Latest / GAIN Momentum / A Caribbean Hotelier's Perspective on Hotel Technology | with Nima Anwar
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- GAIN Momentum episode #34 - A Caribbean Hotelier's Perspective on Hotel Technology === Adam Mogelonsky: Welcome to the Gain Momentum podcast, focusing on timeless lessons from senior leaders in hospitality, food service, travel, and technology. Today, I'm joined by my co host, Neil Foster. Neil, how are you? Neil Foster: Great to see you, Adam. Good to be with you. How are you? Adam Mogelonsky: I'm doing well. And our special guest today is Nima Anwar. He is the CEO of GuestChat. Nima, how are you? Nima Anwar: Great to be here. Really glad to be with you guys. You guys already know how I feel about you, so I'm just glad to be here and have a talk. Adam Mogelonsky: Yeah, so we structure our podcast around four key questions and a little bit of context on Nima is that he has this company called Guest Chat, which is a chatbot and AI technology company for hospitality. [00:01:00] But before that, interestingly, he's coming from the buyer side working in Siesta Hotel and Grenada as, I believe it was the general manager. Nima Anwar: Yep, that's right. Adam Mogelonsky: For over two decades, correct? Nima Anwar: And before that, I was working for the California Department of Health Services, uh, as an epidemiologist, just turned, uh, Coming out of my master's program, so I had a biology background, and so, yeah, I've had a, wide range of experiences. Adam Mogelonsky: Well, wide range, but that, of course, helps to influence your perspective, and then that influences, your wisdom and your conversation here today. So let's get underway with the first question here, Nima, which is, when it comes to scaling a business, what is the single piece of advice you would give entrepreneurs, from your perspective as a professional in hospitality technology? Thank you. Nima Anwar: a tough question, you know, because I'm sitting [00:02:00] right in the middle of it. I mean, uh, I can't give you one answer. I can tell you part of the thing has to do with automation. Automation is going to be key if you're going to want to scale anything. if you cannot find ways to automate processes, you're not going to be able to. But, scaling has so many components to it. it's the ability, it has to do, frankly, With your, type of business, everything doesn't scale the same way. You know, if you're scaling a company in, in hospitality tech, your clients have to be a part of that scaling. That is to say, if you require them to do something, you know, and they don't want to do it, you're not going to scale very easily. So that's why I said automation as a, as a big part of it. But. there's so many facets involved. It's not just like one piece of thing. You have to think about sales and you have to think about how you can, um, you know, bring in a mass amount of, of sales and how you're going to, you know, put [00:03:00] people through the top of the funnel. So it's a big gamish of things. It's not just one thing, but if you were to pin me down on it, I would say automation. Adam Mogelonsky: So within automation, let's pull out a thread here with sales automation. And guest chat is, has been around for how many years? You started Nima Anwar: going on five, Adam Mogelonsky: going on five. So you had to decide Let's say four or five years ago about your product versus your sales efforts and where to devote resources on a bootstrap budget, I imagine, or, uh, Nima Anwar: Yes, I, yes. Are you asking me, what would I do had I looked back, or what did I do? Adam Mogelonsky: oh, well, I, I would say a little bit of both. Let's focus on what you did and, uh, Nima Anwar: Yeah, as you were, as you were asking that question, I was thinking the answer is B, and I'll tell you a quick joke. [00:04:00] So there was a joke running around during the pandemic, where they had this guy, the camera on the guy, he said, it's the pandemic. You have two choices. Uh, you are, you, you know, you have to stay in the house with your wife, that's A, or B. And before the person ever had a choice to even find out what B was, he was like, B, B. And so, this is exactly the situation here, um, Adam. For me, it would have been sales every time. If I have a piece of advice for any entrepreneur, and I think, uh, seasoned veterans know this, it's all about sales. It will always be about sales. if I had to do it all over again, I would have put everything I could into sales and I don't want to be lopsided about it, obviously you want your product to be good, but, sales is a very, very difficult thing to master in any field. And if you're going to get good at it, you best start early. So that's what I would have done. It's not what I did do. We put a lot of attention [00:05:00] on development and that's partially because it felt nicer to do. It was more convenient. It was easier. It was more pleasant than, you know, making calls and following up with people and getting hung up on and all that sort of thing. So sales every time. Adam Mogelonsky: wow. another point of color about your background is that you're from the Caribbean Nima Anwar: Yeah. Adam Mogelonsky: When we're talking about sales, uh, was Guest Chat, were you in Grenada at the time? Nima Anwar: Yes, yes. And in fact, I built it with that whole premise because I knew enough people in the region, although it is a, I would say a divided region, but nonetheless, you know, it's a, it's still small enough that people know of each other if they don't know each other already, and they're hospitable, very, very kind people. And so I, that was the path forward. Adam Mogelonsky: [00:06:00] So, that was essentially your sales strategy was to scale within the Caribbean based on, and uh, just, just for context here, how is the Caribbean market different for vendors than a larger market like the EU or, or America? Nima Anwar: Well, I think it's a lot more personal, and I guess I wanted to say that, you know, it doesn't have as much of the brands that you would see or the big chains, although it has its fair share, but, the independents, do have a good, uh, a good, uh, a good Good foothold and because there are so many different islands, it's, um, you can have a more personal, connection with management at each property. And that is wonderful. It's a blessing. Adam Mogelonsky: So, would you say that, it was, it was a purposeful part of your sales strategy to focus on the Caribbean? Or was that something just naturally emerged as Nima Anwar: No, [00:07:00] no. Yeah. I planned on it. I planned on it and it just turned out to be not as big a market as I would like it to be. But then again, it wasn't, wasn't that I completely was unaware of that either. But nonetheless, yeah, we have learned a lot. Adam Mogelonsky: Hmm. Very interesting. Neil Foster: Now, Nima, the, the Caribbean is, seems to me to be really hungry for technology. together we were at Marketplace some months ago, and it seemed that not only is there a lot of cooperation within the region for, trying to solve a, a common problem, which is to increase, uh, tourism. Uh, but also a, a thirst for, for knowledge and, uh, and technical assistance or, or technical support in, in terms of, uh, services, products and services like yours. Now, how are you able to sort of leverage that? it seems to me that if you can, help to conquer some of the, the challenges that the Caribbean is, uh, facing. trying to work its way out of the post, post, uh, [00:08:00] pandemic, uh, constraints that the, whole region has solved, uh, that, that would probably make a big difference to sort of being the rocket ship for your brand. Are there any observations that you've been able to make in terms of, how to make inroads, within your region and where you might have a distinct advantage over, over others in focusing on the Caribbean? Nima Anwar: It doesn't hurt that I'm a hotelier. It doesn't hurt that I've lived here for, what, now 26 years. And, that I do have a reputation. And it doesn't hurt also that I'm relatively, I don't want to say reserved, but I would say conservative in the way I approach technology. So, I want to clarify that. I'm somebody who's big on technology. It's all I do every day. in terms of hospitality tech. but, Because I have a reputation, uh, I, and I want to maintain that reputation, I am not, I don't know, uh, you know, I don't make wanton sort of, uh, [00:09:00] recommendations. I do not, I know what hoteliers are going through, and so because I don't, you know, tell them, oh yeah, you know, this is the, greatest thing since sliced bread, they also, know that they can trust me. And if they don't know it in the beginning, they find out over time because I'm not just, just like I wouldn't put our own property at risk. I'm not going to put theirs at risk because again, that's a small community. there's in any group, there's always going to be the early adopters and they're going to be more open minded. There's going to be those who are going to wait and see. and then there's the late adopters. So it is a. education process that you have to go through with, you know, frankly, all majority of hospitality tech is an education process, some more than others. but yeah, that's how we do it. We, we have that personal connection, develop trust, maintain a reputation. we do not promise the world. in fact, try to be very, [00:10:00] very specific about what they can expect. And I don't say, I don't want to say we under promised, although some people, some people later on tell us that we under promised and they actually got better, but I'm much happier that way. Neil Foster: That's a great perspective that you're sharing, and I guess just really quickly, having had a little bit of experience with island life, uh, one of the interesting things that I've observed is that hospitality often comes baked into, uh, island life. You have a, very small area, outsiders are not always, uh, not always frequent, so you, you have sort of a controlled area. people coming into the community are coming from outside of the culture, and trusting relationships require a different approach from the mainland. in other terms, you can't really run away from broken promises as easily on a small island, and islanders are more likely to repair and salvage versus throwing things out, uh, which includes relationships. so, as that might translate to your perspective that you've shared, [00:11:00] that it sounds to me that you're well immersed in island culture. And the big question is how to share the sense that this is the philosophy of the island culture versus a perception of being disconnected. Uh, within, within an island culture, that it really is more about meaningful connection versus being disconnected. Um, just a small footnote, the first search engine, and, and you would probably know this, uh, Nima, the first search engine was developed by an islander, uh, Alan M. Taj in 1989, a Bajan, uh, who, uh, at McGill through, through his affiliation with McGill, created Archie, uh, and also was involved with the first internet to, uh, er, first internet connection with Eastern Canada. So just really quickly to say that if there's, uh, a company or, or a perspective that would really be keen to find information and organize it, it follows suit that an Islander could be very well positioned to do that. Nima Anwar: Yeah, I think you're absolutely right. There's a certain kind of [00:12:00] utilitarian way and also a scrappiness to how people live in the Caribbean. I can tell you about that. you know, we had Hurricane Ivan here that blew off the the roofs of 90 percent of every home. Hotel and every property on island without exaggeration. that was in 2004. this country was up and running probably, I would say effectively within, I would say maybe 14, 15 months. and that's, that is, testament, to. That, ability to make do with very little, the community that supports one another, and, and, and you're so right too, Neil. Everybody knows everybody. If you, if in an island, if you do something that is significant, like for example, um, and this is why I very rarely did it. If you fire somebody. You're gonna be, it will be known [00:13:00] shortly, so, you know, you have to, again, it goes to that whole reputation thing, and, and that's just one little aspect of it, but if you think about it, when something breaks, because you don't have the parts, you're gonna have to try to come up with other ways of fixing it, it means, and I always just tell my staff, listen, the fact That anybody is actually traveling to Grenada is a small miracle of God. It's a dot that you couldn't find on the globe if you even, you know, tried to zoom in. Population of a hundred thousand and it's a small miracle that people are choosing to come here. And so it, they only deserve the best from us and that's how, that's how we ran it, you know. Adam Mogelonsky: Well, it's only 100, 000 people, but point of trivia, it produces what percent of the world's nutmeg? Nima Anwar: Oh, I don't know, but, but significant. It's the number one producer. I don't know what percent. Adam Mogelonsky: I, I don't know [00:14:00] exactly, but I know it's over half. Nima Anwar: Yeah. Yeah. Adam Mogelonsky: from Little Grenada. Nima Anwar: Yes. Yes, indeed. Adam Mogelonsky: So Nima, we're going to move into our second question here, which is, What are some of the common pitfalls or failures you have witnessed that business owners should look to avoid when scaling their business? Nima Anwar: Yeah, well, the first thing would have been always focus on sales first, always, because if you can't do that, you're not going to be able to do anything. we've been in that realm. We've learned a lot. I wonder to myself, I've seen some companies come and go during our time, sometimes if you're stretching yourself a little too thin, and I have been guilty of that as CEO here too, if you have too many balls up in the air sometimes, that can be a little tricky because, and it's sometimes, it happens as a result of desperation. That is to say You're trying to pull on anything, any thread that might help you in scaling, but [00:15:00] it does require a certain kind of laser focus to be able to do that. So you have to strategically pick an avenue, a strategy, a vertical, I mean, and that's one of the things that for us helped a lot. I have stayed true to the hospitality industry with very little swaying to other industries because our technology could be applied to other industries as well. but focusing in on a niche, offering a service and being able to stick with it, uh, is going to be key, because you're going to, it doesn't make a difference what business you're in, you're going to come up against these problems of scaling and half of it has to do with swimming around in all of that. Confusion and trying to figure out, uh, you know, your way up and out. Adam Mogelonsky: So you talk about verticals and niches, and the whole idea of a vertical is that it actually goes up. Yet, [00:16:00] perhaps there are niches that aren't necessarily verticals in terms of the total addressable market or the serviceable addressable market. So what advice would you give entrepreneurs for knowing that the niche they're pursuing actually has a strong vertical to grow within? Nima Anwar: Yeah, and this is a good point. So, initially when we got into it, you know, I did it the very wrong way. and you know, the whole Agile system and the ways of lean, which basically means You know, try, then move if it doesn't work. Look for traction, and everybody can look into those details, lean system. it was something that we didn't do, but I would highly recommend it. Essentially, what it is, is you have a hypothesis as to what you think is going to work, you're going to make small tests, [00:17:00] and you're going to see if you get traction and interest. If you don't, you adjust, adjust. And you move and it doesn't necessarily mean you move to another vertical but you can adjust your hypothesis a little bit if for example, you thought that I don't know revenue management should work for car rental companies. I'm just making something up. you you can do a small little test. Uh, you can put out some some little offer to both car rental companies and just say Thank you Hey, what do you think about this? If you get traction, then you know this might be of interest. If you don't, you're either going to have to adjust your offer, or move on to another industry. So that's, that's what I would do if I had to do it again. Adam Mogelonsky: Nima, let's move into our third question here. It's all related to the whole idea of niches and verticals, which is, what do you see as the key opportunities and challenges for hospitality technology companies [00:18:00] in 2024 and beyond? Nima Anwar: I think, um, there's a certain kind of disconnect between hospitality tech and hospitality. and I think it's an important thing for tech providers. To remember that ultimately this is about, well, in my case, anyway, I'm speaking from my perspective. Ultimately, these are hoteliers and hotels who are trying to offer, guests these Good services. I mean, at their, at this most simplest, when you boil it down, that's what it is. And I think there's a tendency for people in the tech industry, it doesn't matter if it's hospitality or other, to sort of, um, you know, I don't want to say be siloed away, but kind of be in their own bubble as to how things. are, and I think Hotelier, if, Hospitality Tech is going to be successful, not just in 2024 or beyond, it's going to have to [00:19:00] Understand the role it plays and its station, in the, I don't know what I want to say, in the ranking of things for hoteliers. because that's where you end up starting to promise the moon when you can't deliver it. That's where you don't understand that the manager is not really thinking about the things that you're thinking about. that's where delusion starts to come into play. And, I think, you know, these are real things. Hoteliers are very, very busy. Uh, they're trying to get a lot of practical things done on a daily basis. And it requires a certain kind of empathy from the tech provider, to understand where they sit in the continuum of priority for the hotelier. Adam Mogelonsky: Well, I mean, you know, there's the, there's the saying that you made me think of, which is. When the only thing in the world, when you only have a hammer, everything looks like a nail, right? So for a hospitality technologist, [00:20:00] the solution to everything is hospitality technology. Same thing for, you know, doctors, the solution is going to be Whatever a doctor specializes in, right? So on the one hand, I understand about empathy and understanding what the hoteliers are going through, just being pulled in 50 different directions and understanding the order of priorities and where technology fits on that. But at the same time is hotels are continually besmirched. I want to say, for being laggards in technology and technology can solve a lot of problems. So, within that, how can hotel technologists adjust their language to better communicate their, how they can help add value for the hotel to the hoteliers? Nima Anwar: Yeah, I mean, you know, as you were saying that, I was thinking to myself, Adam, that it does also have a [00:21:00] lot to do with the offering. That is to say, you know, there's a big difference between, uh, offering a PMS, or, you know, an RMS versus a chat tool. Some things are a heavy undertaking, a heavy lift. In terms of operations for a hotel and so that technology is going to be very different delivery than a lighter tool like ours, uh, which is just very easy. but I say that because when you think about language and how you deliver that, I still think it's, I really think it's still care, Adam. I think it's because I imagine that it's ultimately, it's got to be a sales person who is communicating with somebody at the property, right? And so if they are, and I know that those salespeople are very, very mindful of, the GM's time, the marketing manager's time and all of that. And even when they don't [00:22:00] offer the moon, again, it has something else to do also with, with size too, Adam. The larger the tech company. The less, and I'm saying this with respect to all companies, the less care there is. And there's a reason for that because they're growing and they cannot give that same kind of attention. There's often times when, let's say there's incompatibility with the technology. Some companies will just say, well, it's just the way it is, you know, you could take it or leave it. And so. I, and to that end, some hoteliers have to simply make that decision of taking it or leaving it. Meaning, okay, well, we don't have that integration or you're not going to be able to get that. So make that decision. And I think that, where the level of care is, is absolutely important. You as a technologist that is trying to sell a product as a vendor. If you cannot, It's one [00:23:00] thing to convey the value of your product, but it's a whole other thing, to be able to, I, I I want to say like, um, slide that value in. to the hotelier or GM's ranking of, of importance because they have so many other things. So the, uh, the best way I can think of doing is, is showing that you care. You genuinely care that you know, you know what the person is going through. You understand that you may not be top on their list, but that this is important. And then just sticking with it. I wish I could tell you something better. Adam Mogelonsky: Well, to, you know, it totally makes sense to me about care, and I know it's, it's a tough pill to swallow, particularly when you have sales goals and bench, quarterly benchmarks you got to achieve and all that, and understanding the sales cycle could be longer than anticipated. I want to pull on a different thread, because you mentioned heavy versus light software in terms of PMS, RMS versus [00:24:00] something like a chat tool. But, if the news and everything is any indication, those chat tools that are built on LLMs, GPTs, AI, machine learning, they are going to be very heavy, very soon. So, for listening. So, in light of looking ahead to 2025 and beyond, where do you see these chat tools and these AI, AI systems going over the next year or two years for hospitality? Nima Anwar: Yeah, so, um, before I answer that question, and that's my love and passion too, but I just want to go back to what we were talking about. As you were saying, I was thinking to myself about situations when I was a hotelier and other people approached me with technology offers. For me, it was a matter of trust, and building that trust doesn't happen quickly. it often happens slowly, and [00:25:00] so, you have to, as a, as a salesperson or technologist, be able to build that trust over time. so I would just say that it's care and trust that ultimately is going to get the job done. otherwise, and frankly, I can't even imagine that happening regardless of, you know, a small island or, you know, The United States. It just doesn't make a difference. You have to have credibility and that just comes over time. But to your question about LLMs, which is where I'm neck deep in on a daily basis and having to go through all the testing and all that and, um, you know, we do daily testing in terms of the validity of answers that the LLMs are giving and, um, Accuracy and, and, and hallucinations and all that. It's where I swim all day, every day. I wake up thinking about it and I go to sleep thinking about it. Um, so it's extremely powerful, extremely powerful. I'm sure you guys have heard, but in case you haven't, to give you some perspective about where this technology is [00:26:00] going, I believe, uh, Google Gemini has claimed that they showed, They're the Gemini, a silent movie, a Buster Keaton movie, and Gemini was able to summarize pretty much the plot line, character development, you know, what was going on throughout the whole thing. if you can think about the power of that and what that's going to do, it means that An entity that's not human is going to be able to look at things and analyze them without any need for words. That means I don't have to describe anything. You know, we're all familiar now with the note taking stuff that happens, on meetings and things like this, but that's because we're talking and something is recording it and then putting it through the AI and large language models are picking that up. But just imagine the kind of technology when nobody's saying a word [00:27:00] and this thing is not only picking up sentiment, but actions and, you know, Progress and development of whatever's happening. it means in the long run for hospitality, that you're going to have a much more personal awareness about your, your guest preferences. It doesn't necessarily mean that you're going to have to, uh, give away their privacy. That's obviously a very serious issue, but, it does mean that you can offer extreme. personalization, Ultra personalization in everything from knowing what they want and what they, what they don't know that they want. so you can imagine how much that could benefit, uh, hotels and, profit lines. Adam Mogelonsky: Well, I was thinking, first off, when you talked about Gemini, about error recovery situations. That was my first inkling [00:28:00] which, you know, sentiment analysis, you pick up that a guest is particularly irate that something went wrong. Nima Anwar: Yep. Adam Mogelonsky: And then you can automatically elevate that to make that priority number one to correct. Uh, so I, I, that's one use case of dozens, hundreds. Nima Anwar: We can do it with words already, we do it, but imagine if you can just do it by looking at somebody and if that can become accurate. it's scary. I always tell people it's like a power of a superhero and you don't know if you want to unleash it upon the world. And that's really where I'm at right now, um, Adam. I'm really struggling to make sure the thing is not only working well and answering accurately, but, that it doesn't, jeopardize the hotel in any way. You know, you guys have heard recent, recent situations [00:29:00] where companies have had to pay money because virtual assistants have given wrong answers and they've been held accountable for it. And, um, frankly, the bottom line is, you could paste a ton of things that said, just, just testing. It's not real. Don't listen to these answers. You know, you could put warning signs all over it. And, uh, legally speaking, You will be held liable in court if you're, um, If you answer, especially, you know, it's one thing to answer about something that's relatively inconsequential, but, it's something else to give an incorrect answer about something that could make a difference in somebody's, um, travel plans and or just, you know, having a good holiday. So, um, that's where I agonize, it's what I'm doing and we have a system in place already to cover some of those hallucinations. But, I'm not happy yet. And that's, that's what I'm, what we're working on. Adam Mogelonsky: [00:30:00] Nima, let's dive into the fourth and final question here. What are the key things innovative leaders and entrepreneurs should prioritize and focus on to gain traction for their business? Nima Anwar: I'll start from last and work my way up. I think there has to be some, some, uh, I don't want to say quiet time, but I would say more like a research time or thinking time. So that you can just put a little attention on things that. I don't want to say necessarily innovation, but yeah, you see, the thing is there's a tendency to get into the grind of things and you're so busy doing what you need to be doing, that you don't bother to think about, you know, picking your head up and looking at what's going on. Uh, and, and you need a certain amount of quiet time or research time just to look at what's going on and what possibly could be. I usually set one day of the week, that's why I said I set this [00:31:00] one last, as a day where I could just focus, like I set Saturdays as the day to focus in on, um, those things that I normally wouldn't, like trying to figure out how we could apply new technologies and stuff like that. So, innovation. The other things that I think are more important, and of course organization is very important, but, you know, organizing your day or structuring your days in a way that you're, you'd be able to, put the right things up front and the right things as we've talked about, sales and then customer fulfillment. So, I set certain days for sales. And then certain days for customer fulfillment, throughout the week. And, and I think that that's really important because you want to, on the one hand, keep, a pulse of what's happening with your clients, with the hotels, and then on the other hand, you also need new clients. So it's that process of, of going through sales and, dealing with your sales people and, and seeing how they're doing and [00:32:00] watching that and, Obviously tracking numbers is a big thing. You know, the whole measurement thing is a big thing. You need to see, you know, how many calls you're making, how many, uh, you know, uh, dials, how many, uh, emails, how many demos and all that stuff. So you have to be real organized and, and you have to find your, your own way too. So that's what I would do. Adam Mogelonsky: Well, you talk about taking Saturday as sort of your reflection day, and now you're, it almost seems like you have a six day work week, plus one, where even outside of regular work you're just always thinking about it in some way. Nima Anwar: Yeah, no, no, I have a, I have a seven day work week and evenings. Um, yeah, it doesn't stop, but I like it. And, the struggle for me actually is to, to turn it off, but I do have quiet time that I take and I think it's really important. And of course I spend time with the family. So I, I built the business in such a way to make sure that I'm able to spend time with my family as well in the evening. So aside [00:33:00] from traveling, I do have that. Neil Foster: Nima, what would you say are a couple of different qualities that you value highest as your own culture at guest chat? Nima Anwar: So, um, yeah. In hospitality, I'm going to answer it in a roundabout way. if you're ever picking for a hotel, and frankly, restaurant, it doesn't make a difference. If you're hiring, the key ingredient is nice. And take note that I did not say kind, I just said nice. Just have to be nice. If you can't, if you can't manage nice, don't think about hospitality, because that's what hospitality is, right? Now, if you can be kind, that's even better, you know, but, When it comes to, again, and this is a wonderful thing, I've had the bounty of being able to work with some wonderful people. It's a joy to go to work, and it's, I take that same principle. I just need people who are nice. I pick them according to people who are nice. I know that sounds very simplistic, [00:34:00] it's more than that, you know, there's criteria beyond that, obviously, capacity. You guys know about the four C's, right? It's, uh, care, consistency, competence, and there's another one, where's the other one? C I'll, I'll think of it, but yeah, those are the things we think about. I'll think of the fourth C somewhere down the below. Adam Mogelonsky: a lot of Cs we could throw in there, I guess, cognition, compounding, a lot of them, but, Nima Anwar: Yeah. Neil Foster: So, that's a good mirror of the industry that you're looking to, to fit with. And I guess it's a distinct advantage that you have, Nima, having worked in the industry and rolled up your sleeves for 20 years, still with one foot in the industry. that really may be one thing that, that may be a, a value or, uh, an asset to any entrepreneur is to try and understand the culture, of the large, the target, audience in within the industry that you're looking to target. So if it's an industry of care that you're looking to, to target. You [00:35:00] probably want to profess those values and maybe also look for clients that, that have emphasized those values as well. That cultural fit can't be underestimated. Nima Anwar: it is so crucial. It has, I have found it to be so crucial, in my work. There are situations in which it works both ways, but oftentimes there are some people who because they're not familiar with it, come in with a reluctance or just, they just feel like, what is this? but it makes a huge difference when they know somebody has been doing this, and they're based in a hotel, they live in a hotel, they know all about what's going on inside the hotel, and, um, because that's what I, I hear it. You know, my son now runs the same hotel that I ran, and so. I hear what's happening in room 39. I know what's happening in laundry. I hear it all. Adam Mogelonsky: well, Nima, it's been a fantastic [00:36:00] conversation. I think nice is a good way to finish off and really understanding that the human side to hotel technology and uh, I don't think AI is going to replace that any time soon. Nima Anwar: Never, never, it won't. Hospitality is about the human touch. These tools, anybody who has some experience of this will understand. All these tools are just supposed to make it easier for staff and for guests. That's all it is. If you make it more than that, it's You know, you're, you're gonna probably get burned. That's what I would say. Adam Mogelonsky: Yeah, and just being honest about what your technology can do and, and really empathizing with the hotelier who's being pulled in 20 different directions at any given moment. Nima Anwar: That's right. Adam Mogelonsky: Nima, thank you so much for coming on the show. Nima Anwar: Guys, it was great. It was great. I wish it could go longer. Neil Foster: Likewise, Adam Mogelonsky: It could, we, we, we just keep it shorter for, uh, for everyone so that they have time to get on with their [00:37:00] day, because we could talk for three hours about where AI is going. Nima Anwar: Yeah, I would love Neil Foster: Great to chat with you, Nima. Learned lots from you. Take care. Nima Anwar: so much. Alrighty. Bye bye.