Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / How is a 20 -year-old-woman, covered in blood with the word 'boy' carved in her arm, connected to a dead body sprawling out of a car? What happened to Ezra McCandless?

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How is a 20 -year-old-woman, covered in blood with the word 'boy' carved in her arm, connected to a dead body sprawling out of a car? What happened to Ezra McCandless? · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:04
  Speaker 1: What happened to this young woman? Ezra mccandles, a twenty
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: two year old so injured she can't even say her
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: own name. She's in horrible shape, blood around her face,
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: on her face, covered in mud. Coming for help, you're
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: coming for home? What happened? Crime Stories with Nancy Grace
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: twenty ninety one. Once he hadison the emergency at the
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: Gotten Shipple calling and I have a young lady that
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: I just came to my house and somebody attacked her
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: and she needs a doctor. Her colors are all torn,
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: and and what if the advershore located at what what
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: is the address you were at? You say six fourteen,
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: Well hen Duria Tavenuel, Okay, it's she injured. Yeah, she's injured.
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: Her mom who's kind of got the blood around her
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: overall corn okay, and she's by herself. She's by herself.
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: She want to my all apear historyfently? Okay? Can you
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: ask her what her name is? Get hold on a second?
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: What's your name, ma'am? What? You don't know who? She's
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: been kind of bad because you don't know. Oh my stars,
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: you are hearing a nine one one call? What happened
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: to this young woman, a twenty two year old so
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: injured she can't even say her own name. I mean, see, Grace,
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: this is crime stories. Thank you for being with us.
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: Listen to more of that. Nine one one calls a
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: young lady that year that new help define definitely have
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: an ambulance and some officers started that way. Did she
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: think who did this to her? Did she say who
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: did this to her? No? If you did, wick atacks
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: all her then and okay, and uh tell me your name?
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  Speaker 1: Did she say where this happened? No? I didn't. I
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: didn't get scut that. Okay? Do you want to stand
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: the phone? If be gotten or sure? Okay, so the
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: ambulan who's gotten the way, ambulance and officers are on
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: their rail, stand the phone if you as long as
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: they can. Okay, Okay, I'll hang on. Okay, come on
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: for help. You're come for what happened? Joining me an
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: all star panel. Renowned defense attorney Randy Kessler joining us
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: from the Atlanta Jurisdiction. Bruce Johnson, owner ESP Investigations, Crime
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: Scene Commander Chicago. Doctor Liz Debor, license, psychologist, founder of
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: Visionista's by design at doctor Liz Lyz dot com doctor
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: Kendall Craws, Deputy Medical Examiner, Travis County, Texas. That's Austin
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: joining us, and right now to Crime online dot Com
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: investigative reporter Dave mac Let's start at the beginning. What
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: were we just hearing, Nancy? What you were hearing was
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: a farmer named Don Sipple. He goes to his door
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: and there before him is a nineteen year old woman.
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: She's muddy up to her knees, she's got blood around
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: her mouth, she's disheveled, she's crying, and she tells him
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: she needs help right now that she's been attacked. And
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: that's why Don picks up the phone, calls nine one
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: one and he's you know, you can tell he's trying
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: to get information from her to relay back to nine
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: one one and can't even get the girl's name. You know,
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: I'm listening to the nine one one call and it's
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: conjuring up so many imagist Randy Kessler, defense attorney joining
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: me out of Atlanta. Randy, that's the kind of thing
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: you want to play for a jury, if you ever
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: make it to a jury. There's something about a nine
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: one one call that takes you to that moment and
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: also you're getting the very first impressions of what could
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: be a felony. You're exactly right when you say the
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: numbers nine one one. It's almost like a theatrical drum roll.
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: You know, whatever comes after this in the nine one
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  Speaker 1: one call it a heavier sense of urgency, and it's
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: going to weigh on the jury. They're gonna listen more intently.
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: And that's what you wanted as a lawyer. You want
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: the jury to pay attention to what you're about to
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: say or the evidence you're about to a tender And
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: that's the best you know setup is, ladies and gentlemen,
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: I want you to hear the nine one one call.
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: That's what started this whole project. It starts the whole thing.
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: Dave Matt tell me about where this happened. Happened about
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: halfway between Minemy and Eau Claire. Most of the principles
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: involved in this case lived in and around the Eau Claire,
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: Wisconsin area. You know, when you first see a woman
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: with blood around the mouth covered in mud, know to
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: Bruce Johnson, owner ESP Investigations, Master Sergeant Retire Chicago Metro,
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: the first thing you want to do is help her
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: What strikes you about the nine one one call? What
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: strikes me, but that is that obviously she was dazed
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  Speaker 1: and confused. And for the gentleman that was, you know,
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: opening the door and seeing this in front of him,
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: I'm sure he was a little bit in shock. You know,
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: at this point, it's so early, you're not going to
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: question her her motives or anything like that. But you're
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: looking at a young woman nineteen twenty years old. She's disheveled,
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  Speaker 1: possibly you know, clothes torn up, looks like she's been
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: a victim of a beating. And he was very you know,
• 5:42
  Speaker 1: obviously he's an older, an older person, and wasn't in
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: the frame of mind to start questioning her. And that's
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: why he was struggling when the operator was asking him
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: questions about her conditions. Yeah, yeah, he's a good samaritan.
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: Let's see what more we can learn. Sights her bleeding
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  Speaker 1: from the mouth. Do we know what other injuries she has?
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: Is she looks like she's injured anywhere else? Yeah, she
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: looks a little bit some other uh bloody marched on
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  Speaker 1: or her leg a little bit Okay, Okay, I'm sure
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: all torn Okay, and how old? If you had to
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: get so old you think she's how old are you man?
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: Nineteen nineteen? Okay, if that much is coming, you're gonna
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: get help. Or because so she came on the flip correct, Yeah, okay, yep,
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: she just walked to my daughter. Okay, can you ask
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: her who did this to her? Repeat? God, please, can
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: you ask her who did this to her? Oh it?
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: Do you have any idea? Who did this to you?
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: Dis old s Okay, So the piece of evidence I
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: hear from her, She makes her way to his door,
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: bams on the door. He comes to the door. She's
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: in horrible shape, blood around her face, on her face,
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: covered in mud. To doctor Liz debor you can find
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: her at doctor liz Lyz dot com. Doctor Liz, I
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: notice that she does know her age. She knows she
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: is nineteen, but does not know her name or what
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: happened to her. So what we hear from just hearing
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: her in the background of the nine one one call
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: is a high intensity of psychological disorganization. So obviously she's
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: been involved in some extreme trauma. Um, it just looks
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: like an attack. It looks like she's a victim, and
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: she is really seemingly disconnected from reality, a real disorganized
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: schema of personality. Right now, we don't know what to think.
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: A nineteen year old girl shows up, what would you do?
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: A lot of people wouldn't even open the door, that's right,
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: that'd be too afraid. But this elderly gentleman opens the door,
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: a good samaritan to a woman covered in blood and mud. Listen,
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: we'll get her to help. She needed to be in
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: an ambulance. SERI hold also, just lp you could, We'll
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: get her taken care of the backboardly, how much about
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: vacate um fifteen? I notice to get here. Yeah, they're
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: coming from a nomine unfortunately, so it'll be a few minutes.
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: But she's got to cloud goes on, he said, maybe
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: I told her she's nineteen? Okay, ended up? Did you
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: get the blood on her multilause? I get it was
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: dry or yeah? I hit a little on a dry side, y'all,
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  Speaker 1: But I have a while ago. I think she's walked
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: right away as maybe yeah, I don't know how she
• 8:50
  Speaker 1: found it here, but that's okay. Don't you give any
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: family tr right down. Climb Stories with Nancy Grace on
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: March twenty second of twenty eighteen, the dun County Sheriff's
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: Office received a nine one one call from a local farmer.
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: I have a lady that just came to my house
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  Speaker 1: and somebody attacked her. A woman had showed up at
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: his house and was bloody. The doctor her colored her
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: all torn. A young woman claimed that she had been
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: violently attacked. What's your name, ma'am? You don't know? Do
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: you have any idea who did that to you? She
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: couldn't remember. They saw the word boy carved into her
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: left arm. She said she was scared. Something horrible happened
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: to this woman was a straituation one I've never been,
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: and I've been her own wrong time. Even think, oh
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: my gosh, this is horrible, this poor woman. And then
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: law enforcements show up and learned that her name is
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: Ezra McCandless. But as you listen, you know you hear
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: Jason Mangle called Jason Mingle. Finally we have a name,
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: you were just hearing our friends at CBS forty eight hours.
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: We learn her name finally is Ezra McCandless, and she
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: keeps saying call Jason mangele. Okay. We also hear that
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: someone has carved letters into her body joining me. Doctor
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: Kendall Crowns, Deputy Medical Examiner, Travis County, Texas. That's Austin,
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: doctor Crowns. I've seen cases that I personally investigated and
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: handled where victims' bodies had had letters carved into them,
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: usually one letter, maybe two, and it's very very rare.
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: Have you ever seen anything like it? Yes, I have.
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: I've seen people who have committed suicide actually at whole
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: sentences into their body, usually on their non dominant arm.
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  Speaker 1: So it is actually interesting in this case that everything
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: she has on her seems to be on her left side,
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: Doctor Kendall Crowns. Is really interesting that you notice that
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: when you say everything is on her left side, what
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: do you mean by everything? From the pictures? The carving
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  Speaker 1: of the word boy fears to be on her left floearm.
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: Then her defensive injuries of her left palm of her
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: hand also on her left hand. So and also the
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: defensive injury on her left hand looks very superficial as well.
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: With people with the defensive injuries I've seen where they
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: were legitimately murdered, the wounds are actually very deep and
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: cut through multiple layers of the skin because they're actually
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: grabbing the knife, trying to stop being killed, and they'll
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: do anything to stop it. So when they grab it,
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: they grab hard and deep and they get cut very bad.
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: Her wounds looks like someone trying not to hurt themselves,
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: but trying to make it look like they were injured.
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: You know, that's really fascinating that you picked up on that. Also,
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: when you say on her left hand, I believe you
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: said it was very superficial. Describe what you mean by that,
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: and if you could address the rest of her wounds. Sure,
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: the wound on her left hand is on her palm,
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: and it appears to be like only the skin surface,
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: almost like a scratching across the skin surface instead of
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: a deep cutting. Again, with defensive wounds, it often goes
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: through the upper layer of skin, the lower layer of skin,
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: and into the underlying fat. So she just looks like
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: she has an upper layer wound. Only joining me Dave
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: Matt Crime online dot Com investigative reporter. Now, this guy,
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: the good Samaritan don simple that we hear in the
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: nine one one call. He just here's bamming at his
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: door at what time of the day or night in
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: it is it? And is it a rural area. Well
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: we're talking. We're talking about fourth fifteen in the afternoon,
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: Don Simple. As has been mentioned, he's an elderly man.
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: He's about ninety years old. He's sitting down to dinner
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: when all of this begins for him. So fourth fifteen
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: in the afternoon, sitting down to dinner, and here comes
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: this knock on the door, and he opens it up
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: and sees somebody who looks like they have just been
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: through the worst experience of life. And he has no
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: reason to doubt anything. She's saying, take a listen to this.
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: She was my girlfriend. I was in deep love without row.
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: She was an amazing person. I thought she was pretty
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: interesting and she was really artistic. We were good friends.
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: She liked having people in her life. As the investigation continues,
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: as he was able to remember that she was attacked
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: money Muddy Road, very remote by Alexander Woodworth, an ex boyfriend.
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: Law enforcement was treating this case as a woman who
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: was violently attacked by a man and they were unable
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: to find him. He needed to find alex You thought
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: he was an attacker. Wow, wow, Ezra McCanless. Now what
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: do we learn is she starting to come around Dave
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: mckin explain what happened to her. She's having trouble right
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: at the very beginning, Okay, at the very start, when
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: she's trying to relate what happened, she claims that she's
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: kind of in a brain fog that she can't really
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: remember what all took place. Detectives are basing everything on
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: what she is telling them, so they start, you know,
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: investigating what she is saying, and they immediately start looking
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: for Alex because that's who she's claiming you did this
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: to her. As the investigation starts to spread out, they
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: get her to the hospital and they're just not able
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: to find what's really going on. So Alex actually is missing.
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: They can't find him anywhere. Take a listen to our
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: friends at k A R A eleven. Ezra eventually broke
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: up with Jason and Alex, and around that time, she
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: claimed she was sexually assaulted by one of Jason's friends,
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: Oh Claire. Detective Ryan Rock investigated Ezra's allegations. First meeting
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: with her was March first, twenty eighteen. She came in
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: for an interview. He kept telling me to be quiet,
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: like she keeps shushing me. She's sitting in off leaning
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: against the wall with her knees up, and she's telling
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: me the story of what took place, starking really really
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: really tipsy, that they consumed alcohol and that's when she
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: said she blacked out and she was sexually assaulted at
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: that point. That's what she believes. Yes, it's really scary.
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: Don't you believe she was a victim? Correct? You know,
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: the stories become conflicting, Randy Kessler, You've tried so many cases.
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: Very often witnesses are not what they appear to be.
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: Definitely are not what they appear to be. But also
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: memories fade and change. You know, we all think, how
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: could you not remember something like that? And if you
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: think about it, what you remember sometimes is the image
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: of what you want to remember. You see pictures of
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: yourself at a birthday party with family twenty years ago.
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: You remember the picture of the party, but you don't
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: remember the party. So memories change, witnesses change, and witnesses
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: that's why we have trial by jury. You know, we're
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: trying to pick them apart, show why we think they're
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: a long and piece them based on other statements or
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: prioring consistent statements. All these tricks and tools of the
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: trade help us get to the truth. It is very
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: hard to just say, let the witness tell us the
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: story and just believe it. Okay, you see a car
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: in the distance, and this is all coming from the
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: appearance of a young woman, very young, around nineteen years old,
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: carvered in blood and mud. And now is she connected
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: to a dead body hanging out of a car? To
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: go listen to this? Everything changed when law enforcement found
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: the body. We found Alex's body laying across the whole
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: backseat football. I've been a prosecutor since twenty eleven and
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: I've never seen anything this violent. This is heinous. Sixteen
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: times he was stabbed. This was anger and rage, and
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: this was personal. This case boiled down to whether you
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: believed as our mechanists or not. Okay, take a listen
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: to our friends at CBS forty eight hours. Ezra says
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: she grabbed the knife by its jagged blade, wrenched it
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: away from Alex, and began stabbing him. He said, you
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: were head to knife. Where were you cutting him? He
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: just was going anywhere and everywhere it could. Proc looks
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: at Ezra's hands, which have only superficial cuts. The wounds
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: don't match. If you're grabbing a knife like she said
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: she did, and you pull your hand across, your hand
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: is going to be fleet open. He just kept grabbing
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: me and Greg gravity. It's a harrowing story, but as
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: the evidence is examined, authorities become more convinced than ever
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: that Ezra mccandleus is lying. This was cold blooded murder
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: crime stories with Nancy Grace. We got calls that Alex
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: was missing. I thought maybe it was like an accent
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: or something. Yeah, we thought maybe we could help find him.
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: What is he missing? With nowhere else to go? The
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: next day, police return to Don Sipple's farm. As we're
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: driving down the road, we see the muddy road right
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: here and we stopped and at that point we're able
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: to see footprints in the mud coming from the top
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: of the hill down the road, and we lose them
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: right in this area. Investigators follow those footprints and spot
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: a car. This is the police video from that day
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: from our advantage point on top of the hill. We
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: use binoculators and we're able to see down there and
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: we could see a human body and hanging over the
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: back seat driver's side. Did you immediately think this is Alex.
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: We did. We thought it was Alex. Okay, you see
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: a car in the distance, and this is all coming
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: from the appearance of a young woman, very young, around
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: nineteen years old, carvered in blood and mud. To Dave
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: Matt Crime online dot Com investigative reporter, who is Alex.
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: Alex Woodworth was twenty four years old. He and Ezra
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: had been romantically involved. He actually was friends. He worked
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: as a barista coffee shop where Ezra and her her
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: boyfriend actually went to this coffee shop. They all became
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: friends together, and then we had kind of a triangle
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: going on. Ezra and Alex became close, became romantically involved,
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: and it actually that relationship caused her other relationship with Jason.
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: And Okay, guys, we're talking about what seems to be
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: a young woman appearing out of nowhere, banging on an
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: elderly gentleman's door. He's a good Samaritan, Misressip well well
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: up in his eighties at the time. This happens, really
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: knocking on ninety and he's calling nine one one trying
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: to help this woman. Take a listen to this. Twenty
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: four year old Alex Woodworth is dead. Oh Claire Police
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: Detective Ryan Prock is now leading the homicide investigation along
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: with investigators from the dun County Sheriff's Department. It's a
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: very very violent attack on a person with a knife.
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: How shocking was that to hear? Oh? Terrible? Yeah, you
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: can't wrap him. I end around it. We knew nothing
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: about it really to study. Does stabs sixteen times? And
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: that's pretty graphic. Arm now with specific details. Proc returns
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: to the hospital. He tells Ezra he's found the crime scene,
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: and this time her memory returns, beginning with a knife.
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: She says, Alex found in the car. Okay, hold on,
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: it's all coming back to her. Now you're hearing our
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: friends at CBS forty eight hours to doctor Liz Dubor,
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: licensed psychologist. You can find her at doctor Liz Lyz
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: dot com. Doctor Liz, How does that work? You don't remember,
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: then suddenly, bam, it hits you. You do remember what happened. Um,
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: that's a really interesting question. Certainly, we've heard that when
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: someone's involved in some kind of trauma, an attack of
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: physical altercation of this magnitude, the memory can be compromised,
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: so to speak, and so the stress, the emotional stress,
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: the physical stress. Sometimes what our brain does is kind
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: of disconnects from the moment in order to protect us
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: as a protective factor. And so there is a feature
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: of dissociation disconnect where the brain just kind of disconnects
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: from the present moment in order to somehow protect the body,
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: protects the psyche from from such extreme distress. Two Dotriginal Crowns,
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: Deputy Medical Examined, Travis County, Texas sets. Often there's nothing
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: like an eye fight for somebody like you or may
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: because you get so much forensic evidence. I explain how
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: a knife fight, a death by knife, is so much
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: different than let's just say asphyxiation, a ligature manual, or
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: even a gunshot wound. What is it about a knife fight? Well,
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: the knife knife fights are usually not always, but usually
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: have quite a few wounds associated with them. But the
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: main reason is is when you stab an individual, you
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: don't necessarily hit something that's going to kill them instantly.
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: And then that person is not going to lay there
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: and just be stabbed, so they're going to try and
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: fight back, They're going to try and run away, so
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: you get more and more stab wounds and an attempt
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: to control them and attempt to kill them. If you
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: don't lab your land, your stab wound in the right area,
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: hitting like a major vessel or something associated with the
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: spinal cord, They're going to keep moving for quite a while.
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: A blood and you get a lot of and then
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: the more stabound, more superficial estab bound the sap Doctor
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: Kennall Crowns. Doctor Kendall Crowns, let me just say two words,
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: Jody Arius to Bruce and Johnson, owner I SP Investigations,
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: was Master Sergeant crimes in commander at Chicago Metro before
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: he went into business for himself. That's not a walk
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: in the park right there in Chicago. I'm telling you,
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: that's right on par with Inner City Atlanta, where I
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: prosecuted Bruce a NI fight. It's bloody, it's it's it's
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: also Richard Forensics. Absolutely, you know there's gonna be a
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: lot obviously what Pathalo just said, There's gonna be a
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: lot of blood, a lot of uh movement from the body.
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: But with this case, for a woman to overcome a
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: man in this manner, the first blow had to be
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: a good one or possibly near fatal, because she has
• 24:58
  Speaker 1: to take control of him and she admitted it. First
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: blow that she stabbed was to the head, so we're
• 25:02
  Speaker 1: curious about where it was in the head. If you
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: say the head, it still could be the lower base
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: of the neck because she said that she stabbed him
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: from behind. But she the positions that she was talking
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: about weren't right. But the first blow is the most
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: important because he had to have gone down. We know
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: about the crime scene that the officers were talking about
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: in the field. There's a lot of blood and disheveled
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: stuff outside of the vehicle that puts them outside. So
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: how she was able to control him and possibly stabbed
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: him the first blow, Well, she said the first blow
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: was to the head and from behind, so that is
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: probably what put him down. And then from there she
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: can gain control. She can be on top, and now
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: you're going to start to win the fight, because I
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: want to know where's his defensive wounds and why couldn't
• 25:57
  Speaker 1: he overcome her? Because she's doesn't appear to be too
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: big of a woman. She's nineteen years old, probably one
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: hundred and ten pounds. He looks like an average male,
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: you know, five eight possibly one hundred and sixty pounds.
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: They don't add up unless the first blow, had some
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: abilitating wound to him bottom off guard and caught him
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: by crime stories with Nancy Grace. Candlist told police Woodworth
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: forced himself on her in the backseat of her car
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: while parked on a country road, and she said Woodworth
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: used a knife to cut her clothing, but then she
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: got the knife away and stabbed him in self defense.
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: Prosecutors say McCandless cut her own clothing to frame a
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: phony crime scene and set up her defense claim. Okay,
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: so you don't know if sweater was cut. Do you
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: know if the sweater was torn? Do you know if
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: the sweater was ripped? I don't. The prosecution says this
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: case is about a twisted form of love. Their theory
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: that McCandless killed Woodworth in a desperate attempt to recapture
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: the relationship she had with another ex boyfriend. But the
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: defense says the victim Woodworth, had a twisted mind fascinated
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: with violence in cannibalism, and McCandless thought she was about
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: to be violently raped, A disturbed and obsessive of ex
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: boyfriend attacker, cut her, strangled her. Did I just hear cannibalism?
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: You're hearing our friends at ka R eleven. That's lou
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: Ragus speaking. Wow, this just gets crazier and crazier. But
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: what we learn is that this young woman that we
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: thought was a victim covered in blood and mud, admits
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: to the stabbing, but claims her boyfriend, part of a
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: loved triangle, attacked her. Okay, wait a minute, I don't
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: get it. Why would it be then that Randy Kessler,
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: you're the defense attorney. What do you do when your
• 28:10
  Speaker 1: client admits to stabbing somebody, claiming it's in self defense,
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: but then they take the time to carve the word
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: boy into her into their own arm. I don't know
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: what you do. You know you gotta go with what
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: your client tells you. Well you better think. Well, wait
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: a minute, wait a minute, Randy, Randy, what do you
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: do you get a case like this? What do you
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: just go into your conference room or your office and
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: you huddle up with all those interns and syncophats, oh
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: excuse me, assistance that are always following you around at
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: the courthouse, and you just sit there. What do you
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: say think people come up with something? Well, how do
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: you come up with something? The first thing you gotta
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: do is you can't let your client line. So you
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: got to decide do you want to hear your client story,
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: because if your client story is one that doesn't make sense,
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: you can't let her tell another story when you know
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: it's not true. So that's the first thank you. You know,
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: I'm not sure that I even want to hear doctor
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: Liz Debor. Licensed psychologists, you can find her doctor liz
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: lyz dot com. And self defense. How would you suddenly
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: just pause in the whole self defense drama and carve
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: the word boy into your arm? Yeah, it doesn't make sense,
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: does it? So I think that when we look at
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: the evidence, that is one of the things that just
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: stands out as you know, how did that happen? What
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: we can see is that again, very disturbed sense of
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: reality in this woman, and and probably a history of
• 29:46
  Speaker 1: self mutilation. You know, doctor Liz Debor, I'm hanging onto
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: one phrase. You used, a distorted sense of reality. Okay
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: in my world, but that means she's lying, Doctor Kendall Crowns.
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: Let's just down to it, doctor Crowns. The victim, Alex
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: Woodworth was stabbed sixteen times. I think that's why I
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: brought up Travis Alexander Jody Arius's victim. He was stabbed
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: about twenty eight twenty nine times. They couldn't really tell
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: because the stab ones were overlapping each other before he
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: was shot in the head. Dodger Kennel crowns, what if
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: anything about this death, says that she was acting in
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: self defense six day stab ones. That does not sound
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: like self defense to me. Well, I agree. I mean
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: usually when you hear self defense, it's like you stab
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: him once, maybe twice, and you run for it. And
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: I often will tell the police when we get these
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: cases come in and someone's claiming self dispense, I'll give
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: you one stab, maybe two, But once you get over five,
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: six eight, now we're now we're starting to talk, how
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: is that self defense? And in sixteen I mean and
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: in the back of the head as well. It's just
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: it's very very suspect that how could that be self defense?
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: I don't think it is okay because forensics science is
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: going to rule the day. I don't care what Asra mccannles,
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: the young woman says, I don't care what a witness says.
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: I care what the forensics tell me, because they're not
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: gonna lie to Bruce Johnson, what do you make of
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: the theory that this murder was not spur of the
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: moment that you may expect with sixteen sab wounds, it
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: sounds like a frenzy, but that it was premeditated. What
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: do you know about claims that Ezra McCandless Lord Alex
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: Woodworth just twenty four years old to that muddy road,
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: knowing what was about to happen, right Well, and here
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: you go in in the love triangle that usually they
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: end up like this very nasty, very vindictive, very conniving
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: means of death. So something's going on in the love
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: triangle and she's worried about Jason, and she's taken out
• 32:09
  Speaker 1: Alex for that whole story, we haven't gotten the whole
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: part of it too, And we haven't got into the
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: third part of the triangle. This is John Hanson, how
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: he comes into play. But basically her world is crumbling.
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: And if you go back just a few minutes with
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: her statements saving that's defensive wounds. So I want to
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: know based on her statement, if he's on top of
• 32:36
  Speaker 1: her in the car where it started, where's his first action,
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: where's his first stab wound? And how could he not
• 32:45
  Speaker 1: control her? Based on her own statement, So where's his
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: first stab wound to her? If she puts her hand
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: up and blocks it, he's still going to be able
• 32:55
  Speaker 1: to overcome her. So her statements fall flattened really quick
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: with putting him on top of her, and she's somehow
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: gonna overcome him. Take the knife, you know, stab him
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: multiple times, which she eventually admits, and then harves herself
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: a lot of gaps, a lot of holes. We are
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: starting to get a picture of a premeditated crime. Did
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: this nineteen year old Ezra McCanless actually lure the victim,
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: Alex Woodworth to his death as opposed to being some
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: frenzied act of self defense. Then text messages are uncovered.
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: Take a listen Jeff Friends at CBS forty eight hours.
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: Then the detective reviewed suggestive text messages Ezra had sent
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: to Jason's friend. Proc also interviewed Alex Woodworth, and he
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: did not support Ezra's version of events. He said that
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: Ezra told him that it was consensual, She just regretted it.
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: This relationship wasn't even a love triangle, it was a
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: love square. And those relationships began and stopped with Azrama Chambless.
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: The sexual assault case was ultimately dropped, thinks in part
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: to Alex's statements, and Ezra was upset her world was
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: crumbling around her. She had created Ezra, she had created
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: this intricate network of lives, and they kept falling apart
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: and there was nothing left. There was nothing left behind it.
• 34:24
  Speaker 1: Ezra moved out of Eauclaire and back home with her family,
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: but Jason says she tried desperately to win him back,
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: and she all of these tales about these these manipulative,
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: vindictive men who tried to take me away from you. Jason.
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: It's not me, it's them. Wow, what a mess, What
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: a tangled web we weave when first we practiced to
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: deceive Randy Kesso, r nowned defense attorney joining me out
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: of Atlanta. There's nothing like text messages popping up on
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: your client's cell phone, text messages that clearly proved claims
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: of self defense. It's the worst, You know, as soon
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: as you think you got it. It was good practicing
• 35:06
  Speaker 1: law thirty years ago, wasn't it, Nancy, At least from
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: our side, And we didn't have text message, Facebook and
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: posting and Snapchat and cell phone cameras and security cameras
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: on every building. It's a new world and dependents of
• 35:19
  Speaker 1: a harder time today. That's where it is. Man. You're
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: so right, Dave Mack. What do you make of claims
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: that Ezra mcchanal's just nineteen years old lured the victim
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: to a bloody death, that this was not some spur
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: of the moment attack. The police believed that she used
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: her writings and the fact she wanted to talk to
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: Alex about how their relationship ended as a means of
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: getting him away from the coffee shop and everybody else
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: to separate him so she could be alone with Alex.
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: So she lured him from the coffee shop, claiming she
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: wanted him to look at her writing. Did you mention
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: earlier that there were six hundred text messages the night
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: before where this happened. She was texting with her ex
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: boyfriend Jason Mingle, and they exchanged six hundred messages, and
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: at no point did she ever mentioned that she was
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: coming to Eau Claire. So her goal, according to police,
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: is to lure Ezra McCanless away murder him in order
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: to get back with the first boyfriend, right, correct, What
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: do we know? Dave Matt about claims that this crime
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: scene was staged. Well, what police figured out was from
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: the time that the attack occurred in that vehicle, that
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: Ezra was able to take the time to set the
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: stage there. As we mentioned, she claimed the attack happened
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: in the backseat of that vehicle, but all the evidence
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: of the DNA, the blood, everything that was found was
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: outside the vehicle, and police believe that Ezra took the
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: time between the end of the attack, when Alex was
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: no longer able to do anything, that Ezra then took
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: the time to rip her clothing or cut her clothing
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: to stage herself to make it look like she had
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: been the victim, and that she set the stage in
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: that vehicle to make it appear that they had been
• 37:11
  Speaker 1: in this attack and Alex was the aggressor. It's believed
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: at that point in time that the attack on her
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: left arm where the boy was etched into it, that
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: that's what she was doing during that time between the
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: attack and the time she shows up at mister Sipple's farmhouse.
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: To doctor Kennel Crown's Deputy medical Examiner, Travis County, Texas, Austin,
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: doctor crowns, what suggests to you the same was staged
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: the way the bodies in the back of a car,
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: it's odd. There's blood all over the place, and then
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: just her ripped clothes and walking away from it, and
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: then of course the superficial injuries to her body. To me,
• 37:54
  Speaker 1: all that just sounds very set up and unrealistic. What
• 37:58
  Speaker 1: do you mean the opposite of the body in the
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: back of the car, his head's hanging out the door.
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: So if either she's trying to pull him back into
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: the car to let him die, or she's stabbed him
• 38:10
  Speaker 1: in the car and he's trying to pull out, it's
• 38:13
  Speaker 1: odd that his head's hanging out the doorway. She's either
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: trying to get out or she pulled him back in.
• 38:18
  Speaker 1: Although she's a very small woman, so I don't think
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: she could manipulate his body all that much. We are
• 38:23
  Speaker 1: learning that Ezra had a quote pretty in pink performance
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: at trial. What does that mean? Dave Matt Nancy At
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: trial when she was on the stand, Ezra mccandles had
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: a demeanor several times. You've mentioned Jody Arius today, and
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: that was the comparison that people came up with that
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: she was so composed. She wore an outfit that made
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: her look softer, more feminine. The pretty in pink refers
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: to the pink sweater that she wore on this day
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: in court where she was on the stand and looked
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: like this peaceful, fragile, wonderful little, you know, flower of
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: a girl who could never be involved in a heinous cry,
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: A peaceful, fragile snowflake on the stand. Bruce Johnson, how
• 39:14
  Speaker 1: many times have you seen that someone present a very
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: different image in front of a jury than what they
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: really were thank the Menendez brothers. Yeah. Well, the first
• 39:26
  Speaker 1: noticeable thing was, you know, they changed her glasses, she
• 39:29
  Speaker 1: has makeup on him, She instantly lost her nose, ear ring,
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: and at times she even had a somewhat joyful demeanor
• 39:41
  Speaker 1: on the stand. Take a listen to this. We the
• 39:45
  Speaker 1: jury find the defendant, Ezra J. McCandless guilty. A first
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: degree intentional homicide is charged in the information and the
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: answer to the special verted question is yes, used the
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: dangerous weapon. Wow, it only took the jury three hours
• 39:59
  Speaker 1: to vict now twenty two year old Ezra Mchamalis nineteen
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: years old at the time of murder one with a weapon.
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: Apparently overwhelming evidence at trial. What do they mean by
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: overwhelming evidence at trial, Dave Dave mac joined me from
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: crime Online. What were the significant facts that convicted her.
• 40:24
  Speaker 1: You've got the crime scene in and of itself that
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: doesn't match her story of what happened. You've got all
• 40:30
  Speaker 1: of the blood found outside the vehicle. And again you
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: go back to the sixteen stab wounds on Alex's body.
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: Was the first wound being the back of the head,
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: very big in the argument that, in talking about the
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: lack of defensive wounds, that she was able to take
• 40:49
  Speaker 1: him by surprise. That was the basic thing that really
• 40:52
  Speaker 1: when you look at this case. Nancy her claimed that
• 40:56
  Speaker 1: she was the victim, that he had attacked her in
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: the back seat, and none of the physical evidence bore
• 41:02
  Speaker 1: that out. It was actually outside the car she was
• 41:06
  Speaker 1: the aggressive. What do you make of that, doctor Kendall Crowns,
• 41:09
  Speaker 1: Because we're hearing Dave Mack state that the victim had
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: no defensive wounds, that she quote took him by surprise.
• 41:15
  Speaker 1: How can that be proven forensically? I'm not one hundred
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: percent sure if you could prove that he was taken
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: by surprise just by the nature of his wounds, but
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: the fact that he has no defense wounds does mean
• 41:28
  Speaker 1: that he either didn't fight back, or she did get
• 41:33
  Speaker 1: him from behind initially, or one of the wounds initially
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: done was severe enough that he was immobilized. You know,
• 41:41
  Speaker 1: we know at the end of the trial she showed
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: no remorse, but did sob and apologize at sentencing. Another
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: case of me, me, me, me, me, me, me, forget
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: about him. It's all about me in the end. What's
• 41:58
  Speaker 1: her sentence, davemac Her sentence was life in prison with
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: the possibility for parole after fifty years. Too much, not enough?
• 42:05
  Speaker 1: What about it? Bradis Johnson definitely fits the crime. She
• 42:08
  Speaker 1: should not get parole. This was a hanness crime. She
• 42:11
  Speaker 1: overtook him, she set him up, she set up the
• 42:14
  Speaker 1: crime scene. It just goes on and on. There's a
• 42:18
  Speaker 1: lot of vindictiveness there, and she should not have any
• 42:23
  Speaker 1: cancer parole, let alone fifty years. Jorandy kesser Fier sentencing.
• 42:27
  Speaker 1: I'm not so much about the punishment and punish her
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: as much as I am about the protecting society. She's
• 42:32
  Speaker 1: the kind of person that sounds that she is, that
• 42:35
  Speaker 1: doesn't recognize what she did was wrong and doesn't admit it,
• 42:38
  Speaker 1: then I don't want her on my streets. We wait
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: as justice unfolds at this hour. Ezra McCandless plotting her
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: appeal behind bars. Nancy Grace Crime Story signing off good bye,
• 42:50
  Speaker 1: Send