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Butterflies: Caterpillars with Wings! · Stuff You Should Know

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Hey, everyone, we want to announce that we have our
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: final three shows of the year on the books August
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  Speaker 1: twelfth in Orlando, Florida, September sixth in Nashville, Tennessee, and
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  Speaker 1: winding it up right here in Atlanta September ninth.
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• 0:19
  Speaker 2: Should Know greatness, the last of it for the year,
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  Speaker 2: you can by going to stuff youshould Know dot com
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  Speaker 2: and checking out our tour page or going to link
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  Speaker 2: and all the info you need. We'll see you starting
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: in August.
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you Should Know, a production of iHeartRadio.
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh, and there's
• 0:46
  Speaker 2: Chuck and Jerry's here too, and this is Stuff you
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: Should Know, Part two of a one to two punch
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: of insect Goodness.
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Caterpillars hopefully you just listen to. If you did,
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: you might want to, because really, you know, without Caterpillar
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: there is no Butterfly episode. Yeah.
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: I feel like they could stand on their own, Like,
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: I don't think you have to have listened to one
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  Speaker 2: to understand what we're going to talk about here.
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: No, no, no, but you know we're probably gonna say
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: when it comes time to talk about how the caterpillar
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: turns into a butterfly, just go back in time to
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  Speaker 1: two days ago and listen to that one.
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  Speaker 2: Right, we'll be like.
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: And once again we have to thank HowStuffWorks dot Com
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: and our former and current colleague Tracy Wilson, as well
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: as our former colleague not current, Jennifer Horton, wrote a
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: fun piece about butterfly gardens that we're going to talk
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: about at the end. But I forgot about Jennifer. You
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: remember her?
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, she was great. She wrote lots of great stuff.
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  Speaker 2: She's a good person.
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: So, Jennifer, I don't know if you're out there and listen,
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: but Hi, Hi.
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: It's been a while, yeah, since like two thousand and
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: eight or nine, in a long while. Well, so we're
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: talking about butterflies, and we should probably kind of pick
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: up not where we left off, because we talked I
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: think about caterpillars being pests at the end, or considered pests,
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: but they're not really. Yeah, we should pick up after
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: the caterpillar emerges from its chrysalis because we're talking specifically
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: about butterflies. So it's the chrysalis, not a cocoon that
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: it metamorphosizes within, and once it emerges, it is a
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: beautiful creature that resembles the caterpillar that it was almost
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: not at all. But it's the same exact creature. It's
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: got the same mind, it can remember smells and all that.
• 2:36
  Speaker 2: But whereas the caterpillar was built for eating, I think
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: we said it in the last episode too, the butterfly
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: is built for sex, sex, sex.
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they're built for reproducing. Should we talk, I mean,
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: should we go back in time just a little bit
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: and talk about the fact that, like the distinction between
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: mals and butterflies and stuff like that. Sure, well, what's
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: the deal, wasn't it aren't moths and butterflies basically mostly
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: the same except moths are they do their sex at
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: night and butterflies do their sex in the day.
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, there's not many distinctions between them other
• 3:16
  Speaker 2: than like the obvious ones. But that's the biggest one.
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: And the reason why butterflies are diurnal and moths are
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: nocturnal is because all butterflies, I think, what is there
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: like fifteen twenty thousand species.
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: Of butterflies, A lot of them.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, all of them are descended from moths, and these
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: were just moths that started to do their thing in
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: the daytime rather than the nighttime, and over time they
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: evolve to fit in in the daytime rather than the nighttime,
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: which is how moths evolved. So a moth's camouflage is
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: meant to blend in with like a tree where it's
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  Speaker 2: sleeping during the day, whereas a butterfly is bright colored
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: because it's out in the daytime and it needs to
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: blend in with the big, color full flowers that it
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: likes to hang out on.
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: Do you know why I'm meant to look this up
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: and didn't. Why then a moth is so attracted to light.
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  Speaker 2: I saw that they think that it is attracted to
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  Speaker 2: the moon for navigation. Oh okay, and that butterflies aren't
• 4:16
  Speaker 2: attracted to light because they don't navigate by the moon.
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  Speaker 2: They lost that ability or that need.
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: Well, butterflies navigate by the sun. That's one of the
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: one of my amazing facts about butterflies.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, but then that's weird that they don't fly to light,
• 4:30
  Speaker 2: but they are not attracted to flames or light bulbs.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, Oh well maybe they know sun is death.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, whereas the moon is nice and cool.
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: Should we talk about their bodies a little bit, because
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  Speaker 1: that's where we like to start off usually with our
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: insect casts.
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  Speaker 2: One more thing, let's talk about where the word butterfly
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: came from.
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  Speaker 1: Eh, where to come from?
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  Speaker 2: Oh well, it's very Old English and it means butter
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  Speaker 2: and fly, right, No real mystery there. Yeah, but the
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  Speaker 2: reason they think there's two reasons why they are named
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: butterflies in the Old English. And they think it's either
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  Speaker 2: because some of them are a pale yellow in color,
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  Speaker 2: so they resemble butter. We can pretty much discard that one.
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  Speaker 2: The other one is that there was a folk belief
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  Speaker 2: that they stole butter, that they were just kind of
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  Speaker 2: some sort of supernatural spirit in a butterfly form to
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  Speaker 2: come and steal your milk in your butter. And there's
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  Speaker 2: evidence of that in other nearby languages. I think the
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  Speaker 2: Germans called butterflies milk.
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  Speaker 1: Thieves and butterfairy almost.
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  Speaker 2: Yes, and then the Dutch and the Germans have a
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  Speaker 2: word for butterfly that means butter witch. So that's probably
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: why butterflies are called that, because they used to think
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  Speaker 2: that they stole butter.
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: Well, you know who it was the whole time, it
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  Speaker 1: was Grandpa night eating.
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he could get one cc of blood through those arteries.
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: They were so clogged he was he was on ambient.
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: Does it does it say when the name more for
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: my wife into flutterfly.
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  Speaker 2: They actually used to think or something like, it's a
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: pretty strange idea that they are called butterflies rather than flutterbys,
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: because that makes more sense. So Emily's kind of taking
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: it in a much smarter direction. But it's interesting. She
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  Speaker 2: probably just doesn't know the fact that they're actually witches
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  Speaker 2: in disguise who are out to steal butter and milk.
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, she's always she still calls them fltterflies.
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: Just does she call spaghetti pasquetti?
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: No? No, just flutterflies. Can we talk about their their
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: bodies now?
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  Speaker 2: Yes? Yes, thank you for indulging me. I feel so indulged.
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  Speaker 1: Sure. So, like we mentioned, the head, the thorax, and
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  Speaker 1: the abdomen of the butterfly will look a lot like
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: a caterpillar in some ways if you hold them up
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  Speaker 1: next to each other, and that's about it. For one,
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  Speaker 1: a butterfly can see a lot better than a caterpillar.
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  Speaker 1: Can I get the idea that it still doesn't have like,
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: you know, like great vision. But caterpillars, remember, we're essentially blind.
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  Speaker 1: Butterflies at least have these compound eyes and they can
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  Speaker 1: detect color. And I think we said the caterpillar could
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: only see black and white. They can detect movement as well.
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  Speaker 1: But when it comes to the star of the show,
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: as far as butterfly parts go, it's those antennae.
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  Speaker 2: Well, hold on, before we move on, I've got one
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  Speaker 2: about the eyes too. You know, the monarch butterfly like
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: basically the quintessential butterfly. Sure, they have twelve thousand eyes,
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  Speaker 2: both compound and simple, and they go basically all the
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  Speaker 2: way around their head.
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  Speaker 1: It's a lot of eyes.
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  Speaker 2: They can see into your soul.
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  Speaker 1: And that's why they Maybe that's why they're so great,
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  Speaker 1: migrating every year and such large numbers.
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  Speaker 2: Possibly, I think we talked about in our animal Migration episode.
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  Speaker 2: We talked about monarch butterfly migration, and I think we
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: said one of the reasons why they're able to make
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  Speaker 2: it from eastern Canada all the way down to northwest
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: Mexico is because they are they navigate using UV they
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: see in the UV.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's that it's that sun. And that's kind of
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  Speaker 1: brings me back around to antennae. These things are amazing.
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  Speaker 1: They they get their sense of direction from the position
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  Speaker 1: of the sun, so they are literally navigating by the
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: position of the sun. The antennae also act as light receptors,
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  Speaker 1: obviously to tract the sun. They're highly attuned to odors.
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  Speaker 1: Those antenna are great smellers. They sense pheromones during times
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  Speaker 1: of mating, and they can even sense these antennae the
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  Speaker 1: beat of wings of butterflies of the same species.
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  Speaker 2: During amazing, just the antennae, just the antennae. Well, how
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  Speaker 2: about the labial palps.
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  Speaker 1: Well, yeah, those are if you if you look at
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  Speaker 1: a close up of a butterfly, and they can take
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  Speaker 1: kind of different positions, but usually I've seen them they
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  Speaker 1: look like kind of little hairy tusks coming out.
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  Speaker 2: Coming out of what chuck coming out of.
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  Speaker 1: Their their head well near the mouth parts.
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  Speaker 2: Yeaping thing. Okay, it's now officially a Tracy Wilson article.
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: That's right.
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  Speaker 2: So they apparently are like this is food. This isn't food.
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  Speaker 2: This is food, but they don't eat with the labial palps.
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  Speaker 2: It's just a way of sensing food. What they eat
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  Speaker 2: with is their proboscis and that's the long kind of
• 9:27
  Speaker 2: tongue like appendage that they suck nectar with.
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: That's right, I got one more thing on the labial palps.
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  Speaker 2: So, oh okay.
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  Speaker 1: They they've kind of surmised that it detects food. That
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  Speaker 1: the function was is fairly unknown, but I think they've
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  Speaker 1: learned I'm not sure how recently that they can those
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: labial palps detect CO two in the air. Oh, neat
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: as well, and they think that might be the main function.
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  Speaker 2: Oh that's really cool.
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: Who knows?
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: So instead of seeing red or green, they have the
• 9:56
  Speaker 2: labial palps that detect I guess two. That was a
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: reference to a reality episode.
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, So what part did you move to?
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: I moved on to their proboscis.
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: Oh, everyone loves a good prescos and the uh, the
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: butterfly proboscos is interesting because when the butterfly comes out,
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: and we'll talk about this morn in a second, it's
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: almost like it should have a label that says some
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: assembly required. Yeah, because they got to do some stuff
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: before they can really do their butterfly thing. And one
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: of those things is literally almost like screwing together their proscis.
• 10:33
  Speaker 2: Mm hmm. Yeah, they have two parts of their proboscis
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  Speaker 2: that they have to connect in order to start eating.
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: So that's one of the first things that they do
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: when they e close from their chrysalis.
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: E close. It's a great name.
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: Now, it sounds like Apple has trademarked it or something.
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: And we'll talk more about the proboscos as we go,
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: but we do need to mention their legs. If you remember,
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: the caterpillars have six real legs and then a bunch
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: of pro legs. The butterfly says, I don't need those
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: pro legs anymore because I'm flying basically, but I've still
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: got those six legs. I've got a set of four legs,
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: some middle legs and some hind legs. And these things
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: are pretty they're more than just legs as well, because
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: they will land on something and they're looking for dissolving
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: sugars basically to eat, and they're looking for that with
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: their legs.
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And also you'll probably see fairly commonly that there
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: are some butterfly species that only have two pairs of legs,
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: and that's not true, they actually have six, but one
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: pair is basically shriveled almost to nothingness.
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: And by the way, I should clear up when I
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: say their legs are looking for dissolving sugars, they're not
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: doing it by feel like they are taste organs in
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: their feet.
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they can taste through all sorts of different organs.
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: It's pretty cool. They apparently when they're they step in
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: like some dissolving sugar, their proboscis uncoils involuntarily and it
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: just starts sipping nectar immediately. Oh man, so you better
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: hope that your your legs are finely attuned to sugar
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: and you don't accidentally suck up some really gross stuff. Yeah,
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: you know, like, oh it was puss right.
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: Oh my god, Oh, the worst word. It's the worst.
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: It's pretty bad and hygenic utensil.
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: Though, Like, what are the odds that one of the
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: grossest things has the grossest word.
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I wonder if that was intentional?
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like, what is that?
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: Ugh?
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: Puss?
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: Does that sound gross enough? Sure, let's go with it.
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: We please stop talking about puss.
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: Sure, Webster the wings, We're going to talk about a lot.
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: We did a whole episode on the iridescence of butterfly wings.
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: So we're not going to really get into it here,
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: but if you want to learn about iridescence, it's very
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: complex and complicated and deserved its own episode many years ago.
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but the opshot is the structure of the scales.
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: They're transparent, multi layered, and they reflect and amplify light
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: multiple times. That was a really cool episode if I
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: remember correctly.
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: It was, and it was a tough one if I
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: remember to like absorb.
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: Yes, but we did such a great job of it.
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: I would like to say we probably just knocked it
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: out of the park.
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: Really, I think so too. But the butterfly wings are
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: made of it's transparents called kiten. If you've heard of
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: kitenre you're probably just alive on the earth because it
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: is one of the most abundant polysaccharides in nature. It's
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: I think the second most abundant. It's all over the place.
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: Their wings are made of that kitan, and they have
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: those sort of vein like structures that you can if
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: you look at their wings closely. Don't touch them though,
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: please no, we talked about that in that episode. But
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: they have those four wings that are obviously toward the
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: front and they are basically triangular, and then the hind
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: wings toward the button and they kind of look like
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: little seashells.
• 14:02
  Speaker 2: Yes, and they're like you said, don't touch them. They're very,
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: very delicate, and those veins are species specific, so that's
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: one of the ways that they use to recognize one
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: another when they're mating as well.
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think butterflies cannot repair their wings, isn't
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: that correct?
• 14:19
  Speaker 2: Yes, they have no means of doing that. They have
• 14:22
  Speaker 2: no car shield for wings.
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: But I don't think it kills them. But if a
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: butterfly can't fly, that's probably ultimately a death sentence, right.
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: That's my guess. It would make them easy prey at
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: the very least.
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's kind of the deal. When they
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: say a butterfly will die if you touch their wings, Yes,
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: it will die quicker.
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: There's something that a butterfly that's recently e closed and
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: a baby that's just been born have in common. Do
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: you know what it is?
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: Mmm? Maybe, but go ahead.
• 14:52
  Speaker 2: They both poop out in a meconium.
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: Oh sure, a human baby yeah, yeah, yeah, maconium. Is
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: that that first poop that they take and in this case,
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: the butterfly is pooping what it last eight as a caterpillar.
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: That's so cool.
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: It is really cool.
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: It's usually red bright red, almost looks like blood. But
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: the butterfly poops that out. That's one of the first
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: things it does. It has to clean off all of
• 15:20
  Speaker 2: its organs, its feet to make sure it's sugar finding
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: not puss finding, clean off its antennas, put its proboscis
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: together again, let its wings dry out. I saw, and
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: I don't think we mentioned in the Caterpillar episode that
• 15:34
  Speaker 2: in its last in star it has wings already. They're
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: just folded up under its skin that they develop even
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: further in the chrysalis. But when they're when they come out,
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: they're soaking wet because the butterfly was goo not too
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: long ago, and they have to spread them out and
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: let them dry in the sun before they can fly.
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: So they're doing all of this like self care, basically
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: a morning at the spa after they're born.
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but they can't just like flop their wings open immediately.
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: They actually have to pump them up, almost like an
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: air pump inflating a raft or something, or some high stops, yeah,
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: or some oh man, remember those. That's so funny. What
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: a scam.
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: That was a scam, right, I'm quite sure you could
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: break your ankle in that just as easily as any
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: other shoe. Sure.
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it may give you like a little tighter fit
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: or something. I don't know about that.
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: Uh.
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: And for people that are our younger or younger listeners,
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: if you don't know who Milli Vanilli was or pump
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: up basketball shoes, there were I think Rebock.
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: Right, pretty sure it was Rebock.
• 16:39
  Speaker 1: Had basketball shoes that on the tongue had a little
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: basketball that was a little pump, and you would put
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: on your shoes, tie them up, and then press that
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: pump a bunch of times, and it would fill some
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: cavities with air, I guess, and make your shoes tighter.
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, especially around your ankle. It was meant to give
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: you extra ankle support so you could daunt easier, even
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: though you've never donked in your life.
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: That's right. But they had Spudweb repping them, so oh yeah, yeah,
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: I think he. I think he was one of their
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: pitch guys for a little while. Okay, cool, but anyway,
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: the butterfly Wait.
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: Wait, should we explain who spud web.
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: He was a diminutive NBA player for the hostod Land
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: to get his autograph one time. Yeah.
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: Nice.
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: They pump their wings out, but not with air. There's
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: a fluid that they pump through these those two black
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: veins we were talking about, and just sort of inflate
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: them out, and like you said, they just get all
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: cleaned up and ready to fly.
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: Yes, And then once they're all ready, they start flying
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: and they realize very quickly, up it's not a very
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: good day to fly. And I say, we take a
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: break and come back and explain just what in the
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: holy heck I'm talking about?
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: All right, what in the holy heck are you talking about?
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: Oh well, let me explain, Chuck. It turns out that butterflies,
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: while being pretty hardy individuals, at least as far as
• 18:19
  Speaker 2: insects are concerned, on that level, they're also very delicate,
• 18:23
  Speaker 2: like we talked about with their wings, and even beyond
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: their wings, getting like a rain drop driving through it,
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: that can happen, or say like strong wind tattering it.
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: That's a big problem for a butterfly. Just the temperature,
• 18:39
  Speaker 2: the ambient temperature has a tremendous effect on them. Not
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: just because they're ectotherms, meaning they're like a lizard. They
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: rely on the ambient temperature to warm themselves or cool
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: themselves off. Their muscles just simply will not function when
• 18:54
  Speaker 2: it drops below a certain temperature.
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think Tracy points out they work best when
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: their internal temperature is about eighty two fahrenheit twenty eight celsius.
• 19:05
  Speaker 1: And you know, they use these wings for flying, which
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: is great, but you might think like, oh, it's no
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: big deal if it's cold, they just kind of hunker down.
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: But they also use these wings to do all kinds
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: of like cool things, like, namely to scare away predators.
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: They can do all sorts of like they can make
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: eyes where it looks like a scary face, kind of
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: like their little caterpillar former selves can look like snakes.
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: They can flash these bright colors that a lot of
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: times say get away predator. And if they can't move
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: their wings, it's not just that they can't fly, but
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: they can't defend themselves or disguise themselves. So it means
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: that when it's cold outside, or when it's two windy
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: or rainy or something, then they're way more vulnerable to
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: prey for sure, or as prey.
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: Right but even prey could probably get them. That's how
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: vulnerable they are, so for sure. So you'll often see
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: like butterflies is kind of bask in the sun. I've
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: always wondered what they're doing, Like they just seem like
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: they're they don't know what to do next. That's how
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: it's always struck me. For some reason, they're thinking of
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: their next move, but in reality, they're just sitting there
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: getting warmed up by the sun so they can fly
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: to another spot. And if you stop and think about it,
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: the next time you see a butterfly basking in the sun,
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: I'll bet it's below eighty degrees out and the butterflies
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: having to warm itself so it can fly on to
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: the next flower to eat or rest or whatever.
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a good point. They do take shelter at
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: night when it gets chilly. That's why you don't see
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: butterflies flying around at night mainly. And like you said,
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: they're what are daytime dwellers called diurnal diurnal day urinal? Yeah,
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: day ernal? Is that how you remember it?
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: Now? It is?
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: Okay, you do remember it. That's how I need to
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: remember it, right, But yeah, they bass those wings, they'll
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: sit on rocks they shelter at night sometimes that they
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: will actually do like a kind of like human shiver
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: to warm up. They can kind of shake their butterfly
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: wings to get their muscles warmed up to fly. They
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: just can't go out cold. They gotta do a little
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: warm up first.
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: It's like that knee hike thing. Live their knees really
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: really high, like in place a bunch of times.
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that soccer players do. Yeah, like that ted Lasso guy.
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: Right, then there's a name for that. But don't bother
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: emailing us with it. We can figure it out ourselves.
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: They also can use those wings as little reflectors, like
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: you know how in the nineteen fifties and sixties people
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: would sit out in the sun with those reflectors under
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: their neck to reflect sun back on their faces. They
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: can use their wings to do that to their body
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: and warm it.
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: Up, right, which is pretty cool. They can also they
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: can also keep the sun from warming them up when
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: it's too hot out. They'll fold their wings together and
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: just present like the edge, the outer edge of their
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: wings to the sun, so there's much less surface area.
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And they, like
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: you said, when you see them sitting they're probably not
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: sitting for long. They're probably sitting just so they can
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: get it going to fly again very shortly.
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: Exactly so, even though they're sitting there, warming themselves up
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: to move from flower to flower even and that's typically
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: what you see. There's a lot of species I see
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: at least two hundred that migrate over very long distances,
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: and monarchs are the ones that they're like the money,
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: the money butterfly that everybody knows about. But one of
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: the reasons why is because they migrate so far. Again,
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: they migrate from eastern Canada to northwest Mexico. It takes
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: eight months, and not a single butterfly that starts that
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: journey is alive at the end. So it's like you
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: look at the butterfly. By the way, the butterfly flock
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: or a group of butterflies is called the kaleidoscope. M
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: I love that also, that's the official one. They're also
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: called flutter, shimmer, and rainbow of butterflies.
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: Okay, a flutter of butterflies, yep.
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: But you look at the kaleidoscope of butterflies, it's like
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: a single organism in each individual butterfly that lives and
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: dies and reproduces, not necessarily in that order, as kind
• 23:22
  Speaker 2: of like cells that function and make up the larger hole.
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: But it's really a bunch of individual butterflies flying together
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: but migrating as a whole down from eastern Canada to
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: northwest Mexico.
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I guess since we're there, there was a
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: big deforestation, illegal deforestation, logging operation in Mexico at the
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: Butterfly Biosphere Reserve in twenty fifteen and they got like
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: I can't remember, like thirty or forty acres of land
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: just cut down before anyone knew what was going on.
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: And since then, and we can't get into it here
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: because it's really complex, but they have this very involved
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: plan that they've been enacting since then of reforestation, including
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: something called assisted migration that I don't fully understand yet,
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: but I'm going to look into it more.
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: They just drive slowly by some butterflies and swipe them
• 24:15
  Speaker 2: into the car and drive them halfway.
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: Well, things are better now, but there were a billion
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: butterflies in that migration in nineteen ninety six, and in
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: I think twenty sixteen that was down to thirty five
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: million from a billion, and I think has since gone
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: up due to these efforts.
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: But that's good.
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, then you know, butterflies, if you take down where
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: they're trying to get to, then they're going to die.
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's that Biosphere Reserve is a UNESCO World
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: Heritage Site and you can go visit it. But apparently
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: when the number of butterflies that show up are in
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: the billions, the branches that they're sitting on bend under
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: the weight of butterflies, that's how many butterflies there are
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: are sometimes. But yes, it's very problematic that there's fewer
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: and fewer. I'm glad to hear that it's kind of
• 25:06
  Speaker 2: bounced back a little bit, but they're still under I
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: don't know if they're endangered or just critical right now,
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: but there's there's something to keep an eye on, as
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: we'll see, because they're an indicator species.
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: They are, and they're also pollinators. They're not, you know,
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: the best pollinators, but they're pretty good. They're not like bees.
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: I mean, bees were made to pollinate. They wear shirts
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: that they do, they wear be shirts. But the some butterflies,
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: some butterflies don't spread pollen at all. They just love
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: that nectar. But generally butterflies are looked at as polleners,
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: and they have that proboscis. Like you said, that's just
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: it's made for diving deep into those flowers and getting
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: all that sweet stuff. But butterflies have lots of dietary needs.
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: They can't just get by on that sweet, sweet sugar.
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: They need minerals and stuff, and they get this in
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: a variety of interesting ways.
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, one is puddles. They'll just descend on a
• 26:07
  Speaker 2: puddle that's bare dirt. I don't think asphalt would work,
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: so yeah, it's kind of gross to think about. But
• 26:14
  Speaker 2: the minerals from the dirt and the soil leach into
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: the puddle, and the butterflies suck up those minerals through
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: the puddle, and apparently if there's not enough minerals for
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: their liking, they'll actually flutter off real quick and then
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: come back to the puddle, and just that little butterfly
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: movement is enough disturbance of the water to bring some
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: extra minerals to the surface of the puddle for them
• 26:38
  Speaker 2: to drink and to create a hurricane in Belize.
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: Right, if there's no water, it's pretty gross. If it
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: gets pretty bad, they will resort to puking onto the
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: soil and then drinking that mineral puke.
• 26:57
  Speaker 2: I took it more as spit.
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: One man's other man's that's right.
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: But yeah, they need the minerals, the nutrients, and it's
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: just not enough for the nectar.
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. They've done some studies because they'll they'll eat fruit.
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: They'll eat rotten fruit on the ground, or they will
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: get on a piece of fruit. They will stomp on
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: it with their little feet ye to try and tenderize
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: it a little bit, and then jab it with that
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: proboscis and drink it up. And they've done studies that
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: have found that the fruit eaters live longer and are
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: better at reproducing in studies because they I think it
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: was the monarchs. Even they fed them either mash banana
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: or sugar, and the ones that ate the mash banana
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: laid almost two times as many eggs, and those eggs
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: were bigger and like more robust and vital as well.
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I also read that they tend to be easier
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: going in social situations and are more well liked by
• 27:58
  Speaker 2: their peers.
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: The fruit. Oh wow.
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: So there's a couple other places that they can get
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: nutrients and minerals, dung, and urine. Butterflies are not above that,
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: especially if they need it really badly. But the when
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: they're getting it from a puddle, it's called puddling. There's
• 28:18
  Speaker 2: just so many great words around butterflies. And there's a
• 28:21
  Speaker 2: specific word for butterflies pollinating plants. It's called psychophily, like psychophillly,
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: but with one l okay. Specifically, butterflies pollinating plants is psychophily.
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: I love that.
• 28:34
  Speaker 2: I thought you would. I found that and I was like,
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: fuck's gonna love this.
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: The sexy stuff you mentioned. They you know, butterflies love
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: to try and reproduce, and they reproduce like a lot
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: of animals. They they join themselves. They join end to
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: end at the abdomen. I think the male has a
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: like clasps clasps down on the female to make sure
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: they stay together. And there is sperm from the male
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: that is eventually going to fertilize the eggs of a female.
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: But not like you would think, it's pretty remarkable because
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: what they do is they well, first of all, they
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: have to recognize each other, like I said, using those antennae,
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: they recognize themselves as the same species or whatever. And
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: through their pheromones as well, which is also the antennae,
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: and then the male delivers a spermatophore, so it's like, hey,
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: I don't just have sperm for you. I've packaged it
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: up in a little package for you, and it's got
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: all these other minerals and nutrients that you love that
• 29:37
  Speaker 1: will help you in this fertilization process. And they will
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: take extra time to get an extra good spermatophore package
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: ready to be an extra attractive mate. The good ones
• 29:49
  Speaker 1: will sure.
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: So I guess the female butterflies when they fertilize their eggs,
• 29:59
  Speaker 2: they use the the last sperm that was inserted to them,
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: the last spermatophor package.
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: So there are some species where the male will basically
• 30:11
  Speaker 2: close up shop after he's inserted a spermataphor with kind
• 30:15
  Speaker 2: of like a sticky substance that prevents more sperm from
• 30:18
  Speaker 2: going in. So his sperm is the most recent sperm.
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's not very cool at all. But I guess
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: that guy's also like, you know what am I doing
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: giving you my spermataphor if you're just gonna use the
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: latest spermataphor that you got.
• 30:31
  Speaker 2: Exactly I went to a lot of trouble combining the spermatophoor.
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like, look at this stuff. Look at all these minerals.
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: I also saw that some of the males in some
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: species will spray them with an off putting scent. Huh,
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: so no other butterflies will want them. There are mating
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: dances that they'll do, and they, you know, when the
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: female gets this spermataphor, they put it in their bursa
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: and then they wait until they're ready to lay their eggs.
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: And they actually lay the eggs first and then use
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: the sperm to fertilize them once they have laid the eggs,
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: which is also I think pretty unusual in the insect kingdom.
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: Right, I don't know. For some reason, I had the
• 31:12
  Speaker 2: impression that they were fertilizing each egg as they were
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: coming out, kind of like a pez dispenser. Yeah.
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what I mean though, But they're not, like
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: they're not fertilized in the body.
• 31:24
  Speaker 2: I see what you're saying. They're fertilized externally.
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, sure, that's the word.
• 31:30
  Speaker 2: One other thing you talked about terrible smells. I turned
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: up that there some pheromones are pleasant smelling to humans. Specifically,
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: let me tell you about the green vein white butterfly.
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: Let's hear it.
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: It puts together lemon oil for all intents and purposes.
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: It has the same chemical composition as lemon oil, but
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: it's the pheromone it produces to attract a mate. And
• 31:53
  Speaker 2: I got to tell you, lemon oil is a pretty
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: great smell. It would attract me too.
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: I love it.
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: So if you ever smell a great vein white during
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: mating season, you're gonna smell some lemon oil.
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: The gestation periods about three days, and they lay anywhere
• 32:09
  Speaker 1: from ten to three hundred eggs in clusters over a
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: two to four week period.
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: Oh wow, it's that long.
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it can't. Yeah, two to four weeks and these eggs,
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: you know, they lay that many because it's tough for
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: these eggs to survive into adulthood. They got to be
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: the temperature's got to be just right, humidity's got to
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: be just right. They can rot very easily if it's
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: too wet. If it's not wet enough, they're going to
• 32:36
  Speaker 1: dry out. And then of course there's all those predators
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: that are just dying to eat those butterfly eggs.
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: They need to find the goldilock zone with the humidity
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: for the eggs.
• 32:45
  Speaker 1: That's right, they do.
• 32:47
  Speaker 2: So they also make sure that they put the eggs
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: on their baby's favorite food, which is a certain kind
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: of plant. Their butterflies are very frequently indiscriminate pollinators. They
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: just go from plant to plant. But there are also
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: plenty of species that are very plant specific, and those
• 33:04
  Speaker 2: are the ones where they will not only eat that
• 33:07
  Speaker 2: plant while they're caterpillars, they were probably born on that
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: same plant as well.
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: We used to have a butterfly bush in our yard
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: that was those things get really big and out of control,
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: kind of in a we have sort of a wild
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: garden anyway. It's not like a you know, super manicure
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: like English type garden. It's kind of a crazy, fun garden.
• 33:26
  Speaker 1: So it fit in the garden and we had tons
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: and tons of butterflies. But it went away. And I
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: don't know if it was because I think some people,
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: well I think it could be an invasive species, and
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: a lot of people say, like they'll play it the
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: butterfly bush, but we had one for a while but
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: don't now, so Emily may have taken it down for
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: that reason.
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: So the reason it's considered invasive and harmful the butterflies
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: is it produces tons of nectar, but it has no
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: value in supporting eggs or the life cycle of it
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: other than nectar for adults, And so it's a distract
• 34:00
  Speaker 2: from native plants that do provide not just nectar but
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: also shelter and a place to lay their eggs. So
• 34:07
  Speaker 2: it actually disrupts the life cycle of local butterflies. Even
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: though it's a butterfly bush and they love it, it's
• 34:12
  Speaker 2: actually bad for them. So I have to go cut
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: down mine after this.
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: Even if you have a lot of those natives nearby,
• 34:19
  Speaker 1: like as a whole, it's still bad, yes.
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: Because it's a distraction because it's so chuck full of
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: nectar that they go to that one instead and just
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: die off.
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: Well, some distractions are okay, right, like television.
• 34:31
  Speaker 2: Sure, you could put a TV with an extension cord
• 34:33
  Speaker 2: out in your butterfly garden. That's not going to harm them.
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: If you have a butterfly bush, you have to chop
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: it down. I command you, all right.
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: They're really pretty though, and it's fun to see other butterflies,
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: But yeah, I get you.
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: In the But wait until you've planted other plants, which
• 34:49
  Speaker 2: we'll talk about, and then you can chop down your
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: butterfly bush.
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: All right, Well, let's take a break or second break,
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: and we'll talk a little bit more about what's going
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: on with a butterf population and the butterfly gardens right
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: after this. Okay, Well, we talked already about the monarchs
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: and how they had been hit hard from the illegal
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: logging going on in Mexico in the mid twenty tens,
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: and in general, butterflies are doing okay, but there are
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: some you know, pesticides and things like that. I think
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: one of the other big reasons besides the logging for
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: that migration of the monarchs, I think pesticides has killed
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: a lot of milkweed, which I think the monarchs love.
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: So pesticides are a big threat. And it's not like
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: I'm just going to spray this one little part of
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: my garden, Like pesticides in your garden in one part
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: of your garden generally means it's in most parts of
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: your garden.
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it travels very easily. But on top of that,
• 36:10
  Speaker 2: butterflies are extremely sensitive to pesticides. So I don't know
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: about herbicides, but definitely pesticides, So if you are going
• 36:18
  Speaker 2: to plan a butterfly garden, you want to use natural
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: pest defenses. But that's a big thing that's killing off
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: butterflies and bees too.
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: And then also we talked about it in the last episode.
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: A lot of people think of caterpillars as pests. It's like, oh,
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: you ate some of them, I lettuce, I'm going to
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: kill all of you. That kills butterflies too. They never
• 36:38
  Speaker 2: make it to be adult butterflies, and you've just disrupted
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: generations of butterflies that could have been So when you
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: put all that together, humans have not been super good
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: for butterflies. Did you mention urbanization and roads too? Now
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: those are a problem. Like anytime we build somewhere, we
• 36:57
  Speaker 2: destroy plants, and those often are butterflies or that's a
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: butterfly habitat. And then the roads that we have, the
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: marginal land alongside of the roads are often like great
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: places for butterfly centric plants to grow. But that means
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: that the butterflies are very close to cars that are
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: going seventy eighty miles an hour, which is never good
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: for the butterfly when they come in contact with them. So, yeah,
• 37:21
  Speaker 2: like I was saying, humans have been kind of bad
• 37:23
  Speaker 2: for butterflies, but fortunately we're starting to wake up and
• 37:27
  Speaker 2: see the value in butterflies goes beyond like let's put
• 37:30
  Speaker 2: that thing on a stamp, Like, there's there's more value
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: to the butterfly than just its esthetic beauty. But that
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: makes it plenty valuable in and of itself.
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: I wonder if butterflies and other insects would ever if
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: natural selection would be such that they would learn to
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: fly higher than the height of an average car.
• 37:51
  Speaker 2: Sure, I could see that, but then they run into
• 37:53
  Speaker 2: semis and they're like, it's going to take millions more
• 37:57
  Speaker 2: years to get higher than a semi.
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a good point.
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: Maybe they'll figure out how to fly under cars very quickly.
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: Okay, that collecting butterflies is, believe it or not, another
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: thing that has hit the butterfly population. Butterfly collecting butterflies
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: is a thing. Hunting butterflies and putting them behind glass
• 38:21
  Speaker 1: in your office is a thing that some people are
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: really into. And I don't know a lot about that,
• 38:28
  Speaker 1: but I do know that that there are certain species
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: that are endangered, and part of the problem is over collecting.
• 38:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and the more rare a butterfly species gets, the
• 38:40
  Speaker 2: more desirable it is for collectors, and the more collecting
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: harms that population because it's so small. So or a burros,
• 38:49
  Speaker 2: but the worst kind.
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I imagine we'll hear from some collectors who
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: who can tell us that there are responsible ways of
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: doing this. I really don't know enough about it to
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: speak to it, but I'm not gonna click butterflies, That's
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: all I'm gonna say.
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I wonder if it's one of those things like ivory,
• 39:04
  Speaker 2: where it's like, Okay, this happened, this is done, Like
• 39:07
  Speaker 2: these things are are out there and we're not just
• 39:12
  Speaker 2: gonna throw them away. That's an even bigger waste. So
• 39:17
  Speaker 2: like antique ivory or antique taxidermy, butterflies are legal, but
• 39:21
  Speaker 2: anything new is illegal. I wonder if it's treated like
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: that or what. But I get the impression that butterflies
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: don't have that much legal protection. I think they do
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: on paper, but it's very rarely enforced.
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I guess if you find one in the ground
• 39:36
  Speaker 1: or something that's uh, you know that for your collection.
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: Sure not sunning on a rock, but you know dead right.
• 39:43
  Speaker 2: Sure it just fell over of old age.
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: Uh, should we talk about butterfly gardens here at the end.
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because one of the things people are doing or saying, like, hey, butterflies,
• 39:53
  Speaker 2: we got to save these butterflies. If we don't, things
• 39:57
  Speaker 2: are gonna go pear shaped even more. And so people
• 39:59
  Speaker 2: are starting to plant butterfly gardens.
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because I think you said they're a big indicator
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: of like, if butterflies are dying off all around you,
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: that's a big indicator of how your local ecosystem is doing,
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: in large part.
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: The canary and the coal mine.
• 40:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. And butterfly gardens are beautiful and it doesn't
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: take a lot. You need some plants, and you're gonna
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: want plants. Well, you're gonna want to find out what
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: kind of butterflies you have around you.
• 40:24
  Speaker 2: That's a big one.
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: You can look with your eyeballs and then cross reference,
• 40:28
  Speaker 1: or you can just look it up on the internet,
• 40:30
  Speaker 1: and then you want to find out what kind of
• 40:31
  Speaker 1: plants those butterflies love that are native to your area
• 40:35
  Speaker 1: and plant those.
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: Chuck. When I was researching this, all I wanted to
• 40:39
  Speaker 2: do was be done with this episode so I can
• 40:41
  Speaker 2: go garden.
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: Oh. I love that Emily's gardening. I'm looking at it
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: right now, is gardening outside?
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: Well, pound on your window and tell her I'm jealous
• 40:49
  Speaker 2: of her.
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: We got I put it on my Instagram. I don't
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: know if you saw it, but I saw a huge,
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: well it's not that big, but a hornet's nest in
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: our backyard yesterday. That is the coolest, most beautiful thing.
• 41:04
  Speaker 1: I'm kind of tucked in a magnolia branch about only
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: four feet off the ground. Yeah, And I'm glad I
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: saw it because I was about to go do some
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: trimming of my box woods right behind it in a
• 41:15
  Speaker 1: few days and I would have bumped right into that thing.
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: So, oh boy.
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: Now we're just going to steer clear of it until
• 41:21
  Speaker 1: it is out of season and then hopefully try and
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: preserve it. But hornets ness are so cool looking, and
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: I just love that we have one back there. We
• 41:29
  Speaker 1: got a crazy backyard full of all kinds of critters.
• 41:32
  Speaker 2: Does it look like a mummy's head? Sometimes it looks.
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: It looks like a sort of a mummy's head, But
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: if it was an alien mummy, because it's like top heavy,
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: and it looks like it has a little mouth at
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: the bottom. You know, their little door. Yeah, I'll send
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: you a picture, it's cool.
• 41:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, or I can just go on Instagram like everybody else.
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: Now you get text privies.
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: Thanks man.
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: What else about the butterfly guarden? You need water, right, Yeah?
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: Remember they like to drink minerals from puddles, So if
• 42:01
  Speaker 2: you have a little bit of water dripping that forms
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: a puddle in the soil, that's definitely gonna help them.
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: You want rocks for them to sun on. A big one, Chuck,
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: is you want to use native plants. I know you
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: and Emily are like big into that, and I feel
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: like people, including myself, are really waking up to just
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: how bad for the local ecosystem like non native plants are,
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: and to use native plants whenever you can when you're
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: building a butterfly garden. It's crucial because even plants within
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: the same species can be harmful to butterflies. Yeah, and
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: I have an example if you'll allow me. Sure, So,
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: butterflies in Florida and Georgia in the southeast in general,
• 42:43
  Speaker 2: I think, are very very keen on what's called butterfly weed.
• 42:48
  Speaker 2: It's what monarchs love. It's that very tiny, multi flowered,
• 42:52
  Speaker 2: orange flowered weed. It's a type of milk weed. Okay, yeah,
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: that's native. There's another kind of milkweed called tropical milk
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: weed that does just fine in Florida and Georgia in
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: the southeast too, but it's not native. And the problem
• 43:08
  Speaker 2: with putting that in your butterfly garden into the Southeast
• 43:12
  Speaker 2: is that it blooms so late into the season that
• 43:17
  Speaker 2: butterflies will keep reproducing and entire parts of the population
• 43:21
  Speaker 2: will freeze to death because they've gone beyond their natural
• 43:25
  Speaker 2: reproductive window. And then furthermore, when the temperature drops a
• 43:30
  Speaker 2: little bit, they're more susceptible to a specific kind of
• 43:33
  Speaker 2: protozoan parasite called ot or oe I. Can't remember that
• 43:38
  Speaker 2: they wouldn't otherwise be if they were just on the
• 43:41
  Speaker 2: native milkweed rather than the tropical milkweed. So like, that's
• 43:45
  Speaker 2: how much attention you really should be paying to your
• 43:47
  Speaker 2: butterfly garden, because you can inadvertently harm them while you're
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: doing something you think is good for them, like putting
• 43:52
  Speaker 2: a butterfly bush out there. Everybody would think, like, that's great,
• 43:56
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna put a butterfly bush out and I can
• 43:58
  Speaker 2: pretty much call myself Gandhi from here on out the butterflies.
• 44:02
  Speaker 2: But it turns out you're harming them. So it's definitely
• 44:04
  Speaker 2: something that you need to take some research for. But
• 44:06
  Speaker 2: it's the kind of research that it's like an invitation
• 44:10
  Speaker 2: to go, like immerse yourself in the natural world in
• 44:12
  Speaker 2: all of the best ways.
• 44:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Boy, that butterfly weed is beautiful.
• 44:17
  Speaker 2: Yes it is, and it's native to Georgia. So you
• 44:20
  Speaker 2: just plan it all you.
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: Like, you know what, I'm gonna go tell Emily like, oh,
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: this butterfly milkweed and shes gonna be like it's right
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: behind you, coming right.
• 44:27
  Speaker 2: But it's not only a food source, it's a it's
• 44:29
  Speaker 2: like a place where monarchs lay their eggs. So you
• 44:31
  Speaker 2: will have butterflies like living in your garden. I mean
• 44:35
  Speaker 2: they'll fly to Mexico eventually, but they'll hang out there
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: for a while. Yeah.
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: I mean that's the cool thing about the butterfly garden too.
• 44:41
  Speaker 1: If you if you do it right, then you're you're
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: gonna have butterflies in your yard. And not only that,
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: but butterflies are gonna like word gets around and it'll
• 44:52
  Speaker 1: become a place for butterflies. It'll become like a haven
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: for butterflies, and they don't. They don't generally, I mean
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: the ones who migrate migrate. But other than that, you
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: could have you could have butterflies families living their whole
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: life back there in your backyard.
• 45:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And speaking of backyards, I've got a backyard. A
• 45:08
  Speaker 2: lower part of my backyard is kind of wild. I
• 45:11
  Speaker 2: keep it wild, like I don't know it very often,
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: and there's lots of weeds and like little clovers and
• 45:16
  Speaker 2: stuff growing. So I've left it there for the beds,
• 45:19
  Speaker 2: the birds and the bees and all that and the butterflies.
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: But I'm going full on, man, I'm going to let
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: Oh yes, it's gonna be all butterflies, like up to
• 45:27
  Speaker 2: your hips butterfly stuff. I cannot wait to go plan it.
• 45:31
  Speaker 2: It's I'm really looking forward to it because it's really
• 45:34
  Speaker 2: goes right up to the edge of some woods too,
• 45:36
  Speaker 2: so it's gonna be amazing.
• 45:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, there's something we really love like leading green spaces
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: and making it an invitation for animals, you know, like
• 45:49
  Speaker 1: I got my camp up there in North Georgia, and
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: like all of North Georgia is just being torn down
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: for neighborhoods and and or and you know, if you're
• 45:57
  Speaker 1: a hunter. Let's fine that that's your thing. I'm not
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: into it. And we love that we have this acreage
• 46:02
  Speaker 1: where we're just like, tell your dear buddies this to
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: come to our land setup shop here. No one will
• 46:09
  Speaker 1: be shooting you, and spread the word everybody. We have.
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: We have a safe space for all you critters out here.
• 46:16
  Speaker 2: Yes, except for humans, because it's also a most dangerous
• 46:20
  Speaker 2: game type setup. You got going there?
• 46:21
  Speaker 1: Huh well sure the weekends.
• 46:24
  Speaker 2: Right. Let's see one more thing about butterflies. There is
• 46:28
  Speaker 2: an amazing fact that I think we can end on.
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: How about that, Let's do it.
• 46:32
  Speaker 2: They're frequently cited as inspiring the discovery of the RH
• 46:38
  Speaker 2: blood factor, which is a type of subtype of blood types,
• 46:42
  Speaker 2: and it actually cured what's known as Rhese's hemolytic disease,
• 46:46
  Speaker 2: which is where a baby has a positive RH blood
• 46:49
  Speaker 2: type and is born from a mother with a negative
• 46:52
  Speaker 2: RH blood type and its immune system starts attacking its blood.
• 46:56
  Speaker 2: Not good, but the discover of the R blood factor.
• 47:01
  Speaker 2: His name is Sir Cyril Clark, and he was big
• 47:03
  Speaker 2: time in the butterflies, and he was inspired by the
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: butterfly's ability to mimic other butterflies genetically, that they had
• 47:12
  Speaker 2: these what are called super genes, these big clusters of
• 47:14
  Speaker 2: genes that all produce this mimicry, and that we're refined
• 47:17
  Speaker 2: by smaller genes over time. And he was like, I
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: wonder if that has to do with blood types and diseases,
• 47:23
  Speaker 2: and in fact, it was Oh, wow, yeah, so butterflies,
• 47:27
  Speaker 2: super useful, super beautiful. Go cut down your butterfly bush today. Amazing,
• 47:33
  Speaker 2: Chuck said, amazing. So that means it's time for listener
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: mail everybody.
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna call this our influence on Spotify. Perhaps, Hey, guys,
• 47:46
  Speaker 1: I was wondering, wondering if you were aware of your
• 47:48
  Speaker 1: potential impact on Spotify searches. On the Milli Vanilli episode,
• 47:52
  Speaker 1: Josh mentioned the song owner of a Lonely Heart by
• 47:55
  Speaker 1: Yes being the best song of the eighties, And in
• 47:58
  Speaker 1: my head, I'm like, I'm not sure what that song
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: is is, but I said it out loud and immediately
• 48:03
  Speaker 1: the chorus popped into my head. So I go over
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: to listen to it later on Spotify. I see a
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: ton of covers for it, and I see Millie Vanilli
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: is also in the search results, which was going to
• 48:14
  Speaker 1: be my next search. So I think you guys may
• 48:16
  Speaker 1: have had enough people searching Owner of a Lonely Heart
• 48:19
  Speaker 1: and Millie Vanilly close together so that the algorithm associated
• 48:24
  Speaker 1: those two. That's awesome because other than the time period,
• 48:27
  Speaker 1: it's not similar music.
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: You know, No, I would say not.
• 48:31
  Speaker 1: Maybe do a test to mention two unrelated songs for
• 48:33
  Speaker 1: something to see what happens. Oh boy, should we try it?
• 48:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, let's mix Sabbath and you pick the other one.
• 48:43
  Speaker 1: Okay, So Black Sabbath, you name a song specifically, Warpigs. Okay, Warpigs. Hey, everybody,
• 48:50
  Speaker 1: if you haven't heard Warpigs, you should go search it
• 48:52
  Speaker 1: on Spotify. Give it a listen. It's a great song.
• 48:56
  Speaker 1: And while you're at it, I don't know if you've
• 49:00
  Speaker 1: ever heard Barry Manilow's Chuck.
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: I was going to suggest Barry Manilo I had it.
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: Well, I had a fifty to fifty chance there. I
• 49:08
  Speaker 1: don't know if you've ever heard the Barry Manilo song
• 49:12
  Speaker 1: even Now, but it's a classic Barry Manilo song. And
• 49:16
  Speaker 1: everyone should just go search those two on Spotify.
• 49:18
  Speaker 2: So war Pigs and even Now by Black Sabbath and
• 49:21
  Speaker 2: Barry Manilo, Let's see what happens. Let's see what happened.
• 49:24
  Speaker 2: That was a great experiment. Who was that from?
• 49:27
  Speaker 1: That was from Corey and I just want to give
• 49:31
  Speaker 1: Corey's to side notes. Saw you guys for the Andre
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: the Giant Live in Chicago episode. I also saw Josh's
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: Into the World Live in Chicago when you tour that
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: your short series. That was so great and I really
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: enjoy that. Josh walked by on his way in when
• 49:47
  Speaker 1: we were outside and patted my friend Sam on the shoulder,
• 49:52
  Speaker 1: and he's definitely mentioned that several times since then.
• 49:55
  Speaker 2: That's awesome.
• 49:57
  Speaker 1: So that's from Corey and you patted Sam on the shoulder.
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: I think that mean launch say.
• 50:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, thanks for coming to see me, Sam and Corey.
• 50:03
  Speaker 2: It was a fun show. Actually, let's see if you
• 50:07
  Speaker 2: want to let us know how this experiment pans out.
• 50:10
  Speaker 2: Corey's experiment is what we're gonna call it Corey's choice.
• 50:14
  Speaker 2: How about that love it? No, let's call it a
• 50:20
  Speaker 2: Corey's song rather than Brian's song. Oh okay, okay, no,
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: Corey can wait perfect Okay.
• 50:28
  Speaker 1: So oh no, but how about Corey's in Charge?
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: Okay, that's a good one. That's perfect. We're gonna end
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: on that. If you want to let us know how
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: the Corey's in Charge experiment goes, but we'd love to
• 50:39
  Speaker 2: hear from you, you can send us an email to
• 50:41
  Speaker 2: Stuff podcast at iHeartRadio dot com.
• 50:47
  Speaker 1: Stuff you Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For
• 50:50
  Speaker 1: more podcasts my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
• 50:55
  Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.