Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Damning evidence in case of 26-year-old gunned down inside own apartment by cop claiming 'wrong apartment'

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Damning evidence in case of 26-year-old gunned down inside own apartment by cop claiming 'wrong apartment' · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace. The number one answer that
0:15
Speaker 1: I want is what happened? I have asked too many
0:20
Speaker 1: questions and I've been told that there are no answers. Yet.
0:26
Speaker 1: I'm looking forward two all of the powers that be
0:31
Speaker 1: to come up with the answers to make me more
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Speaker 1: satisfied that they are doing what is in the best
0:41
Speaker 1: interest of getting justice for both them. You're hearing the
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Speaker 1: mother of both them, Jane. That's Alison Jane speaking through
0:51
Speaker 1: her pain as she searches for answers as to why
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Speaker 1: her son a really shining star. A twenty six year
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Speaker 1: old young man with his life before him, had done
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Speaker 1: great in school, had an awesome job, had a beautiful
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Speaker 1: apartment that he kept neat as a pen. He's at
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Speaker 1: home reading in his apartment at night when a cop,
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Speaker 1: a Dallas cop, comes through the door. He stands up
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Speaker 1: and she guns him down dead. And the defense is,
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Speaker 1: I hope you're sitting down that she was in the
1:29
Speaker 1: wrong apartment. She thought it was her apartment. Now I
1:32
Speaker 1: had a problem with that. Now, a lot of people claiming, oh,
1:35
Speaker 1: it's a racial issue, you know what, Maybe it is.
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Speaker 1: I don't know that. But my real problem I don't
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Speaker 1: care about the white, the black that this that that
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Speaker 1: I care about. How can a cop who's just come
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Speaker 1: off duty, who we assume is going to be stone cole, sober,
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Speaker 1: maybe even a little wired up from working a beat
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Speaker 1: on the street, still in uniform, goes to the wrong apartment,
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Speaker 1: doesn't notice a key fact about a bright red doormat
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Speaker 1: his apartment has it hers, doesn't jen notice that the
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Speaker 1: we're now taking a close look at the part the
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Speaker 1: apartment itself. The numbers on the apartments are lit up
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Speaker 1: in neon knee on. You walk in, you can't see
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Speaker 1: that's not your furniture. But still gunn somebody down. Now
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Speaker 1: we are hearing that the doors to the apartments. And
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Speaker 1: I've had these at in many places where I live,
2:42
Speaker 1: so I know, and still in New York, a heavy
2:46
Speaker 1: metal fire door is your door. That's very common. A
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Speaker 1: heavy metal fire doors that automatically slam shut, allegedly in
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Speaker 1: this building where both of them lived. And listen to
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Speaker 1: this natural sam We've obtained um the video of how
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Speaker 1: this door works. Okay, you you can't hear it at
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Speaker 1: the beginning, but you can hear with the shutting that
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Speaker 1: that's one of those heavy metal doors from my apartment.
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Speaker 1: Door closes. Uh, you can hear, whether you barely its
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Speaker 1: three inches to the door jam or not, you can
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Speaker 1: hear just like that. That says a lot to me,
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Speaker 1: which I will explain. Joining me right now, Syndicated talk
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Speaker 1: show host Dave mac Also with me right now, New
3:53
Speaker 1: York psychologist Karen Stark, Kathleen Murphy, North Carolina lawyer and
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Speaker 1: Vincent Hill, Nashville p D turned private eye Dave mc
4:03
Speaker 1: let's just start at the beginning for people that are
4:05
Speaker 1: not familiar with shooting death of this young twenty six
4:09
Speaker 1: year old man, both of Jane. What happened that night
4:12
Speaker 1: of an off duty police officer who had just finished
4:14
Speaker 1: her shift, who lived directly below the victim. Here, she
4:17
Speaker 1: comes home, she parks in the wrong carking deck, one
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Speaker 1: deck higher than she normally parks, and goes into if
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Speaker 1: you believe her story, she goes to her apartment what
4:26
Speaker 1: she believes to be her apartment, and the door is
4:29
Speaker 1: a jar. She opens the door, lights her all out,
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Speaker 1: and she sees the silhouette of a man who is
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Speaker 1: not obeying her commands to do whatever. The problem here
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Speaker 1: is that we don't have an answer as to why
4:42
Speaker 1: or anything else except for the fact that we have
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Speaker 1: one six year old young man and a police officer
4:49
Speaker 1: with no reasonable story that can be believed. I'm taking
4:52
Speaker 1: a look at the door right now, the front door
4:56
Speaker 1: of apartment directly below both of Jane's. Now, this is
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Speaker 1: Amber Geiger, the police officers front door. The panel to
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Speaker 1: the left of her door has the apartment lit up
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Speaker 1: in neon. You can't help but see it, Jack, You
5:14
Speaker 1: look at this, see that's how it looks. It's so
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Speaker 1: too long, rectangular strip by every door, very clear, and
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Speaker 1: this is kind of like, um, I don't know what
5:28
Speaker 1: that style of art would be, geometric. It's a rectangle.
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Speaker 1: It looks to be like maybe three or four ft long.
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Speaker 1: It's beside to the left of every door. It's decoration,
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Speaker 1: and there are several squares lit up white neon squares
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Speaker 1: within the rectangle. The it's vertical, and underneath the first
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Speaker 1: square you see your apartment number lit up fourteen seventy eight.
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Speaker 1: It's literally lit up in neon beside the door. That's
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Speaker 1: what I'm I'm saying. Both of Jeanne was shot and
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Speaker 1: killed by a Dallas police officer, Amber Geiger, who says
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Speaker 1: it was a mistake that she went into both of
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Speaker 1: Jean's apartment four seventy eight thinking it was her own,
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Speaker 1: But the door numbers are clearly visible. Now, let me
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Speaker 1: go back to you, David Matt, syndicated talk show host,
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Speaker 1: What can you tell me again about the red, bright, red,
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Speaker 1: deep red doormat? Well, it was something that that both
6:37
Speaker 1: put there on purpose to differentiate his apartment from all
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Speaker 1: of the others around him. And if you actually look
6:42
Speaker 1: at the pictures we've seen, nobody else has a red
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Speaker 1: Matt in front of the apartment, and certainly not miss Geiger.
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Speaker 1: She didn't have them out in front of her apartment.
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Speaker 1: There's no excuse there that could have been a mistake.
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Speaker 1: There's nothing Her red semi circular doormat outside both of
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Speaker 1: Jean's apart meant hers was there. I would have noticed
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Speaker 1: that if I came home and suddenly there was a
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Speaker 1: bright red doormat that I hadn't bought, and it was
7:09
Speaker 1: because I know, I can tell you this, My husband,
7:13
Speaker 1: David is not slung up at the bed bath and beyond.
7:16
Speaker 1: That's not happening, okay, And nobody but me is going
7:20
Speaker 1: to take time out to order anything on Amazon not happening.
7:24
Speaker 1: In fact, our code to Amazon is highly classified because
7:27
Speaker 1: if the twins had that, I'd be in the poorhouse
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Speaker 1: for sure. So if I came home and see a
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Speaker 1: red doormat, I'm gonna notice it. And you gotta keep
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Speaker 1: in mind. As I was describing how the numbers are
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Speaker 1: lit up in Neon, I'm looking now at the front
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Speaker 1: of the apartment. It's very geometric looking. Check this out, Jackie,
7:48
Speaker 1: Jackie Howard here in the studio with me. See everything.
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Speaker 1: If you look at the front of the building is
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Speaker 1: lock tall, rectangular, it's very geometric designing. The building is
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Speaker 1: a square, it's very let me just say contemporary. And
8:05
Speaker 1: the front of the building is decorated in rectangles, different
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Speaker 1: types of rectangles. Now, also, as she would, Jackie's holding
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Speaker 1: up a sign, yes that you would feel the doormat
8:18
Speaker 1: as you walk across and get your key, which leads
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Speaker 1: me to the key. Hold on, Vincent, Kathleen and Karen,
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Speaker 1: I just got to give you these facts. David Mack
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Speaker 1: tell me about the key. It's an electronic key. Yeah,
8:30
Speaker 1: they're electronic keys, and they won't open any door other
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Speaker 1: than the one that they're coded for. So the key
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Speaker 1: for thirteen seventy eight Miss Geiger's apartment would only open
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Speaker 1: thirteen seventy eight. It would not have opened fourteen seventy eight.
8:44
Speaker 1: And you gotta remember her claim that the door was
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Speaker 1: a jar. We already throved earlier that that wouldn't happen
8:50
Speaker 1: because they automatically closed. So the options for what she's
8:53
Speaker 1: claiming nothing holds true to her story at all. But
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Speaker 1: that key, the electronic key, the only one that would
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Speaker 1: work is fourteen seven, and both those keys were found
9:01
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9:04
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10:02
Speaker 1: new network for Crime. I am faithful because of both them,
10:09
Speaker 1: as you are no idea. Times when you feel like
10:11
Speaker 1: giving up, I could not give up because of both them.
10:17
Speaker 1: I'm right now in his death. I can never give
10:22
Speaker 1: up because I know that both them is singing with
10:33
Speaker 1: the angels, and I want to join that quile the
10:37
Speaker 1: incredible composure of both them. Jane's mother, Alison Jane, speaking
10:41
Speaker 1: of for the church congregation about her son, who was
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Speaker 1: shot dead in his own apartment, reportedly lying on sofa
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Speaker 1: or sitting on the sofa reading when a Dallas cop,
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Speaker 1: a female Amber Geiger, comes in and opens fire. Joining me,
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Speaker 1: Vincent Hill, private eye, former cop, Kathleen Murth, North Carolina
11:00
Speaker 1: lawyer Karen Start, New York psychologist and syndicated talk show
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Speaker 1: host Dave Matt. Let's start with you, Vincent Hill. What
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Speaker 1: do you make of it? Nancy? There's so many things
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Speaker 1: missing here that I questioned with this story. I mean,
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Speaker 1: she says she went in, she saw a guy when
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Speaker 1: she thought was her apartment. But here's the thing. As
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Speaker 1: a police officer, if I'm yelling commands, I would expect
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Speaker 1: some neighbor to be able to say, yes, I heard
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Speaker 1: her say show me your hands or something like that.
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Speaker 1: You didn't hear any reports of that, Nancy. And we
11:28
Speaker 1: also tell uh citizens, hey, if you get to your
11:31
Speaker 1: house and you see your doors open, don't go in,
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Speaker 1: come out and call police. Why didn't she call for
11:37
Speaker 1: backup if her door was ajar as she claimed. And
11:40
Speaker 1: more importantly, where's this miss key reading if she put
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Speaker 1: her key into that door? Because it's all electronic, it's
11:46
Speaker 1: all monitored, so we should be able to go in
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Speaker 1: and see. Yes, she did indeed put the key in
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Speaker 1: the door, but I don't think we'll be able to
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Speaker 1: see that. Now. You said something very important. Well, everything
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Speaker 1: you said was critical in my mind, Vincent Hill. Uh,
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Speaker 1: you're a former turned private eye speaking of the neighbors
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Speaker 1: not hearing her say stand down, stand down, put your
12:06
Speaker 1: arms up, put your hands in there here. No. In fact,
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Speaker 1: witnesses are coming forward its claiming they heard bamming on
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Speaker 1: the door and a woman yelling out let me in,
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Speaker 1: Let me in now, Vice and Hill. Eye witness testimony
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Speaker 1: is often attacked under cross exam. What about ear witnesses. Yeah,
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Speaker 1: I think there's no question these neighbors heard exactly what
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Speaker 1: they heard. The problem, of course, when this goes to
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Speaker 1: trowel is how can you identify that voice? You know?
12:35
Speaker 1: But at this this point that's neither here nor there.
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Speaker 1: More importantly, Nancy, I would expect someone because trust me
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Speaker 1: as a police officer, and I did that job for
12:44
Speaker 1: many years. If I'm yelling at someone with commands and
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Speaker 1: my weapon is drawn, you better believe the entire neighborhood
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Speaker 1: would be able to hear. Man, You're not kidding about that.
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Speaker 1: If you've ever been at the scene, when copsy l
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Speaker 1: put your hands out, put your hands up, they're screaming
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Speaker 1: it out. Kathleen Murphy um that. I'm a North Carolina lawyer. Kathleen,
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Speaker 1: I can't help but wonder if there's some connection between
13:05
Speaker 1: both them and both the Gene and Amber Geiger the cop.
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Speaker 1: It's just because the story doesn't make sense to me.
13:13
Speaker 1: But on another note, when I'm saying eye witness testimony
13:16
Speaker 1: is often attacked in court, your witness testimony could be
13:20
Speaker 1: a problem as well. Unless there's more than one witness
13:23
Speaker 1: saying they heard it. Well, there is a connection Nancy,
13:26
Speaker 1: and I'd like to read this. But she wrote a
13:29
Speaker 1: complaint to the apartment complex about our victim, that he
13:34
Speaker 1: was making too much noise. And that was about a
13:37
Speaker 1: week before this incident happened. And Vincent makes wonderful points,
13:43
Speaker 1: But on a previous show, he also made a point
13:46
Speaker 1: that she would have not gone into a dark room.
13:49
Speaker 1: She would have had her flash fight on and both
13:52
Speaker 1: of them. Sister said she's afraid. He's afraid of the dark.
13:55
Speaker 1: So was he reading a book in the dark. And
13:58
Speaker 1: there's just too many holes in the story. And there
14:01
Speaker 1: is a connection there. You know, she had only lived
14:04
Speaker 1: in the building for a very short time. It was
14:06
Speaker 1: a very expensive building. The prices in the block, it's
14:10
Speaker 1: Dallas's gentrifying South Side area, start at rising to two thousand,
14:18
Speaker 1: four hundred and thirty five dollars a month. Now. The
14:22
Speaker 1: Dallas Police headquarters on Lamar Street is directly next door. Now,
14:27
Speaker 1: this guy, both of Jane, was a graduate of Harding
14:29
Speaker 1: University in Arkansas. Now it appeared that both he and
14:35
Speaker 1: Geiger had good relations with all of their neighbors. I'm
14:38
Speaker 1: very curious about this noise report that you're telling me
14:42
Speaker 1: about that she filed on him. I know there were
14:46
Speaker 1: noise complaints that day about upstairs activity in his apartment.
14:51
Speaker 1: He got a call about noise coming from his department
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Speaker 1: from the downstairs neighbor. That had to be her. Is
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Speaker 1: that the report you're talking about, Kathleen thing about And
15:00
Speaker 1: I don't know if it's a written report or not.
15:03
Speaker 1: I don't know if she called it in, but there's
15:06
Speaker 1: a report out there made by her against our victim. Now,
15:11
Speaker 1: according to his family, they say they did not know
15:14
Speaker 1: each other. There's no relationship. Catches, she had only been
15:17
Speaker 1: living there a month, a little over a month prior
15:20
Speaker 1: to the shooting. And then if it's herd already been
15:24
Speaker 1: complaining about noise overhead, I'm looking at her right now
15:29
Speaker 1: and him according again, according to his family, no relationship
15:35
Speaker 1: to Karen Start New York psychologists. We now have complaints
15:41
Speaker 1: that the victim in this case, both of Jane, who
15:45
Speaker 1: never has had any police problem nothing, is now being
15:50
Speaker 1: attacked and dragged through the mud his reputation. Why I
15:55
Speaker 1: would think that that would have to do with the
15:57
Speaker 1: fact that she's a police officer. Nancy Oh, they're trying
16:01
Speaker 1: to find ways to make it look like he was
16:04
Speaker 1: doing something wrong. There was something suspicious going on, trying
16:09
Speaker 1: to back her up in some way by demigrating this guy,
16:13
Speaker 1: which it's along with the whole story is a mess
16:17
Speaker 1: because it doesn't make a lot of sense. This is
16:19
Speaker 1: a good kid who really sounds like he was sitting
16:24
Speaker 1: there innocently and was shot. And I wonder how about
16:28
Speaker 1: her own anger at the policewoman. It's so, was she
16:32
Speaker 1: excessively aggressive? Did she have a history where people knew that?
16:37
Speaker 1: What's her history? And the police force too, well what
16:40
Speaker 1: they're saying right now, there are complaints Dallas police investigators
16:44
Speaker 1: seeking evidence, reportedly, according to their critics, to discredit both
16:51
Speaker 1: of Jane who was shot dead by a white off
16:53
Speaker 1: duty officer. Now that's according to the victims family. Police
16:57
Speaker 1: did execute multiple search warrant at both of his apartment
17:00
Speaker 1: in the aftermath of the killing, and complaints are they
17:05
Speaker 1: should have been in her apartment looking for whatever they
17:09
Speaker 1: could find evidence relevant to the homicide investigation, but instead
17:13
Speaker 1: they were looking in his apartment. What about that, your
17:17
Speaker 1: former cap Vincent Hill, Well, Nancy, I can understand the
17:19
Speaker 1: search warrant of his apartment simply because it was an
17:22
Speaker 1: active crime scene. Right, there was a shooting there, So
17:25
Speaker 1: I understand that piece of it. But what they found
17:28
Speaker 1: in that search warrant has absolutely nothing to do with
17:32
Speaker 1: the shooting. There's reports that ten point five grams and
17:35
Speaker 1: marijuana were found there. So what he was in his apartment,
17:39
Speaker 1: if he's using Mirijuana for recreational use, who cares? It
17:43
Speaker 1: has absolutely nothing to do with the shooting. But I
17:45
Speaker 1: would assume a defense attorney will come back and say, well,
17:49
Speaker 1: there was marijuana found. That's why he wasn't listening to
17:52
Speaker 1: her commands, and that's what calls the shooting. I think
17:55
Speaker 1: that's what the intent hears. Nancy, Well, what about the
17:58
Speaker 1: use of deadly force? If she she just says in
18:01
Speaker 1: her own statement that she saw him and took out
18:04
Speaker 1: her pistol, took out her firearm, I don't understand that
18:09
Speaker 1: that is the correct standard for an officer to use
18:12
Speaker 1: deadly force. Vincent, Well, any citizen can do that, Nancy,
18:17
Speaker 1: if you come into your home and you see someone
18:18
Speaker 1: in there, and you can protect your domicile in that way,
18:23
Speaker 1: up too deadly force. So I understand that part, But
18:26
Speaker 1: what I don't understand is based on her training and
18:28
Speaker 1: based on what we tell citizens to do, she should
18:31
Speaker 1: have handled that totally different. I didn't see any reports
18:35
Speaker 1: that she keyed up on the radio to dispatch to say,
18:38
Speaker 1: there's someone in my apartment, sent backup. Nothing like that, Nancy,
18:42
Speaker 1: only until she called from her cell phone that she
18:46
Speaker 1: even alert police that something was going on. When police
18:49
Speaker 1: go in to search, it's signs of life, and they're
18:54
Speaker 1: very poignant. A half eaten bowl of cereal, of flip
18:58
Speaker 1: flop still lying there where he was killed. Metal fire
19:02
Speaker 1: doors that slam locked, contradict to her claims that it
19:06
Speaker 1: was open and she went in. I'm looking at the
19:10
Speaker 1: scenes and it looks as if he was sitting there,
19:15
Speaker 1: maybe even having cereal and reading. I'm looking at it.
19:20
Speaker 1: It's an autobiography of Gucci Maine. There's his flip flop,
19:25
Speaker 1: the home with a large tech of pillows on the sofa,
19:29
Speaker 1: pillows and blankets there. I'm just looking at it. Looks
19:34
Speaker 1: like a typical guy's home, kind of messy, kind of clean,
19:39
Speaker 1: and I can imagine him sitting there minding his own business,
19:43
Speaker 1: just before he has gunned down. Right now, more questions
19:46
Speaker 1: than answers in the shooting of this unarmed man in
19:49
Speaker 1: his own apartment, just twenty six year old. Right now
19:53
Speaker 1: joining me as special guest, the lawyer for both of
19:56
Speaker 1: Jean's family, longtime friend and colleague, Benjamin Crump, being thank
20:02
Speaker 1: you so much for being with us. Now, why are
20:05
Speaker 1: you sure or are you sure that the shooting was
20:10
Speaker 1: racially motivated? We don't have any evidence at this time
20:14
Speaker 1: to demonstrate one way or the other whether racism was
20:19
Speaker 1: a factor in this crime. I would be more focused
20:23
Speaker 1: at this point on finding motive. Of course, the state
20:26
Speaker 1: doesn't have to prove motive, but in this case, any
20:29
Speaker 1: jury is going to want to know the motive if
20:32
Speaker 1: it's not a racially motive motivated crime. For instance, I
20:36
Speaker 1: know that she Uh the officer had complained and made
20:40
Speaker 1: a noise complaint. Did they have words? Was she angry?
20:44
Speaker 1: Was he angry? According to witnesses now emerging, they heard
20:49
Speaker 1: a woman bamming on a door saying let me in,
20:51
Speaker 1: let me in. But let me ask you this, Ben,
20:54
Speaker 1: do you have any reason to believe officer Geiger and
20:57
Speaker 1: both of them Jane had any connection before the shooting,
21:01
Speaker 1: like some kind of relationship. Again, we don't have any information,
21:05
Speaker 1: uh to know that at this time. And that's the
21:08
Speaker 1: one of the big things is we are waiting to
21:11
Speaker 1: get the phone records, not only from both of them, John,
21:15
Speaker 1: but also from the police officers phone records to determine
21:19
Speaker 1: if they had any interaction whatsoever. You know, everyone with me,
21:23
Speaker 1: Benjamin Crump, Ben, how could Geiger not know it wasn't
21:30
Speaker 1: her apartment because of the big red and I mean
21:34
Speaker 1: red candy apple red rug, you know, one of those
21:38
Speaker 1: semi circular rugs doormats, and there was a different number.
21:43
Speaker 1: Not only that it was lit up in neon, Ben.
21:46
Speaker 1: It's just mind boggling when you think about it. Uh,
21:49
Speaker 1: both of them, John had a big red rug right
21:53
Speaker 1: out front his apartment for the very reason people would
21:58
Speaker 1: know that that was his apartment. Uh. Also, when you
22:01
Speaker 1: think about the probable cause after David that they used
22:08
Speaker 1: to issue the warrant. In that statement, the Texas Rangers,
22:13
Speaker 1: based on what we believe could only be her account
22:17
Speaker 1: says that the door was a jar, that it wasn't locked,
22:22
Speaker 1: And that's hard to believe when you look at that door.
22:25
Speaker 1: How it has a very heavy latch that pulls the
22:31
Speaker 1: door closes the door won't stay open on its own
22:35
Speaker 1: and the fact that she claims to have put the
22:38
Speaker 1: key in the door with the door is open, Why
22:40
Speaker 1: would you put the key in the door. These are
22:43
Speaker 1: things that just trouble both of John's family to no
22:46
Speaker 1: end because they still cannot understand why he is in
22:51
Speaker 1: his apartment, minding his business, doing everything he has the
22:55
Speaker 1: legal right to do, and the police officer breaks in
22:58
Speaker 1: and kills him, and now she's attempting to claim in
23:02
Speaker 1: some way a self defense argument. It just makes no
23:05
Speaker 1: sense to them at all. I mean, guys, you gotta
23:10
Speaker 1: gotta look at this from both of Jane's family point
23:13
Speaker 1: of view or your think about it. If you're in
23:16
Speaker 1: your own home and a cop comes in the front
23:18
Speaker 1: door and shoots you dead while you're in your own home.
23:22
Speaker 1: There was a half eating bowl of cereal, there were
23:25
Speaker 1: books laying around. Was he just sitting there having cereal
23:27
Speaker 1: leading a book? And now he's dead. We are looking
23:31
Speaker 1: for answers, and to you, Vincent Hill, former cop turned
23:34
Speaker 1: p I Vincent, did you hear what Ben just said?
23:38
Speaker 1: And he's right. I've been concerned about this big metal door.
23:43
Speaker 1: We just played it. You can hear it slam shut,
23:45
Speaker 1: and I can relate to that because that's the way
23:47
Speaker 1: the door is in our apartment in New York. It
23:52
Speaker 1: slams shut. I have to rig it to make it
23:55
Speaker 1: be open. Like if I go out to throw trash
23:58
Speaker 1: down the shoot down the hall, I have to rig
24:00
Speaker 1: the door to make it stay open or it will
24:03
Speaker 1: shut behind me and I'll be out in the hall.
24:06
Speaker 1: So we played that. You can hear the door shutting.
24:09
Speaker 1: But listen to this, Vincent Hill, based on what Ben
24:11
Speaker 1: Crump just said, Officer guy Gert does say she used
24:16
Speaker 1: her key. Now I think it's an electronic key. But
24:20
Speaker 1: if the door was a jar, why would she need
24:23
Speaker 1: to use her key? Why would you even go in
24:26
Speaker 1: if the door is open when you get home? Vincent,
24:29
Speaker 1: this this story doesn't make sense. Well, Nancy, there's just
24:32
Speaker 1: too many contradictions him that she says it was a jar,
24:35
Speaker 1: but I used my key, which is an electronic key. Again,
24:38
Speaker 1: I want to see a record that the wrong key
24:40
Speaker 1: was put into his door. That should be recorded because
24:43
Speaker 1: all of that is electronic. But police officers tell people,
24:48
Speaker 1: when you come to your house, your door is a jar,
24:50
Speaker 1: call us, wait for us to go in and clear it.
24:53
Speaker 1: And I'm troubled that I didn't hear any radio transmission
24:56
Speaker 1: from this officer saying, Hey, someone's at my house, please
25:00
Speaker 1: and uh, some additional units so we can go in
25:02
Speaker 1: and clear my house. Because she didn't know if it
25:05
Speaker 1: was her apartment, what was on the other side of
25:07
Speaker 1: that door. It could have been five or six people
25:09
Speaker 1: waiting there to ambush her. So why would she just
25:12
Speaker 1: go in? Well, here's another thing to Dr Lauren Howard,
25:14
Speaker 1: New York Psychologists joining me, Lauren, here's the thing she probably,
25:20
Speaker 1: and I'm projecting, felt that as a cop, she had
25:24
Speaker 1: to explain, I had to say something, give some explanation. Okay,
25:28
Speaker 1: she couldn't take the fifth for Pete's sake, But her
25:31
Speaker 1: story is getting all twisted up. Well, it's getting all
25:34
Speaker 1: twisted up, because when a story gets twisted up, what
25:37
Speaker 1: did I tell you that the story is not accurate?
25:39
Speaker 1: You know, one thing we know is police to gather
25:43
Speaker 1: around one another. I mean, it's pretty rare for police
25:46
Speaker 1: to get convicted. And and that's wrong. I mean that
25:50
Speaker 1: is patently wrong. Whether this was racially motivated or based
25:55
Speaker 1: on the past history between the two of them, some
25:58
Speaker 1: disagreement they had or simply just she screwed up, walked
26:03
Speaker 1: in the wrong apartment, saw a large person and shot first.
26:09
Speaker 1: It doesn't know. I mean when you say cops rally
26:11
Speaker 1: around each other, they're they're like family because they've been
26:15
Speaker 1: in basically combat conditions for years on end, and in
26:18
Speaker 1: their mind they're like, I know her, she did not
26:21
Speaker 1: do this on purpose. But they may or may not
26:23
Speaker 1: be wrong. I hear what you're saying. Back to Ben Crump,
26:27
Speaker 1: the family lawyer for both of Jean's family, Ben, what
26:30
Speaker 1: does the family learned, if anything, from all the neighbors.
26:33
Speaker 1: I understand they've come forward to you with information about
26:35
Speaker 1: what they heard that night. Certainly there were neighbors who
26:42
Speaker 1: came forward to the family, and they believe that they
26:47
Speaker 1: heard not only uh uh conversation or verbal communication before
26:56
Speaker 1: the good shots, they also her uh knocking at the
27:00
Speaker 1: door on more than one occasion before they heard the gunshots.
27:07
Speaker 1: So if this was allegedly her apartment, so she says,
27:12
Speaker 1: why would she be knocking on the door that door
27:15
Speaker 1: that was open. In their mind, so they don't think
27:19
Speaker 1: the things that are coming out in the media are accurate.
27:22
Speaker 1: So that's why they came forward to the family. And
27:25
Speaker 1: we then forwarded them to the District Attorney's office and
27:29
Speaker 1: the law enforcement authorities to make sure that their statements
27:33
Speaker 1: were recorded for the use of information gathering in this case. Also,
27:39
Speaker 1: I might add that she admits that there were in
27:44
Speaker 1: verbal commands that she issued, I wanna ask you this,
27:48
Speaker 1: and that I said, you and your apartment. Somebody comes
27:51
Speaker 1: in and they starts yelling at your issuing verbal commands.
27:56
Speaker 1: Wouldn't the person say something back in response? Where based
28:01
Speaker 1: on what we know from this affidavit, she claims that
28:04
Speaker 1: both of john doesn't say anything in response. In fact,
28:08
Speaker 1: she claims that she just sees this dark figure in
28:13
Speaker 1: the shadows and she shoots into the apartment from outside
28:18
Speaker 1: the apartment. Now, this is something that I don't I
28:21
Speaker 1: don't believe even a reasonable citizen would do. But this
28:26
Speaker 1: is supposed to be a well trained police officer. Where
28:30
Speaker 1: is that in the training, Nancy? Where is that in
28:32
Speaker 1: the policy? Will you shoot into a dark apartment that
28:38
Speaker 1: you don't know who is in there? Why couldn't she
28:40
Speaker 1: have just taken the perimeter? She failed her policy was
28:44
Speaker 1: being burglarized and called for back up. The police department
28:48
Speaker 1: was less than three minutes from this apartment complex. There
28:53
Speaker 1: is no reason both of them John should be dead. Uh,
28:56
Speaker 1: black people get killed, and some of the most offitrayal
29:00
Speaker 1: ways in America, you know, driving while black while we're
29:04
Speaker 1: in our automobiles, walking while black, while we're in our neighborhoods.
29:10
Speaker 1: And now it's living while black while we're in our
29:13
Speaker 1: own apartments and houses, doing everything that we have the
29:18
Speaker 1: legal right to do. And that's what's so outrageous about
29:22
Speaker 1: this case. Not only is it shocking to both of
29:25
Speaker 1: Jones family, it is astonishing to many sensible people, not
29:31
Speaker 1: only in America but all around the world. This is
29:35
Speaker 1: crime Stories. We are taking your calls. We are talking
29:38
Speaker 1: about the shooting of an unarmed man in his own apartment.
29:41
Speaker 1: The female cot they gunning down climbs. She thought she
29:44
Speaker 1: was in her apartment. Nine nine crime nine zero nine
29:48
Speaker 1: four nine to seven four six three. Let's go straight
29:52
Speaker 1: to the causes. Is Morgan from Texas All lost you
29:55
Speaker 1: high Morgan. It's very confusing. There's a lot of different
29:58
Speaker 1: facts and a lot of the theories out there, and
30:03
Speaker 1: I looked at this affidavit, it's not all adding up.
30:07
Speaker 1: And on top of that, I've seen that the victims
30:11
Speaker 1: family is now being represented by Lee Merritt, a civil
30:15
Speaker 1: rights attorney, and she's contesting several allegations from you know,
30:20
Speaker 1: the way that Geiger has claimed to enter the apartment,
30:25
Speaker 1: to the interaction between um Bottom, John and Geiger. And
30:31
Speaker 1: now I'm hearing of this new witness who didn't come
30:34
Speaker 1: forward to the police but is now telling the family
30:38
Speaker 1: that she overheard conversation and knocks and gunshots. So what
30:43
Speaker 1: do we do with this, with this evidence or or
30:46
Speaker 1: these facts, Nancy? And and do we think that this
30:49
Speaker 1: manslaughter charge is gonna stick or do we think we're
30:52
Speaker 1: going to see a murder charge? I anticipate that the
30:55
Speaker 1: charges will be upgraded by the grand injury. Let me
30:58
Speaker 1: throw that to visit He'll private investor, Gator, former cop Vincent.
31:02
Speaker 1: They earwitnesses that her banning at the door and let
31:05
Speaker 1: me in, let me in. They're going to be attacked
31:07
Speaker 1: on cross exam because again there are those big metal doors,
31:11
Speaker 1: and the defense is going to claimb they could not
31:12
Speaker 1: possibly have heard that. Well I disagree, because it's hot.
31:18
Speaker 1: There's a very good chance they may have had their
31:19
Speaker 1: windows open. But that's going to be an issue for
31:22
Speaker 1: a jury to decide if they're telling the truth. Yeah,
31:26
Speaker 1: that's definitely gonna be up to the jury to believe it.
31:30
Speaker 1: But of course the defense is going to say, well,
31:31
Speaker 1: why didn't you go to police immediately when you heard that?
31:35
Speaker 1: Just like the caller said, you went to the attorney first.
31:38
Speaker 1: So as a defense attorney, of course they're going to say, well,
31:41
Speaker 1: how do we know you're not making this up? How
31:43
Speaker 1: come you didn't say this when police were there on
31:45
Speaker 1: the scene when he was shot. So all of that
31:48
Speaker 1: stuff will come into question when this goes to trial.
31:50
Speaker 1: And Anti joining me right now a lawyer from Florida, welcome.
31:56
Speaker 1: What's your question? One question I had, Nancy is um,
32:00
Speaker 1: has there been any further discussion or mention of UM
32:05
Speaker 1: some photographs of the two of them, of the victim
32:09
Speaker 1: and UM, the and Geiger together. UM. I know some
32:14
Speaker 1: of those are floating around the internet. I don't know
32:16
Speaker 1: if they're real, and I wondered if you had any
32:19
Speaker 1: more information on that, again, knowing that you may not
32:22
Speaker 1: have access to a lot of information yet because it's
32:26
Speaker 1: an open, ongoing criminal investigation. Anyway, thank you for your
32:31
Speaker 1: hard work, Nancy, Thanks for your call. I have been
32:34
Speaker 1: destroyed by those photos as well, and I've learned the
32:39
Speaker 1: hard way. You think it's someone in the patron, it
32:42
Speaker 1: turns out to be someone similar to them. So I'm
32:45
Speaker 1: waiting for these photos to be verified of both of
32:50
Speaker 1: Jane allegedly with Officer Geiger before this incident. I honestly
32:56
Speaker 1: cannot look at it objectively and say yeah or nay.
33:00
Speaker 1: So I'm waiting for that to be verified. And if
33:03
Speaker 1: it is verified, she is in a lot of trouble
33:06
Speaker 1: because it would prove they had some sort of a
33:09
Speaker 1: familiarity before the shooting. Very quickly to Ben Crump before
33:14
Speaker 1: he heads back into court, being officer Geiger got some
33:18
Speaker 1: real curb services, I like to call it by the police.
33:21
Speaker 1: And then she got in at seven thirty in the
33:23
Speaker 1: in the evening and out by eight thirty, booked out
33:28
Speaker 1: the eight the back door, so she didn't have to
33:30
Speaker 1: do a purple walk. What was that, Ben? We certainly
33:35
Speaker 1: are concerned that this police officer is getting preferential treatment. Uh.
33:39
Speaker 1: Not only is she not arrested the day of the shooting,
33:43
Speaker 1: because considered this Nancy, regular citizens, you're officer of the court,
33:48
Speaker 1: you're an attorney. If somebody claimed that they allegedly went
33:53
Speaker 1: into the wrong apartment and then they shot and killed
33:56
Speaker 1: the innocent homeowner. We won't be allowed to go home
34:01
Speaker 1: that night. You would be arrested that night. And not
34:04
Speaker 1: only that she is the suspect, but she's ter adding
34:08
Speaker 1: with the crime scene with the police officers while they're
34:12
Speaker 1: doing this alleged investigation. And so we believe that she
34:17
Speaker 1: is getting preferential treatment, and she's been getting preferential treatment
34:20
Speaker 1: before from the beginning. It took them over seventy two
34:24
Speaker 1: hours before they finally arrested her, and that was very
34:29
Speaker 1: troubling to both of Jones's family because they understood that
34:34
Speaker 1: their son was in his apartment innocent and the person
34:38
Speaker 1: who killed him got to go home and sleep in
34:42
Speaker 1: her bed, uh for three nights before she was even arrested. Yeah,
34:48
Speaker 1: would still be in the y'all right now, Ben, what
34:50
Speaker 1: is that family? Hope the grand jury will do well.
34:54
Speaker 1: Both of John's family hopes and believes and expects that
35:00
Speaker 1: the grand jury will hear all the evidence and based
35:03
Speaker 1: on that evidence, based on what they know, they believe
35:07
Speaker 1: it should be murder. However, we have told them, as
35:12
Speaker 1: their family attorneys, that it is very difficult to convict
35:16
Speaker 1: the police officer, especially what we've seen in history, UH
35:22
Speaker 1: when the person is a person of color UH and
35:26
Speaker 1: the police officer is white, that there would be a
35:30
Speaker 1: conviction of murder. Manslaughter is easier UH conviction to get
35:40
Speaker 1: from the prosecutor. However, if what these witnesses say are true,
35:48
Speaker 1: then it certainly will lean towards that this was a murder.
35:54
Speaker 1: We will wait till we get all the information to
35:57
Speaker 1: make that determination. Now, said that I were glad to
36:00
Speaker 1: come back on and share with few. Not only are
36:04
Speaker 1: what we believe is strategy going forward in the civil
36:08
Speaker 1: room for death matter, but also what the family believes
36:15
Speaker 1: is the correct charge based on the information that they
36:20
Speaker 1: are being given. As the victims question, how is his
36:24
Speaker 1: mom doing well? That says, as a mother, you can
36:27
Speaker 1: imagine that this is her son, her child. Uh. He
36:32
Speaker 1: came from her wound. It is something that is so
36:37
Speaker 1: unnatural in so many ways. And both of them was
36:41
Speaker 1: doing exceptionally well in life. He was just a tremendous
36:47
Speaker 1: young man. His homegoing celebration was just one that with
36:55
Speaker 1: rival the best UH citizen that anybody whatever. Though he
37:01
Speaker 1: had the chairman of UH Price Waterhouse Cooper accounting firm.
37:08
Speaker 1: He was college educated, he was an accountant. He was
37:13
Speaker 1: doing everything right. He was a believer. He sung in
37:19
Speaker 1: the church choir. I mean, he was a tremendous young
37:23
Speaker 1: man on every level. And so his mother is devastated.
37:27
Speaker 1: His mother is completely devastated that she had to bury
37:32
Speaker 1: her child, Clump. Thank you for being with us, Vincent Hill,
37:36
Speaker 1: Lauren Howard, Dave mac We wait for justice. Two months old,
37:41
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace comes story, signing off Get My Friend,