Latest / Rugby Rivals - Sir John Kirwan & Victor Matfield / Who Ruined the Chicago Test?! Beware France & Scotland This Weekend!

Transcript

Who Ruined the Chicago Test?! Beware France & Scotland This Weekend! · Rugby Rivals - Sir John Kirwan & Victor Matfield

• 0:00
  Of course, Ireland are going to have with the old backs and then the real world kicked in the lift.
• 0:04
  Ireland were really conservative and I don't think it helped them. I think I kicked too much.
• 0:09
  This is going to be a huge taste. I think we did see the antidotes going into this.
• 0:14
  You can't play that card anymore mate. You just can't actually say that anymore because you're not.
• 0:19
  World rugby is completely leading us down. Victor should be too much.
• 0:23
  Whenever I got home I realized your influence is far and wide. My daughter.
• 0:27
  Obviously I look the exact same look at that. I just got the CMCMI for fashion as UJK.
• 0:35
  You look way better, Trumbi.
• 0:42
  Welcome to rivals and after a big weekend one of us is happy and one of us got a little
• 0:50
  weight and a little bit unhappy. Trumbi.
• 0:54
  Yeah, it's just one of those. I just got carried away. I just got carried away with the whole
• 0:59
  buzz of being in Chicago all the Irish people. I didn't spend any time with any New Zealanders
• 1:04
  so I didn't get my expectations checked. So I was just surrounded by Irish propaganda for three days
• 1:11
  partying. So for me, of course Ireland are going to have with the old backs and then the real
• 1:17
  world kicked in the net. Yeah, look, I just thought I was going to amazing few days.
• 1:27
  You know, I don't get from you. I actually don't get how come the Irish.
• 1:31
  Like, you know, I did go looking for you and I walk into an Irish pub and there's a guy there
• 1:35
  from Dublin, a guy there from Limerick. Like, what's the go? You just fly to the other part of the
• 1:41
  world and then go to an Irish pub. I probably know all those people that you have.
• 1:47
  They all live, we all live in the same street together.
• 1:52
  Okay, is it the best pub to go to Irish pub? Come on. Doesn't matter where you go in the world,
• 1:57
  that's always the same option. If you don't know where to go, find the Irish pub. Even if you
• 2:02
  into Penn, Tokyo doesn't matter where you are, find the Irish pub and you'll be fine.
• 2:07
  There'll be some nice competition. That's a competition we win.
• 2:11
  But we always win that competition. The Six Nations pubs, Robby championship pubs,
• 2:16
  we will win that competition. That's a good thing because you're going to ask
• 2:20
  you about the game, do you? Yeah, I'd rather know. Oh, can I just jump in, Trombie?
• 2:25
  Can I just jump in, mate? Because like for me, I don't know if we need to go on strike,
• 2:34
  every rugby player, every rugby coach in the world because World Rugby is completely letting us
• 2:39
  down. Like that referee and I'm not going to take this, please referee if you're listening to
• 2:46
  this, don't take it personally, but that was an absolute disgrace the first 50 minutes, right?
• 2:56
  It's not a red card because when is our TMO actually going to look at the game and go,
• 3:03
  there was no malice in that. It was a mistake, right? And he didn't mean to do it. I mean,
• 3:09
  Bowden comes out after the game and says, look, if you look at that game, you know, I got the ball
• 3:16
  late. It was a reaction. He shouldn't have been red carded. You add the ref was too pedantic,
• 3:22
  right? I'm sitting in a box. I won't tell you who it was, but we've got this massive American
• 3:28
  influence, all right? First rugby game and to be fair, they were bored for 50 minutes until the
• 3:35
  game livened up and the ref was pedantic. And I think the both players, both teams got frustrated
• 3:43
  and there was no flow to the game and that added, I mean, I think that both teams made, I think
• 3:48
  the Irish tactically was an interesting game for them and the all blacks made a few mistakes.
• 3:54
  You know, we've got a spectacle plate. When we play our game, when our game is a great game,
• 3:58
  right? When our game is a great game, it is one of the best spectacles you can play normally, isn't it?
• 4:07
  Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, against, you know, against an opposition that's not really,
• 4:12
  anyway, let's not go there. So, so I'm really frustrated at the moment because we keep talking
• 4:17
  about how great our game is. World rugby keeps saying we want to change. We want we want bigger
• 4:23
  crowds. We want better crowds. We need a better spectacle. I went to the Bulls game during the week
• 4:28
  and although basketball stopped start, there was a whole lot going on. It was just this vibe.
• 4:33
  So I was just really, really frustrated. I felt really sorry for Tag, you know, that's, that's
• 4:39
  after two minutes. It's just like, when are we going to actually think about the fan and think
• 4:45
  about the speed of the game? When's that going to happen? Yeah, but Bud and Barrett, to be
• 4:51
  ferociously came right off the game and said something really nice words. At the time though,
• 4:56
  he did, he did go down very easily. His body went limp, his soul left his body and he looked like
• 5:04
  one of those, you know those goat you see in YouTube where they run along and they stop and their
• 5:08
  legs go in the air. That's what he looked like when he got glanced by Tyburn, like no impact at all.
• 5:15
  But yeah, he came right afterwards and said something really nice word supportive of Ty.
• 5:19
  And that was bananas. Everybody thinks nobody thinks nobody sensible thinks that was a red card.
• 5:23
  That was outrageous. But the spectacle as well at JK. Yes, the performance and referees didn't help.
• 5:29
  TMO didn't help the performance of the teams didn't help more so let's be fair. But the spectacle
• 5:34
  as well was poor. The tech didn't work. The video replaced didn't work. The pitch wasn't good.
• 5:40
  It just felt like everything up until the game was brilliant. They absolutely nailed the marketing
• 5:45
  and the excitement, the buzz and time was amazing. And then as soon as the game, we got the
• 5:50
  game time. Everybody disappointed. It was a big opportunity for us to impress the biggest sports
• 5:55
  market in the world, grew our game and we didn't do it. We talked it up.
• 5:59
  Would you think Victor? Yeah, I just think it's very difficult for the teams to perform if it's
• 6:05
  a stop start like that. I mean, I think that first off, almost to an hour, I mean the break
• 6:12
  on the red card couldn't get this big screen on. There's a TMO. Now they're waiting. They're running
• 6:17
  to the side to make decisions. I mean, Ireland gets a penalty. Jack Crowley goes over the
• 6:26
  mark. It doesn't kick the ball out. So it's actually advantage for New Zealand. He calls him back.
• 6:30
  So you can't go over. Kick it again. I mean, it's just crazy. I mean, we want to get momentum
• 6:36
  into the game. We want to get speed into the game. And I think the officiating just killed it. I mean,
• 6:41
  just away from this game as well, going to disciplinary hearings and stuff. I mean, what's
• 6:47
  happening with the unindriqued baseball at the moment? Play a punch in the game. He claims,
• 6:53
  he grabbed him in a certain place. There's no evidence at all. He gets nine week band. They go
• 6:59
  on a pool. He gets eight week band without any evidence. How can that work in any court of law,
• 7:07
  anything? I mean, I just think whoever's running the referees, whoever's running the judiciary,
• 7:14
  is that how you say it? Process. We just failing the game. Definitely at the moment.
• 7:21
  It feels like it feels like the referees, and this is Joel Judge, I presume, is the boss.
• 7:27
  So the referee on Saturday, like they'll look at his game and he has actually
• 7:34
  refereed to the law of the game. But if we refereed to the law of the game, it's a shit game,
• 7:39
  you know, if you get the good refs that actually let it flow, they actually let it a little bit go.
• 7:43
  But the players get it. The players understand straight away, oh, this guy's going to let that go,
• 7:48
  right? And so we need to take some responsibility. You're at, you're so right. I think that
• 7:55
  with the red card, it's got to be around malice now, right? I'm okay with that being a yellow
• 8:01
  and then coming back on, but it shouldn't have been put to a red, because there's no malice in there.
• 8:06
  So just the, I mean, the forward pass, the burden almost pulled out of the thing,
• 8:12
  dead, pulled out because it's a forward pass, he can't get the ball. Then they collide. I mean,
• 8:18
  if you know right, if you look at the incident, you'll say, listen, there's almost like a dead ball
• 8:23
  with a forward pass to you. And he pulled out, that's, he can't, if he'd tackle him low,
• 8:27
  there's also a penalty, you've got to tackle him without the ball, understand?
• 8:30
  So, yeah, I think someone just need to look at the game and understand the game and make decisions
• 8:35
  that's for the good of the game. Yeah, that's going to do damage as well. Either being,
• 8:40
  if there's malice, as you say, JK, they're looking to do damage, or if they're just being
• 8:45
  leasiness or their techniques, not good, or they're being careless in the air, for example,
• 8:49
  or they're upright, and it's just a different body shape. Everybody in rugby understands
• 8:55
  what happened there. The, as you say, the, he felt like that was a clumsy play. He got the ball,
• 9:01
  he had boot and barred, didn't expect the ball. He ended up with his arms in this position
• 9:06
  cross, but it's not, I think they're thinking technically when lads do that, they're loading up
• 9:10
  their shoulder to really put that through someone's upper body or chest, neck, whatever it is.
• 9:17
  And that is dangerous, but that body position is a defensive one. It's a clumsy one. It's an awkward
• 9:22
  one. You got to be sensible with that. And it's what you say, JK, to the letter of the law,
• 9:28
  or let's be sensible about the game, referees that want us to do it to the letter of the law,
• 9:33
  impact the actual law. They're getting carried away. They're thinking we're something that we're
• 9:38
  not. These are not the laws of physics. They're, they're flawed. We made these laws up
• 9:45
  to play a fun game. And we have, we're destroying a fun game by being taken ourselves to
• 9:52
  seriously. This is what I think needs to happen, Ricardo. We need to stop ruling by committee.
• 9:57
  We've been professional now for 26, 27 years, and the trouble is we've all got to come together
• 10:04
  in a committee and make that rule. Now people say to me, ah, stop talking about rugby league JK,
• 10:10
  but rugby league's product has grown from a crowd point of view, from a spectacle point of view,
• 10:14
  the game sped up from 35 minutes to 55 minutes, but they make decisions also during the season,
• 10:20
  right? We talk about the stuff pre cut, we'll cut, and then they make a rule late.
• 10:25
  So we need to trust someone to be able to make the decision. We shouldn't have to come together,
• 10:29
  because when we come together, it takes us 12 months to decide, because maybe the Irish don't
• 10:34
  want to do this, and maybe the Kiwis don't want to do that, and the Africans don't want to do
• 10:37
  anything, right? You know what I mean? And so we all come together and we can't decide. We need
• 10:41
  to show some leadership and have someone in this game that gets it, and way we go. Like, I reckon,
• 10:47
  Victor should be TMO, so if someone grabs your nuts, you're all good, you just punch him,
• 10:52
  and he's playing next week. Yeah, I think so too. Just maybe to the rugby,
• 10:57
  uh, Jimmy, did you think, um, Ferrell made a mistake to take McCloskell? He was unbelievable on the
• 11:04
  day. Why would he pull him off the game? He was brilliant. He got injured. Yeah, I know, because
• 11:10
  when Aziz came off, he was over our side, and he looked, I thought he looked, he looked
• 11:14
  devastated, and I've seen, I've seen Strip McCloskell, he looked devastated because
• 11:19
  Robbie Hedgehog's blend, uh, Gary Ringrose, Bondiaki, all these guys are getting out of
• 11:23
  him. He's been devastated for 10 years. I assumed it was that again. He was going to be bringing
• 11:28
  brought off for the big impact you expected from, from Bondiaki, but then seeing him later,
• 11:33
  he was growing, strapped up on a, he's a, he's a doubt for next week, but I really hope, as you say,
• 11:38
  I, I remember trying, went out the back a few times, went to the kicking game a few times,
• 11:42
  everything was, uh, inaccurate. Everything was untidy, apart from when you put Strip McCloskell
• 11:48
  right up the guts. That's how you're going to get an offload, change the picture. He was
• 11:52
  absolutely brilliant. He's waited so long for his opportunity, and he was brilliant, and it was
• 11:56
  great to see him, just patience be rewarded. I think tech, sorry, man, I'm just sort of jumping.
• 12:02
  I thought, technically, um, Ireland were really conservative, and I don't think it helped them.
• 12:07
  I think they, I think they kicked too much. I mean, we, we are used to seeing, um,
• 12:12
  Ireland trying to hang on to the ball for 15 racks, and it seemed to me that they had a different
• 12:17
  tactical game, and it just didn't suit them. Didn't look like the players were into it. And,
• 12:21
  you know, the, the South Africa have taught us one thing. If you're going to play that,
• 12:25
  that kicking, high kicking game, you've got to be incredibly accurate.
• 12:28
  Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I think I, maybe given the benefit of the day, I, I assume they think
• 12:35
  because they weren't fit enough to go multi-phase, then we didn't get to see that. I know, we're
• 12:39
  saying that, that version of Ireland that we've seen over the last while, we haven't seen that
• 12:43
  version to really accurately or really well at tempo at pace, at, you know, with accuracy,
• 12:49
  for over probably over a year now, but before that, we did see that for Ireland on repeat,
• 12:54
  and it was so effective. If they can get back there, then they'll be a threat, and they might
• 12:58
  be able to compete with the top teams in the world. But if they don't do that, the plan B doesn't
• 13:03
  work. They can't, Ireland can't do that. They proved the weekend. They can't do the kicking game,
• 13:07
  slow down the game. If they slow down the game, they're not big enough, they're not physical enough,
• 13:11
  they're not accurate enough in the air to be really clinical in those moments. So I agree, JK,
• 13:16
  these lads have got to get game time, get them back on the pitch, get them fit, and then they
• 13:20
  can go back to that multi-phase. Do you think they can play that game with Jack Crowley at 10?
• 13:26
  Isn't that more prender-goss in either option if you want to go play the multi-phase? Isn't Jack
• 13:31
  Crowley more, but deep in the pocket, play tier tree like he does for monster, but he doesn't
• 13:39
  really take the ball to the line as much as a prender-goss or a six-ended in the East-Aid.
• 13:45
  I think prender-gossed over the last while probably probably does, like, picks that option better,
• 13:50
  he's maybe considered to be better with ball in hand if he is playing against structure
• 13:56
  or running that, but if you saw the monster lads for the game, that's exactly what Jack Crowley,
• 14:00
  it was a master class, it was an unbelievable performance from him, and when it comes to kicking
• 14:05
  game, that's, you know, prender-gossed is kicking game. He's, you know, there's old school spiral
• 14:09
  just like nothing and he's just got this variety to his game and he sees spear. So I'm not sure if
• 14:14
  it's that simple to kind of separate, you know, the strengths of the two. I think Crowley can do
• 14:19
  that. I think if he's got, if he's got guys around him who've got loads of running in them,
• 14:24
  and they're all in good, in good positions that got good shape around their fears play,
• 14:28
  I think Jack Crowley can absolutely play that game. That's not to say I think he's going to lead
• 14:33
  the way. I don't know who's going to, who's going to be there in six months, 12 months time,
• 14:37
  who's going to be leading the way, but I feel like he's definitely capable of doing it at the minute.
• 14:41
  Trimby, I don't disagree with you, but I think it's definitely the sixth benefit, like,
• 14:47
  Max X then at the end of his career had this amazing ability. It was like watching this machine
• 14:54
  in place, right? And it was totally led by six things. So I agree with you that both these young
• 15:00
  boys Crowley and they, they can play this game, but it takes a hell of a lot of discipline to go out
• 15:05
  and then everyone around you is so confident they know what you're going to do. I mean,
• 15:09
  the switching from one side of the field to the other under sixth and everyone knowing what they
• 15:13
  were doing was incredible. So, you know, I just think you've got to stick with one. I don't
• 15:19
  think there's enough difference in them both. You've got to give someone the, you've got to give
• 15:23
  someone the rugby team, right? And I understand competition, but when you play like the Irish,
• 15:29
  it just, I just think it takes a while to get into that first five at the line like Victor said,
• 15:35
  you know, that balance between kicking and running. Just sum up the game from the all black
• 15:42
  point of view. I mean, you know, by the way, Matt Sexton was a canary hawker, but can we just
• 15:48
  sum up the game from the all black point of view? Lost a couple of barats early, a whole new midfield
• 15:53
  that really looked effective and obviously a good last 20 minutes. But what was your,
• 15:58
  what was your thoughts on the all blacks? Yeah, I thought they'll be, they'll be confirmed about
• 16:03
  their in-air accuracy with the ball. I thought they made some really good line breaks early and,
• 16:08
  you know, we're knocking it on and didn't really get the rhythm. Just the young guys,
• 16:14
  lister for our Nuku man, like he's been away, like we thought we'd lost him and his impact
• 16:21
  at impact time, right? So his second efforts to get you just over the advantage line, you know,
• 16:27
  Josh Lorde comes in, you know, Josh has been around the team for a while now. He's had a few
• 16:32
  injuries. I thought he was unbelievable Fabian. So I think the disruption early was amazing.
• 16:38
  But our young guys came on. So TT, I thought the last 20 minutes, you saw these young guys come on
• 16:44
  and really make an impact. So that was really, really positive and creates competition within the
• 16:49
  team. So to sum up very quickly, I thought, you know, I've been inaccurate in the first 50 minutes
• 16:55
  and then, you know, we had some big games as well from our locks that day you would have been
• 16:59
  really excited about our two young locks that stepped up. And then the young guys for our Nuku,
• 17:03
  so TT, you know, really coming on and making a difference. So I thought it was really, really
• 17:09
  positive. I thought the venture unbelievable. I think Williams in the front row every time he comes
• 17:18
  on got a big impact in the game. So TT was a TT of lost here. He was unbelievable supporting lines.
• 17:25
  I mean, running hard, getting over the advantage line. And I don't know what's the kid that came
• 17:31
  on on 12. He just had magic. I mean, his first touch, he created that try. And that's what you
• 17:38
  got used to from all black backs. Someone that takes the ball, nothing on footwork, speed,
• 17:46
  power and then they should try. So I think a few youngsters that really stepped up for the
• 17:52
  all blacks, they'll be very exciting about those guys. And it's nice to see. I mean, last year's
• 17:57
  TT was really outstanding. It was a young player of the year. And we all thought he'll kick on.
• 18:03
  Unfortunately, he didn't, but this is a step in the right direction for him as well.
• 18:08
  Caleb Clark was very good as well. It felt like I don't, I don't, I'm not buying into the
• 18:14
  New Zealand didn't play well for 60 minutes and then played well for the last 20 minutes.
• 18:18
  I think New Zealand were trying to play rugby. It's just that last pass. I think they were actually
• 18:23
  they misfired to give it all in. They misfired, but they were close to cutting loose a few times.
• 18:28
  Actually, I remember saying to my body beside me, it was only a matter of time before these passes
• 18:32
  start sticking. And those, they started sticking whenever Ireland fatigued. They lost, Ireland lost
• 18:37
  all that line speed, all that intensity and defense. And then you just give them a McKenzie,
• 18:41
  a little second extra on the ball. And then the passes started sticking and defenders started
• 18:46
  to get beaten. And then we saw the real version of New Zealand. Caleb Clark is also a massive net
• 18:51
  all black teamer. I mean, he's carrying ability, these aerial skills. I can't believe they
• 18:57
  sometimes leave him out. He just bring something different. Last year in South Africa as well,
• 19:02
  he was outstanding in those two matches over here in South Africa. So I don't understand why
• 19:08
  they sometimes just don't want to pick him. Oh, I think Victor, I think his issue this year has
• 19:15
  been a couple of niggly injuries that have kept him out. But I agree with you, I really like
• 19:19
  the combination. I really like the combination of having a big winger and then a fast winger.
• 19:24
  You know, and I think Caleb's really on form. I totally agree. I think that's, you know, I think that's
• 19:30
  that's that's a given. So I don't disagree, Trimby. I think I think the team were trying to play,
• 19:36
  you know, you know, what it's like when you've finished a game, they'll be sitting down Monday morning
• 19:40
  and say, you know, we can't be dropping those balls, those last passes. We've got to make that
• 19:47
  better. I do think they tried to play rugby, I agree with that. And yeah, so I think they'll come
• 19:51
  away pretty happy Ricardo. I mean, it's another hard week this week. Be interesting to see what he
• 19:57
  does with selection, you know, because while Trimby's making the excuse that the Irish at the
• 20:01
  beginning of the season are not fit enough, you know, but he still had to swim in the in the lake.
• 20:08
  You know, we just on that, I saw there was a big winger and a lean fast winger on the
• 20:16
  beach in California as well, huh? It's definitely a nice moment. A big and a lean winger there.
• 20:31
  Yeah, it's just a request from the viewers, JK, if you could just keep your shirt on for the
• 20:36
  rest of the series, that would be great. Like it must have been the tough weekend for you, Victor,
• 20:42
  obviously being the Japanese line-out advisor. Not the line-out advisor. I'm just helping Eddie
• 20:49
  with everything. So I'm not lost. I did the line-outs. This year, I'm just actually second boys
• 20:55
  to Eddie. So just giving him impact. Yeah, and it was difficult. And I've said it in the past,
• 21:02
  I remember when we played for the Bulls and we had that team that just dominated for three years.
• 21:06
  Everyone said they knew exactly what we're going to do. And I said, well, if you know what you're
• 21:11
  doing, try and stop it. And you just can't stop it. And just the bell of the spring walks,
• 21:16
  unfortunately, the Japanese play just couldn't live with it. Physicality, intensity,
• 21:23
  and then guy like Sasha comes in two half gaps and he scored two tries, and then it's game over.
• 21:29
  So, yeah, unfortunately for them, I think it's a wake-up pull off to last week against Australia.
• 21:35
  They probably thought we are a bit closer. And it's nice. I mean, there's a lot of systems that
• 21:41
  get into place. But unfortunately, against the top three four teams in the world, if you don't stand
• 21:46
  up physically, if you can't handle the intensity, if you can't, especially the 22. If you can't do that
• 21:56
  22 defence and 22 attack you in trouble. So you need that physicality, unfortunately.
• 22:01
  And you've got a huge weekend against France.
• 22:08
  Yeah, this weekend, I think it's probably our toughest test of the year. Even tougher than
• 22:15
  go down to Eden Park. I think it's going to be harder to beat them.
• 22:20
  But you didn't. Yeah, but I mean, that's why I say this is going to be a huge test.
• 22:25
  I think we're definitely the underdogs going into this, although we're playing really well at the
• 22:30
  moment. France, I think that one thing that can count in our favour is they haven't played together
• 22:37
  for quite some time. And these one or two injuries. But I mean, they're going to be up for it.
• 22:43
  They've been waiting for this for two years to get this grand match against South Africa after
• 22:50
  that quarter final. I can't believe you say you were underdogs. You can't play that card any more,
• 22:57
  mate. You just can't, you just can't actually say that anymore, because you're not.
• 23:00
  You're going to Paris playing the French team. That's the six nice and champions. What do you mean?
• 23:07
  Why have you not mentioned your World Cup wins, Victor? You can't talk up your World Cup wins
• 23:13
  and then talk about being underdogs. We'll win in next week. I'm hiding that away this week. I'm
• 23:21
  nice and humble this week. I'm a bit worried about the week. Okay. So I'm really humble.
• 23:28
  Whenever I got home, I realised that your influence is far and wide. My daughter.
• 23:34
  Obviously, I look the exact same. Look at that. I just got the CMI for fashion as UJK.
• 23:42
  The good thing is about coverage, Mike. You're nice, Mike. You look way better, Trombie. So
• 23:46
  extreme. I would have worn the whole podcast, but they make your nose itchy.
• 23:54
  Those are the best JK. I have to send that over to you.
• 24:00
  You also look good actually last week. Victor, you also look like shit, Trombie,
• 24:03
  but listen, I will take you guys shopping. Don't worry. I will help you out if you need me to.
• 24:08
  I think getting back to the French. I'm going to have it to Ireland, Trombie. I'm not on the beach
• 24:13
  next. I'll be straight to the bar. Teneck dropped the next morning again or to whiskey tasting or
• 24:17
  something. Not getting me in gold. Go for a swim. I'm not sure. Before the Ireland game,
• 24:22
  are you going to be world champions? Are you going to be underdogs? Which ones are going to be
• 24:26
  double or high? We'll be double world champions. I think the French, I personally think the
• 24:35
  French after seeing them down in New Zealand with not their top side. I just think that one of the
• 24:43
  best rugby nations in the world, from A to Z, I think the game is really working from a publicity
• 24:52
  point of view. The crowds are full. The TV rights are going up. They're attracting a whole
• 24:58
  lot of foreign players over there. That's why I thought Benazee should have been chairman because
• 25:05
  I think that French have proved that the whole game is going right. I do think that they need to
• 25:12
  beat South Africa, New Zealand. They beat us last year in November. They need to get these
• 25:17
  scalps under their belt if they want to go into the World Cup and actually be really, really
• 25:23
  confident. I still believe way back in 2002 that the reason England won in Australia is they came
• 25:28
  down to New Zealand. They beat us on our turf. It just gives you that confidence you can do it.
• 25:33
  You said Trombie. Ireland turned around from 2016. I do think you need that belief in between
• 25:40
  World Cups. Yeah, I don't think France have ever struggled with confidence. I think France
• 25:48
  feel like they are one of the big dogs in World Rugby. They haven't had to cope with that kind of
• 25:54
  imposter syndrome that northern other northern hemisphere teams certainly aren't in any way before
• 25:59
  they make that big step and then they convince themselves they can compete. I think France have
• 26:03
  always thought they can compete. I don't feel like they're going to go to the next level now.
• 26:06
  Certainly what they're capable of anyway. I think I think Rick, sorry, I'm just a I'm such a big
• 26:14
  fan of Bordeaux and Toulouse. If you look at those two teams, almost 80% of the clips that I took
• 26:21
  to Eddie that I think we're actually should go to is probably from Bordeaux. The way they play,
• 26:27
  and I mean, then you've got Toulouse on the other side that's been probably the top club
• 26:32
  with Lisa for the last three or four years. I mean, if you put those two teams, just those players
• 26:37
  together, they don't have to play together too much. It will just be magic. They just got
• 26:43
  glass all over the field. I think there's one team that we haven't talked a lot about that
• 26:49
  actually is quietly really climbing up the charts and that's England, you know, and it's hard to
• 26:54
  think of a team that's quiet when you've got someone like Henry Pollock that's playing for them,
• 26:58
  but they are quietly putting up results. They do well in Argentina, you know, they put the wallabies
• 27:03
  away at Twickenham. They're going to be a team that are going to be doing well in this autumn
• 27:09
  series, do you think? I don't know why we're trying to make this is sort of sums up our game.
• 27:14
  Why are we trying to make Henry Pollock something that is not? Well, doesn't he?
• 27:23
  What do you mean? Well, doesn't he just need to be himself? Why are we always trying to,
• 27:28
  you know, make something some of them are not Ricardo? I think he's being himself. I was just saying
• 27:35
  he's not someone that lacks confidence. Yeah, well, that's right, but it annoys me that
• 27:40
  everyone around the traps is trying to make him some of them. He's not. England are always a
• 27:45
  threat. I think England lost their way a wee bit, but now under Borswick, they're back to actually
• 27:50
  understanding how they want to play. You know, what was Ireland's problem on the weekend?
• 27:55
  I think they got caught between two styles of game. Why is South Africa such a massive threat?
• 28:02
  Because I think South Africa now have the correct balance between smashing you and then they
• 28:07
  can be expansive. Why are France so good when France is so good because they can play their
• 28:12
  expansive game? And it's really, I think Victor's point is so good. Rugby nations that are doing
• 28:20
  well have two or three really dominant clubs that are doing a great job from their junior club,
• 28:24
  right through to the senior club. You know, Lentz stuff, for example, you know, and and and
• 28:31
  Munster and teams like that franchise are doing well in New Zealand at the moment. It's well,
• 28:35
  it's been for the last 20 years, probably Canterbury. So, you know, England, I think, have come back
• 28:41
  to actually, this is how we play Borswick's is. This is our DNA. If we do this, we're hard to be
• 28:50
  Yeah, and the Henry Pollock stuff as well. Like we need rock stars in the game. I know it's been said
• 28:55
  a few times recently, but if you behave like Henry Pollock, then you get a bit of a reaction,
• 29:00
  but that reaction is a good thing. All of this stuff, all of this, this rivalry slag and banter,
• 29:06
  intense, the frustration hatred between teams and he's one of these guys. He's a beacon for
• 29:12
  our response. There's no lions hanging over with Henry Pollock. He's hit the ground run
• 29:17
  and straight away. He's backing up his talk. He performs like a rock star. So I love guys like
• 29:23
  that. He's very good for our game. He makes our game more popular and brings it to to new kids
• 29:28
  that haven't grown up playing rugby. They want to be Henry Pollock. I want to be Henry Pollock.
• 29:36
  Gary Thorick. I just know you just want to make the all blacks and the spring box when
• 29:39
  ever they play against England, the boys will actually be into it. I think you'll enjoy that
• 29:48
  Victor. I think he's the type of player that needs that. Some players need to have that confidence
• 29:54
  in that and that sort of pizzazz to play and good on him and I think it's awesome.
• 30:01
  There's a team we haven't mentioned and I think the New Zealand side should be thinking about
• 30:07
  these guys in that Scotland. They're quietly going about their business, getting ready to play
• 30:13
  the all blacks at Murrayfield. They'd never beaten the all blacks before in their history and I think
• 30:20
  quietly they're giving themselves a big chance this weekend. Does anyone give them a chance?
• 30:27
  We would never underestimate Scotland, Ricardo. We know that Scotland under towns in
• 30:34
  they're incredibly well organised. They're a really good rugby team. It'll be their biggest
• 30:40
  game of the year because like Trimby was in 2016, they will want to be the team that breaks that
• 30:48
  who to. For me it's the biggest game of the trip. I knew that everyone would get up for the
• 30:57
  Ireland game. That was a big game. This is the biggest game from a combination. We've got a
• 31:03
  couple of injuries now. We've just got to, this needs to be our best game by a long shot from
• 31:12
  a preparation point of view and the coaches will know it. We will not be underestimating him.
• 31:18
  There'll be nothing left on the preparation table. This is the biggest game and I'm pretty
• 31:23
  short team though. I think Scotland's kind of unbelievable backline, I mean with Fin Russell,
• 31:36
  they've got dangerous outside backs, everything but unfortunately they just don't have a back that
• 31:41
  can lift with a spring box, all blacks, France, Ireland. I think they won't be really competitive.
• 31:51
  I think the all blacks will run away with it this weekend. I'm a victor. I'm surprised that you're
• 31:58
  saying it's the biggest. I don't see New Zealand being concerned about this granted. They'll
• 32:03
  not take it for granted but I think they'll turn up on the blue Scotland away. Scotland, they do
• 32:09
  have this. They certainly have a higher seal in them we've seen from them but I just feel like
• 32:14
  Scotland's sides for the last 10 years. They've got maybe when they're first to give them the
• 32:19
  six nations and then they start thinking okay where can we be and they start thinking they're here
• 32:24
  but we don't see consistency from Scotland. At least every now and again we see a big performance
• 32:29
  from them but they very rarely back it up and I think it's because of that reason they haven't got
• 32:33
  a pack to give them that consistent foundation. The young guys come through Liam McConnell's playing
• 32:39
  very well for Edinburgh at the minute. Glasgow are kind of revving their engine at times and showing
• 32:43
  how good they can be but it feels like they never really step up and compete consistently with the
• 32:47
  big teams in the world. I mean we're trying to talk Scotland up can you help us hear a little bit
• 32:54
  from me? Sorry. I mean what the boys have said is correct from a technical point of view
• 33:06
  and when I say it's the biggest game of the season is because if we think like Victor and Trimby
• 33:10
  will get beaten like we've got to be right on our game the only thing right so from a psychological
• 33:17
  point of view this is the hardest week you know you get yourself up for a game in Chicago there's
• 33:22
  all the hype you know the boys go to the bloody the boys go to the game you know go to the bulls
• 33:26
  game they do all that sort of stuff. This week's the grind this week's when you've got to really pick
• 33:30
  it up. If we played our best we'll beat Scotland but if we're a little bit off we won't.
• 33:36
  So I had an opportunity to get in the box in Quentin on a grand slam tour and back then we
• 33:43
  haven't beaten Ireland for quite some time so we had almost the same tour that New Zealand
• 33:48
  is so we had Ireland Scotland England Wales and beat everyone and then we lost against Scotland so
• 33:56
  I mean if you're not mentally up for it it can be a problem so but I don't think I think we're
• 34:02
  the all black side at the moment they will still feel the pressure they they want to win every game
• 34:08
  so I think they'll be ready for the game. From a select from a from a selection point of view
• 34:14
  Ricardo when when I'm talking about this as a select do you go who's in the balance moment right
• 34:19
  so Satiti has been a little bit a little bit criticised you know like like Victor said play
• 34:25
  the year it's been left out a couple of times you know do you do you rest someone like Arty and
• 34:30
  start Satiti so you bring a bit of edge to the bit of edge to the week you know so for me it's
• 34:37
  about selecting a couple of guys that are on the fringe but you know they're good enough
• 34:41
  and that brings a bit of edge to the team you know they're bloody running round like like Madman
• 34:45
  during the week because they just want to take their opportunity so it's just balancing it right
• 34:49
  just making sure you get the right max of selection make make sure you make that week really good
• 34:56
  and then I think if we pay to our ability we don't lose. Hey everyone Razi would do Victor I know
• 35:02
  you mentioned this before once they ruby championship they bring in the young guys they deliver that
• 35:07
  does not mean the older guys the veterans the lads who are established up it doesn't mean they're gone
• 35:12
  they're going to come back in a few weeks time with a point to prove and Razi's going to lean on
• 35:16
  that I think that's maybe a lesson that other head coaches can can learn it's okay for
• 35:21
  South Africa to do that because they have like five tiers of depth they how certainly I've got that
• 35:26
  Maryland they may not have that New Zealand either so maybe other teams can are with constraint
• 35:32
  from what's available. I was talking about I was talking about innovation before when I was in
• 35:39
  Chicago you know Razi has completely changed also the emotional side of the game you know
• 35:45
  and I've been talking about I've been wrong for probably 12 months because Razi has actually said
• 35:50
  to test guys right you're going to be put into this game and put under selection pressure every
• 35:56
  week and it's working and that's what our game lacks our game lacks a bit of innovation from
• 36:01
  World Rugby to say we need to do this to make sure our game changes so you know Trimby's right
• 36:07
  and I think you know Ireland do need to make some changes after the weekend Trimby you know
• 36:13
  like that you do need to put pressure on some of these guys doesn't mean the old guys are not
• 36:18
  any good anymore it just creates that internal pressure. I think some dogs are just killing wild
• 36:24
  animals on Victor's lawn so we better go have a good weekend gentlemen and lots to talk about
• 36:32
  next week on rugby rivals.