Latest / Becker’s Healthcare Podcast / Navigating Policy Pressures, Growth and AI Strategy at Sutter Health with Jonathan Ma

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Navigating Policy Pressures, Growth and AI Strategy at Sutter Health with Jonathan Ma · Becker’s Healthcare Podcast

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Every year, Becker's annual meeting brings health care
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leaders together to unpack the most pressing issues
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facing the industry.
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And every year, those conversations shift in profound
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sixteenth.
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For the agenda and event details,
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visit beckershospitalreview.com
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and click on the events tab in the
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upper right.
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This is Alan Condon back with another episode
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of the Becker's CFO and Revenue Cycle podcast.
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And today, I'm thrilled to be joined by
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Jonathan Ma, CFO of Sutter Health. That's a
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nonprofit integrated health system where that includes 27
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hospitals across northern, across Central California.
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Jonathan, a real pleasure to have you make
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what I think is your debut podcast appearance,
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not just at Becker's debut podcast ever.
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For those of our listeners who might not
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be as familiar with yourself, the the great
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work that you do at Sutter Health, do
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you mind just giving us a little bit
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more insight into your background and your role
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at the health system?
1:14
Sure. Well and thanks, Alan, for having me,
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and,
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really pleased to be here. So I've been
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at Sutter Health since 2019.
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I joined the company as the treasurer and
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then,
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spent some time with financial planning and analysis,
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before stepping into the interim CFO role last
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year and then,
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into the permanent position last May.
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Before that, I was in health care investment
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banking at Morgan Stanley in New York. I
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still had, worked in both the San Francisco
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and the New York offices.
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So I've spent, all of my career since
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college focusing on health care, and it's just
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a a really
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great privilege to be at Sutter Health today,
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and, and watching our company grow and pursue
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all our strategic initiatives,
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especially under Warner Thomas's leadership.
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Yeah. Absolutely. Fantastic leaders surrounding you as well.
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So, Jonathan, excited to kinda dive in and
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pick your brains here. You're approaching
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almost a a year in that permanent CFO,
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see which you were appointed in last May.
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No doubt there are sort of things we
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could touch on here. But
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as 2026,
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as February at the time of recording,
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what are the kind of top two or
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three trends that you're paying closest attention to
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in health care today?
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Sure. I would say, just like many other,
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not for profit health care systems out there,
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we're we're very focused on,
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kind of federal and state developments.
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You know, serving Medicare and Medi Cal patients
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are are also core to our mission in
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in addition to many of the commercial patients,
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in in our markets.
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So making sure that we have,
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kind of just ongoing,
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eyesight as we can into ongoing developments,
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in the in the policy realm.
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You know, our colleagues in digital and and
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AI and technology, I mean, that is a
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a huge area of interest for us as
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an executive management team.
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So I'm trying to to read up as
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quickly as I can even though just,
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those developments are changing,
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at at light speed as well.
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But just trying to make sure that I
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understand from a financial perspective at least how
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I can support those initiatives,
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and and really
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understand
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the best I can how that could really
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transform the delivery of health care as we
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know it. And then I guess the third,
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in terms of trends or or just
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a constant focus,
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for us here at Sutter is our people.
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I'm really fortunate to have
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a remarkable,
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talented
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team that that really cares about our mission.
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So always wanting to keep in mind how
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do we continue to retain and attract the
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best talent,
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here at Sutter Health within our finance team,
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making sure we're meeting the needs of our
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colleagues and and and the mission,
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and and that's also a constant focus for
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me.
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Mhmm. I'm curious about the first trend that
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you'd mentioned. I think,
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certainly a challenging time for for CFOs across
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the board. I think particularly in in California,
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I recently spoke with, Scripps Health CFO Brett
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Tandy, also their CEO Chris Van Goerter, just
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about the the multitude of challenges facing reimbursement
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in the state. No doubt we have some
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of those Medicaid, Medi Cal cuts coming down
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the pipeline 2026
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into 2027.
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There was a lot of a lot of
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back and forth in terms of ACA subsidies
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at the end of last year and now
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expired.
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I'm curious how how is Sutter thinking about
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this year and into next with some of
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those challenges facing, not just Sutter Health, but
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indeed health systems across the state as we
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think about some of those medical costs.
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Yeah. I mean, we're we've been working just
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like many of our peers on,
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you know, different scenarios,
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on stress testing, on on kind of how
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different,
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policies could eventually unfold. Obviously, we're,
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you know, trying to prepare the best we
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can for the legislative,
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development as we know them today. I I
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would also say we're we're hoping that, you
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know, we're keeping the lines of communication and
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dialogue open with our policymakers
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and,
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our different, associations that we're a member of.
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I have to give a big shout out
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to our external affairs team here at Sutter,
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and they're constantly partnering with us here in
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finance to help help make sure that we
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we each on both sides have the the
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data exchange,
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so that we can best advocate for
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our organization and for the industry at both
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the state and federal level.
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You know, generally, I'd I'd again, we'd just
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like to say that we have to keep
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the lines of communication open so that we
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can continue to make sure that, health care
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is
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is, is supported,
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in our communities.
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Mhmm.
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And then maybe just a word on on
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your people. Sutter Health, fantastic organization.
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I believe just shy of 60,000 employees, if
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I'm not mistaken, 12,000 physicians, whatnot. Kind of
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what are the the key focuses in terms
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of,
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retention,
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from your workforce? What are the key focuses
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as you as you refer to your people,
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your culture this year? Yeah. I think overall,
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it really is about connecting the purpose and
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the mission and making sure we're all aligned
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on kind of the reason why we're here.
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And I think
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over the past several years as we've seen
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the organization evolve,
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with kind of the team and the mission
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and,
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the energy that,
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Warner has brought to the organization and and
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the broader management team. I think it's just
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making sure we're
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the the teams that we have here know
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that they belong at Sutter Health and are
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contributing,
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to the mission,
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every day. I think just that connection to
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purpose is what we've really focused on in
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trying to make Sutter the best place to
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work,
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in health care. And we know it's we're
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a learning organization too. I think that that's
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also been,
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kind of a key part of our messaging
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to our people and how we've built our
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teams just to encourage curiosity,
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new ways of thinking, and that we're
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we're constantly a work in progress. We're all
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trying to get better each day. We we
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give, somebody had a a great phrase the
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other day, so I can't claim it for
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myself. But,
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he said,
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give yourself the right to always get smarter.
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And I really liked how that was phrased
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because it just allows,
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for constant growth. And, I think that that's
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how we're we've been trying to shape our
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teams, here at Sutter.
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Give yourself the right to always get smarter.
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I like that one. I'm gonna have to
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keep a hold of that one for future
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reference. It wasn't it wasn't my I can't
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claim,
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credit for it, but I liked how it
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was phrased and,
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you know, taking feedback,
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understanding growth.
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We're all works in progress both, you know,
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as career professionals.
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But just being open to getting smarter each
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day, I think, has been,
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part of the curiosity and the and the
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learning part of of our organization.
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Yeah. No. Absolutely.
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Jonathan, we touched at the top of the
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conversation about some of the some of the
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ubiquitous challenges. I don't wanna kinda focus too
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much on the challenges in health care. There
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are many. There are always gonna be many.
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But there's also a lot of opportunity. There's
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also a lot of room for excitement,
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in health care. No doubt at Sutter Health
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as well.
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As you as you look ahead as CFO
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of the organization,
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what most excites you now?
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I think the what's what has excited me
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over the past few years and then also
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as I'm looking forward is just our growth
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and and really that's translating into the ability
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to serve more people and patients
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and make a bigger impact.
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So when we're already, you know, we're fortunate
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at Saturday,
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at at this point, being nearly a $20,000,000,000
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revenue organization.
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And what I try and communicate,
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not just with the finance team, but also
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others outside of finance that, you know, revenues
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are one way to kind of or just
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one metric. Overall, we should think about
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how
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that is the the potential for our platform
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and really the scale of our mission.
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And the fact that we can continue to
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grow more just because there's such a need
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for health care services, not just in California,
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but nationally,
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I I think
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being part of a team
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and, thankfully, you know, being supported by a
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board of directors
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that really shares in that vision on growing
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to serve more more patients to the best
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we can,
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I think is what,
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is is really
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motivating and and helps me,
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kind of focus my team and and energies
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as I'm looking at the year ahead?
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Yeah. It's fascinating. It kinda ties nicely into
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my next question. I think we've covered many
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systems
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recently,
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growing into new states, multi health multistate health
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systems, new regional expansions.
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I know Sutter recently appointed Scott Norland as
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a EVP of corporate development and partnerships.
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As you grow beyond this $20,000,000,000
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revenue health system,
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is nationally something that you're looking at potentially
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expanding outside of California into new markets, and
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what potentially might make sense for sort of
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health in that regard?
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Yeah. I think just like all not for
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profit health care systems, you know, we're looking
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at, you know, different scenarios. I know the
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kind of the reporting on on Scott's position
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kind of captured all of that. I'm
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I'm really excited to have the opportunity to
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work with him and learn from him. We've
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already had, kind of we spent quite a
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bit of time together.
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So overall, you know, I think as we're
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continuing to to grow, we're looking at a
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lot of different scenarios just in any way
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that we can make, the best impact we
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can.
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Absolutely.
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And I guess maybe just in the in
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the near term,
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twelve months to twenty four months, you said
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growth no doubt is a is a key
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key focus for sort of for yourself, your
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executive team.
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I guess more specifically, what does that growth
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mean? Is that,
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improving access to care, digital expansion,
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recruiting more physicians? I guess, is there a
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key one or two areas that you're really
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focusing on for the near term?
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I think it's all of the above that
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you just mentioned and and probably, you know,
10:52
eve even more than that. But I think
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it's, you know, in our management
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presentations, we've and and it's not just,
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only to Sutter, but I know in a
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lot of, a lot of systems think about
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the flywheel or virtuous cycle.
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You know, it all kind of goes together,
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meaning
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making sure we're recruiting the clinicians,
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that we need in our communities,
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to address,
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you know, the patient patient needs,
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to make sure that we're we're serving more
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more people in in different settings,
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whether that's, through a digital front door or
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bricks and mortar.
11:28
I I think all of that really goes
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together. So,
11:31
it it's it's probably and, kind of all
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the items that you mentioned.
11:36
Got it. Definitely multi multi pronged approach to
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grow growth across the board, it sounds like.
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Jonathan,
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one final question I'd love to ask you
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as as just kinda popped up. I think
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as it relates to
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catch word, here we go, AI. Because I
11:50
think that a conversation goes by with CFOs,
11:53
revenue cycle leaders about AI not popping up
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into the conversation. But, I guess, from your
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perspective as CFO, Sutter,
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I'd love to kinda get your opinion. How
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is Sutter using it specifically in the revenue
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cycle as we see this kind of push
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pull dynamic with payers? Payers have no no
12:11
doubt been using AI in the revenue cycle
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for quite some time. Feels like providers like
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Sutter Health and these these tech forward health
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systems playing catch up in terms of the
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vetting AI more meaningfully into the revenue cycle.
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Curious to hear maybe your perspective at Sutter.
12:27
Any kind of, any kind of real impacts
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that you're seeing here? Anything you're particularly excited
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about in that regard?
12:32
Yeah. That's definitely on our road map, especially
12:35
with all of the kind of manual interventions
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and kind of repetitive repetitive natures of really
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not just revenue cycle, but a lot of,
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workflows in health care. I would say,
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with AI, we're, again, fortunate to have,
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you know, remarkable
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digital team led by Laura Wilt, our chief
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digital officer. You know, she has been instrumental
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in helping us,
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you know, put together a road map,
13:00
that incorporates
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AI and digital advancements in revenue cycle. We
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also have partners,
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through r one and Epic.
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So,
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it's
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it'll it'll be a collaboration
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among,
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ourselves and our outside partners, but our hopes
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for AI are very high, and and we
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definitely see a lot of opportunity there.
13:20
Absolutely. Well, Jonathan, a real pleasure to have
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you on the podcast with us today. No
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doubt a lot of exciting things ahead for
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Sutter, for you and your executive team.
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Really, really appreciate you taking the time out
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of your busy schedule, and I look forward
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to catching up with you again down the
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line. Anytime. Thanks so much, Alan. Appreciate it.