Latest / I Choose Me with Jennie Garth / I Choose...To Grieve The Loss of Shannen Doherty

Transcript

I Choose...To Grieve The Loss of Shannen Doherty · I Choose Me with Jennie Garth

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: You're listening to I Choose Me with Jenny Garth. Hi, everybody,
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: welcome to the I Choose Me Podcast. So this is
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: a very difficult time that we are all going through.
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: We are all experiencing this great loss of our friend
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: Shannon Doherty. Because I know that we're all feeling this sadness,
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: this happiness. Grief is just so unique to each one
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: of us, plays out differently for everybody, and I just
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: wanted to acknowledge this huge, huge loss. I'm gonna have
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: my best friend, Adele, our therapist, come in, and it
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: helped me to sort of process my feelings and talk
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: about grief with us in hopes that this will help
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: you guys, if you're feeling the same as I am,
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: which I'm pretty sure you are. Hi, Adele, thank you.
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: Of course, I have not seen you or talked to
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: you other than by text since we heard the news
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: about Shannon, and I'm honored and glad that you wanted
• 1:23
  Speaker 2: to include me in this conversation. And I'm I'm glad
• 1:26
  Speaker 2: you want to be of service to your nine O,
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: two and o family that's grieving, and from what I
• 1:34
  Speaker 2: can tell by the news cycle, it's more than just
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: your nine oh two and O family grieving.
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a big family. The whole world definitely feels
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: the loss. I think, you know, whether you are a
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: fan of the show or one of her other shows,
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: or if you were a fan of the way she
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: was addressing her battle publicly and helping a lot of
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: people through their own struggles. You know, there's a lot
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: of people that really looked up to Shannon, and I
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: was one of them.
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: So, yeah, it's been about five days, so maybe we
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: start with you just have you what how did you
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: find out?
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: I was on a trip with my husband. We had
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: planned a get away to sort of be able to
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: spend time together, and I found out while we were away,
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: So that definitely sort of changed the tone of that
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: trip entirely. And since it happened while I was out
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: of town, it didn't feel real somehow. And there's no
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: way I would open my Instagram or do any kind
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: of looking because it's you know, just kind of everywhere
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: and it's just too much. My phone was blowing up
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: with like people sending their condolences and which you know,
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: of course that is so kind, but it just kept hitting, hitting, hitting,
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: And so when I got back to La. When we
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: got home, I just wanted to stay home, like I
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: just don't want to go anywhere right now. That kind
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: of feeling of just needing to like crawl in a
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: hole and process this without eyes.
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that makes sense. And you know you're describing exactly
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: what kind of happens when somebody learns that someone they
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: love and.
• 3:47
  Speaker 3: Care about dies.
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: It's a shock, right, That's kind of the first thing
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: that happens, is, yeah, belief and shock.
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: Well it's crazy because we all knew she was sick.
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: The whole world knew that, you know, And and I
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: don't know why, but I just thought she would get better.
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: I thought she would kick it. She's, you know, the
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: strongest woman around. And I just never thought that this
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: would happen. And I had listened to some of her
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: podcasts from the previous week, and I knew she was
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: kind of undergoing this new chapter in her battle with cancer,
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: more chemotherapy, and I could tell she was feeling nervous,
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: but I also saw glimmer of hope in her, and
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: that just reassured me that everything was going to be okay.
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: If she was hopeful, then I could be hopeful too.
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think that's what she was putting
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: out in the world, and I think everybody that was
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: rooting for her was paying close attention. But I think
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: we all felt like, oh, cancer is no match for her,
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: Like she just wanted.
• 4:59
  Speaker 3: To live, and she made that very clear.
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: Over and over again, and so I was totally shocked
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: when I heard the news. She felt so alive the
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: last several weeks with her podcast and everything that I
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: just thought. It just was such a shock, And of
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: course I thought about you immediately. I was one of
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: the people that blew up your phone at seven am,
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: hoping I wasn't the first person.
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: You were, and you were the first person I didn't
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: see it. Actually, Dave was having his coffee in bed
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: and he I came out from the bathroom and he said,
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: I need to tell you something. And instantly when he
• 5:34
  Speaker 1: says that, I panic just instinctually, and I thought he
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: was going to say something about, you know, my dog
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: who's elderly, or something like from our family. And then
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: he told me that this happened, and I was like, like,
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: I literally felt like someone punched me in the stomach.
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: I think I feel so protective of you that you know,
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: and I'm an early bird. When I saw it, I thought,
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: I got to get to Jenny and make sure she's protected.
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: And I'm so glad you were with Dave. I'm sure
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: it was dizzying to be out of the country.
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I was very felt, very weird. I don't know
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: how to explain it, and then just flying back into
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: La and kind of coming to terms that it was real.
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: It was really hard.
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: Have you spoken with any of your other nine oh
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: two one zero co stars.
• 6:39
  Speaker 3: Are you guys.
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: Supporting each other and reaching out and if you want
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: to share anything.
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: About that, Yeah, I mean we've talked about it that
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: we have a group chat. Jason of course was the
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: first one to reach out to everybody and just you know,
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: say I love you guys, and this is insane and
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: no more, no more loss, Like this is crazy that
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: that I think that's one of the hardest parts for
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: me is that it's it's now two three. It's two
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: people from our original cast, you know, and of course
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: Joey Tada and Paul Wagner and Jessica Klein other people
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: have passed away also, But this just was like, you know,
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: when you have like a group shot and if you
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: can imagine that image of that person in the group
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: shot fading away, Yeah, and two like disappear Like it's
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: just I can't I can't really wrap my head around it.
• 7:45
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And I'm sure it brought all the feelings back
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: about Luke. I know that was an incredibly difficult loss
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: for you.
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: I was with you that day, as was Dave.
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: And watching that loss was Yeah, I'm sure brought it
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: all flooding back.
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: Definitely. I never I chose to never speak publicly very
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: much at all about Luke's passing. Didn't, you know, put
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: up a post or anything. I just I didn't know
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: how to handle that and I didn't feel compelled to
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: let my feelings out there. This one felt, I don't know,
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: felt different but the same. So yeah, I mean I
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: feel like when grief comes knocking at your door, death
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: comes knocking at your door causing grief, Like it's the
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: same feeling grief, just however you feel grief individually, it's
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: the same feeling. So yeah, it does take you right
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: back to that any previous pain or encounter you've had
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: with it, just like it was yesterday.
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: So it has familiar elements to it that any other
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: grief that you've gone through or any other loss that
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: you've had, you're right back there feeling that loss too.
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: Is that normal? Is that normal to have that same
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: feeling about different people?
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: Of course, because it is a very like you said
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: at the very beginning, it's so unique to each individual
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: and wherever you feel it in your body, right, and
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: whatever thoughts you have around losing somebody or something that
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: you love, whether it's a person, an animal, job, a partnership,
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: lives in your body in the same place.
• 9:47
  Speaker 3: So you're right back there.
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: And if you kind of kept it to yourself or
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: locked it away or didn't fully grieve, it's an open
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: wound again.
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't think I've ever fully grieved any loss
• 10:03
  Speaker 1: that I've had, So it's like opening up a nasty
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: box of feelings.
• 10:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah.
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: And you know, a lot of grief experts think that
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: the best thing you can do with grief, as painful
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: and sorrowful as it is, is to feel it fully right,
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: And maybe the gift that Shannon's passing can give you,
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: especially because she's kind of known for this too, is
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: to really feel the sorrow and lean into it and
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: grieve it. Because I know you and I know you
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: lock things away and you only allow for as much
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: as you think you can allow. But I also know
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: as you've evolved and grown, I know you can allow more.
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: And maybe this is the time where you let some
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: of those other losses that are kind of locked away
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: or you know, trapped in your body, that you let
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: it go. You don't just cry for Shannon, but you
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: cry for your dad and Luke, and I'm you know,
• 11:10
  Speaker 2: thinking of other people, Lynn and many dogs that you've lost,
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: and you know you've had a lot of You've had
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: a lot of loss.
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean some people haven't experienced loss yet. We
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: all will. But like like a real loss like your
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: dad or your friend or your mom or something like
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: that kind of grief or a child, that kind of grief,
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: you cannot understand it even the slightest until you've been
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: through it. Right, Like my husband Dave's never lost anybody,
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: He's never experienced death. So in a way it's kind
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: of hard because he tries his best, of course, to
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: like come for me and be there for me, but
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: I don't think he fully grasps the depth of it
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: and just the way it works, like it'll just come
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: up out of nowhere. In the middle of a dinner bite,
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: like you never know when you're just gonna basically lose
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: it and be sad.
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: Right. It ebbs and flows, It comes in waves. It
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: is not linear at all. It catches you by surprise,
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: you know, and you know you'll be giving Dave a
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: gift showing him what it looks like when it comes
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: for him.
• 12:33
  Speaker 3: Right, and your kids.
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: We always talk about modeling when we get together, you know,
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: and do this podcast, like what are you modeling for people?
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: But any way that you can sort of let the
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: sorrow in and lean into it, they say that that
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: also allows you to feel the greatest joy too, because
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: if you're feeling two sides of the same coin and
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: you're allowing for both, it can be a continuum or whatever,
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: or that you you're also giving yourself a gift of
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: feeling deeply on both sides of the continuum and you
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: can handle it.
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I have learned more about just letting feelings pass,
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: you know, and honoring them and reminding myself when I
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: am feeling any kind of certain way that it's just
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: a feeling and it will pass. And I you know,
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: I talk to my little self inside and I say
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: it's okay. You know I'm here for you. You got this,
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: You're gonna be okay. I know it hurts right now,
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: but it's going to get better. I know that. When
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: my dad passed away, people would say to me, time
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: will heal honey, time will fix it, and I was like,
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: f you. You know, time will never make this feel better. Yeah,
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: And it really made me mad when people would say that.
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: And I realize, of course now I don't even know
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: how many years later, twelve years later from my dad's passing,
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: that it does dissipate, like the emotions that raw feelings
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: of emotions that you go through right away, and that
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: I'm still going through, and I know so many people
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: are still going through. They do dissipate. And it's not
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: it's not that you're forgetting that person or you're like
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: moved on to something else, because it does live in
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: you forever. It's just that you have find found some
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: way to comfort yourself through it and accept it and
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: honor it and move forward with your life because that's
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: what you have to do.
• 14:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: I heard I heard a beautiful description the other day
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: in a podcast, and I wish I could give credit,
• 14:58
  Speaker 2: but I don't remember who said it, but that grief
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: is like a heavy stone in your pocket and.
• 15:04
  Speaker 3: You're very aware of it.
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: You feel that heavy stone and it weighs you down,
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: and you feel it every day. And as time goes
• 15:13
  Speaker 2: on and you get stronger, the stone gets lighter. Right,
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: So you don't feel it as often, it's not as
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: ever present, but it's always in your pocket. You never
• 15:24
  Speaker 2: forget about it. But your strength and courage and kind
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: of integration of the loss allows for the stone and
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: the heaviness and weight of it to get lighter.
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel that. I know that from dealing with
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: it so many times. Yeah, you think in the moment
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: you're going to break, you know. And I know with Shannon,
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: I was shocked, and then I was pissed at myself
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: for being shocked.
• 16:01
  Speaker 3: I was like so mad, you know.
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: I was bargaining and saying why her, Like why not me?
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: And I know I don't know anything actually, but there
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: were so many feelings. I was angry, angry at her circumstances,
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: at cancer, at the world for taking you know, her
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: away from her mom.
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and.
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: Her family and her dog. She loved Bowie so much.
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: Oh sorry, I don't want to cry.
• 16:47
  Speaker 3: And just the world.
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: Like all of our nine O two one oh family,
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: there's been this crazy division in some of the fans
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: that they were either team Kelly or they were team Brenda.
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: And I don't think that either Shannon or I ever
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: wanted that, So I you know, even though if you
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: were team Brenda or whatever, I know you're hurting just
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: the same everybody is hurting, and there's just you know,
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: it's a time when we can all come together and
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: process this all with each other. So that is my hope.
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: And maybe in that once and for all in that
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: you know, binary choice or that divisiveness, because you and
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: Shannon never wanted that, and people get so wrapped up
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: in TV shows and I understand, but to think that
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: it's it was so black and white, or that they
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: understand the story or the friendship between you and Shannon
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: and what worked and what was complicated and the love
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: that was there and the experiences that you and Shannon
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: had are nobody else's but your own. So you know,
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: I would just say, let's hope that everybody can kind
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: of release that once and for all. I wanted to
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: bring something up that you, I mean, you basically talked
• 18:11
  Speaker 2: about you cycled through the Elizabeth Koobler Ross stages of
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: grief in a matter of moments, right, you know that denial, anger, bargaining, depression, acceptance,
• 18:25
  Speaker 2: and they come and go again like quickly over time,
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: and all of it is okay. Because when I heard
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: you say you were mad at yourself for I think
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: being angry, I just want to say to you two.
• 18:41
  Speaker 3: Things in grief.
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: The most important thing that I can impart to you
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: and to people listening, everything is okay in grief, meaning
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: whatever it looks like for you, whatever it looks like
• 18:54
  Speaker 2: for anybody that's listening, all is okay. Shutting down irritability, anger,
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: if you feel guilty, that's a really common thing, and
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: that you have to be the most important thing is
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: you have to be gentle on yourself. We do so
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: much self recrimination, we do so much beating ourselves up,
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: and so that's the second thing, is gentle on yourself
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: except all and also not just for you, but anybody
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: else that's grieving, how they do it is also okay.
• 19:25
  Speaker 2: So you give space for yourself and others, and gentleness
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: and grace.
• 19:31
  Speaker 3: For yourself and.
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: Others, because all is okay during grief. Any kind of behavior,
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: acting out, shutting down.
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I think that that's important. I hope everybody
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: really hears that, that you're grieving, Like, even if you
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: weren't friends with Shannon, or you know, weren't in my
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: position or any of our positions, you her and it's
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: a loss for anybody who loved any part of her.
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: So I hope that people really hear that and are
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: gentle on themselves and honor their grief, because, like you're saying,
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: that's the only way to get through it. You can't
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: go around it.
• 20:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, when talking about Shannon, like, what do you think, so,
• 20:24
  Speaker 2: I know you've been thinking about her a lot. What
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: do you think you'll remember most about her?
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: I will remember the respect that I have for her,
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: always had for her, in her willingness to voice her
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: opinions on things, stand up for people that needed to
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: be stood up for that couldn't do them do it themselves.
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: I will admire that's so her bravery.
• 20:55
  Speaker 3: And she was.
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: One of the most generous people I know. She was
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: really kind and generous and strong, and sometimes her strength
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: got in her way and didn't look the way other
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: people wanted it to look. But she didn't care she
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: was strong anyway, because I think she had to be.
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: I know, we have very similar upbringings and stories about
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: our dads and are just deep, deep connections with our fathers.
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: And then how her dad and my dad both got
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: sick when we were young and we did everything in
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: our power to keep them alive as long as possible,
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: and that was a lot of pressure and wait to
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: put on our shoulders at you know, as teenagers basically yeah,
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: and so we both shared that, I want to say
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: burden because it was very difficult, and I was thinking, like,
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: you know, Shannon was a fighter. She was always a fighter,
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: though it wasn't just because of one thing or or
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: things that weren't significant. She fought four things that mattered
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: to her and people that mattered to her. And I
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: loved laughing with Shannon, like we could have a good
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: session of just like uncontrollable laughing. And she was funny.
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: And I will probably miss the most just hearing her
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: say my name because she she always said Ginny it
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: like from the South, Yeah, And I never corrected her.
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: It's just the way she said it, and I loved it.
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: Do you have a favorite memory or story with her,
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: like one of your favorite funny times.
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: Oh my god, we could get really mischievous together. Her
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: I very very strong independent girls and women. I loved
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: when we were being mischievous or honery or just a
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: little devilish, like, you know, not to the point of
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: bad things happening, but just for a little fun. And
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: one of the last like main memories I have is
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: going several years back now, was going to Vegas to
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: see Ian, our friend Ian in Chippendale's right. So we
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: flew together to see him, and we supported him, and
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: we just laughed so hard, and she thought it was
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: so funny when they pulled me up on stage and
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: you know, did a public lap dance. So we had
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: a really great time on that trip. Yeah, And I
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: also keep like remembering the last word that she said
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: to me. It was just an example of even though
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: our relationship was complicated at times, or was convoluted at
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: times by outside forces that just sort of crept in
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: for us both, we still loved each other. And it
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: was after our last time together at maybe nineties gone. Anyway,
• 24:49
  Speaker 1: she had to get right back to la and she
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: was taking her i think her friend's private plane, and
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: she had offered everybody that need to get back to
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: La or even Jason, who had to go to Nashville,
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: get on the plane and we can all go together.
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: And no one asked me, and I was feeling a
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: little like ouch just from being not asked, or I
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: don't know why. I didn't even have to go back
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: to LA, I had to go to the opposite direction
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: to New York. But she came up to me right
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: before they left, and she was like, we're going on
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: this plane. You're welcome to come with us, Jinny, and
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: I can see her saying it, and that just keeps
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: playing over and over in my mind.
• 25:38
  Speaker 3: Her generosity. I hear that a lot.
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: Something that's so remarkable to me is the way you
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: talk about her and the way you describe her. And
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: I met her but way back in the day when
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: you were doing one two one O, Like I was
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: there on set with you guys, but I hadn't seen
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: her in all the decades ensuing decades. But the way
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: you talk about her and describe her is so similar
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: to who you are in so many ways, fighter, strong,
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: standing up for people, mischievous and funny, like there are
• 26:13
  Speaker 2: so many similarities.
• 26:15
  Speaker 3: And the way that you grew up with your dad's.
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: And I can see why you bonded, but it just
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: hit me for the first time in all these decades,
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: how actually similar you are.
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: That's true, it really is. We're both strong, independent, not
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: necessarily by our own decisions. Yeah, and are both aries,
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: you know, and that's a whole thing in itself.
• 26:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: But yeah, I don't think anybody ever realized how similar
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: we actually were. And I think that people that just
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: met Shannon, you know, quickly or you know, they didn't
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: get to know her the way that I had the
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: privilege of getting to know her and the rest of
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: the cast to get to know her was to love her. Yeah, definitely,
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: it's been a tough week. I know that it'll feel
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: better over time. I encourage everybody to believe me on that.
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: It's just also really hard when you know, and this
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: was with Luke too, Like when someone famous dies, you're
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: there's just so many reminders, visual reminders, whether it's on
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: your feed or on the news, or on your for
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: you page or old cast photos like the you know,
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: when it's really really hard to sign cast photos and
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: see Luke not there, and now to have to sign
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: those photos without Shannon there, it's just like inconceivable. That's
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: the part that's like I don't want to believe it.
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: Like and I there are times when I still refuse
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: to believe that Luke is gone.
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: Well, I think he's here right now in that light
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: that's shining behind you.
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's weird. There's a light shining right on my
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: head like a ray.
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: I know he's with you a lot.
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: He is with me a lot. And you know, he
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: was the first person I thought of when I heard
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: the news, and I thought how happy he was going
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: to be to be.
• 28:44
  Speaker 3: With her again.
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: Like whatever your beliefs are about heaven and hell and
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: transitioning or spirits all the things, like whatever it is
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: for me personally, I feel the spirits of the people
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: that I love the most if they die or crossover
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: or whatever you want to call it, I feel them
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: so much. And I turned to Luke all the time
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: for help, you know, like in dealing with certain things
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: or making decisions. I asked him, and I just I
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: get pretty strong answers from him because he was very
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: opinionated on the things that I had going on in
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: my life. But I just know he it's gonna sound
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: very weird, but he definitely was there to catch her,
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: and I knew he would be, but I know he was.
• 29:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, And he was like that for you in your
• 29:48
  Speaker 3: life too.
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: He was somebody that you turned to and you know,
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: took his consult and wanted his opinion on things, and
• 29:56
  Speaker 2: he had no problem giving them to And so I
• 29:59
  Speaker 2: think it's a beautiful example that you're sharing that you
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: still get that even though he's not here physically anymore,
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: you absolutely still get that.
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I didn't believe it. I didn't believe it until
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: I believed it, like.
• 30:15
  Speaker 3: I want.
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: For a long time, I called myself agnostic, like I
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: didn't believe in anything. I didn't know, I didn't have
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: any faith, and I was okay with that. I survived
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: a long time without it. And now they've gotten older,
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: you know, you look at things like that, and I
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: just started believing having faith in that. I call them
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: my angels, my spirits, my loved ones that I have
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: passed away. I still feel them with me and I
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: can literally this is the weirdest thing too, Like in
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: a way, when Luke was alive or Shannon was alive,
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: I felt like that relationship was diluted because it was
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: shared by so many. I think I sometimes felt like
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: I didn't have as much of their attention or time
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: or as close a relationship as I wanted. But I
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: found with Luke and with my Dad that I have
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: them all the time now, Like I'm closer Luke than
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: I ever was, and I'm closer to my Dad than
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: I ever was, because they're always with me and I
• 31:33
  Speaker 1: can always turn to them and ask them. And I
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: hope that people can can feel that way.
• 31:40
  Speaker 3: With Shannon, that's really hopeful.
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: I want to say something to you and to everyone
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: who's listening, which is grief isn't just one thing. It
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: is a process, okay, and again, let it come and
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: go as it does. And if you know you or
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: anybody that's listening needs extra support, let's make sure to
• 32:07
  Speaker 2: leave some resources.
• 32:09
  Speaker 3: Yes, let's do that.
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: We'll leave resources in the show notes. And well, if
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: anybody needs help getting through this or dealing with this
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: grief or any grief, reach out to a professional, because
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: it really does sort of smooth the rough edges of
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: the whole experience, and it gives you, like some outside
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: perspective and some insight that you don't have when you're
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: feeling all these intense feelings so I hope that people
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: will check out those resources that we're going to leave
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: for you in the show notes. And I guess you
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: know it is what it is like. You can't change it,
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: even though you want to. You have to accept it
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: and move forward.
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, don't force it. I'm so glad you wanted to
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: be of service because this was a hard thing to do.
• 33:07
  Speaker 2: I'm glad you wanted to do it for fans of
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: the show, other people who are grieving. I'm really touched
• 33:14
  Speaker 2: that you asked me to.
• 33:15
  Speaker 3: Do this with you always, thank you. I love you
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: so much. Yeah, thanks, thanks for doing.
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: This, Thank you, and thanks everybody for being here with
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: me today. And I will be back soon. Bye bye.