summers working aboard Buckley's sixty two foot sailing
41:35
yacht. Yeah you heard that right, sixty two foot sailing yacht. As
41:44
the years passed and the boys and their boss grew closer, the young men
41:47
even adopted Buckley's conservative political philosophy. When Mike Starr graduated from college, I'm
41:54
sorry. Peter Starr graduated from college in sixty four. He went to work
41:58
as a salesman for an my high radio station owned by Buckley's National Review magazine,
42:02
and in four months he was promoted to manager of the station. In
42:07
nineteen seventy, Buckley BackStar in organizing what rapidly grew into a multimillion dollar communications
42:14
conglomerate called the Star Broadcasting Group. Star, only twenty eight at the time,
42:20
was generally described as brilliant, and Buckley in one of his books,
42:23
set of his partner, I have that special affection for Peter. I reserved
42:29
for people who make me a million dollars. Now Peter Starr is suing Star
42:35
Broadcasting for breach of contract. So in the late seventies, folks William F.
42:43
Buckley screwed over the Star brothers in their business dealings and left them holding
42:51
the bag for millions of dollars and fines to the sec which led Mike Starr
43:01
to write the book that you see here on the right side called What a
43:05
Friend We Hadn't Bill, William F. Buckley's Junior and the Rise, Betrayal,
43:10
Betrayal and Fall of Star Broadcasting. Now, for the sake of time,
43:15
I don't have time to get into this book today, but if you
43:19
want a good read, folks, head to Amazon and find it. Mike
43:24
Starr passed away, I believe it was in twenty fifteen or so, but
43:32
you know, he went to He went on to have a you know,
43:36
a nice long life, but very very still pissed off at William F.
43:42
Buckley many years after the passing of William F. Buckley. It's off,
43:49
it off, you have to write a book about it, And that's pretty
43:53
pissed. Yeah, And you know somebody left me holding them back for means
44:00
and I'd be pissed too. Yeah. So the next one is the mac
44:07
little tidbit there wanting to go to that, yep. And so in the
44:13
course of you know, digging into all this Midwest radio history from the forties
44:20
and fifties and sixties and believe me, it's a long rabbit hole, folks.
44:25
I came across this little tidbit. Of course, the name popped out
44:29
of the page at me when I read it. Gary Mack was on KOI
44:34
L in nineteen sixty five, which was another radio station in Omaha, and
44:39
he went on to become Gary Gears at WLS Chicago. Now, one possibility
44:47
is a young Gary Mack growing up in the Chicago suburbs in the nineteen sixties
44:54
heard Gary Mack on the radio in Chicago and wanted to pay homage to him
45:01
by stealing his moniker when he became a DJ and TV personality in Dallas many
45:08
many years later. So I thought that that was a pretty cool find for
45:16
that, and indeed it is very interesting. Yeah. So I think that's
45:30
about all I have on Jolly Joe there, Jolly Joe. Oh who is
45:38
more jolly jolly Joe Martin or Jolly Joe's Joe Joey scarves? Oh? Hold
45:45
on, I do have one more thing. My bad, my bad,
45:50
Okay. So, in the court at the court of of you know,
45:55
investigating all this stuff, I went down some mafia rabbit hole and there was
46:02
an came across an FBI document regarding the Marcello's and the Vitaris and the Romes
46:15
and the Salvadores and the Trampani's and all kinds of good stuff. But number
46:23
six on their list here of things to do concerning land dealings with Marcello.
46:31
Uh it says, we'll locate in interview William Wayne Dalzel, subject of New
46:36
Orleans case one five DASH one five three, who allegedly relayed an offer from
46:42
Marcello to the New Orleans unit of the Cuba Revolutionary Front for a contribution of
46:46
some two hundred thousand dollars. Bureau Authority granted for the interview with Dalzel per
46:53
Beulay, dated four twenty six sixty one and entitled Carlos Marcello aka Anti Racketeering.
47:02
Now, what's interesting is also on this list is Arnesto Rodriguez, manager
47:09
of the Berlitz School of Languages, who was contacted on twelve nine, nineteen
47:15
sixty. Now this is the guy who claimed to have a tape of Oswald
47:24
discussing the assassination and a Missus Tina Hurlinger world trade development of the International House,
47:34
New Orleans, that kind of the international trademark, that kind of brings
47:38
us back to our last episode and mister Wilford Martin who worked James Wolford Martin
47:46
who worked as the port director at the trademark. So that is interesting.
47:52
Yeah. And lastly, here Joe it says the above sources were contacted by
47:58
special agents Ernest sea Wall Junior. And take a while, guess and who
48:01
the other one is? I'm sorry say that, Yeah, new range FBI
48:10
agents. The above sources were contacted by special agents Ernest sea Wall Junior and
48:15
Warren Debrize ding Ding ding Ding Winter Winter Chicken dinner for Joe Warren c Debris.
48:23
What do I get for sure? No? Free band aid I already
48:31
get free band aids. As we talked about, God bless that Ethiopian front
48:38
desk clerk, the bearer of band aids Ethiopian, because that then would correspond
48:45
with Dozel And speaking of Ethiopian, we might have another connection there. He
48:50
could have sweet talked her. I mean, did you write out of our
48:54
loin cloth or whatever they were over there? Yeah? Yeah, but that
49:01
is a fascinating story, Rob, And that was one of our three Martins
49:07
we decided to focus in on during our condensed Lancer presentation and we had a
49:15
lot of time. Rob had a lot of time figging that into fifteen minutes,
49:19
so I'm glad he was able to expand on that here. It is
49:23
kind of more deep in the weeds, but it is nonetheless and a fascinating
49:30
story, and it deals with players in the assassination, New Orleans, Beckham
49:37
and all the screwy that was going on around then. Yeah, like I
49:40
said, it's a crazy story, but it's definitely one and needed to be
49:45
deep diving on, deep diving on Yeah, deeply dived on. Yes,
49:52
unless you wanted to dive on something like medical evidence for the million Yeames.
49:58
Okay. You know when you get little details like this to the stories and
50:02
you actually go digging in sources that have nothing to do with the Kennedy assassination
50:08
that have never been looked at before. Like I forget what that name of
50:15
that book is called Joe that I found, but somebody wrote a book.
50:19
We thanked them in the credits on the History Omaha Radio and that's actually where
50:30
I got a lot of my information from. So kudos to whoever that guy
50:36
was. You know, if you can write two hundred some pages on the
50:39
history of Omaha, radio. I mean it even went back to Jolly Joe's
50:46
humble beginnings working in a theater on the street and announcing show times through a
50:58
megaphone. That was like his first job ever, you know, like,
51:02
hey, over here, we got Titanic starting at two fifteen. Step right
51:09
up, get your tickets here, you know, uh, those were the
51:16
days. Yeah, I love myself a good Titanic theory. Sorry, that's
51:23
the first movie that popped in my head. So I don't know, why
51:27
what does that say about me? I don't know what does that say about
51:30
me that my girlfriend every time Titanic comes on, I like can't shut it
51:35
off and she thinks that's weird, and probably because she wishes you'd slide away
51:39
like Leo at the end of your story. I was like, why couldn't
51:43
they both fit on that fucking door? You know, they on that door.
51:52
Rose could have saved him. All right, let's let's stop our tom
51:59
foolery and would you like to move on to we got more Martins to get
52:02
into Joey, and let's do it. I figure, yes, sir,
52:09
and I figured since we started with Jolly Joe, we would go to a
52:15
different Joe, and that is mister Billy Joe Martin, which j B J.
52:24
Martin and that n yeah, beautiful picture on the right. And he
52:31
was, of course the motorcycle cop to the back left rear of the JFK
52:37
Lemo, across from Hargus and who was on his right, and Billy Joe
52:44
Martin had blood and brain tissue all over his helmet and uniform and says JFK
52:51
told him not to stay in close formation immediately to the rear of the limo.
52:55
And I think you know all those secret surface JFK is said to keep
53:04
back. All that stuff is very manufactured, in my opinion, says he
53:10
was five feet back and six to eight feet to the rear of the left
53:14
bumper, which would indicate a shot from probably not the back if you know
53:22
anything about trajectories unless there was a huge wind, anything about what trajectories and
53:35
trajectories. Okay, yeah, I said that right. I don't think you
53:38
did the first time. I did the second time though pronunciation pronunciation motherfucker's liberty.
53:49
Oh boy, here we go. And yeah, folks, there is
53:52
a Liberty Liberty shirt in the merch store with the Liberty Lobby logo on it.
53:57
It's pretty sweet. Yeah, so let me get back to this slide
54:01
show that just jumped. I was gonna say, what does everyone have as
54:06
they're over under? For how many times I score up with the power point?
54:10
But how many? Three to one, three to one, three to
54:17
one odds, three to one odds? Well, the issue was that,
54:22
like, sometimes you have to open it and close it for it to like
54:27
not jump. But what are you gonna do? What are you gonna do?
54:32
All right, so we started with the Billy Joe segment that I won't
54:39
bring up right in a second. Here, Billy Joe, it is not
54:45
my lover. Uh, well, while I pull this up, look when
54:55
I acquired Rob Can you see wow, a vintage life magazine? It is
55:02
of Oswalt's full Russian diary from him and Marina. And hold it up one
55:09
more time, Joe, sure, let you know that is a great picture.
55:16
Twelve dollars Marina's perky tits. Oh yes, we need to uh consult
55:29
our boob expert, mister Horney. We'll change change the name of the show
55:36
to the Perkiest of boobs. Yes, yeah, you give me one second
55:43
here, and you know James Herbert loved them things. Oh yes, and
55:49
uh and mister Martin Thorn, which will be both the topic in new episodes.
55:58
But Robin, I also want to talk about how we are going Listen,
56:01
we understand this Martin thing is a lot to take in, so we
56:06
are going to be doing This is a good time to tell them Rob a
56:12
little break, not a break, but another non Martin episode slash interview in
56:17
the coming week, a brief reprieve if you will, yes, a midweek
56:23
surprise for all of you. We'll still be back here next weekend talking Martin
56:29
shit. Don't worry about that, of course, but we'll give you a
56:31
brief reprieve, yes, and if all goes well tomorrow, it'll be a
56:39
very good It won't be a live show because we're actually doing an interview,
56:45
but it will be video and we'll probably plan on putting that out Wednesday.
56:52
But it's definitely wild and wacky, so stay tuned for that. And we
57:00
have some really cool guests in the lineup upcoming after we finished this Martin thing.
57:07
So in the pipeline, baby yes that's what they call it, or
57:13
what big swinging dis h oh boy of the JFK community. Some maybe talking
57:24
about future yes, not my God, all right, we're over on.
57:31
I hear a lot of clicking going on over there. Joe, my screen's
57:36
not sharing yet. New that's a negative negative ghost rider. Well give me
57:44
one second, three two. Well, as we were going through the DPD,
57:53
obviously we just talked about Billy Joe Martin, we came across this this
58:00
file. I believe it's from the HSCA, but we have a screenshotted.
58:05
But there was apparently another motorcycle cycle cop named j D. Martin according to
58:13
key person files on DPD officers in nineteen sixty three. Oh, Jimmy Dennis
58:19
Martin. Was this Billy Joe or just another Martin coincidence, mister rob or
58:27
a typo? But B and D are not really close to each other on
58:30
the well, BJ is far different from j D. I could see if
58:37
it was DJ and they mixed up with JD. But BJ and JD two
58:44
totally different things. So this is probably another guy in the motorcycle division.
58:47
And so we have two Martins. They have little safe stations all over Dallas
58:53
that cover different areas. So two j Martin's in the motorcycle squad of the
59:00
year. Okay, that's definitely coincidence. Jimmy Dennis, Yes, Jimmy Dean.
59:08
All right, next, let's move on to our This is not a
59:14
j. Martin. I'm going to warn you, but it is a Martin,
59:16
and it is Captain Frank M. Martin, and his story looks like
59:22
a dick. We have another picture coming, and this is a little picture
59:28
of him on his left. He ran the juvenile division for the DPD,
59:34
but also had twenty five detectives, a few patrol men he had. He
59:42
had power in the DPD right and this little stimpetus from Walt Walt Brown's chronology.
59:49
Frank Martin is somewhat unique in that during his Warmth commissioned deposition on March
59:52
twenty four to sixty four, he told Warren Council Leon Hubert Hubert that there
1:00:00
were things he should not state for the record, but from context they related
1:00:05
to Ruby transfer and not teenager with some pistol, which I have no idea
1:00:09
what they're talking about with teenager with some form of pistol. But I'm going
1:00:14
to bring you here to the War commission snippet of mister Frank Martin. So
1:00:22
they're asking him about the basement and how Ruby got in there and all that
1:00:27
good stuff, and he admitted to knowing Ruby earlier in the his testimony.
1:00:37
Now, Captain Martin, mister Hooper says, is there anything else you would
1:00:40
like to say concerning any aspect of this matter at all? I this is
1:00:46
Captain Martin. I don't take this down. So he doesn't even say,
1:00:52
can we go off the record? He totally fumbles, well, and then
1:00:58
he gets interrupted. If you don't want to say on record, you'd better
1:01:00
not say it at all. So what does that say about the Warrant Commission?
1:01:07
What they were, what their agenda was? There is a lot.
1:01:09
Captain Martin then states, there's a lot to be said, but probably be
1:01:14
better if I don't say it. Well, I don't know what you mean,
1:01:19
and he goes, well, he goes that it would be better that
1:01:22
and he cuts them off and just cuts off that conversation completely right then where
1:01:28
he was going with that? So yeah, and it goes nowhere it goes
1:01:31
and they start talking about other, you know, not significant things. So
1:01:38
mister Captain Frank and Martinton happened to be on the list. And this actually
1:01:45
corresponds with our previous episode. We talked about Ruby's first lawyer Tom Howard not
1:01:54
dying on March of sixty five, two reporters dying in six sixty four,
1:02:00
in April, and in September. Blow to the neck. That's the Accidentshile,
1:02:05
shooting by policeman, that's like a Dick Cheney incident. You know,
1:02:09
Oh the gun just fell and blow to the neck. I think you mentioned
1:02:15
that heart attack and at the bottom Frank Captain Frank Martin six sixty six,
1:02:22
I don't like the devil. Dallas policeman who witnessed Oswalt Slang told Warrant Commission
1:02:30
there was a lot to be said, but probably better if I don't say
1:02:32
it. Sudden cancer. I mean, I think this is from Penn Jones's
1:02:37
list, right, you got that sudden cancer. Sudden just came on all
1:02:43
of a sudden. We yeah, right, similar to someone else, but
1:02:52
that relates to this exact story. But it is very interesting and we would
1:02:59
be remiss to not mentioned him and his kind of going off the official narrative
1:03:07
on the record. And you know, as you could see. Let me
1:03:12
see if I can bring up the next slide without that thing this up.
1:03:15
Oh no, I can't. He's a very interesting character and obviously did not
1:03:24
make it long past sixty six, along with a long list of people ignoring
1:03:30
Dorothy Kilgallen. Because that's true. So we are now going to move on
1:03:37
to another Martin, and that is Rolando J. Martin. He was the
1:03:42
owner of Martin's Cafe. When Oswald worked at the Riley Coffee Company, he
1:03:46
always ate launch at Martin's Cafe. So here we have Martin, I mean
1:03:53
Oswald eating at Warton's Cafe, cashing his checks at Martin's cafe JFVA, writing
1:04:00
his speech, and proposing to Jackie Joe. Yes, what street was Martin's
1:04:06
Cafe on? Martin's Cafe was on? Was it on Decatur? Or was
1:04:15
it on Uh No, it's right here on this graphic. I just want
1:04:18
to hear you say it. Mm hmm. I'm not sure we're set that.
1:04:30
What you mean? What street was Martin's cafe? It's the second line.
1:04:36
Oh almost, you're setting me up for failure. I am okay.
1:04:44
What street? Ch you picture? Who? Seven? Oh one cheat Choe
1:04:54
Street one block from Riley And and you know Oswald cashed all but two of
1:05:03
his payroll checks from Riley's at Martin's restaurant, where he ate lunch nearly every
1:05:10
day and was remembered by Roland Jay Martin. Anthony Martin, who was his
1:05:15
son, said, usually Oswald ordered Hamburger. That means it's not of relevance.
1:05:21
But here's the graphic. I think we showed it briefly on our jacks
1:05:26
or actually on our intro on November twenty second, and you could see here
1:05:31
that they did. Lee did cash a ton of checks at Martin's restaurant,
1:05:39
some endorsed by the restaurant, some endorsed by Roland Martin, and we came
1:05:45
across a couple that were endorsed by Rose Martin, which was his wife.
1:05:49
So that led us down an interesting path, and that was Rolando. And
1:06:00
we're going to tease you here because we have another J. Martin, and
1:06:05
his name is Eugenio Rolando Martinez, a lifelong s agent, was very much
1:06:13
active in sixty three known J. Martin alias. This is just a screenshot
1:06:17
from a document from the seventies trying to figure out which Martin aliases were his.
1:06:24
But it was known that he had a J. Martin alias. And
1:06:30
with that, we are going to tease our next segment because we Rob and
1:06:38
I have some very interesting Jay Martin's if you've seen our Lancer presentation on locals
1:06:45
or in person, you'll know what we're talking about. Of some Watergate burglars
1:06:48
that have j Martin aliases Barkans. So it's a and we look then,
1:07:00
so we tried to tie see was Orlando, Jay Martin roll Eugenio Martinez And
1:07:08
we tried hard to do it. We wanted it to be, but we
1:07:12
couldn't. Right. We found no evidence yet yet, but we implore people's
1:07:18
help if they want to look into it and email us at the Lone Gun
1:07:23
and at gmail dot com, or or join us on locals and sort of
1:07:27
conversation and we can rationally debate it. The middle name sticks out to me.
1:07:33
I had a little feeling about it, but for the documents, we
1:07:36
weren't able to tie it together. But I think that gives a little tease
1:07:43
on our next episode, which will be involving some Watergate burglars or all the
1:07:49
Watergate burglars or all of them, yeah, a couple of few. Yeah.
1:07:58
Is that all you got, Joseph? That is it for now?
1:08:00
Sir? Where what is our time? At a little over an hour?
1:08:04
Everybody iron coming up on an hour ten, so it would be a good
1:08:09
place to stop. Yeah, we don't want to go too long. And
1:08:13
if you want your emails to actually get to us, it's the Lone Gunman
1:08:15
Podcast at gmail dot com. What did I say, who gets the Lone
1:08:20
Gunman at gmail dot com? Okay, the Lone Gunment podcast. Yes,
1:08:25
make sure you add the podcast. Yeah, probably get that right. Yes,
1:08:30
But as always, mister Robb, it has been a pleasure doing this
1:08:36
episode with you. We got into some more Jay Martin's and we are leaving
1:08:43
the best for last. So I don't know how many where we have.
1:08:47
There's not going to be that many, but they will be mind blowing.
1:08:56
Yes, and thank you no true Flags for your excellent pronunciation for Joe.
1:09:02
There it is Joe. Do you see that chee patoulas chu Patulus. I
1:09:09
wasn't too far off. I was way far off. So are you just
1:09:14
gonna tease me with pronunciation things? Later? I'm going to set you up
1:09:17
for failure at every turn for comedic purposes. Yeah, it's okay, Yes
1:09:26
it is. So again, I want to thank before Robins that off.
1:09:30
I want to thank everyone who has joined us, who's going to watch us
1:09:33
later again, all these files will be up on locals and as well as
1:09:40
our Lancer presentation and we look forward to seeing you there and mister robb I
1:09:47
will let you lose it out yep. I wanted to thank you everybody for
1:09:53
hanging out with us today. I know it's a weird time, uh,
1:09:57
Like I said, look out midweek for another exciting episode and then next weekend
1:10:01
we'll be live again, back with some Watergate. Burglar Martins is for you,
1:10:09
and thanks everybody for playing along and hanging out with us and participating.
1:10:15
It's much appreciated, and like Joe said, head over to our locals link
1:10:18
down below, you can support the show. Check out the the merch and
1:10:24
the spread spread shirt store located either below this video or over on the Lone
1:10:31
Cooming podcast channel. Make sure you subscribe, folks. Much appreciated and for
1:10:40
Joey Scarsborrelli, this is a big bad vibe and again it's been a pleasure
1:10:47
and we'll see you all next week. You around the things of the pad
1:11:01
down try don't get away from the polls. Your game. It's mine,
1:11:10
don't you wear it? Is my final neighbor the show Jesu Amount the originally
1:11:18
a change every week in a wood Da to my week jan not to wear
1:11:30
James phone off the phone to get Mom in a Jabel del jogs my final
1:11:42
name and the show do you name is my junior name? My man Wavin
1:12:17
into the page of your Moato the Street Game to joke Joe an Jack after
1:12:23
your job, Will and Gie and Jackie don't pim shut up me o no
1:12:33
so with game my jam Cat into the big show. He don't we don't
1:12:40
tell you I'm got some chocobn O me by your job. Thank you guys
1:12:54
again, peace be until next time, guys,