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You Are Not Independent · Critical Error

0:00
Nothing says independent journalism like
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27 outlets all having the exact same
0:04
thought at 9:00 a.m. on a Tuesday.
0:06
>> Yep.
0:09
>> A critical error is an error which the
0:11
OS cannot reasonably ignore.
0:14
Jake Steinberg is a streamer and writer
0:16
and certified yapper. Complimentary.
0:18
Peter Hunt spit tech is a YouTuber,
0:22
journalist, and certified yapper.
0:24
Derogatory. These are the things they
0:26
cannot reasonably ignore. Jake, I woke
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up this morning and I saw a post from
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the Game Informer Blue Sky account that
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reads, "We will have Sorrowos. We have
0:35
Sorrowos in hand and are currently
0:37
working on the review, which you will be
0:39
able to read on April 24th at 2 a.m.
0:42
CT." And that got me thinking about this
0:44
a little bit. First of all, I think it's
0:46
silly that we still that that this
0:48
happens, but it got me thinking about
0:49
the reason why this sort of thing
0:51
happens. Why these social media embargos
0:54
exist and why um outlets and journalists
0:59
that would never call themselves
1:01
influencers um kind of start acting in a
1:03
way that you would sort of attribute to
1:06
influencers. Do you know what I mean?
1:08
>> Oh, yeah. 100%. I'm curious to see where
1:10
you're going with this, though.
1:12
>> I don't know. It's just like when I when
1:14
I see something like this, uh it just
1:17
makes me think about like the idea of
1:18
like how independent are these
1:21
companies, these journalists, uh all
1:23
these people from the companies that are
1:27
publishing games and what is the
1:29
distinction there between people who are
1:31
who would like label themselves as like
1:33
influencers on YouTube and Tik Tok and
1:35
whatever else, Instagram, and um the
1:37
people who are doing something pretty
1:40
similar on more traditional
1:42
publications.
1:43
>> Sure. And I think like something that I
1:45
don't want to go unsaid here is that
1:47
there is kind of like this pretty I
1:50
would say public animosity between
1:53
people in games media and then maybe
1:55
like YouTubers and influencers where the
1:58
games media person can occasionally be
2:00
seen maybe elevating themselves as more
2:03
important and more I don't know
2:05
something like the kind of looking down
2:06
upon. Yeah. And it goes both ways, too,
2:08
which we've talked about what, two
2:10
episodes ago when we were talking about
2:11
like the whole like, well, I'm a
2:12
YouTuber. You can't trust these games
2:14
journal. It like kind of like it goes
2:16
both ways, you know?
2:17
>> And I I kind of like you introducing
2:18
this the social media embargo as as our
2:21
first kind of example here because this
2:23
is um you know, the post is not here is
2:28
what I think. Here's information about
2:30
the game. This is this is a company
2:32
saying, "Hey, can you post that you are
2:35
in possession of the object,
2:38
>> which is really like quite an
2:40
interesting thing because when you see a
2:41
post like that, what is it doing?" Like
2:44
genuinely, what is it doing?
2:45
>> No, it like I I don't really know. And
2:47
it's this like I I could guess as to
2:50
what the people who post this sort of
2:52
thing think it is doing, but I would
2:55
probably disagree with all of those.
2:56
Like of course you have people saying
2:58
like would say like oh well it's getting
2:59
people excited for our review to that I
3:03
would say like yeah like your game
3:05
informer I assume you're going to have a
3:07
review of Sorrowos up at some point
3:10
right you know what I mean between now
3:11
and then like like do we need to get
3:13
people excited for your review you know
3:16
so how is it actually functioning then
3:18
like you as a gamer you go on social
3:21
media and you see that that they have
3:23
posted that they have the game. What is
3:26
What does that What does that do to you
3:28
genuinely?
3:28
>> So, I I think what it's doing is it is
3:30
actually just like working as a part of
3:32
like the hype PR cycle for a game,
3:35
right? Because like for me, I see this
3:36
and I just I like okay, like sure, this
3:40
is not information. But I think what
3:42
it's trying to do is to get people to be
3:44
like, oh yeah, Sorrows is coming out
3:46
soon and oh my gosh, Sorrowos like
3:48
reviews for Sorrowos are coming out
3:49
soon. You know what I mean? So, it's
3:50
like it's helping build that
3:51
anticipation. I I at least I think.
3:54
>> Yeah. Yeah. And I I think like um in a
3:56
digital media class that I teach at
3:57
university, uh something that I I teach
3:59
a lesson in campaign ordering and like
4:01
the how do you how you order your social
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media posts and um something I teach is
4:06
a fivestep framework and it's tease,
4:10
launch, engage, convert, amplify. And I
4:13
think it's kind of easy to see that this
4:15
kind of post is maybe part of a
4:17
marketing plan. It is simply the tease.
4:19
Yes, it is. Yeah. So like
4:21
>> it's it's like it's unpaid marketing,
4:23
right? because it's like, you know, no
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money changes hands between who's
4:27
publishing Sara? Oh, that's PlayStation,
4:28
right? Sony Interactive Entertainment.
4:30
>> Yeah,
4:31
>> they're not paying uh and I'm not I have
4:33
Game Informers one up here, but they're
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not the only people who do this. This is
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uh super common, you know. Um but like
4:40
money didn't change hands and yet here
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we are. This is a piece of marketing for
4:45
sorrows, right? I think that's kind of
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fascinating.
4:47
>> Well, and you are following a schedule,
4:49
right? Because the social media embargo
4:51
has a time. It has a date. It says we're
4:53
doing this now. And then there is a
4:56
review embargo that says this is it's
4:58
going up now. You are part of a
4:59
schedule. And I think for anybody
5:01
watching, there is maybe a plan that
5:04
will reveal itself to you. If again,
5:07
thinking about this thing, this this
5:08
tease, launch, engage, convert, amplify.
5:11
It's like, oh, okay. There's the social
5:13
media embargo, there's the review
5:15
embargo, there's the launch trailer,
5:18
there's the accolades trailer, there's
5:20
the release of the game, there's the
5:22
It's like, oh, I can maybe start to see
5:23
how these things are fitting together in
5:26
this way. And I think something that is
5:28
odd when we interrogate that kind of
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friction between the content creator,
5:33
the influencer and the games media
5:35
person is that I think that there is an
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attitude in games media that like they
5:40
do not participate in marketing,
5:42
influencing or anything of the sort. And
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I think that that's really the core of
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what we're talking about today. And I
5:48
because the truth of the matter is I
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think it's very hard to maintain that
5:52
position because if you are abiding by a
5:58
review embargo if you have a
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relationship with the person that you
6:02
get these codes with the person that you
6:03
coordinate with is a is a PR person you
6:07
are working with them you are 100% um
6:11
you know operating within their
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marketing plan and I think it is okay I
6:16
don't think you lose any legitimacy by
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recognizing the kind of mutually
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beneficial relationship at play there.
6:23
>> Yeah. So, I think this is what it is. I
6:25
mean, you said like there's an attitude
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towards discussing that or or talking
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about that. I think that's that's like
6:31
the thing that is weird to me. It's the
6:35
like the lack of disclosure
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uh or or willingness to even like uh
6:40
it's not like disclosure as in like no
6:42
one's saying like oh we get codes from
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whoever cuz obviously people disclose
6:46
that but it's the um lack of
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transparency but like no no we do have a
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relationship with this company. This is
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a company that we have a relationship
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with because very famously when
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companies um deny outlets from getting
6:57
codes and things like that usually
6:58
that's kind of a story and usually there
7:00
is there is like discussion to be had
7:02
there. Uh very famously, who was it? Uh
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was it Bethesda Softworks stopped
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providing codes to uh Kotaku, I believe,
7:09
for something they said about Prey? I I
7:11
don't remember.
7:12
>> It's been a long time. I actually don't
7:14
know if that is still going on or not. I
7:15
think it might be.
7:17
>> Yeah, it's it's possible, but it also
7:18
might have changed when they got
7:19
acquired and everything like that. But
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um it's interesting that there is just a
7:23
this again attitude, as you said,
7:25
towards the idea of even discussing this
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and even opening up the conversation of
7:29
saying like, "No, no, this is a PR
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relationship." And in participating it
7:33
in in it, you are doing PR.
7:36
>> Yeah. Yeah, definitely. And I think I've
7:38
had this conversation with people in the
7:40
games media sphere before and one of the
7:42
most common points of push back that
7:44
I've received is like, yeah, but like
7:46
Jake, just because you are reviewing a
7:49
game, just because you're embiding by an
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embargo does not mean that you are
7:52
suddenly performing marketing for this
7:54
company. And I I actually disagree with
7:56
this. And I think what what what comes
7:58
where that comes from is this sense of
8:02
if you are being honest in your
8:04
appraisal of whatever it is that you are
8:06
reviewing then you that is simply being
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a critic. You you couldn't possibly be
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doing PR. And I actually think that
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whether or not you are honest about
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something has very little to do with
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whether or not you are doing marketing.
8:19
Um no here's an example. I personally to
8:22
be entirely honest with you really like
8:24
case defy cases.
8:26
I also for phones. Sorry, this is an
8:30
audio medium as well. I also got this
8:31
Caseify case for free when I was a tech
8:33
journalist.
8:34
>> How could you?
8:35
>> And so, but here's the question. Am I
8:37
being honest about that? 100%. I like
8:39
them. But does that make me like still a
8:42
part of the PR like uh uh
8:46
portion of it because they gave this to
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me? Certainly.
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>> Yeah. And it's it's funny. I think
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people are often look to circumstances
8:54
to make an argument about credibility
8:56
and I frankly just don't care because
8:58
it's it's this weird thing where it's
9:00
like you know how you build credibility
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is I you write a piece and I believe it
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and I believe that it came from like an
9:05
honest place and you communicate those
9:07
ideas to me. Um I think that the
9:09
credibility conversation is kind of like
9:11
an old silly one and I'm not even really
9:14
interested in having it. But I think the
9:16
thing that I want to make most clear to
9:17
people is that like so so another point
9:21
of push back that I've gotten is like
9:23
well Jake look at movie reviews. If you
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look at movie reviews they are also
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abiding by an embargo but nobody's
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looking at the film critics and saying
9:30
you guys are just doing PR and one
9:32
because I think in that sphere they're
9:35
simply not as um self-conscious and
9:38
dramatic about it. But then I think the
9:40
the the I truthfully and then I think I
9:43
think the other half of it is the the
9:45
framing of video game reviews. I think
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that video game reviews are almost
9:50
exclusively um verdictbased and
9:54
>> it's about like should you buy, should
9:55
you play, should you Yeah. And even if
9:58
they don't use that language of like it
10:01
is worth your $70, I think that the uh
10:04
verdict driven nature of video game
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reviews is evident to anybody who pays
10:08
attention to them. And I think
10:09
>> a cultural thing,
10:10
>> it's a cultural thing 100%. And I think
10:12
that you can even look at uh something,
10:16
you know, we were looking I'm I'm so
10:17
sorry I forget which outlet it was, but
10:18
we were looking at a review earlier that
10:20
uh for Pragmata that the title of the
10:23
review was um Capcom's next big
10:27
franchise
10:28
>> um or or some something of that nature.
10:31
And there is almost like this implicit
10:34
understanding there about like it's
10:37
worth getting into this game because
10:39
it's going to be a big deal with more
10:41
games that you can buy.
10:43
>> Yeah. And so there's there's this thing
10:44
of worth of what is what is what is
10:48
worthy that I think is grounded in like
10:52
advisement
10:53
>> of whether or not you know whereas a
10:56
movie review to explain in case people
10:58
are unfamiliar I think is much much
11:00
closer to what is this thing doing is it
11:04
interesting is it effective is it worth
11:05
engaging with um and even when there is
11:09
this kind of thumbs up thumbs down
11:11
metric to it I think that there still is
11:14
a critical center that is grounded in
11:16
interpretation
11:17
um not guidance or authority
11:19
>> which is like the difference in the
11:22
culture of the industries right so like
11:24
games have this culture of reviews that
11:27
are uh incredibly tied to PR and film
11:32
I'm not saying it doesn't happen of
11:34
course it does but like it is just a
11:37
different relationship that those uh
11:38
critics have with the uh studios and
11:42
things like And
11:42
>> yeah, definitely.
11:43
>> And and I I think it's it's uh like you
11:47
could you could I mean examine so many
11:49
different elements of the games industry
11:52
um with this sort of thing where it's
11:53
like people want to think that these
11:55
major companies, these major publishers
11:57
are like their friends, right? Not only
11:59
are there the interpersonal
12:00
relationships that we see on display
12:01
when you know whoever from whatever
12:03
major studio comes and does an interview
12:05
with this person and they get to have
12:07
their exclusive story about this that
12:09
and whatever. um and they've known each
12:11
other for years and all that and
12:12
whatever, but it's like I I think that
12:13
that tends to not be the case in other
12:15
industries. And so as a uh games media
12:19
culture, I think we have this kind of
12:23
bizarre relationship between uh games
12:26
press that would call themselves
12:28
independent. I'm not talking about
12:29
specifically independent like media,
12:31
which we can talk about, but like in
12:33
general, you know, like I would say that
12:34
someone like IGN would say they are
12:36
independent from these major studios. I
12:38
think that, you know, like all these
12:40
different places would say they're
12:41
independent from these places and yet
12:43
there is this sort of interesting
12:45
dependent relationship between the two.
12:47
>> Yeah, it's funny and I think that you
12:49
can do a pretty kind of simple material
12:51
analysis between industries to kind of
12:54
explain how this um happens, right?
12:57
Because I think like if you look at
12:59
video games versus movies, which I think
13:01
is a helpful thing to do in this
13:02
particular case, is that um you know
13:06
often times if you're getting a review
13:08
code for a game in advance, early access
13:11
is a big deal because video games are
13:13
such a big time commitment.
13:14
>> Yeah.
13:14
>> Um so like if you don't get a code
13:16
early, you like literally cannot get
13:19
your video game review in that window
13:21
where it's going to have maximum
13:23
relevance, right? So immediately you
13:26
have this dependency on publishers. Now,
13:28
uh, alternatively, critics all will go
13:31
to press screenings that happen for
13:32
everybody at once. And a film, you know,
13:35
how long is a movie? 2, three hours,
13:36
right? Um, if you miss that early
13:38
access, how your your you have less
13:41
dependence on needing to maintain that
13:44
relevancy because you can go the day a
13:46
movie comes out, put out your review
13:48
easy, much easier than you can like a
13:50
video game, right? So,
13:52
>> I like I don't know. I I think that
13:54
sometimes there there just like is this
13:56
attitude that is very resentful over
13:59
this maybe um accusation in games over
14:02
just how dependent on PR and publishers
14:06
the space is almost almost in its
14:08
entirety. You know, you and I are making
14:10
plans to go to the summer game um fest
14:14
>> that you got it in one. I'm so proud of
14:16
you. Yeah.
14:17
>> All right. Thank you. Um and uh that's
14:20
this that's this thing that is like
14:23
invite only access completely. Um you
14:27
know and I think that there's this
14:29
there's this thing that comes up
14:30
whenever we have conversations like this
14:32
where it's like oh okay and that makes
14:35
the journalists or the critics or
14:37
whoever um positive. It makes them
14:40
positive. it makes them want to have a
14:43
good relationship with these people and
14:45
>> for them to be dishonest in their
14:47
assessments. And I just genuinely
14:50
>> don't think that that is true. Um I
14:52
don't think that that's what's going on.
14:53
But but
14:55
>> are you creating a person that is more
14:59
likely to have a positive experience by
15:01
making them feel a certain way, by
15:03
granting them legitimacy, by granting
15:05
them access? I think yes.
15:07
>> Yes. that that aside that and that aside
15:11
I actually don't think it really matters
15:12
whether or not you are creating somebody
15:14
who is positive or negative in their
15:16
assessments and their reviews the truth
15:18
is that you are controlling what people
15:21
talk about and when they talk about it.
15:23
So that's that that's the whole thing,
15:24
right? And and we have heard from people
15:27
who have pushed back on, you know, what
15:29
we've said about like Xbox and and BDS
15:31
and and all that sort of stuff because
15:32
people are saying like, well, no, don't
15:34
you understand? I'm being critical of
15:36
Xbox. And it's like, right, you're being
15:37
critical of Xbox in the time when Xbox
15:40
is telling you that it's you are allowed
15:42
to be critical of them. When it's like a
15:43
press release comes out, you it's not
15:45
just Xbox, right? It's all sorts of
15:46
companies, but that's just the one that
15:47
jumps to mind where it's like, um, press
15:49
release comes out, hey, unfortunately,
15:51
we've had to lay off, you know, 400
15:52
people. And it's like, okay, well, now's
15:54
the time to talk about Xbox's uh
15:56
behaviors with this sort of thing. It's
15:58
like, right, what you're doing there is
16:00
you are performing your job with the
16:03
approval of the company that you are
16:06
talking about.
16:06
>> This is a really good point to make
16:08
because you are right. When you are
16:10
expressing disapproval at a company when
16:13
they set out their send out their press
16:14
release about layoffs, you are allowing
16:18
the you are just upholding the
16:20
conversation that they want to be having
16:21
when they want to be.
16:22
>> They want to be they said, "Okay, you
16:23
know what? This week we're going to get
16:25
a lot of the hit." Yep. But what are we
16:27
doing next week? Because that's how
16:28
companies operate, you know? And if you
16:30
don't uphold that sentiment elsewhere
16:33
when they're not planning around it,
16:36
you're not actually do you're just doing
16:37
exactly what they want you to do.
16:39
>> Yeah. And it's also interesting too, you
16:40
know, you talk about like the idea of
16:41
like animosity or whatever, like the
16:43
relationships these companies have with
16:44
like individual reporters, whatever. And
16:47
like if you talk about this sort of
16:49
stuff outside of the allotted you know
16:52
window of of like uh irritation with
16:56
these companies whatever this you know
16:58
just personally I have found that people
17:00
do not like that like like people
17:02
there's like you know you talk about
17:03
like animosity whatever like there's
17:05
like a vibe aimed towards you because
17:08
now is not the allotted time to talk
17:09
about why this company is doing this
17:11
thing. Oh, I mean, of course. And the
17:14
problem is is that from the inside, this
17:16
is such a hard thing to really for for
17:18
for our listeners who are maybe not in
17:21
the the games media sphere, it's maybe a
17:23
hard thing to put your finger on because
17:25
that tension I have found comes from so
17:28
many different angles. Yes.
17:30
>> Um, angle angle number one, Jake, it is
17:33
so hard to have a job in games that you
17:36
should not be giving anybody [ __ ] for
17:38
how they're doing anything because they
17:39
just need to have their job. Um, angle
17:42
number two, a lot of people in video
17:46
game PR used to be people in games
17:48
media. You want me to socially slight my
17:52
friends online? That's not going to
17:54
happen. Uh, angle number three,
17:58
maybe I just don't believe in this.
18:01
Maybe I just don't believe that the
18:02
cause is important.
18:03
>> Yeah,
18:04
>> maybe I, you know what I mean? It's like
18:06
I or um or uh, you know, angle number
18:08
four, I don't want negative attention. I
18:11
don't want people to harass me. I don't
18:13
want to, you know, I've se I I saw that.
18:15
>> Sure. Right. Yeah. But but it's this
18:17
thing where like
18:19
I understand that like like that last
18:21
point specifically like I get it. But
18:25
what I would just urge you to do is like
18:28
think about
18:30
if you are not interested in receiving
18:32
uh like bad your own personal bad PR for
18:37
discussing these things and I think
18:38
maybe it's you're looking for a
18:39
different line of work. I think I think
18:40
what you were trying to do is is not
18:42
journalism is not uh independent work
18:45
because when you look at people who do
18:48
like whistleblow at like other in other
18:50
like fields and whatever it's a big deal
18:53
and those people are not beloved right
18:55
like those people take like big hits
18:56
like socially whatever because they are
18:58
doing the real work of this and I don't
19:00
know it's it's frustrating you know
19:04
>> yeah I think something that I am going
19:06
to push back on a little bit though is
19:08
that last point that I made about like I
19:10
don't want to be harassed or whatever.
19:12
Um I I understand like emotionally where
19:15
you're coming from when you say I
19:16
understand that person. I am a lot less
19:18
generous to that person because the the
19:21
truth of the matter is is that I have
19:23
seen people in this space like Alysa
19:25
Merante or um Autumn Wright, people that
19:29
I think are um going to get harassed by
19:34
virtue of existing. Yes. Um, you know,
19:36
we were we were at a games media event
19:39
once and somebody fairly prominent in
19:41
this space uh came up to me after kind
19:44
of witnessing my summer of getting
19:46
harassed and said, "Um, sorry Jake, I
19:49
wanted to say something online, but I
19:51
have a family to think about."
19:52
>> Oh my gosh.
19:53
>> And like one that is like so like that
19:56
is like top tier weirdo [ __ ] Um because
19:59
like what are you what are you saying is
20:02
your understanding of what is happening
20:04
to me and like your man I don't know
20:07
there's a degree of like allyship that
20:09
is not present there that I think is
20:11
like really messed up the longer you
20:13
think about it.
20:14
>> Yeah because I'm I'm not willing to just
20:16
like let the minorities and let people
20:19
who are scrutinized for existing just
20:22
[ __ ] that's your problem. I don't
20:24
have to worry about that. So, I'm not
20:25
going to bring that into my life when
20:26
the fact of the matter is the privilege
20:28
that is afforded to you that those
20:30
problems have not begun knocking on your
20:32
doorstep already is what will protect
20:34
you if you decide to get engaged with
20:36
these problems.
20:36
>> Yes. Yes. Cuz it's this thing where like
20:38
like what I when I said like I
20:40
understand that it's like it's never fun
20:41
for people to yell at you online, but
20:43
it's like you're talking about like
20:44
getting yelled at online for like an
20:46
afternoon for for for talking about this
20:48
in in a different way than than everyone
20:50
else is talking about it. It's it's not
20:51
like a real like uh you do not become
20:55
like the target of long-term harassment
20:57
for this stuff. It it comes from
20:59
different angles. I don't know. But like
21:00
to to sort of like bring it back though,
21:02
>> please.
21:03
>> The qu I have a question for you. So
21:05
like when we talk about like this
21:06
animosity that like more traditional
21:08
games media has towards the idea of
21:11
being seen as PR, as influencers, where
21:15
does that come from? because so many of
21:18
the like so many of the material actions
21:20
that these people and these companies do
21:22
do sort of echo being PR influencers,
21:25
right? So like you know the re the not
21:28
review embargo well the review embargo
21:29
sure but like the
21:32
social media embargo you know.
21:34
>> Yeah.
21:35
Um, so listen, I think like there is a
21:42
inherent self-consciousness to working
21:45
in the video game space that almost
21:47
everybody is battling at all times.
21:51
>> Sure. and the and and I think that is
21:54
part and parcel with just this um idea
21:58
of legitimacy and how hard the job is
22:02
and just kind of trying to uphold this
22:04
image of the job as something that is
22:07
important. And I think that the
22:08
self-consciousness and the insecurity,
22:11
>> it just um stops people sometimes from
22:14
having a entirely honest appraisal of
22:18
what is going on. Like I you and I both
22:23
played Dose of Divas before the launch
22:26
date and there was a review embargo and
22:30
I did my blue sky posts for that game um
22:33
at the time of the review embargo.
22:37
I participated in PR for that game.
22:43
What am I losing by saying that? What am
22:45
I losing?
22:47
I don't think any why like what makes
22:49
people feel awkward about or or like
22:51
like what makes people so weird about it
22:53
cuz it's like exactly the same thing. I
22:54
wrote a review.
22:56
>> My review was then used by uh Outer Loop
23:00
Games or maybe in Outer Sloth, whatever
23:02
the publishers and and developers and
23:04
whatever to help promote the game. They
23:06
they used a clip from my review or not
23:08
clip, you know, like a line from my
23:09
review in their tweets and whatever in
23:11
their marketing materials. So now I have
23:12
become a part of marketing for that. So,
23:14
it's it's this thing where it's like I
23:16
didn't lose anything from doing this. I
23:18
I don't think anyone would look at me
23:19
and be like, "Look at this shill. Look
23:21
at this corporate shill." It's like, but
23:23
just to be entirely honest, I became I'm
23:25
a part of the PR
23:27
cycle for it because I participated in
23:29
it at all.
23:30
>> Well, and there's this overwhelming
23:32
feeling, I think, from people in games
23:34
media that it's like we feel like we
23:36
should matter more, whereas the material
23:39
reality is that influencers are treated
23:41
like they matter more because they
23:44
functionally do.
23:45
>> Yeah.
23:46
>> So, I think that So, I think that
23:47
there's something there that is like
23:49
seated within people that brings out
23:52
this um this like tension or or whatever
23:55
you want to call it.
23:56
>> Yeah.
23:56
>> Um Yeah. And I and I I guess I just um
24:00
>> I also think that there's maybe just
24:01
like a self-conscious reaction to
24:03
anything that would paint a video game
24:06
reviewer as dishonest just from like
24:08
years of rhetoric. I was going to say,
24:10
do you think it's it's because of the
24:12
way that like
24:13
>> people just already view like like
24:16
>> you're a shill? You're you're Yeah.
24:18
access journalism, you're a shill. Um
24:21
and I think the
24:23
>> I I think there's an issue that is at
24:26
play right now is to entirely free
24:30
ourselves from those accusations. You
24:32
need to embrace the whole of the reality
24:35
and not pretend that these these
24:38
elements of our material reality are not
24:40
there. And I think that's where games
24:42
media gets into trouble is that people
24:44
uphold this like utopic version of what
24:47
the video game reviewer is. And we all
24:50
have eyes. We can all see and we know
24:52
that it is not entirely true.
24:54
>> Yeah. I think I think what you said here
24:56
uh I think really hits on it where it's
24:58
like because there is this obfuscation
25:01
to a certain degree uh and it feel like
25:04
it feels intentional obuscation. It
25:06
feels like
25:08
that almost to me adds some fuel to the
25:11
fire of the potential like distrust that
25:15
some people can can like
25:18
uh sort of dig into when they're trying
25:20
to discredit like games journalists and
25:23
and games press in general, right? Games
25:25
media because, you know, if you're a
25:27
YouTuber, you just have to say, well,
25:28
look at how they react to all this
25:30
stuff. Look at, you know, they're
25:31
receiving this, they're receiving that.
25:32
And it's like, but they don't talk about
25:34
it, you know, and it's like if I think
25:36
if if and I think either you or I said
25:38
this at the top of this episode, like I
25:40
think if there was just more disclosure
25:41
about what this is and and uh more
25:44
interest in in like being honest and
25:45
saying, "Yeah, I did, you know, yes, I
25:47
you know,
25:48
>> and I think that what we're ultimately
25:50
circling here is that there is this like
25:53
social and cultural pressure for
25:55
everyone to be nice to each other all of
25:57
the time in a way that um
26:00
>> there is no way to challenge each other
26:04
in the Okay. So, okay, let me let me
26:06
just let me just be as candid as I
26:08
possibly can.
26:09
>> Sure.
26:10
>> I have found that in our current
26:12
cultural beat, if if somebody posts
26:15
something on Blue Sky and you reply to
26:17
them disagreeing, that is like a we are
26:20
no longer friends moment.
26:22
>> Correct.
26:22
>> That is that is there is something there
26:24
that is like there is a we are enemies
26:26
now. And um I think what happens in the
26:30
games media space is because you have
26:33
the you know if you're doing the content
26:35
creator influencer games media person
26:38
breakdown they're each kind of like
26:40
selling you the vision of something and
26:42
the thing that the games media person is
26:45
selling you is legitimacy.
26:47
>> Yes. That's yeah and that's why we are
26:50
so tied to the relationships with the
26:52
brands and the the the access and the
26:55
that's because part of what they're
26:56
selling you is legitimacy and that's how
26:58
you know an outlet is legitimate. They
26:59
they got a code which is why people are
27:01
on social media saying I got a code for
27:03
this game. This is all it's all right
27:05
there. So I think
27:08
when legitimacy is such a big part of
27:11
the conversation, you never want to
27:14
challenge somebody who has already been
27:16
granted legitimacy out of fear of that
27:19
legitimacy being taken away from you.
27:22
And we have the pitch perfect example of
27:24
this in practice thanks to the project
27:28
helix
27:29
>> merch. Uh, dude,
27:32
this was this was one of those things
27:33
where like had to had to take a break
27:37
from the internet for a full day, which
27:39
maybe I should do more often.
27:40
>> But, um, if you are listening and not
27:42
familiar, uh,
27:45
>> with with the new CEO of Xbox, Asha
27:48
Sharma, uh, one of the first things that
27:50
she did when she took the reigns is
27:52
announce Project Helix, which is the
27:54
next generation of Xbox. That's all we
27:56
know. Um, we Yeah. Wait, the next the
28:01
next console got announced by Xbox.
28:03
Yeah, is what you're telling me?
28:04
>> That thing that they've talked about
28:05
like a bunch before. You know what I
28:06
mean? That thing.
28:07
>> Project Helix sounds cool. That was my
28:09
man in arms.
28:11
>> All right.
28:12
>> That was that was okay. So, yeah. So,
28:15
this this like, you know, very Project
28:17
Octopath Traveler of them, I would say,
28:19
>> dude. But I'm more Project Octo dad.
28:22
>> Oh,
28:23
>> everyone's talking about real quick.
28:24
Everyone's talking about dad games this
28:25
week with that whole pragmata stuff
28:27
>> and they're forgetting the dadliest
28:28
catch. No one is remembering the
28:30
deadliest catch.
28:31
>> Oh my god, I can't believe it. So So
28:33
Xbox sends out uh this this limited
28:38
exclusive
28:39
uh box of of Stop it. There was a
28:43
hoodie, too. And a hat. And uh and it's
28:45
all this this Project Helix branded
28:48
merchandise. And it's so funny because
28:52
you see this collection of I'm going to
28:55
say influencers, but there are people
28:57
who would not identify as such. There
28:58
are people who would identify as like
29:00
members of games media.
29:01
>> Yeah.
29:02
>> But you know, whatever. Um, take to
29:04
social media to say,
29:06
>> "I was given this merch. It's awesome."
29:10
And I think we can all acknowledge,
29:14
you know, Project Helix doesn't exist.
29:16
>> Yeah. I think what the the thing that
29:18
like my like step one for me with this
29:21
is like I think there's like a lot of
29:22
places where I'm like yeah we we like
29:26
all of the places for push back for me
29:28
return to the beginning of guys this
29:31
thing doesn't exist. This is a madeup
29:34
thing that no one has. It's it's not
29:36
real. So
29:39
I guess what is what is tough about this
29:43
spiritually
29:44
is that Project Helix as it exists right
29:48
now um is very obviously boldly nothing
29:54
more than a branding exercise
29:56
>> brother it's a tweet that's what it is
29:58
>> so so when you take to the internet and
30:01
you say I'm going to use my platform to
30:04
participate in Microsoft's branding
30:07
exercise for something that doesn't
30:09
exist. This is this is two things. One,
30:13
just absolute bottomfeeding desperation
30:16
for other people to think that you are
30:18
in a club, that you are a have and they
30:20
are a have not. Just absolute
30:23
bootlicking. I I don't know what else to
30:26
say. This is this is like so so weird.
30:28
It is not enough to get a box of free
30:31
stuff and enjoy it. You must tell other
30:34
people. You must make sure there is
30:36
evidence so that if Xbox looks for your
30:38
tweet, they will find it and they will
30:40
be proud of you. Like that is the first
30:43
part of this.
30:44
>> Yes.
30:44
>> And then I think the second part of this
30:46
is a willingness to
30:50
clap your hands together like a seal
30:54
whenever Xbox tells you to.
30:56
>> There is no product here. That's
30:58
>> there's no product.
30:59
>> That's what it is where I'm like, okay,
31:00
like if you think about what is what is
31:02
this move, right? they are marketing a
31:04
thing that doesn't exist. And so it's
31:06
like why would you market something that
31:08
doesn't exist? It's because you're just
31:09
like trying to get like a handle on the
31:12
brand again, right? Like there's been
31:14
all this bad press with like rising
31:15
prices, you know, like social political
31:17
like problems with Xbox and Microsoft,
31:19
all this stuff. Uh uh their games are
31:21
also just like not like selling very
31:22
well, delivering super well. Then they
31:25
have this big shakeup of the company.
31:26
Sarah Bond, Phil Spencer are out. Are
31:29
they fired? Who knows? Maybe, right?
31:33
It's not looking good. They're closing
31:34
all these studios. It's not looking good
31:36
for Xbox PR-wise right now. So, what's
31:38
an easy win? How do we get some some
31:40
goodwill towards project? How do we get
31:42
some good will towards Xbox? Well, first
31:43
of all, let's announce that we have a
31:44
new console that working that we're
31:46
working on. We've already announced it,
31:47
but whatever. And then let's just get
31:49
people talking about it positively by
31:51
posing their t-shirts and be like,
31:52
"Thanks, Xbox. Love the brand."
31:54
I guess I just don't know what else to I
31:55
I I think like I'm sorry how I I must be
31:58
coming across at this moment right now,
31:59
but I just feel like you're an
32:00
embarrassing loser if you're posting
32:02
about this. It's it's like I don't know,
32:04
man. It's like not only cuz listen,
32:06
we've talked about it. Microsoft is on
32:07
the B BDS list. They lay off a million
32:10
people. They get rid of who was
32:12
previously your best friend who you were
32:14
kissing his sweet little toes, Phil
32:16
Spencer. You loved him so much. I guess
32:18
that relationship was worth nothing to
32:19
you. I guess you were a fake friend.
32:22
something because you got a t-shirt and
32:24
a hoodie out of it.
32:25
>> But then but then they they kicked Phil
32:27
Spencer to the curb. They they Sarah
32:29
Bond you it turns out turns out your
32:31
friendship was fake. Now you're besties
32:32
with Asha Chararma and you're posting
32:34
Project Helix merch a 40-year-old man
32:37
like it's Christmas godamn morning. Like
32:39
are do you is this seriously what you're
32:41
going to do with your life? And listen,
32:42
you weren't paid to do that which
32:44
probably makes it worse. So at least if
32:47
you were paid to do it, I could maybe
32:48
get behind you that you were doing some
32:50
kind of job. But this is be this was
32:52
this is like purely a perfectly like
32:57
like the the the put cooked in the in
33:01
the crockpot social performance. I like
33:04
I I I don't know how like what more I
33:07
can say to this person because this is
33:08
the same person who is being granted
33:11
interviews with Xbox developers who is
33:14
being sent the ROG Xbox Rag ally X to
33:18
>> I'm really glad they got the names of
33:19
those
33:22
to to review and they put out a thing
33:24
called review and I think like if if
33:27
they're and listen if you're an Xbox
33:30
influencer and at the end of the day
33:32
everything you do online is because you
33:34
secretly hope that Xbox is going to
33:36
offer you a job at the end of the day.
33:38
More power to you. There is an audience
33:41
for that. There is a space for that. But
33:43
I am deeply ashamed of the larger games
33:48
media apparatus for being so unwilling,
33:52
so lacking in the ability to confront
33:55
anyone and anything that they are
33:58
willing to admit that this is even
34:01
silly, that this is even worth maybe
34:03
laughing at.
34:04
>> Yes. It's this thing where it's like
34:06
like uh I think you could very easily be
34:08
like, "What? You guys don't know that
34:10
influencers exist?" And it's like that's
34:11
not that's not what we're talking about
34:13
here. We're talking about the fact that
34:14
um you have some people who are parading
34:16
as like games press who are like
34:18
accepting these and posting about these.
34:20
And then also you have the games press
34:23
itself reporting on this without trying
34:26
to uh analyze and discuss what it
34:28
actually is, right? Like being able to
34:31
without being able to say like, "Hey,
34:33
isn't this bizarre?" Like like, "Hey,
34:36
I'm the journalist here. I'm not I was
34:37
not involved with getting the getting
34:39
the project helix t-shirt, hat, hoodie
34:41
combo, right? I didn't get that, but I
34:43
had do have to report on it. And so it's
34:45
like to just like uncritically discuss
34:48
this to just present it exactly as it
34:50
is. Yeah. What's up?
34:51
>> I just had a vision of us doing this
34:53
podcast and the entire time we were
34:55
actually just wearing the project.
34:56
>> We should have done that. We should have
34:58
made it. That would have been so [ __ ]
34:59
funny. Oh my gosh. That would have
35:01
actually been like really really good.
35:04
>> I know. That would have been
35:05
gigabrained. But okay. So, I think I
35:08
think just like
35:10
>> the thing that I find to be really like
35:12
problematic about this because I I like
35:14
the point that you're making that like,
35:16
oh, do you guys just not know that like
35:17
influencers exist? I think that that's
35:19
like a valid thing to to think at this
35:21
moment. I guess what I just want people
35:23
to understand is that like in the
35:26
current context of having the new head
35:30
of Xbox be this this AI lady, having all
35:34
of the layoffs, having all of the the
35:36
the the BDS stuff. Um these all of this
35:41
stuff is not unrelated to posting about
35:44
Project Helix, right? Yeah. Um because
35:48
the company is reducing labor costs.
35:52
They are participating in
35:55
you know um disgusting warfare on one
35:58
end while sustaining visibility and
36:01
enthusiasm on the other. And what the
36:04
what what the reason the merch exists
36:06
because there is no reason for Microsoft
36:08
to produce a hat and a hoodie. The
36:10
reason it exists is so that Xbox is in
36:13
the news not for things that are
36:15
critical of them. It is so that they are
36:17
in the news for things that are
36:18
positive. It keeps the conversation
36:21
around anticipation and access and good
36:24
vibes instead of like labor conditions
36:26
instead of political pressure. And it's
36:29
not that like you know Xbox influencer
36:31
is that's posting the merch is
36:33
personally responsible for the layoffs.
36:35
it's that their post is part of the
36:38
system that is redirecting attention
36:40
away from causes that critically need
36:43
attention. So if you are posting about
36:45
how layoffs are bad, but you are also
36:47
posting Project Helix merch, I think
36:50
that maybe you are um
36:54
>> a liar or a coward.
36:56
>> There's like a really easy contradiction
36:58
there that I don't think it takes some
36:59
like bigrained like uh uh critical
37:02
thinking to to arrive at, right? Uh uh
37:06
it it's very very simple to connect the
37:08
dots between like like what is my role
37:11
in this?
37:12
>> If my role is to just post a picture of
37:14
me wearing their t-shirt and saying like
37:16
thanks Xbox, this is great. Or you know
37:18
even like anyone else, right? It's not
37:20
it's not just Xbox. The Project Helix
37:22
stuff I think is uh incredibly easy to
37:24
like see this for. But it's like um the
37:27
same thing with with Sony, right? We can
37:29
switch sides here, right?
37:30
>> Yeah. uh Sony uh also doing layoffs,
37:34
also shutting studios all the time,
37:36
purchasing studios, shutting them down
37:37
in two years, right? Like it it is it is
37:40
a tale that has been told over and over
37:42
and over again over the last like five,
37:44
six years. Um and yet so if if you are
37:47
someone who's like, well, we're going to
37:48
be critical of those of of in those
37:50
times, we are going to be critical of
37:52
those times, but then also happily, you
37:54
know, participate in a social media
37:55
embargo to promote their new game, it's
37:57
like, well, draw the line. Draw the
37:59
line. You you are already holding you
38:01
are already holding the red string and
38:04
the two things are already on the
38:05
corkboard. Just put it in there. You got
38:07
it. Well, and I think that this so
38:08
easily extends to kind of a larger
38:10
conversation about the role of um not
38:13
just independent games media, but kind
38:15
of announcing yourself as independent
38:17
games media because I think
38:19
>> something that something that I perceive
38:21
a lot in the space is that there is this
38:24
um framework or workflow that is simply
38:28
like receive access,
38:31
post about access,
38:33
amplify a marketing plan. Um, but
38:36
because I don't have corporate
38:38
ownership, I am fulfilling the promise
38:41
of what an independent media outlet is
38:43
supposed to be. And frankly, I think I
38:45
think people maybe um throw around
38:48
independent
38:49
too easily. And um
38:51
>> I would I would agree. I mean, but it's
38:54
I don't know. There so there is there's
38:55
a history of how how and why independent
38:59
media functions and kind of what you are
39:02
able to do when you are not uh
39:05
restricted by corporate pre pressure.
39:07
But if your independent media outlet
39:09
exists simply to uh copy or emulate what
39:14
mainstream media is doing. If you are
39:17
not willing to do anything with that
39:19
lack of constraint, then you are not
39:21
actually operating at independent g as
39:23
independent games media, you are simply
39:25
operating as the same uh as anyone else.
39:29
You just don't have funding. And like
39:32
that's and if you and if listen and if
39:34
you want to be proud of that, more power
39:36
to you. But the fact of the matter is is
39:38
that um there is a consolidation of
39:41
privilege that happens at too many of
39:43
these places. And
39:46
the the kind of call to to to
39:49
independent games outlets is um again I
39:54
I I it just feels like posturing. It
39:56
just feels like it's for appearances. It
39:57
feels like it's a thing that you can say
40:00
that sounds like you are liberal or
40:02
progressive or that you are meaningful
40:04
without actually um using the power that
40:07
that is supposed to supply you with.
40:09
>> Right? cuz it's it's this thing where
40:11
it's like well we want to be independent
40:12
but we also want to be brand safe so
40:13
that we can you know go to the events
40:15
and whatever and it's like hey
40:17
unfortunately like you just can't have
40:19
both you just can't have both right and
40:20
it comes back to this conversation about
40:22
like so then who you know who are you
40:23
serving and and if you want to be an
40:26
influencer and if you want to be like an
40:27
you know people talk about independent
40:29
media but if you want to be like an
40:30
influencer group right why not just be
40:34
that why not why not just like be open
40:37
about that um instead of like trying to
40:39
masquerade is something I think maybe
40:41
more mature and more um
40:44
uh serious I guess is is the word. Um,
40:49
and I I think it comes down to the thing
40:50
that we sort of even like started this
40:52
conversation with, and it's just like
40:53
the attitude that most people in
40:55
traditional games media, more
40:56
traditional publications, whatever, have
40:58
towards the idea, the concept even of
41:00
influencers at all. while still like
41:02
there's the animosity, but they still um
41:06
don't actually have any issue with these
41:07
people because, you know, it's it's
41:09
there's so much like cross uh contam
41:11
contamination is the wrong word, but
41:12
like cross uh
41:15
there's just crossover between PR, games
41:19
press, and influencers. Like you go to
41:20
these events, right, and like like
41:23
you're hanging out with PR, you're
41:25
hanging out with influencers, you're
41:26
hanging out with journalists, and
41:27
there's this weird thing of like, "Hey,
41:29
we're all friends." And I'm not saying
41:30
you shouldn't be friendly. I'm not, of
41:31
course. Uh, but it's this thing where
41:32
it's like, as an independent journalist,
41:36
am I supposed to be friends with PR?
41:40
>> You know what I mean? Like, and I don't
41:41
know. It's like, of course, again, I'm
41:43
not saying friendly. I'm not saying
41:44
polite.
41:45
>> Why is it so Why is it so hard for
41:46
people to say no to gifts? Why?
41:48
>> Right. No, that's that's the thing.
41:49
>> Why? You know what I mean?
41:50
>> Yes. You you can you can just say no.
41:52
You can just say no.
41:54
>> You know, and it is it's it's very
41:55
difficult. I I think you and I were
41:57
maybe both at the Yes, we were. I don't
41:59
know. Game Awards summer gamefest. This
42:01
is like when
42:02
>> Xbox jackets.
42:03
>> The Xbox Jackets. This is the day that
42:04
you and I met.
42:05
>> Oh, okay. Lovely.
42:08
>> Yeah, people sure did like those Xbox
42:09
jackets.
42:10
>> Yeah. So, basically what happened is uh
42:12
there was some big Xbox show. No, it
42:14
wasn't even the showcase. It was like
42:15
some like closed it was just like a
42:16
network kind of
42:18
>> network. It was a networking event. was
42:20
um it was like a like a cocktail hour
42:22
that like Xbox hosted and um as you were
42:26
like walking out the door they gave you
42:27
these like jackets that had the names of
42:30
all the studios and stuff. I'd be
42:31
curious to see how many of those studios
42:32
are still at Xbox. Um that's not the
42:35
point. Uh and and people everyone walks
42:37
out everyone arrived at at a different
42:39
um sort of like mixer all at the same
42:41
time all wearing the Xbox and there was
42:43
this moment of like wow
42:45
>> like just fully
42:47
>> just appealing to the brand. I mean,
42:48
it's the same as like similar but
42:50
different uh to the like the Project
42:51
Helix merch where it's just like why
42:52
wear this merch if you're if you're a
42:54
journalist or or whatever. Just say no.
42:56
You can say no.
42:56
>> And it's tough. And I think like if
42:58
we're again I think what's important to
43:00
me here is just being really really
43:03
honest about what's going on. And I
43:04
don't think we I don't think we have to
43:06
make it more dramatic than it is. I
43:07
think the reason why it is so hard to
43:09
say no to the Xbox Jacket is because
43:12
>> people want the Xbox Jacket. And let's
43:15
just analyze that for a second. Um,
43:19
is it fair to say that a lot of people
43:20
in games media are hardcore fans of
43:23
video games?
43:24
>> Uh, certainly
43:25
>> I would say yes.
43:26
>> Certainly. And I think that something
43:28
that has again just just trying to be
43:31
honest, trying to assess what's going on
43:32
in the space is that there has maybe
43:34
been a lack of development on the side
43:37
of critical video game reviews to the
43:39
point that if you give somebody in games
43:43
media a video game to review and you
43:45
give a YouTuber a video game to review,
43:48
how different are those reviews going to
43:50
be? like they might come to different
43:52
conclusions, but in their framework, in
43:54
what they're looking at, like I don't
43:55
know if they're going to be different at
43:56
all. I don't know. And I think that
43:58
there has been a lack of kind of
44:01
incisive critical development in what it
44:03
means to review a video game to the to
44:06
the point that that lack of development,
44:08
it has democratized the space and it has
44:11
fed this insecurity on the game's media
44:14
person because they don't have something
44:16
that everybody else doesn't have. Dude,
44:18
what you actually just said is like I
44:20
think the most like maybe one of the one
44:22
of the best pieces of like analysis of
44:23
this entire situation and it's just this
44:26
idea of like if influencers and like
44:28
games journalists and reviewers or
44:30
whatever are so different, then
44:32
shouldn't their reviews look different?
44:34
Shouldn't shouldn't like like if you
44:36
just gave me like the transcript of a
44:37
video review from whoever that got the
44:39
game early and then gave me the, you
44:42
know, text of the review from whatever
44:45
games press person got it early. Should
44:47
those not feel different?
44:51
>> And I and I'm sorry everybody, but the
44:52
truth of the matter is is that you can
44:54
see this dead end as as easy as possible
44:58
with a bullet because the video game
45:00
outlet reviews for the Super Mario
45:02
Galaxy movie are more aligned with
45:04
YouTuber reviews than they are film
45:07
critics. Why is that?
45:10
>> Maybe because of framework. It's because
45:11
of how you've been taught to to about
45:14
what a review is and what you're even
45:15
criticizing.
45:17
>> Maybe we're close to a to a YouTuber
45:19
games press alliance. Do you know what I
45:21
mean?
45:23
>> Maybe maybe
45:23
>> that's that's interesting actually.
45:25
>> Maybe it was the Mario movie that made
45:26
them made everyone look around and say
45:28
like, "What are we even fighting about?
45:29
>> What are we even fighting? What are we
45:31
doing here?" Yeah. We're all on the same
45:32
page.
45:33
>> Um
45:34
>> Jake, you know what? I You and I are
45:36
100% on the same page about other than
45:39
most things. I want to fight about
45:40
something.
45:40
>> Yeah, I know. I know. I know that you
45:42
are like chomping at the bit for the
45:44
episode that we do where I say something
45:45
and you get to finally like be like,
45:47
"Peter, I actually fully 100% disagree
45:48
with you.
45:49
>> I've been thinking deeply about this and
45:50
I've just and I've decided the way it
45:52
might have to go down is that I will
45:53
have to buy a second copy of Yoshi and
45:55
the Mysterious World. A g a game I will
45:57
assuredly love and a and a game that you
45:59
will assuredly maybe not like because
46:01
you'll say it's a baby game."
46:03
>> I I don't know. I don't know.
46:04
>> That's the thing. I don't know. And I
46:05
and then and then I can start a podcast
46:07
and I can say, "Peter, what do you think
46:09
of Yoshi and the Mysterious book?" And
46:10
you'll get one sentence in and then I
46:11
can tell you why you're wrong.
46:12
>> Okay. See, maybe maybe that's maybe
46:14
that's it. So, look forward to that in
46:16
the future. Yes.
46:17
>> Um No, Jake, what I'm talking about here
46:18
is the Critical Ear Nation.
46:20
>> Oh, they're good.
46:20
>> They're they're great. They're great.
46:22
>> They're good.
46:22
>> Okay.
46:23
>> And you can trust us because they're you
46:24
know, we're not paid.
46:26
>> Um uh the members of our Patreon,
46:29
patreon.com/critical.
46:31
You can join the nation to get our uh
46:34
weekly bonus episodes. This week was
46:35
pretty good. Talked about divas. Talked
46:37
about
46:37
>> Wait, I actually thought this bonus
46:39
episode was really good this week.
46:40
>> I thought it was great. I thought
46:41
>> I thought there was some like
46:43
>> we were really talking about games
46:45
>> in like a in like a close way that I
46:47
appreciated
46:48
>> in a way that we do uh not super
46:50
frequently. I remember there was I don't
46:52
remember what episode it was, but there
46:53
was one of the main episodes of the show
46:54
where you and I were like, "Hold on a
46:55
second." Like,
46:56
>> are we talking about a game? Like
46:58
actually even talk about the game. This
46:59
is fun.
47:00
>> It's crazy. Um, yeah. So, we we did that
47:01
in our in our bonus episode with Dose of
47:03
Divas, and we did that with um Pokemon
47:06
Champions. Uh, it was a great app. I I
47:08
had a good time with it. Um, you can get
47:10
that on patreon.com/critical
47:12
error by becoming a $5 or up member of
47:15
the nation. I would like to give a very
47:17
special shout out though to members of
47:19
the Jake and Peter tier. This is the $20
47:21
tier on our Patreon. I would like to say
47:24
thank you to Andrew Bulkar, Evan Snee,
47:26
and Robert Quesada. These are people who
47:28
are absolutely helping us do this show,
47:31
which we 100% appreciate.
47:34
Each and every week, we also create a
47:36
sound for the members of Critical Error
47:38
Royalty. This is not an ad. Not an ad.
47:40
Could not be an ad. Definitely not an
47:42
ad. These are the members of Critical
47:45
Error Royalty who paid to have their
47:47
names as part of this reading. Let's all
47:50
see how they are posting today. Ooh,
47:52
Shin posting organically. Andrew Bolkar,
47:56
that's not an ad, baby. He just loves
47:58
the product. Pinky Oats got that link in
48:00
the bio. Connor Trulov just sharing what
48:03
they use every day. Mitch Dyer, you know
48:06
that discount code is active. Kochow
48:08
says thoughts are my own. Love to see
48:11
it. Alex Sims gifted not sponsored.
48:14
That's different. That's different.
48:15
Non-existent. A new member of Critical
48:16
Era royalty just boosting for
48:18
visibility. Danny Disaster. There's full
48:20
disclosure somewhere in the comments
48:22
below. Robert Quesada. Early access was
48:24
provided. Jacob Richtor just doing
48:26
coverage for the community. Sam Woods is
48:29
out there building relationships. Mero,
48:31
he's just a huge fan. Thick dick Mystic
48:34
that his algorithm approved. Anel trade
48:37
really just part of a wider campaign.
48:39
Cole just happened to post this. Evan
48:42
Sne, your engagement is looking strong.
48:44
Jared Kuseno is amplifying the message.
48:46
And finally, James Pierre Reed, thank
48:49
you to the team for sending this over.
48:52
All of this completely independent, of
48:54
course. Now more than ever, Peter,
48:56
before you read your piece that you've
48:57
prepared for this week.
48:58
>> Yeah, please.
48:59
>> I just want to say I just want to say on
49:01
on
49:02
there's there's something that's kind of
49:04
occurring to me in mentally reviewing
49:06
the episode that we just had.
49:07
>> Yeah. Okay.
49:08
>> And I think I just want to if I can
49:10
leave maybe a lasting thought with
49:12
people,
49:12
>> please. the,
49:16
you know, because of the the kind of
49:18
material conditions of what games media
49:20
is at this moment, the the I don't I
49:23
don't want people to think I'm doing,
49:25
you know, a shot across the aisle here
49:28
at people at at outlets and places that
49:30
call themselves independent games media
49:32
as kind of like a blanket statement,
49:34
>> right? But what I do what I do want to
49:36
say and what is important to me and why
49:38
I get fired up about this issue is that
49:41
I think one of the responsibilities of
49:43
any outlet any any organization that
49:46
calls itself independent is to redirect
49:49
attention away from the capitalist
49:51
priorities of any corporation and direct
49:53
that attention towards the people and
49:56
the systems beneath the products. And
49:59
too often I feel I feel disappointed in
50:03
that regard. And I think that to achieve
50:05
this, you need to be honest about how
50:07
your own coverage fits into this system.
50:09
>> Yeah.
50:10
>> And listen, and if and if you retort and
50:13
if you come back to me and you say, "But
50:15
Jake, I need to make money. I need to do
50:18
clicks." Then then I'm I'm sorry to tell
50:20
you this, you have traded your
50:22
dependence on one thing for dependence
50:25
on another.
50:25
>> Yes. That is that is it
50:28
>> because I mean I mean to your point here
50:30
like
50:32
>> I think journalism is about uh pushing
50:36
back on corporate interests and if and
50:38
if the uh number one priority for you
50:42
know your website, your podcast, your
50:45
whatever um is to ensure
50:50
coverage in the future and is to ensure
50:52
is to continue a relationship with a
50:54
company then I think that you are
50:55
straight up not doing that like just
50:57
just full stop. Um, and you can feel
51:00
however you want about that, but I think
51:01
at the end of the day, I think it's
51:02
important to be honest about that.
51:04
>> Giovani Giovani Coltonia said something
51:06
to me once that I really appreciated.
51:07
Something that something I have a lot of
51:08
friction with as a person is kind of the
51:10
purpose of video game previews because
51:12
they seem so outright focused with just
51:15
doing PR. And how many times do you see
51:17
a preview that's just kind of like an
51:19
overview trailer? It's like a summary of
51:20
the game and then at the end, but we'll
51:22
have to wait and see how it all turns
51:24
out. and and something he said to me
51:26
was, "Every time you go to a press
51:27
event, they have a story that they're
51:30
trying to get you to tell,
51:31
>> and you need to identify what that story
51:33
is and then tell your own story."
51:35
>> And I and I really And I really that
51:38
that stuck with me. I thought that that
51:39
was really powerful. So,
51:42
>> I don't know. There's there's I think
51:44
it's just wary to
51:47
really reflect on like your role in in
51:50
all of these settings and what in your
51:53
coverage you are upholding as the most
51:55
important thing.
51:56
>> Yeah. I I mean we were talking about
51:58
this before we even started. there's
51:59
this video going around of um I'm not
52:01
sure I don't know her name but some
52:04
woman who is I think a journalist on on
52:05
Tik Tok um posted this thing talking
52:09
about like how having influencers at
52:11
like red carpet events um really does a
52:14
big disservice to uh journalism because
52:17
you have just people who are just like
52:20
playing games with celebs or execs or
52:22
whatever and not actually like having
52:24
like questions and like asking follow-up
52:26
questions and and she talks about um
52:28
this idea a of like as a journalist like
52:32
do some research. See what the person
52:34
who you are talking to see what their
52:35
talking points have been in the past and
52:36
what they have been told to say about
52:38
the company or the show or the game or
52:41
whatever that is and figure out a way to
52:43
get past that and get around that and
52:45
ask something else and then also ask
52:48
follow-up questions. What do you mean by
52:49
that? Says who, you know?
52:52
>> Yeah, I like it.
52:53
>> Yeah.
52:53
>> Yeah. You got to you got to serve
52:54
something else besides the algorithm at
52:56
the end of the day.
52:56
>> Yeah. Uh I I think uh at the end of the
52:58
day like one of the things I uh do every
53:01
single time I read anything and
53:03
especially if I'm going to be working on
53:05
it is ask the question of like who's
53:06
saying this and why. And like I I went
53:11
to school for journalism. But I don't
53:13
think that that's like necessarily
53:14
something you need to go to school for
53:16
journalism to uh
53:18
have you know that just the the
53:20
curiosity of like sorry what who anyway.
53:25
>> Yeah. Can I read?
53:26
>> What' you write? What' you write this
53:27
week? Yeah.
53:28
>> Um,
53:29
Jake, I just got married. Writing about
53:32
being in love.
53:33
>> Oh, good.
53:34
>> Enjoy.
53:35
>> Yep.
53:37
>> I am sending her a picture of two small
53:39
kittens napping on each other. A video
53:41
of otter holding hands as they drift
53:43
downstream. A dog making an unlikely
53:46
friend with a young dough and running
53:48
together in someone's backyard.
53:51
Us. I write. I'm a poet.
53:57
This seems to be a universal experience
53:58
for dating and now being married to
54:00
another person. Everyone in a
54:02
relationship I know is in the same boat.
54:04
I am contractually obligated to send her
54:06
frogs sitting on each other's heads, a
54:09
pair of flowers sprouting up out of the
54:11
concrete and let her know that I see her
54:13
in these images.
54:15
>> That I see myself reflected back to that
54:17
I can superimpose photos from our first
54:20
date, our road trip to the bad lands,
54:22
kisses snuck at our wedding. Every
54:24
moment we have ever lived breathing the
54:26
same air over all of these small little
54:29
pieces of love.
54:31
At least I assume they're love. But what
54:34
do I know about the loving capabilities
54:36
of bats hung upside down, bundled in
54:39
single file lines, of two stones leaning
54:42
sideways holding each other up? Can they
54:44
even appreciate the sunset behind them?
54:46
Can they even love each other? They are
54:48
rocks.
54:51
Of course they can. If love is truly
54:54
nothing more than a chemical reaction in
54:56
my brain that we've all labeled an
54:58
emotion based on passion, which itself
55:01
is just a different chemical reaction,
55:03
then why can I not look at other forces
55:05
the same way? Those rocks are held
55:07
together by gravity and a centrial force
55:10
that binds us all to the ground keeps us
55:12
on Earth. That is love, my friends.
55:16
We're on our way to Joey and Sarah's
55:18
wedding through the rural Midwest and
55:20
two proud stalks of corn stand on the
55:23
edge of an empty field. They escaped the
55:25
tractors that came to harvest the rest
55:27
of their kin at the end of the season.
55:29
Us, she points and says
55:32
she's a poet.
55:34
Once you start seeing another person
55:36
where they are not, you cannot stop.
55:38
It's easy to see us in videos of
55:40
adorable animals, but even more now.
55:45
I look down at my desk and my phone is
55:47
balanced precariously on a coffee mug.
55:49
It's us. Obviously, she's sick this
55:52
week, so maybe she's the phone with the
55:54
delicate balance. And I'm the mug
55:55
beneath her, keeping her steady while
55:57
she's down. Or maybe I'm the phone,
55:59
heavy and tired from a week of work, and
56:01
she sits beneath me. A cold drink on a
56:03
warm spring afternoon.
56:06
>> It's like I'm seeing the code of the
56:08
matrix. The entire universe is made out
56:10
of me and her. Like God himself decided
56:13
to use our skeletons as the building
56:14
blocks for everything.
56:18
I'm sending a crocodile climbing over
56:20
another crocodile at the edge of the
56:22
water before it stops. Its tail sitting
56:24
on the face of the one beneath it.
56:27
>> Us.
56:29
Us.
56:30
>> Us.
56:32
Thank you.
56:33
>> Excellent. Wow. So fun. I love that you
56:36
made me imagine like uh like a wedding
56:41
and I've seen this thing before where
56:43
couples at different tables will put
56:44
like pictures of themselves at every
56:46
age.
56:47
So, it's like, "Oh, here's both of us at
56:48
like age." And I was like, "Damn, I just
56:50
want to see now
56:52
>> like these pictures pictures where
56:53
you're like, that's us and everyone."
56:55
You know, that's that would actually I'
56:57
like go around and look at all of them
56:58
and I'd be like, "Oh, that's fun."
56:59
>> Cuz I imagine you do this as well to to
57:02
a certain extent, right?
57:03
>> Like I said, I feel like No, not at all.
57:05
>> No, I I know what you're talking about.
57:08
>> Okay.
57:08
>> I I am familiar with this, but this is
57:12
very infrequently. I actually was okay
57:14
at yeah there there right at the tail
57:17
end I actually pulled my phone out and I
57:19
was like can I find something that me
57:20
and Sarah did that was like this and the
57:23
truth is we just send each other
57:25
pictures of Chip so it's not a little
57:28
bit of a different it's a little bit of
57:29
a different situation but um and I will
57:32
I will also say that like
57:34
>> I I personally don't see me and Sarah
57:37
out in the world as as a as a pair like
57:40
that. I think I think I see me sometimes
57:42
and I see her sometimes
57:44
>> and I I rarely see those little
57:46
characters together. Yeah,
57:47
>> that's so interesting. That's so
57:49
interesting cuz I to me it's like um
57:51
like I said, it's not just like the
57:53
obvious like
57:54
>> like oh two things doing this thing.
57:56
It's like literally as I was writing
57:58
this, I looked at my desk and I could
58:00
not stop. I had to choose which thing
58:02
that I thought we were.
58:03
>> Do you know what I mean? I was like I
58:04
was like are we the scissors?
58:08
>> Do you know what I mean? kept together
58:10
forever in this by a single hinge. Are
58:13
we the two [ __ ] Xbox controllers that
58:15
are on my desk that I trade?
58:17
>> No, I don't do this. I do not do this.
58:19
>> I couldn't I couldn't stop seeing. I was
58:20
like I was like, "No, absolutely not."
58:21
>> That's so funny. That's so interesting
58:22
>> cuz cuz you know what's tough? I can
58:24
very easily see myself as a cartoon
58:26
character. So, for for example, there
58:28
when we go take Chip on a walk right
58:30
down the block, one of these neighbors
58:31
in their yard has one of these little
58:33
yard stone uh frog guys. And he's this
58:37
he's this big belly frog kind of sitting
58:39
back on a lily pad with a little hand up
58:41
and I and every time I go by I'm like I
58:42
just see myself in that [ __ ] frog.
58:44
I'm just I'm like that's my [ __ ] guy
58:46
right there. And and I think I I think I
58:49
maybe don't
58:50
>> cartoonify my wife in my head.
58:53
>> Sure.
58:53
>> I think I cartoon myself. I don't think
58:55
I cartoon I don't think I cartoon her.
58:57
>> Yeah, that's interesting. That's really
58:58
really interesting.
58:59
>> Yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna try to I can't
59:01
wait to ask her about this. Yeah,
59:03
>> I'm I'm like dying to go see what she
59:05
says about this now because now because
59:06
you've really got me thinking about
59:07
this. I'm going to start looking for it.
59:09
Maybe next week on the bonus podcast
59:11
patreon.com/critical air. I will I will
59:13
report back to you if I see anything in
59:14
the world and I go, "Oh, that was us."
59:16
Yeah. Yeah.
59:17
>> Yeah. I don't know.
59:18
>> Thank you very much. Thank you. Um Yeah.
59:20
I don't know.
59:21
>> It's so salient. It's so because even
59:22
though I'm telling you I don't really do
59:23
this, it's extremely salient. I like
59:25
know exactly what you're talking about.
59:26
>> Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Cuz I think I think
59:28
it's this thing where like I didn't used
59:29
to feel this way. Do you know what I
59:30
mean? Not necessarily about like her.
59:32
Exactly. But like certainly there was a
59:33
point in my life where I didn't. Um and
59:35
now it's like inescapable and like I
59:37
said like it's I feel like I'm seeing
59:38
the matrix where I'm like oh my gosh
59:40
it's us everywhere everywhere for
59:42
everything. And and like um I think
59:45
there's a certain amount of like being
59:46
in love that's like insanity
59:48
because I also think that like
59:49
explaining this to another person who
59:51
maybe doesn't have this is like you know
59:55
I sound like a cra you sound like a
59:56
crazy person. But
59:59
>> I'm so out of touch with those people at
1:00:00
this point. I I don't even care to know
1:00:02
what they think of me.
1:00:02
>> Uh me and talked about this once was
1:00:04
like it's like if we ever like broke up
1:00:06
or at this point I guess got divorced.
1:00:08
Um I'm like completely undatable cuz I'm
1:00:12
just like so
1:00:14
>> not worried about it. You know what I
1:00:15
mean? Like
1:00:15
>> Yeah. Right. Right. Right.
1:00:17
>> So completely not interested in like
1:00:18
what other people think of me like
1:00:20
especially in that way. I'm like just I
1:00:22
would
1:00:24
completely undatable. just totally like
1:00:25
out of out of that section of our
1:00:27
>> I mean I mean listen can I tell you can
1:00:29
I tell you that I got a I got a text
1:00:31
from my wife that reads remind me to
1:00:32
tell you the metaphor I just thought of
1:00:34
>> oh see that's good
1:00:36
>> and I'm like this is love
1:00:38
>> yeah no that's that's like quite good I
1:00:40
think a good text
1:00:40
>> to be honest with you I think that's uh
1:00:43
what I'm trying to get at like this is
1:00:44
love I mean sure this thing that like
1:00:47
isn't actually this grand gesture to me
1:00:50
still like sits like in my heart a
1:00:52
little bit I love taking a picture of
1:00:56
Chip, going up to Sarah's office, and
1:00:59
just showing her what Chip is doing at
1:01:01
that moment on my phone. I like did I
1:01:03
did this earlier today.
1:01:04
>> Oh, he's in the shoes.
1:01:06
>> He's in the shoe.
1:01:07
>> Oh, he's so good.
1:01:08
>> He loves getting in the shoes.
1:01:10
>> He's so good.
1:01:11
>> So, I get it. I don't know. There's, you
1:01:13
know, there's a little world that you
1:01:14
that you cultivate there. That's that's,
1:01:16
you know, I I never I can't leave. You
1:01:19
can't make me leave.
1:01:20
>> No. No. Good luck. Good luck trying.
1:01:23
>> Peter, can I ask you something for the
1:01:24
for the people that stuck around for the
1:01:25
very end of this podcast?
1:01:26
>> You can ask me anything.
1:01:28
>> Did Did I get a little too messy today?
1:01:31
>> And can I be honest with you? I was
1:01:33
worried I got too messy.
1:01:34
>> Oh, I know. I think I I
1:01:37
there were there were a few times that I
1:01:39
just had, you know, I was speaking about
1:01:41
being honest and there are times where I
1:01:43
I kind of just have some harsh words for
1:01:45
people.
1:01:46
>> No, I think I No, I I don't think so.
1:01:48
Welcome to the post show, by the way,
1:01:49
everyone. the spaces just trained me
1:01:52
that like any confrontational
1:01:55
argumentation at all is like the worst
1:01:57
possible practice that you can
1:01:59
participate in.
1:02:00
>> Yeah. No, I get in my own head about
1:02:01
this sometimes when we put up episodes
1:02:02
that I do feel are like maybe a little
1:02:04
bit more confrontational. Um, and like
1:02:06
at the end of the day, I just have to be
1:02:08
like, and I know you know this, but it's
1:02:10
this thing where it's just like
1:02:12
if you get mad about me saying I think
1:02:14
that is weird that you're posting the
1:02:16
project Helix merch, then I just think
1:02:19
we're not like I just think you wouldn't
1:02:21
like me in general. And so that's okay.
1:02:23
So, I'm just going to say that's that's
1:02:24
a relationship that was going to serve.
1:02:25
>> I guess I guess you're right. It's it's
1:02:27
simply the the podcast is simply weekly
1:02:29
ammo for somebody who didn't like me at
1:02:30
anyways.
1:02:31
>> Yeah. Like like you weren't going to
1:02:32
like me anyway, you know? Uh because I I
1:02:34
think like there is a very real um and I
1:02:38
think I don't know like I I find maybe
1:02:40
I'm wrong but I think that our show is
1:02:42
actually empathetic to a certain degree
1:02:43
but being like yeah we know we know it's
1:02:45
this way but why like why and does it
1:02:48
have to be? And and do we need to make
1:02:49
sure that it is this way?
1:02:51
>> Um and if it's to me it's like like you
1:02:54
said if if you if you were not going to
1:02:57
be open to hearing this topic then you
1:03:00
like then we were going to have this
1:03:01
conversation at some point. So like you
1:03:02
know You know what's something I think
1:03:04
about a lot? It's it's like I feel like
1:03:05
something we we try to put into practice
1:03:07
here is sacrificing some of our own
1:03:09
personal comfort and maybe standing in
1:03:11
the space by like by like for lack of a
1:03:14
better term speaking on business.
1:03:16
>> And something that that I mean we talked
1:03:18
about today towards the end here is this
1:03:20
idea of like being independent, right? I
1:03:21
am an independent journalist. I don't
1:03:23
really do a lot of journalism anymore,
1:03:24
but like some I think some of my videos
1:03:26
are journalism a little bit. Um,
1:03:29
>> and so if we're not using the fact that
1:03:31
we are independent and not, you know,
1:03:33
who tells me what to do? You and me.
1:03:35
That's it.
1:03:36
>> Yeah.
1:03:36
>> Do you know what I mean? Like like we
1:03:38
make decisions together on what we're
1:03:39
going to talk about and how we're going
1:03:40
to talk about it and that's it.
1:03:42
>> And um
1:03:44
>> I think we should I think sometimes
1:03:46
doing that does put you out of your
1:03:48
comfort zone a little bit. It certainly
1:03:49
does for me. But at the end of the day,
1:03:50
it's like that's what we're talking
1:03:51
about. You got to do it.
1:03:53
>> Yeah.
1:03:54
>> Yeah. I think I think standing out
1:03:55
business is good and what you should be
1:03:56
doing if you are in this position.
1:03:58
>> Yeah. Okay. I think Yeah. I don't know.
1:04:00
I think we gota we got to like live the
1:04:02
values and
1:04:02
>> yeah I don't like when people are mad at
1:04:04
me but also like
1:04:07
sorry this is this is where I'm at with
1:04:09
this you know.
1:04:11
>> It's also funny too though because then
1:04:12
it just kind of brings in this um why
1:04:14
why why is what I say
1:04:17
meaningful
1:04:18
>> then the other thing. Yeah.
1:04:20
>> Well but but also I have no power. I
1:04:21
can't hurt you.
1:04:22
>> No. And dude, that's a that's a thing I
1:04:24
think I come back to a lot. Um yeah,
1:04:26
>> with with our show, it's like if
1:04:27
anyone's mad at us, I'm like we're
1:04:29
nobody's respectfully,
1:04:31
>> you know what I mean? We're not we're
1:04:32
not we don't have some huge platform and
1:04:34
of course we have, you know, our lovely
1:04:35
critical error nation
1:04:36
patreon.com/critical error, but like
1:04:38
that that we are beholden to to a
1:04:40
certain extent, right? But it's like at
1:04:42
the end of the day, we don't have this
1:04:43
like huge audience behind us that is
1:04:46
like uh empowering us to say anything or
1:04:49
to have any control over anyone. It's
1:04:51
like how the the the Chud YouTubers have
1:04:53
this audience that they manipulate into
1:04:56
harassing people, but we that just with
1:05:00
people in games to us.
1:05:04
>> Yeah. No, we have we have um we've
1:05:06
successfully uh translated the getting
1:05:09
mad at Jake and Peter pipeline.
1:05:11
>> Yeah. Right. Right. Right. We definitely
1:05:14
perfected that. Um
1:05:15
>> that's good.
1:05:16
>> I don't know. I also think like you know
1:05:17
we we are going to Summer Gamef Fest
1:05:19
this year and uh if you are sticking
1:05:21
around and listening to this and going
1:05:22
to be at Summer Game Fest and also mad
1:05:24
at us um I would like to say uh hey for
1:05:28
real I'm happy to have a conversation
1:05:29
with anyone
1:05:30
>> with anyone and and it might be the sort
1:05:32
of thing where we have to walk away and
1:05:33
say like listen you are not going to
1:05:34
meet me where I'm at with this. I'm not
1:05:35
going to meet you where you're at with
1:05:36
that. Like we're just going to have to
1:05:38
agree to disagree and just walk away and
1:05:40
call it there. But at the end of the
1:05:41
day, I'm happy to talk to whoever about
1:05:43
anything. And if and if if hey, if
1:05:45
you're at Summer Gamefest and when you
1:05:46
feel personally slighted by us, I will
1:05:49
happily talk to you about it. Happily
1:05:50
talk to you about it.
1:05:52
See you there.